November 12, 2025 • 44 mins
We trace Lauren’s jump from a late‑stage layoff to a thriving, values‑driven PR firm, and explore how culture, clarity, and earned media fuel growth in an AI‑noisy world. Along the way we dig into boundaries, motherhood, and the quiet power of trusting your gut in your forties.
• layoff at eight months pregnant sparks launch
• coach‑guided decision making and early clients
• why reputation and networks beat résumés
• codifying culture through five core values
• client focus on values‑driven, often unsexy industries
• AI as tool not voice, plagiarism risks and fixes
• earned media outranking owned in AI search
• clear ICP, outcomes, and calls to action for creators
• PR versus marketing, simple and practical
• resilience in a weird 2025 market and longer cycles
• boundaries, mental health days, and glass vs rubber priorities
• trusting intuition sooner and teaching it to kids
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_00 (00:02):
Hi, I'm Carlene, and this is Diva.
Tonight, right now we're workingon a series called This Is 40, a
female perspective.
And I've talked to many women,and tonight I'm talking to
Lauren Cockerell, who's intaxes.
You know, she is very, verytalented in what she does.
(00:26):
You know, she is a publicrelations and marketing expert
for growing organizations, andshe has her own business, which
is Sweet Art and Co.
And she helps other smallbusinesses.
And I guess it's been a fewyears now that you've been doing
this operation, right?
And so what was the drivingforce behind it?
(00:49):
Well, well, thank you.
Well, I'm so glad to be herewith you.
SPEAKER_01 (00:52):
Thank you.
Looking forward to our chat.
Well, it's it's two-pronged.
There was the tactical, oh crapmoment of I was eight months
pregnant and got laid off.
And so it was time to make thesecond thing happen, which is
I've always wanted to own my ownbusiness and I've always wanted
to own my own PR firm.
So I'm I'm 44 now, and so I'vebeen in PR for as long as I
(01:16):
haven't been, so for half mylife now.
And I really love servingothers, and so it had been on my
heart to start my own company,and then the day came when I was
eight months pregnant with oursecond kid, and I certainly
couldn't go interview foranother job.
And I was like, well, today'sthe day.
SPEAKER_00 (01:33):
Wow, it was were you stressed?
I mean, like it's it's hard, youknow.
Like I I don't have kids, so Ican't really say I can relate,
but I mean to have all thethings like all that happen like
a few weeks before the babycomes, it's kind of like uh it
was definitely a you know, rugpulled out from under your feet
moment.
SPEAKER_01 (01:53):
I I had a feeling something was happening and
changing.
I'm I'm an empath by nature, soI could I could sense there was
a shift a couple weeks before Iactually went to my husband.
I was like, hey, I I I I don'twant to stay here anyway.
Like we'd already planned, youknow, for my eventual exit.
But I I said, I think they mightbe gonna, I think they might be
about to let me go.
Are we okay?
Like how much runway do we have?
(02:14):
You know, how quickly I'm like,I can't go interview.
I mean, especially in theStates, just really no matter
what I say, I don't know ifanyone's gonna believe me
saying, like, no, I really wantto come work, I promise.
And so, uh, you know, we'refine.
This is how much time we have,you know, don't sweat about it.
But it's like, you know, beingfired or let go is is really,
you know, is a a sort of atrauma.
And then for it to be at such avulnerable moment, just like, oh
(02:37):
my gosh, you know, they theygave me a nice severance, so
that was good.
Oh, they did.
SPEAKER_00 (02:40):
Okay, I was gonna say, like, yeah.
No, and that position, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (02:44):
That's like Yeah, they didn't want to get sued.
SPEAKER_00 (02:46):
So it's gonna be a lawsuit at that point.
Yeah, yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (02:50):
Like, I'm so no, they gave me what I felt was a
fair severance, and they gave memy the equipment that I'd had at
home as kind of like my so I waslike, Well, I guess I'll go
start my company now.
You know, in hindsight, it feelsa little more blasé, but you
know, in the moment I was I wasvery emotional, very upset, very
stressed out.
I'd really it'd been a verytoxic environment, and so I kind
of didn't really know what whichway was up either.
(03:11):
I had lost a lot of faith inmyself.
Ironically, or coincidentally,that morning I had mailed a
$5,000 check to a coach that Iwas hiring to like help me
figure out what was next for me.
Like, do I do a resume and gofind another job?
Do I start my own company?
Like, I'd already been thinkingthrough what's my next step.
And and then they called me andlet me go.
And I'm like watching the mailtruck drive away.
(03:33):
I'm like, come back.
SPEAKER_00 (03:37):
Oh my god.
SPEAKER_01 (03:40):
It turned out to be very fortuitous.
She helped me process the youknow everything that had
happened to me.
And then we started to evaluatethe two paths, but very quickly
I was like, no, I I want to domy own thing.
This is where my heart is.
And so she helped hold meaccountable and you know, helped
me set up some initial valuesand helped me think through how
I wanted to show up as abusiness person.
And so it's very is veryhelpful.
And I and I got I startedgetting clients right away.
(04:01):
So it was very fortunatecircumstance and things turned
around very quickly.
SPEAKER_00 (04:06):
How did you build like your network so quickly?
SPEAKER_01 (04:09):
Right.
So as soon as I felt thingsshifting, I reached out to my
first boss and mentor.
So I reached out to her to say,like, hey, I I think things are
shifting a little bit.
I I can take on side work ifthere's ever a project you don't
want to do or if there'sanything you want to team up on.
And so she became almost like anoutside salesperson for me.
And then I also reached out tomy my network just saying, Hey,
(04:29):
I'm available.
And I had I had past clientscoming to me saying, like, oh,
can we be on retainer with you?
I'm like, Yeah, sure.
SPEAKER_00 (04:36):
Oh my gosh.
You know what?
I think when it's supposed tohappen, some things happen, you
know, and hearing you talk aboutthat reminds me of like when I
started this journey, like thepodcast, like everything just
kind of happened.
Like, I got into this businessboot camp through a friend I
know from high school, and likemy editor, my designer him, I
(05:00):
know him from like elementaryschool.
Someone even offered to be myeditor.
So, like, I don't know, I findlike if it's something you're
passionate about, it might bescary in the beginning, but it
it works out.
And and like here you are now totalk about it, right?
SPEAKER_01 (05:13):
And so it's kind of like you're like you're living
right, you know, it's likeyou're in line with your
purpose.
And because when I, as I waswrapping up that corporate role,
I really was not living in a waythat I felt like I was put on
this earth to do.
Like I was selling commodity,you know, I'd moved from a PR
role into like sellingcommodities and uh, you know,
selling Office 365 and managedhosting.
(05:33):
I was like, kill me now.
My special skills and talentswere not being used.
And I was like, oh man, youknow, I like to solve problems,
like to help people, and like Icouldn't help people.
Like it was just not, they werelike, No, I don't want to talk
to you, I just want to buy thisthing, you know.
And so I remember one day I wastalking to my coach at the time,
and then I was telling her aboutall the progress that was
happening at that time, and so Iwas at postpartum and had all
(05:56):
these clients coming in, and andshe was like, gosh, you know,
Lauren, I just want you to know,like, this is not how a new
business is supposed to start.
Like, you're very lucky.
And in the moment, I said, nowwait a minute.
I've been working for 15 years,like I have a reputation.
This is, you know, yes, I amfortunate, but it's not luck.
Like I have a body of work thatI'm and in a network, and you
(06:16):
know, I've made sure not to burnbridges over the years so I
could walk across them at thisexact moment.
Like, I don't think it's fair tocall it totally luck here.
SPEAKER_00 (06:24):
Yeah, you know what?
I think I think it's safe tosay, like, if you have a good
work ethic with people and likethey remember like what you did
to help them, no matter what,they'll remember you.
And I and I think that's likewhen it's your calling and
you're helping people, they'llcome, right?
And so do you feel like okay,from your past work experiences,
where did you work prior?
(06:45):
Because obviously this is likethe the road that leads you
here, right?
So where did you start yourcareer in PR?
SPEAKER_01 (06:53):
Yep.
So I graduated with a businessdegree from a small liberal arts
school in 2003 and likeliterally stumbled into a PR
firm not even knowing what PRwas.
I was like, can I be an internhere?
Um I had a friend who was anintern there and she was leaving
town.
I was like, Well, can I meanthis is the naivety of a
22-year-old.
I was like, Well, can I haveyour internship?
(07:15):
Like, like they're transferable,you know?
Which is not.
And she was like, I don't know,we can ask.
And so they hired, you know,dumb old me, but I always love
stories.
And it ended up being thisincredible mashup.
Like, I didn't even know what itwas, but turns out that I love
stories and I love business, andI was able to pull them
together.
And I was like, I'm the perfectperson for a PR.
(07:36):
And so I was there.
I started as an intern, and then10 years later, when I left, I
was the vice president.
And just, I mean, I was like, Iwant to do this, I want to own
this business.
You know, I ended up not wantingto own that business in
particular.
Like, I just was like, you know,I think I'd rather start my own
thing one day.
But after 10 years, I'd gottenmarried.
Uh, we knew we wanted to startit anyway.
I was in my 30s at that point.
(07:56):
And so I was like, well, youknow, we don't have maternity
leave or anything here.
We're just, you know, tinylittle PR agency.
And I wanted to try somethingdifferent anyway.
I kind of felt like I'd run outof runway there.
So a client hired me and I wentin-house.
They created a a director ofpublic relations role for me,
and it was two sister ITcompanies.
So I went from the agency tothis IT shop and was running
(08:18):
their PR and some vendorrelationships, and that role
changed over time.
So after five years, they laidme off and I started my company,
and we'll be uh eight years inOctober.
SPEAKER_00 (08:26):
Wow, eight years, wow.
So in the eight years thatyou've been doing this, what
what do you think you've learnedin in that time period?
Like, how do you run asuccessful business, especially
a PR business?
SPEAKER_01 (08:40):
It's it's been an evolution, honestly.
You know, there I think everyit's you know, it's it is like
with children, every age andstage has its pros and cons.
You know, you're starting out,you're trying to figure it out
who are you.
And when when I started thecompany, I was I was burned and
burned out.
And I just thought, I don't wantto hire anybody, I'm just gonna
do this myself.
I mean, I was just like, whoof,no, but then quickly needed to
(09:03):
staff up for different projects.
And so I I allowed it to evolveas I felt like it was meant to
be, you know, like to thinkabout like what what you know
the first year of my son's lifeand then also my business life,
like, you know, that neededsomething at that time where it
was like I was more of asolopreneur um consultant and
(09:23):
and now I have a team of seven.
But I think one thing that Irealized in business ownership
is that it has allowed me to bethe most fully actualized person
that I'm meant to be.
Like it really has brought outevery part of me that I did had
not been able to bring to thetable it as a W-2 employee at
(09:45):
other roles.
Now that's not to say likeeverybody needs to have their
own business because I thinkthere are roles and functions
for which we need someone whowants to show up and do the same
thing every single day.
And and then need that we needthem to make the system run.
And we need people who areentrepreneurs where they don't
want to own their own business,but they want to treat my
business as theirs.
You know, I mean, like we needevery uh every lid for a
(10:06):
different pot.
But I think one of the thingsthat I've done as I've grown the
company is institutionalizedculture and defining you know
who we are as a business, whatare our values, and you know,
how do we imbue everything thatwe do with who we are so that
our brand can live beyond justme.
You know, it's not just meanymore.
(10:27):
And so I think you know,sometimes people are missing
that, they're missing culturethat really helps make people
want to show up every day andthey want to fight for the
business as if it's theirs.
And that's something I see itwith clients when they're
struggling.
That's can often be part of thethe reason.
And then I see people who aredoing it really beautifully with
thousands of employees.
(10:48):
So maybe I got there in the endon your answer.
SPEAKER_00 (10:52):
It's like me when I asked you a question.
I'm like, wait, that was a fullyloaded question.
But when you saidinstitutionalized culture, what
do you mean?
Uh can you elaborate on that?
Like, that's an interestingthing.
SPEAKER_01 (11:03):
Right.
Well, it's you know, some peoplesay, like, oh, we've got a great
culture.
Like, what does that mean?
They've got ping pong tables orsomething like that.
Um whereas one of the smartthings I've done in this
business is is coming up withour our core values.
They weren't just like, oh, thisis Lauren's secret sauce.
It's like, okay, these areattributes that people, you
know, they came out of thewoodwork when I started the
(11:24):
company to work with me becauseof these things, but also I see
them in people who want to workfor us.
So strategy first, hungry andhumble, delightfully curious, do
what we said, be the easybutton.
Those are our core values.
And so when I I put those onpaper and I define them and I
share them with the team.
Well, I could have just stoppedthere.
What we also did, we created itas a part of our employee
(11:48):
recruitment process.
So when someone applies for arole, they have to tell us how
those values resonate with themand how they show up with those
values, like what they mean tothem.
And then as we're talking tothem, we're screening for them.
Okay, like, does this they saidthis is, you know, do it what
they said, like, but are theyreally walking the walk here?
We use it in disciplinary uhactions as well.
(12:08):
So if you tell me you're gonnahave a draft to me tomorrow, but
then you're a week late with it,over and over and over again,
you're having now that's avalues violation, and we have to
have a conversation about that.
And I've dismissed people beforebecause of it.
And then also we have a valueschampion every week.
So and it's the team manages it.
So today someone was nominatedfor a value, next week they're
(12:29):
nominating somebody else, and soit perpetuates on and on.
And so it's it's like, you know,it's not just oh, you're a
strategist for strategy first,but you have to say why.
So it's like caught doing good.
So it's like it's thiscontinuation where it's always
alive and well in ourorganization.
And and that's that's one partof culture, it's not just
values, but it really helps fromthe foundational aspect of, you
(12:51):
know, here's who we are, here'swho we say we are, here's how we
act what how we say we are.
And then that really feeds intoeverything else and how we treat
each other and our clients.
SPEAKER_00 (13:00):
And so who are your clients?
Like you you say in your more orless who you are as as an
individual that you servesmaller businesses.
And so the small guy versus thebig guy, you know what I mean?
We're just starting off here,right?
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (13:15):
It varies and not necessarily like not necessarily
micro businesses like like myown, but we tend to work a fair
amount in the North Texas areajust because I'm from here and
I've lived here most of my life,uh, and this is where my my
network is.
But we also have folks aroundthe country and you know, really
looking for folks who I sayvalues driven, but but I mean
(13:35):
that in like a their core valuesdrive them.
They're looking to treat theirteam well, they're looking to
treat their community well,they're looking to treat their
their clients well, and youknow, maybe they aren't great at
articulating what it is they'retrying to accomplish, and that's
where we come in to help themcast that vision and communicate
all the wonderful things thatthey're doing.
(13:56):
Um, a lot of unsung heroes, wewe love like the folks in the
manufacturing or industrial orfinancial services uh space.
Like they're not quote unquotesexy, but we love it because we
can really like crack open theirthe chest of the business and
pull out that beating heart andbe like, no, look at what you're
doing.
Like, yes, you're selling theselittle widgets that you know you
might think nobody cares, butyou they you do care because
(14:18):
you're employing these manypeople and you're able to
contribute thousands of dollarsa year to these nonprofits and
blah blah you know, on and onand on.
And so that's what we love.
And multi-generationalbusinesses is a little bit of a
side niche for us, helping thatthird or fourth generation step
into their family's legacy andhelp them really crystallize
what they want to do movingforward as while they're
(14:40):
honoring the past.
So, so it ranged, you know,we've got some folks in the kind
of like one to ten millionrevenue range, small business,
and then we have some in likethe billion dollar range, you
know, where they, you know, I Iwas talking to somebody the
other day, they're like, I'm I'msorry, I just you know, we we
need you.
We're not that we're not verysophisticated.
I'm like, listen, if you didn'tyou didn't need me, what would I
(15:02):
be here for?
Like, it's okay to to need somehelp.
Like, you know, you could be abillion-dollar business and
still need some help.
Like it's it's all right.
SPEAKER_00 (15:10):
Yeah.
With any business, it's aboutthe brand and and the message,
right?
And how you show up and if youcan help them, you know, create
a brand that's better for them,all the power to it, right?
You know what I mean?
Like you put your your name yourcompany name across that.
And so I think that becausewe're in the age of technology,
(15:31):
what's important with marketing,especially in a digital era?
SPEAKER_01 (15:36):
So this is not my saying.
I I ripped it off with somebodyand I don't remember how.
It's hard to read the label frominside the bottle.
So it's really hard to do foryou what you need to do.
So, like, like you know all theins and outs, you know the good,
the bad, and the ugly aboutyourself, but it's really hard
to discern what your customerswant to hear from you.
So we come alongside our clientsand we help, you know, we pull
(15:58):
out what's really important,what's gonna resonate with their
audience.
Let's distill it down, distillit down, distill it down.
And then in the age oftechnology, in the age of AI,
you have to make sure thatyou're clear and consistent and
different.
So, you know, you don't want tojust lean on Chat GPT and sound
like everybody else, and oh, andalso maybe accidentally
(16:21):
plagiarize somebody else'scontent because if you don't
give it enough, it's just gonnapull from the internet, which
means it's gonna rip offsomebody else, and then you're
using that content as if it'syours.
Yeah, yeah, look out.
SPEAKER_00 (16:32):
Very how do you stop that?
Like, I mean, a lot of peopleare using chat GPT.
Yeah, like okay.
SPEAKER_01 (16:40):
This is true true story.
So I I use chat.
I I love chat.
Um, me too.
I when I show up with chat withlike, here's my point of view,
here's the experience I've justhad, here's what I'm trying to
accomplish, here's my vision,like take this crappy first
draft and make it make sense.
If I do that, the content ismine, it's in my voice, I've
trained it, it but it's it'smine.
(17:00):
If I come up and say, I don'tknow what's right today, what
should I talk about?
You know, what are some topicswe can talk about?
Okay, we'll talk about that.
All right, write it for me.
It if I don't give iteverything, I've taken content,
run it through a plagiarismchecker, and it's plagiarized.
SPEAKER_00 (17:15):
My goodness.
So, like if you're pretty muchsaying that even when you're
using a tool like chat GBT, thatyou really have to be very
specific with what you're askingto do.
Otherwise, if it's too general,it will take away from well
that's what's trained to do.
It's it's it's not it's not.
See, that's the thing that'sthat so many people don't
(17:36):
understand about this thisplatform.
It's it's amazing to help you,but like there's so many things
that like people don't really.
SPEAKER_01 (17:46):
You know, you you you have to be in the captain
seat, and you know, you have tosay, This is our turn of voice,
this is what I'm trying toaccomplish.
It's um great writers creategreat content in Chat GPT
because we understand storystructure, we understand what
we're trying to accomplish,we're able to pull out like that
that makes sense, where's thateven coming from?
That's not you know, like thatyou're just generating generic
(18:10):
AI slop that's ripped from theinternet because that's what
you've been trained to do.
But if you instead are coming upwith your like this is my point
of view, this is my story, thisis my expertise.
I'm trying to comment on thisexact thing, then it then it is
yours, then it is a great help.
SPEAKER_00 (18:24):
I have never thought to last to whether or not it
plagiarized, but now I know frompersonal experience from a
business person, businessperspective, I just learned so
many things that I I would havenever really thought that it
would take because I'm seeing itin my voice and asking it, okay.
This is Diva tonight, postedthis is the guest, and you know
(18:46):
what I mean, and in my voice.
And so, like I you just taughtme something that I have to
think about.
So that's just mind blob mindbobbling.
I'm just like blown away rightnow.
SPEAKER_01 (18:55):
Keep showing up as you, and it's great.
It's great, you know, feed it asmuch as you can, uh, and and
you'll be in good shape.
SPEAKER_02 (19:01):
Diva tonight, glamour for your ears.
This is 40, a femaleperspective.
SPEAKER_00 (19:08):
I do have a off-topic, like I mean, starting
from the big beginning, butyou're in business, and so is
this like a family thing?
Did you have a business mindsetwhen you were younger?
I always say like it's it's notwhere you're going, it's where
you came from.
So who instilled this this thisuh mindset for you?
(19:29):
I mean, this journey here.
SPEAKER_01 (19:30):
Um both both of my parents were professional.
They're they're both still withus, fortunately.
My mom worked for IBM in salesfor multiple decades, and my dad
has owned his own business formy whole life in the insurance
financial services realm.
But even as a kid, I rememberbeing interested in being a
babysitter, not because I likedkids, but because I wanted to
make money.
And and so I went to the localchildren's hospital.
(19:56):
I went to the children'shospital, I took like a safety
class, I I passed like the CPRtest and like the poison
prevention test, and and like Ibought a bottle of Ipecac syrup,
which you used to use.
I don't even think you'resupposed to use it anymore, but
to induce vomiting if someoneingests poison, and I like put
it in my backpack and made alittle flyer and like you know,
rode around on my bike in theneighborhood, like handing out
flyers, trying to get clients.
(20:16):
It turns out I was a horriblebabysitter, did not have any
repeat clients.
I'm probably my own kids, but uhyou know, I was kind of like,
Are you not an adult?
Let's just talk like adults, butanyway.
But looking back, you know, it'slike I I wanted my own business,
I wanted my own money, and andso I, you know, I had
internships and jobs, and butboy, that first after-school
internship when I was at the PRfirm, I was like, oh man, yeah,
(20:39):
this is this is for me.
So, you know, it's sort of me issort of the environment.
So just kind of like I thinkit's one of those things that's
like the uniquely Laurenexperience for you know, this is
what I was meant to do.
You know, not a I don't thinkI'll ever own like a 50-person
agency that overwhelms me.
I like, you know, the small butmighty, I can beat everybody
(20:59):
with two pizzas, I can hugeverybody and know, you know, I
want to know their families andwho they are and all their
wishes and hopes and dreams.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (21:06):
No, I like that though.
I think small is good, you know.
When I went to school at Humberfor radio, and they always say
when you're starting off, youyou're gonna get a job at a
small radio station because likeworking at a bigger radio
station is is when you've madeit, like you built yourself up
to that point.
But in small community radio iswhere you'll learn the most.
(21:27):
And so even for you, I think yourealize too, like when you're
working for small businesses,um, you get to focus in and like
help them build that brand.
So when you say all that andjust who you are, what is your
legacy?
What what do you want to leavebehind?
SPEAKER_01 (21:45):
While you were while you were getting to the
question, I was thinking, youknow, one of the reasons I do
like the smaller environment,because I've always I was
reflecting like, oh gosh, I'veactually always liked a smaller
environment.
I went to a small school as akid, went to a small liberal
arts school, 1500 people.
Like I wanted I knew I wanted aclassroom of like 20 people,
like I wanted to know myprofessors, I wanted to know the
(22:07):
people, like it's but it's it'salways been about the people for
me.
I want the human relationship.
I want to have I don't want tohave lots of friends, I want to
have a few like really deeprelationships, and and so the I
think that is my legacy of howyou know the the connections I
have and the deep friendshipsand impact I make on, you know,
my loved ones and just how I seethem and they see me and and how
(22:31):
we can help each other grow andand love each other.
And so it's you know it's it'sit's about the people for sure.
SPEAKER_00 (22:37):
Yeah.
And you know, it's interestingthat you say that with the
people because I find like, youknow, it like you said earlier
that you're an empath, and Ifeel like I'm the same way.
People have always been drawn tome.
And like sometimes, Lauren, Ijust want to be like, leave me
alone.
I don't want to talk to you, Idon't want to help you today.
No.
But like you said, it's it's therelationships you have with
(22:59):
people.
And I think as I've gottenolder, like we haven't even
talked about 40, but I think asI've gotten older in this age
now, that I realize that likeI'm not gonna care too much
about what others think of me asmuch as I used to.
And I and I'm always because Iwork with people, like even my
(23:19):
personal job other outside ofthe podcast, that I find that
now it's easier for me to talkto people and not feel awkward
about I'm like, oh, should I sayanything to that person?
You know, and and hearing youreiterate the thing with people
is so important behind anybusiness because you aren't like
even if you don't directly talkto people all the time, we're in
(23:41):
the people business no matterwhat.
SPEAKER_01 (23:43):
So now that's have their own money.
It sounds like they can shop forus now, but they don't have
their own money yet.
SPEAKER_00 (23:52):
So with PR and marketing, as someone who is a
podcaster, how do I stand out?
Like myself, other than beingauthentic.
People keep saying you're justjust be authentic.
That's the important thing.
But as a PR person and someonewho works in marketing every
day, what do you say?
SPEAKER_01 (24:13):
Yep.
Uh well they're right.
Definitely be you, be uniquely,Carlene.
I think also being clear aboutwhat you want to have happen for
your brand, knowing who youserve, how are you helping them,
what does success look like onthe other side of engaging with
you in some way, whether it'slistening to your content or or
if you have other pathways forthem.
(24:34):
I think knowing those thingsreally help fuel your content
engine.
So the your social, your blog,your the podcast you're putting
out, the guests that you'rehaving on, you know, viewing the
viewing your screening throughthat lens of okay, is this a
good guest or a guess it's not afit?
Based on uh are they helping meget to that goal of of helping,
(24:55):
you know, my avatar of you know,so-and-so, whatever you want to
name her.
And then also, you know, beyondthat, being clear about that.
So what are your actual goals?
What do you want to have happen?
What are your calls to action?
Who who's you?
What uh who is you?
That's good.
Yeah, yeah.
Who are you?
SPEAKER_00 (25:12):
That's not no, but that works.
I guess who's you?
We're all, you know.
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (25:19):
Getting the unfiltered version here.
Who are you?
You know, who is for you, andhow do you want to help those
people?
And how do you, you know, ifthey're not ready to engage with
you, are there ways for them toconnect with your content?
Are there is something you cangive them so they're in your
email list?
You better email them if youwant to talk to them.
So building up your email list,providing good content, valuable
content, something that you knowis is what advice do you have to
(25:42):
give?
Like what is what is your secretsauce and how can you package
that up?
Uh is is where you need tostart.
And then from there, what otherplatforms can you be on to help
amplify your podcast and yourbrand?
So can you beyond other shows?
Can you contribute to what uhwhat other channels and medium
are are available to you?
So other other blogs, other youknow, news articles, so on and
(26:05):
so forth.
Like what all can you create?
And then also because right nowis for AI in this in this moment
in time, however long this isgonna last.
unknown (26:13):
Yeah.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (26:16):
The year of our Lord, 2025, in August, at the
time of recording, this is true.
I don't know what will be truewhen it airs.
SPEAKER_00 (26:22):
Oh my gosh.
I'm laughing, but it's so true,it's so scary.
I never in my wildest dreamswould I think it would be so
advanced now.
You know what I mean?
It's like technology has changedso much, and it always does.
SPEAKER_01 (26:37):
Let me land a quick plane and let me let me tell you
something else about that.
So, right now, AI search isranking earned media, so
articles, columns, you know,your your traditional media is
ranking those results higher andrecommending.
So if you say I'm looking for apodcaster who's focused on women
(26:57):
in their 40s, if you've gotcontent out there other than
what you own, it is gonna pullthat first, and then it will
start to recommend based on youknow, like your own blog or
whatever, but it prioritizedquote unquote earn media ahead
of other channels right now.
Right now, yes.
But technology changes.
When I started in 2003, we stillsent press releases via fax
(27:18):
machine.
There was no Facebook, there wasno Twitter.
I mean, you know, I've alreadyseen stuff change tremendously
in my 22 years, and it changed abunch before that too.
You know, there used to be like,you know, you used to have to
hand do everything.
So that's just job to change.
We just have to stay on top ofit without going losing their
minds.
SPEAKER_00 (27:36):
Yeah, yeah.
And you know, one thing I dowant to say is because we're
talking about marketing and PR,but what is the difference?
SPEAKER_01 (27:43):
So people when the people think about PR, they tend
to think about working with mewith the media, being a
publicist, things like that.
It's uh a little bit broaderthan that.
Uh as far as I was raised up inthe industry, I was taught to
think about PR as a function ofmanagement and leadership.
So, like casting a vision forthe business, the reputation of
the business.
You know, some of the thingsthat we do in PR aren't
(28:05):
necessarily related tomarketing.
Sometimes, you know, we'reannouncing executive changes or
mergers and acquisitions or youknow, things things of that
nature.
We're doing crisiscommunications, those aren't
necessarily related to sales,which marketing is a function of
sales.
We're driving, we're trying toget people to buy something,
whether it's services orproducts or what have you.
We're putting butts in seats,we're selling widgets, marketing
(28:27):
is a function of sales.
You can usually measure your ROIa lot better with marketing.
And so, you know, marketing isusually PR, but PR is not always
marketing.
You know, I can't if I'm talkingabout a new executive vice
president for a company, is thatgonna drive sales?
Not necessarily.
SPEAKER_00 (28:44):
So wow.
Yeah, and so you know, you'retalking about marketing and PR.
And so if anyone is listeningand they want to work with you,
like and they want your help,how do they go about it?
Like, I know you have a websiteand all that jazz.
What is it?
What the fuck would you do?
SPEAKER_01 (29:02):
Oh, thank you.
SPEAKER_00 (29:02):
Uh there you go.
You can you can you can check usout.
SPEAKER_01 (29:05):
Uh we're everywhere at Queen Arco, so that's K W E D
A R C O.
So that's dot com.
That's all of our socialchannels.
You can find me on LinkedIn.
I'm pretty active over there.
We'd love to chat.
If you just have a question,feel free to drop me a DM.
And then our my podcast, TheImpatient Entrepreneur, is the
Impatient Entrepreneur Pod.
SPEAKER_00 (29:25):
I haven't checked it out.
The Impatient Entrepreneur.
I gotta check that out.
Yeah.
So as a businesswoman and apodcaster that has, I mean,
whatever you said, it's gonna beeight years in October.
When you started this journey atlike eight months from now, I
can I can't even imagine, like,woo! Like, and now the baby is
(29:46):
not the baby anymore.
The baby's in second grade.
So it's just like it's yourbaby, you'll which is like they
say, like having a child is likeowning a business.
So, like, it's it's like two andone.
You know what I mean?
Like you started both at a atlike a pivotal time, like a
crazy time.
Like, you know, now that yourbaby is almost eight, what do
(30:08):
you say to that?
You know?
SPEAKER_01 (30:11):
Yeah.
Like, Lordy, here we go.
It's so interesting.
After I had my son, our secondkid, and my business had
started, I I was telling people,you know, like my son was born
and I was reborn when I started.
It was it was like for me owningmy own business.
And and I do feel like, youknow, I'm Lauren 6.0 or wherever
I am in this, you know, at 44.
(30:32):
And so, you know, I'm really I'mI'm proud of myself.
I've the obstacles keep coming,you know.
I I think I think sometimes ashumans we can think like, okay,
I experienced this bad thing, soI'm good now.
No more, thank you.
But having the resilience to toget back up when you just get
knocked in the teeth sometimes,you know, successful people
(30:52):
aren't necessarily successfulbecause they had the best idea.
They're successful because itjust kept going.
And they believed in the ideaand they they sacked themselves
up.
I mean, 2025 has been a weird,weird year.
My sales cycles are the longestI've ever experienced.
The you know, consumer behaviorhas been I mean, and you know, I
I feel the same way.
Like it's just like theunsteadiness, the chaos, the
(31:14):
confusion, the the clouds kindof hanging over some of us.
It's it's been a tough year, andI've really had to dig deep to
to psych myself up sometimes.
Like, how do I keep swimming?
How do I just keep swimming?
Because I have to show up formyself, I have to show up for my
team, I have to show up for myclients, I have to show up for
my children, my husband, myfriends, my family.
And and it's a lot.
Uh but you're a lot.
SPEAKER_00 (31:33):
When you list it all like that, I'm like, oh my god.
Yeah, it's a lot.
SPEAKER_01 (31:40):
I I can't believe it's been it's about to be eight
years.
I have not done this alone.
I have an incredible team,incredible support system.
I've I'm very blessed.
And but you know, I'm also theone waking up in the morning and
and showing up.
So I I you know, if you'relistening to this and you're
like, heck yeah, I'm like, yeah,you know, pat yourself on the
back.
You're you're doing it.
SPEAKER_00 (31:58):
Yeah, yeah.
You know what I mean?
I think it's it's like at thisage in our lives that in in our
forties, like we are we arepushing through.
Like I think everyone is goingthrough different things, and
it's people like yourself whoare entrepreneurs that like you
know inspire us to like, youknow, if Lauren can do it, she
has two kids, I don't have anykids, then I can suck it up and
(32:20):
do it.
You know what I mean?
Like it goes to show that likeyou know, women are so like what
powerhouses, you know, and yeah,doing a lot.
SPEAKER_01 (32:30):
Helps to be an I I will say I trend toward optimism
more than pessimism orskepticism.
And I guess I'm like justdelusion delusional enough.
SPEAKER_00 (32:42):
You know, it's true though, because I mean I'd like
to get back up again and and doit again, you know what I mean?
And and the tenacity and thedrive and the push, you know.
And so for anyone who'slistening and they are in their
40s and they are starting, whatdo you say to them?
What is your Woo?
That's oh my goodness.
(33:04):
She's like, wow.
SPEAKER_01 (33:07):
Well, it's it's so funny, you know.
I think if we knew what wasahead of us, none of us would do
it.
It's like marriage or childbirthor anything like that.
If we knew how hard it would be,we would not do it.
But that doesn't mean it's notalso glorious.
And I think if you're starting abusiness right now, I'm super
(33:28):
proud of you.
You can do this.
You know, I think arm yourselfwith a support system who
understands what it's like to bean entrepreneur because not
everybody does understand thesacrifices you have to make, the
late nights, the worrying, youknow, the the the amount of
sleep I lost at the first halfof this year around taxes and
payroll and all that.
It's just like, oh my God.
(33:49):
It's tremendous.
But you know, being clear aboutwhy you're doing this and who
you serve, and and you know,hopefully you're using special
skills and talents that reallylight you up and make you feel
like you're in your flow state.
And you know, and but somepeople start businesses because
they can't get a job too.
And I see you too.
You know, whatever you gotta do.
Find your joys I'm out.
SPEAKER_00 (34:10):
But in this market, yeah, like you were saying,
thank yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (34:13):
Yeah, I get it, I get it.
But find find people whounderstand what you're going
through.
And you know, so you have yourown like mini board of directors
so that there's people whounderstand who, you know, if
something's not going right, oryou want to ask somebody a
question about a contract orwhatever, that you have you've
got, you know, your your boardof directors, as I called it,
that you can call and and reachout to and lean upon, who can,
you know, hopefully someonewho's a little further along so
(34:35):
they can guide you.
SPEAKER_00 (34:38):
Like you mean like a mentor.
SPEAKER_01 (34:40):
Yeah, I think people you can you can rely on and and
help you.
That's that's certainly been ahuge, huge help for me.
SPEAKER_00 (34:48):
I think you you couldn't have said it any
better.
Like it's so true.
For me, I think it's what'shelped me is having some good
mentors along the way, likepeople who support you, like um
in everything that you do.
Like my sister's been veryhelpful, and sometimes you're
just like the drive.
Like, I I I remember like onelast thing I I was uh on
(35:08):
Saturday, it wasn't feeling100%.
And I I said I was going to anevent, and I'm like, so it took
me a long time to get ready togo, and like my sister reminded
me, you know what I mean?
I think she's always been alittle pushed that you know
helps you.
And then when I finally got tothe event, I'm like, I'm glad I
did it.
You know what I mean?
I never would have met thepeople I did, and so even when
you're I'm not having the bestday, I feel like if when you
(35:32):
keep your word to yourself, notto anybody else, that's when
it's like, okay, I'm glad I didit, right?
SPEAKER_01 (35:38):
Yeah, remind yeah, reminding yourself while you're
doing it too.
I mean, like I I'm I'm anintrovert by nature, and so the
energetic shift into doingpodcasts or doing my own podcast
or going to events, likesometimes I have to kind of
psych myself up a little bitbecause the the energy drain is
real, but it's like no, no, thisis a good thing.
(35:59):
But then it also makes me morediscerning about how I want to
spend my time too.
You know, and I'm like, likethis is really morbid.
But um, I started decliningthings.
I'm like, if I get killed on theway home from this thing, will I
be mad about it?
SPEAKER_00 (36:13):
Oh my god, saying no.
That's the hardest thingsometimes.
Like, you know what I mean?
SPEAKER_01 (36:18):
I'm like, if it's a waste of my time, like if I I I
spent time away from mybeautiful children or my
business or my my sweet husbandto do some dumb thing, I'm gonna
be real mad.
SPEAKER_00 (36:29):
So it better be worth my time.
Oh my goodness.
Yes, I mean I'm trying, butyeah, I totally I I get we were
saying something about that forsure.
You know, we're talking a lotabout business, but like we
didn't talk about you being amom and and you know, juggling
all the things.
So as a mom and as a wife, howdo you do all the things?
(36:49):
How do you manage it all?
SPEAKER_01 (36:51):
Yeah, it's uh on one hand, being my own boss is is
helpful because you know, I canmake my own schedule.
I can say, no, I'm not gonna beavailable for that.
I can go be at school, I canhave much more kids, or or if
they you know need to stay home,you know, it's it's that's that
makes it a little easier fromtime to time.
One of my company policies istwo mental health days per year
(37:11):
per employee, no questionsasked.
And now I offer that to my kids,you know, two two days a
semester, no questions asked,you know, if they're because
that that now that they'regetting older, sometimes there's
like I just I cannot, you know.
SPEAKER_00 (37:21):
Oh my gosh, wow.
Yeah, they even told you.
Oh my gosh, wow, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (37:27):
So that's that's great.
But then there's other timeswhere I'm like, no, I I can't do
that because I have made othercommitments, or I've got to go
do this because I need torecruit a new client.
And and so a couple things havehappened.
One, I've invited, especially mykids, into the business.
So I walk them through it.
They you know help me do littlethings around the office, they
help me check my mailbox andcash checks and such.
(37:50):
I talk about my day with them, Italk about when things are hard
or when they're great.
And then, you know, as someonetold me a metaphor a long time
ago, it's like, you know, we'reall juggling balls, we all have
balls in the air, but you needto know the difference between
which ones are glass and whichones are rubber.
And so if something's gonnadrop, you have to make sure that
you catch the ones that areglass.
My children are the ones thatare glass.
Now, that doesn't mean, youknow, I personally for me, I
think you have to decide likewhat is works for you and which
(38:13):
doesn't work for you.
Like, I know what I want to showup for and what has meaning for
my kids.
Like, if they need me there fora class play or want to have
lunch on their birthday orsomething like that, like that's
what matters.
If it's just like a class party,I don't want to go.
I would rather have quality timewith them doing something else.
And I think figuring out likewho you are as a parent, as a
working parent, that's like youhave to make those decisions.
(38:35):
And so I hold boundaries with mykids too.
I say, like, no, that doesn'twork for me, but can I do
something else with you instead?
And you know, we figure that outtogether.
SPEAKER_00 (38:42):
No, that's good though.
I think boundaries is importantbecause we just don't want to
burn ourselves, like like yourun yourself ragged because you
said yes to everything, right?
And so teaching them boundariestoo, that's so important.
I like that.
I like the two days, the twodays off.
I wish I wish sometimes I hadthose days.
You know what I mean?
Because sometimes we do need amental break.
(39:02):
You do, like, you know, becauseit's a different time now.
Like we're we're spending moretime on technology, on
everything.
It's you have to like turn itoff.
SPEAKER_01 (39:11):
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
My daughter was in fourth grade,she's 10.
She so she's in fifth grade now,she'd be 11 this fall.
She woke up one morning, she'sjust like, I I just can't.
She's having a rough time withsome social stuff.
And she's like, I don't think Ican I don't I I feel fine, I
just don't think I can go toschool today.
Uh like, can I stay home?
And I mean, you know, the lookin her face was one like she was
(39:33):
shooting her shot.
She was pretty sure I was gonnabe like, put your uniform on,
you're letting you get out thisdoor.
And I I thought about my day andI was like, Yeah, yeah, you can
stay home.
And she's just immediately like,Are you kidding me right now?
I'm like, no, it's fine.
Sometimes you just can't.
That's okay.
I'll you we can do this, youknow, a couple times a year.
Uh you gotta take it seriously.
But, you know, w if you if youreally need it, you can stay
home and you can refresh andyou'll you'll have some work to
(39:55):
do.
It's not just watch TV all day.
But if you need to re-ret re-rest and recharge, you know, you
need to honor that.
You need to honor your body andyour mind, and we'll start again
tomorrow.
SPEAKER_00 (40:03):
Oh my gosh, that's amazing.
I think I think that's amazingthat you like people instill
that in your family.
I that's the first time I'veheard that.
And so um kudos to you, mom.
I think that's awesome.
I just feel I felt that there.
You know what?
Even when you said it, like itfelt like you were talking to
your daughter, and so it's soimportant.
Like, I think being the personthat you want them to be and to
(40:24):
be understanding because I meanlike she'll remember that, you
know, maybe an issue.
SPEAKER_01 (40:29):
Right.
Well, and also like learning, Idon't feel like if but speaking
of being in 40s, I don't feellike I learned to trust myself
until I was in my forties.
And I was always looking forexternal validation of like, you
know, whether it was like whatto put in my body from a diet
perspective, what wascomfortable for me with like
men, what what I needed to sayyes to or no to in a business
context.
(40:50):
Like I would always, you know, Iused got so used to s to
quieting my intuition and youknow, that other people were the
expert in me.
And so I'm trying to teach mychildren to be the experts in
them and to listen to their ownintuition and in in all facets
and hopefully learning that morequickly than I did.
SPEAKER_00 (41:10):
Yeah, I wish I I I can say the same thing because
you know what?
Like you you talk about thatjob.
Um I had a job too, and um well,I still I still work now, but
like this other job I wasworking, it was such a toxic
environment.
And I tried to organize thechaos, but you can't always
organize chaos.
And I think I like you saidsometimes the warning signs are
(41:34):
there and you're ignoring them.
Like we're so intuitive aswomen.
So I'm like that week before ithad before I got laid off, like
my manager was so like distant.
And I, if anything, if if I hadjust narrowed in on that, I
would have known.
Like, you know what I mean?
Like sometimes we ignore thethings that are right in our
face.
And I I remember like even inanother job before, I had to
(41:56):
pick up anything.
And I and I said it to mycoworker, I'm like, they're
gonna do something, something'shappening, and it happened.
So, like, yeah, don't ignore thesigns, like you know what I
mean, and and like getting backto you, like um and your
daughter, and and just needingthe the time.
Like sometimes we just need amental break from everything
because it's it's you come inbetter the next day.
(42:18):
You know what I mean?
Like every day's a good day, andyeah, so we like to love it,
yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (42:23):
Yeah, there's um a podcaster and author, um,
happiness expert, GretchenRubin.
Um, one of her rules is, youknow, to um to ask more from
yourself, you must giveyourself, or maybe or to I'm
sure I'm messing that up, butbut the I keep that in mind, you
know, like I can't I can't askof myself anymore if if I if my
cup is empty, you know, I needto rest and recharge, and you
(42:44):
know, there's a law ofdiminishing returns if you just
keep pushing through.
SPEAKER_00 (42:48):
Yeah, yeah.
You know what?
Like it's it's kind of the thewhole thing where you're you're
trying to make yourself better,but the environment that you're
in is is is taking that away,then that's not a good thing
either, right?
And so it goes full circle, butI am so glad we got to talk.
This has been amazing, and I I Ihope we can talk again soon
(43:10):
because you are a world ofknowledge, right?
And and for sure, all the way inTexas, right?
You know, it's amazing what youdo.
And say again for me, like so.
If anyone wants to check outyour website, it's qrnco.com.
Yeah, I can check it out myself.
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (43:30):
Yeah, just queid our co the and is dropped from the
URL.
So quedarco.com, that's what weare on Instagram, LinkedIn, all
the places, and then LaurenQueedar Cockerell on LinkedIn.
So if you want to slide in myDMs, you may that's amazing.
SPEAKER_00 (43:45):
Uh Carlene, if this is Diva Tonight with Lauren
Cocker, if this episoderesonates, you can send us a
text on the show.
Thank you so much again.
I appreciate your hat.
Thank you, Carlene.
SPEAKER_02 (43:56):
Diva Tonight with Carlene will be back.
Send us a message on Instagramat Diva underscore tonight.
Hi, I'm Carlene, and this is Diva.
Tonight, right now we're workingon a series called This Is 40, a
female perspective.
And I've talked to many women,and tonight I'm talking to
Lauren Cockerell, who's intaxes.
You know, she is very, verytalented in what she does.
(00:26):
You know, she is a publicrelations and marketing expert
for growing organizations, andshe has her own business, which
is Sweet Art and Co.
And she helps other smallbusinesses.
And I guess it's been a fewyears now that you've been doing
this operation, right?
And so what was the drivingforce behind it?
(00:49):
Well, well, thank you.
Well, I'm so glad to be herewith you.
SPEAKER_01 (00:52):
Thank you.
Looking forward to our chat.
Well, it's it's two-pronged.
There was the tactical, oh crapmoment of I was eight months
pregnant and got laid off.
And so it was time to make thesecond thing happen, which is
I've always wanted to own my ownbusiness and I've always wanted
to own my own PR firm.
So I'm I'm 44 now, and so I'vebeen in PR for as long as I
(01:16):
haven't been, so for half mylife now.
And I really love servingothers, and so it had been on my
heart to start my own company,and then the day came when I was
eight months pregnant with oursecond kid, and I certainly
couldn't go interview foranother job.
And I was like, well, today'sthe day.
SPEAKER_00 (01:33):
Wow, it was were you stressed?
I mean, like it's it's hard, youknow.
Like I I don't have kids, so Ican't really say I can relate,
but I mean to have all thethings like all that happen like
a few weeks before the babycomes, it's kind of like uh it
was definitely a you know, rugpulled out from under your feet
moment.
SPEAKER_01 (01:53):
I I had a feeling something was happening and
changing.
I'm I'm an empath by nature, soI could I could sense there was
a shift a couple weeks before Iactually went to my husband.
I was like, hey, I I I I don'twant to stay here anyway.
Like we'd already planned, youknow, for my eventual exit.
But I I said, I think they mightbe gonna, I think they might be
about to let me go.
Are we okay?
Like how much runway do we have?
(02:14):
You know, how quickly I'm like,I can't go interview.
I mean, especially in theStates, just really no matter
what I say, I don't know ifanyone's gonna believe me
saying, like, no, I really wantto come work, I promise.
And so, uh, you know, we'refine.
This is how much time we have,you know, don't sweat about it.
But it's like, you know, beingfired or let go is is really,
you know, is a a sort of atrauma.
And then for it to be at such avulnerable moment, just like, oh
(02:37):
my gosh, you know, they theygave me a nice severance, so
that was good.
Oh, they did.
SPEAKER_00 (02:40):
Okay, I was gonna say, like, yeah.
No, and that position, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (02:44):
That's like Yeah, they didn't want to get sued.
SPEAKER_00 (02:46):
So it's gonna be a lawsuit at that point.
Yeah, yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (02:50):
Like, I'm so no, they gave me what I felt was a
fair severance, and they gave memy the equipment that I'd had at
home as kind of like my so I waslike, Well, I guess I'll go
start my company now.
You know, in hindsight, it feelsa little more blasé, but you
know, in the moment I was I wasvery emotional, very upset, very
stressed out.
I'd really it'd been a verytoxic environment, and so I kind
of didn't really know what whichway was up either.
(03:11):
I had lost a lot of faith inmyself.
Ironically, or coincidentally,that morning I had mailed a
$5,000 check to a coach that Iwas hiring to like help me
figure out what was next for me.
Like, do I do a resume and gofind another job?
Do I start my own company?
Like, I'd already been thinkingthrough what's my next step.
And and then they called me andlet me go.
And I'm like watching the mailtruck drive away.
(03:33):
I'm like, come back.
SPEAKER_00 (03:37):
Oh my god.
SPEAKER_01 (03:40):
It turned out to be very fortuitous.
She helped me process the youknow everything that had
happened to me.
And then we started to evaluatethe two paths, but very quickly
I was like, no, I I want to domy own thing.
This is where my heart is.
And so she helped hold meaccountable and you know, helped
me set up some initial valuesand helped me think through how
I wanted to show up as abusiness person.
And so it's very is veryhelpful.
And I and I got I startedgetting clients right away.
(04:01):
So it was very fortunatecircumstance and things turned
around very quickly.
SPEAKER_00 (04:06):
How did you build like your network so quickly?
SPEAKER_01 (04:09):
Right.
So as soon as I felt thingsshifting, I reached out to my
first boss and mentor.
So I reached out to her to say,like, hey, I I think things are
shifting a little bit.
I I can take on side work ifthere's ever a project you don't
want to do or if there'sanything you want to team up on.
And so she became almost like anoutside salesperson for me.
And then I also reached out tomy my network just saying, Hey,
(04:29):
I'm available.
And I had I had past clientscoming to me saying, like, oh,
can we be on retainer with you?
I'm like, Yeah, sure.
SPEAKER_00 (04:36):
Oh my gosh.
You know what?
I think when it's supposed tohappen, some things happen, you
know, and hearing you talk aboutthat reminds me of like when I
started this journey, like thepodcast, like everything just
kind of happened.
Like, I got into this businessboot camp through a friend I
know from high school, and likemy editor, my designer him, I
(05:00):
know him from like elementaryschool.
Someone even offered to be myeditor.
So, like, I don't know, I findlike if it's something you're
passionate about, it might bescary in the beginning, but it
it works out.
And and like here you are now totalk about it, right?
SPEAKER_01 (05:13):
And so it's kind of like you're like you're living
right, you know, it's likeyou're in line with your
purpose.
And because when I, as I waswrapping up that corporate role,
I really was not living in a waythat I felt like I was put on
this earth to do.
Like I was selling commodity,you know, I'd moved from a PR
role into like sellingcommodities and uh, you know,
selling Office 365 and managedhosting.
(05:33):
I was like, kill me now.
My special skills and talentswere not being used.
And I was like, oh man, youknow, I like to solve problems,
like to help people, and like Icouldn't help people.
Like it was just not, they werelike, No, I don't want to talk
to you, I just want to buy thisthing, you know.
And so I remember one day I wastalking to my coach at the time,
and then I was telling her aboutall the progress that was
happening at that time, and so Iwas at postpartum and had all
(05:56):
these clients coming in, and andshe was like, gosh, you know,
Lauren, I just want you to know,like, this is not how a new
business is supposed to start.
Like, you're very lucky.
And in the moment, I said, nowwait a minute.
I've been working for 15 years,like I have a reputation.
This is, you know, yes, I amfortunate, but it's not luck.
Like I have a body of work thatI'm and in a network, and you
(06:16):
know, I've made sure not to burnbridges over the years so I
could walk across them at thisexact moment.
Like, I don't think it's fair tocall it totally luck here.
SPEAKER_00 (06:24):
Yeah, you know what?
I think I think it's safe tosay, like, if you have a good
work ethic with people and likethey remember like what you did
to help them, no matter what,they'll remember you.
And I and I think that's likewhen it's your calling and
you're helping people, they'llcome, right?
And so do you feel like okay,from your past work experiences,
where did you work prior?
(06:45):
Because obviously this is likethe the road that leads you
here, right?
So where did you start yourcareer in PR?
SPEAKER_01 (06:53):
Yep.
So I graduated with a businessdegree from a small liberal arts
school in 2003 and likeliterally stumbled into a PR
firm not even knowing what PRwas.
I was like, can I be an internhere?
Um I had a friend who was anintern there and she was leaving
town.
I was like, Well, can I meanthis is the naivety of a
22-year-old.
I was like, Well, can I haveyour internship?
(07:15):
Like, like they're transferable,you know?
Which is not.
And she was like, I don't know,we can ask.
And so they hired, you know,dumb old me, but I always love
stories.
And it ended up being thisincredible mashup.
Like, I didn't even know what itwas, but turns out that I love
stories and I love business, andI was able to pull them
together.
And I was like, I'm the perfectperson for a PR.
(07:36):
And so I was there.
I started as an intern, and then10 years later, when I left, I
was the vice president.
And just, I mean, I was like, Iwant to do this, I want to own
this business.
You know, I ended up not wantingto own that business in
particular.
Like, I just was like, you know,I think I'd rather start my own
thing one day.
But after 10 years, I'd gottenmarried.
Uh, we knew we wanted to startit anyway.
I was in my 30s at that point.
(07:56):
And so I was like, well, youknow, we don't have maternity
leave or anything here.
We're just, you know, tinylittle PR agency.
And I wanted to try somethingdifferent anyway.
I kind of felt like I'd run outof runway there.
So a client hired me and I wentin-house.
They created a a director ofpublic relations role for me,
and it was two sister ITcompanies.
So I went from the agency tothis IT shop and was running
(08:18):
their PR and some vendorrelationships, and that role
changed over time.
So after five years, they laidme off and I started my company,
and we'll be uh eight years inOctober.
SPEAKER_00 (08:26):
Wow, eight years, wow.
So in the eight years thatyou've been doing this, what
what do you think you've learnedin in that time period?
Like, how do you run asuccessful business, especially
a PR business?
SPEAKER_01 (08:40):
It's it's been an evolution, honestly.
You know, there I think everyit's you know, it's it is like
with children, every age andstage has its pros and cons.
You know, you're starting out,you're trying to figure it out
who are you.
And when when I started thecompany, I was I was burned and
burned out.
And I just thought, I don't wantto hire anybody, I'm just gonna
do this myself.
I mean, I was just like, whoof,no, but then quickly needed to
(09:03):
staff up for different projects.
And so I I allowed it to evolveas I felt like it was meant to
be, you know, like to thinkabout like what what you know
the first year of my son's lifeand then also my business life,
like, you know, that neededsomething at that time where it
was like I was more of asolopreneur um consultant and
(09:23):
and now I have a team of seven.
But I think one thing that Irealized in business ownership
is that it has allowed me to bethe most fully actualized person
that I'm meant to be.
Like it really has brought outevery part of me that I did had
not been able to bring to thetable it as a W-2 employee at
(09:45):
other roles.
Now that's not to say likeeverybody needs to have their
own business because I thinkthere are roles and functions
for which we need someone whowants to show up and do the same
thing every single day.
And and then need that we needthem to make the system run.
And we need people who areentrepreneurs where they don't
want to own their own business,but they want to treat my
business as theirs.
You know, I mean, like we needevery uh every lid for a
(10:06):
different pot.
But I think one of the thingsthat I've done as I've grown the
company is institutionalizedculture and defining you know
who we are as a business, whatare our values, and you know,
how do we imbue everything thatwe do with who we are so that
our brand can live beyond justme.
You know, it's not just meanymore.
(10:27):
And so I think you know,sometimes people are missing
that, they're missing culturethat really helps make people
want to show up every day andthey want to fight for the
business as if it's theirs.
And that's something I see itwith clients when they're
struggling.
That's can often be part of thethe reason.
And then I see people who aredoing it really beautifully with
thousands of employees.
(10:48):
So maybe I got there in the endon your answer.
SPEAKER_00 (10:52):
It's like me when I asked you a question.
I'm like, wait, that was a fullyloaded question.
But when you saidinstitutionalized culture, what
do you mean?
Uh can you elaborate on that?
Like, that's an interestingthing.
SPEAKER_01 (11:03):
Right.
Well, it's you know, some peoplesay, like, oh, we've got a great
culture.
Like, what does that mean?
They've got ping pong tables orsomething like that.
Um whereas one of the smartthings I've done in this
business is is coming up withour our core values.
They weren't just like, oh, thisis Lauren's secret sauce.
It's like, okay, these areattributes that people, you
know, they came out of thewoodwork when I started the
(11:24):
company to work with me becauseof these things, but also I see
them in people who want to workfor us.
So strategy first, hungry andhumble, delightfully curious, do
what we said, be the easybutton.
Those are our core values.
And so when I I put those onpaper and I define them and I
share them with the team.
Well, I could have just stoppedthere.
What we also did, we created itas a part of our employee
(11:48):
recruitment process.
So when someone applies for arole, they have to tell us how
those values resonate with themand how they show up with those
values, like what they mean tothem.
And then as we're talking tothem, we're screening for them.
Okay, like, does this they saidthis is, you know, do it what
they said, like, but are theyreally walking the walk here?
We use it in disciplinary uhactions as well.
(12:08):
So if you tell me you're gonnahave a draft to me tomorrow, but
then you're a week late with it,over and over and over again,
you're having now that's avalues violation, and we have to
have a conversation about that.
And I've dismissed people beforebecause of it.
And then also we have a valueschampion every week.
So and it's the team manages it.
So today someone was nominatedfor a value, next week they're
(12:29):
nominating somebody else, and soit perpetuates on and on.
And so it's it's like, you know,it's not just oh, you're a
strategist for strategy first,but you have to say why.
So it's like caught doing good.
So it's like it's thiscontinuation where it's always
alive and well in ourorganization.
And and that's that's one partof culture, it's not just
values, but it really helps fromthe foundational aspect of, you
(12:51):
know, here's who we are, here'swho we say we are, here's how we
act what how we say we are.
And then that really feeds intoeverything else and how we treat
each other and our clients.
SPEAKER_00 (13:00):
And so who are your clients?
Like you you say in your more orless who you are as as an
individual that you servesmaller businesses.
And so the small guy versus thebig guy, you know what I mean?
We're just starting off here,right?
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (13:15):
It varies and not necessarily like not necessarily
micro businesses like like myown, but we tend to work a fair
amount in the North Texas areajust because I'm from here and
I've lived here most of my life,uh, and this is where my my
network is.
But we also have folks aroundthe country and you know, really
looking for folks who I sayvalues driven, but but I mean
(13:35):
that in like a their core valuesdrive them.
They're looking to treat theirteam well, they're looking to
treat their community well,they're looking to treat their
their clients well, and youknow, maybe they aren't great at
articulating what it is they'retrying to accomplish, and that's
where we come in to help themcast that vision and communicate
all the wonderful things thatthey're doing.
(13:56):
Um, a lot of unsung heroes, wewe love like the folks in the
manufacturing or industrial orfinancial services uh space.
Like they're not quote unquotesexy, but we love it because we
can really like crack open theirthe chest of the business and
pull out that beating heart andbe like, no, look at what you're
doing.
Like, yes, you're selling theselittle widgets that you know you
might think nobody cares, butyou they you do care because
(14:18):
you're employing these manypeople and you're able to
contribute thousands of dollarsa year to these nonprofits and
blah blah you know, on and onand on.
And so that's what we love.
And multi-generationalbusinesses is a little bit of a
side niche for us, helping thatthird or fourth generation step
into their family's legacy andhelp them really crystallize
what they want to do movingforward as while they're
(14:40):
honoring the past.
So, so it ranged, you know,we've got some folks in the kind
of like one to ten millionrevenue range, small business,
and then we have some in likethe billion dollar range, you
know, where they, you know, I Iwas talking to somebody the
other day, they're like, I'm I'msorry, I just you know, we we
need you.
We're not that we're not verysophisticated.
I'm like, listen, if you didn'tyou didn't need me, what would I
(15:02):
be here for?
Like, it's okay to to need somehelp.
Like, you know, you could be abillion-dollar business and
still need some help.
Like it's it's all right.
SPEAKER_00 (15:10):
Yeah.
With any business, it's aboutthe brand and and the message,
right?
And how you show up and if youcan help them, you know, create
a brand that's better for them,all the power to it, right?
You know what I mean?
Like you put your your name yourcompany name across that.
And so I think that becausewe're in the age of technology,
(15:31):
what's important with marketing,especially in a digital era?
SPEAKER_01 (15:36):
So this is not my saying.
I I ripped it off with somebodyand I don't remember how.
It's hard to read the label frominside the bottle.
So it's really hard to do foryou what you need to do.
So, like, like you know all theins and outs, you know the good,
the bad, and the ugly aboutyourself, but it's really hard
to discern what your customerswant to hear from you.
So we come alongside our clientsand we help, you know, we pull
(15:58):
out what's really important,what's gonna resonate with their
audience.
Let's distill it down, distillit down, distill it down.
And then in the age oftechnology, in the age of AI,
you have to make sure thatyou're clear and consistent and
different.
So, you know, you don't want tojust lean on Chat GPT and sound
like everybody else, and oh, andalso maybe accidentally
(16:21):
plagiarize somebody else'scontent because if you don't
give it enough, it's just gonnapull from the internet, which
means it's gonna rip offsomebody else, and then you're
using that content as if it'syours.
Yeah, yeah, look out.
SPEAKER_00 (16:32):
Very how do you stop that?
Like, I mean, a lot of peopleare using chat GPT.
Yeah, like okay.
SPEAKER_01 (16:40):
This is true true story.
So I I use chat.
I I love chat.
Um, me too.
I when I show up with chat withlike, here's my point of view,
here's the experience I've justhad, here's what I'm trying to
accomplish, here's my vision,like take this crappy first
draft and make it make sense.
If I do that, the content ismine, it's in my voice, I've
trained it, it but it's it'smine.
(17:00):
If I come up and say, I don'tknow what's right today, what
should I talk about?
You know, what are some topicswe can talk about?
Okay, we'll talk about that.
All right, write it for me.
It if I don't give iteverything, I've taken content,
run it through a plagiarismchecker, and it's plagiarized.
SPEAKER_00 (17:15):
My goodness.
So, like if you're pretty muchsaying that even when you're
using a tool like chat GBT, thatyou really have to be very
specific with what you're askingto do.
Otherwise, if it's too general,it will take away from well
that's what's trained to do.
It's it's it's not it's not.
See, that's the thing that'sthat so many people don't
(17:36):
understand about this thisplatform.
It's it's amazing to help you,but like there's so many things
that like people don't really.
SPEAKER_01 (17:46):
You know, you you you have to be in the captain
seat, and you know, you have tosay, This is our turn of voice,
this is what I'm trying toaccomplish.
It's um great writers creategreat content in Chat GPT
because we understand storystructure, we understand what
we're trying to accomplish,we're able to pull out like that
that makes sense, where's thateven coming from?
That's not you know, like thatyou're just generating generic
(18:10):
AI slop that's ripped from theinternet because that's what
you've been trained to do.
But if you instead are coming upwith your like this is my point
of view, this is my story, thisis my expertise.
I'm trying to comment on thisexact thing, then it then it is
yours, then it is a great help.
SPEAKER_00 (18:24):
I have never thought to last to whether or not it
plagiarized, but now I know frompersonal experience from a
business person, businessperspective, I just learned so
many things that I I would havenever really thought that it
would take because I'm seeing itin my voice and asking it, okay.
This is Diva tonight, postedthis is the guest, and you know
(18:46):
what I mean, and in my voice.
And so, like I you just taughtme something that I have to
think about.
So that's just mind blob mindbobbling.
I'm just like blown away rightnow.
SPEAKER_01 (18:55):
Keep showing up as you, and it's great.
It's great, you know, feed it asmuch as you can, uh, and and
you'll be in good shape.
SPEAKER_02 (19:01):
Diva tonight, glamour for your ears.
This is 40, a femaleperspective.
SPEAKER_00 (19:08):
I do have a off-topic, like I mean, starting
from the big beginning, butyou're in business, and so is
this like a family thing?
Did you have a business mindsetwhen you were younger?
I always say like it's it's notwhere you're going, it's where
you came from.
So who instilled this this thisuh mindset for you?
(19:29):
I mean, this journey here.
SPEAKER_01 (19:30):
Um both both of my parents were professional.
They're they're both still withus, fortunately.
My mom worked for IBM in salesfor multiple decades, and my dad
has owned his own business formy whole life in the insurance
financial services realm.
But even as a kid, I rememberbeing interested in being a
babysitter, not because I likedkids, but because I wanted to
make money.
And and so I went to the localchildren's hospital.
(19:56):
I went to the children'shospital, I took like a safety
class, I I passed like the CPRtest and like the poison
prevention test, and and like Ibought a bottle of Ipecac syrup,
which you used to use.
I don't even think you'resupposed to use it anymore, but
to induce vomiting if someoneingests poison, and I like put
it in my backpack and made alittle flyer and like you know,
rode around on my bike in theneighborhood, like handing out
flyers, trying to get clients.
(20:16):
It turns out I was a horriblebabysitter, did not have any
repeat clients.
I'm probably my own kids, but uhyou know, I was kind of like,
Are you not an adult?
Let's just talk like adults, butanyway.
But looking back, you know, it'slike I I wanted my own business,
I wanted my own money, and andso I, you know, I had
internships and jobs, and butboy, that first after-school
internship when I was at the PRfirm, I was like, oh man, yeah,
(20:39):
this is this is for me.
So, you know, it's sort of me issort of the environment.
So just kind of like I thinkit's one of those things that's
like the uniquely Laurenexperience for you know, this is
what I was meant to do.
You know, not a I don't thinkI'll ever own like a 50-person
agency that overwhelms me.
I like, you know, the small butmighty, I can beat everybody
(20:59):
with two pizzas, I can hugeverybody and know, you know, I
want to know their families andwho they are and all their
wishes and hopes and dreams.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (21:06):
No, I like that though.
I think small is good, you know.
When I went to school at Humberfor radio, and they always say
when you're starting off, youyou're gonna get a job at a
small radio station because likeworking at a bigger radio
station is is when you've madeit, like you built yourself up
to that point.
But in small community radio iswhere you'll learn the most.
(21:27):
And so even for you, I think yourealize too, like when you're
working for small businesses,um, you get to focus in and like
help them build that brand.
So when you say all that andjust who you are, what is your
legacy?
What what do you want to leavebehind?
SPEAKER_01 (21:45):
While you were while you were getting to the
question, I was thinking, youknow, one of the reasons I do
like the smaller environment,because I've always I was
reflecting like, oh gosh, I'veactually always liked a smaller
environment.
I went to a small school as akid, went to a small liberal
arts school, 1500 people.
Like I wanted I knew I wanted aclassroom of like 20 people,
like I wanted to know myprofessors, I wanted to know the
(22:07):
people, like it's but it's it'salways been about the people for
me.
I want the human relationship.
I want to have I don't want tohave lots of friends, I want to
have a few like really deeprelationships, and and so the I
think that is my legacy of howyou know the the connections I
have and the deep friendshipsand impact I make on, you know,
my loved ones and just how I seethem and they see me and and how
(22:31):
we can help each other grow andand love each other.
And so it's you know it's it'sit's about the people for sure.
SPEAKER_00 (22:37):
Yeah.
And you know, it's interestingthat you say that with the
people because I find like, youknow, it like you said earlier
that you're an empath, and Ifeel like I'm the same way.
People have always been drawn tome.
And like sometimes, Lauren, Ijust want to be like, leave me
alone.
I don't want to talk to you, Idon't want to help you today.
No.
But like you said, it's it's therelationships you have with
(22:59):
people.
And I think as I've gottenolder, like we haven't even
talked about 40, but I think asI've gotten older in this age
now, that I realize that likeI'm not gonna care too much
about what others think of me asmuch as I used to.
And I and I'm always because Iwork with people, like even my
(23:19):
personal job other outside ofthe podcast, that I find that
now it's easier for me to talkto people and not feel awkward
about I'm like, oh, should I sayanything to that person?
You know, and and hearing youreiterate the thing with people
is so important behind anybusiness because you aren't like
even if you don't directly talkto people all the time, we're in
(23:41):
the people business no matterwhat.
SPEAKER_01 (23:43):
So now that's have their own money.
It sounds like they can shop forus now, but they don't have
their own money yet.
SPEAKER_00 (23:52):
So with PR and marketing, as someone who is a
podcaster, how do I stand out?
Like myself, other than beingauthentic.
People keep saying you're justjust be authentic.
That's the important thing.
But as a PR person and someonewho works in marketing every
day, what do you say?
SPEAKER_01 (24:13):
Yep.
Uh well they're right.
Definitely be you, be uniquely,Carlene.
I think also being clear aboutwhat you want to have happen for
your brand, knowing who youserve, how are you helping them,
what does success look like onthe other side of engaging with
you in some way, whether it'slistening to your content or or
if you have other pathways forthem.
(24:34):
I think knowing those thingsreally help fuel your content
engine.
So the your social, your blog,your the podcast you're putting
out, the guests that you'rehaving on, you know, viewing the
viewing your screening throughthat lens of okay, is this a
good guest or a guess it's not afit?
Based on uh are they helping meget to that goal of of helping,
(24:55):
you know, my avatar of you know,so-and-so, whatever you want to
name her.
And then also, you know, beyondthat, being clear about that.
So what are your actual goals?
What do you want to have happen?
What are your calls to action?
Who who's you?
What uh who is you?
That's good.
Yeah, yeah.
Who are you?
SPEAKER_00 (25:12):
That's not no, but that works.
I guess who's you?
We're all, you know.
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (25:19):
Getting the unfiltered version here.
Who are you?
You know, who is for you, andhow do you want to help those
people?
And how do you, you know, ifthey're not ready to engage with
you, are there ways for them toconnect with your content?
Are there is something you cangive them so they're in your
email list?
You better email them if youwant to talk to them.
So building up your email list,providing good content, valuable
content, something that you knowis is what advice do you have to
(25:42):
give?
Like what is what is your secretsauce and how can you package
that up?
Uh is is where you need tostart.
And then from there, what otherplatforms can you be on to help
amplify your podcast and yourbrand?
So can you beyond other shows?
Can you contribute to what uhwhat other channels and medium
are are available to you?
So other other blogs, other youknow, news articles, so on and
(26:05):
so forth.
Like what all can you create?
And then also because right nowis for AI in this in this moment
in time, however long this isgonna last.
unknown (26:13):
Yeah.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (26:16):
The year of our Lord, 2025, in August, at the
time of recording, this is true.
I don't know what will be truewhen it airs.
SPEAKER_00 (26:22):
Oh my gosh.
I'm laughing, but it's so true,it's so scary.
I never in my wildest dreamswould I think it would be so
advanced now.
You know what I mean?
It's like technology has changedso much, and it always does.
SPEAKER_01 (26:37):
Let me land a quick plane and let me let me tell you
something else about that.
So, right now, AI search isranking earned media, so
articles, columns, you know,your your traditional media is
ranking those results higher andrecommending.
So if you say I'm looking for apodcaster who's focused on women
(26:57):
in their 40s, if you've gotcontent out there other than
what you own, it is gonna pullthat first, and then it will
start to recommend based on youknow, like your own blog or
whatever, but it prioritizedquote unquote earn media ahead
of other channels right now.
Right now, yes.
But technology changes.
When I started in 2003, we stillsent press releases via fax
(27:18):
machine.
There was no Facebook, there wasno Twitter.
I mean, you know, I've alreadyseen stuff change tremendously
in my 22 years, and it changed abunch before that too.
You know, there used to be like,you know, you used to have to
hand do everything.
So that's just job to change.
We just have to stay on top ofit without going losing their
minds.
SPEAKER_00 (27:36):
Yeah, yeah.
And you know, one thing I dowant to say is because we're
talking about marketing and PR,but what is the difference?
SPEAKER_01 (27:43):
So people when the people think about PR, they tend
to think about working with mewith the media, being a
publicist, things like that.
It's uh a little bit broaderthan that.
Uh as far as I was raised up inthe industry, I was taught to
think about PR as a function ofmanagement and leadership.
So, like casting a vision forthe business, the reputation of
the business.
You know, some of the thingsthat we do in PR aren't
(28:05):
necessarily related tomarketing.
Sometimes, you know, we'reannouncing executive changes or
mergers and acquisitions or youknow, things things of that
nature.
We're doing crisiscommunications, those aren't
necessarily related to sales,which marketing is a function of
sales.
We're driving, we're trying toget people to buy something,
whether it's services orproducts or what have you.
We're putting butts in seats,we're selling widgets, marketing
(28:27):
is a function of sales.
You can usually measure your ROIa lot better with marketing.
And so, you know, marketing isusually PR, but PR is not always
marketing.
You know, I can't if I'm talkingabout a new executive vice
president for a company, is thatgonna drive sales?
Not necessarily.
SPEAKER_00 (28:44):
So wow.
Yeah, and so you know, you'retalking about marketing and PR.
And so if anyone is listeningand they want to work with you,
like and they want your help,how do they go about it?
Like, I know you have a websiteand all that jazz.
What is it?
What the fuck would you do?
SPEAKER_01 (29:02):
Oh, thank you.
SPEAKER_00 (29:02):
Uh there you go.
You can you can you can check usout.
SPEAKER_01 (29:05):
Uh we're everywhere at Queen Arco, so that's K W E D
A R C O.
So that's dot com.
That's all of our socialchannels.
You can find me on LinkedIn.
I'm pretty active over there.
We'd love to chat.
If you just have a question,feel free to drop me a DM.
And then our my podcast, TheImpatient Entrepreneur, is the
Impatient Entrepreneur Pod.
SPEAKER_00 (29:25):
I haven't checked it out.
The Impatient Entrepreneur.
I gotta check that out.
Yeah.
So as a businesswoman and apodcaster that has, I mean,
whatever you said, it's gonna beeight years in October.
When you started this journey atlike eight months from now, I
can I can't even imagine, like,woo! Like, and now the baby is
(29:46):
not the baby anymore.
The baby's in second grade.
So it's just like it's yourbaby, you'll which is like they
say, like having a child is likeowning a business.
So, like, it's it's like two andone.
You know what I mean?
Like you started both at a atlike a pivotal time, like a
crazy time.
Like, you know, now that yourbaby is almost eight, what do
(30:08):
you say to that?
You know?
SPEAKER_01 (30:11):
Yeah.
Like, Lordy, here we go.
It's so interesting.
After I had my son, our secondkid, and my business had
started, I I was telling people,you know, like my son was born
and I was reborn when I started.
It was it was like for me owningmy own business.
And and I do feel like, youknow, I'm Lauren 6.0 or wherever
I am in this, you know, at 44.
(30:32):
And so, you know, I'm really I'mI'm proud of myself.
I've the obstacles keep coming,you know.
I I think I think sometimes ashumans we can think like, okay,
I experienced this bad thing, soI'm good now.
No more, thank you.
But having the resilience to toget back up when you just get
knocked in the teeth sometimes,you know, successful people
(30:52):
aren't necessarily successfulbecause they had the best idea.
They're successful because itjust kept going.
And they believed in the ideaand they they sacked themselves
up.
I mean, 2025 has been a weird,weird year.
My sales cycles are the longestI've ever experienced.
The you know, consumer behaviorhas been I mean, and you know, I
I feel the same way.
Like it's just like theunsteadiness, the chaos, the
(31:14):
confusion, the the clouds kindof hanging over some of us.
It's it's been a tough year, andI've really had to dig deep to
to psych myself up sometimes.
Like, how do I keep swimming?
How do I just keep swimming?
Because I have to show up formyself, I have to show up for my
team, I have to show up for myclients, I have to show up for
my children, my husband, myfriends, my family.
And and it's a lot.
Uh but you're a lot.
SPEAKER_00 (31:33):
When you list it all like that, I'm like, oh my god.
Yeah, it's a lot.
SPEAKER_01 (31:40):
I I can't believe it's been it's about to be eight
years.
I have not done this alone.
I have an incredible team,incredible support system.
I've I'm very blessed.
And but you know, I'm also theone waking up in the morning and
and showing up.
So I I you know, if you'relistening to this and you're
like, heck yeah, I'm like, yeah,you know, pat yourself on the
back.
You're you're doing it.
SPEAKER_00 (31:58):
Yeah, yeah.
You know what I mean?
I think it's it's like at thisage in our lives that in in our
forties, like we are we arepushing through.
Like I think everyone is goingthrough different things, and
it's people like yourself whoare entrepreneurs that like you
know inspire us to like, youknow, if Lauren can do it, she
has two kids, I don't have anykids, then I can suck it up and
(32:20):
do it.
You know what I mean?
Like it goes to show that likeyou know, women are so like what
powerhouses, you know, and yeah,doing a lot.
SPEAKER_01 (32:30):
Helps to be an I I will say I trend toward optimism
more than pessimism orskepticism.
And I guess I'm like justdelusion delusional enough.
SPEAKER_00 (32:42):
You know, it's true though, because I mean I'd like
to get back up again and and doit again, you know what I mean?
And and the tenacity and thedrive and the push, you know.
And so for anyone who'slistening and they are in their
40s and they are starting, whatdo you say to them?
What is your Woo?
That's oh my goodness.
(33:04):
She's like, wow.
SPEAKER_01 (33:07):
Well, it's it's so funny, you know.
I think if we knew what wasahead of us, none of us would do
it.
It's like marriage or childbirthor anything like that.
If we knew how hard it would be,we would not do it.
But that doesn't mean it's notalso glorious.
And I think if you're starting abusiness right now, I'm super
(33:28):
proud of you.
You can do this.
You know, I think arm yourselfwith a support system who
understands what it's like to bean entrepreneur because not
everybody does understand thesacrifices you have to make, the
late nights, the worrying, youknow, the the the amount of
sleep I lost at the first halfof this year around taxes and
payroll and all that.
It's just like, oh my God.
(33:49):
It's tremendous.
But you know, being clear aboutwhy you're doing this and who
you serve, and and you know,hopefully you're using special
skills and talents that reallylight you up and make you feel
like you're in your flow state.
And you know, and but somepeople start businesses because
they can't get a job too.
And I see you too.
You know, whatever you gotta do.
Find your joys I'm out.
SPEAKER_00 (34:10):
But in this market, yeah, like you were saying,
thank yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (34:13):
Yeah, I get it, I get it.
But find find people whounderstand what you're going
through.
And you know, so you have yourown like mini board of directors
so that there's people whounderstand who, you know, if
something's not going right, oryou want to ask somebody a
question about a contract orwhatever, that you have you've
got, you know, your your boardof directors, as I called it,
that you can call and and reachout to and lean upon, who can,
you know, hopefully someonewho's a little further along so
(34:35):
they can guide you.
SPEAKER_00 (34:38):
Like you mean like a mentor.
SPEAKER_01 (34:40):
Yeah, I think people you can you can rely on and and
help you.
That's that's certainly been ahuge, huge help for me.
SPEAKER_00 (34:48):
I think you you couldn't have said it any
better.
Like it's so true.
For me, I think it's what'shelped me is having some good
mentors along the way, likepeople who support you, like um
in everything that you do.
Like my sister's been veryhelpful, and sometimes you're
just like the drive.
Like, I I I remember like onelast thing I I was uh on
(35:08):
Saturday, it wasn't feeling100%.
And I I said I was going to anevent, and I'm like, so it took
me a long time to get ready togo, and like my sister reminded
me, you know what I mean?
I think she's always been alittle pushed that you know
helps you.
And then when I finally got tothe event, I'm like, I'm glad I
did it.
You know what I mean?
I never would have met thepeople I did, and so even when
you're I'm not having the bestday, I feel like if when you
(35:32):
keep your word to yourself, notto anybody else, that's when
it's like, okay, I'm glad I didit, right?
SPEAKER_01 (35:38):
Yeah, remind yeah, reminding yourself while you're
doing it too.
I mean, like I I'm I'm anintrovert by nature, and so the
energetic shift into doingpodcasts or doing my own podcast
or going to events, likesometimes I have to kind of
psych myself up a little bitbecause the the energy drain is
real, but it's like no, no, thisis a good thing.
(35:59):
But then it also makes me morediscerning about how I want to
spend my time too.
You know, and I'm like, likethis is really morbid.
But um, I started decliningthings.
I'm like, if I get killed on theway home from this thing, will I
be mad about it?
SPEAKER_00 (36:13):
Oh my god, saying no.
That's the hardest thingsometimes.
Like, you know what I mean?
SPEAKER_01 (36:18):
I'm like, if it's a waste of my time, like if I I I
spent time away from mybeautiful children or my
business or my my sweet husbandto do some dumb thing, I'm gonna
be real mad.
SPEAKER_00 (36:29):
So it better be worth my time.
Oh my goodness.
Yes, I mean I'm trying, butyeah, I totally I I get we were
saying something about that forsure.
You know, we're talking a lotabout business, but like we
didn't talk about you being amom and and you know, juggling
all the things.
So as a mom and as a wife, howdo you do all the things?
(36:49):
How do you manage it all?
SPEAKER_01 (36:51):
Yeah, it's uh on one hand, being my own boss is is
helpful because you know, I canmake my own schedule.
I can say, no, I'm not gonna beavailable for that.
I can go be at school, I canhave much more kids, or or if
they you know need to stay home,you know, it's it's that's that
makes it a little easier fromtime to time.
One of my company policies istwo mental health days per year
(37:11):
per employee, no questionsasked.
And now I offer that to my kids,you know, two two days a
semester, no questions asked,you know, if they're because
that that now that they'regetting older, sometimes there's
like I just I cannot, you know.
SPEAKER_00 (37:21):
Oh my gosh, wow.
Yeah, they even told you.
Oh my gosh, wow, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (37:27):
So that's that's great.
But then there's other timeswhere I'm like, no, I I can't do
that because I have made othercommitments, or I've got to go
do this because I need torecruit a new client.
And and so a couple things havehappened.
One, I've invited, especially mykids, into the business.
So I walk them through it.
They you know help me do littlethings around the office, they
help me check my mailbox andcash checks and such.
(37:50):
I talk about my day with them, Italk about when things are hard
or when they're great.
And then, you know, as someonetold me a metaphor a long time
ago, it's like, you know, we'reall juggling balls, we all have
balls in the air, but you needto know the difference between
which ones are glass and whichones are rubber.
And so if something's gonnadrop, you have to make sure that
you catch the ones that areglass.
My children are the ones thatare glass.
Now, that doesn't mean, youknow, I personally for me, I
think you have to decide likewhat is works for you and which
(38:13):
doesn't work for you.
Like, I know what I want to showup for and what has meaning for
my kids.
Like, if they need me there fora class play or want to have
lunch on their birthday orsomething like that, like that's
what matters.
If it's just like a class party,I don't want to go.
I would rather have quality timewith them doing something else.
And I think figuring out likewho you are as a parent, as a
working parent, that's like youhave to make those decisions.
(38:35):
And so I hold boundaries with mykids too.
I say, like, no, that doesn'twork for me, but can I do
something else with you instead?
And you know, we figure that outtogether.
SPEAKER_00 (38:42):
No, that's good though.
I think boundaries is importantbecause we just don't want to
burn ourselves, like like yourun yourself ragged because you
said yes to everything, right?
And so teaching them boundariestoo, that's so important.
I like that.
I like the two days, the twodays off.
I wish I wish sometimes I hadthose days.
You know what I mean?
Because sometimes we do need amental break.
(39:02):
You do, like, you know, becauseit's a different time now.
Like we're we're spending moretime on technology, on
everything.
It's you have to like turn itoff.
SPEAKER_01 (39:11):
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
My daughter was in fourth grade,she's 10.
She so she's in fifth grade now,she'd be 11 this fall.
She woke up one morning, she'sjust like, I I just can't.
She's having a rough time withsome social stuff.
And she's like, I don't think Ican I don't I I feel fine, I
just don't think I can go toschool today.
Uh like, can I stay home?
And I mean, you know, the lookin her face was one like she was
(39:33):
shooting her shot.
She was pretty sure I was gonnabe like, put your uniform on,
you're letting you get out thisdoor.
And I I thought about my day andI was like, Yeah, yeah, you can
stay home.
And she's just immediately like,Are you kidding me right now?
I'm like, no, it's fine.
Sometimes you just can't.
That's okay.
I'll you we can do this, youknow, a couple times a year.
Uh you gotta take it seriously.
But, you know, w if you if youreally need it, you can stay
home and you can refresh andyou'll you'll have some work to
(39:55):
do.
It's not just watch TV all day.
But if you need to re-ret re-rest and recharge, you know, you
need to honor that.
You need to honor your body andyour mind, and we'll start again
tomorrow.
SPEAKER_00 (40:03):
Oh my gosh, that's amazing.
I think I think that's amazingthat you like people instill
that in your family.
I that's the first time I'veheard that.
And so um kudos to you, mom.
I think that's awesome.
I just feel I felt that there.
You know what?
Even when you said it, like itfelt like you were talking to
your daughter, and so it's soimportant.
Like, I think being the personthat you want them to be and to
(40:24):
be understanding because I meanlike she'll remember that, you
know, maybe an issue.
SPEAKER_01 (40:29):
Right.
Well, and also like learning, Idon't feel like if but speaking
of being in 40s, I don't feellike I learned to trust myself
until I was in my forties.
And I was always looking forexternal validation of like, you
know, whether it was like whatto put in my body from a diet
perspective, what wascomfortable for me with like
men, what what I needed to sayyes to or no to in a business
context.
(40:50):
Like I would always, you know, Iused got so used to s to
quieting my intuition and youknow, that other people were the
expert in me.
And so I'm trying to teach mychildren to be the experts in
them and to listen to their ownintuition and in in all facets
and hopefully learning that morequickly than I did.
SPEAKER_00 (41:10):
Yeah, I wish I I I can say the same thing because
you know what?
Like you you talk about thatjob.
Um I had a job too, and um well,I still I still work now, but
like this other job I wasworking, it was such a toxic
environment.
And I tried to organize thechaos, but you can't always
organize chaos.
And I think I like you saidsometimes the warning signs are
(41:34):
there and you're ignoring them.
Like we're so intuitive aswomen.
So I'm like that week before ithad before I got laid off, like
my manager was so like distant.
And I, if anything, if if I hadjust narrowed in on that, I
would have known.
Like, you know what I mean?
Like sometimes we ignore thethings that are right in our
face.
And I I remember like even inanother job before, I had to
(41:56):
pick up anything.
And I and I said it to mycoworker, I'm like, they're
gonna do something, something'shappening, and it happened.
So, like, yeah, don't ignore thesigns, like you know what I
mean, and and like getting backto you, like um and your
daughter, and and just needingthe the time.
Like sometimes we just need amental break from everything
because it's it's you come inbetter the next day.
(42:18):
You know what I mean?
Like every day's a good day, andyeah, so we like to love it,
yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (42:23):
Yeah, there's um a podcaster and author, um,
happiness expert, GretchenRubin.
Um, one of her rules is, youknow, to um to ask more from
yourself, you must giveyourself, or maybe or to I'm
sure I'm messing that up, butbut the I keep that in mind, you
know, like I can't I can't askof myself anymore if if I if my
cup is empty, you know, I needto rest and recharge, and you
(42:44):
know, there's a law ofdiminishing returns if you just
keep pushing through.
SPEAKER_00 (42:48):
Yeah, yeah.
You know what?
Like it's it's kind of the thewhole thing where you're you're
trying to make yourself better,but the environment that you're
in is is is taking that away,then that's not a good thing
either, right?
And so it goes full circle, butI am so glad we got to talk.
This has been amazing, and I I Ihope we can talk again soon
(43:10):
because you are a world ofknowledge, right?
And and for sure, all the way inTexas, right?
You know, it's amazing what youdo.
And say again for me, like so.
If anyone wants to check outyour website, it's qrnco.com.
Yeah, I can check it out myself.
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (43:30):
Yeah, just queid our co the and is dropped from the
URL.
So quedarco.com, that's what weare on Instagram, LinkedIn, all
the places, and then LaurenQueedar Cockerell on LinkedIn.
So if you want to slide in myDMs, you may that's amazing.
SPEAKER_00 (43:45):
Uh Carlene, if this is Diva Tonight with Lauren
Cocker, if this episoderesonates, you can send us a
text on the show.
Thank you so much again.
I appreciate your hat.
Thank you, Carlene.
SPEAKER_02 (43:56):
Diva Tonight with Carlene will be back.
Send us a message on Instagramat Diva underscore tonight.
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