From Friendship to Collaboration: Unpacking the New Album with Never Meet Your Heroes

Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Listen to the Sean, Sean Geek, the.
Sean Geeking Crash Site podcast.
Yeah, you got it, folks.
It's me again with a littleaptitude for all you out here in
white bread land.
Let's see, we're on 92 FM.
Feels like a nice, cleanlittle band so far.
No one else is using it.

(00:21):
The price is right.
Don't you find it, Crusty Dave?
This is bigger than friendship.
This is what you call cousin.
And the Buddhist is called,let me see.
Reincarnation.
Mushi, Mushi.

(00:43):
Hey, wait a minute.
Since when is Pismo beachinside a cave, I wonder.
You know, I just think weshould have turned left at Albuquerque
and then maybe a right turn atLa Jola.

(01:08):
Shush.
Hush, please.
Welcome to the show and Geekand Fast Fret Podcast.
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In recent news, I think I gotto shave this thing on my face.

(01:29):
Why?
Getting hit on, like, all the time.
Really?
Oh, yeah.
It doesn't happen to me.
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I don't know.
There's this church lady atwork, and I'm sure one of our guests
knows who I mean.
She kind of held her hand upto my face.
Oh.
And then she didn't touch myface, but she got close to my face

(01:51):
and she said, praise Jesus,and then walked away.
It's like, what the fuck?
This looks so crazy.
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It's awesome.

(02:11):
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(02:53):
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(03:15):
We love what we do.
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Okay, it's done.
I hate that part.
I fucking hate it.
But anyway, it's over.
So we have a returning guestand a new guest, which I'm kind of
excited about.
I don't.
I can't remember how manytimes this guy's been on our show,

(03:36):
but it's been a shit ton of times.
He's.
He's an OG of the show now.
He's.
I consider him a good friendand he's an incredible musician.
I want to welcome BS Raps and Dre.
Always a pleasure, gentlemen.
Always a pleasure.
Good to be here.
Yeah.

(03:57):
So, Dre, are you nervous?
Like, you know, like coming onlike such a tenured show or such
an old folks show?
I think nerves are a sign thatyou care and.
Yeah, I'm a little.
I got a little bit of nerveshere and there.
That's good.
That's good.
So is that your studio?
I noticed you get your.
Your.
Not sonics, but whatever the.

(04:18):
Yeah, call.
Call it.
Call it the.
The echo chamber.
Yeah, you try and soften alittle bit of that, you know, and
we.
We do the recordings here sometimes.
Yeah.
You know, home studio.
He's got some high ceilings in here.
You can't see it, but, my God,these sound just bounces off these
walls.
You don't have any on the ceiling?
Huh?

(04:39):
You don't have them on the ceiling?
No, not that I could.
We can't reach that high, man.
Gotta get a ladder.
Todd could reach that high.
So if you need to put anythingup there, toddle, just reach and
put them up there for you.
Yeah,.
I've got some.
I've got some overhead fromme, actually, but my.

(05:00):
My ceiling isn't.
Isn't that tall.
It's a good problem to have.
It's better than, you know,having to bend over or slouch in
the basement.
I did that for a number of years.
I think I have a creek in my back.
I'm trying to stand upward nowand practice more better posture.
So I, you know, don't getcarpal tunnel in my spine when I'm
older.
I know you guys haven't metDre, but he's a tall.

(05:21):
Tall, some.
Oh, yeah.
Awesome.
Yeah, that's for sure.
My house was built in the 50s,so I. I hear you.
Every time I go downstairs, Ihave to make sure I duck my head.
Otherwise I.
Straight.
Clothesline yourself.
Yeah, yeah.
It's not.
It's not.

(05:42):
It's not funny.
But no.
So.
So like the last.
Since the last time Brian'sbeen on a show, or should I say bs
I don't know what's.
What's the right thing to callyou Brian.
BS BS Yeti, Van Halen, EddieVan Halen.
I like.
I like that one a lot.
For example, the rapper.

(06:03):
Dre, how many names do you have?
Or does Brian, like, have thewhole, like, roll call of names?
Like, are you keeping up with him?
Or.
You know, I just try and stayin my own lane.
I stick to a cadre, AKA Dre,my first name.
Sometimes people call me theKid, but I'm.
I'm.
I'm grown now, so it's not somuch of that.

(06:26):
A cadre is fine.
Dre is fine.
I go by Dre.
It's all good.
Not the doctor, you know, but, you.
Know, he's much more sure ofhimself, man.
I like Cadre, though.
That's good.
That's.
That's a great name.
Thank you.
Yeah, that came to me afteralmost 10 years, and this guy kept
asking me, what's your handle, dude?
What's your handle, bro?
You gotta pick a name.
Pick a name.

(06:46):
And then, yeah, in my artistLamenta was sitting up like.
Like Sherlock Holmes trying torace through the tunnel hole here
with the rabbit, and justended up coming up with something.
After I started, like,writing, sometimes you go on, like,
a tangent.
For me, it's like a stream ofconsciousness, and you have, like,
different ideas that you pullfrom and then come to you and you
put them down on paper, and,like, that's where the magic happens.

(07:08):
Nice.
Nice.
So how did you guys actually meet?
Because, like, this kind ofcame out of left field, and I'm like,
like, wait, Brian's rappingwith this other guy now?
Like, what's going on here?
So I was kind of curious howthat kind of kind of got set up,
because I love these storiesabout the Winnipeg music scene and.
And just how shit just kind of happens.

(07:28):
Yeah, it's something that.
I don't know if you want tospeak on that.
There was an era there wherewe were.
We were playing Goldeneye onN64, you know.
Yeah.
Yeah, right.
Sam showing you guys.

(08:14):
We're in Huggies together, Right.
Since we were babies,obviously, life.
People kind of go on theirpaths in life or whatever, and Dre
actually spent most of hisyoung, young life in Texas.
Yeah, he moved away when I wasabout 13, I want to say.

(08:36):
And then every once in awhile, he'd come back to the city,
and I'd be like, yo, Dre, comelook at.
Look at this production stuffI've been working on.
And I remember how bad I wasback then.
We actually recorded a songCalled Walls of Jericho.
It was one of the first songsI ever.
I ever made, and it was kindof like a little Chris Jericho kind
of vibe thing going on.

(08:56):
Well, what you're forgetting,Ricochet, is I don't have to find
somebody that likes me to teamup with.
I just have to find somebodythat doesn't like you.
Bald Brick.
That was on a coat hanger, bythe way.
Yeah.
Yeah, Our bike stand was acoat hanger.
And that's awesome.
And looking back, it waspretty bad, but, I mean, you know,

(09:17):
you got to start somewhere.
You guys have known each otherforever, then.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Seriously.
Yeah.
And N64,007.
I remember playing that withSean, actually.
Yeah.
Anyone who used Odd Job was a dick.
Come on, man.
That's my go to.

(09:39):
That's why I hate.
Oh, this guy used to bemoonwalking in the pyramids and,
like, just doing slaps, and Icould never chase slaps over time.
It was the timing of all the.
Of all the things.
I'd always be off the timing,but that's.
That's something that I had tocome correct with, too.
When I started writing, I wentto, like, Studio 393 at Portage Place.

(10:00):
Place I check in with.
I also know.
Know Alani over a number of years.
When I came back, when I movedback to Winnipeg, just wanted to
kind of, like, touch down andreally see what was going on, like,
on the ground.
It was just, like, reallyplaying catch up, and I'm glad I
did.
When I did, I'm glad I came back.

(10:21):
My mom, she always made surethat we touched down and, like, made
sure we stayed in contact withfriends and family and relatives.
That's good.
Yeah, it's good.
It's really good.
Most of.
Most of the people, even atthis point now kind of, like, passed
away.
So it was.
It was really a blessing to.
To have all of that in termsof experience.
And then also now you guys,like, 10 years.

(10:43):
Yeah, it's been about 10 yearsfor me also.
And.
And now it's like a new era, and.
Yeah.
Rising from the ashes on thatfire horse, you know?
Yeah.
You know what I'm saying?
So I didn't even know thisdude was back in the city.
I was in a really bad rockband, and I.
Okay, wait, wait.
So wait.
Let's.
Let's touch on that for a sec.

(11:04):
And not too much, because wedon't want to.
We don't want to say too much, but.
Dre, were you aware of thisband that Brian was in?
Oh, yeah.
I'LL check them out at a showtaphouse once.
And one thing, one thing Inoticed was, well, whenever, whenever
Brian was rapping, it was, itwas difficult to hear.

(11:26):
So I would, I told him I waslike, yo, they need to kind of like
boost your mic because they'renot, they're not really playing to
their strengths.
And Brian was a strength andmade it different.
Made it different than, thanwhat you would normally expect from
a band even on a headlinerthat would, that would play.
It was a different sound in a way.
And after that I think we, wekind of collaborated more and encouraged

(11:50):
me to like make a move also tosay, hey, you know, be the change
you kind of want to see.
If no one else is going tostep up to the plate, then why not
me?
So, okay, so I.
So Todd, you remember.
Well, we're not going tomention the band, but the, the old
man Brian was in.
That's how I met Brian.
But then I also worked withBrian, which is like really odd because

(12:15):
I'm like, wait a minute, who's.
Wait, who's this guy?
So we had Brian on with, withthat old band and the, the one thing
I like, the one thing I notedis, I mean there's a lot of bands
in Winnipeg, like, of.
Of that ilk, like rock bands,classic rock or whatever you want
to call it.
There is a kind of a genericsound to it.

(12:35):
They're kind of sameness to it.
And what I really like, thereason I jived with this band and
I really wanted the band onour show was because what Brian brought
to is like, okay, you guys arenot doing what everyone else is doing.
This is unique.
And I felt, I mean, Brian wasyoung at that stuff at the time,
but I could still hear shit.

(12:56):
Like I could hear the shit in it.
Like the good stuff in it thatwas coming out that he was dropping
down.
I was like, fuck.
Like, this is not likeeveryone else.
Like, this is.
There's a, there's a hook here.
There's something original andI wanted more of that.
And then it was done.
And I'm like, wait, what areyou doing?
I was kind of.
I don't know.
I think Brian, I talked aboutthis a bit, but I was kind of a little

(13:19):
bit pissed off about it.
It's like you guys actuallyhad an edge, something unique, something
different than everyone elseout there and you drop it like a
hot potato and just sound likeeveryone else, like, hey, all the
success to them and stuff andyou know, good on them and you know,
they keep playing Shows and,you know, doing music and stuff and,

(13:39):
you know, good on them, but,man, there was something different
with them before.
So, you know, Dre, you hookedon to this.
This here, and, you know,like, hang on.
Because this guy's creative as.
And what I'm hearing out ofyou, too, man.
Good stuff.
This is exciting.
Like, this is actuallyexciting now, you know, That's.

(14:02):
Yeah, that's much love right there.
It's very exciting for us, too.
We were just talking aboutthis before y' all came on, that
we.
We were talking about, like,pipe dreams and those pipe dreams
now becoming more reality.
And why.
Why not?
Like, what else?

(14:22):
You know, why.
Why put labels or putsomething in a box?
That's impossible.
Yeah.
I honestly real.
I used to hate when peopletalked about manifesting and all
that.
There you are.
He's been saying about you, man.
Holy crap.

(14:43):
I'm sold on it now.
We actually did a show withthose guys.
Yes, yes, I heard.
I heard about it, and I wasgonna ask about it.
I don't know if we should talkabout it on air or not.
It's up to you.
But I'm like, oh, that'sinteresting, because one of the other
bands there kind of.
Kind of knows what was goingon there, too, and.
And he's like, oh, did youknow, Sean?

(15:05):
Did you know that this is happening?
I'm like, oh, shit.
But you know what?
Like, water under the bridgeis the way it should be, you know?
Like, they're doing good ontheir own, you know?
But you guys are doing good, too.
But, like, I don't know.
I'm listening to you guys that.
I don't have no idea whatthey're up to.
I kind of just lost interest.
You know what?

(15:25):
I just look back and laugh at it.
And, yeah, the stuff I'm doingnow is what I should have been doing
the whole freaking time.
Yeah, but, you know, youneeded to take that step, right?
Yeah.
You know what they made.
They made me better.
They did.
I'll straight up admit it.
They made me a better writer, sure.
Maybe a better rapper.

(15:46):
They introduced me to the.
To live performance and.
But I. I've taken it to thenext level now, and we ain't looking
back.
Like, I'll say the same thing.
Like, I'm.
I'm a mediocre performer andmusician and whatever.
So that's why I hook up withTodd, because he makes me shine.
He makes me sound great.
It's awesome,.

(16:08):
Right, Todd?
Iron sharpens iron.
Yeah.
Yeah.
If you're not pushed, ifyou're not pushed or you don't have
somebody in your corner, youknow, you don't need a yes man.
You need somebody who's goingto be real with you and have like,
you know, sharpened to tools,you know, stay on top of it.
We actually started doing kindof just meetups once a week and going

(16:30):
over like different sounds.
We committed to that probably,well last year, about this time last
year, right?
Yeah.
And once we started doingthat, there was a lot of things that
came out of it.
Actually.
One of our songs there,mexico, yeah, was like a banger that
just all of a sudden came outof, you know, almost like the essence.
And that one was definitelyone of my favorites.

(16:52):
And there's a memoryassociated with that, that when we
perform it, you kind of havethat nostalgia but also euphoric
feeling at the same time tosay, wow, this came out of something
that was an idea that was froma beat that we were listening to.
And all of a sudden it turnsinto, you know, one of the greatest
openers that we do fordifferent shows and performances

(17:13):
at these venues.
Yeah, yo, I'll go first.
Let me go, go.
Let me take it.
Let me take these.
Look at these.
Take it all.
I got it, got it.
Crossing over like a weekendand feeling over the feeling era
Any hands up get nothing butcold shoulders that snake shit is

(17:35):
over tolerated but cook a passit all changed that's an understatement
through chills and sweats Imade it out unindoctrinated years
in the making no debating fuckthe system we baby we Ways for the
next generation King Colin gotshit on this not faded but well predicted

(17:58):
the ill times a test for whatI manifested I atone for my lack
of patience you were told tryto stop greatness it's yeti step
to the mic like a sharpmachete I hope they ready, hope they
ain't ready kid checkspectacular words, spectacular herbs
count Jetty smack in a herbmake sure the faction is heard being

(18:21):
trained this time you bastardshould learn we hit hard haggling
hers it's like we throwingbombs at these kids Be throwing jazz
hands hanging on the wheelCause yo, you never had that backstage
catch them all smoking withthe jazz bad boy I'm talking about
that good, not bad, bad oh,and not a moment too soon Woman watch

(18:42):
franchise on you like sh womanwhat will we have?
Like the sun in Cancun lateJune Whatever you do, just stay tuned
and let me show you how to dothis real skill off the m trey in
the true I said I do as I likeyou rappers buster Douglas, how you
ruined the fight A bunch ofbusters with no substance come through
just like nothing.

(19:03):
Yo, Trey, I gotta go back in.
Go ahead.
All right, all right.
A wise man once told me nevermeet your heroes so I watch it burn
like Nero mad the Nero eat arapper like a gyro out in London
dropping heroes times pluralyour mind01 my mind feral when they

(19:23):
shot bullets, we shot arrowsyet we still here and fly apparel
and still staring down theperil it's like a family heirloom
come knock on the door, I dare you.
I give you fuckers moreattention than I bear to Getty I
hear you stop up to everyvenue r death route these grass panic
as we making new moves Actinglike they ain't printing money every

(19:45):
day fool who am I up at nightas I let the pin lose fire keeper
hair splitter as I drop thisscripture exposing whack MCs like
these sitters biting fromflows heard from other lies we just
go from soul elders with thecleaver on you japetos master and
puffy will cut your nosePinocchio, we really will.

(20:06):
You just got to play dope wantto turn to fold we dropping bows
off the top rows people'selbow come correct mumble rap flows
you a hobbyist we the repocome to collect far from the rest
Davey Jones say it with your chest.

(20:27):
So that was.
That was an older song becauseI heard an early version of it quite
a while ago.
So, yeah, when I.
When I got the tracks, I'mlike, oh, there's a song again.
And I mean, it stood out right away.
Like, you know, it's, it's.
It's good too, because like,like, you know, I'll apologize now,
like, I'm not a big rap guy oranything, but there's something in

(20:48):
the way that you guys arerapping and the way, like the, like
the production of it isreally, really good.
And I'm a sound like, I Likewhen I'm listening to music, I'm
not just listening to the words.
I'm listening to everything.
And I like to absorbeverything and feel where things
are going.
And I just got.
I got sucked in.
I probably almost had a caraccident listening to in the car

(21:10):
because I thought I was inMexico driving down.
It was good stuff, but itactually, it told a story, but it
actually transformed portedyou, which I.
Which.
Which is good, man.
Like, that's.
That's what I want my music.
I don't want something fluffLike, I mean, there's a story there.
So can you guys maybe, like,talk about how that came together?

(21:32):
Like, that particular track,since that was the first one?
Oh, man.
I. I had that sample saved onmy computer for, like, two years.
And then me and Dre, like,literally, like, the first time we
met up in my backyard, he'slike, we need a beat.
I'm like, okay, let's go downstairs.

(21:53):
I got something in mind.
And I freaking pull the sampleup, and I start chopping it up right
there on the spot and that.
So he's watching you actuallydo the actual, like, production part?
Yeah, he watched me lay down.
I put, like, organ on there.
I freaking.
The way I loop the sample, I'mlike, oh.
I'm, like, listening to it.
I'm like, oh, I know exactlywhat I'm gonna do here.

(22:16):
Very, very much.
I like to be also involved in,like, the creative process because
there's certain things thatjust as, like, you know, two heads
are better than one.
Sure.
That can add different flavorsand things.
Like, I also pull from a lotof what I experience in the culture
down south in Texas, Louisiana.
And there's also, like, morestories that I uncover for myself,

(22:39):
even, like, for my family.
And also having the referenceof, like, the movie Death Proof and,
like, Tarantino's.
That's a storyteller.
Right.
Having that also was justsomething that ideas will spawn out
of, out of, out of air, andthen we'll bounce off one another
about what we think aboutthis, and then we kind of, like,
just start writing from there,and then we start ironing out.

(23:03):
Maybe we'll do, like, a couplemeetups, and then we'll go to, like,
an open mic.
We'll test it out.
Because one thing Brian toldme was that it's different.
It's a difference between therecording process and the actual
live performance and thebreath work that also goes into it.
The pronouncing, exercising,you know, the vocal, being able to
use this as Also as aninstrument is something that I've

(23:25):
really fallen in love with.
And, you know, I have.
I have a lot of.
I have a lot of passion behindthe creative process.
Luckily, too, like, Brian hasbeen doing this and.
And put me onto it, and inthat way also, I can just kind of
focus on for myself right now,tightening up the writing, exploring

(23:45):
different.
Different patterns orcategories with the voice.
Shout out to Tyler Duke, bythe way.
He's our guitarist.
Adds a lot of flavor.
He is amazing as a lot of the beat.
You know, it really broughtout the sound and the impact from
when we.
When we went back.
Like, when you went back andrecorded the guitar for Mexico and

(24:08):
even added layers to Bobby.
It's incredible.
It was incredible.
Tyler gave me.
Gave me a audio interface anda microphone, so I was able to, like,
do some recordings on my own.
So there's a lot of thingsthat we haven't even tipped the iceberg
with in terms of where we'regoing with the sound and direction.
We're very versatile in thatway, too.

(24:28):
Yeah.
This is just the start.
And you know what?
Dre is an amazing writer.
Like, I. I'm an experiencedrapper, but Dre is a very good writer.
He does a, like, open.
Oh, yeah.
Like, he does the poetry.
Yeah.
Seriously.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Oh, that shit's hard to pulloff, man.

(24:50):
Very hard.
Yeah.
And I've seen him perform afew times, and.
And.
And I've always.
And ever since I've known Dre,he's always had a journal.
He's always been writing.
Dude, I've never had a planner.
Remember in school, they triedto make you use, like, planners and.
No, I don't do that.
I've never had a journal in my life.

(25:10):
Like, this dude actually writes.
I don't write.
I just talk.
So when.
Say, when Sean and I were inthe band, and we.
And we do creative stuff.
Okay.
So everybody had their own instruments.
Everybody put in their own input.
Now, because you guys both rapnow, I'm not too sure if.

(25:31):
If Dre, If.
If you also do the music or ifit's just, you know, one person's
doing the music and anotherperson is collabing with.
Like you said, you do the.
The poetry thing, so it's justkind of on the spot, and you just
come up with stuff.
How do you guys collaborateword wise?
Like, do you.
Do you share some aspects ofit or integrate your own lyrics or

(25:58):
how does that work?
Or is it just strictly oneperson does the lyrics?
No, we.
We collaborate.
We.
We say that.
Okay, we want a 16 or 32.
Or we figure out the structure.
Yeah.
Okay, I'm gonna go here.
You're gonna go here.
Okay.
And then we bounce the idealsoff one another.
Like, I'll send them something.

(26:19):
Yeah, Maybe a voice note or acouple bars on something and say,
like, well, what do you thinkabout this?
And then eventually, when we.
When we collaborate, the.
The day of the week, we.
We go down different.
We bounce.
We just basically bounce theideas off one another.
And, you know, in a way, italso encourages us to.
To write more because I knowhe says he doesn't write, but when

(26:41):
he does have.
Does have, like, he certainlywrites himself.
Sure.
But more so, I guess, with thefocus with him is the production
and the process on that end.
So it's not to say that.
That that's any better or worse.
It's just to say that rightnow, for me, I'm practicing, and

(27:02):
I'm trying to find that consistency.
Sometimes when I've had tomove around so much the past 10 years
again, is I haven't had the stability.
So one thing I have had was the.
Was the writing or the journalor put something down on my phone.
So I've been able to beconsistent with that.
But everything is.
Is open, really in the air.

(27:23):
I definitely want to get intomore of the production of own beats
and certain samples to cut andjust throw them his way and see what
comes out of that also, you know?
So, yeah, there's acollaborative process with that that.
That's going to just increaseas we also, respectively, get better
at the craft.
One of my favorite thingsabout this project is the contrast
between me and Dre.

(27:45):
Very different flows.
Yeah, sure.
Voices.
Very different.
We're talking about the samestuff, but we're talking about it
in completely different ways.
But it's a cohesive storyyou're telling, too.
And that within the same song,which I'm fascinated with that process
because every band I've beenin, I'm the guy writing the words,
I'm the guy singing, and,like, I'm controlling the narrative

(28:08):
that's being told.
So I'm like.
I'm fascinated by the two ofyou telling a story within the.
The span of one song, being onthe same page, but still having,
like, different sides to thesame story you're telling within
the song.
Like, just fascinated by that.
Like, like, hashing.
Hashing back forth.
Like, is there time where Dre.

(28:29):
Or you're gonna say, brian,like, this.
This don't work, man.
Like, I'm telling a storyhere, and this is butting in to this.
Or is there, like, an osmosisbetween the two of you?
Or like a psychic rapportwhere, like, you kind.
You know where the story'sgoing, you know?
Well, the fortunate thing wehave is that we've been friends for,
like, 30 goddamn years.

(28:49):
So we like to like the same stuff.
We grew up on the same stuff we.
We.
That's why we've always stayedin touch, too, you know?
Yeah, it's solid.
Like, this has been really solid.
Brian's been my oldest friend.
I Mean, there's friends thatyou make that I still keep in contact
with every now and again.
More particular from the onesthat I met out when I was in bc.

(29:12):
But there's no one that I'vereally talked to and revisited more
than.
Than Brian.
So there is an osmosis to the.
To the style.
For instance, like withMexico, the.
The idea started with, okay,we're pulling where.
Where I would do some.
Some research on my own if Ididn't know this song, where the
sample was from.
Is it inspired by something?

(29:33):
Where.
Where were they coming from?
Is this a movie or a film?
How was it used in the movieor the film?
And then you start toformulate different ideas based on
the.
For me, the original lyricsthat are written and then I'll do
a motif, if you will, to saythis is the idea that my lyrics are
going to be centered aroundwhat do you think about this?
And.
And it's kind of like it'sback and forth with that too.

(29:55):
It could be.
It's the same on the flip sidewith Bobby.
You know, Brian came up withthe hook.
I couldn't figure out what toput on that sample.
The hook, but he.
He heard it.
He.
He knew what was there.
Hey, Bobby was the most touchand go song on the ep.
Like, it was like, this beatwas good.
And I was like, okay, we'regonna do this, this and that.

(30:17):
And like, even when I like putrecorded like a rough example, it
just didn't sound right.
And I'm like, no, no, no, I don't.
You don't understand.
Once this is done and we do itthis way, it's gonna be am.

(31:00):
Leg drop off top rope Eversince I got dope you can't deny that
I've been the flies theserappers is all plot roast thinking
that they got jokes oh pullyour card like tonsils I'm hip hop
Snoop Losto, you would thinkthat he's not though I'm Costco my
sample slap are you afraid youcan sample that hidden meaning Sweet
do his rap so there's no BSThe BS is back Yeti Van Halen I ain't

(31:23):
in it for no proceeds Mywitch's brew needs crow's feet My
interests include most snakesbut that's born right Learn from
a friend of a friend that youcan hear the low at night no soul
in sight just a voice from thedark it's kind of like a walk in
the park it's kind of like avision in the sweat lodge the type
that you can't forget lord andif you're thinking how we natural
to breath I advise that youwatch where you step never meet your

(31:43):
heroes they will alwaysdisappoint that's why Yeti got the
flint and Dre, he got thejoint it's the power duel making
power moves and to devour youand we be getting ours like every
single hour Do I rock withever meet your heroes you rock the
hoofies don't come throughhere rockin blue shades you ain't

(32:07):
who knock you too thin neverstyle a bit and I can see that your
style is pit but I'mma showyou how to ride with it I'm regulating
like I'm Bobby shit pushingmountains just in case they doubt

(32:27):
it the hurdles count it paidin time when primes are founded word
is born call me crazy no justgive me more it's big cheap you're
killing me, Smalls.
The best to tequila on mybreath but beneath there's death
where you look from naked dogstyle hit like men lying so strong

(32:48):
baby Jesus wet and from thebrown I wipe the sweat protect the
neck this cook got me thinkingabout all this bread Imma get transcribing
the neck of my lessons anddebts the big payback coming the
next from my hometown you winthe pagets I I pay respects product

(33:09):
of my environment breakingtables, frustration I need a therapist
Texas ray sipping syrup likeI'm Bobby Shane they ain't dropping
ain't no stopping the freighttrain is missing link I rock with
never meet your heroes yourock with who cares don't come through
here rocking roosters matchyou at full fair knocking too dead

(33:37):
and I'm a style a bit I cansee that your style is big but I'
ma show you how to rock withit regulating like a bravi.

(34:04):
Because that one is like, it'sdifferent than the other tracks.
Like, it's.
I don't.
I, I was, I was trying to,like, kind of get my thoughts together.
Listening to, like, well, theintro is kind of like giving the
statement, right?
Like the intro song, justgiving the statement as to what you
guys are talking about.
I do want to go back to thatin a sec because, like, the statement

(34:24):
is actually very importantbecause I was listening to it today
and I'm going like, I, I, Ifeel you.
I'm actually, I know what youguys are talking about.
Like, the, the.
What do you get the.
There's the line in there about.
The.
Shadow, and there's almostlike an illusion to like, hey, we're
in Canada.
We're waiting for the.

(34:45):
For the.
Not the hedgehog.
What is it?
The beaver comes out orwhatever the hell.
Yeah, the groundhog.
Sorry, the groundhog comesout, sees a shadow.
Because it was kind of tight.
It was very Canadian, ifyou're Canadian, you know.
But that whole thing of seeinghis shadow, like, fuck it.
I was like, fuck, yeah.

(35:07):
I don't know, I just.
I'm like, okay, so.
So this is what.
This is about, this.
So it's funny because who thefuck is that in the beginning anyway,
with this French guy.
But.
But yo, he said that was gonna happen.
Hey, you know what?
This guy was just calling me.
Nevermind.
Sully.
So it's called a Sully.
The intro, right?

(35:27):
Was a.
Was a friend that.
So he's a real guy.
He's a real guy.
Okay.
Yeah.
Oh, yes.
Yeah.
It's not AI Dre.
Bet Sully.
Like, what?
Well, no, I thought someonewas doing an accent or something
maybe, or.
But then I'm like, we're halfFrench, right?
So I'm like, no, no, no, Thoseare the right words.
You know, they're not.
They're not around.
This is the right words.
I'm like.
But I'm like, you know, as astatement at the beginning of an

(35:50):
ep, like that.
I'm like.
And then.
But then there's only foursongs on here.
I'm like, no, no, I think youguys can go a bit further with the,
like, the.
The concept.
Like as this is a conceptalbum makes sense to me.
And I don't know if that wasthe plan, but it sounds like a concept
album.
And you lay it out in the.
First track, it's almost likea concept group.
Like we.
The whole ethos of never meetyour heroes is tearing down people

(36:13):
on pedestals, man.
Yeah, yeah.
And then for.
And then on the flip side, yousay, like, Brian, you mentioned that
coming at it from a different.
Yeah, so, yeah, Brian is liketearing the person off a pedestal.
I'm the one that's kind ofpointing them out to say where they
are.
And even the ones like.
For the lyrics, all my heroesis dead.

(36:36):
I never met him.
You know, Instead they've beenassassinated by the feds.
So it's saying, like, all myheroes have been killed.
The ones that.
That were striving or fordoing that had any kind of genuine
good.
I was having a talk tosomebody at the King's Head about
this.
They were saying something onthe lines, like, you know, what.
What is a what.
What ends up happening to aperson that just Ends up doing so

(36:59):
much good or it's so good forthe mass majority of people.
I example, you know, FredHampton in the States, 21 years old,
assassinated by the CIA or the.
The FBI.
Rather part of the coyoteintel pro.
All this and that, you know, it's.
There was this.
All this background andunderground things that happen to

(37:21):
genuine people.
And anytime this happens, whenthat person that you think is on
that pedestal is who youshould be striving for, well, never
meet your heroes because onceyou meet them, you'll surely disappoint.
That's also goes back to whatone of the lyrics that Brian says.
So he's pointing them out likehe's tearing them down.
I'm pointing them out.
It's funny because a lot ofpeople are like, oh, the ones above

(37:43):
all.
You're the ones above all.
I'm like, no, no.
Yeah, that's.
We're talking about the peopleon the pedestals.
That's so.
Okay.
The reason it's connected withme is because on our Dome album,
we had a song called Paradigm,which was about.
I'll try to be brief, but it'sa song about our dad and how people

(38:04):
put my dad on a pedestal.
And people were telling us,okay, we've put him on this pedestal.
And this is what my people aretelling me.
Well, the writer on the songis telling me what my dad means and
what he represents, which wasa false.
In my mind, it's that.
No, that's not what he was about.

(38:25):
That's not what he was.
He's my dad.
You know, my brother and Iknow our dad better than anyone else,
but someone's telling us ourdad's hopes and dreams and was trying
to get us to line up withtheir hopes and dreams as related
to my dad, who he put on afucking pedestal.
So when I'm hearing this, I'm like.
Like, I don't know.
It was just go listen to Paradigm.

(38:46):
Like, maybe.
Maybe you can pick somethingout of.
We could.
Never mind.
And we r pushing outward pastthe green dead.

(39:13):
Hello?
Never got past that.
It was the same thing.
And I was like sensing that.

(39:33):
It's like we put these peopleon fucking pedestals all the time,
and then we just.
We can't wait to pull them off.
And it's.
I don't know, man.
I just really connected, like,right away.
I was like, okay, I'm gonnalike this.
I'm gonna like this, right?
For sure.
You know?
Bonjour me.

(39:54):
Hey, listen.
In every city there are peoplewaiting to be safe Waiting for a
hero.
Waiting for somebody to riseabove the noise, above the struggle,
about the cold winters andempty promises.
But the truth is, the moment aman becomes successful, society by

(40:20):
him a pedestal.
They raise him high above thecrowd, so high that the people can
no longer see his flaws.
And when the flaws appear, meh.
Then look away, Monfre.
Because people don't want truth.
They want symbols.
They want idols.
They want heroes they neverhave to meet but understand something.

(40:42):
Heroes are just people withoutthe microphones.
And this city, this calledsefroy suburban city called Winnipeg,
has watched too many artistsrun from its shadow.
The moment the spotlightflickers, they park their bags.
Toronto, Vancouver, bro.
Anywhere but here, likesisters can only exist somewhere

(41:05):
else.
Like redness can grow infrozen sun.
But there are three men wholooked at this city and said something
different.
They did not ask for permission.
They did not wait for validation.
They did not wait for somebodyfrom a bigger market to tell them
they were important.
No.

(41:26):
No, bro.
BS Raps Alcadrae and Tyler.
The Duke.
The Duke, my brother, wereawesome to together.
They call themselves nevermeet you heroes.
Because the moment you meetthe people you've been worshipping,
you realize they bleed thesame as you.

(41:49):
Mad.
And these men, they're alreadytalking reckless, talking bold, talking
like kings.
On their very first chapter, a debut.
EPI le debut.
An episode, a declaration, a warning.
Because when you step into thearena speaking like giants, you better
be ready to stand among them.

(42:09):
This is not humility.
This is ambition.
This is the three voices fromthe middle of the continent telling
the we're not leaving thiscity to find greatness.
We're bringing greatness tothis city.
But remember, rapato en culede mer.
When people put you abovethem, they expect you to fall.

(42:32):
So the question is whethernever meet your heroes can talk like
champions.
The question is, can theybecome the ones above all.
Yeah, Monfrey.

(43:00):
It almost seems like whenyou're doing the music, like when
Sean and I talk is like, well,what's your podcasting?
Well, it's.
It's like, say we're justhanging out on the couch at home,
you know, having a couple ofdrinks, jig jib jabbing type thing.
And it's almost like your.
Your music is.
Because you guys are.
It's not the same thing, butyou guys are collaborating together

(43:22):
through life experiences andtalking about it, but you're doing
it in a rap function insteadof like, do we do it in a podcast?
Yeah, absolutely.
Yeah.
Yeah, I.
You know what, man?
I really can't Stand.
Celebrity worship.
Like, don't get me wrong, Ilike that.
I like.
I love music.
I love music artists.

(43:43):
But there's like a.
There's a certain level of success.
It doesn't even have to bemusic where people get.
Get to this level of successand like, everything's forgiven.
They could be the biggestpiece of.
On earth and yeah, yeah, noone cares.
But that guy's like a great ass.
Yeah, I know he did that, butI mean, he's amazing or whatever.

(44:05):
It's like that happens way toomuch in this today's world.
And you know what?
We're sick of it.
Yeah.
So we've made this group so wecan talk about it.
As far as channeling thatenergy and recycling some.
Some of that trauma and paininto something that's going to be
able to, you know, beexpressive, creative.

(44:27):
It's an outlet, it's therapy.
It's something I think that alot of people can connect with and
hopefully wake up to, if not already.
You know, there's certainlycertain other experiences that I've
had.
I know, respected to Brian,like just where I've been that our
thing.
Those experiences at the endof the day have a common denominator

(44:47):
and they align no matter what.
If you're here, if you're there.
So it's just being able tolike, point them out or keep those
things in check because youalways got to have the home base
solid.
Jimi Hendrix said, what is that?
Castles made of sand alwaysreturn to the sea eventually.

(45:08):
And so castles made of sandfall in the sea eventually.
Wow, that's a good poll there.
That's a great poll.
Yeah, but that's true.
That's really what that is.
See, he's my poet.
Don't you know it?
No.

(45:29):
You know, it's cool because Ilike, I know Brian well enough by
now and I kind of like, I'mfamiliar with his rhymes and stuff.
And I'm like, like at first,like, what's this Drake guy gonna
be?
Like, is it gonna be.
I wasn't sure how this wasgonna go, but like, I.
And I don't know if it's justbecause you're really good at what
you're doing.
And I don't even know if yourealize this, but.

(45:51):
But subconscious.
But the way.
The way the.
The words you're picking orhow you're painting the picture right
away I'm like, oh, fuck, I'veknown this guy for 20 years.
Right?
Like, it's weird.
Like, how.
How are you connecting on.
On one of your Songs to a songI wrote.
And I'm like, fuck.
It's like we were.
It's like you and I werehaving a drink one night.

(46:13):
We were having a whiskey in mybasement, and you're like, hey, Sean.
Yo.
You know, here's the song I'mworking on, and I'm like, oh, dude.
Here's the song I'm working on.
And we're actually tradingideas because it feels like even
though the song sound nothingalike, but the.
The.
The thematic.
Like, how the.
Like, how the.
Are you doing that?
Like, how do I.
How do I know you, but I don'tknow you?

(46:35):
Like, it's so.
It's.
It's talented, man.
It's good.
When we started this project,like, some advice I gave Dre was.
And I think I. I can give this.
You can give this advice toany music artist.
You got to be vulnerable.
You have.
It's not easy.
No.
People can't connect with you.

(46:56):
Yeah.
Unless you do it.
It took me a while to turn that.
That diary of mine intosomething that I put on a.
On a stage.
That's what you're doing as aperformer, as an artist.
You're basically showing your.
Your diary.
You know, your rhymes wouldhave to the audience.
And it took.
It took.
It took a good 10 years toreally get comfortable in my own

(47:18):
skin in that way, becausethere was.
Was.
There was like an extra stage,if you will, of evolution to get
to that.
To that point in time.
And sometimes you just got togo through things.
Right.
There was certainly something.
We always, always say, oh, Iwish I would have started, you know,
some odd years ago.
But there's always a path.
You got to trust your path.
You gotta trust the process,and everything will come to fruition

(47:40):
when it's ripe enough.
Now, it's.
It's.
It's taking.
Going like RP genre, G's,going to karaoke, understanding that
there was something there withbehind the voice that made people
dance or groove or sing or,you know, feel.
Feel it.
There was going to theHandsome daughter when they had the.
They have the slam poetry nights.

(48:00):
Yeah.
That they'll do sometimesevery month or every other month
or every other week.
Doing that.
Putting.
Putting myself out there,having the nerves, riding the lightning
with that.
And a lot of it goes back tojust having that experience or that
feeling with sports.
When sports ended for me in2017, I didn't think I would be able
to ever find that kind of typeof thrill again.

(48:24):
But it's better on stage, man,I tell you.
Yeah.
It's way better on stage with boxing.
When I stopped boxing, that'swhen I really got into music.
Yeah, yeah.
Need my creative outlet, man.
It's therapeutic, really, to have.
To have a craft that you canmaster and get.
Get better at and have peoplefeel that also in different levels,

(48:46):
in different ways.
There's no better feeling thanthat, really.
So how did.
How did you feel?
Like, the very first time youwent out and wrapped, like, was there.
I'm sure you.
I'm sure you were nervous.
How did you get over that?
Was it just a matter of justsaying, you know what?
I'm just gonna do it, andthat's it?
Was there kind of a prolonged,.

(49:10):
I.
Guess how you say it, just tokind of work yourself up to it, or
did you just.
Just go out and says, you know what?
I'm just gonna do it, andthat's it for sure.
You did the Cube?
The Cube?
Was it Cube, the first one?
Yeah, yeah, the Cube was thefirst one.
I think around the last year, right?
Yeah, I was.
I. I got to do a show atFringe Fest and at the Cube there.

(49:33):
And we weren't.
The group wasn't official yet.
We just finished kind of noteven recording Mexico, just kind
of like putting it together.
And, yeah, I brought Trey outto make his big, grand debut.
He knocked it out of the park,but I did make him rehearse his.

(49:53):
It's easier.
Exactly what you're.
What you're doing.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
We did rehearsal, we did the.
We practiced, we prepped.
I. I started getting morecomfortable on the microphone.
I've been kind of a publicspeaker before, so it wasn't.
It was a little bit different,obviously, being sometimes even in
the smaller, intimate crowd.

(50:15):
But these things were tested,and eventually you work through those
nerves.
You.
You find a kind of a groovewithin yourself, and, I don't know,
you just don't take yourselftoo seriously, you know, I think.
I think for me, like, it's been.
It's kind of been like thealchemist, like, waiting like the
elephant in the room in front of.
In front of me this whole time.
But I thought it was like.
I thought of it, for me, waslike, cringe.

(50:36):
It was cringe to me, but I gotsome message from the essence that
it was like, time to do.
Do that, which most you thinkis cringe.
And so from that pointforward, it was like, now the gift
keeps giving.
So I know exactly what he means.
Oh, yeah, same rap.
Rap is a weird genre, man.
Like, people will like, oh,you're a Rapper.

(50:59):
Oh.
I'm like, yeah, freaking great.
Oh, yeah.
I. I don't like that attitude,like, when people like, yeah.
Oh, you're.
Whatever.
No, no, it's.
It's valid, man.
Yeah.
And I. I.
So I know exactly what Dre'stalking about there.
I have to have a really deepconversation with myself.
But when I.
Before I got into all this,I'm like, do I actually want to be
on stage rapping?

(51:20):
And then.
I don't know why I everdoubted it, because it's freaking.
The best thing I ever did was start.
Start making music, man.
Did you record it, or did you.
Did anybody record your first?
Yeah.
Oh, yeah.
We got videos.
Yeah.
Because that's.
Anybody who kind of listensknows that I. I record everything.

(51:43):
Record everything just becauseof the nostalgia that it would bring
later on.
And I knew it would besomething that I would listen to
20, 30 years, you know, downthe line type of thing as a.
As a memory.
So something like that.
That's special.
Like, your first show.
I mean, that's.
That's epic.
You'll have that forever, andyou can always revert back to it

(52:04):
and says, oh, you rememberwhen we first started?
Oh, I played the tape.
Yeah.
And there's.
There's a reason that, like, that.
That Todd's good at that andwants that is like, her mom was a
singer in the 70s, andapparently she was badass, but we'll
never know.
None of that was ever recorded.
She was even on TV and stuff,you know, singing blues and.

(52:26):
And.
And whatever.
Like, seeing Etta James and.
And it's like, we don't havethat anywhere.
Like, we don't have a copy ofthat anywhere.
It's like, no, you know, even if.
Like, even if I'm singinghorrible, I'd rather have a copy
of it somewhere as.
As a, you know, chronology oras some sort of a document of what

(52:47):
we did.
Because, I mean, it'simportant for, like, our, you know,
our kids and their kids andall that sort of stuff.
Like, you got to have that out there.
So, you know, I.
This is my big regret.
We don't have Mom.
You know, we don't have anyvideo of mom, like, back when she
was, like.
She was like, the Queen, you know.
That's crazy.
Yeah, I would love to hear that.

(53:08):
Yeah.
Content.
Content has definitely been something.
A part of this process, too,that a lot of artists, if you're
indie, that's kind of part of.
Part and partial.
What you're also responsible for.
It can be like, obviously,it's work.
But that, too, to me, is whatkind of interests me about the process.

(53:29):
Being able to, like, cutdifferent visuals with that, cut
different content with that,make a theme even with the.
The content or the reels.
There's this prompt that.
That popped up recently thatI'd seen that says it's incarnations,
like, hey, dad, how were you,like, in the 90s?
So now you can say, are you inthe 2000s?

(53:50):
And you have this footage.
Yeah, it'll be like a Frozen Booter.
When we were doing thechangeover set, you know, this past
January, I think,.
Hey, Frozen Booter was theofficial debut.
Yeah.
I've never met Heroes.
We had the.
We had our buddy Tyler therewith the guitar.
Yeah, we did, like, a full actual.
I think we did all our songs.
Well, Bobby wasn't done yet.

(54:11):
Bobby wasn't done.
But we did it anyways, didn't we?
Did we?
I can't remember.
So is Tyler always going to be there?
Is that.
Is that part of the.
Is that part of the.
Is this, like, a trio, Tyler?
Yeah.
Well, Tyler actually left theband now.
We got.
We got a new guitarist.
His name's Dead Prez.
Okay.
Oh, Dead Prez.
Okay.
Yeah.
But is that the idea, though,to always incorporate, like, a.

(54:33):
A guitar in there?
No, no, no, it wasn't.
It just kind of happened outof the blue.
Tyler has his own band,Graffiti Parks, and they're so good.
And I did a few shows withthem, and we started hanging out.
I invited him over to jam onetime with me and Dre.
Yeah.
And we were literally cakes.
Oh, my God.

(54:54):
So we're out outside of my backyard.
I have, like, one of those big umbrellas.
It's pouring, storming, it'spouring out.
I have a barbecue cover overthe PA speaker.
All the equipment's under the umbrella.
I'm holding on to the thing, trying.
To like, yeah, Dre's holdingon Vegas.
So the rain doesn't hit anything.
We are freaking rocking out.

(55:14):
Pouring rave.
And I knew right then andthere, I'm like, this is.
Yeah, this is it.
And the more we got to get.
Tyler involved, the more I'vegotten to know him.
Also, I keep thinking tomyself, you know, Brian, how the
heck did we find this guy?
How.
How he found us kind of justcame together in a really organic
way.
And that's another thing about the.
The group and.
And Brian, that's what I loveand respect about you, is that we're

(55:37):
not shying away from, like,the live elements, like the instruments
and all that definitely, youknow, from like, super duty, tough
work does this.
Super duty, tough work.
Huge inspiration.
Yeah.
What yo, listen, listen, yo.
Running on fumes.
Now that's the mood.

(55:58):
My crew on the groove.
Now that's a tune.
Mary soul stood by the stove.
What's in the soup?
Top boy taught you that slang.
We been half food.
I'm sowing these seeds to eatthis fruit they bake for bars.
All I'm doing is singing the blues.
My styles like loremy slangsto use power from the.
The vastness and beauty that'sin these hues.
Infiltrators hidden among us.

(56:19):
You might get duped.
I just kick my truth and letit do what it do.
Bad, bad, not good.
Yeah, but I love.
I love that, though.
Like, why not?
Yeah, yeah, you should do it.
Why not?
I don't want to force it.
I want it to be, like, organic.
And it just kind of happened with.
Tyler sound like, like the.

(56:40):
The tracks on there on the album.
So.
So is that all.
Like, those aren't samples?
Like, the guitar?
Is that all, like, not liveguitar, but whatever you want to
call it.
But are those sample guitar oris that just.
Is that.
Is that.
Is that that guy playing?
Tyler came to my basement twoweeks before the release.
We banged out the guitarrecordings we had.

(57:02):
We had scheduling conflicts.
Every time I tried to get himin, he would always.
He had job stuff going on or whatever.
So, like, two weeks.
I'm panicking.
I'm like, oh, I got to getthis done in two weeks.
He finally comes in.
We bang it out in one session.
Dude.
Yeah.
It was like magic.
That kid is so good at justimprovising, like on stage, in the

(57:23):
studio.
Yeah.
He plays with his teeth.
He like.
I just like frozen booter.
Frozen booter.
I sent him the backing tracksfor like, nine songs the night before.
He comes out there.
Yeah.
And just kills it.
Dude.
He's amazing.
How much of that Frozen Booterstuff is up now.

(57:44):
I want to go back and watch it all.
Frozen Booter.
So that's.
They had their first festivalthat's organized by one of the gentlemen
from lipstick 45.
I don't know if you ever heardof Lipstick.
No, no.
I'm gonna look at.
I'm gonna look into it though.
For sure.
I like your hair.
And now it's fashionable.

(58:07):
Reroll joints.
Old Hell, yeah.
The fashionable.
I like your shoes.
And guess what?
They're fashionable.
They're so fun.

(58:28):
They're so fun.
We're great rock band.
I did a. I met them at the tap.
Host.
I got.
Yeah, I'm looking it up rightnow because, like, I got.
I gotta.
I. I gotta not forget to.
Here we go.
BS Raps Natural ceremonies.
This guy.
Yeah, yeah, I'll be back next year.
We'll be back next year for sure.
He's like, wait a minute.

(58:49):
Who the this BS rap 6060. Whothe that what?
Some imposter.
Opa tudo bem saa okanal.
BS raps.
Mexican version.
Yeah, I speak a littleSpanish, so.
I already got doppelgangers.

(59:11):
Well, I mean.
Oh, B.S.
Raptors.
Hang on.
That's what it is.
No, it's B.S.
Raps, man.
What the.
That's not cool.
All right, I'm gonna go toyour page.
I'm gonna.
I want to listen to this stuffbecause I like, there was a.
There was a friend of mine,Ray Ettenhofer, and he was in, like,

(59:32):
a local band called Bliss andthen later called Gin Taxi.
And he was a good guitar player.
They played stuff that waskind of like Pink Floyd ish, right?
And then a certain point, hehad an epiphany moment where he realized
he really liked electronic music.
So he, you know, he decided togo down EDM route, right?

(59:52):
And.
And people like, are youfucking nuts?
But he was following his passion.
Like, I feel this.
He became a DJ known as DJ Rain.
And he was great, man.
I have a lot of his stuff.
But what he started doing wasincorporating a live guitar into
his DJing.
Nice.
And he toured Europe, like,playing that stuff.

(01:00:13):
And they were playing, like,they were playing his.
They're playing his stuff inclubs all throughout Europe.
And it's like, but.
But it was so fresh, right?
It's like EDMs usually likepure electronica, right?
Like, there's no liveinstruments and stuff.
But it's like, well, why can'tI just put a live guitar in that?
Why not?
There's no.
The only rules is there are no rules.

(01:00:36):
That's the thing you got to do.
You got to do what you feel like.
And if it feels like the thingto do, then do it.
Like, don't wait.
Just do it, you know?
I can't think of one.
I was trying to think of thisthe other day because I was posting
all our stuff on forstreaming, and it's like, what is.
What band?
What popular bands do yousound like?

(01:00:57):
I'm like, God, I.
So, like, how do you do that?
Maybe Rage against the Machine.
Like, maybe.
I don't think so, though.
Like, I don't.
It's it's its own thing.
I love it, though.
Yeah.
Yeah.
To be undefinable is.
You know.
Yeah.
I'm waiting for country rap.
Well, there is country rap.
It's a whole thing.

(01:01:18):
Okay.
Yeah.
Because so many genres you canmix together.
You could just make your own.
Yeah, There's.
There's.
There's like a death country.
That's a thing now.
It's like.
Yeah.
I was showing a band.
I can't remember the name.
I'm trying to think of thename, but.
But they were from Germany andthey were.
They were coming over to tour.
They started touring Canadaand Vancouver, and they mixed.

(01:01:38):
They mixed techno with heavy metal.
It's like semper tourism.
I'm trying to think of an edm,but it's.
It has this crazy sound to it,and people, like, they're.
You could tell they'repassionate about it because they
put their music.
They put all the effort intotheir music videos.
Yeah.
And just have a good time andthey don't really care.

(01:01:59):
Then that attracts more people.
That.
It's just like, oh, thesepeople, they're authentic to themselves.
Yeah.
They're trying.
They're trying shit.
And it's like, I want to do this.
And then you do it and theyput it out.
I think Europe's a bit morefreeing in that regard.
Like, there's a lot of, like.
Like, industrial music.
Would.
It happened over there?
Right.
Like, it's just like, youknow, it's Germany.

(01:02:20):
It's industrial.
Right.
So.
So what you're talking about,Dre, is like, yes, of course.
It makes sense to me.
You know, Like, I always likelistening to new.
New styles of music and new.
Just kind of weird.
Weird shit.
Like when we played.
When Todd and I, we.
We play with.
I. I'm gonna say it wrong.
I. Dithylamide.

(01:02:41):
Oh, yeah, he's great.
Like, he's like.
He's.
He's not following any rulesat all.
None.
Yep.
He's his own thing.
And then how do you define.
How do you define Anthony?
You don't.
He's doing his own shit, andhe's a.
God damn it.
A diethylamide.
And he's fucking great.

(01:03:25):
Like, there's a certainrebellion that you have to have against
the status quo or, like, whatyou perhaps are used to hearing or,
like, what the trend is inorder for you to.
If that's what you feel like.
And that's.
That's kind of like how thiskind of all came together, was just
being able to bring that outfrom, like, what we hear what we
want to hear, you know.
Yeah.
To something unique, something different.

(01:03:46):
And it, and it brings out.
We're just always, we'retrying to bring out also a lot of
other local people, localacts, because there's a lot of great
talent in this city.
Going to the Soundways Musicmeeting, the demo listening session.
You have like a very, very com.
Like, there's, there's talent,there's hidden talent.
You just have to kind of likestay connected, like.
And then we always want to tryand push those types of things too.

(01:04:10):
To say, hey, you know, this isa unique sound.
This is a talented individual.
Great individual behind the scenes.
Just more than a musician.
Great human being also, youknow, we.
Have met so many amazingpeople over like the last one to
two years.
I want to say, like so many amazing.
It really picked up after,after, like the last couple months,
especially after January.

(01:04:30):
Frozen Booter.
Yeah.
Putting, putting ourselves outthere also, like going to the open
mics.
Yeah, lots of open mics.
So.
Okay, because I, this is whatpopped up on your pay on, on BS's
page.
And I'm like, what the hell isgoing on here?
So are you guys actuallydeveloping other artists or.
Because what's this post here?
It was Tannis K8.

(01:04:54):
Oh, we did a radio, we did aninterview with her at the, on for
ckuw.
Right, right.
And played, we played a set.
Right.
We had songs, we had a coupleof songs from local.
Yeah.
She hosts, she hosts thePurple Room.

(01:05:18):
It's breaking and breaking.
And you're breaking too.
But what can we do?
What can we do?
Stay up real late and discussall the things we could possibly
think.
Hoping the night will continue.
Oh, okay.

(01:05:39):
Open mic there that they do atXQ's in the winter.
Yeah.
In the summer.
I just met up with that guy yesterday.
Or Todd that we met up withthat guy on Sunday.
He was the guy at the end ofthe table.
He's the Purple Room guy.
Yeah, great guy.
We actually have a bigannouncement coming up about that.
We'll have to save that fornext time.

(01:06:00):
But so are you guys.
So have you ever thought.
So I, I, I, I, I didn't lookinto this deep enough, but.
So you have, so you, you'reself releasing, self producing, putting
your out.
You're doing, you're doing thecompletely indie thing.
You're gonna, everything'sgonna be on Spotify and all the streamings
you're gonna go through,probably CD baby, or whoever the

(01:06:21):
hell you're going through, butso you have your own, like this is
your own label.
Right.
Like putting your.
Your own shit out on your own label.
Have you ever thought aboutbringing other artists onto the label?
Oh, I. I would love to, but,you know, I.
That's.
I.
There's only so many hours.
Yeah.
Fair process.

(01:06:41):
Right.
That's a good start.
It's a good start.
It's just right now, more orless like, just sharpening our craft.
Yes.
Making sure that, you know, we're.
We're developing us as agroup, us as individuals also.
We're not.
We're not.
We're definitely open or keento, like, working with others.
I mean, this place.
There's another great producerthat, you know, they.

(01:07:06):
They meet up with with FourthQuarter Records producer.
They call it the track meet.
Yeah.
So Fourth Quarter Recordshosts a monthly track meet at Sucram's
Brewing where like a bunch ofproducers, hip hop producers, EDM
producers.
Oh, really?
Anything that was like a drumpad, whatever.
Yeah.
On your phone or whatever.

(01:07:26):
They were doing a publicdomain and then.
Yeah, that was like, what.
That was again last summer, right?
Yeah, yeah.
Around this time.
Yeah, I think.
Yeah.
So they.
Yeah, we went there for.
I don't know if that was theirfirst one, but it wasn't a while.
No.
They used to do them beforeCOVID right?
Yeah, they've been doing themfor a while, but.
But that was the first one wewent to and put a bunch of people

(01:07:47):
unnoticed, man.
They're like, who the hell?
Who the heck is these guys?
Yeah.
Hey.
Oh, what happened?
Sorry, I just.
Around.
There you go.
Yeah, go back to that.
And I started making it like a.
Like, I try to go to each oneof those now.
It's actually really good.

(01:08:07):
It's made me a betterproducer, you know, that's what they
do.
That's good because you're.
You're trade.
You're trading chops withthese guys.
Yeah.
They take a record and theygive it to the group and they're
like, this is what you'regonna use to sample.
Oh, okay.
That's cool.
And so you get to seeeveryone's kind of like, approach
to it.
Yeah.
And there's a lot of peoplewho are better than me there, that's
for sure.

(01:08:27):
But no, that's.
That's awesome you're doingthat, though, because I think that's
important because.
To just stay in your room andmixing and stuff.
I think it's important.
Even on the podcasting side,we meet up with all the podcasters
all the time, and I'm hangingout with podcasters online.
Like the guys in Tennessee andthe guys in Georgia and whatever.
I think it's important to talkto your peers and feel how things

(01:08:50):
are going or to come up withcreative ideas.
I think it's key.
Being insular and not talkingto these people is.
Doesn't work.
Like, I like that you guys aredoing this.
Like, that's.
I didn't even know there wassuch a thing.
Like, it's great.
You got to put yourself out there.
Yeah, it's been.
It's been really great to have that.
You got to have construction,constructive criticism, feedback.

(01:09:11):
Yes.
Because you can't.
You can't have it all figuredout by yourself.
No.
I started with going to, like,again, the Studio 393 at Portage
Place.
Great space for.
Sorry, can you talk about thatplace a bit more?
Because this is new to me.
I don't know what that place places.
So it's.
I think it used to be like anold staples.
Okay.
But even with the renovationsthat they're doing to Portage Place,

(01:09:32):
there's a studio space forcreatives to come down.
Artists, they have breakdancing classes.
They have some after school programming.
They have DJ set up there.
They have a recording studio,you know.
Holy.
Cool.
Yeah.
So people, you can go, you cancome down.
It's like.
Like, they started like four.

(01:09:52):
They go from four to seven,and then they have different things
during the week that theyfocus on going there.
Bounce ideas off of Osani tosee, like, okay, what could I do
in terms of like songwritingfor me, same way I do with Brian,
and just have more feedback, adifferent perspective.
Go back to the drawing board.
You know, if you guys haven'tlistened to Osani, you gotta check

(01:10:17):
them out.
That kid is amazing.
And that's his home base.
Like, that's his home.
Okay.
Yeah, I'll definitely check it out.
I'll play it on our Metal Shop show.
Yeah.
He's very unique and I lovehis production style.
It's like avant garde.
Yeah.
Like, it's only.

(01:10:37):
Just sounds epic.
It's evolved very much so too,in the past.
Like, I would say even a yearand going there like a couple years
ago and hearing it now is.
I think there's a.
At least from what I see, youhave this threshold that you.
If you put in a number of hours.
Right.
Or you put in years of work,that there's a threshold that you

(01:10:58):
eventually break through as an artist.
And then there's a.
There's like an evolution, ifyou will, of sound understanding
and even how you want toproject that or Express that, rather.
And, yeah, it's all about.
It's all about being able to push.
You know, you see that pictureof that people, like, you know, they're
hunting for the diamonds, andthen one person gives up when they're

(01:11:20):
right there.
Yeah.
The other, you know, is youtake that extra step and, you know,
something's waiting for you.
Great.
On the other side.
I. I've noticed that all thehip hop people doing stuff in this
city right now are not newcomers.
They're more like peoplewho've stuck to it.
It.
Yeah.
And that's really the key.
You got to stick to it.

(01:11:41):
What's that?
Yeah, he's bending genres, youknow, as it goes.
And it.
It's very.
Again, it's unique.
It's very unique.
And it's.
It's his own sound.
And it's.
It's just.
Yeah, it's interesting to seewhere it's going to end up or where
it's going to keep going from there.
But I like what you're saying.
Like, there's that.
There's that maybe light bulbmoment or whatever.

(01:12:03):
There's the point where you'vedone it long enough, if you've done
it put enough time.
That 10,000 hours, you know,theory, where you.
You kind of get really good atsomething at a certain point where
all of a sudden it just clicksand then you got it, you know?
Like, I. I believe in that.
Like, you know, it's true.
Like, I don't know.
Like, I think, like, it.

(01:12:25):
It may sound weird, but Ithink somebody told.
Somebody told me the other daybecause I've been.
I've been doing some vocals for.
For people, and.
And I. I think my vocals havedeclined over the years.
Right.
Because I've been singing for,I don't know, 30 years or whatever
it is, and I think they'redeclining because you hear all these
people, their.
Their vocals are declining.

(01:12:45):
And then somebody said that Isounded, like, fantastic, and, like,
really.
And then they kind of.
So they actually did ananalysis of a vocal I gave them,
and I'm like, I didn't know Iwas doing any of that stuff, but
I think because I've beendoing it for so.
Long that you don't even thinkabout it.
I don't think about it.
Yeah, I think that's.
But I think what Dre wassaying, it's like.

(01:13:06):
It's that you hit that.
You hit that.
That.
That.
That kind of that curve orwhere it slopes up your.
It's an upward climb to learning.
And then eventually, like, No,I know how I sound.
I know how to manipulate how I sound.
I know how to, you know, forceit out.
I wrote, I wrote a song.
I didn't even tell Todd aboutthis yet.
I wrote a song the other dayand I wrote the song in like five

(01:13:30):
minutes.
Like, just the lyric part.
I'm like.
And I looked at it like, did Ijust really do that?
But I know what my voice is, right?
Like, I know, I know what it is.
I know my meter.
I know how I sing.
I know my flow or whatever youwant to call it.
And I just, and I just.
It just came out.
And then I sent it.
That was the Chaz, Todd.

(01:13:50):
I sent it to Chaz and Chaz islike, how the fuck did you come up
with this?
I said, I wrote it in five minutes.
He goes, no, you didn't.
Yeah, I did, dude.
Like, I did.
But you know, but that's thething, like, we're putting the time
in, right?
Like, Brian, I'm not gonna lie.
When you came out, I'm like,this stuff's pretty good.

(01:14:10):
But you've been working.
You've busted, you've bustedyour fucking ass.
Yeah.
And you need to be commendedfor that.
You didn't go, I'm gonna try this.
I don't know, I'm gonna try it.
I'm do some.
No, you're like, no, I'm gonnaget good at this.
And you persevered.
And honestly, man, you soundgreat now, but you put the work in,
but you're passionate.

(01:14:31):
You're doing the passion.
You're, you're.
The shit's coming out of you.
Like, it's just coming out ofyou now because you actually put
the work in, right?
Yeah, but you're not doing itas a, as a, as.
I'm gonna try this out.
No, no, you're doing itbecause you want to do it.
Like you can hear it.
I know exactly what I want to do.
Yeah.
There's no question.

(01:14:51):
Yeah.
You gotta have, you got tohave conviction.
You can't half assets ifyou're going to be in.
For me, I've always beeneither all in or all out.
I can't half ass anything thatI do best.
Passion.
You know that sometimes, youknow, you, you have certain, like,
things that you go through.
Maybe something is frustratingand maybe it's not working out today.
Maybe you know, you're writingor it's not coming out his way, but

(01:15:14):
you stay consistent otherwise.
And you do something like 10 minutes.
Like when you wake up and youhave like, for Me, I have a little
exercise that I'll do.
And you just keep doing this,keep doing this, and then eventually
it's going to crack and thensomething is going to come out.
It's really something special.
But you always keep working at it.
Practice.
Because you don't know whenthat time, when that day is going
to be.
Yep.
Yep.

(01:15:34):
Amen.
Amen to that.
I actually, you know, you'retalking about the journal.
I've been carrying a journal around.
I've always had a journal.
I have journals full oflyrics, like, over the years.
And I think it's important todo that because you never know when
a good idea is going to strike you.
But it's not bad to have a bad.

(01:15:56):
To have a bad idea.
I think it's good to have alot of bad ideas too.
You just chronicle everythingin a journal because you never know.
Sometimes you got to workthrough the process of shitting out
a bunch of bad ideas to get tothe good idea.
And that's okay.
That's normal.
That's not a bad thing.
That's actually a great thingbecause you're actually practicing

(01:16:16):
your prose.
You're practicing how you'reverbalizing or your beat or your
cadence on how you actuallyrap or sing or poetry or whatever.
Like, you gotta find yourbeat, but you can't find your beat
if you haven't started walking yet.
You know, big time.
Everybody starts somewhere.
And you'd be surprised to,maybe you.

(01:16:39):
You look back at that lyric orthose verses or whatever you have
written down, and you have acompletely different perspective
on it.
A year or two later, you'relistening to a beaten.
Or you're listening to a lyricor a melody.
Now all of a sudden you'repulling something from you, what
you wrote down you thought wasshitty at that time.
And then you, you can flip itand have something different to it

(01:17:00):
now.
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
Oh, I totally know what you mean.
Yeah.
I have my little notepad on my phone.
Whenever something pops intomy head, I gotta capture it right
then and there.
Yeah, just put it out.
Because maybe you're like.
What I found is some of thestuff I would write, like 20 years
ago or whatever.
I didn't have the ability tosing it that way yet, but the idea

(01:17:23):
was still there.
So then you go back, go, oh, Ican totally sing in that key.
Or I can totally.
You know, sometimes I wouldtrip over my words when I was singing
because I couldn't get themeter right.
But.
But I can do that now.
You know, it's like, so don'tget rid of anything.
Keep.
Like, I've got shelves of myold journals and stuff, you know?
But it's important, like.

(01:17:43):
And it's training, right?
It's the training to get towhere it's those 10,000 hours, those
count that, you know, thattime does count.
They're so important.
I feel like a lot of peoplewant to be on stage, they want the
spotlight, but they forget the.
The journey is everything, dude.
Yeah.
Oh, yeah.
If you skip all that and yougo right to being a star, you don't.

(01:18:08):
You're not going to enjoy it.
Yeah.
You miss.
You're just going to be like,oh, cool.
Yeah, you miss a lot.
Yeah.
I think Nas has, like, somelyrics like that.
It's like, second or thirdalbum when he's talking about being.
Having patience and notwanting to jump the shark so much,
because you'll be either underprepared or you won't know how to
handle it.

(01:18:28):
So whatever you got to gothrough, you know, accept it.
Go through the process.
Right.
Enjoy the process.
It's all about the journey,for sure.
Yeah.
And that's why it's great,honestly, to have Dre involved, because,
I don't know, it's bad.
Work with your friends.
Yeah.
What better way, you know?
And.
And because there's a lot of.

(01:18:48):
From what I hear also.
I always hear it.
You have snakes in the industry.
A bunch of crabs.
Yeah, a bunch of crabs.
I was hoping.
See, there's been perfectsegues to every single one of the
songs on that ep, so I waswaiting for the crab one to get into
there.
I think.
I think crabs is my favoriteon the project, honestly.

(01:19:08):
It is my favorite.
Especially.
I. I really like the.
The scratching you're doing atthe end, because I was, like, grooving
on that big time.
That was our buddy, DJ Crispy.
Oh, is.
Was that who that is?
Okay.
Yeah, I brought him in for that.
Oh, man, that was great.
I live in the city Hard pressed.

(01:19:29):
To see smiles on my kin Unless.
They get revenge or they pullit from the trends Just to fit in
where we at Just out thecradle I follow crumbs and I give
you a story similar to Kaneand Abels Bottom of the bucket Knuckled
up smoking blunts in the cut Iseen others slump was rugged but

(01:19:52):
we made do who knew we'd makeit this far Turn a pig beat the soul
food from nosebleeds the floorseats all but these visions of fatalities
from cold dreams get over herenow some seem limpid Wanna set me
up trying to stunt wishing Iwas still pitching talking like they

(01:20:15):
sharks they still swimmingtrying to pull me apart but they
trippin definition just listenclaws out when you rise bad vibes
off a closed mind Real onesrelies the first sign is jealousy
and misery must company hitjust a glare from my eyes when the

(01:20:39):
rain turned to fire Red's nameand headlines Christmas Eve I expected
to shine plot twist this issuicide of what's life with crabs
and making dogs cry I let thesleeping dog lie now this the fish
fry she fought for Kim butthey didn't see the Ben kept himself

(01:21:02):
hypocrites half witcounterfeits go to hell.
You look selling pulling downgliding by the veil Yeti show and
tell they.
Standing at attention now.
Damn Dre, they sound like abunch of crabs to me.

(01:21:28):
Crab legs.
Surf and turf delicious crab cake.
Check.
Crabs will always need somebutter and some lemon.
A crab will never ever do whatyou tell them.
Nor will a crab ever do whatyou ask them.
It's safe to say that thesecrabs they lack passion.

(01:21:51):
That's safe to to say thatthese crabs won't take action.
And why is everyone evolvinginto crabs?
Man, I keep the can of old bayfor the seasoning you're going to
need it to swallow these crabsreasoning I'll tell you something,
it's a fact dude you hang withthe crab you a crap too you an imitation
crab stick I catch you on thatcrab shit you can't check quicker

(01:22:12):
than a trunk pours liquor madat me as raps because my mind sicker
you cross crabs as the OG potstickers so stereotype we use every
play that we got and showthese crabs that we is what they
not.
I seen crabs on the beachescrabs in the precincts, crabs at
city wall Crabs up in my skullshout out to crab skull I can feel

(01:22:33):
it in my soul Never meet yourheroes the ones above all these crabs
they move funny but they don'tmake me mad man you are what you
eat that's why I never eatcrab I got no love for a crab in
a bucket crabs in a bucket,crabs in a bucket why there gotta
be crabs in a bucket?

(01:22:54):
Crabs in a bucket, crabs in abucket there's no economy with crabs
in a bucket crabs in a bucket,crabs in a bucket A bunch of wannabes
y just crabs in a bucket crabsin a bucket, crabs in a. I'm like
it.
I'm out.

(01:23:24):
Never meet your hero.
Never meet your heroes.
Never meet your hero.
Never meet your heroes.
The.

(01:23:59):
Now.

(01:24:25):
Fuck.

(01:25:12):
He was just Jamming on.
On the scratch.
And it's like.
It's so good.
He has great.
Yeah, he just did.
Yeah, we just did a show withhim on Thursday, and that was the
first show I actually got todo with him and.
Or we actually got to do withhim and man, he.
He's way better than I thoughthe was.
I knew he was good.

(01:25:35):
Mixing live at a cipher thatwe did like 25 for 25 minutes before.
Yeah.
Where we got on and.
And it was so.
It was.
Was so hip hop, like, and verycommunity driven because every.
Any.
Anybody or everybody was freeto come on stage to spit whatever
they wanted.
Yeah, we had like a open cipher.
Yeah.
And there was this.
This woman there, Sage, whowas doing a cipher hosting at Public

(01:25:57):
Domain on Thursday.
That really opened it up andwas like co hosting this entire thing
with an amazing voice.
And it works, so.
It works so well with what,what, what?
DJ Crispy was also putting inwith the breaks and the samples.
So it's very magical thingthat happened.
It was magic, dude.
Yeah, it was one of the, like,probably my favorite show ever.

(01:26:21):
It was love.
It was great.
Like, we've done bigger stagesand we've done bigger shows, but
this one was just.
Yeah, right?
People were there.
Community showed up, you know,and everybody was having fun.
It was so fun, dude.
Yeah, that's key.
Key, man.
This was great, but we.
We gotta end at some point.
We gotta end at some point.
Can you guys talk about yoursocial media stuff?

(01:26:43):
Where do we find you?
Where.
Where do we get the new ep?
How do we do all that stuff?
So we're on Instagram.
Never meet your heroes 204.
You can go to nevermeat your heroes.net.
You can go to bsraps.com Dre is.
What is yours.
What is yours on Instagram?
Yeah, it's a cop, so.

(01:27:05):
Aka, period.
Dre.
Ishkote.
So Ishkote is spelled I, S, H,K, O, T, E. And that just means fire
in Anishna Bay.
Moon, Ojibwe.
My.
My cultural.
My heritage.
With Dre is this.
This.
It speaks for itself.

(01:27:25):
Like the two sides of me, right?
Like bringing those two cultures.
Cultures together.
Dre, you know, and thenIshkote, the, you know, fire, flame,
and it's like, it works.
That's really cool.
Yeah.
Thank you.
It's a pleasure, you know, towork alongside this.
This guy and to have somethingin terms of a platform, creative
process, you know, the visualsand such, doing the reels.

(01:27:48):
I have a lot of fun with that.
So that's.
We gotta.
We got a posse cut coming outwith, like, eight local rappers on
it.
Yeah,.
The data that's taken up on the.
On the computer at that point, you.
Know, it's like, yeah, everytime I try to play this song, my
computer wants to blow up.

(01:28:09):
People spitting fire, youknow, just like straight 16, best
16.
And then everyone, you know,at performances and shows like that,
too, people come up, you know,if there's somebody in the crowd
from that posse cut come up,spit your.
We have nothing against thatat all.
I love that.
I love that.
Yeah, that's cool.
And just want to say shout out.

(01:28:29):
Shout out to displaced cj, theGray Kids, Willman, Osani, Ranger
System.
Oh, my goodness.
We've met so many amazingpeople in this last year.
Shout out to Sully, shout outto Gaetano, and like everyone else
supporting us, shout out to Lucky.

(01:28:49):
Yeah, the venues.
The venues that you have, theopen mics, you know, just those platforms
for those things to bepossible, like Community Works.
When Community Works andhaving people, you know, show up
and show out, you know, that's love.
So we try to, you know, returna favor as best we can, for sure.
Absolutely.
No, that's important.
It's very important.
I'm glad you guys are doingthat because it turns me on to any
stuff I hadn't heard before,too, which is good, because I'm.

(01:29:12):
I love absorbing any new musicI can, so that's fucking great.
So thanks, you guys, forcoming on.
Brian, fuck.
I'm sure you're gonna comeback, Dre.
It'll be great to have youback, too.
I like this fucking guy.
I like this Drake, man.
He's fucking great.
Thanks.
Thanks.
Feels like a brother, man.

(01:29:33):
Feels like another brother.
I love it, but fuck, this is great.
So I'm gonna release this in.
Wait, two weeks, I think, or Imight do it faster.
We'll see.
We'll see how quick theediting goes.
But thanks, man.
This was great.
Absolutely.

(01:29:53):
Thank you for listening, andwe'll see you next week, and bye.
Have a good day.

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