November 3, 2024 • 37 mins
Join us in celebrating the three-year anniversary of "Ordinary People Extraordinary Things" as we welcome back our very first guest, Kay. Her story is a powerful testament to resilience as she shares her evolution from enduring a painful divorce to achieving remarkable personal and professional growth. Kay's journey over the past three years highlights her pursuit of financial independence, career advancement, and spiritual well-being, offering hope and inspiration to all who face similar challenges.
Explore the profound theme of friendship and self-discovery in this enlightening episode. We discuss the importance of overcoming codependency and recognizing one's inherent worth without relying on external validation. This journey of self-growth emphasizes the significance of faith and introspection while also cherishing genuine friendships that support authenticity.
“I am enough, because I am a daughter of God.”
Finally, embrace kindness as a guiding principle throughout life's journey. By surrounding ourselves with friends who offer diverse perspectives, we enrich our lives and cultivate gratitude. Reflecting on personal experiences, we uncover the joy and beauty present in daily life, choosing happiness over resentment. As the episode concludes, we express gratitude to our listeners and tease an exciting upcoming episode featuring an extraordinary Christmas lights mission. Join us for more inspiring stories of ordinary people achieving extraordinary things.
You can listen to our very 1st episode with Kay:
https://www.buzzsprout.com/1882033/episodes/9503309
https://generationstogenerations.com/podcast
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Stories shared by guests may not always be shared views of OPET.
Being a guest does not mean OPET approves of every decision or action in the guests' life.
We all have a story, all of us, share your story. You don't have to have the perfect answer or the perfect life - share what Jesus is doing in your life. This is an easy, real way to witness & share your testimony.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
This marks three years of Ordinary People,
extraordinary Things.
I am so excited.
Thank you so much for eithercoming on today for our very
first episode or being with usfrom the very beginning.
I'm so blessed to becelebrating three years.
So today, for our three-yearanniversary, I wanted to bring
(00:24):
on our very first guest.
Can't wait for you to hear this, and thank you so much for
making Ordinary People,extraordinary Things what it is
today.
Welcome to Ordinary People,extraordinary Things.
We're here with Kay.
Kay, thanks for coming.
Thank you for having me.
So I'm so excited.
If you don't remember, kay wasour very first podcast guest, so
(00:48):
I asked her to come backbecause we're celebrating three
years on Ordinary People,extraordinary Things and I'm so
excited about that and I thoughtwhat better way to celebrate
three years than to have Kayback and kind of talk about what
she's learned in the last threeyears, how her own story has
evolved.
So I'm so thankful she said yes.
Speaker 2 (01:10):
Thank you again.
I appreciate being here andhopefully the words I speak
today will resonate or helpanother woman who's gone through
some of the similar things I'veexperienced.
Speaker 1 (01:19):
Yes and for sure.
Check out the first episode ifyou haven't.
But if someone is like, well,who is this person?
Can you give 30 words orphrases to describe yourself?
Speaker 2 (01:31):
Yes, I actually had to call a friend and ask for
some help, because it's reallyhard sometimes to describe your
own self without being tooself-righteous or
self-condemning.
And so some words that I gotfrom both of my children, my
boys and my very best friend inFlorida.
They said words like kind andthoughtful, caring, nurturing.
(01:51):
I'm an empath, I'm a helper.
And then the one word that theyall three said ironically they
all told me I was a survivor andI agree with that.
But when I ran that word overwith another friend who I'm very
close to at church, she said Idon't see you as a survivor, I
see you as a thriver.
And.
(02:12):
I kind of tilted my head.
What?
What do you mean?
Thriver?
I'm not thriving.
And she said I've known you formany years and I've seen you
experience incredible challengesand pain and hurt and
disruption of life, and you're athriver because every time you
experience something hard, yougrow from it and you search from
within and you change and youevolve, whereas survivors you
(02:35):
know they survive and thenthat's it.
And so that was a shocking wayto describe myself, but I
thought I'd share it because Iam as intrigued in that word as
I was when she told me about it.
Speaker 1 (02:47):
I love that yeah.
I love that.
That is so good, because we allgo through things, but it's.
Are we going to learn?
Are we going to grow?
Are we going to be able to notjust live at a base level but to
thrive?
Wow, I love that.
Speaker 2 (03:07):
Thank you for sharing that.
Yeah, I was very touched bythat word.
I've never chosen that word todescribe myself, nor has anybody
ever told me I was a thriver.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
Right, but then you can probably show that to
someone else.
I bet that you see that in themand how impactful that might be
absolutely oh, that's good.
So where are you three yearslater from our last podcast,
sure?
What have you learned?
Speaker 2 (03:34):
so our last podcast was focused on forgiveness, and
when we did our last podcast, Iwas fresh out of a very
unexpected divorce.
It it wasn't my choosing, itwasn't part of my hopes and
dreams, and so I went through asevere amount of devastation.
So it's been three years and Iwould say the first year was
(03:55):
absolutely unbearable.
I wasn't very kind to myself.
I retreated into myself.
I wasn't utilizing tools andhealing techniques to help
myself grow.
I was basically just stickingmy head in the sand and licking
my wounds.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
So maybe just surviving at that point.
Speaker 2 (04:11):
Surviving, absolutely .
And then the second year camewhere I was much more
action-oriented, where I'm gonnado all these things and conquer
this and beat this and feelbetter, and dust was kicked up
through that process and so thatlanded me in therapy, Okay, and
so I sought out those resourcesand really dove into it and
(04:33):
explored a lot of childhoodtrauma that I experienced and
some of the things that you knowwere triggered from my divorce.
Here I am now, On the surface.
When you ask how am I doing inthe last three years, one of the
first things I did afterdivorce is I went through
Financial Peace University tolearn how to budget like a boss.
Yes, that's such a good one, andsurvive in a financial way,
(04:56):
because divorce is sofinancially devastating,
especially to someone who didn'thave control of the finances
and was told she couldn't domath and things like that.
So there was a consciousincompetence about finances, so
that was a good thing that I did.
I also went back to school fora year and got a international
healthcare certification it'scalled CPXP and passed this
(05:17):
massive exam and that helped meto gain some confidence and it
also allowed me to be promotedto a manager level role at work.
That's awesome, as you know, inour last podcast, I had been
working part-time in my marriageand I was faced with going back
to work full-time, and so thatreally helped to excel me into a
manager and leadership role.
I've really delved into myfitness commitment, taking care
(05:41):
of my body in a physical way.
I've joined a weekly Biblestudy, so that's been wonderful.
We're in Torah, so we've readGenesis and Exodus, and now
we're in Leviticus, and sothat's been really incredible
having those intellectualconversations with people who I
feel know so much more than I doabout the Bible and then also
(06:01):
being accepted when I askquestions that are out of the
ordinary type of question.
My kids are getting bigger andmy youngest son is driving.
He's making a stay off the roadsin Parker, my older son is a
mail carrier at the Parker PostOffice and he is officially off
the payroll.
I got a new puppy.
(06:22):
I moved out of that horribleapartment that I was living in.
Post-divorce I bought myself alittle townhouse, so
structurally things are fallinginto place.
I've also gained new friends.
I lost a lot of friends in mydivorce but I've gained friends
and we'll talk about that latertoday.
But there's a reality to it,there's an undertow.
I've been in therapy, I've donethe EMDR, I've gone to weekly
(06:45):
sessions.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
Sorry, what's?
Speaker 2 (06:47):
EMDR.
It's a therapy technique tohelp me explore the past and
resolve issues that are triggersor traumas.
Speaker 1 (06:54):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (06:55):
Yeah, another thing that I experience is I really do
keep my circle small, whereasbefore I had this vast amount of
friends that turned out to notreally be real friends.
you know, they were moreacquaintances, so I keep my
circle small okay and I thinkthat's just part of the healing
process and maybe some parts ofnot trusting people as openly as
(07:17):
I did previously.
I don't go to big events.
I don't go to parties or barslike the stereotypical divorcee
would do.
I really do enjoy solo time.
I had my first son when I wasso, so young, and so, you know,
in my age now I've never beenalone, and so sometimes I find
(07:37):
myself on my patio just sittingin the quiet and enjoying the
world around me, and I'mcomfortable with that.
I don't feel alone.
I don't feel alone.
I don't feel lonely, I feel atpeace, and I like that.
It's safe for me.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
Some people say it's not healthy, but for me it's
what's working right now.
Sorry, could I stop you for asecond and ask you have you
always been okay with beingalone and solo and in the quiet,
or is that something new?
Speaker 2 (08:04):
I was first at the party, always wanted to go to
the barbecue, be social, havelots of friends keep in touch
with people, social media andthat's really changed in me
because I don't feel that I needto put my life on display and
share, you know, intimate thingsor personal things with many
people and now I just sharethose things with people I trust
(08:25):
.
Yeah.
And so I do know that that's aneffect of divorce, because
that's not who I was previously.
Okay, um, that I find comfortin being alone and and, of
course, just like all women andworking mother, I have doubt, I
have fears, you know, sometimescrippling anxiety, um, and so I
don't know if I can attributethat directly to divorce, but
it's definitely a new thing forme, where I had much more
(08:48):
confidence previously, and nowI'm just okay being, you know,
the small girl in the corner.
I'm comfortable there.
One thing I wanted to talkabout is the divorce itself.
You know, when you go through adivorce, especially when it's
unwanted, unplanned andunexpected.
For me, I felt like I had thistarget on my back and everyone
(09:08):
knew I was divorced.
I would sit in church alone andI would think people would
judge me or think about me, andthrough the therapy and
everything I've experienced withhealing, I've realized that
divorce is grief.
It is profound grief, it is loss.
It's not just loss of yourhouse, but it's loss of your
(09:28):
dreams.
It's loss of, for me, myidentity.
I didn't even know who I wasafter divorce.
I didn't know what my favoritecolor was, because he told me
what my favorite color was and Ijust went along.
You know, got along to.
You know, go along to get along.
You know, got along to.
You know, go along to get along.
I do realize too that you know,when people experience loss of a
(09:50):
loved one through death,there's so much more support in
the community.
You know, people bring mealsand take all the time you need,
come back to work when you'reready, whereas when I went
through my divorce it was wascan I take two days off to move?
And once I moved, it wasneeding to be a hundred percent
and and get through that in avery quick matter of fact.
(10:12):
It's the splitting of C's andthen you just move on.
And so that grieving processhas taken a long time for me
because there's many things thatI'm grieving.
It's not just the divorceitself or the broken marriage.
It was so many underlyingthings that I've had to really
work through and deal with,especially through therapy
(10:33):
that's a good point.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
Thank you for bringing that up.
As far as I was thinking, whenyou were saying there was
different like levels, I waslike, oh, that sounds like grief
.
Where you go, you know there'sthe steps of grief.
Speaker 2 (10:45):
Yeah, denial, anger, right that kind of thing, and
then in social circles they'rethe stereotype of divorced women
, the number one question I getasked when I run into a friend
that I haven't seen.
The very first question are youdating?
Oh and there's this pressure tomove on.
You know I'll hear things frompeople.
You You'll find a new man Like.
(11:07):
It's like buying a new shirt atthe store or something you know
or.
I've had friends, you know,almost pressure me to date
trying to set me up with peoplejust because they're single.
We've got to be the perfectmatch, not even in an
encouraging way, but I feel it'smore pressure.
You've got to get out there.
You're never going to meetsomeone if you're sitting on
your patio.
I've even had a friend tell meafter.
(11:30):
She asked me if I was datingand she said let me guess Jesus
is the man in your life.
Speaker 1 (11:36):
Just very disparaging , very condescending.
Speaker 2 (11:39):
I said with confidence well, yes, he is, but
there's a social pressure tomove on.
I have a group of friends whohave been separated or gone
through divorce and quite a fewof them have moved on rather
quickly, where they didn't takethe time to heal and get to know
themselves, their new selves,and they're in toxic
relationships.
(11:59):
And so I'm just kind of sittingin the background observing
their experiences and you knownot that I'm never going to date
again or move on.
I'll move on when I'm ready,when God tells me to.
Speaker 1 (12:12):
Well and the social pressure to be married is very
widespread.
Speaker 2 (12:17):
Yeah, I had another friend say if you don't get out
there and start dating, you'regoing to end up an old lady with
cats.
And I said, well, dogs maybe,not cats.
It'll come for me in time andI've realized through my healing
process that there's there's notimeline in healing from
divorce and you know it's mytimeline, it's God's timeline.
There shouldn't be any pressureto do something and move on and
(12:40):
and feel fulfilled because I'min a relationship and therefore
I have, you know, succeeded.
So, that's been really different.
And then also with friends thatI had previously, friends who I
would consider to be incrediblefriends, all of a sudden are
jealous of me when I'm aroundtheir husbands, like you know.
(13:01):
And so there's that socialaspect of it.
I, just because I'm single, intheir minds means I'm desperate,
and you know, and so there'sthat social aspect of it like
just because I'm single in theirminds means I'm desperate, and
you know, sometimes I think youknow you've been telling me how
horrible your marriage is for 10years.
You think I'd want to move onwith that, so that's been kind
of tough.
Is like having friends changejust because I'm single okay,
yeah being being the third wheelwhen I go out to dinner.
(13:22):
Um, but that that slowlyateswith time, so that's kind of
another reason I like to stay onmy patio.
So another thing you asked meis what have I learned through
this?
Speaker 1 (13:33):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:34):
And a lot of what I've learned has really been
through the counseling andtherapy, because the therapy
helped me to see my own worth,instead of allowing it to be
defined by the deeds that I didof the day if that makes sense,
and then also explore mychildhood.
In my childhood, the way I grewup and the support systems and
(13:59):
resources that I had around me,it forced me to become what I
would have called veryindependent.
When I realized, in counselingI was very codependent, and so
that was a new term for me andrealizing that when I met my
ex-husband I, without knowing itor being able to articulate it,
I was so desperate to be lovedand accepted that I tolerated
(14:24):
anything.
I tolerated poor behavior, Itolerated poor treatment towards
me, I tolerated being, you know, not even second choice, but
like hundredth and tenth choice.
I tolerated not being able toshare my opinions.
(14:51):
How does this codependency showup in my new self and how to
recognize the sign so that Idon't enter a new relationship
having that mindset and thenalso I've been able to acquire
some tools to be able to copeand deal and, you know, breathe
through times where I'm feelinganxious or nervous.
I've learned that I am enoughbecause I am a daughter of God.
I am enough just the way I am,and the growth that I'm doing is
(15:14):
part of the process.
It's not something that Ifailed at or didn't learn before
and therefore you know I'm lessthan it's been a process where
it's been a beautiful process tounfold and learn and relearn
and allow that to be okay, thatI don't know everything about
myself and that I'm stillgrowing and evolving and that
(15:35):
God is right next to me, by myside, supporting me through this
growth.
And then I also ultimatelylearned.
I still have a whole lot more tolearn about myself and to find
those answers, you know, throughmy relationship with the Lord,
but also within myself, insteadof the outside world the earthly
temptations and social, youknow, expectations and things
(15:57):
like that.
So, yeah, I've learned a greatdeal.
And then a beautiful thing youknow, I've learned that I can do
it.
I can buy a house, I cansucceed in school, I can raise
my children and still be anincredible mom.
Those things were not takenfrom me, whereas when I first
went through the divorce therewas so much loss loss of hopes
(16:20):
and dreams, friends, futureplanning, all of these things.
But then in my healing process Irealized there were a lot of
things that I didn't lose thatwere consistent, that were
beautiful, that I needed to kindof like wipe the clouds out of
my eyes to see and see themclearly, and so that's been a
blessing to realize that.
Speaker 1 (16:41):
That's.
That's really beautiful.
That's beautiful.
You talked about some friends.
Yes.
I think people either are theyhave a lot of friends, like you
just said, they are very social,they have tons of friends, or
you have almost the veryopposite of when they talk about
, hey, who are your five friendsof influence?
(17:01):
Or you need to be in community,but you know all this stuff
it's very anxious of.
I don't have that and I don'tknow how to get that, and that's
a lot of pressure and I feellike I'm the only one who
doesn't have these people in mygroup, this tribe.
However, you want to say it how, how, what would you say to
them?
Speaker 2 (17:21):
Yeah Well, previously I had a tribe, but I realized
they weren't my tribe.
Um, you know the, the womenthat stopped calling stopped
inviting because I was a threatto them or because I was no
longer the wife of so, and so Ihave found my people.
It's not necessarily a tribe,because we don't all come
together and hang out.
They don't even know each other.
(17:41):
But it's been really coolbecause I have found some people
that have really helped toelevate me as a woman, me as a
person, me as a colleague.
These people that I'mmentioning I won't mention their
name, but they are the mostunusual friends that have popped
up that have come into my life.
(18:01):
They are different generations.
One of the people that I'llreference is 87 years old.
One of the people that I'llreference is 87 years old and
he's been an incrediblecompanion to me he and his wife,
both.
I have another friend that wesend scripture to each other
daily devos.
I have another friend that wehave weekly conversations about
(18:32):
our walk.
You know our week and our walkwith the Lord.
I have another friend that Irecently met, a couple years ago
, who continually sends meencouraging wisdom calls and
checks on me, make sure I'm okay, not from the preference of
wanting something from me or,you know, needing to put the
picture on Facebook, but thisperson really cares about who I
am and who I'm becoming and howI'm feeling and it's just a
really comforting type offriendship.
(18:52):
But we have we do differentthings than I would do with my
tribe before, whereas we wouldgo out and do girls things.
And now I am, you know, havingintellectual conversations and
people are listening to mewithout judgment.
I don't have to put on.
This persona of life iswonderful, with the white picket
fence.
I have weekly meetings and wedo Bible studies.
(19:13):
We talk about our relationshipwith the Lord and how we can be
better.
I get spiritual encouragement,we pray together.
They check in on me.
We'll go on walks andexperience this beautiful earth
that we have and all the trailsthat we have in Parker.
But ultimately, just havinghaving these true, genuine
friends from different walks oflife, different genders,
(19:35):
different ages, differentethnicities, having them reach
out because they care about me,means the world to me and that
means so much more than beinginvited to girls night.
It's just so much moremeaningful, more richness in the
friendship and it's moregenuine and it's just really
comforting.
It really is.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
Yeah, I can see a difference.
And you're you're right.
I think that a lot of anxietymight be coming out of social
media and hey, we're hanging out, we're doing this, we're doing
that, and then I don't have that.
And you're like yeah, andthat's okay.
Speaker 2 (20:14):
I went to this women's conference at a church
and the topic of the conferencewas flourishing, and I
legitimately did not understandwhat that meant because I had
been surviving my entire lifeand you know women were talking
about how they flourish and I'mjust kind of like marveling at
(20:34):
what they mean by it.
And you know I want that, I wantto flourish.
You know I kept telling myselfwell, I'm not there yet.
How are all these womenflourishing?
Are they being honest abouttheir flourishing?
Because I know we allexperience pain and challenges.
And then there's thatunderlying question of what
(20:55):
exactly does flourishing looklike in a day-to-day?
Life, because not?
every day is sunshine and roses,and what I came to the
conclusion on is I don't have tobe flourishing, but I know I'm
on my way, I know I'm on thepath to get there, whatever that
means.
And I think about with myrelationship with the Lord.
I think about also my childhoodand my upbringing.
(21:16):
I was brought up Roman Catholic.
Growing up Jesus was a scarydead guy on the cross.
He was not my protector, mybest friend, he was not the
Prince of Peace.
You know everything that I did.
If you do this you're a sinner,If you do that you're bad.
And so my relationship with theLord has really evolved and
(21:39):
changed as I've gravitatedtowards more Christianity but
also having that internal peaceof knowing I might not be
flourishing yet, but I have theLord with me and he flourishes
within me.
And I've spent so much time,especially in the last year,
searching for answers.
You know, mostly asking why me,god, why did this happen to me?
(22:02):
And there's this little sweetstory I want to share with you.
You know how sometimes you hearthe most sweetest innocent
things from the mouth of babes.
Speaker 1 (22:10):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (22:10):
One day after my divorce, I was having one of
those days where I just couldn'tstop crying.
I couldn't control it, I wasweepy, I was broken and I was
trying to fake it in front of mykids.
And I was.
I was actually making themsloppy joes and I kept turning
around to the stove.
They were sitting on thekitchen counter behind me and I
literally could see tearsfalling into the sausage doughs.
(22:31):
Don't tell my children, they'llkill me.
And as soon as dinner was ready,I went to the couch and I still
had tears and I was trying to,you know, suck it up and be
strong.
And, you know, my little soncame up to me and crawled up at
my lap and he said Mama, mama, Iknow dad did this to you, but I
(22:55):
also know God did this for you.
And so I reflect on those wordsand, especially when I think
about flourishing, I reflect onthose words and think nothing
was done to me.
This was all done for me tohelp get me to the point where I
have this incrediblerelationship, not only with
friends, but with the Lord aswell, with my church and and
with myself, most importantly.
Speaker 1 (23:13):
That's beautiful, thank you.
Thank you for sharing that.
I can see just that story initself really really touching
someone.
Yeah, thank you for sharingthat.
Speaker 2 (23:24):
Yeah and I heard this incredible quote when you do
find your people, those peopleleave a blueprint on your mind,
a handprint on your heart and animprint on your soul.
And so I reflect on that and Ithink about these special people
that I mentioned before and howthey have left the blueprint,
the handprint and the imprint onme, friends on me, and it's
(23:50):
like I said, it's just, it's awonderful feeling to know that I
have people who are there, whocare and and care about who I am
and how I am.
Speaker 1 (23:56):
Yeah, I wonder if part of the problem with finding
friends is that you want one ortwo friends to have all of
these attributes and it'ssounding kind of like all of
your friends have specialattributes that pour into you.
They're all very different.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
They're all very different and I think it's very
common.
When you're trying to find yourpeople, you naturally gravitate
towards people who are like you.
You know people who are in thesame.
You know part of life as you,or go to the same church as you,
or went to the same high schoolas you, and all these people
that I'm mentioning here I'vemet at different points of my
life and they, they bring arichness to me because of their
(24:37):
experience and their, theirpassion and just their genuine
hearts yeah, yeah, I really likethat.
Speaker 1 (24:44):
I do too.
I think I'll keep them.
Well, as we wrap up, we alwayswrap up with what is your
favorite Bible verse or story.
Speaker 2 (24:56):
I always tend to gravitate towards Romans 8, 28.
And so that says and for thosewho love God, all things work
together for good for those whoare called according to his
purpose.
And so, yeah, a terrible thinghappened to me I got divorced.
You know horrible, terriblething at the time, but it's
amazing to think about what Godis going to do with this for me,
(25:19):
you know how he's going to joinforces, how he's going to allow
me to possibly impact otherpeople someday, support another
person going through it and, youknow, not only repair my
relationship with myself, butalso with my ex-husband too.
We're friends, we're on goodterms.
Co-parenting is a challenge,but one thing I promised myself
(25:41):
is that I wouldn't allow myheart to grow hardened, and I
don't think I have.
I've become stronger throughthat, and so this verse really
resonates with who I am today,as an ex-wife, as a co-parent is
that all these things will worktogether for the good.
And so, trusting in that and,you know, just laying out at the
(26:03):
cross and allowing God to dohis wonders and not try to
control it, not try to fix it,but just really leaning into how
these things are going to workfor good, and knowing that I am
called according to His purpose,and so, as I still search to
find what that is, this isdefinitely a verse that I often
reflect on.
Speaker 1 (26:24):
How do you not let your heart grow hard?
Speaker 2 (26:27):
From watching other people do it.
I've seen so many women gothrough bitter divorces where 20
years later, they're stillangry, they're still spiteful,
and I didn't want to become thatand of course I was angry at
times, but I didn't allow it tofester and stick there.
I worked through it to be ableto trust that God has made all
(26:51):
these things work for his good.
I don't want to be angry.
I don't want to be that bitterperson.
I know anger is a true emotionand we have to honor and
recognize it when it creeps up.
But I just know myself and I dohave a kind heart.
And why would I change that?
Because somebody else made adecision that impacted my life.
Speaker 1 (27:10):
Yeah, so you don't let it fester.
So if it comes up you don'tfeed it.
Is that kind of yeah don't?
Speaker 2 (27:17):
feed the beast.
Okay, don't feed the beast.
Because these women that Ireferenced, who are bitter and
angry.
Whether it's two years, youknow 20 years down the road.
I see how it affects theirphysical health.
I see how it affects their agingprocess, their ability to cope
and interact with other people,their lack of social awareness,
when all they're talking aboutis you know their ex did this or
(27:39):
you know my child's father didthat, and it's not a feeling
that I ever felt comfort with inthose conversations.
Of course you want to besupportive to those women, but
you don't want to become thateither.
Speaker 1 (27:51):
That's really good and I think that from the very
beginning I think that's why Isaid I was just kind of drawn to
you because you do have thisspirit of love and not of anger
and resentment, and so I thinkthat really does show in you.
Speaker 2 (28:09):
It helps.
It really helps to alleviatethe heaviness of going through
something like that and findingjoy in the things around you,
because sometimes life is justtoo painful inside, you know,
and there's got to be good inevery day, there's got to be
beauty in every sight and visionthat you have, if you search
for it.
I think as humans, you know, wecan make the choice to be happy
(28:32):
or we can make the choice to bemiserable.
I think the amount of effort,of work and energy that you put
into either one, it's the sameamount of work.
It's just for to achievedifferent purposes, so good.
Speaker 1 (28:45):
What are you grateful for?
Speaker 2 (28:47):
You know I had a hard time reflecting on that
question when we discussed it.
I honestly, I'm grateful forthe journey.
I really am.
Had I have been born into theperfect family with the perfect
life, without struggles, I don'tthink that I would be as
evolved as I am now, because Ithink you grow most in pain.
I think the lessons are in thevalley, they're not at the
(29:10):
mountaintop.
There's very thin up there, andso I'm grateful for the journey
and that, I think, incorporatesthe journey that I've gone
through with my relationshipwith the Lord, with my children,
with my career, even with myown family.
So, yeah, I'm grateful for thejourney.
Speaker 1 (29:25):
That's wonderful to hear, knowing what your journey
has been Right.
Speaker 2 (29:32):
Sure.
Speaker 1 (29:32):
Yeah, and I think that that speaks to your Romans
8 Bible verse, right, yes, yeahthat speaks to your Romans 8
Bible verse, right?
Speaker 2 (29:43):
Yes, yeah, I think if people were to look at me on
the outside, there's assumptionsthat oh, she's this or she's
that, or you know, she's got itall together.
I think there's assumptions andwhen we met at church, when I
gave that talk about forgiveness, I had quite a few women come
up to me saying things like Iwould have never known that you
experienced this or that.
You know I would have assumedthat you have this like perfect
(30:04):
Douglas County housewife.
You know story about you andyou know.
It really makes me think aboutyou.
Just, you never know what peopleare battling.
You never know what people aredealing with, what kind of day
they've had, what kind of lifethey've had.
And you have to assume you knownot only positive intent, but
you have to assume that everyonehas struggled to some degree,
(30:25):
whether it's on the outside orthe inside, and to not make
those stereotypes of people justbecause they look some type of
way on the outside, and knowingthat everyone has a journey,
everyone has a broken heart,everyone has wonderful things in
their life as well, and it'sreally about sitting down and
getting to know the heart ofpeople, regardless of how they
appear on the outside,regardless of their background,
(30:46):
their age, their ethnicity, andjust looking really at the human
centeredness of the person'sspirit and being curious about
who they are.
Speaker 1 (30:54):
Yeah, yeah, and that's why I love stories and
that's why we're here.
So what kindness have youreceived in the last week, or
what kindness have you given?
Speaker 2 (31:06):
That is a really appropriate question for what's
going on in my life right now.
So I reached out to you beforethis podcast and I had shared
with you that our family hasgone through a trauma in the
last couple of weeks.
My 19-year-old nephew recentlydied by suicide and it's been
traumatic and awful and horribleand shocking and all the things
(31:27):
.
And also we lost my olderbrother to suicide years ago,
and so it's almost like relivinga trauma.
And so, taking you back to thebeginning of this, when I said I
was grew up to be veryindependent.
Part of being independent is Ididn't ask for help, I didn't
receive help, I didn't say Ineeded things.
(31:47):
And so when you asked me thisquestion of how have I received
kindness in the last two weekssince I returned from traveling
for my nephew's service andhandling his affairs, I was kind
to myself because I allowedpeople to help me.
I would have normally closed mydoors and said I don't need
(32:10):
anything.
I got it, I'm strong, I'mcapable, I'll go to the store
and get milk, even though Ihaven't brushed my hair in three
days.
But this time I did reach outand I received incredible
kindness.
One person in particular fromchurch who I'm very close with.
She came by my townhouse anddropped off four bags of
groceries milk, eggs, all thethings that I hadn't gone to the
(32:33):
store to get and she just didit in a non-intrusive way I just
want to give you a hug, andhere's some groceries.
And that was so kind because Ireally, really needed those
groceries at the time.
My son was telling me we wereout of milk and I accepted that,
and so that was incredibly kind.
I also had amazing people, evenlike you, saying I'm praying for
you, I'm praying for yournephews, my niece, who was also,
(32:59):
you know, left by her brother,and so that incredible kindness
that people are thinking of meand praying for me and cheering
me on has been a kindness thatI've allowed to be led into my
world and in my heart, wherenormally I would have said no, I
got this and I'm okay.
So I think that's a veryimportant life lesson,
(33:19):
especially for us women, becausesometimes we are our own worst
critic.
We set the illusion that we cando all things and a lot of
times we can't.
And so just being kind toyourself by accepting help and
admitting where you need help, Ithink that there's no better
way to be kind to yourself thanallowing that.
Speaker 1 (33:40):
Yeah, and then you were allowing people to show
that kindness in return.
I was very thankful that, justout of the blue I mean we'd been
talking, but I didn't reach outto you that day and be like,
hey, how's your day?
And you just reached out andsaid, hey, I need you to pray
for me, I need you to pray forour family, and I'm thankful
(34:01):
that you did that and that Icould walk alongside you in a
very, very, very, very small way, but that you allowed me to do
that.
Speaker 2 (34:10):
And I reached out to you specifically because I see
you as so soulful and so notreligious but so spiritually
practiced, and I know that yourprayers go up into heaven.
I know God hears your prayers.
And so I reached out to youspecifically because I know and
I can trust that when you sayyou're praying for someone, you
(34:32):
do.
I think all too often people,oh yeah, you're in my prayers,
you're in my prayers, but areyou really?
I think all too often people,oh yeah, you're in my prayers,
you're in my prayers, but areyou really?
You know, are you actually?
You know you wrote down myniece's name when we talked so
that you could specifically prayfor her.
Yeah, and that matters to me,and that's why I specifically
reached out to you and told you,even though it was raw and it
was hard, and it's hard to type.
Speaker 1 (34:54):
Right, you know a text like that, and so I really
appreciate your kindness as welland your prayers in this alone.
(35:14):
You're not alone.
I'm here by chance.
If you needed anything,hopefully you would let me know,
but I like that little tidbit,if that helps anybody, of when
you are praying for them, oreven if you're praying for them
every day.
You might not have to do thatevery day, but once in a while
just let them know hey, I'mstill here, I'm still thinking
(35:35):
of you, and so thank you forthat.
Speaker 2 (35:38):
It matters.
It really does matter.
It really does make adifference in the healing
process.
And you know, getting throughthe cobwebs of going through
something like that, Justknowing that there's angels in
the outfield like yourself thatare taking the prayer seriously,
really meaning it and actuallydoing it.
Speaker 1 (35:58):
Yeah Well, thank you.
Thank you for sharing that.
I know that, beyond everything,there's so much more going on
with your story and all of ourstories, like you just said, so
thank you for sharing that.
Speaker 2 (36:09):
Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1 (36:11):
Well, I am so thankful that Kay was on for our
third anniversary podcast andthere's just so many tidbits in
there.
I am just.
I just know that wherever youare in your walk, there's
something that came out of there.
So I appreciate your story andsharing and being vulnerable.
Speaker 2 (36:31):
Absolutely, and if there's any other women out
there listening who have gonethrough divorce, your life is
not over.
You are worthy of a healthy,loving relationship.
You are worthy of love.
You will get through this and,even though your life may feel
like it's been broken into athousand pieces of glass, it's
your opportunity to take thatglass and make a beautiful
(36:52):
mosaic out of it and the purposethat God created for you.
Speaker 1 (36:56):
Well, we'll end with that.
Thanks for listening toOrdinary People Extraordinary
Things, where your story is Hisglory.
Thank you for listening.
Thank you for being a part ofthree years of Ordinary People
Extraordinary Things, where yourstory is His glory.
But we are not finished.
In two weeks come back for abrand new episode.
(37:17):
We are going to talk to twopeople that have made Christmas
lights part of their mission.
They have one of the biggestChristmas light displays that
I've ever seen at one person'shouse.
You won't want to miss thisreally fun story.
This marks three years of Ordinary People,
extraordinary Things.
I am so excited.
Thank you so much for eithercoming on today for our very
first episode or being with usfrom the very beginning.
I'm so blessed to becelebrating three years.
So today, for our three-yearanniversary, I wanted to bring
(00:24):
on our very first guest.
Can't wait for you to hear this, and thank you so much for
making Ordinary People,extraordinary Things what it is
today.
Welcome to Ordinary People,extraordinary Things.
We're here with Kay.
Kay, thanks for coming.
Thank you for having me.
So I'm so excited.
If you don't remember, kay wasour very first podcast guest, so
(00:48):
I asked her to come backbecause we're celebrating three
years on Ordinary People,extraordinary Things and I'm so
excited about that and I thoughtwhat better way to celebrate
three years than to have Kayback and kind of talk about what
she's learned in the last threeyears, how her own story has
evolved.
So I'm so thankful she said yes.
Speaker 2 (01:10):
Thank you again.
I appreciate being here andhopefully the words I speak
today will resonate or helpanother woman who's gone through
some of the similar things I'veexperienced.
Speaker 1 (01:19):
Yes and for sure.
Check out the first episode ifyou haven't.
But if someone is like, well,who is this person?
Can you give 30 words orphrases to describe yourself?
Speaker 2 (01:31):
Yes, I actually had to call a friend and ask for
some help, because it's reallyhard sometimes to describe your
own self without being tooself-righteous or
self-condemning.
And so some words that I gotfrom both of my children, my
boys and my very best friend inFlorida.
They said words like kind andthoughtful, caring, nurturing.
(01:51):
I'm an empath, I'm a helper.
And then the one word that theyall three said ironically they
all told me I was a survivor andI agree with that.
But when I ran that word overwith another friend who I'm very
close to at church, she said Idon't see you as a survivor, I
see you as a thriver.
And.
(02:12):
I kind of tilted my head.
What?
What do you mean?
Thriver?
I'm not thriving.
And she said I've known you formany years and I've seen you
experience incredible challengesand pain and hurt and
disruption of life, and you're athriver because every time you
experience something hard, yougrow from it and you search from
within and you change and youevolve, whereas survivors you
(02:35):
know they survive and thenthat's it.
And so that was a shocking wayto describe myself, but I
thought I'd share it because Iam as intrigued in that word as
I was when she told me about it.
Speaker 1 (02:47):
I love that yeah.
I love that.
That is so good, because we allgo through things, but it's.
Are we going to learn?
Are we going to grow?
Are we going to be able to notjust live at a base level but to
thrive?
Wow, I love that.
Speaker 2 (03:07):
Thank you for sharing that.
Yeah, I was very touched bythat word.
I've never chosen that word todescribe myself, nor has anybody
ever told me I was a thriver.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
Right, but then you can probably show that to
someone else.
I bet that you see that in themand how impactful that might be
absolutely oh, that's good.
So where are you three yearslater from our last podcast,
sure?
What have you learned?
Speaker 2 (03:34):
so our last podcast was focused on forgiveness, and
when we did our last podcast, Iwas fresh out of a very
unexpected divorce.
It it wasn't my choosing, itwasn't part of my hopes and
dreams, and so I went through asevere amount of devastation.
So it's been three years and Iwould say the first year was
(03:55):
absolutely unbearable.
I wasn't very kind to myself.
I retreated into myself.
I wasn't utilizing tools andhealing techniques to help
myself grow.
I was basically just stickingmy head in the sand and licking
my wounds.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
So maybe just surviving at that point.
Speaker 2 (04:11):
Surviving, absolutely .
And then the second year camewhere I was much more
action-oriented, where I'm gonnado all these things and conquer
this and beat this and feelbetter, and dust was kicked up
through that process and so thatlanded me in therapy, Okay, and
so I sought out those resourcesand really dove into it and
(04:33):
explored a lot of childhoodtrauma that I experienced and
some of the things that you knowwere triggered from my divorce.
Here I am now, On the surface.
When you ask how am I doing inthe last three years, one of the
first things I did afterdivorce is I went through
Financial Peace University tolearn how to budget like a boss.
Yes, that's such a good one, andsurvive in a financial way,
(04:56):
because divorce is sofinancially devastating,
especially to someone who didn'thave control of the finances
and was told she couldn't domath and things like that.
So there was a consciousincompetence about finances, so
that was a good thing that I did.
I also went back to school fora year and got a international
healthcare certification it'scalled CPXP and passed this
(05:17):
massive exam and that helped meto gain some confidence and it
also allowed me to be promotedto a manager level role at work.
That's awesome, as you know, inour last podcast, I had been
working part-time in my marriageand I was faced with going back
to work full-time, and so thatreally helped to excel me into a
manager and leadership role.
I've really delved into myfitness commitment, taking care
(05:41):
of my body in a physical way.
I've joined a weekly Biblestudy, so that's been wonderful.
We're in Torah, so we've readGenesis and Exodus, and now
we're in Leviticus, and sothat's been really incredible
having those intellectualconversations with people who I
feel know so much more than I doabout the Bible and then also
(06:01):
being accepted when I askquestions that are out of the
ordinary type of question.
My kids are getting bigger andmy youngest son is driving.
He's making a stay off the roadsin Parker, my older son is a
mail carrier at the Parker PostOffice and he is officially off
the payroll.
I got a new puppy.
(06:22):
I moved out of that horribleapartment that I was living in.
Post-divorce I bought myself alittle townhouse, so
structurally things are fallinginto place.
I've also gained new friends.
I lost a lot of friends in mydivorce but I've gained friends
and we'll talk about that latertoday.
But there's a reality to it,there's an undertow.
I've been in therapy, I've donethe EMDR, I've gone to weekly
(06:45):
sessions.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
Sorry, what's?
Speaker 2 (06:47):
EMDR.
It's a therapy technique tohelp me explore the past and
resolve issues that are triggersor traumas.
Speaker 1 (06:54):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (06:55):
Yeah, another thing that I experience is I really do
keep my circle small, whereasbefore I had this vast amount of
friends that turned out to notreally be real friends.
you know, they were moreacquaintances, so I keep my
circle small okay and I thinkthat's just part of the healing
process and maybe some parts ofnot trusting people as openly as
(07:17):
I did previously.
I don't go to big events.
I don't go to parties or barslike the stereotypical divorcee
would do.
I really do enjoy solo time.
I had my first son when I wasso, so young, and so, you know,
in my age now I've never beenalone, and so sometimes I find
(07:37):
myself on my patio just sittingin the quiet and enjoying the
world around me, and I'mcomfortable with that.
I don't feel alone.
I don't feel alone.
I don't feel lonely, I feel atpeace, and I like that.
It's safe for me.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
Some people say it's not healthy, but for me it's
what's working right now.
Sorry, could I stop you for asecond and ask you have you
always been okay with beingalone and solo and in the quiet,
or is that something new?
Speaker 2 (08:04):
I was first at the party, always wanted to go to
the barbecue, be social, havelots of friends keep in touch
with people, social media andthat's really changed in me
because I don't feel that I needto put my life on display and
share, you know, intimate thingsor personal things with many
people and now I just sharethose things with people I trust
(08:25):
.
Yeah.
And so I do know that that's aneffect of divorce, because
that's not who I was previously.
Okay, um, that I find comfortin being alone and and, of
course, just like all women andworking mother, I have doubt, I
have fears, you know, sometimescrippling anxiety, um, and so I
don't know if I can attributethat directly to divorce, but
it's definitely a new thing forme, where I had much more
(08:48):
confidence previously, and nowI'm just okay being, you know,
the small girl in the corner.
I'm comfortable there.
One thing I wanted to talkabout is the divorce itself.
You know, when you go through adivorce, especially when it's
unwanted, unplanned andunexpected.
For me, I felt like I had thistarget on my back and everyone
(09:08):
knew I was divorced.
I would sit in church alone andI would think people would
judge me or think about me, andthrough the therapy and
everything I've experienced withhealing, I've realized that
divorce is grief.
It is profound grief, it is loss.
It's not just loss of yourhouse, but it's loss of your
(09:28):
dreams.
It's loss of, for me, myidentity.
I didn't even know who I wasafter divorce.
I didn't know what my favoritecolor was, because he told me
what my favorite color was and Ijust went along.
You know, got along to.
You know, go along to get along.
You know, got along to.
You know, go along to get along.
I do realize too that you know,when people experience loss of a
(09:50):
loved one through death,there's so much more support in
the community.
You know, people bring mealsand take all the time you need,
come back to work when you'reready, whereas when I went
through my divorce it was wascan I take two days off to move?
And once I moved, it wasneeding to be a hundred percent
and and get through that in avery quick matter of fact.
(10:12):
It's the splitting of C's andthen you just move on.
And so that grieving processhas taken a long time for me
because there's many things thatI'm grieving.
It's not just the divorceitself or the broken marriage.
It was so many underlyingthings that I've had to really
work through and deal with,especially through therapy
(10:33):
that's a good point.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
Thank you for bringing that up.
As far as I was thinking, whenyou were saying there was
different like levels, I waslike, oh, that sounds like grief
.
Where you go, you know there'sthe steps of grief.
Speaker 2 (10:45):
Yeah, denial, anger, right that kind of thing, and
then in social circles they'rethe stereotype of divorced women
, the number one question I getasked when I run into a friend
that I haven't seen.
The very first question are youdating?
Oh and there's this pressure tomove on.
You know I'll hear things frompeople.
You You'll find a new man Like.
(11:07):
It's like buying a new shirt atthe store or something you know
or.
I've had friends, you know,almost pressure me to date
trying to set me up with peoplejust because they're single.
We've got to be the perfectmatch, not even in an
encouraging way, but I feel it'smore pressure.
You've got to get out there.
You're never going to meetsomeone if you're sitting on
your patio.
I've even had a friend tell meafter.
(11:30):
She asked me if I was datingand she said let me guess Jesus
is the man in your life.
Speaker 1 (11:36):
Just very disparaging , very condescending.
Speaker 2 (11:39):
I said with confidence well, yes, he is, but
there's a social pressure tomove on.
I have a group of friends whohave been separated or gone
through divorce and quite a fewof them have moved on rather
quickly, where they didn't takethe time to heal and get to know
themselves, their new selves,and they're in toxic
relationships.
(11:59):
And so I'm just kind of sittingin the background observing
their experiences and you knownot that I'm never going to date
again or move on.
I'll move on when I'm ready,when God tells me to.
Speaker 1 (12:12):
Well and the social pressure to be married is very
widespread.
Speaker 2 (12:17):
Yeah, I had another friend say if you don't get out
there and start dating, you'regoing to end up an old lady with
cats.
And I said, well, dogs maybe,not cats.
It'll come for me in time andI've realized through my healing
process that there's there's notimeline in healing from
divorce and you know it's mytimeline, it's God's timeline.
There shouldn't be any pressureto do something and move on and
(12:40):
and feel fulfilled because I'min a relationship and therefore
I have, you know, succeeded.
So, that's been really different.
And then also with friends thatI had previously, friends who I
would consider to be incrediblefriends, all of a sudden are
jealous of me when I'm aroundtheir husbands, like you know.
(13:01):
And so there's that socialaspect of it.
I, just because I'm single, intheir minds means I'm desperate,
and you know, and so there'sthat social aspect of it like
just because I'm single in theirminds means I'm desperate, and
you know, sometimes I think youknow you've been telling me how
horrible your marriage is for 10years.
You think I'd want to move onwith that, so that's been kind
of tough.
Is like having friends changejust because I'm single okay,
yeah being being the third wheelwhen I go out to dinner.
(13:22):
Um, but that that slowlyateswith time, so that's kind of
another reason I like to stay onmy patio.
So another thing you asked meis what have I learned through
this?
Speaker 1 (13:33):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:34):
And a lot of what I've learned has really been
through the counseling andtherapy, because the therapy
helped me to see my own worth,instead of allowing it to be
defined by the deeds that I didof the day if that makes sense,
and then also explore mychildhood.
In my childhood, the way I grewup and the support systems and
(13:59):
resources that I had around me,it forced me to become what I
would have called veryindependent.
When I realized, in counselingI was very codependent, and so
that was a new term for me andrealizing that when I met my
ex-husband I, without knowing itor being able to articulate it,
I was so desperate to be lovedand accepted that I tolerated
(14:24):
anything.
I tolerated poor behavior, Itolerated poor treatment towards
me, I tolerated being, you know, not even second choice, but
like hundredth and tenth choice.
I tolerated not being able toshare my opinions.
(14:51):
How does this codependency showup in my new self and how to
recognize the sign so that Idon't enter a new relationship
having that mindset and thenalso I've been able to acquire
some tools to be able to copeand deal and, you know, breathe
through times where I'm feelinganxious or nervous.
I've learned that I am enoughbecause I am a daughter of God.
I am enough just the way I am,and the growth that I'm doing is
(15:14):
part of the process.
It's not something that Ifailed at or didn't learn before
and therefore you know I'm lessthan it's been a process where
it's been a beautiful process tounfold and learn and relearn
and allow that to be okay, thatI don't know everything about
myself and that I'm stillgrowing and evolving and that
(15:35):
God is right next to me, by myside, supporting me through this
growth.
And then I also ultimatelylearned.
I still have a whole lot more tolearn about myself and to find
those answers, you know, throughmy relationship with the Lord,
but also within myself, insteadof the outside world the earthly
temptations and social, youknow, expectations and things
(15:57):
like that.
So, yeah, I've learned a greatdeal.
And then a beautiful thing youknow, I've learned that I can do
it.
I can buy a house, I cansucceed in school, I can raise
my children and still be anincredible mom.
Those things were not takenfrom me, whereas when I first
went through the divorce therewas so much loss loss of hopes
(16:20):
and dreams, friends, futureplanning, all of these things.
But then in my healing process Irealized there were a lot of
things that I didn't lose thatwere consistent, that were
beautiful, that I needed to kindof like wipe the clouds out of
my eyes to see and see themclearly, and so that's been a
blessing to realize that.
Speaker 1 (16:41):
That's.
That's really beautiful.
That's beautiful.
You talked about some friends.
Yes.
I think people either are theyhave a lot of friends, like you
just said, they are very social,they have tons of friends, or
you have almost the veryopposite of when they talk about
, hey, who are your five friendsof influence?
(17:01):
Or you need to be in community,but you know all this stuff
it's very anxious of.
I don't have that and I don'tknow how to get that, and that's
a lot of pressure and I feellike I'm the only one who
doesn't have these people in mygroup, this tribe.
However, you want to say it how, how, what would you say to
them?
Speaker 2 (17:21):
Yeah Well, previously I had a tribe, but I realized
they weren't my tribe.
Um, you know the, the womenthat stopped calling stopped
inviting because I was a threatto them or because I was no
longer the wife of so, and so Ihave found my people.
It's not necessarily a tribe,because we don't all come
together and hang out.
They don't even know each other.
(17:41):
But it's been really coolbecause I have found some people
that have really helped toelevate me as a woman, me as a
person, me as a colleague.
These people that I'mmentioning I won't mention their
name, but they are the mostunusual friends that have popped
up that have come into my life.
(18:01):
They are different generations.
One of the people that I'llreference is 87 years old.
One of the people that I'llreference is 87 years old and
he's been an incrediblecompanion to me he and his wife,
both.
I have another friend that wesend scripture to each other
daily devos.
I have another friend that wehave weekly conversations about
(18:32):
our walk.
You know our week and our walkwith the Lord.
I have another friend that Irecently met, a couple years ago
, who continually sends meencouraging wisdom calls and
checks on me, make sure I'm okay, not from the preference of
wanting something from me or,you know, needing to put the
picture on Facebook, but thisperson really cares about who I
am and who I'm becoming and howI'm feeling and it's just a
really comforting type offriendship.
(18:52):
But we have we do differentthings than I would do with my
tribe before, whereas we wouldgo out and do girls things.
And now I am, you know, havingintellectual conversations and
people are listening to mewithout judgment.
I don't have to put on.
This persona of life iswonderful, with the white picket
fence.
I have weekly meetings and wedo Bible studies.
(19:13):
We talk about our relationshipwith the Lord and how we can be
better.
I get spiritual encouragement,we pray together.
They check in on me.
We'll go on walks andexperience this beautiful earth
that we have and all the trailsthat we have in Parker.
But ultimately, just havinghaving these true, genuine
friends from different walks oflife, different genders,
(19:35):
different ages, differentethnicities, having them reach
out because they care about me,means the world to me and that
means so much more than beinginvited to girls night.
It's just so much moremeaningful, more richness in the
friendship and it's moregenuine and it's just really
comforting.
It really is.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
Yeah, I can see a difference.
And you're you're right.
I think that a lot of anxietymight be coming out of social
media and hey, we're hanging out, we're doing this, we're doing
that, and then I don't have that.
And you're like yeah, andthat's okay.
Speaker 2 (20:14):
I went to this women's conference at a church
and the topic of the conferencewas flourishing, and I
legitimately did not understandwhat that meant because I had
been surviving my entire lifeand you know women were talking
about how they flourish and I'mjust kind of like marveling at
(20:34):
what they mean by it.
And you know I want that, I wantto flourish.
You know I kept telling myselfwell, I'm not there yet.
How are all these womenflourishing?
Are they being honest abouttheir flourishing?
Because I know we allexperience pain and challenges.
And then there's thatunderlying question of what
(20:55):
exactly does flourishing looklike in a day-to-day?
Life, because not?
every day is sunshine and roses,and what I came to the
conclusion on is I don't have tobe flourishing, but I know I'm
on my way, I know I'm on thepath to get there, whatever that
means.
And I think about with myrelationship with the Lord.
I think about also my childhoodand my upbringing.
(21:16):
I was brought up Roman Catholic.
Growing up Jesus was a scarydead guy on the cross.
He was not my protector, mybest friend, he was not the
Prince of Peace.
You know everything that I did.
If you do this you're a sinner,If you do that you're bad.
And so my relationship with theLord has really evolved and
(21:39):
changed as I've gravitatedtowards more Christianity but
also having that internal peaceof knowing I might not be
flourishing yet, but I have theLord with me and he flourishes
within me.
And I've spent so much time,especially in the last year,
searching for answers.
You know, mostly asking why me,god, why did this happen to me?
(22:02):
And there's this little sweetstory I want to share with you.
You know how sometimes you hearthe most sweetest innocent
things from the mouth of babes.
Speaker 1 (22:10):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (22:10):
One day after my divorce, I was having one of
those days where I just couldn'tstop crying.
I couldn't control it, I wasweepy, I was broken and I was
trying to fake it in front of mykids.
And I was.
I was actually making themsloppy joes and I kept turning
around to the stove.
They were sitting on thekitchen counter behind me and I
literally could see tearsfalling into the sausage doughs.
(22:31):
Don't tell my children, they'llkill me.
And as soon as dinner was ready,I went to the couch and I still
had tears and I was trying to,you know, suck it up and be
strong.
And, you know, my little soncame up to me and crawled up at
my lap and he said Mama, mama, Iknow dad did this to you, but I
(22:55):
also know God did this for you.
And so I reflect on those wordsand, especially when I think
about flourishing, I reflect onthose words and think nothing
was done to me.
This was all done for me tohelp get me to the point where I
have this incrediblerelationship, not only with
friends, but with the Lord aswell, with my church and and
with myself, most importantly.
Speaker 1 (23:13):
That's beautiful, thank you.
Thank you for sharing that.
I can see just that story initself really really touching
someone.
Yeah, thank you for sharingthat.
Speaker 2 (23:24):
Yeah and I heard this incredible quote when you do
find your people, those peopleleave a blueprint on your mind,
a handprint on your heart and animprint on your soul.
And so I reflect on that and Ithink about these special people
that I mentioned before and howthey have left the blueprint,
the handprint and the imprint onme, friends on me, and it's
(23:50):
like I said, it's just, it's awonderful feeling to know that I
have people who are there, whocare and and care about who I am
and how I am.
Speaker 1 (23:56):
Yeah, I wonder if part of the problem with finding
friends is that you want one ortwo friends to have all of
these attributes and it'ssounding kind of like all of
your friends have specialattributes that pour into you.
They're all very different.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
They're all very different and I think it's very
common.
When you're trying to find yourpeople, you naturally gravitate
towards people who are like you.
You know people who are in thesame.
You know part of life as you,or go to the same church as you,
or went to the same high schoolas you, and all these people
that I'm mentioning here I'vemet at different points of my
life and they, they bring arichness to me because of their
(24:37):
experience and their, theirpassion and just their genuine
hearts yeah, yeah, I really likethat.
Speaker 1 (24:44):
I do too.
I think I'll keep them.
Well, as we wrap up, we alwayswrap up with what is your
favorite Bible verse or story.
Speaker 2 (24:56):
I always tend to gravitate towards Romans 8, 28.
And so that says and for thosewho love God, all things work
together for good for those whoare called according to his
purpose.
And so, yeah, a terrible thinghappened to me I got divorced.
You know horrible, terriblething at the time, but it's
amazing to think about what Godis going to do with this for me,
(25:19):
you know how he's going to joinforces, how he's going to allow
me to possibly impact otherpeople someday, support another
person going through it and, youknow, not only repair my
relationship with myself, butalso with my ex-husband too.
We're friends, we're on goodterms.
Co-parenting is a challenge,but one thing I promised myself
(25:41):
is that I wouldn't allow myheart to grow hardened, and I
don't think I have.
I've become stronger throughthat, and so this verse really
resonates with who I am today,as an ex-wife, as a co-parent is
that all these things will worktogether for the good.
And so, trusting in that and,you know, just laying out at the
(26:03):
cross and allowing God to dohis wonders and not try to
control it, not try to fix it,but just really leaning into how
these things are going to workfor good, and knowing that I am
called according to His purpose,and so, as I still search to
find what that is, this isdefinitely a verse that I often
reflect on.
Speaker 1 (26:24):
How do you not let your heart grow hard?
Speaker 2 (26:27):
From watching other people do it.
I've seen so many women gothrough bitter divorces where 20
years later, they're stillangry, they're still spiteful,
and I didn't want to become thatand of course I was angry at
times, but I didn't allow it tofester and stick there.
I worked through it to be ableto trust that God has made all
(26:51):
these things work for his good.
I don't want to be angry.
I don't want to be that bitterperson.
I know anger is a true emotionand we have to honor and
recognize it when it creeps up.
But I just know myself and I dohave a kind heart.
And why would I change that?
Because somebody else made adecision that impacted my life.
Speaker 1 (27:10):
Yeah, so you don't let it fester.
So if it comes up you don'tfeed it.
Is that kind of yeah don't?
Speaker 2 (27:17):
feed the beast.
Okay, don't feed the beast.
Because these women that Ireferenced, who are bitter and
angry.
Whether it's two years, youknow 20 years down the road.
I see how it affects theirphysical health.
I see how it affects their agingprocess, their ability to cope
and interact with other people,their lack of social awareness,
when all they're talking aboutis you know their ex did this or
(27:39):
you know my child's father didthat, and it's not a feeling
that I ever felt comfort with inthose conversations.
Of course you want to besupportive to those women, but
you don't want to become thateither.
Speaker 1 (27:51):
That's really good and I think that from the very
beginning I think that's why Isaid I was just kind of drawn to
you because you do have thisspirit of love and not of anger
and resentment, and so I thinkthat really does show in you.
Speaker 2 (28:09):
It helps.
It really helps to alleviatethe heaviness of going through
something like that and findingjoy in the things around you,
because sometimes life is justtoo painful inside, you know,
and there's got to be good inevery day, there's got to be
beauty in every sight and visionthat you have, if you search
for it.
I think as humans, you know, wecan make the choice to be happy
(28:32):
or we can make the choice to bemiserable.
I think the amount of effort,of work and energy that you put
into either one, it's the sameamount of work.
It's just for to achievedifferent purposes, so good.
Speaker 1 (28:45):
What are you grateful for?
Speaker 2 (28:47):
You know I had a hard time reflecting on that
question when we discussed it.
I honestly, I'm grateful forthe journey.
I really am.
Had I have been born into theperfect family with the perfect
life, without struggles, I don'tthink that I would be as
evolved as I am now, because Ithink you grow most in pain.
I think the lessons are in thevalley, they're not at the
(29:10):
mountaintop.
There's very thin up there, andso I'm grateful for the journey
and that, I think, incorporatesthe journey that I've gone
through with my relationshipwith the Lord, with my children,
with my career, even with myown family.
So, yeah, I'm grateful for thejourney.
Speaker 1 (29:25):
That's wonderful to hear, knowing what your journey
has been Right.
Speaker 2 (29:32):
Sure.
Speaker 1 (29:32):
Yeah, and I think that that speaks to your Romans
8 Bible verse, right, yes, yeahthat speaks to your Romans 8
Bible verse, right?
Speaker 2 (29:43):
Yes, yeah, I think if people were to look at me on
the outside, there's assumptionsthat oh, she's this or she's
that, or you know, she's got itall together.
I think there's assumptions andwhen we met at church, when I
gave that talk about forgiveness, I had quite a few women come
up to me saying things like Iwould have never known that you
experienced this or that.
You know I would have assumedthat you have this like perfect
(30:04):
Douglas County housewife.
You know story about you andyou know.
It really makes me think aboutyou.
Just, you never know what peopleare battling.
You never know what people aredealing with, what kind of day
they've had, what kind of lifethey've had.
And you have to assume you knownot only positive intent, but
you have to assume that everyonehas struggled to some degree,
(30:25):
whether it's on the outside orthe inside, and to not make
those stereotypes of people justbecause they look some type of
way on the outside, and knowingthat everyone has a journey,
everyone has a broken heart,everyone has wonderful things in
their life as well, and it'sreally about sitting down and
getting to know the heart ofpeople, regardless of how they
appear on the outside,regardless of their background,
(30:46):
their age, their ethnicity, andjust looking really at the human
centeredness of the person'sspirit and being curious about
who they are.
Speaker 1 (30:54):
Yeah, yeah, and that's why I love stories and
that's why we're here.
So what kindness have youreceived in the last week, or
what kindness have you given?
Speaker 2 (31:06):
That is a really appropriate question for what's
going on in my life right now.
So I reached out to you beforethis podcast and I had shared
with you that our family hasgone through a trauma in the
last couple of weeks.
My 19-year-old nephew recentlydied by suicide and it's been
traumatic and awful and horribleand shocking and all the things
(31:27):
.
And also we lost my olderbrother to suicide years ago,
and so it's almost like relivinga trauma.
And so, taking you back to thebeginning of this, when I said I
was grew up to be veryindependent.
Part of being independent is Ididn't ask for help, I didn't
receive help, I didn't say Ineeded things.
(31:47):
And so when you asked me thisquestion of how have I received
kindness in the last two weekssince I returned from traveling
for my nephew's service andhandling his affairs, I was kind
to myself because I allowedpeople to help me.
I would have normally closed mydoors and said I don't need
(32:10):
anything.
I got it, I'm strong, I'mcapable, I'll go to the store
and get milk, even though Ihaven't brushed my hair in three
days.
But this time I did reach outand I received incredible
kindness.
One person in particular fromchurch who I'm very close with.
She came by my townhouse anddropped off four bags of
groceries milk, eggs, all thethings that I hadn't gone to the
(32:33):
store to get and she just didit in a non-intrusive way I just
want to give you a hug, andhere's some groceries.
And that was so kind because Ireally, really needed those
groceries at the time.
My son was telling me we wereout of milk and I accepted that,
and so that was incredibly kind.
I also had amazing people, evenlike you, saying I'm praying for
you, I'm praying for yournephews, my niece, who was also,
(32:59):
you know, left by her brother,and so that incredible kindness
that people are thinking of meand praying for me and cheering
me on has been a kindness thatI've allowed to be led into my
world and in my heart, wherenormally I would have said no, I
got this and I'm okay.
So I think that's a veryimportant life lesson,
(33:19):
especially for us women, becausesometimes we are our own worst
critic.
We set the illusion that we cando all things and a lot of
times we can't.
And so just being kind toyourself by accepting help and
admitting where you need help, Ithink that there's no better
way to be kind to yourself thanallowing that.
Speaker 1 (33:40):
Yeah, and then you were allowing people to show
that kindness in return.
I was very thankful that, justout of the blue I mean we'd been
talking, but I didn't reach outto you that day and be like,
hey, how's your day?
And you just reached out andsaid, hey, I need you to pray
for me, I need you to pray forour family, and I'm thankful
(34:01):
that you did that and that Icould walk alongside you in a
very, very, very, very small way, but that you allowed me to do
that.
Speaker 2 (34:10):
And I reached out to you specifically because I see
you as so soulful and so notreligious but so spiritually
practiced, and I know that yourprayers go up into heaven.
I know God hears your prayers.
And so I reached out to youspecifically because I know and
I can trust that when you sayyou're praying for someone, you
(34:32):
do.
I think all too often people,oh yeah, you're in my prayers,
you're in my prayers, but areyou really?
I think all too often people,oh yeah, you're in my prayers,
you're in my prayers, but areyou really?
You know, are you actually?
You know you wrote down myniece's name when we talked so
that you could specifically prayfor her.
Yeah, and that matters to me,and that's why I specifically
reached out to you and told you,even though it was raw and it
was hard, and it's hard to type.
Speaker 1 (34:54):
Right, you know a text like that, and so I really
appreciate your kindness as welland your prayers in this alone.
(35:14):
You're not alone.
I'm here by chance.
If you needed anything,hopefully you would let me know,
but I like that little tidbit,if that helps anybody, of when
you are praying for them, oreven if you're praying for them
every day.
You might not have to do thatevery day, but once in a while
just let them know hey, I'mstill here, I'm still thinking
(35:35):
of you, and so thank you forthat.
Speaker 2 (35:38):
It matters.
It really does matter.
It really does make adifference in the healing
process.
And you know, getting throughthe cobwebs of going through
something like that, Justknowing that there's angels in
the outfield like yourself thatare taking the prayer seriously,
really meaning it and actuallydoing it.
Speaker 1 (35:58):
Yeah Well, thank you.
Thank you for sharing that.
I know that, beyond everything,there's so much more going on
with your story and all of ourstories, like you just said, so
thank you for sharing that.
Speaker 2 (36:09):
Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1 (36:11):
Well, I am so thankful that Kay was on for our
third anniversary podcast andthere's just so many tidbits in
there.
I am just.
I just know that wherever youare in your walk, there's
something that came out of there.
So I appreciate your story andsharing and being vulnerable.
Speaker 2 (36:31):
Absolutely, and if there's any other women out
there listening who have gonethrough divorce, your life is
not over.
You are worthy of a healthy,loving relationship.
You are worthy of love.
You will get through this and,even though your life may feel
like it's been broken into athousand pieces of glass, it's
your opportunity to take thatglass and make a beautiful
(36:52):
mosaic out of it and the purposethat God created for you.
Speaker 1 (36:56):
Well, we'll end with that.
Thanks for listening toOrdinary People Extraordinary
Things, where your story is Hisglory.
Thank you for listening.
Thank you for being a part ofthree years of Ordinary People
Extraordinary Things, where yourstory is His glory.
But we are not finished.
In two weeks come back for abrand new episode.
(37:17):
We are going to talk to twopeople that have made Christmas
lights part of their mission.
They have one of the biggestChristmas light displays that
I've ever seen at one person'shouse.
You won't want to miss thisreally fun story.
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