October 28, 2024 • 39 mins
In this compelling episode of the 'Milk and Honey with Lemon' podcast, host Lemon Price engages with Ray Higdon to explore the intersection of business success and spiritual fulfillment.
The discussion includes Ray's transformative journey toward faith, insights on leadership development, and financial freedom. Listeners will hear powerful testimonies of overcoming challenges, embracing God's calling, and integrating faith into public and professional life.
Topics range from addressing skepticism, leveraging excellence in business to attract others to faith, and navigating personal identity in Christ. Additionally, the episode emphasizes the importance of love, connection, and recognizing opportunities to share one's faith, enriched by inspiring personal stories and practical advice.
Special highlights include discussions on debt-free strategies, prayer, and upcoming events with notable Christian speakers.
00:00 Welcome to Milk and Honey with Lemon
01:02 Introducing Ray Higdon
04:05 Ray's Journey to Faith
09:32 The Power of Obedience and Influence
17:00 Personal Reflections and Impact
19:46 Faith Over Fear: A Journey of Identity
20:37 Breaking Free from Self-Judgment
22:52 Event Details and Exciting Speakers
25:49 The Power of Meditation and Intention
30:02 Stories of Transformation and Love
35:15 Final Thoughts and Encouragement
Come to Faith Over Fear
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
Hey, I'm Lemon.
I am just like you, sisterfriend, about stepping into that
overflow that God has for us bybecoming those ultimate
Proverbs 31 women.
Hey, I'm Lemon.
I am just like you, sisterfriend.
I knew God had something morein store for me, but I couldn't
see a way out of the laundrypiles and, frankly, I resented
that Proverbs 31 woman.
How was I going to live up tothe hype?
(00:39):
That is until I found out howto really step into becoming
this Proverbs 31 woman throughleadership development.
In this podcast you're going tofind financial freedom,
leadership, growth andmotivation so you'll be able to
do all the things God has calledyou to do with ease and really
step into that land of milk andhoney.
Welcome back to the Milk andHoney podcast.
(01:00):
I'm your host, lemon Price, andtoday I'm really excited
because I have my new friend,ray Higdon here.
We actually met in San Diegoonly a week ago.
I can't believe that it's onlybeen a week that we were in San
Diego together, and so before Iread his bio actually I don't
even know Ray I have such afunny story.
I don't know if you know this,but you actually came in 10
(01:21):
minutes before I was supposed tospeak at that conference and
Michelle had already prepped meand was like the comp plan.
Training is one of the mostimportant trainings of a
conference like this, and so shehas no pressure at all.
And then you walk in and I texther.
You were sitting right next toher and I was like I'm actually
going to pass out, and of course, she told me I was going to be
great and you're fine.
And I was like you're right, itwill be great.
(01:47):
And so, anyway, you guysprobably know Ray.
I'm going to read some of hisbio, but you probably already
know who he is.
He's the CEO of the HigdonGroup.
Since 2017, he has helped salesteams generate over 300,000 new
customers.
That's a lot of new people,over 70,000 new reps.
He's been on every major stagewith people like Tony Robbins,
les Brown, bob Proctor, garyVaynerchuk the list goes on.
He has an incredible podcastwhere there's over 10 million
(02:09):
downloads, which is amazing andyou're prepping for what I would
say is probably one of yourbiggest events of the year right
now.
Right, yeah, it's our annualevent.
Speaker 2 (02:19):
It'll be the most important event we've ever done,
for sure.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
I am so excited.
So just thank you for beinghere and hanging out with me.
I'm pretty excited about it andI was super nervous.
I texted Michelle and I waslike this is it I'm going to
pass away right now in the backof the room.
Speaker 2 (02:35):
So I just want to thank you for being so kind and
gracious.
You did, you did great and also, I didn't know the name of the
podcast.
I love that the Milk and Honeypodcast.
I love it.
It's fantastic, thank you.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
You know what's so funny?
I actually have a funny storyabout this.
Of course, my name's Lemon, andso this comes to me at 3 am
with God, and we argued aboutthis podcast extensively because
I had one in 2018 when I gotdivorced from my first husband,
and it was a train wreck thewhole thing.
It was so bad.
Nobody listened to it.
It was very bad.
(03:05):
God woke me up at 3 am and waslike you're going to podcast
again?
I said absolutely not, I'm notdoing that again the first time
it was so bad and I won't dothat again.
Of course, god was like yes,you are, and you're going to
call it Milk and Honey.
I'm like, okay, now it soundslike a food thing.
Every time I say milk and honeywith lemon, I'm like this
sounds like such a food thing orlike a sweet grandma, old lady
(03:28):
podcast, even though I love likemy sweet grandmas.
But God definitely has donesome amazing things with it and
I've had podcast experts be likeyou should really change it.
I'm like we can't change it.
This is what God said it had tobe.
Speaker 2 (03:40):
It's subtle and it's great.
I love it.
Speaker 1 (03:43):
Thank you, Thank you so much.
So that verse you know aboutGod promising us abundance and
being in this land of milk andhoney, and I'm like that's
really where I focus.
I want to focus on leadershipdevelopment, and so that's where
I think the abundance is.
It's when you're fully in yourcalling, and I kind of think
that's where you're at right now.
You're fully in your calling.
Something you said when youspoke at our event last week is
(04:05):
that you were pretty successfulin business.
I mean, most people know yourname and yet you were like I
reached this point where itwasn't fulfilling necessarily
anymore.
Can you kind of talk a littlebit about that?
Speaker 2 (04:16):
Yeah, you know I had hit a lot of the goals and
milestones and different things.
You know I, you know I'd made,you know, tens of millions of
dollars, building 5,000 company,bestselling books, you know,
great family like really allaround, had all the things that
I, you know, thought wouldfulfill me, make me happy, and
(04:38):
all that stuff.
And I just I knew something wasmissing and I knew that more of
the same wasn't the answer.
Right, just keep scaling andgrowing.
And you know, I knew somethingwas missing and I knew that more
of the same wasn't the answer.
Right, just keep scaling andgrowing.
And you know, I knew that therewas something else, but I
didn't know what it was and so Ithought maybe it was healing.
You know, I grew up in a veryabusive home and so I thought,
(04:58):
well, maybe there's just partsof me that need to heal, maybe
that's the, maybe that's thejourney inward.
And I go at this journey inwardand you know I do a lot of
different therapy, hypnosis.
I do two years of meditation,one to three hours a day, and so
(05:18):
I tame the body, and all ofthose things were helpful.
I won't say that they weren't,you know, I know a lot of.
It's popular for Christians tobash all that stuff or yoga or
whatever else, and it's helpfulto me, you know.
But what?
But they weren't it.
That wasn't the answer, and inNovember of 2022, almost two
years ago my wife had spoken atan event in Nashville this
women's event and she came homeand she said, hey, there's
(05:40):
someone I want you to meet andI'm like, okay, and so he lives
in Miami, I live in Naples,florida.
We get on a Zoom call and thefirst words out of his mouth are
I see a big vision for you inGod.
I'm like, oh, okay, you know,because I didn't grow up in the
church, I didn't know one verse.
I don't know what this guy'stalking about.
Is he trying to raise money?
(06:01):
What's he doing here?
And we talk for an hour andnothing he says makes sense, but
feels true, and I'm a littleweirded out about it because I
don't know what to do with this.
And then the next day, my wifeand I go to a networking
function the very next day inNaples and I run into this guy
that I'd met before and I didn'tremember his name or anything.
(06:21):
And as soon as he saw me, hesays I see a big vision for you
in God.
I'm like, okay, that's weird.
You know, it's verbatim whatthe other guy said.
They don't know each other.
One's in Miami, one's in Naples,and he's we need to pray and he
started praying over me andwe're in the middle of this
networking function.
Like everyone was seated, wewere standing, he's 6'4" former
(06:43):
corrections officer, marineCorps, and he's just you got to
choose God.
It's just a really wildexperience and I feel like it
went on forever.
I feel like it was like 10minutes, 20 minutes, I don't
know how long it was, but itseemed like forever.
I started weeping, I startedshaking, I don't know.
I don't know half of, I don'tknow 90% of what he said, I
(07:06):
don't know what's going on, butI feel very much moved and when
we come out of the prayer huddleor whatever it's called, I'm
kind of embarrassed because youknow, I know a lot of people in
the room and I look around andno one saw anything, which is
supernaturally impossible.
I mean, we were literally inthe middle of the room with 200
people seated, we were standing.
(07:27):
I could have hit him.
I could have just flung my armsaround and hit him in the face
and no one saw anything, none ofthe waiters or waitresses
passing right by us Very strange.
And so now I'm really convictedand I wrestle with it for a
couple of weeks, I'm not reallysure what to do, and then I
invite the original guy over, hebrings a guy from church and
(07:48):
both my wife and I give our lifeto Christ, and the next day is
when it got real and I didexperience.
I don't always share this part,but I did experience a pretty
wild thing with my son aroundspiritual warfare night one.
But the next day, when I wokeup, as soon as my feet hit the
(08:08):
floor, something was different.
And I'm looking at my hands,I'm looking at the sunrise, I'm
different, and I don't knowanything.
I don't know a new heart bornagain.
I don't know any of that, anyof the scripture at all, but I
just know I'm different becauseI knew my body.
And so I just I felt a verypowerful nudge to pray and I
(08:30):
don't know how to pray.
So I just I got on my knees andI'm just like God, tell me what
to do, I'll be obedient, and Iget, go live.
I'm like, oh, I don't want todo that.
You know, I've been a publicspeaker for 20 years, you know
I've never said the word Godfrom stage or on a video or
anything.
And so I wrestle with it alittle bit and then eventually I
go live and you know that videojust takes off like crazy.
(08:54):
I had over 200 direct messagesfrom people.
It's like they were in cahoots.
They sent me a message sayingI've been woken up in the middle
of the night to pray for you,but none of them had ever told
me that.
And so that really started thejourney of this obsession with
having a relationship with Godand scripture, and it's led to a
(09:14):
lot of different adventures anddifferent things he's nudged me
to do, and I've been mainlyobedient, pretty obedient, and
that's just been a wild ride.
And so I found what was missing.
I didn't know what it was, butI found it and that is having a
relationship with our HeavenlyFather through Jesus Christ.
Speaker 1 (09:32):
I love this story because I think there's a lot of
parts we can actually discuss.
There's people praying for youthat you didn't know about, and
the obedience of those people,and then the obedience of the
two different people to tell you, I see a big vision for you and
God.
If they hadn't been obedient towhat God told them to do, your
story might be completelydifferent.
And then you've been mainlyobedient, as you said.
(09:53):
So then you do this live andpeople are talking about it and
just having a completelydifferent conversation, and I
love that.
You know.
Very next day you're like okay,this is this is what God, you
know, this is it, what do I needto do?
And he tells you to go live,even though you've been a public
speaker and you've done allthese things and people know you
, and so I gave you thisplatform.
(10:14):
Now you get to go talk about me, which I think is really
beautiful, because I thinkpeople struggle to be a believer
and to have influence, or be abeliever and have a business,
and I would love to hear yourperspective on this, because God
has given you a platform toshare the things he's done in
your life and currently doing inyour life.
Speaker 2 (10:33):
Yeah.
So I immediately.
You know, I'm just the way I'mwired.
You know the way that he wiredme.
I didn't do this, I didn'tlearn this.
But one I'm very relentless inthat, you know, I either want to
be an absolute expert atsomething or I don't want to
have anything to do with it,like I want nothing to do with
(10:54):
it.
I don't dabble, I don't dabbleat all.
So I'm either like I'm all into it, like people are weirded
out by how obsessed I am, or Idon't want anything to do with
it.
And, and you know, my firstweek I have a Hebrew mentor, an
Aramaic mentor.
I'm in the Bible every day andand so I'm like, man, are you
calling me to be a pastor?
Do you want me to be inministry?
(11:14):
And so I just start sharingwhat I'm learning and he's, you
know, just opening me up tolearn so many things.
And it's just awesome.
Three months in, I'm in CostaMesa, california, and they had
hired me before I came to Christ, although they're a Christian
organization and so they askedme.
(11:36):
They're like hey, are you okaysharing your testimony?
On Sunday?
I'm like, yeah, absolutely.
And then on Saturday, one ofthem came up and said, hey, I
look forward to your sermon.
I'm like sermon.
And then another one said hey,let me know if you need help
with altar call.
I'm like altar call, like I'venever even seen one because I
didn't respond.
Mine was outside the church.
I've never even seen an altarcall.
(11:57):
I don't know what you'retalking about.
And so I'm like man, am Isupposed to do this?
And so, prayed about it.
I feel like God's telling me todo it.
And so that Saturday I Googledhow to do altar call and got
some tips and advice.
And then the next day I talkabout church hurt, I talk about
father wounds, and do the altarcall and 20 people come up on
(12:19):
stage and accept Christ.
And it was just such a magicalexperience, it was just so good.
I mean people with Wiccansymbols and piercings and pink
hair, I mean it was kind of awild bunch, but it felt so good
and I knew I want more of that.
Now, for the last almost twoyears, I've had different levels
(12:44):
of being faith forward, butvery faith forward.
And you know, multiple times Imean even in a dream I got for
me to focus on the marketplace,not ministry, but I was just so
in love.
I'm so in love with scriptureand I'm so in love with him and
everyone needs to know, and whyshouldn't I tell them?
And so what has happened overthese last two years is he's
(13:05):
allowed me that season of beingextreme, extremely faith forward
.
I mean scripture in every video, like you know, and he's helped
me understand.
You know scripture at a.
You know some people say anaccelerated.
You know pace and um.
But what I've learned over thelast few years is that for most
(13:25):
people, if they're very faithforward, they're not bringing
anyone to Christ.
And the reason for that is thetwo primary reasons that people
stay away from the church, orwhat they call religion or
anything about Jesus, is eitherchurch hurt or father wounds.
Either they've been judged,shamed or treated, treated
poorly or abused or traumatizedor lied to or stolen from
(13:48):
somebody in the church.
So they drew the conclusion oh,that's how God's people are.
Or father wounds, and theyproject how they feel about
their biological father ontotheir heavenly father.
And I know I did.
I thought God was mean andcaring, I'd never be good enough
, he'd never be proud of me,because that's how I felt about
my dad, my biological dad, andso that's not true.
(14:10):
But if you, your heavenlyfather, isn't like that, but if
you lead with, you know whatothers see as religion Jesus,
the cross faith you arerepelling those people.
You're not bringing them,you're repelling them.
So what I've learned is thatmost people that are as faith
forward as I've been, they don'texpand the kingdom, they just
(14:31):
repel people.
And, yeah, you get aroundpeople that agree with you and
there is benefit to that.
You know a fellowship andbreaking bread and you know and
singing psalms to each other andeverything, but you're not
expanding the kingdom.
Which is the great commission,not the great suggestion.
It was to make disciples allover the world right and to talk
about the gospel all over theworld.
(14:51):
And so there's either thatscenario of very faith forward
don't bring many to Christ oryou're all business and you
punch the clock on Sunday.
You also don't bring anyone toChrist.
And so what I realize is he'sallowed me to experience these
last two years to get my mindaround it of what it looks like,
(15:13):
because what I'm actuallycalled to do, and my main
marching order at our eventcoming up here in 10 days, is to
teach people how to be absoluteindustry titans, to be so
excellent at what they do in themarketplace, that they attract
large amounts of people to themand they grow their influence,
(15:36):
but they also have systems,processes and procedures in
place to introduce people totheir faith.
And one person that does thisvery well, and God just put us
together.
The entire last year I'veworked with him, I've observed
him, he was a part of ourmentorship program and him and I
(15:56):
trained my clients, and that'sJohn Maxwell.
So John Maxwell will run athree-day event I forget what he
calls it, I can't remember thename, but he'll do a three-day
event.
You won't hear him say Jesus orGod the entire time, but then
at the end of day three, he'llsay hey guys, some of you would
like to know my personal beliefsand hear about my faith.
If you would like, cometomorrow morning I'll share it
(16:17):
with you.
Well, everyone comes and hebrings hundreds of people to
Christ, and so that's someonewho does it well, and I believe
God is calling me to teach thatmore to teach people how to be
absolutely excellent in theirindustry, whatever that is, and
also to bring people to Christ.
If we're super faith forward,we're going to repel people
(16:38):
before we have a chance toconnect with them, and so I'm
actually what you'll see, youknow, is you'll see me still use
scripture because I can't,that's you know, I would.
Just that's part of me now youknow.
So I'll still use scripture inmy trainings and things, but be
more marketplace focused, butI'll always have some kind of
options for people to learn moreabout my faith.
Speaker 1 (16:59):
I love that and again , there's so much that we can
unpack with what you just said.
I honestly I have to tell youthis first, because you talked
about it in our conference and Ihaven't told anybody.
I wrote it down in my notes andI haven't told anybody this.
I don't even think I've told myhusband yet.
And I was sitting there withFerris and she was like, oh, I
can tell you just had abreakthrough and she said do you
want to tell me?
And I was like, not yet it fora minute.
(17:26):
You're talking about projectinghow you feel about your
biological father onto.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
God and.
Speaker 1 (17:28):
I was like, for the first time anybody's ever said
that to me, and I wrote it downand I was like, oh my gosh.
I immediately recalled thismoment.
When I was in the eighth grade,my parents had me at 19.
And you're going to get a quickstory of my life here, sorry.
So they had me at 19.
My father worked at my middleschool, but he worked the night
shift as a janitor, so nobodyever actually saw him at school.
(17:48):
I never really saw him atschool.
We didn't really have arelationship.
And I remember for my birthdayin the eighth grade, he handed
me a box of condoms in theschool, like in the middle of
the school hallway, and he saidI didn't want you, I begged your
mother for an abortion, pleasedon't make the same mistake that
I did.
And that was like the last realinteraction that we had.
(18:09):
And so when you said that, I waslike, oh my gosh, I've been
striving so hard my whole lifeto prove that I was supposed to
be here and that I have value.
And so when you said it I'm notgoing to get emotional because
it's only nine, something in themorning, because I will but I
was like, oh, this is so freeing.
I feel like this huge weightjust got lifted, and so I really
(18:32):
do think that's the benefit ofwhat you're like.
I don't know, I've just Ipersonally experienced the
benefit of your faith and yourrelationship and your experience
and how it's alreadytransformed me, and I've been a
believer for 11 years now andnobody's spoken to me the way
that you did at that event.
So I just need you to know thatyou're already having a very big
(18:53):
impact on people.
But I also love that you'reteaching people to be good at
what they do.
It was insanely good.
It's something Michelle saysall the time she's your life
should be so attractive thatpeople are asking what are you
doing you?
Should be so good at whatyou're doing, that they're
asking you about it, and thenyou get to tell people about
Jesus.
That's right.
Speaker 2 (19:14):
I just think that's so smart, because everybody I'm
around they're like Jesus firstand you know it's like I'm not
putting Jesus first but, I, likeI'm not putting Jesus first,
but I also like I'm not puttingJesus first, but I also am going
to repel a lot of people whodon't want what I'm doing.
Speaker 1 (19:29):
They're not going to listen to what I'm doing because
Jesus is first, and so I lovethat you're kind of shifting
this, and so obviously then yourevent that's coming up is
different, I mean probably, thanany event you've done.
This is only the second timeyou've done this, or is this the
first one?
Speaker 2 (19:46):
Yeah, so we had ran an annual event every year for
10 years.
Last year we changed the nameto Faith Over Fear and last year
I mean, I'm one year in and Istill hadn't discovered my
identity with Christ and Ididn't really know.
I was obedient.
So if he told me to dosomething, I did it, but I
(20:10):
didn't know.
I just didn't know my identityand I didn't know his nature.
See, his nature is to alwaysgrow us and to help us become.
That's his nature.
So it's all.
He's always working and he'salways working on us to grow us
into that more powerful versionof ourselves and weed out all
the fears and things like that.
(20:32):
And it is our second time doingFaith Over Fear Live.
It's just very different.
You know this last year he'sreally grown me, helped me
understand my identity.
My identity used to be like, Ithink, most people what have I
done?
What am I doing?
What have I accomplished?
And no matter the answer, itwas never good enough.
There's always something Ididn't do or something I should
(20:52):
have done or I could have donebetter, and so literally every
day for most of my life, I wouldbeat myself up.
I would find some reason eitherI ate a cupcake or I, you know,
didn't work, or I should havedone better at that sale or
whatever.
And so he helped me to break offthat identity from me.
In fact, in prayer since comingto Christ, there's been some
(21:17):
areas of my life that have justflourished and been amazing and
other areas that have been tough.
And I remember in prayer I wasasking man, why does this keep
happening?
Like I'm being obedient, I'mdoing whatever you tell me to do
, like why is this?
Why do I keep struggling inthis one area?
And I got I had to keepbreaking you so you would keep
searching and find the need tolove yourself.
(21:39):
I was like, ooh, so I didn'treally get that.
At first I was well, well, howdo I do that, you know?
And what I realized is he gaveme my identity, and my identity
is I'm a bold, loving, authenticman of God.
That's who I am.
I may happen to do things, Imay happen to have things or
accomplish things or whatever,but that's who I am, regardless
(22:01):
of all that stuff.
And so that was very freeing.
That's the day I stoppedbeating myself up every single
day and that's the day I startedlearning to walk in the new
creation.
You know, 2 Corinthians 5.17says those of you who are with
Christ, you are a new creation.
The old has passed away, theold is gone, and so that was
really the first time I startedwalking in that new creation,
(22:22):
making different choices,breaking patterns and programs,
and it just was so freeing.
And so it'll be a verydifferent.
Although last year's event wasexcellent, it'll be a great a
very different event this year.
Speaker 1 (22:38):
for sure, I just love what you're doing with this
event because I know a lot ofthe people that are speaking in
this event and it excited me tosee the people speaking at this
event.
Speaker 2 (22:50):
And that's what you're doing you're bringing in
these titans and so I'm excitedto come down to orlando for this
event, and so I'd love to just,yeah, have you tell them a
little bit about what you'replanning to do where they can
get tickets, because I knowthere's still virtual tickets.
Speaker 1 (23:00):
I don't know if you have ones in person still or not
.
Speaker 2 (23:03):
We have some.
We have some in-person ticketsavailable.
Still, it's in Orlando.
It starts October 31st toNovember 3rd, so it starts on
Halloween and then ends rightbefore election.
So it's perfect time.
People need it and it's reallythe best of the best in business
and the best of the best infaith.
(23:23):
For example, one of our speakersis Pastor Baker out of Ohio.
He did a 14-part series onfinances and over 25% of his
congregation became debt-free.
Whoa, where do you hear that?
Like nowhere, right.
And so we have, you know, justamazing, we have, you know, my
one of, actually multiple of mymentors are speaking there.
(23:45):
One of them is Graham Cook.
Graham's, one of the most youknow.
My one of, actually multiple ofmy mentors are speaking there.
One of them is Graham Cook.
Graham's, one of the mostrecognized name in Christian
faith and he's going to betalking about empowering
business leaders.
I just did an interview withhim that was unbelievable.
His whole thing is to have adeeper relationship with God and
to learn instead of justpraying willy nilly and praying
(24:06):
like it is a shotgun approach.
Learn God's will first, thenpray for that will to be done,
which is actually, you know, theLord's prayer right, your will,
as on earth, as it is in heaven, and so he completely changed
the game for me in prayer and inmy relationship with God.
But we have just businessjuggernauts.
I mean we have, you know,people making millions and
millions of relationship withGod, but we have just business
(24:26):
juggernauts.
I mean we have people makingmillions and millions of dollars
a year.
So you're going to learn thesocial media strategies.
For example, one of my friends,cap Chatfield, he's got 1.3
million subscribers on YouTube.
He hit over a millionsubscribers in six months by
doing Jesus interviews and heshares exactly how he did that,
how you can grow your YouTubechannel, and so we have the best
(24:48):
of faith and relationship withGod, as well as the skills and
tactics that people want to heartoo about growing their
business.
And we do have virtual ticketsavailable, extremely affordable,
and you can learn more.
You can see all the speakersand everything at
faithoverfearlivecom.
Speaker 1 (25:06):
I love this.
I'm going to link to it becausemy friends, you should go and,
of course, my husband's we needto go and I'm like I'm going to
try to go because it's reallynot that far.
And of course, Bobby, he waslike just come and hang out with
me, and we love Bobby.
I'm just kind of obsessed withwhat you're doing and I think
something you said in thebeginning and I have to send you
this podcast because I thinkyou'll like it, it's called the
(25:26):
Deep End with Taylor WelchSomething you said in the
beginning.
You're like, I went on thisjourney where I was meditating
and doing all these things, andI think Christians are afraid of
those things, and I know wewere just talking business, but
I would love for you to kind oftalk about that, because I think
Christians are deeply afraid ofit, even though meditation and
things like that they'rebiblical concepts, and so I
would love for you to kind ofdissect that a little bit for us
(25:49):
.
Speaker 2 (25:55):
Yeah, I mean, you know, and there's differences,
right, you know, like Easternmeditation is more about
emptying yourself, you know.
So it's, you know it'sdifferent, right In the context.
But you know, if you look at, Ithink too many people are
living in an Old Testamentcovenant way than the New
Testament.
So Old Testament was all aboutrole and doing Do this, don't do
that, right, we weren't coveredby the blood.
(26:16):
New Testament is all aboutbeing.
So it's not just hey, don'tcommit adultery, don't even lust
.
Hey, don't murder, don't eventhink bad thoughts.
And so the New Testament, withthe new covenant, it is about
being.
Who are you being?
So you can successfullymeditate and keep your eyes
(26:36):
fixed on God, and it be verypowerful.
Now I'm not saying that, hey,that's what you should be doing,
like, maybe you shouldn't.
If you have a racing mind andyour mind is just chattering
away, definitely ask God forhelp and ask for guidance and he
may guide you to some types ofmeditation or something like
that.
I'm not saying it's mandatory,right, but it's really intention
(26:58):
.
So, for example, when I studiedunder Dr Joe Dispenza and that
was my meditation journey and DrJoe does a lot of scientific
research and he's very good atwhat he does.
I've heard him say he believesin God.
I don't know to what extentthat means, but think about this
(27:18):
.
I would do his meditations, butevery time before meditation I
set an intention to get closerwith God.
That was before I came to God.
Why was my intention?
I want a closer connection withGod, but I didn't know God.
You know, and so it'sinteresting.
You know, and I could argue tosay that it worked.
You know, I got closer to God,and so it's something that it's
(27:39):
much less about doing than it isabout being like.
Some people are so up in arms atHalloween.
Halloween is terrible.
You're going to burn in hell ifyou wear a mask.
You know, and it's what's yourintention.
Is your intention to honorSatan?
Okay, then you know that's notthe best idea.
That's not very smart.
Is your intention to you know,connect with other people and
(27:59):
have a good time?
God isn't going to strike youdown for that.
That's silly, that's very silly, and so it's much more about
who are you being.
Are you being judgmental andshameful, even though the Bible
tells you not to, or are youbeing of love, because the
Apostle Paul says 1 Corinthians13, that you can have all the
prophetic gifts in the world,but you're not of love, it's a
(28:21):
waste.
It's a complete waste.
You're like a clanging cymbaland you know, and you and that
it amounts to nothing.
And so you can be the mostversed person on planet earth,
but if you're not of love andyou're more of judgment,
bitterness, division, then allof that's for nothing.
You wasted your time and soit's all about you.
Know, lord, help me to grow inyour nature.
(28:42):
Help me have more of yournature in me.
Give me that heart of Christthat I so crave.
For how do I love on others?
And a guy that I think does agood job of this, a guy named
Darren Wilson.
Darren Wilson, he did themovies Father of Lights, I think
, finger of God, holy Ghost, hedid a whole bunch of them and,
at the end of the day, they'rereally all about love.
(29:04):
Like they literally go to aSatanist convention and they're
outside the Satanist conventionand they're asking people hey,
can we pray for you?
And there's a guy with horns,you know, with upside down
crosses, and they're like hey,brother, can we pray for you?
And they're praying for thesepeople and they're weeping.
Some of them are coming toChrist.
That's love.
Now, what would most Christiansdo?
(29:24):
They'd be there saying you'regoing to burn now, all right, we
aren't about judgment, we areabout love.
Love is what people are craving, even when they strap on those
horns and whatever else.
They're actually cravingconnection and love, and we have
a deep, driving desire to havea connection with our Heavenly
Father, but we mislabel it.
(29:45):
We think it's something else.
So we try to find God ineverything but God.
But when you approach with love, you have the possibility of
creating new opportunities, andthat's what we're to be.
Speaker 1 (29:58):
I just love this and I just love this conversation.
I don't know if I told you thiswhen I was in person Maybe I
did, but my husband's anex-pagan too, and so it was
people being nice to him, peopleshowing him love and kindness,
and he's got an old pagan tattooSuper interesting.
People are always asking himare you going to cover it up?
It's kind of a reminder ofwhere he was, and so he was
(30:20):
looking for a relationship withGod and I think that's what he
wanted.
And his conversion story isreally fascinating because his
dad was on his deathbed, it wasChristmas Eve, hospice, the
whole kit and caboodle, and heprayed and he asked God, if
you're real, just let him getthrough Christmas.
And it was the morning of the26th that his dad had passed
away and he was like, okay, youknow, I got to spend Christmas
(30:43):
with my dad and that's how hecame to Christ, because God
revealed himself to him.
But it really was Christiansnot being judgmental and I mean
he was in a.
He was really angry at God, youknow, like burning crosses on
the church lawn type of a person.
Speaker 2 (31:02):
Wow, so that that kind of person you know, this is
the, you know when Jesus wastalking to the Pharisee and the
Pharisee was like why are youletting this prostitute wash
your feet?
And it's well, the person who'sbeen forgiven more is usually
more grateful, and so it's justvery powerful when you see that
kind of thing.
You know, I, you know, I justlove it.
(31:24):
I think that's amazing.
Speaker 1 (31:26):
I do too, and I think my husband is so interesting,
right, His faith is so strong.
He's listen, God's got my sick.
But it's interesting how man Ifeel like we could do a whole
episode on this it all startedwhen he found out he was adopted
and then, you know, he was soangry at God and so he had all
these wounds and he rejected Godfor it.
(31:47):
And then he got to have thishealing moment, kind of with his
dad and.
God at the exact same time.
Speaker 2 (31:52):
Have you had him on your podcast?
Speaker 1 (31:54):
Yeah, we've definitely talked about having
him on here and it's really cooljust to see the way that God
works and how he's going to takeyou through these things and
then put people in your life whoare going to love you enough to
bring you to Christ to actuallyhave a conversation with you.
My husband's really good atthis because he's been in such
dark places, and so our oldneighbors, which, thank God, you
know we've moved, and that's awhole other story.
(32:16):
I did a whole podcast episode onit and they were not in the
greatest of place.
They're regulars at our countyjail.
Everybody kind of knows themfor a variety of reasons.
And so the parents, they gotclean, they're sober, they
started attending church buttheir son who?
was in their 20s was still youknow not making the world's best
(32:38):
choices, and so my husband madeit a point to constantly go out
and talk to him.
The world's best choices.
And so my husband made it apoint to constantly go out and
talk to him.
You know, let's, you know,let's sit and have a
conversation, let me grab you asoda, whatever it is right.
He's like constantly with thiskid.
I'm like that's reallyinteresting because you know,
there's a lot there's a lothappening in that household and
he was my husband's like,constantly trying to intervene
(33:00):
and speak life into him and Iwas like this kind of freaks me
out a little bit.
And then there's just this onenight.
I mean he was coming down fromsomething and angry outside and
my husband said I need to gotalk to him.
And I was like, oh, that scaresme a little bit Because of the
place he was in, and so myhusband's outside they're
chatting and I can see him fromthe window.
(33:22):
So so my husband's outsidethey're chatting and you know I
can see him from the window, soI know everything's okay.
And he accepted Christ thatnight.
That's what they were out therehaving a conversation about and
it was really cool to see, tosee him start to change his life
.
You know, he's sober now.
He's last we knew, I mean thatwas only six weeks ago, he was
still sober.
(33:42):
He, you know, in three monthsover and just completely
changing his life around becausemy husband was willing to meet
him where he was at andunderstand him.
Speaker 2 (33:52):
Wow, beautiful when you, when you understand that
every soul is valuable to God,regardless of what they've done,
right, it may not be valuableto society or most people, but
every soul is valuable, you know, to god like it's really
powerful I think it's sobeautiful and that god will use
all of our experiences so we cango reach people.
Speaker 1 (34:11):
There's no way I could have reached him, because
I didn't have anything in commonwith him and so I couldn't
relate, but my husband could andthat's biblical, you know.
Speaker 2 (34:22):
Judges 312 says god allowed some of the israelites
to experience war so that theycould teach those but my husband
could, and that's biblical.
Judges 3.1.2 says God allowedsome of the Israelites to
experience war so that theycould teach those who had not
been through war, and so heactually the things that we what
was meant for evil, god usesfor good.
So what we've gone through wasactually equipping us to go help
other people with what they gothrough, and a lot of times
you'll find similarities.
(34:42):
So the person that lost a childwill be able to consult someone
who lost a child, whereassomeone who hasn't may not, and
so I just think that's reallypowerful.
You should definitely have himon for sure.
Speaker 1 (34:53):
Okay, I will text him and tell him he has to come on
and actually share his story andnot just talk about working
together and so, and I think Ijust love that's what you're
doing right together.
And so, and I think I just lovethat's what you're doing right.
God's using you in thiscapacity and you get to teach
people to be radically good atwhat they're doing, but then
also go out and be the church,without the religion necessarily
, and really focus onrelationship and to anybody
(35:16):
listening.
If you wanted to give them afinal piece of advice, they're
like I don't know how to mergethe two, or I'm really scared to
put my faith out there oranything of that capacity.
What would you leave?
Speaker 2 (35:26):
them with.
Yeah, I would just.
You know one prayer I startedvery early on.
I still, to this day, I say itevery day and you know,
yesterday God blessed me.
I brought maybe four or fivepeople to Christ yesterday and I
say this prayer every morningand that is I forgive anyone
who's wronged me.
I'm available today.
(35:48):
Please send me someone, tell mewhat to say.
And you know I pray that everymorning and you know I'll just
find people in my life and a lotof times they don't.
They may not know they'relooking for Christ, but we get
into a conversation all of asudden they're accepting Christ.
And you know the other lastWednesday, you know I send
(36:10):
anyone that I'm connected to onFacebook.
I do something, maybe strangeto most, but I send every
morning.
I send an audio birthday messageto anyone that it's their
birthday, and so I'll say youknow, hey, lemon Lemon, just
wanna say happy birthday.
God bless you.
If there's anything I can prayfor you about or help you with,
let me know, and I hope you havea great day.
It's eight seconds, nineseconds, very simple.
And last Wednesday this ladyresponded and she said hey,
(36:35):
you've made me cry because inthe last two years I've lost my
entire family and no one hasnoticed me on my birthday except
you.
So, thank you, thank you, thankyou.
And I prayed about her and I'mlike, lord, is she?
Is she with you?
No, is she ready to be with you?
Yes, okay, and so I sent her anaudio message.
I'm like, hey, this prayerchanged my life.
(36:55):
I think that this would reallyhelp you when you have,
sometimes, when you have no oneto turn to you, turn to him and
that's your best option.
And so she accepted Christ.
And that was from a birthdaymessage, you know.
So you, just you look foropportunity.
And it's very easy to be busy,you know, and just be busy in
your business and follow up andsales and marketing and learning
(37:16):
and all that stuff, but do thatstuff, but just look for
opportunities.
Lord, open my eyes, Let me beaware of opportunities, and you
will.
And that's, of all the thingsthat I do, that's the most
rewarding right.
And so there's, just, boy, Igot a hunger for it very early
on, three months in, I got thathunger and then I went and I
(37:38):
brought my mom to Christ, my dadto Christ, my ex-wife to Christ
, my brother-in-law, my25-year-old son and I just, you
know, I've converted almost thewhole family, but not all.
I'm still working on it.
I'm staying in step with theSpirit.
So I'm just praying and waitingfor the opportunity.
And so, yeah, you want to learnto look for that opportunity and
tell God you're available, andthat's a dangerous prayer, you
(38:00):
know.
If you tell him you'reavailable, be and that's a
dangerous prayer.
You know, if you tell himyou're available, be available.
You know, and you know that'snot just, you know empty words.
If you tell him you'reavailable, be available.
Speaker 1 (38:11):
Oh, I love that advice.
I always tell people be carefulwhat you pray for you know, be
careful what you pray for.
If you are like God, I trustyou and it's your will, then you
have to be trusted.
I always laugh when people arelike I'm going to pray for
patience.
I'm like are you sure?
Are you sure you want to dothat?
More power to you.
(38:33):
And Ray, I just want to thankyou for this.
This was really incredible.
I love hearing your story.
I love hearing the mission thatGod has you on.
I took a lot of notes and Ijust want to thank you for being
here.
I want to thank you for beingso faith-forward but also being
so excellent in what you do,that you get to have these
conversations with people, and Ijust deeply appreciate the way
that you're stewarding thethings that God has already
given you.
Speaker 2 (38:53):
Yes, thank you so much.
I appreciate that.
Speaker 1 (38:57):
Hey friend, what a joy it has been to share today's
journey with you.
If you found a spark ofinspiration or a nugget of
wisdom that resonated, would youbless someone else by sharing
this episode with them?
It could be the encouragementthey need to step into their
purpose and calling.
Also, if you could spare amoment to leave a review, it
would mean the world to me.
I really appreciate yourfeedback and it really helps our
(39:20):
community grow.
Remember, Remember.
The road to discovering God'scall for you isn't one you have
to walk alone.
So join me again next Mondayfor another episode where we'll
continue to explore the depthsof leadership and the heights of
our heavenly calling.
Until then, keep seeking, keepgrowing and keep trusting in his
plan.
God bless you and I'll catchyou on the flip side.
Bye, friend.
Hey, I'm Lemon.
I am just like you, sisterfriend, about stepping into that
overflow that God has for us bybecoming those ultimate
Proverbs 31 women.
Hey, I'm Lemon.
I am just like you, sisterfriend.
I knew God had something morein store for me, but I couldn't
see a way out of the laundrypiles and, frankly, I resented
that Proverbs 31 woman.
How was I going to live up tothe hype?
(00:39):
That is until I found out howto really step into becoming
this Proverbs 31 woman throughleadership development.
In this podcast you're going tofind financial freedom,
leadership, growth andmotivation so you'll be able to
do all the things God has calledyou to do with ease and really
step into that land of milk andhoney.
Welcome back to the Milk andHoney podcast.
(01:00):
I'm your host, lemon Price, andtoday I'm really excited
because I have my new friend,ray Higdon here.
We actually met in San Diegoonly a week ago.
I can't believe that it's onlybeen a week that we were in San
Diego together, and so before Iread his bio actually I don't
even know Ray I have such afunny story.
I don't know if you know this,but you actually came in 10
(01:21):
minutes before I was supposed tospeak at that conference and
Michelle had already prepped meand was like the comp plan.
Training is one of the mostimportant trainings of a
conference like this, and so shehas no pressure at all.
And then you walk in and I texther.
You were sitting right next toher and I was like I'm actually
going to pass out, and of course, she told me I was going to be
great and you're fine.
And I was like you're right, itwill be great.
(01:47):
And so, anyway, you guysprobably know Ray.
I'm going to read some of hisbio, but you probably already
know who he is.
He's the CEO of the HigdonGroup.
Since 2017, he has helped salesteams generate over 300,000 new
customers.
That's a lot of new people,over 70,000 new reps.
He's been on every major stagewith people like Tony Robbins,
les Brown, bob Proctor, garyVaynerchuk the list goes on.
He has an incredible podcastwhere there's over 10 million
(02:09):
downloads, which is amazing andyou're prepping for what I would
say is probably one of yourbiggest events of the year right
now.
Right, yeah, it's our annualevent.
Speaker 2 (02:19):
It'll be the most important event we've ever done,
for sure.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
I am so excited.
So just thank you for beinghere and hanging out with me.
I'm pretty excited about it andI was super nervous.
I texted Michelle and I waslike this is it I'm going to
pass away right now in the backof the room.
Speaker 2 (02:35):
So I just want to thank you for being so kind and
gracious.
You did, you did great and also, I didn't know the name of the
podcast.
I love that the Milk and Honeypodcast.
I love it.
It's fantastic, thank you.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
You know what's so funny?
I actually have a funny storyabout this.
Of course, my name's Lemon, andso this comes to me at 3 am
with God, and we argued aboutthis podcast extensively because
I had one in 2018 when I gotdivorced from my first husband,
and it was a train wreck thewhole thing.
It was so bad.
Nobody listened to it.
It was very bad.
(03:05):
God woke me up at 3 am and waslike you're going to podcast
again?
I said absolutely not, I'm notdoing that again the first time
it was so bad and I won't dothat again.
Of course, god was like yes,you are, and you're going to
call it Milk and Honey.
I'm like, okay, now it soundslike a food thing.
Every time I say milk and honeywith lemon, I'm like this
sounds like such a food thing orlike a sweet grandma, old lady
(03:28):
podcast, even though I love likemy sweet grandmas.
But God definitely has donesome amazing things with it and
I've had podcast experts be likeyou should really change it.
I'm like we can't change it.
This is what God said it had tobe.
Speaker 2 (03:40):
It's subtle and it's great.
I love it.
Speaker 1 (03:43):
Thank you, Thank you so much.
So that verse you know aboutGod promising us abundance and
being in this land of milk andhoney, and I'm like that's
really where I focus.
I want to focus on leadershipdevelopment, and so that's where
I think the abundance is.
It's when you're fully in yourcalling, and I kind of think
that's where you're at right now.
You're fully in your calling.
Something you said when youspoke at our event last week is
(04:05):
that you were pretty successfulin business.
I mean, most people know yourname and yet you were like I
reached this point where itwasn't fulfilling necessarily
anymore.
Can you kind of talk a littlebit about that?
Speaker 2 (04:16):
Yeah, you know I had hit a lot of the goals and
milestones and different things.
You know I, you know I'd made,you know, tens of millions of
dollars, building 5,000 company,bestselling books, you know,
great family like really allaround, had all the things that
I, you know, thought wouldfulfill me, make me happy, and
(04:38):
all that stuff.
And I just I knew something wasmissing and I knew that more of
the same wasn't the answer.
Right, just keep scaling andgrowing.
And you know, I knew somethingwas missing and I knew that more
of the same wasn't the answer.
Right, just keep scaling andgrowing.
And you know, I knew that therewas something else, but I
didn't know what it was and so Ithought maybe it was healing.
You know, I grew up in a veryabusive home and so I thought,
(04:58):
well, maybe there's just partsof me that need to heal, maybe
that's the, maybe that's thejourney inward.
And I go at this journey inwardand you know I do a lot of
different therapy, hypnosis.
I do two years of meditation,one to three hours a day, and so
(05:18):
I tame the body, and all ofthose things were helpful.
I won't say that they weren't,you know, I know a lot of.
It's popular for Christians tobash all that stuff or yoga or
whatever else, and it's helpfulto me, you know.
But what?
But they weren't it.
That wasn't the answer, and inNovember of 2022, almost two
years ago my wife had spoken atan event in Nashville this
women's event and she came homeand she said, hey, there's
(05:40):
someone I want you to meet andI'm like, okay, and so he lives
in Miami, I live in Naples,florida.
We get on a Zoom call and thefirst words out of his mouth are
I see a big vision for you inGod.
I'm like, oh, okay, you know,because I didn't grow up in the
church, I didn't know one verse.
I don't know what this guy'stalking about.
Is he trying to raise money?
(06:01):
What's he doing here?
And we talk for an hour andnothing he says makes sense, but
feels true, and I'm a littleweirded out about it because I
don't know what to do with this.
And then the next day, my wifeand I go to a networking
function the very next day inNaples and I run into this guy
that I'd met before and I didn'tremember his name or anything.
(06:21):
And as soon as he saw me, hesays I see a big vision for you
in God.
I'm like, okay, that's weird.
You know, it's verbatim whatthe other guy said.
They don't know each other.
One's in Miami, one's in Naples,and he's we need to pray and he
started praying over me andwe're in the middle of this
networking function.
Like everyone was seated, wewere standing, he's 6'4" former
(06:43):
corrections officer, marineCorps, and he's just you got to
choose God.
It's just a really wildexperience and I feel like it
went on forever.
I feel like it was like 10minutes, 20 minutes, I don't
know how long it was, but itseemed like forever.
I started weeping, I startedshaking, I don't know.
I don't know half of, I don'tknow 90% of what he said, I
(07:06):
don't know what's going on, butI feel very much moved and when
we come out of the prayer huddleor whatever it's called, I'm
kind of embarrassed because youknow, I know a lot of people in
the room and I look around andno one saw anything, which is
supernaturally impossible.
I mean, we were literally inthe middle of the room with 200
people seated, we were standing.
(07:27):
I could have hit him.
I could have just flung my armsaround and hit him in the face
and no one saw anything, none ofthe waiters or waitresses
passing right by us Very strange.
And so now I'm really convictedand I wrestle with it for a
couple of weeks, I'm not reallysure what to do, and then I
invite the original guy over, hebrings a guy from church and
(07:48):
both my wife and I give our lifeto Christ, and the next day is
when it got real and I didexperience.
I don't always share this part,but I did experience a pretty
wild thing with my son aroundspiritual warfare night one.
But the next day, when I wokeup, as soon as my feet hit the
(08:08):
floor, something was different.
And I'm looking at my hands,I'm looking at the sunrise, I'm
different, and I don't knowanything.
I don't know a new heart bornagain.
I don't know any of that, anyof the scripture at all, but I
just know I'm different becauseI knew my body.
And so I just I felt a verypowerful nudge to pray and I
(08:30):
don't know how to pray.
So I just I got on my knees andI'm just like God, tell me what
to do, I'll be obedient, and Iget, go live.
I'm like, oh, I don't want todo that.
You know, I've been a publicspeaker for 20 years, you know
I've never said the word Godfrom stage or on a video or
anything.
And so I wrestle with it alittle bit and then eventually I
go live and you know that videojust takes off like crazy.
(08:54):
I had over 200 direct messagesfrom people.
It's like they were in cahoots.
They sent me a message sayingI've been woken up in the middle
of the night to pray for you,but none of them had ever told
me that.
And so that really started thejourney of this obsession with
having a relationship with Godand scripture, and it's led to a
(09:14):
lot of different adventures anddifferent things he's nudged me
to do, and I've been mainlyobedient, pretty obedient, and
that's just been a wild ride.
And so I found what was missing.
I didn't know what it was, butI found it and that is having a
relationship with our HeavenlyFather through Jesus Christ.
Speaker 1 (09:32):
I love this story because I think there's a lot of
parts we can actually discuss.
There's people praying for youthat you didn't know about, and
the obedience of those people,and then the obedience of the
two different people to tell you, I see a big vision for you and
God.
If they hadn't been obedient towhat God told them to do, your
story might be completelydifferent.
And then you've been mainlyobedient, as you said.
(09:53):
So then you do this live andpeople are talking about it and
just having a completelydifferent conversation, and I
love that.
You know.
Very next day you're like okay,this is this is what God, you
know, this is it, what do I needto do?
And he tells you to go live,even though you've been a public
speaker and you've done allthese things and people know you
, and so I gave you thisplatform.
(10:14):
Now you get to go talk about me, which I think is really
beautiful, because I thinkpeople struggle to be a believer
and to have influence, or be abeliever and have a business,
and I would love to hear yourperspective on this, because God
has given you a platform toshare the things he's done in
your life and currently doing inyour life.
Speaker 2 (10:33):
Yeah.
So I immediately.
You know, I'm just the way I'mwired.
You know the way that he wiredme.
I didn't do this, I didn'tlearn this.
But one I'm very relentless inthat, you know, I either want to
be an absolute expert atsomething or I don't want to
have anything to do with it,like I want nothing to do with
(10:54):
it.
I don't dabble, I don't dabbleat all.
So I'm either like I'm all into it, like people are weirded
out by how obsessed I am, or Idon't want anything to do with
it.
And, and you know, my firstweek I have a Hebrew mentor, an
Aramaic mentor.
I'm in the Bible every day andand so I'm like, man, are you
calling me to be a pastor?
Do you want me to be inministry?
(11:14):
And so I just start sharingwhat I'm learning and he's, you
know, just opening me up tolearn so many things.
And it's just awesome.
Three months in, I'm in CostaMesa, california, and they had
hired me before I came to Christ, although they're a Christian
organization and so they askedme.
(11:36):
They're like hey, are you okaysharing your testimony?
On Sunday?
I'm like, yeah, absolutely.
And then on Saturday, one ofthem came up and said, hey, I
look forward to your sermon.
I'm like sermon.
And then another one said hey,let me know if you need help
with altar call.
I'm like altar call, like I'venever even seen one because I
didn't respond.
Mine was outside the church.
I've never even seen an altarcall.
(11:57):
I don't know what you'retalking about.
And so I'm like man, am Isupposed to do this?
And so, prayed about it.
I feel like God's telling me todo it.
And so that Saturday I Googledhow to do altar call and got
some tips and advice.
And then the next day I talkabout church hurt, I talk about
father wounds, and do the altarcall and 20 people come up on
(12:19):
stage and accept Christ.
And it was just such a magicalexperience, it was just so good.
I mean people with Wiccansymbols and piercings and pink
hair, I mean it was kind of awild bunch, but it felt so good
and I knew I want more of that.
Now, for the last almost twoyears, I've had different levels
(12:44):
of being faith forward, butvery faith forward.
And you know, multiple times Imean even in a dream I got for
me to focus on the marketplace,not ministry, but I was just so
in love.
I'm so in love with scriptureand I'm so in love with him and
everyone needs to know, and whyshouldn't I tell them?
And so what has happened overthese last two years is he's
(13:05):
allowed me that season of beingextreme, extremely faith forward
.
I mean scripture in every video, like you know, and he's helped
me understand.
You know scripture at a.
You know some people say anaccelerated.
You know pace and um.
But what I've learned over thelast few years is that for most
(13:25):
people, if they're very faithforward, they're not bringing
anyone to Christ.
And the reason for that is thetwo primary reasons that people
stay away from the church, orwhat they call religion or
anything about Jesus, is eitherchurch hurt or father wounds.
Either they've been judged,shamed or treated, treated
poorly or abused or traumatizedor lied to or stolen from
(13:48):
somebody in the church.
So they drew the conclusion oh,that's how God's people are.
Or father wounds, and theyproject how they feel about
their biological father ontotheir heavenly father.
And I know I did.
I thought God was mean andcaring, I'd never be good enough
, he'd never be proud of me,because that's how I felt about
my dad, my biological dad, andso that's not true.
(14:10):
But if you, your heavenlyfather, isn't like that, but if
you lead with, you know whatothers see as religion Jesus,
the cross faith you arerepelling those people.
You're not bringing them,you're repelling them.
So what I've learned is thatmost people that are as faith
forward as I've been, they don'texpand the kingdom, they just
(14:31):
repel people.
And, yeah, you get aroundpeople that agree with you and
there is benefit to that.
You know a fellowship andbreaking bread and you know and
singing psalms to each other andeverything, but you're not
expanding the kingdom.
Which is the great commission,not the great suggestion.
It was to make disciples allover the world right and to talk
about the gospel all over theworld.
(14:51):
And so there's either thatscenario of very faith forward
don't bring many to Christ oryou're all business and you
punch the clock on Sunday.
You also don't bring anyone toChrist.
And so what I realize is he'sallowed me to experience these
last two years to get my mindaround it of what it looks like,
(15:13):
because what I'm actuallycalled to do, and my main
marching order at our eventcoming up here in 10 days, is to
teach people how to be absoluteindustry titans, to be so
excellent at what they do in themarketplace, that they attract
large amounts of people to themand they grow their influence,
(15:36):
but they also have systems,processes and procedures in
place to introduce people totheir faith.
And one person that does thisvery well, and God just put us
together.
The entire last year I'veworked with him, I've observed
him, he was a part of ourmentorship program and him and I
(15:56):
trained my clients, and that'sJohn Maxwell.
So John Maxwell will run athree-day event I forget what he
calls it, I can't remember thename, but he'll do a three-day
event.
You won't hear him say Jesus orGod the entire time, but then
at the end of day three, he'llsay hey guys, some of you would
like to know my personal beliefsand hear about my faith.
If you would like, cometomorrow morning I'll share it
(16:17):
with you.
Well, everyone comes and hebrings hundreds of people to
Christ, and so that's someonewho does it well, and I believe
God is calling me to teach thatmore to teach people how to be
absolutely excellent in theirindustry, whatever that is, and
also to bring people to Christ.
If we're super faith forward,we're going to repel people
(16:38):
before we have a chance toconnect with them, and so I'm
actually what you'll see, youknow, is you'll see me still use
scripture because I can't,that's you know, I would.
Just that's part of me now youknow.
So I'll still use scripture inmy trainings and things, but be
more marketplace focused, butI'll always have some kind of
options for people to learn moreabout my faith.
Speaker 1 (16:59):
I love that and again , there's so much that we can
unpack with what you just said.
I honestly I have to tell youthis first, because you talked
about it in our conference and Ihaven't told anybody.
I wrote it down in my notes andI haven't told anybody this.
I don't even think I've told myhusband yet.
And I was sitting there withFerris and she was like, oh, I
can tell you just had abreakthrough and she said do you
want to tell me?
And I was like, not yet it fora minute.
(17:26):
You're talking about projectinghow you feel about your
biological father onto.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
God and.
Speaker 1 (17:28):
I was like, for the first time anybody's ever said
that to me, and I wrote it downand I was like, oh my gosh.
I immediately recalled thismoment.
When I was in the eighth grade,my parents had me at 19.
And you're going to get a quickstory of my life here, sorry.
So they had me at 19.
My father worked at my middleschool, but he worked the night
shift as a janitor, so nobodyever actually saw him at school.
(17:48):
I never really saw him atschool.
We didn't really have arelationship.
And I remember for my birthdayin the eighth grade, he handed
me a box of condoms in theschool, like in the middle of
the school hallway, and he saidI didn't want you, I begged your
mother for an abortion, pleasedon't make the same mistake that
I did.
And that was like the last realinteraction that we had.
(18:09):
And so when you said that, I waslike, oh my gosh, I've been
striving so hard my whole lifeto prove that I was supposed to
be here and that I have value.
And so when you said it I'm notgoing to get emotional because
it's only nine, something in themorning, because I will but I
was like, oh, this is so freeing.
I feel like this huge weightjust got lifted, and so I really
(18:32):
do think that's the benefit ofwhat you're like.
I don't know, I've just Ipersonally experienced the
benefit of your faith and yourrelationship and your experience
and how it's alreadytransformed me, and I've been a
believer for 11 years now andnobody's spoken to me the way
that you did at that event.
So I just need you to know thatyou're already having a very big
(18:53):
impact on people.
But I also love that you'reteaching people to be good at
what they do.
It was insanely good.
It's something Michelle saysall the time she's your life
should be so attractive thatpeople are asking what are you
doing you?
Should be so good at whatyou're doing, that they're
asking you about it, and thenyou get to tell people about
Jesus.
That's right.
Speaker 2 (19:14):
I just think that's so smart, because everybody I'm
around they're like Jesus firstand you know it's like I'm not
putting Jesus first but, I, likeI'm not putting Jesus first,
but I also like I'm not puttingJesus first, but I also am going
to repel a lot of people whodon't want what I'm doing.
Speaker 1 (19:29):
They're not going to listen to what I'm doing because
Jesus is first, and so I lovethat you're kind of shifting
this, and so obviously then yourevent that's coming up is
different, I mean probably, thanany event you've done.
This is only the second timeyou've done this, or is this the
first one?
Speaker 2 (19:46):
Yeah, so we had ran an annual event every year for
10 years.
Last year we changed the nameto Faith Over Fear and last year
I mean, I'm one year in and Istill hadn't discovered my
identity with Christ and Ididn't really know.
I was obedient.
So if he told me to dosomething, I did it, but I
(20:10):
didn't know.
I just didn't know my identityand I didn't know his nature.
See, his nature is to alwaysgrow us and to help us become.
That's his nature.
So it's all.
He's always working and he'salways working on us to grow us
into that more powerful versionof ourselves and weed out all
the fears and things like that.
(20:32):
And it is our second time doingFaith Over Fear Live.
It's just very different.
You know this last year he'sreally grown me, helped me
understand my identity.
My identity used to be like, Ithink, most people what have I
done?
What am I doing?
What have I accomplished?
And no matter the answer, itwas never good enough.
There's always something Ididn't do or something I should
(20:52):
have done or I could have donebetter, and so literally every
day for most of my life, I wouldbeat myself up.
I would find some reason eitherI ate a cupcake or I, you know,
didn't work, or I should havedone better at that sale or
whatever.
And so he helped me to break offthat identity from me.
In fact, in prayer since comingto Christ, there's been some
(21:17):
areas of my life that have justflourished and been amazing and
other areas that have been tough.
And I remember in prayer I wasasking man, why does this keep
happening?
Like I'm being obedient, I'mdoing whatever you tell me to do
, like why is this?
Why do I keep struggling inthis one area?
And I got I had to keepbreaking you so you would keep
searching and find the need tolove yourself.
(21:39):
I was like, ooh, so I didn'treally get that.
At first I was well, well, howdo I do that, you know?
And what I realized is he gaveme my identity, and my identity
is I'm a bold, loving, authenticman of God.
That's who I am.
I may happen to do things, Imay happen to have things or
accomplish things or whatever,but that's who I am, regardless
(22:01):
of all that stuff.
And so that was very freeing.
That's the day I stoppedbeating myself up every single
day and that's the day I startedlearning to walk in the new
creation.
You know, 2 Corinthians 5.17says those of you who are with
Christ, you are a new creation.
The old has passed away, theold is gone, and so that was
really the first time I startedwalking in that new creation,
(22:22):
making different choices,breaking patterns and programs,
and it just was so freeing.
And so it'll be a verydifferent.
Although last year's event wasexcellent, it'll be a great a
very different event this year.
Speaker 1 (22:38):
for sure, I just love what you're doing with this
event because I know a lot ofthe people that are speaking in
this event and it excited me tosee the people speaking at this
event.
Speaker 2 (22:50):
And that's what you're doing you're bringing in
these titans and so I'm excitedto come down to orlando for this
event, and so I'd love to just,yeah, have you tell them a
little bit about what you'replanning to do where they can
get tickets, because I knowthere's still virtual tickets.
Speaker 1 (23:00):
I don't know if you have ones in person still or not
.
Speaker 2 (23:03):
We have some.
We have some in-person ticketsavailable.
Still, it's in Orlando.
It starts October 31st toNovember 3rd, so it starts on
Halloween and then ends rightbefore election.
So it's perfect time.
People need it and it's reallythe best of the best in business
and the best of the best infaith.
(23:23):
For example, one of our speakersis Pastor Baker out of Ohio.
He did a 14-part series onfinances and over 25% of his
congregation became debt-free.
Whoa, where do you hear that?
Like nowhere, right.
And so we have, you know, justamazing, we have, you know, my
one of, actually multiple of mymentors are speaking there.
(23:45):
One of them is Graham Cook.
Graham's, one of the most youknow.
My one of, actually multiple ofmy mentors are speaking there.
One of them is Graham Cook.
Graham's, one of the mostrecognized name in Christian
faith and he's going to betalking about empowering
business leaders.
I just did an interview withhim that was unbelievable.
His whole thing is to have adeeper relationship with God and
to learn instead of justpraying willy nilly and praying
(24:06):
like it is a shotgun approach.
Learn God's will first, thenpray for that will to be done,
which is actually, you know, theLord's prayer right, your will,
as on earth, as it is in heaven, and so he completely changed
the game for me in prayer and inmy relationship with God.
But we have just businessjuggernauts.
I mean we have, you know,people making millions and
millions of relationship withGod, but we have just business
(24:26):
juggernauts.
I mean we have people makingmillions and millions of dollars
a year.
So you're going to learn thesocial media strategies.
For example, one of my friends,cap Chatfield, he's got 1.3
million subscribers on YouTube.
He hit over a millionsubscribers in six months by
doing Jesus interviews and heshares exactly how he did that,
how you can grow your YouTubechannel, and so we have the best
(24:48):
of faith and relationship withGod, as well as the skills and
tactics that people want to heartoo about growing their
business.
And we do have virtual ticketsavailable, extremely affordable,
and you can learn more.
You can see all the speakersand everything at
faithoverfearlivecom.
Speaker 1 (25:06):
I love this.
I'm going to link to it becausemy friends, you should go and,
of course, my husband's we needto go and I'm like I'm going to
try to go because it's reallynot that far.
And of course, Bobby, he waslike just come and hang out with
me, and we love Bobby.
I'm just kind of obsessed withwhat you're doing and I think
something you said in thebeginning and I have to send you
this podcast because I thinkyou'll like it, it's called the
(25:26):
Deep End with Taylor WelchSomething you said in the
beginning.
You're like, I went on thisjourney where I was meditating
and doing all these things, andI think Christians are afraid of
those things, and I know wewere just talking business, but
I would love for you to kind oftalk about that, because I think
Christians are deeply afraid ofit, even though meditation and
things like that they'rebiblical concepts, and so I
would love for you to kind ofdissect that a little bit for us
(25:49):
.
Speaker 2 (25:55):
Yeah, I mean, you know, and there's differences,
right, you know, like Easternmeditation is more about
emptying yourself, you know.
So it's, you know it'sdifferent, right In the context.
But you know, if you look at, Ithink too many people are
living in an Old Testamentcovenant way than the New
Testament.
So Old Testament was all aboutrole and doing Do this, don't do
that, right, we weren't coveredby the blood.
(26:16):
New Testament is all aboutbeing.
So it's not just hey, don'tcommit adultery, don't even lust
.
Hey, don't murder, don't eventhink bad thoughts.
And so the New Testament, withthe new covenant, it is about
being.
Who are you being?
So you can successfullymeditate and keep your eyes
(26:36):
fixed on God, and it be verypowerful.
Now I'm not saying that, hey,that's what you should be doing,
like, maybe you shouldn't.
If you have a racing mind andyour mind is just chattering
away, definitely ask God forhelp and ask for guidance and he
may guide you to some types ofmeditation or something like
that.
I'm not saying it's mandatory,right, but it's really intention
(26:58):
.
So, for example, when I studiedunder Dr Joe Dispenza and that
was my meditation journey and DrJoe does a lot of scientific
research and he's very good atwhat he does.
I've heard him say he believesin God.
I don't know to what extentthat means, but think about this
(27:18):
.
I would do his meditations, butevery time before meditation I
set an intention to get closerwith God.
That was before I came to God.
Why was my intention?
I want a closer connection withGod, but I didn't know God.
You know, and so it'sinteresting.
You know, and I could argue tosay that it worked.
You know, I got closer to God,and so it's something that it's
(27:39):
much less about doing than it isabout being like.
Some people are so up in arms atHalloween.
Halloween is terrible.
You're going to burn in hell ifyou wear a mask.
You know, and it's what's yourintention.
Is your intention to honorSatan?
Okay, then you know that's notthe best idea.
That's not very smart.
Is your intention to you know,connect with other people and
(27:59):
have a good time?
God isn't going to strike youdown for that.
That's silly, that's very silly, and so it's much more about
who are you being.
Are you being judgmental andshameful, even though the Bible
tells you not to, or are youbeing of love, because the
Apostle Paul says 1 Corinthians13, that you can have all the
prophetic gifts in the world,but you're not of love, it's a
(28:21):
waste.
It's a complete waste.
You're like a clanging cymbaland you know, and you and that
it amounts to nothing.
And so you can be the mostversed person on planet earth,
but if you're not of love andyou're more of judgment,
bitterness, division, then allof that's for nothing.
You wasted your time and soit's all about you.
Know, lord, help me to grow inyour nature.
(28:42):
Help me have more of yournature in me.
Give me that heart of Christthat I so crave.
For how do I love on others?
And a guy that I think does agood job of this, a guy named
Darren Wilson.
Darren Wilson, he did themovies Father of Lights, I think
, finger of God, holy Ghost, hedid a whole bunch of them and,
at the end of the day, they'rereally all about love.
(29:04):
Like they literally go to aSatanist convention and they're
outside the Satanist conventionand they're asking people hey,
can we pray for you?
And there's a guy with horns,you know, with upside down
crosses, and they're like hey,brother, can we pray for you?
And they're praying for thesepeople and they're weeping.
Some of them are coming toChrist.
That's love.
Now, what would most Christiansdo?
(29:24):
They'd be there saying you'regoing to burn now, all right, we
aren't about judgment, we areabout love.
Love is what people are craving, even when they strap on those
horns and whatever else.
They're actually cravingconnection and love, and we have
a deep, driving desire to havea connection with our Heavenly
Father, but we mislabel it.
(29:45):
We think it's something else.
So we try to find God ineverything but God.
But when you approach with love, you have the possibility of
creating new opportunities, andthat's what we're to be.
Speaker 1 (29:58):
I just love this and I just love this conversation.
I don't know if I told you thiswhen I was in person Maybe I
did, but my husband's anex-pagan too, and so it was
people being nice to him, peopleshowing him love and kindness,
and he's got an old pagan tattooSuper interesting.
People are always asking himare you going to cover it up?
It's kind of a reminder ofwhere he was, and so he was
(30:20):
looking for a relationship withGod and I think that's what he
wanted.
And his conversion story isreally fascinating because his
dad was on his deathbed, it wasChristmas Eve, hospice, the
whole kit and caboodle, and heprayed and he asked God, if
you're real, just let him getthrough Christmas.
And it was the morning of the26th that his dad had passed
away and he was like, okay, youknow, I got to spend Christmas
(30:43):
with my dad and that's how hecame to Christ, because God
revealed himself to him.
But it really was Christiansnot being judgmental and I mean
he was in a.
He was really angry at God, youknow, like burning crosses on
the church lawn type of a person.
Speaker 2 (31:02):
Wow, so that that kind of person you know, this is
the, you know when Jesus wastalking to the Pharisee and the
Pharisee was like why are youletting this prostitute wash
your feet?
And it's well, the person who'sbeen forgiven more is usually
more grateful, and so it's justvery powerful when you see that
kind of thing.
You know, I, you know, I justlove it.
(31:24):
I think that's amazing.
Speaker 1 (31:26):
I do too, and I think my husband is so interesting,
right, His faith is so strong.
He's listen, God's got my sick.
But it's interesting how man Ifeel like we could do a whole
episode on this it all startedwhen he found out he was adopted
and then, you know, he was soangry at God and so he had all
these wounds and he rejected Godfor it.
(31:47):
And then he got to have thishealing moment, kind of with his
dad and.
God at the exact same time.
Speaker 2 (31:52):
Have you had him on your podcast?
Speaker 1 (31:54):
Yeah, we've definitely talked about having
him on here and it's really cooljust to see the way that God
works and how he's going to takeyou through these things and
then put people in your life whoare going to love you enough to
bring you to Christ to actuallyhave a conversation with you.
My husband's really good atthis because he's been in such
dark places, and so our oldneighbors, which, thank God, you
know we've moved, and that's awhole other story.
(32:16):
I did a whole podcast episode onit and they were not in the
greatest of place.
They're regulars at our countyjail.
Everybody kind of knows themfor a variety of reasons.
And so the parents, they gotclean, they're sober, they
started attending church buttheir son who?
was in their 20s was still youknow not making the world's best
(32:38):
choices, and so my husband madeit a point to constantly go out
and talk to him.
The world's best choices.
And so my husband made it apoint to constantly go out and
talk to him.
You know, let's, you know,let's sit and have a
conversation, let me grab you asoda, whatever it is right.
He's like constantly with thiskid.
I'm like that's reallyinteresting because you know,
there's a lot there's a lothappening in that household and
he was my husband's like,constantly trying to intervene
(33:00):
and speak life into him and Iwas like this kind of freaks me
out a little bit.
And then there's just this onenight.
I mean he was coming down fromsomething and angry outside and
my husband said I need to gotalk to him.
And I was like, oh, that scaresme a little bit Because of the
place he was in, and so myhusband's outside they're
chatting and I can see him fromthe window.
(33:22):
So so my husband's outsidethey're chatting and you know I
can see him from the window, soI know everything's okay.
And he accepted Christ thatnight.
That's what they were out therehaving a conversation about and
it was really cool to see, tosee him start to change his life
.
You know, he's sober now.
He's last we knew, I mean thatwas only six weeks ago, he was
still sober.
(33:42):
He, you know, in three monthsover and just completely
changing his life around becausemy husband was willing to meet
him where he was at andunderstand him.
Speaker 2 (33:52):
Wow, beautiful when you, when you understand that
every soul is valuable to God,regardless of what they've done,
right, it may not be valuableto society or most people, but
every soul is valuable, you know, to god like it's really
powerful I think it's sobeautiful and that god will use
all of our experiences so we cango reach people.
Speaker 1 (34:11):
There's no way I could have reached him, because
I didn't have anything in commonwith him and so I couldn't
relate, but my husband could andthat's biblical, you know.
Speaker 2 (34:22):
Judges 312 says god allowed some of the israelites
to experience war so that theycould teach those but my husband
could, and that's biblical.
Judges 3.1.2 says God allowedsome of the Israelites to
experience war so that theycould teach those who had not
been through war, and so heactually the things that we what
was meant for evil, god usesfor good.
So what we've gone through wasactually equipping us to go help
other people with what they gothrough, and a lot of times
you'll find similarities.
(34:42):
So the person that lost a childwill be able to consult someone
who lost a child, whereassomeone who hasn't may not, and
so I just think that's reallypowerful.
You should definitely have himon for sure.
Speaker 1 (34:53):
Okay, I will text him and tell him he has to come on
and actually share his story andnot just talk about working
together and so, and I think Ijust love that's what you're
doing right together.
And so, and I think I just lovethat's what you're doing right.
God's using you in thiscapacity and you get to teach
people to be radically good atwhat they're doing, but then
also go out and be the church,without the religion necessarily
, and really focus onrelationship and to anybody
(35:16):
listening.
If you wanted to give them afinal piece of advice, they're
like I don't know how to mergethe two, or I'm really scared to
put my faith out there oranything of that capacity.
What would you leave?
Speaker 2 (35:26):
them with.
Yeah, I would just.
You know one prayer I startedvery early on.
I still, to this day, I say itevery day and you know,
yesterday God blessed me.
I brought maybe four or fivepeople to Christ yesterday and I
say this prayer every morningand that is I forgive anyone
who's wronged me.
I'm available today.
(35:48):
Please send me someone, tell mewhat to say.
And you know I pray that everymorning and you know I'll just
find people in my life and a lotof times they don't.
They may not know they'relooking for Christ, but we get
into a conversation all of asudden they're accepting Christ.
And you know the other lastWednesday, you know I send
(36:10):
anyone that I'm connected to onFacebook.
I do something, maybe strangeto most, but I send every
morning.
I send an audio birthday messageto anyone that it's their
birthday, and so I'll say youknow, hey, lemon Lemon, just
wanna say happy birthday.
God bless you.
If there's anything I can prayfor you about or help you with,
let me know, and I hope you havea great day.
It's eight seconds, nineseconds, very simple.
And last Wednesday this ladyresponded and she said hey,
(36:35):
you've made me cry because inthe last two years I've lost my
entire family and no one hasnoticed me on my birthday except
you.
So, thank you, thank you, thankyou.
And I prayed about her and I'mlike, lord, is she?
Is she with you?
No, is she ready to be with you?
Yes, okay, and so I sent her anaudio message.
I'm like, hey, this prayerchanged my life.
(36:55):
I think that this would reallyhelp you when you have,
sometimes, when you have no oneto turn to you, turn to him and
that's your best option.
And so she accepted Christ.
And that was from a birthdaymessage, you know.
So you, just you look foropportunity.
And it's very easy to be busy,you know, and just be busy in
your business and follow up andsales and marketing and learning
(37:16):
and all that stuff, but do thatstuff, but just look for
opportunities.
Lord, open my eyes, Let me beaware of opportunities, and you
will.
And that's, of all the thingsthat I do, that's the most
rewarding right.
And so there's, just, boy, Igot a hunger for it very early
on, three months in, I got thathunger and then I went and I
(37:38):
brought my mom to Christ, my dadto Christ, my ex-wife to Christ
, my brother-in-law, my25-year-old son and I just, you
know, I've converted almost thewhole family, but not all.
I'm still working on it.
I'm staying in step with theSpirit.
So I'm just praying and waitingfor the opportunity.
And so, yeah, you want to learnto look for that opportunity and
tell God you're available, andthat's a dangerous prayer, you
(38:00):
know.
If you tell him you'reavailable, be and that's a
dangerous prayer.
You know, if you tell himyou're available, be available.
You know, and you know that'snot just, you know empty words.
If you tell him you'reavailable, be available.
Speaker 1 (38:11):
Oh, I love that advice.
I always tell people be carefulwhat you pray for you know, be
careful what you pray for.
If you are like God, I trustyou and it's your will, then you
have to be trusted.
I always laugh when people arelike I'm going to pray for
patience.
I'm like are you sure?
Are you sure you want to dothat?
More power to you.
(38:33):
And Ray, I just want to thankyou for this.
This was really incredible.
I love hearing your story.
I love hearing the mission thatGod has you on.
I took a lot of notes and Ijust want to thank you for being
here.
I want to thank you for beingso faith-forward but also being
so excellent in what you do,that you get to have these
conversations with people, and Ijust deeply appreciate the way
that you're stewarding thethings that God has already
given you.
Speaker 2 (38:53):
Yes, thank you so much.
I appreciate that.
Speaker 1 (38:57):
Hey friend, what a joy it has been to share today's
journey with you.
If you found a spark ofinspiration or a nugget of
wisdom that resonated, would youbless someone else by sharing
this episode with them?
It could be the encouragementthey need to step into their
purpose and calling.
Also, if you could spare amoment to leave a review, it
would mean the world to me.
I really appreciate yourfeedback and it really helps our
(39:20):
community grow.
Remember, Remember.
The road to discovering God'scall for you isn't one you have
to walk alone.
So join me again next Mondayfor another episode where we'll
continue to explore the depthsof leadership and the heights of
our heavenly calling.
Until then, keep seeking, keepgrowing and keep trusting in his
plan.
God bless you and I'll catchyou on the flip side.
Bye, friend.
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