From Captain Controversies to Equipment Chaos: A Raw Taekwondo Conversation

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
The Warehouse 15, and I am joined by my brothers in
arms, olymp, true Olympians,have done the dance at the
highest level.
Coach, coach TJ, you're goingto go first today.
How are you, sir?

Speaker 1 (00:31):
How are you Just chilling, hanging out?

Speaker 2 (00:34):
Well, I heard you had a momentous visit and you
visited with one of ourillustrious, very well-decorated
team captains from the past andone of our most famous,
infamous women in our sport.
But we'll get to that.
Coach Moreno, how are you today?

Speaker 3 (00:52):
I'm good.
I'm good.
I'm just here.
I'm like peeling like a lizardbecause I was doing some crazy
yard work this week.
Got all fried, first burnt ofthe season, but I'm doing good.
I'm actually going out toFresno, california, tomorrow,
kind of in your neck of woodssort of.

Speaker 2 (01:07):
kind of sort of to be careful be careful out in
Fresno, because Fresno is awell-known Haven for migrant
workers and I don't want you toget caught up in that rushing
and end up on a plane in.

Speaker 1 (01:20):
El Salvador, which I was waiting for.
It I was waiting for it.

Speaker 3 (01:22):
Since you said yard work, I was waiting for it.
Let me be clear.
I'm like there's no way he'sletting this one go.
Hold on.

Speaker 2 (01:27):
His neck is peeling.
He said the word yard work andhe should just be happening to
be walking around and talking tosomebody, and then next thing
you know he's on a plane in ElSalvador with a naked back on
some other guy's butt like ahuman centipede.
True story.

(01:47):
True story, I'm not even goingto say who.

Speaker 1 (01:49):
You cannot follow that statement with true story.

Speaker 2 (01:52):
Last name, moreno, don't help, go ahead.

Speaker 3 (01:54):
True story.
I had somebody that said to mydaughters, because my daughters
are very artsy and building andstuff like that, they're like oh
yes, it's because your Mexicanancestor, you know that builds
like layers and I was like no, Iswear to God.
They said you're so good atyour, you know, creative
building and it's the Mexicanancestry of your building of

(02:16):
blocks and buildings.
And I'm like come on man.
That's great.
I got to say a shout out.
I just got a text message frommy man, michael, from Michigan.
He said to give a shout out tothe grandmaster of disaster, the
man himself, grandmaster HerbPerez.

Speaker 2 (02:32):
So that's from Mike Whitney.
Tell him I said hi, yeah, he'sthe man.

Speaker 3 (02:38):
I'm working on a book with him.
We've been working on it for along time and TJ knows him very
well.

Speaker 2 (02:46):
Well, I working out for a long time and uh, well, tj
knows him very well.
We've, well, we, I found, youknow, I found a, uh, I found a
video of your last trip tofresno.
I haven't been there yet, okay,all right.
Well, you must have been there.
You moved pretty quickly, allright, but uh, how is how about
your mother?

Speaker 1 (03:03):
I guess, how about your mother?

Speaker 2 (03:04):
I'm telling so, uh, uh.
So you're getting ready to goto fresno, and what are you
doing in fresno?

Speaker 3 (03:11):
just a training camp with a gentleman, my coach
carter.
He's got a pretty good programthere, especially uh oh yeah, so
um yeah, he's been to a few ofmy place, my uh, my camps in in
up in the san francisco area,with james howe and he asked me
to come out and we found thedate.
Yeah, we'll be out there, soit'll be fun.
So if you're in the area,you're welcome to come, if not
next time.

Speaker 2 (03:31):
Next time it's nice to see you all.
Well, let's get started today.
What do we got?

Speaker 3 (03:35):
I want to talk about this last President's Cup that
just happened in Europe.
President's Cup, young, is likeeach continental area has a
President's Cup and it's a valueof a G3, which is higher than
the most value, and it's extrapoints.
So you get a point cap of 40points and this can go above and

(03:57):
beyond.
So technically you could win 70points.
So, anyway, it's the best ofthe best A lot of Europeans, a
lot of Asians, and it's a verygood event.
The Russians destroyed it.
They were just like I I talkedabout last week with the cadets
and I said there's only onecountry that is dominant and
that's russia.
The russians were everywhere.
They were amazing.

(04:18):
I watched some of the big onesfight.
It was.
It was really fun to watch.
But what I want to talk aboutis the chest protectors, the Gen
3 chest protectors I hadpersonally sent to me, I think
by four or five different people.
Yeah, four or five differentpeople.
Imagine where a kick goes upand five points go up.
I mean it was just and ifyou're not watching, you know,

(04:40):
and there's just sometimes therecould be a melee of kicks and
you didn't know, did two pointsscore.
I mean it was chaos and this isa brand new system and, if I'm
not mistaken, tj, this is forworlds.
I think they're using this forworlds yep absolutely.
Yep, that's the goal.

Speaker 1 (04:56):
That's the goal.

Speaker 3 (04:57):
That's the goal for world championship they're using
it, the grand prix challenge incharlotte and like I mean buy
socks.
We got to buy Gen 3 socks.

Speaker 1 (05:06):
I was thinking about that the other day after you
mentioned it to me.
Think about how, again, wealways go to the underprivileged
countries.
How disadvantaged are you ifyou don't even fight on the
system?
You're showing up to an eventto fight on the system for the
first time of something of themagnitude of a world
championship Potentially right.
That in itself has to be anissue.
I don't know how you fix it,but I don't think we can keep
switching systems like that andthey just keep getting more and

(05:28):
more expensive.

Speaker 3 (05:28):
Yeah, they keep getting more and more expensive
they should fix their system andnot change their system and
force us to buy more things.
Just fix gen 2 or gen 3.
You have an upgrade, but yoursocks don't work or whatever.
Look at I mean, and I'm gonnawe always talk about how europe
and asia are of us.
They've been fighting all yearin Gen 3 and KPMP 2.
And we're still Grand Prix.

(05:49):
I'm sorry.
All of our nationals anddomestic tournaments have been
Gen 2.
The Rio Open next week in Riode Janeiro is KPMP.
It's not Gen 2, kpmp, it's thestandard one.
So it's just crazy how here weare, trying to be advanced and

(06:10):
we're not even fighting on themost current systems right now.

Speaker 1 (06:13):
Yeah, it's impossible .

Speaker 3 (06:15):
That's crazy, it's impossible, it's a tough
situation.

Speaker 1 (06:18):
Yeah, I mean between that and the, and it'll probably
get switched out last secondtoo.
It'll probably get switched outor changed.
I mean, we've seen it before.
Remember the last Olympic cycle?
They said we wouldn't be ableto switch from Dado to KPP
before the Olympic Games.
Yeah, Remember that whole fight?
That was a fight, oh yeah.
And then that just went away,and what do we have at the
Olympics?
Kpp.

Speaker 3 (06:38):
It happened, you're right.

Speaker 1 (06:39):
I think we're headed down the same path and I think
it will happen late.
We talk about all thespeculation, how bad it was at
the World Championships inMexico for the data in front of
the world you know what I meanand that kind of set the tone.
It kind of changed everything.
I think we've entered thatearly now, early, early early On
that note.

Speaker 3 (06:57):
I mean just because it's not a secret, it's public
knowledge, especially for a lotof high level coaches.
We have a WT coaches chat roomand we we exchange a lot of
information on that chat, onWhatsApp, and we you know
whether it's events or rules orwhatever and of course this
system was really gettingblasted by the Europeans because

(07:18):
they were competing on it andthey just saw a lot of
discrepancy.
And then but I'm going to bringup my man I don't want to use
the word good friend.
I mean I've known him for yearsand we're definitely friendly.
I've known him, his family andI watched his boys grow up and
good friends with his brother aswell, competed against him
twice.

(07:39):
Gergely Salim was having a bigproblem with a lot of referee
calls on deductions.
To be honest with you, his sonwas, I think he's a three-time
European champion, he's atwo-time Olympian, I mean class
act kid.
I've never seen him getdeducted out in his life, in his

(08:00):
career, and he got deducted outin this President's Cup by
Comjohns in a really shortperiod of career.
And he got deducted out in this, you know, president's Cup, you
know, by Comjohns, in a reallyshort period of time and you
know I mean there's.
I know every call is debatable.
I saw a couple that I'm likehmm, but there was a couple in
there that were called really,really quick and if it's not
anything for a referee to bethat impactful in less than a

(08:22):
minute and deduct somebody out,how many did?

Speaker 1 (08:26):
he get in a minute.
I didn't see the last.
How many did he get?
In a minute Five.
He had zero and went to five ina minute Five.
And 60?

Speaker 3 (08:31):
I think it was less to me.
I mean I have to go back andwatch.
It was a short period of time,but it was like clinch come John
, clinch come John, and it hedon't run from nobody, he fights
everybody.

Speaker 1 (08:42):
So I can't even imagine it being like him
sprinting and falling andgetting out of the way and all
that stuff like that.

Speaker 3 (08:48):
It was for holding.
It was for, like, his foot gotcaught up one time and he fell
down.
I mean, it was just a weird.

Speaker 1 (08:55):
I don't know.
I always find that gum jumpweird when you watch a kid or
someone slip on the logo in themiddle of the ring, like in no
tech one, no window contact,where they kind of smooth and
their foot comes up off the mat.
And now we're, we're down onepoint because we slipped, like I
, I don't know.
I think the warning, like the,the stand-ups, were important
back then.

Speaker 3 (09:11):
You know well, I think, I think what's worse than
that one is when you kicksomebody in the head and they
run you over, you know, and thenyou and you, you basically get
thrown out and they they rarelycall a push, they just give you
a come down for falling on theground or the one where you
someone kicks to the person'shead and you can watch them grab
and pull the other person downand then they wave it off Like
that one drives me nuts.

Speaker 1 (09:32):
It's like dude.
You had to see this kid losinghis balance and him pulling the
other guy to the floor on hisway down.

Speaker 3 (09:38):
Good referees will call it, but I would say you're
right.
We can hear you Nine times outof ten.
It's not called.

Speaker 2 (09:44):
Do you hear me more on this one?
Or do you hear me more on thisone?

Speaker 1 (09:48):
I don't know, I can't tell If you put them up closer
to one another.
You might sound loud on one butthat's just logical, I guess.

Speaker 3 (09:59):
Oh my gosh, I mean, listen, I only bring it up
because I have support forGerger and his family, because I
just, I mean, I only bring itup because, you know, out of
support for for, for Gergay andhis family, because I mean
they're, they're, they'retalented.
And you know, he sent me someprivate clips that weren't
actually on the on that chat andI got to agree with him.
There was some some reallystrange things that just weren't

(10:20):
being called his way, you know.
And so again, I don't know ifthat's, you know if there's some
dislike for him or his athleteor his family, but it was weird,
I ain't going to lie.

Speaker 1 (10:32):
I mean it was definitely.
Yeah, I was at the American EastOpen this weekend and I was
informed that there's this newrule.
Oh no, I was informed that therewas this new rule that
basically I guess WT's new thingis about the coaches
interacting with the referees.
Like, basically, if I'm likesaying this is what happened, I
was in a chair and I'm goinglike that's got to be holding

(10:52):
For sure, that one's holding.
Apparently, those are warningsto be told to sit down Even
though you're in your chair,you're not being ecstatic.
But any words of interferenceof the match's calls and that
one kind of runs me the wrongway because that's why I'm not
allowed to talk about the match,I'm not allowed to voice my
opinion of a call, like I thinkwe're going too far with the
rest, to the point where it'slike, oh, if you do it again,

(11:14):
you'll get a yellow card.
That's what I was told thisweekend as a new update as far
as coaches interacting with thereferees or the matches Not even
the matches, not evenparticularly talking to the
referee or being like ecstaticor jumping out their chair or
anything like that.

Speaker 3 (11:31):
I'm going to say something.
I'm going to go.
Okay, I'm not sure if that isthe case.
If it is the case, we're goingto find out real fast at the at
the Grand Prix challenge.
Okay, If it's not the case, thensomebody is, somebody is
misinterpreting.
I've also heard that they'renot going to score a front hand
punch anymore.
Again, this certainly hasn'tbeen told to us.
So if it's told to the refereesand we are punching or we are
talking, get a deduction, that'simproper number one.

(11:52):
But number two I'm going to goback to something.
Listen, I appreciate theAmerican referees trying to do
their best job, but they do as adisservice, because I watch
over there in Europe and I watchin Asia and I watch in Asia and
I watch how the refereesinteract.
They let people go and I feellike our guys are just trying so
hard to give deductions thatthey're interfering too hard to

(12:14):
the match.
You know, now I just talked toyou know, I don't know where
that lady was from in the Salimmatch, but generally speaking, I
was watching those cadets,youets, I was watching the
Europeans open and they letthose kids fight.
They were grabbing, they werepushing, they were punching,
they were going.
And I'm watching the UnitedStates and they're like uh, uh,
uh, and they're so quick to showthat they know a rule or they

(12:37):
saw something.

Speaker 1 (12:38):
That's what it feels like.

Speaker 3 (12:40):
It's the NFL.
Every single play, there's aholding.
Every single play, there's aholding.
Every single play.
Do you call it or not?
Based on did it affect the play?
Do you understand what I'msaying?
And I think this is whathappened with our referees here.
You know it's tough, Toughcalls.

Speaker 1 (12:55):
Yeah, I see that a lot too.
I know we talk about it, I knowthere's no way to document it,
but I feel like we're so andthey like to make calls that
like, say, if you're up by fiveor six or something and the call
doesn't affect the immediatepart of the match, I feel like
they give it more likely to showthat, like, I'm being fair,
this I'm being fair crap.
You know what I mean.
Not that the call was warranted, not that it made sense,

(13:28):
no-transcript.
And it's like you already giveme five deductions.
You give me up to fivedeductions to play with.
You put a limit of how manypenalties I can have.
Now, if I pitched a shutout atthis point, I'm up and there's
eight seconds left.
Why can't I use those to myadvantage now?
Everybody does it right.
Every other sport does it.
Why can't I slowly back up andnot engage anymore?

(13:49):
Why do I have to go forward inthose situations you give me
five, and now I?

Speaker 3 (13:53):
can't use them.
I've said that forever.
I've said that forever.
Like boxing, I can move around.
Listen, I scored 10 points.
It's your job to catch me.
As long as I'm staying in thering, I don't care if I'm
freaking.
Moving like this, like again.
This is some peopleaesthetically trying to fix the
matches that have never foughtand don't understand even.
Like you said, let's say I goback, back, back, back, boom.
Like that's a strategic move isto move back.

(14:16):
You're.
Now someone says you can onlydo it twice.
If not, you're not fighting.
If I do it three times, I'm outof the ring.
It's, it's, it's a dumb rule.
I don't care what anybody says.
It's, it's, it's what, what'sit?
Why can't I go like this?
Why can't like, if you kick me,why can't I?
I duck under.
Why can't I turn and backaround like, oh, it's a
dangerous play, it's dangerousfor me.

(14:38):
If I get hit, then I'm dumb.
It's not dangerous to you.
It's just.
What's the difference of movingor ducking or spinning out?
If I can get away from you, Iget away from you.
Whoever makes those kind ofrules?
They've never fought and theydon't understand what's
happening in a real match, realmatch.

Speaker 1 (14:53):
And I'll debate that with anybody Bring them up?
I don't think there's much of adebate when it comes to that.
I know we always talk about thepast generations of Taekwondo
and this generation of Taekwondo.
I think that takes thepersonalization of someone's
game and style out of it.
You watch boxing.
You got different type ofboxers.
You have aggressive boxers, youhave counter boxers, you have
patient boxers, you have boxerswith a lot of foot step, foot

(15:15):
movement and some people thatwant to encourage and fight and
that's what our sport has wentaway from.
I watch it.
It's cut, cancel, cut, cancel,cut, cancel.
Try to find your foot.
Because I can't really affordto be fancy, because if they get
close now I'm down by three.
There's so many things thatwent wrong, but you're a hundred
percent right, it's just taken.
I don't.
I don't see a reason why, likeI can't go a hundred percent
defensive.
I can do defense for 20 seconds.

(15:35):
You can't score on me.
That has to be your fault,that's your fault.
I can't be, even if I'mstationary on my spot and I'm
just catching everything,catching everything, stepping on
everything, like, yes,obviously I'm avoiding, but I'm
avoiding this guy's shotsbecause I'm better than him, I
got his timing, I know where toput my body, I know how close to
be, I know how far to be, andwe've taken that away because
then they're going to fight, oreven the rush when people are

(15:57):
standing still and they're goingto fight.

Speaker 3 (15:59):
What do I want?
The NFL yesterday did not banthe tush push, because the
Philadelphia Eagles, they allget in line and they all go down
and the quarterback usuallygets a yard or two.
And they didn't ban it.
And I was, look, I don't likeit, they kill my team with it,
they kill everybody with it.
But just because a team doessomething really well, better

(16:21):
than anybody else, why shouldyou ban that play?
Right, I was about to say it'snot an illegal play, it's not
Not anyone can do it, but theytried to figure out that you
can't.
They're going to make a rulefor it Again.

Speaker 1 (16:33):
It's like Because of the fans, though.
Because of the fans, because ofhow they want it to feel and
look oh, it's too easy.
Or he gets it every single time, or it's cheating.
It's not real football.
Blah, blah, blah, blah blah.

Speaker 3 (16:43):
So if it works every single time, everybody should do
it.
It doesn't work every time.
Only certain teams can do it.
Eagles do it better thaneverybody.
People can't replicate it.
So I'm just kind of giving theanalogy to the sport.
I agree with you, tj.
If I could stay in there, sowhat if I just stood there and
just blocked everything?
Am I avoid fighting Technically, but I'm just stopping
Technically?
But no, yeah, but what if Idecide to use footwork?

(17:06):
I'm avoiding fightingtechnically, but I'm just
staying out of the way.
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (17:12):
I mean, it's a, you can lose a.
I mean again, now we're goingdown the rabbit hole here.
But even, like I said, I was atthis American East Open thing
this weekend and I watched somematches.
I'm talking about the kids'side, the kid side.
I watch some of these cadet andjunior matches where it's like,
oh, the person is gettingkilled for three rounds, like to
the point of like they'recrying, they're distraught and
like they have no idea what'sgoing on, and then they win the
match.
I watch people get beat up forthree straight rounds to the

(17:35):
point they're in tears and theywin the match based on solely
just the rules.
You know.
Oh, instead of a little girl,the person going out of bounds,
they push them out of boundslike no, this girl has been
crying for for the last 45seconds.
She's showing no resistance atall.
So whatever I do is going tolook extra aggressive, right,
but like I'm watching it, like Imean, if you, if you, I wish I

(17:55):
had, if you could watch thatmatch back without seeing the
score you're going.
Man, this is so one-sided.
And other little girl one orother, yeah, other little girl
one, and it's crazy to me.
It's crazy.
That's where our sport's gottento.
Yeah, yeah, I mean, that's whatwe're enabling by not allowing
style, by not allowing people tofight in a clinch.
You know the time that oneperson starts to complain or cry

(18:15):
.
We've used all these deductionsto our advantage.
Yeah, that's the issue.
We cheer I here.
I think we messed up and Ithink I said it before we cheer
when someone falls.
That's where our sport wentwrong.
We started cheering fordeductions, like we're hoping
for them, we're doing things tocause them to slip and like get
a point off of it, canceling andgetting their leg out of the
way.
I think that's where we wentwrong.
Like that's where the game,that's where it changed

(18:37):
everything.
No-transcript call holding whenobviously I'm not fighting.
But do I need to be fightingright now?
The referee can call notfighting.
When should I be fighting rightnow?
There's so many interpretationsof this rule and it takes us

(19:00):
down a whole other path of whyit becomes more complicated to
call and to judge this game.

Speaker 3 (19:05):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean 100%.
I mean I agree with you.
I mean, getting back to theoriginal thing, as far as the
chess predictors, they need tofix this Gen 3.
I don't know, I don't know whatthey're going to do.
I don't know if they can do itin time, and I know it's a
political fight between D peoplelike KP and P better, I mean KP
and P has Regular chess cards,mess up the world, what?

(19:26):
Let's do it.
I mean, I'm ready for it, thatwould be something.
So, anyway, I mean let's letthat go, let's change something
I got to.
It's so funny because I know wetalked about you know, someone
just got, you know, bought orpurchased a book, and when I
heard about that purchase of thebook, I remembered something.

(19:46):
Someone had told me something.
I couldn't remember who.
I figured out who that didn'tspeak.
I heard you have a big fan, mrPerez that someone didn't like
your presence or your.
I don't even know why itmatters in that person's book,
but about your position ofnational team captain during the
Olympic games.

Speaker 2 (20:14):
I was national team captain from 1989 through 1992.
Historically, I was captainafter Jay Warwick retired and
decided to pick the pockets ofUSA Taekwondo for many years and
I was captain and you had beenon teams that I was captain of
and there was a reason I wascaptain.
I was.
Usually you choose a captainand this isn't talking about me,
but usually you choose acaptain one of two ways.
One, you choose a captain basedon their success matrix, right,

(20:38):
and how did they train?
What did they do?
How did they do Right Number do, how did they do right?
Number two how they lead a team.
And then in some cases rarecases the organization will
choose the captain.
So in my situation, I was thelast guy from the generation

(21:00):
before me that kept fighting andtraining and I had certain
leadership qualities and then,to speak frankly, I was one of
the most successful with you,one of the most successful
athletes in the history of thesport.
And, uh, I won a bunch.
I beat korea, won, won theworld cup, won the pan am game

(21:22):
gold medal, so, um, you had anolympic silver medal.
And so, between the two of us,I was a little bit older and, uh
, for the men's team captain.
Um, that was a, that was a,that was a, that was just a
choice.
Second, um, over the years anddemonstrating my skill as a
captain.
When the 92 team came around, umdon kum park was the coach and

(21:49):
he knew me from my days back innew york.
So, in addition to being seniorto everyone on the team, and,
uh, you and I were on the teamtogether, han wan lee was on the
team, the team together.
Han Wan Lee was on the team andum, han Wan.
Han Wan Lee didn't have arecord.

(22:10):
He was a good fighter, but hedidn't have a record and um, so,
between you and me, I was alittle bit older and so probably
that's why I ended up men'steam captain and Han was
co-captain.
I think because, um, you know,to be honest, I think, um, that
was fair.
We both were on the team, weboth had spent a lot of years on
the team together and teammates.

(22:30):
Um, we only had four men, soyou couldn't, honestly, I don't
want to interrupt you.

Speaker 3 (22:36):
I was gonna listen.
I mean, I was on the team since88.
Tonight, 92, five years in arow.
But and, and quite honestly,you were always the, you were
the captain, um, and when it gotto 92, we had four people.
We had you, hanwoo Young, jamesB Hassan and me.
And I mean I was just going tosay just seniority based on your
age and based on your longevityof the team.
I mean, listen, I had a lot ofwins up at that point.

(22:58):
But I think it's interestingbecause it was such a non-factor
, it was such a normal thing.

Speaker 2 (23:08):
We didn't talk.
I don't even think we talkedabout it.
I think you're right.
It was just like no, we hadeight people on the team.

Speaker 3 (23:16):
We had eight people on the team between yourself,
ha-won Lee and Lynette Love.
Three out of the five were likesuper older seniorities than us
.
And then you had people likeyou know me James Viasana, terry
Poindexter and Diana Murray andDaniel Laney.

Speaker 2 (23:35):
So Diana Diana Murray Diane Murray, nice girl.
No seniority, no record.
Terry Poindexter no record, noseniority.

Speaker 3 (23:44):
Who was the other one ?

Speaker 2 (23:47):
James Viasana.
No, I mean women, lynette loveuh, yeah, terry, terry points.

Speaker 3 (23:52):
There's uh lynette love um uh, danielle laney and
diana.

Speaker 2 (23:57):
No, no no record, no, whatever.
So that leaves in the historyof the sport there's never been.
Uh, because the men just wentto more events.
There were always the men, theoverall captain was always a man
, and that could have been awoman, I guess, in some case,
but it was record-based, so Idon't who said what.
What was said?

Speaker 1 (24:16):
I don't know you guys are.
Thank you, I do have a book.
This is the book he's talkingabout.
Oh, lynette Love said it.

Speaker 2 (24:22):
Oh, okay, never mind.
So you know, very nice message.
Thank you In general, but youguys, have ruined the book.

Speaker 1 (24:27):
For me, it's like watching hearing about a movie
before you read it, like Ihaven't even opened the book yet
.
It's like now I got to, likeI'm reading it.
It's like searching whateverwe're talking about right now.
So thank you guys for that.

Speaker 2 (24:47):
So ankle biter is no, it's a little different than a
pillow biter, but an ankle biteris a, uh, someone who, instead
of running faster, they bite atthe ankle of the person who's
running and faster in front ofthem.
And one of the things that'sgood about being in front of
everyone else is the view isreally nice, it's an open vista
if you're riding a bike oryou're running or whatever.
And um, coach moreno always ranlong distance way better than I
did Sprints I was better.

(25:08):
So when ankle biters speak, forthe most part I don't speak,
but when an ankle biter ieLynette Love wants to speak,
let's be clear Lynette wasn'tgood at taekwondo.
Lynette wasn't a good leader.
Lynette didn't practice andLynette didn't work hard.
She didn't train.
During trainings, she wasalways injured.
She didn't do taekwondo.

(25:30):
She did.
I am tall, though she was sixfoot eight or seven foot.
Aguni Gugu, who was bigger thaneveryone else, and the men
would take turns beating her todeath in practices when given
the opportunity, at which pointshe would go hide in a corner or
cry to somebody about what washappening.

(25:50):
So I don't have anything bad tosay about Lynette.
That's just factual.
In other words, she wasn't goodat taekwondo, she barely won,
and then, when she faced peoplethat could fight, which is what
happened in Spain, she lost.
Faced people that could fight,which is what happened in Spain
she lost.
And so, as a leader, hold on asecond.
As a leader, just to speak,leadership comes from how you

(26:10):
train and practice period.
When you go to the gym, you'rethe first guy in the gym, you're
the last guy to leave the gym.
And so Jay Warwick and Dae SungLee were captains for a reason
they were in the gym, theytrained and there's nothing you
can say bad about them.
Juan Moreno, all of us, wetrained before practice, after

(26:32):
practice and we had specialpractices.
We trained as hard as anyoneelse.
I can't say that about the women.
I can't say that about LynetteLove, and I can't say that she
would be a great leader.
What I can say is she barelymade it through the Olympic team
trials.
She didn't train and she lostat the Olympics.
So those are just facts.
Now, if she wants to ankle bite, you know there's what you know

(26:52):
.
I tell my son when he's playingsoccer guys like to talk on the
field.
Don't talk If they keep talking.
Just take your finger and pointto the scoreboard.
So I'll point to the scoreboardand the record board.
So I love, point to thescoreboard and the record board.
So I love Lynette.
I'm sad that she would take.
I don't know what's going on inher personal life.
I know she has some challenges.
I'm glad that she wrote a bookand I encourage people to read

(27:17):
my book.
But and then after that, if youwant to compare it, read her
book.
But I'm sad that she would dothat because I have the utmost
respect for my olympic teammatesand I have the utmost respect
for anyone who's ever made anolympic team let me say this.

Speaker 3 (27:33):
I mean again, I mean you spent more time with her.
Well, yeah, I spent time withher on national teams and stuff
and again, she's extremelyaccomplished.
And you know, I had so muchrespect for her because she was
way before me.
I was a little kid when she,when I made the team and she was
you know she's, she's had agreat career and stuff.
It's kind of sad, I think youknow that she, you know, kind of

(27:54):
took a shot at you.
But I'm going to say somethingI have another person that wrote
a book with his family and Iwas in that person's book and
they, they took a couple shotsat me and stuff like that.
And when I saw him I'm like,hey, what was that?
He's like, come on, you know,we got to have a little pizzazz
in there to kind of spice thingsup, because I'm like that's not
the way I remember thingshappening.
And he's like, well, so maybeshe's trying to—.

Speaker 2 (28:17):
Everybody—so you know what the beautiful—there's a
science about this right, andthe science is how you create a
memory.
So we all recreate memories,because we really don't.
You know, I studied Buddhism.
Now you live in the presentmoment.
You think there's a future, butin reality there's only a
present.
You think there's a past.
So when you think there's apast, you start to recollect the

(28:40):
past.
And the beauty of memory isthat you start to create a past
and you remember it in adifferent way, because it's a,
it's a construct.
If I told you to rememberswimming, you would see yourself
swimming.
Now, the reality is youcouldn't have seen yourself
swimming.
If you remember yourselfswimming, all you would see is

(29:03):
water splashing, splashing andyou'd see the bottom of the pool
.
That's how people swim.
In TJ's case, you know he'd beon the bottom of the pool
because you know historically,you know I'll leave it at that.
It's so fucking stupid.

Speaker 1 (29:16):
He can't help himself , he can't.

Speaker 3 (29:17):
It's true, because I can't, because I can go across
the river.

Speaker 2 (29:21):
I mean, I'm sure TJ had to be.
That's why he joined the armyand not the navy, but the um on
the other, on the other side ofthat um, I don't remember seeing
lynette ever swim, so let her I.
I'll let her recreate hermemory, because the best advice
that I heard was a beautifulwoman who was the woman in
scandal and her name was carriewashington, and she said I just

(29:44):
try to be generous.
And what does that mean?
She said well, if someone'shaving a tough day or I can be
that thing that causes them tofeel better, I just absorb it,
cause it doesn't matter to me.
It's like a cloud passing inthe sky.
And so I love Lynette.
I hope she's enjoying passingin the sky, and so I love

(30:05):
lynette.
I hope she's enjoying successin the 25th iteration of a
taekwondo school.
She's tried to open and closethat have failed.
I hope she's not working atstarbucks anymore, whatever else
she was doing, and I hope shehas a better life, because she
deserves it.
She was a great athlete.
She, um, was tall, um.
She never learned how to backkick or back hook kick, but she

(30:28):
was tall and she could kind ofthrow a push kick, which was in
the days of dinosaurs, highlyeffective against the short, fat
people.
She would fight from variousSouth American countries and her
career ended as it should.
She fought Corral from Spain,who was an amazing athlete, very

(30:50):
talented and, in fairness toSpain, corral should have won
the first time they fought.
She won the next time.
I think the record book sayswhat it says.

Speaker 3 (30:59):
Did they fight in?

Speaker 2 (30:59):
1988?
I think I don't know if theyfought in 88, but I know they
fought once before and I watchedthe match and I never talk
about matches because we all winmatches we should have lost and
we all lost matches we shouldhave won.
But her comments about thething that I think was
disturbing when I saw this clipwas I don't remember any of us,

(31:21):
we didn't have a right to jockeyfor a position to be captain.
It was either de facto known orit was given to us by a coach
and so, like the idea that Icared, I didn't care about.
You know what I cared about?
And it showed I cared aboutwinning an Olympic gold medal
and that's what.

Speaker 3 (31:39):
I focused on.
I didn't mean to go down arabbit hole, I just thought it
was funny because you've got tofocus.

Speaker 2 (31:47):
You know you want to.
This would be a great podcast.
Who I?
I'll ask the question now whowas the best woman fighter that
we had?
We name a couple of great womenfighters that we've had on the
U S team.
And I'll tell you that Iwouldn't start with Lynette.
Who would you start with?

Speaker 3 (32:09):
Oh no, I'm going to real fast.
I'll go back to so TJ justbecause of now.
We're talking about captains.
Think, in light of everythinghe just said about how a captain
was made, who's the USA teamcaptain?

Speaker 2 (32:18):
You don't have one.
You don't have one.

Speaker 3 (32:21):
You don't have one because you don't have any
leadership.

Speaker 1 (32:24):
Yeah, I guess that was going to be my next question
, kind of leading into it.
Do you think that, like whetherit's on a development level, on
a national team first of all,we don't have a, it's a whole
nother story but on adevelopment level, on a national
team level, like, is having acaptain important?
Do?

Speaker 2 (32:40):
you need that person.
I had this conversation lastnight.
I had this I had dinner withthe coach from a very high level
college who was in town to meetme and talk to my son and we we
mentioned that.
I said I've talked because Italked about a team dynamic.
Do you have it in soccer?
Is there like, do you have like11 guys to get on the field?
I said and do you have acaptain?
What does a captain do?

(33:01):
How do they lead?
What do you expect in it?
And I'm going to say without adoubt that currently, first of
all, you need a captain.
You do.
Yeah, when I got on the team,jay and Daesung were captains.
They kept me in check.
I didn't want to hang out withthe team.
They're like we're going to amovie.
I said I'm not going to a movie.
He's like you're going to amovie.

(33:21):
We do things as a team.
We're going to dinner.
I don't want to go to dinner.
We're going to dinner and Ilearned there's you, which is
important.

Speaker 1 (33:32):
Then there's the team , which, it's crazy.
I think I never had to.
I don't think we've ever.
I think about me being at peakand being around all the great
guys when I first got there Tonybeing there, rufus being there,
all the guys that are like theolder guys before I got there.
I don't think it ever was saidout loud that this person is the
captain.
But you knew, you knew.
You knew I don't know if it wasa captain or that you knew who
was the big dog in the room.

(33:53):
You knew who, who, who set thestandard.
You knew who.
You knew who to marry yourselfafter.
If he wasn't tired, youcouldn't be tired.
If he didn't sit down, youdidn't sit down.
If he was yelling, you wereyelling, like that's.
That's inferred in, like, Iguess, the energy given.
I guess my question is is itworth if you have to go to the
point of going assigning?
You're the team captain, you'rethe guy and you got to explain
to them their roles and duties,or does that just like happen

(34:19):
over, like a span of time, orlike on accident, or like
without being?

Speaker 3 (34:22):
said, it's tough when you don't have anybody that
just stands out like what wejust talked about.
But I also think you do listen.
I'm a culture guy so I thinkeven on a cadet level and a
junior level, okay, you pick theoldest kid on the team, you
pick the oldest kid on the team,you pick the biggest kid on the

(34:43):
team, I mean, other than ifthey're super shy or introverted
but you just say listen,so-and-so is going to be the
focal point.
When something comes up, we'regoing to talk to him, he's going
to make sure that everybodyknows.
I think you've got to startthat Maybe that person doesn't
end up the captain next year orwhatever.
But if you're a good coach, youcan find the alpha male in the
room or the alpha female in theroom and kind of start to build
that process.
So is it as prevalent as whenwe were fighting?

(35:03):
Probably not.
It's probably been diminished.
And I know where you're going,tj, we don't really have a
national team, but we have.
You should have a focal pointjust to kind of relay
information to people.
I mean, I really think it'sit's, it's a part of course.

Speaker 2 (35:19):
You need it because here's what happens, and coach
Moreno and I have.
And we've been fortunatebecause coach Moreno and I have
had three differentrelationships One, when he first
made the team, I didn't makethe team, I was on the sideline.
And two, we were athletestogether and I was only his

(35:43):
senior.
Then three, I was team captainand he was athlete.
Four, I was head of team and hewas coach.
And five, I was administratorand he was coach.
So we've each lived in each oneof these and I can tell you
that I met with him when I washead of team and talked to him

(36:06):
about what I wanted the cultureto be, and then he went down to
the athletes and disseminatedthe culture.
And when I was captain, Italked directly to the team and
he was there.
When it's no fun being captain,everybody thinks it's some great
thing, it's extra work and youwant to focus on yourself.
But now you've got to watchsome guy who decides he wants to
bring a girl to his room and,by the way, he's rooming with

(36:30):
the other team captain whodoesn't handle it.
So now, as captain, I have tohandle it.
So now, as captain, I have tohandle it.
Um, now I want to focus on whatI'm doing and the way it works
is I'm on a bus, he's got a girlon the bus, I got jay and
dayson looking at me you're dead.
Because the president islooking at him and saying you're
dead and that nobody's heldaccountable anymore.

Speaker 1 (36:53):
That's the problem nobody's like we, we held the
culture they lost.
We don't.
We held everybody, but here'swhere the demise came.

Speaker 2 (37:02):
The demise came when we had a group of people who
were abusing the system becausethey could and they were
instructors who had no historyin sport and they were abusing
the culture of senior junior andthey were cheating and lying
and stealing.
So then all of a suddenrightfully so a lot of Americans
became disillusioned with thesenior junior thing.

(37:23):
Then we went the otherdirection too far.

Speaker 3 (37:26):
Yeah, that's a problem.

Speaker 2 (37:28):
Yeah, we empowered people and they're like, oh, I'm
coming to practice and if Iwant to wear a T-shirt, I'll
wear a T-shirt, or if I don'twant to practice today, today
I'm going to go to sports met.
And so we went fully in theother direction.
And then we lost leadership, welost mentorship, we lost esprit
decor, what is what you guyscall culture.
And when you lose culture, tj,you were in the, you were in the

(37:49):
uh, merchant marines, right, orsomething like that.
You were in the.
No, you're in the army, and Iknow that in the army they have
a culture.
I I don't think that you showedup and said I don't think I'll
wear my cap today.
You guys okay with that.
I don't think you saw yoursergeant and said hey, what's up
, brother, how you doing Right.

Speaker 1 (38:07):
That's the tough part for me right there, but I think
that's you got to blame.
I don't know, I blame nobody,but the coaches.
Like I, just if I, if one of myguys, if I hear from any of
these coaches or people that oneof my guys was like what's that
man?
Or call them by their firstname, I'd be so thrown off and
we'd have to deal with it likeit's like and it happens to me
every now and then and I'm justlike there's no way this person
think this is okay, like it'sjust not normal, like I go to

(38:30):
1993 you asked any member of the1993 world championship team
was towards the next changeoverof leadership of the guard which
I coached that team and wasteam manager.

Speaker 2 (38:42):
Ask any of them if they didn't understand what the
culture was.
Garth Cooley may he rest inpeace was made team captain
because he was the most seniorguy on the team and Garth, from
me, got the culture.
Garth transmitted that culturedown to David Kong kong.
All the guys and three of myguys were on that team who
understood the culture and theydid stuff.

(39:02):
And you want to know, the onlyones complaining wasn't the
men's team, it was the women'steam when they had to run the
stairs to death or they had tohang on the wall.
And then they tried to findsomebody to complain.
Why are we hanging on the wall?
It's like, uh, it's part of theculture, my friend, you don't
have to love it, you don't haveto like it.
Part of the culture.
Back when we were coming up,the junior member on the team

(39:24):
did laundry.
I did laundry and made noodles,made ramen at night.
So if the senior wanted ramen,you got water, you made ramen,
coach moreno yeah, but hey,someone tried to tell me to
clean the room one time.

Speaker 3 (39:34):
I was like you must be crazy man.
I'm going to bed, man, itdidn't work on me Anyway let's
change it.

Speaker 2 (39:40):
One last story.
One last story my brother,james Villasano, who I love
dearly.
James was my roommate at theOlympics.
And this guy, untold.
I didn't expect anything fromthe guy.
This was a guy I'd come when wewere ready to.

(40:00):
He'd make the beds not his bed,he'd make our beds.
He would clean up the room hewas.
He would pack our bags, packour bags.
So I go to law school, I go ona trip with my friends to like
your bag, like you put yourstuff in your bag, literally
packed our bag.
True, true story.
I go to.
I go to go to uh law schoolfirst year after um olympics.
I go on a trip with a couple ofmy friends.
We go down to florida hollywood, florida to hang out for spring

(40:21):
break.
We get ready to go to the nextplace we're going.
We we're halfway there and I gowhere's my stuff?
He goes what are you talkingabout?
I was so used to my juniorspacking my stuff or bringing it.
I totally left my stuff.
Left my stuff in the last hotelroom.
Yeah, I know, I know when wereyou, brother.
I needed you TJ.

(40:43):
All right, let's move on.

Speaker 1 (40:44):
You got to be able to get there with folding your
underwear.
It's crazy.

Speaker 2 (40:47):
Lynette, Miss Love, a lot of respect for you.
You are my senior in taekwondoand I always, when I see you
smile, regardless of all theother stuff, I still love you.
I forgive you for, in yourmoment of finding a pencil or AI
to draft your book, that youdecided you would take a shot at

(41:07):
me.
But as we say here, sorry, notsorry.

Speaker 3 (41:11):
I want to talk about two things.
Real fast, you got something TJ.

Speaker 1 (41:15):
No, I'm listening.

Speaker 2 (41:16):
Why is he blocking?

Speaker 3 (41:17):
the.

Speaker 2 (41:17):
Joker today.
Oh there, it is All right, Isee the joke.

Speaker 3 (41:20):
I was thinking about the um.
I mean, you got the reopen nextweek, but I think, probably
more importantly, the theCharlotte.
You know the Grand Prixchallenge.
Um, what you're doing?
A camp, well, we're hosting.
You're hosting the camp we'vebeen able to bring super excited
I'm really.

(41:42):
I mean it's it's not huge, youknow, but I think we have 40
plus athletes.
You know, different athletesfrom, uh, around the states, um,
from from brazil, from puertorico, from a couple of caribbean
islands, from jamaica, fromhaiti.
So it's uh, it's really shapingup to be a pretty good program,
you know.
I mean, obviously the focus isgoing to just be on interaction

(42:03):
and movement, not necessarilythe quote, unquote, learn or
have somebody teach anybody, butjust kind of the interacting
and that kind of.
You know me, and you have builta schedule to give each coach a
little time to give theirflavor of a training.
I mean, again, nothing specific, but, of course, left out time
for just regular matches.

(42:23):
So what do you feel about it?
What are you thinking?

Speaker 2 (42:26):
Oh, I'm sorry.
I just got a message.
Can I share this with you guys?

Speaker 1 (42:30):
Oh, that's important.

Speaker 2 (42:32):
No, I just got.
I don't know where it came from.
It was like it's like a randomviewer, but I'll hold on a
second.
Can't wait to see it.
It's going to be something.
Hold on a second.
Oh, I don't want to be real.
Who is this person?
It's not going to be real, Idon't know.
No, no.

Speaker 1 (42:53):
It's it's serious Like I.
I guess my number must be upsome way.

Speaker 3 (43:02):
Sorry, not sorry.

Speaker 1 (43:06):
Sorry, I'm fucking sorry.
Yeah, I'm sorry.
I'm super excited about thecamp though I think, like you
said, we have almost 40 peopleand it's kind of cool for me
because this will be the firsttime I'll hold like a big event
in the room, so it'll give me agood running idea of like the
capacity of the room, how theroom feels with that many people
.
I mean, obviously it's a kindof a cool thing for me that you

(43:29):
know you're going to be thereleading some trainings, like in
in the gym and another peakperformance location, so that'll
be big.
I'm looking forward to doing alittle bit of a semi.
What is he showing me?
A semi, a little like smallgrand opening.

Speaker 2 (43:41):
At that point, you know just to kind of start it,
why wouldn't I show my muscle?
You said you're talking about asemi.
Go ahead, this is going southtoday.
Man, I'm going to have to beexplicit.

Speaker 1 (43:52):
I know, I know, but also with the other coaches
coming and just having all thosedifferent you know coaches in
the room and different athletesin the room, I'm ecstatic about
it, and so I thought you'd askme was it about, you know, are
we charging, are we doingsomething like that?
This is about exchange.
This is about growth.
This is about kind of being ina room with high-level athletes
and high-level coaches that allcan you know, come together and
have the same vision of of, likeI said, growth and and

(44:15):
development.
I think we got a good group.
Um, like I said, I'm superexcited about it, so hopefully
it'll be a good week.
I got a lot of moving piecesgoing on that week and, um, I'll
try my best to be a good host.

Speaker 3 (44:24):
Looking, look, really looking forward to it, though
well, no, listen, I I'm goingback in there.
I mean, I I always tell people,like you know, I'm just gonna
use my personal peak performancemodel.
Listen, I, I have a grassrootsdevelopment.
I have a grassroots developmentmodel, I have a business model
and I have a do the right thingmodel and it might do.

(44:45):
The right thing is to try togive back as much as possible.
You know I believe infulfillment, trying to do
because I can, not because Ihave to.
And you know there's times incertain moments of my life that
you know I need to do things, dothings from a business
standpoint to provide for me andmy family, and I don't think
anybody disagrees with that kindof stuff.
And then there's times, momentslike this, when I can bring

(45:07):
people together because, quitehonestly, this was my creation
and TJ.
We were lucky enough to havehis facility opened up at the
right time.
Everything kind of cametogether.
And this is true.
I mean, this is an invitationtype event, it's not open to the
public, but it's 100% free.
I've had a couple of people thatI indirectly know from New York

(45:28):
and they said, hey, we'd beinterested.
I'm like who you got?
Tell me who you got.
I'm like, yeah, I think it's afit.
I had somebody call meyesterday and ask me about
somebody else.
I said, yeah, yeah, I thinkit's a fit.
I had somebody call me yesterdayand ask me about somebody else.
I said, yeah, I don't thinkit's a good fit.
And I was just being honest.
I'm like I want people in theroom that I think are going to
enjoy and work with people.
I mean, it's not a competition,it's not a measuring stick of

(45:50):
I'm better than you, it'sliterally interaction and that's
the kind of stuff that I wantto be involved in.
So interaction and that's thekind of stuff that I want to be
involved in.
So I think it's going to begreat.
I mean, like I said, we haveyou.
You mentioned, I think we haveum one, two, three.
I think we have five differentinternational coaches there one,
two, three, four, maybe six umout of the two that you know
what?
I wasn't even thinking about her.
She's going to be there for notfor the whole time, but she'll

(46:11):
be there.
So there's another one.
So just a lot of good eyes inthe room and and it's going to
be fun, it's going to be super,and I know you'll be a great
host.
I mean, I forgot to tell you Iinvited everybody to your house
for a barbecue I'm just kiddingand a big poker game Poker game
for sure.

Speaker 1 (46:29):
Can you imagine I wouldn't have to worry about
paying overhead for my schoolfor like a year if I left that
room?
I'd be good to go for a while.
Actually, we should puttogether a poker game.
I might need it.

Speaker 2 (46:41):
Is there going to be potato salad?

Speaker 1 (46:43):
Only potato salad.
It's just going to be pokerchips and a big bowl of potato
salad.

Speaker 2 (46:48):
Watermelon Just curious.

Speaker 3 (46:52):
Padilla.

Speaker 2 (46:53):
Who Padilla?

Speaker 3 (46:56):
I know Sandia.
Sandia is that water by the way.

Speaker 2 (47:01):
Don't act like you don't know.

Speaker 1 (47:03):
I don't know what that is.
That's Spanish, I hope.
I hope I'm not that far off.
Right, you said it in Spanish,correct?

Speaker 3 (47:11):
yeah.

Speaker 1 (47:12):
I didn't know that word in Spanish sorry, just
being honest, you know, I'm notthat cultured.

Speaker 3 (47:18):
Nah, it's easy.
Yeah, I think the Grand PrixChallenge is going to be
interesting.
Like I said, I know we've got acouple weeks to build up, but I
think there's some I'm going togo here and say it.
There's some random people thatmaybe shouldn't be there, but
it is a Grand Prix Challenge.
It is open, so it is what it is.

(47:40):
But I think you're going to see, I'm going to predict you're
going to see some bad mismatchesearly on Bad mismatches.
There's going to be some peoplethat are going to go out real
quick and maybe not too pretty,and you're also going to have
some really we talked about thissome weird tough early matches,
because you're going to havesome good athletes that don't
have a high ranking right nowjust because of the reset, and
they're going to be fightingsome high level athletes that
are have the, you know, numberone, two, three, four, five seed

(48:02):
and that's going to beinteresting.

Speaker 1 (48:05):
it's going to be interesting maybe we can finish
up, go ahead, go ahead, go ahead, finish, finish.
I was about to say I'm hopingI'll probably have a few guys in
my gym before building up andusing the facilities to prepare.
I'm super excited.
I'm excited about the week.
I hope the venue is up to par.
I hope it's exciting.
I was looking a little ahead,historically right.

(48:28):
Stop me if I'm wrong.
And I'm asking you, coach, whenthe country gets their Olympic
Games, there's usually moreevents in Taekendo in their
country, correct, like a grand,like an actual grand prix and
like an actual, like even agrand prix, to the point of
saying a grand prix final andthings like that.
I think, when I look at theschedule, yeah, when I look at
the schedule, put all the events, all we do, 2027, and I don't

(48:48):
think we have a grand prix likeyou know other than this
challenge?
I don't.

Speaker 3 (48:51):
We don't have a grand prix in our country and the
challenge is really not that big, because it's just, it's not
that many points.
You know I'm saying so yeah,yeah, that's a good point.
You're a world championship orwhatever going on something
right I hope that this, I hopethat the, the usa, does a again
historically, these grand prixsit's really nice.
It's uh, they, they decorate itreally nice.

(49:13):
They have a good you knowformat.
It looks really good.
I hope that I've never been tothis facility, the stadium, so
I'm not sure if it.
Can you know what it's?

Speaker 1 (49:22):
It's a convention center though.
I think it's a conventioncenter.
I don't know.
I think it's a conventioncenter.

Speaker 3 (49:28):
I hope it looks like a Grand Prix, like for the
finals at night.
I hope you know they have goodlighting and I hope they have
good, you know, a good walkoutand stuff like that.
I hope you know, I don't know.
I hope it's done well.
I mean, it should be, theUnited States should do things
first class.
I got to turn on, I got to dosomething real fast.

Speaker 1 (49:48):
My wife is instructing me to turn on the
oven, give me a break.
Okay, I hope so too.
I hope so too.
I, I hope so too.
I don't know, I'm hoping forstadium seating.
That's all I'm hoping for.
I think that one's got to bestadium seating.
I don't know, we got to get thebleakers out, make us higher
than everyone else, or something, but that kind of gives that
effect of big-time vibecompetition for me.
Yeah, I don't think we can dothe guardrails and stand next to

(50:15):
.
Historically, and all the modes, more than the past, have been
a little bit designed like that,so I hope the design stays the
same yeah, well, they're gonnaneed to have seats that go up,
right, I mean, come on, I meanit's gotta be.

Speaker 3 (50:25):
you can't have like a right I don't know what, I
don't need a hot tub, but you,you can't have seats that are
seated like they have it rightnow, like like this, and have
people see they got to havebleachers sitting around.

Speaker 1 (50:37):
I'm going to $50 a pop right.

Speaker 2 (50:42):
I think they'll have that yeah.

Speaker 3 (50:45):
When is CFA?

Speaker 1 (50:47):
12, 13, 14?
, Something like that 13, 14, 15or something 13, 14, 15.

Speaker 3 (50:54):
What month?

Speaker 1 (50:56):
June it's like three weeks.

Speaker 2 (50:59):
I'm going to be in that area.

Speaker 1 (51:01):
I suppose I'll be in North.

Speaker 2 (51:01):
Carolina at my gym.
Well, I've come down becauseI've got to go to the.
I'll be in that area.

Speaker 3 (51:09):
I'm going to be in Murfreesboro.

Speaker 2 (51:11):
Murfreesboro yeah, tennessee yeah yeah.
I think that's right next doorto to to north carolina is it a
little?
Far is it a little far like asfar as the as a crow flies or as
a like, is it?
You know what?
How do you?
How do you?

Speaker 1 (51:30):
gotta just hop your private jet just get over here
dude, there's more.

Speaker 2 (51:33):
I'm not getting on any jets, all these.
There's a plane crash yesterdayin san diego.
You know, have you ever been ina small plane like I mean not
like a commercial.
Get over here, dude, there'smore.
I'm not getting on any jets.
There's a plane crash yesterdayin San Diego.
Have you ever been in a smallplane?
I mean not like a commercialjet like one of these.
Those things are made out ofroof siding what you ever been
in.
It's basically like an enginewith something to cover the
engine.
Those things are not.

Speaker 3 (51:54):
You remember Ruben Gayon, right?

Speaker 2 (51:55):
Ruben Gayon Mm- those things are you remember?
You remember ruben galleon?

Speaker 3 (51:57):
right, ruben galleon was a good fighter and he has
two great personal planes.
Two personal planes and he flew.
He flew me up to um uhgainesville one time to see my
daughter um up there, and wewent during a rainstorm the
scariest shit of my life.

Speaker 2 (52:13):
I was just like they fly sideways, they fly, sideways
, they fly.

Speaker 3 (52:16):
Literally he's like.
He's like we got to go throughthese, these, this, and I'm like
I'm just watching all thisstuff and then I literally, when
we got off, I'm like I need adrink, like I need a drink I
need.
I was terrified, but on the way, like a couple days later and
just coming across Florida pitchblack, beautiful lights it was

(52:40):
just like the most calm thingI've ever done.
It was just really, reallyinteresting.
I can't say I would want to doit again.

Speaker 2 (52:49):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (52:52):
I've been on small planes.
Little Judge.

Speaker 1 (52:53):
Scary.
Yeah, I've only been on thelittle commercial ones.

Speaker 2 (52:55):
You've never been on a Cessna.

Speaker 1 (52:57):
No, not the tiny ones like that.
No, like the six seaters andstuff.
No, oh, actually I'm lying, I'mlying, I'm lying.
When we went from um, but whenI went to belize, we flew from
the, where we were to like themain island, where the airport
was, was one of those tiny Ithink there's like eight seats
on there.
It was wasn't the worst, butyou can like, like he said, you

(53:18):
can feel everything.
You can like almost feel theair coming through the cracks of
the siding.
Like he said, it's not sturdy,it's not sturdy, it's not
comfortable.
The guy that was on the planeas a passenger he was sitting in
the seat next to the pilot Likethat's how tight this plane was
.

Speaker 2 (53:41):
I'm the pilot, like that's how tight this plane was.
Oh yeah, I'm like there's noway.
I mean it's a cool seat, but Idon't want to be up there.
Yeah, the one I was on hadcontrols on my side too, so it's
one of those two seaters, butit must be like how they teach
them.
So there's one here, and then,yeah, same set of controls here,
you know, and I was, like youknow, at least I felt like I
could grab something if it wentwent south and it was ruben's
like go ahead, pull it right.

Speaker 3 (53:54):
No, just no, I'm good , no, just do this.
I'm like no, I'm not gonna bethe reason that I kill myself.

Speaker 2 (54:03):
No I was in the car I was in the cockpit of a 737 or
747 because my boss was, um,also a pilot for um kuwaiti
airlines.
He was the captain.
So, um, I'm sitting back in theplane and the stewardess comes
up, this flight attendant.
She goes, oh, the captain wouldlike to see you, so, okay, so I

(54:25):
come up, they open the door.
This is pre-911.
Um, actually was it.
Yeah, it was pre-911.
And, uh, he pulls me into thecockpit and has me sit in the
co-pilot seat, like flying intoDubai, and I'm like, oh my gosh,
like I'm just sitting theretrying not to touch anything.

(54:46):
But I thought we had one morething.
I heard something about anathlete and like the idea that
should we support If anathlete's been identified as a
high performance athlete, apodium potential athlete?
What level of response orsupport should we kind of think
about?
And I think this has been achallenge in the organization

(55:09):
for a long time.
And, uh, so you, there's twotypes of cultures, right,
there's a culture where wemeaning everybody in the
organization is we, and thenthere's us and them, or us and
they and I.
I think, unfortunately for usin our sport there's been a
historical perspective that theefforts of the ngb makes them us

(55:35):
and they or us and them, evenrelative to its own
developmental pipeline.
And what I mean by that iswe've identified athletes in the
past that we think havepotential, metal potential, and
they end up going to a program,whether that's at the olympic
training center, somewhere else,somewhere else, and all of a
sudden they become us.
Not we, not the royal we, butus.

(55:58):
And then everybody else thatdoesn't come is treated as they.
And so I wonder about thatculture, because the fundamental
charter of the OlympicCommittee for each NGB is we,
not us, and they not this selectgroup of athletes that kiss the
ring drink from the chalice ofpastor sphinx.

(56:19):
It's supposed to be we, so thatmeans, if I'm identified as an
athlete, you provide whateverresources are necessary and that
are reasonable to me so that Ican make a podium, podium
performance for the us, all ofus, all of we.

(56:41):
You don't say to them do this,or else you become part of them
and they and I.
I wonder.
I wanted to kind of get yourthoughts on this, because I
certainly have my own thoughtson it.

Speaker 1 (56:53):
I mean, okay, I'll go back a little bit.
I mean, I go back to like prewas it pre 2020 Olympic
qualifications.
You know, when we, when, whenPaige was competing coach and
like again, athlete in a goodsystem with a coach has taken
her to the Olympic Games, let'sput her on a podium that has the
support, that has the trainingthat has all this stuff is kind

(57:13):
of pushed it aside a little bitand they start building another
athlete and the reason was, well, she doesn't want to work with
us, so we start pushing anotherathlete behind to replace this
this said athlete.
That is an advanced.
I just don't think you see thatagain.
Maybe you do.
I just thought from from mystandpoint, it makes zero sense
here.
Instead of just fielding andsupporting this, we're we're,
we're fighting heads up, to thepoint that we're in heads up

(57:35):
matches against each other tomake the national team I mean
for a point race that wouldpotentially get direct
qualification for the OlympicGames or not.
You have the national teamorganization using their athlete
to fight against them and it'sbeen like that for a while, you
know.

Speaker 3 (57:50):
That's not a we mentality.
I think that was interesting, tj, now that you bring that up,
because I forgot about that.
But it's one thing.
Again, it's one thing If yousay if, if, if this athlete
athlete X page didn't want to bethere, she wanted to do her own
thing, she was successful andblah, blah, blah, for them to
say you know what, okay, we'regoing to try to build something

(58:11):
else, because that's what wehave to do.
We can't just sit around and donothing.
But when you actively try tobuild against that person,
instead of still saying youconfused me for a little bit
there, young we, we're still we,we're still we, we're still the
United States, we're stilltrying to build for the future.
But their objective was to stopthis person that wasn't with

(58:33):
them, to get this person highenough in ranking to force a
fight off so that possibly theycould do there.
There was nothing that theywere trying to do for this
person over here.
It was the exact opposite theywere against it.
So I guess, to answer yourquestion, young, is, what's the
ethical obligation when they'veidentified somebody?

(58:53):
I've identified, tj, I thinkyou're really good, really good,
great potential, this and thatwe love it.
We want you to come over hereand if you come over here, we'll
do this, this and this and thisfor you and TJ says, ah, thank
you, but I don't really needthat.
I could use this.
I don't need the training.
I have all that taken care of.

(59:14):
I have a support system.
Come and look at it, come andsee it and if it's suitable to
you, then could you help me inthese other things.
And I think that's thecomponent that's missing.
I remember when I was notrenewed in my contract in 2012.
All right, and it is what it is.
It wasn't renewed and theyhired Coach Patrice Remarque.

(59:37):
I wasn't happy but stuck out myhand, coach Patrice TJ, you
were there.
Did or did not Patrice Remarquecome out to our school to watch
our trainings and to watch whatwe?

Speaker 1 (59:48):
were doing 100% Immediately the dude came out.

Speaker 3 (59:51):
The dude came out and said let me see.
And afterwards, he said this isgreat, I know what you're doing.
He gave me some suggestions andyou know, okay, great.
And after that we had a greatrelationship.
He never doubted what we weredoing.
Or were we sitting on our assdoing nothing, playing chess?
No, he knew we were busting ourass to make sure that TJ and

(01:00:12):
whoever else that was on thenational team at that time could
do the best of their ability.
So, anyway, I know I'm gettingoff on a tangent on myself, but
I just to answer your question.

Speaker 1 (01:00:20):
I think.
But again, I mean, even, likeyou just said, and again I'm
just using that as an examplewhen I actually got into the
World Class Athletes Program,the WCAP program, the director
came and saw the training, hesaw what I was doing every
single day.
He talked to you he single day.
He, he talked to you, he sawthat the facilities was good, I
mean, and he and they allowed meto stay there and train and I
was being funded by, you know,the world-class athletes program
at the time because of thecaliber of coach, the caliber of

(01:00:42):
room, the caliber of vision,the understanding of the
professionalism going on in aroom.
But they don't want to see anyof that stuff.
That's why they never come.
That's why, you know, they seethe q soul.
It's like you said, it's the usand they thing it's always been
us and that, when it comes tothat standpoint, Let me answer
the question.

Speaker 2 (01:00:56):
If there's an ethical , here's what the Amateur Sports
Act says tomorrow.
Okay, one second.
This is your boy, lopez.
The Amateur Sports Act sayswait, hold on a second.

Speaker 3 (01:01:17):
Don't let me forget about this, because the ethical
part of it, because that's yeah,give it to me Tuesday.

Speaker 2 (01:01:25):
Here's the ethical part.
Right.
There's an obligation of theNGB to develop the we not that,
they not the us, everybody inthe pipeline to what degree they
have to the ethicalresponsibility.
If an athlete says, here's whatI need, the organization could

(01:01:45):
say okay, let's see if we can dothat, because that's in the
best interest of we, of all ofus.
If an athlete says, on theother hand, um, you know what?
I don't, I don't need anything.
Um, by the way, I'm not reallytraining, I'll show up at the
event and do the best I can.
And uh, that's a different one.
When the athlete's notparticipating, not doing his job

(01:02:06):
, not doing his work or her work, that's different.
But when you have an athletewho's doing everything humanly
possible it has been identifiedas a podium performer then you
have an obligation, and that'snot just an ethical one, you
have an actual obligation underthe Amateur Sport Act to
facilitate, because that's yourjob.
Your job is to put people onthe podium.

(01:02:28):
Does that make sense?

Speaker 3 (01:02:30):
Yeah, but what I'm saying is my question ethically
is if, if I was offeredsomething right and An athlete.
An athlete.
You've been identified and I'vebeen offered it and I say no,

(01:02:50):
thank you, I don't need anythingfrom you.
Okay, they say we tried.
I can see that.
Yeah, did we or not do that?
Remember that in 2012?
They tried to tell us to dosomething.
We said you know what, we don'tneed it.
We're good.
2012, they tried to tell us todo something.
We said you know what, we don'tneed it.
Thank you, save your money.
We'll stay right here in ourlittle hole.
We didn't ask for anything,zero, but that was that time.
But let's say I said youidentified me and I go thank you

(01:03:14):
.
Really, I can't do exactly whatyou are asking me to do.
Can you do?
Do something else?
Can we have a hybrid?
Or because that's what I'mtalking about, ethically, you
know you, you've identified me,but because I haven't done
exactly what you said and I'vegiven you legitimate, I've given
you legitimate you still havean ethical, in other words, what

(01:03:36):
I remember.

Speaker 2 (01:03:37):
This is all I'm saying.

Speaker 1 (01:03:38):
So, in other words, when you're like we're talking
about athletes who are like oneof the higher performing or
people that are higherperforming in the country, like
they're comparable to the peoplethat are in your current room
that are doing it.
So that's the part of it thatyou have to like.
There's a comparison here.
There's an easy comparison tomaking you see this person have
success.
Sorry, go ahead.
So what?

Speaker 2 (01:03:58):
I'm saying is this If you say to an athlete so, in
other words, here's the contract, and these used to be called
athlete contracts.
I don't know if they have themanymore they say, if you're an
athlete and you're gettingfunding, here are the things we
expected from you to do, thefunding and it should be bare
minimum.
In other words, if we're goingon a foreign trip, you have to
show up at the training center aweek before to coalesce with

(01:04:22):
the team.
Okay, great, you have to dothese things.
You have to maintain yourcondition, you have to maintain
your weight.
Those are all threshold issues,meaning, have to do them if you
want to make the team.
On the other side, if you'regiven options, you say here's
what we think would help yourperformance, and you say, like
Patrice did, let me see whatyou're doing.
Instead, you said, okay, oh,this is just as good, here are

(01:04:42):
some suggestions.
Then you've met the athletes,met their ethical obligation to
train and be the best preparedathlete they can, and the
organization has made itsattempts to offer what they can
offer.
Too often, what's happening nowis you have egotistical coaches
, coaches that think they arethe best and brightest in the

(01:05:03):
world, despite the fact thatthey've had no performance and
they're telling them you have tocome here.
And the reason they're tellingthem to come there is not
because they think it's in theirbest interest, but they need
critical mass.
They only have a handful ofpeople there.
They want people there that aregood, right.
So my son I go back to my sonbecause it's the most recent
experience.
So my son I go back to my sonbecause it's the most recent
experience.
So he's playing on a very, verygood team.

(01:05:25):
Well, an even better teamyesterday that's a full live-in
academy team wants him and areconsidering him.
Why?
Because they want to raise thelevel of their game.
They're like the more guys wecan get like this, the better it
makes our players and thebetter it makes our place, the
better it makes our environment.
So now the obligation for my sonis okay.

(01:05:47):
Is that in my best interest,where I'm here, where I'm going,
and my son's like?
I don't think so.
In other words, my trainingsituation is great.
I've got my plan moving forward, I've got my thing.
Now, yeah, is it?
Would it be better for theother team if more kids like the
kids they have, and my son andother guys at high levels joined

(01:06:09):
in, yeah, you'd have thecritical mass or you could
develop them, but you can'tforce them to do it, because
that's just not the way theworld works.

Speaker 1 (01:06:19):
Each I guess my thing is not even better or worse.
It's like when I win asituation, that's not even go
better or worse.
Let's go when a situation isworking like you.
You see the person is issucceeding and the situation
that they're currently in why isthe goal?
To change their?
Situation we've talked aboutthis I don't understand why
that's the we've talked aboutthis.

Speaker 2 (01:06:40):
This hasn't been new.
In 1987, before you were, Ifought in a tournament and won,
beat Korea in the final.
I was born in 1986, just formath.
There you go.
So I came over and I sat onyour butt and that's why you
became who you became.
So on the plane, on the ridehome, I was approached by the

(01:07:00):
president of the organization atthat time, who had a long talk
with me about how I had aGod-given talent and I needed to
leave my instructor, move tothe Olympic Training Center and
train under Sang Lee.
He said now, you can't tellanybody about this conversation,
but this is the only way thatyou're going to make an Olympic
team if you go, move to ColoradoSprings and train under Coach

(01:07:21):
Sang Lee.
I looked at it.
The first thing I did when Igot off the plane was go tell my
instructor.
By the way, I had a greattraining situation.
I was training with one of thebest people in the world.
I was training with the bestfighter I've ever known in my
life, sifu Paul Vizio, and I hada better training situation,
but I was put upon privately,private, in a private

(01:07:44):
conversation.
This individual is still aroundand I should wait till he dies
to tell the story, but he'saround and he was part of the
Korean mafia and that was thething that was put on me.
Now that came back to bite mein the butt a couple of times
over the years, but I ultimatelyended up getting to my goal now
.
Um, so that this is not new.

(01:08:04):
This, this has been happeningbecause at the olympic training
center they had people that wentand they went there and they
weren't top level athletes, sothey needed more top level
athletes to go, because theyneeded to create a training
environment, and there's onlytwo ways to create that.
One is create your own or getothers to come and create it for

(01:08:25):
you.

Speaker 3 (01:08:25):
So so, but, TJ, you bring a good point and I never
thought about it like that.
I think it's a very wellthought out point.
Is is why should the goal be tochange what you're doing when
you're successful?
Again, I can understand ifyou're not, if, if, if.
I just was like look at thisathlete.
He's young, he's in anenvironment that hasn't produced

(01:08:46):
anything.
I think there's some potential.
I want to put him in this thingand we can grow him.
That's one thing, but when Isee this athlete I'm going, wow,
this kid is winning everywhere.
This kid seems to be in goodshape.
He's got good coaching.
I see the coach sitting in hischair.

(01:09:07):
He just came to our practiceand he did pretty much amazing.
Why should the goal be to riphim out of what he's doing and
put him there?
Should the goal be somewhere inthe middle?
Maybe it is a hybrid, Maybe itis you know what.
Let's let him work with us, Lethim continue working with you
and we can develop.
I'm not saying that shouldn'tbe an option, but you're right,
TJ, it seems like the goal is toremove an implant over here

(01:09:44):
like he said, just trying tobuild the room or whatever.

Speaker 1 (01:09:45):
But my problem is you started with a lot of people
and now we're down to where weare, seven, six, eight years
later.
We're still sitting at the samepoint.
And my issue is like, if we'renot, let's say, the goal was
like you said, I just think ourproduct is better.
I'm like our room is better.
We're going to do it allourselves.
We have the staff, we have theunderstanding, we have
everything.
We're amazing.
And now we're six, seven yearsdeep and you can't call us
amazing.

(01:10:05):
That's my point.
Like you can't say we'reamazing for sure, by any means
necessary, by any means of thisconversation, we're not close to
amazing, but that we're nottrying different things.
We're still.
We're still doing the samething and it's it's what to?
To hope we to have the one thatthat fits, but we're we're
taking.
To hope we to have the one thatfits, but we're taking.
We're putting people.
We're like limiting oursituation.

Speaker 3 (01:10:24):
The worst thing happened.
The worst thing happened Time.
At the beginning we were alllike they were like wait and see
, you'll see, you'll see, you'llsee, you'll see.
Here we are seven years deep.
Now we have history.
Now we can go back and say lookat what happened here, here,
here, here, here, here.
So if I'm an athlete, I'm acoach, why am I like, yeah,

(01:10:46):
they're going to do it, they'regoing to change this person.
You know what I'm saying?
Like now we have a historicalreference to go back and see.
Like you said, they had a bigroom.
It's whittled down to what theyhave.
Why?

Speaker 1 (01:10:56):
It goes.
It goes back to like again.
What he just said is I have togo there.
But, like you said, when yougot off the plane and that
person had a conversation, I hada conversation with you on the
plane.
If you don't go there, you'relimiting your chance of making
the Olympic team.
You're not going to be on theOlympic team.
You have to be in this room tomake the Olympic team and we've
kind of proven that you knowwhat I mean.
We've kind of seen that youknow what I mean.

(01:11:17):
So I mean it's TJ.
What do we want?
Turn it off who likes?

Speaker 3 (01:11:30):
to do this to me.
I don't know if it's to theviewers, but it's loud.
I mean TJ.
Yeah, it's funny, herb, thatwas in 19,.
I think it was in 1986, right,no 87, 87.

Speaker 1 (01:11:41):
He said 87.

Speaker 3 (01:11:42):
In 1987.
So how many years ago?
It's 20, 30, almost 50 years,40 years, 50.
At least 40.
40.
40.
Yeah, 40 years, almost 40 years.
40 years ago you had thatconversation and, tj, you know
for a fact that athletes believethat the only way they can get

(01:12:03):
to the team is to go there,because they've said that.
So it's crazy.
Here we go, we want to talkabout the bad times of a certain
ethnic group.
You know what I'm saying.
I don't want to marginalizethat and single anything out
like that, because I don't thinkit's worth doing that.

(01:12:24):
But here we are, this manyyears later, and that's even in
the air.
That's wrong For me.
That's like racism right now.
You know what?
I don't want to give people apass for racism, but let's just
say things were a different way60 years ago, but in this day
and age you know what racism isFor white people, black people,

(01:12:46):
brown people, asian people.
So when people are racist rightnow, for me it's even worse
than way back then, becausepeople were segregated back
there.
If you're racist right now,screw you, because you should
know better If you're going todo things like that.
That happened 30, 40 years agoin Taekwondo and you're still
doing those same practices.
Now that's worse, because weshould be better, we should have

(01:13:08):
way more opportunities, weshould be way more open, we
should be way more educated, andthe fact is, it doesn't appear
that we are.

Speaker 2 (01:13:15):
I don't know, With that I think I agree.
I think it's again another atopic we're going to have to
delve into.
We keep you guys ducked thequestion, ducked the question.
I'll give you one last chanceto respond to the question of

(01:13:36):
about the females, femalefighters, the best female
fighters, and if you're not,willing to, then I will.
I will start, but I will.
I will still put it out to mrd-i-t-r, which stands for duh uh
this is my non-profitorganization.

Speaker 1 (01:13:54):
Is diamond in the rough you see how I thought it
was.
You switch one letter aroundyou get something amazing you
gotta, you gotta flow with it.
Thank you.

Speaker 2 (01:14:01):
thank you, coach.
I'll send you guys one.
I got shirts for you, though Ifigured out when I saw the
diamond I thought it was diamondin the rough, but I knew it was
.

Speaker 1 (01:14:08):
I was like Johnny read nice one, one letter, one
opportunity, one situation.

Speaker 2 (01:14:16):
Mr D-I-T-R, because that flows off the tongue so
nicely, you're a female fighter,start one.
Nicely, you're a female fighter, start One, don't go, don't hum
and haw, that's crazy, I stilllike on fin weights.

Speaker 1 (01:14:26):
I like that fin weights One, just name one,
alicia Bourne.
I'll start with her.

Speaker 3 (01:14:31):
Coach.
You know what I'll miss again.
I have a lot of respect for alot of people, mandy Malone.

Speaker 2 (01:14:39):
Mandy Malone was going to be my first choice.
Mandy Malone, I'm going to giveyou an oldie but a goodie.
Kim Dotson.

Speaker 3 (01:14:45):
Kim Dotson.
I knew you were going to saythat she was rough.

Speaker 2 (01:14:48):
Kim Dotson was rough From that generation, I'd go.
Kim Dotson, I'd go.
I got to give Arlene some lovebecause she was a fighter.
Got to give Arlene some love,Alicia absolutely.
Gotta give Arlene some love,Alicia absolutely.
Mandy Malone, though, was thefirst woman I saw fight that I

(01:15:08):
didn't want to fight, like if Iwere a woman I wouldn't want to
fight her.
She could hit his heart and waswilling to fight.
Did we miss anybody?
Who are we missing?

Speaker 3 (01:15:22):
I may say two talented people.
I mean Mandy Malone was a I'mnot going to say Mandy Malone.
Heidi Gilbert was a talentedheavyweight when she was young
and I mean she could do thingsthat no heavyweight could do.
And you know what you got togive Diana Lopez.
Diana Lopez can fight man thatgirl was.

(01:15:43):
She was rough, she could do alot of things and, again, her
era of fighting was interesting.
But I mean, I've seen her inpractice.
You know I'm talking about whatI know where you guys are going
this well-rounded skills.
That's why I picked mandy,because she could do taekwondo.
Heidi could do taekwondo, um,you know, and, and quite
honestly, so could diana.
She could kick with the frontleg, back leg, offense defense,
double kick, axe kick.
She could do taekwondo.

Speaker 1 (01:16:03):
So her skills were very good.
The female team overall theywere tough man.
Like I think that I waswatching some old 2012 Olympic
trial stuff with the girls.
Like I liked it because therewas a lot of pridedness, like
everybody was competitive backthen.

Speaker 3 (01:16:18):
There were a lot of good girls and scrappy girls
that could fight in exchange,both of you guys know two girls
that I had.
Two girls good girls that I hadthat were really talented oh
Paige.

Speaker 1 (01:16:28):
Oh, Paige Danielle first, right Danielle first.

Speaker 3 (01:16:30):
Danielle and Danielle for sure, hopefully, sorry,
yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:16:34):
Yeah, I watched.
I mean I'm watching the.
I was watching the fight aroundlike I watching her emotion
move in time back, kick thesegirls, knock them on the floor.
They're standing up.
She's going directly to theface Like it was good Taekwondo,
solid Taekwondo.
I mean we had a crazy field ofwomen in the United States.

Speaker 2 (01:16:50):
A shout out, a shout out to all the women and and if
we missed anybody, we apologize.
Oh yeah, again, we got a lot ofgreat fighters.
I want to thank you all fortoday.
My brothers in arms and TJ Ilike your hat and D-I-T-R to you
, my friend.

Speaker 1 (01:17:09):
And we are out Peace.

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