October 31, 2025 • 34 mins
The ground shifted under nonprofit fundraising, and we felt the jolt. Federal grants vanished, competition for private dollars surged, and small teams were suddenly racing against institutions with entire development departments. So we got practical: rebuild the grant pipeline, rethink risk, and double down on alignment over volume. Luke Keller—founder and CEO of Match Grant and board leader at Tekton—joins the podcast to share a candid playbook born from necessity: how to diversify revenue, target right-fit funders, and use data to spot warm signals that boost your odds.
If you’re just starting with grants—or rebuilding after a tough year—you’ll leave with concrete steps: get laser-specific on funding needs (capital, program, or general operating), map true peers and their funders, cultivate relationships before you ask, and measure outcomes so your story holds up. The theme that carries through it all is simple and hard: don’t chase every dollar, chase alignment. Subscribe for more practical strategies, share this with a nonprofit leader who needs a lift, and leave a quick review to help others find the show.
Get free nonprofit professional development resources, connections to cause work peers, and more at https://nonprofithub.org
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SPEAKER_00 (00:00):
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SPEAKER_01 (00:18):
Welcome back to the Nonprofit Hub Radio Podcast.
I'm your host, Megan Speer.
Joined today by my friend LukeKeller, who's the founder and
CEO of Match Grant.
We're going to dig into thatstory and Match Grant itself.
Super excited for all of Luke'sinsights on the podcast today.
So, Luke, welcome in.
SPEAKER_02 (00:35):
Thanks, Megan.
Excited to be here.
SPEAKER_01 (00:37):
Nice.
So tell the audience a littlebit about yourself and kind of
your journey in the nonprofitsector that brought you to Match
Grant.
SPEAKER_02 (00:46):
Yeah.
Thank you for the question.
Again, thanks for thanks forhaving me.
So my my journey to launchingMatch Grant, I would say is not
a typical one in terms ofentrepreneurial, entrepreneurial
story or venture.
But I, my wife and I started anonprofit called Tectonic Career
Training about 13 years ago outof a necessity within the
(01:08):
refugee community, uh justoutside Atlanta where we live,
in a community called Clarkston,which is the most diverse square
mile in the US.
We saw a need for training tohelp primarily age, you know,
adults who have aged out ofeducation around upward
mobility.
So there were refugees are 10times as likely to be under or
(01:29):
unemployed versus the averageAmerican.
And so we saw a need to come in,and really the lowest hanging
fruit were skilled jobs.
So construction, things likewelding and carpentry and
electrical.
Um, you know, we've we'vetabooed that in the US in
general.
You know, there's there's a hugeneed.
I think the statistic now is forevery seven journeyman that are
(01:50):
leaving the workforce, only oneis filling their shoes.
And so just based off supply anddemand, if the demand the supply
is going down, the demand isdefinitely going up, especially
in in economies where things aregoing better.
Yeah, um, that means wages aregoing up.
And so we the the idea was ifAmericans are going to take
these jobs, refugees aredesperate, they're under under
(02:13):
or unemployed, we can helpupskill them and then get help
them get these jobs.
So that was what we did.
We've pivoted a little bit overthe years.
We've developed the technology,we were doing a lot, a lot of
coding classes.
That's kind of stopped becauseof AI.
And um, I started theorganization, I hired people to
run it.
I am just, I guess you couldcall serially curious.
(02:34):
I constantly am like, oh, Iwonder if there's a uh a
solution to this problem.
And so I've started a couple ofbusinesses, and so I was, I was
maybe always too busy, toodistracted to run TETON.
So I always sat in like a boardchair, more leadership role.
And then my board came to me twoyears ago, two and a half years
ago or so.
No, sorry, three and a halfyears ago, and said, We need you
(02:56):
to step in.
The organization has basicallybeen paused for the most part
because of COVID.
We've never really startedprogramming back.
Funding is at an all-time low.
Could you step in and we'reeither going to shut it down or
the founder is gonna step in andredirect the ship?
And so I did that.
Um, and at the time I shouldn't,I think it was taking on way too
much.
(03:16):
I had a one month-old um mydaughter who's now three and a
half, and uh, and I also had afull-time job in technology, and
I also had another technologystartup.
So it's I was way too much.
But when you're passionate aboutsomething, you know, you figure
out how to make it work.
And so, and then the starsaligned, weirdly enough, and
then I got laid off from my techjob.
(03:38):
So I got like six months ofseverance, and so I was able to
step in and kind of do all thethings again.
And long story short, the thefirst thing I did when I stepped
in was I immediately got a grantwriter.
So we subcontracted a grantwriter out, and I started
working with her on a dailybasis.
And I think within that firstyear, we like 20x'd our grants
(03:59):
that we'd ever received before.
We were able to get somegovernment grants, which we were
heavily reliant on, ended upbeing about three-fourths of our
entire budget for up untilJanuary of this year.
And um, and then January of thisyear, for lack of a better way
to describe it, we got doged.
We lost all those federal grantswe become dependent on, and
(04:20):
programming was just up and tothe right, because we're going
the right direction, and then welost that funding.
And I think the thing that a lotof people don't talk about, like
if you if you're listening tothis and you've been, if you
were quote unquote doged, is thereality is that the comp the
level of competition for grants,for private grants, is also
significantly increased.
(04:40):
So for example, last week wasthe first week in NPR's history
that they were not, they werenot supported by federal grants.
I'm here in Atlanta and the CDC,you know, CDC has almost
entirely been federal grants.
And I've I've got friends thatwork over there in development,
and they're telling me the samething that they're now as organ
at these institutionalorganizations are now going
(05:04):
after the same grants, you know,that they're more reliant
actually on the same grants thanI am.
So I'm a small nonprofit and I'mhaving to battle.
I hate to use the word battle,but I'm having to go against,
you know, these otherorganizations.
And so what it's done though isI think it's made it so the
level of competition hasincreased, meaning nonprofits,
(05:25):
especially smaller nonprofits,have to be willing, ready, able
to go after 10 times the amountof grants they did in the past.
It doesn't mean that they're notgoing to win, you know, that it
doesn't mean that they're notgonna win those.
They have to be more creative,maybe more entrepreneurial or
like sales, sales-minded, ifthat makes sense.
(05:45):
Um and so after all thathappened, I started looking into
the existing software solutions,which are really good solutions.
You know, instrumental is agreat solution, candid, great
solution.
There's some of these other onesthat I think are really good,
but they're also very cost,they're very costly.
And as a nonprofit, as a smallernonprofit, we just we looked at
that and we were like, well, thereality is, is to really use an
(06:08):
instrumental to the full effect,that's gonna be half my week
dedicated to using this thesolution, or we have to have
another$100,000 in the budget topay for a development person.
And neither of those were thingsthat we could do.
And so after uh a lot of kind ofinternal debates, I decided I
was gonna try to try to buildsomething myself.
(06:30):
And so I built really the ducttape version, so to speak, of
Mass Grant.
And the idea for me was can Iuse the same access to these,
you know, to available 990s, toavailable data out there to help
my organization, help Tektonfind the right grants, but only
(06:51):
the most relevant grants that Ishould actually apply for.
So I wanted to, you know, findmore great opportunities, but
also find the right ones, thethe ones that were more aligned
with what we do, who we are.
And it worked.
Weirdly enough, I I built itmyself and I'm like, oh my
goodness, like this is a reallystellar solution.
(07:14):
And I kind of felt a littleguilty, like, okay, I need to I
need to share this.
Like, I can't build somethingthat's good and then not share
it.
So we're so involved with thecommunity here.
You know, I'm I'm part of anumber of groups if you're
familiar with Praxis and some ofthese organizations.
And so I reached out through mynetwork and invited about 50
nonprofits to participate in avery closed beta.
And I brought on a partner, he'sa very seen seasoned software
(07:37):
engineer, the best softwareengineer I've ever met, happened
to be my cousin.
And uh we worked with those 50nonprofits for about four months
on a weekly, sometimes dailybasis to literally co-create the
best solution possible,simultaneously the most
affordable solution.
Because in my research as well,what I realized is I and don't
(08:00):
quote me on this, but I want tosay it's like 75% of nonprofits
in the US are less than$600,000in annual budget.
And I looked at and I heard thatand I looked at that, and I'm
like, okay, well, if the 30%rule applies here, you know,
meaning that like, what is that,like$180,000, give or take.
So a third of their budget couldbe administrative overhead and
(08:22):
maybe some supporting, you know,software and whatnot.
Well, to build a team aroundthat, along with the software
and development people, youknow, spending$20,000, which is
really where a lot of theseother software solutions stood,
$10,000 to$20,000 per year, isjust out of the question.
So when we when we launched theproduct, we did the co-creation,
(08:45):
we built the best possiblesolution that we're continuing
to make better and better.
Um, it's basically just to giveyou the quick, it uses AI to
match you based off of yourfunding needs with available
opportunities.
And then it gives you all theinformation needed to then go
chase that grant and then alsomanage the grant.
(09:05):
So, you know, in that process oflike applying, getting the right
documents, you know,understanding if they're a good
fit for you, who else have theygiven to in the past.
So that's one element of it.
You can also search for peers soyou can find, you know, all the
potential peers that, you know,the like who's giving to them,
you know, kind of even theplaying field, which was kind of
part of this idea, the idea oflike the the reason that the top
(09:30):
nonprofits continue to get somuch funding.
I mean, I was literally justmeeting with an organization
just before this, this, uh, thiscall.
Like they they looking at theircompetitor, and their competitor
has is getting literally$20million a year.
And and they're like, uh weprovide so much better of a
level of service and our ouroutput so much better.
(09:50):
They could use the platform togo in and basically copy paste
their their competitor.
I you hate to use theircompetitor, but their peers, uh,
grant calendar as part of theirgrant calendar.
And so, yeah, Megan is working.
We've got about 60, maybe 65users right now, give or take,
from all around the world.
(10:11):
I think that's the most funthing for me is just being able
to um, you know, work withorganizations that are fighting
human trafficking and helpingrefugees and helping with
employment and homelessness.
And, you know, we're workingwith an organization,
organization on Texas that givesaway a few million dollars every
year around Christmas time andand gift cards and toys for
(10:31):
low-income individuals.
And that's just, you know,that's that's that's the stories
we get to hear on a daily basis.
And I don't think anything'snothing's been more exciting or
fulfilling than to serveorganizations doing the most
important work.
So that's that's kind of wherewe're at.
SPEAKER_01 (10:47):
Okay.
Great.
So I want to talk a little bitthough about something that you
mentioned in in that sectionthere, and that is kind of the
drive to and I think I think alot of nonprofit leaders have
this, right?
Of like, I want to make itbetter, I want to make it more
accessible, but I feel like weare, and I'm curious because you
(11:11):
do have a tech background,right?
I had Matt Lombardi was on acouple weeks ago on the podcast,
and we were talking about somepieces from the tech world that
maybe can apply to nonprofitsthat we've been really slow to
adopt as a as an industry.
And one of them I think is theidea of that entrepreneurial
spirit, right?
So nobody knows better what youneed than you do, and you like,
(11:32):
but I feel like sometimes we'reso scared to fail.
And that's something that struckme in your story is like, yeah,
I had 17 things going on, butthis was important and I wanted
to give it a shot.
I'm willing to wing it and ducttape version, if you will, and
put it together.
So talk to me a little bit aboutthat piece of your story of like
(11:55):
where did that ability to say,you know what, I'm just gonna
try and see what happens?
Kind of the fail-fast mentality,right?
That tech startups tend to have,that nonprofits tend to not, but
man, I wish that that's a piecewe could adopt.
How do we, how could we, or asnonprofit leaders, embrace that
idea a little bit more?
(12:16):
Tell me a little bit about whatthat journey was like for you.
SPEAKER_02 (12:20):
That's a great question.
I don't think it's anything youlike learn overnight.
I don't think it's I don't thinkit's ingrained.
I mean, maybe, maybe some ofthat is ingrained in you, but I
I honestly think that most ofthat comes from being gritty,
which the only way you can begritty or build the muscle
perseverance is to fail a lot.
(12:42):
And maybe in my life I've faileda lot.
Maybe I've tried a lot, andmaybe that's like this one skill
or fault, maybe even I have isI'm I'm willing to try, I'm
willing to fail, I'm willing toembarrass myself.
You know, for example, we withour nonprofit, we did a we tried
and we we pulled it off animmersive experience.
(13:02):
We built a refugee camp in awarehouse, and it was a huge
labor of love.
I mean, it was it was chaos, andwe were able to pull it together
like hours up until our launchevent.
And it did okay.
But we, you know, ultimately,like it was a we tried it, you
know.
It was, I think most peoplearen't willing to just even just
take that step of like, well,what if we do it and it doesn't
(13:26):
work out?
You know, I I I look at that andthat specifically, and I'm like,
I think it, I think it impacteda lot of people in a lot of
people's empathy.
I think it built some empathyfor some people.
We did raise a little bit ofmoney around it.
So that's just an example.
I think that at the end of theday, it's being willing.
(13:46):
And I actually I think Megan,where the biggest fear for
people are, and I completelyunderstand it, is that when you
fail fast and break things intechnology, the ramifications
are maybe like, oh, you loseyour investors some money.
I mean, that that's a MarkZuckerberg line.
So, like, yeah, he probably losta lot of money for investors,
(14:07):
but I think ultimately if youbought meta and you held meta,
you're doing pretty well.
You know, like that's a goodinvestment.
I think failing, uh, moving fastand breaking things in the
nonprofit world is really itcould be really dangerous
because that's the things you'rebreaking could be the people
you're trying to serve.
Sure.
And so I think that there's thisbalance to it where it's like
(14:30):
taking an entrepreneurial stanceand doing things that are maybe
innovative or different are alittle outside of the norm.
And I think that we get a littlecomplacent, especially when you
I mean, maybe in a weird way,Megan, the doge environment, the
level of competition that's aright uh this rising is forcing
nonprofit leaders and forcingthese organizations to actually
(14:54):
have to be more gritty, be moreentrepreneurial, think a little
bit differently.
And and maybe in a weird wayit's good.
You know, maybe even the peoplewe serve will benefit far
greater because we're beingpulled outside of our comfort
zone, because of the like cushy,uh sustainable grants that were
(15:14):
coming in, and these federalgrants have gone away.
It's kind of forcing us to haveto, you know, do things
differently, maybe better.
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SPEAKER_01 (16:11):
I guess I do wonder about that from a grant
perspective, right?
Is like, is now the time to bebecause we're going up against
much larger institutions and itthe competition is definitely
ramping up.
People are having to look at allsorts of different funding
sources that they've never hadto utilize before.
And so I do wonder in that case,right, is it is now the time to
(16:34):
be risky, I guess, or is now thetime to just kind of play it
safe and go with what works andstick to it.
It's an interesting environmentand not one that we've ever
seen, at least that I've everseen before.
I've been in the industry forgoing on 25 years now.
Um so I do wonder about that interms of grants.
(16:55):
But I also do, as I as we thinkabout like the innovation side
of it, I think this is a reallygood, it's a key time to step
back and say, is what we'redoing actually working?
And I think that grant the grantprocess gives us a chance to
kind of evaluate that in adifferent way than anything else
(17:16):
that we do, right?
SPEAKER_02 (17:17):
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (17:18):
Because you have to prove those outcomes.
You have to be able to say, wedid this program and here's what
happened because of it.
And I feel like sometimes we getstuck in this cycle of like,
well, we're doing a little bitof good, and as long as we keep
doing a little bit of good, it'sfine.
SPEAKER_00 (17:34):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (17:35):
Without being able to really prove, like, no, this
is the impact our organization'shaving.
And if you can't prove that,well, then maybe it is time for
that program to go away.
And that's always so hard.
SPEAKER_00 (17:47):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (17:48):
That's so hard because we don't want to lose
any programs, right?
We don't want to lose any of thework that we're doing.
Oh, but it's such a delicatebalance, right?
Yeah.
So I think that this is likejust as I'm watching it, I think
this is such an interesting timein the nonprofit space as we
look at kind of theeffectiveness of programs
alongside of it.
SPEAKER_02 (18:08):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I I think to your your originalthought or question, you know,
like, is this the time to berisk, you know, be risky, so
speak?
I actually might argue that Ithink the riskier thing, and
this is not a plug, by the way,for match grant.
I I truly just, this is justunsolicited advice for your
listeners, but I think theriskier thing to do is to not
(18:31):
diversify your your revenue, youknow, not diversify where you're
receiving money from.
You know, it's to stay the pathof like, oh, well, like
obviously you can't do that ifyou're receiving mostly
government grants because thoseare basically gone and who knows
when those are coming back.
But I think if there's a lot ofpeople I've talked to who are
like, oh yeah, we're fine, youknow, we got really solid
(18:52):
individual donors.
Well, guess what?
You have one recession, onedown, down economy.
Yeah, you know, that's that'sthere goes a huge portion of
what you thought you could relyon.
And the organizations, I'm I'vebeen fortunate, I've been
blessed to meet with so manydiverse organizations, with
well, you know, anywhere fromhalf a million to million, you
(19:15):
know, tens of millions ofdollars in annual budget.
And the ones I see that are thestrongest are that have the most
sound, you know, like they gotit together, happen to be the
ones that have the most diverselevel of income.
You know, they're they're notthey're not just solely focused
on individuals, they're not justsolely focused on grants.
(19:38):
I think usually grants tends tobe when those last ones
organizations think like that itfeels like a heavy lift.
It feels like a burden.
Oh, I've got to hire a grantwriter, I've got to have a
development person, or where doI even find the grants?
And I get all that, but it Ithink actually once you get
going, and I say this as thefounder of Tekton, the person
who's written grants, has foundgrants, is once you get rolling,
(20:02):
it's actually not that scary.
It's not that difficult.
And it's actually one of theleast risky things you can do
because you know you're you'retrading hours of your time,
hours of research to findaligned grants, whether you're
using a match grant, whetheryou're you're using a candid, or
you're just googling it.
You know, like they're outthere, you just kind of have to
(20:25):
know what to do and how to looklook for those.
SPEAKER_01 (20:27):
Yeah.
I'm curious your take, as you'vekind of obviously you've been
spending a lot of time in thegrant world as of late.
I'm curious if there areorganizations because I and I
just talked to one maybe lastweek at at a conference that was
talking about the fact thatthey've never done grant before.
But they're because of some ofthe economic conditions of
(20:50):
things as of late, they'reseeing a decline in individual
donors.
So they're like, I think now'sthe time we want to start doing
grants.
SPEAKER_02 (20:58):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (20:59):
This is that's a bold move of my like in my
estimation, just start grantright now is like, wow, okay,
great, good blessings on you.
Um if someone in thisenvironment is just starting to
dip their toe into grant for thefirst time, what kind of outside
(21:19):
of like, oh, just sign up formatch grant and it'll help you
do it, right?
It's like, okay, fine, we'llwe'll that's a given and we'll
put it off to the side.
But are there things that youwould encourage them?
I mean, my first piece of adviceto them was like you get as
niche as possible to in findingthe ones that are right for you,
right?
As zeroed in as you can.
(21:41):
Are there other pieces of wisdomlike that that you would share
for somebody who's kind of justdipping their toe into
diversifying integrants?
SPEAKER_02 (21:49):
Yeah, that's a great question.
And I would say, like, first ofall, maybe this would be both
like scary and also maybeencouraging.
It's not gonna happen overnight.
I mean, it takes sometimes ittakes years of cultivating the
relationship with the foundationbefore they're like, okay,
they've this is the third timeapplying.
I guess we should give to them.
The short answer is I thinkthat, and and outside of using
(22:12):
match grant, we the platformdoes all this, but like there
are you could it's difficult,but you could do this yourself.
So, number one is who'ssupporting your peers?
Who are your peers?
Number one, if you don't knowyour peers, I'm gonna use the
word competition.
It's probably not liked, butlike I'm gonna use competition
because we're all going afterthe same grants.
(22:33):
So know your competition.
If you don't know yourcompetition, I can tell you
match grants perspective, I knowall of our competition.
I know how much money they'veraised, I know who they're
focused on, who they're focusedon winning, all of that.
Because that's just what that'swhat I'm supposed to do.
You and your your job, yourrole, you should do know the
same thing.
And if you know them wellenough, you can actually start
(22:55):
to find who's supported them.
And there's ways of doing that.
Match grant does make it reallyeasy in that you can search for
those those peers by name or byEIN and actually like see who's
giving to them.
But like you can do some diggingto find out who's giving to them
because the likelihood that ifthey're giving to your
(23:15):
competition, if they have in thepast, that they give to you is
is pretty pretty significant.
I don't know the data around it,but I'm I would say it raises
your chances, probably like 75%chance of winning the grant if
it's one they've alreadysupported somebody in a similar
uh industry, a similar field.
And then, like you said, beinghyper, hyper niche.
(23:37):
So that's where it's like, okay,well, if and I didn't know this,
development people know this, isthat you can be very, very hyper
niche, and meaning we needobviously to raise, we need a
capital campaign.
We got to get a new building, wegotta get a new piece of
equipment, whatever it is.
Or, you know, like if you'retrying to support general
operating or you know,unrestricted, like being hyper,
hyper specific in your grantresearch.
(23:59):
Again, shameless, unshamelessplug for match grant.
We also help them by likeactually finding grants relevant
to those specific funding needs.
That's kind of what the platformdoes is use AI to do that.
But I think like you've got tostart to think a little bit you
how can you find grants that areknit, are super niche to your
(24:24):
industry, who you're serving.
And that's gonna highly increasethe chances of your ability to
win because you know you're notyou're not going after the very
like easy grants that everybodyelse is chasing.
Uh the last thing I will say,Megan, is the one the the found
the nonprofits I see that tendto have the best balance and
tend to be the most successfulin terms of winning grants
(24:46):
heavily are outweighed byunsolicitation grants or not
non-solicitation grants.
So they have figured out a wayto network themselves into these
small, they're usually smallerfamily foundations.
They there's sometimes most ofthe time there's no websites.
And it that's a hard one, but itis feasible and it's it's
(25:08):
possible.
And especially if you're using atool like a match grant where
you can find those foundationsbecause there's you know they'll
show up on your peers as onesthey receive money from.
But just in general, like justGoogle it, like find the
foundations.
There are other resourcesresources out there to find
these foundations that are hyperniche to your maybe geography or
(25:29):
your industry and approach them,find them on LinkedIn.
I mean, you've got to think likea salesperson in a weird way.
It's like find the peoplerunning the foundations on
LinkedIn.
You know, don't overly sell.
Don't go into it like, hey,here's what we do.
Can you support me?
It's like, hey, we I want to getto know you.
You know, I you supported, yousupport organizations in our
(25:49):
community.
I've seen, you know, I've seenthat before.
Can I get to know you?
Can I buy you a cup of coffee?
Can you know, can we meet forlunch in the community and you
can see a little bit of ourwork?
You know, I think there's, youknow, you don't want to overly
sell that.
This is actually, this line ismore specifically to fundraising
around like for-profits raisingcapital, but I think it is so
relevant for nonprofits.
(26:11):
And it's ask for money andthey'll give you advice, ask for
advice and they'll give youmoney.
And I think it's so true fornonprofits too, because if
you're going into it genuinelynot to sell, but like, hey, I
you're you're brilliant, you'rea business person, you're
connected.
I just need you to help speakinto the work I'm doing.
And if you can, if you cangenuinely spark up that
(26:33):
relationship and ask for theiradvice, um, I think it's the
book, How to Win Friends andInfluence People.
Like, nothing's sweeter thansomeone's own voice or being
praised.
And if you go into it like, hey,you're a really dynamic business
person, and I think I want tolearn from you, they're probably
gonna be so flattered by youasking the right questions and
getting to know them that like acheck might just show up.
(26:55):
And I've literally had thathappen before.
SPEAKER_01 (26:57):
Yeah.
No, I think that's great advice.
I one of the statements I makeregularly on this podcast, I'm
sure people are tired of hearingit, is that nonprofit is just a
tax status.
You still have to think like abusiness.
And so when it comes toespecially to those
relationships, I think everyonelikes to kind of wrinkle their
nose when we talk about, oh,it's sales.
I don't want to do sales.
(27:18):
Well, you're not doing sales,but you do have to take the same
practices of cultivatingrelationships and building those
connections and kind of buildingyour network of people that
someone who is in sales woulddo.
And there's nothing bad aboutthat.
There's nothing wrong about youknow, borrowing from that
philosophy because that is whatworks.
And it works for a reason.
(27:38):
Absolutely.
SPEAKER_02 (27:39):
I think, and on that point, I Megan, on that point, I
love following you on LinkedIn,and I think that your listeners
can like like look at Megan'sLinkedIn and see what she's
posting because I think what youdo and like you're providing
value, not selling people, andthat inadvertently is pushing
(28:00):
people to y'all's organizationand to the podcast and all the
other work you're doing.
And I think that that's a that'sa growth hack, that's a
strategy.
I see, I mean, I saw this when Iwas in the tech industry.
I mean, these these companiesliterally would incentivize
their salespeople to post andthey would do these unique
posts.
It was very interesting.
(28:21):
I think this could be somethinghelpful for your listeners.
Like, for example, let's say I'mtrying to sell, I don't know, a
technology product toWhataburger.
Uh, we don't, I think we havelike one of one Whataburger in
Atlanta.
I literally used the strategy,that's why it came to mind.
Um, I was trying to sell a bigcontract to them.
So I brought my daughter, who isI don't know, a couple years old
at the time, to Whataburger.
(28:42):
We drove like an hour away tothe Whataburger, and I ordered a
meal and I ordered her a meal,and we snagged a picture, a
selfie, in front of it, and likecome up with you know, some sort
of like cheesy line, silly lineabout like coming to Whataburger
or whatever, and we posted it onLinkedIn and it went crazy
viral.
I mean, like half the like I hadlike 200 likes and half of them
were employees of Whataburger.
(29:04):
I did the same thing atChick-fil-A.
I was trying to sell Chick-fil-Acontract in this old tech job I
had.
So I think like that's that's anobviously like example, like
hyper niche example, but I thinkthat example, like what you're
doing, what I try to do onLinkedIn as well, is just offer
value, not overly sellingpeople.
Yes.
Um, especially if you're doing,and I'm sure your listeners are
(29:26):
doing really good work, and youcan offer base basic like yeah,
value in some capacity that thenwill get them interested, you
know, get them maybe followingyou, and then eventually you
kind of you can kind of dropsome lines around like giving
Tuesday or whatever it is.
SPEAKER_01 (29:42):
So yeah, no, I love that.
Okay, so we're almost at time,but I want to kind of close out
here with the same question thatI've been asking everybody this
season.
And that is if you could giveone piece of advice or wisdom or
encouragement to nonprofitleaders right now.
Obviously firsthand that they'vehad a tough year with uh
(30:03):
especially if they have beengrant reliant.
Um so if you could give onepiece of advice or wisdom or
encouragement to nonprofitleaders, what would that be?
SPEAKER_02 (30:13):
It's a great question.
I would say it's easy to feellike chasing every dollar is
worth your time.
It and it's I'm not saying it'seasy, it's still hard work.
I think the harder thing to doand the smarter thing to do is
to chase alignment uh with theright funders, um, the right
(30:37):
don, right individual donors,the right the foundations, the
right grantors.
And that's easier said thandone.
Again, shameless plug, that'swhat Matt Church does, is it
helps you find the right alignedfoundations and not individual
donors, but foundations andgrant grantors.
But you know, I think that goesacross the board.
I think that you know, youfinding like let me let me give
(30:59):
you an exact example.
And this is this is one thatmaybe will encourage people,
maybe leave a sour taste intheir mouth about us.
But uh we were out of money uhearlier this year.
I mean, we were we were deadbroke.
I did I couldn't cover payroll.
I didn't know what we were gonnado.
We had tons of programmingplanned, we were expanding
internationally, we were reallyexcited, but we had we ran on
(31:21):
money and we applied for agrant.
I did a ton of research on thespecific grants.
It was a pre-match grant, and umand it was a perfect, we were
perfectly aligned.
We got a grant by them, and Iworked really hard cultivating
that relationship.
It was actually a foundation ofa larger bank, larger
institutional foundation, whichis not one of those places that
(31:44):
a lot of people look, you know,like thinking about the larger
for-profit companies that havethese foundations, I think are
really solid opportunities.
Um, because oftentimes they'rerun by volunteers in the
company.
So these are not like like likepaid, and they're not employees
paid by the foundation, they'repaid by the company and they're
like giving out of their owncompassion to nonprofits, right?
(32:08):
And so, anyways, like we get thegrant, we're all excited, it
saves us.
Well, fast forward, you know,six months later, we're still in
a bad spot.
Match grant has helped us find,you know, like$300,000,$400,000
in grants that we're waiting on.
We've gotten word on quite a fewof them that all yeses, but we
still have to cover some income.
And out of the blue, that samewoman, that woman that had
(32:30):
granted us that original amount,calls me and is like, hey, we
have money left over.
Do you guys need any?
And just randomly another giantchip shows up.
And it was just absurd.
But I say that because that wasnot like months or, you know,
that wasn't days or weeks ormonths.
It was like a couple years ofcultivating that relationship.
(32:52):
And so I think like, again, notchasing every dollar, but
chasing alignment.
And I think alignment is theharder thing, but once you can
find it, you just lean heavily,heavily into it.
And those organizations, youknow, like when you're when
you're, for example, if like inher job, she's like an
accountant at this largercorporation.
(33:13):
In a weird way, if she'svolunteering and she's giving
her time to that foundation,she's like kind of like like she
lives for being able to helporganizations like Tecton.
Like that's what excites herabout her job.
SPEAKER_00 (33:26):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (33:26):
And so if you can find those right people, lean in
those relationships.
I don't know if that's helpfulor not, but I would again I
summarize that by saying, don'tchase every dollar, chase
alignment.
That would be my end.
I love it.
SPEAKER_01 (33:37):
It's a good one.
Uh Luke, thanks so much for allof your wisdom.
We really appreciate you joiningus today.
And uh thanks so much for beinga good match grant is certainly
a nonprofit hub partner, sowe're excited about that
partnership.
Uh, thanks for being here today.
SPEAKER_02 (33:51):
It's my pleasure, Megan.
Thanks for having me.
SPEAKER_01 (33:53):
Yeah.
This has been another episode ofthe Nonprofit Hub Radio Podcast.
I'm your host, Megan Spear, andwe'll see you next time.
Marketing Support Network is proud to serve the
nonprofit community by offeringfull service contact center,
fulfillment, digital marketing,and fundraising services.
Your vision is our mission, andwe can't wait to partner with
you.
Visit Marketing SupportNetwork.com for more
information.
SPEAKER_01 (00:18):
Welcome back to the Nonprofit Hub Radio Podcast.
I'm your host, Megan Speer.
Joined today by my friend LukeKeller, who's the founder and
CEO of Match Grant.
We're going to dig into thatstory and Match Grant itself.
Super excited for all of Luke'sinsights on the podcast today.
So, Luke, welcome in.
SPEAKER_02 (00:35):
Thanks, Megan.
Excited to be here.
SPEAKER_01 (00:37):
Nice.
So tell the audience a littlebit about yourself and kind of
your journey in the nonprofitsector that brought you to Match
Grant.
SPEAKER_02 (00:46):
Yeah.
Thank you for the question.
Again, thanks for thanks forhaving me.
So my my journey to launchingMatch Grant, I would say is not
a typical one in terms ofentrepreneurial, entrepreneurial
story or venture.
But I, my wife and I started anonprofit called Tectonic Career
Training about 13 years ago outof a necessity within the
(01:08):
refugee community, uh justoutside Atlanta where we live,
in a community called Clarkston,which is the most diverse square
mile in the US.
We saw a need for training tohelp primarily age, you know,
adults who have aged out ofeducation around upward
mobility.
So there were refugees are 10times as likely to be under or
(01:29):
unemployed versus the averageAmerican.
And so we saw a need to come in,and really the lowest hanging
fruit were skilled jobs.
So construction, things likewelding and carpentry and
electrical.
Um, you know, we've we'vetabooed that in the US in
general.
You know, there's there's a hugeneed.
I think the statistic now is forevery seven journeyman that are
(01:50):
leaving the workforce, only oneis filling their shoes.
And so just based off supply anddemand, if the demand the supply
is going down, the demand isdefinitely going up, especially
in in economies where things aregoing better.
Yeah, um, that means wages aregoing up.
And so we the the idea was ifAmericans are going to take
these jobs, refugees aredesperate, they're under under
(02:13):
or unemployed, we can helpupskill them and then get help
them get these jobs.
So that was what we did.
We've pivoted a little bit overthe years.
We've developed the technology,we were doing a lot, a lot of
coding classes.
That's kind of stopped becauseof AI.
And um, I started theorganization, I hired people to
run it.
I am just, I guess you couldcall serially curious.
(02:34):
I constantly am like, oh, Iwonder if there's a uh a
solution to this problem.
And so I've started a couple ofbusinesses, and so I was, I was
maybe always too busy, toodistracted to run TETON.
So I always sat in like a boardchair, more leadership role.
And then my board came to me twoyears ago, two and a half years
ago or so.
No, sorry, three and a halfyears ago, and said, We need you
(02:56):
to step in.
The organization has basicallybeen paused for the most part
because of COVID.
We've never really startedprogramming back.
Funding is at an all-time low.
Could you step in and we'reeither going to shut it down or
the founder is gonna step in andredirect the ship?
And so I did that.
Um, and at the time I shouldn't,I think it was taking on way too
much.
(03:16):
I had a one month-old um mydaughter who's now three and a
half, and uh, and I also had afull-time job in technology, and
I also had another technologystartup.
So it's I was way too much.
But when you're passionate aboutsomething, you know, you figure
out how to make it work.
And so, and then the starsaligned, weirdly enough, and
then I got laid off from my techjob.
(03:38):
So I got like six months ofseverance, and so I was able to
step in and kind of do all thethings again.
And long story short, the thefirst thing I did when I stepped
in was I immediately got a grantwriter.
So we subcontracted a grantwriter out, and I started
working with her on a dailybasis.
And I think within that firstyear, we like 20x'd our grants
(03:59):
that we'd ever received before.
We were able to get somegovernment grants, which we were
heavily reliant on, ended upbeing about three-fourths of our
entire budget for up untilJanuary of this year.
And um, and then January of thisyear, for lack of a better way
to describe it, we got doged.
We lost all those federal grantswe become dependent on, and
(04:20):
programming was just up and tothe right, because we're going
the right direction, and then welost that funding.
And I think the thing that a lotof people don't talk about, like
if you if you're listening tothis and you've been, if you
were quote unquote doged, is thereality is that the comp the
level of competition for grants,for private grants, is also
significantly increased.
(04:40):
So for example, last week wasthe first week in NPR's history
that they were not, they werenot supported by federal grants.
I'm here in Atlanta and the CDC,you know, CDC has almost
entirely been federal grants.
And I've I've got friends thatwork over there in development,
and they're telling me the samething that they're now as organ
at these institutionalorganizations are now going
(05:04):
after the same grants, you know,that they're more reliant
actually on the same grants thanI am.
So I'm a small nonprofit and I'mhaving to battle.
I hate to use the word battle,but I'm having to go against,
you know, these otherorganizations.
And so what it's done though isI think it's made it so the
level of competition hasincreased, meaning nonprofits,
(05:25):
especially smaller nonprofits,have to be willing, ready, able
to go after 10 times the amountof grants they did in the past.
It doesn't mean that they're notgoing to win, you know, that it
doesn't mean that they're notgonna win those.
They have to be more creative,maybe more entrepreneurial or
like sales, sales-minded, ifthat makes sense.
(05:45):
Um and so after all thathappened, I started looking into
the existing software solutions,which are really good solutions.
You know, instrumental is agreat solution, candid, great
solution.
There's some of these other onesthat I think are really good,
but they're also very cost,they're very costly.
And as a nonprofit, as a smallernonprofit, we just we looked at
that and we were like, well, thereality is, is to really use an
(06:08):
instrumental to the full effect,that's gonna be half my week
dedicated to using this thesolution, or we have to have
another$100,000 in the budget topay for a development person.
And neither of those were thingsthat we could do.
And so after uh a lot of kind ofinternal debates, I decided I
was gonna try to try to buildsomething myself.
(06:30):
And so I built really the ducttape version, so to speak, of
Mass Grant.
And the idea for me was can Iuse the same access to these,
you know, to available 990s, toavailable data out there to help
my organization, help Tektonfind the right grants, but only
(06:51):
the most relevant grants that Ishould actually apply for.
So I wanted to, you know, findmore great opportunities, but
also find the right ones, thethe ones that were more aligned
with what we do, who we are.
And it worked.
Weirdly enough, I I built itmyself and I'm like, oh my
goodness, like this is a reallystellar solution.
(07:14):
And I kind of felt a littleguilty, like, okay, I need to I
need to share this.
Like, I can't build somethingthat's good and then not share
it.
So we're so involved with thecommunity here.
You know, I'm I'm part of anumber of groups if you're
familiar with Praxis and some ofthese organizations.
And so I reached out through mynetwork and invited about 50
nonprofits to participate in avery closed beta.
And I brought on a partner, he'sa very seen seasoned software
(07:37):
engineer, the best softwareengineer I've ever met, happened
to be my cousin.
And uh we worked with those 50nonprofits for about four months
on a weekly, sometimes dailybasis to literally co-create the
best solution possible,simultaneously the most
affordable solution.
Because in my research as well,what I realized is I and don't
(08:00):
quote me on this, but I want tosay it's like 75% of nonprofits
in the US are less than$600,000in annual budget.
And I looked at and I heard thatand I looked at that, and I'm
like, okay, well, if the 30%rule applies here, you know,
meaning that like, what is that,like$180,000, give or take.
So a third of their budget couldbe administrative overhead and
(08:22):
maybe some supporting, you know,software and whatnot.
Well, to build a team aroundthat, along with the software
and development people, youknow, spending$20,000, which is
really where a lot of theseother software solutions stood,
$10,000 to$20,000 per year, isjust out of the question.
So when we when we launched theproduct, we did the co-creation,
(08:45):
we built the best possiblesolution that we're continuing
to make better and better.
Um, it's basically just to giveyou the quick, it uses AI to
match you based off of yourfunding needs with available
opportunities.
And then it gives you all theinformation needed to then go
chase that grant and then alsomanage the grant.
(09:05):
So, you know, in that process oflike applying, getting the right
documents, you know,understanding if they're a good
fit for you, who else have theygiven to in the past.
So that's one element of it.
You can also search for peers soyou can find, you know, all the
potential peers that, you know,the like who's giving to them,
you know, kind of even theplaying field, which was kind of
part of this idea, the idea oflike the the reason that the top
(09:30):
nonprofits continue to get somuch funding.
I mean, I was literally justmeeting with an organization
just before this, this, uh, thiscall.
Like they they looking at theircompetitor, and their competitor
has is getting literally$20million a year.
And and they're like, uh weprovide so much better of a
level of service and our ouroutput so much better.
(09:50):
They could use the platform togo in and basically copy paste
their their competitor.
I you hate to use theircompetitor, but their peers, uh,
grant calendar as part of theirgrant calendar.
And so, yeah, Megan is working.
We've got about 60, maybe 65users right now, give or take,
from all around the world.
(10:11):
I think that's the most funthing for me is just being able
to um, you know, work withorganizations that are fighting
human trafficking and helpingrefugees and helping with
employment and homelessness.
And, you know, we're workingwith an organization,
organization on Texas that givesaway a few million dollars every
year around Christmas time andand gift cards and toys for
(10:31):
low-income individuals.
And that's just, you know,that's that's that's the stories
we get to hear on a daily basis.
And I don't think anything'snothing's been more exciting or
fulfilling than to serveorganizations doing the most
important work.
So that's that's kind of wherewe're at.
SPEAKER_01 (10:47):
Okay.
Great.
So I want to talk a little bitthough about something that you
mentioned in in that sectionthere, and that is kind of the
drive to and I think I think alot of nonprofit leaders have
this, right?
Of like, I want to make itbetter, I want to make it more
accessible, but I feel like weare, and I'm curious because you
(11:11):
do have a tech background,right?
I had Matt Lombardi was on acouple weeks ago on the podcast,
and we were talking about somepieces from the tech world that
maybe can apply to nonprofitsthat we've been really slow to
adopt as a as an industry.
And one of them I think is theidea of that entrepreneurial
spirit, right?
So nobody knows better what youneed than you do, and you like,
(11:32):
but I feel like sometimes we'reso scared to fail.
And that's something that struckme in your story is like, yeah,
I had 17 things going on, butthis was important and I wanted
to give it a shot.
I'm willing to wing it and ducttape version, if you will, and
put it together.
So talk to me a little bit aboutthat piece of your story of like
(11:55):
where did that ability to say,you know what, I'm just gonna
try and see what happens?
Kind of the fail-fast mentality,right?
That tech startups tend to have,that nonprofits tend to not, but
man, I wish that that's a piecewe could adopt.
How do we, how could we, or asnonprofit leaders, embrace that
idea a little bit more?
(12:16):
Tell me a little bit about whatthat journey was like for you.
SPEAKER_02 (12:20):
That's a great question.
I don't think it's anything youlike learn overnight.
I don't think it's I don't thinkit's ingrained.
I mean, maybe, maybe some ofthat is ingrained in you, but I
I honestly think that most ofthat comes from being gritty,
which the only way you can begritty or build the muscle
perseverance is to fail a lot.
(12:42):
And maybe in my life I've faileda lot.
Maybe I've tried a lot, andmaybe that's like this one skill
or fault, maybe even I have isI'm I'm willing to try, I'm
willing to fail, I'm willing toembarrass myself.
You know, for example, we withour nonprofit, we did a we tried
and we we pulled it off animmersive experience.
(13:02):
We built a refugee camp in awarehouse, and it was a huge
labor of love.
I mean, it was it was chaos, andwe were able to pull it together
like hours up until our launchevent.
And it did okay.
But we, you know, ultimately,like it was a we tried it, you
know.
It was, I think most peoplearen't willing to just even just
take that step of like, well,what if we do it and it doesn't
(13:26):
work out?
You know, I I I look at that andthat specifically, and I'm like,
I think it, I think it impacteda lot of people in a lot of
people's empathy.
I think it built some empathyfor some people.
We did raise a little bit ofmoney around it.
So that's just an example.
I think that at the end of theday, it's being willing.
(13:46):
And I actually I think Megan,where the biggest fear for
people are, and I completelyunderstand it, is that when you
fail fast and break things intechnology, the ramifications
are maybe like, oh, you loseyour investors some money.
I mean, that that's a MarkZuckerberg line.
So, like, yeah, he probably losta lot of money for investors,
(14:07):
but I think ultimately if youbought meta and you held meta,
you're doing pretty well.
You know, like that's a goodinvestment.
I think failing, uh, moving fastand breaking things in the
nonprofit world is really itcould be really dangerous
because that's the things you'rebreaking could be the people
you're trying to serve.
Sure.
And so I think that there's thisbalance to it where it's like
(14:30):
taking an entrepreneurial stanceand doing things that are maybe
innovative or different are alittle outside of the norm.
And I think that we get a littlecomplacent, especially when you
I mean, maybe in a weird way,Megan, the doge environment, the
level of competition that's aright uh this rising is forcing
nonprofit leaders and forcingthese organizations to actually
(14:54):
have to be more gritty, be moreentrepreneurial, think a little
bit differently.
And and maybe in a weird wayit's good.
You know, maybe even the peoplewe serve will benefit far
greater because we're beingpulled outside of our comfort
zone, because of the like cushy,uh sustainable grants that were
(15:14):
coming in, and these federalgrants have gone away.
It's kind of forcing us to haveto, you know, do things
differently, maybe better.
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SPEAKER_01 (16:11):
I guess I do wonder about that from a grant
perspective, right?
Is like, is now the time to bebecause we're going up against
much larger institutions and itthe competition is definitely
ramping up.
People are having to look at allsorts of different funding
sources that they've never hadto utilize before.
And so I do wonder in that case,right, is it is now the time to
(16:34):
be risky, I guess, or is now thetime to just kind of play it
safe and go with what works andstick to it.
It's an interesting environmentand not one that we've ever
seen, at least that I've everseen before.
I've been in the industry forgoing on 25 years now.
Um so I do wonder about that interms of grants.
(16:55):
But I also do, as I as we thinkabout like the innovation side
of it, I think this is a reallygood, it's a key time to step
back and say, is what we'redoing actually working?
And I think that grant the grantprocess gives us a chance to
kind of evaluate that in adifferent way than anything else
(17:16):
that we do, right?
SPEAKER_02 (17:17):
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (17:18):
Because you have to prove those outcomes.
You have to be able to say, wedid this program and here's what
happened because of it.
And I feel like sometimes we getstuck in this cycle of like,
well, we're doing a little bitof good, and as long as we keep
doing a little bit of good, it'sfine.
SPEAKER_00 (17:34):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (17:35):
Without being able to really prove, like, no, this
is the impact our organization'shaving.
And if you can't prove that,well, then maybe it is time for
that program to go away.
And that's always so hard.
SPEAKER_00 (17:47):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (17:48):
That's so hard because we don't want to lose
any programs, right?
We don't want to lose any of thework that we're doing.
Oh, but it's such a delicatebalance, right?
Yeah.
So I think that this is likejust as I'm watching it, I think
this is such an interesting timein the nonprofit space as we
look at kind of theeffectiveness of programs
alongside of it.
SPEAKER_02 (18:08):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I I think to your your originalthought or question, you know,
like, is this the time to berisk, you know, be risky, so
speak?
I actually might argue that Ithink the riskier thing, and
this is not a plug, by the way,for match grant.
I I truly just, this is justunsolicited advice for your
listeners, but I think theriskier thing to do is to not
(18:31):
diversify your your revenue, youknow, not diversify where you're
receiving money from.
You know, it's to stay the pathof like, oh, well, like
obviously you can't do that ifyou're receiving mostly
government grants because thoseare basically gone and who knows
when those are coming back.
But I think if there's a lot ofpeople I've talked to who are
like, oh yeah, we're fine, youknow, we got really solid
(18:52):
individual donors.
Well, guess what?
You have one recession, onedown, down economy.
Yeah, you know, that's that'sthere goes a huge portion of
what you thought you could relyon.
And the organizations, I'm I'vebeen fortunate, I've been
blessed to meet with so manydiverse organizations, with
well, you know, anywhere fromhalf a million to million, you
(19:15):
know, tens of millions ofdollars in annual budget.
And the ones I see that are thestrongest are that have the most
sound, you know, like they gotit together, happen to be the
ones that have the most diverselevel of income.
You know, they're they're notthey're not just solely focused
on individuals, they're not justsolely focused on grants.
(19:38):
I think usually grants tends tobe when those last ones
organizations think like that itfeels like a heavy lift.
It feels like a burden.
Oh, I've got to hire a grantwriter, I've got to have a
development person, or where doI even find the grants?
And I get all that, but it Ithink actually once you get
going, and I say this as thefounder of Tekton, the person
who's written grants, has foundgrants, is once you get rolling,
(20:02):
it's actually not that scary.
It's not that difficult.
And it's actually one of theleast risky things you can do
because you know you're you'retrading hours of your time,
hours of research to findaligned grants, whether you're
using a match grant, whetheryou're you're using a candid, or
you're just googling it.
You know, like they're outthere, you just kind of have to
(20:25):
know what to do and how to looklook for those.
SPEAKER_01 (20:27):
Yeah.
I'm curious your take, as you'vekind of obviously you've been
spending a lot of time in thegrant world as of late.
I'm curious if there areorganizations because I and I
just talked to one maybe lastweek at at a conference that was
talking about the fact thatthey've never done grant before.
But they're because of some ofthe economic conditions of
(20:50):
things as of late, they'reseeing a decline in individual
donors.
So they're like, I think now'sthe time we want to start doing
grants.
SPEAKER_02 (20:58):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (20:59):
This is that's a bold move of my like in my
estimation, just start grantright now is like, wow, okay,
great, good blessings on you.
Um if someone in thisenvironment is just starting to
dip their toe into grant for thefirst time, what kind of outside
(21:19):
of like, oh, just sign up formatch grant and it'll help you
do it, right?
It's like, okay, fine, we'llwe'll that's a given and we'll
put it off to the side.
But are there things that youwould encourage them?
I mean, my first piece of adviceto them was like you get as
niche as possible to in findingthe ones that are right for you,
right?
As zeroed in as you can.
(21:41):
Are there other pieces of wisdomlike that that you would share
for somebody who's kind of justdipping their toe into
diversifying integrants?
SPEAKER_02 (21:49):
Yeah, that's a great question.
And I would say, like, first ofall, maybe this would be both
like scary and also maybeencouraging.
It's not gonna happen overnight.
I mean, it takes sometimes ittakes years of cultivating the
relationship with the foundationbefore they're like, okay,
they've this is the third timeapplying.
I guess we should give to them.
The short answer is I thinkthat, and and outside of using
(22:12):
match grant, we the platformdoes all this, but like there
are you could it's difficult,but you could do this yourself.
So, number one is who'ssupporting your peers?
Who are your peers?
Number one, if you don't knowyour peers, I'm gonna use the
word competition.
It's probably not liked, butlike I'm gonna use competition
because we're all going afterthe same grants.
(22:33):
So know your competition.
If you don't know yourcompetition, I can tell you
match grants perspective, I knowall of our competition.
I know how much money they'veraised, I know who they're
focused on, who they're focusedon winning, all of that.
Because that's just what that'swhat I'm supposed to do.
You and your your job, yourrole, you should do know the
same thing.
And if you know them wellenough, you can actually start
(22:55):
to find who's supported them.
And there's ways of doing that.
Match grant does make it reallyeasy in that you can search for
those those peers by name or byEIN and actually like see who's
giving to them.
But like you can do some diggingto find out who's giving to them
because the likelihood that ifthey're giving to your
(23:15):
competition, if they have in thepast, that they give to you is
is pretty pretty significant.
I don't know the data around it,but I'm I would say it raises
your chances, probably like 75%chance of winning the grant if
it's one they've alreadysupported somebody in a similar
uh industry, a similar field.
And then, like you said, beinghyper, hyper niche.
(23:37):
So that's where it's like, okay,well, if and I didn't know this,
development people know this, isthat you can be very, very hyper
niche, and meaning we needobviously to raise, we need a
capital campaign.
We got to get a new building, wegotta get a new piece of
equipment, whatever it is.
Or, you know, like if you'retrying to support general
operating or you know,unrestricted, like being hyper,
hyper specific in your grantresearch.
(23:59):
Again, shameless, unshamelessplug for match grant.
We also help them by likeactually finding grants relevant
to those specific funding needs.
That's kind of what the platformdoes is use AI to do that.
But I think like you've got tostart to think a little bit you
how can you find grants that areknit, are super niche to your
(24:24):
industry, who you're serving.
And that's gonna highly increasethe chances of your ability to
win because you know you're notyou're not going after the very
like easy grants that everybodyelse is chasing.
Uh the last thing I will say,Megan, is the one the the found
the nonprofits I see that tendto have the best balance and
tend to be the most successfulin terms of winning grants
(24:46):
heavily are outweighed byunsolicitation grants or not
non-solicitation grants.
So they have figured out a wayto network themselves into these
small, they're usually smallerfamily foundations.
They there's sometimes most ofthe time there's no websites.
And it that's a hard one, but itis feasible and it's it's
(25:08):
possible.
And especially if you're using atool like a match grant where
you can find those foundationsbecause there's you know they'll
show up on your peers as onesthey receive money from.
But just in general, like justGoogle it, like find the
foundations.
There are other resourcesresources out there to find
these foundations that are hyperniche to your maybe geography or
(25:29):
your industry and approach them,find them on LinkedIn.
I mean, you've got to think likea salesperson in a weird way.
It's like find the peoplerunning the foundations on
LinkedIn.
You know, don't overly sell.
Don't go into it like, hey,here's what we do.
Can you support me?
It's like, hey, we I want to getto know you.
You know, I you supported, yousupport organizations in our
(25:49):
community.
I've seen, you know, I've seenthat before.
Can I get to know you?
Can I buy you a cup of coffee?
Can you know, can we meet forlunch in the community and you
can see a little bit of ourwork?
You know, I think there's, youknow, you don't want to overly
sell that.
This is actually, this line ismore specifically to fundraising
around like for-profits raisingcapital, but I think it is so
relevant for nonprofits.
(26:11):
And it's ask for money andthey'll give you advice, ask for
advice and they'll give youmoney.
And I think it's so true fornonprofits too, because if
you're going into it genuinelynot to sell, but like, hey, I
you're you're brilliant, you'rea business person, you're
connected.
I just need you to help speakinto the work I'm doing.
And if you can, if you cangenuinely spark up that
(26:33):
relationship and ask for theiradvice, um, I think it's the
book, How to Win Friends andInfluence People.
Like, nothing's sweeter thansomeone's own voice or being
praised.
And if you go into it like, hey,you're a really dynamic business
person, and I think I want tolearn from you, they're probably
gonna be so flattered by youasking the right questions and
getting to know them that like acheck might just show up.
(26:55):
And I've literally had thathappen before.
SPEAKER_01 (26:57):
Yeah.
No, I think that's great advice.
I one of the statements I makeregularly on this podcast, I'm
sure people are tired of hearingit, is that nonprofit is just a
tax status.
You still have to think like abusiness.
And so when it comes toespecially to those
relationships, I think everyonelikes to kind of wrinkle their
nose when we talk about, oh,it's sales.
I don't want to do sales.
(27:18):
Well, you're not doing sales,but you do have to take the same
practices of cultivatingrelationships and building those
connections and kind of buildingyour network of people that
someone who is in sales woulddo.
And there's nothing bad aboutthat.
There's nothing wrong about youknow, borrowing from that
philosophy because that is whatworks.
And it works for a reason.
(27:38):
Absolutely.
SPEAKER_02 (27:39):
I think, and on that point, I Megan, on that point, I
love following you on LinkedIn,and I think that your listeners
can like like look at Megan'sLinkedIn and see what she's
posting because I think what youdo and like you're providing
value, not selling people, andthat inadvertently is pushing
(28:00):
people to y'all's organizationand to the podcast and all the
other work you're doing.
And I think that that's a that'sa growth hack, that's a
strategy.
I see, I mean, I saw this when Iwas in the tech industry.
I mean, these these companiesliterally would incentivize
their salespeople to post andthey would do these unique
posts.
It was very interesting.
(28:21):
I think this could be somethinghelpful for your listeners.
Like, for example, let's say I'mtrying to sell, I don't know, a
technology product toWhataburger.
Uh, we don't, I think we havelike one of one Whataburger in
Atlanta.
I literally used the strategy,that's why it came to mind.
Um, I was trying to sell a bigcontract to them.
So I brought my daughter, who isI don't know, a couple years old
at the time, to Whataburger.
(28:42):
We drove like an hour away tothe Whataburger, and I ordered a
meal and I ordered her a meal,and we snagged a picture, a
selfie, in front of it, and likecome up with you know, some sort
of like cheesy line, silly lineabout like coming to Whataburger
or whatever, and we posted it onLinkedIn and it went crazy
viral.
I mean, like half the like I hadlike 200 likes and half of them
were employees of Whataburger.
(29:04):
I did the same thing atChick-fil-A.
I was trying to sell Chick-fil-Acontract in this old tech job I
had.
So I think like that's that's anobviously like example, like
hyper niche example, but I thinkthat example, like what you're
doing, what I try to do onLinkedIn as well, is just offer
value, not overly sellingpeople.
Yes.
Um, especially if you're doing,and I'm sure your listeners are
(29:26):
doing really good work, and youcan offer base basic like yeah,
value in some capacity that thenwill get them interested, you
know, get them maybe followingyou, and then eventually you
kind of you can kind of dropsome lines around like giving
Tuesday or whatever it is.
SPEAKER_01 (29:42):
So yeah, no, I love that.
Okay, so we're almost at time,but I want to kind of close out
here with the same question thatI've been asking everybody this
season.
And that is if you could giveone piece of advice or wisdom or
encouragement to nonprofitleaders right now.
Obviously firsthand that they'vehad a tough year with uh
(30:03):
especially if they have beengrant reliant.
Um so if you could give onepiece of advice or wisdom or
encouragement to nonprofitleaders, what would that be?
SPEAKER_02 (30:13):
It's a great question.
I would say it's easy to feellike chasing every dollar is
worth your time.
It and it's I'm not saying it'seasy, it's still hard work.
I think the harder thing to doand the smarter thing to do is
to chase alignment uh with theright funders, um, the right
(30:37):
don, right individual donors,the right the foundations, the
right grantors.
And that's easier said thandone.
Again, shameless plug, that'swhat Matt Church does, is it
helps you find the right alignedfoundations and not individual
donors, but foundations andgrant grantors.
But you know, I think that goesacross the board.
I think that you know, youfinding like let me let me give
(30:59):
you an exact example.
And this is this is one thatmaybe will encourage people,
maybe leave a sour taste intheir mouth about us.
But uh we were out of money uhearlier this year.
I mean, we were we were deadbroke.
I did I couldn't cover payroll.
I didn't know what we were gonnado.
We had tons of programmingplanned, we were expanding
internationally, we were reallyexcited, but we had we ran on
(31:21):
money and we applied for agrant.
I did a ton of research on thespecific grants.
It was a pre-match grant, and umand it was a perfect, we were
perfectly aligned.
We got a grant by them, and Iworked really hard cultivating
that relationship.
It was actually a foundation ofa larger bank, larger
institutional foundation, whichis not one of those places that
(31:44):
a lot of people look, you know,like thinking about the larger
for-profit companies that havethese foundations, I think are
really solid opportunities.
Um, because oftentimes they'rerun by volunteers in the
company.
So these are not like like likepaid, and they're not employees
paid by the foundation, they'repaid by the company and they're
like giving out of their owncompassion to nonprofits, right?
(32:08):
And so, anyways, like we get thegrant, we're all excited, it
saves us.
Well, fast forward, you know,six months later, we're still in
a bad spot.
Match grant has helped us find,you know, like$300,000,$400,000
in grants that we're waiting on.
We've gotten word on quite a fewof them that all yeses, but we
still have to cover some income.
And out of the blue, that samewoman, that woman that had
(32:30):
granted us that original amount,calls me and is like, hey, we
have money left over.
Do you guys need any?
And just randomly another giantchip shows up.
And it was just absurd.
But I say that because that wasnot like months or, you know,
that wasn't days or weeks ormonths.
It was like a couple years ofcultivating that relationship.
(32:52):
And so I think like, again, notchasing every dollar, but
chasing alignment.
And I think alignment is theharder thing, but once you can
find it, you just lean heavily,heavily into it.
And those organizations, youknow, like when you're when
you're, for example, if like inher job, she's like an
accountant at this largercorporation.
(33:13):
In a weird way, if she'svolunteering and she's giving
her time to that foundation,she's like kind of like like she
lives for being able to helporganizations like Tecton.
Like that's what excites herabout her job.
SPEAKER_00 (33:26):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (33:26):
And so if you can find those right people, lean in
those relationships.
I don't know if that's helpfulor not, but I would again I
summarize that by saying, don'tchase every dollar, chase
alignment.
That would be my end.
I love it.
SPEAKER_01 (33:37):
It's a good one.
Uh Luke, thanks so much for allof your wisdom.
We really appreciate you joiningus today.
And uh thanks so much for beinga good match grant is certainly
a nonprofit hub partner, sowe're excited about that
partnership.
Uh, thanks for being here today.
SPEAKER_02 (33:51):
It's my pleasure, Megan.
Thanks for having me.
SPEAKER_01 (33:53):
Yeah.
This has been another episode ofthe Nonprofit Hub Radio Podcast.
I'm your host, Megan Spear, andwe'll see you next time.
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