November 26, 2025 • 45 mins
For our 75th episode of the podcast, we discuss potential dragons every year through 2030. Minwa and Tony break down the new Westeros roadmap, debate a fifth season for House of the Dragon, and call out risky sequel ideas. They also do some catching up on what movies and shows they've seen since the last recording.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_02 (00:08):
Hello everyone, welcome to Dancing with Dragons,
your one and only podcast foreverything related to George R.
Martin's world of a song of iceand fire.
I'm one of your hosts, Minua,and I'm joined here by my
co-host Tony, and it's our 75thepisode of the podcast.
And we're here today to bringyou a quick news-focused episode
where we'll be discussing recentupdates regarding House of the
(00:29):
Dragon, the Knight of the SevenKingdoms, and more.
There's a lot happening inWesteros, so sit back and relax
as we get up to date togetherand everything you need to know.
But before that, let's catch upa little bit.
How are you, Tony?
It's been a while since wetalked.
SPEAKER_00 (00:40):
Yeah, we keep saying that every episode.
I'm doing fine.
How are you doing?
SPEAKER_02 (00:46):
I'm doing fine.
Thank you for asking.
Have you watched any new moviesor shows daily before we talk
about everything going on inWesteros?
Just I feel like I'm personallybehind on everything.
And I remember you saying thesame thing as well.
So I'm wondering if you arecaught up in any recent movies
and shows.
Because, spoiler alert, I am notthat caught up.
SPEAKER_00 (01:05):
I'm like a broken record on Instagram, and I keep
saying I'm so behind.
I am so behind.
Like last year, I started thetrend of not being able to watch
stuff like I did when I firststarted my accounts.
Because I remember 2020 wheneverything was locked down and
people were watching hundreds ofmovies.
(01:25):
And we were every day I had likea review up on Instagram, and
the content was just flowing,and now I'm going back to our
real lives.
But no, uh this year has beeneven not worse, but uh a
struggle to keep up with allthese new movies.
And I see people, oh, they'rewatching everything, and bless
their hearts that they can watchfive movies a day.
(01:48):
Um I think I've logged sixmovies on my litter box this
month, and that's the trend.
The last few months has beenfive here, four there.
But the last couple weeks I'vewatched a couple big movies that
were highly anticipated, andthat's the Leo DiCaprio and uh
Paul Thomas Anderson and Beniciodel Toro.
SPEAKER_02 (02:09):
Yeah, one battle after another, I loved it.
That's one of the few recentmovies I've watched, and I
really liked it.
It's actually the only PaulThomas Anderson movie that I
like.
I'm not a big fan of him.
I know uh yeah, that's anunpopular opinion, but that's
the only PTA movie that Iactually loved.
So the fact that I love it showsthat everyone can love it.
SPEAKER_00 (02:29):
Yeah, I think, well, I I think he's one of the best
directors we have right now.
And he has so many movies that Ithink are not so many, maybe
three, that I would consider amasterpiece.
And I think There Will Be Bloodis my favorite, just and then
it's just because of Daniel DayLewis and how he incredible he
is.
(02:50):
But this movie is just nothinglike any other movie he's ever
directed.
You know, I'm not gonna get intothe plot, but it's highly
political, and it's notsomething you'd expect.
I mean, you could expect it, butthe way the story twists and
turns, you're like, wait, what?
They don't really focus on oneparticular issue.
(03:11):
You could see the issues in thebackground that you go, okay, I
could relate to that in 2025 inthe world, especially in the US.
But I think this is Leo's one ofhis best performances, and it's
one of those performances thathe's uh like a bumbling idiot.
He's he's comical, it's kind oflike Wolf of Wall Street.
(03:33):
He had that scene where he'sbeing funny, he's not it's
dramatic, also.
He he's uh he's so underrated.
No, you know, people call himoverrated, but this is one of
his best.
And I I'm gonna bet a milliondollars he'll get another
nomination for best actor.
SPEAKER_01 (03:48):
Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (03:48):
Um, this is gonna get like what's today's date is
the 24th of November.
Stamp it now, it's gonna getlike 13 nominations for Academy
Awards.
Yeah, the whole movie is amazingand and from start to finish,
it's easily jumped to my numberone of the year.
And there's a lot of more moviesI I need to watch.
Um, but other than that, anyother movies you've seen
(04:11):
recently?
SPEAKER_02 (04:12):
Um, for me, honestly, it's just been
Frankenstein, Del Toro's newmovie.
It's one of my uh mostanticipated films of the year.
Just because I love Guillermodel Toro and I like the story of
Frankenstein as well, and I knowthat and being a fan of his, I
always knew that this would be apassion project for him, so I
was extremely excited to see howhe would adapt the story.
(04:33):
And um like I watched it likeabout a week or so after it
dropped on Netflix, and Ireally, really liked it.
Like the more it sat with me,the more I loved it.
Um it was it was one of thosemovies where my enjoyment kind
of wasn't just during the movieitself, like the more I thought
about it, the more I liked itand appreciated it, the more I
(04:54):
kind of read about it or sawwhat other people said said of
it, like their uh their praiseof it or their interpretations.
It's just I appreciate the moviemore and more and more.
So I think that in a few monthsor so I'm going to give it
another watch because Iunfortunately like just watched
it on my iPad.
I couldn't watch it like on abig screen the way I wanted to.
So it definitely deserves like aproper second view, and I'm
(05:17):
going to give it that.
Um, other than that, it's justbeen a couple of rewatches here
and there.
Um, I re-watched K-pop DemonHunters for like the third or
fourth time.
SPEAKER_00 (05:27):
I still need to watch that.
Uh, my daughter keeps telling meI need to watch it.
SPEAKER_02 (05:31):
Oh, I hope you enjoy it because it's so fun.
It's just a great animatedmovie.
Love all the details, and it'sso good.
I'm not as up to date as I'dlike to be.
I still haven't seen Wicked Part2.
Um, that's not one of my mostanticipated movies of the year,
and I it's out already, and Ijust didn't get the chance to
see it.
SPEAKER_00 (05:49):
Um I'm seeing a lot of lot of negative stuff coming
out from a lot of people I trustabout.
SPEAKER_02 (05:56):
Honestly, like I I don't I don't I'm not surprised
just because I know the storyinside and house.
You know, I watched the the theplay like a couple of times.
I I I know Wicked and I knowthat the second part is
significantly weaker than thefirst.
But at the same time, likedespite that, I love it.
I love Wicked, you know, like Iknow that it's not as good as
(06:16):
the first part, but I still loveit.
And my friends who are the exactsame way, they they said that
they enjoyed it.
SPEAKER_00 (06:22):
So I'm going off, I mean I'm going off the uh
reviewers here, and I I justlooked at um not that is
anything to curtail yourexcitement.
Um Rotten Tomatoes has it at71%.
I know part one was at 80, likethe high 80s, um, which I
(06:42):
watched part one, and I think Igave it the one, I got like one
star.
I think I gave it like a threeand a half.
SPEAKER_02 (06:50):
Okay, wow.
SPEAKER_00 (06:51):
Something that I would have um, and I saw it on
TV and I mean uh on the on myTV, and I think something that
like that I should be watched ona big screen.
Yeah, uh the one other thing Idid see.
Oh, I did watch Frankenstein.
I ended up giving it four and ahalf stars on Letterboxd.
I'll I'll be completely honest.
When it comes to the story ofFrankenstein, I have no idea.
(07:14):
Like I don't know the story.
Like I the only thing I know isthat Frankenstein is the doctor,
not the monster.
Uh because everybody alwaysconfuses that.
I went in, I thought the openingscene was amazing, just to start
off.
Mia Goth, uh, this is no shadeto her.
She like freaks me out when Isee her.
I don't know why.
Maybe it's because she's thishorror queen, right?
(07:37):
But the way she looks and talk,have you seen her talk in real
life?
Again, nothing against her.
SPEAKER_02 (07:42):
Yeah, I think so in a couple of interviews.
SPEAKER_00 (07:44):
It's really like if I were to hear her talking like
at three in the morning and Iwas in bed, I would it would
scare the crap out of me.
Because just the squeakiness,and anyway, um, again, nothing
against her.
I think she's really good.
Oscar Isaac was a kind of weirdchoice, but I love Oscar Isaac,
and I think he did well.
Uh it's nice to see uh TywinLannister in the movie.
SPEAKER_01 (08:08):
Uh yeah, that was a surprise.
SPEAKER_00 (08:10):
Charles Dance.
Uh, yeah, I think the moviewhat's the guy's name?
I forgot his name, Jacobsomething.
SPEAKER_02 (08:16):
Jacob Lordi, he was amazing.
Yeah, he was surprisingly, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (08:20):
And who what is he originally from?
SPEAKER_02 (08:23):
He was in Euphoria, which was like that show with
Zenday, and he was also in whichhe uh doesn't want to be known
for now, I think, but he was inuh the kissing booth on Netflix,
like that cheesy rom-com.
I didn't watch it.
SPEAKER_00 (08:36):
Hey, you know what, Jacob?
Everybody has those moments.
SPEAKER_01 (08:40):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (08:41):
You gotta, you gotta, you gotta own it.
You you want a paycheck, you'rean actor, you sometimes you
gotta do what you gotta do.
The music was great, it lookedgreat.
Uh, it's so funny.
I see a lot of people hating onit, like, oh, it looks so
manufactured, this looks so CGI.
Like, I didn't really see that,but hey, whatever.
I'm not gonna argue about moviesanymore with random people.
I've watched uh any shows beforewe get to uh our topics here.
SPEAKER_02 (09:31):
Yeah, I've watched two shows.
I've watched uh I just finisheda K-drama called Our Unwritten
Soul, which came out I thinkover the summer.
It's good, it's emotional.
Like it's it's it's a fineK-drama.
I have my I don't think it'sperfect, but it's it was a good
watch.
I think with a lot of showsnowadays, it's just for some
reason I don't feel like theyI'm interested for for for long,
(09:52):
if that makes sense.
Like I'd watch an episode ortwo, but I wouldn't feel um like
engaged enough to continue orI'd forget about it.
But this was a K-drama where Ijust kept it kept me up at
night, basically, because I keptwanting to to watch it.
And then I also watched andloved, or not loved, but I I I
thoroughly enjoyed thecompetition show Physical Asia
(10:12):
on on Netflix.
Like that athletic show.
SPEAKER_00 (10:15):
You know what?
I started watching somethingcalled 100.
I don't know if it was the samething.
SPEAKER_02 (10:20):
Physical 100, it's the same thing, but it's 100 is
yeah, yeah.
Physical 100 is just Korea, andthen physical Asia is where they
take like the best six athletesfrom uh different countries in
Asia and have them like fightagainst each other in different
like uh athletic competitionsbasically.
Um and it it it's okay, it wasvery fun to watch.
(10:42):
It there's a lot of discussiononline, which I kind of it seems
true to me that Korea kind ofcheated, if I'm honest, just
because it's their show and anduh like there were some moments
that were suspicious, butdespite that it was a fun, it
was a fun watch.
So I I needed something likethat at that time.
And I feel like now I finishedthose two shows and I I'm in
(11:04):
need of a good show.
You know what I mean?
Like I I need to watch somethinggood now, I need to start
something good.
So I hope that's whatever show Iwatch next is fun, enjoyable,
gripping.
That's what I need right now.
SPEAKER_00 (11:16):
Well, let me let me let me say something.
There's you know how those thesaying there's there's some
things that are certain in thisworld, right?
And um here's what I'm certainof the sun comes up every
morning, and when I ask yousomething about shows, you
always say K drama first.
SPEAKER_01 (11:35):
Oh, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (11:36):
Something K drama.
So I should have known.
SPEAKER_02 (11:38):
I have to.
SPEAKER_00 (11:39):
Uh here's something I recommend.
Uh, the were you a fan ofBreaking Bad and uh Better Call
Soul?
SPEAKER_02 (11:45):
Oh yeah, that that's what I should watch.
Plurbus.
Plurbus.
SPEAKER_00 (11:48):
Okay, so let me let me just tell you, I won't tell
you anything about it.
Okay, I went into it completely.
I don't need to see a trailerbecause I know Vince Gilligan is
the creator and he's the writer,and Rhea Seahorn is the main
actress.
So, right there, that's threewins.
It's the the is one of the bestfirst episodes of a show of all
time.
Um I'm just gonna say this Ithink that when you trust the
(12:13):
process of a great writer, youalways get rewarded, and that's
when I think people are so umhell-bent on being satisfied.
Like every five seconds theyneed to be.
Oh, this is like you know what Imean.
Like, we've come to a pointwhere if a show is not
mind-blowing, every episode uhit sucks.
(12:36):
Like they don't trust theprocess.
So that fourth episode, it wasjust building.
It's it has a it reminds you alot of a breaking bad and better
called Saul uh moments where hewould start an episode and
there's no dialogue.
He's just showing you themundane action of somebody, but
it has a point to it.
(12:57):
The concept is is original, it'sgreat, and I think you're gonna
really enjoy it, especiallyafter that first episode.
Anyway, um, another show that uhthis is it right here.
I'm promised last thing.
Uh, I've been uh hounded by mywife to watch a show for two
years, shrinking on Apple TV,which I think Apple TV is
becoming one of the beststreaming services that we have
(13:19):
because they just put offbangers after bangers.
Uh I've been putting it off, Idon't really want to watch it,
blah blah blah blah.
Uh I finally watched the firstepisode.
We binged it in like, I don'tknow, a couple days.
And which is nice that they'reum they average like 30 minutes
to episodes.
I love the first season.
I think you know Harrison Fordis perfect to play a curmudgeon,
(13:41):
a therapist, but also have youknow the heart deep down there,
you know what I mean?
So he he plays his roleperfectly.
Uh, the guy who plays the mainguy, Jason Siegel, uh, doing
great.
I didn't know that the BrettGoldstein who plays Roy Kent and
Ted Lasso, he's the one of he'sone of the creators of the show.
(14:04):
And he's actually starring inseason two, which I'm midway
through.
I really enjoyed the show.
Eight out of ten season one.
They tiptoe the line betweencomedy and grief because it's
part of the show.
And I I think you would enjoy itif you just watched the first
first episode, you know.
Um, but anyway, that's what I'vebeen watching.
Oh, by the way, I did watchJurassic Rebirth, whatever
(14:27):
world.
SPEAKER_01 (14:27):
Yeah, little Jonathan Bailey.
SPEAKER_00 (14:30):
Please, no more.
I we don't need after The LostWorld in '97.
We haven't had really a goodJurassic Park movie.
That's my that's my take.
All right.
SPEAKER_02 (14:40):
The only thing that could convince me to watch that
new Jurassic World movie isJonathan Bailey.
And I might watch Swindy becauseof him.
I might not, I don't know.
But I definitely agree with youthat we've had enough Jurassic
World movies, and I'm yeah, I'mdone.
Like, let's just let thefranchise rest for a good while.
Like a good time.
SPEAKER_00 (14:58):
How about do like uh some uh I don't want to keep
talking about it, but dosomething different out of the
box, like do an animated show,do something like when if you
were to watch it and and youwould to see the the storyline,
you're like, this is sofar-fetched.
Like, what are we doing next?
Are we gonna have underwater uhlab where it's just underwater
(15:18):
dinosaurs, or are they gonnahave in space, or we did uh
something in in Mars?
I don't know.
Anyway, sorry.
Let's go on to some bettertopics that we would know we
were gonna enjoy talking about.
SPEAKER_02 (15:31):
So, as you all know, though, 2025 was a year where
unfortunately we got anotherJurassic World movie, another
unfortunate situation this year,is that we had no Westerosi
shows at all this year, right?
Like we have obviously seen itwith our podcast, our coverages
last week.
Didn't talk about any new showthis this year at all.
You know, we didn't have anyweek-to-week analysis of any
(15:52):
episode.
And if you've been followingalong or you're a fan of the
show, then you obviously knowthat we're in for two big shows
next year.
The first season of United SevenKingdoms premiering in January,
and uh the next season of Houseof the Dragon, season three,
which is set to premiere insummer, summertime, summer 2026.
But it's just been announced uhand and reconfirmed almost that
(16:14):
we're after that we're basicallynot going to have a year without
a Game of Thrones related show.
Two shows next year, UnitedSeven Kingdoms and House of the
Dragon, and then in 2027, we'regoing to be having uh season two
of Unite of the Seven Kingdoms,and in 2028, we're going to be
having House of the Dragonseason four.
So for the next three years,we're pretty much sorted.
We can expect uh season three ofUnited Seven Kingdoms in 2029 as
(16:39):
well.
It seems like they should be ontrack for that.
I uh like they there could be achance of a delay, obviously,
even for these shows.
We never expected United SevenKingdoms to be delayed by just a
few months to push it to uhJanuary from now, November,
October, which is when we kindof expected it to be.
But this is at least like thetentative date of our show that
we're not going to have a yearwithout West Rossi stories on
(17:01):
screen.
SPEAKER_01 (17:01):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (17:02):
And we mentioned House of the Dragon season three
being out in 2026 and seasonfour being out in 2028, but
there's actually news now thatuh there might be a fifth
season.
Me and Tony talked about it lastyear where when we were covering
House of the Dragon season twoand they officially they were
like, that's it, it's just gonnabe four seasons.
We uh talked about how couldthey possibly uh structure and
end the show.
(17:22):
Tony shared his thoughts on it.
He has a lot of thoughts.
I'm sure he's gonna jump into itshortly.
Uh it's still kind ofunconfirmed, and uh that is
making me concerned.
So basically, the article thatdropped this news basically
said, Showrunner Ryan Condellhad previously revealed that the
series would end after fourseasons, but that was not
mentioned in the release and isup in the air right now.
Sources tell us Condal is stillwriting the fourth season and
(17:43):
the end date could change.
Condor will make the finaldecision after season four is
completed.
Those last words really worryme.
So he should be writing seasonfour already knowing if he's
going to be having a season fiveor not.
Not waiting until it's over.
Like I know that there's stilltime, but it's kind of worrying
me.
I like my shows kind ofpre-planned.
(18:06):
You know, we we didn't see thejust swinging it stuff go well
for Game of Thrones.
Um and though I think, you know,we mentioned Vince Gilligan uh
earlier, uh he said that not allof Breaking Bad is planned from
the very beginning, but it'salways that that feels so
unbelievable because it feelsperfectly planned out.
The end feels pre-planned fromthe beginning, you know, like it
(18:27):
feels like they didn't missanything, like didn't seem like
they were making it up as hewent along.
I don't think that this is goingto be as perfectly done as
Breaking Bad was.
This is worrying to me becausethey already have the existing
material, they could like justexpand on it.
If the situation or like the thehesitation kind of uh about the
renewal is coming from HBO, andthat's why they're kind of
(18:49):
putting Ryan Condell in thislimbo state of like, oh, we're
gonna wait until after thescripture season four is done,
then that's an executiveproblem.
But either way, it's still it'sstill worrying me.
I mean, they should this is thisis their their like one of their
biggest shows yet.
They already messed up seasontwo slightly.
That it caused some damage.
I don't want to see the samething happen with season three.
(19:09):
I want to know what you have tosay about it.
SPEAKER_00 (19:11):
Well, first off, I'm happy we have content for the
next three years or more.
Uh when we talk about Aegon'sconquest, that's another thing
that can you know happen.
As for this season four, goinginto season five, there's only
one reason why you'd go toseason five, and I hope they do.
And maybe they're just waitingto see how season three goes,
(19:33):
how it's um how the fans reactto it.
We're always gonna want more.
And they could also do like um,oh, we're gonna do season four
and split them.
We'll do six episodes here, andthen you know, if they wanted to
do that, and that way you getfour more episodes uh out of
this one particular uh storylinethat we want to talk about, and
(19:54):
that's needed um time.
Do want to mention, all right.
Let me just get into it.
For those who've read the novelFire and Blood, you can keep
listening.
We'll just do a timestamp forthis uh brief spoiler and then
we'll come back to it.
Uh all right, 3, 2, 1, spoilershere we go.
So the only reason why you wouldhave a season 5 is to do the
(20:15):
hour of the wolf.
That's when Craig and Starkcomes in and takes over as Hand
of the King.
And I do want to see that allunfold because you know you have
a mastic Stark presence in theKing's Landing, he kind of
brings Law and Order back.
There's a lot of executions.
Lord uh Corlus Valarian is inpart of it.
Like he, you know, Aegon is ispoisoned.
(20:37):
We talk about Renera, uh, howthat's all gonna happen.
I don't want the Hour of theWolf limited to one episode.
Yeah, you know what I mean?
Like it's just not enoughbecause if you have good
writers, you can make this intoeven if they did six episodes, I
would be okay.
That's the one thing I'mthinking about.
(21:00):
Um, because season four has tocover you know the back half of
the Dance of Dragons, the drag,you know, the Fall of King's
Line.
There's so much that they haveto cover in season three and
four that I'm hoping that thisnews comes to fruition and we
get a season five.
I I don't what are your thoughtson on the Hour of the Wolf?
Because I think it's one of thebest chapters in the book.
SPEAKER_02 (21:23):
I agree that it shouldn't be condensed into one
episode.
That was kind of what uh we oryou were really worried about
when they said that's just gonnabe four seasons.
Um so I think like three or fourepisodes, maybe even five, would
would be would be good.
Um I don't want to see any of itrushed, you know.
I mean I think that with Houseof the Dragon, they have this
(21:45):
weird thing with pacing whereseason one kind of felt a bit
too rushed.
People I I was fine with it, butthat's uh the impression that a
lot of people got from it.
And then with season two, itfelt like we were moving
breaking, like when you're in atraffic jam, it's like you you
move and then you stop youmoving.
That's exactly what season twofelt like because there would be
some developments within you,okay, something's going on with
(22:07):
Allison, but then also nothingreally important is happening.
It felt like a traffic jam, andthen Damon is the big mess of
the season where he was justwasting a whole the whole season
away having nightmares in inHeron Hall.
So it it has a it has a problemwith with pacing, and I uh think
that it's best for everyone ifthey just take their time.
With so many shows nowadays, theones that take their time are
(22:28):
the ones that actually succeed.
You know, you mentioned it inthe beginning of the episode
where like the new show, uhPlurribus, Fins Veligans, uh new
show takes is taking its timelike in one of the recent
episodes, and that's howBreaking Bad was, and Breaking
Bad is known to be likebasically perfect, and it was a
very slow show.
So if you just take your timeand like you should be good.
(22:49):
House of the Dragon is a showwhere it's kind of uh it came
with a built-in audience, itcame with uh people that are
going to tune in just becauseit's set in Westeros.
You could have taken your timewith everything and and and with
the with the planning, with thisand that.
Like if HBO rushed them, thenfine, maybe they rushed the
production.
But and I I won't blame it allon the writers because I keep
(23:10):
mentioning HBO because I knowthat's uh you know, we've seen
how where we know how executivesare and how their involvement
can really damage a product aswell.
I mean, we've seen it in theshow, I think it's called the
studio, right?
The one from the one with withSeth Rogan.
Like it's it's a big problem.
So whether who whoever's faultit is, it's not it's not good.
At the end of the day, you'redoing something that isn't
benefiting your show, it's notwhat the audiences want to see,
(23:33):
it's not the best decision.
So I think that they should justslow down uh and adapt it
faithfully or in the best waypossible.
SPEAKER_00 (23:42):
That's our dream, right?
People adapting faithfully.
But then let me uh let me uh I'msorry to inter interrupt.
Uh so okay, spoilers over.
Uh back to um our conversationhere.
No more spoilers.
SPEAKER_02 (23:54):
I was just gonna say, oh, yeah, no small no more
spoilers.
I was gonna just gonna say thatlike they with House of the
Dragon they have a pacing issue.
SPEAKER_00 (24:00):
They have uh I do think that season two, like I
don't want to keep defending it,uh, because I think when I
re-watch it next year beforeseason three, I'm gonna have a
lot more issues with it.
But yeah, if you think inhindsight, right, if let's say
we had 10 episodes, I think theseason would have been way
stronger because we would havehad the battle of the agree.
(24:22):
Uh we would have that would havebeen the penultimate episode,
and then we would have had theaftermath of the battle.
So that would have uh made upfor the oh my god, Damon and
Heronhall, oh my god, blah blahblah blah.
Kind of like season five of Gameof Thrones, where we're like,
why is this so boring?
Like, not so boring, but like itwas so slow, and then we got
(24:42):
Hard Home for season five.
We got you know, John, that wasuh almost a 10.
Then you have um season uhepisode nine with um what
happens in season five, episodenine?
Oh my gosh, I'm blanking.
SPEAKER_02 (24:56):
I'm googling it.
I am let me The Dance of theDragons.
It's Loki what our episode'snamed after.
Um what's our what's our podcastnamed after?
SPEAKER_00 (25:06):
But what happens in it?
Is it the one with Daenerys?
SPEAKER_02 (25:09):
It's yeah, when Danny leaves the fighting pits
when she rides the dragon forthe for the first time and flees
the city.
SPEAKER_00 (25:16):
Okay, and then obviously the finale we get
John's death.
So those final three episodeskind of made up for the majority
of season five.
So I think that would havehappened for season two, it's
what I'm saying.
But uh obviously it didn'thappen, so that's just me, you
know, whatever.
So um let me jump into this.
We'll we'll keep continuing andtalking about the show.
(25:37):
So if it let's say we do get aseason five, right?
Hypothetically, so that meanswe'll have another season in
2030, so then we'll have 26, 27,28, 29.
We'll be doing this podcast fora long time, and then if we get
Aegon's conquest, I'm assumingthey're gonna wait until House
of the Dragon is done becausewe're not gonna have two major
(25:58):
shows at the same time.
SPEAKER_02 (25:59):
Oh, yeah, yeah, definitely.
Not two tar very Targaryen-esqueshows at the same time.
SPEAKER_00 (26:04):
So then that's gonna happen, and that's gonna be
something that was talked aboutby George.
Uh, he was he had an appearancein Iceland, and um he he said,
Aside from the Knight of theSeven Kingdoms in House of the
Dragon, there are other GLTspin-off projects in
development.
Most are prequels, there areseveral in development, five or
(26:26):
six series, and I'm notdeveloping them alone, I'm
working with other people, andyes, there are some sequels.
Um quote prequels will be uhAegon's Conquest, which will be
a major, major, major show.
Uh tons of special effects, tonsof dragons.
The biggest dragon you will eversee on screen will be there.
(26:49):
Uh, this is gonna be a massiveundertaking, and there's you
know, this is something that umthey asked the the writer Matt
Matson Tomlin what's he mostexcited about with the show, and
he said the opening scene is theit's just just to see that come
to life on the show, which wedon't know what that could be.
That could be anything.
(27:10):
I mean, it's fun to speculatewhat the opening scene can be,
right?
It could be the Doom of Valeria,they could show that, they could
show the dragon dream prophecy,they could drill, you know, the
fleeing, leaving dragon.
You know, there's a lot of stuffto do.
Uh, and that's something I meanwe could always talk about in
the future.
Not until we see casting, youknow, directors.
(27:32):
Am I gonna get excited about it?
There's there's one little bitof news that I want to mention
that I thought it was kind offunny.
They came out a story about uhKid Harrington and Sophie
Turner.
SPEAKER_02 (27:43):
Yes, I did, but to remind me again what Kitts
exactly said.
SPEAKER_00 (27:47):
So apparently uh it was revealed that he's starring
opposite of Sophie Turner and asher love interest in this
upcoming movie called TheDreadful.
And uh he said, and I quote, shewas the one that sent that movie
to me and somehow didn't seewhat I saw in it.
(28:07):
I was like, these guys arelovers, right?
I felt very odd about that, butit was a good chance to be with
her again and work together.
It was slightly embarrassinghaving to get on an apple box to
kiss her because she's about afoot taller than me.
But other than that, my dignitywas pretty intact.
What was lovely is that we goton set together and our
(28:29):
friendship is completely ignitedagain.
It felt like being with family,it really did.
Unquote.
SPEAKER_02 (28:36):
Okay, so it like sweet but weird.
SPEAKER_00 (28:39):
Yeah, because uh how old was Sophie when uh Game of
Thrones started?
Well, like 14, maybe 15.
No, I don't think he um he wasborn in 1986.
So he was 23.
Oh so she was fifteen and he wastwenty-five.
So they're ten years older.
(29:00):
Anyway.
SPEAKER_02 (29:01):
Oh I mean it it's it's definitely weird.
SPEAKER_00 (29:05):
Um but but can I say is that they didn't really have
any screen time in C when shewas a minor.
The only time they got to seasonseven, season six, she was what
that was already twenty nineteentwenty eighteen.
So she was already twenty,probably.
It is kind of weird that you'regonna kiss her, but then again,
she's you know, twenty-five.
(29:27):
What how old is she now?
Thirty?
SPEAKER_02 (29:31):
Yeah, so yeah, but I mean still like the I like I
like I understand thatobviously, and that they both
seem okay with it, or likeSophie's okay with it, but like
I can't imagine being in thatposition position because they
everybody and like imagine howit's gonna be for us, the
viewers, as well, because weknow them as siblings as well,
too.
You know, like yeah, and intruth, they weren't even
(29:52):
siblings, they were cousins.
So, like we I don't know, likeit's it's gonna be weird uh for
everyone.
It was weird for them, it'sgonna be weird for us next.
SPEAKER_00 (30:01):
Okay, let's go move on to um sequels.
They talked about potentialsequels, and here's it was a
surprise.
Yeah, like we we've heard therumors uh a couple years ago
about John uh Kid Harringtonstarring in a show about Jon
Snow, and and we're like, why?
What would be the point of goingback with Jon Snow?
(30:23):
Here's the thing about Jon SnowI hated the fact.
That he went back to beyond thewall, whatever.
I thought he should have juststayed in Winterfell.
He did all that work.
Uh, what kind of show would youhave with Jon Snow?
Like he's exiled, he's beyondthe wall.
Maybe he's interacting with.
I mean, he finds um we haven'texplored the north, north,
(30:44):
north.
Maybe there's these magicalthreats that we don't know
about.
SPEAKER_01 (30:49):
Please, please.
SPEAKER_00 (30:51):
You know, but here you go.
Like, exactly.
Like, maybe some newsupernatural things, but how is
that gonna work if you didn'tincorporate that into the actual
show?
You know what I mean?
Like, you can't would I would Ilove to see a show with our
favorite actors coming back andplaying these roles?
Yeah, but what what will be thepoint of going back to the
(31:14):
future?
Back to the future.
Uh maybe if you did like agenerational jump where
everybody's gone and you havenew leaders and something else
pops up, uh, dragons mightreturn.
Who Drogon comes, whatever, orsorry, or you know what I mean?
Like, uh, what can we do?
Like, you can't have the same umhow you know fighting for the
(31:39):
throne, these houses, thebackstabbing, because we've seen
all that.
Like, it's hard, it's hard tothink about.
The one that I think might work,not might work, but I would
prefer to see something aboutthe north and have Sansa, you
know, Sansa's reign.
And you could have like, youknow, how the north is so hard
to control.
(31:59):
Maybe the northern lords or thepeople in the north don't want
to see a woman queen, uh aqueen, uh, you know, and then
you have a woman queen.
A woman queen.
You know, she inherits it.
There they have to, there'sfamine, there's something that
has, you know, there could besome kind of stark-centric
political big stakes, whatever,harsh winters, rumors spreading,
(32:22):
king's like you know what Imean.
There could be some term termmoral there, but how if your
brother's the king, he's alwaysgonna have your back.
That doesn't really work either.
So, I mean, this is somethingI'm just throwing out, like
whatever.
Uh, here's one that maybe uhtickles your fancy.
I don't know if that's aappropriate thing to say.
(32:46):
Uh Daenerys coming back to life.
Yeah, you call it the mother ofdragons.
No, no, after her death,Daenerys is brought to uh by
Drogon to the Red TempleValantis.
She's resurrected, but not thesame.
She's altered, she's carryingvisions, she sees uh thread in
(33:06):
Esos, and we get to see AmeliaClark.
SPEAKER_02 (33:10):
I mean, look, I I feel bad saying no, but I really
just don't want them to touchany of it again.
You know what I mean?
Like it's like even the conceptof Danny seeing where she would
be, like now starting all overagain in Esos, it doesn't appeal
to me.
Like, you know what it remindsme of, funnily enough?
(33:31):
You know, Joey, the the spin-offfrom Friends?
That's what that's giving me.
Very weird uh spin-off showwhere he goes to LA uh wanting
like a break from like NewYorker, like a new fresh start
in his acting career in LAinstead of New York, and he
leaves behind like the rest ofthe Friends crew, like Chandler,
Ross, whatever, and he startsthis new chapter of his life in
(33:52):
LA, and it's so bad.
Like it's not uh it's a showthat I enjoyed when I was like
11 and too young to watch bothFriends and Joey.
It's like objectively, it's notgreat, you know.
That's what that Danny storyfeels like to me, and I got the
ick hearing it.
Like, no, that's Joey.
That's just Joey.
I don't want it.
I don't want to see her struggleagain.
Like, she didn't have to shedoesn't have to go through that
again.
(34:12):
I don't want to see her struggleagain.
SPEAKER_00 (34:14):
Okay, let's say I give you um a mulligan, the
writing of the last season.
Again, we're gonna talk aboutthis in the future when we get
to season eight.
But whatever, let's just talkabout it right now.
What would have been yourpreference with her character?
Let's say they had freaking Johnstab her.
He doesn't do that.
What what should have happened?
SPEAKER_02 (34:35):
Listen, I'm going to be completely honest.
We talk about season eight allthe time, how much we hate it,
how much we're so unsatisfiedwith it, how it was a bad
ending, da da da da da.
I'm gonna be completely honestand say, I never like I never
came up with my own version ofhow I wanted the story to end
because I was just so trusting,you know, of like George.
(34:56):
And I kind of see the vision oflike I honestly see see v C
Bran.
Like I see that vision.
It's just that the sudden madqueen twist doesn't make any
sense.
So I don't know how I would wantthe story to go.
That deserves its whole likeseparate episode from us where
we talk about that and we saywe're gonna.
But I honestly don't have I'mgonna be honest and say I don't
(35:18):
have an answer about how I wouldrewrite like that last couple of
episodes of season eight andlike season eight as a whole.
That needs that needs so muchtime for me to think about.
I I don't know.
But before I ask your opinion, Iwill say like another kind of
bite-sized news that we haveabout this actually is that uh a
(35:39):
court in America, I think, hasruled that George R.
Martin can sue Opening Eye, thepeople behind ChatGPT, because I
heard or like there was somesort of news article or news
that came out that someone usedChat GPT to write like the best
version of how the Game ofThrones story could have ended.
And I don't I think that theywere trying to profit off of
that something.
(36:00):
I don't know because I don'tknow how the the suing part came
into play.
Like I f I found it veryinteresting that like and as
they should honestly, becausethe these AI machines obviously
just take from other stories andthen just generate it generates
content based on what they isalready existing.
So they kind of steal, right?
So yeah, that was just somethingthat came out.
(36:20):
And now let me ask that veryhard question to you, Tony.
How would you uh end seasoneight?
SPEAKER_00 (36:26):
I wrote something down here, and I think that
what's frustrating about seasoneight is just the laziness of
the writing and the laziness ofhow everything happened in that
last episode, since there's onlysix episodes, they had to rush
everything, and it's kind oflike okay, she takes over King's
Landing, and then the next dayshe gets stabbed.
(36:47):
Like, no having her guilt comeinto because we knew Daenerys to
be a compassionate person,empathetic, and not even have
her see her the struggle in hermind of what did I do, or yeah,
having the guilt of like I justcommitted genocide against all
these people.
What she it should have been herstruggling with her own actions.
(37:09):
We didn't get to see, and thatcould have been a great
something for Amelia to playwith, like that play with all
you know what I mean.
Like, and we didn't get to seethat.
We get to see an amazing shot ofher walking, and then you see
Drogon's wings flapping, whichis a great scene, a great shot.
But I it's hard to to decidewhat could have happened because
(37:29):
her burning down King's Landingto me doesn't make any sense.
Um that could have been the thefinale of a season, and you go,
Oh my god, what did thenarrators do?
And then you have to wait, andthen the whole next season is
the whole aftermath of do theytry to kill her.
You know what I mean?
Like we could have had we wererobbed.
(37:50):
Let's just say we were robbed,anyway.
Yeah, I I'm just throwing outsequel ideas, you know, none of
them are gonna agree to it.
I I think everyone who was apart of the show, uh other than
Kid Harrington, wants to comeback.
I think, you know, even whenthey asked them, you know,
Amelia, um Peter Dinklage, theyasked them about Hasa the
(38:10):
Dragon, like they're like, we'redone with that.
We're that part of our life, youknow.
I haven't seen the show.
Good luck to everybody.
You know, I hope the show doesgreat, but uh, we have no
interest in watching thatanymore, which I thought was
honest.
SPEAKER_01 (38:25):
Yeah, honestly, I don't blame them.
SPEAKER_00 (38:27):
Like, and then you have that famous interview or
that famous shot of Amelia,they're asking her, okay, yeah,
of what are you and she doesthat, like, oh my god, do I have
to say it?
It's and then you have the tablereading of her like slinking
into her chair, like, oh my god,this is horrible.
You know what I mean?
You see that that that shot ofthem looking at each other,
(38:49):
like, what the freak is going onhere?
And don't you think the writersor D were there?
And they're like, Oh shit, maybewe should rewrite this?
No, I think that they're they'reno no I'm just saying if they
had any conscience or like theycould read the room, but like,
okay, maybe we should um, yeah,we need to fix this.
(39:12):
Uh well, I'll just say what wedon't want to see.
We don't want to see Johnexploring the north.
SPEAKER_02 (39:17):
Uh no, no, no.
SPEAKER_00 (39:18):
Do we want to see do we want to see Aria going west
of Westeros?
SPEAKER_02 (39:24):
Tony, I don't want to see anything.
I don't want to see anything.
I don't like the concept of anysequel to like the like
literally, even if they say it'slike a thousand years into the
future, I don't want it.
Stories should end, they shouldhave an ending.
It's not life, you know, likeeven life, every life has an
ending.
I don't want to go deep in and Idon't want to say like silly
(39:45):
things because it's midnighthere and I'm I'm exhausted.
So I'm just gonna say whateverif I continue speaking that way,
but I don't want anything,anything that has to do with the
sequel uh world in Game ofThrones, I really just don't
want it.
Nothing could go well, and youknow what I think would be
horrible, what I think would beprobably the worst of the worst,
(40:06):
like worse than John, worse thanAri, worse than Sansa, is if
it's suddenly, oh, somehow theWhite Walkers returned.
Somehow Palpatine returned thatif if someone tells me that
that's what they're writing, Idon't know what I'm gonna do.
I don't know what I'm gonna do.
I'm gonna I'm gonna scream, I'mgonna walk into to the HBO
building and be like, this isthe stupidest idea that you've
(40:27):
ever had.
I don't know what George isgonna do.
Oh, it's so stupid.
I I I any sequel idea is is dumband should not be adapted.
I would not want to see that.
I don't care what it is, I don'twant it at all.
SPEAKER_00 (40:41):
I agree.
I don't want to see a sequelunless actually unless nothing.
I don't want to see a sequel.
SPEAKER_02 (40:46):
Yeah, no, no, no, no, no, unless I don't know.
SPEAKER_00 (40:49):
Because I saw somebody say, well, maybe you
could do a sequel of of peoplewe don't know, but like, okay,
but what would it be about?
SPEAKER_02 (40:55):
Yeah, no.
SPEAKER_00 (40:56):
We we already have a show that we're gonna focus on
the small folk.
That's gonna be the knight ofthe seven kingdoms.
SPEAKER_02 (41:02):
If we're talking about post-Game of Thrones, you
would have to always mention whois the king, who's this, like
you would have to like you youwould need to build that
timeline, you would need tofigure out what happens like to
brand, to to all of thecharacters that we know, and I
don't want to know any of it,you know, like that's it.
SPEAKER_00 (41:20):
And um well, wait until the books come out.
SPEAKER_02 (41:24):
Yeah, but that's the thing too.
Like, like they if they would doa sequel show, they'd be working
with with no material to be likejust off the top of their heads,
not like nothing approved fromGeorge.
That's horrible.
Yeah, I need oh I was gonna sp Iwas just about to rant in
Arabic.
Um, they already don't know whatthey're doing when they have
George's material perfectly laidout for them.
(41:44):
We are seeing like kind of umwarning signs or things that are
giving us, I guess, a bit ofhesitancy or confusion when it
comes to House of the Dragon.
George is feeling the same way,and everything is already
written out for them perfectlyin fire and blood.
It has like like all they needto do is just like expand on the
characters.
The main plot points are perfectas they are, and they're going
(42:06):
about and changing them for noreason.
And it's already written therein in like in front of them.
If they're just gonna be makingstuff off the top of their
heads, it's gonna be even worse.
Like they're just gonna bemaking things like it's gonna be
fanfiction at that point, youknow.
Like, oh, I think Bran marriesthis girl or whatever, and I
think that Sansa has these kidsand her son uh Edard II
(42:27):
something, something it's likeno, no, no, I don't want to see
any of it.
It's gonna be fanfiction.
SPEAKER_00 (42:33):
You think Sansa would wed somebody or marry
somebody?
SPEAKER_02 (42:37):
I I just said that because they they would they
could do that, you know.
Like I it's just something thatI said in a rambling moments
because I'm trying to toillustrate to our listeners how
unappetizing the idea of asequel show would be.
SPEAKER_00 (42:52):
I think, yeah, let's just move on here because we're
getting upset.
Um we're getting illustrated.
Uh uh, that's gonna be I thinkthat's gonna be all for uh this
episode.
Um, our 75th was gonna be usdiscussing the blood and cheese
uh book versus show, but wedecided that we wanted to talk
about this and this is timely asnews and give you our opinions,
(43:17):
but our next episode will beBlood and Cheese.
That's gonna be a fun onebecause we're gonna get dive
deep into what our opinions areof the show and the book and get
to talk about Allison because Ido I did re-listen to our uh Son
for Son episode, and my favoritepart is that you went on an
(43:40):
Allison rant for like 10minutes.
SPEAKER_01 (43:46):
I forgot that.
SPEAKER_00 (43:50):
Her actions in that episode infuriated you, and I
think I don't even rememberother than that last year.
And I think we'll I think whatwe'll do is we can both re-watch
the episode and then re you knowreread the chapters.
Yeah, we might have a littlespoilers because one of the main
reasons uh we I I'm gonna safelyassume we both didn't uh think
(44:12):
it was right because theyomitted a character.
So we'll talk about that.
So a quick note uh with thepodcast.
So after this episode, we'll dothe blood and cheese, like I
mentioned.
We'll we're planning to do atleast two more before the sea
the season, before the year isout.
Uh, one more, we'll have areturning guest.
We'll do a what if season three.
Um, check out what if season oneand two, those are fun to do,
(44:35):
and then we'll figure out anepisode before the year is out.
But other than that, thank youfor listening.
To follow us on Instagram, go todancing with underscore dragons.
There we post reels, stories, uhfun polls, and any updates to
the podcast you will find there.
If you want to shoot us a DM, goright ahead.
We welcome any ideas for thefuture shows.
(44:59):
Make sure to download ourepisodes in your preferred
podcast platform if you don'tmind.
Share, rate, all that goodstuff.
Thank you once again forlistening.
And here's to another 75episodes of Dancing with
Dragons.
Peace out.
Hello everyone, welcome to Dancing with Dragons,
your one and only podcast foreverything related to George R.
Martin's world of a song of iceand fire.
I'm one of your hosts, Minua,and I'm joined here by my
co-host Tony, and it's our 75thepisode of the podcast.
And we're here today to bringyou a quick news-focused episode
where we'll be discussing recentupdates regarding House of the
(00:29):
Dragon, the Knight of the SevenKingdoms, and more.
There's a lot happening inWesteros, so sit back and relax
as we get up to date togetherand everything you need to know.
But before that, let's catch upa little bit.
How are you, Tony?
It's been a while since wetalked.
SPEAKER_00 (00:40):
Yeah, we keep saying that every episode.
I'm doing fine.
How are you doing?
SPEAKER_02 (00:46):
I'm doing fine.
Thank you for asking.
Have you watched any new moviesor shows daily before we talk
about everything going on inWesteros?
Just I feel like I'm personallybehind on everything.
And I remember you saying thesame thing as well.
So I'm wondering if you arecaught up in any recent movies
and shows.
Because, spoiler alert, I am notthat caught up.
SPEAKER_00 (01:05):
I'm like a broken record on Instagram, and I keep
saying I'm so behind.
I am so behind.
Like last year, I started thetrend of not being able to watch
stuff like I did when I firststarted my accounts.
Because I remember 2020 wheneverything was locked down and
people were watching hundreds ofmovies.
(01:25):
And we were every day I had likea review up on Instagram, and
the content was just flowing,and now I'm going back to our
real lives.
But no, uh this year has beeneven not worse, but uh a
struggle to keep up with allthese new movies.
And I see people, oh, they'rewatching everything, and bless
their hearts that they can watchfive movies a day.
(01:48):
Um I think I've logged sixmovies on my litter box this
month, and that's the trend.
The last few months has beenfive here, four there.
But the last couple weeks I'vewatched a couple big movies that
were highly anticipated, andthat's the Leo DiCaprio and uh
Paul Thomas Anderson and Beniciodel Toro.
SPEAKER_02 (02:09):
Yeah, one battle after another, I loved it.
That's one of the few recentmovies I've watched, and I
really liked it.
It's actually the only PaulThomas Anderson movie that I
like.
I'm not a big fan of him.
I know uh yeah, that's anunpopular opinion, but that's
the only PTA movie that Iactually loved.
So the fact that I love it showsthat everyone can love it.
SPEAKER_00 (02:29):
Yeah, I think, well, I I think he's one of the best
directors we have right now.
And he has so many movies that Ithink are not so many, maybe
three, that I would consider amasterpiece.
And I think There Will Be Bloodis my favorite, just and then
it's just because of Daniel DayLewis and how he incredible he
is.
(02:50):
But this movie is just nothinglike any other movie he's ever
directed.
You know, I'm not gonna get intothe plot, but it's highly
political, and it's notsomething you'd expect.
I mean, you could expect it, butthe way the story twists and
turns, you're like, wait, what?
They don't really focus on oneparticular issue.
(03:11):
You could see the issues in thebackground that you go, okay, I
could relate to that in 2025 inthe world, especially in the US.
But I think this is Leo's one ofhis best performances, and it's
one of those performances thathe's uh like a bumbling idiot.
He's he's comical, it's kind oflike Wolf of Wall Street.
(03:33):
He had that scene where he'sbeing funny, he's not it's
dramatic, also.
He he's uh he's so underrated.
No, you know, people call himoverrated, but this is one of
his best.
And I I'm gonna bet a milliondollars he'll get another
nomination for best actor.
SPEAKER_01 (03:48):
Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (03:48):
Um, this is gonna get like what's today's date is
the 24th of November.
Stamp it now, it's gonna getlike 13 nominations for Academy
Awards.
Yeah, the whole movie is amazingand and from start to finish,
it's easily jumped to my numberone of the year.
And there's a lot of more moviesI I need to watch.
Um, but other than that, anyother movies you've seen
(04:11):
recently?
SPEAKER_02 (04:12):
Um, for me, honestly, it's just been
Frankenstein, Del Toro's newmovie.
It's one of my uh mostanticipated films of the year.
Just because I love Guillermodel Toro and I like the story of
Frankenstein as well, and I knowthat and being a fan of his, I
always knew that this would be apassion project for him, so I
was extremely excited to see howhe would adapt the story.
(04:33):
And um like I watched it likeabout a week or so after it
dropped on Netflix, and Ireally, really liked it.
Like the more it sat with me,the more I loved it.
Um it was it was one of thosemovies where my enjoyment kind
of wasn't just during the movieitself, like the more I thought
about it, the more I liked itand appreciated it, the more I
(04:54):
kind of read about it or sawwhat other people said said of
it, like their uh their praiseof it or their interpretations.
It's just I appreciate the moviemore and more and more.
So I think that in a few monthsor so I'm going to give it
another watch because Iunfortunately like just watched
it on my iPad.
I couldn't watch it like on abig screen the way I wanted to.
So it definitely deserves like aproper second view, and I'm
(05:17):
going to give it that.
Um, other than that, it's justbeen a couple of rewatches here
and there.
Um, I re-watched K-pop DemonHunters for like the third or
fourth time.
SPEAKER_00 (05:27):
I still need to watch that.
Uh, my daughter keeps telling meI need to watch it.
SPEAKER_02 (05:31):
Oh, I hope you enjoy it because it's so fun.
It's just a great animatedmovie.
Love all the details, and it'sso good.
I'm not as up to date as I'dlike to be.
I still haven't seen Wicked Part2.
Um, that's not one of my mostanticipated movies of the year,
and I it's out already, and Ijust didn't get the chance to
see it.
SPEAKER_00 (05:49):
Um I'm seeing a lot of lot of negative stuff coming
out from a lot of people I trustabout.
SPEAKER_02 (05:56):
Honestly, like I I don't I don't I'm not surprised
just because I know the storyinside and house.
You know, I watched the the theplay like a couple of times.
I I I know Wicked and I knowthat the second part is
significantly weaker than thefirst.
But at the same time, likedespite that, I love it.
I love Wicked, you know, like Iknow that it's not as good as
(06:16):
the first part, but I still loveit.
And my friends who are the exactsame way, they they said that
they enjoyed it.
SPEAKER_00 (06:22):
So I'm going off, I mean I'm going off the uh
reviewers here, and I I justlooked at um not that is
anything to curtail yourexcitement.
Um Rotten Tomatoes has it at71%.
I know part one was at 80, likethe high 80s, um, which I
(06:42):
watched part one, and I think Igave it the one, I got like one
star.
I think I gave it like a threeand a half.
SPEAKER_02 (06:50):
Okay, wow.
SPEAKER_00 (06:51):
Something that I would have um, and I saw it on
TV and I mean uh on the on myTV, and I think something that
like that I should be watched ona big screen.
Yeah, uh the one other thing Idid see.
Oh, I did watch Frankenstein.
I ended up giving it four and ahalf stars on Letterboxd.
I'll I'll be completely honest.
When it comes to the story ofFrankenstein, I have no idea.
(07:14):
Like I don't know the story.
Like I the only thing I know isthat Frankenstein is the doctor,
not the monster.
Uh because everybody alwaysconfuses that.
I went in, I thought the openingscene was amazing, just to start
off.
Mia Goth, uh, this is no shadeto her.
She like freaks me out when Isee her.
I don't know why.
Maybe it's because she's thishorror queen, right?
(07:37):
But the way she looks and talk,have you seen her talk in real
life?
Again, nothing against her.
SPEAKER_02 (07:42):
Yeah, I think so in a couple of interviews.
SPEAKER_00 (07:44):
It's really like if I were to hear her talking like
at three in the morning and Iwas in bed, I would it would
scare the crap out of me.
Because just the squeakiness,and anyway, um, again, nothing
against her.
I think she's really good.
Oscar Isaac was a kind of weirdchoice, but I love Oscar Isaac,
and I think he did well.
Uh it's nice to see uh TywinLannister in the movie.
SPEAKER_01 (08:08):
Uh yeah, that was a surprise.
SPEAKER_00 (08:10):
Charles Dance.
Uh, yeah, I think the moviewhat's the guy's name?
I forgot his name, Jacobsomething.
SPEAKER_02 (08:16):
Jacob Lordi, he was amazing.
Yeah, he was surprisingly, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (08:20):
And who what is he originally from?
SPEAKER_02 (08:23):
He was in Euphoria, which was like that show with
Zenday, and he was also in whichhe uh doesn't want to be known
for now, I think, but he was inuh the kissing booth on Netflix,
like that cheesy rom-com.
I didn't watch it.
SPEAKER_00 (08:36):
Hey, you know what, Jacob?
Everybody has those moments.
SPEAKER_01 (08:40):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (08:41):
You gotta, you gotta, you gotta own it.
You you want a paycheck, you'rean actor, you sometimes you
gotta do what you gotta do.
The music was great, it lookedgreat.
Uh, it's so funny.
I see a lot of people hating onit, like, oh, it looks so
manufactured, this looks so CGI.
Like, I didn't really see that,but hey, whatever.
I'm not gonna argue about moviesanymore with random people.
I've watched uh any shows beforewe get to uh our topics here.
SPEAKER_02 (09:31):
Yeah, I've watched two shows.
I've watched uh I just finisheda K-drama called Our Unwritten
Soul, which came out I thinkover the summer.
It's good, it's emotional.
Like it's it's it's a fineK-drama.
I have my I don't think it'sperfect, but it's it was a good
watch.
I think with a lot of showsnowadays, it's just for some
reason I don't feel like theyI'm interested for for for long,
(09:52):
if that makes sense.
Like I'd watch an episode ortwo, but I wouldn't feel um like
engaged enough to continue orI'd forget about it.
But this was a K-drama where Ijust kept it kept me up at
night, basically, because I keptwanting to to watch it.
And then I also watched andloved, or not loved, but I I I
thoroughly enjoyed thecompetition show Physical Asia
(10:12):
on on Netflix.
Like that athletic show.
SPEAKER_00 (10:15):
You know what?
I started watching somethingcalled 100.
I don't know if it was the samething.
SPEAKER_02 (10:20):
Physical 100, it's the same thing, but it's 100 is
yeah, yeah.
Physical 100 is just Korea, andthen physical Asia is where they
take like the best six athletesfrom uh different countries in
Asia and have them like fightagainst each other in different
like uh athletic competitionsbasically.
Um and it it it's okay, it wasvery fun to watch.
(10:42):
It there's a lot of discussiononline, which I kind of it seems
true to me that Korea kind ofcheated, if I'm honest, just
because it's their show and anduh like there were some moments
that were suspicious, butdespite that it was a fun, it
was a fun watch.
So I I needed something likethat at that time.
And I feel like now I finishedthose two shows and I I'm in
(11:04):
need of a good show.
You know what I mean?
Like I I need to watch somethinggood now, I need to start
something good.
So I hope that's whatever show Iwatch next is fun, enjoyable,
gripping.
That's what I need right now.
SPEAKER_00 (11:16):
Well, let me let me let me say something.
There's you know how those thesaying there's there's some
things that are certain in thisworld, right?
And um here's what I'm certainof the sun comes up every
morning, and when I ask yousomething about shows, you
always say K drama first.
SPEAKER_01 (11:35):
Oh, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (11:36):
Something K drama.
So I should have known.
SPEAKER_02 (11:38):
I have to.
SPEAKER_00 (11:39):
Uh here's something I recommend.
Uh, the were you a fan ofBreaking Bad and uh Better Call
Soul?
SPEAKER_02 (11:45):
Oh yeah, that that's what I should watch.
Plurbus.
Plurbus.
SPEAKER_00 (11:48):
Okay, so let me let me just tell you, I won't tell
you anything about it.
Okay, I went into it completely.
I don't need to see a trailerbecause I know Vince Gilligan is
the creator and he's the writer,and Rhea Seahorn is the main
actress.
So, right there, that's threewins.
It's the the is one of the bestfirst episodes of a show of all
time.
Um I'm just gonna say this Ithink that when you trust the
(12:13):
process of a great writer, youalways get rewarded, and that's
when I think people are so umhell-bent on being satisfied.
Like every five seconds theyneed to be.
Oh, this is like you know what Imean.
Like, we've come to a pointwhere if a show is not
mind-blowing, every episode uhit sucks.
(12:36):
Like they don't trust theprocess.
So that fourth episode, it wasjust building.
It's it has a it reminds you alot of a breaking bad and better
called Saul uh moments where hewould start an episode and
there's no dialogue.
He's just showing you themundane action of somebody, but
it has a point to it.
(12:57):
The concept is is original, it'sgreat, and I think you're gonna
really enjoy it, especiallyafter that first episode.
Anyway, um, another show that uhthis is it right here.
I'm promised last thing.
Uh, I've been uh hounded by mywife to watch a show for two
years, shrinking on Apple TV,which I think Apple TV is
becoming one of the beststreaming services that we have
(13:19):
because they just put offbangers after bangers.
Uh I've been putting it off, Idon't really want to watch it,
blah blah blah blah.
Uh I finally watched the firstepisode.
We binged it in like, I don'tknow, a couple days.
And which is nice that they'reum they average like 30 minutes
to episodes.
I love the first season.
I think you know Harrison Fordis perfect to play a curmudgeon,
(13:41):
a therapist, but also have youknow the heart deep down there,
you know what I mean?
So he he plays his roleperfectly.
Uh, the guy who plays the mainguy, Jason Siegel, uh, doing
great.
I didn't know that the BrettGoldstein who plays Roy Kent and
Ted Lasso, he's the one of he'sone of the creators of the show.
(14:04):
And he's actually starring inseason two, which I'm midway
through.
I really enjoyed the show.
Eight out of ten season one.
They tiptoe the line betweencomedy and grief because it's
part of the show.
And I I think you would enjoy itif you just watched the first
first episode, you know.
Um, but anyway, that's what I'vebeen watching.
Oh, by the way, I did watchJurassic Rebirth, whatever
(14:27):
world.
SPEAKER_01 (14:27):
Yeah, little Jonathan Bailey.
SPEAKER_00 (14:30):
Please, no more.
I we don't need after The LostWorld in '97.
We haven't had really a goodJurassic Park movie.
That's my that's my take.
All right.
SPEAKER_02 (14:40):
The only thing that could convince me to watch that
new Jurassic World movie isJonathan Bailey.
And I might watch Swindy becauseof him.
I might not, I don't know.
But I definitely agree with youthat we've had enough Jurassic
World movies, and I'm yeah, I'mdone.
Like, let's just let thefranchise rest for a good while.
Like a good time.
SPEAKER_00 (14:58):
How about do like uh some uh I don't want to keep
talking about it, but dosomething different out of the
box, like do an animated show,do something like when if you
were to watch it and and youwould to see the the storyline,
you're like, this is sofar-fetched.
Like, what are we doing next?
Are we gonna have underwater uhlab where it's just underwater
(15:18):
dinosaurs, or are they gonnahave in space, or we did uh
something in in Mars?
I don't know.
Anyway, sorry.
Let's go on to some bettertopics that we would know we
were gonna enjoy talking about.
SPEAKER_02 (15:31):
So, as you all know, though, 2025 was a year where
unfortunately we got anotherJurassic World movie, another
unfortunate situation this year,is that we had no Westerosi
shows at all this year, right?
Like we have obviously seen itwith our podcast, our coverages
last week.
Didn't talk about any new showthis this year at all.
You know, we didn't have anyweek-to-week analysis of any
(15:52):
episode.
And if you've been followingalong or you're a fan of the
show, then you obviously knowthat we're in for two big shows
next year.
The first season of United SevenKingdoms premiering in January,
and uh the next season of Houseof the Dragon, season three,
which is set to premiere insummer, summertime, summer 2026.
But it's just been announced uhand and reconfirmed almost that
(16:14):
we're after that we're basicallynot going to have a year without
a Game of Thrones related show.
Two shows next year, UnitedSeven Kingdoms and House of the
Dragon, and then in 2027, we'regoing to be having uh season two
of Unite of the Seven Kingdoms,and in 2028, we're going to be
having House of the Dragonseason four.
So for the next three years,we're pretty much sorted.
We can expect uh season three ofUnited Seven Kingdoms in 2029 as
(16:39):
well.
It seems like they should be ontrack for that.
I uh like they there could be achance of a delay, obviously,
even for these shows.
We never expected United SevenKingdoms to be delayed by just a
few months to push it to uhJanuary from now, November,
October, which is when we kindof expected it to be.
But this is at least like thetentative date of our show that
we're not going to have a yearwithout West Rossi stories on
(17:01):
screen.
SPEAKER_01 (17:01):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (17:02):
And we mentioned House of the Dragon season three
being out in 2026 and seasonfour being out in 2028, but
there's actually news now thatuh there might be a fifth
season.
Me and Tony talked about it lastyear where when we were covering
House of the Dragon season twoand they officially they were
like, that's it, it's just gonnabe four seasons.
We uh talked about how couldthey possibly uh structure and
end the show.
(17:22):
Tony shared his thoughts on it.
He has a lot of thoughts.
I'm sure he's gonna jump into itshortly.
Uh it's still kind ofunconfirmed, and uh that is
making me concerned.
So basically, the article thatdropped this news basically
said, Showrunner Ryan Condellhad previously revealed that the
series would end after fourseasons, but that was not
mentioned in the release and isup in the air right now.
Sources tell us Condal is stillwriting the fourth season and
(17:43):
the end date could change.
Condor will make the finaldecision after season four is
completed.
Those last words really worryme.
So he should be writing seasonfour already knowing if he's
going to be having a season fiveor not.
Not waiting until it's over.
Like I know that there's stilltime, but it's kind of worrying
me.
I like my shows kind ofpre-planned.
(18:06):
You know, we we didn't see thejust swinging it stuff go well
for Game of Thrones.
Um and though I think, you know,we mentioned Vince Gilligan uh
earlier, uh he said that not allof Breaking Bad is planned from
the very beginning, but it'salways that that feels so
unbelievable because it feelsperfectly planned out.
The end feels pre-planned fromthe beginning, you know, like it
(18:27):
feels like they didn't missanything, like didn't seem like
they were making it up as hewent along.
I don't think that this is goingto be as perfectly done as
Breaking Bad was.
This is worrying to me becausethey already have the existing
material, they could like justexpand on it.
If the situation or like the thehesitation kind of uh about the
renewal is coming from HBO, andthat's why they're kind of
(18:49):
putting Ryan Condell in thislimbo state of like, oh, we're
gonna wait until after thescripture season four is done,
then that's an executiveproblem.
But either way, it's still it'sstill worrying me.
I mean, they should this is thisis their their like one of their
biggest shows yet.
They already messed up seasontwo slightly.
That it caused some damage.
I don't want to see the samething happen with season three.
(19:09):
I want to know what you have tosay about it.
SPEAKER_00 (19:11):
Well, first off, I'm happy we have content for the
next three years or more.
Uh when we talk about Aegon'sconquest, that's another thing
that can you know happen.
As for this season four, goinginto season five, there's only
one reason why you'd go toseason five, and I hope they do.
And maybe they're just waitingto see how season three goes,
(19:33):
how it's um how the fans reactto it.
We're always gonna want more.
And they could also do like um,oh, we're gonna do season four
and split them.
We'll do six episodes here, andthen you know, if they wanted to
do that, and that way you getfour more episodes uh out of
this one particular uh storylinethat we want to talk about, and
(19:54):
that's needed um time.
Do want to mention, all right.
Let me just get into it.
For those who've read the novelFire and Blood, you can keep
listening.
We'll just do a timestamp forthis uh brief spoiler and then
we'll come back to it.
Uh all right, 3, 2, 1, spoilershere we go.
So the only reason why you wouldhave a season 5 is to do the
(20:15):
hour of the wolf.
That's when Craig and Starkcomes in and takes over as Hand
of the King.
And I do want to see that allunfold because you know you have
a mastic Stark presence in theKing's Landing, he kind of
brings Law and Order back.
There's a lot of executions.
Lord uh Corlus Valarian is inpart of it.
Like he, you know, Aegon is ispoisoned.
(20:37):
We talk about Renera, uh, howthat's all gonna happen.
I don't want the Hour of theWolf limited to one episode.
Yeah, you know what I mean?
Like it's just not enoughbecause if you have good
writers, you can make this intoeven if they did six episodes, I
would be okay.
That's the one thing I'mthinking about.
(21:00):
Um, because season four has tocover you know the back half of
the Dance of Dragons, the drag,you know, the Fall of King's
Line.
There's so much that they haveto cover in season three and
four that I'm hoping that thisnews comes to fruition and we
get a season five.
I I don't what are your thoughtson on the Hour of the Wolf?
Because I think it's one of thebest chapters in the book.
SPEAKER_02 (21:23):
I agree that it shouldn't be condensed into one
episode.
That was kind of what uh we oryou were really worried about
when they said that's just gonnabe four seasons.
Um so I think like three or fourepisodes, maybe even five, would
would be would be good.
Um I don't want to see any of itrushed, you know.
I mean I think that with Houseof the Dragon, they have this
(21:45):
weird thing with pacing whereseason one kind of felt a bit
too rushed.
People I I was fine with it, butthat's uh the impression that a
lot of people got from it.
And then with season two, itfelt like we were moving
breaking, like when you're in atraffic jam, it's like you you
move and then you stop youmoving.
That's exactly what season twofelt like because there would be
some developments within you,okay, something's going on with
(22:07):
Allison, but then also nothingreally important is happening.
It felt like a traffic jam, andthen Damon is the big mess of
the season where he was justwasting a whole the whole season
away having nightmares in inHeron Hall.
So it it has a it has a problemwith with pacing, and I uh think
that it's best for everyone ifthey just take their time.
With so many shows nowadays, theones that take their time are
(22:28):
the ones that actually succeed.
You know, you mentioned it inthe beginning of the episode
where like the new show, uhPlurribus, Fins Veligans, uh new
show takes is taking its timelike in one of the recent
episodes, and that's howBreaking Bad was, and Breaking
Bad is known to be likebasically perfect, and it was a
very slow show.
So if you just take your timeand like you should be good.
(22:49):
House of the Dragon is a showwhere it's kind of uh it came
with a built-in audience, itcame with uh people that are
going to tune in just becauseit's set in Westeros.
You could have taken your timewith everything and and and with
the with the planning, with thisand that.
Like if HBO rushed them, thenfine, maybe they rushed the
production.
But and I I won't blame it allon the writers because I keep
(23:10):
mentioning HBO because I knowthat's uh you know, we've seen
how where we know how executivesare and how their involvement
can really damage a product aswell.
I mean, we've seen it in theshow, I think it's called the
studio, right?
The one from the one with withSeth Rogan.
Like it's it's a big problem.
So whether who whoever's faultit is, it's not it's not good.
At the end of the day, you'redoing something that isn't
benefiting your show, it's notwhat the audiences want to see,
(23:33):
it's not the best decision.
So I think that they should justslow down uh and adapt it
faithfully or in the best waypossible.
SPEAKER_00 (23:42):
That's our dream, right?
People adapting faithfully.
But then let me uh let me uh I'msorry to inter interrupt.
Uh so okay, spoilers over.
Uh back to um our conversationhere.
No more spoilers.
SPEAKER_02 (23:54):
I was just gonna say, oh, yeah, no small no more
spoilers.
I was gonna just gonna say thatlike they with House of the
Dragon they have a pacing issue.
SPEAKER_00 (24:00):
They have uh I do think that season two, like I
don't want to keep defending it,uh, because I think when I
re-watch it next year beforeseason three, I'm gonna have a
lot more issues with it.
But yeah, if you think inhindsight, right, if let's say
we had 10 episodes, I think theseason would have been way
stronger because we would havehad the battle of the agree.
(24:22):
Uh we would have that would havebeen the penultimate episode,
and then we would have had theaftermath of the battle.
So that would have uh made upfor the oh my god, Damon and
Heronhall, oh my god, blah blahblah blah.
Kind of like season five of Gameof Thrones, where we're like,
why is this so boring?
Like, not so boring, but like itwas so slow, and then we got
(24:42):
Hard Home for season five.
We got you know, John, that wasuh almost a 10.
Then you have um season uhepisode nine with um what
happens in season five, episodenine?
Oh my gosh, I'm blanking.
SPEAKER_02 (24:56):
I'm googling it.
I am let me The Dance of theDragons.
It's Loki what our episode'snamed after.
Um what's our what's our podcastnamed after?
SPEAKER_00 (25:06):
But what happens in it?
Is it the one with Daenerys?
SPEAKER_02 (25:09):
It's yeah, when Danny leaves the fighting pits
when she rides the dragon forthe for the first time and flees
the city.
SPEAKER_00 (25:16):
Okay, and then obviously the finale we get
John's death.
So those final three episodeskind of made up for the majority
of season five.
So I think that would havehappened for season two, it's
what I'm saying.
But uh obviously it didn'thappen, so that's just me, you
know, whatever.
So um let me jump into this.
We'll we'll keep continuing andtalking about the show.
(25:37):
So if it let's say we do get aseason five, right?
Hypothetically, so that meanswe'll have another season in
2030, so then we'll have 26, 27,28, 29.
We'll be doing this podcast fora long time, and then if we get
Aegon's conquest, I'm assumingthey're gonna wait until House
of the Dragon is done becausewe're not gonna have two major
(25:58):
shows at the same time.
SPEAKER_02 (25:59):
Oh, yeah, yeah, definitely.
Not two tar very Targaryen-esqueshows at the same time.
SPEAKER_00 (26:04):
So then that's gonna happen, and that's gonna be
something that was talked aboutby George.
Uh, he was he had an appearancein Iceland, and um he he said,
Aside from the Knight of theSeven Kingdoms in House of the
Dragon, there are other GLTspin-off projects in
development.
Most are prequels, there areseveral in development, five or
(26:26):
six series, and I'm notdeveloping them alone, I'm
working with other people, andyes, there are some sequels.
Um quote prequels will be uhAegon's Conquest, which will be
a major, major, major show.
Uh tons of special effects, tonsof dragons.
The biggest dragon you will eversee on screen will be there.
(26:49):
Uh, this is gonna be a massiveundertaking, and there's you
know, this is something that umthey asked the the writer Matt
Matson Tomlin what's he mostexcited about with the show, and
he said the opening scene is theit's just just to see that come
to life on the show, which wedon't know what that could be.
That could be anything.
(27:10):
I mean, it's fun to speculatewhat the opening scene can be,
right?
It could be the Doom of Valeria,they could show that, they could
show the dragon dream prophecy,they could drill, you know, the
fleeing, leaving dragon.
You know, there's a lot of stuffto do.
Uh, and that's something I meanwe could always talk about in
the future.
Not until we see casting, youknow, directors.
(27:32):
Am I gonna get excited about it?
There's there's one little bitof news that I want to mention
that I thought it was kind offunny.
They came out a story about uhKid Harrington and Sophie
Turner.
SPEAKER_02 (27:43):
Yes, I did, but to remind me again what Kitts
exactly said.
SPEAKER_00 (27:47):
So apparently uh it was revealed that he's starring
opposite of Sophie Turner and asher love interest in this
upcoming movie called TheDreadful.
And uh he said, and I quote, shewas the one that sent that movie
to me and somehow didn't seewhat I saw in it.
(28:07):
I was like, these guys arelovers, right?
I felt very odd about that, butit was a good chance to be with
her again and work together.
It was slightly embarrassinghaving to get on an apple box to
kiss her because she's about afoot taller than me.
But other than that, my dignitywas pretty intact.
What was lovely is that we goton set together and our
(28:29):
friendship is completely ignitedagain.
It felt like being with family,it really did.
Unquote.
SPEAKER_02 (28:36):
Okay, so it like sweet but weird.
SPEAKER_00 (28:39):
Yeah, because uh how old was Sophie when uh Game of
Thrones started?
Well, like 14, maybe 15.
No, I don't think he um he wasborn in 1986.
So he was 23.
Oh so she was fifteen and he wastwenty-five.
So they're ten years older.
(29:00):
Anyway.
SPEAKER_02 (29:01):
Oh I mean it it's it's definitely weird.
SPEAKER_00 (29:05):
Um but but can I say is that they didn't really have
any screen time in C when shewas a minor.
The only time they got to seasonseven, season six, she was what
that was already twenty nineteentwenty eighteen.
So she was already twenty,probably.
It is kind of weird that you'regonna kiss her, but then again,
she's you know, twenty-five.
(29:27):
What how old is she now?
Thirty?
SPEAKER_02 (29:31):
Yeah, so yeah, but I mean still like the I like I
like I understand thatobviously, and that they both
seem okay with it, or likeSophie's okay with it, but like
I can't imagine being in thatposition position because they
everybody and like imagine howit's gonna be for us, the
viewers, as well, because weknow them as siblings as well,
too.
You know, like yeah, and intruth, they weren't even
(29:52):
siblings, they were cousins.
So, like we I don't know, likeit's it's gonna be weird uh for
everyone.
It was weird for them, it'sgonna be weird for us next.
SPEAKER_00 (30:01):
Okay, let's go move on to um sequels.
They talked about potentialsequels, and here's it was a
surprise.
Yeah, like we we've heard therumors uh a couple years ago
about John uh Kid Harringtonstarring in a show about Jon
Snow, and and we're like, why?
What would be the point of goingback with Jon Snow?
(30:23):
Here's the thing about Jon SnowI hated the fact.
That he went back to beyond thewall, whatever.
I thought he should have juststayed in Winterfell.
He did all that work.
Uh, what kind of show would youhave with Jon Snow?
Like he's exiled, he's beyondthe wall.
Maybe he's interacting with.
I mean, he finds um we haven'texplored the north, north,
(30:44):
north.
Maybe there's these magicalthreats that we don't know
about.
SPEAKER_01 (30:49):
Please, please.
SPEAKER_00 (30:51):
You know, but here you go.
Like, exactly.
Like, maybe some newsupernatural things, but how is
that gonna work if you didn'tincorporate that into the actual
show?
You know what I mean?
Like, you can't would I would Ilove to see a show with our
favorite actors coming back andplaying these roles?
Yeah, but what what will be thepoint of going back to the
(31:14):
future?
Back to the future.
Uh maybe if you did like agenerational jump where
everybody's gone and you havenew leaders and something else
pops up, uh, dragons mightreturn.
Who Drogon comes, whatever, orsorry, or you know what I mean?
Like, uh, what can we do?
Like, you can't have the same umhow you know fighting for the
(31:39):
throne, these houses, thebackstabbing, because we've seen
all that.
Like, it's hard, it's hard tothink about.
The one that I think might work,not might work, but I would
prefer to see something aboutthe north and have Sansa, you
know, Sansa's reign.
And you could have like, youknow, how the north is so hard
to control.
(31:59):
Maybe the northern lords or thepeople in the north don't want
to see a woman queen, uh aqueen, uh, you know, and then
you have a woman queen.
A woman queen.
You know, she inherits it.
There they have to, there'sfamine, there's something that
has, you know, there could besome kind of stark-centric
political big stakes, whatever,harsh winters, rumors spreading,
(32:22):
king's like you know what Imean.
There could be some term termmoral there, but how if your
brother's the king, he's alwaysgonna have your back.
That doesn't really work either.
So, I mean, this is somethingI'm just throwing out, like
whatever.
Uh, here's one that maybe uhtickles your fancy.
I don't know if that's aappropriate thing to say.
(32:46):
Uh Daenerys coming back to life.
Yeah, you call it the mother ofdragons.
No, no, after her death,Daenerys is brought to uh by
Drogon to the Red TempleValantis.
She's resurrected, but not thesame.
She's altered, she's carryingvisions, she sees uh thread in
(33:06):
Esos, and we get to see AmeliaClark.
SPEAKER_02 (33:10):
I mean, look, I I feel bad saying no, but I really
just don't want them to touchany of it again.
You know what I mean?
Like it's like even the conceptof Danny seeing where she would
be, like now starting all overagain in Esos, it doesn't appeal
to me.
Like, you know what it remindsme of, funnily enough?
(33:31):
You know, Joey, the the spin-offfrom Friends?
That's what that's giving me.
Very weird uh spin-off showwhere he goes to LA uh wanting
like a break from like NewYorker, like a new fresh start
in his acting career in LAinstead of New York, and he
leaves behind like the rest ofthe Friends crew, like Chandler,
Ross, whatever, and he startsthis new chapter of his life in
(33:52):
LA, and it's so bad.
Like it's not uh it's a showthat I enjoyed when I was like
11 and too young to watch bothFriends and Joey.
It's like objectively, it's notgreat, you know.
That's what that Danny storyfeels like to me, and I got the
ick hearing it.
Like, no, that's Joey.
That's just Joey.
I don't want it.
I don't want to see her struggleagain.
Like, she didn't have to shedoesn't have to go through that
again.
(34:12):
I don't want to see her struggleagain.
SPEAKER_00 (34:14):
Okay, let's say I give you um a mulligan, the
writing of the last season.
Again, we're gonna talk aboutthis in the future when we get
to season eight.
But whatever, let's just talkabout it right now.
What would have been yourpreference with her character?
Let's say they had freaking Johnstab her.
He doesn't do that.
What what should have happened?
SPEAKER_02 (34:35):
Listen, I'm going to be completely honest.
We talk about season eight allthe time, how much we hate it,
how much we're so unsatisfiedwith it, how it was a bad
ending, da da da da da.
I'm gonna be completely honestand say, I never like I never
came up with my own version ofhow I wanted the story to end
because I was just so trusting,you know, of like George.
(34:56):
And I kind of see the vision oflike I honestly see see v C
Bran.
Like I see that vision.
It's just that the sudden madqueen twist doesn't make any
sense.
So I don't know how I would wantthe story to go.
That deserves its whole likeseparate episode from us where
we talk about that and we saywe're gonna.
But I honestly don't have I'mgonna be honest and say I don't
(35:18):
have an answer about how I wouldrewrite like that last couple of
episodes of season eight andlike season eight as a whole.
That needs that needs so muchtime for me to think about.
I I don't know.
But before I ask your opinion, Iwill say like another kind of
bite-sized news that we haveabout this actually is that uh a
(35:39):
court in America, I think, hasruled that George R.
Martin can sue Opening Eye, thepeople behind ChatGPT, because I
heard or like there was somesort of news article or news
that came out that someone usedChat GPT to write like the best
version of how the Game ofThrones story could have ended.
And I don't I think that theywere trying to profit off of
that something.
(36:00):
I don't know because I don'tknow how the the suing part came
into play.
Like I f I found it veryinteresting that like and as
they should honestly, becausethe these AI machines obviously
just take from other stories andthen just generate it generates
content based on what they isalready existing.
So they kind of steal, right?
So yeah, that was just somethingthat came out.
(36:20):
And now let me ask that veryhard question to you, Tony.
How would you uh end seasoneight?
SPEAKER_00 (36:26):
I wrote something down here, and I think that
what's frustrating about seasoneight is just the laziness of
the writing and the laziness ofhow everything happened in that
last episode, since there's onlysix episodes, they had to rush
everything, and it's kind oflike okay, she takes over King's
Landing, and then the next dayshe gets stabbed.
(36:47):
Like, no having her guilt comeinto because we knew Daenerys to
be a compassionate person,empathetic, and not even have
her see her the struggle in hermind of what did I do, or yeah,
having the guilt of like I justcommitted genocide against all
these people.
What she it should have been herstruggling with her own actions.
(37:09):
We didn't get to see, and thatcould have been a great
something for Amelia to playwith, like that play with all
you know what I mean.
Like, and we didn't get to seethat.
We get to see an amazing shot ofher walking, and then you see
Drogon's wings flapping, whichis a great scene, a great shot.
But I it's hard to to decidewhat could have happened because
(37:29):
her burning down King's Landingto me doesn't make any sense.
Um that could have been the thefinale of a season, and you go,
Oh my god, what did thenarrators do?
And then you have to wait, andthen the whole next season is
the whole aftermath of do theytry to kill her.
You know what I mean?
Like we could have had we wererobbed.
(37:50):
Let's just say we were robbed,anyway.
Yeah, I I'm just throwing outsequel ideas, you know, none of
them are gonna agree to it.
I I think everyone who was apart of the show, uh other than
Kid Harrington, wants to comeback.
I think, you know, even whenthey asked them, you know,
Amelia, um Peter Dinklage, theyasked them about Hasa the
(38:10):
Dragon, like they're like, we'redone with that.
We're that part of our life, youknow.
I haven't seen the show.
Good luck to everybody.
You know, I hope the show doesgreat, but uh, we have no
interest in watching thatanymore, which I thought was
honest.
SPEAKER_01 (38:25):
Yeah, honestly, I don't blame them.
SPEAKER_00 (38:27):
Like, and then you have that famous interview or
that famous shot of Amelia,they're asking her, okay, yeah,
of what are you and she doesthat, like, oh my god, do I have
to say it?
It's and then you have the tablereading of her like slinking
into her chair, like, oh my god,this is horrible.
You know what I mean?
You see that that that shot ofthem looking at each other,
(38:49):
like, what the freak is going onhere?
And don't you think the writersor D were there?
And they're like, Oh shit, maybewe should rewrite this?
No, I think that they're they'reno no I'm just saying if they
had any conscience or like theycould read the room, but like,
okay, maybe we should um, yeah,we need to fix this.
(39:12):
Uh well, I'll just say what wedon't want to see.
We don't want to see Johnexploring the north.
SPEAKER_02 (39:17):
Uh no, no, no.
SPEAKER_00 (39:18):
Do we want to see do we want to see Aria going west
of Westeros?
SPEAKER_02 (39:24):
Tony, I don't want to see anything.
I don't want to see anything.
I don't like the concept of anysequel to like the like
literally, even if they say it'slike a thousand years into the
future, I don't want it.
Stories should end, they shouldhave an ending.
It's not life, you know, likeeven life, every life has an
ending.
I don't want to go deep in and Idon't want to say like silly
(39:45):
things because it's midnighthere and I'm I'm exhausted.
So I'm just gonna say whateverif I continue speaking that way,
but I don't want anything,anything that has to do with the
sequel uh world in Game ofThrones, I really just don't
want it.
Nothing could go well, and youknow what I think would be
horrible, what I think would beprobably the worst of the worst,
(40:06):
like worse than John, worse thanAri, worse than Sansa, is if
it's suddenly, oh, somehow theWhite Walkers returned.
Somehow Palpatine returned thatif if someone tells me that
that's what they're writing, Idon't know what I'm gonna do.
I don't know what I'm gonna do.
I'm gonna I'm gonna scream, I'mgonna walk into to the HBO
building and be like, this isthe stupidest idea that you've
(40:27):
ever had.
I don't know what George isgonna do.
Oh, it's so stupid.
I I I any sequel idea is is dumband should not be adapted.
I would not want to see that.
I don't care what it is, I don'twant it at all.
SPEAKER_00 (40:41):
I agree.
I don't want to see a sequelunless actually unless nothing.
I don't want to see a sequel.
SPEAKER_02 (40:46):
Yeah, no, no, no, no, no, unless I don't know.
SPEAKER_00 (40:49):
Because I saw somebody say, well, maybe you
could do a sequel of of peoplewe don't know, but like, okay,
but what would it be about?
SPEAKER_02 (40:55):
Yeah, no.
SPEAKER_00 (40:56):
We we already have a show that we're gonna focus on
the small folk.
That's gonna be the knight ofthe seven kingdoms.
SPEAKER_02 (41:02):
If we're talking about post-Game of Thrones, you
would have to always mention whois the king, who's this, like
you would have to like you youwould need to build that
timeline, you would need tofigure out what happens like to
brand, to to all of thecharacters that we know, and I
don't want to know any of it,you know, like that's it.
SPEAKER_00 (41:20):
And um well, wait until the books come out.
SPEAKER_02 (41:24):
Yeah, but that's the thing too.
Like, like they if they would doa sequel show, they'd be working
with with no material to be likejust off the top of their heads,
not like nothing approved fromGeorge.
That's horrible.
Yeah, I need oh I was gonna sp Iwas just about to rant in
Arabic.
Um, they already don't know whatthey're doing when they have
George's material perfectly laidout for them.
(41:44):
We are seeing like kind of umwarning signs or things that are
giving us, I guess, a bit ofhesitancy or confusion when it
comes to House of the Dragon.
George is feeling the same way,and everything is already
written out for them perfectlyin fire and blood.
It has like like all they needto do is just like expand on the
characters.
The main plot points are perfectas they are, and they're going
(42:06):
about and changing them for noreason.
And it's already written therein in like in front of them.
If they're just gonna be makingstuff off the top of their
heads, it's gonna be even worse.
Like they're just gonna bemaking things like it's gonna be
fanfiction at that point, youknow.
Like, oh, I think Bran marriesthis girl or whatever, and I
think that Sansa has these kidsand her son uh Edard II
(42:27):
something, something it's likeno, no, no, I don't want to see
any of it.
It's gonna be fanfiction.
SPEAKER_00 (42:33):
You think Sansa would wed somebody or marry
somebody?
SPEAKER_02 (42:37):
I I just said that because they they would they
could do that, you know.
Like I it's just something thatI said in a rambling moments
because I'm trying to toillustrate to our listeners how
unappetizing the idea of asequel show would be.
SPEAKER_00 (42:52):
I think, yeah, let's just move on here because we're
getting upset.
Um we're getting illustrated.
Uh uh, that's gonna be I thinkthat's gonna be all for uh this
episode.
Um, our 75th was gonna be usdiscussing the blood and cheese
uh book versus show, but wedecided that we wanted to talk
about this and this is timely asnews and give you our opinions,
(43:17):
but our next episode will beBlood and Cheese.
That's gonna be a fun onebecause we're gonna get dive
deep into what our opinions areof the show and the book and get
to talk about Allison because Ido I did re-listen to our uh Son
for Son episode, and my favoritepart is that you went on an
(43:40):
Allison rant for like 10minutes.
SPEAKER_01 (43:46):
I forgot that.
SPEAKER_00 (43:50):
Her actions in that episode infuriated you, and I
think I don't even rememberother than that last year.
And I think we'll I think whatwe'll do is we can both re-watch
the episode and then re you knowreread the chapters.
Yeah, we might have a littlespoilers because one of the main
reasons uh we I I'm gonna safelyassume we both didn't uh think
(44:12):
it was right because theyomitted a character.
So we'll talk about that.
So a quick note uh with thepodcast.
So after this episode, we'll dothe blood and cheese, like I
mentioned.
We'll we're planning to do atleast two more before the sea
the season, before the year isout.
Uh, one more, we'll have areturning guest.
We'll do a what if season three.
Um, check out what if season oneand two, those are fun to do,
(44:35):
and then we'll figure out anepisode before the year is out.
But other than that, thank youfor listening.
To follow us on Instagram, go todancing with underscore dragons.
There we post reels, stories, uhfun polls, and any updates to
the podcast you will find there.
If you want to shoot us a DM, goright ahead.
We welcome any ideas for thefuture shows.
(44:59):
Make sure to download ourepisodes in your preferred
podcast platform if you don'tmind.
Share, rate, all that goodstuff.
Thank you once again forlistening.
And here's to another 75episodes of Dancing with
Dragons.
Peace out.
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