Building a Magnetic Marriage While Growing a Business with Angela & James Mitchell S5E11

Episode Transcript
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Sheri Miter (00:00):
In today's episode, you'll hear the conversation I
had with Angela and JamesMitchell of love intentionally.
And I feel like this was such avital conversation that I think
anybody who is married orthinking about getting married
or in a serious relationshipshould listen to.
They shared so many good,tangible things you can walk
away with on how to make yourmarriage stronger.
But I feel like thisconversation is essential,

(00:23):
especially if you are already inthe entrepreneur space or
you're thinking about steppinginto the entrepreneur space
because that's where yourcalling is leading you.
So make sure you listen to thisconversation and you might want
to have your spouse listen toit as well.
Enjoy.
Welcome to the Discovering YourCalling podcast.

(00:45):
I'm your host, Jerry Miter.
I'm here to help you unleashyour strengths and get clarity
on your calling.
I believe when you find yourpurpose in life, fulfillment,
joy, and success will follow.
If you're ready, pop in thoseearbuds, hit that follow button,
and join me on this journeytoward discovering your calling.
All right, well, welcome to theDiscovering Your Calling

(01:08):
podcast.
This is your host, SherryMiter, and I am excited to
welcome Angela and JamesMitchell today.
And they are the founders ofLove Intentionally.
They are married entrepreneursraising three kids and helping
other couples stay deeplyconnected in the middle of busy,
ambitious lives.
With Angela's background incounseling and James' experience

(01:30):
in entrepreneurship andcoaching, they both bring heart
and strategy to buildingmarriages that thrive.
And what I really love as Ikind of dove into your story is
that it seems like this businesswasn't just this idea you came
up with, that it really camefrom your own personal journey.
And I'd love to just start theconversation there.

(01:52):
So first, just welcome to thepodcast, Angela and James.
And I would love to know whatwas happening when you started
to feel this nudge that thiscalling to create this business
and maybe the situation that youjust couldn't really ignore
anymore, that you had to like,we need to do something here.
Yeah.

Angela (02:09):
Yeah, great.
Well, first of all, thanks forhaving us.
Love, love being able to sharewith your audience.
So we oh, where to start?
I have been a counselor for 22years in the field of counseling
in a variety of settings.
I started in nonprofits, then Iworked as a school counselor.
And James, when we met, was inreal estate.

(02:31):
That was his first on well, notyour first, but not my first,
lifelong here.
Yeah, lifelong entrepreneur.
But his first one he actuallymade money at, maybe, was being
a realtor.

James (02:40):
Substantial, yeah.

Angela (02:41):
Yeah.
And so when we started, he was,he had his own, you know,
business and real estate anddoing that entrepreneur thing.
He also had a couple otherthings like getting good
entrepreneur in the fire, acouple other ideas.
And so I had the W-2 and kindof the steady income.
And then we started having kidsand we really had to figure out
systems on how are we.

(03:01):
We knew we wanted to beintentional when we got married.
We wanted this to be a lifelongthing.
I mean, I don't think anyonewhen they get married is like,
I'm getting married, and thenwe'll just get divorced someday.
But we felt really strongly tobe intentional.
And so from the beginning, wewere having those conversations
about yeah, what was our planfor life?
How are we gonna get there?
How do we stay connected alongthe way?

(03:23):
And and also at the same timehaving do that alongside him
building his business and thenus building a family, starting
to have kids and buy our housethat we wanted and investments
and all of those things.
So we had a lot on our platesat the time.
And so a lot of what we weredoing was just figuring out how
to make it work for us.
Like it really started out aswhat we needed, right?

James (03:46):
Yeah, to thrive.
And then on my side of things,Angela loves and has loved her
job, her W-2 and the counselingfield and the school system here
in Fort Collins, Colorado,where we live.
But there were two things thatreally happened that started to
shift my entrepreneurship fromlike the efforting
entrepreneurship into this moreheart-driven, purpose-driven

(04:06):
work.
And one was I remember the dayAngela said, I've never known
you to be happy in your career,which actually came as a shock
to me, which I thought I wasstating the facts.

Angela (04:15):
Like I did not think this was gonna be a surprise.

James (04:17):
Which was also a shock to her.
But I was just putting a lot ofeffort into it.
And I was just what felt greatat the beginning, no amount of
caffeine, no amount of nicotine,no amount of effort or energy
was really making it workanymore.
So that was the first thing.
And then the second was we'lljust call a mystical experience
that helped me realize thatthere was a more heart-driven
purpose in this life for me.

Angela (04:39):
Yeah.
So that's when you switched toreally coaching, and you started
with coaching entrepreneurs,realtors.

James (04:46):
I wanted to become full-time and love
intentionally.
I saw a huge opportunity inthis.
And my intention is always tobe be a master at what I'm
doing.
I want to feel like I am anexpert, not just feel that way,
but be an expert in the work.
And so with Angela being acounselor, working with couples
to her came really easily.
But for me to go from being arealtor, an investor to working

(05:06):
in this field, I wanted tobecome a coach.
And so I went and took thebridge I knew.
And so I shifted into coachingrealtors through a company
called Ninja Coaching and ourNinja Selling, and got my, you
know, a couple thousand hours ofin-person coaching there and I
started my 10,000-hour journeyto expertise in this field.

Right, right.
So I'm curious, what was themystical?

James (05:27):
Uh there is a plant medicine, it's a plant medicine
called ayahuasca.

Okay.
Okay.

James (05:32):
An invitation and opportunity to try that.
And the message was clear.
I mean, again, it was just likeI'm burning out and just
grinding my gears to a nub andit wasn't working.
And so I just got the themessage, so to speak, from the
universe that said, hey, likethere is something to what
you're doing here.
And if you lead with yourheart, everything is going to
work out.

I love that message because I think a lot of
entrepreneurs feel that.
And it seems to me like moreand more and more are really
sensing that because there wasthe hustle culture that a lot of
us became entrepreneurs in orstarted our businesses in.
And we realize that that doesnot, it's not sustainable,
isn't, you know, and it leads toburnout very quickly.

(06:14):
And it leads to maybe ourspouse is saying, you don't
really seem happy.

James (06:20):
Classic story of the day.
Yeah.

Yeah.
Yeah.
So before we do like reallyjump into what you do today, I
want to just pause for a minuteand take a little strengths
detour here because I really dofeel like your strengths, and I
could already hear them comingout as a strengths coach, really
do play in how you probablywork together and or even the

(06:45):
challenges, which I'm sure iswhat you help other couples
with.
So Angela, and and James andAngela were very kind enough to,
I said, why don't we take thestrengths, take the strengths
assessment?
Let's just play with this.
And so thank you for doingthat.
So Angela leads with woo,communication, achiever,
empathy, and connectedness,which are really a lot of

(07:07):
relationship building skills,influencing themes, and also a
little executing shows up inthere.
I got a little type A in me.
I can see, and that's thatachiever in there.
Yep.
James has strategic ideation,communication, activator, and
woo.
So you are the strategy andinfluencing.
So that's why like you're onall these, you know, I'm the

(07:29):
same type of themes, a fewdifferent different ones, but I
still leave with strategic andinfluencing.
So I can relate to you, James,with the entrepreneurship.
Like the ideas are alwaysflowing.
There's never enough time to doall the ideas we have.
And as I kind of went intostrength study session
yesterday, preparing for ourcall today, I love what some of
the things that Gallup saysabout the two of you together.

(07:51):
It says that you both together,you light up a room and turn
ideas into motion.
Angela, your warmth andconnection create the relational
found foundation.
And James, your strategicvision and bold action push
things forward.
Together, you create energythat attracts people and drive

(08:12):
real progress without losing thehuman side.
I love that.
So when you hear that, how doyou see either each other's
talents or your own talents?
And we just did the top five,and what I just shared show up
in real life and in yourbusiness.

Angela (08:31):
Yeah.
So uh when you sent this to usand I took a look at it, we were
looking over it, I was like, Ithink Gallup is in our house,
like right?
I feel so both the strengthsand the compliments and you
know, the ways we workcomplimentary, and then also the
challenges, you know, which I'msure we'll get to in a minute.
But yeah, I do see that.
We have always said, which isone thing I've appreciated about

(08:54):
us, is that we do feel like wecomplement each other well.
So we do both share thatcommunication, that woo, right?
So we're both extroverts, we'reboth people people.
I loved when we were datingthat I could take him somewhere,
like a friend's birthday party,and I didn't have to babysit
him.
He could just like walk aroundthe room, make friends, right?
And that was actually reallyattractive to me because I had

(09:16):
that same quality.
And so there's, you know,obviously some things that we're
similar in, but we also reallycompliment each other.
James has always been thecreative big picture, right?
I think that's that ideationpart.
And then I'm like, okay, what'sthe to-do list?
How are we gonna get that done?
Right.
I'm the achiever.
So I think those without me,his dreams may never come to
reality.

(09:36):
And without him, I feel like Icould stay small.
I could stay really focused onjust the here and now in my
to-do list and and that.
I also think that there is, wereally in our work with clients
blend counseling and coaching,right?
So my background in counseling,his and coaching, which I found
really helpful for couples,right?
Because whenever you're workingwith a couple, there could be

(09:59):
some sore spots that need tendedor cleaned up from the past,
either from their ownrelationship or even something
from childhood that's poppingup, you know, an abandonment
wound or whatever that's uhpresenting itself in the
relationship.
And so I feel like mycounseling skills and like my
empathy and connectedness reallyshine, get to shine there.
And then on the other hand,James is as the coach is really

(10:21):
great about the where are younow?
Where do you want to be, andhow are you gonna get there,
right?
Let's take that action, let'sactivate, let's get you moving
forward.
And we found for couples thatthose really work well together.

James (10:32):
The one of the things we've always done extremely well
in this work together is theactual work together.
When we're with clients, whenwe're with our groups, when
we're with our customers, thesynergy of how she shows up and
how I show up really work well.
And also when it comes tocouples, there's usually one
that's like, let's docounseling, and the other one is

(10:53):
like, ah, why?
Nothing's wrong.

Angela (10:55):
We're not broken.

James (10:56):
We're not broken, right?
We just we just need a coupleof tweaks.
And then that's where lookingat the work that we do and
bringing the coaching aspect canhelp hold them and make them
feel comfortable about whatexactly it is we're gonna be
spending our time and resourceson.

And I would imagine you probably are able to paint
the picture of why they shouldbe at counseling.
They may think a bit more ofthe empathetic side.
So it's nice to have thatbalance of the two of you coming
together.
Like you said, Angela, thatyou're that empathy, the
counseling, that background.
Whereas, James, you can takeand like, but this is what you

(11:31):
get when you do this, right?
So this is where you're gonnago.
Yeah.

James (11:36):
Yeah.
And I also get some permissionto say the thing very bluntly.
I don't take it for granted.
And in fact, I take it as ajust one of my favorite
privileges in this work, it isto beer and reflect back what's
actually happening in a way.
And especially with in themen's world, right?
I do a lot of men's coaching aswell.
The more blunt and clear I cansay things, the more likely they

(11:59):
are to hear it.
And it could have beensomething that their spouse or a
friend or somebody else hastold them a million times, but
when it comes out in thissetting, like they actually hear
it almost for the first time.

Right, right.
Especially if it's, like yousaid, been coming from a spouse
previously.
Matters who says it.
Yes, absolutely.
And I've been married 40 years,so I feel like I can say some
of these things too.
So we have been married 40years.
And as I share before we hitthe record, it's interesting
because my husband, my husband'sa professional firefighter.

(12:31):
Oh, he's retired now.
But he found he's one of thosepeople that since he was three
years old knew exactly what hewanted to do and went out and
did it.
You know, he had to do a fewdetours to get there, but he was
willing to take the detoursbecause he knew exactly what he
wanted to do and he excelled atit.
He he'd probably still beworking if if I wasn't ready to

(12:53):
retire as a firefighter's wife.
And, you know, I've always beenlike you, James, are like,
well, I'll try this.
Okay, well, now I'm gonna trythis.
Well, now I'm gonna try this.
And I fell into networkmarketing.
That's where I kind of landedfor 20-something years until I
outgrew that.
And then I got into doing thediscovering your calling
coaching.
But there were times andseasons, and he didn't say it to

(13:17):
me like you did, Angela, and heprobably should have, but that
you don't seem happy.
That I would used to get veryjealous that he was living his
calling.
And at the time I had no ideacalling wasn't the word I would
have used.
You know, this is going back,you know, 25, 30 years ago.
But I remember that that andbeing envy of or envious of him

(13:42):
because he was so happy in hiscareer.
And I'm curious, do you findthat a lot?
And do you see that theentrepreneurs are normally
happier or the W-2 people arenormally happier?
Or does it really even doesthat even make a difference?
But do you see that like thattension show up for couples

(14:03):
sometimes of one's very solid,happy, doing what they love, and
the other one's struggling tofind that?

James (14:56):
I think any uh not to make generalizations, but most
of the time there's anentrepreneur in the
relationship, the answer tothat's gonna be yes.
Somebody I like to look andwhat we see a lot is this game
of leapfrog, right?
And so whenever Angela washolding down the W-2, what we
call the anchorpreneur, right?
She was the anchor and I wasout there doing the

(15:16):
entrepreneurship, heranchorness, that's officially
known a word, right?
It'll it allowed me to go outand create with a sense of
security at home.

Yes.

James (15:27):
And then for us, once I had that, it was also like,
okay, well, that's not exactlyit.
Well, how can I shift anentrepreneurship?
But what we see a lot incouples is they play leapfrog.
And so somebody's in that likedown position, like, I've got
this, maybe I'm happy in this orI'm content in this.
And so you can take the leap togo do what it is that's going
to, in your mind and in yourvision, fulfill you.

(15:50):
And then once they get set andsettled, then usually it's their
turn to hunker down while theother person takes a leap and
maybe jumps into a differentcareer in the W-2 position,
maybe jumps out of the careerand decides to go home and be a
full-time stay-at-home parent.
Trevor Burrus, Jr.

Angela (16:03):
Goes back to school, you know, a variety of things.

James (16:06):
But we take turns.
And I think taking turns isalways these couples continuing
to iterate what it is on the wayto their vision.
Because a lot of times it's notexactly what they're doing, but
how is what you're doingproviding the ability to live
the dream life.

Right.
Right.
Yeah.
And I love that you how yousaid that with the leapfrog,
because I definitely see thatlike with some of the women I
work have worked with inmultiple different when I was in
network marketing anddefinitely today, that they say
that, that like, well, I'm gonnafigure out what I really want
to do, but then I want to retiremy husband so that he can then

(16:46):
go do what he wants to do.
So I hear that a lot.
So that totally makes sensewith the leapfrog.

Angela (16:52):
I think some of the strain or tension can come when
someone, and I'm it, you know,not to blame anyone in the
relationship on whose fault thisis, but where one person isn't
getting their chance to do theirthing, right?
And it could be because theyfeel stuck, they feel like, no,
that's too risky.
I have to stay with my W 2, orI have to stay with this W 2, I

(17:14):
can't career shift, or I thinkit's like only five years until
I get my pension or ten yearsand stuff like that.

Oh, that drives me.
That's like the worst thing Ihear.

Angela (17:22):
Yeah.
Yeah.
And so if forever for whateverreason, their own inhibitions or
because what's going on theother side of the relationship,
but when they don't get theirturn to really live out their
dreams, that's where I see oftenthe tension arise.
And the couples that can, likeJames, I kind of leapfrog it,
usually are both, you know,especially when we reflect that
back to them, are appreciativeof that, right?

(17:43):
That they have been able toboth do that at some point.

And the other tension that I see with some of
the women I work with is if theyhave come from using your
terms, the W-2 lifestyle, wherethey've always had that W,
they've always had the steadyquote unquote job.
And their spouse has come fromthe same type of family, always

(18:08):
the traditional career,paycheck, you know, retire, then
you enjoy life mentality.
And all of a sudden, one ofthem, you know, I tend to work
with women, so normally for meit's the woman, decides she
wants to venture out and tryentrepreneurship.
That does bring on the wholenew dynamics of not really

(18:31):
understanding this.
And actually, right now I evensee sometimes with my son, my
young, we have three boys, myyoungest son has his own
business, side business rightnow.
He has another, he has his W-2job still.
And his wife comes from moretraditional.
So when there is that tensionin there of conflict of
scheduling or something, I hearlittle comments and he she's

(18:53):
very supportive of, they're verysupportive of each other, but
every once you hear these littlecomments made.
And I'm just curious, how doyou coach couples through when
they're feeling that tensionbecause they don't really
understand what it does take torun your own business and the
different mindset that as anentrepreneur you need to have
and all the different thingsthat come up with it?

(19:15):
How do you deal with that?

Angela (19:17):
Yeah, I mean, I would say like step number one in our
coaching.
Well, step number one is thatwe always want to build a safe
container for theseconversations, right?
And so that's part of thereason people pay counselors and
coaches is to have this kind ofmore neutral space with guides
that they can talk through someof these issues that are
sometimes trickier, money beingone of them, right?

(19:37):
It's one of the main thingscouples fight about.
And so our our process then isto help them go a layer deeper,
right?
So if there is tension going onaround, you know, let's say
it's money, right?
So, like, oh, I'm, you know,well, I'm scared if you go do
this entrepreneurship thing,right?
What is that gonna do for ourincome?
Then we want to dig down alittle bit, right?

(19:58):
What are their values aroundmoney?
What is important?
What are the fears?
What are the non-negotiables,right?
And see if we can find a planthat is going to meet both
people's needs.
So, you know, just using moneyas an example, oftentimes we
encourage couples to get bucketsof money, right?
So we have our savings, we haveour monthly spending, we have,

(20:19):
you know, this we're saving fora new house, we're, you know,
vacation money, whatever, havingdifferent accounts or buckets,
and then helping them identifyfor both of them how much do you
need in the buckets to feelsafe and secure, right?
And then how much can be playedwith?
How much can be maybe used totake that risk for the

(20:39):
entrepreneur?
I mean, that's just oneexample, you know, depending on
the configuration, the dynamicsin the relationship.
But we want to go, what's thelayer deeper?
What are the needs and thefears that we need to address?
And then how do we come up witha plan that really helps both
partners feel like their needsare being met?
I love that.
Very practical.

Yeah, the very practical.

James (20:59):
That resonates.
That's so that's inside the ownrelationship.
One of the things you alludedto is how it affects the family
and our friends around us.
And so as our own energy risesand our own vibration rises to
be able to match the new levelof entrepreneurship and risk
that it takes, our flame startsto burn a little brighter.

(21:20):
And it can really like createsituations where some people
want to step up to the fire,right, and get warm and like
catch fire with you.
And then others are steppingback, like, hey, this is not
feeling like what has happenedto you.
You've changed.
You've changed.
I've worked with in men'scoaching lawyers and doctors
that are stepping away fromthose degrees to step into
entrepreneurship and coachingand their families, like, you

(21:42):
had it, you had the safe job,you got the degree.
Why are you stepping away fromthat?
One of the things that isimportant is that what I've
noticed, right?
Anytime I step into a new roleand I'm moving into something
else, it is bringing up my owntension, my own fears, my own
insecurities.
And when it brings that up inthose around us, it's just

(22:03):
noticing how their tension andtheir insecurity can trigger
mine as well.
And so just learning to thebest entrepreneurs can sit with
that and alchemize it intoaction and clarity without being
necessarily dragged back downto the other vibration frequency
that the people around us arehaving around this big shift

(22:24):
that we're having, because itscares them.
And if we're scared too, whichusually we are, that can create
a rough situation.
And so it's becoming betterable to handle what's coming up
inside of our own bodies so wecan hold that space for those
around us.

I love that.
And I love the analogy of thefire of like you said, some are
gonna want to go.
Next to the fire, and othersare gonna oof, you know, what's
happening, and and do that.
That's a great analogy.
And it's interesting.
I decided this year I reallywant to get to get into
meditation, like reallyunderstand it.

(23:01):
And so much of what you'resaying, like, okay, just
acknowledge that, let it go,acknowledge it, let it go, you
know, and the vibrations.
So love the uh love the way youexplain that.
I usually talk about thelobster pot.
I don't know if you ever heardof when lobsters get put into a
pot and they try to pull eachother down.
If one tries to climb out ofthe lobster pot, the other ones

(23:23):
are pulling them back downagain, pulling them back down
again because we're allcomfortable stuck here.
But when one of us tries toescape, it makes everybody else
a little uncomfortable andstuff.
But I love working on your ownemotions when that's happening
and what you said.

James (23:40):
That's been a good practice and an ongoing one, if
I'm being honest.

Oh, totally.
I think because mindset is sohuge.
And I am thinking as I waslistening to you too, it you
know, it sometimes it's the dayof the week.
Somebody can say something toyou one day and you're feeling
like, I've got this, I'minvincible, I'm gonna fulfill my
dream, and it just rolls.
And then if they say it anotherday where you're not feeling so

(24:06):
strong in your conviction, ithits a whole different way.
A whole different way.
So I want to just mention oneof the other strengths themes
because I definitely hear thiswhen I'm listening to the two of
you talking.
How again, and you said thisbeautifully earlier, Angela,
just how you the both of youcomplement each other so well.

(24:27):
And I don't know if you caughtthis in the strengths reports,
but even your woo andcommunication descriptions are
different when you really lookat them because it they play
with the rest of your talentthemes.
And I I wrote this down and Idefinitely want to bring this
up.
Your communication theme.
So, James, your description,one of the little bits that

(24:49):
caught my attention, said drivenby your talents, you keep the
dialogue going when talking withvisionaries about what will be
possible in the distant future.
You customarily share your ownexperiences, examples, or
stories to make a point.
You ask questions and seekexplanations to help
forward-looking thinkers refinetheir imagination propositions.

(25:10):
And you just did thatbeautifully with the fire
analogy.
And then Angela, though, yourcommunication with the thing
says by nature, you sometimespoint out potential difficulties
when discussing ideas withforward-looking thinkers.
While they concentrateprimarily on possibilities, you
may you may find exciting.
You try to help them be morerealistic and practical, or this

(25:33):
even says this budgetconscious.
That's why I'm the CEO of ourfamily.

(25:54):
And that just kind of brings upwhen you see that in other
couples that you're workingwith, how do you help them
navigate understanding andappreciating?
Because I really do hear andsense you two really appreciate
your differences.

(26:15):
How do you help other couplesappreciate the differences and
not be clashing because of them?

Angela (26:22):
Yeah.
So I love kind of personalitytests and things, you know,
similar to the strengths.
And we use them with couples,you know, whether it's love
languages, we have our ownintimacy styles quiz.
But I do we often have couplestake these kind of assessments
to get some common languagearound to better understand

(26:44):
themselves and each other,right?
And I find when we have thatcommon language and it is
honoring language, right, thenwe are able to view it as, you
know, in this case, a strengthof theirs, right?
And so, and I think that issomething James and I really
both came into the relationshipwith is that we are very
different.
We comp we have similar values,a lot of that stuff, but you

(27:06):
know, we show up differently inthe world, but we see those
things as complementary, right?
And so, you know, instead of,you know, instead of calling my
organized nature and myspreadsheets and everything, oh,
you're being anal retentive,or, you know, some kind of more
derogatory term, James is soappreciative of those qualities,
right?
And might use the language oflike, you know, strengths is

(27:27):
achiever, or on true colors, I'mgold, you know, I'm blue gold,
right?
Like so kind of looking at thatlanguage to look at those
traits as honoring what are thegood parts of those and what do
they bring to the relationship?
And for us, you know, we kindof we've joked like if, you
know, if both of us were, youknow, big picture dreamers, we'd
probably never get anythingdone, right?

(27:49):
Or if we were both liketaskmasters, we may never like
look up from our to-do list andyou know, whatever.
So the seeing them ascomplements to being on the same
team and recognizing we use thesame team language a lot,
right?
So we create this vision.
That's a big part of the workwe do with couples, is create a
vision.
What is this life we want tocreate?
What is our North Star?

(28:10):
And then how are we both goingto use our strengths, our
talents, our roles on the teamto help us get there?
And those need to complementeach other.
We don't always want to both bepitchers, right?
Somebody needs to be a catcher.

James (28:22):
So we both want to get we have this vision, it's shared,
and we both want to get what weneed.
And so one of the things thatwe do really well is I spend a
lot of my energy focused on whatdoes she need, and I trust
she's gonna do that back.
And so I'm focused on what sheneeds in order to feel safe and
secure to move forward.
And she's focused on what Ineed to feel space to dream and

(28:46):
to be creative and to have theseideas that then we can work on
together and mold.
The trust between the two of usthat we're each approaching our
relationship that way and ourbusiness that way, with that
common honoring language hasbeen a game changer and
something that's really not thathard to install in any
relationship.

I love that.
That's yeah, if you approachthat with the trust and what do
they need.
You know, that right there isso powerful that if that's all
somebody took into theirrelationship, that would
probably really make a hugedifference, whether they're
W-2s, entrepreneurs, orwhatever, just what do they need

(29:27):
and how can I help them withthat?

Angela (29:30):
Yeah.
And it's partly because we loveeach other, but it's also
partly selfish.
Like if he, if James is showingup at his best, right, if he's
thriving, I get a better husbandand mate.
Yes, right.
And so how can I help himthrive, right?
And vice versa.

James (29:48):
So it all comes back to connection for us.
And this works in yourmarriage, this works in your
relationship, this works in yourbusiness relationship, this
works if you work together.
But and for us, we defineconnection as feeling seen,
feeling appreciated, and feelingdesired.
And you got to get those firsttwo down, the seen and
appreciated, for the desire toreally kick in.
But this, what we're talkingabout right here is how do each

(30:11):
of us feel seen?
And when we're both fighting tobe seen, then it's more like,
what do I need?
What do I, I, I, I, I?
And when we can just pause andthen create a nice container
that says, all right, how can Isee you better?
Right.
What would you like some moreappreciation around?
And we do this pretty much oncea week in our weekly marriage

(30:31):
meeting, not our businessmeeting.
But how can we better give eachother what we're looking for
and then not just keep it up toguesswork, right?
Just make it extremely clear.
And what that requires is thatfor me, if I'm going to ask her
what I'm looking for and whatI'm wanting to be seen and
appreciated for, guess who needsto know that first?
So it's up to me to decide thatand then to communicate that in

(30:54):
a way and in a container thatallows that communication to
land.

Right.
So I have two questions for onefor each of you.
And so, Angela, you saidsomething about your the North
Star, the relationship northstar star.
I want to come back to that.
And then, James, I want to comeback to what you just said
about the marriage meeting.
Yes.
I want to come, I want to hearmore about that.
So whoever wants to go first.

Angela (31:19):
Yeah, it's funny too, because I feel like we're gonna
talk about the thing that is theother person's strength.
Yeah.
So I love this.
This would be great.
Yeah.
So I feel like the relationshipNorth Star is like more in line
with James' personality, butI've come to love it too.
So when we what we look at isholistically intentional
relationship, right?
So we're, you know, looking atall the things.

(31:39):
We identified really kind ofthree prongs to that.
So there's creating this visiontogether, which we call your
relationship North Star.
And that is what do we, what isthis life that we want to live
together?
What are we creating together?
Some of it might be reallytangible, like we want to live
in this town, in this type ofhouse.
We want 2.5 kids and adachshund, right?

(32:00):
Like it can be reallylogistical.
And some of it is like, how dowe want to feel in that life,
right?
And so it's a lot of dreaming.
We make a lifelist, also knownas a bucket list, right?
Kind of so it's it's a funexercise we usually do together
and we guide other couplesthrough is really creating this
vision of this life we want.
And we found that when we havethat, it keeps us on the same

(32:23):
page and feeling like we're onthe same team.
Second prong is our strategiclife plan.
So that's like the how are wegoing to get to that, right?
How what are the goals?
What are we doing this year?
What's what are we doing overthe next five years to help us
reach and create that life we'rewanting, that vision?

James (32:38):
Lots of logistics in that phase.

Angela (32:40):
Yeah, that's mostly logistics.
And then the third prong is theconnection.
And really for us, that's whatmakes it all worth it.
We can build this beautifulhouse and life and kids and all
the things and have thefinancial success we want.
And if we're not connected atthe end of the day, like it it
doesn't matter.
That feels flat it falls flat.
It feels unfulfilling, right?

(33:01):
So our connection andrelationship is what makes the
dream life really worth it andfeel like the dream life inside
of it, right?
So those are kind of our threethings.
So a relationship north star,though, is where we start.
It's that vision.

James (33:13):
And for this weekly marriage meeting, a lot of folks
like it's like one more meetingand anything else.
I was that guy.
I didn't really want to startdoing this.
But for me, I was noticing ourlogistics were bleeding over
into every single part of ourlife.
On Monday afternoon, it waslike, well, what are we having
for dinner tonight?
Who's gonna go to the store?
Who's taking the kid tobasketball?
And then on the other side, foryou know, there's this our

(33:35):
connection piece.
Like, what do we need?
What kind of support are welooking for?
So we, from one of our mentorsthat we worked with a long time
ago, they provided us with atemplate that we have just
reworked to be more appropriatefor our marriage.
And everybody gets thatartistic license.
But once a week, and for us wedo it on Sundays and we hold
Sundays sacred.
Doesn't have to be the sametime, depending on what we're

(33:57):
doing.
A lot of times it's in the carif we're coming back from the
ski mountain or camping orsomething like that.
But we sit down and the firstthing we do is we share
appreciation and gratitude.
That's an important one.
We have accidentally skippedthat sometimes.

Angela (34:09):
And we notice we notice real fast.
We're like, let's pause and godo that again.

James (34:14):
Because it's important that we are always connecting
before we're correcting.
And sometimes it's just coursecorrection.
But we start with that and thenwe move into our emotional
connection.
Right.
The counselor brought that oneinto the game as well.
But how are we feeling thisweek?
It allows us just to check in.
One time I was like, I'mfeeling overwhelmed.
Angela traditionally owns thatparticular emotion in our

(34:36):
relationship.

Angela (34:37):
I'm the best at that emotion in our relationship.
Yep.

James (34:41):
Right.
So it helped her to just helpme and not necessarily put
anything extra or add anythingextra to my plate.
In fact, take things off of itwithout me having to ask for it,
especially whenever it startedto blip out as frustration.
Uh and then we move into afinancial check, right?
How is our financials doing?
There's a short, medium, andlong-term goal on that.
A lot of this is reallydedicated towards that North

(35:02):
Star.
And then we move into ourlogistics.
All right, what's the calendarfor the week?
Who's going to be what where?
What's our meal plan?
We do a meal plan for the week,and we uh I do the grocery
shopping, and then we do thatfor the entire week.
And then we get into some ofthe more fun stuff, like what
are our social life andfriendship plans this week?
What does our personal carelook like?
When are we going to the gym?
We schedule sex and intimacyonce a week.

(35:24):
Doesn't mean that's all wehave, but the intimacy part of
it is like, let's just createsome space for us.
And so that was actually theone item on the weekly to uh the
weekly marriage meeting thatgot me really interested in
doing it on a regular basis.

Angela (35:39):
All right, I'll be there something for everyone in that
meeting.
Yep.

James (35:42):
And then we end up, we close off every year we do
what's called we do our marriageretreat.
So it's like a businessplanning, but for our life, and
it's got those logistics, it'sgot everything in the North Star
that Angela was mentioning.
And we'll pull out our onepager from that and just check
in and say, these were thethings we wanted to do.
How are we doing on them?
It's like, oh shoot, we haven'thad a one-on-one with the kids
this this last month.
We kind of that one fell to theway.

Angela (36:03):
That was the goal for this year, and we let's let's
schedule that.

James (36:05):
So this weekly marriage meeting is extremely important
ritual in our marriage thatkeeps us on the same page,
managing logistics, and it alsofor me it puts logistics into a
nice little box where they'renot becoming all of our
conversations every day.

Angela (36:20):
It takes us about an hour, but it saves us so much
time in inefficiencies and justin like mental load, right?
If we have all of the stufffigured out in that hour, then
we're not having to worry aboutit or figure it out or balls
don't get dropped as often.

James (36:38):
And we can save stuff for that meeting, right?
And so if something comes upthroughout the week that we want
to touch on, bringing it up inthe moment or in the kitchen at
seven, eight, nine o'clock atnight hasn't really worked well
for us.
We don't really see thatworking well for a lot of folks.
And so just having a place toput that and for me knowing and
for her knowing that there's aspace to address that in a safe
container has been a monumental,a monumental shift.

Aaron Ross Powell Right.
I could see where that wouldbe, especially when you're in
the heat of raising kids.
And and how old are your kids?
11, 13, and 20.

Angela (37:11):
So that's busy life.
Yes.

James (37:14):
But we're in the heavy, you know, sport seasons and
theater seasons.
Like it's a great time.
I mean, it's just a littleextra.

Right, right.
A lot of, like you said,logistics that have to be
figured out.
Who's dropping off, who'spicking up, who, you know, do we
have to stay the practice?
All those things.
Like I said, we had three boys.
I remember those days.
And that was when I did have tomeal plan.
I did have, we had to be verymore structured, which is not my
way of being at all.
I'm very much a morego-with-the-flow kind of person,

(37:45):
but that structure is whatkeeps you sane.
That structure is what keepsthe arguments down.
That structure is what againgoes back to what do you need
this week?
How can I take the load off alittle bit?
And how can I support you andthose things.
So that's a brilliant.
I love that.
And I love that it's a weekly,a weekly check-in and you know,
goes back to your business name,love intentionally.

(38:07):
It's like when you do thesethings and it seems may seem
like like, why do we have to dothat?
You shouldn't have to do that.
I'm sure you probably hearthat.
Well, why do we have to dothat?
Because if you don't, timeslips away.
You know, and life happens, andwe just don't make time for

(38:28):
anything.
That's really importantsometimes.

James (38:31):
There is a book called Outwitting the Devil by Napoleon
Hill.
Ever familiar?

I have not heard that one, no.

James (38:37):
And he basically identifies what he's gonna call
the devil as drift.
And that's what you'redescribing is that we can we can
intentionally move closertogether, or we're nationally
gonna drift further apart.

And I know we're coming close to our time here,
and that was a great way to end,but I just want to know is
there anything else that youwant to add that you want
couples that are listening tothis, or maybe that one person
that's listening to this, like,okay, I need to have my husband
or or my spouse listen to thisepisode.
Is there anything else youreally like on your heart that
you want to say to that personright now that's listening?

James (39:15):
The one thing that comes up out of the two things,
there's two things that come up.
Welcome, Doc.
Right.
The first thing is that ittakes two to create a pattern
and only one person to changeit.
That's something that Angelasays often, but I'm gonna steal
it in this moment because thatcame directly to mind.
And you know, if you'restepping into this world of
entrepreneurship and steppinginto a new life, right, there's
a leadership component to that.

(39:38):
And it just takes a little bitof leadership to be able to make
a huge change.
So you can be the reason thepattern gets disrupted and a new
one gets created.
So just a little encouragementto that.
And it's not easy, mind you,but it's simple.
And one of the things that wedid is we wrote a book.
We did a sabbatical last year.
We spent the year in Peru withour family, and we wrote a book.

(40:01):
It's called Married andMagnetic, and it's a toolbox.
And so depending on whereyou're at and what situation
you're encountering in yourrelationship, whether it's lack
of connection, lack of vision,the strategy, or the household
logistics are just not working,there's something in that book
that you can flip to to help youget a real tool that we have
used, identified that itactually works to help manage

(40:23):
that particular like clunkymoment.

I'll have to grab that book for my three, all
three of my sons are nowmarried.
So it sounds like a great giftto give them.

unknown (40:34):
Awesome.

Angela (40:35):
Yeah.
And I would the only otherthing I would add to that is the
Gottmans who are, you know,have done the most tons of
marriage research, right?
Over the last 40 years, theyhave all sorts of good stuff.
But what they found was thatthe average couple waits six
years to get help when they'reexperiencing a struggle.
And so my advice to anyonelistening to this, and I don't

(40:57):
think the struggle even needs tobe that big, even if it's a
little thing, like, you know, wejust have some tension around
this one issue.
We're great in nine out of 10areas, but this tenth issue just
keeps coming up.
Like even that kind ofstruggle, right?
I would encourage folks to seekout resources, get help, while
it's small, because what happensin those six years, and here's
my counselor perspective, right?

(41:18):
When people have come to me andan issue's been going on for a
long time, not only are theydealing with the issue, they're
dealing with the six years ofbaggage they've accumulated as a
result of that issue, right?
And the patterns that arecreated are like these deep ruts
that are harder to get out ofafter six years, right?
Versus six months where thepatterns aren't that instilled,

(41:38):
we can disrupt them easier.
So my encouragement is when youdo feel tension, seek some
resources, get some help.
Doesn't mean things are broken.
It doesn't mean you're on thebrink of divorce, right?
But just that I feel like allof us can do it a little better.
And sometimes it takes thatoutside perspective to help show
us our blind spots, right?
And help us get the coaching weneed.

(41:59):
So whether it's, you know,relationship or in your case
when you're coaching peoplebusiness-wise, that you don't
have to struggle alone.
There's plenty of people outthere that can help.

Right, right.
Very good advice because I'veseen the consequences of from
other friends and family membersthat held on to that one little
thing for too long and ended upin a surprise divorce.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Blindsided the spouse becausethey had no idea.

James (42:26):
But yeah, they're like, I didn't realize we were that
bad.
And it's like, well, what Iwhat I've noticed is that when
that same thing comes back, whatwe start looking at and feeling
is this hopeless and helpless.
Like, oh, that's always gonnabe how it gets, if he's never
gonna change, if she's nevergonna change, and this is always
gonna be the thing.
But the cool thing aboutmarriage is that it is the

(42:47):
greatest personal developmentcontainer on the planet.
And whatever issue that you'redealing with, it takes two to
tango, and you're gonna dealwith it on the next relationship
as well.
So you might as well just buckup, step in, roll up your
sleeves, and deal with it withthe person who loves you and
knows you the best and workthrough it together.

Good advice, good advice.
And it's worth it.
I mean, like I said, we've beenmarried 40 years, and I always
say 39 were very happy.
And the last, the one that wasunhappy was not the recent one.
It was it was early on.
We got through it.
Thank God.
It was, you know, one of thosethings.
Neither one of us knows how westepped into that year not

(43:28):
liking each other, and we gotout of that year, loving each
other.
We don't even know whathappened in between.
It was just an ugly year, butthank God we stuck with each
other because you know, 40 yearsour relationship's still
strong, and we're still learningabout each other.
We're still doing these things.
And now we're gonna incorporatethe weekly.
We do a yearly.
We we did that this year, andthat was wonderful.

(43:49):
Like uh just to get away, but Ilove the weekly.

James (43:52):
Huge.
So 39 out of 40 is some reallygreat statistics there, too.

I feel like it, you know.

James (43:58):
So I mean, it's curious.
I would love to ask you aquestion if that's all right, as
a good deal.

Absolutely.

James (44:03):
40 years, what's your secret?

I think a lot of some of the things you've
already shared, but I thinkcommunication, it really comes
down to communication and andyou know, not keeping like you
you just shared, Angela, notkeeping those little things
bottled up and having that clearline of communication.
And sometimes the conversationisn't easy.
And there's might be hurtfeelings, and you know, I tend

(44:29):
to say things very bluntlysometimes, which is not always
good.
But once the conversationstarts, it's like, okay, now
it's out there and let's talkabout it and we get through it.
And so I think communicationand just also too, I think what
you said earlier on, James, I dofeel like We are concerned with
how's the other person how howcan I make their life easier?

(44:52):
How can I help them, you know,enjoy life today?
What do they need?
And always looking after thatfirst.
And that we are we're a team.
You know, it's it's he's mybest friend.
I couldn't imagine not havingyou know, my husband, he's you
know, we're the ones we want togo do things together.
And I think that's importanttoo, is like we are each

(45:15):
other's, we're not just spouses,we're each other's best
friends.
And that's a huge thing.

James (45:22):
Beautiful.
Thank you for sharing.

Yeah, absolutely.
Thank you for asking.
Well, I knew this conversationwas going to be good with two
woos in the room.
Never you never have to worryabout the conversation not being
good.
And for anybody that is thatlistened to this conversation
and think, okay, I need more ofthis.

(45:45):
I need more of Angela and Jamesand what they're doing.
How do what's the best way forthem to find you?

James (45:51):
So our school community, S K O O L slash Love
Intentionally, we'll send it inthe show notes.com slash love
intentionally.
There's our, you know, what uhso that's the best place to find
us.
And that's the best place tofind our free resources.
So once you're in there, or theweekly marriage meeting is a
free resource.
You can grab that.
There's a little video on howto do it.
How to do it.
Oh awesome.
As well as a couple of otherthings.

(46:12):
And then once you're in there,you can message us.
You can access us directly, butthat is the best place.

Okay, great.
And that will be, like Angelasaid, that will be in the show
notes.
And then also what was the nameof your book again?

James (46:24):
Married and Magnetic.

Married and Magnetic.
And we'll put a link, I assume,is that on Amazon?
Yes.

James (46:31):
On Amazon, and that's also the name of our podcast
where we have two-on-twoconversations with real
entrepreneurial couples.
Doesn't mean both of them areentrepreneurs, but just one
person in the relationship is anentrepreneur, and they're
sharing what it's really like tobe in marriage in that
configuration.

Awesome.
Wonderful.
Well, we'll share all of thosethings in the show notes.
And thank you again, James andAngela, for being on the podcast
today and sharing what you doand playing along with the
strengths part too.
Hope you enjoyed that.
That was fun.
Yes.
Thank you for having us.
Thank you for spending thistime with me.
My hope is something you heardtoday inspires you to take

(47:07):
action toward discovering yourcalling.
I just have two favors to askof you before you go.
One, if you found value andenjoyed this episode, please
leave us a review on ApplePodcasts or Spotify, and you
might hear your review read on afuture episode.
And two, can you share thisepisode with three friends who
will also enjoy it as much asyou did?

(47:28):
By doing these things, you willhelp us grow the podcast to
make a bigger impact on theworld.
And until next week, remember,you've been created to live a
life of fulfillment, freedom,purpose, success, and joy.

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