January 7, 2026 • 30 mins
Our candid conversation with Athena Dean Holtz charts a rare kind of turnaround: from high-achieving workaholic to a leader shaped by discernment, wise boundaries, and a hopeful view of redemption. Athena opens up about childhood trauma she long suppressed, the moment those memories resurfaced, and how a 13-year business partnership collapse forced her to ask the bravest question a leader can ask—what part did I play?
Thanks for listening!
Click here to take the LeaderImpact Assessment and to receive the first chapter of Becoming a Leader of Impact by Braden Douglas.
Remember, impact starts with you!
Listen
Watch
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_00 (00:05):
Welcome to the Leader Impact Podcast.
We are a community of leaderswith a network in over 350
cities around the worlddedicated to optimizing our
personal, professional, andspiritual lives type impact.
This show is where we have achance to listen and engage with
leaders who are living this out.
We love talking with leaders, soif you have any questions,
comments, or suggestions to makethis show even better, please
let us know.
(00:26):
The best way to stay on Canadais our newsletter at
LeaderImpact.ca or on socialmedia at LeaderImpact.
If you're listening from outsideof Canada, check out our website
at leaderimpact.com.
I'm your host, Lisa Peters, andour guest today is Athena
Deanholz.
Athena is a professionalspeaker, Christian publisher,
author, podcaster, discernmentstrategist, and creator of the
(00:48):
Redemptive Leadership Framework,with more than 40 years of
experience equipping leaders inministry and marketplace.
She is the founder of RedemptionPress, recognized as a best
Christian workplace three yearsin a row, and author of multiple
books, including her mostrecent, No Longer Hidden, You
Cannot Resist What You Do NotRecognize, and her forthcoming,
(01:08):
Redemptive Leadership, aframework for leading with
clarity, courage, andcompassion.
Athena speaks nationwide atconferences, churches, corporate
training events, and retreats,empowering audiences to lead
with discernment, resilience,and redemptive influence.
Welcome to the show, Athena.
SPEAKER_02 (01:26):
Oh, thank you, Lisa.
So great to be with you.
SPEAKER_00 (01:29):
It is great to have you.
You know, I I have to know, um,it says Christian publisher.
Is that Christian books orChristian authors?
And what's the difference?
SPEAKER_02 (01:39):
Um, that's a great question.
It is Christian authors.
Okay.
So even if we have someone whois writing a cookbook or a
business book that's notnecessarily spiritual in nature,
really that's what we we publishChristian authors.
We are not all the books wepublish are Christian books.
SPEAKER_00 (02:00):
Right.
Okay.
See, I uh you're you're one oflike two that I know of, and uh
very similar.
So thank you for answering that.
And our I think um yourpublishing company is in, is it
in Arizona?
Did I read?
SPEAKER_02 (02:15):
Well, we just in May of this year moved all the
operations and our distributionwarehouse to Arizona, but I did
not go with it.
So I'm still in WashingtonState, right at the base of
Mount Rainier, where it'sbeautiful when the sun is out,
which isn't very often.
Wow.
SPEAKER_00 (02:35):
That sounds lovely.
Well, thank you for joining ustoday.
It is nice to have you.
SPEAKER_02 (02:39):
Great to be here.
SPEAKER_00 (02:41):
We're gonna go through a series of questions.
We're gonna jump right into it.
Uh, we love hearing about theprofessional story and how you
got to where you are today, butmore importantly, sort of those
pivotal that pivotal moment ormoments that happen.
Wondering if you could sharethose.
SPEAKER_02 (02:56):
You bet.
Well, I think back, um, I mean,my dad was a successful
businessman, and I just wantedto be like him.
I didn't necessarily want to belike my mom.
She was pretty negative.
And uh so just I had a lot ofthe same giftings that my dad
(03:17):
had, even at a young age, I knewthat.
And um I just remember this verypivotal moment of when I was
around 28, just had my firstchild, and I just kind of looked
at my life and went, wow, youknow, I haven't had trauma or
anything like that.
(03:39):
And uh what was crazy was I wascompletely out of touch with
reality because I um betweensexual abuse as a child and a
forced abortion when I was ateenager, and then, you know,
marrying someone who wasphysically abusive.
I mean, I had plenty, but I hadspent so much time just being a
(04:04):
workaholic and just always beingin what I lived for was my work
because I loved it, and so itwas a much more of a happy place
than all those other places.
So it was my medication ofchoice, work and success, but it
(04:26):
really didn't serve me well tokind of be in that space all the
time because then I was kind ofout of touch with what really
needed to be processed in mylife.
SPEAKER_00 (04:39):
Wow.
It's funny that you say uh youwhen you started off like I had
no trauma.
And then you tell me about thetrauma that you had, and I'm
like, Did do you think that youchose um I and I know you said
you were workaholic, so that wassort of your addiction was I'm
gonna do this because I don'twant to think about that.
Um like you chose you chose tobe happy.
(05:04):
Didn't you?
Do you think that like I chosenot to live with that?
I chose to think of a future.
I don't know.
SPEAKER_02 (05:12):
That's I'm I'm definitely a glass half full um
risk taker person who alwayssees the good instead of the
negative, which and that's uhwas traits that my dad had as
well.
And so there was some of thatthere, but I don't really think
(05:34):
that I um realized.
I mean, I had clearlycompartmentalized stuff down
whatever I did, where Ihonestly, when I said that to
myself, I did not remember anyof those things.
It wasn't until I was 40 that Istarted remembering things and
(05:57):
going, oh, okay, I got somestuff here.
SPEAKER_00 (06:02):
Wow.
And you you'd mentioned that at28 you realized you never had
this, but it wasn't until youwere 40 that you maybe started
making changes or well, it waswhen I actually remembered
something.
SPEAKER_01 (06:15):
Yeah, okay.
SPEAKER_02 (06:16):
Uh, and then as I did, I wanted to get some, you
know, process that and get somehelp with it.
And so just acknowledging itwhen I was 40 was a huge step
for me.
Um doesn't mean I didn't keepdoing my workaholic thing
because I kept going there as itwas a safe place for me.
SPEAKER_00 (06:40):
Yeah, I can, yeah, I see, I see that.
Um we might come back to that inthe questions that we asked
because I want to ask you aboutuh your best principle of
success if you have a story thatsort of illustrates that.
SPEAKER_02 (06:53):
Well, I would just say that I came after coming out
of a very abusive businesspartnership uh that ended badly.
It was a 13-year partnershipthat ended very badly, and I set
(07:14):
my heart toward finding out whatpart did I play in that?
Like, is some of that somethingI need to own?
And as I prayed and just like,where how did I end up here
losing everything?
Um, and I realized some thingsthat uh helped me say, okay,
(07:42):
yes, I was a victim, but Ididn't have to play the victim
because there were red flagsthat I absolutely ignored.
There were like I just didn'ttrust that I could get another
author to replace the one Ishould not have ever published,
(08:04):
and that was this toxic person.
And um, you know, I should havebeen able to say, you know what,
and draw a boundary there andgo, I don't, I don't need to
work with this person.
I need to just trust that Godwill bring me someone else to
work with.
Yeah, and and that was a hugehard lesson to learn because of
(08:31):
because of those things, Ireally lost, I lost everything.
SPEAKER_01 (08:37):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (08:38):
He stole it from me, but there were some things that
I ignored to my peril.
SPEAKER_00 (08:47):
Um it is so hard when because listening to you,
you you believed in God at thatpoint of your life to think how
could this happen, how could youdo this to me?
And I know that's a question Ithink people ask, right?
It's like, how could you do thisto me?
Um, that's a hard and I'm whenwhen bad things happen, that's
the question, you know, why, howcould this happen to me?
SPEAKER_02 (09:08):
Um absolutely.
And that is, I mean, there was alittle bit of that in me, like
how how how could you do this tome?
But then I see, oh, that I'mback like 20 years before that,
that God had wanted me to startgetting some counseling and get
(09:30):
some healing for all thesebroken areas.
And I'm like, no, thank you.
I did so I did not surrenderthat.
I didn't do what he was askingme to do, and that left me
vulnerable to being deceived bythis husband, this guy and his
(09:52):
wife, who absolutely just tookme to the cleaners.
SPEAKER_01 (09:57):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (09:57):
And it was a hard lesson to learn, but now I mean,
I look back on it and go, Iwouldn't trade as horrible as it
was.
Yeah, I would not trade itbecause I'm a much deeper and
more compassionate person nowthan I was before that.
SPEAKER_00 (10:15):
I I think that's uh I mean, that is great.
And and just asking, you know,what part did I play?
Um, but it it it it's uh to lookto look ahead and to just keep
moving forward and and acceptand ask that question is is a
great principle.
Like just okay, this happened,what part did I play?
And and understand and do theprocess.
unknown (10:36):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (10:37):
And what can I learn from it?
Yeah.
I mean, we need to learn when wemess, when things don't go well,
there's a lesson for us tolearn.
And that I think is the positiveway to look at it, because
that's just we can get bitter orwe can get better.
SPEAKER_00 (10:56):
Yes, that's a good one.
Yeah, I love that.
You can get bitter, you can getbetter.
Well, um, I'm not even sure whatyou're gonna tell me here
because uh I we've talked alittle bit about failures,
mistakes, but I I'm wondering ifyou have one that um because we
learn more from our failures andmistakes than our own successes.
So if you have one and a storythat illustrates that.
SPEAKER_02 (11:16):
Well, early on, um like 30 some almost 35 years
ago, almost 40 years ago, I umwas working with Vietnam
veterans and their members anduh the and their wives, them
about post-traumatic stress,which wasn't even a word back
(11:39):
then.
It was like in the 80s, no onewas, I mean, we were not
treating our Vietnam veteransvery well at all, let alone you
know, recognizing the traumathat they lived with and that
was kind of pouring out on theirfamily.
And so just learning all that Ilearned about being triggered
(12:03):
and going into fight or flightmode, all the things that happen
when there's unprocessed trauma,it was like there that was a
period of time where I began toconnect some dots and see, oh,
I'm doing that, or oh, I'm I'mdoing the flight mode.
(12:26):
And uh just there was a lotthere that I realized, I think
because I learned that, eventhough I didn't do with it what
I should have done with it atthat time, I learned a hard
lesson that helped me to reallybounce back, um, look at those
(12:52):
pieces, those unhealed places,and really begin to have some
full circle moments of wow, thishappened way back there, but I'm
not even putting it togetheruntil all these years later, but
so grateful that I could havesome answers to the questions
(13:12):
that I had that I didn't evenknow I had.
unknown (13:15):
Wow.
SPEAKER_00 (13:16):
Isn't it amazing that you you went and and had a
uh you worked with the vets thatjust that that that's how it
started for you to the um theprocess of your healing?
Um I want to acknowledge uhbecause you talked about PTSD
and you know where you saw it inin the veterans, which seems you
know right, like PTSD it happensthere, but it can happen at
(13:39):
work, you know, it can happenwhen you are working and you
have a board that is is angrywith each other, or you're
working and your partners arealways fighting, or you know,
PTSD can happen at work, and Idon't think you know people
realize uh that because it youknow, we think trauma, we think
big, and it's not so it can be aloss, it could be a miscarriage
(14:03):
that nobody even knows aboutexcept for you and your husband.
SPEAKER_02 (14:07):
It could there's so many things that it can be, and
that's what was so interestingabout this time where we're
trying to help these veteransunderstand their PTSD, and then
we're the wives are all going,wait a second, they do not have
a corner on the market herebecause we got our own baggage
that we've never dealt with, andwe are constantly getting
(14:29):
triggered into overreacting tothings that we shouldn't be
overreacting to, but becausewe've kind of kept it at arm's
length, it's still gonna implodeif we don't move forward with
some healing.
SPEAKER_00 (14:46):
Yeah, wow.
Um, how long what was your firststep in healing?
Because you started to recognizeit.
Did you know who was that?
Did you make a call?
Did you surround yourself?
SPEAKER_02 (14:57):
Yes, yeah.
I actually did make a call, andactually my husband and I
started going to somecounseling.
It wasn't a great, it wasn't agreat fit.
Um, so that kind of went on theshelf for a while.
But then when I came out of thatabusive, that 13 years of abuse
(15:20):
in business, I um took some timeand spent like three days a
week, two-thirds of each day,getting some counseling and
looking at all the lies that Ibelieved and then looking for
the truth that I needed toreplace that lie with.
(15:43):
And so it was it was huge, but Istill got more.
I mean, there's still more stuffthat continues to pop up, and
it's like, thank you, Lord.
I need to, I need to addressthis, or you wouldn't be
bringing it to my attention.
SPEAKER_00 (16:01):
And and I I I want to think that you believe you
are the person you are todaybecause of that.
SPEAKER_02 (16:07):
Absolutely.
I would not trade it, whichthat's the crazy part.
People go, you must be kiddingme.
You do have they got you todivorce your husband, not talk
to your kids for 12 years, youlost your$3.5 million business
and you don't regret it.
I'm like, I do not, because whatI learned from that that helps
other people is like totallyworth it.
SPEAKER_00 (16:29):
Yeah.
It's a great, great point.
Thank you for sharing that.
That's it's it's a that's a goodpoint.
Um at Leader Impact, which is isthe group that we're part of, we
want to grow professionally, uh,personally, and spiritually.
Uh for obviously increasingimpact, which I think you were
doing a lot of.
Would you be willing to share anexample of how the spiritual
makes a practical difference,which you have talked about the
(16:52):
whole podcast?
But if you have an exampleanother example, I do.
SPEAKER_02 (16:57):
I had a mentor during those Vietnam veteran
ministry days who um challengedme to say a prayer that he said
could change my life.
Like, okay.
What's the prayer?
And it was it went like thisshow me my heart, Lord, as you
(17:20):
see it.
Okay, that doesn't sound sodangerous.
I'll do that.
And at that time in my life, itwas very early on in me
following Christ, and you know,I was just kind of along for the
ride, is how it felt.
(17:42):
Praying this prayer every day, Istart seeing that I was
basically in the driver's seat,Jesus was in the back seat, if
if that.
And the motive of my heart wasmore my kingdom come, my will be
done.
I was making big money, I didn'twant to let that go.
(18:04):
I was very a lot of notorietyand a lot of success.
I really didn't want to let thatgo.
And so all of a sudden I'msaying this prayer, and he's so
happy to answer that prayer.
And the reality of my spirituallife was far from his will be
(18:26):
done, his kingdom come.
And so it really moved me towardthat surrender that needed to be
there for me to say, okay, God,whatever you want for my life, I
want to, I want to do that.
And I want you to cleanse myheart and help me to be who you
(18:46):
created me to be.
And that, but that that onelittle prayer was like, it just
moved me toward that season ofsurrender, and that's where he
met me.
SPEAKER_00 (19:01):
Did um I'm I'm taking a course hearing God, and
when when you pray, show me,show me my heart, Lord, as you
see it.
Did you ever feel God talked toyou?
How did God talk to you?
Because he can talk to you in somany ways, if it's not the
Bible, if it's through your, youknow, people, places, events,
like how did you how did youfeel that things were changing?
SPEAKER_02 (19:24):
Or well, there were a few places in the Bible that
he spoke to me through, like theheart is deceitfully wicked, who
can know it?
That was one of those.
Alrighty then, I wasn't quiteready for that.
But then also the scripture thatsays, seek first the kingdom of
(19:46):
God and his righteousness, andall these other things will be
added unto you.
So it was like, Okay, uh, Idefinitely see that I'm seeking
my plan, my will.
Had a winning uh however manyyears it'd been, seven years in
this insurance and securitiescompany where I was a senior
(20:08):
vice president.
So I really was comfortable withwho I was.
And the conviction that camethrough really mostly through
the scriptures, although I'mpretty sure there were probably
some songs, some worship songs,or something in a sermon that
kind of also brought me fullcircle and kind of helped me
(20:31):
connect the dots in seeing thatI really was not, I really
wasn't running after God like Ineeded to be.
I was busy running after mysuccess.
And so I think he, you know, hemeets us wherever we're at.
(20:51):
And the way he spoke to memostly was through the word.
SPEAKER_00 (20:56):
Yeah.
I I remember thinking when I wasyounger and going to church, um
when a s when a sermon wouldhappen, and it'd be like, he's
talking to me.
And so I never realized no, hehe's, you know, just that moment
was my moment, but it was it wasa lot of people's moment.
(21:16):
But I I never I was like, no,I'm the only one here who's
really hearing this message forwhat it is.
Um God speaks to us.
It is so fun.
SPEAKER_02 (21:26):
Yes.
Amen.
Amen.
SPEAKER_00 (21:28):
All right.
So at Leader Impact, we'rededicated to leaders having a
lasting impact.
So as you continue to movethrough this journey of your
life, um, have you consideredwhat you want your faith legacy
to be when you leave this world?
SPEAKER_02 (21:41):
Yeah, um, I want my family and my team members at
Redemption Press and my friendsto remember me as someone who
allowed trials in this life torefine me.
SPEAKER_01 (22:00):
No matter how painful, yeah, but to choose joy
in the midst of that.
SPEAKER_02 (22:14):
I get weepy, so I mean, I'm just this person that
God is so faithful to do what webeg him for, and just a lot of
my time in prayer was Lord doinga Romans 8 28 thing where in the
(22:38):
Bible, in the book of Romans,chapter 8, verse 28, it says,
and we know that he works allthings together for good for
those who love him and arecalled according to his purpose.
But then if you go to the nextverse, it talks about being
conformed to the likeness ofChrist, that a lot of times
(23:01):
these hard things, God allowsthem because he knows it's going
to be something that's going toconform us to the likeness of
Christ.
And I think just wanting myeveryone that knew me, because I
touch a lot of people in thispublishing ministry, and just
(23:26):
for them to have some hope thatJesus could do some of the same
things for for them that He didwith me.
And I mean, I was a Christianhater when I started, when I got
saved.
I thought Christians wereidiots, wimps, they don't,
they're just a they need acrutch.
(23:47):
I don't need a crutch.
I mean, it's pretty amazing whoI was before and how God changed
me.
SPEAKER_00 (23:56):
Yeah, I I I believe I take that for granted because
I was raised, not in anything,you know, like church on Sunday
was about the hardest core wewent.
Not we didn't, we didn't doanything else.
I'm much different now, but Iwas raised that way versus not
like you didn't believe.
And so what a what a greatstory.
(24:18):
Oh, great story.
Thank you.
Thank you for sharing thatbecause I think people listen
and they think, yeah, you grewup like that, you're all, you
know, right?
We and it's like, no, now Itotally get the name redemptive,
redemptive press.
SPEAKER_02 (24:32):
Yeah, and I, you know, at some point in my life,
right before I got saved, Ididn't get saved till I was 33,
and I had never heard the gospelof Christ.
No one, I never went to Iwana, Inever meant to, I never went
anywhere, so I never heard it.
And this lady asked me when Iwas about 31, 32, so are you a
(24:55):
Christian?
I'm like, hmm, well, I'm notJewish, and I live in America.
I guess I am, which that doesnot make you a Christian, by the
way.
Um, but just you know, I lookback and I can chuckle so many
times on just the way Godallowed me to be wrong, and I
(25:21):
was willing to say, wow, I waswrong, and I'm sure glad I got
the the scoop on what the realJesus, who the real Jesus is,
and just I've watched him nowfor 40 some years be so faithful
and so loving.
SPEAKER_01 (25:41):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (25:42):
Oh, it's so good.
Um, my final question for you iswhat brings you the greatest
joy?
SPEAKER_02 (25:51):
I would say just watching how hard times in my
life and how God worked them forgood in the end, um, that they
end up speaking life to someoneelse, to those who are maybe
looking to him but not realizinghow much he is drawing them to
(26:13):
himself.
And I just look back on my lifeand see this amazing
faithfulness that he hasdemonstrated that even before I
even knew him, he knew me, lovedme, and drew me to himself.
(26:35):
And listen, if he could, I usedto drop the F bomb every single
sentence.
I mean, I'm that is not anexaggeration.
I was I was pretty prettyraunchy, and to think that God
would woo me and draw me tohimself and save me and let me
(26:56):
do what I do, helping authorstell their hard stories and how
he's faithful, even in the hard.
SPEAKER_01 (27:06):
It's amazing.
It's amazing.
SPEAKER_00 (27:09):
Oh um I I I love I love this podcast.
Like I just love listening toyou and and being so vulnerable
in your story.
Uh there's a there was a lotthere, and I think uh I think I
think sharing your story is justso important to people because
number one, to hear your storyand to know that you've you know
(27:29):
you from all the trauma, youbelieve in God.
Um, because that can, you know,that's I would think that's
hard.
Uh I do not have the trauma.
I have some that I've workedthrough, but nothing.
So I just want to thank you forsharing that and then sharing,
you know, your your normalcy ofthe life before dropping F bombs
(27:52):
to what was I, you know, becauseI think you're not perfect, none
of us are perfect, and God willwait.
God, you know, so He will.
SPEAKER_02 (28:03):
And what's funny is I mean, that was who I was, just
trash mouth, sailor.
And I mean, the minute I said,Okay, God, I'm yours, gone.
Not one more cuss word out of mymouth.
unknown (28:23):
Wow.
SPEAKER_02 (28:24):
And it wasn't like I asked for that.
I just he wanted to make a pointthat he's God, I'm not, and he
can do the miraculous, which hedid.
SPEAKER_00 (28:37):
Athena, thank you for this last half hour.
It is it has been a pleasure toto speak with you, to see you.
Um, someday I'm coming toWashington State and be at Mount
Rainer, right?
SPEAKER_02 (28:50):
Mount Rainier.
SPEAKER_00 (28:52):
Yes.
SPEAKER_02 (28:53):
So come when it's not raining, like July or
August.
SPEAKER_00 (28:57):
That sounds like a nice time.
Um, Athena, if anyone wants toreach out to you, follow up,
actually look at, you know,they're they're a Christian
author, anything.
How can they find you?
SPEAKER_02 (29:07):
My website is Athenaholtspeaks.com.
Okay.
And my the business isredemptionpress.com.
SPEAKER_00 (29:17):
Okay, so they can find you for any speaking
engagements, anything like thatas well.
Awesome.
We'll get that in our shownotes.
Well, I want to thank you againfor joining us.
It has been a pleasure.
Thank you.
SPEAKER_02 (29:27):
Well, it's you've been delightful.
Thank you for having me on.
Awesome.
SPEAKER_00 (29:31):
Well, this ends our podcast, and we hope you've
enjoyed our time together.
Thank you so much.
If you're part of Leader Impact,you can always discuss or share
this podcast with your group.
And if you are not yet part ofLeader Impact and would like to
find out more and grow yourleadership, find our podcast
page on our website atleaderimpact.ca.
You can also check out groupsavailable in Canada at
LeaderImpact.ca, or if you'relistening from anywhere else in
(29:53):
the world, check outLeaderImpact.com or get in touch
with us by email.
Info at LeaderImpact.ca, and wewill connect you.
And if you like this podcast,please leave us a comment, give
us a rating, or review.
This will help other globalleaders find our podcast.
Thank you for engaging with us.
And remember, impact starts withyou.
Welcome to the Leader Impact Podcast.
We are a community of leaderswith a network in over 350
cities around the worlddedicated to optimizing our
personal, professional, andspiritual lives type impact.
This show is where we have achance to listen and engage with
leaders who are living this out.
We love talking with leaders, soif you have any questions,
comments, or suggestions to makethis show even better, please
let us know.
(00:26):
The best way to stay on Canadais our newsletter at
LeaderImpact.ca or on socialmedia at LeaderImpact.
If you're listening from outsideof Canada, check out our website
at leaderimpact.com.
I'm your host, Lisa Peters, andour guest today is Athena
Deanholz.
Athena is a professionalspeaker, Christian publisher,
author, podcaster, discernmentstrategist, and creator of the
(00:48):
Redemptive Leadership Framework,with more than 40 years of
experience equipping leaders inministry and marketplace.
She is the founder of RedemptionPress, recognized as a best
Christian workplace three yearsin a row, and author of multiple
books, including her mostrecent, No Longer Hidden, You
Cannot Resist What You Do NotRecognize, and her forthcoming,
(01:08):
Redemptive Leadership, aframework for leading with
clarity, courage, andcompassion.
Athena speaks nationwide atconferences, churches, corporate
training events, and retreats,empowering audiences to lead
with discernment, resilience,and redemptive influence.
Welcome to the show, Athena.
SPEAKER_02 (01:26):
Oh, thank you, Lisa.
So great to be with you.
SPEAKER_00 (01:29):
It is great to have you.
You know, I I have to know, um,it says Christian publisher.
Is that Christian books orChristian authors?
And what's the difference?
SPEAKER_02 (01:39):
Um, that's a great question.
It is Christian authors.
Okay.
So even if we have someone whois writing a cookbook or a
business book that's notnecessarily spiritual in nature,
really that's what we we publishChristian authors.
We are not all the books wepublish are Christian books.
SPEAKER_00 (02:00):
Right.
Okay.
See, I uh you're you're one oflike two that I know of, and uh
very similar.
So thank you for answering that.
And our I think um yourpublishing company is in, is it
in Arizona?
Did I read?
SPEAKER_02 (02:15):
Well, we just in May of this year moved all the
operations and our distributionwarehouse to Arizona, but I did
not go with it.
So I'm still in WashingtonState, right at the base of
Mount Rainier, where it'sbeautiful when the sun is out,
which isn't very often.
Wow.
SPEAKER_00 (02:35):
That sounds lovely.
Well, thank you for joining ustoday.
It is nice to have you.
SPEAKER_02 (02:39):
Great to be here.
SPEAKER_00 (02:41):
We're gonna go through a series of questions.
We're gonna jump right into it.
Uh, we love hearing about theprofessional story and how you
got to where you are today, butmore importantly, sort of those
pivotal that pivotal moment ormoments that happen.
Wondering if you could sharethose.
SPEAKER_02 (02:56):
You bet.
Well, I think back, um, I mean,my dad was a successful
businessman, and I just wantedto be like him.
I didn't necessarily want to belike my mom.
She was pretty negative.
And uh so just I had a lot ofthe same giftings that my dad
(03:17):
had, even at a young age, I knewthat.
And um I just remember this verypivotal moment of when I was
around 28, just had my firstchild, and I just kind of looked
at my life and went, wow, youknow, I haven't had trauma or
anything like that.
(03:39):
And uh what was crazy was I wascompletely out of touch with
reality because I um betweensexual abuse as a child and a
forced abortion when I was ateenager, and then, you know,
marrying someone who wasphysically abusive.
I mean, I had plenty, but I hadspent so much time just being a
(04:04):
workaholic and just always beingin what I lived for was my work
because I loved it, and so itwas a much more of a happy place
than all those other places.
So it was my medication ofchoice, work and success, but it
(04:26):
really didn't serve me well tokind of be in that space all the
time because then I was kind ofout of touch with what really
needed to be processed in mylife.
SPEAKER_00 (04:39):
Wow.
It's funny that you say uh youwhen you started off like I had
no trauma.
And then you tell me about thetrauma that you had, and I'm
like, Did do you think that youchose um I and I know you said
you were workaholic, so that wassort of your addiction was I'm
gonna do this because I don'twant to think about that.
Um like you chose you chose tobe happy.
(05:04):
Didn't you?
Do you think that like I chosenot to live with that?
I chose to think of a future.
I don't know.
SPEAKER_02 (05:12):
That's I'm I'm definitely a glass half full um
risk taker person who alwayssees the good instead of the
negative, which and that's uhwas traits that my dad had as
well.
And so there was some of thatthere, but I don't really think
(05:34):
that I um realized.
I mean, I had clearlycompartmentalized stuff down
whatever I did, where Ihonestly, when I said that to
myself, I did not remember anyof those things.
It wasn't until I was 40 that Istarted remembering things and
(05:57):
going, oh, okay, I got somestuff here.
SPEAKER_00 (06:02):
Wow.
And you you'd mentioned that at28 you realized you never had
this, but it wasn't until youwere 40 that you maybe started
making changes or well, it waswhen I actually remembered
something.
SPEAKER_01 (06:15):
Yeah, okay.
SPEAKER_02 (06:16):
Uh, and then as I did, I wanted to get some, you
know, process that and get somehelp with it.
And so just acknowledging itwhen I was 40 was a huge step
for me.
Um doesn't mean I didn't keepdoing my workaholic thing
because I kept going there as itwas a safe place for me.
SPEAKER_00 (06:40):
Yeah, I can, yeah, I see, I see that.
Um we might come back to that inthe questions that we asked
because I want to ask you aboutuh your best principle of
success if you have a story thatsort of illustrates that.
SPEAKER_02 (06:53):
Well, I would just say that I came after coming out
of a very abusive businesspartnership uh that ended badly.
It was a 13-year partnershipthat ended very badly, and I set
(07:14):
my heart toward finding out whatpart did I play in that?
Like, is some of that somethingI need to own?
And as I prayed and just like,where how did I end up here
losing everything?
Um, and I realized some thingsthat uh helped me say, okay,
(07:42):
yes, I was a victim, but Ididn't have to play the victim
because there were red flagsthat I absolutely ignored.
There were like I just didn'ttrust that I could get another
author to replace the one Ishould not have ever published,
(08:04):
and that was this toxic person.
And um, you know, I should havebeen able to say, you know what,
and draw a boundary there andgo, I don't, I don't need to
work with this person.
I need to just trust that Godwill bring me someone else to
work with.
Yeah, and and that was a hugehard lesson to learn because of
(08:31):
because of those things, Ireally lost, I lost everything.
SPEAKER_01 (08:37):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (08:38):
He stole it from me, but there were some things that
I ignored to my peril.
SPEAKER_00 (08:47):
Um it is so hard when because listening to you,
you you believed in God at thatpoint of your life to think how
could this happen, how could youdo this to me?
And I know that's a question Ithink people ask, right?
It's like, how could you do thisto me?
Um, that's a hard and I'm whenwhen bad things happen, that's
the question, you know, why, howcould this happen to me?
SPEAKER_02 (09:08):
Um absolutely.
And that is, I mean, there was alittle bit of that in me, like
how how how could you do this tome?
But then I see, oh, that I'mback like 20 years before that,
that God had wanted me to startgetting some counseling and get
(09:30):
some healing for all thesebroken areas.
And I'm like, no, thank you.
I did so I did not surrenderthat.
I didn't do what he was askingme to do, and that left me
vulnerable to being deceived bythis husband, this guy and his
(09:52):
wife, who absolutely just tookme to the cleaners.
SPEAKER_01 (09:57):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (09:57):
And it was a hard lesson to learn, but now I mean,
I look back on it and go, Iwouldn't trade as horrible as it
was.
Yeah, I would not trade itbecause I'm a much deeper and
more compassionate person nowthan I was before that.
SPEAKER_00 (10:15):
I I think that's uh I mean, that is great.
And and just asking, you know,what part did I play?
Um, but it it it it's uh to lookto look ahead and to just keep
moving forward and and acceptand ask that question is is a
great principle.
Like just okay, this happened,what part did I play?
And and understand and do theprocess.
unknown (10:36):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (10:37):
And what can I learn from it?
Yeah.
I mean, we need to learn when wemess, when things don't go well,
there's a lesson for us tolearn.
And that I think is the positiveway to look at it, because
that's just we can get bitter orwe can get better.
SPEAKER_00 (10:56):
Yes, that's a good one.
Yeah, I love that.
You can get bitter, you can getbetter.
Well, um, I'm not even sure whatyou're gonna tell me here
because uh I we've talked alittle bit about failures,
mistakes, but I I'm wondering ifyou have one that um because we
learn more from our failures andmistakes than our own successes.
So if you have one and a storythat illustrates that.
SPEAKER_02 (11:16):
Well, early on, um like 30 some almost 35 years
ago, almost 40 years ago, I umwas working with Vietnam
veterans and their members anduh the and their wives, them
about post-traumatic stress,which wasn't even a word back
(11:39):
then.
It was like in the 80s, no onewas, I mean, we were not
treating our Vietnam veteransvery well at all, let alone you
know, recognizing the traumathat they lived with and that
was kind of pouring out on theirfamily.
And so just learning all that Ilearned about being triggered
(12:03):
and going into fight or flightmode, all the things that happen
when there's unprocessed trauma,it was like there that was a
period of time where I began toconnect some dots and see, oh,
I'm doing that, or oh, I'm I'mdoing the flight mode.
(12:26):
And uh just there was a lotthere that I realized, I think
because I learned that, eventhough I didn't do with it what
I should have done with it atthat time, I learned a hard
lesson that helped me to reallybounce back, um, look at those
(12:52):
pieces, those unhealed places,and really begin to have some
full circle moments of wow, thishappened way back there, but I'm
not even putting it togetheruntil all these years later, but
so grateful that I could havesome answers to the questions
(13:12):
that I had that I didn't evenknow I had.
unknown (13:15):
Wow.
SPEAKER_00 (13:16):
Isn't it amazing that you you went and and had a
uh you worked with the vets thatjust that that that's how it
started for you to the um theprocess of your healing?
Um I want to acknowledge uhbecause you talked about PTSD
and you know where you saw it inin the veterans, which seems you
know right, like PTSD it happensthere, but it can happen at
(13:39):
work, you know, it can happenwhen you are working and you
have a board that is is angrywith each other, or you're
working and your partners arealways fighting, or you know,
PTSD can happen at work, and Idon't think you know people
realize uh that because it youknow, we think trauma, we think
big, and it's not so it can be aloss, it could be a miscarriage
(14:03):
that nobody even knows aboutexcept for you and your husband.
SPEAKER_02 (14:07):
It could there's so many things that it can be, and
that's what was so interestingabout this time where we're
trying to help these veteransunderstand their PTSD, and then
we're the wives are all going,wait a second, they do not have
a corner on the market herebecause we got our own baggage
that we've never dealt with, andwe are constantly getting
(14:29):
triggered into overreacting tothings that we shouldn't be
overreacting to, but becausewe've kind of kept it at arm's
length, it's still gonna implodeif we don't move forward with
some healing.
SPEAKER_00 (14:46):
Yeah, wow.
Um, how long what was your firststep in healing?
Because you started to recognizeit.
Did you know who was that?
Did you make a call?
Did you surround yourself?
SPEAKER_02 (14:57):
Yes, yeah.
I actually did make a call, andactually my husband and I
started going to somecounseling.
It wasn't a great, it wasn't agreat fit.
Um, so that kind of went on theshelf for a while.
But then when I came out of thatabusive, that 13 years of abuse
(15:20):
in business, I um took some timeand spent like three days a
week, two-thirds of each day,getting some counseling and
looking at all the lies that Ibelieved and then looking for
the truth that I needed toreplace that lie with.
(15:43):
And so it was it was huge, but Istill got more.
I mean, there's still more stuffthat continues to pop up, and
it's like, thank you, Lord.
I need to, I need to addressthis, or you wouldn't be
bringing it to my attention.
SPEAKER_00 (16:01):
And and I I I want to think that you believe you
are the person you are todaybecause of that.
SPEAKER_02 (16:07):
Absolutely.
I would not trade it, whichthat's the crazy part.
People go, you must be kiddingme.
You do have they got you todivorce your husband, not talk
to your kids for 12 years, youlost your$3.5 million business
and you don't regret it.
I'm like, I do not, because whatI learned from that that helps
other people is like totallyworth it.
SPEAKER_00 (16:29):
Yeah.
It's a great, great point.
Thank you for sharing that.
That's it's it's a that's a goodpoint.
Um at Leader Impact, which is isthe group that we're part of, we
want to grow professionally, uh,personally, and spiritually.
Uh for obviously increasingimpact, which I think you were
doing a lot of.
Would you be willing to share anexample of how the spiritual
makes a practical difference,which you have talked about the
(16:52):
whole podcast?
But if you have an exampleanother example, I do.
SPEAKER_02 (16:57):
I had a mentor during those Vietnam veteran
ministry days who um challengedme to say a prayer that he said
could change my life.
Like, okay.
What's the prayer?
And it was it went like thisshow me my heart, Lord, as you
(17:20):
see it.
Okay, that doesn't sound sodangerous.
I'll do that.
And at that time in my life, itwas very early on in me
following Christ, and you know,I was just kind of along for the
ride, is how it felt.
(17:42):
Praying this prayer every day, Istart seeing that I was
basically in the driver's seat,Jesus was in the back seat, if
if that.
And the motive of my heart wasmore my kingdom come, my will be
done.
I was making big money, I didn'twant to let that go.
(18:04):
I was very a lot of notorietyand a lot of success.
I really didn't want to let thatgo.
And so all of a sudden I'msaying this prayer, and he's so
happy to answer that prayer.
And the reality of my spirituallife was far from his will be
(18:26):
done, his kingdom come.
And so it really moved me towardthat surrender that needed to be
there for me to say, okay, God,whatever you want for my life, I
want to, I want to do that.
And I want you to cleanse myheart and help me to be who you
(18:46):
created me to be.
And that, but that that onelittle prayer was like, it just
moved me toward that season ofsurrender, and that's where he
met me.
SPEAKER_00 (19:01):
Did um I'm I'm taking a course hearing God, and
when when you pray, show me,show me my heart, Lord, as you
see it.
Did you ever feel God talked toyou?
How did God talk to you?
Because he can talk to you in somany ways, if it's not the
Bible, if it's through your, youknow, people, places, events,
like how did you how did youfeel that things were changing?
SPEAKER_02 (19:24):
Or well, there were a few places in the Bible that
he spoke to me through, like theheart is deceitfully wicked, who
can know it?
That was one of those.
Alrighty then, I wasn't quiteready for that.
But then also the scripture thatsays, seek first the kingdom of
(19:46):
God and his righteousness, andall these other things will be
added unto you.
So it was like, Okay, uh, Idefinitely see that I'm seeking
my plan, my will.
Had a winning uh however manyyears it'd been, seven years in
this insurance and securitiescompany where I was a senior
(20:08):
vice president.
So I really was comfortable withwho I was.
And the conviction that camethrough really mostly through
the scriptures, although I'mpretty sure there were probably
some songs, some worship songs,or something in a sermon that
kind of also brought me fullcircle and kind of helped me
(20:31):
connect the dots in seeing thatI really was not, I really
wasn't running after God like Ineeded to be.
I was busy running after mysuccess.
And so I think he, you know, hemeets us wherever we're at.
(20:51):
And the way he spoke to memostly was through the word.
SPEAKER_00 (20:56):
Yeah.
I I remember thinking when I wasyounger and going to church, um
when a s when a sermon wouldhappen, and it'd be like, he's
talking to me.
And so I never realized no, hehe's, you know, just that moment
was my moment, but it was it wasa lot of people's moment.
(21:16):
But I I never I was like, no,I'm the only one here who's
really hearing this message forwhat it is.
Um God speaks to us.
It is so fun.
SPEAKER_02 (21:26):
Yes.
Amen.
Amen.
SPEAKER_00 (21:28):
All right.
So at Leader Impact, we'rededicated to leaders having a
lasting impact.
So as you continue to movethrough this journey of your
life, um, have you consideredwhat you want your faith legacy
to be when you leave this world?
SPEAKER_02 (21:41):
Yeah, um, I want my family and my team members at
Redemption Press and my friendsto remember me as someone who
allowed trials in this life torefine me.
SPEAKER_01 (22:00):
No matter how painful, yeah, but to choose joy
in the midst of that.
SPEAKER_02 (22:14):
I get weepy, so I mean, I'm just this person that
God is so faithful to do what webeg him for, and just a lot of
my time in prayer was Lord doinga Romans 8 28 thing where in the
(22:38):
Bible, in the book of Romans,chapter 8, verse 28, it says,
and we know that he works allthings together for good for
those who love him and arecalled according to his purpose.
But then if you go to the nextverse, it talks about being
conformed to the likeness ofChrist, that a lot of times
(23:01):
these hard things, God allowsthem because he knows it's going
to be something that's going toconform us to the likeness of
Christ.
And I think just wanting myeveryone that knew me, because I
touch a lot of people in thispublishing ministry, and just
(23:26):
for them to have some hope thatJesus could do some of the same
things for for them that He didwith me.
And I mean, I was a Christianhater when I started, when I got
saved.
I thought Christians wereidiots, wimps, they don't,
they're just a they need acrutch.
(23:47):
I don't need a crutch.
I mean, it's pretty amazing whoI was before and how God changed
me.
SPEAKER_00 (23:56):
Yeah, I I I believe I take that for granted because
I was raised, not in anything,you know, like church on Sunday
was about the hardest core wewent.
Not we didn't, we didn't doanything else.
I'm much different now, but Iwas raised that way versus not
like you didn't believe.
And so what a what a greatstory.
(24:18):
Oh, great story.
Thank you.
Thank you for sharing thatbecause I think people listen
and they think, yeah, you grewup like that, you're all, you
know, right?
We and it's like, no, now Itotally get the name redemptive,
redemptive press.
SPEAKER_02 (24:32):
Yeah, and I, you know, at some point in my life,
right before I got saved, Ididn't get saved till I was 33,
and I had never heard the gospelof Christ.
No one, I never went to Iwana, Inever meant to, I never went
anywhere, so I never heard it.
And this lady asked me when Iwas about 31, 32, so are you a
(24:55):
Christian?
I'm like, hmm, well, I'm notJewish, and I live in America.
I guess I am, which that doesnot make you a Christian, by the
way.
Um, but just you know, I lookback and I can chuckle so many
times on just the way Godallowed me to be wrong, and I
(25:21):
was willing to say, wow, I waswrong, and I'm sure glad I got
the the scoop on what the realJesus, who the real Jesus is,
and just I've watched him nowfor 40 some years be so faithful
and so loving.
SPEAKER_01 (25:41):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (25:42):
Oh, it's so good.
Um, my final question for you iswhat brings you the greatest
joy?
SPEAKER_02 (25:51):
I would say just watching how hard times in my
life and how God worked them forgood in the end, um, that they
end up speaking life to someoneelse, to those who are maybe
looking to him but not realizinghow much he is drawing them to
(26:13):
himself.
And I just look back on my lifeand see this amazing
faithfulness that he hasdemonstrated that even before I
even knew him, he knew me, lovedme, and drew me to himself.
(26:35):
And listen, if he could, I usedto drop the F bomb every single
sentence.
I mean, I'm that is not anexaggeration.
I was I was pretty prettyraunchy, and to think that God
would woo me and draw me tohimself and save me and let me
(26:56):
do what I do, helping authorstell their hard stories and how
he's faithful, even in the hard.
SPEAKER_01 (27:06):
It's amazing.
It's amazing.
SPEAKER_00 (27:09):
Oh um I I I love I love this podcast.
Like I just love listening toyou and and being so vulnerable
in your story.
Uh there's a there was a lotthere, and I think uh I think I
think sharing your story is justso important to people because
number one, to hear your storyand to know that you've you know
(27:29):
you from all the trauma, youbelieve in God.
Um, because that can, you know,that's I would think that's
hard.
Uh I do not have the trauma.
I have some that I've workedthrough, but nothing.
So I just want to thank you forsharing that and then sharing,
you know, your your normalcy ofthe life before dropping F bombs
(27:52):
to what was I, you know, becauseI think you're not perfect, none
of us are perfect, and God willwait.
God, you know, so He will.
SPEAKER_02 (28:03):
And what's funny is I mean, that was who I was, just
trash mouth, sailor.
And I mean, the minute I said,Okay, God, I'm yours, gone.
Not one more cuss word out of mymouth.
unknown (28:23):
Wow.
SPEAKER_02 (28:24):
And it wasn't like I asked for that.
I just he wanted to make a pointthat he's God, I'm not, and he
can do the miraculous, which hedid.
SPEAKER_00 (28:37):
Athena, thank you for this last half hour.
It is it has been a pleasure toto speak with you, to see you.
Um, someday I'm coming toWashington State and be at Mount
Rainer, right?
SPEAKER_02 (28:50):
Mount Rainier.
SPEAKER_00 (28:52):
Yes.
SPEAKER_02 (28:53):
So come when it's not raining, like July or
August.
SPEAKER_00 (28:57):
That sounds like a nice time.
Um, Athena, if anyone wants toreach out to you, follow up,
actually look at, you know,they're they're a Christian
author, anything.
How can they find you?
SPEAKER_02 (29:07):
My website is Athenaholtspeaks.com.
Okay.
And my the business isredemptionpress.com.
SPEAKER_00 (29:17):
Okay, so they can find you for any speaking
engagements, anything like thatas well.
Awesome.
We'll get that in our shownotes.
Well, I want to thank you againfor joining us.
It has been a pleasure.
Thank you.
SPEAKER_02 (29:27):
Well, it's you've been delightful.
Thank you for having me on.
Awesome.
SPEAKER_00 (29:31):
Well, this ends our podcast, and we hope you've
enjoyed our time together.
Thank you so much.
If you're part of Leader Impact,you can always discuss or share
this podcast with your group.
And if you are not yet part ofLeader Impact and would like to
find out more and grow yourleadership, find our podcast
page on our website atleaderimpact.ca.
You can also check out groupsavailable in Canada at
LeaderImpact.ca, or if you'relistening from anywhere else in
(29:53):
the world, check outLeaderImpact.com or get in touch
with us by email.
Info at LeaderImpact.ca, and wewill connect you.
And if you like this podcast,please leave us a comment, give
us a rating, or review.
This will help other globalleaders find our podcast.
Thank you for engaging with us.
And remember, impact starts withyou.
Popular Podcasts
Hey Jonas!
Hey Jonas! The official Jonas Brothers podcast. Hosted by Kevin, Joe, and Nick Jonas. It’s the Jonas Brothers you know... musicians, actors, and well, yes, brothers. Now, they’re sharing another side of themselves in the playful, intimate, and irreverent way only they can. Spend time with the Jonas Brothers here and stay a little bit longer for deep conversations like never before.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com