January 22, 2026 • 52 mins
A single glance can change a life.
That idea drives our powerful conversation with Kelley Marshall, survivor leader and training specialist with Truckers Against Trafficking. Kelley turns a painful past into practical guidance, breaking down how traffickers groom their targets through attention, financial “help,” and manufactured debt—and why so many victims may appear compliant while living under coercive control. Her story brings hard truth to the surface: demand fuels exploitation.
We move beyond headlines to the everyday places where trafficking hides in plain sight—truck stops, schools, restaurants, farms, and construction sites. Kelley explains the red flags drivers can notice without confrontation, including coerced companions, scripted answers, lack of ID or money, and controlling “partners.” Most importantly, she shares exactly what to do next: observe, document vehicle details and locations, and make the call. Law enforcement would rather investigate a false alarm than miss a chance to help someone in danger.
Kelley also opens up about healing. She shares how shame and silence gave way to recovery through faith, community, and reflective writing—work that led to her book I’ve Got a Secret, which includes a biblically based curriculum and journaling tools for survivors. We challenge myths around legalizing prostitution, discuss the growing reality of labor trafficking, and talk about purpose at work—how building people up reduces vulnerability and strengthens communities. Whether you drive for a living or simply care about human dignity, this episode equips you to see more clearly, understand more deeply, and act with confidence.
Key Takeaways
✅ Trafficking often begins with grooming, not force—attention, money, and debt are common tools of control
✅ Victims may appear “willing” due to fear, manipulation, or survival tactics
✅ Trafficking hides in everyday places, not just on the news
✅ Drivers can spot red flags safely without confronting anyone
✅ Document details and report—law enforcement prefers false alarms over missed opportunities
✅ Demand drives exploitation; addressing buyers matters
✅ Healing is possible through community, faith, and intentional recovery work
✅ Purpose-driven workplaces and communities reduce vulnerability
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_01 (00:00):
Welcome back to Das Delivered, a truck show that
helps many people, uh, not justwith trucks, but also many other
areas in life as well.
I'm your host, Trucking Ray, andtoday we're going to uh dive
into deep something powerful,personal, and that we're talking
with someone whose life story isboth humble and inspiring for
everyone.
And this is a moment wheretrucking meets purpose well
(00:20):
beyond freight and logistics.
I've been looking forward tothis conversation, and it's
real, raw, and it has somethingthat you will remember outside
of the road and counts in manyways, most of us can't even
imagine.
So, my guest today is KellyMarshall.
Uh, she's with Truckers AgainstTrafficking, and uh, she is a
survivor herself, and we can'twait to hear her story.
(00:46):
Kelly, it's so nice to have youon the show.
How are you?
SPEAKER_02 (00:50):
It's good to be here.
SPEAKER_01 (00:51):
Very nice.
So happy to have you here totell your story.
I mean, being a survivor ofhuman trafficking yourself, and
also taking the time to giveback and as a training
specialist and survivor leaderwith Truckers Against
Trafficking TAP for short.
Your story is one of survival,resilience, and uh
transformation.
Uh, it directly powers themission that you're dedicated
(01:13):
to.
So tell us about yourself andhow you got started on this
journey of sharing your story.
SPEAKER_00 (01:19):
Well, I am I'm originally from Miami, now in
Memphis, Tennessee.
And when I originally wrote mybook, I was starting to speak
out on this because that hasbeen a really big part of my
healing process.
Being able to share and toeducate, letting people know
(01:42):
that this is a real thing.
This, you know, this isn'tsomething that's happening in a
third world country, it's not,it's right here in our
backyards.
And it's important for people tounderstand what a victim goes
through.
And so with the love and thesupport of so many of my
(02:03):
friends, my family, people withtat, I love tat.
So it's just become my lifemission.
And because if if I can't share,then how is anybody gonna know
what to look for?
SPEAKER_02 (02:22):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (02:23):
And how does anybody know that you know there's
victims out there, they need toknow that there's hope, that
there is hope in coming out ofthat life into having such a
beautiful life?
SPEAKER_01 (02:36):
Yeah, yeah.
As a survivor yourself, yourperspective is is huge.
I mean, you think about when youlook back at the conditions in
your life before trafficking wasa topic, what were some of the
key things that made you atarget, not just emotionally,
but practically?
Can you share that with us?
SPEAKER_00 (02:55):
Well, growing up, my dad was extremely abusive.
And so I had very lowself-esteem.
He was physically abusive,emotionally abusive, mentally
abusive, and then eventually hewas sexually abusive.
And so it wasn't it wasn't mystraight A's that made him
(03:18):
happy.
It wasn't the fact that I cookedand cleaned every day that made
him happy.
It was only when he was sexuallyabusing me that he was happy
with me.
And so I equated sex with love.
And and so that was kind of mypattern.
And I craved that love andattention so much that I was
(03:42):
just this easy target fortraffickers.
Because at the time when I gotgroomed, when I was groomed by a
trafficker, I was a single mom.
I had no income or little incomecoming in, I had just lost my
apartment and you know, I wastrying to get jobs here or
(04:06):
there.
And due to the lack ofself-esteem and the massive
trauma that I had alreadyendured with my dad, I was
pretty, I was a pretty easytarget.
So when he walked by me and hecalled me beautiful, I was like,
whoa, somebody actually calledme beautiful.
(04:27):
Okay, and so that is how thatstarted, you know, and for a few
weeks we hung out and then we,you know, he wanted to know all
about me.
He know he wanted to knoweverything about me, and nobody
ever cared about me.
I was invisible, and so with himshowing me that much attention,
(04:53):
I just fell in hook, line, andsinker.
And and once he told me what hewas, I was like, no, I don't
want to do that.
It doesn't even sound, you know,that's not and he's like, Well,
you give it away for free, soyou might as well get paid for
it.
And because he had been helpingme with my rent, because he had
(05:15):
been helping with my daughter'sbasic needs, he had said to me,
he said, Well, what kind ofmother would you be if you can't
even take care of yourdaughter's basic needs?
And at that point, I knew I hadI couldn't go to my family.
I had nowhere else to go, and Ifelt like I owed him.
(05:36):
And so that is how thingsstarted.
SPEAKER_01 (05:39):
Yeah.
Wow.
Yeah, many people aren't awareof those tactics that are used,
and they think that you know,and someone's just being nice
and it went too far.
But the thoughts of thatindividual was well before you
guys met that their intentionswere to find someone that would
fit into that mole.
That's what it seems like to me.
SPEAKER_00 (06:00):
It is, that's exactly.
Traffickers are very smart, theyknow what to look for, they know
the vulnerabilities that they'reseeking.
It's not just this snatch andgrab.
They take the time to get toknow a person, get that person,
you know, figure out what theirvulnerabilities are, and they
(06:24):
play off of those.
They exploit thosevulnerabilities.
And it can be something assomeone just is looking for
love, someone who's looking toget out of poverty, somebody who
needs a mom figure, a dadfigure, because you know, not
just males are traffickers,traffickers can be anybody, and
(06:47):
I and I don't think peoplerealize that.
SPEAKER_01 (06:51):
What what are some other individuals that you would
warn people about or bring bringattention to?
Who would you say that are thesetype of people?
I mean, I think of theentertainment industry when
you're talking and think aboutsome of these documentaries you
watch on TV.
I feel like that could be at ahigher level, but hey man, the
the things that Diddy, SeanCombs, you know, here's a person
(07:14):
that's supposed to be respected,and then you hear the remarks
from the jurors saying that, oh,that must have been just a love
relationship.
I'm like, I think it was uh wellbefore those individuals met
that some of that was beingdone.
And I think about even like withtrucking, down to that level and
(07:35):
an occupational level, you know,you get these people that need
help, and then they're offeredan opportunity, and and to get
them to get it taken away, uhthey're exploited with their
going out there doing thingsthat you're violating the hours
of service, doing all thesethings for to make a profit for
the company.
And then there's dangerousroadways, you know.
(07:57):
You know, people out therecausing accidents that probably
shouldn't be driving.
So even on an occupationallevel, entertainment level, who
would you bring highlights to?
Those are my two that I I see ona day-to-day basis trucking.
SPEAKER_00 (08:10):
I think for me, I would put it on an even deeper
level.
Think about our youth, thosethat are in the foster care
system, they're an easy target.
People that come from abusivehouseholds, you know, people
that are just down on theirluck.
(08:31):
Anybody can become a traffickingvictim given the right
circumstances.
Well, or bad circumstances, butthere are so many different
ways.
I mean, even those who arementally challenged, you know,
this person comes in their life,they become their friend.
And next thing you know, theyare being trafficked.
(08:56):
So, you know, yes, we can lookat the high level, but most of
it is well, I can't say most ofit, but a lot of it is going to
be at a normal level, someone inpoverty, someone with low
self-esteem, someone who hassome kind of vulnerability.
(09:18):
And I think Tat does a wonderfuljob of highlighting the red
flags, highlighting thesevulnerabilities in all of our
trainings, and you know, beingable to recognize the signs of
someone who is being trafficked.
SPEAKER_01 (09:37):
Right.
Well, you I got your book, and Ithink it's a great story, a
great read for many out there.
And it's titled Sh I've Got aSecret.
And I found it on Amazon.
I'll put the link on there.
Uh, I think you tell a greatstory on there as well.
It was a real sad moment when Iread about how you said uh I
(09:58):
think your mom attempted to jumpoff a high, was it a dresser?
Yes, because she didn't want tocarry through with the
pregnancy, or at least that'swhat he told you.
Um yeah, tell us about that alittle bit.
SPEAKER_00 (10:12):
Like I said, my dad was very controlling, he was
abusive, and that was why my momleft him.
But you know, I I look back nowat hearing that again of you
know, my mom trying to get ridof me, but I know how much my
mom loved me.
(10:34):
So I don't know if it wasbecause she didn't want to bring
a child into the world knowingwho the dad was, knowing how
horrible he was, or I I don'tknow.
I I honestly don't know becauseI never heard it from my own.
SPEAKER_01 (10:54):
That's what I was wondering.
SPEAKER_00 (10:55):
I never wanted to bring it up because I didn't
want to hurt her feelings, okay,yeah, and so I never did, right?
SPEAKER_01 (11:04):
Yeah, yeah, that uh yeah, just to tell your your
daughter a story like that initself is that's just
mind-boggling to figure out howto you what what was your
purpose of doing that, you know.
So, but again, it's probably forcontrol, and that's what a lot
of these individuals like thatare out there.
(11:25):
I think they love having controlover another human, yes, like a
like a god complex, and that'ssomething that they don't have
any right to.
SPEAKER_00 (11:34):
No, and I agree, I agree with that, and you know,
if you think about it,trafficking is a business.
We have the supplier, theproduct, and the demand.
And so the trafficker,obviously, he provides the
(11:55):
product, which is the victim,and then we have the demand,
which are the people that arepurchasing.
And you know, to anyone thatthat would listen to this, if
you are purchasing commercialsex, keep in mind that person
doesn't want to be there, nomatter how they're acting in
(12:15):
front of you, no matter howthey're like, oh baby, yes, this
and that.
That is not the case.
And if we really want to getdeeper into it, you're paying to
rape somebody.
And that is the bottom line.
It is paid rape.
And if we didn't have thedemand, we wouldn't have
(12:39):
trafficking, but there's such ahigh demand for it, and and you
would be surprised, some of thebuyers are worse than the
traffickers, they feel likethey've paid money, they've
purchased this person forwhatever amount of time, and
they can do what they want, theycan treat them the way they
(13:01):
want.
So, you know, you we're thinkingabout all sides here.
unknown (13:08):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (13:08):
And you know, what would you say to politicians
that say they should legalizeit, prostitution and things like
that?
What are your thoughts when youhear things like that?
SPEAKER_00 (13:19):
Personally, I think it's a big mistake because then
there's going to be more andmore trafficking because it is
made, if it is made legal, therewould be more, and then there
would be no consequences for thetrafficker or the buyer.
And then they would continue toarrest the prostituted person,
(13:44):
and so and everybody else getsaway with what they're doing,
and so that is a really big uhthing personally for me.
Is why would you want tolegalize this?
SPEAKER_01 (13:59):
Yeah, they they claim that the demand will go
down because they're creating amarketplace, it's the same
mentality with drugs.
Uh, if it was legalized, theyfeel like then it won't be much
of a demand.
And you know, they're so wrong.
That's even hard to repeat it.
(14:19):
Yeah, that is yeah, that's whatthey're saying.
That's uh that is the messagethat they're putting out there
for people to hear.
And you being a survivor, Ithink you have every right to
speak on it.
Let your voice be heard whenthings like that are coming up.
So appreciate you telling uswhat you thought.
What you think.
SPEAKER_00 (14:37):
Yeah, I think it would just exasperbate,
exasperbate it even more.
So this would not be a goodthing, this would not bring the
demand down.
I think it would actually causemore demand and more
trafficking, and then morevictims and no help for the
victims.
SPEAKER_01 (14:58):
So looking back, so often survivors talk about
looking back, hindsight.
That's a question that manypeople in your audience may
think about what did you not seeat the time that you wish
someone had told you?
Something that wasn't asobviously right in front of you,
but it truly matters.
What would you say?
SPEAKER_00 (15:20):
Are you talking about during my time?
SPEAKER_01 (15:23):
I guess it's yeah, you know, the 2020 hindsight
that people always say, if Ijust at new, or if I had an
idea, or if someone had helpedme, and I was thinking maybe you
could speak on that so thatpeople can say, hey, you know,
yeah, now I now I can see sinceI listened to this podcast and
hearing that from Kelly, thatmaybe I'm aware now, you know,
(15:44):
it helps helps me to not besusceptible to the trap.
What would you say?
SPEAKER_00 (15:52):
I think one of the biggest things that I would say
is for those that have beenmaybe brought up in abusive
situations, especially as a kid,it wasn't your fault.
You are still worthy.
(16:12):
You are more than anyone hassaid you are.
Because I find a lot of it is alack of self-esteem and a lack
of self-love.
If I had been able to lovemyself and know that what my dad
did wasn't my fault, maybethings would have been
(16:37):
different.
Maybe if my school bus drivercould have seen the bruises and
the different demeanor and howmy personality had changed and
they knew about humantrafficking, maybe I wouldn't
have gone down this road.
Maybe if while I was at school,my teachers would have noticed,
(17:02):
you know, something was verywrong.
But I think for myself, if I ifif somebody would have been able
to say, you are special, you areworthy, what your dad did to you
is wrong, and it's not yourfault.
And so I think for me, thatwould be my biggest thing is
(17:29):
reassuring my younger self thatyou know what, it wasn't my
fault, it was just he wasbrought up in a sick way, and so
yeah, he didn't know how to be adad.
SPEAKER_01 (17:42):
Yeah, I was reading about the let's see, he was
putting a lot of what was it,orphanages, orphanages, and yes,
they do, yeah.
So it was the incidents where hewas sexually abused, yes.
So you know, when I'm out thereand I'm driving truck, I'm
thinking about getting home,thinking about being safe,
(18:05):
thinking about yeah, I mean, I'mthinking about myself and my
family, and there are thosemoments where I have to stop and
think about where I'm atpresently and realize that I
have a moral obligation to be aguardian of the road or
wherever.
I know I think I was at a truckstop and I saw a young lady
(18:27):
crying.
And first thing you want to sayis that's none of my business,
or you know, like what's goingon.
But afterwards, you know, thethe clerk and and all, you know,
we could we all made eyecontact, and but yeah, they
called the police and because itwas obvious that they were
arguing, the couple, she waswith another man, you know, he
(18:48):
was invisible.
You know, I could see hercrying, but I didn't who was she
with, you know.
I don't know.
It was my mind just isn't thatin that gear of yeah, I don't
know what the situation is.
But when I stopped thinkingabout me and I stopped shopping
because I was in there as an asa newer store, and I was excited
about the new truck stop andeverything, right?
(19:08):
But when I took a moment torealize what was going on around
me, I was able to be more awareof my situation and to be able
to help be there for anindividual I had no clue about.
I never met the person.
So the more I practice that andexercise that, like you
mentioned, the bus driver, themore we try to bring it to
(19:29):
attention, not for others, butalso for ourselves mentally, we
can be an effective tool to helpthose individuals in their time
of need and feel like we aremaking a difference versus
saying, Oh, I'm I'm botheringsomeone, you know.
So yeah, you're right.
If someone would have done morethat would, even it's just a
(19:51):
little bit, you know, just youknow, the question what's going
on here?
You know, that starts theconversation versus just going.
About your own well selfishneeds, you know, even if they
are just trying to get home, yougotta stop thinking about just
yourself, you know.
So, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (20:10):
Well, I I feel like truckers have this unique
ability to be able to helpbecause truckers are the eyes
and the ears of the road.
Y'all see things that we don'tnotice, we don't see, and you're
at these truck stops, you are onthe road, and you you can see
(20:34):
above everything else,everything that's going on.
And you know, with the TATtraining, being able to be more
vigilant on what to look for,and taking that time, and so
many truckers I'm so gratefulfor because y'all have taken the
(20:55):
time, you know, after taking thetraining, the TAT training, you
learned about human trafficking,you learned about the size, the
signs, and made that call.
Yeah, and I think one of thebiggest things is people are
afraid.
Well, what if this isn't what Ithink it is?
(21:17):
What if I'm wrong?
Well, I think law enforcement,and I've I've talked to many,
many law enforcement, done lawenforcement trainings, and they
would rather you be wrong thannot make the call because you
never know whose life you'regonna save.
And you know, I say this a lot.
(21:39):
Instead of judging those thatare being prostituted, ask how
they got, ask yourself, how didthey get there?
I mean, nobody wakes up andsays, Wow, it's my life's dream
to sell my body for someone elseto make money, you know what I
mean?
And so, you know, there's somuch judgment there, but just
(22:04):
take that time to ask yourself,hmm, I wonder how she got here
and make that call.
You know, I wouldn't say goapproach the trafficker, please
don't do that.
That's dangerous.
But you can you can get as muchinformation about the people
(22:24):
that you're seeing.
You may be seeing thetrafficker, you may be seeing
his vehicle, get the licenseplate, you know, get as much
information as you can and makethat call.
And even if you're wrong, youstill did something instead of
not doing anything at all.
And I think as a society, wetend to bury our heads in the
(22:49):
sand because we don't want todeal with something hard.
SPEAKER_01 (23:18):
Nice, yeah, yeah, absolutely.
Very good words to speak there.
I mean, think about your youryour life and how you've got to
where you are in your healingprocess.
Did you ever reach a momentwhere you thought this is not
where my life ends?
What what changed that for youas a person, the moment, or
(23:40):
well, was there some insightthat you have so you can share?
SPEAKER_00 (23:45):
It took me, well, first of all, it took me a
really long time.
I lived with the shame and guiltof that lifestyle that I thought
I chose until I found out that Iwas a victim.
And from then, you know, I mean,I had already been clean off of
(24:07):
drugs, and then, you know, justfor me, for my healing process,
it has been a spiritual process.
You know, my relationship withGod has been so crucial to my
healing, and I mean, he has putsuch amazing people in my life
(24:30):
to help me grow and to buildthis life that I have now.
It took me six years to writethat book, by the way.
SPEAKER_01 (24:41):
Really?
Congratulations.
SPEAKER_00 (24:43):
It was hard, it was hard.
SPEAKER_01 (24:47):
It's something about writing down your memories and
knowing that there's someone outthere that may not read it the
way you want them to read it, orthey just don't understand.
I mean, so many ways it can gowhen someone has those words and
they're looking at it.
And I mean, you you put yourselfout there, you're vulnerable to
do that, and I applaud that.
That's awesome.
SPEAKER_00 (25:08):
Thank you.
But it it did help a lot in myhealing journey because I was
able to see as I was writing,like Kelly, what were you
thinking?
SPEAKER_01 (25:19):
Is there a story behind the cover too?
SPEAKER_00 (25:23):
Yes, I like it.
There is because that the sidewith the bruising and the tears
is who I used to be, and theother side is who I am now.
And see, because I kept thatpart of my life a secret for so
many years, that's why it'scalled I've got a secret.
SPEAKER_01 (25:47):
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (25:49):
And so, you know, it was letting it go, it was
releasing it, it was okay, I'mgonna put it out there.
But you know, I'm sure you'veseen already, it's more than
just my story.
In the back of the book, thereare pages where if someone has
(26:12):
been through any type of trauma,there it's it's biblically
based.
It is a curriculum that Icreated and it's meant for
people to heal.
And so that's why I made it thatway, because I didn't want it to
be just another survivor book.
(26:33):
I wanted it to have, I I want,you know, people want to know,
okay, I've been through this,I've been through this.
Okay, how did you heal?
What was your process?
And so that was the biggest pushfor my book.
SPEAKER_01 (26:51):
Who did you have help or you did it all by
yourself?
SPEAKER_00 (26:55):
Um did most of it by myself.
I did have some help withediting and things like that,
but as far as the creating ofthe curriculum, I did that.
SPEAKER_01 (27:05):
That's awesome.
Yeah, yeah, because thecurriculum part, yeah, I did see
that in the workbook, kind oflike a workshop that you can
make notes like a journal.
I think that's great for peopleto exercise their mind in a
healthy way by writing somethingdown.
You can refer back to it.
I mean, journaling in itself,that just alone can help
(27:26):
healing.
So adding that to the book is isamazing.
SPEAKER_00 (27:29):
Oh, yeah, that that is definitely true.
Doing a lot of writing and likeget those thoughts out, you
know, do what you need to do,you know, to heal, because that
is what's gonna break thiscycle.
And for some people, traffickingis a generational thing, and
(27:55):
then we have families, thefamilial trafficking, where
families are trafficking theirown kids, and so you know, we
have to think about all thesethings, and these kids are going
to school every day, and and Ithink Tat does a wonderful job
(28:16):
of I think we do an amazing jobat getting these materials out
for the trucking industry, forthe school transportation, motor
coach.
I mean, there's just we have aplethora of information and we
give it out for free, you know.
SPEAKER_01 (28:35):
Yeah, a lot of great people there to get that energy,
to get that vibe to continue asto be a force for good.
Let's tell us about that.
Being a survivor leadership,you're helping shape how TAT
trains others.
How does your role influence theway a training is structured,
especially now that TAT's reacha national and includes more
(28:56):
industries, not just trucking?
How does your role and yourexperience help TAT?
SPEAKER_00 (29:03):
So, what I do is as a training specialist, now I do
have to say Tat already had thatamazing training before me.
So, but my role is importantbecause when I go around the
country and I train lawenforcement or we do coalition
(29:24):
builds, I'm coming from thesurvivor's perspective, but not
uh it's not just telling mystory, it is a training because
I also include, you know, redflags to look for, you know, I
share some of my story.
Okay, what red flag indicatorsdid you hear?
(29:48):
And training points.
It's important for people inwhatever industry they're in or
government agency to know sometraining points, some red flag
indicators, and that is what Ibring to the table.
I I bring that in real life, youknow.
(30:11):
This isn't just from somereading I did, this was my life,
and so who better to do thattraining than someone who has
lived experience?
And so with TAT, I've I've beenable to just grow so much in my
(30:31):
presenting and in just so manyareas of my life.
And and and I do have to saythat Tat is amazing.
Everybody on staff has such afuel and a passion about human
trafficking and and how can weend this or how can we keep
(30:54):
people educated?
And I am just truly blessed.
This is actually my dream job.
Um it is my dream job, and Ican't think of a better
organization to work for.
I honestly can't.
SPEAKER_01 (31:11):
That's great.
Yeah, yeah, but that wouldprobably be my dream job too.
That'd be awesome.
Yeah, that's great.
Wow.
Um, yeah, Tat has done so manygreat things.
I can't thank him enough.
Really appreciate you guystaking the time to speak on our
on our show and bring thatawareness.
There's so many things that wecan do as a group.
(31:33):
I look at some of thejournalists that hop up with
trafficking documentaries, andsome of them were talking about
how people are being scammedfrom rehab facilities or just
trafficked for for businesspurposes, you know, to make a
profit.
I mean, it's it doesn't alwayshave to be sexually that people
(31:54):
are are being trafficked, andthey're they're trying to
they're claiming that it'scontinuing to rise, it's not
going away.
SPEAKER_00 (32:00):
No, it isn't.
SPEAKER_01 (32:01):
The sad part is I see all the efforts from Tat,
and then I and I see thesedocumentaries where the bad guys
are still making momentum.
I'm like, wow, it is wish itwould end, you know.
SPEAKER_00 (32:15):
Well, you know, there it's you're right in
saying that it isn't just sextrafficking, it's labor
trafficking as well.
In agriculture or inrestaurants, construction sites.
There is just such a plethora ofinformation that we continue to
learn about where labortrafficking is concerned.
(32:40):
And we have a couple of staffmembers that have worked really
hard on research, and they havedone an amazing job of putting
together some labor traffickingtraining and you know, just
things that I wouldn't havethought of.
(33:00):
And I think our our corporatevideo also gives a real life
scenario.
We have actors that we wentahead and hired to make this
video of they they show onescene of someone being sex
trafficked, and and one scene isof labor trafficking.
(33:22):
And it just give it just kind ofwakes you up to, oh yeah, I
didn't think about that.
Huh, maybe I have seen somethingand I just haven't said
anything.
So the creativity on our team,it is just amazing.
So yeah, Tat, we do so much tojust try to make sure that we
(33:48):
can cover as much as we possiblycan in the transportation
industry.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (33:55):
I mean, just thinking on the level you said
spiritually, I like myspirituality as well.
So the common denominator that Isee a lot of times is that greed
is fueling a lot of this.
SPEAKER_00 (34:08):
It is.
SPEAKER_01 (34:09):
You know, if you take away a person's purpose,
make them feel worthless, thenyou have an opportunity to
exploit that person.
And I'm not saying that that'sthe intention of every CEO
company or but we have to becareful that we're not creating
a more of a void when we hearthings like self-driving trucks,
(34:31):
uh, we hear about automation.
We may think it's exciting withthe technology and that the
change that can come about.
But what is the real purpose ofit?
Is it for greed?
Are we really making thingsbetter for humans?
Or are we creating a void wherehumans will feel worthless?
So I feel like bringingawareness to that.
(34:52):
Uh, me personally, I guess youknow, a lot of reasons why I
started this podcast to helppeople see that they can make it
in trucking, that they can havea career, they can take care of
their families.
They don't have to feel likethey're the scum of the earth,
that they have a purpose.
Like you said, truckers and busdrivers and professionals out
there bring awareness forhelping people that are victims.
But if we keep creating voids,it becomes like a whack-a-mo.
(35:17):
Um, we got to try to buildpeople up and make people feel
like they are worth somethingand that they have a chance to
make a life for themselves.
What would you say on a topiclike that spiritually?
SPEAKER_00 (35:30):
Spiritually, yes.
You know, it's hard when youfeel empty and you feel like you
don't have a purpose.
And and if you don't have peoplein your life that are telling
you that yes, you are worthy,yes, you do have a purpose, yes,
you know, there's nothing thatyou can't do.
(35:52):
And sadly, that's not happeninga lot in our society, and it is
about the greed, and that's whythere's traffickers, and you
know, as long as they're sogreedy, they don't care about
human beings that they'reselling.
(36:14):
I mean it's really, reallydifficult, and so on a spiritual
aspect, you know, we need tostart building people up.
We need to let people know thatwhat they do matters, yes, and
(36:35):
especially our youth, our youth,I think they really, really
struggle, and they need peoplein their lives that are there to
say, you know what, what is itthat you want to do?
Well, you can do whatever,whatever you you dream to do,
(36:57):
you can do it, you can strivetoward it, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (37:00):
Yes, if you don't eat you know, and if you don't
get to that goal, you become abetter person.
Uh, it's not a failure.
No, you're gonna grow along theway, and you may fall into
something that you never thoughtyou would fall into, and it
could be an actual a good thing.
Like, I didn't you know, Ididn't think I would be a a
podcaster, but here I am.
SPEAKER_00 (37:23):
Yeah, and you do such an amazing job, too.
SPEAKER_01 (37:27):
Oh, really?
Thank you.
Uh that's a huge complimentcoming from you.
Thank you so much.
Uh, and then also, too, readingyour book.
Yeah, it's it's a good way forme to rework my mind as a man,
as a father, the responsibilitythat we have, you know,
masculinity can sometimes lookbad in the wrong hands.
(37:50):
A lot of men, you know, I don'tI can't speak for every man, but
masculinity isn't taught.
There's no school course of howto be a man and to do things in
a way that helps society versusbeing destructive.
It's not saying that beingmasculine is bad, neither is
(38:10):
being feminine bad, you know,but what do we do with those
things?
You know, how do we as a personuse that to be a force for good?
And you know, some of these guysare learning things and they're
talking amongst each other.
Is it gonna be something that'sgonna promote something healthy
and good?
We have to really soul search.
And reading your book and thingslike that, you can really soul
(38:34):
search yourself and look atwhat's going on inside of me
here.
Am I being used like a pawn oram I being making decisions that
we're gonna help society, help,help women, help men, young ones
to be successful?
And that's kind of where I wantto be when it's all said and
done.
So yeah, thank you for gettingthat out there.
(38:56):
Six years of hard work, and uhit's in my hands now.
So what do we do with it?
Thank you.
I hope more people get to readyour book, to hear your message.
I think you are a force forgood.
Uh hearing about it, I'm veryproud that you have done what
you've done with your life,turning things around.
You may have already been in thein the right direction.
Just people kept trying to deteryou, kept trying to pull you
(39:19):
away from where you probablywere gonna end up here anyway.
So, because you're a fighter.
SPEAKER_00 (39:23):
Yes, uh, I'm definitely a fighter, and you
know, I am grateful, especiallyto the TAT team.
I do have to say, they've alsohelped me grow over the last few
years, and it has been amazing.
(39:44):
It's been an amazing journey.
I've learned so much aboutmyself and what my strengths
are, what my weaknesses are,what what am I good at?
What am I not good at?
And I think if more people learnthat, you know, okay, so where
are my strengths?
You know, what am I not sostrong in?
Do I want to get stronger inthat to gain to gain more?
(40:09):
Or do I want to work on what I'malready strong at?
You know, whatever, you know,what I'm good at.
Now, what is the gift that Ihave that I can give to others?
And If we think about that, itjust changes our thinking, it
(40:31):
changes our behaviors, it itstrengthens us even more.
You know, I it sadly so manypeople that I see that are um in
the workforce that don't liketheir job.
Yeah, and they're miserable.
(40:52):
And so, okay, I understand youneed to feed your family, you
need to do this, you need to dothat.
Well, let's see what you'restrong in.
And there's not a lot ofemployers that encourage that
though, either.
And that is the one thing that Ican say with my time at Tat,
(41:15):
they do help with my strengths,all of us together, and it is
like a family, and that's why wefeel so strongly the way that we
feel about the differentindustries, especially.
I mean, our hearts are reallyespecially for the truckers
(41:36):
because you are where westarted, and you know, I don't
think I mean y'all just y'allare special to us.
SPEAKER_01 (41:49):
All right, thank you.
I'll take that, and uh it's gotuh and it'll fuel me.
It'll fuel me.
You know, you go to the the thefuel island at the truck stop
and things like that, but wehave to fill up our hearts, we
have to fill up our minds withpositive things to keep going.
So thank you.
(42:09):
And I hope other truckers feelthe same way, and other
professionals uh know that Tat'son their side of being a force
for good.
So, I mean, what misconceptionsof people outside of the space
often believe about survivors?
How can you help educate folksto see beyond the misconception?
What would you say from one ofthe questions here at the end?
SPEAKER_00 (42:33):
We need a lot of care.
When someone is coming out ofthat life, you have to
understand what their mentalhealth is like.
And if if there aren't peoplethat can care enough for
(43:13):
survivors, they can fall backinto it because that's what
they're comfortable with.
And I know that happened withme.
I mean, I was trafficked bythree different traffickers, and
you know, but looking back now,I never had the healing process
that I needed.
SPEAKER_01 (43:33):
What would you say to a person that you want to
help them, but they don't wantto help, or that's how they
express it, and they don'taccept getting help.
SPEAKER_00 (43:46):
I I would say continue to try.
I mean, just be kind.
I mean, I tell people all thetime in trainings a kind word,
encouragement, small acts ofkindness, letting them see a
(44:09):
different side of what lifereally is.
Because how if if they've beentold for however long that
they're nothing, that they'regarbage, that being prostitute
is the only being prostitute isthe only thing that they're good
(44:30):
at.
They're not used to being, we'renot used to being treated like a
human being should be.
And so coming out of that kindof a situation, even though we
don't say help that we wanthelp, we don't even know we need
help.
(44:51):
We just think this is who weare.
This is this has been my lifefor this many years.
So how has that changed now andnobody cared then?
SPEAKER_01 (45:05):
Yeah, because yeah, I usually could be 10, 20 years,
yeah, before you can see that'sthat's usually what I kind of go
off of.
And when things dramaticallyhappen to us, it's kind of it
could be decades.
SPEAKER_00 (45:18):
I know for me, it took me many, many years to let
go of that shame and that guilt,still thinking that I was this
worthless piece of garbage,yeah.
And but until I had people whowho could tell me, hey, that's
(45:43):
not who you are.
SPEAKER_01 (45:44):
That reason why I mentioned the time frame is
because people think, oh, you'reout of that situation, all
right.
Let's let's move on with life,or I don't know.
It's just like like you want toyou can't really put a time
frame on it.
It's just if we could educatepeople that it does take a lot
of time, even though you don'tfeel like you have time because
(46:05):
life is just flying by, it itdoes takes a long time to heal.
SPEAKER_00 (46:11):
It does, and I don't and I'm gonna say this, but it
is a continuous journey thatnever ends.
We're always healing, there'salways gonna be triggers.
Many of us come out of oftrafficking with mental health
issues, complex PTSD.
(46:35):
Because if you think about it,just like someone who's been to
war and how they come home, Imean, just imagine with all the
torture, the beatings, therapes, the the way we're talked
(46:58):
to, the way we're treated.
I mean, if someone it this isthe best way that maybe I can
put this in perspective.
If anyone who's listening canthink of a person who's been
raped maybe one time, and howlong did that recovery take?
SPEAKER_01 (47:21):
Yeah, it's a lifetime.
SPEAKER_00 (47:24):
And then think about someone who has been prostituted
over and over and over, soldpaid rate day after day after
day after day after day, monthafter month, year after year.
(47:49):
So how would how long do youthink it should be for someone
to heal?
SPEAKER_01 (47:59):
Thanks for sharing that.
That's um it's not gonna getfixed that quick.
It's no, you gotta getcomfortable, and it's gonna take
time.
There may be setbacks.
There's gonna be a lot that thatperson has to go through, and we
have to be in for the long haul.
Well, well, like a trucker.
(48:19):
Trying to make a joke enlightenthe mood, yeah.
Yeah, thank you for pouring yourheart out.
That's so sweet that you canhelp people, and I hope that
they're listening and know thatthere is help out there, and it
can start the recovery process.
Yeah, start start turning itaround.
It does yeah, we want everyoneto be free from it, and we hope
(48:44):
that that day is sooner ratherthan later.
And like I said, we hope we canbring awareness to individuals
that are you know, we thinkabout the money, the money, the
money.
Uh, all money ain't good money,and really think about what your
purpose is as to why you'redoing what you're doing out
there because humans areinvolved.
And uh, if we can get this AIand all this automation to help
(49:04):
people be successful, to helppeople feel like yes, look what
I can do.
Man, this is amazing.
I mean, or how do they know thatthis would be where we're at
today?
Where podcasting is so huge.
I mean, when I was a little kid,I wanted to be on the radio and
be a radio voice, a personalitylike a DJ and things like that.
I thought that was so cool.
And now I got that gift given tome.
(49:25):
I mean, having to podcast isit's free.
Now all the other stuff thatgoes with it, the microphones
and everything.
But but that that channel ofcommunication from the FCC is
that's huge that we're able touse that.
So now I I can feel like youknow, I have purpose.
So and you do have that's mystory, yeah.
(49:46):
That's my story.
I think other people, if we canuse technology in that way for
that good, I think uh we'll havemore successful humans versus
people saying, Oh man, nobodywants to work.
Right, yeah, that's not helping.
So thank you.
SPEAKER_00 (50:03):
Thank you so much for thank you for having me on.
I really appreciate it, and Ijust want to say one thing to
everyone out there.
Okay, I know that not only Ray,but everyone that's listening to
this podcast is a change maker.
So, what I would say is go outthere and be the change that you
(50:29):
want to see.
SPEAKER_01 (50:30):
Nice.
I like that.
Very nice.
You say the best for last, huh?
SPEAKER_02 (50:36):
Of course.
SPEAKER_01 (50:37):
There you go.
All right.
Well, Kelly, thank you so muchfor joining us and breaking not
just your expertise but yourheart.
And uh yeah, this conversationreminds us whether you drive 25
miles or 2500 miles, every setof eyes that you have out there
and the ears that are out there,it matters.
We can help folks, and folks arefolks are listening.
(50:59):
So if you want to learn moreabout how to get trained and how
to support TATS mission, or evento share this message wherever
you're at, you can go totruckersaginstrafficking.org.
And that's a great group ofindividuals like Kelly.
Uh, the industry uh needs morepeople to get involved and to
have that power to save livesand now be a part of you know of
(51:22):
what happens with TATS movingforward.
You know, I'm sure there's moreto come and Tats not stopping.
SPEAKER_00 (51:27):
No, we're not.
SPEAKER_01 (51:28):
Yeah, so yeah, keep those wheels turning and uh keep
those minds open.
And as always, that'sdelivering.
Welcome back to Das Delivered, a truck show that
helps many people, uh, not justwith trucks, but also many other
areas in life as well.
I'm your host, Trucking Ray, andtoday we're going to uh dive
into deep something powerful,personal, and that we're talking
with someone whose life story isboth humble and inspiring for
everyone.
And this is a moment wheretrucking meets purpose well
(00:20):
beyond freight and logistics.
I've been looking forward tothis conversation, and it's
real, raw, and it has somethingthat you will remember outside
of the road and counts in manyways, most of us can't even
imagine.
So, my guest today is KellyMarshall.
Uh, she's with Truckers AgainstTrafficking, and uh, she is a
survivor herself, and we can'twait to hear her story.
(00:46):
Kelly, it's so nice to have youon the show.
How are you?
SPEAKER_02 (00:50):
It's good to be here.
SPEAKER_01 (00:51):
Very nice.
So happy to have you here totell your story.
I mean, being a survivor ofhuman trafficking yourself, and
also taking the time to giveback and as a training
specialist and survivor leaderwith Truckers Against
Trafficking TAP for short.
Your story is one of survival,resilience, and uh
transformation.
Uh, it directly powers themission that you're dedicated
(01:13):
to.
So tell us about yourself andhow you got started on this
journey of sharing your story.
SPEAKER_00 (01:19):
Well, I am I'm originally from Miami, now in
Memphis, Tennessee.
And when I originally wrote mybook, I was starting to speak
out on this because that hasbeen a really big part of my
healing process.
Being able to share and toeducate, letting people know
(01:42):
that this is a real thing.
This, you know, this isn'tsomething that's happening in a
third world country, it's not,it's right here in our
backyards.
And it's important for people tounderstand what a victim goes
through.
And so with the love and thesupport of so many of my
(02:03):
friends, my family, people withtat, I love tat.
So it's just become my lifemission.
And because if if I can't share,then how is anybody gonna know
what to look for?
SPEAKER_02 (02:22):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (02:23):
And how does anybody know that you know there's
victims out there, they need toknow that there's hope, that
there is hope in coming out ofthat life into having such a
beautiful life?
SPEAKER_01 (02:36):
Yeah, yeah.
As a survivor yourself, yourperspective is is huge.
I mean, you think about when youlook back at the conditions in
your life before trafficking wasa topic, what were some of the
key things that made you atarget, not just emotionally,
but practically?
Can you share that with us?
SPEAKER_00 (02:55):
Well, growing up, my dad was extremely abusive.
And so I had very lowself-esteem.
He was physically abusive,emotionally abusive, mentally
abusive, and then eventually hewas sexually abusive.
And so it wasn't it wasn't mystraight A's that made him
(03:18):
happy.
It wasn't the fact that I cookedand cleaned every day that made
him happy.
It was only when he was sexuallyabusing me that he was happy
with me.
And so I equated sex with love.
And and so that was kind of mypattern.
And I craved that love andattention so much that I was
(03:42):
just this easy target fortraffickers.
Because at the time when I gotgroomed, when I was groomed by a
trafficker, I was a single mom.
I had no income or little incomecoming in, I had just lost my
apartment and you know, I wastrying to get jobs here or
(04:06):
there.
And due to the lack ofself-esteem and the massive
trauma that I had alreadyendured with my dad, I was
pretty, I was a pretty easytarget.
So when he walked by me and hecalled me beautiful, I was like,
whoa, somebody actually calledme beautiful.
(04:27):
Okay, and so that is how thatstarted, you know, and for a few
weeks we hung out and then we,you know, he wanted to know all
about me.
He know he wanted to knoweverything about me, and nobody
ever cared about me.
I was invisible, and so with himshowing me that much attention,
(04:53):
I just fell in hook, line, andsinker.
And and once he told me what hewas, I was like, no, I don't
want to do that.
It doesn't even sound, you know,that's not and he's like, Well,
you give it away for free, soyou might as well get paid for
it.
And because he had been helpingme with my rent, because he had
(05:15):
been helping with my daughter'sbasic needs, he had said to me,
he said, Well, what kind ofmother would you be if you can't
even take care of yourdaughter's basic needs?
And at that point, I knew I hadI couldn't go to my family.
I had nowhere else to go, and Ifelt like I owed him.
(05:36):
And so that is how thingsstarted.
SPEAKER_01 (05:39):
Yeah.
Wow.
Yeah, many people aren't awareof those tactics that are used,
and they think that you know,and someone's just being nice
and it went too far.
But the thoughts of thatindividual was well before you
guys met that their intentionswere to find someone that would
fit into that mole.
That's what it seems like to me.
SPEAKER_00 (06:00):
It is, that's exactly.
Traffickers are very smart, theyknow what to look for, they know
the vulnerabilities that they'reseeking.
It's not just this snatch andgrab.
They take the time to get toknow a person, get that person,
you know, figure out what theirvulnerabilities are, and they
(06:24):
play off of those.
They exploit thosevulnerabilities.
And it can be something assomeone just is looking for
love, someone who's looking toget out of poverty, somebody who
needs a mom figure, a dadfigure, because you know, not
just males are traffickers,traffickers can be anybody, and
(06:47):
I and I don't think peoplerealize that.
SPEAKER_01 (06:51):
What what are some other individuals that you would
warn people about or bring bringattention to?
Who would you say that are thesetype of people?
I mean, I think of theentertainment industry when
you're talking and think aboutsome of these documentaries you
watch on TV.
I feel like that could be at ahigher level, but hey man, the
the things that Diddy, SeanCombs, you know, here's a person
(07:14):
that's supposed to be respected,and then you hear the remarks
from the jurors saying that, oh,that must have been just a love
relationship.
I'm like, I think it was uh wellbefore those individuals met
that some of that was beingdone.
And I think about even like withtrucking, down to that level and
(07:35):
an occupational level, you know,you get these people that need
help, and then they're offeredan opportunity, and and to get
them to get it taken away, uhthey're exploited with their
going out there doing thingsthat you're violating the hours
of service, doing all thesethings for to make a profit for
the company.
And then there's dangerousroadways, you know.
(07:57):
You know, people out therecausing accidents that probably
shouldn't be driving.
So even on an occupationallevel, entertainment level, who
would you bring highlights to?
Those are my two that I I see ona day-to-day basis trucking.
SPEAKER_00 (08:10):
I think for me, I would put it on an even deeper
level.
Think about our youth, thosethat are in the foster care
system, they're an easy target.
People that come from abusivehouseholds, you know, people
that are just down on theirluck.
(08:31):
Anybody can become a traffickingvictim given the right
circumstances.
Well, or bad circumstances, butthere are so many different
ways.
I mean, even those who arementally challenged, you know,
this person comes in their life,they become their friend.
And next thing you know, theyare being trafficked.
(08:56):
So, you know, yes, we can lookat the high level, but most of
it is well, I can't say most ofit, but a lot of it is going to
be at a normal level, someone inpoverty, someone with low
self-esteem, someone who hassome kind of vulnerability.
(09:18):
And I think Tat does a wonderfuljob of highlighting the red
flags, highlighting thesevulnerabilities in all of our
trainings, and you know, beingable to recognize the signs of
someone who is being trafficked.
SPEAKER_01 (09:37):
Right.
Well, you I got your book, and Ithink it's a great story, a
great read for many out there.
And it's titled Sh I've Got aSecret.
And I found it on Amazon.
I'll put the link on there.
Uh, I think you tell a greatstory on there as well.
It was a real sad moment when Iread about how you said uh I
(09:58):
think your mom attempted to jumpoff a high, was it a dresser?
Yes, because she didn't want tocarry through with the
pregnancy, or at least that'swhat he told you.
Um yeah, tell us about that alittle bit.
SPEAKER_00 (10:12):
Like I said, my dad was very controlling, he was
abusive, and that was why my momleft him.
But you know, I I look back nowat hearing that again of you
know, my mom trying to get ridof me, but I know how much my
mom loved me.
(10:34):
So I don't know if it wasbecause she didn't want to bring
a child into the world knowingwho the dad was, knowing how
horrible he was, or I I don'tknow.
I I honestly don't know becauseI never heard it from my own.
SPEAKER_01 (10:54):
That's what I was wondering.
SPEAKER_00 (10:55):
I never wanted to bring it up because I didn't
want to hurt her feelings, okay,yeah, and so I never did, right?
SPEAKER_01 (11:04):
Yeah, yeah, that uh yeah, just to tell your your
daughter a story like that initself is that's just
mind-boggling to figure out howto you what what was your
purpose of doing that, you know.
So, but again, it's probably forcontrol, and that's what a lot
of these individuals like thatare out there.
(11:25):
I think they love having controlover another human, yes, like a
like a god complex, and that'ssomething that they don't have
any right to.
SPEAKER_00 (11:34):
No, and I agree, I agree with that, and you know,
if you think about it,trafficking is a business.
We have the supplier, theproduct, and the demand.
And so the trafficker,obviously, he provides the
(11:55):
product, which is the victim,and then we have the demand,
which are the people that arepurchasing.
And you know, to anyone thatthat would listen to this, if
you are purchasing commercialsex, keep in mind that person
doesn't want to be there, nomatter how they're acting in
(12:15):
front of you, no matter howthey're like, oh baby, yes, this
and that.
That is not the case.
And if we really want to getdeeper into it, you're paying to
rape somebody.
And that is the bottom line.
It is paid rape.
And if we didn't have thedemand, we wouldn't have
(12:39):
trafficking, but there's such ahigh demand for it, and and you
would be surprised, some of thebuyers are worse than the
traffickers, they feel likethey've paid money, they've
purchased this person forwhatever amount of time, and
they can do what they want, theycan treat them the way they
(13:01):
want.
So, you know, you we're thinkingabout all sides here.
unknown (13:08):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (13:08):
And you know, what would you say to politicians
that say they should legalizeit, prostitution and things like
that?
What are your thoughts when youhear things like that?
SPEAKER_00 (13:19):
Personally, I think it's a big mistake because then
there's going to be more andmore trafficking because it is
made, if it is made legal, therewould be more, and then there
would be no consequences for thetrafficker or the buyer.
And then they would continue toarrest the prostituted person,
(13:44):
and so and everybody else getsaway with what they're doing,
and so that is a really big uhthing personally for me.
Is why would you want tolegalize this?
SPEAKER_01 (13:59):
Yeah, they they claim that the demand will go
down because they're creating amarketplace, it's the same
mentality with drugs.
Uh, if it was legalized, theyfeel like then it won't be much
of a demand.
And you know, they're so wrong.
That's even hard to repeat it.
(14:19):
Yeah, that is yeah, that's whatthey're saying.
That's uh that is the messagethat they're putting out there
for people to hear.
And you being a survivor, Ithink you have every right to
speak on it.
Let your voice be heard whenthings like that are coming up.
So appreciate you telling uswhat you thought.
What you think.
SPEAKER_00 (14:37):
Yeah, I think it would just exasperbate,
exasperbate it even more.
So this would not be a goodthing, this would not bring the
demand down.
I think it would actually causemore demand and more
trafficking, and then morevictims and no help for the
victims.
SPEAKER_01 (14:58):
So looking back, so often survivors talk about
looking back, hindsight.
That's a question that manypeople in your audience may
think about what did you not seeat the time that you wish
someone had told you?
Something that wasn't asobviously right in front of you,
but it truly matters.
What would you say?
SPEAKER_00 (15:20):
Are you talking about during my time?
SPEAKER_01 (15:23):
I guess it's yeah, you know, the 2020 hindsight
that people always say, if Ijust at new, or if I had an
idea, or if someone had helpedme, and I was thinking maybe you
could speak on that so thatpeople can say, hey, you know,
yeah, now I now I can see sinceI listened to this podcast and
hearing that from Kelly, thatmaybe I'm aware now, you know,
(15:44):
it helps helps me to not besusceptible to the trap.
What would you say?
SPEAKER_00 (15:52):
I think one of the biggest things that I would say
is for those that have beenmaybe brought up in abusive
situations, especially as a kid,it wasn't your fault.
You are still worthy.
(16:12):
You are more than anyone hassaid you are.
Because I find a lot of it is alack of self-esteem and a lack
of self-love.
If I had been able to lovemyself and know that what my dad
did wasn't my fault, maybethings would have been
(16:37):
different.
Maybe if my school bus drivercould have seen the bruises and
the different demeanor and howmy personality had changed and
they knew about humantrafficking, maybe I wouldn't
have gone down this road.
Maybe if while I was at school,my teachers would have noticed,
(17:02):
you know, something was verywrong.
But I think for myself, if I ifif somebody would have been able
to say, you are special, you areworthy, what your dad did to you
is wrong, and it's not yourfault.
And so I think for me, thatwould be my biggest thing is
(17:29):
reassuring my younger self thatyou know what, it wasn't my
fault, it was just he wasbrought up in a sick way, and so
yeah, he didn't know how to be adad.
SPEAKER_01 (17:42):
Yeah, I was reading about the let's see, he was
putting a lot of what was it,orphanages, orphanages, and yes,
they do, yeah.
So it was the incidents where hewas sexually abused, yes.
So you know, when I'm out thereand I'm driving truck, I'm
thinking about getting home,thinking about being safe,
(18:05):
thinking about yeah, I mean, I'mthinking about myself and my
family, and there are thosemoments where I have to stop and
think about where I'm atpresently and realize that I
have a moral obligation to be aguardian of the road or
wherever.
I know I think I was at a truckstop and I saw a young lady
(18:27):
crying.
And first thing you want to sayis that's none of my business,
or you know, like what's goingon.
But afterwards, you know, thethe clerk and and all, you know,
we could we all made eyecontact, and but yeah, they
called the police and because itwas obvious that they were
arguing, the couple, she waswith another man, you know, he
(18:48):
was invisible.
You know, I could see hercrying, but I didn't who was she
with, you know.
I don't know.
It was my mind just isn't thatin that gear of yeah, I don't
know what the situation is.
But when I stopped thinkingabout me and I stopped shopping
because I was in there as an asa newer store, and I was excited
about the new truck stop andeverything, right?
(19:08):
But when I took a moment torealize what was going on around
me, I was able to be more awareof my situation and to be able
to help be there for anindividual I had no clue about.
I never met the person.
So the more I practice that andexercise that, like you
mentioned, the bus driver, themore we try to bring it to
(19:29):
attention, not for others, butalso for ourselves mentally, we
can be an effective tool to helpthose individuals in their time
of need and feel like we aremaking a difference versus
saying, Oh, I'm I'm botheringsomeone, you know.
So yeah, you're right.
If someone would have done morethat would, even it's just a
(19:51):
little bit, you know, just youknow, the question what's going
on here?
You know, that starts theconversation versus just going.
About your own well selfishneeds, you know, even if they
are just trying to get home, yougotta stop thinking about just
yourself, you know.
So, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (20:10):
Well, I I feel like truckers have this unique
ability to be able to helpbecause truckers are the eyes
and the ears of the road.
Y'all see things that we don'tnotice, we don't see, and you're
at these truck stops, you are onthe road, and you you can see
(20:34):
above everything else,everything that's going on.
And you know, with the TATtraining, being able to be more
vigilant on what to look for,and taking that time, and so
many truckers I'm so gratefulfor because y'all have taken the
(20:55):
time, you know, after taking thetraining, the TAT training, you
learned about human trafficking,you learned about the size, the
signs, and made that call.
Yeah, and I think one of thebiggest things is people are
afraid.
Well, what if this isn't what Ithink it is?
(21:17):
What if I'm wrong?
Well, I think law enforcement,and I've I've talked to many,
many law enforcement, done lawenforcement trainings, and they
would rather you be wrong thannot make the call because you
never know whose life you'regonna save.
And you know, I say this a lot.
(21:39):
Instead of judging those thatare being prostituted, ask how
they got, ask yourself, how didthey get there?
I mean, nobody wakes up andsays, Wow, it's my life's dream
to sell my body for someone elseto make money, you know what I
mean?
And so, you know, there's somuch judgment there, but just
(22:04):
take that time to ask yourself,hmm, I wonder how she got here
and make that call.
You know, I wouldn't say goapproach the trafficker, please
don't do that.
That's dangerous.
But you can you can get as muchinformation about the people
(22:24):
that you're seeing.
You may be seeing thetrafficker, you may be seeing
his vehicle, get the licenseplate, you know, get as much
information as you can and makethat call.
And even if you're wrong, youstill did something instead of
not doing anything at all.
And I think as a society, wetend to bury our heads in the
(22:49):
sand because we don't want todeal with something hard.
SPEAKER_01 (23:18):
Nice, yeah, yeah, absolutely.
Very good words to speak there.
I mean, think about your youryour life and how you've got to
where you are in your healingprocess.
Did you ever reach a momentwhere you thought this is not
where my life ends?
What what changed that for youas a person, the moment, or
(23:40):
well, was there some insightthat you have so you can share?
SPEAKER_00 (23:45):
It took me, well, first of all, it took me a
really long time.
I lived with the shame and guiltof that lifestyle that I thought
I chose until I found out that Iwas a victim.
And from then, you know, I mean,I had already been clean off of
(24:07):
drugs, and then, you know, justfor me, for my healing process,
it has been a spiritual process.
You know, my relationship withGod has been so crucial to my
healing, and I mean, he has putsuch amazing people in my life
(24:30):
to help me grow and to buildthis life that I have now.
It took me six years to writethat book, by the way.
SPEAKER_01 (24:41):
Really?
Congratulations.
SPEAKER_00 (24:43):
It was hard, it was hard.
SPEAKER_01 (24:47):
It's something about writing down your memories and
knowing that there's someone outthere that may not read it the
way you want them to read it, orthey just don't understand.
I mean, so many ways it can gowhen someone has those words and
they're looking at it.
And I mean, you you put yourselfout there, you're vulnerable to
do that, and I applaud that.
That's awesome.
SPEAKER_00 (25:08):
Thank you.
But it it did help a lot in myhealing journey because I was
able to see as I was writing,like Kelly, what were you
thinking?
SPEAKER_01 (25:19):
Is there a story behind the cover too?
SPEAKER_00 (25:23):
Yes, I like it.
There is because that the sidewith the bruising and the tears
is who I used to be, and theother side is who I am now.
And see, because I kept thatpart of my life a secret for so
many years, that's why it'scalled I've got a secret.
SPEAKER_01 (25:47):
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (25:49):
And so, you know, it was letting it go, it was
releasing it, it was okay, I'mgonna put it out there.
But you know, I'm sure you'veseen already, it's more than
just my story.
In the back of the book, thereare pages where if someone has
(26:12):
been through any type of trauma,there it's it's biblically
based.
It is a curriculum that Icreated and it's meant for
people to heal.
And so that's why I made it thatway, because I didn't want it to
be just another survivor book.
(26:33):
I wanted it to have, I I want,you know, people want to know,
okay, I've been through this,I've been through this.
Okay, how did you heal?
What was your process?
And so that was the biggest pushfor my book.
SPEAKER_01 (26:51):
Who did you have help or you did it all by
yourself?
SPEAKER_00 (26:55):
Um did most of it by myself.
I did have some help withediting and things like that,
but as far as the creating ofthe curriculum, I did that.
SPEAKER_01 (27:05):
That's awesome.
Yeah, yeah, because thecurriculum part, yeah, I did see
that in the workbook, kind oflike a workshop that you can
make notes like a journal.
I think that's great for peopleto exercise their mind in a
healthy way by writing somethingdown.
You can refer back to it.
I mean, journaling in itself,that just alone can help
(27:26):
healing.
So adding that to the book is isamazing.
SPEAKER_00 (27:29):
Oh, yeah, that that is definitely true.
Doing a lot of writing and likeget those thoughts out, you
know, do what you need to do,you know, to heal, because that
is what's gonna break thiscycle.
And for some people, traffickingis a generational thing, and
(27:55):
then we have families, thefamilial trafficking, where
families are trafficking theirown kids, and so you know, we
have to think about all thesethings, and these kids are going
to school every day, and and Ithink Tat does a wonderful job
(28:16):
of I think we do an amazing jobat getting these materials out
for the trucking industry, forthe school transportation, motor
coach.
I mean, there's just we have aplethora of information and we
give it out for free, you know.
SPEAKER_01 (28:35):
Yeah, a lot of great people there to get that energy,
to get that vibe to continue asto be a force for good.
Let's tell us about that.
Being a survivor leadership,you're helping shape how TAT
trains others.
How does your role influence theway a training is structured,
especially now that TAT's reacha national and includes more
(28:56):
industries, not just trucking?
How does your role and yourexperience help TAT?
SPEAKER_00 (29:03):
So, what I do is as a training specialist, now I do
have to say Tat already had thatamazing training before me.
So, but my role is importantbecause when I go around the
country and I train lawenforcement or we do coalition
(29:24):
builds, I'm coming from thesurvivor's perspective, but not
uh it's not just telling mystory, it is a training because
I also include, you know, redflags to look for, you know, I
share some of my story.
Okay, what red flag indicatorsdid you hear?
(29:48):
And training points.
It's important for people inwhatever industry they're in or
government agency to know sometraining points, some red flag
indicators, and that is what Ibring to the table.
I I bring that in real life, youknow.
(30:11):
This isn't just from somereading I did, this was my life,
and so who better to do thattraining than someone who has
lived experience?
And so with TAT, I've I've beenable to just grow so much in my
(30:31):
presenting and in just so manyareas of my life.
And and and I do have to saythat Tat is amazing.
Everybody on staff has such afuel and a passion about human
trafficking and and how can weend this or how can we keep
(30:54):
people educated?
And I am just truly blessed.
This is actually my dream job.
Um it is my dream job, and Ican't think of a better
organization to work for.
I honestly can't.
SPEAKER_01 (31:11):
That's great.
Yeah, yeah, but that wouldprobably be my dream job too.
That'd be awesome.
Yeah, that's great.
Wow.
Um, yeah, Tat has done so manygreat things.
I can't thank him enough.
Really appreciate you guystaking the time to speak on our
on our show and bring thatawareness.
There's so many things that wecan do as a group.
(31:33):
I look at some of thejournalists that hop up with
trafficking documentaries, andsome of them were talking about
how people are being scammedfrom rehab facilities or just
trafficked for for businesspurposes, you know, to make a
profit.
I mean, it's it doesn't alwayshave to be sexually that people
(31:54):
are are being trafficked, andthey're they're trying to
they're claiming that it'scontinuing to rise, it's not
going away.
SPEAKER_00 (32:00):
No, it isn't.
SPEAKER_01 (32:01):
The sad part is I see all the efforts from Tat,
and then I and I see thesedocumentaries where the bad guys
are still making momentum.
I'm like, wow, it is wish itwould end, you know.
SPEAKER_00 (32:15):
Well, you know, there it's you're right in
saying that it isn't just sextrafficking, it's labor
trafficking as well.
In agriculture or inrestaurants, construction sites.
There is just such a plethora ofinformation that we continue to
learn about where labortrafficking is concerned.
(32:40):
And we have a couple of staffmembers that have worked really
hard on research, and they havedone an amazing job of putting
together some labor traffickingtraining and you know, just
things that I wouldn't havethought of.
(33:00):
And I think our our corporatevideo also gives a real life
scenario.
We have actors that we wentahead and hired to make this
video of they they show onescene of someone being sex
trafficked, and and one scene isof labor trafficking.
(33:22):
And it just give it just kind ofwakes you up to, oh yeah, I
didn't think about that.
Huh, maybe I have seen somethingand I just haven't said
anything.
So the creativity on our team,it is just amazing.
So yeah, Tat, we do so much tojust try to make sure that we
(33:48):
can cover as much as we possiblycan in the transportation
industry.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (33:55):
I mean, just thinking on the level you said
spiritually, I like myspirituality as well.
So the common denominator that Isee a lot of times is that greed
is fueling a lot of this.
SPEAKER_00 (34:08):
It is.
SPEAKER_01 (34:09):
You know, if you take away a person's purpose,
make them feel worthless, thenyou have an opportunity to
exploit that person.
And I'm not saying that that'sthe intention of every CEO
company or but we have to becareful that we're not creating
a more of a void when we hearthings like self-driving trucks,
(34:31):
uh, we hear about automation.
We may think it's exciting withthe technology and that the
change that can come about.
But what is the real purpose ofit?
Is it for greed?
Are we really making thingsbetter for humans?
Or are we creating a void wherehumans will feel worthless?
So I feel like bringingawareness to that.
(34:52):
Uh, me personally, I guess youknow, a lot of reasons why I
started this podcast to helppeople see that they can make it
in trucking, that they can havea career, they can take care of
their families.
They don't have to feel likethey're the scum of the earth,
that they have a purpose.
Like you said, truckers and busdrivers and professionals out
there bring awareness forhelping people that are victims.
But if we keep creating voids,it becomes like a whack-a-mo.
(35:17):
Um, we got to try to buildpeople up and make people feel
like they are worth somethingand that they have a chance to
make a life for themselves.
What would you say on a topiclike that spiritually?
SPEAKER_00 (35:30):
Spiritually, yes.
You know, it's hard when youfeel empty and you feel like you
don't have a purpose.
And and if you don't have peoplein your life that are telling
you that yes, you are worthy,yes, you do have a purpose, yes,
you know, there's nothing thatyou can't do.
(35:52):
And sadly, that's not happeninga lot in our society, and it is
about the greed, and that's whythere's traffickers, and you
know, as long as they're sogreedy, they don't care about
human beings that they'reselling.
(36:14):
I mean it's really, reallydifficult, and so on a spiritual
aspect, you know, we need tostart building people up.
We need to let people know thatwhat they do matters, yes, and
(36:35):
especially our youth, our youth,I think they really, really
struggle, and they need peoplein their lives that are there to
say, you know what, what is itthat you want to do?
Well, you can do whatever,whatever you you dream to do,
(36:57):
you can do it, you can strivetoward it, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (37:00):
Yes, if you don't eat you know, and if you don't
get to that goal, you become abetter person.
Uh, it's not a failure.
No, you're gonna grow along theway, and you may fall into
something that you never thoughtyou would fall into, and it
could be an actual a good thing.
Like, I didn't you know, Ididn't think I would be a a
podcaster, but here I am.
SPEAKER_00 (37:23):
Yeah, and you do such an amazing job, too.
SPEAKER_01 (37:27):
Oh, really?
Thank you.
Uh that's a huge complimentcoming from you.
Thank you so much.
Uh, and then also, too, readingyour book.
Yeah, it's it's a good way forme to rework my mind as a man,
as a father, the responsibilitythat we have, you know,
masculinity can sometimes lookbad in the wrong hands.
(37:50):
A lot of men, you know, I don'tI can't speak for every man, but
masculinity isn't taught.
There's no school course of howto be a man and to do things in
a way that helps society versusbeing destructive.
It's not saying that beingmasculine is bad, neither is
(38:10):
being feminine bad, you know,but what do we do with those
things?
You know, how do we as a personuse that to be a force for good?
And you know, some of these guysare learning things and they're
talking amongst each other.
Is it gonna be something that'sgonna promote something healthy
and good?
We have to really soul search.
And reading your book and thingslike that, you can really soul
(38:34):
search yourself and look atwhat's going on inside of me
here.
Am I being used like a pawn oram I being making decisions that
we're gonna help society, help,help women, help men, young ones
to be successful?
And that's kind of where I wantto be when it's all said and
done.
So yeah, thank you for gettingthat out there.
(38:56):
Six years of hard work, and uhit's in my hands now.
So what do we do with it?
Thank you.
I hope more people get to readyour book, to hear your message.
I think you are a force forgood.
Uh hearing about it, I'm veryproud that you have done what
you've done with your life,turning things around.
You may have already been in thein the right direction.
Just people kept trying to deteryou, kept trying to pull you
(39:19):
away from where you probablywere gonna end up here anyway.
So, because you're a fighter.
SPEAKER_00 (39:23):
Yes, uh, I'm definitely a fighter, and you
know, I am grateful, especiallyto the TAT team.
I do have to say, they've alsohelped me grow over the last few
years, and it has been amazing.
(39:44):
It's been an amazing journey.
I've learned so much aboutmyself and what my strengths
are, what my weaknesses are,what what am I good at?
What am I not good at?
And I think if more people learnthat, you know, okay, so where
are my strengths?
You know, what am I not sostrong in?
Do I want to get stronger inthat to gain to gain more?
(40:09):
Or do I want to work on what I'malready strong at?
You know, whatever, you know,what I'm good at.
Now, what is the gift that Ihave that I can give to others?
And If we think about that, itjust changes our thinking, it
(40:31):
changes our behaviors, it itstrengthens us even more.
You know, I it sadly so manypeople that I see that are um in
the workforce that don't liketheir job.
Yeah, and they're miserable.
(40:52):
And so, okay, I understand youneed to feed your family, you
need to do this, you need to dothat.
Well, let's see what you'restrong in.
And there's not a lot ofemployers that encourage that
though, either.
And that is the one thing that Ican say with my time at Tat,
(41:15):
they do help with my strengths,all of us together, and it is
like a family, and that's why wefeel so strongly the way that we
feel about the differentindustries, especially.
I mean, our hearts are reallyespecially for the truckers
(41:36):
because you are where westarted, and you know, I don't
think I mean y'all just y'allare special to us.
SPEAKER_01 (41:49):
All right, thank you.
I'll take that, and uh it's gotuh and it'll fuel me.
It'll fuel me.
You know, you go to the the thefuel island at the truck stop
and things like that, but wehave to fill up our hearts, we
have to fill up our minds withpositive things to keep going.
So thank you.
(42:09):
And I hope other truckers feelthe same way, and other
professionals uh know that Tat'son their side of being a force
for good.
So, I mean, what misconceptionsof people outside of the space
often believe about survivors?
How can you help educate folksto see beyond the misconception?
What would you say from one ofthe questions here at the end?
SPEAKER_00 (42:33):
We need a lot of care.
When someone is coming out ofthat life, you have to
understand what their mentalhealth is like.
And if if there aren't peoplethat can care enough for
(43:13):
survivors, they can fall backinto it because that's what
they're comfortable with.
And I know that happened withme.
I mean, I was trafficked bythree different traffickers, and
you know, but looking back now,I never had the healing process
that I needed.
SPEAKER_01 (43:33):
What would you say to a person that you want to
help them, but they don't wantto help, or that's how they
express it, and they don'taccept getting help.
SPEAKER_00 (43:46):
I I would say continue to try.
I mean, just be kind.
I mean, I tell people all thetime in trainings a kind word,
encouragement, small acts ofkindness, letting them see a
(44:09):
different side of what lifereally is.
Because how if if they've beentold for however long that
they're nothing, that they'regarbage, that being prostitute
is the only being prostitute isthe only thing that they're good
(44:30):
at.
They're not used to being, we'renot used to being treated like a
human being should be.
And so coming out of that kindof a situation, even though we
don't say help that we wanthelp, we don't even know we need
help.
(44:51):
We just think this is who weare.
This is this has been my lifefor this many years.
So how has that changed now andnobody cared then?
SPEAKER_01 (45:05):
Yeah, because yeah, I usually could be 10, 20 years,
yeah, before you can see that'sthat's usually what I kind of go
off of.
And when things dramaticallyhappen to us, it's kind of it
could be decades.
SPEAKER_00 (45:18):
I know for me, it took me many, many years to let
go of that shame and that guilt,still thinking that I was this
worthless piece of garbage,yeah.
And but until I had people whowho could tell me, hey, that's
(45:43):
not who you are.
SPEAKER_01 (45:44):
That reason why I mentioned the time frame is
because people think, oh, you'reout of that situation, all
right.
Let's let's move on with life,or I don't know.
It's just like like you want toyou can't really put a time
frame on it.
It's just if we could educatepeople that it does take a lot
of time, even though you don'tfeel like you have time because
(46:05):
life is just flying by, it itdoes takes a long time to heal.
SPEAKER_00 (46:11):
It does, and I don't and I'm gonna say this, but it
is a continuous journey thatnever ends.
We're always healing, there'salways gonna be triggers.
Many of us come out of oftrafficking with mental health
issues, complex PTSD.
(46:35):
Because if you think about it,just like someone who's been to
war and how they come home, Imean, just imagine with all the
torture, the beatings, therapes, the the way we're talked
(46:58):
to, the way we're treated.
I mean, if someone it this isthe best way that maybe I can
put this in perspective.
If anyone who's listening canthink of a person who's been
raped maybe one time, and howlong did that recovery take?
SPEAKER_01 (47:21):
Yeah, it's a lifetime.
SPEAKER_00 (47:24):
And then think about someone who has been prostituted
over and over and over, soldpaid rate day after day after
day after day after day, monthafter month, year after year.
(47:49):
So how would how long do youthink it should be for someone
to heal?
SPEAKER_01 (47:59):
Thanks for sharing that.
That's um it's not gonna getfixed that quick.
It's no, you gotta getcomfortable, and it's gonna take
time.
There may be setbacks.
There's gonna be a lot that thatperson has to go through, and we
have to be in for the long haul.
Well, well, like a trucker.
(48:19):
Trying to make a joke enlightenthe mood, yeah.
Yeah, thank you for pouring yourheart out.
That's so sweet that you canhelp people, and I hope that
they're listening and know thatthere is help out there, and it
can start the recovery process.
Yeah, start start turning itaround.
It does yeah, we want everyoneto be free from it, and we hope
(48:44):
that that day is sooner ratherthan later.
And like I said, we hope we canbring awareness to individuals
that are you know, we thinkabout the money, the money, the
money.
Uh, all money ain't good money,and really think about what your
purpose is as to why you'redoing what you're doing out
there because humans areinvolved.
And uh, if we can get this AIand all this automation to help
(49:04):
people be successful, to helppeople feel like yes, look what
I can do.
Man, this is amazing.
I mean, or how do they know thatthis would be where we're at
today?
Where podcasting is so huge.
I mean, when I was a little kid,I wanted to be on the radio and
be a radio voice, a personalitylike a DJ and things like that.
I thought that was so cool.
And now I got that gift given tome.
(49:25):
I mean, having to podcast isit's free.
Now all the other stuff thatgoes with it, the microphones
and everything.
But but that that channel ofcommunication from the FCC is
that's huge that we're able touse that.
So now I I can feel like youknow, I have purpose.
So and you do have that's mystory, yeah.
(49:46):
That's my story.
I think other people, if we canuse technology in that way for
that good, I think uh we'll havemore successful humans versus
people saying, Oh man, nobodywants to work.
Right, yeah, that's not helping.
So thank you.
SPEAKER_00 (50:03):
Thank you so much for thank you for having me on.
I really appreciate it, and Ijust want to say one thing to
everyone out there.
Okay, I know that not only Ray,but everyone that's listening to
this podcast is a change maker.
So, what I would say is go outthere and be the change that you
(50:29):
want to see.
SPEAKER_01 (50:30):
Nice.
I like that.
Very nice.
You say the best for last, huh?
SPEAKER_02 (50:36):
Of course.
SPEAKER_01 (50:37):
There you go.
All right.
Well, Kelly, thank you so muchfor joining us and breaking not
just your expertise but yourheart.
And uh yeah, this conversationreminds us whether you drive 25
miles or 2500 miles, every setof eyes that you have out there
and the ears that are out there,it matters.
We can help folks, and folks arefolks are listening.
(50:59):
So if you want to learn moreabout how to get trained and how
to support TATS mission, or evento share this message wherever
you're at, you can go totruckersaginstrafficking.org.
And that's a great group ofindividuals like Kelly.
Uh, the industry uh needs morepeople to get involved and to
have that power to save livesand now be a part of you know of
(51:22):
what happens with TATS movingforward.
You know, I'm sure there's moreto come and Tats not stopping.
SPEAKER_00 (51:27):
No, we're not.
SPEAKER_01 (51:28):
Yeah, so yeah, keep those wheels turning and uh keep
those minds open.
And as always, that'sdelivering.
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