August 28, 2025 • 62 mins
In this episode of Taste Music Hear Food, we sit down with Gustavo & Kate Romero; the powerhouse couple behind Minneapolis’s beloved Nixta Tortilleria and the James Beard–nominated Oro by Nixta.
From ancient nixtamalization to the realities of running a kitchen (and a marriage), we dive into it all:
How heirloom corn became their shared love language What it’s really like building a food empire as a coupleWhy culture, craft, and conflict all deserve a seat at the tableAnd the soundtrack behind their slow burns and big wins
We play “This or That: Husband & Wife Edition,” get candid in the Lightning Round, and explore the beautiful tension between legacy and innovation.
This episode is layered with flavor, full of heart, and 100% hand-pressed.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
You know we. Don't you know what takes a
special track to do this? My Mama B&Q super sauce.
It's just the flu with this chef.
I'm here to remind y'all I'm sick with it.
My name is meaning it's one of the same.
Simple and plain. I'm all about my paper.
The bacon cheddar pain got theselanes running for the border.
(00:20):
The talents and Mr. Porter keep it flowing like it's water.
Here we go, Here we go creeping to below speed.
Is it him and his friend sittingin the nose?
Please play it cool. He is special.
Just because he's on TV, everybody's hands up acting like
they know we welcome, welcome, welcome to another episode of
the taste music here food podcast show.
(00:40):
I am your host Ed Porter. This is the place for food,
music and culture and how they all connect.
Today we have two very amazing guests that travelled such a
very long way to be here today. Before we get started, I I
definitely want to attempt to pay them the proper give them
(01:05):
the pop of flowers they deserve with this intro.
OK, so here we go. Today's guests are the heartbeat
behind one of the most culturally rich and
unapologetically flavored drivenspots in the Twin Cities.
These partners, both in life andin business, aren't just making
tortillas. They're preserving stories,
honoring ancestry, and redefining what modern Mexican
(01:27):
food can look like through Nextaand Ora by Nexta.
From the ancient tradition of nixtomalization to a James Beard
nod that turned heads nationwide, their work isn't
just about the food on the plate, it's about the soul
behind it. They're bringing the baselines
of Jodego Mexico and the Temple of Minneapolis into one shared
(01:48):
rhythm. So let's tap in, because today
we're talking about heirloom corn, cultural preservation,
creative grind, and the melody behind the masa.
Welcome to the table, Gustavo and Kate Romero.
That that seemed perfect to me. Yep.
Yeah. Thank you guys for being here.
(02:12):
Thank you for having us. There's everybody has a First
off What's going on shirt is an honor of you guys.
I'm a lover of all things tortillas.
Honestly, I think it's the perfect bread.
It's a vehicle. It is bread.
It's a vehicle. Yes, it is.
It is the perfect vehicle. Talk to me about how you guys
First off, how'd you guys meet? That's that's even a better
(02:35):
question. How'd you guys meet?
It's my fault he's here to point.
That out you did it. OK, I was.
I was raised in Poland for many years, but when I was 11-12
years old, we moved here to Minneapolis.
I grew up here for the most partand then went out to San
Francisco to do a little post culinary school, like big
(02:58):
dreams. I wanna cook there and
eventually have my own restaurant and then that's where
I met him. In San Francisco.
Awesome. Awesome.
What years was that around 2:00?1009, not 2010, is when we
started working together. OK, yeah.
So, yeah, I, I, I lived in the Bay for 11 years.
(03:18):
So I actually was here in 98. Open up Aquavit left in O3 went
to the Bay. I was there for 11 years.
I I love the Bay Area. This is it's a it's a it's
different. It's wonderful.
It's a lovely. It's a.
Super. Cultural I love it.
I I literally love love the Bay Area.
(03:39):
It's it's it's one of those places that you just have to
experience. That's a OK from there to here
though. Like how?
Well, I think we were kind of done with San Francisco.
Yeah, he left to go to Miami andhelp fix a restaurant down there
for a restaurant group. I think ended up working at like
2 restaurants. I moved back home.
So I was like, and we, we were doing long distance.
(04:01):
Then there was the idea that, oh, maybe we'll like Miami
enough and I'll go down there, and then I went to Miami.
Yeah, Miami's good for the weekend.
Yes, two days Max. It was wonderful to go, like,
around, you know, Thanksgiving or like when it's cold, but then
when you go in June, you're like, I can't do this right now.
Miami is is a beautiful, again, beautiful place, great, great
(04:24):
food, scenery, beach, all those things.
It's not real. Like there's a lot of it's it's
it's, it's not like you would. It's very it's very Hollywood.
I like it's it's hard to describe that like nothing
against it. I just think that it's not.
It's such a tourist destination that like you have to go to the
outskirts of Miami to really seepeople live.
(04:47):
And for a especially raising a family that's not, at least
there's not high, you know, think of of that as well.
Like for me, when I started, when I had my family, like I had
an opportunity to go back to NewYork.
First off, my kids are way too soft to my kids are way too
sheltered. And I've I've baby birded them
(05:07):
too much. So they yeah, they wouldn't
survive. They'd be yeah, broken naked on
the corner in under an hour. But yeah, this is a great place.
Minnesota is a great place to raise a family for sure.
Yeah. And I don't necessarily know if
that was our plan when he ended up moving here.
There was a long period of time where like we don't really want
(05:27):
to have kids. You know, we were on that page
for a very long time. But we both.
What I knew once I moved back from San Francisco is that this
city was getting like the culinary scene was growing at
that time. So we came back and it was
20/13/2014. So when you started seeing like
(05:47):
a lot more pedigree and it, it was like we can probably have
something here, you know, we canmaybe own a business here one
day. If not, we'll be working in the
city that is starting the trend,right.
The trend is starting of like good food and good eating.
We're in San Francisco is like this has been there for years.
It's. Established as well as
(06:08):
established. Let's talk about that.
So so initially so again, I camehere in 98 with a restaurant
that was established in New Yorkbecause it's a large population
of Swedes here outside of Swedenway ahead of his time.
At that time there was good fellows Murray's those were the
two only two fine dining establishments here.
(06:29):
So it somebody somebody didn't do their research enough to
understand that it was way too early on.
There is literally specifically now of course, which you guys
being a part of that movement, this you can get pretty much the
best of any cuisine in the cities.
And a lot of it in this 8 block.Rating this is the same.
(06:50):
So like this is this is like restaurant Rd. becoming
restaurant like all the I'm gonna talk about heavy hitters,
though. It's not just like food.
All this. You can just stumble upon any
one of these corners and and have the best meal of your your
life. That to me is special.
But people don't talk about it like it's not it's it's known,
(07:13):
but it's you have to be in the know to know, right.
And so why? Why do you think that is?
Why do you think that's it's OK?So you have Chicago, right?
So this you'd be hard pressed tofind a couple of blocks or or
four mile radius like what we have here in any city except for
San Francisco, New York, OK, Chicago is, but not that not
(07:36):
that much of a congestion of that pedigree of restaurants.
Why do you think that it's not really celebrated the way that
it is in other cities here? I think that a lot of people
don't understand that it's happening.
I think they for for you that realize that it's happening, you
(07:58):
have to go to other places and figure it out that it's not the
same. It's not normal.
And and you know, for us that wehave the opportunity to live in
different places and work in different places.
You know, you work in a restaurant, except for like
places like San Francisco or like you go around the corner
and it was another bad ass restaurant.
You know, as most places, they, they have one place here and
(08:20):
then another place there and it's kind of like scattered over
the city. And then when you when you stay
in a place like the one that we have right now, and then you can
just like cross the street and go to another place or go next
door and go to another place. I think it's very special and
and I think the people started realizing because we see a trend
of people just coming and then having a drink with us and then
(08:41):
going to eat with Gia or going to end.
And then, you know, and they just like, they kind of like
like they, they see what, what that does.
And, and from the beginning, when we, when, when we start
like working in there and like we saw these places opening, you
know, having Christina like few blocks from, from what we had to
(09:03):
like, we always say that like this was so good for, for us
because people will have like now people can drive here and be
like, you know, if we cannot getto 1 place, we go.
To another park and just walk and just walk around and.
See where you can get in. And for so long this part of
Northeast is was like and is still known as the Arts
District. So like art, but you know,
people, we're bringing more art here.
(09:26):
When you think about it with thefood, like we want to be in a
place where like especially withour restaurant, you know, a lot
of the art we have on our walls is local artists.
Art. Absolutely.
Because we want to celebrate that and then have people come
celebrate that with us. Yeah, I, I liken it to the
theater district and any city, any major city has a theater
district and they usually you'llhave the theaters and then you
(09:47):
have museums and they're all clustered together.
And so that is how I look at this, honestly.
And it is art. Food is art.
And it's the, the whole dining experience.
And to be able to have that in such a rich tapestry and just a
small radius is super cool and unique.
And it should be celebrated. And because that's not a normal
(10:09):
thing and and it's not, and it takes it or it takes years to
develop that like a San Francisco or New York, it did
that. That didn't just happen
overnight. So, yeah, I mean, you guys are,
like you said, you definitely celebrate local art and art in
general because as we all know, you eat with your eyes first,
right? And so that is well represented
(10:31):
in everything that you guys do. Everything you guys do, it is
super duper intentional and purposeful.
Let's talk about that. Let's talk about the intention
to detail to every little thing,even down to the name.
Next step. Of course, that's a nod to the
magical process of so. I spent I spent a month in in
(10:54):
Mexico doing some tequila research for SO.
Must be like, yeah. Yes, I had, I had a blast.
So it was I was just down there because we're we're doing
opening up a new restaurant now.I wanted to do some some
research and so I was set up with some people and going to
deal with look at all the agavesand that the whole process of
(11:17):
making tortilla everything. So I fell in love with.
Obviously I was just geeking outjust like a love process.
How everything that you guys do is intentionally to highlight
the corn, right, because that's where it all starts from.
Talk to me about laying in all that attention to everything
(11:38):
that you're doing. So it's I think it's a a super
duper skill set to do it so seamlessly so that most people
don't see it. So let's speak to that.
Let's let's talk about how and why.
I, I think it kind of grow as, as we were growing, you know,
(12:00):
the, we always wanted to have a restaurant like that was a
dream, but we never knew how it was going to happen and, and
what it was going to happen. So when we start making family
meals and we start putting tortillas into the packaging and
we start seeing the reaction of people and we got approached by
(12:20):
stores saying like, Hey, we wantto sell you tortillas first, an
opportunity on market, but also we saw an opportunity where a
lot of people didn't know what it was.
A lot of people will ask us, is this flower?
What are you putting for coloring in how to explain to
people that corn was different and then the importance of it?
(12:42):
I think that that's kind of whenit clicks for us to be like we
can, we can change something here.
You know, we in the middle of corner country and people saw
corn completely different the way that we saw it.
And, and it was a very importantpart of for us to share the the
importance of it. Education, right?
Like the education part, becauseI think we looked at it too,
(13:02):
it's like started with tortillas, the humble tortilla,
but you know, people had to learn about the process.
The process is so much differentthan like a regular tortilla.
Not just mixing Masaharina with water and, and pressing it and
it's done. You're doing this long cooking
process. Then after the tortilla, when we
were like, well, we can also teach people what else they can
(13:23):
do with this dough. And I think the, the, the, the
biggest part of that is you guys, this becoming what it is,
you also helping to preserve theheirloom corn because I'm a huge
component of, you know, being able to acts have access to
(13:46):
things in their original state because they were never broken
to begin with. And so there's the vast
different amounts of types of corn and they have everything
changes with the with that. And it's not all corn is not
created the same. And then there's this, I mean,
it's so it's so many different varieties and there's the
(14:09):
different applications for it and the fact that you've become
it's the Museum of for the corn,honestly.
And so I think it's super cool. I, I really do.
And it it and it's, it's definitely a labor of love, like
we were talking about off camerabefore the it's not a cheap
process. You know, it's, it's important
(14:32):
to, to see it that way because Ithink they, you know, we have
the option, you know, now is, isthe company that we purchase the
corn from. They, they produce flour, which
we know they, they use good cornto process the flour.
But that doesn't change what we want to do.
And it doesn't change our idea and our commitment to show
(14:55):
people what or food this actually looks like.
You know, and the importance of the process, you know, and the
importance of the flavor and theimportance of what, what
culturally means to us to be able to do it that way.
Absolutely. Because it's such a labor of
love and and it is such a labor cost wise, I think it puts us in
(15:17):
a unique position. You know, if we continue to do
this and we respect the process,you know, we want people to eat
things that are not just better tasting, but better for their
body. Absolutely.
Maybe that'll like, you know, restaurants are hard business.
So maybe we'll like be around for a while.
Yeah, trickle down in effect, Absolutely, absolutely like to
(15:38):
play a little game right now. So we do this little game we're
going to play is called this a bet, but it's the husband and
wife addition. Yes, I don't have this
opportunity. You're like, listen, I, I now I
get to, you know, this is going to be good for me and it's
hostile. Yes.
Yeah. It's, you know, you get to see
also why I think the reason theyour business is successful is
(16:03):
because we are very different. And that's and that is the key.
So every good business relationship you have alter egos
and different areas like so thatwherever one is lacking in or or
or overbearing in one area, you have to have that balance it.
It makes for the the best relationships, whether business
(16:25):
or not, have to have that levity.
So all right, so here we go. This is this is that.
So I'm going to ask you a question and then I want to get
an answer from both of you on the question.
All right? So which one hits harder,
arguments in the kitchen or silence in the car ride home?
(16:48):
Arguments in the kitchen. Yes.
No, because it affects everybody.
Yeah. Yeah, I'm.
Like, oh crap, who heard that? You know, because I can't
believe I just said that to. You right there.
You don't. You don't think about.
It no, no, you're. Hot you say something, you're
like oh crap and and. Just then the the silence on the
(17:10):
curve I'd. Follow.
Yeah, yeah. That, that it's coming anyway,
so it's going anyway. It's true.
It's like what needs to happen. Before though, yeah, it's
passion. So that's the passion, right?
OK, which one wins in your kitchen?
Take a risk on a new dish or play it safe with the signature
hit. Take a risk, 100%, yeah.
(17:32):
I like that. Plus you always have the base of
the safe you. Can always.
You can always go back. You can always do exactly.
It's never going anywhere. Yeah, we've had, we noticed
worse. Sometimes with dishes, we're
like, OK, this was, but then, you know, it gets reviewed and
then people keep coming in and asking for it, like, OK, I
cannot hear about it anymore. Put that dish back on the menu.
Next week we have the mullet. Yeah, let's just make it.
(17:54):
Let's just make it. OK?
Where's your compass pointing right now?
Build the brand bigger or protect the piece.
Interesting. I think we both have different
answers, but I. Think that that's.
Because we like, like he wants to build it bigger, I think.
(18:16):
And he, you know, he always sayshe wants to be retired by 50.
Well, that's approaching, you know, you know, about 7717
years. No, I'm just but.
You look at there with 20 man, what do you think?
That's what he does that part while I make sure and you know,
we have the help of my wonderfulsister who helps us like do all
the back end business stuff. We do that for him so we can do
(18:39):
both at the same time, understand.
So builder. Yeah, yeah.
So like, is that what you like? I like bees, but I think the
having a having a a goal to attain and provide peace in the
long run. Very true.
You can't shake up the world in a vacuum.
(19:02):
You need to. Well, they don't necessarily
always have to be like, oh, we want another restaurant, we want
another business. Like, you know, one of the
things he's doing right now is this beautiful USDA funded
project that is about like it's bringing chefs from all around
the country to come here and work with those scientists from
EU of M to adapt this heirloom corn here.
(19:23):
So we've been growing it for years and now we're going to do
like testing and that is part ofbuilding it.
Absolutely, absolutely, absolutely.
That's that's cool. What fills you up more, being
praised for your food or being seen for your purpose?
Purpose 100 percent, 100%. As I think if you get the
(19:45):
purpose then you get the food. Absolutely.
Well. I mean, you know, like the the
preservation of corn in that like you can, you know,
sometimes maybe you won't like adish, but you can respect the
fact that I'm trying to teach you something with it.
Yeah, yeah, I look at it that way.
You know, it's like when music, right?
You don't have to. I understand that.
You can see talent, right? You can see the level of intent
(20:07):
in in in years to to attain a certain.
Skill set. Whether it's my jam or not, like
I, I, I can see the skill, so I respect it.
And food is funny too, because we were just talking about this
earlier. The the barrier to entry, to be
an expert, so to speak about certain things.
(20:29):
A critic is very low. So the average person doesn't
understand what it takes to get from point A to point B and
something that looks so simple to do, the level of skill set
and time and energy and researchthat went into, it's like, I'm
pretty sure down the line after you did finish this project,
(20:50):
they're not going to talk about the the 10 years before that
went into, you know, the research research.
And that that to me is the travesty of the industry.
And and I think things are turning a little bit because the
more that we put things out there and people get to see and.
I think like people see, you know, now you can see videos and
(21:12):
you see like how intricate things can get.
And you know, we always talk about a restaurant and whether
it's not perfect. It's like, you know, it was
perfect for us. But I always say that I, I would
like for us to have an open kitchen because you know, you
see a, you see a, a, a dish, a masa dish in the plate and you
(21:33):
like, oh, you know, it's corn again.
And they just this stuff, but you don't get to see like how
it's made. And, and I think that that's,
that's super important. You know, I think that like,
again, like the process is what's expensive.
You know, I'm trying to explain to people they you're not just
paying for the what you get in the plate, you also get paid for
all the time that is spent creating that, that that dish.
(21:57):
Yeah, and the and the years of knowledge it took to attain it,
right, to get there, to get to where you are, that is the most
important thing. So let's talk to me about the
role that music plays because it's it's a huge cultural
things, specifically this prayers in your so I've I've
been in the restaurant and the music is a heavy influence in in
(22:18):
in the vibe of the of the environment.
So tell me how much of an important role it plays.
And I haven't been in the kitchen.
So I'm sure it's a different. Thing Oh, it's a party.
I know it's I, I I'm already knowing.
I'm already knowing so. I was like, turn it down, I
can't talk to you. No, it's it's super important
though. We, we grew up and then I
include my team because we kind of culturally again, it's the
(22:42):
same, you know, we, we wake up every day with music.
That's, that was my mom, you know, like it was like 6 o'clock
7:00 in the morning when you go to school.
Like the first thing she would do would turn on the radio.
So music's always been so important.
Even if I wasn't allowed to cookwhen I was at home, I would
remember seeing my family in thekitchen with loud music,
(23:04):
screaming, throwing shit at eachother, amazing meals.
And then it just, it's part of us, you know, like we, I mean,
not dance without music. Absolutely.
You know, I'm tapping all the time.
Like I, I'm a horrible singer. She can attend to that.
He's a. Bad singer, but he's an
excellent dancer there. You go play to your strengths.
(23:25):
And I think, I think the, you see the difference, you know, I
guess, I guess the times where, you know, you get really busy
and like the music kind of died down for a reason.
And, and people still so into what they do and they kind of
forget that it's not music. But the difference between
having music and not is also very noticeable.
(23:45):
It's a rhythm that you, that youpick up as, as you, it's almost
like you need like a like a background noise to be able to,
to perform better. And, you know, I work in
kitchens where the kitchen musicwas not allowed or, you know, I
remember the chef that told me that was the sound of
concentration one time when he like turned the, the music off.
(24:07):
And, and, you know, there's things that you remember, you
like, you know, I, I get that and I get the importance of
being able to focus on, on what you're doing.
But for me, it's just, you know,I, I, I like to see my kitchen
in a way where people are comfortable and, and people feel
happy doing what they do it. Well, that's the thing.
Music and food, I think release endorphins in a part of our
(24:30):
brain right That like if happy people make happy food.
Absolutely. Yeah, it's definitely transfers
into whatever you're doing, whatever you're touching.
The the other thing is too is transformative, right?
So, and when you, when you walk through the threshold of your
restaurant, you're transported because of all the things
(24:53):
happening to your senses. So what you see, what you hear,
what you smell. And then finally, once you
taste, you're transported into, you know, a, a, a certain mode
and mood. And that to me, music is a, is,
is definitely a, a huge part of that, but it also is into the
(25:13):
mentality of the people that arecreating everything.
So that understanding that how important that is, is the key.
What? So what would you say if you had
to create a playlist for that sets the mood for the
restaurant? What would you say that is?
Probably cumbia yeah, I think that's something, you know, I
(25:36):
mean we, we play different genres and and, and the Latin
and all the Latin genres are within within Latin music but I
would say that the most consistent 1 is is cumbia.
It's it's an upbeat, happy, happy.
And then we know all the songs. So we walk around, walk around
(25:59):
singing songs and there's. A lot of Selena in the.
Restaurant. It's definitely.
A lot. Of Selena, you know, Queen.
Listen, yeah, that's awesome. That's awesome.
Let's talk about culture and identity.
So your work emphasizes heavily the importance of preserving
(26:20):
Mexican culinary traditions as well as utilizing what you, what
is readily available to in a way, highlight the area as well.
And so how do you balance authenticity and innovation in a
(26:42):
dish? Well, we, we, we try to search
things as close as we can. You know, we, we work with
couple farmers. They're actually pretty cool.
We work with black radish farm. I know you're familiar with
them. There are the rent spaces like
(27:03):
backyards, people and then they grossed up there and then.
Last year they were really cute because I was like, I need the
chili, the poblano for the Reno to be exactly this big.
So they would just come every week and be like, is this the
right size? Yeah, but but you create those
relationships and and I think that that kind of helps with the
(27:24):
with like what we look for because now, you know, they're,
they come to me and they're like, well, I have these things
and I'm like, OK, well send it to us.
And then we figure out how we merge into into the menu.
And then I talked with Jose, it was my chef de cuisine and was
like, OK, we're going to have these items for the next, you
know, two months. Like how do we incorporate into
(27:45):
the into the menu? And then when it comes to like
trying to keep it as culturally as we can, like we also trying
to look for all the ingredients.They are very important for us
that people don't know them a lot, you know, So whenever we
have. Ingredients too, that are like
specifically Minnesota, right? Right.
(28:06):
So that's how it's. Like wild rice or if we do
venison on the menu like having.That.
Cross. Yeah, we turned it up into, you
know, living here and working. I have the opportunity to work
in good restaurants here and I was able to pick up those things
that people really like. Like yeah, we made a pescadilla
with walleye and. I was gonna say I like it.
(28:28):
Yes, I was like, you have to have walleye like.
This you have to have. Or or chatters with wild rice.
It's just like, it's those thosethings that people will
recognize and be like, OK, I know this, this is different,
but I know this and I know that it's going to be good because I
know that part of the. Usage yeah, those and that's the
that's the unique thing with andthere's both food and music do
(28:49):
the same thing. So usually if somebody is making
wants to make a hit, they look at another hit like OK, let's
let's look at the parts of that song that make it a hit and
let's try to infuse some of thatinto whatever this new thing is.
And that's just to create familiarity into lessen the blow
of people wanting to try something.
(29:10):
So there's and what the innovation that comes in that I
think is amazing. So those, that's how all of the
things that we deem to be certain foods, they're not,
they're American creations. Like Chinese food here is not
Chinese food in China. It's not even not even remotely
close. So it's not.
So these are all American creations.
The the fortune cookie was invented in San Francisco.
So it's not. Oh, yeah, I've been to the fact.
(29:34):
Yeah, yeah, me too. Oh, I love it.
Oh, my goodness. So I did in the restaurant, I
made a huge, a huge fortune cookie that had the dessert in
it. Yeah.
So I found a process like, OK, how can I do this?
And it was a timing thing. So you the cookie hardens and
it's like, OK, how can I? So I went to the factory and
(29:55):
found, OK, I just need to jumbo size that thing so I can figure
it out. But yeah, I just, you know,
again, a geek. I'm just a geek.
Can you tell me a story about for you specifically, a dish
that is near and dear to your heart for whatever reason it is
that you don't even want to touch?
(30:15):
So I have, I'll use an example. So this, I'm not really a fan of
tuna fish, right? But my grandmother used to make
a tuna fish sandwich for me thatto this day, I just won't make
it. I won't make it for myself.
I don't even want to make it because it has so much value to
me emotionally that I wouldn't even touch it.
(30:38):
I just, I just deemed it is off the since she passed, I'll never
have another game. I'm just not.
And it's fine, you know, becauseI I attribute it because I don't
want to. I don't want to mess my memory
up, you know, so also the reasonwhy I was such a great sandwich.
She begged the bread she grew, the tomatoes she made, you know,
she did it all. And so is there anything like
(31:00):
that to you that you just like, you know what?
I don't want to sell it. So I don't know, you know, I.
Like that we make. No, that you've, that, that is
tied to a memory, whether it be from childhood or anything.
Like, you know what, I don't want to.
And if I do do it, it's going tobe such a far departure from
what it was because I don't wantto, you know?
Yeah, I think, well I 2 examples.
(31:22):
I think we we make a version of beef tartare that is far removed
from what Kate's mom make because I think they trying to
make a traditional tartar, they would taste like the one that
she made, like it was just not going to happen.
So we go like completely far away from that.
(31:43):
When it comes to to my food, I think they I spend so much time
trying to cook with memories andtrying to bring some of those
ideas and some of those things that my family will make for us.
They, I don't, I don't think I have anything like that.
I think they every good dish that my mom made, like I was
trying to replicate it so many times.
(32:05):
I'm trying to get as close as possible.
Yes. Just because to have their
memories. Yeah, absolutely.
Well, and, and to, you know, achieve that goal, there's a
very real reality that, you know, your parents will, you
know, hopefully be longer than your parents.
So it's like, I want to learn how to make a cabbage roll from
my mom or how to make, you know,the fermented rye soup that she
makes every Easter because it's like, I can't imagine not having
(32:27):
that. But yes, I've, I've tried to
replicate some of her stuff and it takes months or even yes,
like, and it's still like just alittle off.
Yeah, still love. Then you just blame it on the
love. Yeah, absolutely, yeah,
absolutely. That that those I always say
that you know in for cooking, whether you're cooking in the
(32:47):
restaurant or at home. First off, it's it's the the
biggest form of expression of love that you can do is to make
something from the heart to givesomebody to nourish their their
body and spirit. But you're either trying to
recall a past favorite memory orcreate a new one.
That's it. That's, that's a little, that's
(33:07):
always, that's all we're trying to do.
And so if we do, if you've done that, you've done your job
because everybody's been somewhere.
And this one, you know, the, thejob is not successful.
We've gone out to eat someplace and you can't remember at all.
It's just, we had, it's usually because of the company you kept.
Oh, we had a good time. What'd you eat?
(33:30):
Chicken dish, I think you know. Yes.
And so you didn't pull on that? Yeah, you didn't.
You didn't pull on that much. Really limited the the times I
think that you remember meals, you know there has to be.
Has to be. Extremely special.
Exactly, exactly. OK, let's talk about First off,
(33:50):
congratulations on Bon Petit being named one of the 20 best
new restaurants in 2020. So that's a huge, huge, huge
thing, specifically being that, you know, you already have, I
think it's harder to, to, to keep the, the mystique when you
(34:13):
have it, it's it's, it's easy towin a, a title.
It's hard to keep a title, right.
And so the fact that you guys have not only been recognized,
you know, now, but you've been being recognized since you,
since you started. And that is a testament to your
consistency and your, your love for what it is you're doing.
(34:37):
And the fact that you guys have this perfect balance.
It definitely, like you said, Gustavo, is, is definitely the
reason why this works. So kudos to that because that's
a, a huge, a huge accomplishmentfor obviously you yourselves,
your team specifically, and theneverybody who gets to join in
(34:59):
the party. So I always say that I think a
restaurant, especially a restaurant of your caliber,
you're, you're inviting people in to to have a piece of you.
Just like if my house was big enough, if my house was big
enough, this is what it would be.
And so welcome, welcome into thehouse, you know, so that's that
(35:21):
itself in itself is, is an amazing and beautiful thing.
How have you seen the accolades?You know the James Breer's
nomination. How have you seen that impact
the operations of your mission? I think they give us a great
(35:44):
sense of responsibility. We understand the the microphone
got bigger. There is going to be more people
seeing us. There is going to be people that
are more critical seeing us and they and they also they, we
create an expectation for where people come to a restaurant.
You know, they're where before they came to a place where, you
know, we were doing something. Now they come to a place that we
(36:06):
doing something and it's nationally recognized.
So their expectations are huge. And I think, I think they're
like any accolade the the UK, it's great for, for business,
it's great for morale, It's great for just to kind of see
where you were standing. It's great for the team because
they feel part of something important.
(36:28):
And I think that we just trying to maintain it, you know, as
much as we can, we trying to, wedon't go crazy.
We don't change much of anything.
We just continue to work and trying to provide the best
product, the best service possible.
Yeah, you guys, you guys will. So there's two types of and you
(36:48):
know this, they are establishments and restaurants
that that create restaurants forthe instinct purpose of
attaining an award, right? And then there's people that
just do the work, right? And so because you just this is
what we do and we're not, we didn't change or alter anything
for the sake of this and nor will we do it to retain it.
(37:09):
This is how we do it. This is why we do it and we got
to continue to do it. And if you appreciated that
before, you will always appreciate it.
And that's me is the mark of a great, great restaurant.
It's like, OK, we we are the we're creating the wave.
You're not you're not, you know,changing to fit any narrative.
(37:30):
So yeah, kudos to that that and that's you guys would be great.
There's. Plenty of places, you know, I
think that we have modeled ourselves after that are across
the country. There just hasn't been anything,
I think, in Minnesota that has kind of pushed that envelope
with Mexican food and corn and, again, the hard process of an
externalization. So yeah, that really helped.
(37:51):
And pivoting at every turn, right.
Because we started in COVID and then it was like, OK, now you
can do something else, so let's change this and then let's
change this. And it was little by little.
Yeah, no, hopefully full grown. Yeah, hopefully, or we'd have to
leave the building if we want todo anything else because we took
like, you know, we had the dining room, then we moved into
(38:13):
the bar, then we have a courtyard now so.
Oh yeah, yeah, we're. Out of space now, yeah, yeah, we
just have to buy the block now. Yeah.
So let's let's talk about Nixon realization.
Let's let's this really describethe process because I had the
the great fortune to watch, you know, masses at work, Hellesco,
(38:33):
but just speak to the process and because it's central to what
it is you do so. Well, we, we import all the corn
from Mexico. That's like the one of the most
important pieces of it. And then to be able to to
processing activate all the goodenzymes in corn, you have to put
(38:54):
it through this processing externalization, which is they
cook them with an alkaline or analkaline solution.
They will help remove the outer skin.
And then they will activate all the urine enzymes by soaking in
that in some of that calcium into the corn.
You know, the, the industrialization of, of corn in
(39:17):
the 90s, it kind of changed the process where there was still
mixed amylize to remove the skin, but then they would not
let it soak and then they would let it dry and then they process
it, meal it so you can get a flower.
So that's kind of the biggest, the biggest difference between
the corn that we oh, the processthat we do into, into the, the
(39:39):
industrialization and then, you know, we can get it to the
different corn that they use in here.
But when it comes to the process, it just, we've done it
for thousands of years. They were actually comes from
ashes because ashes was the first alkaline that they used
to, to mix amylize. And then now we use calcium
(40:02):
hydroxide this kitchen safe and it is very, very minimum.
We, we because the way that we cook it, we use about .5% and
then it's diluted on water and then whatever it gets soaked,
it's like very, very minimum. But it does activate all the
good in some. You get potassium, you get
(40:22):
calcium, you get nice and you get.
A lot of fiber, which, you know,the only thing the corn doesn't
have is protein. But it that's what you, you
know, that's what the bottle goes for.
Yeah, that's what. The bottle.
Goes for but it's, you know, we when we do stuff with, with corn
too, it's like we currently lookit as a, as a super flavorful
(40:45):
plate that you can put whatever into it.
And then, you know, when you saythis, there's a great B equal to
it. That's, that's the way that we
see it. You know, it's, it's something
that's like the most flavorful play that you can see.
Yeah, yeah. It's and exactly it's an edible
play. It's a great, that's a great way
to look at it. So beyond beyond this culinary
(41:06):
significance, what cultural and historical importance does this
process hold for you specifically?
I think of the well-being, you know, I think the, the, the
importance is the as, as professional chefs, which you
know, we both are, I, I think our priority, our commitment to
(41:28):
our guests is to provide with something that is good for them
and the best possible. So, you know, I think that
that's that's where we both comefrom, Like we from when we were
in San Francisco or wherever we went, we always like try and
deserve the best rather possible.
So if we were going to do tortillas, we needed to do the
same. Absolutely, and I also think
(41:49):
there's something to be said forif if everything went to hell in
a handbasket, right? I have these few humble
ingredients with the know how I can do this that that that is
special, you know what I mean? So because even when you know,
just think about the amount of things that were made before,
(42:14):
you know, the industrialation, the industrial revolution and
all this machinery, you know, this, this that this was
happening, you know, with stone and Kamal.
Yeah, very. Very, very minimal.
Yeah, nothing. Nothing fancy and amazing and
better than what we can do all the know how in the world.
(42:34):
Yes, and and you know, culturally too, I think
something they they always like me personally bought me is the,
you know, you go to you go to a superstar, a supermarket and
then you you get the aisle of the tortillas and the aisle is
bigger than the hamburger buns. And and then you know, you look
(42:55):
up and it's like, you know, Latin food or international
food. And like you get, it's a
relation to the connection the tortillas have with Mexican
food. I mean, some brands even use the
flag. Yep, and.
And to know the the that productis either not good for you and
also not good taste. To me it was, it was almost
(43:15):
insulting. So the only way that you can
change that is like, well one ofthe change that then we have to
do it like. Big branding in specifically as
Mexican. I mean, Native Americans did the
same process. You know, Sean Sherman's making
tortillas at the Indigenous FoodLab.
Like this isn't because this wasan American product.
(43:37):
They put the Mexican flag on it like they eat it everywhere,
right? Yeah, it's, it's the same.
That's a great, great point you bring up too, because there's so
much, you know, corn has been very important to Native
Americans for for eons as well. And you know, so much so that
you know the Indian corn. You know the the name Indian
(43:58):
corn is well. That's what we're using.
Our heirloom corn is Indian corn, Yes.
Like, actually, you know, so Mexicans are Native Americans.
Yeah, go figure. They.
Were here before. Absolutely, And that's so even
that that's I was just having this conversation a couple of
weeks ago about I remember beinga kid and I'm probably dating
(44:20):
myself, but being a kid. And you saw these you saw Indian
corn like off it was it was readily available, right.
Like I can't tell you the last time that I without, you know,
some kind of like ornate, you know, yeah, decorative thing
next to a scarecrow or somethinglike that.
But like we like see it for purchase that and without the
(44:45):
process and the things that you guys are doing, those things go
away and then the kids don't know.
So they will never they won't even know what they're missing.
So it'll just be gone forever. Plus coin is one of those things
that you know, you need, you know, human interaction for it
to happen. So there's no wild, there's no
(45:05):
there's no wild coin. Anyway, let's talk about the,
and we talked talked about this a little earlier, but the
community is powerful. So you guys are part of a of a
very unique community where yourrestaurant lies.
But I believe the community thatyou build extends outside of, of
(45:27):
course, the four walls of your restaurant and the region
because the beauty of the Internet and what it is we're
doing, your story gets to travel.
So therefore the community growsexponentially.
Talk to me about the importance and the responsibility that you
feel in order to just make sure that the local farmers are are
(45:53):
are part of the conversation. And because we kept everything
comes from the ground up, No farmers, no food restaurants.
It's very, it's a very simple equation and people don't see,
they don't really look at where their food truly comes from and
who's making it possible to get from point A to point BI.
Got to remember, I got to send you guys the link to the film
(46:16):
because I did a whole film aboutfor me and, and, and it's, it's,
it was, I spent time in in Merced County, in the San
Joaquin Valley, actually going through and talking to farmers
and, and, and the whole thing like, because it's important.
Talk to me about and I know that's important to you because
(46:38):
we just talked about it, but what type, what legacy are you
intending to leave through the lens?
Because the farmer doesn't really get to talk.
We, we are the food is a spokesman for the farmer.
So how do you how do you carry that weight?
There's so much pressure on bothends, I think when we talk about
(46:59):
this because you want to make sure you're getting the best
product, then taking care of it very, very well.
And then that the person, on theother hand, is also happy
receiving that product and that they're getting something that's
better for them, has higher nutritional value.
All of these things also is interesting and cutting edge in
(47:22):
some way because you want to still, you know, stay relevant
in this like big restaurant community too.
So I think it's a lot, you know,and we have also the
responsibility to your communitytoo.
Like we do a lot of outreach, especially to like schools.
He was a judge for the junior Iron Chef or actually
(47:43):
competitor. He competed with a team of kids.
We're going to judge some class at Roosevelt this weekend
because like, we love making sure that we have a 4 1/2 year
old. There's a responsibility and
idea that like, you know, we grew up with the white Wonder
bread and all of that stuff and now things are changing.
But how do we educate these kidsand next generations to about
(48:06):
like why is it OK for a baguetteto be $12.00 but not but like a
Taco? Yeah, it's a great.
And going into those points, that's a great, that's a great
point. Where, you know, that they are
filled with, you know, Latino and immigrant children at these
schools and like, they love seeing him.
Absolutely, absolutely that, yeah, the seeing representation
(48:30):
matters. I don't care what anybody says.
And I just know for, for me, youknow, being a young like kids, I
was always the youngest. I got into the 16.
So when I was and I failing to find out and God knows I had got
his hand on me. I, I, I didn't belong and all,
but I was, you know, the youngest, the darkest and I felt
(48:53):
the most out of place always. And then I realized that I'm
just chicken no matter where I go.
So chicken can be in anywhere from fine dining to I'm
translatable. I've learned to be a linguistic
champion enough to be able to describe and communicate my
thoughts, needs, and my point ofview no matter who I sit across
(49:18):
from. And so you only learn that from
representation. So when you get to see, when
you, when you get to see yourself and someone else and
see the possibilities, that's why it's important for those
kids to see you. That's and that's a beautiful
thing. Well, unlike all the accolades
we just talked about, it's like those things we really only care
about because they open more doors to those rooms where
(49:41):
you're changing the demographic and the dynamic because you're
part of the conversation. Yeah, for sure.
You, you know, I think the importance of not now that I
consider myself a role model, but then you can you hope that
when you go to these schools andyou and you talk to these kids,
(50:01):
the one of them would think thatif I made it, he can make it
Absolutely, you know, and, and. There's importance in like trade
jobs too, you know, because thisis, this is different.
You're like, and we all know we can go to culinary school, sure,
but like, did we need to? No, we probably could have
learned everything on the job. It was just about getting in the
right kitchens and and learning with from the right people who
(50:24):
wanted to teach. And but seeing that, you know,
there's not no longer something that like, oh, you work in a
restaurant. Oh, you're a chef, you know, but
but changed years ago and and it's not OK.
So you're here, you from an immigrant family, your parents
are cooks, but guess what? This guy's a chef.
(50:44):
Yeah. And and it means something.
Yeah. And it's a, it's a not only,
it's a very important a job to have, you're also galvanizing
and you're, you're leading, you have your, you have, you have
your family and you have your work family, right?
So you, your team is just as dependent on you as your kids.
(51:12):
And a good leader feels that pressure everyday like I, I
don't want to let and it's, it goes back and forth.
So you're, you're, I always say that people don't work for jobs,
They work for people. And when somebody who respects
you enough to, they don't want to let you down.
And because you not, you're not letting them down.
That cycle is what keeps life going.
(51:34):
And that's that, that's, that's the beautiful part about the
restaurants. I learned all of my life skills
from working in restaurants, like all of the important soft
skills that are now dying my sister.
And her husband worked in restaurants for years, too.
He's a banker now, but he alwayssays, And I think it's important
that he understands this, but hebartender just 1314 years, when
(51:59):
he sees that somebody has service industry experience on
their resume, he's more likely to hire them.
Absolutely, absolutely. There's, there's.
And this is not for everybody, too.
He's also equate cooking to like, singing.
So you can go to school and learn musical theory all you
want. Either you can sing like Mariah
(52:20):
Carey or you can so you and thisand now here's the beauty.
That's OK, That's OK. He's a dancer.
He's a dancer, though, OK. Now there's different ways and a
lot of different ways to to to earn a living in this business.
Now some people from here to here, they don't have it right,
but they can tell you, you know,the great teachers, great
coaches, great, you know, cookbook writers, But there's
(52:45):
there's the skill set for I knowguys that never been any on the
same side of the street as this school that just have it.
You know, these guys are just monsters.
And and and that to me, that skill set, you can't, you can
you can cultivate it. You can't necessarily teach
somebody to have that rhythm. You know, I can put you in the
(53:06):
right Adaptability I think is exact.
Thing you know when because thatjust changing, like as you grow
into a position on the kitchen, whether it's you start as a
dishwasher, you move to Lancook,then you're a sous chef, then
you're the chef. Like, it's also changing with
the food trends, like what's hotright now, you know, it's a lot.
(53:27):
And you have to love it enough, okay?
And we're all masochists, right?So who else do you know, gets
their shit kicked in and still comes every day?
Like I just like, yeah. And it's like, yeah, I'll be
better tomorrow. It is.
And there's no greater feeling than than than to, you know,
(53:47):
stab the last ticket like this. This was horrible day.
But and it makes for great stories.
It was great stories. It makes for great stories.
And it's the sense of accomplishment.
It's in real time, though, like literally in real time.
Like to be able to to conquer that, that type of mountain with
a team, it is no greater feeling.
(54:09):
It really is. It's no greater feeling and I
hope the masses will get to. Feel.
Yeah. I mean, we're not Tim Worlds,
but I mean I'd assume that's howthey feel if they want a game
together, right? Absolutely.
That's. We always, always have this idea
of seeing the kitchen team as like a, a sports team for sure,
(54:33):
you know, and, and it's going tobe the times where like one
player is not doing OK and the whole team has to kind of carry
them along. And, and I think that that's,
that's true in life for, you know, your community And then
just trying to have better days and, and be the +1 and, and as
as a, as a leader, you're the one that pushes, you know,
you're the one that has the beat, you're the one that has
(54:56):
the rhythm that everybody's moving at.
You're the team captain. The goalie is definitely the
dishwasher. OK, for sure, for sure, for
sure. I always say so.
In all my restaurants, I was always tell if the dishwasher
was down or you can see when they're struggling, right.
But specifically, the dishwasherwas out, everybody just 15
(55:19):
minutes in the pit, everybody. And so you're going to respect
this guy. So he's the, he's the most
important guy in the building. He doesn't do his job.
No food goes out. I don't care what you're saying.
We don't give me pen. No food gets cooked, no nothing.
Nothing moves if this dude is not on his job and he gets
shitted on on a daily basis. You know, you know, it's, it's
horrible. Yeah, I think we how to say the,
(55:43):
I think it's three positions in the restaurant.
The the mark, the how the day goes, the person on the door,
the person in the past in the dishwasher.
Yeah. If like all the other ones that
can be move and arrange and kindof fill in.
For it, they can shit the bed they, they, they, they, they
(56:04):
have an off day, they have, theyhave an off day.
It crashes, it crashes everything.
The whole system crashes. And most, so that's the most
people don't understand that, like, like diners don't
understand it. Like, so you can, you can
completely alter the mood of a person by being greeted
properly. Here's the other thing.
(56:26):
Most people don't go out to eat.You'd have to have a bad time.
So like we, we are in this business to either enhance or
shit the bed. So like nobody's going out to
have a, to purposely have a bad time, you know, but it happens,
right? And usually for one of those
three things, the, the, the, thegreeter or something that the
(56:51):
kitchen's at a standstill. Usually it's something's going
on. The something's going on with
the disc, the machine, bro. Yeah, something, something's
happening. Yeah, something's happening.
That's that's a great. I'm glad you just said that.
We need to have a a National Dishwasher's Day.
Yes. We should we should I'm I'm you
know what? We're putting that in the action
(57:12):
over Taco, of course. OK, so before I let you guys go,
we like to do close out with a little the game I call the
Lightning round. So in the lightning round, it's
a quick fire answers. I'm going to give you a phrase
or word. Mostly it's going to be a
phrase. And then you give me the first
thing that pops into your head. Yeah, yeah.
(57:36):
Case like case like. I don't know, I'm just you want
the first thing. You want the first thing.
All right, all right, here we go.
What's the smell that instantly takes you back to childhood?
Try chills. Dang.
(57:56):
I can smell the chillies too. When you said that, that's
that's crazy out of mind words. Probably like chicken like, like
broth like. OK.
Broth all the time. That smells good too. 1
ingredient you'll defend until the end, no matter what any
haters say. Corn.
Corn. That's a good.
(58:20):
One, you'd be surprised how manypeople have walked into the
restaurant without doing their research, being like, I'm
allergic to corn and I'm like, Idon't know how to say this to
you nicely. What would you say?
If you go out and make a left. You see a lot of like I might,
then I might be better. Yeah, there's rice down the
street. It's hard, hard because even
(58:41):
from like, I can't even do corn oil and I'm like OK, so like.
So a lot of people. So have you found this too?
A lot of people are. They're not allergic to the
corn. It's the process in which it was
done. So all of that, that, you know,
right, all that, all that. Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, allow for you to explain that you can have that
conversation and be like, we don't actually do that.
(59:01):
You don't like this corn becauseit's like fortified with niacin.
This is natural, you know, you do all of that, and then they're
like, oh, but. Each other's cooking style in
one word. Organized.
I'd assume it's like a tornado, but now I'm thinking like not
(59:23):
as. Like tornadoes organized a chef.
Cooking anymore, right? I'm thinking like, oh, he's
talking about like my food at home cooking like it's usually
like what's in the fridge. It's all going in that pot.
But his is like, his is innovative, like he really wants
to push the envelope on a lot ofthings.
Love that. OK.
And finally, one word to describe the restaurant.
(59:52):
Home. Yep, that's a good one.
Yeah, home. That's a great one.
I think we always between the art and wanting to have artists
that are friends. Like grace the walls to also,
you know, it's it's a very humble space.
It came, you know, it was a Wellness clinic before.
(01:00:14):
We didn't invest a lot of money to blow out the ceilings and do
crazy light fixtures. It's just we didn't have the
means to do that, but to wanted some place where everybody's
comfortable and we have again, asmall kid.
So we like that in the early seatings, like there's families
there, like just because it was James Beard nominated and it was
(01:00:35):
in The New York Times and it wasin Bon Appetit, like it doesn't
have to be for people who are driving from the suburbs
somewhere on a Friday, Saturday night.
Right. Be for everyone.
Awesome. Awesome.
OK, you guys have to tell everyone where they can follow
you guys. Come see you guys.
Give me all the things. OK, so we're across the street
(01:00:58):
and here. Obviously 12/12. 22 2nd St.,
Northeast, Minneapolis. Yeah, literally.
It's Oral, our flagship restaurant.
That's where we produce all the tortillas that then get
distributed around the Twin Cities.
But we're in most coops around the Twin Cities, so you can
always find our tortilla there to make delicious tacos at home.
(01:01:19):
And lastly, we also have Tixley by Nexta is in the Gray's Food
Hall downtown Minneapolis, righta couple blocks from the Twins
stadium and like Modest Brewing.OK.
And where can they follow you onsocials?
On Instagram we have Dixley by Nixta or Nixta MPLS is the
Instagram handle for our restaurant and just general
(01:01:41):
nonsense. And also Nix to minneapolis.com,
so you can definitely go there. All the good stuff is there.
Again, thank you guys so much. Thank you for having us for.
Coming This has been a blast andsorry about the travel that you
had. I hit traffic.
(01:02:03):
I appreciate. For the red light, yeah, No, the
only traffic in Northeast is usually just when the turkeys
show up. On yeah, yeah, exactly, exactly.
Oh my God damn turkeys. OK, this has been taste music
here food podcast show. I am your host Ed Porter.
Till next time. Awesome.
(01:02:31):
Thanks for having us, MBC. Our relation to NBC.
NBC. Our relation to NBC.
You know we. Don't you know what takes a
special track to do this? My Mama B&Q super sauce.
It's just the flu with this chef.
I'm here to remind y'all I'm sick with it.
My name is meaning it's one of the same.
Simple and plain. I'm all about my paper.
The bacon cheddar pain got theselanes running for the border.
(00:20):
The talents and Mr. Porter keep it flowing like it's water.
Here we go, Here we go creeping to below speed.
Is it him and his friend sittingin the nose?
Please play it cool. He is special.
Just because he's on TV, everybody's hands up acting like
they know we welcome, welcome, welcome to another episode of
the taste music here food podcast show.
(00:40):
I am your host Ed Porter. This is the place for food,
music and culture and how they all connect.
Today we have two very amazing guests that travelled such a
very long way to be here today. Before we get started, I I
definitely want to attempt to pay them the proper give them
(01:05):
the pop of flowers they deserve with this intro.
OK, so here we go. Today's guests are the heartbeat
behind one of the most culturally rich and
unapologetically flavored drivenspots in the Twin Cities.
These partners, both in life andin business, aren't just making
tortillas. They're preserving stories,
honoring ancestry, and redefining what modern Mexican
(01:27):
food can look like through Nextaand Ora by Nexta.
From the ancient tradition of nixtomalization to a James Beard
nod that turned heads nationwide, their work isn't
just about the food on the plate, it's about the soul
behind it. They're bringing the baselines
of Jodego Mexico and the Temple of Minneapolis into one shared
(01:48):
rhythm. So let's tap in, because today
we're talking about heirloom corn, cultural preservation,
creative grind, and the melody behind the masa.
Welcome to the table, Gustavo and Kate Romero.
That that seemed perfect to me. Yep.
Yeah. Thank you guys for being here.
(02:12):
Thank you for having us. There's everybody has a First
off What's going on shirt is an honor of you guys.
I'm a lover of all things tortillas.
Honestly, I think it's the perfect bread.
It's a vehicle. It is bread.
It's a vehicle. Yes, it is.
It is the perfect vehicle. Talk to me about how you guys
First off, how'd you guys meet? That's that's even a better
(02:35):
question. How'd you guys meet?
It's my fault he's here to point.
That out you did it. OK, I was.
I was raised in Poland for many years, but when I was 11-12
years old, we moved here to Minneapolis.
I grew up here for the most partand then went out to San
Francisco to do a little post culinary school, like big
(02:58):
dreams. I wanna cook there and
eventually have my own restaurant and then that's where
I met him. In San Francisco.
Awesome. Awesome.
What years was that around 2:00?1009, not 2010, is when we
started working together. OK, yeah.
So, yeah, I, I, I lived in the Bay for 11 years.
(03:18):
So I actually was here in 98. Open up Aquavit left in O3 went
to the Bay. I was there for 11 years.
I I love the Bay Area. This is it's a it's a it's
different. It's wonderful.
It's a lovely. It's a.
Super. Cultural I love it.
I I literally love love the Bay Area.
(03:39):
It's it's it's one of those places that you just have to
experience. That's a OK from there to here
though. Like how?
Well, I think we were kind of done with San Francisco.
Yeah, he left to go to Miami andhelp fix a restaurant down there
for a restaurant group. I think ended up working at like
2 restaurants. I moved back home.
So I was like, and we, we were doing long distance.
(04:01):
Then there was the idea that, oh, maybe we'll like Miami
enough and I'll go down there, and then I went to Miami.
Yeah, Miami's good for the weekend.
Yes, two days Max. It was wonderful to go, like,
around, you know, Thanksgiving or like when it's cold, but then
when you go in June, you're like, I can't do this right now.
Miami is is a beautiful, again, beautiful place, great, great
(04:24):
food, scenery, beach, all those things.
It's not real. Like there's a lot of it's it's
it's, it's not like you would. It's very it's very Hollywood.
I like it's it's hard to describe that like nothing
against it. I just think that it's not.
It's such a tourist destination that like you have to go to the
outskirts of Miami to really seepeople live.
(04:47):
And for a especially raising a family that's not, at least
there's not high, you know, think of of that as well.
Like for me, when I started, when I had my family, like I had
an opportunity to go back to NewYork.
First off, my kids are way too soft to my kids are way too
sheltered. And I've I've baby birded them
(05:07):
too much. So they yeah, they wouldn't
survive. They'd be yeah, broken naked on
the corner in under an hour. But yeah, this is a great place.
Minnesota is a great place to raise a family for sure.
Yeah. And I don't necessarily know if
that was our plan when he ended up moving here.
There was a long period of time where like we don't really want
(05:27):
to have kids. You know, we were on that page
for a very long time. But we both.
What I knew once I moved back from San Francisco is that this
city was getting like the culinary scene was growing at
that time. So we came back and it was
20/13/2014. So when you started seeing like
(05:47):
a lot more pedigree and it, it was like we can probably have
something here, you know, we canmaybe own a business here one
day. If not, we'll be working in the
city that is starting the trend,right.
The trend is starting of like good food and good eating.
We're in San Francisco is like this has been there for years.
It's. Established as well as
(06:08):
established. Let's talk about that.
So so initially so again, I camehere in 98 with a restaurant
that was established in New Yorkbecause it's a large population
of Swedes here outside of Swedenway ahead of his time.
At that time there was good fellows Murray's those were the
two only two fine dining establishments here.
(06:29):
So it somebody somebody didn't do their research enough to
understand that it was way too early on.
There is literally specifically now of course, which you guys
being a part of that movement, this you can get pretty much the
best of any cuisine in the cities.
And a lot of it in this 8 block.Rating this is the same.
(06:50):
So like this is this is like restaurant Rd. becoming
restaurant like all the I'm gonna talk about heavy hitters,
though. It's not just like food.
All this. You can just stumble upon any
one of these corners and and have the best meal of your your
life. That to me is special.
But people don't talk about it like it's not it's it's known,
(07:13):
but it's you have to be in the know to know, right.
And so why? Why do you think that is?
Why do you think that's it's OK?So you have Chicago, right?
So this you'd be hard pressed tofind a couple of blocks or or
four mile radius like what we have here in any city except for
San Francisco, New York, OK, Chicago is, but not that not
(07:36):
that much of a congestion of that pedigree of restaurants.
Why do you think that it's not really celebrated the way that
it is in other cities here? I think that a lot of people
don't understand that it's happening.
I think they for for you that realize that it's happening, you
(07:58):
have to go to other places and figure it out that it's not the
same. It's not normal.
And and you know, for us that wehave the opportunity to live in
different places and work in different places.
You know, you work in a restaurant, except for like
places like San Francisco or like you go around the corner
and it was another bad ass restaurant.
You know, as most places, they, they have one place here and
(08:20):
then another place there and it's kind of like scattered over
the city. And then when you when you stay
in a place like the one that we have right now, and then you can
just like cross the street and go to another place or go next
door and go to another place. I think it's very special and
and I think the people started realizing because we see a trend
of people just coming and then having a drink with us and then
(08:41):
going to eat with Gia or going to end.
And then, you know, and they just like, they kind of like
like they, they see what, what that does.
And, and from the beginning, when we, when, when we start
like working in there and like we saw these places opening, you
know, having Christina like few blocks from, from what we had to
(09:03):
like, we always say that like this was so good for, for us
because people will have like now people can drive here and be
like, you know, if we cannot getto 1 place, we go.
To another park and just walk and just walk around and.
See where you can get in. And for so long this part of
Northeast is was like and is still known as the Arts
District. So like art, but you know,
people, we're bringing more art here.
(09:26):
When you think about it with thefood, like we want to be in a
place where like especially withour restaurant, you know, a lot
of the art we have on our walls is local artists.
Art. Absolutely.
Because we want to celebrate that and then have people come
celebrate that with us. Yeah, I, I liken it to the
theater district and any city, any major city has a theater
district and they usually you'llhave the theaters and then you
(09:47):
have museums and they're all clustered together.
And so that is how I look at this, honestly.
And it is art. Food is art.
And it's the, the whole dining experience.
And to be able to have that in such a rich tapestry and just a
small radius is super cool and unique.
And it should be celebrated. And because that's not a normal
(10:09):
thing and and it's not, and it takes it or it takes years to
develop that like a San Francisco or New York, it did
that. That didn't just happen
overnight. So, yeah, I mean, you guys are,
like you said, you definitely celebrate local art and art in
general because as we all know, you eat with your eyes first,
right? And so that is well represented
(10:31):
in everything that you guys do. Everything you guys do, it is
super duper intentional and purposeful.
Let's talk about that. Let's talk about the intention
to detail to every little thing,even down to the name.
Next step. Of course, that's a nod to the
magical process of so. I spent I spent a month in in
(10:54):
Mexico doing some tequila research for SO.
Must be like, yeah. Yes, I had, I had a blast.
So it was I was just down there because we're we're doing
opening up a new restaurant now.I wanted to do some some
research and so I was set up with some people and going to
deal with look at all the agavesand that the whole process of
(11:17):
making tortilla everything. So I fell in love with.
Obviously I was just geeking outjust like a love process.
How everything that you guys do is intentionally to highlight
the corn, right, because that's where it all starts from.
Talk to me about laying in all that attention to everything
(11:38):
that you're doing. So it's I think it's a a super
duper skill set to do it so seamlessly so that most people
don't see it. So let's speak to that.
Let's let's talk about how and why.
I, I think it kind of grow as, as we were growing, you know,
(12:00):
the, we always wanted to have a restaurant like that was a
dream, but we never knew how it was going to happen and, and
what it was going to happen. So when we start making family
meals and we start putting tortillas into the packaging and
we start seeing the reaction of people and we got approached by
(12:20):
stores saying like, Hey, we wantto sell you tortillas first, an
opportunity on market, but also we saw an opportunity where a
lot of people didn't know what it was.
A lot of people will ask us, is this flower?
What are you putting for coloring in how to explain to
people that corn was different and then the importance of it?
(12:42):
I think that that's kind of whenit clicks for us to be like we
can, we can change something here.
You know, we in the middle of corner country and people saw
corn completely different the way that we saw it.
And, and it was a very importantpart of for us to share the the
importance of it. Education, right?
Like the education part, becauseI think we looked at it too,
(13:02):
it's like started with tortillas, the humble tortilla,
but you know, people had to learn about the process.
The process is so much differentthan like a regular tortilla.
Not just mixing Masaharina with water and, and pressing it and
it's done. You're doing this long cooking
process. Then after the tortilla, when we
were like, well, we can also teach people what else they can
(13:23):
do with this dough. And I think the, the, the, the
biggest part of that is you guys, this becoming what it is,
you also helping to preserve theheirloom corn because I'm a huge
component of, you know, being able to acts have access to
(13:46):
things in their original state because they were never broken
to begin with. And so there's the vast
different amounts of types of corn and they have everything
changes with the with that. And it's not all corn is not
created the same. And then there's this, I mean,
it's so it's so many different varieties and there's the
(14:09):
different applications for it and the fact that you've become
it's the Museum of for the corn,honestly.
And so I think it's super cool. I, I really do.
And it it and it's, it's definitely a labor of love, like
we were talking about off camerabefore the it's not a cheap
process. You know, it's, it's important
(14:32):
to, to see it that way because Ithink they, you know, we have
the option, you know, now is, isthe company that we purchase the
corn from. They, they produce flour, which
we know they, they use good cornto process the flour.
But that doesn't change what we want to do.
And it doesn't change our idea and our commitment to show
(14:55):
people what or food this actually looks like.
You know, and the importance of the process, you know, and the
importance of the flavor and theimportance of what, what
culturally means to us to be able to do it that way.
Absolutely. Because it's such a labor of
love and and it is such a labor cost wise, I think it puts us in
(15:17):
a unique position. You know, if we continue to do
this and we respect the process,you know, we want people to eat
things that are not just better tasting, but better for their
body. Absolutely.
Maybe that'll like, you know, restaurants are hard business.
So maybe we'll like be around for a while.
Yeah, trickle down in effect, Absolutely, absolutely like to
(15:38):
play a little game right now. So we do this little game we're
going to play is called this a bet, but it's the husband and
wife addition. Yes, I don't have this
opportunity. You're like, listen, I, I now I
get to, you know, this is going to be good for me and it's
hostile. Yes.
Yeah. It's, you know, you get to see
also why I think the reason theyour business is successful is
(16:03):
because we are very different. And that's and that is the key.
So every good business relationship you have alter egos
and different areas like so thatwherever one is lacking in or or
or overbearing in one area, you have to have that balance it.
It makes for the the best relationships, whether business
(16:25):
or not, have to have that levity.
So all right, so here we go. This is this is that.
So I'm going to ask you a question and then I want to get
an answer from both of you on the question.
All right? So which one hits harder,
arguments in the kitchen or silence in the car ride home?
(16:48):
Arguments in the kitchen. Yes.
No, because it affects everybody.
Yeah. Yeah, I'm.
Like, oh crap, who heard that? You know, because I can't
believe I just said that to. You right there.
You don't. You don't think about.
It no, no, you're. Hot you say something, you're
like oh crap and and. Just then the the silence on the
(17:10):
curve I'd. Follow.
Yeah, yeah. That, that it's coming anyway,
so it's going anyway. It's true.
It's like what needs to happen. Before though, yeah, it's
passion. So that's the passion, right?
OK, which one wins in your kitchen?
Take a risk on a new dish or play it safe with the signature
hit. Take a risk, 100%, yeah.
(17:32):
I like that. Plus you always have the base of
the safe you. Can always.
You can always go back. You can always do exactly.
It's never going anywhere. Yeah, we've had, we noticed
worse. Sometimes with dishes, we're
like, OK, this was, but then, you know, it gets reviewed and
then people keep coming in and asking for it, like, OK, I
cannot hear about it anymore. Put that dish back on the menu.
Next week we have the mullet. Yeah, let's just make it.
(17:54):
Let's just make it. OK?
Where's your compass pointing right now?
Build the brand bigger or protect the piece.
Interesting. I think we both have different
answers, but I. Think that that's.
Because we like, like he wants to build it bigger, I think.
(18:16):
And he, you know, he always sayshe wants to be retired by 50.
Well, that's approaching, you know, you know, about 7717
years. No, I'm just but.
You look at there with 20 man, what do you think?
That's what he does that part while I make sure and you know,
we have the help of my wonderfulsister who helps us like do all
the back end business stuff. We do that for him so we can do
(18:39):
both at the same time, understand.
So builder. Yeah, yeah.
So like, is that what you like? I like bees, but I think the
having a having a a goal to attain and provide peace in the
long run. Very true.
You can't shake up the world in a vacuum.
(19:02):
You need to. Well, they don't necessarily
always have to be like, oh, we want another restaurant, we want
another business. Like, you know, one of the
things he's doing right now is this beautiful USDA funded
project that is about like it's bringing chefs from all around
the country to come here and work with those scientists from
EU of M to adapt this heirloom corn here.
(19:23):
So we've been growing it for years and now we're going to do
like testing and that is part ofbuilding it.
Absolutely, absolutely, absolutely.
That's that's cool. What fills you up more, being
praised for your food or being seen for your purpose?
Purpose 100 percent, 100%. As I think if you get the
(19:45):
purpose then you get the food. Absolutely.
Well. I mean, you know, like the the
preservation of corn in that like you can, you know,
sometimes maybe you won't like adish, but you can respect the
fact that I'm trying to teach you something with it.
Yeah, yeah, I look at it that way.
You know, it's like when music, right?
You don't have to. I understand that.
You can see talent, right? You can see the level of intent
(20:07):
in in in years to to attain a certain.
Skill set. Whether it's my jam or not, like
I, I, I can see the skill, so I respect it.
And food is funny too, because we were just talking about this
earlier. The the barrier to entry, to be
an expert, so to speak about certain things.
(20:29):
A critic is very low. So the average person doesn't
understand what it takes to get from point A to point B and
something that looks so simple to do, the level of skill set
and time and energy and researchthat went into, it's like, I'm
pretty sure down the line after you did finish this project,
(20:50):
they're not going to talk about the the 10 years before that
went into, you know, the research research.
And that that to me is the travesty of the industry.
And and I think things are turning a little bit because the
more that we put things out there and people get to see and.
I think like people see, you know, now you can see videos and
(21:12):
you see like how intricate things can get.
And you know, we always talk about a restaurant and whether
it's not perfect. It's like, you know, it was
perfect for us. But I always say that I, I would
like for us to have an open kitchen because you know, you
see a, you see a, a, a dish, a masa dish in the plate and you
(21:33):
like, oh, you know, it's corn again.
And they just this stuff, but you don't get to see like how
it's made. And, and I think that that's,
that's super important. You know, I think that like,
again, like the process is what's expensive.
You know, I'm trying to explain to people they you're not just
paying for the what you get in the plate, you also get paid for
all the time that is spent creating that, that that dish.
(21:57):
Yeah, and the and the years of knowledge it took to attain it,
right, to get there, to get to where you are, that is the most
important thing. So let's talk to me about the
role that music plays because it's it's a huge cultural
things, specifically this prayers in your so I've I've
been in the restaurant and the music is a heavy influence in in
(22:18):
in the vibe of the of the environment.
So tell me how much of an important role it plays.
And I haven't been in the kitchen.
So I'm sure it's a different. Thing Oh, it's a party.
I know it's I, I I'm already knowing.
I'm already knowing so. I was like, turn it down, I
can't talk to you. No, it's it's super important
though. We, we grew up and then I
include my team because we kind of culturally again, it's the
(22:42):
same, you know, we, we wake up every day with music.
That's, that was my mom, you know, like it was like 6 o'clock
7:00 in the morning when you go to school.
Like the first thing she would do would turn on the radio.
So music's always been so important.
Even if I wasn't allowed to cookwhen I was at home, I would
remember seeing my family in thekitchen with loud music,
(23:04):
screaming, throwing shit at eachother, amazing meals.
And then it just, it's part of us, you know, like we, I mean,
not dance without music. Absolutely.
You know, I'm tapping all the time.
Like I, I'm a horrible singer. She can attend to that.
He's a. Bad singer, but he's an
excellent dancer there. You go play to your strengths.
(23:25):
And I think, I think the, you see the difference, you know, I
guess, I guess the times where, you know, you get really busy
and like the music kind of died down for a reason.
And, and people still so into what they do and they kind of
forget that it's not music. But the difference between
having music and not is also very noticeable.
(23:45):
It's a rhythm that you, that youpick up as, as you, it's almost
like you need like a like a background noise to be able to,
to perform better. And, you know, I work in
kitchens where the kitchen musicwas not allowed or, you know, I
remember the chef that told me that was the sound of
concentration one time when he like turned the, the music off.
(24:07):
And, and, you know, there's things that you remember, you
like, you know, I, I get that and I get the importance of
being able to focus on, on what you're doing.
But for me, it's just, you know,I, I, I like to see my kitchen
in a way where people are comfortable and, and people feel
happy doing what they do it. Well, that's the thing.
Music and food, I think release endorphins in a part of our
(24:30):
brain right That like if happy people make happy food.
Absolutely. Yeah, it's definitely transfers
into whatever you're doing, whatever you're touching.
The the other thing is too is transformative, right?
So, and when you, when you walk through the threshold of your
restaurant, you're transported because of all the things
(24:53):
happening to your senses. So what you see, what you hear,
what you smell. And then finally, once you
taste, you're transported into, you know, a, a, a certain mode
and mood. And that to me, music is a, is,
is definitely a, a huge part of that, but it also is into the
(25:13):
mentality of the people that arecreating everything.
So that understanding that how important that is, is the key.
What? So what would you say if you had
to create a playlist for that sets the mood for the
restaurant? What would you say that is?
Probably cumbia yeah, I think that's something, you know, I
(25:36):
mean we, we play different genres and and, and the Latin
and all the Latin genres are within within Latin music but I
would say that the most consistent 1 is is cumbia.
It's it's an upbeat, happy, happy.
And then we know all the songs. So we walk around, walk around
(25:59):
singing songs and there's. A lot of Selena in the.
Restaurant. It's definitely.
A lot. Of Selena, you know, Queen.
Listen, yeah, that's awesome. That's awesome.
Let's talk about culture and identity.
So your work emphasizes heavily the importance of preserving
(26:20):
Mexican culinary traditions as well as utilizing what you, what
is readily available to in a way, highlight the area as well.
And so how do you balance authenticity and innovation in a
(26:42):
dish? Well, we, we, we try to search
things as close as we can. You know, we, we work with
couple farmers. They're actually pretty cool.
We work with black radish farm. I know you're familiar with
them. There are the rent spaces like
(27:03):
backyards, people and then they grossed up there and then.
Last year they were really cute because I was like, I need the
chili, the poblano for the Reno to be exactly this big.
So they would just come every week and be like, is this the
right size? Yeah, but but you create those
relationships and and I think that that kind of helps with the
(27:24):
with like what we look for because now, you know, they're,
they come to me and they're like, well, I have these things
and I'm like, OK, well send it to us.
And then we figure out how we merge into into the menu.
And then I talked with Jose, it was my chef de cuisine and was
like, OK, we're going to have these items for the next, you
know, two months. Like how do we incorporate into
(27:45):
the into the menu? And then when it comes to like
trying to keep it as culturally as we can, like we also trying
to look for all the ingredients.They are very important for us
that people don't know them a lot, you know, So whenever we
have. Ingredients too, that are like
specifically Minnesota, right? Right.
(28:06):
So that's how it's. Like wild rice or if we do
venison on the menu like having.That.
Cross. Yeah, we turned it up into, you
know, living here and working. I have the opportunity to work
in good restaurants here and I was able to pick up those things
that people really like. Like yeah, we made a pescadilla
with walleye and. I was gonna say I like it.
(28:28):
Yes, I was like, you have to have walleye like.
This you have to have. Or or chatters with wild rice.
It's just like, it's those thosethings that people will
recognize and be like, OK, I know this, this is different,
but I know this and I know that it's going to be good because I
know that part of the. Usage yeah, those and that's the
that's the unique thing with andthere's both food and music do
(28:49):
the same thing. So usually if somebody is making
wants to make a hit, they look at another hit like OK, let's
let's look at the parts of that song that make it a hit and
let's try to infuse some of thatinto whatever this new thing is.
And that's just to create familiarity into lessen the blow
of people wanting to try something.
(29:10):
So there's and what the innovation that comes in that I
think is amazing. So those, that's how all of the
things that we deem to be certain foods, they're not,
they're American creations. Like Chinese food here is not
Chinese food in China. It's not even not even remotely
close. So it's not.
So these are all American creations.
The the fortune cookie was invented in San Francisco.
So it's not. Oh, yeah, I've been to the fact.
(29:34):
Yeah, yeah, me too. Oh, I love it.
Oh, my goodness. So I did in the restaurant, I
made a huge, a huge fortune cookie that had the dessert in
it. Yeah.
So I found a process like, OK, how can I do this?
And it was a timing thing. So you the cookie hardens and
it's like, OK, how can I? So I went to the factory and
(29:55):
found, OK, I just need to jumbo size that thing so I can figure
it out. But yeah, I just, you know,
again, a geek. I'm just a geek.
Can you tell me a story about for you specifically, a dish
that is near and dear to your heart for whatever reason it is
that you don't even want to touch?
(30:15):
So I have, I'll use an example. So this, I'm not really a fan of
tuna fish, right? But my grandmother used to make
a tuna fish sandwich for me thatto this day, I just won't make
it. I won't make it for myself.
I don't even want to make it because it has so much value to
me emotionally that I wouldn't even touch it.
(30:38):
I just, I just deemed it is off the since she passed, I'll never
have another game. I'm just not.
And it's fine, you know, becauseI I attribute it because I don't
want to. I don't want to mess my memory
up, you know, so also the reasonwhy I was such a great sandwich.
She begged the bread she grew, the tomatoes she made, you know,
she did it all. And so is there anything like
(31:00):
that to you that you just like, you know what?
I don't want to sell it. So I don't know, you know, I.
Like that we make. No, that you've, that, that is
tied to a memory, whether it be from childhood or anything.
Like, you know what, I don't want to.
And if I do do it, it's going tobe such a far departure from
what it was because I don't wantto, you know?
Yeah, I think, well I 2 examples.
(31:22):
I think we we make a version of beef tartare that is far removed
from what Kate's mom make because I think they trying to
make a traditional tartar, they would taste like the one that
she made, like it was just not going to happen.
So we go like completely far away from that.
(31:43):
When it comes to to my food, I think they I spend so much time
trying to cook with memories andtrying to bring some of those
ideas and some of those things that my family will make for us.
They, I don't, I don't think I have anything like that.
I think they every good dish that my mom made, like I was
trying to replicate it so many times.
(32:05):
I'm trying to get as close as possible.
Yes. Just because to have their
memories. Yeah, absolutely.
Well, and, and to, you know, achieve that goal, there's a
very real reality that, you know, your parents will, you
know, hopefully be longer than your parents.
So it's like, I want to learn how to make a cabbage roll from
my mom or how to make, you know,the fermented rye soup that she
makes every Easter because it's like, I can't imagine not having
(32:27):
that. But yes, I've, I've tried to
replicate some of her stuff and it takes months or even yes,
like, and it's still like just alittle off.
Yeah, still love. Then you just blame it on the
love. Yeah, absolutely, yeah,
absolutely. That that those I always say
that you know in for cooking, whether you're cooking in the
(32:47):
restaurant or at home. First off, it's it's the the
biggest form of expression of love that you can do is to make
something from the heart to givesomebody to nourish their their
body and spirit. But you're either trying to
recall a past favorite memory orcreate a new one.
That's it. That's, that's a little, that's
(33:07):
always, that's all we're trying to do.
And so if we do, if you've done that, you've done your job
because everybody's been somewhere.
And this one, you know, the, thejob is not successful.
We've gone out to eat someplace and you can't remember at all.
It's just, we had, it's usually because of the company you kept.
Oh, we had a good time. What'd you eat?
(33:30):
Chicken dish, I think you know. Yes.
And so you didn't pull on that? Yeah, you didn't.
You didn't pull on that much. Really limited the the times I
think that you remember meals, you know there has to be.
Has to be. Extremely special.
Exactly, exactly. OK, let's talk about First off,
(33:50):
congratulations on Bon Petit being named one of the 20 best
new restaurants in 2020. So that's a huge, huge, huge
thing, specifically being that, you know, you already have, I
think it's harder to, to, to keep the, the mystique when you
(34:13):
have it, it's it's, it's easy towin a, a title.
It's hard to keep a title, right.
And so the fact that you guys have not only been recognized,
you know, now, but you've been being recognized since you,
since you started. And that is a testament to your
consistency and your, your love for what it is you're doing.
(34:37):
And the fact that you guys have this perfect balance.
It definitely, like you said, Gustavo, is, is definitely the
reason why this works. So kudos to that because that's
a, a huge, a huge accomplishmentfor obviously you yourselves,
your team specifically, and theneverybody who gets to join in
(34:59):
the party. So I always say that I think a
restaurant, especially a restaurant of your caliber,
you're, you're inviting people in to to have a piece of you.
Just like if my house was big enough, if my house was big
enough, this is what it would be.
And so welcome, welcome into thehouse, you know, so that's that
(35:21):
itself in itself is, is an amazing and beautiful thing.
How have you seen the accolades?You know the James Breer's
nomination. How have you seen that impact
the operations of your mission? I think they give us a great
(35:44):
sense of responsibility. We understand the the microphone
got bigger. There is going to be more people
seeing us. There is going to be people that
are more critical seeing us and they and they also they, we
create an expectation for where people come to a restaurant.
You know, they're where before they came to a place where, you
know, we were doing something. Now they come to a place that we
(36:06):
doing something and it's nationally recognized.
So their expectations are huge. And I think, I think they're
like any accolade the the UK, it's great for, for business,
it's great for morale, It's great for just to kind of see
where you were standing. It's great for the team because
they feel part of something important.
(36:28):
And I think that we just trying to maintain it, you know, as
much as we can, we trying to, wedon't go crazy.
We don't change much of anything.
We just continue to work and trying to provide the best
product, the best service possible.
Yeah, you guys, you guys will. So there's two types of and you
(36:48):
know this, they are establishments and restaurants
that that create restaurants forthe instinct purpose of
attaining an award, right? And then there's people that
just do the work, right? And so because you just this is
what we do and we're not, we didn't change or alter anything
for the sake of this and nor will we do it to retain it.
(37:09):
This is how we do it. This is why we do it and we got
to continue to do it. And if you appreciated that
before, you will always appreciate it.
And that's me is the mark of a great, great restaurant.
It's like, OK, we we are the we're creating the wave.
You're not you're not, you know,changing to fit any narrative.
(37:30):
So yeah, kudos to that that and that's you guys would be great.
There's. Plenty of places, you know, I
think that we have modeled ourselves after that are across
the country. There just hasn't been anything,
I think, in Minnesota that has kind of pushed that envelope
with Mexican food and corn and, again, the hard process of an
externalization. So yeah, that really helped.
(37:51):
And pivoting at every turn, right.
Because we started in COVID and then it was like, OK, now you
can do something else, so let's change this and then let's
change this. And it was little by little.
Yeah, no, hopefully full grown. Yeah, hopefully, or we'd have to
leave the building if we want todo anything else because we took
like, you know, we had the dining room, then we moved into
(38:13):
the bar, then we have a courtyard now so.
Oh yeah, yeah, we're. Out of space now, yeah, yeah, we
just have to buy the block now. Yeah.
So let's let's talk about Nixon realization.
Let's let's this really describethe process because I had the
the great fortune to watch, you know, masses at work, Hellesco,
(38:33):
but just speak to the process and because it's central to what
it is you do so. Well, we, we import all the corn
from Mexico. That's like the one of the most
important pieces of it. And then to be able to to
processing activate all the goodenzymes in corn, you have to put
(38:54):
it through this processing externalization, which is they
cook them with an alkaline or analkaline solution.
They will help remove the outer skin.
And then they will activate all the urine enzymes by soaking in
that in some of that calcium into the corn.
You know, the, the industrialization of, of corn in
(39:17):
the 90s, it kind of changed the process where there was still
mixed amylize to remove the skin, but then they would not
let it soak and then they would let it dry and then they process
it, meal it so you can get a flower.
So that's kind of the biggest, the biggest difference between
the corn that we oh, the processthat we do into, into the, the
(39:39):
industrialization and then, you know, we can get it to the
different corn that they use in here.
But when it comes to the process, it just, we've done it
for thousands of years. They were actually comes from
ashes because ashes was the first alkaline that they used
to, to mix amylize. And then now we use calcium
(40:02):
hydroxide this kitchen safe and it is very, very minimum.
We, we because the way that we cook it, we use about .5% and
then it's diluted on water and then whatever it gets soaked,
it's like very, very minimum. But it does activate all the
good in some. You get potassium, you get
(40:22):
calcium, you get nice and you get.
A lot of fiber, which, you know,the only thing the corn doesn't
have is protein. But it that's what you, you
know, that's what the bottle goes for.
Yeah, that's what. The bottle.
Goes for but it's, you know, we when we do stuff with, with corn
too, it's like we currently lookit as a, as a super flavorful
(40:45):
plate that you can put whatever into it.
And then, you know, when you saythis, there's a great B equal to
it. That's, that's the way that we
see it. You know, it's, it's something
that's like the most flavorful play that you can see.
Yeah, yeah. It's and exactly it's an edible
play. It's a great, that's a great way
to look at it. So beyond beyond this culinary
(41:06):
significance, what cultural and historical importance does this
process hold for you specifically?
I think of the well-being, you know, I think the, the, the
importance is the as, as professional chefs, which you
know, we both are, I, I think our priority, our commitment to
(41:28):
our guests is to provide with something that is good for them
and the best possible. So, you know, I think that
that's that's where we both comefrom, Like we from when we were
in San Francisco or wherever we went, we always like try and
deserve the best rather possible.
So if we were going to do tortillas, we needed to do the
same. Absolutely, and I also think
(41:49):
there's something to be said forif if everything went to hell in
a handbasket, right? I have these few humble
ingredients with the know how I can do this that that that is
special, you know what I mean? So because even when you know,
just think about the amount of things that were made before,
(42:14):
you know, the industrialation, the industrial revolution and
all this machinery, you know, this, this that this was
happening, you know, with stone and Kamal.
Yeah, very. Very, very minimal.
Yeah, nothing. Nothing fancy and amazing and
better than what we can do all the know how in the world.
(42:34):
Yes, and and you know, culturally too, I think
something they they always like me personally bought me is the,
you know, you go to you go to a superstar, a supermarket and
then you you get the aisle of the tortillas and the aisle is
bigger than the hamburger buns. And and then you know, you look
(42:55):
up and it's like, you know, Latin food or international
food. And like you get, it's a
relation to the connection the tortillas have with Mexican
food. I mean, some brands even use the
flag. Yep, and.
And to know the the that productis either not good for you and
also not good taste. To me it was, it was almost
(43:15):
insulting. So the only way that you can
change that is like, well one ofthe change that then we have to
do it like. Big branding in specifically as
Mexican. I mean, Native Americans did the
same process. You know, Sean Sherman's making
tortillas at the Indigenous FoodLab.
Like this isn't because this wasan American product.
(43:37):
They put the Mexican flag on it like they eat it everywhere,
right? Yeah, it's, it's the same.
That's a great, great point you bring up too, because there's so
much, you know, corn has been very important to Native
Americans for for eons as well. And you know, so much so that
you know the Indian corn. You know the the name Indian
(43:58):
corn is well. That's what we're using.
Our heirloom corn is Indian corn, Yes.
Like, actually, you know, so Mexicans are Native Americans.
Yeah, go figure. They.
Were here before. Absolutely, And that's so even
that that's I was just having this conversation a couple of
weeks ago about I remember beinga kid and I'm probably dating
(44:20):
myself, but being a kid. And you saw these you saw Indian
corn like off it was it was readily available, right.
Like I can't tell you the last time that I without, you know,
some kind of like ornate, you know, yeah, decorative thing
next to a scarecrow or somethinglike that.
But like we like see it for purchase that and without the
(44:45):
process and the things that you guys are doing, those things go
away and then the kids don't know.
So they will never they won't even know what they're missing.
So it'll just be gone forever. Plus coin is one of those things
that you know, you need, you know, human interaction for it
to happen. So there's no wild, there's no
(45:05):
there's no wild coin. Anyway, let's talk about the,
and we talked talked about this a little earlier, but the
community is powerful. So you guys are part of a of a
very unique community where yourrestaurant lies.
But I believe the community thatyou build extends outside of, of
(45:27):
course, the four walls of your restaurant and the region
because the beauty of the Internet and what it is we're
doing, your story gets to travel.
So therefore the community growsexponentially.
Talk to me about the importance and the responsibility that you
feel in order to just make sure that the local farmers are are
(45:53):
are part of the conversation. And because we kept everything
comes from the ground up, No farmers, no food restaurants.
It's very, it's a very simple equation and people don't see,
they don't really look at where their food truly comes from and
who's making it possible to get from point A to point BI.
Got to remember, I got to send you guys the link to the film
(46:16):
because I did a whole film aboutfor me and, and, and it's, it's,
it was, I spent time in in Merced County, in the San
Joaquin Valley, actually going through and talking to farmers
and, and, and the whole thing like, because it's important.
Talk to me about and I know that's important to you because
(46:38):
we just talked about it, but what type, what legacy are you
intending to leave through the lens?
Because the farmer doesn't really get to talk.
We, we are the food is a spokesman for the farmer.
So how do you how do you carry that weight?
There's so much pressure on bothends, I think when we talk about
(46:59):
this because you want to make sure you're getting the best
product, then taking care of it very, very well.
And then that the person, on theother hand, is also happy
receiving that product and that they're getting something that's
better for them, has higher nutritional value.
All of these things also is interesting and cutting edge in
(47:22):
some way because you want to still, you know, stay relevant
in this like big restaurant community too.
So I think it's a lot, you know,and we have also the
responsibility to your communitytoo.
Like we do a lot of outreach, especially to like schools.
He was a judge for the junior Iron Chef or actually
(47:43):
competitor. He competed with a team of kids.
We're going to judge some class at Roosevelt this weekend
because like, we love making sure that we have a 4 1/2 year
old. There's a responsibility and
idea that like, you know, we grew up with the white Wonder
bread and all of that stuff and now things are changing.
But how do we educate these kidsand next generations to about
(48:06):
like why is it OK for a baguetteto be $12.00 but not but like a
Taco? Yeah, it's a great.
And going into those points, that's a great, that's a great
point. Where, you know, that they are
filled with, you know, Latino and immigrant children at these
schools and like, they love seeing him.
Absolutely, absolutely that, yeah, the seeing representation
(48:30):
matters. I don't care what anybody says.
And I just know for, for me, youknow, being a young like kids, I
was always the youngest. I got into the 16.
So when I was and I failing to find out and God knows I had got
his hand on me. I, I, I didn't belong and all,
but I was, you know, the youngest, the darkest and I felt
(48:53):
the most out of place always. And then I realized that I'm
just chicken no matter where I go.
So chicken can be in anywhere from fine dining to I'm
translatable. I've learned to be a linguistic
champion enough to be able to describe and communicate my
thoughts, needs, and my point ofview no matter who I sit across
(49:18):
from. And so you only learn that from
representation. So when you get to see, when
you, when you get to see yourself and someone else and
see the possibilities, that's why it's important for those
kids to see you. That's and that's a beautiful
thing. Well, unlike all the accolades
we just talked about, it's like those things we really only care
about because they open more doors to those rooms where
(49:41):
you're changing the demographic and the dynamic because you're
part of the conversation. Yeah, for sure.
You, you know, I think the importance of not now that I
consider myself a role model, but then you can you hope that
when you go to these schools andyou and you talk to these kids,
(50:01):
the one of them would think thatif I made it, he can make it
Absolutely, you know, and, and. There's importance in like trade
jobs too, you know, because thisis, this is different.
You're like, and we all know we can go to culinary school, sure,
but like, did we need to? No, we probably could have
learned everything on the job. It was just about getting in the
right kitchens and and learning with from the right people who
(50:24):
wanted to teach. And but seeing that, you know,
there's not no longer something that like, oh, you work in a
restaurant. Oh, you're a chef, you know, but
but changed years ago and and it's not OK.
So you're here, you from an immigrant family, your parents
are cooks, but guess what? This guy's a chef.
(50:44):
Yeah. And and it means something.
Yeah. And it's a, it's a not only,
it's a very important a job to have, you're also galvanizing
and you're, you're leading, you have your, you have, you have
your family and you have your work family, right?
So you, your team is just as dependent on you as your kids.
(51:12):
And a good leader feels that pressure everyday like I, I
don't want to let and it's, it goes back and forth.
So you're, you're, I always say that people don't work for jobs,
They work for people. And when somebody who respects
you enough to, they don't want to let you down.
And because you not, you're not letting them down.
That cycle is what keeps life going.
(51:34):
And that's that, that's, that's the beautiful part about the
restaurants. I learned all of my life skills
from working in restaurants, like all of the important soft
skills that are now dying my sister.
And her husband worked in restaurants for years, too.
He's a banker now, but he alwayssays, And I think it's important
that he understands this, but hebartender just 1314 years, when
(51:59):
he sees that somebody has service industry experience on
their resume, he's more likely to hire them.
Absolutely, absolutely. There's, there's.
And this is not for everybody, too.
He's also equate cooking to like, singing.
So you can go to school and learn musical theory all you
want. Either you can sing like Mariah
(52:20):
Carey or you can so you and thisand now here's the beauty.
That's OK, That's OK. He's a dancer.
He's a dancer, though, OK. Now there's different ways and a
lot of different ways to to to earn a living in this business.
Now some people from here to here, they don't have it right,
but they can tell you, you know,the great teachers, great
coaches, great, you know, cookbook writers, But there's
(52:45):
there's the skill set for I knowguys that never been any on the
same side of the street as this school that just have it.
You know, these guys are just monsters.
And and and that to me, that skill set, you can't, you can
you can cultivate it. You can't necessarily teach
somebody to have that rhythm. You know, I can put you in the
(53:06):
right Adaptability I think is exact.
Thing you know when because thatjust changing, like as you grow
into a position on the kitchen, whether it's you start as a
dishwasher, you move to Lancook,then you're a sous chef, then
you're the chef. Like, it's also changing with
the food trends, like what's hotright now, you know, it's a lot.
(53:27):
And you have to love it enough, okay?
And we're all masochists, right?So who else do you know, gets
their shit kicked in and still comes every day?
Like I just like, yeah. And it's like, yeah, I'll be
better tomorrow. It is.
And there's no greater feeling than than than to, you know,
(53:47):
stab the last ticket like this. This was horrible day.
But and it makes for great stories.
It was great stories. It makes for great stories.
And it's the sense of accomplishment.
It's in real time, though, like literally in real time.
Like to be able to to conquer that, that type of mountain with
a team, it is no greater feeling.
(54:09):
It really is. It's no greater feeling and I
hope the masses will get to. Feel.
Yeah. I mean, we're not Tim Worlds,
but I mean I'd assume that's howthey feel if they want a game
together, right? Absolutely.
That's. We always, always have this idea
of seeing the kitchen team as like a, a sports team for sure,
(54:33):
you know, and, and it's going tobe the times where like one
player is not doing OK and the whole team has to kind of carry
them along. And, and I think that that's,
that's true in life for, you know, your community And then
just trying to have better days and, and be the +1 and, and as
as a, as a leader, you're the one that pushes, you know,
you're the one that has the beat, you're the one that has
(54:56):
the rhythm that everybody's moving at.
You're the team captain. The goalie is definitely the
dishwasher. OK, for sure, for sure, for
sure. I always say so.
In all my restaurants, I was always tell if the dishwasher
was down or you can see when they're struggling, right.
But specifically, the dishwasherwas out, everybody just 15
(55:19):
minutes in the pit, everybody. And so you're going to respect
this guy. So he's the, he's the most
important guy in the building. He doesn't do his job.
No food goes out. I don't care what you're saying.
We don't give me pen. No food gets cooked, no nothing.
Nothing moves if this dude is not on his job and he gets
shitted on on a daily basis. You know, you know, it's, it's
horrible. Yeah, I think we how to say the,
(55:43):
I think it's three positions in the restaurant.
The the mark, the how the day goes, the person on the door,
the person in the past in the dishwasher.
Yeah. If like all the other ones that
can be move and arrange and kindof fill in.
For it, they can shit the bed they, they, they, they, they
(56:04):
have an off day, they have, theyhave an off day.
It crashes, it crashes everything.
The whole system crashes. And most, so that's the most
people don't understand that, like, like diners don't
understand it. Like, so you can, you can
completely alter the mood of a person by being greeted
properly. Here's the other thing.
(56:26):
Most people don't go out to eat.You'd have to have a bad time.
So like we, we are in this business to either enhance or
shit the bed. So like nobody's going out to
have a, to purposely have a bad time, you know, but it happens,
right? And usually for one of those
three things, the, the, the, thegreeter or something that the
(56:51):
kitchen's at a standstill. Usually it's something's going
on. The something's going on with
the disc, the machine, bro. Yeah, something, something's
happening. Yeah, something's happening.
That's that's a great. I'm glad you just said that.
We need to have a a National Dishwasher's Day.
Yes. We should we should I'm I'm you
know what? We're putting that in the action
(57:12):
over Taco, of course. OK, so before I let you guys go,
we like to do close out with a little the game I call the
Lightning round. So in the lightning round, it's
a quick fire answers. I'm going to give you a phrase
or word. Mostly it's going to be a
phrase. And then you give me the first
thing that pops into your head. Yeah, yeah.
(57:36):
Case like case like. I don't know, I'm just you want
the first thing. You want the first thing.
All right, all right, here we go.
What's the smell that instantly takes you back to childhood?
Try chills. Dang.
(57:56):
I can smell the chillies too. When you said that, that's
that's crazy out of mind words. Probably like chicken like, like
broth like. OK.
Broth all the time. That smells good too. 1
ingredient you'll defend until the end, no matter what any
haters say. Corn.
Corn. That's a good.
(58:20):
One, you'd be surprised how manypeople have walked into the
restaurant without doing their research, being like, I'm
allergic to corn and I'm like, Idon't know how to say this to
you nicely. What would you say?
If you go out and make a left. You see a lot of like I might,
then I might be better. Yeah, there's rice down the
street. It's hard, hard because even
(58:41):
from like, I can't even do corn oil and I'm like OK, so like.
So a lot of people. So have you found this too?
A lot of people are. They're not allergic to the
corn. It's the process in which it was
done. So all of that, that, you know,
right, all that, all that. Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, allow for you to explain that you can have that
conversation and be like, we don't actually do that.
(59:01):
You don't like this corn becauseit's like fortified with niacin.
This is natural, you know, you do all of that, and then they're
like, oh, but. Each other's cooking style in
one word. Organized.
I'd assume it's like a tornado, but now I'm thinking like not
(59:23):
as. Like tornadoes organized a chef.
Cooking anymore, right? I'm thinking like, oh, he's
talking about like my food at home cooking like it's usually
like what's in the fridge. It's all going in that pot.
But his is like, his is innovative, like he really wants
to push the envelope on a lot ofthings.
Love that. OK.
And finally, one word to describe the restaurant.
(59:52):
Home. Yep, that's a good one.
Yeah, home. That's a great one.
I think we always between the art and wanting to have artists
that are friends. Like grace the walls to also,
you know, it's it's a very humble space.
It came, you know, it was a Wellness clinic before.
(01:00:14):
We didn't invest a lot of money to blow out the ceilings and do
crazy light fixtures. It's just we didn't have the
means to do that, but to wanted some place where everybody's
comfortable and we have again, asmall kid.
So we like that in the early seatings, like there's families
there, like just because it was James Beard nominated and it was
(01:00:35):
in The New York Times and it wasin Bon Appetit, like it doesn't
have to be for people who are driving from the suburbs
somewhere on a Friday, Saturday night.
Right. Be for everyone.
Awesome. Awesome.
OK, you guys have to tell everyone where they can follow
you guys. Come see you guys.
Give me all the things. OK, so we're across the street
(01:00:58):
and here. Obviously 12/12. 22 2nd St.,
Northeast, Minneapolis. Yeah, literally.
It's Oral, our flagship restaurant.
That's where we produce all the tortillas that then get
distributed around the Twin Cities.
But we're in most coops around the Twin Cities, so you can
always find our tortilla there to make delicious tacos at home.
(01:01:19):
And lastly, we also have Tixley by Nexta is in the Gray's Food
Hall downtown Minneapolis, righta couple blocks from the Twins
stadium and like Modest Brewing.OK.
And where can they follow you onsocials?
On Instagram we have Dixley by Nixta or Nixta MPLS is the
Instagram handle for our restaurant and just general
(01:01:41):
nonsense. And also Nix to minneapolis.com,
so you can definitely go there. All the good stuff is there.
Again, thank you guys so much. Thank you for having us for.
Coming This has been a blast andsorry about the travel that you
had. I hit traffic.
(01:02:03):
I appreciate. For the red light, yeah, No, the
only traffic in Northeast is usually just when the turkeys
show up. On yeah, yeah, exactly, exactly.
Oh my God damn turkeys. OK, this has been taste music
here food podcast show. I am your host Ed Porter.
Till next time. Awesome.
(01:02:31):
Thanks for having us, MBC. Our relation to NBC.
NBC. Our relation to NBC.
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