April 1, 2026 • 21 mins
On the latest episode of Rugby Direct, Elliott Smith and Liam Napier unpack the reaction and wider implications of Gregor Paul’s Ardie Savea column published in the New Zealand Herald, sparking debate across the rugby landscape.
The duo also cast an eye ahead to a notably light Round 8 of Super Rugby Pacific, discussing what it means for teams and fans alike as the competition only has three games.
Plus, there’s time for a moment of reflection as they farewell the Crusaders’ iconic 'temporary' home stadium.
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Speaker 1 (00:09):
You're listening to a podcast from News Talks ed B.
Follow this and our Wide Ranger podcasts now on iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Straight down the Middle, Try.
Speaker 1 (00:28):
Get inside the game from every end goal. It's Rugby
Direct with Elliott Smith and Liam Navier powered by News
Talks EDB.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
Welcome into Rugby Direct powered by Habit Held Physio book
today and stay in the game. Back in the Rugby
dit K for another recording. Elliott Smith with me on
the line is always is Liam Napier Napes Welcome into
Rugby Direct type. You haven't tucked into too many Easter
eggs as of yet with the big day just a
few days.
Speaker 4 (00:56):
Away now, not for now, elliotts.
Speaker 5 (00:59):
But I'll be placing the placing the eggs around the garden,
so just awaiting your presence to finalize the hunt.
Speaker 3 (01:06):
That's right. Well, I've got my Easter budding suit really
the go, so you just let me know the time
and I'll be read to bounce around and get those
chocolate eggs going. Let's get into the podcast. A few
Raby issues around to kick into first, also some mail
bag stuff as well, but first and foremost a new
Hell and Herald colleague Gregor Paul publishing a about five
(01:27):
thousand word in depth feature on Artie Savia and how
it came to breaking point with him last year in
terms of his All Blacks future. Basically at the end,
everyone's kissed and made up, but it does paint a
picture of a player that was deeply unhappy. What was
I guess your reaction to that piece, and I guess
(01:48):
some of the things contained inside.
Speaker 4 (01:50):
It, Yeah, a lot of it's been traversed before.
Speaker 5 (01:54):
I guess it's a deep dive on the subject that
certainly paints the picture that we'd all heard that that
Artie was, as you say, deeply unhappy in the All
Black's environment. And you know, there are a number of
contributing factors to that. Time away from family a big
part of it, but also I think from the starts,
(02:16):
certainly at the end of the Northern tour last year,
Ardi and a whole host of senior players and others
were deeply unhappy with that All Black's environment. And I
think that that comes to the fore within Gregor's piece
as well. That's, you know, a fall's rosy in an
All Black environment. That's not something you're going to want
(02:37):
to walk away from. You're going to want to make
it work. So I think it's a reflection of where
that environment was at. But certainly Gregor goes into great
detail about how that's been smoothed over and that New
Zealand Ragbia is going to retain Ardie severe through to
twenty twenty seven. Maybe there'll be a few more breaks
(02:58):
because he was physically and mentally exhausted by the end
of last year. So potentially he comes back from Japan
in May after finishing up with Kobe and maybe skips
some of the July series. But I guess that's for
Dave Renny to determine as well, and does that effect
his potential All Black captaincy. So a lot of water
(03:20):
to flow under that bridge yet, but I guess, first
and foremost it's great that art. He's going to be retained,
but it also paints the picture he was never alone,
but it does paint the picture of I think, just
how bad they're all blacks environments, certainly the culture and
the environment and the unhappiness, the discontent among those senior
(03:41):
playing group.
Speaker 3 (03:42):
Do you think that he was using his frustration with
the camp as a cover to get out of his
content contract, not you know sort of, I mean playing wise.
You know, he signed the contract, he knew what he
was getting into. He was given two sabbaticals in this period.
Was this you know, talking about workload et cetera, et cetera,
and quite unquite easier out for him potentially than you know,
(04:05):
getting these issues to bubble to the surface.
Speaker 5 (04:08):
It's a pretty nuclear extreme mover, isn't it to say?
I wan out two years early? And you can certainly
understand he's one on Rugby's reluctance to allow him to
walk away, given his marketability, given.
Speaker 4 (04:23):
His popularity and appeal. He's widely regarded as.
Speaker 5 (04:27):
One of the world's best players, so you're not just
going to let him walk away. And I think, look,
a player of Artie's caliber could commands a lot more
money elsewhere, whether that be in R three sixty, which
has gone under for now, but there's been talk about
some of the French clubs and the riches that they
(04:48):
could table him Artie Spence a couple of seasons now
in Kobe. I'm sure they jump at the chance to
have him there and in some respects, you know, just
aligning with one club in Kobe, earning great money and
being able to bring the family up there and then
come back home as much easier juggling at than doing
(05:10):
that's coming home or.
Speaker 4 (05:12):
Playing form Wjuana and Auckland.
Speaker 5 (05:13):
His family's based in Wellington, then traveling the world with
the All Blacks. So I can see, you know, perhaps
where he was coming from. But it is a very
extreme move, isn't it to say I'm going to walk
away eighteen months out from a major pinnacle event in
the World Cup, and you can understand why. And he's
on a rugby We're desperate to find some form of resolution.
Speaker 3 (05:37):
That's right. Look, he signed the contracts, what was put
on in front of him. He got a very generous
contract from New Zealand Rugby. There were two sabbatical clauses
in there, which is relatively rare. As you say, he
could have gone to Koba in the first place and
signed a deal and not been available for the All Blacks.
So I think he kind of knew what he was
getting himself into. A round workload and everything like that.
The Hurricanes didn't want to resign him given they weren't
(05:58):
going to get him for a long period of this
current cycle with the two sabbaticals in there he goes
to Mwana and Steers. That means more time away from home.
But ultimately, you know, he's responsible along with his agent
for putting pen to paper on the contract, so it
looked ultimately good to have it tied it up, and
in the fact that he is still committed to the
(06:20):
All Blacks moving on. And look, I know you'll be
upset about this, Liam, but the final game at a
Polyoprojec stadium on Friday night seven oh five Crusaders against
the Fiji and Drewer it is a chance, I believe
for the Crusaders to sign off with their one hundredth
win at the ground. But for me, I just can't
believe the amount of fan fear that has been going
(06:41):
on for this god awful stadium over the last couple
of weeks. Look, this has been the longest goodbye in history.
It's a stadium that no one likes, that no one
has enjoyed going to over the years. And this is
coming from me as a Cantabrian you know, who lived
in christ through twenty eleven then moved to Auckland. They're
(07:02):
eating it on so thick around the stadium that is
an absolute dive.
Speaker 5 (07:07):
Yeah, look, I probably said from a wee bit of
a different perspective, Elliott, I think, look, it's served its
purposed in it and for a lot of people when
when anything comes to an end, there's a lot of nostalgia,
a lot of roast into glasses. You think about the success.
That's something Crusader's teams have had there. I saw Richid
(07:29):
Mwonga put up a post this week about some of
his fondest rugby memories have come at that ground. So
a lot of success, a lot of memorable moments. But look,
from an infrastructure point of view, yeah, it's clearly a dive,
but it's served a purpose.
Speaker 4 (07:48):
It's served a purpose for too long.
Speaker 5 (07:50):
But I think even the fact that they're searching for
their one hundredth whin this weekend speaks to the success
that they've had there. And you know that's that can't
that can't be lost. But it's going to be a
significant upgrade, isn't it. This new statum can't wait to
get down there for super Round and so called that up.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
Yeah, it's gonna be special and that you know, being
a bit tongue in cheeck there, but I think, yeah,
this is gonna be a wonderful stadium. It's been far
too long. This is supposed to be five years, it's
going to be fifteen. By all has all times been
said and done around the stadium. So ultimately a good
thing for the Crusaders to moveing in and the longes
good bye in history can finally be over. Napor's quick
(08:30):
one for you. We touched someone on the pod last week.
But three games this Easter weekend and look, not a
great deal to write home about and to draw a
lot of teams on buys this weekend. I'm into minds
about this. Look, teams I don't think enjoy having Easter games.
They don't get crowds. And we know how much you
know New Zealand, and I'm sure this is the same
(08:52):
in Australia. But you know, it's three or four months
into the year, chants for people to escape the city,
go on holidays, et cetera. Really hard to get crowds in.
But also you know you've got a visual and eyeballs
contest that you're up against, you know, the other sports,
but also you know Clicks Disney plus whatever it might be.
And even just allowing one weekend to take the handbreak
(09:13):
off a little bit. I don't think is a good thing.
So what do you make of this super uggy weekend
with just three games.
Speaker 4 (09:19):
Yeah, I don't think it's a great look.
Speaker 5 (09:20):
I think in a perfect world you'd have a full roster,
full slate of games. The draw the eleven team competition
leaves leaves the competition short changed and so at some
point that's going to bite, and they've chosen to take
that hit this weekend. You can look at it up two ways.
(09:41):
You can say, look, East is a time of year
when people congregate together.
Speaker 4 (09:48):
There's maybe not a lot else going on.
Speaker 5 (09:51):
Maybe they'll go to the games, maybe they'll be watching,
maybe they'll be searching for it. Maybe you can market
it in a certain way I don't know, have an
Easter hunt for the kids or something like that. But
as you say, historically it's actually been really difficult to
get crowds along. So maybe the optics had pointed to
them taking the hit this weekends, but you certainly risk
(10:12):
losing ground to the NRL the AFL when they've got
a full slate of fixtures.
Speaker 4 (10:18):
Cambinet, you this weekend.
Speaker 3 (10:19):
You do, and look, I don't think the Easter games
have always been you know, blockbusters from a New Zealand perspective,
that's when they've often put the dare I say at
weeker games, I know there's you know, unless you're around
Mowana and certain players obviously, you know, with a very
religious weekend this weekend not playing. But I think in
some ways you've also got to try and make your
own landmarks and make your own history. And you know,
(10:41):
why don't you set up something like the Crusaders and
Hurricanes or whatever it might be, or Crusaders and Highlanders,
you know, always play two thirty five on Good Friday.
In one year it's in christ Church, one year it's
in Duneed and you alternate between the two and you
know that each year is going to be that Easter
game and whatever it might be Crusaders Blues. But that
is a tradition. I don't think, you know, Rugby has
helped itself over the years in terms of setting up
(11:03):
these traditions, and they've probably again gone too hard basket
leave it for the weekend that was for the weekend
that's coming up, rather and just play the three games.
So look, we'll see what happens. In the future. I
know Jack Measley has talked about, you know, changes and
scheduling and things like that, but not easy when you've
got all sorts of vested interests across the park. Let's
(11:25):
get into some tipping before we dive into the Rugby
Direct mail bag. Just three games this weekend, Liam, you
have a two point lead after mark to pretty handily
for you last week. On our Thursday episode, he got
four or five. I got to three of five last week,
so you've got twenty five overall. I've got twenty three.
Crusaders draw the final game at Apollo Project Stadium. Who wins?
Speaker 5 (11:47):
Well, you know I love the jurior alias, I do,
but I think I think the stadium might actually crumble
to the ground if the Crusaders don't win that game.
So I suspect they'll win, and I suspect they'll do
it pretty handedly.
Speaker 3 (12:02):
Yeah, agreed on that one. Chiefs Wartaz on Saturday night
seven oh five in Hamilton and a live commentary on
Gold Sport and iHeartRadio. Of course, look Wartas will we
boyed with that win over the Brumbies last week, but
it's still hard to see them coming over and beating
the Chiefs, even though the Chiefs have been quite disappointing
for a couple of weeks.
Speaker 5 (12:22):
Now you're no d Max for the Chiefs, which is
a bit of a setback for Concussion and the Chiefs.
But I don't think the warrit has won in New
Zealand for maybe even ten years. I've got a terrible
record crossing the Tasman. What do they say, one summer
doesn't make a swallow or one wind that doesn't make
(12:43):
a season. So no, I'll tap the Chiefs and be
reasonably confident about that.
Speaker 3 (12:48):
Okay, Now I'm going to be the same as you
and let's Eve can go three from three This week
in Reds Force, interesting game, we're going to see Zach
Lomax come off the bench for the Force. This is
in Brisbane. You fancy the Reds will be too good.
The Force can be a little bit tricky, but just
don't see them being able to go over there and
get the win over the Reds.
Speaker 4 (13:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (13:08):
Interesting to see Lomax make his diverse expective taking a
bit of time. We've seen that with other cross code converts.
Maybe they kick to the heavens and try and use
him that way.
Speaker 4 (13:19):
Later in the match.
Speaker 5 (13:20):
Carter Gordon coming back to start eighteen for the Reds,
so I think he'll have a big impact and they'll
bounce back from their shellacking to the Hurricanes.
Speaker 3 (13:30):
Yeah, three from three, we've gone the same, so there
won't be too many changes in the points table. You'll
maintain at two point leads some way somehow. Off the
back of the weekend, let's dive in there to the
Rugby deg mailbag and producer Mark has got some questions
out of the mail bag for us Killer.
Speaker 2 (13:46):
Yes, thank you, Elliott and Liam. Greetings to you, probably
a quick thank you I expect from you after those
picks I did for you last week. You sort of
back in the game. Well, a two point lead, isn't it?
Speaker 5 (13:57):
It is?
Speaker 2 (13:58):
We take that, Nu, It's all good, All good. Two
questions here from Floyd A little bit of a two pointer.
I we'll start with that. Gregor. Is interesting article about
obviously the RD stuff because I've already sort of given
us your general thoughts on it. But an interesting point
he makes as if he doesn't sort of play that
July series because of being in Japan and resting, would
(14:21):
he was obviously going to rule himself out of all
Blacks captain. Does do you think that would rule himself
out of being captain? Sort of going forward for Dave
Rannie side start with you, liamb.
Speaker 5 (14:33):
Yeah, I think it's important to hit the ground running
with your captain, to bring the team together and have
everyone on deck from the outset. So maybe if he
isn't available from the outset, he becomes that fullback guy
that he was during Ian Foster's and Scott Robinson's era. Really,
when Sam Kane was injured or Scott Barrett was injured,
(14:56):
he stepped into that captain See, so I think you
want your captain on deck from the outset.
Speaker 3 (15:01):
Yeah, I'm the same. Look, he needs to be captaining.
If he's going to captain, he needs to be playing
in that July series. This is the changing of the guard,
a forced changing of the guard for the All Blacks.
And I don't think you can wade around until one
of the tour games against South Africa to have your
captain leading the team. I think he's going to be
there from the get go. So yeah, I'm the same.
(15:21):
I think if he's not captain in July, then you've
got to look elsewhere.
Speaker 2 (15:26):
And a two pointer here from Floyd many over the years,
we've always thought sort of ten has been more important
than the nine. Do you believe that's kind of changed
at the moment with especially we talk so much about
on this podcast how incredible Camroy Guard is and the
French halfback who sort of led their way as well.
(15:47):
Do you think now sort of nine's having this sort
of moment in the sun being a little bit more
important than the tent. Liam, We'll start with you.
Speaker 5 (15:57):
I don't think so. I think that their influence has
probably grown. But if you think about someone like Aaron
Smith and the impact he had on the international game,
not so much with his running game, but his speed
of pass, his length to pass. He changed the way
that the All Blacks played, But then you still had
a guy like Dan Carter outside him. And I think
(16:19):
we've seen in recent times the All Blacks perhaps struggle
with not getting the best from their tens did a
serviceable job, but the All Blacks attack wasn't wasn't firing
under Scott Robertson. And we've seen the impacts of other
tens when they're on form. So I still think the
tens of folk Crum, he's your back line director he's
(16:43):
you know, guiding you around the park. But I think
if you have what we have seen in recent times,
I think is the impact a running nine can have
and the ability for them to free up the ten,
to take pressure off him, to give them extra time
and space by being that threat around the ruck. And
that's what du Pomp and ken roygab bringing spades.
Speaker 3 (17:04):
Yeah, and if you and far between up though, those
those running half backs. I mean there's a lot of
running half backs, but the ones that are absolute quality
a few and far between, and that's why they are
game changes in terms of a rey guard. And to DuPont,
you think to the Crusaders and the success they had
it for a number of seasons with you know, Brent
Hall and Mitchell Drummonds. You know, neither of those two
(17:25):
were will go down as great half backs of the game,
but they were very serviceable in that Crusader system and
allowed Richiem Wonga to do what he did very very well.
You know, there's been other examples as well. You think
of someone like a Finlay Christie who was instrumental in
the Blues a couple of years ago and winning their title.
But again you know he's not going to set the
(17:46):
world on fire as the running half back. So I
think it depends on the half back and also the
way that the teams are looking to play. But for me,
you know those half backs that we've mentioned there, DuPont
and royguards set themselves apart because of the running game.
But I still think ultimately the ten is so so
vital when it comes to especially international rugby day. Is
(18:08):
any more in the mailbag for US Killer this.
Speaker 2 (18:10):
Week, Yeah, just the one that was from Floyd from
Sydney as well. Thanks for emailing in there, Floyd. This
is from Dave Paul. This is talking about Monday's episode
when we were talking about the Captains of the future
All Black Captain. Great episode lads, Jordie captain for him,
Artie is and no they Reny won't for for the
bad optics of the big review And from Koe Bay however,
(18:33):
he is picking Jason Ryan will have a big day
and who can mold this team together the best and
team import team input will be sought. So this might
be Cody Taylor. What are your go thoughts on that?
Speaker 5 (18:46):
Starting with you Lamb, Yeah, I think Cody Taylor is
one of the leading candidates. Him Jordi Ardie and obviously
Scott because he's the incumbent.
Speaker 4 (18:56):
I think.
Speaker 5 (18:59):
My only concern I think I raised this on them
on the Monday podcast around Cody is I would like
to see Samsoni, Takyaho and Usfarmore utilize in terms of
their impact off the bench. So maybe you're looking at
pulling Cody Taylor with half an hour ago and maybe
that minimizes his impact as a captain, where someone like
Jordi pretty much plays eighty minutes every week. So Dave
(19:24):
Rennie has also gone down the co captaincy route previously,
so I wouldn't I wouldn't totally rule that option out
just here either.
Speaker 3 (19:30):
Thanks for the letters, guys. There's a couple more in
the mailbag we might get to next week as well.
But keeping coming Rugby directed a news talk zb dot
codo in is it on that Liam on the co captaincy?
Could you do something like a starter as captain and
a bench captain? You know, I'm thinking perhaps Cody Taylor
is the starting captain, but Patrick Thweep a lot too
is the nominal co captain or vice captain off the
(19:51):
team he comes on leads the bench in the closing stages,
but takes on responsibility for the Captaincy wants tayl Leedsville.
Could you do something like that or is that just
too messy?
Speaker 4 (20:01):
I think yeah, you're probably over Kampmcanne and Web.
Speaker 5 (20:03):
I think I'd probably want someone that's been out there,
excuse me, that has a feel for the game, that's
seen it all. If you're coming off the bench, keep
it simple and try to bring that impact. But I
think it's important to remember it's not just about one
person either. You start the buckstops of them in terms
of whether you're kicking for goal or kicking for line,
and maybe some strategic things. But there is a leadership
(20:26):
group in place as well, and there's nothing wrong with
them having a major input on the field. So I
think that's where some work needs to be done as well,
and I think that's where someone like Tana Umanga could
have some real influence, you think for more black captain
coming into that group, trying to bring them together and
mold that culture and specifically around.
Speaker 4 (20:47):
That leadership group. Interesting to see what impact he can bring.
Speaker 3 (20:51):
Absolutely well, they'll do us for another week of rugbe
directs Liam, thank you for your time. We'll just have
the one episode next week. We're just gonna gorge ourselves
a little too much on those chocolate eggs, so we'll
probably see a bit later in the week rather than
earlier next week, just for the once Lee, have you
enjoy your race.
Speaker 4 (21:08):
To weak Likewise, Elliott gets up there, We'll do.
Speaker 3 (21:11):
That is right me direct powered by Heaven Health Physio
Book today and stay at the game thanks as a
ways to produce a Mark Kelly. We'll see.
Speaker 1 (21:20):
For more from news Talks at b Listen live on
air or online, and keep our shows with you wherever
you go with our podcasts on iHeartRadio
You're listening to a podcast from News Talks ed B.
Follow this and our Wide Ranger podcasts now on iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Straight down the Middle, Try.
Speaker 1 (00:28):
Get inside the game from every end goal. It's Rugby
Direct with Elliott Smith and Liam Navier powered by News
Talks EDB.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
Welcome into Rugby Direct powered by Habit Held Physio book
today and stay in the game. Back in the Rugby
dit K for another recording. Elliott Smith with me on
the line is always is Liam Napier Napes Welcome into
Rugby Direct type. You haven't tucked into too many Easter
eggs as of yet with the big day just a
few days.
Speaker 4 (00:56):
Away now, not for now, elliotts.
Speaker 5 (00:59):
But I'll be placing the placing the eggs around the garden,
so just awaiting your presence to finalize the hunt.
Speaker 3 (01:06):
That's right. Well, I've got my Easter budding suit really
the go, so you just let me know the time
and I'll be read to bounce around and get those
chocolate eggs going. Let's get into the podcast. A few
Raby issues around to kick into first, also some mail
bag stuff as well, but first and foremost a new
Hell and Herald colleague Gregor Paul publishing a about five
(01:27):
thousand word in depth feature on Artie Savia and how
it came to breaking point with him last year in
terms of his All Blacks future. Basically at the end,
everyone's kissed and made up, but it does paint a
picture of a player that was deeply unhappy. What was
I guess your reaction to that piece, and I guess
(01:48):
some of the things contained inside.
Speaker 4 (01:50):
It, Yeah, a lot of it's been traversed before.
Speaker 5 (01:54):
I guess it's a deep dive on the subject that
certainly paints the picture that we'd all heard that that
Artie was, as you say, deeply unhappy in the All
Black's environment. And you know, there are a number of
contributing factors to that. Time away from family a big
part of it, but also I think from the starts,
(02:16):
certainly at the end of the Northern tour last year,
Ardi and a whole host of senior players and others
were deeply unhappy with that All Black's environment. And I
think that that comes to the fore within Gregor's piece
as well. That's, you know, a fall's rosy in an
All Black environment. That's not something you're going to want
(02:37):
to walk away from. You're going to want to make
it work. So I think it's a reflection of where
that environment was at. But certainly Gregor goes into great
detail about how that's been smoothed over and that New
Zealand Ragbia is going to retain Ardie severe through to
twenty twenty seven. Maybe there'll be a few more breaks
(02:58):
because he was physically and mentally exhausted by the end
of last year. So potentially he comes back from Japan
in May after finishing up with Kobe and maybe skips
some of the July series. But I guess that's for
Dave Renny to determine as well, and does that effect
his potential All Black captaincy. So a lot of water
(03:20):
to flow under that bridge yet, but I guess, first
and foremost it's great that art. He's going to be retained,
but it also paints the picture he was never alone,
but it does paint the picture of I think, just
how bad they're all blacks environments, certainly the culture and
the environment and the unhappiness, the discontent among those senior
(03:41):
playing group.
Speaker 3 (03:42):
Do you think that he was using his frustration with
the camp as a cover to get out of his
content contract, not you know sort of, I mean playing wise.
You know, he signed the contract, he knew what he
was getting into. He was given two sabbaticals in this period.
Was this you know, talking about workload et cetera, et cetera,
and quite unquite easier out for him potentially than you know,
(04:05):
getting these issues to bubble to the surface.
Speaker 5 (04:08):
It's a pretty nuclear extreme mover, isn't it to say?
I wan out two years early? And you can certainly
understand he's one on Rugby's reluctance to allow him to
walk away, given his marketability, given.
Speaker 4 (04:23):
His popularity and appeal. He's widely regarded as.
Speaker 5 (04:27):
One of the world's best players, so you're not just
going to let him walk away. And I think, look,
a player of Artie's caliber could commands a lot more
money elsewhere, whether that be in R three sixty, which
has gone under for now, but there's been talk about
some of the French clubs and the riches that they
(04:48):
could table him Artie Spence a couple of seasons now
in Kobe. I'm sure they jump at the chance to
have him there and in some respects, you know, just
aligning with one club in Kobe, earning great money and
being able to bring the family up there and then
come back home as much easier juggling at than doing
(05:10):
that's coming home or.
Speaker 4 (05:12):
Playing form Wjuana and Auckland.
Speaker 5 (05:13):
His family's based in Wellington, then traveling the world with
the All Blacks. So I can see, you know, perhaps
where he was coming from. But it is a very
extreme move, isn't it to say I'm going to walk
away eighteen months out from a major pinnacle event in
the World Cup, and you can understand why. And he's
on a rugby We're desperate to find some form of resolution.
Speaker 3 (05:37):
That's right. Look, he signed the contracts, what was put
on in front of him. He got a very generous
contract from New Zealand Rugby. There were two sabbatical clauses
in there, which is relatively rare. As you say, he
could have gone to Koba in the first place and
signed a deal and not been available for the All Blacks.
So I think he kind of knew what he was
getting himself into. A round workload and everything like that.
The Hurricanes didn't want to resign him given they weren't
(05:58):
going to get him for a long period of this
current cycle with the two sabbaticals in there he goes
to Mwana and Steers. That means more time away from home.
But ultimately, you know, he's responsible along with his agent
for putting pen to paper on the contract, so it
looked ultimately good to have it tied it up, and
in the fact that he is still committed to the
(06:20):
All Blacks moving on. And look, I know you'll be
upset about this, Liam, but the final game at a
Polyoprojec stadium on Friday night seven oh five Crusaders against
the Fiji and Drewer it is a chance, I believe
for the Crusaders to sign off with their one hundredth
win at the ground. But for me, I just can't
believe the amount of fan fear that has been going
(06:41):
on for this god awful stadium over the last couple
of weeks. Look, this has been the longest goodbye in history.
It's a stadium that no one likes, that no one
has enjoyed going to over the years. And this is
coming from me as a Cantabrian you know, who lived
in christ through twenty eleven then moved to Auckland. They're
(07:02):
eating it on so thick around the stadium that is
an absolute dive.
Speaker 5 (07:07):
Yeah, look, I probably said from a wee bit of
a different perspective, Elliott, I think, look, it's served its
purposed in it and for a lot of people when
when anything comes to an end, there's a lot of nostalgia,
a lot of roast into glasses. You think about the success.
That's something Crusader's teams have had there. I saw Richid
(07:29):
Mwonga put up a post this week about some of
his fondest rugby memories have come at that ground. So
a lot of success, a lot of memorable moments. But look,
from an infrastructure point of view, yeah, it's clearly a dive,
but it's served a purpose.
Speaker 4 (07:48):
It's served a purpose for too long.
Speaker 5 (07:50):
But I think even the fact that they're searching for
their one hundredth whin this weekend speaks to the success
that they've had there. And you know that's that can't
that can't be lost. But it's going to be a
significant upgrade, isn't it. This new statum can't wait to
get down there for super Round and so called that up.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
Yeah, it's gonna be special and that you know, being
a bit tongue in cheeck there, but I think, yeah,
this is gonna be a wonderful stadium. It's been far
too long. This is supposed to be five years, it's
going to be fifteen. By all has all times been
said and done around the stadium. So ultimately a good
thing for the Crusaders to moveing in and the longes
good bye in history can finally be over. Napor's quick
(08:30):
one for you. We touched someone on the pod last week.
But three games this Easter weekend and look, not a
great deal to write home about and to draw a
lot of teams on buys this weekend. I'm into minds
about this. Look, teams I don't think enjoy having Easter games.
They don't get crowds. And we know how much you
know New Zealand, and I'm sure this is the same
(08:52):
in Australia. But you know, it's three or four months
into the year, chants for people to escape the city,
go on holidays, et cetera. Really hard to get crowds in.
But also you know you've got a visual and eyeballs
contest that you're up against, you know, the other sports,
but also you know Clicks Disney plus whatever it might be.
And even just allowing one weekend to take the handbreak
(09:13):
off a little bit. I don't think is a good thing.
So what do you make of this super uggy weekend
with just three games.
Speaker 4 (09:19):
Yeah, I don't think it's a great look.
Speaker 5 (09:20):
I think in a perfect world you'd have a full roster,
full slate of games. The draw the eleven team competition
leaves leaves the competition short changed and so at some
point that's going to bite, and they've chosen to take
that hit this weekend. You can look at it up two ways.
(09:41):
You can say, look, East is a time of year
when people congregate together.
Speaker 4 (09:48):
There's maybe not a lot else going on.
Speaker 5 (09:51):
Maybe they'll go to the games, maybe they'll be watching,
maybe they'll be searching for it. Maybe you can market
it in a certain way I don't know, have an
Easter hunt for the kids or something like that. But
as you say, historically it's actually been really difficult to
get crowds along. So maybe the optics had pointed to
them taking the hit this weekends, but you certainly risk
(10:12):
losing ground to the NRL the AFL when they've got
a full slate of fixtures.
Speaker 4 (10:18):
Cambinet, you this weekend.
Speaker 3 (10:19):
You do, and look, I don't think the Easter games
have always been you know, blockbusters from a New Zealand perspective,
that's when they've often put the dare I say at
weeker games, I know there's you know, unless you're around
Mowana and certain players obviously, you know, with a very
religious weekend this weekend not playing. But I think in
some ways you've also got to try and make your
own landmarks and make your own history. And you know,
(10:41):
why don't you set up something like the Crusaders and
Hurricanes or whatever it might be, or Crusaders and Highlanders,
you know, always play two thirty five on Good Friday.
In one year it's in christ Church, one year it's
in Duneed and you alternate between the two and you
know that each year is going to be that Easter
game and whatever it might be Crusaders Blues. But that
is a tradition. I don't think, you know, Rugby has
helped itself over the years in terms of setting up
(11:03):
these traditions, and they've probably again gone too hard basket
leave it for the weekend that was for the weekend
that's coming up, rather and just play the three games.
So look, we'll see what happens. In the future. I
know Jack Measley has talked about, you know, changes and
scheduling and things like that, but not easy when you've
got all sorts of vested interests across the park. Let's
(11:25):
get into some tipping before we dive into the Rugby
Direct mail bag. Just three games this weekend, Liam, you
have a two point lead after mark to pretty handily
for you last week. On our Thursday episode, he got
four or five. I got to three of five last week,
so you've got twenty five overall. I've got twenty three.
Crusaders draw the final game at Apollo Project Stadium. Who wins?
Speaker 5 (11:47):
Well, you know I love the jurior alias, I do,
but I think I think the stadium might actually crumble
to the ground if the Crusaders don't win that game.
So I suspect they'll win, and I suspect they'll do
it pretty handedly.
Speaker 3 (12:02):
Yeah, agreed on that one. Chiefs Wartaz on Saturday night
seven oh five in Hamilton and a live commentary on
Gold Sport and iHeartRadio. Of course, look Wartas will we
boyed with that win over the Brumbies last week, but
it's still hard to see them coming over and beating
the Chiefs, even though the Chiefs have been quite disappointing
for a couple of weeks.
Speaker 5 (12:22):
Now you're no d Max for the Chiefs, which is
a bit of a setback for Concussion and the Chiefs.
But I don't think the warrit has won in New
Zealand for maybe even ten years. I've got a terrible
record crossing the Tasman. What do they say, one summer
doesn't make a swallow or one wind that doesn't make
(12:43):
a season. So no, I'll tap the Chiefs and be
reasonably confident about that.
Speaker 3 (12:48):
Okay, Now I'm going to be the same as you
and let's Eve can go three from three This week
in Reds Force, interesting game, we're going to see Zach
Lomax come off the bench for the Force. This is
in Brisbane. You fancy the Reds will be too good.
The Force can be a little bit tricky, but just
don't see them being able to go over there and
get the win over the Reds.
Speaker 4 (13:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (13:08):
Interesting to see Lomax make his diverse expective taking a
bit of time. We've seen that with other cross code converts.
Maybe they kick to the heavens and try and use
him that way.
Speaker 4 (13:19):
Later in the match.
Speaker 5 (13:20):
Carter Gordon coming back to start eighteen for the Reds,
so I think he'll have a big impact and they'll
bounce back from their shellacking to the Hurricanes.
Speaker 3 (13:30):
Yeah, three from three, we've gone the same, so there
won't be too many changes in the points table. You'll
maintain at two point leads some way somehow. Off the
back of the weekend, let's dive in there to the
Rugby deg mailbag and producer Mark has got some questions
out of the mail bag for us Killer.
Speaker 2 (13:46):
Yes, thank you, Elliott and Liam. Greetings to you, probably
a quick thank you I expect from you after those
picks I did for you last week. You sort of
back in the game. Well, a two point lead, isn't it?
Speaker 5 (13:57):
It is?
Speaker 2 (13:58):
We take that, Nu, It's all good, All good. Two
questions here from Floyd A little bit of a two pointer.
I we'll start with that. Gregor. Is interesting article about
obviously the RD stuff because I've already sort of given
us your general thoughts on it. But an interesting point
he makes as if he doesn't sort of play that
July series because of being in Japan and resting, would
(14:21):
he was obviously going to rule himself out of all
Blacks captain. Does do you think that would rule himself
out of being captain? Sort of going forward for Dave
Rannie side start with you, liamb.
Speaker 5 (14:33):
Yeah, I think it's important to hit the ground running
with your captain, to bring the team together and have
everyone on deck from the outset. So maybe if he
isn't available from the outset, he becomes that fullback guy
that he was during Ian Foster's and Scott Robinson's era. Really,
when Sam Kane was injured or Scott Barrett was injured,
(14:56):
he stepped into that captain See, so I think you
want your captain on deck from the outset.
Speaker 3 (15:01):
Yeah, I'm the same. Look, he needs to be captaining.
If he's going to captain, he needs to be playing
in that July series. This is the changing of the guard,
a forced changing of the guard for the All Blacks.
And I don't think you can wade around until one
of the tour games against South Africa to have your
captain leading the team. I think he's going to be
there from the get go. So yeah, I'm the same.
(15:21):
I think if he's not captain in July, then you've
got to look elsewhere.
Speaker 2 (15:26):
And a two pointer here from Floyd many over the years,
we've always thought sort of ten has been more important
than the nine. Do you believe that's kind of changed
at the moment with especially we talk so much about
on this podcast how incredible Camroy Guard is and the
French halfback who sort of led their way as well.
(15:47):
Do you think now sort of nine's having this sort
of moment in the sun being a little bit more
important than the tent. Liam, We'll start with you.
Speaker 5 (15:57):
I don't think so. I think that their influence has
probably grown. But if you think about someone like Aaron
Smith and the impact he had on the international game,
not so much with his running game, but his speed
of pass, his length to pass. He changed the way
that the All Blacks played, But then you still had
a guy like Dan Carter outside him. And I think
(16:19):
we've seen in recent times the All Blacks perhaps struggle
with not getting the best from their tens did a
serviceable job, but the All Blacks attack wasn't wasn't firing
under Scott Robertson. And we've seen the impacts of other
tens when they're on form. So I still think the
tens of folk Crum, he's your back line director he's
(16:43):
you know, guiding you around the park. But I think
if you have what we have seen in recent times,
I think is the impact a running nine can have
and the ability for them to free up the ten,
to take pressure off him, to give them extra time
and space by being that threat around the ruck. And
that's what du Pomp and ken roygab bringing spades.
Speaker 3 (17:04):
Yeah, and if you and far between up though, those
those running half backs. I mean there's a lot of
running half backs, but the ones that are absolute quality
a few and far between, and that's why they are
game changes in terms of a rey guard. And to DuPont,
you think to the Crusaders and the success they had
it for a number of seasons with you know, Brent
Hall and Mitchell Drummonds. You know, neither of those two
(17:25):
were will go down as great half backs of the game,
but they were very serviceable in that Crusader system and
allowed Richiem Wonga to do what he did very very well.
You know, there's been other examples as well. You think
of someone like a Finlay Christie who was instrumental in
the Blues a couple of years ago and winning their title.
But again you know he's not going to set the
(17:46):
world on fire as the running half back. So I
think it depends on the half back and also the
way that the teams are looking to play. But for me,
you know those half backs that we've mentioned there, DuPont
and royguards set themselves apart because of the running game.
But I still think ultimately the ten is so so
vital when it comes to especially international rugby day. Is
(18:08):
any more in the mailbag for US Killer this.
Speaker 2 (18:10):
Week, Yeah, just the one that was from Floyd from
Sydney as well. Thanks for emailing in there, Floyd. This
is from Dave Paul. This is talking about Monday's episode
when we were talking about the Captains of the future
All Black Captain. Great episode lads, Jordie captain for him,
Artie is and no they Reny won't for for the
bad optics of the big review And from Koe Bay however,
(18:33):
he is picking Jason Ryan will have a big day
and who can mold this team together the best and
team import team input will be sought. So this might
be Cody Taylor. What are your go thoughts on that?
Speaker 5 (18:46):
Starting with you Lamb, Yeah, I think Cody Taylor is
one of the leading candidates. Him Jordi Ardie and obviously
Scott because he's the incumbent.
Speaker 4 (18:56):
I think.
Speaker 5 (18:59):
My only concern I think I raised this on them
on the Monday podcast around Cody is I would like
to see Samsoni, Takyaho and Usfarmore utilize in terms of
their impact off the bench. So maybe you're looking at
pulling Cody Taylor with half an hour ago and maybe
that minimizes his impact as a captain, where someone like
Jordi pretty much plays eighty minutes every week. So Dave
(19:24):
Rennie has also gone down the co captaincy route previously,
so I wouldn't I wouldn't totally rule that option out
just here either.
Speaker 3 (19:30):
Thanks for the letters, guys. There's a couple more in
the mailbag we might get to next week as well.
But keeping coming Rugby directed a news talk zb dot
codo in is it on that Liam on the co captaincy?
Could you do something like a starter as captain and
a bench captain? You know, I'm thinking perhaps Cody Taylor
is the starting captain, but Patrick Thweep a lot too
is the nominal co captain or vice captain off the
(19:51):
team he comes on leads the bench in the closing stages,
but takes on responsibility for the Captaincy wants tayl Leedsville.
Could you do something like that or is that just
too messy?
Speaker 4 (20:01):
I think yeah, you're probably over Kampmcanne and Web.
Speaker 5 (20:03):
I think I'd probably want someone that's been out there,
excuse me, that has a feel for the game, that's
seen it all. If you're coming off the bench, keep
it simple and try to bring that impact. But I
think it's important to remember it's not just about one
person either. You start the buckstops of them in terms
of whether you're kicking for goal or kicking for line,
and maybe some strategic things. But there is a leadership
(20:26):
group in place as well, and there's nothing wrong with
them having a major input on the field. So I
think that's where some work needs to be done as well,
and I think that's where someone like Tana Umanga could
have some real influence, you think for more black captain
coming into that group, trying to bring them together and
mold that culture and specifically around.
Speaker 4 (20:47):
That leadership group. Interesting to see what impact he can bring.
Speaker 3 (20:51):
Absolutely well, they'll do us for another week of rugbe
directs Liam, thank you for your time. We'll just have
the one episode next week. We're just gonna gorge ourselves
a little too much on those chocolate eggs, so we'll
probably see a bit later in the week rather than
earlier next week, just for the once Lee, have you
enjoy your race.
Speaker 4 (21:08):
To weak Likewise, Elliott gets up there, We'll do.
Speaker 3 (21:11):
That is right me direct powered by Heaven Health Physio
Book today and stay at the game thanks as a
ways to produce a Mark Kelly. We'll see.
Speaker 1 (21:20):
For more from news Talks at b Listen live on
air or online, and keep our shows with you wherever
you go with our podcasts on iHeartRadio
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