July 8, 2026 • 52 mins
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A child grows up learning that love can arrive in a barrel, but comfort cannot. That tension sits at the heart of our conversation with Grenadian director, producer, and creative industry strategist Meschida Phillip, whose documentary work asks what migration costs families long after the plane takes off. We trace how the Grenada Revolution, early separation, and years of “waiting” shaped her sense of connection and pushed her toward filmmaking as a way to name what Caribbean families often keep silent.
Meschida shares the story behind her feature documentary Scars of Our Mother’s Dreams, grounded in Dr. Claudette Crawford-Brown’s concept of “barrel children,” where parents migrate for opportunity while children remain at home with relatives. We talk about emotional trauma, reunification, and why seeing these stories on screen lands differently than reading them. Meschida also pulls back the curtain on responsible documentary practice, from deep research and interviews to building a film that works as an archive and a conversation starter for Caribbean history, culture, and healing. We then zoom out to the film industry itself, including Caribbean Tales Media Group’s Cross-Continental Forum and what Black diaspora collaboration can look like when it’s intentional. Meschida breaks down the real barriers Caribbean filmmakers face funding infrastructure, banking access, co-production limits, and distribution networks and paints a vivid vision of Global South co-production funds, direct Caribbean Africa pipelines, and a market that rewards cultural specificity instead of asking creators to dilute it.
Meschida Philip is a filmmaker, producer, creative-industry strategist, Executive Director of Mprojekts Creative Group, and Founder and Festival Director of the 12°N, 61°W Grenada Film Festival. She is a director, producer, and creative industries strategist working at the intersection of film production and screen industry development in the Caribbean. With over 20 years of professional experience, including more than a decade leading regional initiatives, her work focuses on positioning the Caribbean as an originating creative economy, capable of developing, financing, and exporting its own stories through equitable international co-production. Her work spans both content creation and industry development, with a focus on co-production frameworks, talent pipelines, and market access for creators in small island developing states.
This episode was created in collaboration with Caribbean Tales Media Group to highlight the annual Cross-Continental Forum, a curated, decolonial co-production hub specifically designed to connect Black producers across Africa, the Caribbean, Canada, Europe and the Americas. It offers a structured pathway from information sharing to treaty-driven deals and market access. As an intensive hybrid accelerator, it functions as a “strategic gateway” to co-productions, beginning with an online Accelerator covering legal, financial and distribution frameworks, followed by two in-person events including a pitch showcase.
Editor's Note: Philips participated in the Cross-Continental Forum with Canary, a documentary project that was in development at the time. She is credited as the project’s director and co-producer. Scars of Our Mother’s Dreams was not the project presented at the Forum, however it was screened at the festival.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker (00:00):
Welcome to Strictly Facts, a guide to Caribbean
history and culture, hosted byme, Dr.
Alexandria Miller.
Strictly Facts teaches thehistory, politics, and activism
of the Caribbean and connectsthese themes to contemporary
music and popular culture.
Hello, hello everyone.
And welcome back to anotherepisode of Strictly Facts, a
(00:24):
guide to Caribbean history andculture, where we explore the
stories, histories, and culturallegacies that shape the
Caribbean and its globaldiaspora.
One of the most powerful thingsabout some of the works and
things that we create is filmand its ability to hold memory.
Through moving images, sound,archives, landscapes, and
(00:46):
storytelling, filmmakers canpreserve histories that might
otherwise be forgotten,challenge the narratives we
inherit, and create new ways ofseeing ourselves in our
communities.
And for the Caribbean, where somuch of our history has been
shaped by colonialism,migration, displacement, and
fragmented archives, filmmakingbecomes ever more significant.
(01:10):
It becomes a way of reclaimingvoice, a way of documenting
lives and experiences that havetoo often existed at the
margins, a way of connectingpeople across islands,
languages, and diasporas.
Today's episode explores theintersections of Caribbean
filmmaking, memory, history, andblack storytelling,
(01:34):
spotlighting how filmmakersnavigate the tensions between
archive and imagination, and howfilm collectives like the
Caribbean Tales Media Groupscrossed Continental Forum have
helped shape Black diasporiccultural production.
Because Caribbean storytellinghas never only been about
(01:54):
entertainment, it has also beenabout preservation, resistance,
survival, and imagining futuresotherwise.
Joining us today to talk abouther experiences and the work of
the Cross-Continental Forum isdirector, producer, and creative
industry strategist, MeschidaPhilip, whose work brings film
(02:16):
production and screen industrydevelopment in the Caribbean
together.
And so, Meschida, thank you somuch for joining us for this
episode.
Do let our listeners know alittle bit more about you,
where, of course, in the regionyou call home, and what inspired
your passions as a filmmakerand storyteller.
And ultimately, whatspecifically about film spoke to
(02:37):
you as a medium?
Speaker 2 (02:39):
Hi, thank you so much for this opportunity.
And it's wonderful being heretoday.
And as you warmly introduce me,my name is Meschida Philips.
I am Grenadian born and Ishare space currently between
Grenada and the US.
I've been doing that now forsome years.
(02:59):
My focus is documentaryfilmmaking, as well as I'm now
dabbling into new media, um,which is really, really
exciting.
And I am also theExecutive Director of Mprojekts Creative Group and Founder and Festival Director of the 12°N, 61°W Grenada Film Festival.
I've been doing that now foreight seasons, and um, yeah,
(03:24):
it's a good time.
Um, as far as film isconcerned, coming from a small
island like Grenada, where theculture is so rich, and a big
part of my history and my livedexperiences come from a space of
migration.
(03:44):
So um that was the epitus forme getting into the film
business as a director producer,but we'll talk about that a
little bit later.
I've been dabbling in thecreative space for years.
My trajectory spans from musicproduction all the way now to
(04:05):
actual film as the medium thatI'm outputting.
Speaker (04:09):
So, yeah, a little bit about me.
It's wonderful to have you.
I was actually going to startwith that question about, you
know, how did growing up inGrenada really shape the kinds
of stories you feel compelled totell now as a filmmaker?
Speaker 2 (04:24):
As I mentioned, um, Grenada is a small island with a
very large history.
And one of the most impactfulmemory for me was during the
Grenada Revolution.
I was a kid then.
Um, and that is a staple in mytimeline because not too long
(04:44):
after that, about two yearsafter that, my mom migrated to
the US.
And that was a very definingmoment for me.
I was on the 10, I'm not gonnasay my aged, but I was under 10
years old at the time.
And um the last of threechildren by my mom, and um, she
(05:08):
was my anchor, and um unaware ofhow long um she would have been
gone for, that became a thing.
So basically, I was separatedfrom my mom for about seven,
eight years um until we werereunited again.
So that bond was broken umduring that time.
(05:32):
But um, she has always beenpresent in our lives, um, but we
did not have that intimacy ofthe relationship, you know.
Um, so yeah, that kind ofsubconsciously put things in
place, and it's not until I wasan adult um I started to really
(05:55):
explore personal issues and howI was actually handling certain
encounters in my life, and um Istarted to think about who I am,
why I was responding to thingsthe way I responded to the
things, why I had suchdifficulties in connecting with
(06:20):
people, trusting people, and thewhole nine yards.
And I actually um sought outtherapy to find answers.
And when I had the opportunityto go into grad school, um, that
was my thesis.
I wanted to figure out if therewas anyone else that shared
(06:41):
similar experiences like I did.
So yeah, this was just a thesisprocess in me trying to figure
out answers to the question.
And that just led intosomething completely different.
Speaker (06:52):
Thank you for sharing that.
You know, we oftentimes talkabout this concept that what Dr.
Claudette Crawford Brown callsbarrel children, right?
Um, and having had theopportunity to watch your first
feature film, which is entitledScars of Our Mother's Dreams,
which I will, of course, linkfor our listeners to also check
out, it raises, as you weresaying through your thesis work,
(07:16):
that it wasn't just anindependent um, you know,
situation.
It wasn't just you, right?
It wasn't just the children ofGrenada.
It's a Caribbean-wide, but ofcourse, you know, worldwide when
we get into the politics ofmigration and necessity and all
of those things.
But your film was previously apart of the Cross-Continental
(07:41):
Forum.
Um, and I think really dealswith some of these lived
realities and the aftermath of,you know, barrel children's
experiences or what Dr.
Crawford Brown calls barrelchildren's experiences.
And so for you, what emotionalor you know, historical
questions really inspired thefilm?
I'll let you answer firstbefore I take give some of my
(08:04):
takes.
But um, additionally, why wasit really important for you to
explore these themes, especiallyof like, you know, emotional
trauma, childhood abandonment,things like that?
Speaker 2 (08:15):
As I mentioned, the film began basically with my own
quest to seek answers.
It was my lived experiencegrowing up with not just one
absent parent, but both myparents migrated.
My dad migrated years before.
Um, and my mom, who was the thestaple, the foundation, in my
(08:40):
um experiences, she then left.
Um, so for years I carried thatwound um without fully
understanding it or having thelanguage for it.
You know, growing up in theCaribbean, you're basically told
what to do.
Like you don't question, youdon't question what adults say,
(09:03):
um, the elephant in the room,you know, you really don't
really express certain things.
And um I think having theexperience of the consistency of
my mom in my life, meaning backthen it was um mail, you used
to write mail, right?
(09:24):
And letters.
So um just imagine um I wouldbe experiencing something.
I write my mom.
It would take maybe like twoweeks for her to receive it, and
then another two weeks for herto respond, for me to get her
response.
Um, so you're talking about amonth thereabout, give or take,
(09:44):
right?
So by the time I get a responseand she's trying to nurture us
and and and soothe us, thatissue is already gone, right?
The urgency in dealing with umthe situation at hand was not
something that was tangible.
Um, so we had to seek otherways in which, meaning my sister
(10:07):
and my brother, um, we had toseek other ways in which we were
comforting each other andraising each other in that
sense.
So my eldest sister wasresponsible for for us, right?
Because she understood things alittle bit different.
So, which is quite interestingbecause her experiences as the
first is completely differentfrom my experience as the last,
(10:32):
and then my brother in themiddle.
So when I started this journey,girl, it was not pretty.
Because now I am askingquestions.
And it's like, why you want todiscuss dirty laundry or why you
want to bring this up rightnow?
(10:52):
And you know, what is theproblem, you know?
And my family was not reallycomprehending, in my opinion,
um, what I was trying to seekanswers for, because now we
categorize it as differentthings.
It can be either selfishness,it can be either you're
(11:14):
difficult.
There are so many differentdescriptors, right, for the way
in which someone would respondto things without having
answers, because we neverdiscuss these things.
So I recalled having my mom andmy my oldest um sister who sat
them down when we were havingconversations.
It wasn't pretty.
(11:35):
It was really, really intense,right?
But we had to discuss it.
And only then as an adult, Icame to find out that my mom did
not just leave.
She left for vacation, found anopportunity, stayed, and that
led to her working and makingcertain sacrifices in order to
(11:58):
give us a better lifestyle,right?
But as a child, you don't knowthis.
And these are conversationsthat is not discussed within
families.
So by the time we werereconnected, like I mentioned,
the distance and that emotionalbond that should be so easy
(12:19):
between a mom and a child was nolonger there.
So now you have a whole slew ofdifferent emotions now to
figure out.
Am I rebelling?
Am I doing this?
Am I doing that?
So it's like you're now deemeda certain way, right?
So these were moments of hardtruth.
And I think at the end, itbecame better.
(12:45):
Um, and while going through umthis research to prepare myself
for my thesis film, that's whenI discovered the barrel trial
syndrome.
I did not know this wasactually a terminology.
And I discovered um Dr.
Crawford.
I think I actually went down toMaryland, if I'm not mistaken,
(13:09):
to meet with her, to havefurther conversations about it.
So I really went deep into it.
I spoke to different umpsychologists and therapists to
understand better.
Because as a documentaryfilmmaker, I think you have um a
responsibility to do adequateresearch because now you are
(13:32):
actually informing people ofcertain things, right?
And I wanted this to answerquestions.
I did not want my voice in thefilm initially.
I did not want it to be like,oh my gosh, here she goes,
right?
Self-serving.
So hence the reason why Iactually sought out different
(13:53):
people who had similarexperiences to get this layer.
And I recall when we wereediting the film, I said it just
felt empty because somethingwas missing.
And it was my personalexperiences that opened up the
film, but allow other umindividuals to answer the
(14:14):
questions that was posed.
Is this a problem?
Speaker (14:18):
I realize we've been using the term and not all of
our listeners might be familiar.
Um, and so before continuing onthe conversation, I just want
to give a brief nod to that.
So for anybody who's not aware,um Dr.
Crawford's term barrel childrenreally refers to the phenomenon
in which, you know, childrenare left back home in the
(14:38):
Caribbean or, you know,certainly other places as well.
Um, but from a Caribbeancontext, they're left at home in
the Caribbean, often under thecare of grandmothers and aunties
and, you know, other familymembers, while their parents go
abroad, usually to the, youknow, global north, US, UK,
Canada, et cetera, um, really insearch for better
(15:00):
opportunities.
And as Meschida was sort ofpointing at, right, there's
obviously the disconnect betweenthe emotional care and
connection that espouses becauseof the distance, but you may
have um oftentimes the morefinancial resources, right?
That's also where the termbarrel comes in because you may
(15:20):
be able to get the shoes andthe, you know, marina and
whatever it is for school thatyour parents are sending home to
you.
Um, but that emotional distanceis certainly there.
But as you were you weretalking, that was certainly
something that I thought ofbeing able to watch the film,
right?
And see how I think I wasreally captivated that you
(15:42):
started with your story, right?
And also then parallel off toother people's experiences.
And I think for me, it was oneof the things that I really
greatly took away andappreciated, especially at the
end of um the film, was hearinghow people are parenting
themselves, right?
Because you're now speaking tothese people as adults who are
(16:05):
reflecting back on theirexperiences, um, the hurt that
they experienced, but also howthat has then not only
translated into how they aim tobe parents, but also the work
that they are doing within thecommunity to better support
others who are have gone throughsort of similar instances.
(16:25):
And so for me, it really led tothis question of like, what
power do you think film holds inbeing able to impact this
memory?
Um, just because ultimately,you know, we can write about
things, right?
You know, this could have beena research paper, for instance,
or something, right?
Um, much like Dr.
Crawford's work, but it is aspecial thing.
(16:48):
Um, and I don't know if I havethe word for it, um, but it's a
special thing to see it capturedin film this way.
And so, sort of how do you hopethat being able to capture this
through film impacts memory andsocial change?
And ultimately, whatconversations were you hoping
that the film would inspire?
Speaker 2 (17:08):
Initially, I did not know what kind of conversations
the film was going to inspire.
I honestly had no clue.
I just knew I wanted to tellthe story, and I'm like, okay,
so the story is told, but I didnot realize how deep this
resonate globally.
And as you said earlier,although the film featured
(17:33):
Grenadians, this is a universalissue.
Migration and immigration, themigrant tale is something that
all cultures experience, right?
And people have differentreasons for migrating.
Um, but it comes down to thefundamental part in most times
(17:57):
wanting to do better for theirchildren.
And out of everyone that Ispoke to at the time and
continue to speak to after thisfilm was premiered, that is the
same sort of conclusion that wasdrawn.
(18:17):
We migrated, we left because wewanted to do better.
But as life has it sometimes,you have people who start new
families.
There are those who migrate andnever look back.
So there is childhoodabandonment that takes place
because they start a whole newlife and forget about where they
came from.
Then you have um situationslike myself, where there is
(18:42):
years of disconnection, andsometimes it's very hard for you
to ever regain that emotionalconnection with your parent.
So there is always adisconnect.
Then you have the viewpoint ofthe parent and their experiences
as well, that this film did notreally address to um, because
(19:05):
we only took one aspect of it,right?
The sacrifices of the parentsas well, leaving your family and
having, depending on what jobyou took out here, like in my
mom's case, she was a domesticworker.
So basically herresponsibilities were raising
other people's children.
(19:26):
Whereas your kids are left andbeing raised by someone else.
So you have that um emotionaland mental and psychological
issues that she also and parentslike her had to deal with,
right?
Then you have the issues of thecaregiver who now take up the
(19:48):
responsibility and become thatstaple for that child.
And when reunification comesaround, that child now is
leaving the safety of thecaretaker and whatever
relationships that they probablyhad with that caretaker now.
So it's it's just a lot, it'svery complex, right?
(20:10):
And very dynamic.
So what I recognized is thatthis film served us was a
conversation starter, and it wasum a small window into people
looking in observationally tosay it's not just me and how can
(20:34):
I do better?
You see, because our societyand our culture is not one where
therapy was introduced at avery young performative period.
So there is the silence and theunspoken um elephant in the
(20:57):
room syndrome that is takingplace, and you just have to know
how to fix it.
So when we were finished withthe production of this film,
you're hearing from thesubjects, the majority of the
subjects who were part of this,thank you.
Thank you for giving me anopportunity to verbalize how I
(21:21):
felt all these years and to getit out.
And it's an opportunity forthem themselves to make
different decisions in how theyare choosing to parent their own
children.
You see, several of them hadthe opportunity to leave and
they made the decision to staybecause they did not want their
(21:43):
children to go through the samekind of trauma that they
themselves went through.
Because it's not in all thesituations, but sometimes you
will see from Dr.
Crawford Brown's um study.
There are abuse that takesplace, physical, sexually abused
(22:06):
that takes place with kids leftbehind, um, broken homes.
I called it the waitingsyndrome because that's how I,
that's how I had described myperiod and for myself, right?
The waiting syndrome.
Because I waited for so long.
And I realized that that alsotranscended in my adult life.
(22:27):
Because whenever I was dealingwith situations, nothing was
urgent for me.
I always waited.
I was waiting to see what willhappen.
I am waiting to see this.
So I had to like really makesense.
So coming out of this, thisfilm also gave me some personal
(22:48):
insights in how to heal myselfas well and become a stronger
version of myself.
You're right.
There is something about seeingsomething on screen, hearing
people's voice, seeing theemotions, right?
Versus that of just reading it.
(23:09):
Because now it becomes realthrough the visual means.
So this was an opportunity inthis film where the
conversations that I was havingwith these people provided an
opportunity for hearing.
To me, that's the takeaway withthis from the historical
(23:31):
context and how it shapedmemories and social changes.
Speaker (23:37):
Thank you.
I think that that broughttogether a lot of my thoughts,
just, you know, having watchedit and being able to, especially
at the end, as I wasmentioning, see people hug their
own kids, right?
Having told this story abouttheir own experiences as
children, and then see them hugtheir own kids, you know, and
grandchildren, right?
(23:57):
See how this experience hasshaped them as a person, but
also the adult that they choseto become and how they chose to
parent, to nurture, right, tosort of end cycles.
And I I very much so agreethat, you know, there is a power
in being able to visualizethat, um, that, you know, I
(24:19):
think wouldn't be captured insuch a heart-wrenching way,
right?
On paper or, you know, forinstance, in a different medium.
You were talking about otherpeople's responses to the film,
right?
And, you know, that this isvery much so a global issue.
And that, of course, brings meto the cross-continental forum
because um your film waspremiered there a while back.
(24:41):
And so for those who areunfamiliar, um, the Caribbean
Tales Media Group has a what oneof their staple programs called
the Cross-Continental Forum.
It's actually running nowthrough September and
specializes on bringing blackproducers across, you know,
Africa, the Caribbean, Canada,the UK, and Latin America to
(25:03):
really foster sustainableindustry growth within
filmmaking.
And wanted to ask you,personally, given your
experiences having participated,um, what was your time in the
program like?
And how do you think it helpedshape you as a filmmaker and
strengthen your relationshipwith black creatives across the
(25:24):
world?
Speaker 2 (25:25):
Um, participating in CCF, the Dark Girl, um, won it
in Barbados two years ago.
It was a very transformationalexperience because it placed me
in a room where producers andfilmmakers from across the
Caribbean and Africa and thewider diaspora were in the same
(25:51):
safe space.
And we had an opportunity to behonest about the fact that all
of us were grappling withsimilar or the same fundamental
questions about whose story getstold and who gets to tell them.
You know, there's aresponsibility, right?
(26:12):
A fundamental responsibility inthat.
And I honestly believe afterhaving the opportunity to
premiere Scars one at CaribbeanTales and also traveling with
this film to other uminternational spaces that had
(26:32):
very diverse audiences, ifsomeone else told that story,
I'm not sure if it would havehad the same kind of impact.
But the mere fact that we arein this particular situation, I
had the opportunity to go in andlisten and tell the story not
(26:57):
just from their experiences, butalso from my own personal
experiences, gave this filmdepth and gave the and increased
the production value for thisfilm that it is not just a film,
but it's also um an archivalpiece, right, that can be
(27:18):
studied and dissected andtransformed and also expanded
on, right?
Because in as much as we areliving in a very digitalized
space where things, you know,there is a sense of um
connection, the ease ofconnection is still better, the
(27:40):
trauma of migration still existsunderneath, right?
Because now, I'm not sure whichone is worse, honestly.
If waiting four weeks to get aresponse and not knowing what
your mom is doing versus theurgency of seeing that your mom
is living a good life or yourdad is living a good life in the
(28:03):
foreign space, right?
And you are separated fromthem, right?
And you don't have that.
And in the event that they wenton and have additional children
outside of the kids leftbehind, there is that sense of
competition and belonging thatis there.
(28:26):
So the issue is still somethingthat is quite relevant because
people are still migrating.
You see what I'm saying?
So having the opportunity toshowcase this project for the
audiences that this wasintentionally made for, that
(28:50):
also gave me the language andthe strategy that I wanted to
focus on doing more work from asocial context that had deeper
meaning and understanding.
So a lot of the things that Ido, I really focus on the
(29:11):
psychological and social impactof our people.
And I try to put it forth whereyou're left with questions or
answers to the questions thatwas raised in the piece.
You see what I'm saying?
As an opportunity to start aconversation and a discussion
(29:32):
around it.
So um, yeah, both um CCF inBarbados and the festivals
provided me with a path forwardto tell more Caribbean um
stories and understand howimportant Caribbean cinema is in
(29:53):
this whole ecosystem.
Because representation is hugeand lack of representation for
so many years have beenexisting.
So myself and other Caribbeanfilmmakers who are taking up
this film of telling ourstories, our experiences through
(30:16):
our lens, that is somethingthat I feel is really needed.
And I think that is what givesme that driving force every day
to get up and just continue todo more, despite the challenges,
is something that we know thatwe just have to do.
Speaker (30:35):
Given that, I want to um ask my next question, really,
just sort of within the framingof your expertise as a
filmmaker, because havingparticipated in a program like
CCF, although based in Barbados,when you participated, um, as
we already said, it broughttogether black filmmakers from
across the world, right?
(30:56):
Um it's really a diasporicprogram, which I find, you know,
amazing and very, verynecessary for the work that all
of us are doing when we'retalking about, you know,
building black histories, blackstories, black creative work.
And I think just from ahistorical perspective, there
(31:17):
are of course a lot ofsimilarities that can be drawn
between, for instance, theCaribbean and and the and
countries in Africa.
Um, and so for creatives suchas yourself who are coming
together, we don't really see asmuch of that collaboration.
And, you know, you can speak toit particularly from like a
(31:39):
filmmaking perspective, but um,you know, I think that that also
applies more generally beyondfilmmaking as well, right?
So what do you think really arethe barriers that exist um that
limit the extent to whichdeeper collaborations between
the regions are like, you know,impeding and impacting the ways
that we work together?
Speaker 2 (32:00):
Well, we start with the basics, right?
Um, as far as barriers isconcerned when coming to
filmmaking, the basics, youstart there, funding the funding
infrastructure, right?
So if you're based in theCaribbean, there are certain
financial barriers that we arenot preview to in the sense of
(32:23):
the accessibility and ease ofbeing qualified for certain
funding resources and also justbasic banking transactions in
the Caribbean becomes veryproblematic, right?
And um when I started a fewyears ago, because I'm still
pretty young in that industry,but when I started a few years
(32:47):
ago from Grenada, the industrywas not as advanced as it is
right now.
There wasn't that much supportin forging financial funding for
creatives who wanted to pursuethings like filmmaking and other
(33:10):
creative ventures.
So most Caribbean countries ormost small island countries like
ours face that fundinginfrastructure challenges and
also finding ways in which youcan now reach out to someone,
say like in Africa, toco-produce a film with.
(33:33):
So fast forward several yearslater, we have a new government
that prioritized the creativesector in Grenada, and film is
one of those sectors in whichattention is being placed.
(33:55):
So there are certain incentivesthat make it much easier.
There are certain um memorandumthat was signed by the
government with um certainAfrican countries.
So there is now relationshipsthat are being implemented to
make things a little bit easierfor not just funding resources,
(34:19):
but also human resources,cross-cultural exchanges, right?
And accessing um thoseterritories as well.
Another barrier that we find isthe distribution network,
right?
So um historically you wouldfind a lot of Caribbean
filmmakers um going through thefilm festival route, especially
(34:43):
for Caribbean film festivals.
So back then you had umCaribbean Tales, you had um
Silid Horizon, um, you hadTrinidad and Tobago Film
Festival, um, then you hadJamaica at a film festival,
Barbados and the film.
So in order for us to get somelevel of visibility for the work
(35:05):
that we were putting on, youwill see that a lot of us were
going through those spaces ofutilizing film festivals.
However, there's still adisconnect as well, right?
Because most people did noteven understand that that
opportunity was also available,right?
Because, you know, in theCaribbean, you just basically
(35:28):
learn.
You learn on your own.
You want to do something, youlearn on your own, right?
So that was another barrier,especially if you did not have
individuals in the diaspora thatcould have supported you and
show you the way as well.
Lack of formal co-productiontreaties that was existing
(35:51):
amongst different um Caribbeancountries as well as
international spaces.
So, again, making it a littlebit more difficult for us to
have these opportunities for ourproducers to go out there and
um get the work.
And even if you went on yourown quite often and you would
(36:12):
reach out to these internationalinfrastructures and spaces, you
also risk the possibility ofmaybe, um, let me let me try to
frame it very diplomatically,being cheated, right?
Um, because sometimes you justdon't know.
Because we we we still havethis full level of hope, right?
(36:34):
We believe, we are excited.
We're very passionate peoplefrom the Caribbean, right?
You just want your story to betold.
But if you don't have theexpertise, you rely on others
who sometimes just takeadvantage of you.
And you saw that happening alot, right?
And then the visibility gap,because um, the Caribbean is
(36:55):
also lumped into Latin America.
So we are not necessarilythat's through the distribution
chain, as well as giving us ourown identity, right?
And um, just the geographicallocation of how it is in the
Caribbean, traveling from onecountry to the next also was
very expensive.
So having this kind ofcollaboration amongst different
(37:20):
islands also poses ownchallenges when everyone wanted
to have the best production umindustry, right?
Because every island had theirown mandates and every island
had their own um intentions,right?
So you had all of thesedifferent barriers um when I
just started and still exist insome way, shape, or form still,
(37:43):
right?
But I must say the internet andalso the film festivals, the
Caribbean film festivals, andalso certain um online
infrastructures like um NancyTV, are providing opportunities
(38:05):
for Caribbean people to be seen.
And there are the internetprovides us an opportunity to do
further research and be able tonow get more visibility for the
work that we are doing.
So in spite of the fact thatthere were barriers, we are also
(38:26):
seeing all of the opportunitiesthat is coming on board, right,
in the last three, four, fiveyears, which I think the
Caribbean right now is reallybuzzing.
And having this bridge betweenthe Caribbean and Africa, as
well as the um North Americandiaspora and Europe, but most of
(38:46):
that synergy that is currentlythe intentionality, I should
say, that the government of theCaribbean now is advocating for
in reaching out and closing gapsbetween the Caribbean and
Africa to provide us with moreopportunities.
That to me is um revolutionary.
(39:07):
And it's also very inspiringfor emergent filmmakers and
seasons filmmakers right now tobe able to reach wider
audiences.
Speaker (39:18):
Certainly.
And I think that gets to, forme, one of the points of you
know, why we're even having thisdiscussion.
CCF recently announced theirfirst co-development grant, um
or the winners rather, of theirfirst co-development grant.
So to your point about, youknow, different organizations
and film festivals reallysupporting creatives, these are
(39:41):
you know really important forfilmmakers and other creatives
looking for avenues to reallydistribute their work, um gain
more international recognitionand you know, boost
collaboration.
I additionally want to ask,sort of in your view, because
you know we're talking about umcollaboration and black
(40:02):
storytelling, what does it looklike ideally for you, you know,
if you were to envision a futureof really mass, not mass, uh,
but you know, uh an ideal avenueor an ideal pathway by which
black creatives were reallycollaborating with each other
(40:23):
across different islands, acrossdifferent nations.
What would it look like andfeel like for you?
Speaker 2 (40:28):
Wow.
Um what that future would looklike for me.
What is is actually presentright now and it's current right
now, um, because CCF isactually in um in motion, right,
and making it um happen, right?
But ideally, that future lookslike for me where a filmmaker
(40:51):
from Grenada and a filmmakerfrom either Nigeria, South
Africa, Ghana can access ashared co-production fund
specifically designed for theGlobal South partnership, you
know, with um no requirementsthat you have to go through the
(41:14):
Western or the traditionalinstitutional ways to qualify
for.
That's one aspect of it.
The second aspect of it is whatwe alluded to earlier, was
direct distribution pipelines.
Having the opportunity to be inAfrica um two years ago and
(41:35):
seeing one, the vastness ofaudiences, right?
And there is a quest to learn,that cultural exchange, right,
between the Caribbean andAfrica, right?
So that direct distributionpipeline between Africa and the
Caribbean markets, I think thatis huge for us to expand
(41:55):
streaming and broadcast dealsbetween the regions.
Um what the future looks like.
I would say a well resourcedphysical and virtual
infrastructure where it allowsus to meet annually and keep
filmmakers in activerelationships year-round, um,
(42:17):
not just once a year.
And, you know, President andCTF and the entire team there,
they already started that.
And there are other individualswho are following suit and has
partnered up with them to makethis a reality, right?
Learning, learning exchanges.
(42:39):
That's another thing, right?
And just having thatopportunity for someone from the
Caribbean to get thatopportunity to maybe go study
film in, say, Nigeria or Ghana,right?
And learn from them how they'redoing it, because they are just
(42:59):
producing things, right?
And the quality of the films istop-notch, right?
So just having that opportunityfor that um educational
exchange, right?
That to me is important.
And um where we can see morefusion, more fusion of um
(43:21):
Caribbean slash African umstorytelling, because we have
shared experiences.
There's only um a matter oftime that we're seeing more or
we're discovering more fusion inthe storytelling.
I think those add so muchdepth.
That's one of my projects thatI had actually proposed for this
(43:44):
year to CCL because I wanted todo a project that is very
inclusive of the dynamicsbetween the Caribbean and
Africa.
So I'm excited to see what thatwould look like.
And this is what That futurelooks like an opportunity to go
to a market, a film market,where resources would be
(44:06):
available to us to say, yes, webelieve in this story.
We understand why this needs tobe made, with us having to
justify why we think it'simportant.
Because fundamentally andthrough lived experiences, they
know the reason why it needs tobe made.
(44:27):
So yes, that's a very importantquestion.
I think that the final note onthat I would say is, and let me,
let me, I want to frame itright.
The future I see is a worldwhere the economic model for
black storytelling does notrequire us as black filmmakers
(44:52):
or Caribbean filmmakers todilute our cultural specificity
to access the market, where therichness of our particular story
is the selling point.
I think that to me would be thefuture that I envision.
Speaker (45:12):
That's beautiful.
Thank you.
I couldn't have you on herewithout asking you about some of
your favorite films.
Um, just because I'm alwaysinterested.
And so while of course the thefocus of our conversation today
has been around cross-culturalstorytelling, so they they can
be cross-cultural if you'd like,um, but they don't have to be.
(45:35):
But I'd love to for you toshare with our listeners um some
of your favorite examples of,you know, Caribbean films and
the way that they shape and, youknow, really reflect who we are
in our histories andexperiences.
Speaker 2 (45:50):
That is just an unfair question for someone who
programmed.
I know.
Speaker 1 (45:56):
So much films, right?
Oh my gosh.
Oh my goodness.
Speaker 2 (46:02):
Um where do I start?
So um a staple for me is theharder they come, right?
Um, right?
Because that's one of the firstfilms as a kid I recall seeing
that was Caribbean, it wasCaribbean people on screen,
(46:25):
right?
And it was just so raw, right?
And just so cultured, right?
Um, so for me, um, The HeartDidn't It Count was was one of
that.
And then um through my processwhen I was actually producing
the Scarlet of Mother's Dream,there was um a film called Um, I
(46:49):
think a Barrel Stories Project.
Um, but that was done by umLisa Haywood, she's from
Barbados, and to me that justspoke and it expanded on what it
was that um I was doing.
And um there is another film,it's not Caribbean, but it spoke
(47:12):
to the sense of familiar umcultural exchanges, right, and
experiences.
There was a film called TheNanny, and in it um basically a
Nancy was the protagonist inthat film, right?
And the domestic um worker wasAfrican, and it just the same,
(47:37):
the same concept um of the samebarrel child um syndrome aspect,
right, was layered with that ofthe Anancy story that was
brought into it.
So that folklore aspect cameinto that space.
Um, I thought that was areally, really nice um film.
And then Machel Montano film,uh Bazodee.
(48:00):
So Bazodee to me was a filmthat I think is worth studying,
right?
Because it dealt with thatwhole intersectionality between
the African, Caribbean, and thenthe Indian, right?
When we were in um Ivy Courseum two years ago, and we were
(48:21):
talking about Caribbean filmsthat picked up distribution, I
believe that was one of thefilms that picked up
distribution in Africa, right?
And it was well received.
And I was like, wow.
So you see, there is a desirefor our films to be seen, right?
Quality films to be seen.
(48:42):
And I think because of limitedresources, most times we limit
ourselves to making short filmsbecause that's what we can
financially manage.
But the opportunity to makefeature-length films, um, and
that's another thing, ideally,the future would have would be
(49:03):
having more feature-length,high-valued, production-valued
film that is representing uscoming out with our voices made
by our people, um, coming outfrom the Caribbean, that there
is no way we cannot get the thevisibility that we know is
(49:28):
possible for stories coming outof the Caribbean.
Speaker (49:31):
I know I asked a hard question, but you also just
answered my final question, um,which was which was in a way,
sort of, you know, how how canthese co-productions um either
within the region or, you know,interregionally, um, really help
shape global perceptions aboutblack storytelling and
(49:54):
storytellers.
And I think you've reallycovered that for us, right?
Um, by being able to share thatit's not, you know, on one
hand, of course, as you weresaying earlier, it's about the
pooling of resources, of about,you know, better distribution,
etc.
But really, I think what I tookaway from what you said a
(50:15):
moment ago was the fact that whowe are and what makes us
special um when it comes to thework that filmmakers and other
creatives are doing should be atthe heart of our work and um
instead not not needing todiminish it for the sake of
(50:35):
getting production and you know,other details like that.
And so I ultimately really wantto thank you, Meshida, for
joining us um for this episode.
I think this is one that Ilearned a lot from.
Um, I will, of course, includefor our listeners um links to
the films that you mentioned,and of course, links to Scars of
(50:57):
Our Mother's Dreams.
I really enjoyed watching it.
Um, and I think, you know,several of our listeners will as
well.
And so with that, thank you somuch for again being a guest on
the show, sharing more about notonly your work, but also the
work of Caribbean Tales MediaGroup.
Um, for our listeners tuningin, for seasoned filmmakers, for
(51:19):
budding filmmakers, I cannotrecommend enough um checking out
Caribbean Tales CCFprogramming.
It is one that I think brings,again, together storytellers
from the region, from across theum Black diaspora to do amazing
work, right?
To continue pivoting, um,sharing, learning from one
(51:41):
another, and really building upum the work of Black
storytelling and filmmaking forus to learn and work together
from one another.
And so with that, thank you somuch all for tuning in.
Links, as always, will be onour website in our show notes,
etc.
Until next time, look more.
Welcome to Strictly Facts, a guide to Caribbean
history and culture, hosted byme, Dr.
Alexandria Miller.
Strictly Facts teaches thehistory, politics, and activism
of the Caribbean and connectsthese themes to contemporary
music and popular culture.
Hello, hello everyone.
And welcome back to anotherepisode of Strictly Facts, a
(00:24):
guide to Caribbean history andculture, where we explore the
stories, histories, and culturallegacies that shape the
Caribbean and its globaldiaspora.
One of the most powerful thingsabout some of the works and
things that we create is filmand its ability to hold memory.
Through moving images, sound,archives, landscapes, and
(00:46):
storytelling, filmmakers canpreserve histories that might
otherwise be forgotten,challenge the narratives we
inherit, and create new ways ofseeing ourselves in our
communities.
And for the Caribbean, where somuch of our history has been
shaped by colonialism,migration, displacement, and
fragmented archives, filmmakingbecomes ever more significant.
(01:10):
It becomes a way of reclaimingvoice, a way of documenting
lives and experiences that havetoo often existed at the
margins, a way of connectingpeople across islands,
languages, and diasporas.
Today's episode explores theintersections of Caribbean
filmmaking, memory, history, andblack storytelling,
(01:34):
spotlighting how filmmakersnavigate the tensions between
archive and imagination, and howfilm collectives like the
Caribbean Tales Media Groupscrossed Continental Forum have
helped shape Black diasporiccultural production.
Because Caribbean storytellinghas never only been about
(01:54):
entertainment, it has also beenabout preservation, resistance,
survival, and imagining futuresotherwise.
Joining us today to talk abouther experiences and the work of
the Cross-Continental Forum isdirector, producer, and creative
industry strategist, MeschidaPhilip, whose work brings film
(02:16):
production and screen industrydevelopment in the Caribbean
together.
And so, Meschida, thank you somuch for joining us for this
episode.
Do let our listeners know alittle bit more about you,
where, of course, in the regionyou call home, and what inspired
your passions as a filmmakerand storyteller.
And ultimately, whatspecifically about film spoke to
(02:37):
you as a medium?
Speaker 2 (02:39):
Hi, thank you so much for this opportunity.
And it's wonderful being heretoday.
And as you warmly introduce me,my name is Meschida Philips.
I am Grenadian born and Ishare space currently between
Grenada and the US.
I've been doing that now forsome years.
(02:59):
My focus is documentaryfilmmaking, as well as I'm now
dabbling into new media, um,which is really, really
exciting.
And I am also theExecutive Director of Mprojekts Creative Group and Founder and Festival Director of the 12°N, 61°W Grenada Film Festival.
I've been doing that now foreight seasons, and um, yeah,
(03:24):
it's a good time.
Um, as far as film isconcerned, coming from a small
island like Grenada, where theculture is so rich, and a big
part of my history and my livedexperiences come from a space of
migration.
(03:44):
So um that was the epitus forme getting into the film
business as a director producer,but we'll talk about that a
little bit later.
I've been dabbling in thecreative space for years.
My trajectory spans from musicproduction all the way now to
(04:05):
actual film as the medium thatI'm outputting.
Speaker (04:09):
So, yeah, a little bit about me.
It's wonderful to have you.
I was actually going to startwith that question about, you
know, how did growing up inGrenada really shape the kinds
of stories you feel compelled totell now as a filmmaker?
Speaker 2 (04:24):
As I mentioned, um, Grenada is a small island with a
very large history.
And one of the most impactfulmemory for me was during the
Grenada Revolution.
I was a kid then.
Um, and that is a staple in mytimeline because not too long
(04:44):
after that, about two yearsafter that, my mom migrated to
the US.
And that was a very definingmoment for me.
I was on the 10, I'm not gonnasay my aged, but I was under 10
years old at the time.
And um the last of threechildren by my mom, and um, she
(05:08):
was my anchor, and um unaware ofhow long um she would have been
gone for, that became a thing.
So basically, I was separatedfrom my mom for about seven,
eight years um until we werereunited again.
So that bond was broken umduring that time.
(05:32):
But um, she has always beenpresent in our lives, um, but we
did not have that intimacy ofthe relationship, you know.
Um, so yeah, that kind ofsubconsciously put things in
place, and it's not until I wasan adult um I started to really
(05:55):
explore personal issues and howI was actually handling certain
encounters in my life, and um Istarted to think about who I am,
why I was responding to thingsthe way I responded to the
things, why I had suchdifficulties in connecting with
(06:20):
people, trusting people, and thewhole nine yards.
And I actually um sought outtherapy to find answers.
And when I had the opportunityto go into grad school, um, that
was my thesis.
I wanted to figure out if therewas anyone else that shared
(06:41):
similar experiences like I did.
So yeah, this was just a thesisprocess in me trying to figure
out answers to the question.
And that just led intosomething completely different.
Speaker (06:52):
Thank you for sharing that.
You know, we oftentimes talkabout this concept that what Dr.
Claudette Crawford Brown callsbarrel children, right?
Um, and having had theopportunity to watch your first
feature film, which is entitledScars of Our Mother's Dreams,
which I will, of course, linkfor our listeners to also check
out, it raises, as you weresaying through your thesis work,
(07:16):
that it wasn't just anindependent um, you know,
situation.
It wasn't just you, right?
It wasn't just the children ofGrenada.
It's a Caribbean-wide, but ofcourse, you know, worldwide when
we get into the politics ofmigration and necessity and all
of those things.
But your film was previously apart of the Cross-Continental
(07:41):
Forum.
Um, and I think really dealswith some of these lived
realities and the aftermath of,you know, barrel children's
experiences or what Dr.
Crawford Brown calls barrelchildren's experiences.
And so for you, what emotionalor you know, historical
questions really inspired thefilm?
I'll let you answer firstbefore I take give some of my
(08:04):
takes.
But um, additionally, why wasit really important for you to
explore these themes, especiallyof like, you know, emotional
trauma, childhood abandonment,things like that?
Speaker 2 (08:15):
As I mentioned, the film began basically with my own
quest to seek answers.
It was my lived experiencegrowing up with not just one
absent parent, but both myparents migrated.
My dad migrated years before.
Um, and my mom, who was the thestaple, the foundation, in my
(08:40):
um experiences, she then left.
Um, so for years I carried thatwound um without fully
understanding it or having thelanguage for it.
You know, growing up in theCaribbean, you're basically told
what to do.
Like you don't question, youdon't question what adults say,
(09:03):
um, the elephant in the room,you know, you really don't
really express certain things.
And um I think having theexperience of the consistency of
my mom in my life, meaning backthen it was um mail, you used
to write mail, right?
(09:24):
And letters.
So um just imagine um I wouldbe experiencing something.
I write my mom.
It would take maybe like twoweeks for her to receive it, and
then another two weeks for herto respond, for me to get her
response.
Um, so you're talking about amonth thereabout, give or take,
(09:44):
right?
So by the time I get a responseand she's trying to nurture us
and and and soothe us, thatissue is already gone, right?
The urgency in dealing with umthe situation at hand was not
something that was tangible.
Um, so we had to seek otherways in which, meaning my sister
(10:07):
and my brother, um, we had toseek other ways in which we were
comforting each other andraising each other in that
sense.
So my eldest sister wasresponsible for for us, right?
Because she understood things alittle bit different.
So, which is quite interestingbecause her experiences as the
first is completely differentfrom my experience as the last,
(10:32):
and then my brother in themiddle.
So when I started this journey,girl, it was not pretty.
Because now I am askingquestions.
And it's like, why you want todiscuss dirty laundry or why you
want to bring this up rightnow?
(10:52):
And you know, what is theproblem, you know?
And my family was not reallycomprehending, in my opinion,
um, what I was trying to seekanswers for, because now we
categorize it as differentthings.
It can be either selfishness,it can be either you're
(11:14):
difficult.
There are so many differentdescriptors, right, for the way
in which someone would respondto things without having
answers, because we neverdiscuss these things.
So I recalled having my mom andmy my oldest um sister who sat
them down when we were havingconversations.
It wasn't pretty.
(11:35):
It was really, really intense,right?
But we had to discuss it.
And only then as an adult, Icame to find out that my mom did
not just leave.
She left for vacation, found anopportunity, stayed, and that
led to her working and makingcertain sacrifices in order to
(11:58):
give us a better lifestyle,right?
But as a child, you don't knowthis.
And these are conversationsthat is not discussed within
families.
So by the time we werereconnected, like I mentioned,
the distance and that emotionalbond that should be so easy
(12:19):
between a mom and a child was nolonger there.
So now you have a whole slew ofdifferent emotions now to
figure out.
Am I rebelling?
Am I doing this?
Am I doing that?
So it's like you're now deemeda certain way, right?
So these were moments of hardtruth.
And I think at the end, itbecame better.
(12:45):
Um, and while going through umthis research to prepare myself
for my thesis film, that's whenI discovered the barrel trial
syndrome.
I did not know this wasactually a terminology.
And I discovered um Dr.
Crawford.
I think I actually went down toMaryland, if I'm not mistaken,
(13:09):
to meet with her, to havefurther conversations about it.
So I really went deep into it.
I spoke to different umpsychologists and therapists to
understand better.
Because as a documentaryfilmmaker, I think you have um a
responsibility to do adequateresearch because now you are
(13:32):
actually informing people ofcertain things, right?
And I wanted this to answerquestions.
I did not want my voice in thefilm initially.
I did not want it to be like,oh my gosh, here she goes,
right?
Self-serving.
So hence the reason why Iactually sought out different
(13:53):
people who had similarexperiences to get this layer.
And I recall when we wereediting the film, I said it just
felt empty because somethingwas missing.
And it was my personalexperiences that opened up the
film, but allow other umindividuals to answer the
(14:14):
questions that was posed.
Is this a problem?
Speaker (14:18):
I realize we've been using the term and not all of
our listeners might be familiar.
Um, and so before continuing onthe conversation, I just want
to give a brief nod to that.
So for anybody who's not aware,um Dr.
Crawford's term barrel childrenreally refers to the phenomenon
in which, you know, childrenare left back home in the
(14:38):
Caribbean or, you know,certainly other places as well.
Um, but from a Caribbeancontext, they're left at home in
the Caribbean, often under thecare of grandmothers and aunties
and, you know, other familymembers, while their parents go
abroad, usually to the, youknow, global north, US, UK,
Canada, et cetera, um, really insearch for better
(15:00):
opportunities.
And as Meschida was sort ofpointing at, right, there's
obviously the disconnect betweenthe emotional care and
connection that espouses becauseof the distance, but you may
have um oftentimes the morefinancial resources, right?
That's also where the termbarrel comes in because you may
(15:20):
be able to get the shoes andthe, you know, marina and
whatever it is for school thatyour parents are sending home to
you.
Um, but that emotional distanceis certainly there.
But as you were you weretalking, that was certainly
something that I thought ofbeing able to watch the film,
right?
And see how I think I wasreally captivated that you
(15:42):
started with your story, right?
And also then parallel off toother people's experiences.
And I think for me, it was oneof the things that I really
greatly took away andappreciated, especially at the
end of um the film, was hearinghow people are parenting
themselves, right?
Because you're now speaking tothese people as adults who are
(16:05):
reflecting back on theirexperiences, um, the hurt that
they experienced, but also howthat has then not only
translated into how they aim tobe parents, but also the work
that they are doing within thecommunity to better support
others who are have gone throughsort of similar instances.
(16:25):
And so for me, it really led tothis question of like, what
power do you think film holds inbeing able to impact this
memory?
Um, just because ultimately,you know, we can write about
things, right?
You know, this could have beena research paper, for instance,
or something, right?
Um, much like Dr.
Crawford's work, but it is aspecial thing.
(16:48):
Um, and I don't know if I havethe word for it, um, but it's a
special thing to see it capturedin film this way.
And so, sort of how do you hopethat being able to capture this
through film impacts memory andsocial change?
And ultimately, whatconversations were you hoping
that the film would inspire?
Speaker 2 (17:08):
Initially, I did not know what kind of conversations
the film was going to inspire.
I honestly had no clue.
I just knew I wanted to tellthe story, and I'm like, okay,
so the story is told, but I didnot realize how deep this
resonate globally.
And as you said earlier,although the film featured
(17:33):
Grenadians, this is a universalissue.
Migration and immigration, themigrant tale is something that
all cultures experience, right?
And people have differentreasons for migrating.
Um, but it comes down to thefundamental part in most times
(17:57):
wanting to do better for theirchildren.
And out of everyone that Ispoke to at the time and
continue to speak to after thisfilm was premiered, that is the
same sort of conclusion that wasdrawn.
(18:17):
We migrated, we left because wewanted to do better.
But as life has it sometimes,you have people who start new
families.
There are those who migrate andnever look back.
So there is childhoodabandonment that takes place
because they start a whole newlife and forget about where they
came from.
Then you have um situationslike myself, where there is
(18:42):
years of disconnection, andsometimes it's very hard for you
to ever regain that emotionalconnection with your parent.
So there is always adisconnect.
Then you have the viewpoint ofthe parent and their experiences
as well, that this film did notreally address to um, because
(19:05):
we only took one aspect of it,right?
The sacrifices of the parentsas well, leaving your family and
having, depending on what jobyou took out here, like in my
mom's case, she was a domesticworker.
So basically herresponsibilities were raising
other people's children.
(19:26):
Whereas your kids are left andbeing raised by someone else.
So you have that um emotionaland mental and psychological
issues that she also and parentslike her had to deal with,
right?
Then you have the issues of thecaregiver who now take up the
(19:48):
responsibility and become thatstaple for that child.
And when reunification comesaround, that child now is
leaving the safety of thecaretaker and whatever
relationships that they probablyhad with that caretaker now.
So it's it's just a lot, it'svery complex, right?
(20:10):
And very dynamic.
So what I recognized is thatthis film served us was a
conversation starter, and it wasum a small window into people
looking in observationally tosay it's not just me and how can
(20:34):
I do better?
You see, because our societyand our culture is not one where
therapy was introduced at avery young performative period.
So there is the silence and theunspoken um elephant in the
(20:57):
room syndrome that is takingplace, and you just have to know
how to fix it.
So when we were finished withthe production of this film,
you're hearing from thesubjects, the majority of the
subjects who were part of this,thank you.
Thank you for giving me anopportunity to verbalize how I
(21:21):
felt all these years and to getit out.
And it's an opportunity forthem themselves to make
different decisions in how theyare choosing to parent their own
children.
You see, several of them hadthe opportunity to leave and
they made the decision to staybecause they did not want their
(21:43):
children to go through the samekind of trauma that they
themselves went through.
Because it's not in all thesituations, but sometimes you
will see from Dr.
Crawford Brown's um study.
There are abuse that takesplace, physical, sexually abused
(22:06):
that takes place with kids leftbehind, um, broken homes.
I called it the waitingsyndrome because that's how I,
that's how I had described myperiod and for myself, right?
The waiting syndrome.
Because I waited for so long.
And I realized that that alsotranscended in my adult life.
(22:27):
Because whenever I was dealingwith situations, nothing was
urgent for me.
I always waited.
I was waiting to see what willhappen.
I am waiting to see this.
So I had to like really makesense.
So coming out of this, thisfilm also gave me some personal
(22:48):
insights in how to heal myselfas well and become a stronger
version of myself.
You're right.
There is something about seeingsomething on screen, hearing
people's voice, seeing theemotions, right?
Versus that of just reading it.
(23:09):
Because now it becomes realthrough the visual means.
So this was an opportunity inthis film where the
conversations that I was havingwith these people provided an
opportunity for hearing.
To me, that's the takeaway withthis from the historical
(23:31):
context and how it shapedmemories and social changes.
Speaker (23:37):
Thank you.
I think that that broughttogether a lot of my thoughts,
just, you know, having watchedit and being able to, especially
at the end, as I wasmentioning, see people hug their
own kids, right?
Having told this story abouttheir own experiences as
children, and then see them hugtheir own kids, you know, and
grandchildren, right?
(23:57):
See how this experience hasshaped them as a person, but
also the adult that they choseto become and how they chose to
parent, to nurture, right, tosort of end cycles.
And I I very much so agreethat, you know, there is a power
in being able to visualizethat, um, that, you know, I
(24:19):
think wouldn't be captured insuch a heart-wrenching way,
right?
On paper or, you know, forinstance, in a different medium.
You were talking about otherpeople's responses to the film,
right?
And, you know, that this isvery much so a global issue.
And that, of course, brings meto the cross-continental forum
because um your film waspremiered there a while back.
(24:41):
And so for those who areunfamiliar, um, the Caribbean
Tales Media Group has a what oneof their staple programs called
the Cross-Continental Forum.
It's actually running nowthrough September and
specializes on bringing blackproducers across, you know,
Africa, the Caribbean, Canada,the UK, and Latin America to
(25:03):
really foster sustainableindustry growth within
filmmaking.
And wanted to ask you,personally, given your
experiences having participated,um, what was your time in the
program like?
And how do you think it helpedshape you as a filmmaker and
strengthen your relationshipwith black creatives across the
(25:24):
world?
Speaker 2 (25:25):
Um, participating in CCF, the Dark Girl, um, won it
in Barbados two years ago.
It was a very transformationalexperience because it placed me
in a room where producers andfilmmakers from across the
Caribbean and Africa and thewider diaspora were in the same
(25:51):
safe space.
And we had an opportunity to behonest about the fact that all
of us were grappling withsimilar or the same fundamental
questions about whose story getstold and who gets to tell them.
You know, there's aresponsibility, right?
(26:12):
A fundamental responsibility inthat.
And I honestly believe afterhaving the opportunity to
premiere Scars one at CaribbeanTales and also traveling with
this film to other uminternational spaces that had
(26:32):
very diverse audiences, ifsomeone else told that story,
I'm not sure if it would havehad the same kind of impact.
But the mere fact that we arein this particular situation, I
had the opportunity to go in andlisten and tell the story not
(26:57):
just from their experiences, butalso from my own personal
experiences, gave this filmdepth and gave the and increased
the production value for thisfilm that it is not just a film,
but it's also um an archivalpiece, right, that can be
(27:18):
studied and dissected andtransformed and also expanded
on, right?
Because in as much as we areliving in a very digitalized
space where things, you know,there is a sense of um
connection, the ease ofconnection is still better, the
(27:40):
trauma of migration still existsunderneath, right?
Because now, I'm not sure whichone is worse, honestly.
If waiting four weeks to get aresponse and not knowing what
your mom is doing versus theurgency of seeing that your mom
is living a good life or yourdad is living a good life in the
(28:03):
foreign space, right?
And you are separated fromthem, right?
And you don't have that.
And in the event that they wenton and have additional children
outside of the kids leftbehind, there is that sense of
competition and belonging thatis there.
(28:26):
So the issue is still somethingthat is quite relevant because
people are still migrating.
You see what I'm saying?
So having the opportunity toshowcase this project for the
audiences that this wasintentionally made for, that
(28:50):
also gave me the language andthe strategy that I wanted to
focus on doing more work from asocial context that had deeper
meaning and understanding.
So a lot of the things that Ido, I really focus on the
(29:11):
psychological and social impactof our people.
And I try to put it forth whereyou're left with questions or
answers to the questions thatwas raised in the piece.
You see what I'm saying?
As an opportunity to start aconversation and a discussion
(29:32):
around it.
So um, yeah, both um CCF inBarbados and the festivals
provided me with a path forwardto tell more Caribbean um
stories and understand howimportant Caribbean cinema is in
(29:53):
this whole ecosystem.
Because representation is hugeand lack of representation for
so many years have beenexisting.
So myself and other Caribbeanfilmmakers who are taking up
this film of telling ourstories, our experiences through
(30:16):
our lens, that is somethingthat I feel is really needed.
And I think that is what givesme that driving force every day
to get up and just continue todo more, despite the challenges,
is something that we know thatwe just have to do.
Speaker (30:35):
Given that, I want to um ask my next question, really,
just sort of within the framingof your expertise as a
filmmaker, because havingparticipated in a program like
CCF, although based in Barbados,when you participated, um, as
we already said, it broughttogether black filmmakers from
across the world, right?
(30:56):
Um it's really a diasporicprogram, which I find, you know,
amazing and very, verynecessary for the work that all
of us are doing when we'retalking about, you know,
building black histories, blackstories, black creative work.
And I think just from ahistorical perspective, there
(31:17):
are of course a lot ofsimilarities that can be drawn
between, for instance, theCaribbean and and the and
countries in Africa.
Um, and so for creatives suchas yourself who are coming
together, we don't really see asmuch of that collaboration.
And, you know, you can speak toit particularly from like a
(31:39):
filmmaking perspective, but um,you know, I think that that also
applies more generally beyondfilmmaking as well, right?
So what do you think really arethe barriers that exist um that
limit the extent to whichdeeper collaborations between
the regions are like, you know,impeding and impacting the ways
that we work together?
Speaker 2 (32:00):
Well, we start with the basics, right?
Um, as far as barriers isconcerned when coming to
filmmaking, the basics, youstart there, funding the funding
infrastructure, right?
So if you're based in theCaribbean, there are certain
financial barriers that we arenot preview to in the sense of
(32:23):
the accessibility and ease ofbeing qualified for certain
funding resources and also justbasic banking transactions in
the Caribbean becomes veryproblematic, right?
And um when I started a fewyears ago, because I'm still
pretty young in that industry,but when I started a few years
(32:47):
ago from Grenada, the industrywas not as advanced as it is
right now.
There wasn't that much supportin forging financial funding for
creatives who wanted to pursuethings like filmmaking and other
(33:10):
creative ventures.
So most Caribbean countries ormost small island countries like
ours face that fundinginfrastructure challenges and
also finding ways in which youcan now reach out to someone,
say like in Africa, toco-produce a film with.
(33:33):
So fast forward several yearslater, we have a new government
that prioritized the creativesector in Grenada, and film is
one of those sectors in whichattention is being placed.
(33:55):
So there are certain incentivesthat make it much easier.
There are certain um memorandumthat was signed by the
government with um certainAfrican countries.
So there is now relationshipsthat are being implemented to
make things a little bit easierfor not just funding resources,
(34:19):
but also human resources,cross-cultural exchanges, right?
And accessing um thoseterritories as well.
Another barrier that we find isthe distribution network,
right?
So um historically you wouldfind a lot of Caribbean
filmmakers um going through thefilm festival route, especially
(34:43):
for Caribbean film festivals.
So back then you had umCaribbean Tales, you had um
Silid Horizon, um, you hadTrinidad and Tobago Film
Festival, um, then you hadJamaica at a film festival,
Barbados and the film.
So in order for us to get somelevel of visibility for the work
(35:05):
that we were putting on, youwill see that a lot of us were
going through those spaces ofutilizing film festivals.
However, there's still adisconnect as well, right?
Because most people did noteven understand that that
opportunity was also available,right?
Because, you know, in theCaribbean, you just basically
(35:28):
learn.
You learn on your own.
You want to do something, youlearn on your own, right?
So that was another barrier,especially if you did not have
individuals in the diaspora thatcould have supported you and
show you the way as well.
Lack of formal co-productiontreaties that was existing
(35:51):
amongst different um Caribbeancountries as well as
international spaces.
So, again, making it a littlebit more difficult for us to
have these opportunities for ourproducers to go out there and
um get the work.
And even if you went on yourown quite often and you would
(36:12):
reach out to these internationalinfrastructures and spaces, you
also risk the possibility ofmaybe, um, let me let me try to
frame it very diplomatically,being cheated, right?
Um, because sometimes you justdon't know.
Because we we we still havethis full level of hope, right?
(36:34):
We believe, we are excited.
We're very passionate peoplefrom the Caribbean, right?
You just want your story to betold.
But if you don't have theexpertise, you rely on others
who sometimes just takeadvantage of you.
And you saw that happening alot, right?
And then the visibility gap,because um, the Caribbean is
(36:55):
also lumped into Latin America.
So we are not necessarilythat's through the distribution
chain, as well as giving us ourown identity, right?
And um, just the geographicallocation of how it is in the
Caribbean, traveling from onecountry to the next also was
very expensive.
So having this kind ofcollaboration amongst different
(37:20):
islands also poses ownchallenges when everyone wanted
to have the best production umindustry, right?
Because every island had theirown mandates and every island
had their own um intentions,right?
So you had all of thesedifferent barriers um when I
just started and still exist insome way, shape, or form still,
(37:43):
right?
But I must say the internet andalso the film festivals, the
Caribbean film festivals, andalso certain um online
infrastructures like um NancyTV, are providing opportunities
(38:05):
for Caribbean people to be seen.
And there are the internetprovides us an opportunity to do
further research and be able tonow get more visibility for the
work that we are doing.
So in spite of the fact thatthere were barriers, we are also
(38:26):
seeing all of the opportunitiesthat is coming on board, right,
in the last three, four, fiveyears, which I think the
Caribbean right now is reallybuzzing.
And having this bridge betweenthe Caribbean and Africa, as
well as the um North Americandiaspora and Europe, but most of
(38:46):
that synergy that is currentlythe intentionality, I should
say, that the government of theCaribbean now is advocating for
in reaching out and closing gapsbetween the Caribbean and
Africa to provide us with moreopportunities.
That to me is um revolutionary.
(39:07):
And it's also very inspiringfor emergent filmmakers and
seasons filmmakers right now tobe able to reach wider
audiences.
Speaker (39:18):
Certainly.
And I think that gets to, forme, one of the points of you
know, why we're even having thisdiscussion.
CCF recently announced theirfirst co-development grant, um
or the winners rather, of theirfirst co-development grant.
So to your point about, youknow, different organizations
and film festivals reallysupporting creatives, these are
(39:41):
you know really important forfilmmakers and other creatives
looking for avenues to reallydistribute their work, um gain
more international recognitionand you know, boost
collaboration.
I additionally want to ask,sort of in your view, because
you know we're talking about umcollaboration and black
(40:02):
storytelling, what does it looklike ideally for you, you know,
if you were to envision a futureof really mass, not mass, uh,
but you know, uh an ideal avenueor an ideal pathway by which
black creatives were reallycollaborating with each other
(40:23):
across different islands, acrossdifferent nations.
What would it look like andfeel like for you?
Speaker 2 (40:28):
Wow.
Um what that future would looklike for me.
What is is actually presentright now and it's current right
now, um, because CCF isactually in um in motion, right,
and making it um happen, right?
But ideally, that future lookslike for me where a filmmaker
(40:51):
from Grenada and a filmmakerfrom either Nigeria, South
Africa, Ghana can access ashared co-production fund
specifically designed for theGlobal South partnership, you
know, with um no requirementsthat you have to go through the
(41:14):
Western or the traditionalinstitutional ways to qualify
for.
That's one aspect of it.
The second aspect of it is whatwe alluded to earlier, was
direct distribution pipelines.
Having the opportunity to be inAfrica um two years ago and
(41:35):
seeing one, the vastness ofaudiences, right?
And there is a quest to learn,that cultural exchange, right,
between the Caribbean andAfrica, right?
So that direct distributionpipeline between Africa and the
Caribbean markets, I think thatis huge for us to expand
(41:55):
streaming and broadcast dealsbetween the regions.
Um what the future looks like.
I would say a well resourcedphysical and virtual
infrastructure where it allowsus to meet annually and keep
filmmakers in activerelationships year-round, um,
(42:17):
not just once a year.
And, you know, President andCTF and the entire team there,
they already started that.
And there are other individualswho are following suit and has
partnered up with them to makethis a reality, right?
Learning, learning exchanges.
(42:39):
That's another thing, right?
And just having thatopportunity for someone from the
Caribbean to get thatopportunity to maybe go study
film in, say, Nigeria or Ghana,right?
And learn from them how they'redoing it, because they are just
(42:59):
producing things, right?
And the quality of the films istop-notch, right?
So just having that opportunityfor that um educational
exchange, right?
That to me is important.
And um where we can see morefusion, more fusion of um
(43:21):
Caribbean slash African umstorytelling, because we have
shared experiences.
There's only um a matter oftime that we're seeing more or
we're discovering more fusion inthe storytelling.
I think those add so muchdepth.
That's one of my projects thatI had actually proposed for this
(43:44):
year to CCL because I wanted todo a project that is very
inclusive of the dynamicsbetween the Caribbean and
Africa.
So I'm excited to see what thatwould look like.
And this is what That futurelooks like an opportunity to go
to a market, a film market,where resources would be
(44:06):
available to us to say, yes, webelieve in this story.
We understand why this needs tobe made, with us having to
justify why we think it'simportant.
Because fundamentally andthrough lived experiences, they
know the reason why it needs tobe made.
(44:27):
So yes, that's a very importantquestion.
I think that the final note onthat I would say is, and let me,
let me, I want to frame itright.
The future I see is a worldwhere the economic model for
black storytelling does notrequire us as black filmmakers
(44:52):
or Caribbean filmmakers todilute our cultural specificity
to access the market, where therichness of our particular story
is the selling point.
I think that to me would be thefuture that I envision.
Speaker (45:12):
That's beautiful.
Thank you.
I couldn't have you on herewithout asking you about some of
your favorite films.
Um, just because I'm alwaysinterested.
And so while of course the thefocus of our conversation today
has been around cross-culturalstorytelling, so they they can
be cross-cultural if you'd like,um, but they don't have to be.
(45:35):
But I'd love to for you toshare with our listeners um some
of your favorite examples of,you know, Caribbean films and
the way that they shape and, youknow, really reflect who we are
in our histories andexperiences.
Speaker 2 (45:50):
That is just an unfair question for someone who
programmed.
I know.
Speaker 1 (45:56):
So much films, right?
Oh my gosh.
Oh my goodness.
Speaker 2 (46:02):
Um where do I start?
So um a staple for me is theharder they come, right?
Um, right?
Because that's one of the firstfilms as a kid I recall seeing
that was Caribbean, it wasCaribbean people on screen,
(46:25):
right?
And it was just so raw, right?
And just so cultured, right?
Um, so for me, um, The HeartDidn't It Count was was one of
that.
And then um through my processwhen I was actually producing
the Scarlet of Mother's Dream,there was um a film called Um, I
(46:49):
think a Barrel Stories Project.
Um, but that was done by umLisa Haywood, she's from
Barbados, and to me that justspoke and it expanded on what it
was that um I was doing.
And um there is another film,it's not Caribbean, but it spoke
(47:12):
to the sense of familiar umcultural exchanges, right, and
experiences.
There was a film called TheNanny, and in it um basically a
Nancy was the protagonist inthat film, right?
And the domestic um worker wasAfrican, and it just the same,
(47:37):
the same concept um of the samebarrel child um syndrome aspect,
right, was layered with that ofthe Anancy story that was
brought into it.
So that folklore aspect cameinto that space.
Um, I thought that was areally, really nice um film.
And then Machel Montano film,uh Bazodee.
(48:00):
So Bazodee to me was a filmthat I think is worth studying,
right?
Because it dealt with thatwhole intersectionality between
the African, Caribbean, and thenthe Indian, right?
When we were in um Ivy Courseum two years ago, and we were
(48:21):
talking about Caribbean filmsthat picked up distribution, I
believe that was one of thefilms that picked up
distribution in Africa, right?
And it was well received.
And I was like, wow.
So you see, there is a desirefor our films to be seen, right?
Quality films to be seen.
(48:42):
And I think because of limitedresources, most times we limit
ourselves to making short filmsbecause that's what we can
financially manage.
But the opportunity to makefeature-length films, um, and
that's another thing, ideally,the future would have would be
(49:03):
having more feature-length,high-valued, production-valued
film that is representing uscoming out with our voices made
by our people, um, coming outfrom the Caribbean, that there
is no way we cannot get the thevisibility that we know is
(49:28):
possible for stories coming outof the Caribbean.
Speaker (49:31):
I know I asked a hard question, but you also just
answered my final question, um,which was which was in a way,
sort of, you know, how how canthese co-productions um either
within the region or, you know,interregionally, um, really help
shape global perceptions aboutblack storytelling and
(49:54):
storytellers.
And I think you've reallycovered that for us, right?
Um, by being able to share thatit's not, you know, on one
hand, of course, as you weresaying earlier, it's about the
pooling of resources, of about,you know, better distribution,
etc.
But really, I think what I tookaway from what you said a
(50:15):
moment ago was the fact that whowe are and what makes us
special um when it comes to thework that filmmakers and other
creatives are doing should be atthe heart of our work and um
instead not not needing todiminish it for the sake of
(50:35):
getting production and you know,other details like that.
And so I ultimately really wantto thank you, Meshida, for
joining us um for this episode.
I think this is one that Ilearned a lot from.
Um, I will, of course, includefor our listeners um links to
the films that you mentioned,and of course, links to Scars of
(50:57):
Our Mother's Dreams.
I really enjoyed watching it.
Um, and I think, you know,several of our listeners will as
well.
And so with that, thank you somuch for again being a guest on
the show, sharing more about notonly your work, but also the
work of Caribbean Tales MediaGroup.
Um, for our listeners tuningin, for seasoned filmmakers, for
(51:19):
budding filmmakers, I cannotrecommend enough um checking out
Caribbean Tales CCFprogramming.
It is one that I think brings,again, together storytellers
from the region, from across theum Black diaspora to do amazing
work, right?
To continue pivoting, um,sharing, learning from one
(51:41):
another, and really building upum the work of Black
storytelling and filmmaking forus to learn and work together
from one another.
And so with that, thank you somuch all for tuning in.
Links, as always, will be onour website in our show notes,
etc.
Until next time, look more.
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