February 28, 2024 • 34 mins
Ever felt like you're battling to make your voice heard in a world built not for you?
In this empowering episode, we dive into Jenny Hoffmann's remarkable journey as a COO in the apparel industry, pioneering sustainability and shattering gender stereotypes.
From being one of the world's first in vitro babies to earning a PhD in bioengineering, Jenny's story is a testament to overcoming 'sticky floors' and breaking glass ceilings.
Tune in for an inspiring conversation filled with strategies for staying true to yourself and making a difference. Let Jenny's story motivate you to find your authentic voice and unleash your potential.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(01:11):
Are you constantlyunderestimated and often the
only unheard voice in the room.
Are you constantly battling theunrealistic expectations that
live only in your mind?
Today's guest is no stranger tothese sticky floors, but she is
all about making the world abetter place.
Jenny Hoffman is a COO in theapparel industry seeking to
(01:34):
transform the industry for asustainable future.
And this woman has a PhD inbioengineering, crazy smart, and
a BS in biomedical engineering.
Now I am not one to read outresumes as intros, but I want
y'all to know this because Jennysticky floors relate to being a
woman in an industry.
Typically dominated by men.
(01:55):
She's had to process thefeedback that she needed to be
more like a man and even tochange her voice.
So if you are stuck living in aworld, built by men for men
y'all we need your voice.
Jenny will give you hands downthe best strategies to being
your authentic self.
However, that looks and soundsso that together we can cause
(02:18):
the ripple effect.
But that is not all onefascinating fun fact about Jenny
is that she is one of theworld's first in vitro babies.
And we talk all about how thatplays into her sticky floors.
You are listening to the podcastfrom now to next.
The podcast that empowers womento get seen, get heard and get
promoted.
I'm your host, Eric Ernie, andI've made it my mission to help
(02:41):
you break free from the stickyfloors, those limiting beliefs
and toxic behaviors to bustthrough the glass ceiling.
I'm obsessed with all things,growth and abundance.
And I'm here to talk you throughthe tried and true secrets to
get you to level up your careerand your life.
We talk about the hard stuffhere.
Imposter syndrome,perfectionism, fear and burnout.
(03:01):
So pull up a seat, pop it innearby.
A bed and let's dive in.
I am so excited that everyone ishere today because we have a
very special guest today.
Her name is Jenny Hoffman andJenny in essence is all about
making the world a better place,but I'm gonna let her tell you
all about it.
So Jenny, welcome.
How are you today?
(03:21):
I am great.
I'm so excited to be here.
Thank you for having me.
It's so fun.
For everyone who doesn't know, Ialways talk with my guests a few
minutes, in a different daybefore just to get to know them.
And Jenny's got a great story.
So Jenny, how about you kick itoff and just tell me a little
bit about who you are and whatyou do.
Well, if you don't mind, I'mgoing to start from the very
beginning of my life.
Let's do it! How the two of usconnected, uh, when we talked
(03:43):
before this as well.
so I am one of the first invitro fertilization babies, and
I felt like people made itpossible for me to be here, and
so that's what made Made me wantto always make a difference in
this world.
And so from that, then I, um,ended up getting my PhD in
bioengineering.
So I could try to engineerbetter solutions for others and
(04:06):
then started working in medicaldevices, everywhere from product
to leading businesses.
And now in the apparel industry,trying to make it a more
sustainable industry.
So I always search out thesemissions of making a difference
in the world.
And that's what really motivatesme.
Oh, I love it.
That's your why.
And you've known that your wholeentire life.
You felt that?
(04:27):
Well, it always sounds thatclear.
Um, but it's, it's never thatclear.
I mean, there's more behind it,of course, always.
And I think that I've spent alot of time, even in the last
five years or so, really gettingto know myself so that I could
define my why very clearly.
And that took a lot ofintrospection and time with
(04:48):
myself.
Um, So it wasn't always clear,but I always knew that there
was.
I've always had this energy,this passion and motivation.
And so it was identifying whatcreated that energy for me.
I love that.
So tell me about growing up asthis very first in vitro baby,
because number one, it wasn't ascommon back then as it is today.
(05:10):
Right?
Like now.
There's a lot of people outthere who are able to have
children because of in vitrofertilization.
But how was that for you growingup and especially like your
background with your parents?
Because you have amazing parentsas well.
Yes, I am very lucky to have thefamily that I have.
So a few things.
The first thing is that I wasthen in newspapers or on TV.
(05:33):
Occasionally, we never releasedmy.
identifying information becauseit was really controversial at
the time.
Many people thought that thatwasn't a way that people should
come into existence, especiallyat the time.
Um, but we really celebrated itas a family.
And so one of the things I sawwas that, you know, my family
(05:54):
for their religious backgroundmight, the extended family might
not have supported this, butthey did because they saw the
good that was coming of it.
So I saw this.
Um, people being willing tochallenge their assumptions and
take new perspective, that wasvery meaningful and has impacted
me throughout my whole life.
The second thing I'd say then isthat that kept coming up
(06:15):
throughout my whole life.
So even when I was in college, Idid a great course on theology,
ethics, and medicine.
And, um, it was all about.
these different topics, youknow, organ donation, who should
get the organ, how do you pick,like, come up with any topic
like that, but one of them wason reproductive technologies,
(06:36):
and even in college, it came upof different viewpoints.
So I suppose it's been this Inmy whole life, seeking to
understand differentperspectives, different points
of view, and how do wecollectively move forward.
And then the third thing I'd sayis the impact of my parents.
So clearly my parents werepioneers and willing to take The
(06:56):
risk to do something different.
even for my mom, that meant shetried to have another child
after me and was not able to,and it was a real impact on her
health.
Um, and so she decided it wasbetter to have one child than to
have two, but not be around.
And so.
I think I always learned fromthem.
She was also one of the firstfemale vice presidents at a
(07:20):
large bank.
I just always learned from themhow to appreciate different
perspectives, how to never giveup that grit determination and
try things new.
The idea that when you'rebetween a rock and a hard place,
that's when you innovate with anew solution.
Well, and what I love about thatand just this whole lesson here
(07:41):
is that It really teaches you tonot give up on those dreams,
right?
Like when you want somethingbadly enough, you will do
whatever it takes to go afterit.
And your parents fortunatelywere able to do that, but they
just, like you said, theypersevered, they had grit, they
wanted a child and they made ithappen.
So I think that's super amazing.
But they also.
(08:02):
evaluated their situation,right?
The, the desire for anotherchild, they had to weigh the
pros and the cons, you know,and, and unfortunately sometimes
those things don't work out, butyou take the time and you weigh
those.
Right?
So I think that's number oneamazing, you know, parents that
put all of that out there from avery young age, but talk to me
(08:22):
about, How this impacted yougrowing up, because I can only
imagine knowing what it took tobring you into the world, right?
All of the risk that wasinvolved, all of the
controversy, did that kind ofcreate a sticky floor for you?
And the fact that like, maybeyou felt like you always had to
show up and be this amazinghuman because of everything it
(08:44):
took to have you?
I definitely felt pressure thatI had to, like, deserve it,
deserve to be here, or had tomake an equal difference for
those that made it possible forme to be here, for like paying
it forward type of idea.
Now nobody put that pressure onme.
It's not like my parents orthose around me.
(09:04):
It was more that I felt thatway.
And so I think a lot of thesticky floor that I realized was
also the way I was thinkingabout things or approached life
as well.
And also this piece that italways looked really easy from
the outside in.
So I don't think peopleperceived that I put that
(09:25):
pressure on myself necessarily.
That led me then to try to putall my energy, my drive into
accomplishing things that couldmake a difference.
And I think many of us are wiredthat way, to try to accomplish
things.
And that's amazing until it goestoo far, is what I learned.
So it was trying to identifywhen it goes too far.
(09:46):
And I think you mentionedperseverance as well.
For me, it's how do you knowwhen that perseverance is
exactly what's needed versuswhen it's time to, to stop.
And so.
Being in touch with myself,trying to identify when that
time is, when it's, maybe it's atime when it's not about the
accomplishments, um, for thatmoment.
It's about just being.
(10:07):
I love that because this wholesticky floor of women putting
unrealistic expectations onourselves.
Is so heavy.
It's one that I struggle withbecause I look at these things
after I really dissect them, Iam like, no one wanted this.
No one asked for this.
But yet I have made it this ideain my mind that it has to be a
(10:28):
certain way or that I have toshow up a certain way.
Right?
Like, Very basic and noncriticalto life example is like using
paper plates at a family dinnerversus the nice plates, right?
Nobody cares what plate they'reeating off of.
And nobody is going to rememberwhat plate they ate off of in
five years.
So why does it matter?
And so what I would like to askyou, because this is an area I
(10:51):
struggle with is how do younotice?
That you start to put theseunrealistic expectations on
yourself.
And then what do you do to kindof pull yourself back from that?
The first thing I'd say is, Idefinitely suffer from this.
So let's be very clear, and thething I started with, so the
plates is a really good example.
I now did paper plates, uh, whenwe hosted Thanksgiving this
(11:12):
year.
The first thing I started withactually was when my daughters
were little, allowing them tohave mismatched socks.
I know that sounds very funny,but I wanted them to always have
matched socks, and I justcouldn't do it and let that go.
the first way to notice wasidentifying how it shows up in
my body.
So I hold tension in my leftshoulder, and so either start to
(11:34):
feel the tension or sometimesit's, like a racing of the heart
or a warmth that comes from thechest.
So it's identifying how yourbody is sending you a signal.
Is the first thing and becomingmore in tune with that, and I
would notice it afterward, andthen you start to just notice it
a little earlier and a littleearlier and a little earlier
(11:57):
over time.
And what I do for it, so what Ido for it, start with a place
where I'm willing to not beperfect or willing to not
accomplish.
Like I said, the socks were anexample.
Another example at work was, Iallowed an email to have a typo.
And, and I know that those arelittle examples, but they were
really meaningful, or Irealized, especially as I had
(12:20):
roles at work that were broaderand required more of me, I might
not as get as much preparationfor a presentation as I would
have liked.
So maybe I only practiced itonce and like, that's okay.
And I learned then to be able topresent without as much
preparation.
So I think what I do about it isfind a place where I'm willing
to not be perfect or not havethe accomplishment.
(12:43):
Give myself grace, supportmyself in whatever way is
needed.
After that, I worked a lot onself compassion and view
failure, not as failure, but aslearning.
I love both of those examples.
Number one, because themismatched socks really speaks
to my soul.
As a parent, I remember havingthese.
(13:05):
Gosh, unrealistic expectations,for lack of a better word, of
like, what my kid would wear,and how they would look, and da
da da da, and like, trying toget my child to style his hair
or do anything is an act of God,right?
He does not want to do any ofthat for anything, so I have to
remind myself, is this a battlethat I want to fight today?
And then in the workplace, thisis something I think and you can
(13:27):
probably really speak to thisbeing a woman in a male
dominated field is I am veryhard on myself when I make what
I would call like a publicmistake, right?
Like, if we're in a room and Irespond in a way, then later I'm
like, oh, I shouldn't haveresponded that way.
Or I should have been more.
whatever, Like more calm or moreprofessional.
(13:47):
I don't know.
But I, I know that I have atendency to beat myself up over
those.
And for me, what has helped hasreally been to just ask the
question of like, do you thinksomeone else is still thinking
about that?
And if the answer is yes, thenlike have that conversation with
the person to say, Hey, I didn'tmean to respond like that.
Here's how I should haveresponded.
(14:08):
This is, I'm sorry, right?
Because sometimes an apology isnecessary and like you can
course correct.
But if the answer is no, they'reprobably not thinking about
that.
Then I have to, like you said,have the grace, have the self
compassion to just move on.
Because if you're the only onethinking about it, it really
doesn't matter.
But I would love to talk aboutyour experience of being a woman
(14:31):
in a male industry.
Because I can imagine.
With all that you've done in thefield that you've done that you
have probably been One of theonly women in many of the room,
is that correct?
Yes the first thing i'd say isSimilar to your example, I
learned that being vulnerableand making mistakes can actually
(14:52):
be a positive.
I had this idea that being theonly woman, I had to show up
more prepared than anyone else,more perfect than anyone else.
And I still often show up thatway.
It's, again, how I'm wired.
Yep.
But I learned, that that wasn'talways serving me well.
What I mean by that was I gotthis feedback when I was first
(15:13):
trying to start lead otherpeople and that to me felt like
a very sticky floor in thetransition of a career going
from an individual contributorto leading others, and it felt
similarly with broaderleadership roles, and that first
time I tried to always show upas.
The most prepared, really ready.
And I got feedback then thatpeople were not feeling like
(15:36):
they knew me as a leader andwhat I was personally about.
And so I realized that thevulnerability to make a mistake
and then acknowledge thatactually built more trust and
more rapport with those that Iwould lead.
Then being the most prepared orbeing perfect.
And that actually built a lotmore trust.
(15:57):
And so it took thisvulnerability, this courage,
and, and I think that the otherpiece was the catch 22 that it
felt like as a woman.
The catch 22 between beingassertive, but oh, you're too
assertive or have a loudervoice.
Oh, not that voice.
and so I think that that was thehardest piece for me to navigate
(16:19):
and is something I continue tonavigate.
I think it's about balance is myconclusion.
How do you find the rightbalance?
You know, so some examples, Iwas given feedback at one point
to be more like a man whenworking with a surgeon customers
and be aggressive and assertiveand in their face.
And as you can tell from me,that's not my style.
(16:40):
So I had to figure out, like,okay, why are you telling me
that?
What was behind that feedback?
(18:17):
Okay, I should approach thatcustomer differently.
What do we mean by differently?
In what way?
Okay, we wanted to work withthem in a closer partnership, so
we were co creating.
Okay, we can do that.
But it doesn't mean that I haveto be more like a man to do
that.
And that was really important tome.
Another, I would say is anexample of, at one point I was
(18:38):
told that people didn't like myvoice, that my voice was too
high and some experienced it asshrill.
At the time, that was veryhurtful because I can't do
anything about my voice.
Now we know there are someexamples where women actually
tried to lower their voice.
And I actually ended up readinga lot about voice.
(18:59):
And my conclusion is it's again,it's one of those points of
feedback that you can't doanything about.
And so I've also tried to bevery.
There's gonna be some thingsthat people don't like about me
then.
I do have a higher registervoice.
But also, I'm not going to besorry for that.
I'm going to keep saying, beingme, and saying what I want to
(19:23):
say with my voice, and nothiding my voice.
This is almost like I would loveto go up to a man and be like,
you know what?
People would take you moreseriously if you were taller.
Like, what?
What do you do with that?
That's such crap.
You know, but I would love to dothat or like, actually, I think
people take you more seriouslyif you have a little bit more
(19:44):
hair.
Are you kidding me?
Like, that's wild to me.
So I would love to talk aboutthat because I know several
women who've had that samefeedback about their voice or
they don't sound serious enough.
And we know.
The, um, Theranos leader,Elizabeth Holmes, lowered her
voice.
We talked about that when wefirst met, like how crazy that
(20:05):
actually is and how much energyyou would have to pour into
remembering to change the, thesound of your voice with every
public interaction.
But when you got that piece offeedback, did you immediately
reject it or did it take a bitof time?
Like, walk me through that.
(20:26):
I did not immediately reject itbecause I am definitely someone
who likes to seek out.
I mean, feedback's a gift.
That's what we hear and thatwomen get less feedback than
men.
And so when I get feedback, I'mlike, great, I want to, what did
I do?
What can I do then?
And I actually was supported byother women who served as a
(20:47):
coach, basically on my personalboard of directors to say, when
you got feedback, you get tochoose what of it.
You decide to act upon and tome, that was really powerful
that it's my choice because Ialmost felt like feedback.
I get feedback.
It wasn't my choice, but no, I'min control.
I have the power to choose whatI take from it.
(21:07):
And it also caused me to view.
Where there are other aspects inmy life that I could make subtle
changes as, as a woman, and I'msure as many of us all say,
sorry, more frequently.
So I tried to cut that out andalso support others that I work
with to cut that out.
I also will say things like, Ithink that we should do this, or
(21:29):
maybe we should.
I know we should.
I'm trying to soften it.
So, trying to remove some ofthat.
Now, those I work with wouldtell you I still do these
things.
So, I'm trying to be moreconscious of them and more
assertive with, with who I amand how I want to show up and
lead.
All of that speaks directly tomy heart because I, all the
(21:53):
time, will say, Well, what doyou think?
Or, maybe we should do this.
Or, I make it very much thatgroup, like, We should go do
this instead of, I am going togo do this.
Because I want to be inclusiveand collaborative.
And, like, as women, we are toldthat this is how we have to show
up.
And I think we still have I justdid it again! I said, I think!
(22:15):
Dammit! Okay! Y'all are seeingit live, in the flesh, and I'mma
leave all that in there.
But, it is my belief that wemust show up and continue
because we have such a long wayto go before people really
accept that women can be directand not be a bitch.
Absolutely.
But it's gonna take some moretime.
(22:36):
I've worked a lot then on how toask questions that lead with my
perspective but are still opento input.
So maybe it's something likeInstead of, you know, what do
you all think, or what is youridea, I see a different
perspective, but help meunderstand yours.
Hmm.
(22:57):
So, or, my perspective is, andlead with it, how do you see
things differently?
So, it's subtle, but meaningful.
And it's not so far fetched, andI say this because So often
women are told that we have tochange how we show up, right?
(23:18):
Don't be so soft, don't be this,don't be that.
But then, if we show up super,like, authoritative or direct,
then it's not authentic to whowe are.
But I love how you put that.
It's just this very tiny, subtleshift in how you show up and ask
questions so that you are takenmore seriously.
You are being direct, but it isnot How do you deal with that?
(23:40):
When you're not authentic to whoyou are, that is so critical to
me.
So you hit that was a momentwhere my heart rate starts
racing a little bit.
I get a little heat and I'mlike, no.
Authentic is so important to me.
And words matching actions is soimportant to me.
And so if anybody gives feedbackthat you should be more like
(24:01):
someone else, don't listen toit.
That's the feedback to throwout.
Then it's trying to understandwhat is it they're really trying
to tell you and how do you makethat resonate for you?
Because I don't think any of usshould be somebody else.
We should be who we are.
That's the greatest impact wecan have in this world.
I think that's so powerfulbecause it's not about changing
(24:21):
who we are.
I mean, this is who we are atthe core, right?
Maybe some things have come infrom society.
Maybe some things have come ingenerationally from our parents
or However, we see the world,but don't go out to totally
change you, who you are in orderto climb the ladder or be
successful.
Show up as who you are, but makethese tiny, subtle shifts to
(24:42):
really just highlight who youare to be authentic, to be
vulnerable, to pull it back tothe very beginning of what you
said.
Oh, my gosh.
All of that is so great.
I would say if you had notwritten that down as she said
it, go back, get a pencil, writeit down.
Jenny, what other advice wouldyou give women who are looking
to really kind of establishtheir authentic self in the
(25:05):
workplace?
That's a great question and abig question.
That is a big question.
It feels like almost sheddingthe baggage or shedding the
scales to emerge as yourself.
So to me, that's what it feelslike.
And advice for how to do that?
is spend time with yourself.
I mentioned this earlier, butthings like, I started
(25:28):
meditating every day.
At the beginning I was like,Why?
What?
But some amount of time to bequiet.
And I say that as a working mom,because we're all there's always
50 things to be doing at anygiven time, and I'm always
trying to do them all.
And it comes across as veryoverwhelming much of the time.
So to actually pause and get toknow oneself is a real gift.
(25:53):
And sometimes I found thingsthat I liked and some things I
found that I didn't like asmuch, but accepting myself as
well.
So it's that, like, journey ofself discovery and accepting
what I found.
And I would encourage each ofyou to do that as well.
Get to know yourself and acceptyourself and view that you're
(26:16):
worth it.
Which is something I've longworked on and I'm still working
on because I had this feelingthat I had to almost like earn
the value.
And I don't think that's reallytrue, even though I still
struggle with it.
I think that's common with a lotof women.
(26:37):
Is knowing our worth and knowingour value when we walk into the
room and to speak a little bitto your story about feedback.
I once did a 360 and I got thefeedback that I was too much and
just like you, I like ran away.
I felt so horrible about thatfeedback because it really kind
(26:57):
of attacks your core being oflike who you are and I was like.
Again, flooded with impostersyndrome, flooded with this,
like, I don't deserve to behere, why am I here in this
executive role, like, clearly Ican't, I shouldn't be here.
And it was actually my mom whowas like, she basically said,
fuck that advice.
Like that's what got you to thisplace.
And I really had to sit withthat because.
(27:19):
My extraness, my loudness, myall of that is what got me to
where I am.
But that doesn't mean that Ican't make those tiny subtle
shifts that you were saying.
So I took that feedback,rejected a lot of it, but what
it did do was it taught me howto deal with that individual
person.
That if I wanted that person tohear my message, to approach
(27:42):
them in just a slightlydifferent manner.
Not change who I was or how Ishowed up.
But just alter with him, maybehow I delivered the message.
And so that was a reallypowerful moment for me.
But it also still blows my mindthat people think it's okay to
give that type of feedback.
What a great example, though.
And I think you highlighted therole of asking others.
(28:04):
That would be my other piece ofadvice.
Ask others.
Because I often found itdifficult to identify my own
value and my own superpowers.
So, for example, others wereable to help me identify that my
energy and passion that comesthrough and how that drives me
and then the way I care, bothfor those that I work with as
well as ultimately the end usersof what I work on, that's
(28:27):
authentic to me.
And they helped me see it.
So sometimes it's hard to expectourselves to identify.
That's a really great piece ofadvice because when someone
gives you feedback that is alsofeedback from a sample of one.
Yes.
So again, we're ignoring all ofthe other great feedback that we
(28:47):
get and we are honing in on thisone horrible piece of advice and
we're like, we've got to changeeverything about who we are.
Oh my gosh.
So Jenny, what is up next foryou?
Like, how are you going to goabout making the world a better
place?
Wow.
never give up, I think is thenext thing.
And.
I've been thinking a lot aboutmaking a difference both at work
(29:10):
as well as with my family andwhat I mean by that is I have
two daughters, my daughters arein elementary school, and I'm
starting to see how showing upfor them will enable them to
make a difference in the worldtoo.
So that's also something I'vethought a lot about is how I am
a mom and what example I settoo.
And in work, how I'm going tomake a difference is.
(29:33):
It's similar to the kids.
I want to empower others to betheir best self, because if I
can do that, I'm I'mexponentially increasing the
impact that I can have.
And that's also a place where ifpeople have a very engaging
experience or provide positivefeedback, keep those copies and
it helps you figure out eitherwhen you're at a low point
(29:55):
feeling like you want to give upor you're trying to figure out
how to be your authentic selfand what your superpowers are.
But that's how I want to makethe biggest difference.
That rings so true for me as amom with an 8 year old boy and a
5 year old girl.
I am constantly thinking abouthow I show up for them.
But what I will tell everybodyis don't put those unrealistic
(30:16):
expectations on being a mother.
Because that is one of thestickiest of lures.
That's a really good pointbecause I was thinking the other
day, the other day, you know,something sad happened and I was
crying.
And I was thinking about, I letthe girls see me cry.
And that's going to happen.
And I want them to see that andwhat it takes to work through
(30:38):
those emotions.
So I don't want them to see meas perfect.
Because again, that's what a lotof people think, that my career
has just been this perfecttrajectory and I've always
gotten everything I wanted.
And it's not true.
There's a lot of hard storiesbehind it.
Roles that I didn't get.
Harsh feedback.
People who didn't want to workwith me.
I mean, there's all sorts ofstories.
(30:59):
And yet I took those and learnedfrom them.
And so it really, to me, then isabout enabling everyone around
me to achieve their purpose inlife.
And that's so powerful becausekids watch us and they see those
steps and how many.
Adults do we know now that lookback and reflect on their
parents who weren't maybe asopen with their struggles to
(31:21):
say, like, well, it was alwaysperfect for my mom and she lived
this perfect life.
And we all know that's not thetruth when we peel back those
onions.
So showing up authentically,letting your children see those
disappointments and thoseemotions are going to help them
manage those emotions and thedisappointments and not let it
stop them when they hit thosered blocks.
(31:41):
Yes, because life is hard.
Life is hard, you know what?
I wish I was a 8 year oldsometimes, but we are doing the
best we can, dang it.
That's right, that's right.
Well, Jenny, one of my favoritequestions, this is one I always
end on, is knowing everythingthat you know now with your
climb, with growing up as one ofthe very first In Vitro Babies,
(32:05):
and just everything that you'veexperienced, what is the one
piece of advice?
You would give the Jenny juststarting out.
I would say you are worth it.
And I mean that because there'sso many concerns about, you can
hear them, the struggle that Istill have on whether I'm worth
it, whether I'll be able to makea big enough difference.
Will I achieve what I want?
(32:26):
And so I think it's going backand giving myself the knowledge
that I'm worth it, as well asthe ability to let go of some of
the fear, as fear, I think oftenholds us back, me back as well.
And I had a health scare withgiving birth to my first
daughter that allowed me to livewith less fear.
(32:49):
And so that's the other piece.
It's the you're worth it so thatyou can also live with less
fear.
Oh, that is so powerful.
I love it.
Well, Jenny, thank you so muchfor being here today.
This was an amazingconversation.
I love all of the things thatyou're doing, especially just
really emphasizing on making theworld a better place one person
at a time.
That is the ripple effect.
(33:10):
That is how we really drivechange.
So Jenny, thank you for beinghere.
It was such an energizingconversation.
Thank you.
Before we wrap up today, Ireally want to emphasize what
Jenny was saying about know yourworth and that you don't have to
earn your value.
Because if you are here, you areenough.
However, you sound.
However you look, however youshow up.
(33:32):
You are enough.
And I'm so glad that you tunedin today.
I am so grateful for you.
Make sure that you follow me onInstagram, LinkedIn, and all the
other socials for content, justlike this.
But one last thing before yougo, this is your reminder to
stop putting a ceiling on whatis possible and start breaking
through it.
Are you constantlyunderestimated and often the
only unheard voice in the room.
Are you constantly battling theunrealistic expectations that
live only in your mind?
Today's guest is no stranger tothese sticky floors, but she is
all about making the world abetter place.
Jenny Hoffman is a COO in theapparel industry seeking to
(01:34):
transform the industry for asustainable future.
And this woman has a PhD inbioengineering, crazy smart, and
a BS in biomedical engineering.
Now I am not one to read outresumes as intros, but I want
y'all to know this because Jennysticky floors relate to being a
woman in an industry.
Typically dominated by men.
(01:55):
She's had to process thefeedback that she needed to be
more like a man and even tochange her voice.
So if you are stuck living in aworld, built by men for men
y'all we need your voice.
Jenny will give you hands downthe best strategies to being
your authentic self.
However, that looks and soundsso that together we can cause
(02:18):
the ripple effect.
But that is not all onefascinating fun fact about Jenny
is that she is one of theworld's first in vitro babies.
And we talk all about how thatplays into her sticky floors.
You are listening to the podcastfrom now to next.
The podcast that empowers womento get seen, get heard and get
promoted.
I'm your host, Eric Ernie, andI've made it my mission to help
(02:41):
you break free from the stickyfloors, those limiting beliefs
and toxic behaviors to bustthrough the glass ceiling.
I'm obsessed with all things,growth and abundance.
And I'm here to talk you throughthe tried and true secrets to
get you to level up your careerand your life.
We talk about the hard stuffhere.
Imposter syndrome,perfectionism, fear and burnout.
(03:01):
So pull up a seat, pop it innearby.
A bed and let's dive in.
I am so excited that everyone ishere today because we have a
very special guest today.
Her name is Jenny Hoffman andJenny in essence is all about
making the world a better place,but I'm gonna let her tell you
all about it.
So Jenny, welcome.
How are you today?
(03:21):
I am great.
I'm so excited to be here.
Thank you for having me.
It's so fun.
For everyone who doesn't know, Ialways talk with my guests a few
minutes, in a different daybefore just to get to know them.
And Jenny's got a great story.
So Jenny, how about you kick itoff and just tell me a little
bit about who you are and whatyou do.
Well, if you don't mind, I'mgoing to start from the very
beginning of my life.
Let's do it! How the two of usconnected, uh, when we talked
(03:43):
before this as well.
so I am one of the first invitro fertilization babies, and
I felt like people made itpossible for me to be here, and
so that's what made Made me wantto always make a difference in
this world.
And so from that, then I, um,ended up getting my PhD in
bioengineering.
So I could try to engineerbetter solutions for others and
(04:06):
then started working in medicaldevices, everywhere from product
to leading businesses.
And now in the apparel industry,trying to make it a more
sustainable industry.
So I always search out thesemissions of making a difference
in the world.
And that's what really motivatesme.
Oh, I love it.
That's your why.
And you've known that your wholeentire life.
You felt that?
(04:27):
Well, it always sounds thatclear.
Um, but it's, it's never thatclear.
I mean, there's more behind it,of course, always.
And I think that I've spent alot of time, even in the last
five years or so, really gettingto know myself so that I could
define my why very clearly.
And that took a lot ofintrospection and time with
(04:48):
myself.
Um, So it wasn't always clear,but I always knew that there
was.
I've always had this energy,this passion and motivation.
And so it was identifying whatcreated that energy for me.
I love that.
So tell me about growing up asthis very first in vitro baby,
because number one, it wasn't ascommon back then as it is today.
(05:10):
Right?
Like now.
There's a lot of people outthere who are able to have
children because of in vitrofertilization.
But how was that for you growingup and especially like your
background with your parents?
Because you have amazing parentsas well.
Yes, I am very lucky to have thefamily that I have.
So a few things.
The first thing is that I wasthen in newspapers or on TV.
(05:33):
Occasionally, we never releasedmy.
identifying information becauseit was really controversial at
the time.
Many people thought that thatwasn't a way that people should
come into existence, especiallyat the time.
Um, but we really celebrated itas a family.
And so one of the things I sawwas that, you know, my family
(05:54):
for their religious backgroundmight, the extended family might
not have supported this, butthey did because they saw the
good that was coming of it.
So I saw this.
Um, people being willing tochallenge their assumptions and
take new perspective, that wasvery meaningful and has impacted
me throughout my whole life.
The second thing I'd say then isthat that kept coming up
(06:15):
throughout my whole life.
So even when I was in college, Idid a great course on theology,
ethics, and medicine.
And, um, it was all about.
these different topics, youknow, organ donation, who should
get the organ, how do you pick,like, come up with any topic
like that, but one of them wason reproductive technologies,
(06:36):
and even in college, it came upof different viewpoints.
So I suppose it's been this Inmy whole life, seeking to
understand differentperspectives, different points
of view, and how do wecollectively move forward.
And then the third thing I'd sayis the impact of my parents.
So clearly my parents werepioneers and willing to take The
(06:56):
risk to do something different.
even for my mom, that meant shetried to have another child
after me and was not able to,and it was a real impact on her
health.
Um, and so she decided it wasbetter to have one child than to
have two, but not be around.
And so.
I think I always learned fromthem.
She was also one of the firstfemale vice presidents at a
(07:20):
large bank.
I just always learned from themhow to appreciate different
perspectives, how to never giveup that grit determination and
try things new.
The idea that when you'rebetween a rock and a hard place,
that's when you innovate with anew solution.
Well, and what I love about thatand just this whole lesson here
(07:41):
is that It really teaches you tonot give up on those dreams,
right?
Like when you want somethingbadly enough, you will do
whatever it takes to go afterit.
And your parents fortunatelywere able to do that, but they
just, like you said, theypersevered, they had grit, they
wanted a child and they made ithappen.
So I think that's super amazing.
But they also.
(08:02):
evaluated their situation,right?
The, the desire for anotherchild, they had to weigh the
pros and the cons, you know,and, and unfortunately sometimes
those things don't work out, butyou take the time and you weigh
those.
Right?
So I think that's number oneamazing, you know, parents that
put all of that out there from avery young age, but talk to me
(08:22):
about, How this impacted yougrowing up, because I can only
imagine knowing what it took tobring you into the world, right?
All of the risk that wasinvolved, all of the
controversy, did that kind ofcreate a sticky floor for you?
And the fact that like, maybeyou felt like you always had to
show up and be this amazinghuman because of everything it
(08:44):
took to have you?
I definitely felt pressure thatI had to, like, deserve it,
deserve to be here, or had tomake an equal difference for
those that made it possible forme to be here, for like paying
it forward type of idea.
Now nobody put that pressure onme.
It's not like my parents orthose around me.
(09:04):
It was more that I felt thatway.
And so I think a lot of thesticky floor that I realized was
also the way I was thinkingabout things or approached life
as well.
And also this piece that italways looked really easy from
the outside in.
So I don't think peopleperceived that I put that
(09:25):
pressure on myself necessarily.
That led me then to try to putall my energy, my drive into
accomplishing things that couldmake a difference.
And I think many of us are wiredthat way, to try to accomplish
things.
And that's amazing until it goestoo far, is what I learned.
So it was trying to identifywhen it goes too far.
(09:46):
And I think you mentionedperseverance as well.
For me, it's how do you knowwhen that perseverance is
exactly what's needed versuswhen it's time to, to stop.
And so.
Being in touch with myself,trying to identify when that
time is, when it's, maybe it's atime when it's not about the
accomplishments, um, for thatmoment.
It's about just being.
(10:07):
I love that because this wholesticky floor of women putting
unrealistic expectations onourselves.
Is so heavy.
It's one that I struggle withbecause I look at these things
after I really dissect them, Iam like, no one wanted this.
No one asked for this.
But yet I have made it this ideain my mind that it has to be a
(10:28):
certain way or that I have toshow up a certain way.
Right?
Like, Very basic and noncriticalto life example is like using
paper plates at a family dinnerversus the nice plates, right?
Nobody cares what plate they'reeating off of.
And nobody is going to rememberwhat plate they ate off of in
five years.
So why does it matter?
And so what I would like to askyou, because this is an area I
(10:51):
struggle with is how do younotice?
That you start to put theseunrealistic expectations on
yourself.
And then what do you do to kindof pull yourself back from that?
The first thing I'd say is, Idefinitely suffer from this.
So let's be very clear, and thething I started with, so the
plates is a really good example.
I now did paper plates, uh, whenwe hosted Thanksgiving this
(11:12):
year.
The first thing I started withactually was when my daughters
were little, allowing them tohave mismatched socks.
I know that sounds very funny,but I wanted them to always have
matched socks, and I justcouldn't do it and let that go.
the first way to notice wasidentifying how it shows up in
my body.
So I hold tension in my leftshoulder, and so either start to
(11:34):
feel the tension or sometimesit's, like a racing of the heart
or a warmth that comes from thechest.
So it's identifying how yourbody is sending you a signal.
Is the first thing and becomingmore in tune with that, and I
would notice it afterward, andthen you start to just notice it
a little earlier and a littleearlier and a little earlier
(11:57):
over time.
And what I do for it, so what Ido for it, start with a place
where I'm willing to not beperfect or willing to not
accomplish.
Like I said, the socks were anexample.
Another example at work was, Iallowed an email to have a typo.
And, and I know that those arelittle examples, but they were
really meaningful, or Irealized, especially as I had
(12:20):
roles at work that were broaderand required more of me, I might
not as get as much preparationfor a presentation as I would
have liked.
So maybe I only practiced itonce and like, that's okay.
And I learned then to be able topresent without as much
preparation.
So I think what I do about it isfind a place where I'm willing
to not be perfect or not havethe accomplishment.
(12:43):
Give myself grace, supportmyself in whatever way is
needed.
After that, I worked a lot onself compassion and view
failure, not as failure, but aslearning.
I love both of those examples.
Number one, because themismatched socks really speaks
to my soul.
As a parent, I remember havingthese.
(13:05):
Gosh, unrealistic expectations,for lack of a better word, of
like, what my kid would wear,and how they would look, and da
da da da, and like, trying toget my child to style his hair
or do anything is an act of God,right?
He does not want to do any ofthat for anything, so I have to
remind myself, is this a battlethat I want to fight today?
And then in the workplace, thisis something I think and you can
(13:27):
probably really speak to thisbeing a woman in a male
dominated field is I am veryhard on myself when I make what
I would call like a publicmistake, right?
Like, if we're in a room and Irespond in a way, then later I'm
like, oh, I shouldn't haveresponded that way.
Or I should have been more.
whatever, Like more calm or moreprofessional.
(13:47):
I don't know.
But I, I know that I have atendency to beat myself up over
those.
And for me, what has helped hasreally been to just ask the
question of like, do you thinksomeone else is still thinking
about that?
And if the answer is yes, thenlike have that conversation with
the person to say, Hey, I didn'tmean to respond like that.
Here's how I should haveresponded.
(14:08):
This is, I'm sorry, right?
Because sometimes an apology isnecessary and like you can
course correct.
But if the answer is no, they'reprobably not thinking about
that.
Then I have to, like you said,have the grace, have the self
compassion to just move on.
Because if you're the only onethinking about it, it really
doesn't matter.
But I would love to talk aboutyour experience of being a woman
(14:31):
in a male industry.
Because I can imagine.
With all that you've done in thefield that you've done that you
have probably been One of theonly women in many of the room,
is that correct?
Yes the first thing i'd say isSimilar to your example, I
learned that being vulnerableand making mistakes can actually
(14:52):
be a positive.
I had this idea that being theonly woman, I had to show up
more prepared than anyone else,more perfect than anyone else.
And I still often show up thatway.
It's, again, how I'm wired.
Yep.
But I learned, that that wasn'talways serving me well.
What I mean by that was I gotthis feedback when I was first
(15:13):
trying to start lead otherpeople and that to me felt like
a very sticky floor in thetransition of a career going
from an individual contributorto leading others, and it felt
similarly with broaderleadership roles, and that first
time I tried to always show upas.
The most prepared, really ready.
And I got feedback then thatpeople were not feeling like
(15:36):
they knew me as a leader andwhat I was personally about.
And so I realized that thevulnerability to make a mistake
and then acknowledge thatactually built more trust and
more rapport with those that Iwould lead.
Then being the most prepared orbeing perfect.
And that actually built a lotmore trust.
(15:57):
And so it took thisvulnerability, this courage,
and, and I think that the otherpiece was the catch 22 that it
felt like as a woman.
The catch 22 between beingassertive, but oh, you're too
assertive or have a loudervoice.
Oh, not that voice.
and so I think that that was thehardest piece for me to navigate
(16:19):
and is something I continue tonavigate.
I think it's about balance is myconclusion.
How do you find the rightbalance?
You know, so some examples, Iwas given feedback at one point
to be more like a man whenworking with a surgeon customers
and be aggressive and assertiveand in their face.
And as you can tell from me,that's not my style.
(16:40):
So I had to figure out, like,okay, why are you telling me
that?
What was behind that feedback?
(18:17):
Okay, I should approach thatcustomer differently.
What do we mean by differently?
In what way?
Okay, we wanted to work withthem in a closer partnership, so
we were co creating.
Okay, we can do that.
But it doesn't mean that I haveto be more like a man to do
that.
And that was really important tome.
Another, I would say is anexample of, at one point I was
(18:38):
told that people didn't like myvoice, that my voice was too
high and some experienced it asshrill.
At the time, that was veryhurtful because I can't do
anything about my voice.
Now we know there are someexamples where women actually
tried to lower their voice.
And I actually ended up readinga lot about voice.
(18:59):
And my conclusion is it's again,it's one of those points of
feedback that you can't doanything about.
And so I've also tried to bevery.
There's gonna be some thingsthat people don't like about me
then.
I do have a higher registervoice.
But also, I'm not going to besorry for that.
I'm going to keep saying, beingme, and saying what I want to
(19:23):
say with my voice, and nothiding my voice.
This is almost like I would loveto go up to a man and be like,
you know what?
People would take you moreseriously if you were taller.
Like, what?
What do you do with that?
That's such crap.
You know, but I would love to dothat or like, actually, I think
people take you more seriouslyif you have a little bit more
(19:44):
hair.
Are you kidding me?
Like, that's wild to me.
So I would love to talk aboutthat because I know several
women who've had that samefeedback about their voice or
they don't sound serious enough.
And we know.
The, um, Theranos leader,Elizabeth Holmes, lowered her
voice.
We talked about that when wefirst met, like how crazy that
(20:05):
actually is and how much energyyou would have to pour into
remembering to change the, thesound of your voice with every
public interaction.
But when you got that piece offeedback, did you immediately
reject it or did it take a bitof time?
Like, walk me through that.
(20:26):
I did not immediately reject itbecause I am definitely someone
who likes to seek out.
I mean, feedback's a gift.
That's what we hear and thatwomen get less feedback than
men.
And so when I get feedback, I'mlike, great, I want to, what did
I do?
What can I do then?
And I actually was supported byother women who served as a
(20:47):
coach, basically on my personalboard of directors to say, when
you got feedback, you get tochoose what of it.
You decide to act upon and tome, that was really powerful
that it's my choice because Ialmost felt like feedback.
I get feedback.
It wasn't my choice, but no, I'min control.
I have the power to choose whatI take from it.
(21:07):
And it also caused me to view.
Where there are other aspects inmy life that I could make subtle
changes as, as a woman, and I'msure as many of us all say,
sorry, more frequently.
So I tried to cut that out andalso support others that I work
with to cut that out.
I also will say things like, Ithink that we should do this, or
(21:29):
maybe we should.
I know we should.
I'm trying to soften it.
So, trying to remove some ofthat.
Now, those I work with wouldtell you I still do these
things.
So, I'm trying to be moreconscious of them and more
assertive with, with who I amand how I want to show up and
lead.
All of that speaks directly tomy heart because I, all the
(21:53):
time, will say, Well, what doyou think?
Or, maybe we should do this.
Or, I make it very much thatgroup, like, We should go do
this instead of, I am going togo do this.
Because I want to be inclusiveand collaborative.
And, like, as women, we are toldthat this is how we have to show
up.
And I think we still have I justdid it again! I said, I think!
(22:15):
Dammit! Okay! Y'all are seeingit live, in the flesh, and I'mma
leave all that in there.
But, it is my belief that wemust show up and continue
because we have such a long wayto go before people really
accept that women can be directand not be a bitch.
Absolutely.
But it's gonna take some moretime.
(22:36):
I've worked a lot then on how toask questions that lead with my
perspective but are still opento input.
So maybe it's something likeInstead of, you know, what do
you all think, or what is youridea, I see a different
perspective, but help meunderstand yours.
Hmm.
(22:57):
So, or, my perspective is, andlead with it, how do you see
things differently?
So, it's subtle, but meaningful.
And it's not so far fetched, andI say this because So often
women are told that we have tochange how we show up, right?
(23:18):
Don't be so soft, don't be this,don't be that.
But then, if we show up super,like, authoritative or direct,
then it's not authentic to whowe are.
But I love how you put that.
It's just this very tiny, subtleshift in how you show up and ask
questions so that you are takenmore seriously.
You are being direct, but it isnot How do you deal with that?
(23:40):
When you're not authentic to whoyou are, that is so critical to
me.
So you hit that was a momentwhere my heart rate starts
racing a little bit.
I get a little heat and I'mlike, no.
Authentic is so important to me.
And words matching actions is soimportant to me.
And so if anybody gives feedbackthat you should be more like
(24:01):
someone else, don't listen toit.
That's the feedback to throwout.
Then it's trying to understandwhat is it they're really trying
to tell you and how do you makethat resonate for you?
Because I don't think any of usshould be somebody else.
We should be who we are.
That's the greatest impact wecan have in this world.
I think that's so powerfulbecause it's not about changing
(24:21):
who we are.
I mean, this is who we are atthe core, right?
Maybe some things have come infrom society.
Maybe some things have come ingenerationally from our parents
or However, we see the world,but don't go out to totally
change you, who you are in orderto climb the ladder or be
successful.
Show up as who you are, but makethese tiny, subtle shifts to
(24:42):
really just highlight who youare to be authentic, to be
vulnerable, to pull it back tothe very beginning of what you
said.
Oh, my gosh.
All of that is so great.
I would say if you had notwritten that down as she said
it, go back, get a pencil, writeit down.
Jenny, what other advice wouldyou give women who are looking
to really kind of establishtheir authentic self in the
(25:05):
workplace?
That's a great question and abig question.
That is a big question.
It feels like almost sheddingthe baggage or shedding the
scales to emerge as yourself.
So to me, that's what it feelslike.
And advice for how to do that?
is spend time with yourself.
I mentioned this earlier, butthings like, I started
(25:28):
meditating every day.
At the beginning I was like,Why?
What?
But some amount of time to bequiet.
And I say that as a working mom,because we're all there's always
50 things to be doing at anygiven time, and I'm always
trying to do them all.
And it comes across as veryoverwhelming much of the time.
So to actually pause and get toknow oneself is a real gift.
(25:53):
And sometimes I found thingsthat I liked and some things I
found that I didn't like asmuch, but accepting myself as
well.
So it's that, like, journey ofself discovery and accepting
what I found.
And I would encourage each ofyou to do that as well.
Get to know yourself and acceptyourself and view that you're
(26:16):
worth it.
Which is something I've longworked on and I'm still working
on because I had this feelingthat I had to almost like earn
the value.
And I don't think that's reallytrue, even though I still
struggle with it.
I think that's common with a lotof women.
(26:37):
Is knowing our worth and knowingour value when we walk into the
room and to speak a little bitto your story about feedback.
I once did a 360 and I got thefeedback that I was too much and
just like you, I like ran away.
I felt so horrible about thatfeedback because it really kind
(26:57):
of attacks your core being oflike who you are and I was like.
Again, flooded with impostersyndrome, flooded with this,
like, I don't deserve to behere, why am I here in this
executive role, like, clearly Ican't, I shouldn't be here.
And it was actually my mom whowas like, she basically said,
fuck that advice.
Like that's what got you to thisplace.
And I really had to sit withthat because.
(27:19):
My extraness, my loudness, myall of that is what got me to
where I am.
But that doesn't mean that Ican't make those tiny subtle
shifts that you were saying.
So I took that feedback,rejected a lot of it, but what
it did do was it taught me howto deal with that individual
person.
That if I wanted that person tohear my message, to approach
(27:42):
them in just a slightlydifferent manner.
Not change who I was or how Ishowed up.
But just alter with him, maybehow I delivered the message.
And so that was a reallypowerful moment for me.
But it also still blows my mindthat people think it's okay to
give that type of feedback.
What a great example, though.
And I think you highlighted therole of asking others.
(28:04):
That would be my other piece ofadvice.
Ask others.
Because I often found itdifficult to identify my own
value and my own superpowers.
So, for example, others wereable to help me identify that my
energy and passion that comesthrough and how that drives me
and then the way I care, bothfor those that I work with as
well as ultimately the end usersof what I work on, that's
(28:27):
authentic to me.
And they helped me see it.
So sometimes it's hard to expectourselves to identify.
That's a really great piece ofadvice because when someone
gives you feedback that is alsofeedback from a sample of one.
Yes.
So again, we're ignoring all ofthe other great feedback that we
(28:47):
get and we are honing in on thisone horrible piece of advice and
we're like, we've got to changeeverything about who we are.
Oh my gosh.
So Jenny, what is up next foryou?
Like, how are you going to goabout making the world a better
place?
Wow.
never give up, I think is thenext thing.
And.
I've been thinking a lot aboutmaking a difference both at work
(29:10):
as well as with my family andwhat I mean by that is I have
two daughters, my daughters arein elementary school, and I'm
starting to see how showing upfor them will enable them to
make a difference in the worldtoo.
So that's also something I'vethought a lot about is how I am
a mom and what example I settoo.
And in work, how I'm going tomake a difference is.
(29:33):
It's similar to the kids.
I want to empower others to betheir best self, because if I
can do that, I'm I'mexponentially increasing the
impact that I can have.
And that's also a place where ifpeople have a very engaging
experience or provide positivefeedback, keep those copies and
it helps you figure out eitherwhen you're at a low point
(29:55):
feeling like you want to give upor you're trying to figure out
how to be your authentic selfand what your superpowers are.
But that's how I want to makethe biggest difference.
That rings so true for me as amom with an 8 year old boy and a
5 year old girl.
I am constantly thinking abouthow I show up for them.
But what I will tell everybodyis don't put those unrealistic
(30:16):
expectations on being a mother.
Because that is one of thestickiest of lures.
That's a really good pointbecause I was thinking the other
day, the other day, you know,something sad happened and I was
crying.
And I was thinking about, I letthe girls see me cry.
And that's going to happen.
And I want them to see that andwhat it takes to work through
(30:38):
those emotions.
So I don't want them to see meas perfect.
Because again, that's what a lotof people think, that my career
has just been this perfecttrajectory and I've always
gotten everything I wanted.
And it's not true.
There's a lot of hard storiesbehind it.
Roles that I didn't get.
Harsh feedback.
People who didn't want to workwith me.
I mean, there's all sorts ofstories.
(30:59):
And yet I took those and learnedfrom them.
And so it really, to me, then isabout enabling everyone around
me to achieve their purpose inlife.
And that's so powerful becausekids watch us and they see those
steps and how many.
Adults do we know now that lookback and reflect on their
parents who weren't maybe asopen with their struggles to
(31:21):
say, like, well, it was alwaysperfect for my mom and she lived
this perfect life.
And we all know that's not thetruth when we peel back those
onions.
So showing up authentically,letting your children see those
disappointments and thoseemotions are going to help them
manage those emotions and thedisappointments and not let it
stop them when they hit thosered blocks.
(31:41):
Yes, because life is hard.
Life is hard, you know what?
I wish I was a 8 year oldsometimes, but we are doing the
best we can, dang it.
That's right, that's right.
Well, Jenny, one of my favoritequestions, this is one I always
end on, is knowing everythingthat you know now with your
climb, with growing up as one ofthe very first In Vitro Babies,
(32:05):
and just everything that you'veexperienced, what is the one
piece of advice?
You would give the Jenny juststarting out.
I would say you are worth it.
And I mean that because there'sso many concerns about, you can
hear them, the struggle that Istill have on whether I'm worth
it, whether I'll be able to makea big enough difference.
Will I achieve what I want?
(32:26):
And so I think it's going backand giving myself the knowledge
that I'm worth it, as well asthe ability to let go of some of
the fear, as fear, I think oftenholds us back, me back as well.
And I had a health scare withgiving birth to my first
daughter that allowed me to livewith less fear.
(32:49):
And so that's the other piece.
It's the you're worth it so thatyou can also live with less
fear.
Oh, that is so powerful.
I love it.
Well, Jenny, thank you so muchfor being here today.
This was an amazingconversation.
I love all of the things thatyou're doing, especially just
really emphasizing on making theworld a better place one person
at a time.
That is the ripple effect.
(33:10):
That is how we really drivechange.
So Jenny, thank you for beinghere.
It was such an energizingconversation.
Thank you.
Before we wrap up today, Ireally want to emphasize what
Jenny was saying about know yourworth and that you don't have to
earn your value.
Because if you are here, you areenough.
However, you sound.
However you look, however youshow up.
(33:32):
You are enough.
And I'm so glad that you tunedin today.
I am so grateful for you.
Make sure that you follow me onInstagram, LinkedIn, and all the
other socials for content, justlike this.
But one last thing before yougo, this is your reminder to
stop putting a ceiling on whatis possible and start breaking
through it.
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