Can Energy Medicine Actually Heal You? The Evidence Problem | Everything's Energy Ep-44 - EEShow (Everything's Energy Show)

Episode Transcript
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Roland (00:00):
I can only imagine the challenges that you've had with

(00:02):
people trying to tell you all ofthe things about things that
there's no diagnostics that cango, this is doing exactly this
in the body. And that's the hardpart about energy medicine as a
field. There are people who tryto capitalize upon things. They
wanna hustle a buck. They wannamake a device to jump on a
bandwagon.
But not only are they notactually doing something
beneficial, potentiallyknowingly, they don't even

(00:22):
understand what they're actuallytrying to do because how would
you define energy medicineknowing all that you've known?
Like, how do you even relatethat to someone who has no idea
what they're talking about?Michael Scalar.

Michael (00:34):
Hello. You're on you're on

Roland (00:35):
the other side of the table today.

Michael (00:37):
Students stole my chair. I guess I'm being
interviewed now.

Roland (00:39):
I I think The tables have turned. The tables stayed
the same. I think we just turnedaround where you are. Yeah. It's
it's interesting becausenormally, you're asking the
questions as the main host ofthe show, but you really are the
man behind the scenes oftentimeswhen it comes to how you operate
the business, how you your life.
And I thought, well, you're aninteresting individual. You're a

(01:01):
modern day polymath. And peopleshould know more about you in
that context because you have alot to share with the world. So
I thought, let's ask you somequestions, and you obliged. I
didn't have to trick you to getyou here.

Michael (01:12):
No. It's funny. One of the one of the co owners of the
studio here was like, I tried tofind out stuff about you online.
I couldn't find anything. I'mlike, well, for a long time, was
kind of by on purpose.
Because I'd I'd I don't yearn tobe famous like a lot of people,
especially in in this industryor in general. And that that
stems from years of being amusician and a DJ. I would go
out and people would run up onme and I have no idea who they

(01:32):
are and I get super anxiousbecause everyone knew who I was
and I didn't know who anyonewas. And I was like, they're
running up like, my god, I knowyou. And I'm like, when someone
does that normally, you're like,oh, well, I know you as well or
have some reference, and it justit gave me tons of anxiety.
And so when I stopped being aDJ, a music producer, my anxiety
went to zero. I was like, I haveno anxiety anymore. This is such

(01:54):
a trip. And I I backtracked. I'mlike, it was because I'm an
introvert, and everyone wastrying to come up to me and get
to know me and I just kind ofmade me like on stage, I was
calm as a cucumber peace,playing music, no one's talking
to me, I'm just focused.
It was amazing. But then offstage, it was, oh my god. You're
famous, and I I follow you onFacebook. And, my god. It's so

(02:17):
good to I know you.
And we met once, and we werereally drunk. And I was like,
okay. What's going on?

Roland (02:23):
You do a hysterical fan impression really good. I'm I'm
believing this story. Yeah.Happened a lot.

Michael (02:28):
And people come up on, like, lots of drugs and stuff
too. It'll make me more anxiousbecause they're like big bulging
eyes like, and now you're justlike, okay. Alright. An alien
just walked up.

Roland (02:39):
Oh. You're trying to human. You don't quite get it.

Michael (02:41):
Yeah.

Roland (02:42):
So was it a the inauthenticity of you not being
able to meet them as they weremeeting you? I know you. I know
stuff about you. What did thatmake you feel uncomfortable when
you were a professional musicianand a DJ?

Michael (02:54):
Well, just didn't know if I actually did know that I
met them because I meet so manypeople. So I would feel really
inauthentic in my soul because Ifelt bad. I'm like, I should
know this person because theyapparently know me. So it just
kinda ground on me. I didn'thave that nonchalantness where I
could just be like, oh yeah, heyfan, like cool.
Yeah bro, you want me to signyour boob? Whatever.

Roland (03:15):
Would you sign mine after the show?

Michael (03:16):
I'll sign your boob. Yeah. It it was just it was a
weird feeling and I'm superintrovert. So in crowds of
people, I kinda shut off. And sothen you have people on drugs
running up and be like, ah.
I was like, okay. I need to gofind a corner.

Roland (03:31):
It's an interesting premise when you have things
that other people haven't,right? Because we're talking
about your time as a DJ, whichyou were an internationally
renowned DJ for how many years?

Michael (03:41):
I started DJing when I was 16 and producing music just
a year or two after that, divinginto that, learning how to work
synthesizers, hardware at thetime, and then the software. And
I think I stopped around age 37.I'm about to turn 43, like
officially stopped, 37, 36,something like that. Mhmm. And I
played a few gigs after that,just yeah.

(04:01):
And I honestly, I'll probablyplay a few more gigs, I just
don't have the time for it. Butyeah, I've been the furthest
place I got booked was likeMykonos, Greece, which was
amazing. Not the best gig. Myfavorite parties were obviously
Burning Man. Super amazingproduction out there with lots
of people really really high ondrugs, they dance And extra
extra

Roland (04:23):
what would you say you learned most about yourself and
about life from being a DJ thatyou carry with you today or
maybe you transfer to what youdo now?

Michael (04:31):
More of it came probably from event production
because I threw parties as welland managing expectations,
especially really entitledpeople who tend to just self
indulge. Managing thoseexpectations, the team's
expectations, volunteers'expectations. The production
side of load in, load out, itgave me a lot of insight into

(04:52):
you need redundancy oneverything, and you need a good
team, and you need clearcommunication, and even clearer
communication with people whoare in the party scene because
you'll literally tell them x yz, and they'll hear a b c, which
was really weird. So a lot of mylife skills I feel that I pulled
into business came from eventproduction. On the music side,

(05:14):
it was more the scientificunderstanding of how frequency
energy and vibration or energywellness.
I got more of a synesthesia, howyou see sound in seeing science.
Because people go, well, what'sthat frequency? But they don't
know what the frequency is. It'sjust a term that they've heard
enough that they think that'sthey sound smart when they say
that frequency of five two eightor whatever. It's like, well,

(05:35):
what is that?
There's long long frequency andshort frequency, long being like
your low hertz, and it's a widelong wave pattern. And then your
short is literally just squigglylines really on on a screen. So
when you start to see how thesethings function and the the way
that speakers process sound andthe way you can compress and
manipulate audio in differentways, it gave me a a visual

(05:56):
understanding more of, Scalarenergy. Honestly, the the
easiest way for Scalar to beunderstood is with phase
conjugate way pairing is if youpay put two subs facing each
other, the and and at the exactsame outputs, they cancel each
other out. You won't hear thesubs pass the subs.

(06:17):
It's a really interestingphenomenon.

Roland (06:19):
The collision of the sound frequency essentially
nullify the effects of both of

Michael (06:23):
them. Right.

Roland (06:24):
Right. Beyond the containment of where they're
Right.

Michael (06:26):
So they say energy can't be created or destroyed,
but it can be transformed ortransformed, reshaped. What is
it? What's another good word forthat? Like Transmuted?
Transmuted.
Transmuted. Yeah. That's theword I was really looking for.
So when you understand that youcan sit there and you can hear
the sub coming out and when youmove, it's actually gone or is

(06:47):
it gone or is it's it's beenchanged into something. Mhmm.
It's really fascinating withthat. And then you can actually
flip subs to face backwards andforwards and change the
polarity. And it literally italmost looks like a torus when
you actually look at the forms.It shapes the audio from the
back to the front. So the subact again, the sub frequencies
aren't going in the back way.

(07:07):
They're all going forward. Soit's again, reshaping the way
audio moves. And I learned a lotfrom I got really, really
passionate about speakers afterhearing a bunch of really good
speakers like Function one,TurboSound. Was like, oh my god.
This is audio.
And so I went out and I boughtsome speakers, scrubbed forums
for months, just readeverything, learned everything.

(07:27):
You learn about resistance andohms and all these different
ways you can deploy speakers andthe timing. So most people don't
realize this, but you have ahigh frequency, mid frequency,
low frequency, and thentypically a mid low frequency in
a good system. The timing is isreally crucial. So they all need
to reach the, say, your thehuman ear at the same time.
And no one ever really thinksabout it. So, like, you put a
sub in the middle of the roomand your highs and mids are 10

(07:50):
feet away. The sound isn'tsynced up and untrained ear
doesn't hear that. But this iswhere you get this the weird
effects of it doesn't quitesound right or it's, you know,
there's a bunch of

Roland (07:59):
different Like a distortion maybe or

Michael (08:01):
It's not really distortion. It's it's you're out
of sync. Okay. So you want allof them to reach the ear at the
same all these frequency rangesto reach the ear at the same
time. So speaker placement andthen signal processing.
So signal processing is reallyfascinating too because you can
isolate which frequencies arecoming out of each speaker. So
your low frequencies areobviously gonna come out of your
sub, but just your 30 hertz to a150 hertz, and then it goes up

(08:22):
there from there. And what whathappens is the speaker is
driving these frequencies asspecific. So separation of
sound, but when they reach you,it's all together. So most subs
are actually only made tosupport those frequencies.
Most highs are only you can'tput a sub frequency through a
high frequency driver. That'swhat's called a high frequency
driver. So it became reallyfascinating. Learning the

(08:44):
different ways you could placespeakers to get an optimal sound
range, I just completely nerdedout on it and ended up getting
my final training with one ofthe top funk function one
installers. And then I was like,okay, I know everything.
I literally have this old turbosound system set up in a
warehouse one night. This guygoes, I just went and toured all
these these sound systems inChicago at the biggest

(09:05):
nightclubs. How does your soundsystem sound better? I'm like,
well, I just really know thescience of sound. It doesn't
matter if the speakers are onething, but the science of sound
is a whole another thing.
From the amps to the processing,to the placement, there's a
whole science to the way audiois conveyed to a crowd,
especially a crowd, becauseyou're dealing with extremely
loud speakers.

Roland (09:25):
And it sounds like what you're after there is coherence
among the frequencies tooptimize the experience of what
the person hears.

Michael (09:32):
Right? You wanna feel everything

Roland (09:34):
Yeah.

Michael (09:34):
And hear everything, but not be bombarded by it. And
that's the biggest problem yougo to a concert nowadays is
you're you literally needearplugs. It hurts. It hurt it
literally physically hurts someof these sound systems, and
you're just like, oh, it soundsso loud. And people are like,
oh, it sounds it's it's it's soloud.
Like, yeah, but it doesn't soundgood. People literally be, like,
excited that it sounds loud. Andnightclub owners will be like,
turn it up. It needs to belouder. It's like, no.

(09:56):
It was fine how it was. Youdon't need it louder. Trust me.
But there's like, no. Louder isbetter.

Roland (10:01):
Well, there's so much that's going on with the body
that is interacting with thosefrequencies because it can
actually stress the nervoussystem out. Mhmm. A certain
amount of frequency in decibels,not good for the ear. Beyond one
twenty, one thirty, that'shearing loss of high from my
understanding, you lose the highpitch frequencies first, then
you start to lose everythingover time.

Michael (10:19):
Yeah. And being in that industry, I I wasn't good at
sticking stuff in my ears. Allof my DJ friends have hearing
problems. What? Yeah.
Exactly. No. They have tinnitus.They have really bad ringing.
They're like, you don't havethat?
I'm like, no. By some miracle,the only thing I can think of is
the EE system.

Roland (10:34):
Honestly, helps. Yeah. It helps.

Michael (10:35):
The only thing I I'm like, the only thing I did that
you guys didn't do was energywellness at EE system because
we've obviously noticed a lot ofpeople with tinnitus having
positive results. But yeah. Imean, audio was fun. And then,
you know, commanding dancefloors as a DJ was a lot of fun.
And there wasn't a whole lot oflife lessons in that.
It being a musician's fun. Butthe touring sucks. I hated

(10:59):
touring. And travel traveling asboth an EE system person and a
DJ person is like being in ahotel room by yourself sucks.

Roland (11:06):
Or you're just on the road perpetually.

Michael (11:08):
Yeah. It's it's it drags on. There's no, like, rest
or relaxation when you'retouring. So I I yeah. See these
touring artists, I'm like, ohman, these guys must be
miserable.
Their social media is like, ohyeah, I'm playing this gig. It's
so exciting. That's, you know,the the Fabrication. Two hours
of the day they're excited. Andthat's why a lot of them switch
to drugs and alcohol and havedepression and different mental

(11:28):
issues is because they'reportraying this happiness and
this dopamine rush constantly,but most of the day they're just
on a plane rushing to a hotelroom or an airplane or to shower
before a gig.
People are constantly trying toyou know put drugs in in your
mouth or up your nose, whichagain was one of the things I
enjoyed coming out of the scene.Was like, the amount of times I

(11:49):
turn around and someone's tryingto stick stuff up my nose is
like, calm down everyone.

Roland (11:53):
Forcibly against your will without asking for this?

Michael (11:55):
Well, you I don't know what happened. No. But it was
constantly there and, you know,I I I definitely did drugs at
many points in my life and quitjust as many points as every
time I did

Roland (12:06):
Mhmm.

Michael (12:06):
Cocaine. I'm like, I'm never doing this again. Of
course, that happened more thanonce. But it's a terrible drug.
I don't understand why it's sopopular.
I keep talking, the only thingcocaine is good for is snapping
you out of being blackout drunk.Past that, it's just a really
bad hangover.

Roland (12:18):
Well, it's not too dissimilar to why people
doomscroll. Right? You'replaying with dopamine. That's
what cocaine really does. Itfloods the brain with dopamine.
And I don't think anyone does itbelieving it's gonna move the
needle forward, let's say, likea psychedelic experience will.

Michael (12:33):
Right.

Roland (12:33):
But there's such an addictive property to dopamine
in the brain that once it's low,you'll do anything to get it
back.

Michael (12:40):
That that's probably part of it.

Roland (12:41):
Physiologic thing. And, you know, people associate
things with unconsciousassociations with events. Like,
oh, we used to do this together,and this makes it better. I
think it's a fallacy of

Michael (12:52):
It's a it's a weird social drug. It's just
everywhere, and people are, Ithink Hollywood probably made
it, you know, more popular thanit should be. It's just
everywhere in the nightnightlife scene. So it was a
really nice getting away fromthat from the music scene. But,
know, from 16 on, I was bothlearning to DJ and going through
that and helping my mom run EEsystem, which became more

(13:13):
prevalent, know, early twentieswhere I really took control of
managing EE system more.
Mhmm. Obviously, growing up withher was fascinating because
she's just a fascinating person.You know, grew up with her
teaching people hands on energyhealing on the nude black sand
beaches of Hawaii. It was partof her process is, you know,

(13:34):
shed your clothing and goswimming Shed

Roland (13:35):
ego and get out of the earth.

Michael (13:37):
Yeah. So it was like around a bunch of crazy naked
people as a kid. It was kind offun. Not really knowing what
that was when I was a kid, butgrowing up I'm like, oh, man.

Roland (13:45):
It's called normal to you.

Michael (13:46):
Right? Yeah. It was well, it's Hawaii. We were in
Puna or Hilo side of Hawaii andsuper hippie culture over there.
So everyone's just kind of freelove, free world.
Yeah. But the beaches werebeautiful and it was
interesting, you know, watchingpeople release their trauma. It
sounded like, you know, murderis happening when she's doing
hands on body work for people.So they're like literally

(14:07):
learning from her how totraverse the body itself. Yeah.
Yeah.

Roland (14:12):
I'm really hoping that she will continue to pass some
of that stuff on becauseeveryone knows her for creating
the tech, but she has so muchmore in her arsenal just than
simply creating the tech.

Michael (14:24):
No. Her her history is she knows the human body in and
out. Energetically, physically,spiritually. That's that's her
passion was the human bodygrowing up and obviously evolved
in the EE system which, know,her whole mission was, well, I
can only touch one person at atime and I can only train so
many people. How do we get thisto this this energy wellness
concept to the world?
Obviously, you need technologyto modernize it.

Roland (14:46):
Did you always know that you wanted to get into the
health energy space as yourmission here? Because, you know,
you said DJing is fun, and Ilistened to what you were
saying. And the thing that cameto me was you learn the science
of music through math and andfrequencies. And we'll get into
a little bit more because youknow math, you know finance
really well. But you saw theeffect of frequency on people

(15:06):
when you're playing music.
Right? Yeah. Like, what did yousee there? Because I wanna get
another question of how you'remerging these two. When you
would play music for people, didyou notice that behaviors would
be massively influencedinstantaneously?
Did you notice people's liveswould get better? Did you use
specific frequencies on peopletrying to get an outcome that
was beneficial?

Michael (15:26):
Well, let's talk about this frequency specific concept
in wellness to start. First off,there is no singular frequency
really of anything. So they say,you know, frequency of love,
whatever.

Roland (15:39):
Five two eight, four three two, the little sine wave
generator things.

Michael (15:43):
I absolutely hate that because let's talk about love.
Okay. Does love feel like asingularity? No. It feels like a
sea of emotion and feeling.
Cannot be a single linear

Roland (15:56):
Between two, three numbers

Michael (15:57):
that are hertzeeing, yeah. It cannot. And so that
drives me nuts when people dothis frequency specific stuff.
Is there some benefit? Possibly.
Is that a good definition? Ithink that's terrible. Like
reading the world's best book orseeing the best movie, and
someone says, I want you toexplain in detail what you just
felt or saw, and you just say,good.

Roland (16:20):
That's a great way of relating it.

Michael (16:22):
Yeah. It's just so linear. So simple overly
simplistic. So did I free playspecific frequencies? Absolutely
not.
Years of listening to music, Ias a musician, wanted my goal
was to make people dance. Itwasn't to make them have an
emotional release on the dancefloor even though that could
happen through moving body, youknow. There's there's actually a

(16:45):
really fascinating thing. Thevagus nerve stimulation on with
electronic music is they'recoming out with these big
speakers are actuallystimulating the vagus nerve and
helping people stay younger. SoI was like, oh, that's
fascinating.
Because if you stay in the partyscene and you don't get dragged
down with drugs and alcohol toobad, you almost like don't age.
It's

Roland (17:04):
also for a living. There's something about doing
something fun that you're sopassionate about if you can find

Michael (17:09):
Well, no. No. No. Just about in general in the crowd.
Oh, you're There's an anti agingeffect to the physio physical
sound waves coming through loudPA speakers are stimulating the
vagus nerve, which is reallyfascinating.

Roland (17:19):
Regardless of the music being played.

Michael (17:21):
Well, I'm sure there's, you know, okay. So we'll go back
to the frequency side. So thebeats per minute, or how fast
the music is being played, Ithink correlates significantly
to good and bad music on thehealth spectrum. I don't think
we usually go above a 132 beatsper minute for most genres. I
think the sweet spot isdepending on the time and what's

(17:41):
going on, anywhere from onetwenty to one twenty eight.
Those are the that's typicallythe range I would play in, and
it would it would change basedoff of the song and the
atmosphere. So you've reallybecome an empath and intuitive
with a dance floor too, becauseyou're watching people's
movement, you're you know,seeing where they're feeling. So
you really have to pay attentionto what's going on in front of

(18:03):
you because a lot of DJs willjust put their eyes down and
play your set. And some they getaway with that. Most of them
just because they have a bigname.
They can play whatever.Everyone's super shit faced. I
always I wasn't a huge name DJmost of my life, I had to like
fine tune and like, alright, I'mgonna grab that person and grab
that person with this song andthat person that try and hook
them in. But for me, it wasresonance. And I figured out

(18:24):
listening to music, there weresongs that sounded good.
And then I use this term, songsthat had booty. Booty. Booty.
That's just a term I came upwith. It had booty.
And the booty was a song thatmade you shake your like wiggle
your butt a little. That's wherethe booty Okay. Yeah. Because
there's lots of songs that soundgood, but good luck dancing to
them. Mhmm.
Then there's the booty track.It's typically got the

(18:45):
percussion. It's got these weirdlittle hooks where you you just
got sucked into wanting todance.

Roland (18:50):
You just

Michael (18:50):
have to move. So I always figured out these songs
that had booty in them. And thenI also I always considered the
conscious side of the music. Soyou I wasn't playing things that
had negative context Mhmm. Whichwas really easy in electronic
music, because most of it wasvery positively intended.
But then I would also I was wellknown for pulling in Middle
Eastern melodies. I thought theyhad a lot of resonance that
brought in that tribalism ofdancing in the desert Mhmm. And

(19:13):
out in nature kind of thing. Andmost of my places I was playing
were actually outdoor events. SoI tried to find organic sounds
with the electronic sounds thatwere symbiotic and certain
vocals that would kinda give youa head rush.
So, like, sometimes people wouldbe like, man, like, your music
act it's like being on drugswithout being on drugs. And I'm
like, it's kinda the point.Like, trying to make you give

(19:35):
you a rush, like a feeling. Sothere was a lot it was a lot of
it was resonance and feeling.That's that's how I I kind of
translated what, like, what Iwas gonna play.

Roland (19:44):
And and if you extrapolate that and look at it
through a lens of health, youwere trying to help people
experience these things withoutthe detriments of putting things
in But their also you're tryingto touch into their souls a
little bit. And I'll explainwhat I mean. We live in our
heads in the Western world somuch, everything's a thought

(20:05):
process and the mind justconstantly runs. And I think
people have a hard time feelingtheir bodies. They have a hard
time getting in touch with bodyconsciousness

Michael (20:12):
They and self have a time getting out

Roland (20:14):
of

Michael (20:14):
their head.

Roland (20:15):
Yeah. Yeah. Which is an inverse way of saying, yeah.
They don't get into their bodiesvery often. And if you can teach
people to do that throughwhatever catalyst, you know,
your mom was doing it throughhands on healing, your medium
was music.

Michael (20:28):
Yeah.

Roland (20:28):
You were helping people in that. And I think it's having
heard that story, I understandhow music connects you to the EE
system now in terms of thecapacity of carryover.

Michael (20:39):
Yeah. Yeah.

Roland (20:40):
If that makes sense.

Michael (20:40):
Yeah. No. It's funny too because I was always an
artist as a kid, drawing,painting. I liked creating art.
And then I found music.
Ended up buying a pair ofturntables off this buddy of
mine for like $50. He was aboutready to throw him away. And
then I started buying vinyl andplaying and I was like, it was
just such a good feeling controland manipulate music, and which
just evolved more and more musicproduction. There you know,

(21:02):
there's no doubt that anyone onthis planet can say that music
isn't important to them. Becauseyou the first thing you do, you
get in your car, is you don'twant silence, typically.
You wanna hear something. And alot of people will go to music
from their childhood or they'llhave these ranges of music that
brought happiness to them orthey'll want something new to
try and find a new likesensation. Music is very much a
drug. Mhmm. It's and it'sfrequency, energy, and

(21:24):
vibration.
It is. It's everything you'regetting. Sound healing is a
thing. A lot of people poo pooit. But when you are super upset
and you listen to some angrymusic, all of a sudden, it's
like therapy for some people.
I had that when I was younger.Was I listened like Lincoln Park
or something when I was upset,I'd be like, strangely, I feel
better. Dance music is that getyou out of your head, start
moving your body, flow kind flowstate. Like, when you're

(21:46):
dancing, you're not thinkingabout what's wrong in the world.
You're just enjoying being therein the moment, which was one of
the prettiest things about thedance scene was just watching
people let go.
So much so that some peoplewould get naked on the dance
floor, which was alwaysentertaining.

Roland (22:00):
Brings you back to the beaches Of Hawaii. See how
things come full circle.

Michael (22:04):
I've had a few different times where I'm like
DJing. Oh, they took off theirshirt. Okay. It's always a guy,
strangely. And right in front ofme, this happened, like, four or
five times.
I I shit you not. I'm like, I'mmixing music. I'm like, oh, god.
Took a shirt off. Yeah.
It's warm out, whatever. Andthen the next thing, pants are
off. He's wearing underwear.Okay. Butt naked.
Alright. We got a butt naked guyon the dance floor.

Roland (22:25):
The only other time you can get that experience probably
even cheaper is go to a changeroom at a fitness facility, and
they're usually 65 plus, andthey're just happily walking
around naked all the time.

Michael (22:35):
No, mean you see some topless girls every once in a
while shaking their their bootybut those are the fun thing
about playing the undergroundlike rave scene is it was kind
of a no holds barred like clubscenes. It's not really about a
vibe, it's about a ego. So Ialways enjoy the rave culture
because you go to a club andit's people trying to seem self
important. They're taking photosor Mhmm. There's like, hey,

(22:55):
we're cool and we're out andwe're doing loads of cocaine and
we have bottle service.
The rave scene was, you know,less bottle service if any. More
of just a culture of peoplelike, we're gonna go out and
we're gonna dance. There's noand then you go to these the
Vegas nightclubs, the dancefloor is like this big. It's a
little square in the middlesurrounded by tables and, you
know, people are dancing at thetables. There's no community in

(23:15):
underground rave scenes.
You have a thousand people justraging on one giant big dance
floor. These smaller ones,couple 100 people. But it's it's
a beautiful thing to watch.There's there's a a
synchronicity that occurs with alot of humans when they're all
dancing the same beat, which Ifind fascinating because they're
all moving to one beat in unity.It it's a replication of that
old tribalism of the tribesdancing around the fire to the

(23:37):
same percussion.
The oppressionists arepercussioning and they're
dancing while they're they'redoing that. Yeah. Everyone else
is dancing around them. It's acommunity oneness event. You
really only get that in the raveculture.

Roland (23:48):
That's so interesting because as you were talking
about that, that word was comingthrough to me. There's there's
like a tribalism about whatyou're doing. And personally
speaking, I've never been drawnbecause I'm like you, I'm quite
introverted. Big crowds ofpeople are kinda like Yeah. But
I've never looked at it in theway that you just proposed it.
And it's really about creatingcoherence momentarily because

(24:10):
the beat is underpinning thebehavior, so to speak. And then
all of a sudden everyone becomesone temporarily in that moment
of everyone swaying to themusic. And it's interesting that
you say one twenty five to onetwenty eight. Was that the
range?

Michael (24:24):
One twenty to one twenty eight. But, yeah, it was,
like, dependent on the time ofthe day and warm up.

Roland (24:29):
What's interesting, and this is just tangential, but you
might find it interesting.That's the rough heart rate
range where they found that thegreatest cardiovascular benefits
from exercise are for theaverage person because they do
about 60 to 70% of their maxheart rate. If you can stay
there, it improves circulation,cardiovascular health,

Michael (24:49):
stroke volume.

Roland (24:51):
So it's just so interesting how math comes back
to it all. Like there's numbers.And when people listen to music,
they're not just hearing themusic. They're imbibing the
music. Like it's hitting everycell in the body.
It's structuring the waterinside of them. It's influencing
the nervous systemcommunication, the regulation of
the vagal tone, as you said.Mhmm. So it's just a different

(25:14):
form of energy healing. I'mseeing how it all connects into
you now running the companyitself, like running the EE
system.
Has that been an easy transitionfor you? Do you find that it's
so different that you felt alittle bit out of your depth, or
did it feel like I've done whatI needed to do in music, I'm
ready to actually grow myself inmore of a left brain way, but

(25:35):
still doing something thatconnects to my mission.

Michael (25:38):
Well, being a musician is a young person thing too. So
you have lots of energy and freemore free time. Mhmm. And I was
kinda on the way out before Imet my ex girlfriend. She's a
violinist.
And I was kinda like, I don'tknow if I still wanna do this.
It's, you know, I'm getting tooold for this kinda And then we
we did that. And once we brokeup, both as a boyfriend
girlfriend and a musician, Ikinda was like, you know what? I

(26:00):
think I am done now. But that'salso as the EE system started to
get really busy.
And during our relationship, itkinda wore on us because I had
work to do, and she wanted to domore music stuff. And I was just
like, I I literally have a realjob. Not to say musician is a
real job, but it's not a verywell paying job. It's it's a
passion project, for mostmusicians. Most musicians don't

(26:21):
make a lot of money.
But I had a mission that Isubscribed to with my mother.
It's like when I grew up, I wasnext to her, I agreed to pretty
much help her on a soul contractkind of way. From very young
age, I told her I'm here toprotect you, like, you know,
like five or six. We joke aboutthat story sometimes, and that's
all that's basically I'm here toprotect her and her mission. And

(26:42):
so she obviously comes first.
And the EE system is a hugeglobal project that is very
important to a lot of peoplefrom my perspective and a lot of
people would probably say thatas well. So transitioning from
music, it was a great learningexperience, a great fun
experience. It felt really good.And do I miss it sometimes? A
little.
But it takes a lot of time andenergy to be a well practiced

(27:04):
musician. Like, even as a DJ,you have to know all your music.
There's a lot of to do, a lot ofpractice. And yes, I could get
back on that bike and startriding it, so to speak. But I
don't have the time right now.
There's so many other thingsgoing on that probably help
humanity more. And there's somany DJs out there. Some of them
are very amazing. So I can't saythat we're at lacking good
artists. So I'm filling the gapthat I need to fill, which is

(27:26):
run this company.
And

Roland (27:29):
it's when people hear family business and they think
second generation or whatever,it's like, you just moseyed on
in to a place of high rankingwithin a company, but you didn't
do that. You have literally doneall the installs. You've been on
the road. You know every singleinch of the business. Like what
was it like growing up insomething that nobody
understood?

Michael (27:50):
Well, it's a fun fun story. So I was living with my
father and my mom had moved toColorado. I was still with him
in Hawaii. That ended and Imoved back to my mother's. And
I'd seen her developing thetechnology through younger years
in small ways.
The first big actually fullybuilt system was when I actually
moved back around the age 16,fifteen sixteen to Colorado. And

(28:12):
I remember walking into thisroom and you know, it's a bunch
of broken computer screens andI'm just like, alright mom, what
are you doing? And you know, Iprobably thought she was crazy
at the time. I was like, yep.There's my mom doing weird weird
blonde lady stuff again.
And but then, you know, peoplewould come in and they'd have
these miraculous experiences andbe like, oh my god. And, you

(28:34):
know, this this isgroundbreaking and people would
wanna do some research. Andslowly, I went from a crazy
concept to, okay, we havesomething here that she's doing
and it's fascinating. And, youknow, it's it it took a lot of
years for the general public tothink of it as a non woo woo
thing. And it was a slow, slow,slow, slow process.

(28:57):
Mhmm. Because anyway even now,people look at oh, you go, it
must be a placebo, whatever,which we've validated. It's not
a placebo. But doing research,running, starting a tech company
on a shoestring budget with afamily, that's groundbreaking to
the point of where it's toocrazy to be real, and then it
moves to, I can't believe thisis real. And then, oh my god,

(29:18):
this is real to a lot of people.
To, you know, there's obviouslya bunch of naysayers out there
that will still stick to, I'mjust gonna go to a doctor and
get pills and energy medicineand wellness is is all foo foo,
color therapy is fake. Howeveryou want to deploy the the that
that left brain thinking.

Roland (29:35):
Yeah. Things that I can't measure can't be real, so
therefore I don't ascribe tothem being anything.

Michael (29:40):
Yeah. And you ask that same person to describe
anything. How you're how doesyour phone receive single? And
be like, the WiFi tower, howdoes that work? None of these
people know how anything works,but they're quick to say that
doesn't work.
Mhmm. It's fascinating. Thelight bulb's the best analogy of
that. It's like, well, how doyou know that light bulb's
working? Well, there's light.
Exactly. But how does thescience work? Oh, I I

(30:02):
Electricity. Well, how doeselectricity It's, you know, it's
it's fun fun fun to throw thesethings out because people think
they're so smart. But mostpeople these days are so
conveniently ignorant toeverything that exists, but they
know to shove food in theirmouth, consume TV and media, and
go do whatever the the Matrixsays to do, but then, you know,

(30:23):
you provide an original thoughtand they they fight the original
thought because it's unique it'stoo unique.
It doesn't fit the box. Oh mygod.

Roland (30:32):
People tend to not like to feel that they're out of
their depth with things.

Michael (30:37):
Mhmm.

Roland (30:37):
And in modern society, everyone has an opinion. And I
don't think people know how todisseminate opinion and fact.
And when you ask them aboutfacts and they can't answer and
that challenges them, they getemotional.

Michael (30:50):
They do.

Roland (30:50):
And they wanna fight for their position. And I can only
imagine the challenges thatyou've had with people trying to
tell you all of the things aboutthings that I mean, there's no
diagnostics that can go, this isdoing exactly this in the body.
And that's the hard part aboutenergy medicine as a field.
There are people who try tocapitalize upon things. They

(31:11):
want to hustle a buck.
They want to make a device tojump on a bandwagon. But not
only are they not actually doingsomething beneficial,
potentially knowingly, theydon't even understand what
they're actually trying to do.Because how would you define
energy medicine knowing all thatyou've known? Like, how do you
even relate that to someone whohas no idea what they're talking
about?

Michael (31:29):
You know, it it takes a lot of patience to understand
things. What you're saying ofpeople kind of being quick to
judge, and and how do how wouldI combat that or just absorb
that. It's it's really justpatience. Mhmm. Because you have
to, instead of arguing withthem, you you just kinda engage
with them and have aconversation.
And you try not to press toomany buttons where they freak

(31:49):
out and run away or argue withyou harder. But energy wellness
is a by the fruits you know kindof industry. So at first, you're
you're looking at testimonials.It's it's your let your your
lettuce study where you'reshowing that the lettuce grew
faster kind of thing. So it'svisual.
Is is there science to lettucegrowing faster? I mean, it's

(32:10):
arguable. It's like, it grewfaster.

Roland (32:11):
It's an anagogical thing.

Michael (32:13):
Yeah. So but you you're seeing when you see a long
succession of this is doing theright thing. Our industry is
full of copycats and snake oil.I've had a lot of people say, in
an industry 95% saturated withsnake oil, you're in the 5%,
which is rare. And, you know,the only way we really can
combat that is holding a higherstandard of truth and met

(32:33):
meteorology or metrics.
Obviously, we have decades ofthat, and most people ignore the
fact that our research page has,like, 30 white papers on it.
They, well, you guys need morestudies. It's like, did you read
the other studies before you askfor we're in the middle of doing
a placebo double blind study,which is great because it's like
the last tick box of nonsensefor and people will still argue,

(32:56):
I'm sure. But there's there'smeteorology. So you have a lot
of people I mean, the amount oftimes I've gone out and people
handed me my my own research andmarketing material to sell
something that's Scalar, it'sit's unfathomable.
People steal all of ourverbiage, which you know, it's a
nice I guess, it's good to knowthat we're so awesome that
everyone's stealing our stuffwhile it's like flattery you

(33:17):
know. Imitation is the highest

Roland (33:18):
form of flattery that old saying.

Michael (33:19):
Exactly. So it's kind of flattering I guess, but when
you're out selling snake oil andyou're using the same
terminology as that we spentyears developing, it makes it
harder for us to break throughand get to people because
everyone's just now associatingthat terminology to snake oil.
So it it it it sucks a little.It hurts a little, especially

(33:40):
when someone's literally, youknow, trying to take something
that is your passion, yourindustry, and your creation and
slap a new sticker on it,whether that's a literal sticker
or a close to sticker. But ifthere was something let's it
would be theoretical.
If there's something that lookedexactly like this technology and
they had absolutely no metricsor meteorology or if they did

(34:01):
have something, it was reallyweak and probably bought and
paid for. And but it's cheaperand better somehow and upgraded
in these weird terms. Would yougo buy that or would you go with
the one that's been around for areally long time and has a
reputation? Unfortunately, lotof people aren't that smart and
they'll be like, oh, it's thesame and cheaper because they
use the same terminology. It'slike, well, I mean, you could

(34:22):
buy a Ferrari or you buy aFerrari kit car that's got a
lawnmower engine in it.
And, yeah, you might drive downthe road at five miles per hour
and look really cool, but youare not hitting zero to 60 in in
under four seconds.

Roland (34:36):
Yeah. But it's the illusion and and that's it's
stuff like that in addition tomy belief that people are just
not primed to understand thingsthat are so abstract that give
the industry of energy medicineits woo woo like moniker because
people can't jump on somethingthat they can't hold experience

(34:59):
in a way that they canunderstand it intrinsically in a
very short period of time. Youknow, you can't feel an EMF
unless you're veryhypersensitive. True. It does
not mean that you're chronicallybeing bombarded by EMFs.
And then if that person in thatenvironment all of a sudden
develops an illness, they'relooking for the things that are
obvious. Oh, was it what I ate?Was it, you know, the water I

(35:23):
was drinking? Was it the stressat work?

Michael (35:25):
Maybe It's everything.

Roland (35:26):
That's the problem. And people don't understand that
energy medicine tools are nottaking a supplement in the same
way that they're going to affectthe body. It's not a diet
change. It's not an aspect ofexercise where you're having
this tangible outcome that hassome degree of communication and
feedback. You're influencing thebody on a subtle level over the
course of time and societybecause for whatever reasons,

(35:49):
people who sell things likepharmaceuticals or various other
highly profitable tools, that'sbad for their business model.
And they'll see that in people'sconsciousness and they go, it's
it's obviously bullshit. It'sobviously not real.

Michael (36:04):
Well, people people don't think about wellness as a
holistic life experience. Theythink of it as a reactive oh
shit button. Yeah. And that'sthe problem. And I I applaud
RFK, like let's you know, makeAmerica healthy again.
Because he's trying to go backto the old model. In the
fifties, we didn't have a lot ofobese people because they had
calisthenics, they had healthierfood, they had some knowledge

(36:26):
base of like what to to do andwhat not to do, it turned into a
a big boy conglomerate of let'sjust make profits huge. Became
overly capitalistic, so theprocessed foods went up, The
quality of all the foods, theregulations dropped, we're just
getting shit diets, then peopleare encouraged to not work out.

(36:46):
I I don't I don't know ifthey're still making people do
PE in school these days, butseems like most people just
continually get fatter inAmerica. And not because they're
stressed out or they have a goodreason, like, you know, it's
just because they're lazy and noone's pushing them to actually
work out, and then they theydevelop some sort of disease.
And then they go, oh, well, Ineed to go to the doctor. And so
the entire western culture ofwellness is sick care. Mhmm. And

(37:11):
it's been designed that way fromchildhood. I mean, you have ADHD
medications being given topeople who are are 18, and it's
like, why why would you giveamphetamines to a child?
I can't figure that out. Maybejust remove the sugar from their
diet. Maybe focus on a fewthings before you start
literally pumping them full ofpharmaceuticals that are gonna

(37:31):
degrade the brain's chemistry.And and then, obviously, if
you're taking amphetamines whenyou're young, your body's gonna
have trouble with metabolismlater in life too. So, you know,
you're gonna tap out every everyresource in your body just so
they can get through school?
Like, it makes no sense to me.So if we actually took a
proactive state in America or inall of the West where we're

(37:52):
making sure there's healthierfoods, there's a some sort of
calisthenics, some sort ofstretching, some sort of
cardiovascular exercise programthat people are are taught
young, like you should do thisand then they get into it. Some
sort of level of sports.Instead, we have video games and
doom scrolling. It's lit morewhich a mental workout at least
with, you know, video games to acertain extent.

(38:14):
You're learning reactive timing.But unless they're playing Dance
Dance Revolution, no one'sactually getting physically
healthy anymore. So we we reallyneed to condition people to
understand that we're notsupposed to be reactive. We're
supposed to be proactive. And ifpeople went to energy wellness
modalities like EE system, redlight therapy, saunas, on a

(38:38):
routine basis, let's just sayonce a week, twice a week,
something, something tofacilitate the body's general
well-being.
The fact if you if we createdthat societally, people would be
getting sick because they'd bedoing the maintenance. And you
say energy, wellness, and andsupplements in a kind of same
range. No. I don't I don't I'venever taken vitamin c, vitamin

(38:59):
e, d, or any supplement otherthan a pre workout or a
nighttime sleep supplement thatactually make me feel any
different. But when I get myblood work done and they say my
b 12 is too high, that I know,reduce my b 12.
I don't know any difference inthat. Or my vitamin d levels are
bad. Maybe I feel a little bitbetter when I've been in the
sun, especially low low immunefunction. Like, I've just gotten
sick. By the way, if you've evergotten a cold or flu and you go

(39:23):
stand outside in the sun for tenminutes, it's mind boggling

Roland (39:26):
how much better you feel. So much better.

Michael (39:28):
But most supplements you don't feel. It's, you there
are very few supplements youactually feel. Well, I guess
beta alanine is gonna make youpretty red and tingly.

Roland (39:36):
Caffeine you'll feel.

Michael (39:37):
Caffeine. Caffeine's not a supplement though. Oh,
some people I

Roland (39:40):
mean, it can't kinda is. This that's a very good point.
Supplements are not high impactexperiences, but people have
been conditioned to take thembecause they know it's good for
them. They don't need to fightthat. I hope society gets there
with energy medicine becausewhat you're saying I could not
agree with more.
Even people that come to the EEsystem as their last ditch

(40:01):
effort. They've gone to everyprofessional under the sun. No
one can cure them of theircondition disease ailment. So
they're just basically throwinga Hail Mary in their own life
and going, well, I'll just trythis because it's it's the last
option left.

Michael (40:13):
And I hate that people do that too because while we
have a lot of miracle stories ofpeople having great effects with
that.

Roland (40:18):
That part is beautiful but it hurts the culture of the
industry because when you usesomething as a last resort, no
one really thinks the lastresort has all that much
potential because it is bydefinition the last resort. It's
because of the culture that webring to it. We as a culture are
reactive. We don't do thingsuntil there's something wrong.

(40:40):
And oftentimes for people, ifthat something wrong happens in
the fifth or the sixth decade oflife, it's been developing for
two or three decades prior tothe symptom showing itself.
Yeah. And if we can start toshift the culture with people to
understand that energy medicineis not meant to be an emergency
patch. The only emergency patchthat is useful in the medical

(41:00):
system is when an accidenthappens and you actually go to
the hospital to prevent yourselffrom dying. Car accident, I'm
not going to the herbalist. Youknow, I have a staph infection
as much as I wouldn't want to.
Give me the antibiotics becauseit's better than death. Stitch
me up if I cut myself open. Buteverything else happens as a
slow erosion. And in saying that

Michael (41:19):
Can can we make fun of the urine therapy people now? If
I got shot with a bullet, shouldI just pee on it?

Roland (41:24):
100%. Bullet and jellyfish. Those are the two
things that do that. But but butyou see what so this is a
perfect example. Someone wouldrather do urine therapy than try
an energy technology because intheir mind, this makes more
sense.

Michael (41:38):
Don't forget

Roland (41:38):
to ferment it. The ancient Egyptians did it. But
you know, what do you thinksociety needs to normalize the
use of energy medicine toolsthat are actually effective?
Like what's gonna be thecritical mass in people's minds
where they stop fighting itbecause of ignorance or because
of what's called historicalcontinuity? All that stuff never

(42:01):
works.
Therefore, it's never gonnawork.

Michael (42:03):
Well, you have it on both sides. So you have
alternative community who refuseto take pharmaceuticals. So
you're always gonna have adivide. You have the left and
the right politically. There's,you know, there there's always
someone who has a preference andit tends to be family and
cultural perspective or justbrainwashing because they watch
too much television which isliterally bought and paid for by

(42:23):
certain groups of people whocontrol industries.
Energy wellness is alreadyprobably way big. Like, I grew
up in this industry and watchingit grow is fascinating because
it's like leaps and bounds. Onceco COVID hit, Everyone like was
throwing up giant middle fingersto the pharmaceutical industry
because they just shovedsomething down their throat. Or

(42:44):
in their Yeah. Literally intheir arms.
That was marketed as safe andeffective and it it didn't show
any very good efficacy and nowthe safety studies are coming
out and showing that it reallywasn't that safe. And people are
still arguing, well, sure it wassafe. I'm still alive. I'm like,
there's a lot of people outthere that died because of

(43:05):
complications that occurredafter that.

Roland (43:07):
But people don't wanna also look at what they're trying
to avoid to see their own facein the mirror of ignorance. A
lot of the times people wouldrather be what's the other
thing? They'd rather be brightthan happy.

Michael (43:17):
Well, everyone's looking for the quick fix too.
They want the easy mode. So shotin the arm is quick, pill in the
mouth is quick. Going to an EEsystem, you know, a couple hours
out of the day, whichironically, a lot of our systems
are in private homes aroundbeds. So people don't have to
take time out of their their dayand they consider it their their
their wellness insurance.

Roland (43:35):
Mhmm.

Michael (43:36):
You know, you can have all the money in the world, but
if you have no health, you haveno wealth, actual wealth.

Roland (43:41):
Mhmm.

Michael (43:42):
So ironically, it's a lot of more wealthy eccentric
people that are live like,there's hey, I made all this
money. I need to make sure Istick around to spend it. It
sucked to be like Steve Jobswhere you worked your entire
life, ground super hard, andthen just collapsed.

Roland (43:57):
Journey of the soul. Right?

Michael (43:58):
Yeah. But I know what

Roland (43:59):
you mean. It's society does need to shift its
perspectives because in otherparts of the world where energy
medicine was kind of made towalk in in tandem or in unison
with biochemical basedmedicines, they use these things
on a regular basis. And it'sprobably dropped off a little
bit because again it becomeskind of a moment in time. Like I

(44:21):
have had some some clients whoare Russian and I've used some
energy wellness devices andlike, oh, I used to make fun of
my grandma for going to the spaand using that thing. I'm like,
well

Michael (44:30):
Well now they're using it.

Roland (44:32):
They do now, but there's been some wisdom lost along the
way because things have takenover. And and I'm really hoping
that energy wellness is gonna besomething that people start to
include as not an alternative tothings we've been talking about.
There's always going be a placefor a medical professional.
There's always going to be placefor natural health things. But
if you include this in yourwellness program, not only is it

(44:54):
more diverse, it's more wellrounded, but it gives you a
greater bandwidth of dealingwith the modern stresses of life
because our life has become sotechno technology or
technologically driven that Ikinda see these things as
necessary to offset some of thepotential negative downsides

Michael (45:12):
No.

Roland (45:12):
Mean of

Michael (45:12):
what's happening. What what you're saying brings
something to mind too is, youknow, while this is in centers
and homes, sticking in publicareas would be amazing. Like,
it's in the middle of anairport, so people walking
through are catching this thisvibe in this field. It's in
night clubs countering some ofthe negative effects of the
EMFs, the alcohol, It's inschools. I think that would be

(45:36):
profound.
I mean, we did an ADHD study andit showed the seventy four
percent efficacy on the ADHDstudy. Talk about kids not
needing amphetamines. Mean, ifwe stuck this in schools and
kids had more mental capacity,more mental clarity, that would
be huge. But if we could getthis in the public spaces where
it's it's an it's anenvironmental control system

(45:57):
like an air filter more than itis a reactive, thing that you
you go out of your way to getto, that would be amazing. I
don't know what has to occur inpolitics or society for
something like that to occur,but that's the ideal thing is
you create a a healthyatmosphere on a a cultural level
level.
Like, they say smart cities,which is a bad word for it, but

(46:18):
that's kind of what I envisionis if you built a city actually
smart, it would incorporate allthe water is is cleaner, all the
air is cleaner. All thetechnology around you has lower
EMFs and there's wellnesstechnologies everywhere you go,
whether it's sound healing inrandom areas that that actually
are is designed to affect yourmood. You're you're wearing
those glasses. You couldactually cause technology around

(46:39):
you, especially with shift outall the lights The harmful blue
frequencies You the frequenciesof all the lighting on a rail.
There's ways to create a city ora living environment that is
hyper reactive to creating ahyper healthy person.
And it all it takes is money,AI, and a knowledge base. I
think we have all those today.Unfortunately, more money is

(47:01):
being spent on war and dumb shitand corruption than it is on
actually helping humanitybecause we have a lot of greedy
people on the planet who justwanna fill their pockets. It's
like, don't know how many boatshouses you need. So you we can't
have public transportation or orgood health care, but at a
certain point, it has to stop.

Roland (47:18):
Well, a cultural shift has to happen. I believe it is
happening. Might be underwaynow, hopefully. Linear time
projections, I e living in thethree d. The experience of it
could take months, years,oftentimes it does.
But I believe that the notion ofyou guys becoming as successful
as you've been is a really goodsign because it shows that even

(47:40):
though it may not be globalmainstream yet, subcultures when
nourished enough can becomebigger and bigger and they can
just become embedded cultureYeah. In day to day society. So
I think it's wonderful. And thething that I'm I'm really
excited about is, we get to knowthe man behind the mask a little
bit. I know I kind of twistedyour arm to get in here, but
you're leading the charge withyour mom.

(48:02):
And at some point, you know,she'll maybe wanna take a step
back and enjoy something.Probably not fully. As I say
that, I'm like, I don't don'tthink that's possible.

Michael (48:11):
She will will work and try and help as many people and
and do what she does till theday that she passes from this
planet because she has troublesitting still and doing nothing.

Roland (48:22):
But I don't know if you feel this, I kinda sense that
there's a call to you to be alittle bit more public facing, a
little bit more as a leader, anadvocate, an educator in what it
is you do. Because for people tojump on, have to connect to
someone and they have to connectto the mission. And I'm I'm
happy that we get to learn alittle bit more about you

(48:42):
because you've done some coolstuff in your life. We didn't
even really get into theknowledge of mathematics and
finance and the various otheraspects of life, but, you know,
music was what kind of startedthis whole thing. And the the
merging of art and sciencestarted sound Yeah.
And look where it's taken you.

Michael (48:57):
Yeah. No. I mean, pattern recognition and we'll
get move on to financial math. Imean, pattern recognition was
always fun in in crypto tradingand learning the science behind
crypto. A lot of people have noidea how it works.
Just think it's these these fakeinternet monies. I have tokens.
But a breakdown of what cryptois, it's it's a decentralized

(49:19):
ledger. And for those notunderstanding the word ledger,
it's a unchangeable record ofthe calculations of of finance,
which is really fascinating. SoI got I I always found crypto
really fascinating, AI is reallyfascinating.
But for a lot of people outthere, finance is their least
healthy aspect of life, whichleads to unhealth in other ways.

(49:41):
And I I would tell the generalpopulace, there's no such way as
a get rich quick scheme. Becauseyou'll get rich quick and then
you lose it all. Yeah. Be Activereactive.
Like likely due to karma or justignorance. Learning to invest is
extremely important. When itcomes to your health, it's
extremely important because yourhealth down stress creates

(50:01):
cortisol. And, you know, stresscreates a lack and then a a
resonance of lack. So you reallyneed to figure out how to manage
finances.
So understand what you'rebringing in, what you're
spending. It's extremelyimportant in business and and in
life. Most people are absolutelyterrible at that. They go into
credit card debt. They're like,oh, I'll just make money later.
It's like, the party scene wasextremely interesting part of

(50:26):
that. Because everyone will beconstantly out spending all
their money on alcohol, drugs,and going to parties, and they
would go nowhere in life.Because they're reacting to
when's the next big party. So Ialways found it fascinating how
many people get stuck in thatloop. And that loop occurs
throughout a lot of people inlife, where they'd rather self
indulge, whether it's videogames or partying Mhmm.

(50:48):
Or meditating even. There's abunch of people out there that
are probably spiritually doingthe greatest things, but they're
completely out of touch withfinance. And finance is circular
to society. And the people thatcomplain, oh, it's a capitalist
society. Capitalist societieshave the the highest rate of
happy people.

Roland (51:04):
Capitalistic isn't negative by definition. It's
assumed that that meansnegative.

Michael (51:09):
Yeah. No. It's it's the greedy side that there's a lot
of people out there that willsteal, thieve, scam, con, and
grift because they they are toolazy to be Malignant honest
capitalism. Yeah. And there's alot of it's it's it's a high
percentage of people.
Mhmm. I wanna say in the Westernculture, but globally, there's
more people out there that havemastered the art of grifting

(51:33):
instead of mastered the art ofself sustainability. Mhmm. And
so they're instead of figuringout how to build something,
they're just trying to figureout how to steal something. And
I guess easier to just go robsomeone than it is to build a
castle.
I mean, throughout society, youknow, land grabs and castle
grabs, etcetera. But financesare extremely important. So
there's no way of achieving itquickly. Create a platform that

(51:57):
a strategy and a platform thatthat are actually going to
facilitate something, whetherit's saving. Stocks are highly
manipulated.
Crypto's highly manipulated.Silver and gold is also highly
manipulated. But find figuringout learning and figuring out
exactly when to buy things andwhen to hold things long term.
Because too many people get intobuying, trading, all these

(52:19):
things I just mentioned, andthen they sell haphazardly on
emotion, and then they try tobuy back. And by a year's time,
they've lost more in theirinvestments than if they would
have just held for four or fiveyears.
So figuring out things that youcan purchase and hold long term
as an investment is extremelyimportant in general well-being.

Roland (52:38):
Do you have any fundamental strategies or tips
to teach people how master theart of personal finance or
financial literacy because whatI've realized, and I've never
gone to the depths that youhave, but we do have some
conversations on, you know, inour personal time together and I
love learning from you. Thething I've realized is people
don't even know how to look atmoney. Even know what money

(53:00):
actually is. They assume that$20 is worth something. But in
modern society, it's basicallycredit backed debt.
So how do people learn about howto manage finance if they want
to be financially healthy? You

Michael (53:16):
have to learn to manage energy.

Roland (53:17):
Okay.

Michael (53:18):
And you are energy. And right now we're exchanging
energy in conversation. So whenyou start to understand that
everything costs energy, therehas to be a medium of exchange
for a set energy. That'stypically either a barter system
item or it's cash or whateverform of payment we're we're
gonna revert to here.

Roland (53:37):
And the grifting, just to add this, that is not a
mutual energy exchange benefit.That is one person capitalizing
and winning at the expense ofthe other person losing.

Michael (53:46):
Yeah.

Roland (53:47):
That's not sustained. That's why you get it quickly,
but it can fall apart as quicklybecause the energy of that is
not grounded or rooted inanything. Well, also, have

Michael (53:55):
the law of the universe. You can't steal
something from someone and theuniverse doesn't come back
around and slap you in the head.For anyone who doesn't
understand that, you will learn.

Roland (54:04):
Karma is a thing.

Michael (54:05):
Karma is a bitch and she has teeth and she will come
for you. It'll come for I'veseen people do really bad things
and get turbo cancer. Like, justcrazy things that instant karma
can take a while or it can berather quick.

Roland (54:18):
They're getting energy back in.

Michael (54:19):
Yeah. Back to energy. So you manage first, start with
your own energy. Throughout theday, how much energy are you
giving away for free and notgetting reciprocated? How much
energy are you spending onyourself?
And this isn't financial energy.This is things so reading is
spending energy on yourself.It's beneficial. You're
learning. Researching.
Beneficial to self. Working out,beneficial to self. Going out

(54:42):
and doing playing video games isa negative unless you're
learning something from it,which can occur. But if you're
overindulging in

Roland (54:50):
Overindulgence. Yes.

Michael (54:51):
Overindulgence in monotonous garbage is a negative
investment. Mhmm. And morepeople spend more time in the
day self indulging to nonsensethan they do actually trying to
learn or achieve something.

Roland (55:04):
Mhmm.

Michael (55:05):
So you have to manage your energy. Is what I'm doing
benefiting me in the long termis the perfect question to ask.
Is this a good energy exchange?If you're constantly helping
your girlfriend with things andshe's nagging at you, that's bad
energy exchange. You probablyneed to find a new girlfriend.
If she's not raising you up andproviding you happiness, time
for a new relationship.Unfortunately, this is we live

(55:26):
in a society where both sidesare trying to take too much from
the other side in different waysYeah. And there's a complete
imbalance. So but you shouldn'tbe trying to have a relationship
if you don't have your financesin in in order because at the
end of the day, men are theproviders, and women, they're
they're supposed to bring manhappiness. But most women what
was all all women are golddiggers.

(55:49):
Just pick one in in your budget.So it's like, you want a really
hot girl, you better you betterhave some money. If if you want
a homely girl and you wanna playvideo games, I'm sure you can
work that out. But most peopleare are due to the Internet on
both sides, male and female. Thefemale are all looking for the
six foot, drives a Lambo, haslots of money, but has all the
time in the world for hersomehow, which does not exist.

Roland (56:10):
Also super emotionally open and

Michael (56:14):
The whole list.

Roland (56:14):
Very allow, yes.

Michael (56:15):
The whole

Roland (56:15):
And guys, are delusional. They want the
Instagram model and they don'twanna

Michael (56:20):
take care body count too. Yes. I want a supermodel
porn star girl that has onlybeen with one guy. Like, come
on. It's unrealistic on allsides.
You know, I want this saint girlthat's gonna cook clean. No. The
the we everyone needs to droptheir expectations by at least
50% on both sides. But back toenergy management. You if you're

(56:40):
not building yourself up, thenyou're going into a negative.
Mhmm. So you're either doingthings that are bringing
yourself up, self worth and notego, having having an ego and
thinking you're worth more thanyou are, also bad energy
management. Because now you'rewasting time of, I'm important,
and I got this cool suit andthis watch, hey, I'm cool.

(57:01):
You're not cool. You'reobnoxious.

Roland (57:02):
That's a pretty good bro impression, by the way, there.
Like, even your voice changed.

Michael (57:07):
Yeah. Yeah. You see a lot of these guys, oh, I'm so
important. It's like, sit down,calm down. Like, I walk around
looking like half homeless halfthe time.
People would never know I haveany money until they actually
get to know me. It's funny withgirls too. As soon as they
figure it out, they're like, oh,let's get married. It's like
wearing a tank top and shorts.It's a switch.
It's a literal switch. It's sucha trip. And people my sister
gives me shit because I I dresslike I'm half homeless half the

(57:29):
time. I'm like, I'm wearingwhat's comfortable. Like, I'm
not trying to impress anyone.

Roland (57:32):
At home with no shoes, going to places, live a beach
bum life because that's a way ofgiving back to you. Because when
you can do that also and stop uppretenses, you don't fall prey
to things that the ego would

Michael (57:44):
put you energy management again too because I'm
wearing this nice jacket becauseI'm on a podcast. Mhmm. Have you
ever seen me wear these jacketsoutside of a podcast?

Roland (57:52):
Only when you're walking into the podcast room.

Michael (57:55):
Yeah. It's

Roland (57:56):
Or at a conference.

Michael (57:57):
At a conference. Would I have to be professionally
presentable? Yeah. But a lot ofpeople will walk around wearing
designer clothes, and they'll gobuy these designer things. It's
bad bad energy management.
You're buying things that are anegative investment. So you
spent $3 on a purse. Ladies, I'mtalking to you. Please stop with
expensive purses. $3 on a purse,and maybe the guy bought it for
you, so you're considering a netpositive.
But it's someone's energy, andyou probably exchanged something

(58:20):
one way or another for thatenergy. So we have a $3,000
purse. As soon as it walks outof the store, it's worth $500 on
a secondary market. Doesn'tmatter really the condition.
Maybe there's some exceptions.
That's negative energy. Whywould you buy garbage for x
amount of money that it all doeshold things? Why do they buy it?
Self importance. Self importanceis a negative energy transport,

(58:41):
and people don't understand.

Roland (58:42):
Makes real Externally projected self importance.

Michael (58:45):
That was it yeah. I mean

Roland (58:48):
I would define it because you can say that I am
self important as an individual.And as long as you keep that
inside of you to maintain anintegrity about yourself.

Michael (58:56):
Well, I'll tell you what self importance is. Self
importance is being a father ora mother and raising your kids.

Roland (59:01):
Exactly.

Michael (59:01):
That's self importance. Yes. Being important because
you're wearing more designerclothes or have more money
things that on that is ego. It'sego importance. It's an it's
negative energy.
Yeah. You're spending time,money, and energy to look a
certain way so that people thinkyou're something. Mhmm. You're
you're kind of aura farming atthe expense of yourself. So
you're putting on all thismakeup which isn't good.

(59:22):
It's going into your body. It'sbad. For for guys, they're using
weird hair products or whateverthey're doing to you know, guys
are a lot simpler. Women, I gotI have a whole laundry list of
things you guys do that aredisgusting. Nails, no one cares.
It's toxic to breathe it in.Most of your hair products are
toxic. You know, you wonder whyyou guys are getting breast
cancer. It's because you you'reconstantly putting stuff in and

(59:43):
on your body that is made ofgarbage. I could go on.
But I think negative energy.Yeah. To look self important, to
seem pretty. I mean, there'spretty I love a natural beauty.
When you don't need a lot ofmakeup and you can just look
pretty and have a spiritualconnected presence and you're
grounded, it's beautiful.
Most of these girls that aredoing all boob jobs, butt jobs,

(01:00:04):
all this makeup stuff, they'rethey're empty. There's really no
substance there. But I lookpretty.

Roland (01:00:10):
Like It's like spirit a way.

Michael (01:00:11):
I would spend ten ten, fifteen minutes with it in your
room. I'm sure it'd befantastic, and we'd have nothing
in common or to talk about afterthat. Like spiritual grifting.

Roland (01:00:19):
It's like spiritual grifting in a way.

Michael (01:00:21):
Right?

Roland (01:00:21):
Yeah. Because what you're doing is you're investing
in things to benefit you as anoutcome in this context. And and
I'm not saying this exclusivelyto women. Guys do it too when it
comes to the car they have to beseen driving, the clothes they
wear.

Michael (01:00:34):
Going to death to buy a watch and these fancy shoes and
stuff.

Roland (01:00:37):
Injecting yourself with anabolics to be really big and
muscular. Yeah. And it's allbecause they can't accept
themselves. And I know thisconversation started with
financial literacy, and I likethat we've actually gone deeper
to the context of it's aboutenergy management because the
self actualization of a personhas to come from seeing all the

(01:01:01):
light, all the dark inside ofthem, not allowing the shadow
side of their existence topredominate because people who
become financially wealthy andthe ones who keep it are also
the ones you typically don'tknow who they are. And what
they've done because they're notrunning around boasting about it
to, I had to Google aura farminglike half a year ago because

(01:01:22):
some young kid said to me, I'mlike, aura farming, what does
this mean?

Michael (01:01:25):
It's great to

Roland (01:01:25):
But they're not doing that because what it is they're
doing in their lives, theirmission, maybe they're focused
on how much they can help otherpeople build themselves up in
their life through their ownsuccess. That's where financial
literacy takes you, but itstarts with having an
understanding and an awarenessthat money is energy. And that
energy is an extension of you.And if you live in

Michael (01:01:47):
place is energy.

Roland (01:01:48):
Yeah. Place of lack, you're gonna be lacking
knowledge.

Michael (01:01:50):
Mhmm.

Roland (01:01:50):
You're gonna be lacking relationships, connection.
You're gonna be lackingfinancial resources, lacking
availability of options tobetter your position in life
because you're just trying toget into something quickly. You
haven't invested in growingyourself and becoming a master
of your own domain.

Michael (01:02:06):
Yeah. Well, and and knowledge is is energy. So a lot
of people overlook this. Whatabout some of the most highly
paid skilled jobs out thererequire what? Knowledge of
something to do.
Mhmm. A coder has to have theknowledge base of it. So someone
complained that they're onlymaking $20 an hour and minimum
wage needs to be raised. I wouldargue, what's your work life
balance? How much time are youspending wasting energy instead

(01:02:29):
of learning?
If you wanna get to makingdouble that at 40, 60, whatever,
you need to find something tolearn so that it become more
valuable to someone who'swilling to pay you for that
value. So it's energy, and it'sfree. Knowledge is free. We have
the Internet, which is well, youmight have to pay for it. You
can go to a library.
It's still free. There's plentyof free Wi Fi out there. You you
get out find a device, you geton there, and you can learn

(01:02:50):
almost anything. I'm self taughtin music, self taught in almost
I've never I've never been toschool. I was a high school
dropout.
When I wanted to know something,I grew up in the age of the
Internet, I would figure it out.And before the Internet, I read
a lot of books. There's don'tBooks seem like a novelty at
this point, but go pick up somebooks.

Roland (01:03:08):
I believe it's a novel, not a novelty.

Michael (01:03:10):
You know, their knowledge is free. It's out
there. It's accessible. It'sjust a matter of figuring out
when you're going to take thetime to digest and increase your
energy so that you can increaseyour finances because it's
circular. If you don't have thefinances, you don't have the
energy.
It's a weird weird littleconcept in life of people. I

(01:03:32):
need I need to make more money.It's like, invest the energy
into making more money. Stopbeing a victim. Mhmm.
Be proactive. Someone someoneasked me asked me to say, what
would you advise people whowanna make more money? I was
like, keep working. Work harder.I literally said, just work
harder.
Too many people think work lifelife balance is is super

(01:03:53):
important, and it it is. But youget to work life balance after
you've expended the correctenergy in the right space.

Roland (01:04:00):
Mhmm. There's a saying I used to say, and I don't know if
I generated this myself or Iheard it from somewhere, but
it's basically do the things noone else wants to do so you can
do the things no one else isable to do. Yeah. And you know,
when it says work harder, thereneeds to be an approach. It
needs to be a strategic approachand an understanding.
And I think what you just sharedwith people hopefully stimulates

(01:04:22):
in them some deeper criticalthinking.

Michael (01:04:24):
Yeah. Glad I said the work harder after I explained
why you should be workingharder. Yes. It's if it

Roland (01:04:29):
It doesn't mean get another or a fourth or a fifth
job pay minimum wage. It's howdo you generate something of
value in your life so someoneelse sees that you have value
and they want to offer you theopportunity to grow and expand.

Michael (01:04:40):
And I started that out too with the finance concept of
you need to make a plan. Youneed to make a platform. And so
the first thing is I have I haveto set a goal. So your if your
goal is to make a $100 an hour,you then you need to figure out
your industry Mhmm. Yourplatform.
Where where will you get that?And then you you achieve that by
setting other goals along theway. Reach your goal, set a new

(01:05:02):
goal, and see the outcome, andthen get the outcome. It's not
difficult. Just people lack themotivation typically or the
there's there's a lot ofvariables there.

Roland (01:05:14):
The perspective, the approach, the knowledge of how
execute, the feedback. Like itis a complicated thing.

Michael (01:05:20):
It is complicated. It's not as easy as just saying it.

Roland (01:05:22):
No. But it does start with a harder framework. It does
start with the framework has tobe there. You just have to
populate it with the details.

Michael (01:05:28):
You create a vision board. It's you know, obviously,
you have to be self sustainablein the moment. So people are
like, oh, I'll get trapped inthis $20 an hour job and

Roland (01:05:35):
Mhmm.

Michael (01:05:35):
But there there's twenty four hours in a day.
Mhmm. You need eight hours ofsleep and you're probably
working an eight hour shift. Sowhat do you do with those those
other hours? You should beinvesting your energy into your
outcome.
Mhmm. Yeah.

Roland (01:05:47):
Yeah. I I have a very specific friend I think about,
and, he's very well regarded inthe pro sports world. And my
other friend went to collegewith him, and he said, I'd get
up, get ready to go out, So andso would be on the computer
researching, always naked. Andthen he'd go out for the night.
He'd come home.
He'd still be on that computerresearching. And he became this

(01:06:08):
incredibly well regarded, wellsought after professional in the
industry where he canmaterialize a job anywhere at
any time he wants. He'sknowledgeable. Because he spent
his college career justresearching on the computer. He
didn't waste time going out anddrinking and chasing things.
He invested in himself. So Ithink you're echoing the same
kind of energy there. Back tothe That's how I

Michael (01:06:29):
my life. Yeah. I became successful by a, having a
mission was part of it. I mean,my mom, obviously, there's a
mission there with the e system.But I had a I was I'm the Swiss
army man of abilities.
You're the MacGyver. I I knowhow to do I'm a master at a very
few things, but I know howeverything works. Mhmm. I know I

(01:06:51):
know how how to achieve anythingI need to achieve in any moment.
I know how to negotiate withpeople.
I the it's there's nothing Ican't do. Someone asked me what
what my superpower was. I waslike, I can figure out how to do
anything if I need if I need to.

Roland (01:07:05):
Self reliance. You know there's that statement, jack of
all trades, master of none.

Michael (01:07:09):
Yeah.

Roland (01:07:10):
Do you know what the other half of that is? Go for
it. So people think it's anegative thing to be a jack of
all trades and a master of none,but it says often better than a
master of one. Yeah. Because ifyou have enough relevance in any
topic, you can interface withsomeone and that person could be
a specialist in their disciplineand you can provide them
feedback that theirspecialization and focus may not

(01:07:32):
have the awareness to seebecause they're so into it.
And then you can do the samething with other people in
different disciplines. You couldbecome a very powerful
influential person if you canunite incredibly smart and
motivated people to a commongoal. And that's what I've
always seen you as a a powerfulperson in that regard. And I'm
glad that you're getting outthere finally, and you're you're
sharing this. Not to boast, notto brag, but to establish a

(01:07:57):
respect and and and a voice inthis.
And I I think it's somethingthat's needed right now.

Michael (01:08:03):
Alright. Well, you have have any more questions for me?

Roland (01:08:07):
Who folded your pocket square? No. I'm joking. It's
more of a triangle. It looksgood.
It looks really good. Michael,it's been awesome. Is there
anything that you'd like toleave us with? Any final
messages, insights, or thingsthat you feel that you need to
share with the audience that'sgonna listen to this?

Michael (01:08:25):
Be the change in your community. Be a leader. Give
advice. Sometimes it won't comeback to you directly from that
person. But community is verypowerful thing and the world is
extremely small.
If you're gonna do harm tosomeone, realize this world is
very small. So if you're gonnascam someone, even if it's for
very little, you're gonnarealize this world is very
small. Karma's a bitch. I'vebeen traveling all over the

(01:08:47):
world. I've ran into peoplerandomly in other countries.
That's how small it is.

Roland (01:08:50):
Mhmm.

Michael (01:08:51):
You know, there's not as many people on this planet as
you really think there is. Andyou think you can do something
negative to anyone in life andwalk away unscathed. It it
doesn't work that way. You know,truth and transparency is actual
truth and transparency, thewords. So be be kind to your
community.
Make sure you're doing right.And, you know, it's it's one

(01:09:11):
thing to steal a loaf of breadwhen you're starving. It's
another to steal the thetruckload of loaves because
you're trying to be greedy.

Roland (01:09:18):
Well said. Appreciate that, my friend. Thank you very
much.

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Can Energy Medicine Actually Heal You? The Evidence Problem | Everything's Energy Ep-44

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Can Energy Medicine Actually Heal You? The Evidence Problem | Everything's Energy Ep-44