March 20, 2026 • 17 mins
There is a preorder for 2025-26 Bowman Basketball next week and we could not be more excited. This is a short minisode as we dive into the info that is available but will make sure you are ready to decide if it is worth the preorder!
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_00 (00:13):
Hello and welcome to Talking Cards with Grand Salami
and the Juice.
We have a special episode foryou today.
I am here with my co-host Bert.
How are you doing, Bert?
I'm doing good.
SPEAKER_01 (00:24):
How are you, man?
SPEAKER_00 (00:25):
I'm doing good.
Thanks.
So, the reason why this episodeis special, it is the first ever
non-baseball episode.
We are going to be talking about25 to 26 Bowman basketball.
And this product has reallyshown itself so far and so
quickly, all of a sudden, whatfeels like out of nowhere to be
(00:47):
such an exciting product.
SPEAKER_01 (00:48):
And cool, yeah.
I mean, you always kind ofwondered what where they were
going to go with BowmanUniversity once Fanatics got the
licenses for football andbasketball.
And now it all kind of makessense, doesn't it?
You know, they're they'retrying, I think they're going in
the direction of wanting tocreate a product that is very
similar in nature to the Bowmanbaseball product.
And what better way to do thatthan add rookies and veterans,
(01:11):
just like in Bowman baseball?
You know, I think Bowman, bynature, its brand is very
prospect-oriented and it'salways going to be prospect
forward.
In Major League Baseball, ofcourse, that means once a player
is drafted to a team, and withthe wonderful Photoshop things
we can do, usually it's theirfirst card in a major league
team uniform.
But we don't have that sameluxury in foot in football and
basketball.
(01:32):
Guys will go straight to theleague and immediately have
their rookie cards.
There's no such thing as a, youknow, a first Bowman of a guy in
a pro uniform in the NBA.
We get that in college.
So yeah, I think kind of meldingthe two together, elevating the
Bowman University brand byincluding rookies and vets is a
huge shakeup.
It makes so much sense thatthey're doing it, though.
(01:52):
I think it's gonna havesignificant effect on that on
the Bowman University market,both good and bad, I think,
depending on where you'resitting.
And uh yeah, it's it's big news.
I think it's gonna be really,really interesting to follow.
SPEAKER_00 (02:06):
So, first, I want to give you the information that
you need to know and what isavailable.
So the product is set to beavailable for pre-order on March
24th.
That is a Tuesday at 12 o'clockEastern time.
Be ready.
We don't have a ton of detailsyet.
There's no checklist, there's noodds, there's no pricing.
(02:27):
But the big thing, as youmentioned, this was Top's
official statement, is for thefirst time ever, Bowman
basketball will includeofficially licensed NCAA men's
and women's, by the way,basketball and NBA trading cards
in the same pack.
SPEAKER_01 (02:42):
It's gonna be a crazy break, isn't it?
You're gonna have to price outall the NBA teams, you're gonna
have to price out all thecolleges or all the different
players, depending on how you'redoing it.
But yeah, it's gonna be wild.
We've never seen anything likethat.
SPEAKER_00 (02:52):
So they did say it's gonna be a 200-card base set and
a 100-card prospect base set.
Total checklist for the basecards, 300.
SPEAKER_01 (03:02):
So 200 NBA and one when 100 college?
SPEAKER_00 (03:06):
Oh, okay.
I expected the reverse.
Yeah, same.
Uh, but yeah, this this reallychanges things.
It makes it feel like Bowmanbaseball, not Bowman draft,
flagship Bowman.
The players not drafted yet,like you said, are still gonna
be in their college unis.
So you may not, you're not gonnasee the same premium for a first
Bowman of a player in basketballas you would for a first Bowman
(03:29):
of a player in baseball that'sstill going to be reserved for
the rookie cards.
The market can change.
I can't say that with a hundredwith 100% certainty, but I'm
pretty damn sure that's how it'sgonna go just based on what
we've seen in the past.
But this product has beenelevated.
It's gonna get a ton moreexposure than these past
releases.
This is gonna be in your face.
(03:49):
They really took Bowman forbasketball and figured out what
to do with it in a big way.
And it's gonna come onto thescene and everyone's gonna be
clamoring for it, I think.
SPEAKER_01 (03:58):
Yeah, I mean, the first thing that you think of
is, oh, they're introducingBowman to basketball, right?
To professional basketball.
So are they gonna follow thesame script as they do with
baseball with three flagshipreleases Bowman, Bowman Chrome,
and some kind of draft?
And I'm not sure that they will.
Like even just thinking aboutthis product, I'm I'm wondering,
is it gonna be more like BowmanChrome than it is like Bowman
(04:20):
baseball?
Because of course, one of thethings that you got to know
about Bowman baseball is thatyou're not gonna have um, you're
not gonna have chrome color forthe veterans and the rookies.
You have to wait until BowmanChrome to get your gold
refractor or red refractor of arookie.
If I were to guess, I would saythat they probably go a little
bit more the Bowman Chromeroute.
(04:41):
And knowing that they have 200pros and 100, only 100 college
players makes me think thatthat's probably the case, that
it'll be more a lot more likeBowman Chrome than it'll be like
regular Bowman.
SPEAKER_00 (04:53):
There's gonna be so many similarities but
differences at the same time.
SPEAKER_01 (04:56):
There is paper, right?
Like they've shown paper.
SPEAKER_00 (04:59):
Yes.
SPEAKER_01 (04:59):
And is it the retro, the isn't there a Bill Russell
paper first?
SPEAKER_00 (05:04):
Yes, there there is a Bill Russell first Bowman.
Yeah, they they will have thoseretro Bowman.
SPEAKER_01 (05:09):
So the retrofractor they have in paper, which is
also kind of unique.
SPEAKER_00 (05:13):
The retrofracture of Bill Russell is Chrome.
And it is a retrofactor.
SPEAKER_01 (05:17):
So okay I was gonna say that'd be weird.
SPEAKER_00 (05:19):
Okay.
So a few things that it ch itkind of flips on its head is
this is gonna be more of arookie chase and a prospect
chase, I believe.
Of course, this will be yourfirst chance to get a lot of
these prospects in like a topp'sproduct and find their first
autograph cards, but I thinkultimately people are still
gonna be looking for like CooperFlag.
That's what they're really gonnawant.
Their Bowman rookies that we'regonna see here, they will sell
(05:42):
for premium, not quite as highas Topps Chrome, but I think
that they will sell for higherthan those other tops off shoots
that we've seen, like ToppsMidnight and things like that.
I think that's where we canexpect the price to settle, just
like we see with Bowman Bowmanrookies for baseball.
And I would also assume we don'thave odds yet, but I would
assume the rookie autos will beabout as short printed as they
(06:03):
are for baseball releases.
So for those that are justlistening, yeah, I I think that
we will see that.
That's that's my gut.
Again, we don't have anything toactually base this on, but when
you see like Bowman baseballrelease, the prospect autos are
what you can really find.
If you get a rookie auto,they're not gonna hit as much at
as high of a rate as theprospect autos.
I think they're parallels, theyalso have less parallels for the
(06:25):
autos than the uh prospects.
You would know that better thanI would.
Yeah, they do.
But I think that the autos thatyou're gonna find are mostly
gonna be prospects, and thatthat's what I would fully go
into expecting.
If we don't get a checklist orodds by the time there's
pre-order, which we probablywon't, something that you should
take into account that shouldnot deter you from buying this.
Yeah.
Now, I want to get into somecool things that they're gonna
(06:47):
have.
There will be the red rookiecards for the red rookie
program.
SPEAKER_01 (06:49):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (06:50):
How do you like that?
SPEAKER_01 (06:51):
I love it.
I love the red rookie program.
SPEAKER_00 (06:53):
So the red rookie program, we saw this for the
first time this year in theBowman products that rookie
cards were available.
They would have the red rookielogo.
There was about like one per boxusually for a regular hobby box,
I believe.
And what it was is if thatrookie won rookie of the year,
and then it would be worth like$50 um in fanatics credit.
It would also make them eligiblefor future prizes for winning
(07:15):
things like MVP and eventuallyHall of Fame status.
But yeah, it's just it's just afun chase, unless you're chasing
Cade Horton and you put a bunchof money into that and you were
disappointed at the end of thestate.
SPEAKER_01 (07:30):
Like you had a bad experience with the red rookie
program.
SPEAKER_00 (07:33):
But I I like the program.
There will be bets in vet autosas well.
Again, these I believe will be avery tough hit.
No telling who they will be yet.
I would assume a similar autochecklist to Tops Chrome, maybe
shorter, but I would assumethose major players to be super
tough to hit.
How do you feel about the vetautos in this?
SPEAKER_01 (07:51):
I mean, I saw them peep a SGA orange auto.
Looks great.
Have they previewed or talkedabout anybody else that will
sign?
SPEAKER_00 (07:58):
I believe so.
Not for vets that I've seen.
No.
SPEAKER_01 (08:02):
I don't know.
It'll be really interesting tosee how they distribute the
autos.
I think my first reaction towhat you were saying about the
rookie versus the prospect orthe college auto, I think it
might be a little bit different,actually.
Um I think you're gonna see alot more rookies.
You're not gonna see morerookies than college players,
but I think the ratio is gonnabe a lot slimmer than it than it
is in Bowman baseball.
(08:22):
You know, Bowman baseball, youopen up a 24-auto jumbo case and
you might hit one or two rookieautos.
I think if it's the same thingover on, well, I guess it's two
autos per hobby box, it'llprobably be 12 boxes per case.
So in a 24 auto hobby case, I'dbet maybe it's like half and
half college versus NBA.
SPEAKER_00 (08:43):
Another reason why I think that we're gonna see a lot
of problems.
SPEAKER_01 (08:45):
No idea to tell.
SPEAKER_00 (08:46):
They're just speculation at this point, but I
think that it'll be And don'tforget we have men's and women's
college basketball that bothhave to be represented in this.
And I think they're gonna havethem signing a ton.
And they already have theirrookies signing a ton.
There's only so many cars theseguys can sign, even though it
seems like it's more and moreevery year.
SPEAKER_01 (09:01):
And they're more expensive to the NBA guys, too.
Yeah, so it wouldn't surpriseme.
SPEAKER_00 (09:05):
Yeah, yeah.
But my favorite part of thisrelease, my favorite part of
this release, we are gonna seeall the case hits and the super
short prints that we have seenacross the Bowman products.
We are gonna see etched inglass, we're gonna see
retrofactors like we talkedabout.
We're gonna see Bowmanspotlights, we're gonna see
crystallized anime, garbage pailkids.
(09:25):
Maybe they'll tell us autosafter all the breakers release
in prices for the garbage palekids again.
But I don't care.
I would love to see those.
Yeah, I am so excited about allthese SSP hits.
SPEAKER_01 (09:35):
Yeah, man.
They picked the best four of theSSPs.
They really did.
I think GPKs are the best.
I think anime is the secondbest, crystallize is the third
best, and spotlight is thefourth best.
Those are the right ones.
And then, of course, you havethe Etchon glass that I think
for a lot of Panini collectorswill resonate.
And a lot of people obviouslymoving over that are big-time
basketball collectors fromPanini to Topps.
(09:57):
That is the part that I think ismost exciting as a Topps
baseball and a Bowman baseballguy, is we know that Panini case
hits have always done so muchbetter than tops.
You're seeing that carry over alittle bit into the topp's
chrome.
Some of the SSPs and ToppsChrome have done really, really
well, better than any ToppsChrome SSP has ever done in
baseball.
(10:17):
I think we could see anelevation of these four Bowman
SSPs in the baseball because ofhow well the basketball ones
will inevitably do.
Um, and that that to me isreally exciting.
Maybe they could lift upSpotlight.
Like Spotlight is one of themost underappreciated,
underpriced cards you could findfor any Bowman prospect, in my
opinion.
It's for a lot of reasons.
(10:38):
But I hope that basketball canelevate that.
I don't know.
We'll see.
SPEAKER_00 (10:42):
I was thinking the same thing.
I think that they are kind ofstarting with a clean slate
here.
Um, because as you said withSpotlight, it didn't start out
as an SSP and then they realizedthat was the direction to go.
Here they can start it howeverthey want.
They are saying it's an SSP, ofcourse, as it should be.
And hopefully they get thoseodds down right where it becomes
(11:03):
a meaningful chase.
But that will be that is yet tobe seen, as as we know.
SPEAKER_01 (11:08):
It'll see how much they print of this stuff too,
you know, right?
Like I think it's gonna be aretail product.
There's probably going to beblasters, megas, maybe hangers.
Delight.
Uh you're gonna see delight,you're gonna see hobby, and
you're probably gonna see jumbo,just like in line, same, same as
you normally see on the hobbyconfigurations.
(11:28):
You'll probably end up seeing asapphire.
I just hope that they keep theprint run kind of in line with
baseball.
I hope that they don't go toofar above.
In fact, I hope that they comein under, but so does everybody.
I don't know if that'srealistic, but they printed
between between Delight, Jumbo,and Hobby in 2025 Bowman
Baseball, they printed anestimated 20,000 cases.
(11:49):
I'm hoping that they keep itunder 20,000.
I'm hope, really hoping thatthey keep it like around 15,000
cases of the hobbyconfigurations, because that
stuff will be really loaded ifthat's the case.
Um, and you know that the pricetag is gonna be really high on
this.
Somebody asked me today, howmuch do you think that tops.com
is gonna list this stuff for onpre-order for the two hobby, for
(12:09):
the two auto hobby boxes, andhow much do you think it's gonna
be worth on release day, like onthe secondary market?
Without seeing a checklist orpack odds, I think it could be a
400, 450,$500 hobby box onpre-order and definitely up from
there on secondary by the timerelease comes around.
(12:30):
And of course, hearing thosenumbers, like a lot of Bowman U
University collectors are gonnabe like, oh, no way, right?
Like, I'm not gonna be able toafford anything anymore.
And I really feel for thosecollectors, right?
Bowman University has alwaysbeen an excellent value rip and
pretty cheap.
Like if you want to rip apersonal box or even a case,
like you could you can affordit.
It's not gonna be the caseanymore, unfortunately.
(12:51):
The entry price, if you want torip personals, is gonna be
really, really high.
I'm hoping that the way thatthey build the checklist that
won't affect things like pickyour team or pick your player
prices.
I hope the value equation is thesame.
If you're not after the NBA guysand you want to go after like,
you know, one of your one ofyour alma mater's best players
or something like that.
I hope it still ends up beingthe same value equation, but a
(13:13):
lot to be seen there.
It just it kind of sucks thatit's gonna be so much more
expensive and unattainable for alot of collectors.
SPEAKER_00 (13:20):
Yeah.
So ultimately it comes down toshould you buy?
And if you can, if you had themeans to do so, yes, it is a
yes.
It almost does not matter whatthe price is if you should
attempt to buy this.
I said just hope it's below 500.
But I think no matter what itis, you're gonna be able to make
money on it.
If you are someone that reallywants to rip it and you do have
(13:42):
the means and the opportunity toactually be able to check out on
tops, buy four boxes, flipthree, and keep one and rip it.
It'll pay for your box, probablyand then some.
That's just one way that you cando it.
But if you're me, then you'regonna end up ripping all four.
Um, but these will skyrocket onsecondary.
Yeah, these are gonna go.
SPEAKER_01 (13:59):
Yeah, as long as the print run isn't astronomical, as
long as they don't do anythingcrazy with the auto checklists
and making them way too lengthyso that it's impossible to hit
any of the big names.
We've seen it happen before.
Look at top two 2022 ToppsChrome baseball.
That's a perfect example of agood rookie class that was just
diluted, watered down, terrible.
(14:20):
They could do the same thing ifthey're really trying to get as
much money out of the product inthe short term as they can.
But I feel like generally, sofar, what we've seen with
fanatics when they're reallystarting a new brand and it's
that first year of a new brand,they do it right.
They did it right with TopsChrome Basketball and Tops
Chrome Basketball Sapphire.
I hope that they do the samething with Bowman.
SPEAKER_00 (14:41):
So if you are looking to buy it, this is gonna
be a sellout and a frustratinghour of mashing at cart and
checkout on tops.com.
It is, since it's a pre-order,they do tend to be slightly
easier.
This is your best chance to buy.
So, and remember, withpre-orders, you have up until a
week before release to cancel.
(15:02):
So if you're on the fence, Iwould take the chance for sure.
And uh, the only negatives thatI see is it will most likely be
a massive auto checklist.
Also, NBA prospects, they do nothave the same value and
long-term prospecting as MLBguys.
Just something for thepredominantly baseball guys that
probably listen to this podcastthat might be moving to
basketball that might not knowtoo much.
(15:23):
A basketball draft is sodifferent than a baseball draft.
Baseball draft, there are guysthat you can find in later
rounds that are going toeventually contribute or you can
take a flyer on.
Basketball, that's very rare.
You don't usually see those lateround guys.
Usually the second round doesn'tmean anything.
No one really watches the secondround.
Not that you're watching thebaseball draft typically, but
(15:44):
you hope to have 10 to 15 guysto care about.
And that's it.
It's so much harder for sleepersand those late picks.
So it really limits whatprospect autos that you can
actually get excited about orget a good value reap reselling.
So those are the only negativesthat I could really think of.
Just something to be aware of ifyou're making that transition
from baseball collecting tobasketball.
SPEAKER_01 (16:06):
Yep.
Well said.
SPEAKER_00 (16:07):
Any any final thoughts on this Bowman
basketball preview?
SPEAKER_01 (16:13):
No, man.
I'm super excited to follow theentire thing.
I'm really looking forward toseeing the pack odds so we can
know production run and thechecklist, of course, so we can
see how long some of these autochecklists are.
But it's gonna be unless theyjust print it to the absolute
moon, this is gonna be such afun rip, and I'm looking forward
to it.
SPEAKER_00 (16:31):
It's gonna be it's gonna be fun.
There's just so many fun hits init, and it it is gonna be
massive with the number ofplayers in there.
But actually, 200 card base and100 card prospect base isn't too
bad.
But yeah, well, there's a lotyet to be seen.
Um definitely, yeah.
All right, well, thank youeveryone so much for listening
for our first ever basketballpreview, and it's kind of a
(16:53):
preview of a preview, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (16:55):
But we'll do more in depth, I think, when when we get
some more details.
SPEAKER_00 (16:59):
Yeah, this is the product where maybe we'll bring
on a guest that knows more aboutbasketball than me.
But yeah, um we'll see how thatgoes.
Thank you so much, everyone, forlistening.
This is the Juice along withGrant Salami.
This is a talking cards podcast.
SPEAKER_01 (17:14):
Thanks, Juice.
SPEAKER_00 (17:15):
Thank you, everyone.
Thanks, Bert.
SPEAKER_01 (17:16):
Thanks, everybody.
Hello and welcome to Talking Cards with Grand Salami
and the Juice.
We have a special episode foryou today.
I am here with my co-host Bert.
How are you doing, Bert?
I'm doing good.
SPEAKER_01 (00:24):
How are you, man?
SPEAKER_00 (00:25):
I'm doing good.
Thanks.
So, the reason why this episodeis special, it is the first ever
non-baseball episode.
We are going to be talking about25 to 26 Bowman basketball.
And this product has reallyshown itself so far and so
quickly, all of a sudden, whatfeels like out of nowhere to be
(00:47):
such an exciting product.
SPEAKER_01 (00:48):
And cool, yeah.
I mean, you always kind ofwondered what where they were
going to go with BowmanUniversity once Fanatics got the
licenses for football andbasketball.
And now it all kind of makessense, doesn't it?
You know, they're they'retrying, I think they're going in
the direction of wanting tocreate a product that is very
similar in nature to the Bowmanbaseball product.
And what better way to do thatthan add rookies and veterans,
(01:11):
just like in Bowman baseball?
You know, I think Bowman, bynature, its brand is very
prospect-oriented and it'salways going to be prospect
forward.
In Major League Baseball, ofcourse, that means once a player
is drafted to a team, and withthe wonderful Photoshop things
we can do, usually it's theirfirst card in a major league
team uniform.
But we don't have that sameluxury in foot in football and
basketball.
(01:32):
Guys will go straight to theleague and immediately have
their rookie cards.
There's no such thing as a, youknow, a first Bowman of a guy in
a pro uniform in the NBA.
We get that in college.
So yeah, I think kind of meldingthe two together, elevating the
Bowman University brand byincluding rookies and vets is a
huge shakeup.
It makes so much sense thatthey're doing it, though.
(01:52):
I think it's gonna havesignificant effect on that on
the Bowman University market,both good and bad, I think,
depending on where you'resitting.
And uh yeah, it's it's big news.
I think it's gonna be really,really interesting to follow.
SPEAKER_00 (02:06):
So, first, I want to give you the information that
you need to know and what isavailable.
So the product is set to beavailable for pre-order on March
24th.
That is a Tuesday at 12 o'clockEastern time.
Be ready.
We don't have a ton of detailsyet.
There's no checklist, there's noodds, there's no pricing.
(02:27):
But the big thing, as youmentioned, this was Top's
official statement, is for thefirst time ever, Bowman
basketball will includeofficially licensed NCAA men's
and women's, by the way,basketball and NBA trading cards
in the same pack.
SPEAKER_01 (02:42):
It's gonna be a crazy break, isn't it?
You're gonna have to price outall the NBA teams, you're gonna
have to price out all thecolleges or all the different
players, depending on how you'redoing it.
But yeah, it's gonna be wild.
We've never seen anything likethat.
SPEAKER_00 (02:52):
So they did say it's gonna be a 200-card base set and
a 100-card prospect base set.
Total checklist for the basecards, 300.
SPEAKER_01 (03:02):
So 200 NBA and one when 100 college?
SPEAKER_00 (03:06):
Oh, okay.
I expected the reverse.
Yeah, same.
Uh, but yeah, this this reallychanges things.
It makes it feel like Bowmanbaseball, not Bowman draft,
flagship Bowman.
The players not drafted yet,like you said, are still gonna
be in their college unis.
So you may not, you're not gonnasee the same premium for a first
Bowman of a player in basketballas you would for a first Bowman
(03:29):
of a player in baseball that'sstill going to be reserved for
the rookie cards.
The market can change.
I can't say that with a hundredwith 100% certainty, but I'm
pretty damn sure that's how it'sgonna go just based on what
we've seen in the past.
But this product has beenelevated.
It's gonna get a ton moreexposure than these past
releases.
This is gonna be in your face.
(03:49):
They really took Bowman forbasketball and figured out what
to do with it in a big way.
And it's gonna come onto thescene and everyone's gonna be
clamoring for it, I think.
SPEAKER_01 (03:58):
Yeah, I mean, the first thing that you think of
is, oh, they're introducingBowman to basketball, right?
To professional basketball.
So are they gonna follow thesame script as they do with
baseball with three flagshipreleases Bowman, Bowman Chrome,
and some kind of draft?
And I'm not sure that they will.
Like even just thinking aboutthis product, I'm I'm wondering,
is it gonna be more like BowmanChrome than it is like Bowman
(04:20):
baseball?
Because of course, one of thethings that you got to know
about Bowman baseball is thatyou're not gonna have um, you're
not gonna have chrome color forthe veterans and the rookies.
You have to wait until BowmanChrome to get your gold
refractor or red refractor of arookie.
If I were to guess, I would saythat they probably go a little
bit more the Bowman Chromeroute.
(04:41):
And knowing that they have 200pros and 100, only 100 college
players makes me think thatthat's probably the case, that
it'll be more a lot more likeBowman Chrome than it'll be like
regular Bowman.
SPEAKER_00 (04:53):
There's gonna be so many similarities but
differences at the same time.
SPEAKER_01 (04:56):
There is paper, right?
Like they've shown paper.
SPEAKER_00 (04:59):
Yes.
SPEAKER_01 (04:59):
And is it the retro, the isn't there a Bill Russell
paper first?
SPEAKER_00 (05:04):
Yes, there there is a Bill Russell first Bowman.
Yeah, they they will have thoseretro Bowman.
SPEAKER_01 (05:09):
So the retrofractor they have in paper, which is
also kind of unique.
SPEAKER_00 (05:13):
The retrofracture of Bill Russell is Chrome.
And it is a retrofactor.
SPEAKER_01 (05:17):
So okay I was gonna say that'd be weird.
SPEAKER_00 (05:19):
Okay.
So a few things that it ch itkind of flips on its head is
this is gonna be more of arookie chase and a prospect
chase, I believe.
Of course, this will be yourfirst chance to get a lot of
these prospects in like a topp'sproduct and find their first
autograph cards, but I thinkultimately people are still
gonna be looking for like CooperFlag.
That's what they're really gonnawant.
Their Bowman rookies that we'regonna see here, they will sell
(05:42):
for premium, not quite as highas Topps Chrome, but I think
that they will sell for higherthan those other tops off shoots
that we've seen, like ToppsMidnight and things like that.
I think that's where we canexpect the price to settle, just
like we see with Bowman Bowmanrookies for baseball.
And I would also assume we don'thave odds yet, but I would
assume the rookie autos will beabout as short printed as they
(06:03):
are for baseball releases.
So for those that are justlistening, yeah, I I think that
we will see that.
That's that's my gut.
Again, we don't have anything toactually base this on, but when
you see like Bowman baseballrelease, the prospect autos are
what you can really find.
If you get a rookie auto,they're not gonna hit as much at
as high of a rate as theprospect autos.
I think they're parallels, theyalso have less parallels for the
(06:25):
autos than the uh prospects.
You would know that better thanI would.
Yeah, they do.
But I think that the autos thatyou're gonna find are mostly
gonna be prospects, and thatthat's what I would fully go
into expecting.
If we don't get a checklist orodds by the time there's
pre-order, which we probablywon't, something that you should
take into account that shouldnot deter you from buying this.
Yeah.
Now, I want to get into somecool things that they're gonna
(06:47):
have.
There will be the red rookiecards for the red rookie
program.
SPEAKER_01 (06:49):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (06:50):
How do you like that?
SPEAKER_01 (06:51):
I love it.
I love the red rookie program.
SPEAKER_00 (06:53):
So the red rookie program, we saw this for the
first time this year in theBowman products that rookie
cards were available.
They would have the red rookielogo.
There was about like one per boxusually for a regular hobby box,
I believe.
And what it was is if thatrookie won rookie of the year,
and then it would be worth like$50 um in fanatics credit.
It would also make them eligiblefor future prizes for winning
(07:15):
things like MVP and eventuallyHall of Fame status.
But yeah, it's just it's just afun chase, unless you're chasing
Cade Horton and you put a bunchof money into that and you were
disappointed at the end of thestate.
SPEAKER_01 (07:30):
Like you had a bad experience with the red rookie
program.
SPEAKER_00 (07:33):
But I I like the program.
There will be bets in vet autosas well.
Again, these I believe will be avery tough hit.
No telling who they will be yet.
I would assume a similar autochecklist to Tops Chrome, maybe
shorter, but I would assumethose major players to be super
tough to hit.
How do you feel about the vetautos in this?
SPEAKER_01 (07:51):
I mean, I saw them peep a SGA orange auto.
Looks great.
Have they previewed or talkedabout anybody else that will
sign?
SPEAKER_00 (07:58):
I believe so.
Not for vets that I've seen.
No.
SPEAKER_01 (08:02):
I don't know.
It'll be really interesting tosee how they distribute the
autos.
I think my first reaction towhat you were saying about the
rookie versus the prospect orthe college auto, I think it
might be a little bit different,actually.
Um I think you're gonna see alot more rookies.
You're not gonna see morerookies than college players,
but I think the ratio is gonnabe a lot slimmer than it than it
is in Bowman baseball.
(08:22):
You know, Bowman baseball, youopen up a 24-auto jumbo case and
you might hit one or two rookieautos.
I think if it's the same thingover on, well, I guess it's two
autos per hobby box, it'llprobably be 12 boxes per case.
So in a 24 auto hobby case, I'dbet maybe it's like half and
half college versus NBA.
SPEAKER_00 (08:43):
Another reason why I think that we're gonna see a lot
of problems.
SPEAKER_01 (08:45):
No idea to tell.
SPEAKER_00 (08:46):
They're just speculation at this point, but I
think that it'll be And don'tforget we have men's and women's
college basketball that bothhave to be represented in this.
And I think they're gonna havethem signing a ton.
And they already have theirrookies signing a ton.
There's only so many cars theseguys can sign, even though it
seems like it's more and moreevery year.
SPEAKER_01 (09:01):
And they're more expensive to the NBA guys, too.
Yeah, so it wouldn't surpriseme.
SPEAKER_00 (09:05):
Yeah, yeah.
But my favorite part of thisrelease, my favorite part of
this release, we are gonna seeall the case hits and the super
short prints that we have seenacross the Bowman products.
We are gonna see etched inglass, we're gonna see
retrofactors like we talkedabout.
We're gonna see Bowmanspotlights, we're gonna see
crystallized anime, garbage pailkids.
(09:25):
Maybe they'll tell us autosafter all the breakers release
in prices for the garbage palekids again.
But I don't care.
I would love to see those.
Yeah, I am so excited about allthese SSP hits.
SPEAKER_01 (09:35):
Yeah, man.
They picked the best four of theSSPs.
They really did.
I think GPKs are the best.
I think anime is the secondbest, crystallize is the third
best, and spotlight is thefourth best.
Those are the right ones.
And then, of course, you havethe Etchon glass that I think
for a lot of Panini collectorswill resonate.
And a lot of people obviouslymoving over that are big-time
basketball collectors fromPanini to Topps.
(09:57):
That is the part that I think ismost exciting as a Topps
baseball and a Bowman baseballguy, is we know that Panini case
hits have always done so muchbetter than tops.
You're seeing that carry over alittle bit into the topp's
chrome.
Some of the SSPs and ToppsChrome have done really, really
well, better than any ToppsChrome SSP has ever done in
baseball.
(10:17):
I think we could see anelevation of these four Bowman
SSPs in the baseball because ofhow well the basketball ones
will inevitably do.
Um, and that that to me isreally exciting.
Maybe they could lift upSpotlight.
Like Spotlight is one of themost underappreciated,
underpriced cards you could findfor any Bowman prospect, in my
opinion.
It's for a lot of reasons.
(10:38):
But I hope that basketball canelevate that.
I don't know.
We'll see.
SPEAKER_00 (10:42):
I was thinking the same thing.
I think that they are kind ofstarting with a clean slate
here.
Um, because as you said withSpotlight, it didn't start out
as an SSP and then they realizedthat was the direction to go.
Here they can start it howeverthey want.
They are saying it's an SSP, ofcourse, as it should be.
And hopefully they get thoseodds down right where it becomes
(11:03):
a meaningful chase.
But that will be that is yet tobe seen, as as we know.
SPEAKER_01 (11:08):
It'll see how much they print of this stuff too,
you know, right?
Like I think it's gonna be aretail product.
There's probably going to beblasters, megas, maybe hangers.
Delight.
Uh you're gonna see delight,you're gonna see hobby, and
you're probably gonna see jumbo,just like in line, same, same as
you normally see on the hobbyconfigurations.
(11:28):
You'll probably end up seeing asapphire.
I just hope that they keep theprint run kind of in line with
baseball.
I hope that they don't go toofar above.
In fact, I hope that they comein under, but so does everybody.
I don't know if that'srealistic, but they printed
between between Delight, Jumbo,and Hobby in 2025 Bowman
Baseball, they printed anestimated 20,000 cases.
(11:49):
I'm hoping that they keep itunder 20,000.
I'm hope, really hoping thatthey keep it like around 15,000
cases of the hobbyconfigurations, because that
stuff will be really loaded ifthat's the case.
Um, and you know that the pricetag is gonna be really high on
this.
Somebody asked me today, howmuch do you think that tops.com
is gonna list this stuff for onpre-order for the two hobby, for
(12:09):
the two auto hobby boxes, andhow much do you think it's gonna
be worth on release day, like onthe secondary market?
Without seeing a checklist orpack odds, I think it could be a
400, 450,$500 hobby box onpre-order and definitely up from
there on secondary by the timerelease comes around.
(12:30):
And of course, hearing thosenumbers, like a lot of Bowman U
University collectors are gonnabe like, oh, no way, right?
Like, I'm not gonna be able toafford anything anymore.
And I really feel for thosecollectors, right?
Bowman University has alwaysbeen an excellent value rip and
pretty cheap.
Like if you want to rip apersonal box or even a case,
like you could you can affordit.
It's not gonna be the caseanymore, unfortunately.
(12:51):
The entry price, if you want torip personals, is gonna be
really, really high.
I'm hoping that the way thatthey build the checklist that
won't affect things like pickyour team or pick your player
prices.
I hope the value equation is thesame.
If you're not after the NBA guysand you want to go after like,
you know, one of your one ofyour alma mater's best players
or something like that.
I hope it still ends up beingthe same value equation, but a
(13:13):
lot to be seen there.
It just it kind of sucks thatit's gonna be so much more
expensive and unattainable for alot of collectors.
SPEAKER_00 (13:20):
Yeah.
So ultimately it comes down toshould you buy?
And if you can, if you had themeans to do so, yes, it is a
yes.
It almost does not matter whatthe price is if you should
attempt to buy this.
I said just hope it's below 500.
But I think no matter what itis, you're gonna be able to make
money on it.
If you are someone that reallywants to rip it and you do have
(13:42):
the means and the opportunity toactually be able to check out on
tops, buy four boxes, flipthree, and keep one and rip it.
It'll pay for your box, probablyand then some.
That's just one way that you cando it.
But if you're me, then you'regonna end up ripping all four.
Um, but these will skyrocket onsecondary.
Yeah, these are gonna go.
SPEAKER_01 (13:59):
Yeah, as long as the print run isn't astronomical, as
long as they don't do anythingcrazy with the auto checklists
and making them way too lengthyso that it's impossible to hit
any of the big names.
We've seen it happen before.
Look at top two 2022 ToppsChrome baseball.
That's a perfect example of agood rookie class that was just
diluted, watered down, terrible.
(14:20):
They could do the same thing ifthey're really trying to get as
much money out of the product inthe short term as they can.
But I feel like generally, sofar, what we've seen with
fanatics when they're reallystarting a new brand and it's
that first year of a new brand,they do it right.
They did it right with TopsChrome Basketball and Tops
Chrome Basketball Sapphire.
I hope that they do the samething with Bowman.
SPEAKER_00 (14:41):
So if you are looking to buy it, this is gonna
be a sellout and a frustratinghour of mashing at cart and
checkout on tops.com.
It is, since it's a pre-order,they do tend to be slightly
easier.
This is your best chance to buy.
So, and remember, withpre-orders, you have up until a
week before release to cancel.
(15:02):
So if you're on the fence, Iwould take the chance for sure.
And uh, the only negatives thatI see is it will most likely be
a massive auto checklist.
Also, NBA prospects, they do nothave the same value and
long-term prospecting as MLBguys.
Just something for thepredominantly baseball guys that
probably listen to this podcastthat might be moving to
basketball that might not knowtoo much.
(15:23):
A basketball draft is sodifferent than a baseball draft.
Baseball draft, there are guysthat you can find in later
rounds that are going toeventually contribute or you can
take a flyer on.
Basketball, that's very rare.
You don't usually see those lateround guys.
Usually the second round doesn'tmean anything.
No one really watches the secondround.
Not that you're watching thebaseball draft typically, but
(15:44):
you hope to have 10 to 15 guysto care about.
And that's it.
It's so much harder for sleepersand those late picks.
So it really limits whatprospect autos that you can
actually get excited about orget a good value reap reselling.
So those are the only negativesthat I could really think of.
Just something to be aware of ifyou're making that transition
from baseball collecting tobasketball.
SPEAKER_01 (16:06):
Yep.
Well said.
SPEAKER_00 (16:07):
Any any final thoughts on this Bowman
basketball preview?
SPEAKER_01 (16:13):
No, man.
I'm super excited to follow theentire thing.
I'm really looking forward toseeing the pack odds so we can
know production run and thechecklist, of course, so we can
see how long some of these autochecklists are.
But it's gonna be unless theyjust print it to the absolute
moon, this is gonna be such afun rip, and I'm looking forward
to it.
SPEAKER_00 (16:31):
It's gonna be it's gonna be fun.
There's just so many fun hits init, and it it is gonna be
massive with the number ofplayers in there.
But actually, 200 card base and100 card prospect base isn't too
bad.
But yeah, well, there's a lotyet to be seen.
Um definitely, yeah.
All right, well, thank youeveryone so much for listening
for our first ever basketballpreview, and it's kind of a
(16:53):
preview of a preview, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (16:55):
But we'll do more in depth, I think, when when we get
some more details.
SPEAKER_00 (16:59):
Yeah, this is the product where maybe we'll bring
on a guest that knows more aboutbasketball than me.
But yeah, um we'll see how thatgoes.
Thank you so much, everyone, forlistening.
This is the Juice along withGrant Salami.
This is a talking cards podcast.
SPEAKER_01 (17:14):
Thanks, Juice.
SPEAKER_00 (17:15):
Thank you, everyone.
Thanks, Bert.
SPEAKER_01 (17:16):
Thanks, everybody.
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