July 22, 2026 • 45 mins
Today, we are speaking with award-winning documentary filmmaker, writer, and storyteller Betsy Murphy.
Her documentaries have screened at international film festivals and appeared on Hulu, Showtime, and Amazon Prime. Her projects have also been featured in The New Yorker, The New York Times, The UK Sunday Times, The Huffington Post, The Washington Post, and Sports Illustrated.
Betsy is also the author of eight books, including Autobiography of an Orgasm, Grief Glimmers Grace, and Write On: A Daily Writing Practice for Anyone with a Story to Tell.
Join our new educational platform From the Heart THRIVE and get free classes on film funding: https://fromtheheartproductions.thrivecart.com/from-the-heart-thrive/
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SPEAKER_02 (01:15):
Stay with us to discover how filmmaker Betsy
Murphy turned an unimaginablepersonal loss into a global
documentary.
You will learn her bolddistribution plan designed to
bring her story directly toaudiences around the world.
SPEAKER_00 (01:36):
So glad you could join us on The Art of Film
Funding.
I'm your co-host, Claire Papan,along with writer and producer
Carol Dean.
As mentioned before, author ofthe best-selling book, The Art
of Film Funding, and presidentof From the Heart Productions.
From the Heart Productions hassupported independent filmmakers
(01:58):
for more than 30 years throughthe Roy W.
Dean Film Grant, fiscalsponsorship, education, and
resources designed to helpfilmmakers fund, produce, and
distribute meaningful films.
Today we're speaking withaward-winning documentary
filmmaker, writer, andstoryteller, Betsy Murphy.
(02:22):
Betsy's earlier films were madeunder the professional name
Betsy Blinkenbaker.
Since 2015, she's used the nameBetsy Murphy professionally.
And her documentaries havescreened at international film
festivals and appeared on Hulu,Showtime, and Amazon Prime.
(02:44):
Her projects have also featuredin The New Yorker, The New York
Times, The UK Sunday Times, TheHuffington Post, The Washington
Post, and Sports Illustrated.
Betsy is also the author ofeight books, including
Autobiography of an Orgasm,Grief Glimmers Grace, and Ride
(03:07):
On, a Daily Writing Practice forAnyone with a Story to Tell.
Her Substack platform, BeautifulInfinity Stories, with Betsy
Murphy, has been recognized as arising platform in literature,
and she continues to share herstories through her Beautiful
(03:27):
Infinity Stories YouTubechannel.
Her newest documentary, Bodiesof Water, is a global film with
an intimate emotional core.
It explores fate, grief,destiny, and transformation,
with the spirit of water servingas both a metaphor and a
(03:49):
messenger.
This conversation is especiallyvaluable for filmmakers because
Betsy is not only sharing howshe returned to filmmaking after
a profound personal loss.
She's also developing a modernrelease strategy that combines
YouTube, theatrical screenings,film festivals, social media,
(04:14):
audience outreach, and shortercompanion videos.
We will explore how filmmakerscan turn a deep personal
experience into a universalstory, recognizing
synchronicities duringproduction, build an audience
beyond traditional gatekeepers,and use today's platforms to
(04:37):
bring a finished film directlyto the people who need to see
it.
And Carol, I'm turning theinterview over to you now.
SPEAKER_02 (04:45):
Good, Claire.
Thank you very much.
Betsy, we're so pleased to haveyou with us.
SPEAKER_01 (04:51):
I'm so pleased to be here.
Thank you, Carol.
SPEAKER_02 (04:54):
Yes, I want to learn all about this process.
What uh courageous uh event foryou to take a major loss and
share it with all of us.
Now, I understand you leftfilmmaking in 2015 and you said
that you would never makeanother film.
So tell us what happened thatbrought you back to filmmaking,
(05:17):
and when did you realize thatthe story of your son Charlie
needed to become a film?
SPEAKER_01 (05:25):
Well, I um I've been a documentary filmmaker since
2000, and I released twodocumentaries, um, New York in
the 50s and something to cheerabout.
They both did very well, andwith the support of from from
the heart track from the heartproductions, and my third
documentary, um, Althea andAlthea and Angela, a perfect
(05:47):
match.
Um, I was so frustrated that Iwas not offered any deal, and
that there were suchgatekeepers.
Like this is such an importantstory about the first Jewish
woman and the first black womanto play together at Wimbledon
and break the barriers intennis.
And I, you know, it was abeautiful film, and I never got
a deal.
(06:08):
And I was so done withfilmmaking that I was, you know,
2015, I left.
And then in, and I, you know,turned that into a career as a
writer and helping other peopletell their stories, and I was
just fine with not making anymore films.
And then in uh 2000, July 2022,my youngest son Charlie died at
(06:33):
the age of 27 of afentanyl-related overdose.
It may have been intentional.
And in my grief, I took hisashes to the Ganges River just
because a few months before hedied, we had talked about going
to India together.
(06:54):
I'd taken him there when he waseight, and we had talked about
returning.
And instead, I found myself on aplane alone from California to
India with my son's ashes.
And all I knew was I wanted torelease them into the Ganges
River.
I didn't plan on making a film.
(07:15):
I just needed to do this formyself.
And I arrived and I knew Iwanted to take them to a really
remote area of the Ganges, notlike the clean area at the
beginning.
I wanted to go to the very endof the Ganges.
And I realized that this part ofthe river was the most polluted,
(07:38):
um, but it also held the mostprayers because if if the Ganges
River is, you know, 1,500 miles,you have millions of people
praying on it every day.
So it's filled with pollution,it's also filled with these
healing prayers.
And I've offered my son's ashesthrough a ceremony that was
(08:00):
created from synchronicities,which I'll share later.
And I realized at that moment,if the Ganges River in the most
polluted part is stillconsidered sacred, then my son
dying alone in a hotel room withdrugs in his body is still
sacred too.
And um, up until that point, Ihad only just heard that, you
(08:25):
know, your son's, I had onlyheard labels about him.
He's an addict, he's this orthat.
Um, I never heard what happenedto him, why was he reaching for
the drug?
Why was he in the room alone?
Um, who stopped taking hiscalls?
So I um came back and startedwriting these stories, and I
(08:48):
realized I wanted to tell it umas a film because you reach a
lot more people.
So that's how I got back intofilmmaking reluctantly.
SPEAKER_02 (08:59):
Well, but what an extraordinary subject.
So that's such a personalsubject, making the documentary
about the death of your son.
So, how where did you get thestrength to go into that
emotional territory and tell uswhat you hoped that the this
process of making bodies ofwater is going to reveal or
(09:23):
transform the benefits?
SPEAKER_01 (09:26):
Well, the um I made it to survive.
Like my grief was so heavy thatthis is, and I've experienced a
lot of death in my life from ayoung age, but to lose a son, as
you know, is devastating.
(09:47):
And I had to take it, it becameCharlie's death, became my
destiny.
And about two months beforeCharlie died, he sent a letter
to me and other family members.
It was a letter he wrote tohimself as a way to heal.
(10:09):
Um he wrote the words that heneeded to, you know, hear to
heal, sent this beautifulletter.
And um, and he also said to me,Mom, someday you're gonna tell
my story.
And I said, Charlie, you'regonna tell your story.
You're such a dynamic, charmingstoryteller, and you're you're
going to connect with so manypeople.
And he said, No, you're gonnatell my story.
(10:32):
And it just was his death becamemy destiny with telling the
story because I also peoplelooked away from Charlie's pain
in this, I was experiencing thesame way of like they were
looking away from my pain, mygrief.
People, we will do anything toavoid pain.
So I um and then I get to this,you know, to India and see this
(10:58):
river that has been um sopolluted, and in 2000 found out
in 2017, uh, the country, thegovernment had declared the
river as um sacred and having uhconsciousness.
So to harm the river would belike harming a human.
(11:19):
And um and India committed to umhelping you know restore the
river and helping it survive.
And I thought, well, if I wantto change the language around
how we and the conversationsaround how we show up for loved
ones who are struggling, becausein too many of our families we
(11:44):
look away from their pain.
Um, and just like a little kidis saying, watch me, watch me,
um, these the moments when ourour children of any age are
struggling, that's when we needto stop watch, listen, witness.
And India taught me that theycould do that with the river, so
I'm trying to change theconversation around.
(12:07):
My son wasn't an addict, he wassomeone in pain, and it was a
pain that needed to bewitnessed.
And I um saw that I could tellthe story on a bigger level
through using water as thestoryteller.
SPEAKER_02 (12:25):
Oh, how smart! Because the water is emotion,
right?
That is what it's all about.
It's all about emotion.
I know in one of ourconversations that I encourage
you to think of Charlie, yourson, as a co-producer.
So, what did that idea mean toyou, and how did your
(12:45):
relationship with Charliecontinue to influence the
creative and practical decisionsthat you made throughout your
production?
SPEAKER_01 (12:55):
That was such an important moment because I had
imagined the documentary asbeing full of interviews with um
uh, you know, Hindus in Indiawho um grew up swimming in the
river and grew up swimming withthe the pink dolphins swimming
(13:15):
in the river, which are now indanger.
They've disappeared because theriver is so polluted.
I've interviewed water experts,I've interviewed experts on um
how sound impacts water as a wayto understand like how prayer
can influence water.
So I was interviewing all theseexperts, and but the film it
(13:36):
just wasn't coming together.
And so I reached out to you andyou said, take Charlie on as
your co-producer, and thatchanged everything.
And I decided to pull all thoseum experts that I'd interview
out of the film and um and usethose as supplemental interviews
(13:58):
um to promote and market thefilm and so that we could have
more in-depth conversations too.
But um, and then with Charlie'sguidance, I really have ended up
telling the story that uh weneeded to tell to together.
And I'm I uh so I will neverforget that conversation with
(14:19):
you because it it switchedeverything.
SPEAKER_02 (14:22):
Oh, thank you.
Well, Betsy, when you go backand think about Imoto's frozen
water forms.
Remember, he froze water and helove on one and on one bottle,
he put I will kill you.
And the vision in the uh what inthe frozen water was a man with
(14:45):
a gun.
Amazing that water has a memoryand water responds to people, so
you've chosen the rightconnection.
So let's talk about creating aglobal production.
So, what part of Bodies of Waterwas created with a production
(15:06):
team in India, and how did thoserelationships come together?
Because you're working acrosscultures and geographic
distances and emotional andspiritual dimensions.
SPEAKER_01 (15:20):
Yeah.
All I can say is, you know, noneof it was planned, and but
everything came through askingand receiving.
Um I had previously shot umworked in India on two different
projects, you know, oh gosh, 15years ago, and I always took a
(15:42):
um, you know, my photographerUS-based crew there.
And this time I really wanted touse a um a local crew, and I
used the platform Fiverr.
I'd been using the platformFiverr for editing skills, and I
I have such good luck findinggreat people on Fiverr.
(16:03):
And um and so I found a young,you know, hot shop producer
named Um Um Mohammed Youssef onFiverr.
And he was building a studio,but at the time I didn't realize
he was building a productionstudio, but at the time, this is
you know five years ago.
(16:24):
Um uh but he was doing it out ofhis dorm room.
And um, but he was um so Iconnected with him to film the
first uh part of the we weregoing to Varanasi, which is the
holiest, um, you know,considered the holiest city in
India.
And but he and I had to trusteach other that he was, I was
(16:47):
sending him money and I had totrust that he was gonna show up
with a photographer.
He had to trust that, you know,I was gonna be there.
And we ended up building, youknow, a really strong
relationship in the last fiveyears, and um and there was a
bit of synchronicity too withthe filming, the end of the
(17:07):
film, which I'll share in aminute.
But um he I also ended up takingthe editing back to him.
I'm I'm used to sitting in anediting, you know, suite from 20
years ago with a big, you know,avid suite, and now you know we
can use editors that areanywhere.
And so he actually knows thisproduct project better than
(17:29):
anybody.
So he's, you know, I've usedthis crew um uh uh for the whole
film, and it's felt really good.
At one point when we weredriving six hours to film, you
know, the end of the film, thecar was filled, it was me, um,
two people that were Muslim andthey were uh it was Ramanam, so
they were fasting, two Hindus inthe car, only two people spoke
(17:52):
English, and they were all intheir 20s, which was my son's
age when he died.
And it just felt like Charliewas taking me on the most
amazing adventure.
And in the same way that peopleuh here, especially close, you
know, family members, couldn'tsee the gift of Charlie when he
(18:15):
was in pain.
Um this group just held on tothe gift of the story that was
trying to come through.
And I just love like the global,you know, the story turned
itself into this, you know,global story.
So um, and I'm very fortunatewith these young hotshot
(18:36):
filmmakers.
I'm the end of our film, itlooks like it was shot with a
big Hollywood production budget.
It's really incredible.
SPEAKER_02 (18:43):
Oh, I'm so happy to hear that.
Well, it all started withFiverr.
It can you spell that for us?
SPEAKER_01 (18:49):
Yeah, it's f-i-v-e-r-r dot com.
SPEAKER_02 (18:55):
Great.
SPEAKER_01 (18:56):
I'll share the link, uh, his link too.
He's fantastic.
SPEAKER_02 (19:00):
Okay, great.
So water as a metaphor and amessenger is what you're doing.
So, how did the water become theconnecting element?
SPEAKER_01 (19:10):
Yeah.
Well, as we said before, youknow, when you're talking about
Emoto's work, I um I wassurprised that there was more
compassion for, you know, thisbody of water that was in danger
of dying than my son in the lastmonths of his life when he
really needed attention fromfamily.
And all I heard was, uh, oh, wedon't want to be around him, or
(19:35):
he's this or that.
Like they were constantlysending negative information,
you know, to him and negativemessages.
And if our bodies, you know, are60, 70% water, then what is that
doing to somebody who's alreadystruggling?
So I really wanted to make thepoint of if you can't help
somebody that is in a lot ofpain or struggling with drugs
(19:58):
and alcohol, can we at leastsend, you know, positive healing
to them, not just say, oh, well,they're an addict or they're
this or that?
Um, because Charlie was so muchmore than that.
And and he was someone in painthat was really trying to um get
beyond the pain.
Um, so I there was no betterexample than this dying river
(20:22):
that's now coming back to lifeto tell the story.
SPEAKER_02 (20:27):
Oh my gosh.
So, what you're doing here ismaking the personal universal,
and um, that's very hard on yourown emotions.
How there has to be a delicatebalance between personal
expression and creatingsomething that connects with a
wider audience.
So, how did you protect theintimacy of your story while you
(20:50):
were making bodies of watermeaningful to people?
SPEAKER_01 (20:54):
Yeah, well, what it was people's connection to me
when and reaching out to mebecause I'm sharing uh this very
intimate personal story, and I'msharing details about his death
and what happened before andafter that people don't usually
share.
And I've heard from so manypeople that said, me too, that
(21:18):
happened to me too.
I've been um I've beenstruggling with this.
Thank you for sharing uh howyour writing is very healing.
Um I didn't want, I also wantedsomeone like Charlie, who I
think at the end of his life,you know, he had uh he died in a
(21:39):
hotel room, but his phone wasright by him.
And I know he was watching a lotof um movies and videos, and I
was just hope, I hope that thisvideo would be um bodies of
water would be something that ifsomebody is scrolling and in
pain, they stop and watch it andthey feel seen, they feel heard,
(22:00):
they they don't feel um, theymight be disconnected from loved
ones, but the message mightconnect them back to themselves
and and bring them back into astate of um where every cell in
their body is reflecting thatlove that they need to be sent
in this moment, not judgment,hate.
(22:23):
Um yeah, so I've just uh Ireally want to change the story
around how we're showing up forloved ones.
At the end of Charlie's life,you know, we were told as a
family, tough love, don't takehis calls, tough love, you know,
let him hit rock bottom.
Well, my son's rock bottom wasdeath.
SPEAKER_02 (22:41):
Oh my gosh.
Yes.
That's that's almost impossibleto deal with the emotions that
go on.
But how great for you to go backand recreate all this that he
was going through becausethere's so many people on drugs
now, this can be a great help tothem to understand they're not
(23:03):
alone.
And to see that Charlie died,they should recognize the fact
they've got to get help, I wouldthink.
SPEAKER_01 (23:11):
Yeah, absolutely.
And and also and feel witnessand seen.
Um and at the very least, youknow, um um send themselves some
love or uh if you can't show upfor that person, um, you know,
send them so that there is help.
And you ask about also water wasthe other way.
(23:32):
Like I I've I bathe, I go to hotsprings, I constantly, you know,
that's where I connect toCharlie.
SPEAKER_02 (23:40):
Yes, I bet.
I bet.
Because I believe that peoplehave crossed over are still
around that we can feel theirenergy and communicate with
them.
SPEAKER_01 (23:52):
Absolutely, yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (23:54):
Wonderful.
Well, so the audienceexperience, now that the
documentary is finished andready to screen, what do you
want audiences to understand?
Or what would you like them todo after they watched it?
SPEAKER_01 (24:12):
Well, uh, one thing that Charlie was really clear on
in the film is like he reallywanted people to dance out of
the you know theater, like tofeel uplifted, not feel uh like,
oh, this was such a hard story,and this you know, person has
died and the river is dying andthe pink dolphins are
endangered.
Um I wanted, I we wanted toexplore the opposite.
(24:36):
What is it like when we don'tturn away?
What is it like um when we uh,you know, I want people to start
paying attention to what or whothey've stopped watching.
And the invitation is to reachout to that person, um make sure
(24:56):
you know, uh pay attention to abody of water near you that may
need, may need help.
I really want people to have anew relationship with water, uh
not just the bodies of water,uh, you know, oceans, rivers,
um, but also bodies of water areour loved ones.
So if we can't, if we can't seeeach other as um as uh the you
(25:21):
know the humanity, if we can'twitness the humanity of
everybody, can you at leastwitness them as a body of water?
I hope that's making sense.
SPEAKER_02 (25:28):
Oh, that does.
It makes a lot of sense.
We are walking bodies of water.
Yes, you're absolutely right.
Well, let's talk about your youchose YouTube for distribution.
So your plan has always been torelease bodies of water through
your beautiful Infinity StoryYouTube channel.
(25:51):
So now that will let your filmreach a lot of people.
So why did you choose YouTube?
SPEAKER_01 (25:59):
Well, it's the number one streaming platform in
the world.
Um, and just as I shared at thebeginning, where I was so
frustrated with my lastdocumentary, Althea and Angela,
not getting an offer after doingfilm festivals, not getting, you
know, any offer um for streamingplatforms.
(26:19):
I um I thought, you know, whynot go right to the number one
platform?
And also we're living at a timewhere we're not waiting for a
gatekeeper to buy our film.
We can be our own gatekeepers.
And um the other thing that hadhappened is my deals with the
first two films, New York in the50s and something to cheer
(26:42):
about.
Um my deals with them were 10 or15 year deals, so they had just
come up.
So I just put, instead of tryingto resell everything, I just put
all my films on the sameplatform.
And um, I knew I I wanted thisstory to reach as many people as
possible right away because umit can save rivers, but it can
(27:05):
also save lives.
SPEAKER_02 (27:07):
Absolutely, and it gives everyone a chance to look
inside a family that's beenthrough such great loss and
understand how to recognize whensomeone is in trouble.
I don't think people realizebecause um your your children
(27:29):
will just disappear on you,they're not communicating.
And when they do, uh, if youdon't give them immediate
feedback, they feel lost.
Your reaction becomes reallyimportant, right?
SPEAKER_01 (27:42):
Yeah, oh absolutely.
I mean, it was like a a dam hadbeen set up in our family, and
there was no possibility, youknow.
Charlie was only reachingthrough to a few people because
people had stopped taking hiscalls.
And I um one of the gifts is atyou know, the last six weeks of
his life is I never stoppedtaking his calls, and I took a
(28:05):
lot of painful calls, but I umhe he um uh got completely you
know off everything in the lastuh weeks of his life, and he was
still reaching out to family,and they weren't showing up or
(28:25):
listening to him or taking hiscalls because they could still
only see him as and define himas uh who he was on a drug or
alcohol, not who he was tryingto you know recover.
SPEAKER_02 (28:39):
Right.
Well, I I really think you'recourageous for making the film,
but I have to really commend youand bravo for making the most of
YouTube.
So tell us how you're preparingto use this YouTube release.
Are you considering scheduledpremiere or live conversations
(29:03):
or sharing trailers or YouTubeshorts or tell us the ways that
you are helping audiencesdiscover and share your film?
SPEAKER_01 (29:13):
So the um intention is to release the um to do a
release in uh this fall onYouTube and um you know with a Q
⁇ A after.
But building up to that is I'veuh filmed, I haven't filmed them
all so far, but all thoseinterviews that I've done for
(29:34):
the that I thought were going tobe in the film, I'm um I'm uh
editing those into three to fiveminute segments that will be
posted uh leading up to thepremiere.
So we will start engaging withviewers even before the film is
out.
And I've started also engagingwith viewers through the
trailers being posted, throughmy Substack platform.
(29:58):
Um and, you know, the the giftis I can only do this because of
having fiscal sponsorshipthrough From the Heart
Productions because I'm not itwas the first film that I wasn't
worried about making my moneyback because everything came in
in the form of donors who got atax deduction.
(30:21):
And it really took a lot of thepressure off of um selling a
film.
I will still do film festivals,but um and the film festivals
are a great way to connect toyou know word of mouth and and
build um intimacy withaudiences, and everybody has
(30:41):
somebody in their family thathas struggled, everybody knows
somebody.
And um, so I really feel like weare connecting to a community
that has not had um of apositive voice to share uh
messages about our loved ones umwho have been struggling.
SPEAKER_02 (31:03):
That's true, that's really true.
Well, let's talk aboutfestivals, theater screenings,
and outreach.
So you are planning to submitthe film to festivals, and
you're considering having aseven-day theatrical screening
in Los Angeles.
So, how will the festival andthe theatrical strategies
(31:24):
support the two YouTube release?
SPEAKER_01 (31:28):
The um the festivals will um at this point the
festivals are coming after theYouTube release.
So it's and because it's adocumentary short, uh, I'm just
using any outlets available,especially for an environmental
film, because this is it's afilm about grief, but it's also
(31:49):
an you know it has a bigenvironmental climate um um
message.
So, and there are specific umfestivals that um promote these
films.
So I'm focused on theenvironmental climate festivals
and um and with the thetheatrical release, it's I
(32:11):
wanted a way to honor um uhbeing in Los Angeles where I've
come, you know, I'm finishingthe film and being right by a
body of water.
Since it's a documentary short,you know, we don't have, they're
not, you know, film uhtheatrical screens aren't normal
for them.
I just wanted uh it to be a wayto gather um and then have a QA
(32:36):
after and raise awareness.
And you know, LA is a prettygood place to connect with
people that could perhaps uhhelp the film.
SPEAKER_02 (32:45):
Exactly.
That's a great place, right?
And you're also creating shortervideos featuring water
consciousness experts, griefsupport.
So, how will these companionpieces help you build an ongoing
audience?
SPEAKER_01 (33:01):
Well, the um, you know, I'll be sharing one a week
to build um the YouTubeplatform, and it you know,
brings people to the platform.
So then they actually, you know,click on that one and they go,
Oh, that was interesting.
I'm gonna go back to this one umfeaturing a um water expert um
(33:21):
who also does freezing, like umDr.
Emoto.
And then I'm gonna go click onto this one that is talking to a
parent that might have uh a sonthat or child that um um you
know that experienced um thatthey had lost through uh drugs
or alcohol.
(33:42):
So it's the idea is that they'regonna be shorter videos for our
shorter attention stands spansthat are also telling of you
know a uh an a message thatconnects to the um bodies of
water, the bigger message of thefilm.
SPEAKER_02 (33:56):
Yes.
Excellent.
So um so you started making thefilm around the year 2000.
What are the most importantdifferences that you see between
documentary filmmaking then andnow?
SPEAKER_01 (34:14):
Well, yeah, so 2000 was when I made my you know
early films, and I just rememberwhen you know those were being
sold, the budgets fordistribution um were you know
fifty to a hundred thousanddollars just for marketing.
Yes, and yeah, and I and thefilm Something to Cheer About uh
(34:36):
um was bought uh by adistributor and they had a big
you know marketing budget forit.
And the it it the film got greatreviews written up in you know,
Sports Illustrated, uh New YorkTimes, you know, great, great um
(34:57):
reviews.
And it just didn't have uh, wedidn't get you know the people
in the theaters.
That was also before Facebook.
So if I would have had Facebookout during that time, social
media promoting the film, wewould have had like a
blockbuster film.
Um now with social media uh wecan reach um markets that would
(35:21):
take uh that you know I couldhave never reached before.
The other big thing is um asmuch as people are uh want to
debate about you know AI, it'shere, it's how we use it.
And what it has allowed me to dousing AI is taking it on as a
(35:41):
production partner in areas as aproducer that I would not have
been able to afford.
So um, or I would have done alot less, like in grant writing
uh or in grant research, whichwould take me, you know, a week
before.
Now it takes me two minutes toresearch which, you know, which
(36:04):
festivals are going to be thebest for an environmental uh
film.
So yeah, AI is an importantco-producer on my film.
SPEAKER_02 (36:13):
Great.
Well, um, speaking ofenvironmental films, you know
the Redford Center has a wide uhoutlook of environmental films.
And they they took one of ourfilms and put and put it in a
lot of festivals because it wasenvironmental about moving a
(36:33):
town.
So um, so you should check thecheck that website out because
you're right on what they wantto do.
They want films that arepersonally involved around
environmental issues.
So they're uh whatever they listas the best um festivals might
(36:55):
be beneficial for you.
SPEAKER_01 (36:58):
Thank you.
Yeah, I they are on my radar,and I think the biggest thing
for me right now is in my mind,I wanted this to be released in
September of this year because Iwanted to get, you know, get it
out as soon as possible.
Um but and a uh a film festivalplan um and slowing down a
(37:22):
little uh and um and going foryou know grants with Redford,
you know, Redford's organizationand others could also be um a
good way to uh expand theoutreach.
So I'm I'm making a decision byAugust 1st, and I'll I will
reach out to you about that.
SPEAKER_02 (37:42):
Oh yes, because they are very good at that outreach.
They want those film seen, sothey're very helpful.
Yeah.
So what advice would you givefilmmakers who are waiting for
someone to give them permissionuh to make or release their
films?
SPEAKER_01 (38:01):
Well, uh with YouTube being the number one
streamer right now, you know,you already have distribution.
Um the other thing is with thisfilm, I made the choice to do a
documentary short.
Um, I could have made a90-minute feature film that
would have taken a lot morefeature documentary that would
(38:24):
have taken a lot more, you know,um money and time to do.
And, you know, start with makinga short film, start with making
short clips um that growinterest on YouTube.
Some of the biggest uh uh uhYouTube success stories right
now are storytellers that arejust telling short three to five
(38:45):
minute stories, they're buildingup their platforms, and then
that's a way to you know getyour bigger stories seen and out
there.
SPEAKER_02 (38:55):
I agree, and uh especially on documentaries
because I worked with um AlexisKresowski, and she did this
great film about uh women behindthe camera.
Uh it was two hours and 30minutes, I think, when I first
saw it.
It was outstanding, but I lovedocumentaries and I love the uh
(39:20):
women directors of photography,and that's what she did.
It was all over the world.
So she had to cut it down,right?
She had to cut it to 90, andthen what got the most was a
60-minute version.
And for a 60-minute, you need 53or 52 minutes, so it kept
getting shorter, but that'swhere the the whole thing ends
(39:44):
up is around the 30, 40 minutewhere your real audience is,
Betsy, and you have more umevents.
I mean, they will take you intomore festivals because when you
go to a festival and you've gota 90-minute film, it's got to be
really good for them to give youthat much time in the screening
(40:05):
room, right?
Right.
So let's take your 40-minutefilm gladly and screen it.
And which reminds me uh um uhthe authentic global film
festival is in September, Ithink.
And it's from our church, PastorGerson is in control of that.
unknown (40:27):
Uh-huh.
SPEAKER_02 (40:27):
So we'll say some prayers and we'll send your
submission in the fall, right?
So this is where you want toknow everybody who knows anybody
anywhere.
Talk to them about getting yourfilm into a film festival
because they have so manyapplicants.
(40:48):
If you just even know somebodywho knows somebody, that's the
way to get in these days, Ithink.
True.
Yeah, so true.
Oh, but you have so much funahead of you.
It's half the fun making thefilm, and now you're getting the
joy of sharing it and watchingit change lives, Betsy.
(41:09):
What a wonderful thing you'vedone.
SPEAKER_01 (41:12):
Well, thank you for being a part of it and helping
to make it happen.
Like I said, the having thephysical sponsorship, and also I
went through your intentional uhproducer filmmaking program, and
that helped so much.
So I am you've made it possiblefor storytellers like me to get
our stories out in the world.
SPEAKER_02 (41:33):
Oh my gosh, how kind of you! And thank you for
sharing this extraordinaryjourney with us.
Bodies of Water is a powerfulexample of what can happen when
a filmmaker listens to the storythat continues to call her, even
when that story emerges fromprofound grief.
(41:55):
So, Betsy, you've reminded usthat filmmaking can be more than
the creation of a finishedmotion picture film.
It can be a path towardshealing, understanding, and
transformation.
And you've also shown filmmakersthat we're living in a
remarkable time.
We're no longer having to waitfor one distributor or one
(42:16):
broadcaster or a studio or anygatekeeper to tell us whether
our stories deserve to reach anaudience.
We know we can go direct.
We have YouTube, social media,email communities, new
technologies that allow us tobuild direct relationships with
(42:37):
the people who care about oursubjects.
So our responsibility is tounderstand our audience, develop
a thoughtful outreach plan, andkeep creating opportunities for
this film to be seen.
To every independent filmmakerlistening today, believe in the
value of your story, give ittime, care, and persistence
(43:02):
because it really deserves it.
So forget about rejection andlimited resources.
Forget things that can stop you.
Put yourself in a bubble andsecure your future by
visualizing your future andbringing it into the present.
So thank you very much for yourhonesty, Betsy, your courage,
(43:23):
and your commitment to bringbodies of water into the world.
Our listeners can learn moreabout Betsy and her work at
Betsyburphy.com.
B-E-T-S-Y-I-B-I-M-U-R-P-H-Y.com.
And you will find beautifulinfinity stories with Betsy
(43:47):
Murphy on YouTube and Substack.
I'm Carol Dean Preston from TheHeart.
And to learn more about our RoyDean Film Grants, named after my
father, and our fiscalsponsorship program, visit from
the Heart Productions.com.
Thank you for listening to theArt of Film Funding.
(44:09):
Thank you, Claire Papon, andthank you, Betsy Murphy.
Stay with us to discover how filmmaker Betsy
Murphy turned an unimaginablepersonal loss into a global
documentary.
You will learn her bolddistribution plan designed to
bring her story directly toaudiences around the world.
SPEAKER_00 (01:36):
So glad you could join us on The Art of Film
Funding.
I'm your co-host, Claire Papan,along with writer and producer
Carol Dean.
As mentioned before, author ofthe best-selling book, The Art
of Film Funding, and presidentof From the Heart Productions.
From the Heart Productions hassupported independent filmmakers
(01:58):
for more than 30 years throughthe Roy W.
Dean Film Grant, fiscalsponsorship, education, and
resources designed to helpfilmmakers fund, produce, and
distribute meaningful films.
Today we're speaking withaward-winning documentary
filmmaker, writer, andstoryteller, Betsy Murphy.
(02:22):
Betsy's earlier films were madeunder the professional name
Betsy Blinkenbaker.
Since 2015, she's used the nameBetsy Murphy professionally.
And her documentaries havescreened at international film
festivals and appeared on Hulu,Showtime, and Amazon Prime.
(02:44):
Her projects have also featuredin The New Yorker, The New York
Times, The UK Sunday Times, TheHuffington Post, The Washington
Post, and Sports Illustrated.
Betsy is also the author ofeight books, including
Autobiography of an Orgasm,Grief Glimmers Grace, and Ride
(03:07):
On, a Daily Writing Practice forAnyone with a Story to Tell.
Her Substack platform, BeautifulInfinity Stories, with Betsy
Murphy, has been recognized as arising platform in literature,
and she continues to share herstories through her Beautiful
(03:27):
Infinity Stories YouTubechannel.
Her newest documentary, Bodiesof Water, is a global film with
an intimate emotional core.
It explores fate, grief,destiny, and transformation,
with the spirit of water servingas both a metaphor and a
(03:49):
messenger.
This conversation is especiallyvaluable for filmmakers because
Betsy is not only sharing howshe returned to filmmaking after
a profound personal loss.
She's also developing a modernrelease strategy that combines
YouTube, theatrical screenings,film festivals, social media,
(04:14):
audience outreach, and shortercompanion videos.
We will explore how filmmakerscan turn a deep personal
experience into a universalstory, recognizing
synchronicities duringproduction, build an audience
beyond traditional gatekeepers,and use today's platforms to
(04:37):
bring a finished film directlyto the people who need to see
it.
And Carol, I'm turning theinterview over to you now.
SPEAKER_02 (04:45):
Good, Claire.
Thank you very much.
Betsy, we're so pleased to haveyou with us.
SPEAKER_01 (04:51):
I'm so pleased to be here.
Thank you, Carol.
SPEAKER_02 (04:54):
Yes, I want to learn all about this process.
What uh courageous uh event foryou to take a major loss and
share it with all of us.
Now, I understand you leftfilmmaking in 2015 and you said
that you would never makeanother film.
So tell us what happened thatbrought you back to filmmaking,
(05:17):
and when did you realize thatthe story of your son Charlie
needed to become a film?
SPEAKER_01 (05:25):
Well, I um I've been a documentary filmmaker since
2000, and I released twodocumentaries, um, New York in
the 50s and something to cheerabout.
They both did very well, andwith the support of from from
the heart track from the heartproductions, and my third
documentary, um, Althea andAlthea and Angela, a perfect
(05:47):
match.
Um, I was so frustrated that Iwas not offered any deal, and
that there were suchgatekeepers.
Like this is such an importantstory about the first Jewish
woman and the first black womanto play together at Wimbledon
and break the barriers intennis.
And I, you know, it was abeautiful film, and I never got
a deal.
(06:08):
And I was so done withfilmmaking that I was, you know,
2015, I left.
And then in, and I, you know,turned that into a career as a
writer and helping other peopletell their stories, and I was
just fine with not making anymore films.
And then in uh 2000, July 2022,my youngest son Charlie died at
(06:33):
the age of 27 of afentanyl-related overdose.
It may have been intentional.
And in my grief, I took hisashes to the Ganges River just
because a few months before hedied, we had talked about going
to India together.
(06:54):
I'd taken him there when he waseight, and we had talked about
returning.
And instead, I found myself on aplane alone from California to
India with my son's ashes.
And all I knew was I wanted torelease them into the Ganges
River.
I didn't plan on making a film.
(07:15):
I just needed to do this formyself.
And I arrived and I knew Iwanted to take them to a really
remote area of the Ganges, notlike the clean area at the
beginning.
I wanted to go to the very endof the Ganges.
And I realized that this part ofthe river was the most polluted,
(07:38):
um, but it also held the mostprayers because if if the Ganges
River is, you know, 1,500 miles,you have millions of people
praying on it every day.
So it's filled with pollution,it's also filled with these
healing prayers.
And I've offered my son's ashesthrough a ceremony that was
(08:00):
created from synchronicities,which I'll share later.
And I realized at that moment,if the Ganges River in the most
polluted part is stillconsidered sacred, then my son
dying alone in a hotel room withdrugs in his body is still
sacred too.
And um, up until that point, Ihad only just heard that, you
(08:25):
know, your son's, I had onlyheard labels about him.
He's an addict, he's this orthat.
Um, I never heard what happenedto him, why was he reaching for
the drug?
Why was he in the room alone?
Um, who stopped taking hiscalls?
So I um came back and startedwriting these stories, and I
(08:48):
realized I wanted to tell it umas a film because you reach a
lot more people.
So that's how I got back intofilmmaking reluctantly.
SPEAKER_02 (08:59):
Well, but what an extraordinary subject.
So that's such a personalsubject, making the documentary
about the death of your son.
So, how where did you get thestrength to go into that
emotional territory and tell uswhat you hoped that the this
process of making bodies ofwater is going to reveal or
(09:23):
transform the benefits?
SPEAKER_01 (09:26):
Well, the um I made it to survive.
Like my grief was so heavy thatthis is, and I've experienced a
lot of death in my life from ayoung age, but to lose a son, as
you know, is devastating.
(09:47):
And I had to take it, it becameCharlie's death, became my
destiny.
And about two months beforeCharlie died, he sent a letter
to me and other family members.
It was a letter he wrote tohimself as a way to heal.
(10:09):
Um he wrote the words that heneeded to, you know, hear to
heal, sent this beautifulletter.
And um, and he also said to me,Mom, someday you're gonna tell
my story.
And I said, Charlie, you'regonna tell your story.
You're such a dynamic, charmingstoryteller, and you're you're
going to connect with so manypeople.
And he said, No, you're gonnatell my story.
(10:32):
And it just was his death becamemy destiny with telling the
story because I also peoplelooked away from Charlie's pain
in this, I was experiencing thesame way of like they were
looking away from my pain, mygrief.
People, we will do anything toavoid pain.
So I um and then I get to this,you know, to India and see this
(10:58):
river that has been um sopolluted, and in 2000 found out
in 2017, uh, the country, thegovernment had declared the
river as um sacred and having uhconsciousness.
So to harm the river would belike harming a human.
(11:19):
And um and India committed to umhelping you know restore the
river and helping it survive.
And I thought, well, if I wantto change the language around
how we and the conversationsaround how we show up for loved
ones who are struggling, becausein too many of our families we
(11:44):
look away from their pain.
Um, and just like a little kidis saying, watch me, watch me,
um, these the moments when ourour children of any age are
struggling, that's when we needto stop watch, listen, witness.
And India taught me that theycould do that with the river, so
I'm trying to change theconversation around.
(12:07):
My son wasn't an addict, he wassomeone in pain, and it was a
pain that needed to bewitnessed.
And I um saw that I could tellthe story on a bigger level
through using water as thestoryteller.
SPEAKER_02 (12:25):
Oh, how smart! Because the water is emotion,
right?
That is what it's all about.
It's all about emotion.
I know in one of ourconversations that I encourage
you to think of Charlie, yourson, as a co-producer.
So, what did that idea mean toyou, and how did your
(12:45):
relationship with Charliecontinue to influence the
creative and practical decisionsthat you made throughout your
production?
SPEAKER_01 (12:55):
That was such an important moment because I had
imagined the documentary asbeing full of interviews with um
uh, you know, Hindus in Indiawho um grew up swimming in the
river and grew up swimming withthe the pink dolphins swimming
(13:15):
in the river, which are now indanger.
They've disappeared because theriver is so polluted.
I've interviewed water experts,I've interviewed experts on um
how sound impacts water as a wayto understand like how prayer
can influence water.
So I was interviewing all theseexperts, and but the film it
(13:36):
just wasn't coming together.
And so I reached out to you andyou said, take Charlie on as
your co-producer, and thatchanged everything.
And I decided to pull all thoseum experts that I'd interview
out of the film and um and usethose as supplemental interviews
(13:58):
um to promote and market thefilm and so that we could have
more in-depth conversations too.
But um, and then with Charlie'sguidance, I really have ended up
telling the story that uh weneeded to tell to together.
And I'm I uh so I will neverforget that conversation with
(14:19):
you because it it switchedeverything.
SPEAKER_02 (14:22):
Oh, thank you.
Well, Betsy, when you go backand think about Imoto's frozen
water forms.
Remember, he froze water and helove on one and on one bottle,
he put I will kill you.
And the vision in the uh what inthe frozen water was a man with
(14:45):
a gun.
Amazing that water has a memoryand water responds to people, so
you've chosen the rightconnection.
So let's talk about creating aglobal production.
So, what part of Bodies of Waterwas created with a production
(15:06):
team in India, and how did thoserelationships come together?
Because you're working acrosscultures and geographic
distances and emotional andspiritual dimensions.
SPEAKER_01 (15:20):
Yeah.
All I can say is, you know, noneof it was planned, and but
everything came through askingand receiving.
Um I had previously shot umworked in India on two different
projects, you know, oh gosh, 15years ago, and I always took a
(15:42):
um, you know, my photographerUS-based crew there.
And this time I really wanted touse a um a local crew, and I
used the platform Fiverr.
I'd been using the platformFiverr for editing skills, and I
I have such good luck findinggreat people on Fiverr.
(16:03):
And um and so I found a young,you know, hot shop producer
named Um Um Mohammed Youssef onFiverr.
And he was building a studio,but at the time I didn't realize
he was building a productionstudio, but at the time, this is
you know five years ago.
(16:24):
Um uh but he was doing it out ofhis dorm room.
And um, but he was um so Iconnected with him to film the
first uh part of the we weregoing to Varanasi, which is the
holiest, um, you know,considered the holiest city in
India.
And but he and I had to trusteach other that he was, I was
(16:47):
sending him money and I had totrust that he was gonna show up
with a photographer.
He had to trust that, you know,I was gonna be there.
And we ended up building, youknow, a really strong
relationship in the last fiveyears, and um and there was a
bit of synchronicity too withthe filming, the end of the
(17:07):
film, which I'll share in aminute.
But um he I also ended up takingthe editing back to him.
I'm I'm used to sitting in anediting, you know, suite from 20
years ago with a big, you know,avid suite, and now you know we
can use editors that areanywhere.
And so he actually knows thisproduct project better than
(17:29):
anybody.
So he's, you know, I've usedthis crew um uh uh for the whole
film, and it's felt really good.
At one point when we weredriving six hours to film, you
know, the end of the film, thecar was filled, it was me, um,
two people that were Muslim andthey were uh it was Ramanam, so
they were fasting, two Hindus inthe car, only two people spoke
(17:52):
English, and they were all intheir 20s, which was my son's
age when he died.
And it just felt like Charliewas taking me on the most
amazing adventure.
And in the same way that peopleuh here, especially close, you
know, family members, couldn'tsee the gift of Charlie when he
(18:15):
was in pain.
Um this group just held on tothe gift of the story that was
trying to come through.
And I just love like the global,you know, the story turned
itself into this, you know,global story.
So um, and I'm very fortunatewith these young hotshot
(18:36):
filmmakers.
I'm the end of our film, itlooks like it was shot with a
big Hollywood production budget.
It's really incredible.
SPEAKER_02 (18:43):
Oh, I'm so happy to hear that.
Well, it all started withFiverr.
It can you spell that for us?
SPEAKER_01 (18:49):
Yeah, it's f-i-v-e-r-r dot com.
SPEAKER_02 (18:55):
Great.
SPEAKER_01 (18:56):
I'll share the link, uh, his link too.
He's fantastic.
SPEAKER_02 (19:00):
Okay, great.
So water as a metaphor and amessenger is what you're doing.
So, how did the water become theconnecting element?
SPEAKER_01 (19:10):
Yeah.
Well, as we said before, youknow, when you're talking about
Emoto's work, I um I wassurprised that there was more
compassion for, you know, thisbody of water that was in danger
of dying than my son in the lastmonths of his life when he
really needed attention fromfamily.
And all I heard was, uh, oh, wedon't want to be around him, or
(19:35):
he's this or that.
Like they were constantlysending negative information,
you know, to him and negativemessages.
And if our bodies, you know, are60, 70% water, then what is that
doing to somebody who's alreadystruggling?
So I really wanted to make thepoint of if you can't help
somebody that is in a lot ofpain or struggling with drugs
(19:58):
and alcohol, can we at leastsend, you know, positive healing
to them, not just say, oh, well,they're an addict or they're
this or that?
Um, because Charlie was so muchmore than that.
And and he was someone in painthat was really trying to um get
beyond the pain.
Um, so I there was no betterexample than this dying river
(20:22):
that's now coming back to lifeto tell the story.
SPEAKER_02 (20:27):
Oh my gosh.
So, what you're doing here ismaking the personal universal,
and um, that's very hard on yourown emotions.
How there has to be a delicatebalance between personal
expression and creatingsomething that connects with a
wider audience.
So, how did you protect theintimacy of your story while you
(20:50):
were making bodies of watermeaningful to people?
SPEAKER_01 (20:54):
Yeah, well, what it was people's connection to me
when and reaching out to mebecause I'm sharing uh this very
intimate personal story, and I'msharing details about his death
and what happened before andafter that people don't usually
share.
And I've heard from so manypeople that said, me too, that
(21:18):
happened to me too.
I've been um I've beenstruggling with this.
Thank you for sharing uh howyour writing is very healing.
Um I didn't want, I also wantedsomeone like Charlie, who I
think at the end of his life,you know, he had uh he died in a
(21:39):
hotel room, but his phone wasright by him.
And I know he was watching a lotof um movies and videos, and I
was just hope, I hope that thisvideo would be um bodies of
water would be something that ifsomebody is scrolling and in
pain, they stop and watch it andthey feel seen, they feel heard,
(22:00):
they they don't feel um, theymight be disconnected from loved
ones, but the message mightconnect them back to themselves
and and bring them back into astate of um where every cell in
their body is reflecting thatlove that they need to be sent
in this moment, not judgment,hate.
(22:23):
Um yeah, so I've just uh Ireally want to change the story
around how we're showing up forloved ones.
At the end of Charlie's life,you know, we were told as a
family, tough love, don't takehis calls, tough love, you know,
let him hit rock bottom.
Well, my son's rock bottom wasdeath.
SPEAKER_02 (22:41):
Oh my gosh.
Yes.
That's that's almost impossibleto deal with the emotions that
go on.
But how great for you to go backand recreate all this that he
was going through becausethere's so many people on drugs
now, this can be a great help tothem to understand they're not
(23:03):
alone.
And to see that Charlie died,they should recognize the fact
they've got to get help, I wouldthink.
SPEAKER_01 (23:11):
Yeah, absolutely.
And and also and feel witnessand seen.
Um and at the very least, youknow, um um send themselves some
love or uh if you can't show upfor that person, um, you know,
send them so that there is help.
And you ask about also water wasthe other way.
(23:32):
Like I I've I bathe, I go to hotsprings, I constantly, you know,
that's where I connect toCharlie.
SPEAKER_02 (23:40):
Yes, I bet.
I bet.
Because I believe that peoplehave crossed over are still
around that we can feel theirenergy and communicate with
them.
SPEAKER_01 (23:52):
Absolutely, yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (23:54):
Wonderful.
Well, so the audienceexperience, now that the
documentary is finished andready to screen, what do you
want audiences to understand?
Or what would you like them todo after they watched it?
SPEAKER_01 (24:12):
Well, uh, one thing that Charlie was really clear on
in the film is like he reallywanted people to dance out of
the you know theater, like tofeel uplifted, not feel uh like,
oh, this was such a hard story,and this you know, person has
died and the river is dying andthe pink dolphins are
endangered.
Um I wanted, I we wanted toexplore the opposite.
(24:36):
What is it like when we don'tturn away?
What is it like um when we uh,you know, I want people to start
paying attention to what or whothey've stopped watching.
And the invitation is to reachout to that person, um make sure
(24:56):
you know, uh pay attention to abody of water near you that may
need, may need help.
I really want people to have anew relationship with water, uh
not just the bodies of water,uh, you know, oceans, rivers,
um, but also bodies of water areour loved ones.
So if we can't, if we can't seeeach other as um as uh the you
(25:21):
know the humanity, if we can'twitness the humanity of
everybody, can you at leastwitness them as a body of water?
I hope that's making sense.
SPEAKER_02 (25:28):
Oh, that does.
It makes a lot of sense.
We are walking bodies of water.
Yes, you're absolutely right.
Well, let's talk about your youchose YouTube for distribution.
So your plan has always been torelease bodies of water through
your beautiful Infinity StoryYouTube channel.
(25:51):
So now that will let your filmreach a lot of people.
So why did you choose YouTube?
SPEAKER_01 (25:59):
Well, it's the number one streaming platform in
the world.
Um, and just as I shared at thebeginning, where I was so
frustrated with my lastdocumentary, Althea and Angela,
not getting an offer after doingfilm festivals, not getting, you
know, any offer um for streamingplatforms.
(26:19):
I um I thought, you know, whynot go right to the number one
platform?
And also we're living at a timewhere we're not waiting for a
gatekeeper to buy our film.
We can be our own gatekeepers.
And um the other thing that hadhappened is my deals with the
first two films, New York in the50s and something to cheer
(26:42):
about.
Um my deals with them were 10 or15 year deals, so they had just
come up.
So I just put, instead of tryingto resell everything, I just put
all my films on the sameplatform.
And um, I knew I I wanted thisstory to reach as many people as
possible right away because umit can save rivers, but it can
(27:05):
also save lives.
SPEAKER_02 (27:07):
Absolutely, and it gives everyone a chance to look
inside a family that's beenthrough such great loss and
understand how to recognize whensomeone is in trouble.
I don't think people realizebecause um your your children
(27:29):
will just disappear on you,they're not communicating.
And when they do, uh, if youdon't give them immediate
feedback, they feel lost.
Your reaction becomes reallyimportant, right?
SPEAKER_01 (27:42):
Yeah, oh absolutely.
I mean, it was like a a dam hadbeen set up in our family, and
there was no possibility, youknow.
Charlie was only reachingthrough to a few people because
people had stopped taking hiscalls.
And I um one of the gifts is atyou know, the last six weeks of
his life is I never stoppedtaking his calls, and I took a
(28:05):
lot of painful calls, but I umhe he um uh got completely you
know off everything in the lastuh weeks of his life, and he was
still reaching out to family,and they weren't showing up or
(28:25):
listening to him or taking hiscalls because they could still
only see him as and define himas uh who he was on a drug or
alcohol, not who he was tryingto you know recover.
SPEAKER_02 (28:39):
Right.
Well, I I really think you'recourageous for making the film,
but I have to really commend youand bravo for making the most of
YouTube.
So tell us how you're preparingto use this YouTube release.
Are you considering scheduledpremiere or live conversations
(29:03):
or sharing trailers or YouTubeshorts or tell us the ways that
you are helping audiencesdiscover and share your film?
SPEAKER_01 (29:13):
So the um intention is to release the um to do a
release in uh this fall onYouTube and um you know with a Q
⁇ A after.
But building up to that is I'veuh filmed, I haven't filmed them
all so far, but all thoseinterviews that I've done for
(29:34):
the that I thought were going tobe in the film, I'm um I'm uh
editing those into three to fiveminute segments that will be
posted uh leading up to thepremiere.
So we will start engaging withviewers even before the film is
out.
And I've started also engagingwith viewers through the
trailers being posted, throughmy Substack platform.
(29:58):
Um and, you know, the the giftis I can only do this because of
having fiscal sponsorshipthrough From the Heart
Productions because I'm not itwas the first film that I wasn't
worried about making my moneyback because everything came in
in the form of donors who got atax deduction.
(30:21):
And it really took a lot of thepressure off of um selling a
film.
I will still do film festivals,but um and the film festivals
are a great way to connect toyou know word of mouth and and
build um intimacy withaudiences, and everybody has
(30:41):
somebody in their family thathas struggled, everybody knows
somebody.
And um, so I really feel like weare connecting to a community
that has not had um of apositive voice to share uh
messages about our loved ones umwho have been struggling.
SPEAKER_02 (31:03):
That's true, that's really true.
Well, let's talk aboutfestivals, theater screenings,
and outreach.
So you are planning to submitthe film to festivals, and
you're considering having aseven-day theatrical screening
in Los Angeles.
So, how will the festival andthe theatrical strategies
(31:24):
support the two YouTube release?
SPEAKER_01 (31:28):
The um the festivals will um at this point the
festivals are coming after theYouTube release.
So it's and because it's adocumentary short, uh, I'm just
using any outlets available,especially for an environmental
film, because this is it's afilm about grief, but it's also
(31:49):
an you know it has a bigenvironmental climate um um
message.
So, and there are specific umfestivals that um promote these
films.
So I'm focused on theenvironmental climate festivals
and um and with the thetheatrical release, it's I
(32:11):
wanted a way to honor um uhbeing in Los Angeles where I've
come, you know, I'm finishingthe film and being right by a
body of water.
Since it's a documentary short,you know, we don't have, they're
not, you know, film uhtheatrical screens aren't normal
for them.
I just wanted uh it to be a wayto gather um and then have a QA
(32:36):
after and raise awareness.
And you know, LA is a prettygood place to connect with
people that could perhaps uhhelp the film.
SPEAKER_02 (32:45):
Exactly.
That's a great place, right?
And you're also creating shortervideos featuring water
consciousness experts, griefsupport.
So, how will these companionpieces help you build an ongoing
audience?
SPEAKER_01 (33:01):
Well, the um, you know, I'll be sharing one a week
to build um the YouTubeplatform, and it you know,
brings people to the platform.
So then they actually, you know,click on that one and they go,
Oh, that was interesting.
I'm gonna go back to this one umfeaturing a um water expert um
(33:21):
who also does freezing, like umDr.
Emoto.
And then I'm gonna go click onto this one that is talking to a
parent that might have uh a sonthat or child that um um you
know that experienced um thatthey had lost through uh drugs
or alcohol.
(33:42):
So it's the idea is that they'regonna be shorter videos for our
shorter attention stands spansthat are also telling of you
know a uh an a message thatconnects to the um bodies of
water, the bigger message of thefilm.
SPEAKER_02 (33:56):
Yes.
Excellent.
So um so you started making thefilm around the year 2000.
What are the most importantdifferences that you see between
documentary filmmaking then andnow?
SPEAKER_01 (34:14):
Well, yeah, so 2000 was when I made my you know
early films, and I just rememberwhen you know those were being
sold, the budgets fordistribution um were you know
fifty to a hundred thousanddollars just for marketing.
Yes, and yeah, and I and thefilm Something to Cheer About uh
(34:36):
um was bought uh by adistributor and they had a big
you know marketing budget forit.
And the it it the film got greatreviews written up in you know,
Sports Illustrated, uh New YorkTimes, you know, great, great um
(34:57):
reviews.
And it just didn't have uh, wedidn't get you know the people
in the theaters.
That was also before Facebook.
So if I would have had Facebookout during that time, social
media promoting the film, wewould have had like a
blockbuster film.
Um now with social media uh wecan reach um markets that would
(35:21):
take uh that you know I couldhave never reached before.
The other big thing is um asmuch as people are uh want to
debate about you know AI, it'shere, it's how we use it.
And what it has allowed me to dousing AI is taking it on as a
(35:41):
production partner in areas as aproducer that I would not have
been able to afford.
So um, or I would have done alot less, like in grant writing
uh or in grant research, whichwould take me, you know, a week
before.
Now it takes me two minutes toresearch which, you know, which
(36:04):
festivals are going to be thebest for an environmental uh
film.
So yeah, AI is an importantco-producer on my film.
SPEAKER_02 (36:13):
Great.
Well, um, speaking ofenvironmental films, you know
the Redford Center has a wide uhoutlook of environmental films.
And they they took one of ourfilms and put and put it in a
lot of festivals because it wasenvironmental about moving a
(36:33):
town.
So um, so you should check thecheck that website out because
you're right on what they wantto do.
They want films that arepersonally involved around
environmental issues.
So they're uh whatever they listas the best um festivals might
(36:55):
be beneficial for you.
SPEAKER_01 (36:58):
Thank you.
Yeah, I they are on my radar,and I think the biggest thing
for me right now is in my mind,I wanted this to be released in
September of this year because Iwanted to get, you know, get it
out as soon as possible.
Um but and a uh a film festivalplan um and slowing down a
(37:22):
little uh and um and going foryou know grants with Redford,
you know, Redford's organizationand others could also be um a
good way to uh expand theoutreach.
So I'm I'm making a decision byAugust 1st, and I'll I will
reach out to you about that.
SPEAKER_02 (37:42):
Oh yes, because they are very good at that outreach.
They want those film seen, sothey're very helpful.
Yeah.
So what advice would you givefilmmakers who are waiting for
someone to give them permissionuh to make or release their
films?
SPEAKER_01 (38:01):
Well, uh with YouTube being the number one
streamer right now, you know,you already have distribution.
Um the other thing is with thisfilm, I made the choice to do a
documentary short.
Um, I could have made a90-minute feature film that
would have taken a lot morefeature documentary that would
(38:24):
have taken a lot more, you know,um money and time to do.
And, you know, start with makinga short film, start with making
short clips um that growinterest on YouTube.
Some of the biggest uh uh uhYouTube success stories right
now are storytellers that arejust telling short three to five
(38:45):
minute stories, they're buildingup their platforms, and then
that's a way to you know getyour bigger stories seen and out
there.
SPEAKER_02 (38:55):
I agree, and uh especially on documentaries
because I worked with um AlexisKresowski, and she did this
great film about uh women behindthe camera.
Uh it was two hours and 30minutes, I think, when I first
saw it.
It was outstanding, but I lovedocumentaries and I love the uh
(39:20):
women directors of photography,and that's what she did.
It was all over the world.
So she had to cut it down,right?
She had to cut it to 90, andthen what got the most was a
60-minute version.
And for a 60-minute, you need 53or 52 minutes, so it kept
getting shorter, but that'swhere the the whole thing ends
(39:44):
up is around the 30, 40 minutewhere your real audience is,
Betsy, and you have more umevents.
I mean, they will take you intomore festivals because when you
go to a festival and you've gota 90-minute film, it's got to be
really good for them to give youthat much time in the screening
(40:05):
room, right?
Right.
So let's take your 40-minutefilm gladly and screen it.
And which reminds me uh um uhthe authentic global film
festival is in September, Ithink.
And it's from our church, PastorGerson is in control of that.
unknown (40:27):
Uh-huh.
SPEAKER_02 (40:27):
So we'll say some prayers and we'll send your
submission in the fall, right?
So this is where you want toknow everybody who knows anybody
anywhere.
Talk to them about getting yourfilm into a film festival
because they have so manyapplicants.
(40:48):
If you just even know somebodywho knows somebody, that's the
way to get in these days, Ithink.
True.
Yeah, so true.
Oh, but you have so much funahead of you.
It's half the fun making thefilm, and now you're getting the
joy of sharing it and watchingit change lives, Betsy.
(41:09):
What a wonderful thing you'vedone.
SPEAKER_01 (41:12):
Well, thank you for being a part of it and helping
to make it happen.
Like I said, the having thephysical sponsorship, and also I
went through your intentional uhproducer filmmaking program, and
that helped so much.
So I am you've made it possiblefor storytellers like me to get
our stories out in the world.
SPEAKER_02 (41:33):
Oh my gosh, how kind of you! And thank you for
sharing this extraordinaryjourney with us.
Bodies of Water is a powerfulexample of what can happen when
a filmmaker listens to the storythat continues to call her, even
when that story emerges fromprofound grief.
(41:55):
So, Betsy, you've reminded usthat filmmaking can be more than
the creation of a finishedmotion picture film.
It can be a path towardshealing, understanding, and
transformation.
And you've also shown filmmakersthat we're living in a
remarkable time.
We're no longer having to waitfor one distributor or one
(42:16):
broadcaster or a studio or anygatekeeper to tell us whether
our stories deserve to reach anaudience.
We know we can go direct.
We have YouTube, social media,email communities, new
technologies that allow us tobuild direct relationships with
(42:37):
the people who care about oursubjects.
So our responsibility is tounderstand our audience, develop
a thoughtful outreach plan, andkeep creating opportunities for
this film to be seen.
To every independent filmmakerlistening today, believe in the
value of your story, give ittime, care, and persistence
(43:02):
because it really deserves it.
So forget about rejection andlimited resources.
Forget things that can stop you.
Put yourself in a bubble andsecure your future by
visualizing your future andbringing it into the present.
So thank you very much for yourhonesty, Betsy, your courage,
(43:23):
and your commitment to bringbodies of water into the world.
Our listeners can learn moreabout Betsy and her work at
Betsyburphy.com.
B-E-T-S-Y-I-B-I-M-U-R-P-H-Y.com.
And you will find beautifulinfinity stories with Betsy
(43:47):
Murphy on YouTube and Substack.
I'm Carol Dean Preston from TheHeart.
And to learn more about our RoyDean Film Grants, named after my
father, and our fiscalsponsorship program, visit from
the Heart Productions.com.
Thank you for listening to theArt of Film Funding.
(44:09):
Thank you, Claire Papon, andthank you, Betsy Murphy.
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