Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:12):
Welcome to Harness Up
with Haste Draft Horses and
Mules, where we talk all thingsrelated to these magnificent
animals, from their history anduses to training and care.
We cover it all.
Join us as we chat with expertsand enthusiasts in the field,
(00:33):
share stories and tips andexplore the world of draft
horses and mules.
Whether you're a seasoned owneror just curious about these
gentle giants, this podcast isfor you.
So harness up and join HasteDraft Horses and Mules for some
lively discussions about theseGod-given creatures.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
Good afternoon folks.
Stephen Haste here Harness UpPodcast with Haste, draft Horses
and Mules.
We're here in Lexington,kentucky, today, beautiful city,
and I got the pleasure to sithere with a fellow I've been
waiting to talk to for a longtime, mr Herbert Reed.
My pleasure, good to meet you,buddy.
Y'all may have watched thepodcast back last summer I did
with Eric Reed, rich Strike,kentucky Derby.
(01:18):
This is his father.
Goes by Herbie, I think.
Yep.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
So goes by, herbie, I
think, yeah, so I'm famous.
I'm the father of 148thKentucky Derby winner.
That's right, you are the sire.
You're the sire.
And there, you know, there's alot of trainers that's winning
the Derby, that is.
But sire of a trainer, that's adifferent.
Speaker 2 (01:37):
You are the sire of a
trainer.
Speaker 3 (01:39):
I tell him he ruined
my life because just about
everywhere we go now we we goout to eat somebody's picked up
my ticket and they get ready toleave.
I said what?
Who did it?
I walk over and he said you'reEric's dad.
I said, yeah, man, I got hispleasure.
I said, hell, I got to putglasses on now so nobody
recognizes me when I go outbecause I don't feel normal, I
(02:01):
can't spend my money.
Was I don't feel normal, Ican't spend my money?
Was it like that right afterthe Derby?
Pretty bad.
Oh yeah, I've met people in thegrocery store.
Come up, you're Eric's dad.
Yeah, I knew it.
You look like him and all that.
We stand there and talk forever.
Speaker 2 (02:16):
Kind of proud to say
you're Eric's dad, though, yeah.
I am now Proud of it now.
Now, before we ain't going totalk about that, did you get
Eric into?
Speaker 3 (02:27):
horse racing.
You think yeah, when was?
Speaker 1 (02:29):
your race.
I didn't want him to get intoit.
Speaker 3 (02:31):
But he wanted into it
and he loved it.
From the time he was, I'd say,six years old on, he went to
track with me all the time,every day that he could go and,
like I told him at Churchill, bythe time he was seven, eight
years old he could put a spiderweb on a spider bandage on a
horse and most people don't evenknow what that is anymore.
(02:52):
It's a hard bandage to put onand he'd sit under them old
horses and stuff and I neverthought about it then, but now I
think about it.
It was dangerous.
It's a wonder he hadn't gothurt.
You know thoroughbreds are highstrung.
He's in there sitting under ahorse that's seven, eight years
old.
Looks like I'm trying to getrid of him or something.
You know he loved it.
(03:13):
But yeah, he never got hurt,thank God, because you know he
could have got kicked or a horsecould have jumped on him or
something at being that age.
But he loved horses right fromthe start.
He went to high school,graduated with high honors and
he could have went to anycollege he wanted to go.
But he said I don't need to goto college, I know what I want
(03:34):
to be?
I'm going to be a horse trainer.
I'm going to train horses.
Where was you born and raised?
I was born in Powell County,stanton, on the old Dirksen farm
, eastern Kentucky.
Then you moved to Lexington whenI was 10, maybe going on 11.
I hitchhiked from Powell Countyfor sales.
(03:56):
Of course everybody hitchhikedback then.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
At 10 years old, you
did.
Speaker 3 (04:01):
Yeah, I wasn't quite
11.
And I had an aunt that lived inMilner there for sales and this
old guy in a cattle truckpicked me up and he was taking
cows out on 33 for somebody andhe was a big heavyset guy and I
knew I was scared to death.
When we got for sales I saidhe's going to take me to because
(04:22):
he kept asking me questions.
Now your family know you'recoming.
I said he's gonna take me tocause he kept asking me
questions.
Now your family know whatyou're coming.
They know who.
I said, oh yeah, my aunt knowsI'm coming.
She didn't know I was coming.
I told him.
I said she knows I'm coming,I'm gonna be there.
And I said he said, well, howfar is it from sales?
I said about a mile.
Well, it's about four and ahalf miles from for sales to
Milton.
But we got there and you pullup.
When you go to get on 33 forsales you pull right up the
(04:44):
stoplight and there's acourthouse there.
You take a left.
Next street is Rose Hill Streetand that's where he let me off.
But when he pulled up to thecourthouse I just knew he was
going to take me in and say, hey, I think this kid's running
away from home or something.
But he didn't.
He told me.
He said, look, this is againstmy better judgment.
Why did you want to go toVersailles?
(05:06):
My aunt was there, okay, and Iwas leaving Because people I was
staying with there.
I was staying with some peoplein Powell County and I'd heard
them talking the day before like, well, you know, he needs
somebody.
They need to come and get him.
He needs to be under somebody'scare or something.
He's going to get hurt, he'sgoing to get killed.
(05:27):
He's on his own, nobody guidinghim and all this stuff.
I heard them saying it.
And we can't afford to keepanother kid.
We've got all we can do.
So when I heard that, I knew itwas time to leave.
You got out, so I got out ofthere and I did that several
times.
I stayed with a lot of auntsand uncles there for sales.
I wouldn't stay home.
(05:48):
My dad remarried and mystepmother she hated me for some
reason and I didn't like hereither, but I'd say the reason
is my mother probably had mespoiled, rotten because, because
Well, well, well.
Speaker 2 (06:11):
Yeah, excuse me a
minute.
So how did you get into thehorse scene?
Speaker 3 (06:21):
Well, I got to
Frisell's and I stayed with four
or five people different therefor sale, but my aunt was the
best one I ever stayed withHazel and she had three kids and
I heard her father.
My uncle worked for JohnConnolly, the singers, daddy
Okay, and he got run through asilage cutter and they buried
(06:43):
him in a plastic bag.
He was pulling, you know, itgot hung up and he was pulling
it out and it jerked him through.
Then I stayed with three or fourother people there for sales
coming up.
But I was staying with thesepeople and Ray Passmore he was a
little rider at them, smalltracks and stuff a jockey and he
(07:06):
said won't you go to the trackwith me tomorrow?
It was on a Sunday morning andI said, well, yeah, I'll go out
with you.
And I went out there with him.
I was 14 years old.
So I went out there with himand I watched him.
He got on seven, eight head ofhorses and we was coming home
and I said did they pay you todo that?
And and we was coming home andI said did they pay you to do
that?
And he said, well, if theydidn't, I wouldn't be doing it.
And I got to thinking, man,this guy just made $16, and I'm
(07:30):
making $18 a week, working sevendays a week.
I said, well, I can do that.
He said, yeah, you could, butyou've got to be 16 to get on
horses.
They won't hire you.
But he said you know, go to afarm, start out with horses and
learn about them.
So I went to work for ScottMiller, mac Miller's brother,
there for sales and I was doingmares and foals and I knew right
(07:54):
off the bat.
When I first started foolingthem foals, I was in love.
You was hooked.
I loved horses but I wanted toget on horses.
I wanted to ride horses becauseI was thinking about that.
Two bucks a head.
I said man, that's big moneyVersus 18 a week, yeah.
So I go across the street andDoug Davis had a farm called
(08:17):
High Hope Farm and Dick Spillerwas his assistant, he run the
show for him and a little blackguy about five foot seven or six
and I asked him.
I said y'all need any helpbreaking urines.
And this was right aboutSeptember, first or second week
(08:40):
of September, and I was gettingready to turn 15 or 16.
I can't really remember if itwas 15 or 16.
I think it was 15 in October.
My birthday is October 4th.
So he said you ever been on anyhorses?
I said yeah, yeah, bro, neverbeen on a horse in my life.
He said well, show up hereMonday morning, come here Monday
(09:01):
morning at 7 o'clock and hesaid we'll give you a shot.
I showed at 7 o'clock and hesaid we'll give you a shot.
I showed up at 7 o'clock, wentin there and stalled.
He called me in.
He was looking at me.
No, I had old shoes on soulfalling off.
Didn't have a hammock, none ofthat stuff.
Didn't have to then, but youknow most of them did.
But he put the bridle on thehorse and I was on the other
(09:23):
side.
He, he put the bridle on thehorse and I was on the other
side.
He laid the saddle up and I'mstanding there and he said what
are you doing?
And I said well, he said comearound here a minute, I come
around.
He said number one, you ain't16.
I said yeah, I am.
He said no, you ain't Quit thatdamn line, you ain't 16.
And he said number two youain't never been on a horse.
You don't even know what sideto get on a horse.
I said yeah.
(09:44):
He said I told you quit thatline.
And he told reporters atKeeneland that one time they
interviewed him before he passedaway and he said now, look, I
know you're having a hard time.
He said I'm going to give you achance.
But he said you know I've got awife, three or four kids, and
you ain't going gonna cost me myjob.
(10:04):
He said now, I'm gonna show youwhat to do and if you can do it
, fine.
If you can't, you got to go.
And I said that's fair enough.
And he told me you know, welaid across from a while, turn
around.
And he let me get on him and hesaid now when you turn him left
, just kind of nod him a littlebit to right, don't kick him
hard, don't pull on his mouth,because they've never had
anything in their mouth and ifyou pull hard they'll flip
(10:26):
backwards on you and if you kickthem hard they're going to.
You know, jump.
He said, just go 50-50 with him, be easy.
These was two-year-olds, right?
Yeah, yearlings, yearlings,Yearlings Never been on.
So I was lucky again.
I had five horses and not a oneof them was crazy.
Now, how lucky, because backthen they didn't handle horses
(10:46):
like they do today.
Today they're like little dogs.
You can walk up and pet them inthe field, you know.
But I was lucky Boy.
I didn't have one that wasjumping, kicking.
Them other boys had themjumping, kicking, bucking.
So we stayed in the stall about, I guess, six or seven days and
he said now we're going out inthe shed row.
They had more room out there,you know.
(11:07):
We went out and stayed in theshed row, walked them around,
walked them around andfigure-aided them and stuff and
did that for about, I'd say,about a week.
Then we went out in the fieldand when we went out in the
field and come back he told me.
He said you're going to be okay.
That made you feel good, yeah.
Speaker 2 (11:29):
He said you got good
hands on the horse and you're
not scared, you're going to beokay.
Speaker 3 (11:33):
And that made me feel
real good.
How long did you work for him?
I was with Doug about a year, Iguess.
And then I went to Kingland.
I went to Kingland, I went toKingland with Doug, got on
horses out there, never been onthe racetrack.
I had to learn the poles.
You know, the green and whitepoles are eighth pole, black and
(11:55):
white 16th, and if you're atKingland you count them
backwards, you know when you goback.
So it didn't take me long topick that up.
So I just got lucky.
And then I got with the right.
I was in the kitchen breakinghorses for Ernest Woods and
Laurel T Stevens and me and MrWoods and Tommy just headed off
(12:18):
and man, we were just like bestfriends.
Mr Woods loved me to death andTommy did too.
And Tommy come in there onemorning and he said, look, won't
you get your trainer's license?
And he said what we'll do thehorses that won't make it to the
big?
You know that ain't working.
Don't look like they're goingto make it to the big track.
We just keep around here andrun them and sell them, or
(12:39):
somebody claim them or something.
And I said, man, I can't trainno more or something.
But he said, yeah, you can.
He said you, you.
And we sat there and talked fora long time and he talked me
into it.
So I did, I went and got mytrainer's license and I was with
Mr Woods for maybe 20 years himand him and Lord Stevens yeah,
I credit Lord Stevens withgiving me a chance to be a
(13:01):
trainer, but you know I never.
I was never assistant trainerfor anybody and never run a barn
for anybody.
But I listened to the oldtrainers and I watched what they
did and I picked up on it.
It's just common sense and Ijust happened to be good at it
and had a talent for it and Iwas lucky.
Speaker 2 (13:20):
What was your
favorite memory of back in your
training years, with the 20years, like your favorite race
or something, favorite race,favorite race you trained at.
Speaker 3 (13:31):
Well, I mostly run at
the little tracks.
You know, I didn't run.
I'd run horses at Kingland andI'd win at Kingland.
Speaker 2 (13:36):
What tracks would?
Speaker 3 (13:36):
that be Bule Park,
fairmont, ellis, miles Park, had
old Miles Park then and youknow, had old Miles Park then
and you know those little trackslike that.
We'd just take horses thatwouldn't go anywhere else and
run them and hope somebody wouldclaim them.
If they didn't claim them,they'd run good enough.
We could sell them after therace and if they didn't do that,
(13:59):
then he'd end up giving them tosomebody, you know for a
pleasure horse or something.
But I didn't run any real good.
I had good horses and I gotthem ready and shipped them out,
some real good horses and uh,but uh to run them.
You know it's hard to train ona.
I was a little track in thewintertime.
Keep a horse fit to run, keephim in shape, so anything.
(14:22):
It looked like it had a lot oftalent.
We'd send up the road somewhere.
Speaker 2 (14:26):
You still hanging out
with Eric giving pointers and
things.
Now I don't talk to him muchabout horses?
Speaker 3 (14:31):
You don't?
No, he knows too much.
I see, makes me feel bad.
I feel inferior to him now.
Speaker 2 (14:37):
Hey, at least you can
go over to his barn and still
hang out and get the feel ofyeah, I tell everybody.
Speaker 3 (14:41):
I said the boy can't
train Lassie to bark, but damn,
he won the derby.
He did win the derby yeah, hedid.
He won a whole lot of races hewon the derby.
I'd say he won more races inabout three years than I did in
my whole career.
He was just good, he loved it.
I mean, you know you findsomething you love to.
(15:07):
Oh, yeah, I did.
But you know, after I guess Itrained for about 40 years and I
just got burnt out.
You know, seven days a week andI was coming up the old way you
had to be the first one to barn, the last one to leave, and you
had to check the temperature,all this crazy stuff, and you
know, and it just, and the helpchanged too.
You know, back when I firststarted them grooms you say
something about one of themhorse, he'd fight you.
They had pride in what they did, you know.
Speaker 2 (15:30):
They got aggressive.
Yeah, they did.
Speaker 3 (15:32):
They loved their
horses and that.
But the horse business reallysaved my life.
The horse business and Eric Her.
Speaker 2 (15:42):
Her, your wife.
Speaker 3 (15:43):
Yeah, I met her, I
was 16.
What's her name?
Glenda Glenda she's over there.
I was 16.
She got lucky that day I mether.
She's been lucky ever since 61years we've been married.
Did you get married inVersailles?
I was 16.
She was 17.
When Eric was born I was justturning 18.
(16:06):
When Eric was born, how manychildren you got.
Two boys.
We knew we couldn't affordanother one, so I had to bisect
him because it was cheaper,that's right.
So we didn't have any more.
They said that's all we canafford, that's cheaper yeah.
And we looked at them, two uglysoxers, and thought we don't
want any more really.
Speaker 2 (16:28):
After you did horse,
did you work anywhere else other
than horse racing?
No, you just did horse racingyour whole life.
Speaker 3 (16:32):
That's all I ever did
in my whole life.
Now, when I was young, comingup, I worked in tobacco and hay
and straw for people there Forsales, Roy Snap I was with him
for about seven, eight monthsand his son's one of Eric's best
friends, Frankie Snap.
Speaker 2 (16:47):
So you know what it's
like to cut a stalk of tobacco
and hang it and strip it.
Yes, I do.
Speaker 3 (16:50):
I've cut it and they
put me on the top rail because
you know you only put one railout, the one's on the bottom.
Speaker 2 (16:58):
I've been on the top
rail many a day.
Speaker 3 (17:00):
Yeah, that's some of
the hardest work you'll ever do
that tobacco.
Speaker 2 (17:05):
I tell people all the
time you don't know a day's
hard work until you cut tobaccoand hang it.
Speaker 3 (17:10):
You got that right.
Speaker 2 (17:11):
Did Eric ever get to
experience that?
Speaker 3 (17:13):
No, I didn't want him
to get blisters on his hands.
I see He'd be using them onhatchets and things.
Speaker 2 (17:20):
I think some of the
prettiest horse barns in the
state are old tobacco barns.
Speaker 3 (17:25):
They are.
Speaker 2 (17:25):
That they redo.
Speaker 3 (17:26):
And you know it's a
shame.
You see them getting rid ofthem all the time and it's part
of our culture.
Speaker 2 (17:34):
I love how they put
blacktop down the center of them
.
Old tobacco barns yeah, andit's still got that smell in it.
Yeah, but it's a horse barn yes, just something about it.
It's Kentucky.
Yeah, a lot of people don'tunderstand.
Nope, it's a feel in this state, in this area.
Yeah, but you can't get nowhereelse.
No, you can't.
Speaker 3 (18:00):
Race day is a feel,
oh my God, A dream come true.
I'm telling you.
On the way home, I still had ahard time believing it.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
Did you have a
feeling at all that day he was
going to win?
Speaker 3 (18:08):
I knew it wasn't
going to be last.
I told everybody.
I said I can tell you one thing, because if you looked at his
chart I got really high on himwhen he ran the last race at
Turfway.
I got really high on him whenhe ran the last race at Turfway.
He should have won that race byfour or five lengths, got in
trouble three different timesand still run third.
And I'm thinking this horse isfor real.
I come home I told Glenn I saidhe's for real, this horse can
(18:29):
run with these horses.
So he proved he could run withthem and he was always catching
them at the end.
So that extra eighth of a mile,shame on him.
he was on top of him man, it was, uh, I, but I.
I was telling her.
I said, man, if you just finishin the middle of the pack,
you've got a hell of a horse.
(18:50):
You're running against the bestthree-year-olds in the country,
in the world.
He won.
So you, yeah, he run over maybeUnbelievable.
Speaker 1 (19:00):
What was?
Speaker 3 (19:00):
unbelievable is that
he got him there.
He took him there Most trainers.
If I'd have claimed that horsefor $30,000, I'd have run him
back for $50,000 and hope he'dwin.
Get my money back.
Then I'd maybe run him back ina non-winners of a race other
than or non-winners of two.
No way I'd have run him in agreat mistake trying to get
derby, uh.
(19:22):
But eric told me he didn't havethat horse two weeks, wasn't it?
He called me.
He said I got the best horseever trained in my life.
And I'm thinking, man, you hada philly got beat what a head by
rachel alexander.
I said how can you say that?
And he said, believe me, that'sthe best horse ever run, ever
had in my life.
And I said, well, good luckwith that.
Sure enough he was right.
(19:44):
You didn't believe it.
No, no way, and you know it wasfunny.
Going up there I took $300 withme and I didn't tell many
people this because I told her.
I said I'm gonna bet a hundredacross the board and I'm gonna
put it in a frame and put it onthe wall.
And we got up right in bed.
A dime, I chickened.
We got up there.
I didn't bet a dime, Ichickened out.
Speaker 2 (20:01):
You didn't bet on
Rich Strike.
Speaker 3 (20:02):
No, I didn't bet a
dime.
Well, we was coming home andeverybody in the car was loaded.
Anybody that didn't knowanything about a horse was
betting on Rich Strike becauseof Eric and us, you know, and I
didn't bet on him.
I didn't bet a penny.
I told Eric.
I said, look, everybody gotmoney.
We worked all our life in thehorse business and I ain't got
nothing.
I didn't bet a dime on him.
(20:28):
But you know, you take mosthorse people you could put a gun
to their head and they wouldn'tbet on him.
Looking at him, you know you'dwin one race.
But if you looked at his chartyou go back and look at his
chart he'd come running afterthem horses every time.
The only time he wasdisappointed was when you took
him to Louisiana and they had tostay in the stall for three
days.
And he's a high, strong horse,he's got to do something every
(20:49):
day.
And Eric said he tried to tearthe paddock up but like never
got the saddle on him and hedidn't run good that day.
But other than that, every racehe was coming at them.
I mean he'd come running atthem.
Speaker 2 (21:02):
Do you still travel
to track some and go?
No, I don't.
You stay in Lexington aroundhere.
Speaker 3 (21:07):
Yeah, I got a bed and
breakfast and we had a little
wedding venue.
We have a daycare there forsales.
My wife's been in the daycarebusiness for about what?
45 years.
Speaker 2 (21:18):
Still doing it.
Speaker 3 (21:23):
Yeah, she's us for
about what?
45 years still doing it.
Yeah, she still got one therefor sale.
So you know it keeps us busyand I I do the.
I got like maybe nine acre farmand I don't know any horses on
it no, no.
Speaker 2 (21:30):
So if you want to see
horses, you just go to eric's
barn, yeah yep, that's now.
Speaker 3 (21:38):
if he'd find me one
night red strike for $30,000, I
might get back in it.
You might buy it, yeah.
But when you can claim a horseworth five-eighths of a mile and
$59,000 for $30,000, you better.
Speaker 2 (21:50):
He was at the right
place at the right time, yeah.
Speaker 3 (21:52):
Well, you know he
took a chance because most
people you take a horse thatworked like that and they they
run him for 30, there'ssomething whole in him somewhere
or something bad, wrong.
But they took a chance and gotcaught the way.
Speaker 2 (22:05):
I seen it Got good.
Speaker 3 (22:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:07):
Real good.
What's the name of your bed andbreakfast there?
Rabbit Creek, and anybody cancome stay at it.
Huh yeah, that's nice.
For a small fee For a small fee.
Does she cook them breakfast?
Speaker 3 (22:21):
Yeah, we fix them
breakfast.
I sit in there and shoot thebull with them and talk to them.
Can she cook it?
Good, sometimes I take themaround, you know, to some of the
farms or something, becausethey like to hear about horses.
You know, most of them don'tknow anything about horses.
Speaker 2 (22:35):
A little tour.
Yeah, bluegrass tour, that'sneat.
Yeah, that's neat.
Keeneland's still going strong.
You don't go over and watch any.
Speaker 3 (22:46):
Well, if he's running
something, you know, a big race
or something I might go over,you'll go check it out.
You know, when I left KeenelandI had some horses two real good
friends of mine and I told them.
I said I'll keep them whenthey're gone, I'm out, I ain't
never training them more and Ileft.
It was like somebody took twotons off my back.
You know, it's seven days aweek of my whole life.
(23:07):
That's all I ever did.
I was married to it.
You don't get Christmas, newYear's Thanksgiving, none of
that stuff.
You know.
And I was just, I was burnedout.
Speaker 2 (23:17):
Kind of like my dad
and me growing up.
We had a dairy farm, oh gosh,Well he was married to it.
Speaker 3 (23:21):
I milked Now I'd have
to ask, I think it was 12 or 13
cows when I was with Roy Snapevery morning and every night by
hand, and he had two old sets.
No, he had two old sets ofmilkers, Okay, and I'd milk one
by hand while they was doing itso I could get done quicker.
And they'd eat those old wildonions out there and they'd come
(23:41):
out in that milk and they'd getthat mass of titus and you'd
have to stick that tube up inthere I forget what it's called
and they'd kick you from here tothat door sometimes.
It's a wonder I hadn't gotkilled.
Speaker 2 (23:53):
We had kickers we put
over their hips and tightened
them up to keep them where theycouldn't kick.
Yeah, I didn't have that.
Speaker 3 (23:59):
We had them at the
barn, man it was.
I mean, you put it in a can.
It was all I could do to dragit to the road.
I had to drag it maybe fromhere to the house to the road
and it was all I could do todrag it out there, because you
know hell, I wouldn't weigh 120pounds in 115.
Speaker 2 (24:14):
Back a few years ago
I was at an Amish house.
I got a lot of friends that areAmish.
This woman makes cottage cheese, homemade cottage cheese.
I love cottage cheese.
Well, they brought me some out.
I like it too.
I got a bite of that stuff andit was that old green onion milk
.
I about lost it.
It turned me against milk.
It's funny you say that aboutthat.
(24:34):
It turned my stomach.
I told that woman.
Speaker 1 (24:38):
I said your cottage
cheese is good man, but God
bless that cow that's got themwhite onions.
Speaker 2 (24:43):
I couldn't eat it.
I could not eat it.
I know what you mean.
I could not eat it.
I got turned against milkpretty much period.
Now the smell of raw milk allmy life.
Speaker 3 (24:52):
Oh, that's the way I
am.
I hardly ever drink it.
Speaker 2 (25:00):
I'd rather have a
bottle of Gatorade or something.
Yeah, anything but milk.
Give me no milk.
Speaker 3 (25:03):
The horse business
has took you a lot of places,
though it sure has.
My wife and I.
We started out.
We didn't have a pot to pee inor a window to throw it out of
and I bought an old 52 pink Fordoff of Larry Long's brother out
on Farmingtown Road give him$50 for it.
(25:23):
And the door was wired on theright side.
The door was wired together.
He couldn't open it and he toldme.
He told me the truth.
He said it looks like junk.
But he said I'll tell you rightnow.
He'll take you there and bringyou back the motor and
everything is good.
It's just junky.
And I said I ain't worriedabout that, I just need
something to run.
And she and I got in.
(25:46):
It took off one morning we ranoff and got married and went to
Jellicoe, tennessee.
Jellicoe had a guy with me,trying to think his name Wayne
Dunn.
He drove us up there and hesigned the paper.
We got married in a little oldbuilding.
I don't even know if the guywas a real minister or not, to
(26:07):
tell you the truth.
But we came back.
We didn't tell her father athing because I was afraid he'd
kill me.
Speaker 2 (26:15):
So you didn't ask him
before you died, we didn't say
nothing.
Speaker 3 (26:19):
So she told her
mother and her mother said oh my
gosh, you've got to tell yourdaddy.
Well, that night she called me.
She said If we're going, we'vegot to go.
So I went, got her, picked herup.
We got in that old Ford andwent to Louisville Now, this is
a God's truth.
The whole door wired together.
(26:39):
I was working Charlie Durbin,when I was with Doug Davis.
He was taking money.
Every week he'd give me half acheck and he'd take the other
half and he said I'm going tosave it for you.
He said you don't need thismoney, you ain't going to spend
it, I'm going to save it for you.
Everybody on the farm kepttelling me that man he'd say
you'll never see that money.
So that man, he'd say you'llnever see that money.
So we got ready to leave.
I went down and told him, Itold Charlie what I was going to
(27:00):
do and he said man, youshouldn't do that, you'll make a
bad move.
But he said wait a minute.
He went back and come back andI think I had like $600 or
something.
That was a lot of money then,hell, we thought we was rich
there about two or three daysand I told Glenn.
I said, hey, we got to get out,we got to go back home, we
(27:21):
can't stay here.
I got to work, we got to getmoney somewhere.
So we come back home and we gotan apartment, old Yocum Motel.
You know where it used to be,on, not just really, it's right
across from where you're goingto UK, okay, to UK.
Okay, it was a big motel thereand right across the road was a
(27:42):
little house and they had twobedroom apartment up over the
the huh, yeah, one bedroom andit was two rooms, right, two
rooms.
And, uh, we rented that rightacross and the guy that
underneath us in the main househe worked for the railroad all
his life and retired, so welived there for about what five,
(28:02):
six months, yeah, and Iremember she'd come get me.
We'd sit there and kiss for 20minutes before we drive off
using love oh god, what made yougo?
Speaker 2 (28:15):
to Jellicoe to get
married.
You could do that, then youcould run to Tennessee, go to
Jellicoe to get married.
You could do that, then youcould run to Tennessee State
Line.
Speaker 3 (28:20):
You could go to
Tennessee, cross the straight
line and get married.
You can't do that.
Well, you probably can.
Now Was 75 here.
Speaker 2 (28:26):
Then they changed
that then Was I 75 here then.
Speaker 3 (28:29):
No, I don't believe
it was.
Speaker 2 (28:30):
So you took the old
road to Jellicoe yeah and went
down there and got married.
Speaker 3 (28:34):
Yeah.
So when we we were, I guess shewent back to the house.
I came home, she went in.
Anyway, she, when she told herfather, uh, I was out farm, and
he pulled up out there and oldScott Miller was in the barn and
he said, uh, I said man, Iain't going out there.
He said go on out there.
He said you got to go out andtalk to this man and tell him,
(28:58):
tell him what happened, tell himwhat you did.
He said you've got to go outand talk to this man and tell
him what happened, tell him whatyou did.
He said you've got to man up.
And I said, oh God.
He said don't worry, I'm goingto be standing right here.
He said if anything gets out ofhand, he said I'll come out and
talk to you.
I said okay, and I went outthere and talked to him and he
told me.
He said well know, I don'tappreciate the thing you just
did.
(29:18):
And he said it's wrong what youall did.
And he said I could take it andforce you to, but he said I'm
not going to do it.
He said see where you end up.
And within a year's time he wasmore.
My father, her mother andfather was more my mother and
father than they was hers andher sister.
Because he, you know, he seenthat I was going to work and I
(29:41):
was determined to have something, and so it turned out they were
as much my parents as they werehers.
And I got lucky there again,because her daddy was smart.
He'd take a dime and make adollar out of it, you know and
he taught me how to dopercentage and stuff like that.
You know, he was just a verysmart person well if you run off
(30:03):
and got married.
Speaker 2 (30:03):
It turned out okay.
You're still married 61 years.
What's the secret from herbertreed to be married?
Speaker 3 (30:10):
yes, dear, tell all
the people just yes, dear, just
yes.
If she said this was red, I'dsay it does have a red color on
it yes, dear yes dear, and itworks.
It took me about four years torealize that and some bumps on
my head, but I finally realizedthat she's always right.
Well, that's good.
Speaker 2 (30:29):
It turned out.
Speaker 3 (30:30):
We both worked hard
and we, when we was 26 or 27, we
took her first trip to Europe,went to England and Scotland.
She had a pen pal in Scotlandshe'd been writing to since she
was about five or six years old.
You flew over and we flew overthere, she and I, and we'd been
in what 80-something countries?
Golly, yeah, for two old peopleto come up with nothing and I
(30:54):
come up on the streets withnothing, and you know, I think
we've done pretty good.
The Lord's blessed you.
Yeah.
The horse business blessed ustoo.
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (31:07):
That's a true horse
business Kentucky story right
there.
Speaker 3 (31:10):
I remember when I
sold my first horse.
I sold the first horse, Ididn't have a clue, and the guy
I think we sold him for $25,000.
And that was a lot of money.
Then too, that was a nice horse.
And next morning he came overand gave me a check for $2,500.
And I said what's this for?
He said that's your percentagefor selling that horse.
And I'm thinking why in thehell would I run a horse?
(31:33):
Why do you want to run horseswhen you can make that kind of
money selling?
I was into that sellingbusiness from then on.
That was like when I went outwith him for riding and he was
getting two bucks a head.
I didn't have to be a genius tofigure out where the big money
was.
Speaker 2 (31:47):
So you sold a lot of
race horses.
Speaker 3 (31:49):
I sold a lot of nice
horses.
I sold Jack Slade, he made 700and something thousand.
Troy Seale had him and I hadLieutenant Lark, he made I guess
he made like 700,000 racing andstuff.
But I sold some good horses.
Yeah, bought them and resoldthem.
Well, I didn't buy them, Ibought them for clients.
Yeah, sold them to clients.
Speaker 2 (32:10):
Yeah, so you run the
commission business, so I got
lucky.
Yeah, that's good.
Speaker 3 (32:16):
And I enjoyed the
racing too when I was younger.
You know it was going, butafter a while it gets old,
because I'd go up with everyhorse and I'd walk over to the
paddock with every horse, youknow, and all that stuff.
And that's ridiculous.
They ain't going to run.
No better if you walk over withthem than they are if you don't
.
Speaker 2 (32:31):
From your time in the
horse business.
You've been in it a long time.
Two years, yeah, four years.
What's the biggest change?
Speaker 3 (32:44):
you've seen in the
race industry from when you
started until now.
Well, the rules and regulationsnumber one, oh yeah.
Yeah, they've just about endedit Because you know, when I was
in it you had a real cheap horseman.
You had to do what you could doto make him pay his way and get
through.
So we'd inject them withcortisone or something if they
soar, give them butazolin likeyou take aspirin well, you can't
(33:08):
give a horse nothing today.
You can't help them and that's ashame too, because it's like
they'd rather see you run ahorse hurting than run one
that's not hurting, you knowthey test them big time now,
don't they?
Speaker 2 (33:20):
Yeah, blood, test
them.
Speaker 3 (33:22):
Yeah, I couldn't
train a horse today.
I just couldn't do it.
You know you've got to have avet come out and watch a horse
jog down the road after you'veworked him and all that stuff.
I mean, come on.
Speaker 2 (33:33):
Do you really have to
do that?
Speaker 3 (33:34):
Yeah, you work a
horse the next day.
They got to watch him walk andjog and make sure he pull up,
all right and all that stuff youknow right, eric, I mean it's
ridiculous, unreal, yeah.
But I took a horse and I took ahorse to I believe it was
Belmont Aqueduct one time andrun him.
He'd win three in a row.
(33:55):
And I took him to Mac Millerbecause I knew Mac when I was
working there.
And uh, I worked him at twodays before the race and they
had a big ride up in the farm,second coming of Hindu and all
that stuff.
And I took Alan when he wasriding him.
He was uh, he was from uh, newZealand and uh got down there
(34:19):
and Alan, for some reason theyfound something on him.
They wasn't going to let himride, but they ended up letting
him ride anyway and Mac told mehe said there ain't nothing up
here that can touch you.
And a horse belonged to PaulHoneycutt and I don't know if
y'all know Paul Honeycutt, he'sa big guy here in Lexington and
anyway, he coming out of theturn he switched leads and he
(34:45):
broke a coffin bone in his backleg and we didn't do any good.
So we come back home and abouta week later I was standing down
there at the rail and John Wardcame over and he said Herb,
sorry about what happened up inNew York.
He said is everything okay?
And I said no.
I said they fined me and Alanboth.
(35:05):
He said what do you mean?
Fined you.
I said well, they fined me $200for impersonating a trainer and
Alan Rennie $500 forimpersonating a rider.
He started laughing.
Speaker 2 (35:23):
You got a lot of
memories from this.
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (35:25):
And I had a lot of
old people work for me.
Barney Marshall worked for mefor a long time, off and on, and
he had the only filly that beatSilver Spoon.
And one time Barney was one ofthe top trainers but he got on
that alcohol, bad alcohol.
He lost everything he had.
You should be in the HorseRacer Hall.
One time Barney was one of thetop trainers but he got on that
alcohol, bad alcohol, losteverything he had.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
You should be in the
Horse Racer Hall of Fame, yeah
he was.
Speaker 3 (35:46):
I don't know about me
, but he was, you could be.
Well, I started, you know.
I stopped back and think whereI ended up where I was at.
I didn't have, like I said, Iwas never an assistant trainer
for anybody, never run a barnfor anybody, but I just used
common sense and I watched theold trainers and listened to
them talk Like shoot, I'm tryingto think he trained Coffee
(36:07):
Money.
I can't think of his name now,but he told me one day sitting
there in the barn and he saidHerbie, the main thing about
training horses is common sense.
And he said you can run aroundthis barn 10 times.
Put 10 pounds on your back andrun around it.
And he said same thing with ahorse.
You got to bring them up slowlyand let them tell you when
(36:29):
you're doing too much.
Back up.
If you ain't doing enough, do alittle more.
And uh, he was right.
Yeah, he was right, but I'd getsome horses that they'd bring
in.
We can't do this.
I trained for Don Ball for along time.
I know you all know Don Ball.
I've heard the name.
I trained for him for a longtime.
(36:50):
They brought me a horse outthere they couldn't do nothing
with.
I took her out the first dayBoy, she was a character.
Second day I took her out,brought her back, took her
bridle off, tied her up and leftthe saddle on.
I took her to track two timesthat day.
The next day I took her totrack three times and after
about two weeks when I come backto barn I could drop her brains
(37:12):
and go in the stall, come backout and she'd still be standing
there.
She didn't want to run, jumpand kick no more and I was
giving her six quarts of feet aday and all the hay she could
eat.
But once she figured that shewasn't just going to go out
there and go around the tracktwo times and go home, she got
to thinking look, I got to dothis again, I better take it
easy.
She didn't come back to the gapand start flipping and running
(37:34):
and going crazy, you know, andbut it.
I enjoyed taking horses somehorses that they was having
problems with.
I loved that part of it.
Changing their mind you know I'dclaim a horse and I'd give him
two or three days.
Take him to the farm, turn himout for an hour or so, just put
him in the trailer in theafternoon and take him out and
(37:55):
turn him out in the paddock fortwo or three hours.
Let him get that feeling offreedom back and the next thing
you know they're eating up andjumping, kicking and feeling
good again I guess the way theyfed racehorses over the years
has changed a lot, a whole lot.
Speaker 2 (38:09):
Yeah, what they feed
them and yeah, the gins feed a
lot of alfalfa back in the day,or not not a whole lot.
Speaker 3 (38:15):
No, alfalfa is pretty
rich in protein.
If you give them much, they getthe scars on you.
But Timothy and alfalfa was mytwo favorites, Mixed yeah about
70, 30.
Speaker 2 (38:30):
Grain.
What grain was y'all feedingback in the day?
Well, we fed oats and I had amix.
Speaker 3 (38:38):
I had oats, flaxseed
corn barley, I had barley and
molasses and something.
I had it all mixed, one feedand I bought it for feed.
I think you still use it, don'tyou?
Speaker 2 (38:54):
Same feed he still
uses it yeah.
Speaker 3 (38:58):
And you know I'd give
it if I had an old gilding that
was getting bad.
You know, getting to where hedidn't have any energy, didn't
have any get-up-and-go to him,I'd get that 100% wheat germ oil
and I'd start giving him thatand about two weeks he'd start
feeling like a man again.
Speaker 2 (39:18):
I've heard people say
that.
Speaker 3 (39:20):
Now you know you
could give them the Equipors and
Windstraw and stuff too, butthe wheat germ oil was a natural
and it really helped them.
It brought a bunch of them backwhere they felt like they was
stud again.
And I learned that from an oldguy called Lawrence Eversall.
He was an old war, probably oneof the smartest horsemen I've
(39:43):
ever had in my life, but he wasruled off for every racetrack in
the country.
Mac Miller got permission forhim this is how good he was to
come to the track and gallop thehorse that he won the derby
with.
Lawrence would come out.
The guards would bring him in.
He'd get out, get on the horse,go to the track, gallop him,
come back and get off and theguards would take him back to
the front gate.
(40:03):
But they let.
What was that horse Mac Millerwon the derby with?
I got it right on the tip of mytongue, but Mac told me the
same thing.
He said that man talked to ahorse.
He was a little bitty guy, agallop-bitty horse.
He just had that naturalability to it, Real quiet.
George Arnold introduced him tome Rusty Arnold's daddy, we was
(40:25):
breaking horses out on a farmand he said now Lawrence is one
of the best horsemen I've everbeen around in my life.
But he said now he don't talk,he won't say nothing to you,
don't take it personal.
I said, well, if he don't wantto talk, that's fine with me.
So, uh, we, we was out thereand I ain't kidding you.
I'd say we worked five, sixdays together before that man
(40:46):
ever said a word to me.
I never said nothing to him.
Then one one day he come up andwe started talking and, man, I
loved him to death.
We bought horses together.
We ran horses.
You know, we bought an oldhorse at Kingland for $1,000 off
a guy.
He had a mule in the stall withhim.
Lawrence got on him, took himdown the track, galloped him
(41:09):
twice around to come back and hesaid let's buy him.
So I went in and Lawrencedidn't have any money.
He was just getting off one ofthose bad drunks.
So I gave the old boy $1,000for him.
We took him to the farm.
We went three in a row with him, lost him at Kingland for five
and he trained him on the farm.
(41:32):
An old racetrack out on that oldgrass farm, no racetrack.
I was on that old grass farmbut man, he could talk to a
horse.
He was just one of those kindof guys.
He went to the Army.
He was one of the leadingriders.
He went to the Army and went tothe war.
They used him as a mole.
I didn't know this.
He never told me he was in themilitary and all that stuff.
Well, when he passed away inCincinnati, the line must have
been a mile long and he'd wonPurple Heart and all that stuff.
Speaker 2 (41:56):
Who's training.
Like all the youngsters comingup, do a lot of them call you
for advice a lot nowadays.
Speaker 3 (42:02):
I've had some call me
, but not anymore.
They know I'm not in it and Idon't.
Speaker 2 (42:06):
Where's the future of
horse racing going, you think?
Speaker 3 (42:09):
I don't know.
They've got to change it though.
Speaker 2 (42:11):
Is there a lot of
youngsters coming into it?
Still Trainers, you think?
Speaker 3 (42:16):
Well, maybe, but you
know a lot of them.
I hate to say this.
They're kids that the parentsare already in the business.
They have a big string ofhorses.
So they get out of college,they want to train, they get
their license and they got guysworking for them that could be
leading trainers anywhere in thecountry.
So you know it's how manyhorses you got.
(42:39):
It's a numbers game anymore.
You know if you got 150, 60head of horses you're going to
have four or five can runregardless of what you do.
Speaker 2 (42:47):
A lot of this old way
is going to slip away if some
of these youngsters don't get inand learn it from y'all.
Speaker 3 (42:52):
Yeah, it is the
horsemanship that's the bad part
about it.
I know, yeah, yeah, and Ericwas a good horseman.
He could find a bone on a horse.
He had a little splint.
I remember one time he wasrubbing for me and I gave him a
hard time all the time.
I shouldn't have done it but Idid.
But I sent a horse to the trackone time and he had a little
(43:14):
splint coming and we got back tothe barn and I said Eric, you
notice anything about that horse?
He said no.
I said you just got throughrubbing him.
You didn't see anything wrong.
He said no.
I said check that left leg andrun your hand down it.
And he did.
I said you feel that bump?
He said yeah.
I said that's a splint.
I said why would you send thathorse out like that?
(43:35):
And he said, well, I didn't seeit.
And I said well, that's yourjob to see it, don't do that
again.
He never did.
Speaker 2 (43:45):
Rich Strach won the
Derby, but you may take a little
credit for it too Well.
Speaker 3 (43:48):
I never had nothing
to do with him.
I think I seen him train one ortwo times and that was it, but
I watched him run.
When I watched him run atTurfway I knew Eric was right
when he first told me that Ithought he's full of bull, that
horse he can't be that good.
Speaker 2 (44:03):
What I'm saying,
though, is you may have trained
the trainer.
Speaker 3 (44:06):
Well, I think that
might be right.
Speaker 2 (44:08):
That's right, a
little bit of credit, you know.
Yeah, I've never been to Turf.
That's one place I've neverbeen is Turf Way Park Is that
right, I want to go somewhere.
Speaker 3 (44:16):
A lot of fun up there
, you know, used to be run at
night and stuff.
Many trips coming back fromthere be 11 o'clock at night,
snowing, sleeting.
Get home 1 o'clock in themorning, get up and be in a barn
5, 30 the next morning, youknow, and but uh they race up
around the winter, don't they?
Yeah, in the cold, yeah purseshave changed a lot up there.
Speaker 2 (44:36):
It's big time now
they got some good purses have
you seen some races in the snowup there in your time?
Speaker 3 (44:41):
yeah, I've come back
when the bis on the road and I'm
driving that old van that wehad three horse van and I was
going across the and it was kindof like this and there was two
cars that had slid down to itand I had a guy with me named
Melvin Woodrum and I told Melvin, I said, melvin, I ain't
sitting here all night, I'mgoing to try it.
And he said, man, we're goingto get stuck.
(45:02):
I said, well, I'm going to tryit.
Sure enough, I crossed thatband, started going, just got
lucky.
Man, I got to the end of thebridge, but it was.
It was cold as heck and I wasready to get home a lot of these
tracks are going to synthetic,ain't they?
Speaker 2 (45:18):
yeah, I don't like
synthetic.
Ain't Keeneland synthetic now?
Speaker 1 (45:21):
no, it was, they
changed it.
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (45:25):
I remember I went to
Keeneland one time back 10 years
ago and it looked like littletire pieces.
Yeah, little chips.
Yeah, I don't like it Synthetic.
Speaker 3 (45:34):
You like the good old
red clay, I like that red clay
sand, yeah, and you know.
Now, though, you can't put toeson a horse.
You can't put, you know, grabsor stickers, it's got to be flat
shoe.
I think that's wrong too,because when a horse pushes out
of that gate, they're usingthose back legs to push out with
(45:55):
and they get sore in the rearend that world bone and stuff, I
think.
But they've changed all therules.
That's their, it's their rightto do it, I guess, so they can
change them, I guess you eitherstay with it and live with it,
or get out of it one or the theother.
Speaker 2 (46:10):
What else can you do?
That's it, if you want to.
Speaker 3 (46:14):
You choose to do it
for a living.
You better be dedicated, is allI can say.
That's right.
You better be committed to it.
That's right.
And he was.
He never missed a day.
I mean, when I'd get ready togo feed in the afternoon, he'd
get out of school.
Boy, if she didn't want him togo with me, he'd throw a fit, so
(46:36):
I'd take him out.
He'd wash the tub, fill up thewater buckets and all that stuff
, you know.
And when I'd run at night, man,he'd go with me.
Every night we'd run, get back,he'd have to get up.
Next morning she'd have hisbreakfast and go to school.
But uh, he, just he lived itwho's your favorite jockey?
Speaker 2 (46:51):
you ever had ride for
you over the years.
Speaker 3 (46:54):
Well, one of my
favorites I rode Shoemaker on a
horse.
Okay, at Kingland Finishedfourth, I think, but one of my
all-time favorites was PJCooksey.
Speaker 2 (47:03):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (47:04):
She's a little old
rider but I loved her to death.
She came from up wellMountaineer.
It was called Waterford Parkthen I've heard of that.
Yeah, a little old, $1,000 race, $1,500 race to come up there.
But she had a lot of heart.
She could get more run out of ahorse at 316th Pole to the wire
for some reason.
I just I loved her and I stilldo.
(47:25):
Yeah, she had a lot of respectfor her.
Speaker 2 (47:29):
I'm going to do a
podcast with Mr Sonny pretty
soon.
Who Sonny Leon?
Speaker 3 (47:33):
Sonny Leon.
Yeah, yeah, I remember.
I thought Shane Sellers wasgoing to be here today.
He's coming April.
Speaker 2 (47:41):
When April April and
Shane, oh Shane, went for a
thousand races, I just never hadnothing.
Speaker 3 (47:47):
I thought he'd fit.
Speaker 2 (47:49):
I'm actually going up
around Bueller and places here.
Pretty soon I'm going to go upand do one with Chip Woolley.
Did you ever know Chip?
I've heard of him.
Speaker 3 (47:55):
Mind that bird's
trainer.
Yep, mind that bird.
He's walked over on a cane.
Speaker 2 (48:00):
I'm going to go up.
I got in contact.
I'm going to go up to Minnesotaand meet him.
That was kind of like Eric.
Speaker 3 (48:06):
Of course, eric had a
different horse $30,000 horse
but that horse he'd come overthere with they didn't give him
a chance either.
What a race man.
What a race.
That was a race You'll neverforget it.
Speaker 2 (48:23):
No, you ever go back
and watch the Derby anymore,
just for fun.
Speaker 3 (48:26):
Oh yeah, I've watched
it a hundred times Just to see
it again.
You get that same thrill manwhen they turn for home and you
see him moving, and then whenthat horse come out on him, I
just dropped my head, I saidit's over and he had to go
around him.
I looked back up and man, he'sgoing to the front and I said,
oh my.
Speaker 2 (48:41):
God, was you sitting
with him when it happened?
Me and him were standing there.
Speaker 3 (48:46):
He passed out.
Well, he didn't pass, he justfell, dropped he dropped.
I almost dropped with him, man,I said God, what a thrill.
Speaker 2 (48:57):
Then you had to rush
through all them people getting
to the circle.
Speaker 3 (48:59):
Oh yeah, I turned
around because one of the girls
rode races for me Her husband'sFrankie Brothers.
What's her name?
Donna?
Yeah, I turned around andlooked at her.
We was coming back.
I said they was all over us,you know.
I said where in the hell werey'all when we was coming over
here?
Of course, nobody said a wordto us.
(49:20):
They didn't come in the stalland say anything to us or
nothing.
It was like they wasembarrassed.
We were in the race, you know,and after the race, you know,
and after the race, they wereall over us.
Golly, oh.
Speaker 2 (49:33):
Lord, that's a story.
Speaker 3 (49:34):
Yeah, I claimed a
horse from her husband and run
him and went back.
She rode him for me.
I run him right back atChurchill and she rode him for
me and went with him and Iclaimed him for I believe it was
12.
And I run him back and I wentto the race.
I made him a I believe it was12.
And I run him back and I wentto the race other than claiming
the Churchill Lounce and he winit and I ended up doing pretty
(49:56):
good with him.
I guess I made about 95 or100,000 with him.
Speaker 1 (50:02):
What's your?
Speaker 3 (50:03):
favorite track
Anywhere, I guess I'd say
Keeneland.
Speaker 2 (50:09):
Keeneland.
Speaker 3 (50:09):
Yeah, hometown track,
hometown.
I remember when Eric was born Iwas going around that track.
I'll never forget it.
I was going around the backsideand I come into the turn and
coming through the stretch, ithit me.
Speaker 2 (50:26):
And I said my God,
I'm a father.
It hit you on the racetrack.
Speaker 3 (50:30):
Oh, boy, and look,
look, when I pulled up and
started back to the barn if itwas raining I'd have drowned I
felt like Superman and I saidman, I got a family.
Speaker 2 (50:40):
Good Lord, hell of a
feeling.
Speaker 3 (50:44):
It was.
The horse business will giveyou a lot of memories, but it's
history, yeah and you horsebusiness will give you a lot of
memories.
Speaker 2 (50:50):
Yeah, but it's
history this area.
Speaker 3 (50:52):
Yeah, and you know, I
don't know how she hung with me
because I had that chip on myshoulder.
You know, you sure did, and shehung in there with me.
Speaker 2 (51:02):
A lot of people don't
understand what horse racing
means to this state and thepeople out west.
Maybe people listening even tothis podcast don't understand
the feeling and just what horseracing is to us here in Kentucky
.
Speaker 3 (51:14):
Greatest thrill on
earth.
I don't care what anybody says.
Well, some of the wealthiestpeople on earth have said the
greatest thrill they ever hadwas watching a horse pass the
finish line.
There's nothing like it.
And some of them said why did Iplay golf all those years?
You know, I've heard them sayit on TV.
They get in a horse business.
There's no thrill.
I don't care if you're runningfor $2,000 or $2 million, the
(51:36):
thrill's still the same.
When they turn that stretch andhead home and you've got a
chance to win, you just holdyour breath.
Speaker 2 (51:44):
I was in Louisville
at the Hyatt Regency back last
April and I went to the bar toget some food at the hotel and I
overheard a conversation fromsome people down at the bar and
this guy's name was MichaelMcMillan and he was going to be
in the Oaks with that horseWhere's my Rink?
So he was there and, being theguy I am, I had to talk to him.
(52:11):
I wasn, I wasn't gonna not, soI snuck around and went over and
said I'm steven hayes, shookhis hand and I said I heard your
story.
Um, would you like to do apodcast with me?
He said when and where.
I said well, we'll just go upthe hotel room and do it.
I got him set up up there.
Come on up with me, him and hiswife come up there and sit down
, talk to me to hear.
You should go listen to hearhis story.
(52:33):
This guy never owned a horse, hejust loved horse racing.
Yeah, he's an owner, not atrainer.
He loved it.
Yeah, and they bought thishorse on a just on a phone call
during a football game.
A chargers game had to it andshe made it to the Oaks, oh my
gosh.
And his wife and him was havingsome trouble and she had left
(52:56):
him for a while.
They told it all on the podcastand she called and said where's
my ring?
She lost her wedding ring.
She said Michael, where's myring?
He said that's the horse's name.
Where's my?
Speaker 3 (53:08):
ring.
Where's my ring?
Speaker 2 (53:09):
they named the horse
that and now they're back
together and of course, they ranin the oaks and they got a
story.
It was a good.
It was good too.
They didn't win.
I think they had some problems,she, I forget what happened,
but uh, he races a lot at delmar in california, yeah, yeah
and he's still buying horses andracing still.
So I guess they're going tostart quarter horse racing in
(53:31):
Kentucky again, or they may havealready over in eastern
Kentucky somewhere.
Yeah, I heard something aboutthat too.
They ran at the Red Mile untilthey're getting it open.
That's one place I love RedMile.
Speaker 3 (53:45):
I love it Every time
I go back on one.
They break stride.
Do you go there some?
Speaker 2 (53:51):
still yeah.
Speaker 3 (53:52):
I like going to Red
Mile.
You know watching Trottersometimes I love it, I like it
too.
Speaker 2 (53:56):
I love being there
about in August, right at dark,
the sun setting over Fifth ThirdBank, yeah, and just looking at
that track and feeling andsmelling it, it's just something
about it.
See, a lot of people don't getthat.
Speaker 3 (54:11):
I get it smelling it.
It's just something about it.
See, a lot of people don't getthat.
They just go and they study thehorse.
They don't see the wonderfulthings, good things around them.
That makes it great.
Speaker 2 (54:18):
I get what the
Bluegrass State in Lexington is
about Looking at that sunset andjust feeling being here.
It's a feeling, yeah, it is.
If nobody out there, if anybodylistens to this, if you've not
been to a horse race, go Go Makethe trip to the Derby if you
can afford it.
Speaker 3 (54:35):
And I tell people
that leave at our bed and
breakfast all the time becausethey come and go to Keeneland
every year and I said don't goout there.
You don't have to go out thereand bet $100 across the board or
$100 on every race.
I said, find a horse you likeor a rider you think's cute or
something, and I said bet $5across the board on him and if
(54:56):
you lose $100, you've still hada cheap entertainment and a good
day and a thrill that you won'tget anywhere else in the
country.
Speaker 2 (55:02):
You know what my wife
loves?
Horse racing that's good, sheloves horses.
She's just a horse nut.
She knows nothing about thestatistics of racing or nothing.
Racing, that's good, she loveshorses.
She's just a horse nut.
Yeah, she knows nothing aboutthe statistics of race or
nothing about it.
Me and her go to the Red Mileand I just get a book.
We go in there around all thempeople at the bar and stuff said
pick us a TV out.
(55:23):
You know we have the best timeat the date night at that table.
Yeah, and we'd.
Neither one really don't knownothing, right?
She just says oh, I like thathorse, let's bet on that one.
Yeah, and we love betting onremington park in oklahoma.
The quarter horses yeah, becausethey're short races and there's
usually only four or fivehorses.
(55:44):
She can flat pick them and wedone good, like we spent a
hundred bucks and walked out ofthere for two thousand.
Yeah, she does good pickingthem things.
That's the best thing likesomebody that.
And we done good, like we spent$100 and walked out of there
with $2,000.
Yeah, she does good pickingthem things.
Speaker 3 (56:00):
That's the best thing
, like somebody that don't know
what they're doing.
Just pick a horse.
So if you're going to a horserace, you know you don't have to
know what you're doing, no, youdon't Just have fun.
I've went out there with peopleand I'd tell them this, this,
this, and there'd be two orthree in the crowd with me
saying I like that rider, he'sso cute and I love that horse.
He's looking at that prettybeautiful red horse and they'd
(56:20):
bet on him.
He'd be 20 to one.
My horse would be fourth orfifth and they'd win it.
And I'd say well, you idiot,you've done it your whole life
and all you had to do is look atthe rider and make sure he's
cute and the horse is prettywell, every time she, she picks,
she picks a horse, and I do thebet.
Speaker 2 (56:35):
When I'm up there at
the little screen, I always pick
the longest shot.
Yeah, put a dollar win playshow every time, just for the
heck of it.
And it's just, it's a, it'sjust so much fun.
Speaker 3 (56:46):
Well, you know you
said that when, when, uh, after
the der, about two weeks afterthe Derby, I took Glenda up
there off of Richmond Road toget her hair done.
Okay, and while she was inthere, I walked down the street
and there was a little bar, alittle restaurant there.
They sold ice cream and beer.
And so I went in and sat downand ordered a beer and this
(57:09):
young girl kept looking at me,looking at me, and I noticed her
looking at me and she came overthe table and she said I've
seen you someplace.
She said have you ever been onTV?
And I said no, I've never.
I said my son won the derbyabout two weeks ago and she said
that's where I saw you.
She said her and her husbandevery year bet ten dollars
(57:32):
across the board on the longestshot in the derby and she said
this drink's on me and if youwant something to eat, it's on
me too.
Did you get ice cream?
Yeah, I did, but look she, Icouldn't believe it.
She.
She said we, we bet biggest betwe've ever had ever won.
And they bet 10 across on Richbecause he was the biggest
(57:52):
longest shot Was theyinterviewing you quite a bit
after that, trying to.
Oh, you mean reporters and stuff.
Oh yeah, they came out.
Speaker 2 (58:02):
All right, we're
going to get out of here.
I guess everybody's tired andready to go home and probably
eat supper.
I'm hungry.
Yeah, I could eat too.
I always can eat.
Yep, eat too.
I always can eat.
Yep, I like to eat.
In closing, you got a lot ofwisdom.
What's something you'd telleverybody, all the youngsters
out there not just something inhorses, but just in life.
Speaker 3 (58:22):
Keep your mouth shut,
listen to older people and
learn to read people and knowwhen to move and when to stay.
That's true.
I learned that real quick.
I knew when my welcome wasrunning out, I knew when to
leave, I knew where to go.
And I have an aunt that Glendamet her and she said she was
(58:44):
telling her she'd come home onenight at 11 o'clock.
They was opening the door andthey looked over on the swing
and she like jumped out of herskin.
I was laying there waiting onthem to come home at 11 o'clock
at night.
So you know, you just gotta, hedidn't have a home.
No, not really.
Mother died.
But I look back at it and Ithink I don't know how I did it.
(59:07):
Really, to tell you the truth,I mean I walked those hills up
there in Powell County.
Wonder I hadn't got bit by arattlesnake or something you
know or somebody hadn't.
But back then it wasn't thatbad.
You know, you'd see a kidwalking up the street with a
.410 going squirrel hunting.
Well, if you see one today,they'd lock him up and his
parents.
Powell County's different nowthan is, yeah, grown up a whole
(59:28):
lot, but getting ready to getbigger.
Speaker 2 (59:30):
You still claim East
Kentucky for your home, don't
you?
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (59:34):
Yeah, my grandmother
lived there and the house is
still there that we was in.
Her never had electric, but wealways had something to eat.
It wasn't much but we'd havesomething to eat.
Speaker 2 (59:47):
Cornbread and beans
that's all you needed to live,
yeah had an old cow and had ahog.
Speaker 3 (59:52):
You know it was.
It was rough up there then.
But if you didn't know anydifference, you didn't know no
difference, didn't make anydifference, you know I will
always respect the folks ineastern kentucky.
Speaker 2 (01:00:02):
Yeah, the way of life
, yeah, that everything over
there, I just I love it.
Yeah, it was rough back in.
Speaker 3 (01:00:08):
I remember when, uh,
when they started that food
thing, you know what was itcalled Relief, and everybody,
they'd give them food and stuff.
Man, that was great.
And they'd give them them bigpacks of cheese.
Well, they figured out a way tobeat it right off the bat.
They was trading that cheesefor moonshine, you know.
Oh yeah, oh yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:00:26):
These people now
trade their food stamps for
stuff.
Speaker 3 (01:00:29):
Yeah, that's right.
Same thing when something goodcomes out, somebody figure out a
way to capitalize on it andturn it into a bad thing.
Speaker 2 (01:00:38):
We got one of them I
live down at Liberty, casey
County and we got a brand newbuilding.
They opened up and on everyTuesday there's a line they give
out free food, big line all theway down 127 for people to get
food.
If people need it it's good ifthey really need it.
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (01:00:56):
I just went into a
dark place.
Speaker 2 (01:01:05):
But you turned out of
it.
I did and made history.
Speaker 3 (01:01:12):
I sure did.
I got lucky and I come close acouple times, getting into
really, really deep, butsomebody was looking after me.
Speaker 2 (01:01:25):
Yeah, your wife took
care of you, probably.
Speaker 3 (01:01:29):
Before.
Speaker 2 (01:01:30):
I, it was before I
met her.
Speaker 3 (01:01:31):
But you know, as long
as I was with family I was
pretty good, but I could tell,you know, they couldn't afford
to keep me either.
Oh yeah, things were tough andyou know they were barely
surviving too, but I knew whento go to another family and get
in.
Yeah, it was in between therewhere I made a mistake a couple
times.
Did you graduate high school,ninth grade, see back.
(01:01:58):
Then you went to eighth grade.
You could quit.
Speaker 2 (01:02:02):
Did you go to school
in Versailles too?
Speaker 3 (01:02:05):
Yeah, I went to I
think eighth grade in Versailles
.
Got out.
I just went enough to wherethey wouldn't come after me.
I went to I think an eighthgrade in Perseverance yeah, and
got out.
Yeah, I just went enough towhere they wouldn't come after
me.
You know I'd go two or threedays a week just so they didn't
come, because my main thing allthe way coming up is I didn't
want to end up in an orphan'shome or a reform school.
Oh yeah, and I knew that ifthings went wrong that's where I
(01:02:28):
was going to end up, so that ifthings went wrong that's where
I was going to end up.
So you know, some thingshappened and I mean I wasn't
going to tell nobody, because ifI did they're going to go to
the police and then I'm going toa home.
So you know, I kept my mouthshut.
Speaker 2 (01:02:41):
I bet you on that
cattle truck.
The whole time your knees wasknocking together.
What?
Speaker 3 (01:02:44):
are you talking about
?
I just knew because he keptasking me questions.
You know about family, you sureyou're family?
And I kept telling him, yeah,and he told me.
He said I never will forget it.
You're a big fat guy, had a haton and he said this is against
my better judgment, but he saidI'm going to let you out.
Speaker 2 (01:03:00):
Did you ever see him
after that?
Never again, never did, no,never got his name or nothing,
you know, I wasn't thinkingabout it.
Speaker 3 (01:03:07):
I was just trying to
get to Milner where my aunt was,
and I remember I knocked on thedoor.
She said my God, where did youcome from?
How did you get here?
And I said I hitchhiked.
And, like I said, she washaving a hard time then too,
because her husband had been,you know, went through that
silage cutter.
She took you right in thoughshe took me right in she.
(01:03:34):
She took you right in thoughshe took me right in.
She was like a mother to me andthat was probably the safest
place I ever stayed and she'sgot.
I got see my mother and hersister married and my dad and
his brother, two brothersmarried, two sisters.
So we're double first cousins.
It's kind of like beingbrothers and sisters, you know.
And one of my cousins had ahouse right beside a rental
(01:03:55):
property I had there for sales.
Zaney and I go over to see herevery once in a while and we
talk.
Speaker 2 (01:04:03):
Still go huh.
Speaker 3 (01:04:04):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:04:04):
Good, yeah, well,
herbert, I appreciate you.
Thank you, and I've sureenjoyed this.
Speaker 3 (01:04:10):
I enjoyed talking to
you too, yes.
Speaker 2 (01:04:12):
I could talk to you
all night and tomorrow.
Yeah, me too.
Speaker 3 (01:04:15):
Just listen to this
story.
Speaker 2 (01:04:17):
You should write a
book.
Speaker 3 (01:04:18):
Well, I had a lady
from shoot.
What was it?
The one who comes to the houseGlendon does all that thing
about.
They come and give you a mentaltest.
Okay, I'm trying to think ofwho it was, but anyway, she
tried to get me to do it.
She wrote four books about kids.
Speaker 1 (01:04:40):
That had come through
like I had.
Speaker 3 (01:04:42):
And she said I'm
telling you, you let me write a
book and you won't have to wantfor nothing.
She said I'm telling you, and Isaid no, I'm not interested,
don't want to do it.
I didn't want to do it and Idid this for Eric, because you
know it's hard for me to talkabout it.
Oh yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:05:02):
I can see that, yeah,
but it's memories Shows you how
far you've come, absolutely.
Speaker 3 (01:05:08):
That's the truth.
But you know, I blacked it outfor I don't know how many years
50 some or something, yeah and Inever thought about it again.
And then, when this come up, Idid.
And, like I said, when I didthe interview out at Mercury, I
was so depressed I shouldn'thave been doing it that day.
(01:05:30):
I couldn't talk for crying, youknow, and I go through a
depression a lot of times, andso it's just.
But I've been blessed.
Nobody's been blessed any morethan me and Glenda.
We have both been blessed.
That's good.
I mean, to come up as hard aswe did and do the things we've
(01:05:53):
done and end up where we're atnow is a miracle, a complete
miracle.
Speaker 2 (01:05:57):
And that Derby win
just set it off, set it all off,
all off.
Speaker 3 (01:06:00):
I don't even have to
buy a meal anymore.
I go out.
Everybody knows me.
Speaker 2 (01:06:05):
That's good.
Yeah, all right.
Guys, thank you all forlistening to the podcast.
We sure appreciate you meansthe world to us.
Um, check out rich strike onyoutube.
Watch the derby if you hadn'twatched it.
If you're new to horse racingor new to horses in general, you
owe it to yourself to type inrich strike on youtube, or
whatever, and watch that horserace thrill of a lifetime.
(01:06:27):
You won't believe it.
And watch the interviews ofthese guys Eric Reid, look up
Eric Reid, herbert Reid onYouTube.
It's a story.
So, thank y'all.
Check us out on the website.
If you're new here and youdon't know about it
wwwdrafthorsesandmulesforsalecom.
We've got a merchandise page onthere now you can get on and
buy Harness Up podcast t-shirts.
Check that out, a lot of othergood stuff on there, and
(01:06:50):
subscribe to the YouTube channel.
We sure appreciate all y'all.
Thank you.
God bless you.
We'll see you on the next one.
Speaker 1 (01:07:03):
As another
captivating episode of Harness
Up with Haste, draft Horses andMules draws to a close, we
extend our sincere gratitude toour listeners for joining us on
this enlightening journey.
We hope today's discussionshave deepened your appreciation
and understanding of thesemagnificent creatures.
Remember, the adventurecontinues beyond this podcast.
Stay connected with us onsocial media and share your
(01:07:26):
stories.
For more information and toexplore further, visit
Draftorsesandmulesforsalecom.
Thank you for being part of ourcommunity.
Until next time, keepharnessing your curiosity and
passion for these God-givencreatures.
Farewell for now.