December 19, 2024 • 38 mins
George Poll has spent decades building some of Long Island’s most celebrated restaurants. Alongside his brother, he’s crafted iconic dining experiences from Bryant & Cooper Steakhouse to Toku Modern Asian, blending culinary creativity with sharp business acumen. Recently, George took his expertise to Miami, where the journey to open Toku wasn’t exactly smooth sailing—facing all the challenges that come with launching in a new city.
This episode is a masterclass in the fine balance between tradition and innovation, the intense planning behind every design choice, and the hurdles that come with launching each new restaurant. Through stories of teamwork, resilience, and a relentless drive to improve, George offers listeners an unfiltered look inside the restaurant business.
George Poll is an alumnus of BU School of Hospitality Administration’s first graduating class and serves on the school’s Dean’s Advisory Board member. George also played on BU’s football team, which is no longer, but that story is for another podcast!
The “Distinguished” podcast is produced by Boston University School of Hospitality Administration.
Host: Arun Upneja, Dean
Producer: Mara Littman, Executive Director of Strategic Operations and Corporate Relations
Research and Content Creation: Lan Lu
Marketing: Anne Dawson
Editing: Isabella Laikin and James Leon
Music: “Airport Lounge" Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License
http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0
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Episode Transcript
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SPEAKER_01 (00:13):
This is Arun Rupnaja, Dean of the Bugh School
of Hospitality Administrationand the host of the
Distinguished Podcast.
I'm excited to welcome GeorgeBowl, an entrepreneur who's
never been afraid to speak hismind, winner of the Alum of the
Year Award from our school, anda key member of our advisory
board.
(00:34):
George has spent decadesbuilding some of Long Island's
most celebrated restaurants.
Alongside his brother, he hascrafted iconic dining
experiences, going from Bryantand Cooper's Steakhouse to Toku
modern Asian cuisine, blendingculinary creativity with a sharp
business acumen.
(00:54):
Recently, George took hisexpertise to Miami, where the
journey to open Toku wasn'texactly smooth sailing.
Facing regulatory delays and allthe challenges that come with
launching in a new city.
George doesn't sugarcoat hisopinions.
Whether it's about the highs andlows of running a restaurant
(01:15):
empire or the road box put inplace by local authorities, you
can expect an honest,no-nonsense conversation today.
We'll dive into what it reallytakes to thrive in the
restaurant industry, the hurdleshe has faced, expanding into new
markets, and how he has managedto stay at the top in a business
(01:36):
known for its high failure rate.
So get ready for some candidinsights, high octane
conversation, and maybe a fewstories you weren't expecting.
Welcome, George, theDistinguished Podcast.
SPEAKER_00 (01:50):
Thank you very much, Dean.
SPEAKER_01 (01:52):
It's amazing to have you here.
We've been talking about thisfor quite some time.
So it's I'm so happy that you'refinally here.
SPEAKER_00 (01:59):
Yeah, but you you set that uh bar pretty high for
me.
I don't know if I have as uhmuch insight and as much
information as you want.
A bunch of stories, I'm sure,but we'll see where you take me.
I'm gonna go on on your journey,and I'll let you lead the way.
SPEAKER_01 (02:13):
Aaron Powell I think people are gonna love your
story.
So okay, but let's start with uhthe first thing is you have so
many restaurants, and um mostentrepreneurs struggle with
maintaining quality whilescaling up, creating new
concepts.
So how do you do that?
How do you keep the quality inevery single restaurant that you
(02:34):
own so high?
SPEAKER_00 (02:35):
So my father always taught us quality.
Quality, quality, quality.
And a lot of my restaurants orour restaurants.
When you have quality, you don'thave to do much to it.
There's no hiding what it is,it's it's the best.
So I remember one of my uh firstclasses here at BU, I had a
professor Joe Curly.
(02:56):
And he says, Do you have to havegood quality to be successful?
And right away I raised my hand.
I have the answer to that one.
And he says, you know, yes, yes,uh, he didn't know my name at
the time, I guess.
It was like the first day.
And uh and he said, ProfessorCurly, yes, you have to have
good quality to be successful.
That's what I was raised on.
(03:16):
And he says, No, you don't.
And I was like, he's blowing mymind.
And he says, for those thatremember, I don't even know if
you know, there was a chaincalled Howard Johnson's.
Yes.
And they were all over thehighways across America.
And they were known for fortheir uh fried clams.
Now in New England, fried clamsincludes the belly, but these
(03:38):
were just strips of fried clams,and they were lousy.
But he said they wereconsistently lousy.
Consistency.
And you're talking about this as40-something years, and he said
it was going to be on the testat the end of the year, and it's
still in my head now.
Consistently fulfill theexpectations you've created.
(03:59):
So if your expectations are agreasy spoon or is a lousy
restaurant, it has to beconsistently that way.
Because if a customer comes inone day and it's great, and one
day it's not, you're gonna fail.
So I still believe inconsistently having good
quality.
But uh it was a great, greatlearning experience uh that I
got here at Boston University.
unknown (04:20):
Trevor Burrus, Jr.
SPEAKER_01 (04:20):
I can attest to it.
I've eaten at many of yourrestaurants consistently high
quality.
Thank you.
But I'm also, again, uh anotherquestion which is very
confusing.
When restaurant is create oneconcept and they're very
successful, they want to justtake it the easy way, replicate
the hell out of those restaurantconcepts and just keep making
(04:43):
more and more of those.
SPEAKER_00 (04:44):
Oh, I wish I.
SPEAKER_01 (04:45):
You don't do that.
SPEAKER_00 (04:46):
No, no, no.
Don't say I don't do it.
I didn't do it.
Well, you did, yeah.
I didn't do it, but oh,sometimes, especially if you
want to have investors or peoplewant to give you money, they
want to see that you've beensuccessful in many different
markets.
My brother and I, it just we hada restaurant and uh and we had
(05:06):
Brian and Cooper Steakhouse.
And there's uh one of the top uhgrossing shopping centers in the
country called the Americana.
And it's one sh it's one lightaway, it's one traffic light
away.
Big, very high-end shoppingcenter.
And the the owner of that centerum had space, he's he was
(05:27):
redoing it and putting in Gucciand Prada and all these
heavy-duty stores, but there wasno food service, and he wanted
to have a high-end restaurant,and uh he put in a restaurant
from New York, and there's somany things.
I can't give you 40 years ofknowledge in in one sitting, but
(05:47):
we met the owner, the chef ofthis restaurant that he put
there, very well-known chef fromNew York.
And he says, these people don'tknow what they want.
Actually, he said, these effingpeople don't know what they
want.
And my brother and I shook ourheads, they're like, oh boy,
he's in trouble.
Because we grew up in this area.
I know I knew my area.
So it failed.
And the owner of the shoppingcenter came to us and what was
(06:10):
what do you think we we shouldput here?
Well, I'm not gonna put anothersteakhouse a block away.
So we thought and we thought,and uh we saw a concept
somewhere else in a shoppingarea that did well.
It was uh an Italian idea.
So we decided to put an Italianrestaurant there.
And the restaurant that we tookover had a kitchen in the
(06:31):
basement.
Well, we had ideas of doinghundreds of meals.
Well, you can't be just puttingin a heating place.
So we took a larger part of thekitchen, we made the kitchen
larger, which left him a smallerspace in the back.
So he says, Well, what can youdo with this?
Because I can't I can't sellthis.
So we put a to-go uh area therebecause the center didn't have a
(06:54):
place to even get a cup ofwater.
So uh we opened up an Italianrestaurant.
People said, Well, what do youknow about Italian food?
Well, in the steakhouse I servemeat, I serve fish, I serve
chicken, I serve pasta, I justhave to serve chicken, meat,
pasta, just done differently,which is what Gallissa and I uh
(07:15):
do.
We we we find the food that welike and we have a chef make
that.
And uh we opened up an Italianrestaurant, and it was a big
hit.
So big a hit that people don'tusually go to shopping centers
at night.
The landlord was so thrilledthat we were filling the parking
lot at night, which is it leadspeople to look in the windows
(07:37):
all night long.
The stores are closed, butpeople I'm bringing in hundreds
of people there, and they'relooking in the windows, and he
loved it.
So he had another restaurant inthe center.
In the same center.
And oh, I I wanted you guys torun it.
I said, Gil.
I said, I said, we have theBrian and Cooper, and now we
have an Italian.
(07:57):
We're gonna we're we're goingthe same well over and over.
We can't do another restaurant.
My brother turns to me and says,Well, someone's gonna go in
there, might as well be us.
I said, Oh boy.
So we we thought, what are wegonna do?
What concept are we gonna do?
What's what's well at the timeuh Asian was was becoming
(08:18):
popular.
There was no boo in the city,which was really at the time.
Now there's numerous uhwell-known uh Asian restaurants,
but we're gonna do Asian.
People came to us.
What do you guys know aboutAsian?
Well, you're gonna serve steak,and you're gonna serve fish, and
you're gonna serve chicken, andyou're gonna serve noodles.
(08:41):
Just have to figure out.
So uh we went around and foundthings that we liked, and we've
traveled and we've traveled thethe world, my brother and I, and
and traveled all over, and we wego out eating and trying the
things that we like.
You know, our restaurants aren'tchef-driven.
If a chef leaves, the people getall, oh my God, you lost your
chef.
(09:01):
My brother and I, we say thatwe're we're chefs of taste.
I know if it's right or wrong.
I know what it's supposed totaste like.
It's your job.
I hire the chef.
It's your job to make it the wayI want it.
I don't know how to do it, butyou better know how to do it.
So uh we opened up a uh an Asianrestaurant, Toku, and thank God
(09:25):
it's a big success.
But we had to, so now we'rebecoming multi-concept guys, but
and we had to work at it, butit's a lot easier just to repeat
your same concepts.
You're taking a chance going todifferent areas.
These are all at least my owncustomers from people that know
us.
You want me to keep going?
Sure.
Oh my God.
All right.
(09:46):
So about two miles east isanother shopping center that
this that this landlord owns.
And uh and it was more of an 80,it was built like in the late
70s, early 80s, and and hewanted to redo that center.
Because the center that we'rein, that I was telling you, the
Americana, it was built in the50s.
(10:07):
When I was a kid, there was abowling alley and an ice cream
store and a Tom McCann's, and itwas just a regular shopping
center.
He's he's he's the one whoelevated it.
He had a supermarket there.
Everything out, Gucci, Prada,Louis Vuitton.
It's the it's the Madison Avenueof Long Island, and it's very
it's actually in Billy Joel'ssong, The Miracle Mile.
(10:28):
It's it's a famous area.
Well, two miles east, there'sthis little shopping center that
has a deli in it, and anothersupermarket, and he was going to
start changing that.
So I comes to my brother andGillis and I.
I want you to put a restauranthere, it's a nowhere's land.
It's not, it's not in an areathat we know that's further
(10:49):
east, and it's not in Manhassetwhere we have our three
restaurants.
No, no, no, no, no.
I need, I want you guys there tostart redoing it.
I'll build you a basement, andwe're gonna, oh my God.
What are we gonna put there?
We're not gonna do anotherAsian.
We're not gonna do so uh wedecided we saw um a restaurant
(11:10):
in New York called Pastis.
It's more of a bist show andlight fair, but it's all night
long kind of a thing.
And uh we designed a beautiful,all our restaurants are designed
unbelievably to their concept.
Our steakhouse was designed by aclassic steakhouse designer that
we knew from that did New York.
(11:30):
Um the Asian is spectacularlygreat.
We won awards for architecture.
The Italian restaurant isgorgeous, actually designed by
uh the man that does most of ourrestaurants, Peter Nimitz, right
here in Boston.
So we go and we design a Frenchbistro, you know, French top, uh
bar top from custom-made inFrance, brought it over, tile
(11:54):
floors, the whole, the wholething.
Well, it didn't do too well.
People didn't take to the fair,and it was taking time for to
get the food out of the kitchen,so we had to work.
We had to work on the kinks andthis and that, and the chef
left, and uh we but we we stayedwith it and we figured out we
may Americanized it a littlebit, and thank God that one's
(12:17):
doing well.
Okay, so we're doing prettywell.
Plus, we already had a casualsteakhouse from the 90s uh in
East Meadow.
Then uh, because you want toknow about why we have so many
different concepts.
So now we're uh we're trying toredo this this French Beast Show
and try to tweak it.
And a catering hall between theFrench Beast Show and Bryan
(12:42):
Cooper in a town called Roslynbecame available.
500-seat catering hall,different rooms though, not one
big hall.
It was a 200-seat and 250 and 50here, um, big parking lot.
There's no parking in that town.
This had big parking.
My brother said, come on, and wecan own the property.
(13:04):
I said, That's about what are wegonna do here, Gil?
It's an old, it was calledGeorge Washington Manor, and it
looked like and GeorgeWashington was actually there.
There's a part of the building.
Talk about dealing with townsand and and and bureaucracy.
Oh my God.
So let's talk about, we'll talkabout Hendrix for five minutes.
(13:24):
So we buy this catering hall,George Washington Manor.
Part of the building is from1740.
Oh, wow.
George Washington actually hadbreakfast there for real.
I don't know if he slept there,but I know that he had breakfast
there.
So it's called uh and it waswhite with these different
rooms, and it had a hearth andand pictures of presidents on
(13:46):
all the walls, and very, very umold style.
And really, my customer a fruitcup out of out of a jar for
dessert.
I mean, so and when I grew up,catering halls were where you
got married.
We knew a catering hall that wealmost bought that did four
(14:06):
weddings on a Friday, fourweddings Saturday morning, four
weddings Sunday night, fourweddings a Saturday night, four
weddings Sunday morning, four.
They were making money in the60s and the 70s.
But even myself, I got marriedin Greece.
Now everyone gets married allover the world.
And catering halls, you know,they'll they'll they'll they'll
want you to take$5 off there andthrow in this and do that.
(14:31):
The band's okay.
The band they're gonna spendmoney on, but the restaurant,
the food, we don't need that.
We'll cut down.
So my brother says, let's we'regonna make it a restaurant.
It was also a chess move becauseother restaurants were seeing,
okay, these poles are makingmoney out there.
People coming from New York, youknow, maybe another steakhouse
is gonna come, or maybe someoneelse is gonna come to our area.
(14:53):
So it's like to stop.
That's the only other place areally good steakhouse can go.
But it's down the street fromBrandon Cooper.
SPEAKER_01 (14:59):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (15:00):
So my brother tells me let's let's open.
We we buy the property, we haverun this, this, this, this, we
turned it into a restaurant.
And now we we wanna we wannarenovate it.
We have to renovate it.
And it's in a historical town.
SPEAKER_01 (15:19):
George Washington ate breakfast there.
SPEAKER_00 (15:21):
He ate breakfast there, but uh it was a Mexican
restaurant 30 years before that.
In the 70s, it was a Mexicanrestaurant, but people don't
know that.
It yes, it it was it's GeorgeWashington Manor, who's
catering.
So uh we had Peter Nimesdesigner.
We always brought New York outhere.
You know, when I grew up, whenyou want to go out, you went to
(15:43):
New York City.
We're about 30 minutes out fromNew York City.
And and like uh the uh uh ourlandlord from the Americana, he
brought New York and style outhere.
That's what my brother and Ihave done.
We brought New York out to LongIsland.
You know, the reason why we didthe steakhouse, and I think I'm
jumping back and forth now, wasbecause my brother used to live
in the city, my brother Gillis.
(16:03):
And he and he saw during highsand lows and recessions, the
only restaurants that werealways busy were steakhouses,
because you went to steakhousesto celebrate, you went to
steakhouses to have a good time,you went to steakhouses to have
a good drink.
So that's why we we built Bryanand Cooper.
So the Hendricks uh we're gonna,we we had our designer bring
(16:24):
like uh there's restaurantsdowntown in the city that are
dark and and warm and they had afireplace and like not down and
dirty, but just places that seemthey've been there a long time.
Now, even though it's GeorgeWashington Manor and it's George
Washington, and the building'sbeen there a long time, it
didn't look that way.
SPEAKER_01 (16:42):
It looked like so you have to modernize it and
then you have to make it lookold.
SPEAKER_00 (16:47):
Okay.
Right.
Because modernize it.
So now we have to go get adesign and and get a but
meanwhile, I'm still not makingit at the French Beast Joe, Bar
Fried's.
We're tweaking that as we'redoing this new project and
buying the property andborrowing money, and now we have
to go to these guys to build it.
(17:07):
Well, you start opening upwalls.
I mean, we opened up one wallwhere there was an office, we
were going to put bathrooms, andthen the foundation wasn't there
anymore.
It was, it was, it wasn't, therewas nothing holding up the wall
but the other two walls.
So you had to pour a foundation,and then another wall they
opened up.
And these old wood beams aretwisted.
You had to get steel to hold upthe roof.
(17:29):
I mean, on and on.
We took out uh, or someone tookthe around one of the fireplaces
upstairs, the the upstairs therewas a fireplace, and they took
out the mantle because they weregoing to do some work.
Well, when they took off themantle, it was so old it
disintegrated.
The town wants to know where themantle is.
(17:50):
What do you mean you want it?
It disintegrated.
We want it.
In case someone else bought itfrom us and wants to put it
back, we had to keep it.
But but there was nothing tokeep.
I mean, because everything wewere doing, the color of the
paint had to go to the town.
It has to be a historical color.
Okay, my designer dealt withthat.
He has he has to deal with thatin Boston.
So he he he knew his way aroundthat.
(18:13):
There was a door, there is adoor that faces the town.
That if there was a fire and Ihave to run through that door in
an emergency, I'd bedecapitated.
So we go to the town, we'regonna raise the door.
Oh no, you're not.
No, you don't understand.
It has to be handicapped and ithas to be raised for a fire.
Oh no.
(18:34):
Historical Trumps, ADA and fire.
I mean, I've never heard ofthese things in my life.
So they had to go through allthese things.
The windows have to be, we hadto put it back the way it looked
because they had a picture fromthe 1800s or 1900s of what that
the the building that'soriginal.
(18:56):
The building that was originalnow has uh parts that made it a
restaurant.
There's a long catering room,there's another long room, but
the original building that'sstill there, we had to really
not touch too much.
The other buildings, because itwas all add-ons.
We put in a bar and we put in uhuh event space and upstairs.
SPEAKER_01 (19:19):
But now this is 500 seats still?
Oh, yeah.
Five and no parking.
SPEAKER_00 (19:25):
No, plenty of parking.
We have the only parking in theOh yeah, we have parking, we
have seats, we we have anoutside area now.
Uh it's beautiful.
It's called Oh, so I changed thename.
SPEAKER_01 (19:36):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (19:36):
I changed the name, Hendrick's Tavern.
Hendrick.
Hendrik Underdunk is the man whoowned it.
He had a printing press there,he had a uh a gristmill there,
he supported the RevolutionaryWar, which is why George
Washington came.
Well, this woman's walkingthrough town, and I'm outside
looking at the sign going on.
(19:57):
Shame on you! Shame on you.
She shamed me.
Shame.
He took down the president'sname, the president of the
United States.
I said, it's it's it's Mr.
Under Dunk's house.
Um, I'm honoring the village.
I'm honoring shame on you.
Oh my God.
So long story short, thank Godthat restaurant's doing well.
We we tweaked uh the bar freeze,that's doing well.
(20:20):
So so again, oh, but the Hendrixis literally like walking from
here to the football stadium tomy other steakhouse.
So we didn't call it asteakhouse, even though it's
primarily steaks and and otheritems and some things from our
other restaurants.
It was called Hendrix Tavern.
Hendrik Anderdonks?
Hendrix Tavern.
(20:41):
And it's very warm.
Oh, have you been there?
I've been there, yes.
SPEAKER_01 (20:45):
There's a BU event you hosted there.
Trevor Burrus, Jr.
SPEAKER_00 (20:47):
Oh yeah, BU in our VIP room downstairs that has its
own parking lot.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
So it was I was there.
SPEAKER_01 (20:53):
So, George, I cannot even imagine anyone winning any
argument against you.
So do you do you does he everwin arguments?
SPEAKER_00 (21:00):
I think he's an older brother, right?
Trevor Burrus, Jr.
He's an older brother.
SPEAKER_01 (21:03):
I think that's why uh Do you let him win and then
do what you want anyways?
SPEAKER_00 (21:08):
Well No, no, no, no, no, and I don't want to make
anyone sound bad, but we uh uhWe have another brother that we
were in business with in anotherrestaurant, and he's done very
well.
He's successful, he owned theboathouse in Central Park, he
now owns Gallagher's in NewYork, he owns Gallagher's down
in Miami, but he was a middlebrother.
(21:31):
Gillis is my is the oldest, thenmy brother Dean, and then
myself.
And there would be discussionsof how to get things done, and
some people want to do it theirway, and that's the only way.
So um we we thought it'd bebetter that we all stick
together because we all have ourstrengths.
But we ended up uh separating.
(21:54):
My brother Dean does his ownthing, and my brother Gillis and
I stayed together when it wasjust Brian and Cooper and
Majors.
And he and I have my brotherDean has done well and we've
done well.
But as far as the uh who winsand who loses, I think.
Between you and GitHub.
I think that's what really makesit a nice team.
(22:14):
I think when one of us isreally, really like it's gotta
be this way.
You know, I might not agree, butlet's do that.
Or if I really feel but if we goback and forth and he really
thinks this is this, and Ireally think this is that, then
we just leave it however it is,because it's too much to fight
of.
(22:34):
I mean, listen, it's so we welisten to each other and we kind
of do too much of the samething.
I mean, I handle for instancethe wine.
Uh I let him handle liquorbecause I'm not a licorice, so I
don't know anything about reallyso he handles that, but
everything else from real estatedeals to regular deals to a
(22:56):
pasta dish to uh to you knowwhat knife to use.
We we look at it all togetherand discuss it together.
SPEAKER_01 (23:05):
Aaron Ross Powell So let's talk about recent
expansion to Miami.
Aaron Ross Powell So Toku,you're opening uh second toku
there.
You opened a second to open.
You already opened it.
Um in Long Island, you know thepeople, you know the rules.
How was it in opening it inMiami?
SPEAKER_00 (23:23):
Um You're very right.
The not even being in New YorkCity, having uh five or six
restaurants within two or threemiles of each other.
Yes, I know all the people inthe city, I know people in the
town, I know you know how to getmy liquor license.
Yes, it is different, but youhire experts.
(23:44):
Uh uh my brother found a spacedown there that he really spoke
to him, and he showed it to methat uh in Aventure, a big it
was a Grand Lux Cafe, and hefelt, oh, there's a big toku,
big, big, huge, big toku.
Our toku does unbelievably.
But the ceilings are like wehave a small little Buddha in
(24:06):
the back.
This one he saw a big Buddha.
We're gonna have a big Buddha,and we're gonna have uh display
on the Buddha, and we're gonnahave a big bar.
The Grand Luxes are big.
So we go into the uh we we makea deal with with the with the
mall.
It's it's it's not inside themall, it's outside, it's uh it's
(24:27):
on the outside, it has its ownown entrance, but it's part of
the Aventura Mall.
Very, very uh uh large mall, oneof the better malls in the
country.
It has up, it has it, it it's ithas a lot of people go to that
that mall.
And they've asked us before tobe in in other sections, but
this one spoke to my brother.
(24:48):
So uh, okay, we're gonna do it.
And the landlord will give us alittle bit of money to help put
it.
But it has a lot of, it has akitchen already.
It has a kitchen, so you don'thave to put a new kitchen and
has a bar, but we're gonna movesome wall.
We don't want to spend a lot ofmoney.
We want to spend a couple ofmillion dollars just, you know,
(25:08):
facelift, make it look nice.
You know, the free they haverefrigerators.
Yeah, they have everything, theyhave the plumbing.
Well, they give us the set ofplans for grand locks, what and
they're called they're called asbuilt.
As built.
You know what an as built is?
These are final, the place isbuilt, this is what was okayed
(25:31):
by the town, stamped everything.
Everything's to code.
Of course, 20 years old, butthis is what well, as we we
start doing a little bit of theconstruction that we want to do,
the uh our our people and ourcontractors, well, the pipes
aren't where they say they areon the on the uh on the plans.
(25:52):
And certain waste pipes don't goto the where they're supposed
to, and then there's new lawsand regulations.
So the new so uh there'ssomething in Florida called
Durham that takes care of whereyour wastewater goes and your
grease chest, and you had toopen up the the parking lot for
(26:12):
that, but that has to do withthe town and not the mall.
And you need an engineer to comein, then we have to rip up the
floors, the bathrooms we'regonna redo anyway, but uh and we
had a very, very uh uh uh uh uma designer with uh it was a
different designer.
We tried someone different uhthat that does we tried it on
(26:35):
the designer, and it was abeautiful design, but I'm like,
I I want to leave the airconditioning where it is.
You're moving walls andopenings, and then with the
kitchen, the the therefrigerators really weren't
that good, and the line's nothow we want to do it, and the
way the air comes in and theunits, because it's Florida and
it has salt in the air, theunits have to be changed.
(26:59):
Well, I ended up we usuallysometimes when you go into a
shopping center or something,they give you a vanilla box.
Well, we had to turn it in.
We had to take everything thatwas in this Grand Lux and gut
though.
So I had to pay for the gut.
I had to pay for putting thingsback.
Then our design, then we'retrying to um what's the
expression?
(27:20):
Uh evaluate uh and evaluatevalue engineer the design.
And here's the design.
What's gonna it's way over whatwe want to spend.
Way! All right, let's let's howare we gonna do this?
And I'm coming up with ideas.
Well, it costs as much for thatas for the original idea, and
you like the original.
Days figuring things out.
Then we have a mirror on theceiling in the bar, and it has
(27:44):
to be screwed in, and the theinspector comes and the screw,
he wants to know how is thescrew and how it's gonna lock,
and then and when the inspectorcomes, so you can't work until
that inspector comes, and thatguy, if you're not working and
that guy is not working, put itup the ceiling.
Well, you can't lay the flooruntil the ceiling's up, and you
want to get open by a certainday because the contra the your
(28:05):
your lease says you have to openby a certain day, and now
they're holding, oh my God.
And then uh how long did it takeyou to to open it?
I I don't remember.
Listen.
I think you put it away fromyour memory, I think.
How long did it take?
I'm gonna tell you how long ittook.
Another brilliant thing that mybrother always tells me, and I
(28:26):
say it back to him.
We always say when we look atthese j projects that we do,
like Hendrix.
Hendrix, did that kitchen?
The kitchen was so old, we hadto take all the equipment out
and put a new floor andwaterproof it and make it brand
new, brand new kid, brand new umuh uh uh um air system and
(28:49):
vents, everything's new.
And then we're gonna clean theequipment and put it back.
And my brother turns to me andsays, You're gonna put that
dirty old equipment in in ournew kitchen?
I said, Gil, you're killing mehere.
And he says, Well, if not if, hesays, when we're successful,
we're gonna close for a week tobuy put new equipment.
So we put new, so we spent themoney and bit the bullet and did
(29:12):
that.
Well, same thing, same thinghere in uh in Toku.
So, same thing.
We're going through all theseissues and all these problems.
And my brother always turns tome, or when he's down, I always
turn to him.
One day there'll be peopleeating here.
SPEAKER_01 (29:28):
So I guess that's a very important concept of having
people come and eat in thisbeautiful place you've designed
and the experience that you'recreating.
I guess that's very important toyou, right?
SPEAKER_00 (29:40):
Well, uh, you know, when we were doing uh Cipellini,
the Italian restaurant, andwe're going through the again.
We know our designer's great.
We know Peter's great.
We know the design's right.
And we know how to make we knowhow to make good food.
Even our chefs always said, youknow, it has to be Gillis and
(30:01):
George good.
Has to be good enough that evenwhen I'm full, I want to take
another bite.
So that's not the hard part.
So but when the landlord wantsus to move the wall, you know,
six inches, to me that'smind-blowing.
Like my landlord, he he he wasMr.
Castagna from Americana, who'sno longer with us, but great,
great guy.
To him, moving a wall isnothing.
(30:23):
But restaurant, he asked us, wewere about a month out from
opening, where's the menu?
I want to see the menu.
And I looked at him.
I I don't worry about the menu.
Menu.
I know what to do.
I know how to make a menu.
I know what people want.
I know what I want, and I thinkthat's what people want, and
it's worked out.
But moving that we have to movethis wall six inches?
You're kidding me?
To me, it's so I don't know ifthat answers your question, but
(30:47):
I I I think when we're alwaysscared, brother and I'm it's in
the there's no guarantee.
But you try to put the mostthings, you know, when when we
decide on a deal or we decide onon what we're gonna do, we talk
about, we and we always talkabout the downside.
What's the downside?
Well, if it doesn't work, howmuch money are we gonna lose?
(31:07):
Or if it doesn't work, is itgonna change our lifestyle?
Or if it doesn't work, well, itcan't not work at all.
Some money is gonna come in.
And these are the do we haveparking?
Do we do we have can peoplecome?
Is it in the right area?
I mean, we had a restaurant inum the three of us at one point,
there was a majors we had inFlorida.
(31:29):
And the entrance to the sh tothe center, we we were a
freestanding restaurant in a umin a business area where there
were uh uh buildings.
And it was, you can see it fromthe highway.
But when you're coming down themain road, by the time you saw
the sign and you saw therestaurant, you turn in, you
(31:51):
were turning onto the highway.
There was no sign at thebeginning of the business
center, and they wouldn't let ushave a sign.
And these are the things overthe years you learn.
It was a big detriment.
All kinds of they wanted to cometo us, but they it was a pain in
the ass.
Once they were on the highway tocome back.
So they would just say, ah,forget it.
And there were other issues atthat time, and we were learning
(32:12):
and growing.
But there are things that youlearn.
You want as many things on thisside of the, there's no
guarantee, but you want as manythings on this side of the of
the ledger to say, all right,this is a good good chance.
This we should be okay.
And if you do okay, and then youdo better, hopefully you keep
(32:32):
going.
SPEAKER_01 (32:32):
Aaron Powell, I was going to ask this question,
George.
You are clearly highly motivatedand passionate about food.
And I have traveled with you alittle bit in every place you
want to go, try out new things.
How do you keep your passionlevel so high for so many years?
SPEAKER_00 (32:49):
Aaron Ross Powell What makes me I'm just a
passionate person.
I can be I'm just passionate.
I'm passionate.
If this water is really good,I'm gonna say, Arun, have you
had this water?
It's I'm passionate about music,I'm passionate about life, I'm
passionate about love, I'mpassionate about my children,
I'm passionate, I could bepassionate about art, or I may
say, that's the ugliest piece ofyou know what I've ever seen,
(33:12):
but I just that's the way I am.
As far as how do I staypassionate in this business,
this is what I know.
You know, my friend made fun ofme.
You were saying how I we go outand you see I'm always looking,
I'm always looking.
Always, I'm always working.
And my friend, my best friendPeter, we're talking about again
in the 70, 79, where we would goto the diner and they burnt the
(33:35):
water and they put the waterdown like this with their hands
on the top of the glass.
Big no-no.
You don't put your fingers wherepeople put their mouth.
So I go like this to my friend,I said, ah, I can't drink that
water.
And he like made fun of me.
He says, you know, you're alwaysyou're always picking, you're
always looking at what's goingon.
So one day he comes to myrestaurant and and and he's in
(33:57):
the fur business.
And a lady was walking by, andas she walked by, he just stuck
his hand out and he just feltthe fur.
She walked by and he says, Iknew it was fake.
I knew that was a fake.
And I said, Oh, oh, when it'swhat you do, it's okay.
But when it's what I do, soyeah, I'm always looking, I'm
always trying to get new ideas.
Every time I go away, my phone,I'm taking pictures, I steal
(34:19):
menus.
My brother says, You can see itonline.
I said, No, I need the what thepaper is.
I have to see the time, the waythat sometimes they don't put
the prices online.
I I want to see, I want to feel,I want to smell, I want to, I
want to taste, and then I wantto give it to you.
Then I want to give it to you.
If I love it, I want to give itto you.
(34:41):
So maybe maybe that answersthat.
Maybe just a little bit.
SPEAKER_01 (34:46):
It absolutely does.
To wrap up, I have some few funquestions for you, Jar.
You have so many restaurantconcepts.
If you could eat at only one ofthem for the rest of your life,
which one would it be?
Oh my God, that's that's not afun question.
SPEAKER_00 (34:59):
My standard answer, which is my true feeling.
I have with my brother builtthese babies.
We had babies, these are ourchildren, they are.
Down to the the grout.
What what color grout in theground?
I mean, it's it's they're allour favorites.
And and uh it's gonna be a longobviously, all my answers are
(35:24):
very long to your questions.
I had a customer one time atToku ask me, what's your
favorite thing?
And the person next to him, oh,he likes everything, because you
know, yeah, he's the owner.
He's like I I do like everythingbecause I put it on the menu.
Chef didn't put it, I put it onthe menu.
My brother and I, those are ourfavorite things.
That's why they're there.
Okay.
(35:44):
So so to answer the questionfairly.
They're all like I always tellpeople, how do you do how which
is your favorite child?
You can't pick your favoritechild.
SPEAKER_01 (35:54):
I was that's what I was gonna say.
I'll make it easy for you.
Tell me who's your favoritechild.
I don't have a favorite child.
SPEAKER_00 (35:59):
But I am gonna answer the question in the one
way.
SPEAKER_01 (36:02):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (36:03):
When I leave the country, and my wife and I, we
go traveling or we go somewhere,or we're gonna go to Greece or
London, wherever we go in theworld, when we land, and we
finally we're on our way home,we have to get a port I have we
gotta have the steak and potato.
It's American.
(36:23):
We we go to Brandon Cooper andwe get steak and potatoes and
the salad and mashed potato.
And so I do miss that a lot whenI don't have a nice big age
steak.
SPEAKER_01 (36:35):
I know that since you make the menus for all your
restaurants, so everywhere inthe world you go, is there a
dish that you've not yetreplicated that you've really
enjoyed somewhere and you wantto come back and put it in one
of your restaurants at somepoint?
SPEAKER_00 (36:49):
Aaron Ross Powell That's a fun question because I
I see things all over.
All over.
And it's so funny you asked methat question.
I I I think see things, then Iforget, and I take pictures of
it.
And I'll look at pictures fromuh it was shockingly seven
years, oh shoot, I didn't oh Iwant to do that.
I've been now that I have anassistant, I send her the
pictures and remind me of that.
(37:09):
But the one dish that comes tomy mind, I was in south of
France, I want to put this inBar Frites.
So someone remind me out thereon the podcast.
I saw mussels.
I we made great clams reganata,great clams regonata in in in a
few of our restaurants.
But it was mussels uh just don'tknow how you would do that.
Do you have to cook the musselfirst?
(37:30):
Because we were on a beach in inSaint Chile.
But uh that dish I sticks in mymind as that's something I like
to do in one of the restaurants.
That's amazing.
That was a good that was a goodfun question.
SPEAKER_01 (37:44):
George, it was an absolute hoot to have you on the
podcast.
And I look forward to the tip ofthe iceberg with me.
It is on the tip of the iceberg.
We're gonna do many more.
Really enjoyed having you.
Thank you so much for coming.
Thanks for having me.
And thank you for all thesupport to the school.
You're on our advisory board.
Your picture graces our wallshere.
(38:05):
Thanks for watching.
First graduating class.
First graduating class, part ofBU football team.
Ah, don't stop me.
That could be a whole hour juston that.
Thank you.
Thanks for asking.
Thank you.
And thank you, everyone, forjoining us today.
Special thanks to the team whoproduces this podcast, Bara
Littman, Andy Halleck, and theentire team at Boston University
(38:27):
School of HospitalityAdministration.
To keep up with distinguishedpodcasts, be sure to subscribe
wherever you listen to yourfavorite podcast.
You can also learn more aboutour undergraduate and graduate
programs at Boston UniversitySchool of Hospitality
Administration by visitingbu.edu slash hospitality.
This is Arun Rupnaja, Dean of the Bugh School
of Hospitality Administrationand the host of the
Distinguished Podcast.
I'm excited to welcome GeorgeBowl, an entrepreneur who's
never been afraid to speak hismind, winner of the Alum of the
Year Award from our school, anda key member of our advisory
board.
(00:34):
George has spent decadesbuilding some of Long Island's
most celebrated restaurants.
Alongside his brother, he hascrafted iconic dining
experiences, going from Bryantand Cooper's Steakhouse to Toku
modern Asian cuisine, blendingculinary creativity with a sharp
business acumen.
(00:54):
Recently, George took hisexpertise to Miami, where the
journey to open Toku wasn'texactly smooth sailing.
Facing regulatory delays and allthe challenges that come with
launching in a new city.
George doesn't sugarcoat hisopinions.
Whether it's about the highs andlows of running a restaurant
(01:15):
empire or the road box put inplace by local authorities, you
can expect an honest,no-nonsense conversation today.
We'll dive into what it reallytakes to thrive in the
restaurant industry, the hurdleshe has faced, expanding into new
markets, and how he has managedto stay at the top in a business
(01:36):
known for its high failure rate.
So get ready for some candidinsights, high octane
conversation, and maybe a fewstories you weren't expecting.
Welcome, George, theDistinguished Podcast.
SPEAKER_00 (01:50):
Thank you very much, Dean.
SPEAKER_01 (01:52):
It's amazing to have you here.
We've been talking about thisfor quite some time.
So it's I'm so happy that you'refinally here.
SPEAKER_00 (01:59):
Yeah, but you you set that uh bar pretty high for
me.
I don't know if I have as uhmuch insight and as much
information as you want.
A bunch of stories, I'm sure,but we'll see where you take me.
I'm gonna go on on your journey,and I'll let you lead the way.
SPEAKER_01 (02:13):
Aaron Powell I think people are gonna love your
story.
So okay, but let's start with uhthe first thing is you have so
many restaurants, and um mostentrepreneurs struggle with
maintaining quality whilescaling up, creating new
concepts.
So how do you do that?
How do you keep the quality inevery single restaurant that you
(02:34):
own so high?
SPEAKER_00 (02:35):
So my father always taught us quality.
Quality, quality, quality.
And a lot of my restaurants orour restaurants.
When you have quality, you don'thave to do much to it.
There's no hiding what it is,it's it's the best.
So I remember one of my uh firstclasses here at BU, I had a
professor Joe Curly.
(02:56):
And he says, Do you have to havegood quality to be successful?
And right away I raised my hand.
I have the answer to that one.
And he says, you know, yes, yes,uh, he didn't know my name at
the time, I guess.
It was like the first day.
And uh and he said, ProfessorCurly, yes, you have to have
good quality to be successful.
That's what I was raised on.
(03:16):
And he says, No, you don't.
And I was like, he's blowing mymind.
And he says, for those thatremember, I don't even know if
you know, there was a chaincalled Howard Johnson's.
Yes.
And they were all over thehighways across America.
And they were known for fortheir uh fried clams.
Now in New England, fried clamsincludes the belly, but these
(03:38):
were just strips of fried clams,and they were lousy.
But he said they wereconsistently lousy.
Consistency.
And you're talking about this as40-something years, and he said
it was going to be on the testat the end of the year, and it's
still in my head now.
Consistently fulfill theexpectations you've created.
(03:59):
So if your expectations are agreasy spoon or is a lousy
restaurant, it has to beconsistently that way.
Because if a customer comes inone day and it's great, and one
day it's not, you're gonna fail.
So I still believe inconsistently having good
quality.
But uh it was a great, greatlearning experience uh that I
got here at Boston University.
unknown (04:20):
Trevor Burrus, Jr.
SPEAKER_01 (04:20):
I can attest to it.
I've eaten at many of yourrestaurants consistently high
quality.
Thank you.
But I'm also, again, uh anotherquestion which is very
confusing.
When restaurant is create oneconcept and they're very
successful, they want to justtake it the easy way, replicate
the hell out of those restaurantconcepts and just keep making
(04:43):
more and more of those.
SPEAKER_00 (04:44):
Oh, I wish I.
SPEAKER_01 (04:45):
You don't do that.
SPEAKER_00 (04:46):
No, no, no.
Don't say I don't do it.
I didn't do it.
Well, you did, yeah.
I didn't do it, but oh,sometimes, especially if you
want to have investors or peoplewant to give you money, they
want to see that you've beensuccessful in many different
markets.
My brother and I, it just we hada restaurant and uh and we had
(05:06):
Brian and Cooper Steakhouse.
And there's uh one of the top uhgrossing shopping centers in the
country called the Americana.
And it's one sh it's one lightaway, it's one traffic light
away.
Big, very high-end shoppingcenter.
And the the owner of that centerum had space, he's he was
(05:27):
redoing it and putting in Gucciand Prada and all these
heavy-duty stores, but there wasno food service, and he wanted
to have a high-end restaurant,and uh he put in a restaurant
from New York, and there's somany things.
I can't give you 40 years ofknowledge in in one sitting, but
(05:47):
we met the owner, the chef ofthis restaurant that he put
there, very well-known chef fromNew York.
And he says, these people don'tknow what they want.
Actually, he said, these effingpeople don't know what they
want.
And my brother and I shook ourheads, they're like, oh boy,
he's in trouble.
Because we grew up in this area.
I know I knew my area.
So it failed.
And the owner of the shoppingcenter came to us and what was
(06:10):
what do you think we we shouldput here?
Well, I'm not gonna put anothersteakhouse a block away.
So we thought and we thought,and uh we saw a concept
somewhere else in a shoppingarea that did well.
It was uh an Italian idea.
So we decided to put an Italianrestaurant there.
And the restaurant that we tookover had a kitchen in the
(06:31):
basement.
Well, we had ideas of doinghundreds of meals.
Well, you can't be just puttingin a heating place.
So we took a larger part of thekitchen, we made the kitchen
larger, which left him a smallerspace in the back.
So he says, Well, what can youdo with this?
Because I can't I can't sellthis.
So we put a to-go uh area therebecause the center didn't have a
(06:54):
place to even get a cup ofwater.
So uh we opened up an Italianrestaurant.
People said, Well, what do youknow about Italian food?
Well, in the steakhouse I servemeat, I serve fish, I serve
chicken, I serve pasta, I justhave to serve chicken, meat,
pasta, just done differently,which is what Gallissa and I uh
(07:15):
do.
We we we find the food that welike and we have a chef make
that.
And uh we opened up an Italianrestaurant, and it was a big
hit.
So big a hit that people don'tusually go to shopping centers
at night.
The landlord was so thrilledthat we were filling the parking
lot at night, which is it leadspeople to look in the windows
(07:37):
all night long.
The stores are closed, butpeople I'm bringing in hundreds
of people there, and they'relooking in the windows, and he
loved it.
So he had another restaurant inthe center.
In the same center.
And oh, I I wanted you guys torun it.
I said, Gil.
I said, I said, we have theBrian and Cooper, and now we
have an Italian.
(07:57):
We're gonna we're we're goingthe same well over and over.
We can't do another restaurant.
My brother turns to me and says,Well, someone's gonna go in
there, might as well be us.
I said, Oh boy.
So we we thought, what are wegonna do?
What concept are we gonna do?
What's what's well at the timeuh Asian was was becoming
(08:18):
popular.
There was no boo in the city,which was really at the time.
Now there's numerous uhwell-known uh Asian restaurants,
but we're gonna do Asian.
People came to us.
What do you guys know aboutAsian?
Well, you're gonna serve steak,and you're gonna serve fish, and
you're gonna serve chicken, andyou're gonna serve noodles.
(08:41):
Just have to figure out.
So uh we went around and foundthings that we liked, and we've
traveled and we've traveled thethe world, my brother and I, and
and traveled all over, and we wego out eating and trying the
things that we like.
You know, our restaurants aren'tchef-driven.
If a chef leaves, the people getall, oh my God, you lost your
chef.
(09:01):
My brother and I, we say thatwe're we're chefs of taste.
I know if it's right or wrong.
I know what it's supposed totaste like.
It's your job.
I hire the chef.
It's your job to make it the wayI want it.
I don't know how to do it, butyou better know how to do it.
So uh we opened up a uh an Asianrestaurant, Toku, and thank God
(09:25):
it's a big success.
But we had to, so now we'rebecoming multi-concept guys, but
and we had to work at it, butit's a lot easier just to repeat
your same concepts.
You're taking a chance going todifferent areas.
These are all at least my owncustomers from people that know
us.
You want me to keep going?
Sure.
Oh my God.
All right.
(09:46):
So about two miles east isanother shopping center that
this that this landlord owns.
And uh and it was more of an 80,it was built like in the late
70s, early 80s, and and hewanted to redo that center.
Because the center that we'rein, that I was telling you, the
Americana, it was built in the50s.
(10:07):
When I was a kid, there was abowling alley and an ice cream
store and a Tom McCann's, and itwas just a regular shopping
center.
He's he's he's the one whoelevated it.
He had a supermarket there.
Everything out, Gucci, Prada,Louis Vuitton.
It's the it's the Madison Avenueof Long Island, and it's very
it's actually in Billy Joel'ssong, The Miracle Mile.
(10:28):
It's it's a famous area.
Well, two miles east, there'sthis little shopping center that
has a deli in it, and anothersupermarket, and he was going to
start changing that.
So I comes to my brother andGillis and I.
I want you to put a restauranthere, it's a nowhere's land.
It's not, it's not in an areathat we know that's further
(10:49):
east, and it's not in Manhassetwhere we have our three
restaurants.
No, no, no, no, no.
I need, I want you guys there tostart redoing it.
I'll build you a basement, andwe're gonna, oh my God.
What are we gonna put there?
We're not gonna do anotherAsian.
We're not gonna do so uh wedecided we saw um a restaurant
(11:10):
in New York called Pastis.
It's more of a bist show andlight fair, but it's all night
long kind of a thing.
And uh we designed a beautiful,all our restaurants are designed
unbelievably to their concept.
Our steakhouse was designed by aclassic steakhouse designer that
we knew from that did New York.
(11:30):
Um the Asian is spectacularlygreat.
We won awards for architecture.
The Italian restaurant isgorgeous, actually designed by
uh the man that does most of ourrestaurants, Peter Nimitz, right
here in Boston.
So we go and we design a Frenchbistro, you know, French top, uh
bar top from custom-made inFrance, brought it over, tile
(11:54):
floors, the whole, the wholething.
Well, it didn't do too well.
People didn't take to the fair,and it was taking time for to
get the food out of the kitchen,so we had to work.
We had to work on the kinks andthis and that, and the chef
left, and uh we but we we stayedwith it and we figured out we
may Americanized it a littlebit, and thank God that one's
(12:17):
doing well.
Okay, so we're doing prettywell.
Plus, we already had a casualsteakhouse from the 90s uh in
East Meadow.
Then uh, because you want toknow about why we have so many
different concepts.
So now we're uh we're trying toredo this this French Beast Show
and try to tweak it.
And a catering hall between theFrench Beast Show and Bryan
(12:42):
Cooper in a town called Roslynbecame available.
500-seat catering hall,different rooms though, not one
big hall.
It was a 200-seat and 250 and 50here, um, big parking lot.
There's no parking in that town.
This had big parking.
My brother said, come on, and wecan own the property.
(13:04):
I said, That's about what are wegonna do here, Gil?
It's an old, it was calledGeorge Washington Manor, and it
looked like and GeorgeWashington was actually there.
There's a part of the building.
Talk about dealing with townsand and and and bureaucracy.
Oh my God.
So let's talk about, we'll talkabout Hendrix for five minutes.
(13:24):
So we buy this catering hall,George Washington Manor.
Part of the building is from1740.
Oh, wow.
George Washington actually hadbreakfast there for real.
I don't know if he slept there,but I know that he had breakfast
there.
So it's called uh and it waswhite with these different
rooms, and it had a hearth andand pictures of presidents on
(13:46):
all the walls, and very, very umold style.
And really, my customer a fruitcup out of out of a jar for
dessert.
I mean, so and when I grew up,catering halls were where you
got married.
We knew a catering hall that wealmost bought that did four
(14:06):
weddings on a Friday, fourweddings Saturday morning, four
weddings Sunday night, fourweddings a Saturday night, four
weddings Sunday morning, four.
They were making money in the60s and the 70s.
But even myself, I got marriedin Greece.
Now everyone gets married allover the world.
And catering halls, you know,they'll they'll they'll they'll
want you to take$5 off there andthrow in this and do that.
(14:31):
The band's okay.
The band they're gonna spendmoney on, but the restaurant,
the food, we don't need that.
We'll cut down.
So my brother says, let's we'regonna make it a restaurant.
It was also a chess move becauseother restaurants were seeing,
okay, these poles are makingmoney out there.
People coming from New York, youknow, maybe another steakhouse
is gonna come, or maybe someoneelse is gonna come to our area.
(14:53):
So it's like to stop.
That's the only other place areally good steakhouse can go.
But it's down the street fromBrandon Cooper.
SPEAKER_01 (14:59):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (15:00):
So my brother tells me let's let's open.
We we buy the property, we haverun this, this, this, this, we
turned it into a restaurant.
And now we we wanna we wannarenovate it.
We have to renovate it.
And it's in a historical town.
SPEAKER_01 (15:19):
George Washington ate breakfast there.
SPEAKER_00 (15:21):
He ate breakfast there, but uh it was a Mexican
restaurant 30 years before that.
In the 70s, it was a Mexicanrestaurant, but people don't
know that.
It yes, it it was it's GeorgeWashington Manor, who's
catering.
So uh we had Peter Nimesdesigner.
We always brought New York outhere.
You know, when I grew up, whenyou want to go out, you went to
(15:43):
New York City.
We're about 30 minutes out fromNew York City.
And and like uh the uh uh ourlandlord from the Americana, he
brought New York and style outhere.
That's what my brother and Ihave done.
We brought New York out to LongIsland.
You know, the reason why we didthe steakhouse, and I think I'm
jumping back and forth now, wasbecause my brother used to live
in the city, my brother Gillis.
(16:03):
And he and he saw during highsand lows and recessions, the
only restaurants that werealways busy were steakhouses,
because you went to steakhousesto celebrate, you went to
steakhouses to have a good time,you went to steakhouses to have
a good drink.
So that's why we we built Bryanand Cooper.
So the Hendricks uh we're gonna,we we had our designer bring
(16:24):
like uh there's restaurantsdowntown in the city that are
dark and and warm and they had afireplace and like not down and
dirty, but just places that seemthey've been there a long time.
Now, even though it's GeorgeWashington Manor and it's George
Washington, and the building'sbeen there a long time, it
didn't look that way.
SPEAKER_01 (16:42):
It looked like so you have to modernize it and
then you have to make it lookold.
SPEAKER_00 (16:47):
Okay.
Right.
Because modernize it.
So now we have to go get adesign and and get a but
meanwhile, I'm still not makingit at the French Beast Joe, Bar
Fried's.
We're tweaking that as we'redoing this new project and
buying the property andborrowing money, and now we have
to go to these guys to build it.
(17:07):
Well, you start opening upwalls.
I mean, we opened up one wallwhere there was an office, we
were going to put bathrooms, andthen the foundation wasn't there
anymore.
It was, it was, it wasn't, therewas nothing holding up the wall
but the other two walls.
So you had to pour a foundation,and then another wall they
opened up.
And these old wood beams aretwisted.
You had to get steel to hold upthe roof.
(17:29):
I mean, on and on.
We took out uh, or someone tookthe around one of the fireplaces
upstairs, the the upstairs therewas a fireplace, and they took
out the mantle because they weregoing to do some work.
Well, when they took off themantle, it was so old it
disintegrated.
The town wants to know where themantle is.
(17:50):
What do you mean you want it?
It disintegrated.
We want it.
In case someone else bought itfrom us and wants to put it
back, we had to keep it.
But but there was nothing tokeep.
I mean, because everything wewere doing, the color of the
paint had to go to the town.
It has to be a historical color.
Okay, my designer dealt withthat.
He has he has to deal with thatin Boston.
So he he he knew his way aroundthat.
(18:13):
There was a door, there is adoor that faces the town.
That if there was a fire and Ihave to run through that door in
an emergency, I'd bedecapitated.
So we go to the town, we'regonna raise the door.
Oh no, you're not.
No, you don't understand.
It has to be handicapped and ithas to be raised for a fire.
Oh no.
(18:34):
Historical Trumps, ADA and fire.
I mean, I've never heard ofthese things in my life.
So they had to go through allthese things.
The windows have to be, we hadto put it back the way it looked
because they had a picture fromthe 1800s or 1900s of what that
the the building that'soriginal.
(18:56):
The building that was originalnow has uh parts that made it a
restaurant.
There's a long catering room,there's another long room, but
the original building that'sstill there, we had to really
not touch too much.
The other buildings, because itwas all add-ons.
We put in a bar and we put in uhuh event space and upstairs.
SPEAKER_01 (19:19):
But now this is 500 seats still?
Oh, yeah.
Five and no parking.
SPEAKER_00 (19:25):
No, plenty of parking.
We have the only parking in theOh yeah, we have parking, we
have seats, we we have anoutside area now.
Uh it's beautiful.
It's called Oh, so I changed thename.
SPEAKER_01 (19:36):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (19:36):
I changed the name, Hendrick's Tavern.
Hendrick.
Hendrik Underdunk is the man whoowned it.
He had a printing press there,he had a uh a gristmill there,
he supported the RevolutionaryWar, which is why George
Washington came.
Well, this woman's walkingthrough town, and I'm outside
looking at the sign going on.
(19:57):
Shame on you! Shame on you.
She shamed me.
Shame.
He took down the president'sname, the president of the
United States.
I said, it's it's it's Mr.
Under Dunk's house.
Um, I'm honoring the village.
I'm honoring shame on you.
Oh my God.
So long story short, thank Godthat restaurant's doing well.
We we tweaked uh the bar freeze,that's doing well.
(20:20):
So so again, oh, but the Hendrixis literally like walking from
here to the football stadium tomy other steakhouse.
So we didn't call it asteakhouse, even though it's
primarily steaks and and otheritems and some things from our
other restaurants.
It was called Hendrix Tavern.
Hendrik Anderdonks?
Hendrix Tavern.
(20:41):
And it's very warm.
Oh, have you been there?
I've been there, yes.
SPEAKER_01 (20:45):
There's a BU event you hosted there.
Trevor Burrus, Jr.
SPEAKER_00 (20:47):
Oh yeah, BU in our VIP room downstairs that has its
own parking lot.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
So it was I was there.
SPEAKER_01 (20:53):
So, George, I cannot even imagine anyone winning any
argument against you.
So do you do you does he everwin arguments?
SPEAKER_00 (21:00):
I think he's an older brother, right?
Trevor Burrus, Jr.
He's an older brother.
SPEAKER_01 (21:03):
I think that's why uh Do you let him win and then
do what you want anyways?
SPEAKER_00 (21:08):
Well No, no, no, no, no, and I don't want to make
anyone sound bad, but we uh uhWe have another brother that we
were in business with in anotherrestaurant, and he's done very
well.
He's successful, he owned theboathouse in Central Park, he
now owns Gallagher's in NewYork, he owns Gallagher's down
in Miami, but he was a middlebrother.
(21:31):
Gillis is my is the oldest, thenmy brother Dean, and then
myself.
And there would be discussionsof how to get things done, and
some people want to do it theirway, and that's the only way.
So um we we thought it'd bebetter that we all stick
together because we all have ourstrengths.
But we ended up uh separating.
(21:54):
My brother Dean does his ownthing, and my brother Gillis and
I stayed together when it wasjust Brian and Cooper and
Majors.
And he and I have my brotherDean has done well and we've
done well.
But as far as the uh who winsand who loses, I think.
Between you and GitHub.
I think that's what really makesit a nice team.
(22:14):
I think when one of us isreally, really like it's gotta
be this way.
You know, I might not agree, butlet's do that.
Or if I really feel but if we goback and forth and he really
thinks this is this, and Ireally think this is that, then
we just leave it however it is,because it's too much to fight
of.
(22:34):
I mean, listen, it's so we welisten to each other and we kind
of do too much of the samething.
I mean, I handle for instancethe wine.
Uh I let him handle liquorbecause I'm not a licorice, so I
don't know anything about reallyso he handles that, but
everything else from real estatedeals to regular deals to a
(22:56):
pasta dish to uh to you knowwhat knife to use.
We we look at it all togetherand discuss it together.
SPEAKER_01 (23:05):
Aaron Ross Powell So let's talk about recent
expansion to Miami.
Aaron Ross Powell So Toku,you're opening uh second toku
there.
You opened a second to open.
You already opened it.
Um in Long Island, you know thepeople, you know the rules.
How was it in opening it inMiami?
SPEAKER_00 (23:23):
Um You're very right.
The not even being in New YorkCity, having uh five or six
restaurants within two or threemiles of each other.
Yes, I know all the people inthe city, I know people in the
town, I know you know how to getmy liquor license.
Yes, it is different, but youhire experts.
(23:44):
Uh uh my brother found a spacedown there that he really spoke
to him, and he showed it to methat uh in Aventure, a big it
was a Grand Lux Cafe, and hefelt, oh, there's a big toku,
big, big, huge, big toku.
Our toku does unbelievably.
But the ceilings are like wehave a small little Buddha in
(24:06):
the back.
This one he saw a big Buddha.
We're gonna have a big Buddha,and we're gonna have uh display
on the Buddha, and we're gonnahave a big bar.
The Grand Luxes are big.
So we go into the uh we we makea deal with with the with the
mall.
It's it's it's not inside themall, it's outside, it's uh it's
(24:27):
on the outside, it has its ownown entrance, but it's part of
the Aventura Mall.
Very, very uh uh large mall, oneof the better malls in the
country.
It has up, it has it, it it's ithas a lot of people go to that
that mall.
And they've asked us before tobe in in other sections, but
this one spoke to my brother.
(24:48):
So uh, okay, we're gonna do it.
And the landlord will give us alittle bit of money to help put
it.
But it has a lot of, it has akitchen already.
It has a kitchen, so you don'thave to put a new kitchen and
has a bar, but we're gonna movesome wall.
We don't want to spend a lot ofmoney.
We want to spend a couple ofmillion dollars just, you know,
(25:08):
facelift, make it look nice.
You know, the free they haverefrigerators.
Yeah, they have everything, theyhave the plumbing.
Well, they give us the set ofplans for grand locks, what and
they're called they're called asbuilt.
As built.
You know what an as built is?
These are final, the place isbuilt, this is what was okayed
(25:31):
by the town, stamped everything.
Everything's to code.
Of course, 20 years old, butthis is what well, as we we
start doing a little bit of theconstruction that we want to do,
the uh our our people and ourcontractors, well, the pipes
aren't where they say they areon the on the uh on the plans.
(25:52):
And certain waste pipes don't goto the where they're supposed
to, and then there's new lawsand regulations.
So the new so uh there'ssomething in Florida called
Durham that takes care of whereyour wastewater goes and your
grease chest, and you had toopen up the the parking lot for
(26:12):
that, but that has to do withthe town and not the mall.
And you need an engineer to comein, then we have to rip up the
floors, the bathrooms we'regonna redo anyway, but uh and we
had a very, very uh uh uh uh uma designer with uh it was a
different designer.
We tried someone different uhthat that does we tried it on
(26:35):
the designer, and it was abeautiful design, but I'm like,
I I want to leave the airconditioning where it is.
You're moving walls andopenings, and then with the
kitchen, the the therefrigerators really weren't
that good, and the line's nothow we want to do it, and the
way the air comes in and theunits, because it's Florida and
it has salt in the air, theunits have to be changed.
(26:59):
Well, I ended up we usuallysometimes when you go into a
shopping center or something,they give you a vanilla box.
Well, we had to turn it in.
We had to take everything thatwas in this Grand Lux and gut
though.
So I had to pay for the gut.
I had to pay for putting thingsback.
Then our design, then we'retrying to um what's the
expression?
(27:20):
Uh evaluate uh and evaluatevalue engineer the design.
And here's the design.
What's gonna it's way over whatwe want to spend.
Way! All right, let's let's howare we gonna do this?
And I'm coming up with ideas.
Well, it costs as much for thatas for the original idea, and
you like the original.
Days figuring things out.
Then we have a mirror on theceiling in the bar, and it has
(27:44):
to be screwed in, and the theinspector comes and the screw,
he wants to know how is thescrew and how it's gonna lock,
and then and when the inspectorcomes, so you can't work until
that inspector comes, and thatguy, if you're not working and
that guy is not working, put itup the ceiling.
Well, you can't lay the flooruntil the ceiling's up, and you
want to get open by a certainday because the contra the your
(28:05):
your lease says you have to openby a certain day, and now
they're holding, oh my God.
And then uh how long did it takeyou to to open it?
I I don't remember.
Listen.
I think you put it away fromyour memory, I think.
How long did it take?
I'm gonna tell you how long ittook.
Another brilliant thing that mybrother always tells me, and I
(28:26):
say it back to him.
We always say when we look atthese j projects that we do,
like Hendrix.
Hendrix, did that kitchen?
The kitchen was so old, we hadto take all the equipment out
and put a new floor andwaterproof it and make it brand
new, brand new kid, brand new umuh uh uh um air system and
(28:49):
vents, everything's new.
And then we're gonna clean theequipment and put it back.
And my brother turns to me andsays, You're gonna put that
dirty old equipment in in ournew kitchen?
I said, Gil, you're killing mehere.
And he says, Well, if not if, hesays, when we're successful,
we're gonna close for a week tobuy put new equipment.
So we put new, so we spent themoney and bit the bullet and did
(29:12):
that.
Well, same thing, same thinghere in uh in Toku.
So, same thing.
We're going through all theseissues and all these problems.
And my brother always turns tome, or when he's down, I always
turn to him.
One day there'll be peopleeating here.
SPEAKER_01 (29:28):
So I guess that's a very important concept of having
people come and eat in thisbeautiful place you've designed
and the experience that you'recreating.
I guess that's very important toyou, right?
SPEAKER_00 (29:40):
Well, uh, you know, when we were doing uh Cipellini,
the Italian restaurant, andwe're going through the again.
We know our designer's great.
We know Peter's great.
We know the design's right.
And we know how to make we knowhow to make good food.
Even our chefs always said, youknow, it has to be Gillis and
(30:01):
George good.
Has to be good enough that evenwhen I'm full, I want to take
another bite.
So that's not the hard part.
So but when the landlord wantsus to move the wall, you know,
six inches, to me that'smind-blowing.
Like my landlord, he he he wasMr.
Castagna from Americana, who'sno longer with us, but great,
great guy.
To him, moving a wall isnothing.
(30:23):
But restaurant, he asked us, wewere about a month out from
opening, where's the menu?
I want to see the menu.
And I looked at him.
I I don't worry about the menu.
Menu.
I know what to do.
I know how to make a menu.
I know what people want.
I know what I want, and I thinkthat's what people want, and
it's worked out.
But moving that we have to movethis wall six inches?
You're kidding me?
To me, it's so I don't know ifthat answers your question, but
(30:47):
I I I think when we're alwaysscared, brother and I'm it's in
the there's no guarantee.
But you try to put the mostthings, you know, when when we
decide on a deal or we decide onon what we're gonna do, we talk
about, we and we always talkabout the downside.
What's the downside?
Well, if it doesn't work, howmuch money are we gonna lose?
(31:07):
Or if it doesn't work, is itgonna change our lifestyle?
Or if it doesn't work, well, itcan't not work at all.
Some money is gonna come in.
And these are the do we haveparking?
Do we do we have can peoplecome?
Is it in the right area?
I mean, we had a restaurant inum the three of us at one point,
there was a majors we had inFlorida.
(31:29):
And the entrance to the sh tothe center, we we were a
freestanding restaurant in a umin a business area where there
were uh uh buildings.
And it was, you can see it fromthe highway.
But when you're coming down themain road, by the time you saw
the sign and you saw therestaurant, you turn in, you
(31:51):
were turning onto the highway.
There was no sign at thebeginning of the business
center, and they wouldn't let ushave a sign.
And these are the things overthe years you learn.
It was a big detriment.
All kinds of they wanted to cometo us, but they it was a pain in
the ass.
Once they were on the highway tocome back.
So they would just say, ah,forget it.
And there were other issues atthat time, and we were learning
(32:12):
and growing.
But there are things that youlearn.
You want as many things on thisside of the, there's no
guarantee, but you want as manythings on this side of the of
the ledger to say, all right,this is a good good chance.
This we should be okay.
And if you do okay, and then youdo better, hopefully you keep
(32:32):
going.
SPEAKER_01 (32:32):
Aaron Powell, I was going to ask this question,
George.
You are clearly highly motivatedand passionate about food.
And I have traveled with you alittle bit in every place you
want to go, try out new things.
How do you keep your passionlevel so high for so many years?
SPEAKER_00 (32:49):
Aaron Ross Powell What makes me I'm just a
passionate person.
I can be I'm just passionate.
I'm passionate.
If this water is really good,I'm gonna say, Arun, have you
had this water?
It's I'm passionate about music,I'm passionate about life, I'm
passionate about love, I'mpassionate about my children,
I'm passionate, I could bepassionate about art, or I may
say, that's the ugliest piece ofyou know what I've ever seen,
(33:12):
but I just that's the way I am.
As far as how do I staypassionate in this business,
this is what I know.
You know, my friend made fun ofme.
You were saying how I we go outand you see I'm always looking,
I'm always looking.
Always, I'm always working.
And my friend, my best friendPeter, we're talking about again
in the 70, 79, where we would goto the diner and they burnt the
(33:35):
water and they put the waterdown like this with their hands
on the top of the glass.
Big no-no.
You don't put your fingers wherepeople put their mouth.
So I go like this to my friend,I said, ah, I can't drink that
water.
And he like made fun of me.
He says, you know, you're alwaysyou're always picking, you're
always looking at what's goingon.
So one day he comes to myrestaurant and and and he's in
(33:57):
the fur business.
And a lady was walking by, andas she walked by, he just stuck
his hand out and he just feltthe fur.
She walked by and he says, Iknew it was fake.
I knew that was a fake.
And I said, Oh, oh, when it'swhat you do, it's okay.
But when it's what I do, soyeah, I'm always looking, I'm
always trying to get new ideas.
Every time I go away, my phone,I'm taking pictures, I steal
(34:19):
menus.
My brother says, You can see itonline.
I said, No, I need the what thepaper is.
I have to see the time, the waythat sometimes they don't put
the prices online.
I I want to see, I want to feel,I want to smell, I want to, I
want to taste, and then I wantto give it to you.
Then I want to give it to you.
If I love it, I want to give itto you.
(34:41):
So maybe maybe that answersthat.
Maybe just a little bit.
SPEAKER_01 (34:46):
It absolutely does.
To wrap up, I have some few funquestions for you, Jar.
You have so many restaurantconcepts.
If you could eat at only one ofthem for the rest of your life,
which one would it be?
Oh my God, that's that's not afun question.
SPEAKER_00 (34:59):
My standard answer, which is my true feeling.
I have with my brother builtthese babies.
We had babies, these are ourchildren, they are.
Down to the the grout.
What what color grout in theground?
I mean, it's it's they're allour favorites.
And and uh it's gonna be a longobviously, all my answers are
(35:24):
very long to your questions.
I had a customer one time atToku ask me, what's your
favorite thing?
And the person next to him, oh,he likes everything, because you
know, yeah, he's the owner.
He's like I I do like everythingbecause I put it on the menu.
Chef didn't put it, I put it onthe menu.
My brother and I, those are ourfavorite things.
That's why they're there.
Okay.
(35:44):
So so to answer the questionfairly.
They're all like I always tellpeople, how do you do how which
is your favorite child?
You can't pick your favoritechild.
SPEAKER_01 (35:54):
I was that's what I was gonna say.
I'll make it easy for you.
Tell me who's your favoritechild.
I don't have a favorite child.
SPEAKER_00 (35:59):
But I am gonna answer the question in the one
way.
SPEAKER_01 (36:02):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (36:03):
When I leave the country, and my wife and I, we
go traveling or we go somewhere,or we're gonna go to Greece or
London, wherever we go in theworld, when we land, and we
finally we're on our way home,we have to get a port I have we
gotta have the steak and potato.
It's American.
(36:23):
We we go to Brandon Cooper andwe get steak and potatoes and
the salad and mashed potato.
And so I do miss that a lot whenI don't have a nice big age
steak.
SPEAKER_01 (36:35):
I know that since you make the menus for all your
restaurants, so everywhere inthe world you go, is there a
dish that you've not yetreplicated that you've really
enjoyed somewhere and you wantto come back and put it in one
of your restaurants at somepoint?
SPEAKER_00 (36:49):
Aaron Ross Powell That's a fun question because I
I see things all over.
All over.
And it's so funny you asked methat question.
I I I think see things, then Iforget, and I take pictures of
it.
And I'll look at pictures fromuh it was shockingly seven
years, oh shoot, I didn't oh Iwant to do that.
I've been now that I have anassistant, I send her the
pictures and remind me of that.
(37:09):
But the one dish that comes tomy mind, I was in south of
France, I want to put this inBar Frites.
So someone remind me out thereon the podcast.
I saw mussels.
I we made great clams reganata,great clams regonata in in in a
few of our restaurants.
But it was mussels uh just don'tknow how you would do that.
Do you have to cook the musselfirst?
(37:30):
Because we were on a beach in inSaint Chile.
But uh that dish I sticks in mymind as that's something I like
to do in one of the restaurants.
That's amazing.
That was a good that was a goodfun question.
SPEAKER_01 (37:44):
George, it was an absolute hoot to have you on the
podcast.
And I look forward to the tip ofthe iceberg with me.
It is on the tip of the iceberg.
We're gonna do many more.
Really enjoyed having you.
Thank you so much for coming.
Thanks for having me.
And thank you for all thesupport to the school.
You're on our advisory board.
Your picture graces our wallshere.
(38:05):
Thanks for watching.
First graduating class.
First graduating class, part ofBU football team.
Ah, don't stop me.
That could be a whole hour juston that.
Thank you.
Thanks for asking.
Thank you.
And thank you, everyone, forjoining us today.
Special thanks to the team whoproduces this podcast, Bara
Littman, Andy Halleck, and theentire team at Boston University
(38:27):
School of HospitalityAdministration.
To keep up with distinguishedpodcasts, be sure to subscribe
wherever you listen to yourfavorite podcast.
You can also learn more aboutour undergraduate and graduate
programs at Boston UniversitySchool of Hospitality
Administration by visitingbu.edu slash hospitality.
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Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
Betrayal Weekly
Betrayal Weekly is back for a new season. Every Thursday, Betrayal Weekly shares first-hand accounts of broken trust, shocking deceptions, and the trail of destruction they leave behind. Hosted by Andrea Gunning, this weekly ongoing series digs into real-life stories of betrayal and the aftermath. From stories of double lives to dark discoveries, these are cautionary tales and accounts of resilience against all odds. From the producers of the critically acclaimed Betrayal series, Betrayal Weekly drops new episodes every Thursday. If you would like to share your story, you can reach out to the Betrayal Team by emailing them at betrayalpod@gmail.com and follow us on Instagram at @betrayalpod and @glasspodcasts. Please join our Substack for additional exclusive content, curated book recommendations, and community discussions. Sign up FREE by clicking this link Beyond Betrayal Substack. Join our community dedicated to truth, resilience, and healing. Your voice matters! Be a part of our Betrayal journey on Substack.