August 13, 2022 • 36 mins
Back in May, Christine and JJ began examining and describing the world of virtual reality. Today the intrepid pair wraps up the three-part series, exploring surreal spaces and fantastical experiences, including a trippy meditation realm, and a journey to Jurassic World. Then JJ's in-house tech expert Owen joins the conversation to provide a teenage take on VR.
Listen
Watch
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
JJ Hunt (00:03):
Talk description to me with Christine Malec and JJ
Hunt.
Christine Malec (00:27):
Hi, I'm Christine Malec.
JJ Hunt (00:28):
And I'm JJ Hunt. This is talk description to me, where
the visuals of current eventsand the world around us get
hashed out in description richconversations.
Christine Malec (00:47):
If you're a regular listener to the podcast,
you will likely have heard acouple of previous episodes we
did on virtual reality. JJ'seldest, bought an Oculus, which
is a virtual reality headset,totally visual experience, kind
of a closed book if you're blindor visually impaired. And in the
(01:10):
past, we've played some of thedemo that JJ did we, we visited
the space station that was ahighlight for me, we looked at
some natural landscapes and someclimbing. Today we're going to
explore some syntheticlandscapes and some artificial
places that the Oculus hasdevised for people's amusement.
(01:35):
And as a bonus, after the demo,we're gonna have a little
conversation with Owen, who isJJ is eldest and the owner of
the Oculus because as a 16 yearold Owen has a different
perspective, from theperspective of middle aged
people like us, so Strapyourselves down and get ready
(01:57):
for some virtual reality. Someof the things you can do with
the Oculus are not reallyvirtual reality, they're really
created or designed, right? Socan we walk through one of those
environments that aredeliberately created to be not
quite not real?
JJ Hunt (02:15):
Okay, so I'm inside liminal. And this the kind of
home screen for this experienceis like standing in a massive
circular pond. And all aroundthe edges of the circle are
(02:35):
these. They look like glowingMisty doorways in different
colors. Like spanning the colorsof the rainbow. If I walk in a
circle, they start from whitesand yellows and then all the way
around me, they go into greensand purples and whites and then
reds and blues. And this pool ofwater and being surrounded by
(02:57):
all these doorways, theseglowing doorways all of this is
set against the like the starrynight sky. So I feel like I'm
standing in this manmade pool infloating in space, and then
dropping down in front of me areare the experiences calm energy,
(03:21):
all and more content? So what dowe want to try calm, energy, or
awe Chris?
Christine Malec (03:29):
I'm in favor of Awe
JJ Hunt (03:31):
Awe. Let's see what all gets me to. So I clicked on, we
go into a black space. Now I'vegot a similar kind of
environment and it looks likethere's like dozens of slots for
experiences. We are justdownloaded the free version of
this. So we only have a fewboundless grid luminescence or
(03:51):
dissent. Any of those sound goodto you? luminescence team
luminescence it is okay, a fewlights. I'm in a totally black
space except in front of me islike in the distance one little
glowing light with some starstwinkling off of it. Okay, so
(04:13):
now the world is starting tounfold around me I'm on a rock
I'm on a rock it looks like aring of what rocks or maybe a
figure eight of rocks andfloating around me in in, in
what looks like space are otherrocks of different colors,
greens and blues and reds. It'slike I'm inside a mine or
(04:39):
something. And there are theseglowing minerals buried in the
walls. And this one little lightis still floating around like a
Tinkerbell kind of light and asit moves around, it trails
behind little glowing specks.
And every one I have to remindmyself that this is a totally 3d
(05:01):
space. So I have to stop andlook up every once in a while.
And look all around me. Oh,okay, so now the golden dot
Tinkerbell is joined by a blueand a green and a red and they
just exploded. And they'retearing away the blackness. And
now I'm in space. Oh,everything's disappearing the
(05:22):
rock, oh, the only thing thatremains is the rock underneath
my feet. And now I'm in a rockfloating in space. And it looks
like there's an exploding redstar that is ejecting tiny
little red dots all around. Andnow, now a green light has
exploded. And now the blue lightis exploding. So this is just an
(05:44):
experience. This is taking me toa space. This is like a VR
equivalent of watching a calm,mesmerizing YouTube video. Like
that's what I would do here. Butthis is just something to
experience. There's no game forme to play. It's just kind of be
(06:04):
in this kind of mesmerizingworld for a little while.
Christine Malec (06:13):
Is it something that makes you want to go back
to it when you're not talking ordescribing?
JJ Hunt (06:19):
Yeah, totall. Frankly, it would be the kind of thing
like, Have a smoke and come backto this space would be the thing
to do. Like it's like, yeah,it's Yeah, trippy, kind of like,
you know, pour a glass of wineand in have one of these
experiences.
Christine Malec (06:37):
And on the scale of like, obviously, it's
it's a surreal environment. It'snot real. But on the convincing
scale of feeling like you'represent there with whatever it
is, how convincing is a tear toyour imagination and your eye.
JJ Hunt (06:53):
Oh, that's an interesting question. So it
wasn't like photorealistic. Soit's not like it was. It's hard
to explain like, it's not like Iwas tricked into believing that
I was actually floating inspace. But it's, it was
(07:14):
convincing that I was in that Iwasn't standing in my living
room, that's for sure. I'm goingto try the hypnosis. So it's
achieve a trancelike state byfixating your attention on a
swinging pendulum, andkaleidoscopic patterns in his
(07:34):
guided hypnotic experience. Whenyou awake, you will be relaxed.
Okay, so again, I'm in this bigdisc, but I'm actually this is a
guided meditation. And there'sthis very trippy bubble that's
expanding and contracting asit's instructing me to inhale
(07:56):
and exhale,
Oculus (07:57):
Now all the muscles of your body to relax
JJ Hunt (08:01):
And in front of me is this, I like sunflower that's
shifting and moving. And I'm inspace in my pool of water.
Again, this is a reallyinteresting way to be guided
through a meditation instead ofclosing your eyes or three
(08:22):
quarters, closing your eyes orfocusing on a.on the floor. I'm
being given this kind of hippiedippie, like, Paisley floral
pattern, but very digitallooking... object to focus on.
Christine Malec (08:41):
That's moving like it's dynamic.
JJ Hunt (08:43):
Its dynamic, in that it's slowly shifting, and then
it's got this it's inside abubble that expands and
contracts to to influence my, mybreathing. And now that I'm
okay, now there's a digitalpendulum swinging back and
forth. So this pendulum isleaving behind a line. And I've
(09:12):
seen versions of this with likependulums that are sand
drippers, where they slowlydrift, little bits of sand, and
they're pushed in a pattern. Andso as the pendulum swings, it
drips little bits of sand. Andwhat follows is a pattern that's
(09:34):
that's drawn on the ground. Andit's doing that but instead of
instead of dripping sand, it'sdrawing with these fluorescent
lines, patterns on the floor.
Christine Malec (09:47):
Wow. I'm continually curious about the
experience of dimension anddistance and so we for your the
experience, Have your eyes. Isit like you're looking? Not the
quality of the image, but howyour your eyes are physically
(10:08):
functioning and how it feels?
Does it feel like you're lookingat a screen? Does it feel like
you're looking at something inthe room with you? Or does it
feel like you're looking atsomething off in the distance.
JJ Hunt (10:18):
So this feels like it's floating in front of me in a
like, what it feels like isright now I'm at like, I'm in a,
in a huge gymnasium with thelights totally off. So I can't
see where any of the edges are,I can't see where the walls are
or the ceiling is. But it's acompletely black space. There's
(10:40):
no light anywhere except to thisone pattern on the floor. And it
does look like it's on thefloor. It's angled in such a way
so that the pattern is on thefloor. And that if I was to
guess I would say this fairlydigital, not entirely convincing
pendulum on a chain is maybe 20feet in front of me. And that's
(11:08):
it. This is a false space. Likethis doesn't feel like it's
trying to convince me I'manywhere but in a blank space.
Not like I'm in outer space.
Just I'm in a blank in a minuteblankness. I'm in an in an in
between place.
Christine Malec (11:27):
Is that disorienting? Because that's not
something you would normallyexperience in your day of
looking around?
JJ Hunt (11:33):
Yeah, you know, what's interesting, it's less
disorienting if I was reallyfocused on this meditation,
which is guiding me through it,there's nothing about it. That's
too unusual. It's just so black.
It's okay. There's it's trippierif there's a little bit of
(11:55):
something in the space.
Christine Malec (11:59):
We had talked about a different you know,
surreal space, which was giraffethe Jurassic experience maybe
that one is more movementoriented. Can we check that out?
JJ Hunt (12:09):
Totally. Okay, so I'm going to open up Jurassic World,
and I haven't been in this spacebefore. My visual field,
everything around me is goneblack. Everything around me is
opening up. And I am in avirtual jungle, massive trees
all around. There's abrontosaurus looking thing. Some
(12:32):
like what I would have thoughtas a kid was a Brontosaurus.
Long Neck Long Tail, it'ssleeping in front of me. The
belly as he's sleeping lyingdown is kind of heaving in and
out. You can see that thiscreature is breathing. There's a
jeep. over to my left. I've alsogot like a coffee mug, and a
flashlight here. Oh, thedinosaurs looking up at me. And
(12:56):
the cat didn't like that the catthat's actually in my space in
my living room didn't lie. Okay,so this dinosaur is looking
straight at me. And it's aboutto stand up. And it is rising.
It's gotten to its feet and it'swalking toward me. Okay, this is
disconcerting. It is the head ofit is really close. Really
(13:21):
close. Like, I feel like I couldreach out and touch its nose.
It's that do you have to lookup? No, it's, it's, it's looking
at me with one eye and then headway up. Wow. So it's like
rearing back like a like ahorse. Head up. And now it's
(13:44):
diving. Its head down reallyclose to me. And who? Oh, it's
no. Okay. Wow. Okay, it is onits hind legs and eating the
leaves off the tree overhead.
Okay, it just came back down onall four feet. And it's tailless
swinging over my head. Yeah, no,this feels real. Yeah, yeah. So
(14:05):
what's interesting about this isit's actually not the crispest
cleanest image I've seen. It's alittle bit fuzzy, it's a little
bit blurry. Oh, but theinteraction the way this
creature came right up to me,and then did things like sweet
like swinging its tail over myhead and sniffing me was in
(14:27):
tirely convincing despite thefact that it was a little tiny
bit blurry. Okay, so, just tolet you know, I can feel my
physical position right now. Iam squatting. I've got my like,
my weight is back on my rightfoot. And I've kind of got my
hands up like I'm about toprotect my head like I'm feeling
(14:51):
100% physically engaged by that.
All right, who want to try theother one? Yeah, yeah, I want to
try the other one. So I'mgetting a screenshot of what
blue is going to be like andblue is a little dinosaur, like
a like a raptor. Uh yeah,Velociraptor follow blue, a
(15:14):
highly intelligent Velociraptorand she fights to survive to put
the tumultuous Island Okay, soI'm gonna I think I'm going to
be running alongside ofVelociraptor as I go through
this like jungle and like soplants and trees with these huge
(15:35):
tropical leaves okay well okayso now I'm flying through space
Oh this is cool so this is thethe opening title card for
Universal Studios, which is theword universal rising over the
planet Earth. But this is thevirtual reality version so this
(15:56):
is I was floating in space asthe giant world universal kept
itself around the planet Earth.
Oh my gosh, that's just theintro. Alright, so I'm in this
jungle and this there's avelociraptor sleeping in front
of me. So it's eyes. It's veryreptilian eyes just opened up.
And it's looking it's going tolook at me any minute. Let's get
(16:19):
into its feet and it's about myheight. And it's a velociraptor
and it's got very sharp lookingclaws. And like snake like eyes.
Okay, now as it moves I'm whatI'm kind of floating along
beside it. So I am I thinksupposed to understand myself to
(16:41):
be a fellow Voluptevelociraptor. Okay, so it is
slowly tiptoeing out of thislittle clearing in the forest
and I am right beside it okay,it's turned its head to look at
me the Triceratops it's it's abit like a baby Triceratops is
chasing a butterfly which isreally cute except that it still
(17:02):
looks like you could hurt me andit's just enthralled the
Velociraptor just jumped over.
okay.
They're fighting in front of meabout three feet in front of me.
So they are standing off againstone another. Oh geez a
(17:24):
pterodactyl just flew in andscooped up the the Stegosaurus
and then the Velociraptor leapedafter the okay there's a lot of
dinosaur fighting going on andit's really believable here. He
this the Velociraptor is lookingup at the sky the volcano
(17:45):
volcano just exploded. Oh my godright in front of us. It was
looking up at a mountain Ithought it was looking at the
sky and it's because a volcanojust exploded. Okay now the
world is coming up. Wow I'm nowinside the volcanic ash as the
as it's slowly starting to clearand as it clears I can see the
(18:10):
ground all around me. Oh,there's the Velociraptor right
in front of me face to face inthe velociraptors looking
around. Oh, my jeep is totallydestroyed from earlier. And I'm
tiptoeing along beside thisVelociraptor as we kind of make
our way through the wreckage.
Oh, he's found a skeleton ofanother dinosaur. He's sniffing
(18:33):
at the skeleton. The remains ofthis dinosaur picking picking up
the bones.
Christine Malec (18:41):
Is he going in for dessert? I understand they
are cannibalistic.
JJ Hunt (18:43):
Yeah, yeah, he totally is. Oh, he's found some eggs but
something else is coming. Ohgeez. Like a T rex is here and
attacking us. Okay. So there'ssomething like it looks like a
giant not a T rex is like agiant crocodile. Oh god and now
Okay, now a real T Rex has justentered the scene. And it is
(19:11):
facing me and the velociraptorshiding behind me. Oh, you can
literally see the saliva whenthat T Rex just reached in to
with its snout at me. I couldsee the saliva from the top jaw
to the bottom jaw. Thevelociraptors jumped onto its
(19:32):
neck just got flung at me by theT Rex. Okay, it's bearing right
down on me. Its tongue iswagging right at me. Oh, oh. Oh,
uh, helicopters flying inoverhead. Oh, a helicopter
because this is Jurassic Park.
Okay, no,
Christine Malec (19:52):
You're gonna be rescued maybe?
JJ Hunt (19:53):
I hope so. Oh, okay. So now They've all all the
dinosaurs have scattered whenthe when the helicopter flew
over the second helicoptersflying overhead. And so all the
dinosaurs have had scattered. Sothis was like living a film this
(20:17):
was composed like a short filmdesigned like a short film all
the velociraptors come back.
Hey, buddy, hey, yo, how areyou? That was weird eh?
Christine Malec (20:27):
Old friends, eh?
JJ Hunt (20:28):
Ya! It's funny like after that that amount of time
when the Velociraptor came backI felt kinda. And this is
written and directed by thisteam like this is produced like
a short film that I was livingin.
Christine Malec (20:43):
Over the past couple of episodes that we've
done on VR. JJ, you had sometechnical assistance? Would you
like to introduce your technicalassistant? Because I have some
questions for them.
JJ Hunt (20:55):
Yes, I'm very fortunate. Here at at our place
we do have an in-house selfdescribed tech expert. This is
my eldest, Owen. And an Owen hasvery kindly agreed to jump on
mic with us. Some listenersmight remember I got a little
(21:16):
bit of help in the Minecraftepisode. And that was Owen as
well. So Owen is with me, in mybasement studio today.
Owen (21:25):
I think I also did some describing of roadsigns.
Christine Malec (21:28):
That's right.
Yeah. Yeah, I remember, that wasvery helpful.
JJ Hunt (21:32):
Yeah, from the back seat in our cottage country
episode I believe that was.
Christine Malec (21:37):
That was very fun. So Oh, and what we've heard
your dad do was all just oneperson with the headset kind of
moving around. But you do thisinteractively with friends.
Right. So can you explain kindof how people would interact in
the Oculus? And in that world?
Owen (21:55):
Yeah, sure. So it mean, it's different from like
application to application. Butthe usual thing is, is that I
have my headset on at my house,and they have Verizon at their
house. And we're playingtogether in the same world. What
would I see them as, of course,in VR, all you have is a headset
(22:15):
and two controllers, it does notknow where your legs are, it
does not know where your elbowsare. So in most games, you are
either just a head and handsfloating or ahead a torso and
hands floating. There are acouple games that actually have
legs for you, but they don'tmove with your actual legs.
They're just separate.
Christine Malec (22:35):
Right. Right.
How many people at a time couldyou be interacting with?
Owen (22:41):
Well, again, it is different from application to
application. But usually thereis like, I would say, maybe like
a 50 person limit. It is notvery restrictive whatsoever. I
of course, don't have that manyfriends who have VR headset.
Christine Malec (22:58):
I don't have that many people do. Right?
Owen (23:01):
But yeah, in most situations like that. It's not
that isn't the limiting factor.
Christine Malec (23:06):
What's the favorite thing to do? What's the
most fun with with multiplepeople?
Owen (23:11):
One of two things. One is a game called gun Raiders, which
is a fairly standard shooter.
But it's in VR. So it has alittle bit of extra coolness to
it. And then another one that Idon't have yet but I really want
to get my friend has beenplaying a lot is kind of a
survival game. It's a little bitlike Minecraft, but in VR, and I
want to I forget exactly whatit's called. But I definitely
(23:33):
want to do that with them.
Christine Malec (23:36):
Oh, my gosh, um, and this kind of brings me
to a question that aboutfavorite stuff. And the
differences between yourfavorite stuff and your friends
favorite stuff? versus say, youryour parents favorite stuff. And
so I'm not sure even where to gowith this. But I guess you guys
(23:58):
have all talked about this. SoOwen, what is your take on what
kinds of things you like to doin VR and people you're 16 So
your friends your age like to doversus the things that your
parents like to do? What's Whatare the differences in general,
do you think?
Owen (24:13):
Oh, well, I would say the main thing me and my friends
like to do is play video games.
We are gamers. I mean, ofcourse, our friend group is
especially into gaming. Yeah.
And so that is most of what wedo on that is play video games.
What we're looking for is fungameplay and good game feel. But
I would say specifically with myparents, they are not gamers, I
(24:36):
think that's fair to say. Yeah,they are not into video games,
that's not really something theyenjoy doing much. So in a lot of
games can be kind of confusingand very complicated where you
have like precise button combosthat you have to do. You know,
just a lot of stuff you have tomemorize in order to play the
game. And so that's less oftheir cup of tea. So what I
(24:59):
noticed To my parents and otheradults that aren't gamers mostly
like to do is they look for theexperiences, not the somewhat
interactive, but not interactivein the sense that you have a big
challenge. But just interestingthings that you would not
otherwise get to experience ordo.
JJ Hunt (25:19):
Yeah, that's definitely that I would agree for me
personally. And I, like I've gotfriends who are my age who are
gamers, and they would be intogames on Oh, in VR. But for me,
the games just, I lose, I loseinterest in the game element of
it. I'm more, I'm more likely tostay involved if the experience
(25:42):
continues to be interesting. Ifthe visuals continue to be
interesting. If I, if I trulybelieve I'm in a new space that
I wouldn't otherwise have accessto. That's going to hold my
attention. Whether or not I haveracked up enough points by
shooting zombies. Right. It justdoesn't that just doesn't hold
me.
Christine Malec (25:59):
Were you ever a gamer, JJ?
JJ Hunt (26:01):
Yeah, I played I had gaming systems when I was a kid,
like I had the earliest Ataris.
And the first Nintendo's and allthat, and I certainly played as
a kid, but I was never even thenI had friends who were way more
interested than I was. Justyeah, wasn't my bag.
Christine Malec (26:20):
I want to talk about what our bodies do when
when our awareness is is in VR.
So JJ in the the demos that thatyou did for us, it was obvious
sometimes that your body wasmoving around in space. And so I
want to ask both of you aboutthis. But JJ first, what was
your experience, like, offeeling located or dislocated in
(26:43):
your actual physical space, whenyou were in VR was disorienting.
Yeah, more than you expected.
JJ Hunt (26:53):
I mean, when you get into whatever world you're in,
if the world is convincing, ifthe virtual world that you're in
has been rendered in aconvincing way, you very quickly
forget that you're in yourliving room, or your bedroom, or
wherever you really aretransported to that new space,
and my body respondsaccordingly. Like, I tip toe, or
(27:18):
I lean cautiously, or ifsomething swings at me, I duck,
like, it's all so new to mybrain. And my brain has spent a
lot longer being in a worldwhere real means real, like
there's just, there's nothing tothat I don't need to like,
that's, that's an obviousstatement for me real is real.
(27:39):
And so if my brain tells me it'sreal, I duck like something
swing, certainly, that's whatI'm gonna do. But I but that's
certainly not the case. WithOwen, I think with with with
Owen, and with our younger, oryounger guy, neither of them
respond physically to a virtualenvironment, the way that I do
(28:01):
or the way that Lois does, wouldyou say, Owen?
Owen (28:03):
I would say that that is very much accurate. Sometimes I
know me and my friends, like thefirst time you play, or you get
into an experience like that. Sothe first time I played
Ritchie's plank experience,which is a game, it's also kind
of just an experience where youare, you have to walk out onto a
plank really high up above acity. And it is kind of known
(28:24):
for being it's one of theearliest VR games and is known
for being very nerve wracking.
Yeah, and you know, hard to do.
But I've like the first time Idid that, I had the exact same
physical reaction. Oh, unlikeyou guys. Like after the first
time or two. I have no problem.
Literally just walking out. Nonewhatsoever anymore. Just because
(28:47):
I I highly doubt that would bethe same in real life if I was
actually on that planet. Oh,because you know, it does look
different. You can tell. I amdone. Like being done being
Yeah, yeah.
Christine Malec (29:05):
That's interesting. There were times,
which didn't make it into ourfinal episodes. But there were
definitely times JJ, where youhad become really disoriented.
Like you took a guess as towhere you thought you were in
the room. Then Owen said, Nope,you're totally facing the other
direction. So Oh, and what's itlike to watch someone? And we're
(29:26):
okay, we're not going to pokefun at your dad. Right? laugh at
your dad. You know what? Okay,maybe a little bit. But what was
it like? What's it like to watchsomeone in VR? And is it
different watching an adultversus someone your age?
Owen (29:40):
It is so different watching an adult versus someone
my age? The adults that I haveseen? I do not. I am not in
close contact with a lot ofgamer adults who Oh, really? Who
would be playing it the sameway? I would. Yeah. So yeah,
this is when I say adults, Imean, my parents.
Christine Malec (30:00):
Sure. That's a good qulification, thank you.
Owen (30:04):
Specifically with my dad, whenever you're playing whenever
he's playing VR, no matter whatthe situation, he is very
stable, I would say your stancesvary a little bit bounce, a wide
stance vary, you're trying to beas stable as possible, I would
assume that that comes from alittle bit of you can tell that
(30:25):
it's not real, but you're alsoreally immersed. So it's, your
brain is having a little bit ofa different like just a little
bit of a difficult time figuringout exactly how, like
JJ Hunt (30:35):
it's a preparedness stance.
Owen (30:37):
If something like you know, jumps out at you or
JJ Hunt (30:37):
Like, I want to be, I'm ready for anything, I'm crouched
Owen (30:37):
Sure.
a little bit low, my, you know,I got a little bit of bounce in
my knees, something, something'soff, and my body needs to be
preparedsomething that'll get more
extreme. Yeah. Whereas with meand my friends, it's, I've seen
that that regular, you know,step steadiness only happens
(30:59):
during those, like if somethingjumps out at you or something
like that, like a moment ofcombat a moment of combat, and
that's only for a second, andagain, only the first couple of
times. But after that fairlystraight stand. One thing I will
say it's this isn't just thateverybody looks very silly
playing here. Very, very sillyplaying VR, especially because,
(31:20):
like because no one can see whatyou're doing. So what it just
you look like a dork. It lookslike you're reaching out for
something. And then, like, yeah,in some games I've played to
move forwards. You have to moveyour arms up and down as if your
walk as as if like just just themotion your weight might make on
like a jog. Right? You have todo that. And that looks
(31:44):
ridiculous. If someone isstanding in one place with a
headset, doing that motion. Itno matter who it is it look I
know. I look like a dork.
Whenever I'm doing it. Yeah,like a dork. My friends look
like dork. That's hard to begreat, everybody. It's very hard
to be graceful. In game, you canlook really graceful. But nobody
(32:05):
else can see what you see.
Everybody else is just seeingyou being a dork
Christine Malec (32:08):
Oh to yourself.
Owen (32:09):
Yeah.
Christine Malec (32:12):
Fascinating.
Or, you know, what I wonder is?
Is there any footage of atheater crowd like a crowd in a
movie theater from like, 1910 orsomething? Because I just keep
going back to this idea oftechnology. It was always new
and shocking until it isn'tanymore. And yeah, like, I
wonder if people are in silentfilms who are like, super
(32:34):
reactive and startled easily andlooked like they were?
JJ Hunt (32:37):
Well, isn't there, what's the famous case of the
train?
Owen (32:40):
Yeah there's a story about like, not the first but one of
the first video recordings wasof a train filling, filling
recording. Yes, you're right. Itwas of a train pulling into a
station. Like, like from notquite head on, I actually we got
to see the recording at amuseum. But like a little bit to
your left. It's like you werestanding on a track looking down
(33:01):
the track, you're standing rightto the side on the platform, and
the train comes at you on theleft. And there's a story. I
don't know how true this is. Youknow, but there is a story that
the first time that was playedin a theater in front of a bunch
of people, they ran out of thetheater because they thought a
train was coming
JJ Hunt (33:19):
People were screaming...
Owen (33:20):
I can't confirm that, I wasn't there at the time.
JJ Hunt (33:23):
Heh heh.
Christine Malec (33:25):
Yeah yeah.
JJ Hunt (33:25):
But I think you're right, Chris. Like, I think it's
like it is the case that whenthese new technologies come out,
even if I mean intellectually,I'm sure people would have been
understood that there wasn't anactual train about to burst
through the screen. But theintellect disappears when when
your brain is introduced withsomething that is genuinely
(33:48):
scary for the first time. And solike, I know that that dinosaur
tail is not really swinging atme. And yet, how do I not duck
like how do I not in a virtualyou know, Jurassic situation,
duck when that you know, spikedtail comes whooshing over my
head. Of course, I'm gonna duck
Christine Malec (34:06):
Until you get hardened. Sorry, go ahead Owen.
JJ Hunt (34:09):
That's right. That's right until I become hardened, ya.
Owen (34:11):
Yeah, I was gonna say, uh, one of my favorite quotes that
I've seen, I don't know who saidthis, but it was human evolution
is all about tricking yourinstincts. Human Evolution is
all about trying to trick yourinstincts into doing different
things. You know, you have liketricking, like, tricking your
eyes with like video and movingpictures. Now we're tricking
(34:33):
like our entire spatialawareness. Like, what is going
you tricking your ears? It's allabout tricking your brain.
Christine Malec (34:40):
Can you say that once more
Owen (34:42):
Human evolution is all about trying to trick your
instincts into doing things.
Christine Malec (34:47):
That's wild.
I'm gonna be thinking about thatall the rest of today.
On Saturday, August the 27th2022. We'll be posting our last
episode of Talk description tome... for now! The show is more
popular than it's ever been. Andwe're still firmly committed to
description rich programming.
But there's been a tectonicshift in the financial position
(35:11):
of the podcast. So we're goingon hiatus to regroup and
reimagine our model. The worldof description is evolving fast,
and funding models for creatorsand innovators haven't kept up.
We're currently exploring newpartnerships and envisioning new
platforms that will not onlyallow us to keep creating
content, but will also provideopportunities for other
(35:34):
innovative creators, describersand allies to expand our
collective view of what can bedescribed and how we hope you'll
stay subscribe to our podcastfeed and our social media will
be quieter, but will still bearound. New episodes might pop
up now and again, as worldevents unfold, and you can stay
in touch with our otherdescription related projects.
(35:55):
We'll be closing our Patreonpage for the time being
limitless gratitude to those whostepped up to help support us,
either with funds or withfeedback. Stay tuned, there's
more to come!
Talk description to me with Christine Malec and JJ
Hunt.
Christine Malec (00:27):
Hi, I'm Christine Malec.
JJ Hunt (00:28):
And I'm JJ Hunt. This is talk description to me, where
the visuals of current eventsand the world around us get
hashed out in description richconversations.
Christine Malec (00:47):
If you're a regular listener to the podcast,
you will likely have heard acouple of previous episodes we
did on virtual reality. JJ'seldest, bought an Oculus, which
is a virtual reality headset,totally visual experience, kind
of a closed book if you're blindor visually impaired. And in the
(01:10):
past, we've played some of thedemo that JJ did we, we visited
the space station that was ahighlight for me, we looked at
some natural landscapes and someclimbing. Today we're going to
explore some syntheticlandscapes and some artificial
places that the Oculus hasdevised for people's amusement.
(01:35):
And as a bonus, after the demo,we're gonna have a little
conversation with Owen, who isJJ is eldest and the owner of
the Oculus because as a 16 yearold Owen has a different
perspective, from theperspective of middle aged
people like us, so Strapyourselves down and get ready
(01:57):
for some virtual reality. Someof the things you can do with
the Oculus are not reallyvirtual reality, they're really
created or designed, right? Socan we walk through one of those
environments that aredeliberately created to be not
quite not real?
JJ Hunt (02:15):
Okay, so I'm inside liminal. And this the kind of
home screen for this experienceis like standing in a massive
circular pond. And all aroundthe edges of the circle are
(02:35):
these. They look like glowingMisty doorways in different
colors. Like spanning the colorsof the rainbow. If I walk in a
circle, they start from whitesand yellows and then all the way
around me, they go into greensand purples and whites and then
reds and blues. And this pool ofwater and being surrounded by
(02:57):
all these doorways, theseglowing doorways all of this is
set against the like the starrynight sky. So I feel like I'm
standing in this manmade pool infloating in space, and then
dropping down in front of me areare the experiences calm energy,
(03:21):
all and more content? So what dowe want to try calm, energy, or
awe Chris?
Christine Malec (03:29):
I'm in favor of Awe
JJ Hunt (03:31):
Awe. Let's see what all gets me to. So I clicked on, we
go into a black space. Now I'vegot a similar kind of
environment and it looks likethere's like dozens of slots for
experiences. We are justdownloaded the free version of
this. So we only have a fewboundless grid luminescence or
(03:51):
dissent. Any of those sound goodto you? luminescence team
luminescence it is okay, a fewlights. I'm in a totally black
space except in front of me islike in the distance one little
glowing light with some starstwinkling off of it. Okay, so
(04:13):
now the world is starting tounfold around me I'm on a rock
I'm on a rock it looks like aring of what rocks or maybe a
figure eight of rocks andfloating around me in in, in
what looks like space are otherrocks of different colors,
greens and blues and reds. It'slike I'm inside a mine or
(04:39):
something. And there are theseglowing minerals buried in the
walls. And this one little lightis still floating around like a
Tinkerbell kind of light and asit moves around, it trails
behind little glowing specks.
And every one I have to remindmyself that this is a totally 3d
(05:01):
space. So I have to stop andlook up every once in a while.
And look all around me. Oh,okay, so now the golden dot
Tinkerbell is joined by a blueand a green and a red and they
just exploded. And they'retearing away the blackness. And
now I'm in space. Oh,everything's disappearing the
(05:22):
rock, oh, the only thing thatremains is the rock underneath
my feet. And now I'm in a rockfloating in space. And it looks
like there's an exploding redstar that is ejecting tiny
little red dots all around. Andnow, now a green light has
exploded. And now the blue lightis exploding. So this is just an
(05:44):
experience. This is taking me toa space. This is like a VR
equivalent of watching a calm,mesmerizing YouTube video. Like
that's what I would do here. Butthis is just something to
experience. There's no game forme to play. It's just kind of be
(06:04):
in this kind of mesmerizingworld for a little while.
Christine Malec (06:13):
Is it something that makes you want to go back
to it when you're not talking ordescribing?
JJ Hunt (06:19):
Yeah, totall. Frankly, it would be the kind of thing
like, Have a smoke and come backto this space would be the thing
to do. Like it's like, yeah,it's Yeah, trippy, kind of like,
you know, pour a glass of wineand in have one of these
experiences.
Christine Malec (06:37):
And on the scale of like, obviously, it's
it's a surreal environment. It'snot real. But on the convincing
scale of feeling like you'represent there with whatever it
is, how convincing is a tear toyour imagination and your eye.
JJ Hunt (06:53):
Oh, that's an interesting question. So it
wasn't like photorealistic. Soit's not like it was. It's hard
to explain like, it's not like Iwas tricked into believing that
I was actually floating inspace. But it's, it was
(07:14):
convincing that I was in that Iwasn't standing in my living
room, that's for sure. I'm goingto try the hypnosis. So it's
achieve a trancelike state byfixating your attention on a
swinging pendulum, andkaleidoscopic patterns in his
(07:34):
guided hypnotic experience. Whenyou awake, you will be relaxed.
Okay, so again, I'm in this bigdisc, but I'm actually this is a
guided meditation. And there'sthis very trippy bubble that's
expanding and contracting asit's instructing me to inhale
(07:56):
and exhale,
Oculus (07:57):
Now all the muscles of your body to relax
JJ Hunt (08:01):
And in front of me is this, I like sunflower that's
shifting and moving. And I'm inspace in my pool of water.
Again, this is a reallyinteresting way to be guided
through a meditation instead ofclosing your eyes or three
(08:22):
quarters, closing your eyes orfocusing on a.on the floor. I'm
being given this kind of hippiedippie, like, Paisley floral
pattern, but very digitallooking... object to focus on.
Christine Malec (08:41):
That's moving like it's dynamic.
JJ Hunt (08:43):
Its dynamic, in that it's slowly shifting, and then
it's got this it's inside abubble that expands and
contracts to to influence my, mybreathing. And now that I'm
okay, now there's a digitalpendulum swinging back and
forth. So this pendulum isleaving behind a line. And I've
(09:12):
seen versions of this with likependulums that are sand
drippers, where they slowlydrift, little bits of sand, and
they're pushed in a pattern. Andso as the pendulum swings, it
drips little bits of sand. Andwhat follows is a pattern that's
(09:34):
that's drawn on the ground. Andit's doing that but instead of
instead of dripping sand, it'sdrawing with these fluorescent
lines, patterns on the floor.
Christine Malec (09:47):
Wow. I'm continually curious about the
experience of dimension anddistance and so we for your the
experience, Have your eyes. Isit like you're looking? Not the
quality of the image, but howyour your eyes are physically
(10:08):
functioning and how it feels?
Does it feel like you're lookingat a screen? Does it feel like
you're looking at something inthe room with you? Or does it
feel like you're looking atsomething off in the distance.
JJ Hunt (10:18):
So this feels like it's floating in front of me in a
like, what it feels like isright now I'm at like, I'm in a,
in a huge gymnasium with thelights totally off. So I can't
see where any of the edges are,I can't see where the walls are
or the ceiling is. But it's acompletely black space. There's
(10:40):
no light anywhere except to thisone pattern on the floor. And it
does look like it's on thefloor. It's angled in such a way
so that the pattern is on thefloor. And that if I was to
guess I would say this fairlydigital, not entirely convincing
pendulum on a chain is maybe 20feet in front of me. And that's
(11:08):
it. This is a false space. Likethis doesn't feel like it's
trying to convince me I'manywhere but in a blank space.
Not like I'm in outer space.
Just I'm in a blank in a minuteblankness. I'm in an in an in
between place.
Christine Malec (11:27):
Is that disorienting? Because that's not
something you would normallyexperience in your day of
looking around?
JJ Hunt (11:33):
Yeah, you know, what's interesting, it's less
disorienting if I was reallyfocused on this meditation,
which is guiding me through it,there's nothing about it. That's
too unusual. It's just so black.
It's okay. There's it's trippierif there's a little bit of
(11:55):
something in the space.
Christine Malec (11:59):
We had talked about a different you know,
surreal space, which was giraffethe Jurassic experience maybe
that one is more movementoriented. Can we check that out?
JJ Hunt (12:09):
Totally. Okay, so I'm going to open up Jurassic World,
and I haven't been in this spacebefore. My visual field,
everything around me is goneblack. Everything around me is
opening up. And I am in avirtual jungle, massive trees
all around. There's abrontosaurus looking thing. Some
(12:32):
like what I would have thoughtas a kid was a Brontosaurus.
Long Neck Long Tail, it'ssleeping in front of me. The
belly as he's sleeping lyingdown is kind of heaving in and
out. You can see that thiscreature is breathing. There's a
jeep. over to my left. I've alsogot like a coffee mug, and a
flashlight here. Oh, thedinosaurs looking up at me. And
(12:56):
the cat didn't like that the catthat's actually in my space in
my living room didn't lie. Okay,so this dinosaur is looking
straight at me. And it's aboutto stand up. And it is rising.
It's gotten to its feet and it'swalking toward me. Okay, this is
disconcerting. It is the head ofit is really close. Really
(13:21):
close. Like, I feel like I couldreach out and touch its nose.
It's that do you have to lookup? No, it's, it's, it's looking
at me with one eye and then headway up. Wow. So it's like
rearing back like a like ahorse. Head up. And now it's
(13:44):
diving. Its head down reallyclose to me. And who? Oh, it's
no. Okay. Wow. Okay, it is onits hind legs and eating the
leaves off the tree overhead.
Okay, it just came back down onall four feet. And it's tailless
swinging over my head. Yeah, no,this feels real. Yeah, yeah. So
(14:05):
what's interesting about this isit's actually not the crispest
cleanest image I've seen. It's alittle bit fuzzy, it's a little
bit blurry. Oh, but theinteraction the way this
creature came right up to me,and then did things like sweet
like swinging its tail over myhead and sniffing me was in
(14:27):
tirely convincing despite thefact that it was a little tiny
bit blurry. Okay, so, just tolet you know, I can feel my
physical position right now. Iam squatting. I've got my like,
my weight is back on my rightfoot. And I've kind of got my
hands up like I'm about toprotect my head like I'm feeling
(14:51):
100% physically engaged by that.
All right, who want to try theother one? Yeah, yeah, I want to
try the other one. So I'mgetting a screenshot of what
blue is going to be like andblue is a little dinosaur, like
a like a raptor. Uh yeah,Velociraptor follow blue, a
(15:14):
highly intelligent Velociraptorand she fights to survive to put
the tumultuous Island Okay, soI'm gonna I think I'm going to
be running alongside ofVelociraptor as I go through
this like jungle and like soplants and trees with these huge
(15:35):
tropical leaves okay well okayso now I'm flying through space
Oh this is cool so this is thethe opening title card for
Universal Studios, which is theword universal rising over the
planet Earth. But this is thevirtual reality version so this
(15:56):
is I was floating in space asthe giant world universal kept
itself around the planet Earth.
Oh my gosh, that's just theintro. Alright, so I'm in this
jungle and this there's avelociraptor sleeping in front
of me. So it's eyes. It's veryreptilian eyes just opened up.
And it's looking it's going tolook at me any minute. Let's get
(16:19):
into its feet and it's about myheight. And it's a velociraptor
and it's got very sharp lookingclaws. And like snake like eyes.
Okay, now as it moves I'm whatI'm kind of floating along
beside it. So I am I thinksupposed to understand myself to
(16:41):
be a fellow Voluptevelociraptor. Okay, so it is
slowly tiptoeing out of thislittle clearing in the forest
and I am right beside it okay,it's turned its head to look at
me the Triceratops it's it's abit like a baby Triceratops is
chasing a butterfly which isreally cute except that it still
(17:02):
looks like you could hurt me andit's just enthralled the
Velociraptor just jumped over.
okay.
They're fighting in front of meabout three feet in front of me.
So they are standing off againstone another. Oh geez a
(17:24):
pterodactyl just flew in andscooped up the the Stegosaurus
and then the Velociraptor leapedafter the okay there's a lot of
dinosaur fighting going on andit's really believable here. He
this the Velociraptor is lookingup at the sky the volcano
(17:45):
volcano just exploded. Oh my godright in front of us. It was
looking up at a mountain Ithought it was looking at the
sky and it's because a volcanojust exploded. Okay now the
world is coming up. Wow I'm nowinside the volcanic ash as the
as it's slowly starting to clearand as it clears I can see the
(18:10):
ground all around me. Oh,there's the Velociraptor right
in front of me face to face inthe velociraptors looking
around. Oh, my jeep is totallydestroyed from earlier. And I'm
tiptoeing along beside thisVelociraptor as we kind of make
our way through the wreckage.
Oh, he's found a skeleton ofanother dinosaur. He's sniffing
(18:33):
at the skeleton. The remains ofthis dinosaur picking picking up
the bones.
Christine Malec (18:41):
Is he going in for dessert? I understand they
are cannibalistic.
JJ Hunt (18:43):
Yeah, yeah, he totally is. Oh, he's found some eggs but
something else is coming. Ohgeez. Like a T rex is here and
attacking us. Okay. So there'ssomething like it looks like a
giant not a T rex is like agiant crocodile. Oh god and now
Okay, now a real T Rex has justentered the scene. And it is
(19:11):
facing me and the velociraptorshiding behind me. Oh, you can
literally see the saliva whenthat T Rex just reached in to
with its snout at me. I couldsee the saliva from the top jaw
to the bottom jaw. Thevelociraptors jumped onto its
(19:32):
neck just got flung at me by theT Rex. Okay, it's bearing right
down on me. Its tongue iswagging right at me. Oh, oh. Oh,
uh, helicopters flying inoverhead. Oh, a helicopter
because this is Jurassic Park.
Okay, no,
Christine Malec (19:52):
You're gonna be rescued maybe?
JJ Hunt (19:53):
I hope so. Oh, okay. So now They've all all the
dinosaurs have scattered whenthe when the helicopter flew
over the second helicoptersflying overhead. And so all the
dinosaurs have had scattered. Sothis was like living a film this
(20:17):
was composed like a short filmdesigned like a short film all
the velociraptors come back.
Hey, buddy, hey, yo, how areyou? That was weird eh?
Christine Malec (20:27):
Old friends, eh?
JJ Hunt (20:28):
Ya! It's funny like after that that amount of time
when the Velociraptor came backI felt kinda. And this is
written and directed by thisteam like this is produced like
a short film that I was livingin.
Christine Malec (20:43):
Over the past couple of episodes that we've
done on VR. JJ, you had sometechnical assistance? Would you
like to introduce your technicalassistant? Because I have some
questions for them.
JJ Hunt (20:55):
Yes, I'm very fortunate. Here at at our place
we do have an in-house selfdescribed tech expert. This is
my eldest, Owen. And an Owen hasvery kindly agreed to jump on
mic with us. Some listenersmight remember I got a little
(21:16):
bit of help in the Minecraftepisode. And that was Owen as
well. So Owen is with me, in mybasement studio today.
Owen (21:25):
I think I also did some describing of roadsigns.
Christine Malec (21:28):
That's right.
Yeah. Yeah, I remember, that wasvery helpful.
JJ Hunt (21:32):
Yeah, from the back seat in our cottage country
episode I believe that was.
Christine Malec (21:37):
That was very fun. So Oh, and what we've heard
your dad do was all just oneperson with the headset kind of
moving around. But you do thisinteractively with friends.
Right. So can you explain kindof how people would interact in
the Oculus? And in that world?
Owen (21:55):
Yeah, sure. So it mean, it's different from like
application to application. Butthe usual thing is, is that I
have my headset on at my house,and they have Verizon at their
house. And we're playingtogether in the same world. What
would I see them as, of course,in VR, all you have is a headset
(22:15):
and two controllers, it does notknow where your legs are, it
does not know where your elbowsare. So in most games, you are
either just a head and handsfloating or ahead a torso and
hands floating. There are acouple games that actually have
legs for you, but they don'tmove with your actual legs.
They're just separate.
Christine Malec (22:35):
Right. Right.
How many people at a time couldyou be interacting with?
Owen (22:41):
Well, again, it is different from application to
application. But usually thereis like, I would say, maybe like
a 50 person limit. It is notvery restrictive whatsoever. I
of course, don't have that manyfriends who have VR headset.
Christine Malec (22:58):
I don't have that many people do. Right?
Owen (23:01):
But yeah, in most situations like that. It's not
that isn't the limiting factor.
Christine Malec (23:06):
What's the favorite thing to do? What's the
most fun with with multiplepeople?
Owen (23:11):
One of two things. One is a game called gun Raiders, which
is a fairly standard shooter.
But it's in VR. So it has alittle bit of extra coolness to
it. And then another one that Idon't have yet but I really want
to get my friend has beenplaying a lot is kind of a
survival game. It's a little bitlike Minecraft, but in VR, and I
want to I forget exactly whatit's called. But I definitely
(23:33):
want to do that with them.
Christine Malec (23:36):
Oh, my gosh, um, and this kind of brings me
to a question that aboutfavorite stuff. And the
differences between yourfavorite stuff and your friends
favorite stuff? versus say, youryour parents favorite stuff. And
so I'm not sure even where to gowith this. But I guess you guys
(23:58):
have all talked about this. SoOwen, what is your take on what
kinds of things you like to doin VR and people you're 16 So
your friends your age like to doversus the things that your
parents like to do? What's Whatare the differences in general,
do you think?
Owen (24:13):
Oh, well, I would say the main thing me and my friends
like to do is play video games.
We are gamers. I mean, ofcourse, our friend group is
especially into gaming. Yeah.
And so that is most of what wedo on that is play video games.
What we're looking for is fungameplay and good game feel. But
I would say specifically with myparents, they are not gamers, I
(24:36):
think that's fair to say. Yeah,they are not into video games,
that's not really something theyenjoy doing much. So in a lot of
games can be kind of confusingand very complicated where you
have like precise button combosthat you have to do. You know,
just a lot of stuff you have tomemorize in order to play the
game. And so that's less oftheir cup of tea. So what I
(24:59):
noticed To my parents and otheradults that aren't gamers mostly
like to do is they look for theexperiences, not the somewhat
interactive, but not interactivein the sense that you have a big
challenge. But just interestingthings that you would not
otherwise get to experience ordo.
JJ Hunt (25:19):
Yeah, that's definitely that I would agree for me
personally. And I, like I've gotfriends who are my age who are
gamers, and they would be intogames on Oh, in VR. But for me,
the games just, I lose, I loseinterest in the game element of
it. I'm more, I'm more likely tostay involved if the experience
(25:42):
continues to be interesting. Ifthe visuals continue to be
interesting. If I, if I trulybelieve I'm in a new space that
I wouldn't otherwise have accessto. That's going to hold my
attention. Whether or not I haveracked up enough points by
shooting zombies. Right. It justdoesn't that just doesn't hold
me.
Christine Malec (25:59):
Were you ever a gamer, JJ?
JJ Hunt (26:01):
Yeah, I played I had gaming systems when I was a kid,
like I had the earliest Ataris.
And the first Nintendo's and allthat, and I certainly played as
a kid, but I was never even thenI had friends who were way more
interested than I was. Justyeah, wasn't my bag.
Christine Malec (26:20):
I want to talk about what our bodies do when
when our awareness is is in VR.
So JJ in the the demos that thatyou did for us, it was obvious
sometimes that your body wasmoving around in space. And so I
want to ask both of you aboutthis. But JJ first, what was
your experience, like, offeeling located or dislocated in
(26:43):
your actual physical space, whenyou were in VR was disorienting.
Yeah, more than you expected.
JJ Hunt (26:53):
I mean, when you get into whatever world you're in,
if the world is convincing, ifthe virtual world that you're in
has been rendered in aconvincing way, you very quickly
forget that you're in yourliving room, or your bedroom, or
wherever you really aretransported to that new space,
and my body respondsaccordingly. Like, I tip toe, or
(27:18):
I lean cautiously, or ifsomething swings at me, I duck,
like, it's all so new to mybrain. And my brain has spent a
lot longer being in a worldwhere real means real, like
there's just, there's nothing tothat I don't need to like,
that's, that's an obviousstatement for me real is real.
(27:39):
And so if my brain tells me it'sreal, I duck like something
swing, certainly, that's whatI'm gonna do. But I but that's
certainly not the case. WithOwen, I think with with with
Owen, and with our younger, oryounger guy, neither of them
respond physically to a virtualenvironment, the way that I do
(28:01):
or the way that Lois does, wouldyou say, Owen?
Owen (28:03):
I would say that that is very much accurate. Sometimes I
know me and my friends, like thefirst time you play, or you get
into an experience like that. Sothe first time I played
Ritchie's plank experience,which is a game, it's also kind
of just an experience where youare, you have to walk out onto a
plank really high up above acity. And it is kind of known
(28:24):
for being it's one of theearliest VR games and is known
for being very nerve wracking.
Yeah, and you know, hard to do.
But I've like the first time Idid that, I had the exact same
physical reaction. Oh, unlikeyou guys. Like after the first
time or two. I have no problem.
Literally just walking out. Nonewhatsoever anymore. Just because
(28:47):
I I highly doubt that would bethe same in real life if I was
actually on that planet. Oh,because you know, it does look
different. You can tell. I amdone. Like being done being
Yeah, yeah.
Christine Malec (29:05):
That's interesting. There were times,
which didn't make it into ourfinal episodes. But there were
definitely times JJ, where youhad become really disoriented.
Like you took a guess as towhere you thought you were in
the room. Then Owen said, Nope,you're totally facing the other
direction. So Oh, and what's itlike to watch someone? And we're
(29:26):
okay, we're not going to pokefun at your dad. Right? laugh at
your dad. You know what? Okay,maybe a little bit. But what was
it like? What's it like to watchsomeone in VR? And is it
different watching an adultversus someone your age?
Owen (29:40):
It is so different watching an adult versus someone
my age? The adults that I haveseen? I do not. I am not in
close contact with a lot ofgamer adults who Oh, really? Who
would be playing it the sameway? I would. Yeah. So yeah,
this is when I say adults, Imean, my parents.
Christine Malec (30:00):
Sure. That's a good qulification, thank you.
Owen (30:04):
Specifically with my dad, whenever you're playing whenever
he's playing VR, no matter whatthe situation, he is very
stable, I would say your stancesvary a little bit bounce, a wide
stance vary, you're trying to beas stable as possible, I would
assume that that comes from alittle bit of you can tell that
(30:25):
it's not real, but you're alsoreally immersed. So it's, your
brain is having a little bit ofa different like just a little
bit of a difficult time figuringout exactly how, like
JJ Hunt (30:35):
it's a preparedness stance.
Owen (30:37):
If something like you know, jumps out at you or
JJ Hunt (30:37):
Like, I want to be, I'm ready for anything, I'm crouched
Owen (30:37):
Sure.
a little bit low, my, you know,I got a little bit of bounce in
my knees, something, something'soff, and my body needs to be
preparedsomething that'll get more
extreme. Yeah. Whereas with meand my friends, it's, I've seen
that that regular, you know,step steadiness only happens
(30:59):
during those, like if somethingjumps out at you or something
like that, like a moment ofcombat a moment of combat, and
that's only for a second, andagain, only the first couple of
times. But after that fairlystraight stand. One thing I will
say it's this isn't just thateverybody looks very silly
playing here. Very, very sillyplaying VR, especially because,
(31:20):
like because no one can see whatyou're doing. So what it just
you look like a dork. It lookslike you're reaching out for
something. And then, like, yeah,in some games I've played to
move forwards. You have to moveyour arms up and down as if your
walk as as if like just just themotion your weight might make on
like a jog. Right? You have todo that. And that looks
(31:44):
ridiculous. If someone isstanding in one place with a
headset, doing that motion. Itno matter who it is it look I
know. I look like a dork.
Whenever I'm doing it. Yeah,like a dork. My friends look
like dork. That's hard to begreat, everybody. It's very hard
to be graceful. In game, you canlook really graceful. But nobody
(32:05):
else can see what you see.
Everybody else is just seeingyou being a dork
Christine Malec (32:08):
Oh to yourself.
Owen (32:09):
Yeah.
Christine Malec (32:12):
Fascinating.
Or, you know, what I wonder is?
Is there any footage of atheater crowd like a crowd in a
movie theater from like, 1910 orsomething? Because I just keep
going back to this idea oftechnology. It was always new
and shocking until it isn'tanymore. And yeah, like, I
wonder if people are in silentfilms who are like, super
(32:34):
reactive and startled easily andlooked like they were?
JJ Hunt (32:37):
Well, isn't there, what's the famous case of the
train?
Owen (32:40):
Yeah there's a story about like, not the first but one of
the first video recordings wasof a train filling, filling
recording. Yes, you're right. Itwas of a train pulling into a
station. Like, like from notquite head on, I actually we got
to see the recording at amuseum. But like a little bit to
your left. It's like you werestanding on a track looking down
(33:01):
the track, you're standing rightto the side on the platform, and
the train comes at you on theleft. And there's a story. I
don't know how true this is. Youknow, but there is a story that
the first time that was playedin a theater in front of a bunch
of people, they ran out of thetheater because they thought a
train was coming
JJ Hunt (33:19):
People were screaming...
Owen (33:20):
I can't confirm that, I wasn't there at the time.
JJ Hunt (33:23):
Heh heh.
Christine Malec (33:25):
Yeah yeah.
JJ Hunt (33:25):
But I think you're right, Chris. Like, I think it's
like it is the case that whenthese new technologies come out,
even if I mean intellectually,I'm sure people would have been
understood that there wasn't anactual train about to burst
through the screen. But theintellect disappears when when
your brain is introduced withsomething that is genuinely
(33:48):
scary for the first time. And solike, I know that that dinosaur
tail is not really swinging atme. And yet, how do I not duck
like how do I not in a virtualyou know, Jurassic situation,
duck when that you know, spikedtail comes whooshing over my
head. Of course, I'm gonna duck
Christine Malec (34:06):
Until you get hardened. Sorry, go ahead Owen.
JJ Hunt (34:09):
That's right. That's right until I become hardened, ya.
Owen (34:11):
Yeah, I was gonna say, uh, one of my favorite quotes that
I've seen, I don't know who saidthis, but it was human evolution
is all about tricking yourinstincts. Human Evolution is
all about trying to trick yourinstincts into doing different
things. You know, you have liketricking, like, tricking your
eyes with like video and movingpictures. Now we're tricking
(34:33):
like our entire spatialawareness. Like, what is going
you tricking your ears? It's allabout tricking your brain.
Christine Malec (34:40):
Can you say that once more
Owen (34:42):
Human evolution is all about trying to trick your
instincts into doing things.
Christine Malec (34:47):
That's wild.
I'm gonna be thinking about thatall the rest of today.
On Saturday, August the 27th2022. We'll be posting our last
episode of Talk description tome... for now! The show is more
popular than it's ever been. Andwe're still firmly committed to
description rich programming.
But there's been a tectonicshift in the financial position
(35:11):
of the podcast. So we're goingon hiatus to regroup and
reimagine our model. The worldof description is evolving fast,
and funding models for creatorsand innovators haven't kept up.
We're currently exploring newpartnerships and envisioning new
platforms that will not onlyallow us to keep creating
content, but will also provideopportunities for other
(35:34):
innovative creators, describersand allies to expand our
collective view of what can bedescribed and how we hope you'll
stay subscribe to our podcastfeed and our social media will
be quieter, but will still bearound. New episodes might pop
up now and again, as worldevents unfold, and you can stay
in touch with our otherdescription related projects.
(35:55):
We'll be closing our Patreonpage for the time being
limitless gratitude to those whostepped up to help support us,
either with funds or withfeedback. Stay tuned, there's
more to come!
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Betrayal Weekly
Betrayal Weekly is back for a new season. Every Thursday, Betrayal Weekly shares first-hand accounts of broken trust, shocking deceptions, and the trail of destruction they leave behind. Hosted by Andrea Gunning, this weekly ongoing series digs into real-life stories of betrayal and the aftermath. From stories of double lives to dark discoveries, these are cautionary tales and accounts of resilience against all odds. From the producers of the critically acclaimed Betrayal series, Betrayal Weekly drops new episodes every Thursday. If you would like to share your story, you can reach out to the Betrayal Team by emailing them at betrayalpod@gmail.com and follow us on Instagram at @betrayalpod and @glasspodcasts. Please join our Substack for additional exclusive content, curated book recommendations, and community discussions. Sign up FREE by clicking this link Beyond Betrayal Substack. Join our community dedicated to truth, resilience, and healing. Your voice matters! Be a part of our Betrayal journey on Substack.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com