Unveiling Pittsburgh Sports Stories with Noah Hiles

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Ever wondered what it's like to be at the heart of breaking sports news? Pittsburgh Post-Gazette's own Noah Hiles joins us to share his journey through the vibrant world of sports journalism. Inspired by legends like Hunter S. Thompson and Rick Reilly, Noah reveals how he draws from both national icons and local heroes to fuel his writing. Together, we explore the rich tapestry of Pittsburgh's media landscape and the unique thrill of being the first to bring groundbreaking stories to the public eye.

We also catch a glimpse of the intricate dance that is sports reporting, as Noah recounts his exhilarating experiences uncovering stories in college football. From quarterback changes to strategies behind the Pittsburgh Pirates' long-term success, he sheds light on the strategic decisions and challenges that come with the territory. Our discussion ventures into the realms of sourcing, strategic leaks, and the camaraderie among journalists, painting a vivid picture of what it's like to live a life where work and passion seamlessly intersect.

Finally, we dive into the art of storytelling and game coverage, focusing on the meticulous balance required to craft compelling narratives throughout a long season. Noah shares his insights on the collaborative dynamics within the newsroom, particularly in baseball reporting, and the strategic moves necessary for maximizing team potential. With a nod to future ambitions and the excitement of what's to come, this episode promises to enrich your understanding of sports journalism's ever-evolving landscape.

Guest 
Noah Hiles
Twitter: https://x.com/_noahhiles

THANK YOU FOR LISTENING!!!!

www.holdmycutter.com

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:10):
Welcome to another exciting episode of Hold my
Cutter.
We're coming your way here atBurn by Rocky Patel, just a
couple blocks down from PNC Parkon the North Shore, greg Brown
and Michael McHenry.
And our special guest isPittsburgh Post-Gazette beat
writer for the PittsburghPirates, noah Hiles, who asked
us to feature and we've donethis the gold label Rocky Patel.

(00:32):
It is very special.
Developed in a lustrous Havanawrapper from Ecuador, the gold
label exudes sophistication fromthe very first glance.
As Noah points out, beneath thesurface lies a harmonious
marriage of binders.
He's such a great writer.
He wrote this With Connecticutshade and Connecticut broad
leaves, lending to a complex butsmooth draw.

(00:53):
A symphony of flavors furtherprogressed by its carefully
curated aged filler tobacco fromthe revered regions of Jalapa
and Esteli in Nicaragua.

Speaker 2 (01:04):
You know, he went there and ran through the forest
, yeah, and he had hisquarterback arm and he was
writing the story as he went.

Speaker 1 (01:12):
And you'll have to watch the previous episode Maybe
you have or maybe you've heardit because he actually did that.
Noah Hiles talked about how hegot here, how he got to become
the Post Gazette writer here,how he got to become the Post
Gazette writer, but I guess whatwe didn't touch on in a
previous episode was you talkedabout people that you look up to
in terms of players, those thatyou idolized and such, talked

(01:35):
about your favorite stories sofar, but what, in your
estimation, maybe you can pointto other national writers you
talked about Beaver County Timesguys that came before you.
Who do you look up to in termsof writing skills, styles and so
forth?

Speaker 3 (01:54):
That's a really good question.
It's hard to pinpoint oneperson right.
There's so many just reallyreally good journalists out
there, really good storytellers.
Someone that I've always justfound very intriguing is a guy
named Hunter S Thompson.
He's not necessarily thegreatest sports writer.

(02:16):
I mean, he is a legendarysports writer and I just think
that his best writing was doneoutside of the realm of sports.
But in the previous episode Ishared the story where I was
running with Maya Cochran, thedistance runner, and he made
himself part of the story andthat's called gonzo journalism
and he invented that form ofjournalism.

(02:37):
And if you don't know whoHunter S Thompson is, go on his
Wikipedia page and read abouthim.
He is the most interestinghuman that has ever lived in his
life.

Speaker 1 (02:46):
Do you know who that is?
No, I'm going to read about him.

Speaker 3 (02:49):
I'll just say Hunter S Thompson.
See before today.

Speaker 1 (02:51):
I thought that he was the most interesting human that
ever lived the end of his lifewhen he died.

Speaker 3 (02:57):
His funeral consisted of Johnny Depp shooting his
ashes out of a cannon off top ofa mountain.

Speaker 2 (03:03):
That sounds something that may be what I want my life
to be.

Speaker 3 (03:06):
Yes, Hunter has top, but as far as inspirations, go
Out of a cannon.
Out of a cannon Ashes out of acannon off top of a mountain.

Speaker 2 (03:13):
I kind of want my body to be shot out of a cannon.
Is that weird?

Speaker 3 (03:15):
Not at all.

Speaker 2 (03:16):
Not at all.
You're not weird at all.
Stay tuned on, oh my.

Speaker 3 (03:19):
God, I'm reading a lot of the people that I've been
coworkers with now.
Just before, when I was eatingbreakfast as a kid, our rule was
Monday, wednesday, friday I hadto read something and I would
tell my dad it was kind of likea book report While I waited for
the school bus.

(03:39):
I'd eat it while I was, or Iwould read it while I was eating
my breakfast.
You didn't read it in your mind.

Speaker 2 (03:43):
Yes, I would read while I was, or I would read it
while I was you know eating mybreakfast.

Speaker 3 (03:45):
Yes, I would.
I would read while I was eatingmy breakfast and then while I
was waiting for the bus, my dadwould say what'd you read?
And it could be from the paper,it could be from sports
illustrated um, so people that II read growing up.
Um, rick Riley was someone.
I think Rick Riley's one of thebest uh, his feature he did on
Marge Schott, the former Redsowner.
Incredibly, god was is one ofthe best.
His feature he did on MargeSchott, the former Reds owner.

Speaker 1 (04:05):
The guy was unbelievable.

Speaker 3 (04:06):
One of the best features ever written Wright
Thompson.
I think he's probably writtenmaybe the best story of all time
.
On his story he wrote aboutMichael Jordan.
Those are national guys Locally.
I mean, I grew up reading a lotof dayan kovacevic, who's
obviously I mean he, I think andI've I've worked for the guy

(04:30):
and you know he's got somediffering, differentiating
opinions but I I read him a lotgrowing up and he he was an
incredible writer.
I will say that about him.
Uh, jason mackie obviouslyfilled these shoes before me.
Uh, I read a lot of his stuff.
I read as someone who grew uprooting for the team before I
was covering it.

Speaker 2 (04:48):
Uh, read his.
He's a great investigator.

Speaker 3 (04:50):
He he is, I.
I equate mackie to.
He is a hunting dog.
You give him a scent and and itcould be about anything you'd
be investigating, it could beabout a feature, it could be, be
whatever If you tell him, ifyou give him a little scent, go
out in the field and get it andhe goes after it.

(05:11):
But I mean a lot of people.
I mean Gene Collier.
I read growing up, ron Cook.
I think Joe Starkey is one ofthe more underappreciated
writers in our city.
There's a lot of people.
I mean, and that's what'sinteresting to me is, if you
look at the landscape ofPittsburgh media, this is not a
huge city compared to Chicago orLos Angeles or New York, but

(05:33):
it's a great sports market towork in.
Right, and if you compare ournumbers to what we get page view
wise or the awards ournewspapers, our radio stations,
our TV coverage gets, I meanpeople really want to read or
consume content about theirsports teams here.
This is a sports town and,having grown up with a dad who

(05:56):
was the ideal sports mediaconsumer, other kids when they'd
go on road trips they wouldlisten to music with their
parents.
I listened to Mike and Mike,you know, or, locally, I
listened to Stan and Guy, youknow, or Mark Madden or whoever
was on ESPN, and then the fangot invented and I remember
listening to just everyone youknow Gianotti and so on and so

(06:19):
forth and I kind of got thesense from my family.
And they're still like this,they are my audience and, having
grown up around my dad and histhree brothers and now their
kids who are in college, I feellike I have a sense of like this
is what my audience wants toread about and I think that

(06:42):
there's value in that.
Just having been immersed inthat and knowing what my friends
, my family and seeing.
Hey, this is what peopleconsume.
And from a young age I wasconsuming it differently.
I was like watching film, wherethey were just kind of, you
know, being entertained.
I remember watching MondayNight Football, or, you know,

(07:03):
sunday Night Football andlistening to Al Michaels and
being like, okay, so that's howhe brought that up.
Or watching Doc Emmerich andbeing like, wow, he used a
different adjective every singletime.
He did not repeat an adjectiveof a game.
I thought that's incredible.
Or Brownie, for example, thefirst college project I ever did

(07:23):
was on Greg Brown.

Speaker 1 (07:24):
Wow, wow, yes, it's stuff like that.
That's cool, isn't it?
Yes, what did you get?
What grade?

Speaker 3 (07:28):
I got an A.
Thank you, yes.
Voices of the Game was the nameof the class.
Yes, no.

Speaker 1 (07:36):
So okay, so these guys, you say it's kind of like
when we ask managers, noah,managers know about when they
get to the big leagues, you knowwho do they either uh look up
to uh, or or or many.
Shelton, for example, talksabout the guys that when he came
up he takes a little piece ofdifferent guys uh which was
really cool to hear, by the wayyeah maybe the same is true, I

(07:58):
guess, for writers, I think soentirely.

Speaker 3 (08:00):
If I had to pick one person who I would kind of try
to want to emulate, bill simmonsis a guy I connect with a lot,
in the sense where Bill Simmonsdid not have the traditional
media path.
He started as a blogger and wasso darn good.
Espn hired him and then he wasso dominant at ESPN he created
his own thing called the Ringer.
But while he was at ESPN, inthe back nine of his ESPN career

(08:23):
, he came up with this idea whatabout the sports doc idea?
We'll call it 30 for 30.
You know, like he, that was hisbaby and now he has his own
thing and just the idea where hewas able to make an impact in
journalism through film, throughpodcasting.
He's one of the most successfulsports podcasts ever.

(08:44):
He's also one of the greatestsports writers of all time.
He was a big part, I believe,in Grantland, which used to be a
branch of ESPN which waslong-form writing.
So I look at him.
A guy like Dan Lebitard isanother example of a guy who
mastered being traditional media, and I think it's important to
create your own brand, um, aslong as you don't put that brand

(09:07):
above what you're reporting on.
That's why I go on.
You know podcasts and shows.
I want people to to get to knowme, the storyteller, but I
don't want them to like me morethan the story that I'm telling.
Uh, but eventually, yeah, Ithink that that's, that's the
goal, and so those are the guysthat I kind of look at now as
like wow, okay, so they use thistraditional media as a way to

(09:30):
build their brand and establishtheir own credibility and to
take this career path to wherethey want to go.
So, to answer your question, Itake a little bit of everyone I
look at I I my dad, told me thisthe other day.
I, he said, you've always beensomeone who reads more than most
of the people I know, and I.
I take a lot of pride in thatbecause I I feel like you know,

(09:54):
in today's world, it's a loteasier to read or to watch a
video or listen to a podcastthan it is to read, but the
written word, I still think,carries the most validity.
So, um, just by consumingcontent, by reading, uh, how
writers construct their stories.
Every time I pick up, everytime I'm on the road, I always
like to pick up a localnewspaper.
If I'm in new york, I'll getthe post the hard copy?

Speaker 1 (10:16):
yeah, the hard copy.
What is that?

Speaker 3 (10:19):
when I'm in the airport.
I love doing that when I'mflying home from a city because,
first off, I'm interested inseeing how the opposing beat the
beat reporter for the opposingteam told the story of the game
that I just told.
Right, I want to see how theHouston Chronicle guy wrote
about that Astros pirates gamecompared to how I wrote about it

(10:39):
.
I want to see you know how theArizona Republic covered that
three game series at Chase fieldcompared to how I covered it.
How are they deploying theircall on this?
How are they doing this?
And then you can also look at,you know, national call on this
and all kinds of stuff.
So, yeah, you pick, you pick andchoose and it the way I look at
it and this is something thatJason relayed to me and kind of,
I guess, confirmed my thoughton it is you're going to get

(11:03):
better, Like when you're abaseball player and the more you
watch baseball as a performerpro, when you watch baseball
it's a different experience thanwhen I watch baseball, right,
You're seeing how a guy'spitching and going after a
batter and you're thinking, okay, well, the next time I face him
.
That's mental note.
I'm reading a game story, I'mreading a column or a feature or

(11:23):
something like that, and I'mthinking, okay, well, the next
time I have something to writeabout in this type of
circumstance.

Speaker 1 (11:35):
I can pick that.
You know, I can pick and choosethat.

Speaker 3 (11:36):
And you know, and I'm sure you do the same thing when
you're when you're listening toplay by play guys on hockey or
football or whatever like, oh, Ilove the way they they built
this up or the way he describedthat.
It's, it's naturally of courseyou don't get that.
If you don't love what you do,yeah right.
If you're doing this for apaycheck which I mean you're
doing this for a paycheck you'rein the wrong field.

(11:57):
Like no, that's not to say II'm very, I'm happy with what
I'm doing and I I livecomfortably.
But, like you know, you canmake more money in finance or
something like that.
But if you're, if you're doingthis because you love it, your
brain never is completely off,right, you're always thinking.
You're watching the NLCS andyou're like is that Brent
Honeywell Jr?

(12:17):
That's a story.
That guy pitched two inningsfor the Pirates and now he's
pitching three innings in theNLCS against the Mets.
You know something like that.
It's never completely off andyou obviously have to balance it
.
You don't want to work yourselfto death.
You don't want to be 100%committed to your career.
You want to make time forfriends, family and things
outside of work.
But if you love this, you'realways kind of thinking about it

(12:41):
a little bit.
You're all in, yeah.

Speaker 1 (12:43):
A very high percentage of it and
unfortunately, friends, familyand so on might suffer because
of it.

Speaker 3 (12:50):
Well, and that's why I'm very fortunate my girlfriend
is a journalist as well.
Oh, that helps and so that isreally cool.
I remember early on in ourrelationship some of the biggest
news I've ever broken in mycareer so far was last fall.
Pitt benched their quarterbackduring the bye week and for most

(13:11):
teams that doesn't come outespecially in college until the
day before the game or themorning of the game.
Well, I found out during thebye week, the day it happened,
and I broke that news.
And then the next day, while mygirlfriend and I were at a
soccer game she loves soccer asource reached out to me and
informed me that not only wasthis quarterback benched,

(13:34):
they're changing his positionand some partners of journalists
would be like, no, this is mytime I'm working.
But I remember talking to her.
I'm like, hey, I've got a hugescoop.
She looked at me and said go doit.

Speaker 1 (13:50):
That's great.

Speaker 3 (13:50):
And sitting there on my phone writing the breaking
news piece and the tweet.
When I broke, that story hadlike two million impressions.

Speaker 1 (13:57):
Noah, how about the rush of breaking a?

Speaker 3 (13:59):
story.
It is unlike anything else.

Speaker 1 (14:02):
Because I'll throw myself in here, but I was a beat
writer.
I was the beat guy, the beatbrownie For the Buffalo Bills,
yeah.
So I did color, but then I alsowas the beat guy during the
week, and so I was up in Buffalofor five years.
I broke one of the biggeststories in that time as a beat
guy and I'll never forget it.

(14:23):
The general manager got fired.

Speaker 2 (14:28):
Bill Polian.
What's the buildup to that?
Because you're grabbing allthis information.
It's a lot different.
Your experience is probably alot different than mine.

Speaker 1 (14:35):
Well, we talked about me being a.
You called me a Stone Age guy.

Speaker 2 (14:38):
No, no, no.
You called yourself a Stone Ageguy.

Speaker 1 (14:39):
He called me an Ice Age guy.

Speaker 2 (14:41):
I said caveman.

Speaker 1 (14:43):
Caveman, but back then we didn't have these Alcor,
you know back then we didn'thave these Neanderthal yeah
pagers and we had those just thebeginning of car phones I only
heard those about pagers and rapsongs.
Yes, yeah yeah, yeah, but youcould go, but those are used for
different things.

Speaker 3 (15:01):
That was not used for breaking news and rap songs
here's the original d-o-double-ggot it study history.

Speaker 1 (15:06):
Uh, anyhow, we were at a, at a luncheon, a banquet,
and my pager went off we saythat one more time we're at a
banquet and my pager went off,okay what did?

Speaker 2 (15:16):
what was that like?

Speaker 1 (15:18):
if you had it on your belt, uh-huh, and it would kind
of vibrate sometimes it wouldbeep, but you could turn it off
them back.
Then we could actually eventurn off the sound and kind of
like.

Speaker 2 (15:27):
And then, what did that, that box on your hip, do?

Speaker 1 (15:29):
the box on and you looked at it and it's a call, a
number.
Oh so I'd go to a landline that.
That's high tech, brian oh yeah, I left the banquet and I
called the landline On a payphone.
I don't know who it was, we allhave sources, but someone said
I'm hearing that Bill Pulliancould be in trouble, which was I
mean.
People talk about the Steelersbeing big in this town and they

(15:51):
are.

Speaker 3 (15:51):
Oh, I mean the Bills in the 90s.
You have no idea about theBills.

Speaker 1 (15:57):
It's even to this day .
That is it.
And so I got on it and Iactually drove to then-Rich
Stadium I don't know what it'scalled now and I hung out in the
parking lot and I startedmaking phone calls and finally
ended up calling his house andgot confirmation from his wife

(16:20):
and broke that story.
And you know people talk aboutthe greatest moments and stuff
that the rush of knowing you'vejust broken a story.
And now you go on the air likethen you call the station, get
me on right away.
We were a news station.
Break in.
This is Greg Brown callingBreak into news right now.
I said we're going to go up toOrchard Park to break that story

(16:44):
.

Speaker 3 (16:44):
That's awesome.
Your experience, my experience,is I mean, you didn't have a
pager, I didn't have a pager.

Speaker 2 (16:50):
Why not?
I kind of want to bring it back, yes.

Speaker 3 (16:57):
It's like 200 innings , Exactly Such a rush, right?
Because I mean, not a lot ofpeople can relate to breaking
news, but everyone can relate todo you hear this, you know?

Speaker 1 (17:10):
Oh yeah, that's essentially what that is right,
Absolutely.

Speaker 3 (17:12):
When you're with friends and family.
You never gonna believe what Ijust heard.
Yeah, and you get to do thatfor an audience right or a
living right.
So, um, what was my first bigone?
I mean, I had ones like when Iwas covering high school, but I
guess my first big one on thepit beat was I broke the story
of um when they were hiring thewomen's basketball coach and it

(17:34):
was just kind of a thing where Iremember, like my hands shaking
because you're typing it, yeah,and like you know you have,
normally now it gets broken on Xright and so, like you,
formerly known as Twitter,formerly known as Twitter, and
while you're typing it, likeanytime I would typically break
something.
If I have the option, I like totype it out with a keyboard,

(17:54):
because I know my hands aregoing to be a little jittery and
I'm not going to you know Doyou sometimes do it with your
thumbs.
Yeah, huh, it's impressive Withmy phone, yeah yeah.

Speaker 2 (18:03):
I mean, that's just impressive writing a story with
your thumbs.

Speaker 3 (18:05):
Oh no.

Speaker 1 (18:06):
What I'm saying is this is just the original thing,
just to get it out.

Speaker 3 (18:09):
Just to.

Speaker 1 (18:11):
Which, by the way, is dangerous, because you don't
want to be wrong, right, but youwant to get it out.
You've got to do it now.

Speaker 3 (18:16):
I had it made sure.
I was like the source whocontacted me.
I was like how confident areyou?
Told me.
I reached out to another one.
They're like, yeah, that's whatI've heard as well, and I run
it by my bosses.
I was like I'm going to firethis and I typed it out and I

(18:37):
was like I cannot believe thisis my.
That was my first breaking newsstory as a news reporter.
I broke some stories, uh,earlier in my career, but like
breaking a sports story for thePittsburgh post Gazette and
seeing like ESPN credit you likein the little ticker or
whatever in the pushnotification.

Speaker 1 (18:50):
You know that that outside of this business, people
that aren't in this businessjust despise that.
They dislike it so much thatall they care about is getting
that story out.

Speaker 2 (19:04):
But at the same time, they love it if it's not about
them.

Speaker 1 (19:07):
You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 3 (19:07):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (19:07):
Don't you agree with that though?

Speaker 1 (19:09):
It's just more they love it.
If it's not about them,probably yeah.

Speaker 2 (19:13):
When I think about the trade deadline, for example.

Speaker 1 (19:14):
All the GMs, all the baseball people look down on it.
Oh, those are rumors, rumors,rumors, and all they care about
is getting it out first.

Speaker 3 (19:21):
Getting out first, but not be right, my thing is,
if I'm 100% right, you havenothing to be upset about other
than I knew your secret.
And so I go back to what I wastalking about when Phil Djokovic
was benched in October of 2023.
That was the best feeling inthe world to me, because I knew
I was exactly right.
I knew to the way it happened,to how he was informed, to how

(19:46):
he informed his teammates and tothe follow-up that happened.
I remember writing in theoriginal story he wasn't just
benched, he was moved to thirdstring.
How did it happen?
The way it happened was he wasinformed They'd fallen to one
Can we go back a little?

Speaker 1 (20:06):
bit Pine Richland kid For those that are watching
from out of town or listeningPhil Dracovic was maybe the best
quarterback prospect that thisarea has produced in 30 years.

Speaker 3 (20:19):
Out of high school he went to Notre Dame, didn't play
there, transferred to BostonCollege, had a really good first
year there.
Injuries kind of derailed hissecond year there.
He had one year left ofeligibility.
Western Pennsylvania guy, hisformer offensive coordinator,
was coaching at Pitt at the time.
They bring him in in thetransfer portal and Pitt, as we

(20:40):
see this year, is typically ateam that's always one
quarterback away from being adecent program.
They always have a good line,always have a good defense,
always have a good run game.
They need someone who can throwthe pill.
So this was supposed to be theanswer to their problems.
So they bring him in and itdidn't go well.
Through five games they won oneand four.
He was a clear problem and so Ihad asked after those games,

(21:06):
after the last two or threelosses, is there any
consideration to maybe making achange?
And I got shot down real quick.
But going into the bye week Ihad my antenna up.
I was like you know this couldhappen.
What made you think that?
Well, just because it was likeit was obvious.

Speaker 1 (21:25):
It was obvious.
Yeah, I know somebody wastipping you off.

Speaker 3 (21:28):
And it was more like a thing where, if it's not going
well, maybe it's going tohappen.
Okay, but that's your instinctof all.
Right now I need to startreaching out or whatever.
But in this case, for this oneinstance, someone contacted me
and heard and they said I heardfrom someone that this is
happening and if you don't havesources, that's worthless.

(21:51):
You know it's.
I heard from someone, but theyreached out to me because they
knew I knew people who would beable to.
They maybe wouldn't tell me it,but they could be like I don't
know how you heard that, butthat's spot on.
So I spent the rest of the daykind of talking with people and
saying this is what I heard,this and that, and I eventually

(22:11):
got the full story, and that wasone where the best breaking
news is not only when you canbreak it with a tweet, but when
that tweet includes a story youtalk to him about.
I didn't talk to him but I hadsome very, very, very good
information and being able toreach out to my boss and say hey

(22:35):
, I'm writing this now, I'll betweeting this, I'm going to have
this filed at 3.15.
At 3.30, we need to publishthis and because the sources
that I talked to said this isgoing to get found out in a
couple of days, you should breakit now, because you have the
exact truth and when you can dothat, that's incredible.

(22:57):
I got that rush.
That's an incredible feeling.
I remember just tweeting it outand just seeing the reaction.
And it's not even a thing ofpat yourself on the back, but
it's just cool because that'slike hitting a walk-off home run
.
That's what everyone kind ofwants to go after.

Speaker 1 (23:15):
And I guess that's what people outside the business
don't understand.
Yes, they just don't get that.
That's a great point.

Speaker 3 (23:21):
And if you're in a that's what you.

Speaker 1 (23:23):
That gives you so much credibility.
Now, people want to read,listen to you.
Yeah, they want to know what'snext.
You're the guy.

Speaker 3 (23:29):
And, if you're right, I broke the story that he was
moving to tight end, and so Iremember that week.
This is college football.
The coaches don't necessarilylove the idea of you knowing
stuff that they don't want youto know.
So the next that first Mondayafter the bye week, we have this
press conference.
They update the depth chart andI was curious as to how they

(23:52):
were going to handle it.
They didn't say a thing thiswhole week.
I was the only one to reportthis and it's just sitting there
.
People confirm the tight endthing, but I'm like, well, let's
see how this goes.
So we get to Monday, we show upthe depth chart.
Indeed, it showed him at numbertwo and I knew that wasn't true
.

Speaker 2 (24:09):
Yeah, they do that all the time in college sports.

Speaker 3 (24:12):
But then he kept.
He went out of his way to sayhe's still a quarterback.
He's still a quarterback when Ihad heard from like four
different people that he wastaking practice reps at tight
end.

Speaker 1 (24:23):
When people are saying that, are you starting to
get worried at all that they'reso dead set on no?

Speaker 3 (24:25):
he's he's still, because I, the people that I had
heard it from, it was like theyit's just, you don't get access
to practice when you covercollege sports.
You get one 10 minute windowand you're not allowed to report
anything that you see.
So it's like the people that Iheard this from.
I'm like no, this is true andhe doesn't have to tell the
truth because there's no way wewould know unless we heard it

(24:46):
from people who saw it.
So when he said he was aquarterback, still, I like
questioned him.
I said so, did he?
Did he take reps at practice attight end?
And he said he didn't doanything in the team session as
a tight end.
I said what about individually?
Did he run routes as a tightend?
And the coach looked at me andhe said I have no comment and I

(25:08):
just smiled, got him, and hegoes what?
Oh, because he ran a couple ofroutes as a tight end.
And I said I'm just asking, andbecause he ran a couple of
routes, he's a tight end.
I said I'm just asking, youknow, and it's like you just
confirmed that.
And a couple of weeks later,sure enough, he says in a
meeting yeah, he has beenworking at tight end and it's
just moments like that where youget it.
Or another big one that I had,yeah, like when you can break
the news of a firing, like Ibroke when they fired Frank

(25:32):
Signetti, and I remember comingback from that one I had just in
this past weekend.
I'd covered Pitt basketball allweek in New York and then that
Saturday morning I woke up at 3am to catch a 5 am flight to
Durham to get there for a noonkickoff.
Covered that game.
That was the last game of theseason for Pitt football.

(25:53):
Next morning woke up at 3 amagain to get a 5 am flight back
to pittsburgh.
I'm exhausted.
I haven't slept hardly at all,but I knew I'm like they're
gonna have to be firing coachestoday.
So I'm exhausted but I'm likefighting back sleep because I'm
like waiting, I'm like I'm gonnaget this text and sure enough
it came and being able to breakthat one when, like every fiber

(26:16):
you're of your being is sayingjust go to bed, who cares?

Speaker 2 (26:19):
Yeah, but then when the boss texts, you, that means,
you love what you do.

Speaker 3 (26:21):
Yeah, it's just like, yeah, no, I'm going to get this
done.
And whenever I get this done,and breaking news stories are
also another reason I love themthe easiest ones to write, you
don't have to be creative ofit's just this is what happened,
and then whenever they releasethe statement.

Speaker 2 (26:38):
So you copy and paste their statement, quote in there
.
It's easy, it's done, yeah, soso I'm gonna be the devil's
advocate kick you off themountaintop.
Now, what about?
What about a story you gotwrong, or a story that you wish
you would have wrote, or, youknow, a regret you have because
obviously nobody's perfect?
Yeah, and how do you handlethat?
Because that's got to be tough,because the opposite effect,

(27:00):
right?
Yeah, that doesn't help you inany way.

Speaker 3 (27:02):
No, I mean, but it's going to happen.
It happens, yeah, and I thinkit's.
I've always in like everythingthat I do.
I've never tried to pretendlike I know everything right.
Like there's certain situationswhere, like you know, if, if,

(27:24):
if, I am next to Brownie and Isee Brownie, you know, spill his
drink and I have like a videoof it and I send you the video.
I'm like here's Browniespilling his drink and you
report that Like you could standon that and you're just like
there's no way I'm wrong.
But most of the time you don'tknow if you're a hundred percent
right.
So you try to be as right asyou can, um, but if you end up
being wrong, you got to own it.
Or or or at the very least, saythis is what I was told, that

(27:48):
that's.
That's a very common thing thatI don't think a lot of people
consumers get is that you'reonly as good as your sources,
and sometimes your sources getplayed.
Sometimes people know who yoursources are and they know that
they can get something out ofthem.
They can if it's maybe to makeyou look dumb, if it's to get a

(28:09):
narrative that makes someonelook bad, or good Agents do that
all the time.

Speaker 1 (28:13):
Agents do that all the time.

Speaker 3 (28:17):
And it's not just agents, front offices will do
that, or athletic departments orcoaches.
I know like a coach.
You know, say a coach is upsetwith how his player is
performing at practice, if he'sshowing up later, if he's being
a jerk to his teammates or ifhe's showing up overweight, if
he's showing up later, if he'sbeing a jerk to his teammates or
if he's showing up overweight.
If there's a writer you'veknown for 20 years, it's

(28:41):
beneficial for you to maybe leakthat and kind of light a fire
under his rear end.
You know, and say that and thatmight be that coach's truth,
but that might not be the wholetruth.
But you've got to say look,this is what I reported.
I remember one thing thathappened with me this year is I
reported that Joshua Palacioswas getting called up.

(29:02):
Remember that.
And then he didn't get calledup that day.
He was there the next day, butI heard pretty credible
information that he was coming.

Speaker 1 (29:13):
I got a question for you in that respect that he was
coming.
I got a question for you inthat respect.
Do you think teams, if they seethat, might say, okay, hold it,
don't.
Is it possible they would saydon't bring him up, let's wait.

Speaker 3 (29:26):
No, not at this level .
I do think that happens atcollege.

Speaker 1 (29:30):
I mean team.
I'm not talking aboutspecifically the players.

Speaker 3 (29:31):
Yeah, I don't think that happens at pro sports.
I think pro sports because ofthe money that's invested in it,
you're just gonna do what'sbest for you, but you could see
in college, in college, don't doit.

Speaker 1 (29:40):
Now that it's out there, hold off if, if they can
make, yeah, if.

Speaker 3 (29:44):
If.
If it's a a move the size ofsomething where it's like they
can maybe make it look like theywere in control the whole time
and you weren't necessarilyright, they, yeah, they.
They'll take their foot off thegas and prolong that.
In my instance, with thePalacios thing, I think a couple
contributing factors led to achange in the decision, but I

(30:06):
knew that this guy was headingto Pittsburgh and going to be on
the major league roster, butsome things either didn't come
to fruition or changed and itwas a day off.
But that was a weird day, right.
Well, how soon after did he getcalled up the next day?

Speaker 1 (30:22):
Oh, the day after the day off.
Yeah, so you weren't right, noit wasn't a day off.

Speaker 3 (30:25):
They played a game, but I was.
Do you have to own that?

Speaker 1 (30:28):
I said Because you were wrong.

Speaker 3 (30:30):
What I reported was.
I tweeted the next day.
I said what I reported this daywas this At that point in time
that's what I was told and Ibelieve that was true Things
changed.

Speaker 1 (30:45):
Well, yeah, but anybody could do that right To
play devil's advocate.
Anybody could throw it outthere and then you could come
back and, ah, didn't happen.
Things changed, right, and.

Speaker 2 (30:55):
I'm sure some writers do that a lot.
Eventually it's going to ruinyour career.
You know, don't you think somewriters probably do?

Speaker 3 (31:00):
that I mean maybe, but I mean in that in that case,
like, like I said, like I thinkwhat happened changed and
that's what I said, yeah, andthat Adam.
Another instance, one instancewhere I do think I was played a
little bit was when Pitt waslooking for an offensive
coordinator.
I think that one of the peoplethat they were interviewing was

(31:25):
simply taking interviews at Pittto try to get more money from
the place he was currently at,and they recognized that I was,
which is very common.
Yes, and they recognized that Iwas a writer that had broken a
lot of news on that beat, and sothey went to me and said it
made it look eminent.
And so I kind of highlightedthis guy as, like it seems like

(31:47):
this is going to be the guy andhe wasn't the guy, and in that
case it was like I had tobasically say like, yeah, you
know, that's, this is what I wastold.
Apparently wasn't true, youknow, and that's a tough pill to
swallow, but guess what youknow, like sometimes you're
wrong.
Right, that's the nature of thebeast.
And like, as long as you'resaying you know, like as long as
you don't speak it as as as ifit's fact, like if, if someone

(32:12):
tells you it's fact and you sayit's fact and it's not, if you
say michael mckenry just signedwith the red socks for 10
million dollars and it didn'thappen, then you guys say, well,
that didn't happen.
But if you're saying, hey, I'mhearing that this guy is the
favorite here and he doesn't endup being the favorite getting
hired, it's like, hey, well,what I heard was wrong, I was
wrong, and then you just got tobe right the next time how much

(32:33):
fun is the MLB trade deadlinefor you as a writer?

Speaker 1 (32:35):
Is that fun or is it too exhausting?

Speaker 3 (32:37):
You'd prefer it's a little bit of both to.
To be honest, you get to acertain point in the deadline
where the national guys are justkind of kind of get all of
those things.
That's kind of just the payoff.

Speaker 1 (32:49):
You have to kind of concede to that.

Speaker 3 (32:51):
Yeah, I mean you try right, but why?
Why is that?
By the way, I mean, that'stheir job, where I'm writing 100
game stories and features onone team.
These insiders, their job is tojust follow transactions.

Speaker 1 (33:06):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (33:07):
If that was 100% of my job, I'd probably be able to
have more transactional news aswell.
But that's one element of manythings that I do and so it's
tough.
And also because those guysthey work for bigger national
outlets, they have biggerplatforms the people who leak
that stuff to them.
It's more serving to theirsources to leak it to a guy with

(33:31):
a hundred thousand followers asopposed to eleven thousand
followers or something like that.
And especially, just one yearinto being on the beat, you just
got to have the realizationwhere it's like, yeah, I'm not
there yet, maybe one day I willbe, maybe one day I won't.

Speaker 1 (33:47):
By the way, are you and Andrew Destin kind of
co-beat?

Speaker 3 (33:50):
writers yes.

Speaker 1 (33:51):
Is that just how you're going to go along?

Speaker 3 (33:53):
for a while.
That's the plan.
We're just a tag team duo.

Speaker 1 (33:57):
How do you get assigned games?
Do you pick them?

Speaker 3 (34:01):
yourself.
Andrew and I are really goodfriends.
We were really good friendsbefore this and I think we work
together incredibly well.
I think we complement eachother's strengths.
So every Monday I'll FaceTimehim, them, and I sit there with
a pen and pad and I'm like allright, here's what I'm thinking.

(34:22):
You base it around your life,you know like, hey, ideally if I
could just show up to Clubhouseand not have to cover this
Thursday game in June, would yoube able to take the game story
and to make it up for you.
I'll have the big Fridayfeature, you know, or something
like that, and you plan it out.
Or, hey, what are you workingon?
You know, who have you beentalking to?

(34:42):
Oh, okay, Well, I got thisthing on on O'Neill.
I got this thing on schemesthat maybe we should run this
next week or maybe.
You know, you coordinate it andif you have a really good team,
you're able to decide.
It's no different than decidingwho gets an off day in the
lineup or who's pitching on whatday.
You just kind of coordinate itbased off of, also, travel

(35:03):
schedules.
If Andrew gets back from asix-day road trip, I'm not going
to be like, hey, man, need youto write all four game stories
for this four-game series comingup.
It's like take a break, dude.
You want to show up to theballpark and just talk to guys
and you work on features thisweek.
All right, Work on game stories, or vice versa.

Speaker 1 (35:20):
If we didn't read the bylines and we just read the
game story, would we know?
What clues would I have,knowing it's your story or his?

Speaker 3 (35:33):
Andrew's a thousand times smarter than me.
So if there are bigger, betterwords, is a thousand times
smarter than me.
So if there are bigger, betterwords, no, like if you see the
word mercurial or something likethat, yeah, that's, I don't
know.
I mean, the game stories areinteresting because there's your
game story at times can only beas good as the game that you
watched.

Speaker 1 (35:51):
You sound like a broadcaster.

Speaker 3 (35:52):
Right.
I mean yeah, like how many ifyou're making?

Speaker 2 (35:55):
a reel.
If you're making a reel, youknow he's been in so many
different ways.

Speaker 3 (35:57):
If you're making a reel, you're not really picking
out a 7-1 loss, right?
I mean, it doesn't necessarilyneed to be all walk-off home
runs, Right, but like, there'sjust certain things where, and
like I remember talking aboutthis over the weekend with
Stephen Thompson, the kid whoreplaced me on the pit beat and
just, you want to always writethe best story possible, but

(36:21):
it's like playing 160 games inthe big leagues you can't sprint
to first on every weak groundball or something like that, or
I'm just saying wait a minute ormaybe, maybe you can't, you,
can't, you can't go and that'sit.

Speaker 1 (36:37):
Yeah, this edition of home by cutter, maybe, maybe
you can't.

Speaker 3 (36:40):
Maybe that wasn't the best example, but it was not a
good example.
Okay, it's not a good example,or you can't.
You've got to be able torealize.
It's like I'm not winning apulitzer prize on this story.
It was a 5-0 win on a Wednesdayafternoon.
I just need to tell the storyof the game and you save.
The good games is when you'regoing to sit down and say I'm

(37:07):
going to really lock in and I'mgoing to be given extra 100,000%
, and that's not to say I'mdogging it on the other ones but
you have to realize, know, likeit's, I give a full effort
every time.

Speaker 1 (37:18):
I can't ask you this because you guys split the
season, so I can't ask you what?
What, in fact?

Speaker 3 (37:21):
uh, I think we had a better record.

Speaker 1 (37:22):
I couldn't, no, I couldn't no no, I could be wrong
and want to talk to hannahmears about it, but I'll bet you
that was an incredible,incredible awakening for her,
because it's the first time shecovered a team.
I think she did probably 140games something around there I
bet you uh, hayley did, theothers maybe dan's.

Speaker 3 (37:41):
But that's, you pick and choose, incredible grind you
when you're, when your job isto tell a story.

Speaker 1 (37:47):
He used to do them.

Speaker 3 (37:48):
He used to do the bulk of it, yes, and you, just
you can't tell a you know frontpage story every day.
It's just not possible.

Speaker 1 (37:58):
You try, though you try.

Speaker 3 (37:59):
You try, but or you recognize that maybe the biggest
story that came from today,like we talked about in the last
episode, is something thatneeds more time to tell and I'm
going to talk about it a littlebit in my game story.
But it's like we're going to puta pin in that and this can be
my Friday feature, even thoughthis game was played on Tuesday.
If I take two more days to lookinto this because I have a

(38:23):
deadline to meet and everythingas well, I don't have time to
sit down and comb through twohours worth of stats and get
secondary quotes.
But if I just mention this here, point out that it happened,
make it the lead and then onFriday I'm going to really dive
into it.
I think that that's how you doa good job on the beat and being
able to recognize, you know andcommunicate with your beat

(38:45):
partner like we'll communicateduring the game.
Was this game worth two storiesor is the game story just
enough?
Or did you see anything thathappened pre-game, post-game,
during the game that we can uselater in the week for our
weekend features?

Speaker 1 (39:00):
Wait a minute.
So you guys decide whetherthere are two stories to a game.
We decide whatever we write.

Speaker 3 (39:04):
You and Andrew yes.

Speaker 1 (39:06):
So there could be two stories the next day, there
could be three, there could be awhole bunch.
Wow, see, that might be anotherepisode, because I'm not having
been a writer, but boy, I thinkthat that's, I don't know.
I think that every game wetalked about this earlier, about
every game has a lot of depthto it regardless of what the

(39:30):
score is.

Speaker 3 (39:31):
Yeah, we cover now.

Speaker 1 (39:32):
This is no disrespect to you and Andrew and the
Post-Gazette, but going on theroad when I get a hard copy
maybe or online, of the st LouisPost-Dispatch like or there are
some other cities that coverbaseball like this is the way to
cover baseball.
I mean, I think you guys do agreat job, but I'd love to see

(39:53):
more.

Speaker 3 (39:54):
So I'll push back on this, because the element here
was we have, unlike other papers, we have four columnists at our
paper, okay, so it's more just.
Well, what are they going towrite about?

Speaker 1 (40:13):
Oh, okay, and stuff like that.
That.
That's different also, and youmight just see it.
You gotta include those guys inthe exactly so in in like for
that's different and that'swhere it's you have to.

Speaker 3 (40:22):
You have to account for that and all, and we have
the way we like to do.
Our coverage is we have weeklythings, so is is something
happens on a tuesday, well, isthis something we can cover in
the podcast on Wednesday?
Is this something we can coverin the mailbag on whatever day?
Is this something we can cover?
Here and there it will beaddressed.
It's just not maybe in thetraditional sense where it's

(40:44):
three stories, because at thesame time, the counter to, I
guess, oppose what you just saidIf you're writing three stories
every day, one of them's goingto get buried, and if it's a
relevant story, then maybe youcould pick and choose the right
time to tell it and it'll getmore eyeballs here's.

Speaker 1 (41:03):
Here's my philosophy, just in general, about every
town, every reader, everylistener, every human.
There's a Pied Piper mentalitythat if you lead the way, people
will follow.
So I'm sensitive to this.

(41:25):
I think that when the piratesstart going bad, as they have in
the last few years, all of asudden people tune out.
Well, people tune out becausethe station and I had an
argument with 93.7 the Fan gotmy hand slapped a few years ago
about this on the air.
They were talking aboutattendance and so on.
I said you guys can determinehow that is.

(41:46):
You guys, the more you talkabout a team, even if they're
bad, you can find good stories.

Speaker 3 (41:55):
You can find interesting things.
There's always good stories,but I think there's you know
there's.

Speaker 1 (42:00):
And, by the way, and educating the fan.

Speaker 3 (42:03):
Right Is important.
I just think there's, but howmuch does the fan I mean?
Well, there's a formula.
There's a formula.

Speaker 2 (42:09):
I agree.

Speaker 1 (42:12):
I feel like a lot of times the fan I mean there, well
, there's a formula, there's aformula.
I, I agree.
I feel like a lot of times thefan has.

Speaker 2 (42:18):
I'm not okay.

Speaker 3 (42:18):
That's just one element, by the way, my point is
would you rather read about youknow, alika williams going two
for three in a game, or wouldyou rather me sit down with him
the next day and talk, hey,why'd you go two for three?
Oh, because I went to thisplace in the off season and I
made some change.
Like you can get more to itthan like we said.

(42:39):
Like, yeah, you could write twoor things, two or three things
every game.
But sometimes it's just more ofa sense where it's like note
that and expand upon it later.
It's having the touch and feelto say is this a two, three that
night, or do these two, threethings play into something we do

(42:59):
later on?
That we can capture it?
And if you look at our bylinecount, I mean we're writing 20,
30 stories a week during theseason.
That's.
I mean how many games they playa week Five, six.
So there's a ton there.
It's just you know when a gameends at 11, how many of your
stories do you want coming?

Speaker 1 (43:19):
out I guess it's just a general feeling about that I
have that there's such anincredible appetite amongst fans
, regardless of the record.
Yeah, and our radio and TVratings show it.
Oh, I agree.
They're dying for it.
They want more content.
They do, yeah so like give itto them.

Speaker 3 (43:37):
Any way you can, unless again, this is general
yeah Around this town.
It also just depends on youknow.
There's so many factors thatplay into that, like in St Louis
, that's the only professionalsports team there.

Speaker 1 (43:48):
Yeah, but it's always been that way, even when they
had the.

Speaker 3 (43:51):
St Louis Rams yeah, or the.

Speaker 1 (43:53):
Cardinals even before that.

Speaker 3 (43:54):
Yeah, but here it's like all right, well, what's
going to get into the paper andthis?
And that I genuinely feel thatif there was a story to be told,
we told it.
It's just, you know it'sdeciding, you know know, is this

(44:15):
a today story?
Is this a tomorrow story?
Is this long form?
And there's you don't alwaysget that right right like
there's things that you probably, when you're driving home after
games, like I wish I probablycould have talked about that.

Speaker 1 (44:24):
No doubt about that it's, it's, it's tough but even
after games that he and I havetalked about this down the road,
doing doing something an hour,they do an hour post-game TV
show.
I think there's room foranother hour and another hour.
And so TV radio, podcasting,writing, whatever it is.
I think people want it, so giveit to them.

(44:47):
And when you don't, when youquit talking about the team,
they're no good.
Well then people then do turnto other things, because that's
where there's no content.
But there's people out therethat want to see it, hear it,
take it in.

Speaker 3 (44:59):
Yeah, and I think that it's always evolving, it's
always moving.
The key, what you alluded to,is, I think it's important to
give it in different ways, likeif all you're doing is writing
about it, that's one thing, but,like, my job, even as a beat
reporter, isn't just to write itI know yeah, like okay, well,
I'll bring this up on my radio.
Hit on the fan tomorrow.

(45:19):
I'll bring this up on mypodcast.
I'll bring this up.
And you know differentperspectives.
When we do a yeah, a live showor you know, this is, this is a
good.
When I'm doing our mailbag,like could, I'm sure someone
will ask about it here.
Let's just put a pin on that.
And then, if it's more of anopinion like what do you think
about this, I get to talk aboutmy opinion in the mailbag and
stuff like that.

(45:39):
It's fun.
It's fun.
And that's what's unique aboutbaseball is, with football,
you're contained to one game aweek and whatever narratives
come, out between monday andthursday when they're practicing
baseball there's.
There's a new story every day,and more than one right, and

(46:00):
it's just your job create morecontent than yeah, yeah, and
that's why it's your job todecipher.
You know what's.
What's a bullet point, what's astory?
What's a story work on for fivedays?
What's a story work on for twomonths and everything in between
online and, uh, hard copies thewe're we're phasing out hard.

Speaker 1 (46:17):
I can't believe there's still some hard copies,
right?
What do you think of that?

Speaker 3 (46:20):
um, I get it.
I I think that I don't know.
I mean the hard copy.
I I see why people like it.
I personally like it because Igrew up reading it, but I think
that online, I mean, it's hardto make someone focus on
anything for two minutes thesedays.

Speaker 2 (46:43):
Yeah, they call it the bull ride.
You have eight seconds to grabsomeone's purse, correct?

Speaker 3 (46:49):
And we're in an information age where you just
want it now, now, now, now, now.
And that's why guys likeSchefter and Shams and Passing
get paid so much money.
It's like they're not writing aton, it's just they're able to

(47:11):
recognize what the grandaudience wants.
And if you could still feedevery mouth at the table, that's
great.
I think that that's theimportant part and I take pride
in that we made an emphasis.
It's like we're always going tohave an in-depth feature run in

(47:34):
the Thursday newspaper and inthe Sunday newspaper.
We will always make sure ourtwo best stories we write this
week as far as features go, wecan't control.
You know, if they lose 11-0, mygame story is not going to be
as good as a walk-off home runin the 12th Right.
That's just facts.

Speaker 1 (47:49):
It could be about Roddy Tellez pitching.

Speaker 3 (47:51):
Yeah, it could be, but I'm just saying it's not
going to be, as that's whatShelton would hope it would be
Right.
So you know you want to focuson that, but you also want to
focus on the new thing.
How are we going to get theyoung Noah Hiles, who's 15 years
old, who just loves baseballand loves sports media?

(48:12):
He's probably not going to CVSand picking up a hard copy of
the Post-Gazette right now howam I going to make him consume
my content?
He's probably going to see iton YouTube, he's going to see it
on TikTok, he's going to see iton Twitter or X or something
like that, and it's going to bein a different thing.

(48:32):
So you've just got to figureout how to package it and how to
get your message out there andhow to reach as many people.

Speaker 1 (48:36):
Just wrapping this up , the other episode you talked
about you just touched on itthat you thought one of the
reasons the Pirates keptCharrington and Shelton was
because they really believed intheir heart of hearts that 2025
was the year right.

Speaker 3 (48:52):
In a way, yeah, I think.
I mean, I think that they hoped.
Obviously, I don't think theyacquired the players this past
offseason knowing that thiswould be the production they
would get, but I think thattheir scope of things was this
is going to be.
A key piece to this is skeinsand jones and getting chandler

(49:16):
and ashcraft and harringtonclose, and I don't know what
they thought ortiz or falterwould be.
I don't, you know.
Maybe they thought they'd bethis good, maybe not.
Um, but I think that, in thegrand scheme of things, skeins,
more than anyone else, theyviewed as if we're going to win
a championship here before 2030,this guy's going to play a
significant role in that, and sowe need to dedicate this year,

(49:39):
a big part of it, to making surethat we set this guy up to be
the best he can long term.
And if we want to, you know, ona counterpoint, like, like,
yeah, they would have been abetter team if they pitched them
once every five days, but youknow who's to say that that
would have went as what?

(50:00):
Would he have ended the yearwith a sub two era, maybe, maybe
not.
Uh, maybe it wouldn't have gonewell, maybe he would have got
injured.
But they took this route withthe six-man rotation, knowing
that, yeah, it might not bewhat's best for keller, it might
create more bullpen dilemmaswhere you're down an arm and you
have to rely on guys to coverinnings and if they don't,

(50:21):
you're you know sol.
Um, they did that with theunderstanding that, like, this
is still going to be the betterlong-term prep play.
So this was more just thementality that they had, that
it's like, yeah, this might makeit a little harder to win now
in 2024, but overall, this isgoing to make us a lot better of
a team moving forward.
And that's what I think theywere getting at was in order to

(50:44):
completely maximize this weaponthat no one else in baseball
really has.
We have to take this route in2024.
And there's still a path thatthey could have probably been a
better team.
Right, if Swinski and Hayes andall these other guys produced,
they probably could have been aplayoff team even bullpen right.
If these things worked out theway they did, they still could

(51:05):
have won by this route, but Idon't think it was the most
ideal route of choice.
I think it was the route thatthey looked at and recognized
and said this is going to be alittle bit inconvenient, but
this is something we need to do.

Speaker 1 (51:19):
I'm sorry, go ahead.

Speaker 2 (51:20):
So you're a fan watching what you just said.
So what changes in your mind?
This is your opinion piece,yeah.

Speaker 3 (51:27):
What changes is you get to use your best weapon way
more.

Speaker 2 (51:35):
Okay.

Speaker 3 (51:35):
Yeah, you get to pitch Paul Skeens more than
however many 18 times at the bigleague level.
You get to let him log 200innings.
Obviously, I think another bigpiece of this year was you got
to figure out what you have withO'Neal Cruz here.
They clearly made a decision onhim and you can debate whether,
if that was the right call ornot, you can debate the progress

(51:55):
he made against lefties, ifhe's hitting enough power or
whatever.
I feel like they figured somethings out.
They also figured out somethings are not going well right
with their hitting development,with Davis, with Sawinski and
all that.
But I think, to answer yourquestion, with the changes, all
right, well, we know what wehave with Cruz.
We know what we have withSkeens.

(52:16):
We have an idea.
They already knew kind of whatthey had with Reynolds.
Let's build around this nowwe're entering.
Last year they really didn'teven I mean, they had an idea of
what they had with this weapon.
They drafted one overall.
But now they really know.
Okay, now we know how to usethis and he's prepared to be

(52:37):
used, how we want to use him.

Speaker 1 (52:39):
I understand people's angst about not keeping
Charrington and Shelton get thatpart of it.
No doubt Change change.
But I also, like you, talkabout skin in the game, and
Charrington pretty much saidthat at that press conference.
He and Shelton are kind of tiedat the hip now.
I mean, they have come out andsaid we have to win.
Like 2025 is the no excusestour.

(53:01):
Yep, it's huge.
So I kind of like that.
You know, to your point.

Speaker 3 (53:07):
Does it feel like 2013?
Maybe a little to you.
Maybe, yeah, well, this pastyear felt like 2012.
Yeah, that's what I'm saying,where it's like we saw hints of
it.
We didn't have this talentthough.
So that's what's interesting tome.

Speaker 1 (53:25):
That's the end of the show.
Yep, that's the end of the show.

Speaker 3 (53:28):
Yeah, but that's what's interesting to me is, you
know, I agree with you where itis like all right, this is your
final chance to kind of piecethis puzzle together, because if
somebody new comes in.

Speaker 1 (53:38):
They're going to have a grace period, a honeymoon.
They have to, I mean, thatalways happens, but now this is
it.

Speaker 3 (53:48):
So I like the immediacy of it.
I agree, yeah, and I think thatthat's.
But my question is what'sdifferent?
I mean as a fan.

Speaker 2 (53:56):
I'm asking the same questions.

Speaker 1 (53:57):
The team will be way different come spring training.

Speaker 3 (54:00):
That's a question that I mean.
Not way.
I should say what will bedifferent.
That is interesting.
There will be.

Speaker 2 (54:06):
The move that you could say you know in 13,.
They went out and got RussellMartin Well they're going to go
out and get somebody.

Speaker 1 (54:11):
That's no doubt in my mind.

Speaker 3 (54:12):
That's the question that needs to be answered.
What's going to be different?
Who do they hire to be theirhead of pro scouting?
Who do they hire to be theirhitting coach, their bullpen
coach?
What do they do in free agencytrade market?
What do you do with Henry Davis?
What do you do with Brian Hayes?
What do you do with BrianReynolds?
Do you play him at first?
Do you play him in the outfield?
Still DH him?
Do you bring Kutch back?
That's what's going to bedifferent.

Speaker 1 (54:33):
You're going to be a busy guy.

Speaker 3 (54:35):
This offseason I'm enjoying these last couple of
days, and again, I don't know ifit's going to be, you know.

Speaker 1 (54:42):
I have a prediction, by the way, what?
Do you got, I think for thefirst time in a fan nothing.
But they are going to go outand be aggressive way more this
year than they have been inyears past.

Speaker 3 (54:55):
And they should.

Speaker 1 (54:55):
As soon as that World Series ends, because you can't
sign guys until, or deals andstuff.
Baseball doesn't want that.

Speaker 2 (55:01):
What does that mean?

Speaker 1 (55:04):
This is a quiet period.
It means they're going toacquire.

Speaker 3 (55:07):
Does it mean a multi-year deal?

Speaker 1 (55:09):
I don't know.
I think that that would be thestart.
For years they've waited, untilJanuary to February.

Speaker 2 (55:15):
I think that's something that we should remind
everybody.
Russell Martin signed atwo-year deal.

Speaker 3 (55:18):
That's my point.

Speaker 2 (55:20):
Because it's not that if you're buying a substitute.

Speaker 1 (55:23):
Maybe that's what's different.

Speaker 2 (55:24):
That's what I'm asking you.
As I've said in other places,that's the start.

Speaker 3 (55:27):
It's easy, as I've said in other places, that's the
start.
It's easy.
I mean, when you bring in a veton a one-year deal, you look at
him as yeah sure, this is cool,I've watched him do great
things.
But it's like, is he going to?
If we're 500 at the deadline,is he going to be here in August
when you sign?
Well, think about him when yousign.

Speaker 2 (55:47):
Think about a free agent signing here.
Why would you sign here If youget a multi-year deal?
It's a little bit ofgame-changing.

Speaker 3 (55:53):
Exactly, and that's exactly it.
When you can make a statementthat says there is no backup
plan here, where when it's aone-year deal, it's okay,
there's always the ripcord.
It's like, no, we're going,we're diving in the pool.
And if you sign a free agent orif you make a substantial trade

(56:14):
, you trade for a guy who hasthree years of control and it's
not just a, you know a guy who'spre-arb or something, but
someone who has, you know, afinancial commitment on his deal
and you say you know, we'rewilling to pay this guy this
amount of money for the nextcouple of years because we know
this is going to make our teambetter in this window.

(56:34):
That's, that's the, that's thestance they need to make, that's
the statement they need to make.
so name a couple free agents,maybe that you have in the back
of your head my leading my wishlist if I was a pirates fan and
I just think the perfect fit forthis team a guy that I look at
is Tyler O'Neal.
Tyler O'Neal makes this teambetter in so many ways.

(56:57):
Tyler O'Neal has been a part ofwinning baseball teams.
Tyler O'Neal hits 30 home runs.
Tyler O'Neal plays excellentoutfield defense on the corners
and when you have a new centerfielder I mean we talked about
what could you do with BrianReynolds you may be moving to
right first base DH.
I think in this ballpark yourbest defensive outfielder needs

(57:18):
to be your left fielder and youget Tyler O'Neal.
That is absolutely the case.
It takes a burden off O'Neal,who's still learning center
field.
You have a 30 home run bat.
You have a guy who's been herebefore and that's a guy who's
not going to sign on a one-yeardeal.
That's a guy who's going totake a notable.

Speaker 2 (57:34):
He's also somebody you have to trade for no, he's a
free agent.

Speaker 3 (57:36):
He's a free agent.
He's a free agent.
He's an unrestricted free agent.

Speaker 2 (57:40):
I'll be baffled if he didn't go back to Boston.

Speaker 1 (57:43):
If it happens, we're bringing you right back guy.

Speaker 3 (57:46):
but I mean there's, you know my, you want to know my
wish list yeah, bo bichette, bobichette.

Speaker 2 (57:51):
Yeah, I want to, when you talk about a right-handed
power bat where's he playingshortstop, shortstop every day
and I signed him to a long-termcontract immediately because I
think that's a loud noise.
I think you bring a a guy thatwants to win.
He learned from too low.
Um, he brings a lot to thetable.
Defense is above, above bar.

(58:13):
But he's also a guy that bringsa lot of tools at the plate.
O'neill I, I agree.
The only problem is name aright-handed power hitting bat
that's played in pittsburgh.
I mean, jason bay didn't work.
That's a huge park and to sayhe's gonna hit 30 home runs, I'm
even if he doesn't at 30, Istill think.

Speaker 3 (58:32):
I mean, if he's 20, that's still.

Speaker 2 (58:34):
I'm with you but I'm just saying bo bichette, longer
term maybe younger, he's 25, himo'neill, exact same age,
probably a similar contract, ifyou look at it okay, if the
pirates signed him, then you'recoming back to hold my cutter
yeah, I mean that'd be a wildmove, but I know the blue jays
need some pitching too, so wehave some depth there.

Speaker 3 (58:54):
Yeah, I mean trade targets.
There are some guys that Ithink make a lot of sense.

Speaker 2 (58:59):
I think free agency's a lot tough.

Speaker 3 (59:00):
I think free agency's tougher, especially this year,
because you look at this freeagent class, there are like
three or four, maybe five guyswho are going to get paid really
well I mean Tyler Neal'sprobably going to get 20 million
Easy right.
I mean this is going to be tough.
It's going to be tough, yeah,and you might have to make some
moves to clear up within yourbudget if you're the Pirates to

(59:20):
do that.
But they're trade guys too.
I mean you want to talk about asplash Kyle Tucker, go get him,
yeah, but what would it take?
Who knows?
But I mean, how serious are youabout winning?
Or a guy I was just texting myfriends about?
Cleveland needs startingpitching right now.

(59:41):
What if you went and got a guylike Stephen Kwan?
That would take a lot.
That's what.

Speaker 1 (59:46):
I'm saying so.
We're talking about scenarios,trades.
It's going to happen.

Speaker 3 (59:50):
You watch.

Speaker 1 (59:51):
I don't know if it'll be that big of a name, but they
are going to do some thingsthey've not done in at least
five or six years.
You watch, it's just going tohappen.

Speaker 2 (59:58):
And that's what you need to do With your backs
against the wall, you need toacquire someone who's going to
be here for multiple years,because that's the difference.

Speaker 3 (01:00:06):
Guys saw rowdy was on a podcast this past weekend.
He was talking about thedifferences in clubhouse culture
between milwaukee andpittsburgh and he said the vets
in milwaukee you just had moreguys who had been there and the
guys that he mentioned you, youlook at their names.
You talk about adonis, youacquire adonis.
Adonis had multiple years onhis deal when he was acquired by

(01:00:27):
tampa.
Right, and so it's.
It's not like a thing where,when you bring in a Rowdy or a
Santana or a Vogelbach, aone-year commitment like what
Art House?
said in the movie Moneyball,it's not a huge vote of
confidence, right.

Speaker 2 (01:00:42):
If you're going to build around, you've got to
bring in the right guy Right.

Speaker 3 (01:00:45):
They need their.

Speaker 2 (01:00:46):
Russell, martin I'd love to have Adamas.
We're never going to be able toget Adamas.
You just look at it.
Adamas is a teammate of mine,he's a friend of mine.
I think the world of him wecannot get him.
You just look at it and say whocan we go out and get?
That makes our clubhouse better.
That is a winner.
That adds to that culture, thatschemes and certain guys,
obviously.

Speaker 3 (01:01:04):
Ryan, mountcastle would be a trade target I would
look at that's an idea too,because you know, what I like
about him is multiple years ofcontrol.
I mean, baltimore's got all ofthese guys.
Eventually one of them's gonnahave to move to first base.
They're gonna take priorityover him and mount castle's a
guy who's kind of seen itthrough.
He's gone through the tunnelthat the pirates are in the

(01:01:25):
middle of right now, and not allthe way to the point of a
championship, but he's seen howa rebuild is supposed to work
right, like where all the talentand he can say, hey, the guy's
like we're not far away and hecan provide quality right.
And there are pieces in thisorganization that I'm sure the
Orioles would love to have.

Speaker 1 (01:01:46):
One thing we can absolutely agree on.
You talked about it the bestpodcast you've ever heard or
been on, hold my Cutter.
Hold my Cutter.
It's truth, absolutely.
You get the nuance of Hold myCutter right.

Speaker 3 (01:02:01):
Yes, okay, it's a double entendre.

Speaker 1 (01:02:03):
Thank you, yes, thanks to.
Double Entendre.

Speaker 2 (01:02:07):
Look that up.

Speaker 1 (01:02:09):
On Hold my Cutter thanks to Noah Hiles.
Thank you for watching.
Like subscribe on all allplatforms.

Speaker 2 (01:02:16):
Yeah, and maybe we'll start our own mailbag because
he's inspired me.
Thanks, noah thanks guys.