Are You a Lover or a Fighter? Week 6: Plato and Herodotus

I'm reading and talking about Ted Gioia's "Immersive Humanities Course," 52 weeks of World Classics.

An interesting combination this week. Ted Gioia, the creator of my reading list, called it “Love and War,” but it felt like a lot more than that. And last week, I called it a hodgepodge, but I can admit I was wrong.

Plato’s Symposium is the third of Plato’s works on this list. After wrestling with Ethics in particular last week, I was happy to get back to my friend. Symposium is written as a dialogue among friends, recalled by one who wasn’t there, a little like the game of “Telephone” we’e all played. The friends’ topic? Love, specifically eros. Given that this is upper-class Ancient Greece, there is a significant discussion of love between men; honestly romantic love between men and women is practically ignored. 

The reading plan only covered a few portion of Herodotus’ Histories, Books 1 and 6-8. For full disclosure, I did NOT complete the reading but stopped with Book 7. In my edition of Histories the assigned books were more than 350 pages and I simply ran out of time. If I had done all the reading this week I would have been around 430 pages! Given that I “signed up” for about 250 pages per week, I had to stop. Confession time over.

As always, I have so many, many thoughts about these works. For Symposium, I summarized each person’s eulogy as a way to get my hands around the text. A few ideas:

• Obviously Love held an important place in the lives of Greeks. This entire dialogue is centered around it, but it doesn’t look like love in many ways. I’m accustomed to thinking of love as wanting and being willing to work for the best of your beloved, and that being mutual. That desiring “for” someone else, rather than merely desiring them, was absent at least as far as I could see.
• There are a number of points made about Love as the dialogue progresses, and they definitely don’t agree. As always, you’re left to parse out the better and worse arguments. 
• “You complete me” (yes, Jerry Maguire) makes an appearance! That attitude has been around a looooong time. Aristophanes tells a long and pretty funny tale about how human beings were at one time two-headed, eight-limbed creatures, but when Zeus got mad and split everyone in two. Now we go around looking for our other half.
• Does Love motivate us to honor? What kind of Love would do that? Or maybe Love is a moderating force? (I found that a weak argument.) Is its purpose beauty? Those are all offered as arguments, and all are rejected by Socrates. 
• Socrates, via his mentor Diotima, argues that Love’s purpose is procreation. As someone who has actually been pregnant several times, I found Socrates’ discussion of pregnancy to be uncomfortable, to say the least. 
• There is a ton of homoerotic talk, especially from Socrates and Alcibiades. It is just so strange to me that there is virtually no discussion of love between men and women, but tons between older and younger men. As usual, my bias shows, but it’s who I am.

On to Herodotus. He’s been on my radar since I read History of the Ancient World by Susan Wise Bauer about a year and a half ago, and seeing him on the reading list was part of my motivation to jump in. He did not disappoint. The sections that I read were the origin stories of Croesus and Cyrus, and Persia, and then the beginning of the Persian War. I ended with the Battle of Thermopylae, which is an amazing story in its own right. A few takeaways:

• Every military leader should read this book. I may actually send it to my son who is in the Navy! There are examples of excellent leadership, and cranky...