Joanne Butcher has shaped the careers of more than a hundred independent filmmakers as a Consulting Producer, helping them navigate the business realities that define success in the industry. Her deep experience in fundraising and distribution has supported the completion and release of dozens of feature films, and she has been directly involved in bringing over 25 features to screens around the world.
What sets her apart is the way she empowers artists to evolve into savvy industry professionals—storytellers who not only understand craft, but who can confidently communicate with investors, funders, and distributors. She has supported creators at every stage of their journey, from first-time short film directors to teams building multimillion-dollar productions that attract top-tier talent. Joanne is a relentless champion for diverse and emerging voices, pushing open doors and dismantling long-standing barriers within the filmmaking ecosystem. Through her leadership, guidance, and industry advocacy, she continues to help filmmakers transform their passion into sustainable careers—ensuring that the stories that need to be told find their audiences, globally.
Her 2024 book, *Getting Your Film Funded, Produced and Distributed Globally: A Seven Step System — The Film Box Office S.U.C.C.E.S.S. Formula, distills her two-decade methodology into a complete roadmap for indie filmmakers. joannebutcher.com
Link to her calendar:
https://www.filmmakersuccess.com/book-a-call
Current Films In Distribution
https://www.filmmakersuccess.com/filmsindistribution-
Website
https://www.filmmakersuccess.com/
Instagram
https://www.instagram.com/joannefilm/
Facebook Group
Getting Your Film Funded, Produced, and Distributed Globally
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1588227901352330
LinkedIn
https://www.linkedin.com/in/joannebutcher/
Join our new educational platform From the Heart THRIVE and get free classes on film funding: https://fromtheheartproductions.thrivecart.com/from-the-heart-thrive/
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Episode Transcript
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SPEAKER_02 (01:15):
Stay with us because Joanne Butcher is about to
reveal why most films never getfunded and seven steps that can
benefit your project and yourfunding.
SPEAKER_00 (01:29):
So glad you could join us here for the Art of Film
Funding podcast.
I'm Claire Papan, co-producerwith Carol Dean, writer,
producer, and president of Fromthe Heart Productions.
And we have film financinginformation to share with you
today.
Our guest is Joanne Butcher, theFilm Vision Alchemist, a
(01:54):
consulting producer and filmfunding coach who has helped
indie filmmakers put 21 featuresinto distribution and over 150
more into development.
Joanne is the author of GettingYour Film Funded, Produced and
Distributed Globally, aSeven-Step System, the Film Box
(02:18):
Office Success Formula.
The book filmmakers are callingthe missing manual for how to
actually pay for the movie youwant to make.
This book distills hertwo-decade methodology into a
complete roadmap for indiefilmmakers.
Over her career, Joanne hasraised millions of dollars, led
(02:43):
teams of professionalfundraisers, and trained
nonprofit boards across multiplesectors before turning her full
attention to teaching filmmakershow to raise money.
Today she works with bothdocumentary and fiction
filmmakers, helping them developtheir projects through the lens
(03:05):
of the funds they actually needto move their films and their
careers forward.
Carol sits down with Joannetoday to unpack the seven steps,
why most indie films stallbefore they ever raise a dollar,
and how filmmakers at any budgetlevel can build a real world to
(03:29):
a real-world plan to get funded,get made, and reach a global
audience.
Carol, I'll turn this over toyou now.
Thanks, Claire.
And Joanne, thank you forjoining us.
SPEAKER_02 (03:43):
Thank you for having me.
Well, there's so many things wewant to cover.
So we're going to get startedabout your story.
It's a fascinating story.
You're a fundraising executive,a nonprofit trainer, a
consulting producer, and now abest-selling author.
So let's start with what was themoment when you realized
(04:06):
filmmakers needed a completelydifferent approach to raising
money.
SPEAKER_01 (04:20):
I was like, wait a minute, you know, some of our
members have made feature filmsalready.
And uh let me bring them in.
I think it was about 11 of them,and do a focus group with them
and see what it is that theyneed and what I can help with
because we were tended to beteaching uh practical.
You know, I used to teachscreenwriting myself.
(04:42):
Uh, we taught sound, we taughtdirecting, we taught all kinds
of things.
Um, and so I thought, what do weneed to do for feature
filmmakers?
What how can we help them?
So I did this first focus group,and basically I said, you know,
how can we help?
And what the answer was that Imostly got was nothing.
(05:07):
We're doing it all by ourselves.
And I was like, oh, that's whatthe independent in independent
filmmakers means.
I do it all by myself, I don'tneed any help, but that kind of
thinking.
And that was a big moment for mebecause I realized, but you
know, fundraising, there are allthere's all kinds of techniques,
(05:28):
there's all kinds of strategies.
They don't know any of thesetechniques and strategies, but
they also don't know that theydon't know how much they would
benefit from them.
And it's interesting becausestill to this day I find that at
least half the filmmakers Ispeak to, and I speak to a lot,
don't actually know that thereis a possibility to learn
(05:52):
fundraising.
That's that's the first thing.
So you can become a betterfundraiser, you can become a
better, a more experienced, moreeducated fundraiser.
It's a skill that you can learnjust the same way you learned
lighting, just the same way youlearned interview techniques.
Um, but they don't realizethat's a possibility.
(06:14):
And then the other half I speakto know that fundraising is
important and they don't knowhow to do it or how to get
better at it.
And um so that there are sort oftwo types of filmmakers: the
ones that don't know anything,you know, that there is such a
(06:36):
thing as fundraising, and theothers that do, but but realize
that they don't know anythingabout it and don't understand.
And it's not their fault.
I write about this in my book.
Even the top film schools, I wasspeaking to AFI recently, do not
teach anything about raisingmoney in their programs.
(06:57):
So you can get a film schooldegree and not know the first
thing about raising money tomake your films.
SPEAKER_02 (07:05):
I know that because working as a sponsor and uh
you're having taking people onwhen they've graduated from some
of the top colleges, it's it'sreally shocking when they come
out and they know how to make afilm, but they don't know the
first thing of fundraising.
Joanne, you're so right.
SPEAKER_01 (07:25):
Um, they did teach me.
I have a client, I have a clientwho graduated from NYU film
school.
Yes.
And he was a very young man.
I met him through his mother,actually.
And he told me, you know, I wantto make my own film, and I don't
have any idea.
My film school training taughtme to go to LA and get a job,
(07:46):
and I don't want a job.
And he made his first featurefilm with me, a micro-budget
horror film.
He made his second feature filmwith me, a micro-budget horror
film.
It was supposed to come out indistribution in January, and
about two days before it wassupposed to get released,
Bloomhouse swooped in and pickedup the film.
(08:07):
So I have my first like hot inHollywood client, but that's
exactly the trajectory.
He graduated from NYV FilmSchool, can't do better than
that, and knew not a clue abouthow to get his first film made.
And now he's going to be famous.
SPEAKER_02 (08:26):
Isn't that wonderful?
This is the kind of stories welike to hear.
Well, let's talk about the titleof your book because it's very
bold.
Getting your film funded,produced, and distributed
globally.
So, why did you put globally inthe title?
And what do most American indiefilmmakers misunderstand about
(08:48):
the international market?
SPEAKER_01 (08:51):
Oh, what a great question.
Um, well, what I saw when Ilooked around me and saw uh my
friends making, you know,multimillion dollar films, um
independent but still, you know,with A-list actors and
everything, what I saw was thatthey already had distribution
before they made the film.
(09:12):
And so I thought, well, if myclient is making a$200,000 film,
a$500,000 film, a$2 millionfilm, then I want them to have
distribution before they beginas well.
So uh the way that I work thatis I work with a couple of sales
agents, and um, you know, Icould work with more, but I
(09:32):
there's a couple that I'vegotten used to working with.
And uh we actually created somelanguage um that my clients can
use in their pitch decks.
Uh it doesn't say we alreadyhave distribution, but it does
say we already have access tosales agents and access to
distribution once the movie iscomplete.
(09:54):
And I actually kept it on thatlevel because I don't really
want my clients to signanything, right?
Even that story I just told, um,I wouldn't before he made the
film, I wouldn't have wanted tosign with a sales agent because
I don't want them locked in.
You know, what if Bloomhousedoes come calling?
You want to be able?
(10:14):
And actually, it was a bit messybecause of the sales agent he
was signed up with, which wasn'tone of mine.
But um so um I have my clientsbegin with the end in mind,
begin with, I'm gettingdistribution for this film, and
then we reverse engineerbackwards.
And so learning how to be ableto speak about a film that's
(10:39):
going into distribution asopposed to a story that I want
to tell, has the conversationstart being about business from
day one.
Does that make sense?
Could I explain it?
SPEAKER_02 (10:52):
Absolutely, that's really great.
You're so right.
This is um, it's really verydifficult for filmmakers when
they get two-thirds finished andsay, okay, now what about
distribution?
Where they would have beenthinking of that since day one.
That's very so terrific.
(11:12):
That's the number one thing isto let them know.
So let's walk our listenersthrough the framework of your
book because it's built aroundthe success formula, a
seven-step system.
So you take the word success andbreak each letter down.
So um give us a high-level tourof what each letter stands for
(11:37):
and why that order matters, andthen we can go through it
together.
SPEAKER_01 (11:43):
Lovely.
Um, so if I I guess if I reallyspoke to a filmmaker and said,
we're going to start withdistribution, they might not
want to listen to me.
So S, the first letter insuccess, stands for script.
Now every book filmmaker ishappy, you know.
Oh, we're talking about ascript.
That's the most important thing,right?
We all agree on that.
(12:03):
What I teach them is how do wemake this not so much a more
excellent script?
They've already been working onthat by the time they find me,
most of them.
Um, they want it to be the bestscript it can be.
They've worked on it sometimesfor years.
And then I come along and I'mlike, how do we make this more
marketable?
(12:24):
How do we make this moreappealing for a sales agent?
And I have people who have likeI have a client right now, he's
written a crime thriller inLondon, and um he realized as he
was going through the processwith me that he wanted to make
(12:45):
it a faith-based movie.
So we're going to have afaith-based crime thriller.
It was already there in thebones of the story, but now it's
it's clearly from a marketingstandpoint a faith-based film.
And um, interestingly, we haveattached a casting director who
was particularly interested infaith-based films, who's
(13:06):
bringing along with him aninvestor who's particularly
interested in faith-based films.
So again, the story is reallythe same, but the butt the
approach makes it much moremarketable.
Another uh client I had, she wasmaking a um a drama, she told
me.
And then um first thing I do isI read my client's scripts.
(13:30):
I read the story and I said, butthis is um a thriller, Debbie,
it's a thriller.
She said, No, it's not, it's adrama.
I said, No, it's a thriller.
She said, No, it's a thrillerdrama.
I said, No, it's a thriller.
I said, Because the maincharacter ends up being jumped
by a gang.
For several minutes of the film,we don't know where she is or
(13:51):
what happened to her or if she'seven alive.
She wakes up in a hospital andthen she gets herself out of the
hospital and she goes to theplace where she had seen that
hidden gun and she goes andrescues the child.
It's a thriller.
Yes.
And she had not seen that.
Most most filmmakers don't.
For some reason, every filmmakerI say, what's the genre of your
(14:13):
film?
It's a drama.
I don't know what that's about.
Well, it's about notunderstanding the industry.
So if she had gone out with a,if she had made that film and it
had been a drama with no namesand, you know, very micro
budget, she would have had nooffice of distribution.
Instead, she did a one-pagerewrite, took it out as a
(14:34):
thriller, and she got 15 offersof distribution.
Oh wow.
How incredible! Yeah, yeah.
One page rewrite.
But that one page turned it intoa far more marketable script.
And that's the kind of work thatI'm doing with my clients.
SPEAKER_02 (14:53):
Most people that are interested in investing often
just read that one or one and ahalf pages, right?
SPEAKER_01 (15:01):
Well, uh, or just the log line, or um, I train my
clients, uh I do a lot oftraining in their verbal pitch,
and I train them to really givevery little more than the log
line, whether it's a documentaryor a fiction film.
Um, the rest is about you knowthe business.
SPEAKER_02 (15:21):
Okay, so step one is the script.
Create a marketable script.
So one creates the script thatinvestors and distributors will
actually back from one that'sbeloved by the writer.
I mean, this sometimes they tellme I channel this script.
(15:43):
I'm not changing a word.
SPEAKER_01 (15:45):
Yes, yes, that's common.
Well, if you're making a filmwith an A-list actor, then
that's your marketability.
You don't say I'm making um afive million dollar film um
without mentioning that you havea star in it, right?
The only way you have to pitchthat film is I have a star in my
(16:06):
film.
That's it.
Um when you're making amicro-budget film, the the thing
that separates some micro-budgetfilms from others is that there
are genres that sell.
So I could go to any sales agentwith a horror film, they're
going to be interested.
(16:26):
I can go to any sales agent witha thriller, they're going to be
interested.
I can go to certain sales agentswith a faith-based film, they'll
be interested.
And so there are certain genresthat sell, and because
filmmakers don't think very muchin terms of genre, for again, I
often in my book I'll say, Idon't necessarily understand
(16:48):
this, but this is how filmmakersthink.
And so genre is one of thethings that they just are not
thinking about.
But um, those genres are verymarketable, and there there are
certain genres that are verymarketable.
Um, the least marketable genresare drama and comedy.
If you have a drama,micro-budget drama or a comedy,
(17:11):
it's going to be very difficultto get distribution.
What are the majority offirst-time feature filmmakers
doing?
They're making dramas andcomedies.
In fact, when I ask them thequestion, what are the most
marketable genres?
They'll say drama.
The next answer will be comedy.
That's what they think.
(17:31):
That's what they think.
SPEAKER_02 (17:32):
Right, it's a long way from true, but I'll guess.
So many filmmakers want to jumpstraight into fundraising, but
your formula puts calculate thevalue of your film before you
ever ask for a dollar.
So, how does a first-timefilmmaker realistically
(17:53):
calculate that value?
And why does skipping this stepkill so many projects?
SPEAKER_01 (18:01):
Yes, near a I would say half the filmmakers, I mean
more than half, uh, you know, ifI say what's your budget,
they'll say whatever it is,300,000, a million.
Um, but they can't tell me howmuch the film is going to make.
Because they've never actuallythought of that question.
(18:23):
And then the next thing theywill say is, well, there's no
way you can know how much a filmis going to make.
But there are plenty of ways youcan know how much a film is
going to make.
For example, I don't have anA-lister in my film.
My film is probably not going tobe making, you know, in the
millions.
Probably.
Um, I have a micro-budget drama,I can pretty much be with no
(18:46):
names, I can be pretty sure it'sgoing to make nothing.
So those are just kind of broadstrokes, but there are lots of
ways.
And the first session that Ihave with my clients, we go
through a checklist of how toincrease the value of the film.
And so, for example, I have adocumentary filmmaker, and one
(19:10):
of the ways he increased thevalue of his film was he got the
narration done by a very famous,probably famous to you and I,
Carol, not necessarily to ouryounger generation, but uh he
got Allie McGraw to do thenarration on his film.
Allie McGraw was a huge filmstar in the 70s, and um and she
(19:36):
is a big, big supporter of film.
And uh, you know, he said, Well,how much will I need to pay you
to do the narration?
She said, Oh, uh, if I chargedyou what I would have to charge
you, you wouldn't be able toafford me.
And it and so I'm gonna be doingit for free.
She shows up at all his events,she's doing the narration on his
(20:00):
second film.
They've become really goodfriends.
And the audience for his filmswill show up at a at a
screening, and uh Ali McGraw isgonna be there, right?
So she brings a lot of value toa film, and um, you know,
fiction filmmakers are used tothinking about celebrities, but
(20:21):
documentary filmmakers not somuch, but that can be very, very
valuable for your film.
Um, so in my very first sessionwith my clients, we go through
this checklist.
How do we increase the valuehere?
How do we increase the valuehere?
How do we increase the valuehere?
So if we start off with a valueof zero, by the end of that
(20:42):
first session, we have ended upadding dollars onto the value of
our film.
So um, but it's a very, veryimportant, and that's why I make
it the first thing.
It's a very foundational way ofthinking.
Stop thinking about what I wantto spend and start thinking
about how is this film going tomake money?
SPEAKER_02 (21:05):
Well done.
That's a great idea becausesometimes I see films that are a
business, actually, that thefilm starts out to be one thing
like forks over knives, wherethere's a way of how to eat
better, healthier, and then itthe film has become such a tiny
(21:27):
part, it became a big business.
They I last time I looked, theywere charging$350 to learn how
to cook the proper food.
So it became a very lucrativebusiness for them, and sometimes
people have that with theirfilms and don't recognize it.
(21:47):
You're the only one I've everheard talk about increase the
value of your film so terrific.
Um would that ever include uhbooks or creating a book to go
with it or um anything likethat, a secondary product?
SPEAKER_01 (22:07):
You know, it is extremely hard to market a film.
And I hear, in fact, I justheard from a filmmaker today
saying I'm I'm going to becreating a book.
The thing is, it's verydifficult to market a book.
So um I am not sure of the valueof adding a book to a film.
(22:31):
Um, however, I have a client umand she has a business as a
coach and she is making herfirst feature film.
It's got nothing to do with hercoaching or anything like that.
Um, but that film will actuallyincrease her coaching business.
(22:52):
And the second film, which isabout around the topic of her
coaching business, willdefinitely increase that
business.
So it's not that I think any ofthat doesn't work.
It it it does, but I think thatthe heavy lift of marketing, um,
I wouldn't suggest, you know, Idon't I don't really.
(23:12):
Believe in that model, althoughit's certainly worked in the
past.
But I think that yeah, peoplewill end up with a film that
they don't know how to marketand a book that they don't know
how to market, and that's a lot.
Okay.
I don't need to be negativeabout it, but I just think, you
(23:33):
know, just make raise yourmoney, make your film.
SPEAKER_02 (23:36):
Yes.
This is it.
One focus.
All right.
So you teach that creating adistribution plan comes before
fundraising, not after the filmis finished.
That's the opposite of what mostindie filmmakers think.
So why is this reversal of theirthinking so critical?
SPEAKER_01 (23:58):
Because even though I start my clients thinking
about distribution from day oneand I teach them a lot about
distribution, they can speakvery confidently with a lot of
clarity about distribution.
I also want them to thinkthrough what does distribution,
(24:19):
what would your idealdistribution plan look for you?
Right.
So my client who made the horrorfilm that got picked up by
Bloomhouse, that would have beenhis ideal choice.
Or A24, and they were actuallyin a in a bidding war for a
little while over his film.
You know, um maybe not everybodyis gonna have that experience,
(24:44):
you know, um, but it's stillsomething to look at because one
of my clients said to meyesterday, oh, my film is an A24
film.
That's a big thing to say, butum it fits that model, his film
fits that model better thanmost, right?
(25:05):
And so um, you know, he canstart now, he can he he watched
an A24 film the other night,he's gonna watch another one
tonight.
He's gonna start familiarizinghimself with that whole tone,
and that might change things inhis script.
Um, and then one day when thatfilm goes into distribution, um
(25:26):
whether A24 picks it up or notis is not necessarily the point,
but it will have been part ofthe vision and part of shaping
the film.
Um I have a uh documentaryclient right now, and I taught
her as I teach all documentaryfilmmakers the concept of an
(25:49):
impact campaign.
And so um an impact can well,you know what an impact campaign
is, but for the audience, Iwould just say um the simplest
way I think of an impactcampaign is say for the for the
documentary bully that was aboutbullying in middle schools.
And if I were making that filmtoday, maybe I would start my
(26:10):
impact campaign small and Iwould say, I'm gonna have one
screening a month at a middleschool, or I'm gonna have one
screening a month at an eventfor middle school teachers, and
I'm gonna uh raise money to payfor that uh those 12 screenings.
That's kind of the minimumversion of an impact campaign as
(26:33):
I can describe it.
But an impact campaign is totake a film and put it in front
of the audiences who need to seeit.
Um with my client, now that sheunderstands the concept of an
impact campaign, she's raisinguh$300,000 for her documentary.
(26:54):
Um, I ask my clients now toraise a minimum of$60,000 for
their impact campaigns.
And if you really had asuccessful impact campaign like
the campaign for bully, whichwas made like 30 years ago, and
still hires three full-timepeople to get that movie in
front of middle school teachers,right?
And middle school districts.
(27:15):
Yes, um that that her impactcampaign could eventually raise
more than the money it took tomake a film because it's about
screenings and getting in frontof people and um some films are
used to change legislation, youknow, uh the impact of a film.
Like you mentioned, forks overknives.
(27:36):
Forks over knives, that's not abusiness, that's a movement.
I I have a client, she made whenshe told me the film she wanted
to make, she wanted to make afilm about um racism and sexism
at the highest levels of thecorporate world in the UK.
Yes, and I said, that's not amovie, that's a movement.
(27:57):
And she she raised uh money tomake her films, very small
budget.
She made over a hundred thousanddollars in her first year with
that film, showing it incorporations that wanted to
retain uh black and minorityhires that they're losing, you
know, at a huge rate.
(28:18):
And um, and so for for employeeretention and and hiring, um,
she just did very, very wellwith her film.
She was a first-time filming.
SPEAKER_02 (28:30):
That is wonderful, and that's very true.
So you're really making themfocus on it, put it in uh the uh
budget and actually think andplan ahead of time.
So I'm all about intention,visualization to create the
future.
(28:50):
So this is exactly what you'redoing.
You're helping them create thatfuture ahead of time because too
many people have no idea.
They wait till they get there,then when they find out the
cost, they're shocked.
Um, and they're not ready to goback on the street and start
raising money.
So that's a great idea to put itin the budget.
SPEAKER_01 (29:13):
Wonderful.
Yeah, for an impact campaign, Ido advise filmmakers not to
spend any money on distributionif they're going a traditional
way with a sales agent and soon.
Um, there are uh a number ofschemes out there that charge
filmmakers money, and I don'tbelieve in any of that.
SPEAKER_02 (29:32):
Good.
Good.
Well, in your work as aconsulting producer, you've
helped people get 21 featuresinto distribution and 150 more
into development.
So, what are the patterns yousee again and again in
filmmakers who actually finishand distribute their films
(29:53):
versus the ones who stall?
SPEAKER_01 (29:57):
That's that's a great question.
Um it's we're now up to 25.
We have 25 films in distributionon my website.
We have another 10 to 15 comingout this year.
So um by the end of the year,we'll be at about 40.
And so out of the 150 projects,40 are already in distribution.
(30:21):
And then there are some clients,um, I call them my failures.
So I had this one client, shewas going to make her first
short film with me and raisemoney to make it, and but she
loved working as a PA.
And I said, Oh, let me um, I I Igot her a job interview with
with a friend of mine.
(30:42):
That didn't really lead toanything, but but I have all my
clients work on their resumesand you know, things like that.
So then she got a job as a PAdoing something or other.
Then she got a job at HBO, nowshe's an executive at uh CAA.
So I call her one of myfailures.
Oh okay.
(31:03):
She kept failing upwards.
So, you know, sometimes uhpeople find out that maybe the
filmmaking isn't what theyreally wanted.
I had a client who made ahistoric documentary, and he is
now a history professor.
SPEAKER_02 (31:21):
Oh, how wonderful!
SPEAKER_01 (31:22):
Yes, he found his colleague from filmmaking.
Yes, that's great.
It was not filmmaking, but itwas that deep interest in
history.
I have a I had a client who wasa VR filmmaker, and I ended up
getting her a job interview at auniversity, and that didn't pan
(31:43):
out, but the next job interviewdid, and she's been working
there now for about five years,full-time, running their VR lab
and teaching and making her ownfilms.
Oh, wonderful.
So so those are, you know, andthen I think that some people um
just sort of give up.
(32:05):
Uh, they get they uh they thinkthey can't do it, or or maybe
life happens, you know.
I had two filmmakers who weremaking this wonderful um
children's film, and andsomething happened, and I was
like, why are they notcommunicating with me and what's
(32:26):
going on?
Well, they went through abreakup, and now it's you know a
while's gone by, so it's timefor him to get back on the
horse.
But all kinds of things canhappen, but I think that giving
up is is the probably the mostdifficult um thing to get over.
(32:50):
Um, and you know, when I'mworking as a coach with someone
and they have the support, thatis really what they they need,
and probably what they need todo is to to continue coaching
rather than to to give up.
Um, but that's that's alwayssomething that we negotiate.
(33:10):
But um, you know, I I just um acolleague of mine, we'd become
friends and we've tried to workon projects over the years, he
just uh contacted me.
He's gonna be the head of astudio, a new studio that's
being built, and he's lookingfor projects.
And so I ended up, we actuallywent through my 150, well, minus
(33:30):
40 projects, and um he pickedout six.
He read the scripts, and he ismoving forward with two of them,
and um really wanted to moveforward with a third, and we
can't find that filmmaker, so uhI don't know what's going on
there.
Yeah.
(33:51):
But this has happened.
I I've had a client die and notget her film made, you know.
Yes, um, she has health issues,and various things happen in
life.
SPEAKER_02 (34:04):
I know from mentoring people too, life gets
in the way, and you have to staywith them through the life
trauma and keep them uh usingthe film to for because
sometimes when you have acreative project to put your
your attentions and your focuson, it helps you get through the
difficulties of life, but it'sall your work.
(34:29):
Well, your book talks aboutfinding the easiest fundraising
plan.
So not one size fits all.
So the question is how do youhelp a filmmaker identify which
strategy of fundraising fitstheir personality, their
network, their project, and uh,whether that's equity, grants,
(34:52):
crowdfunding, tax incentive,free sales, how do you handle
that?
SPEAKER_01 (35:00):
Well, it's different for everybody because it's
different not only for everyfilm, every filmmaker, and every
different place they're at intheir careers.
So I have a client who's a verywell-known filmmaker, his name
is Thomas Allen Harris, and weare currently finishing a$1.3
(35:23):
million documentary.
And, you know, when we firststarted working together, he was
certainly not working at thosebudgets, and he didn't have me.
So, and he was already a goodfundraiser when I met him.
Um, but we have uh grownexponentially.
We also, for that project, wewon a grant from the National
(35:44):
Science Foundation for$3.2million.
Oh, okay.
And now the NSF is reaching outto us to ask us to apply again.
So um, but in a in a somewhatdifferent program.
But um so, you know, uh, but notall my clients are at that
(36:06):
level.
So this one client that I wasjust talking about, her impact
campaign, for her, it's herfirst feature documentary.
She's raising$300,000 to dothat.
And we started, she worked withyou, thank you very much.
She worked with Alyra and sheraised about$10,000 on her
crowdfunding campaign.
(36:28):
And uh then she uh startedworking with a major donor, she
won her first grant that she andI worked on.
That was another$10,000.
Now we're working with a brandsponsorship person who's going
to be bringing uh brands.
The film is going to be on PBS.
Um, brands love to be on PBS.
(36:48):
Um, so you know that works forsome.
And then another documentaryfilmmaker I was talking to
yesterday, we just decided tonot go with PBS.
So um every film is different,things can change, um, but the
funding strategies uh workdifferently for everyone.
(37:11):
So I ended up, I had my myfilmmaker group about a month or
two ago.
It's like, oh wait, everybody inthis group is running a
crowdfunding campaign.
Um but uh now I have a clientwho's not, he's raising$1.5
million to make his campaign.
I mean, sorry, to make his film.
(37:32):
And um, he's not gonna run acrowdfunding campaign, he's just
gonna be going to investors.
It's what works for the person,you know.
But a lot of my clients gotreally excited about
crowdfunding all the same time.
I was like, yay, because I loveit when my clients decide to do
a crowdfunding campaign.
It's a great way to startfundraising, it's a great way to
(37:53):
practice talking to people aboutyour film and money.
It's a great starter.
Um, we I have a client whoraised um, what was it,$13,000
on her crowdfunding campaign.
She also is with you.
And thank you very much.
(38:14):
And she took$10,000 of thosedollars to pay hire one of the
casting directors I work withwho is an A-list casting
director.
So now we're we're still gonnamake her film for$300,000, but
it's gonna have much higherlevel actors in it.
So we've increased the value ofher film radically by adding
(38:38):
this uh casting director.
So all of these are, I think, Ithink in terms of business
models, right?
So if we're making a smallbudget film, what can we do to
increase the value?
It might be attaching a castingdirector.
So it might be simplest to do acrowdfunding campaign.
(39:00):
Now we can hire the castingdirector.
You know, so um there are somany paths, and I'm I'm just
good at you know, seeing whatthe best path is.
And then the truth is,documentary filmmakers, um, I
teach seven different types offundraising.
They often have access to moretypes of fundraising than a
fiction filmmaker has.
(39:21):
You know, for a fictionfilmmaker, it might be
crowdfunding than investors.
That's only two.
But um now I'm working with thisuh brand sponsor person, so uh
some of my clients are workingwith her.
Um, and that's great becausethat was always the one I knew
the least about.
We often we get a lot of um uhcompanies working with my
(39:45):
clients.
I have them work on that fromday one, you know, uh, giving
locations, food, all kinds ofthings to bring down the budget
because there's two ways you canraise money.
You can raise money or you canlower your budget.
You know, those are the two waysyou can do it.
Um, so we've done that for along time, but now I'm working
with somebody who's bringingcash to films.
(40:08):
So that's really exciting andand uh very, very, very
exciting.
SPEAKER_02 (40:13):
Yes, this is what the big and uh in filmmakers do.
I mean, sometimes when they'remulti-million dollar budget,
they're still they've got Ford,their Chevrolet with all their
cars, they've got theirbranding.
They open a cabinet, there'sAnne Jeremima's something or
another.
Right.
(40:34):
Right, and so you're working nowwith a branding person.
This is brilliant.
SPEAKER_01 (40:40):
Yes, yes, that's very recent.
I I I've discovered I have acousin who works in product
placement, but he only workswith A-list actors, right?
So I I didn't have uh films thatwould work for him, right?
But now I didn't even think ofthis till this minute.
(41:02):
But now that we have a castingdirector who can cast A-listers,
maybe I can go back to him andsay, what brands can you bring?
So yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (41:12):
It's wonderful.
So documentary filmmakers andfiction filmmakers often feel
like they live in two differentfinancing worlds.
So, from your vantage point,coaching both of them, where do
these worlds overlap and wheredo filmmakers get in trouble by
borrowing the wrong playbook?
SPEAKER_01 (41:35):
I don't see um filmmakers so much borrowing the
wrong playbook as using alimited playbook, a too-limited
playbook.
Um, I was once hired as aconsultant by a large women's
documentary um organization, andI had five filmmakers to work
with, and each of the five hadreceived a$100,000 grant.
(41:59):
That's really amazing,$100,000grant.
So they were doing somethingvery well, right?
But documentary filmmakers tendto have an obsession with
grants, which is fine.
Um, but they don't know thestrategies I teach around grant
writing, because grant writingis kind of my superpower, but
(42:22):
they don't know thosestrategies, so they often spend
way too much time working ongrants and burning themselves
out, and they they they don'tknow how to do it more
efficiently.
But what happened with each ofthese brilliant women was that
not one of them except one hadraised any other money.
(42:42):
And one of them had raised athousand dollars from a donor.
I'm like, uh, you raise athousand dollars from a grant,
you need to be matching thatwith donors, and they were like,
what?
And you know, and I talkedabout, you know, all my clients,
we start out, you know, with a$20,000 crowdfunding campaign.
(43:06):
Um they were like, what?
So documentary filmmakers thinkin terms of grants and they're
very not thinking about anythingelse.
Um, but there are certain waysof fundraising that are open to
them.
So I tend to, when I teach, Itend to not do something like a
(43:26):
grant writing workshop.
I'm always wanting to teach thisconcept of expanding your
portfolio.
And when I was a consultant tononprofits, I did I saw the same
thing.
They would land on a couple ofways of fundraising and not do
anything with anything else.
And I would just start them outwith the other ones, and that
(43:49):
can grow over time, but youdon't want to be only focused in
one or two types of fundraising,it's just there's all this other
money available, you know, andum and they're just missing out
with fiction filmmakers.
They never think about grants.
And I remember one of my clientsone time we were in a class, and
(44:11):
he I saw this light bulb goingoff in his head about something
I'd been talking about for aboutan hour, and this light bulb
went off, and he's like, Wait,are there grants for fiction
filmmakers?
unknown (44:25):
I was like, Yes.
SPEAKER_01 (44:27):
Yes, there are screenwriting grants, production
grants, post-production grants,all kinds of grants.
Great.
So it's not it's not thatthey're in the wrong playbook,
they're just not they they'renot aware of all the
possibilities.
So film fiction filmmakers thinkthe only way to raise money is
(44:48):
either crowdfunding orinvestors, they don't realize,
oh, we could do both.
How about that?
That would be useful.
Um, so all my fiction filmmakerswho chose to do that
crowdfunding campaign, they'rethey're also using that to
leverage looking for investors.
So, and and and each and onceyou Playing with this whole um
(45:16):
these all these differentopportunities, one helps the
other, you know.
So you write a grant, and all ofa sudden you're communicating
better about your film, and yourfilm improves, all the grants
improve your film.
And once you run a crowdfundingcampaign, you know, my clients
start to have, they're like, ohmy God, I'm so scared to speak
(45:38):
to people.
And by the end, they're like, Ohyeah, I'm talking to all these
different people, and it becomeslike a normal thing.
Yeah, they don't know that atthe beginning, and they have all
this emotional baggage,spiritual baggage, and then by
the end it's become normalized,and now they're ready, they're
much in a much more ready placeto talk to investors.
(46:03):
Exactly.
SPEAKER_02 (46:05):
Yes, this is wonderful.
It's a confidence, you're givingthem confidence, and the
crowdfunding gives themconfidence.
That's wonderful.
unknown (46:15):
Yes.
SPEAKER_02 (46:15):
Now, as a biracial woman and a global ambassador,
you've been very clear that youwant all filmmakers to have the
capacity to tell their storieswell.
So, what specific advice do yougive to filmmakers from
underrepresented backgrounds whoare walking into fundraising
rooms for the first time?
SPEAKER_01 (46:37):
I think the most important thing that I've seen
with my uh I'm half Trinidadian,I've had several clients from
Trinidad and Tobago, I've hadclients from South Africa, um,
Australia, England.
And the most important thingthat they have to learn is that
Americans are not superior,which is what they really have
(47:03):
been taught by their cultures.
And I remember years ago, Iworked with the Brazilian Film
Festival here in Miami for like28 years, and we used to, I used
to run their trade show, and wehad panels on filmmaking, and we
had simultaneous translation.
They would bring 200 Brazilianfilmmakers up every year, and I
would bring Americans who wereproducers and different things.
(47:26):
And I had this producing teamwho were friends of mine.
Um, and uh so all the Braziliansare there to listen to how
they're gonna make money likeAmericans, because America, you
know, they get money.
In the middle of the talk, thesetwo producers, they're listening
to questions and everything, andthey're saying, wait, they said,
Are you telling me that you'regetting money from your
(47:47):
government to make films?
And the Brazilians are all yes,and they're like, the producers
are like, What?
Could you tell us more aboutthat?
Every other country in the worldhas um government funding for
films, except America.
The only one that doesn't havethe federal government funds as
(48:08):
other funds.
But uh it was so funny, and allthe Brazilians are thinking, Oh,
we've got to learn from theAmericans because we want to be
in the American market and wewant to make films like
Americans and we want to beAmerican, and the Americans are
like, You said what now you'reraising how much to make your
(48:30):
movies?
SPEAKER_02 (48:32):
Right.
Okay.
Well, let's get tactical for ourlisteners.
If a filmmaker is sitting attheir kitchen table listening to
this with a script and no money,what are the first three
concrete actions from your bookthat they should take this week
to start moving towards a fundedproduction?
SPEAKER_01 (48:56):
Well, the first thing is call me.
No, the first thing is in thebook uh we talk about the
marketability.
There's a long section in thebook about getting that script,
or if you're a documentaryfilmmaker, getting that
documentary to a more marketableplace.
(49:17):
Whatever place it's at today,you can get it to a more
marketable place by thinkingthrough the marketability
question.
Um the second thing I would sayis to um decide which of the
seven types of fundraisingyou're gonna raise, you're gonna
(49:37):
use.
I would commit to a minimum oftwo and as close to seven as you
possibly can get.
And then uh to do all thepreparation going through the
box office success formula, doall that preparation before you
(49:57):
start fundraising.
So even if you're looking toraise, you know, I have my short
film clients raise$11,000 or$12,000 to make a short.
But even if that's what you'redoing what you decide you're
gonna do, you want to do all thepreparation that's in the book
first before you start yourfundraising.
(50:19):
You're a much better.
SPEAKER_02 (50:22):
Yes, this is good advice.
Thank you.
So, where can the listeners findyou and get your book and
possibly even work directly withyou?
SPEAKER_01 (50:33):
The uh you can get the book on Amazon, you can just
um go to Amazon, put my name in,and the book will pop up and you
can get it there.
You can get it in most countriesuh in the world, I believe,
which is uh interesting.
Um, and then if they want tospeak to me, um either email me.
(50:55):
My email address is Joanne atfilmmakersuccess.com.
My business is called FilmmakerSuccess.
Uh, or um there's a link to mycalendar at
www.filmmakersuccess.com slashbook hyphen a hyphen call.
That might be a lot to remember,but um if you go to my website,
(51:19):
you'll find a link to mycalendar so that you can book a
call with me.
And my website iswww.filmmakersuccess.com.
I would love to hear from you.
I love talking to filmmakers.
Filmmakers are my favoritepeople.
SPEAKER_02 (51:33):
Oh, how nice.
This is a they will love to hearthat.
Filmmakersuccess.com.
SPEAKER_01 (51:40):
Got it.
Filmmaker, it's one filmmaker,so filmmakersuccess.com.
Singular.
Okay.
SPEAKER_02 (51:49):
And now, um, what's one piece of encouragement you'd
leave with the filmmaker who'sbeen told no too many times and
wants to know, do I keep goingor not?
SPEAKER_01 (52:04):
Fundraising is a profoundly spiritual practice.
And I had to have a conversationwith one of my clients the other
day and say every time we have acall, you show up with a
negative comment.
It has to go.
We're we are graduating frombeing filmmakers to being
(52:24):
fundraisers.
The filmmaking is never going togo anywhere.
The fundraising is going tochange, it's going to keep
changing.
And eventually we have to make adecision that we're going to let
go of negative thinking for themoney to arrive.
So that may not sound like apractical thing, but it's
everything.
(52:44):
It's absolutely everything.
SPEAKER_02 (52:47):
I totally agree with you.
Totally agree with you.
Your mind is your greatestbenefit in funding films.
It has to be working with you100%, Joanne.
SPEAKER_01 (53:01):
But if a filmmaker has been trying and trying and
trying and trying and gettingno, it's because they don't have
the correct strategy.
It's not because of something todo with their work.
It's they don't have thefundraising strategy.
I like to tell people (53:14):
if you were to sign up today for a
class to fly a plane and youwould know in three months how
to fly a plane, you would not goout there today and get in a
plane and turn the key on andtry and fly it.
You would know that you neededto do the study in the practice
for three months.
And that's that's what I'mtrying to get across is that you
(53:38):
can't just filmmakers have thisidea that they can start from
standing zero and become afundraiser.
No.
And within a very few minutes ofa conversation, I can I know
exactly where the filmmaker isin is in the wrong strategy.
(53:59):
And that's always what it isthat's getting them the nose.
Always, not sometimes, always.
SPEAKER_02 (54:09):
This is marvelous.
So thank you so much for sharingyour wisdom, your experience,
and your generous spirit withour listeners.
And what I love about yourapproach is that you take
something that feelsoverwhelming to filmmakers,
which is raising money, and youturn it into a practical,
hopeful, step-by-step processthat people can actually follow.
(54:33):
Your success formula remindsfilmmakers that funding is not
magic, it's preparation,clarity, strategy, and believing
enough in your story to keepmoving forward one step at a
time.
So, for those of you listening,you can learn more about Joanne
Butcher, her coaching programs,and her wonderful book, Getting
(54:55):
Your Film Funded, Produced andDistributed Globally, a Seven
Step System, the Film Box Officesuccess formula at
JoanneButcher.com and FilmmakersSuccess.com.
Filmmakersuccess.com.
(55:16):
And to every filmmaker out therewho may be discouraged or
wondering if your project willever get made, please remember
this.
Every great film begins withsomeone who refused to give up
on a story they believed thatthey needed to tell.
So you have to keep learning,keep going, and keep taking the
(55:37):
next step forward because yourvoice matters.
You are the magic.
Hollywood needs you.
I'm Carol Dean, and this is theArt of Film Funding.
Thanks for listening, and ClairePapan and I will see you next
week.
Thank you so much, Carol.
Thank you, Joanne.
(55:58):
You're so good to filmmakers.
You're greatly appreciated.
Stay with us because Joanne Butcher is about to
reveal why most films never getfunded and seven steps that can
benefit your project and yourfunding.
SPEAKER_00 (01:29):
So glad you could join us here for the Art of Film
Funding podcast.
I'm Claire Papan, co-producerwith Carol Dean, writer,
producer, and president of Fromthe Heart Productions.
And we have film financinginformation to share with you
today.
Our guest is Joanne Butcher, theFilm Vision Alchemist, a
(01:54):
consulting producer and filmfunding coach who has helped
indie filmmakers put 21 featuresinto distribution and over 150
more into development.
Joanne is the author of GettingYour Film Funded, Produced and
Distributed Globally, aSeven-Step System, the Film Box
(02:18):
Office Success Formula.
The book filmmakers are callingthe missing manual for how to
actually pay for the movie youwant to make.
This book distills hertwo-decade methodology into a
complete roadmap for indiefilmmakers.
Over her career, Joanne hasraised millions of dollars, led
(02:43):
teams of professionalfundraisers, and trained
nonprofit boards across multiplesectors before turning her full
attention to teaching filmmakershow to raise money.
Today she works with bothdocumentary and fiction
filmmakers, helping them developtheir projects through the lens
(03:05):
of the funds they actually needto move their films and their
careers forward.
Carol sits down with Joannetoday to unpack the seven steps,
why most indie films stallbefore they ever raise a dollar,
and how filmmakers at any budgetlevel can build a real world to
(03:29):
a real-world plan to get funded,get made, and reach a global
audience.
Carol, I'll turn this over toyou now.
Thanks, Claire.
And Joanne, thank you forjoining us.
SPEAKER_02 (03:43):
Thank you for having me.
Well, there's so many things wewant to cover.
So we're going to get startedabout your story.
It's a fascinating story.
You're a fundraising executive,a nonprofit trainer, a
consulting producer, and now abest-selling author.
So let's start with what was themoment when you realized
(04:06):
filmmakers needed a completelydifferent approach to raising
money.
SPEAKER_01 (04:20):
I was like, wait a minute, you know, some of our
members have made feature filmsalready.
And uh let me bring them in.
I think it was about 11 of them,and do a focus group with them
and see what it is that theyneed and what I can help with
because we were tended to beteaching uh practical.
You know, I used to teachscreenwriting myself.
(04:42):
Uh, we taught sound, we taughtdirecting, we taught all kinds
of things.
Um, and so I thought, what do weneed to do for feature
filmmakers?
What how can we help them?
So I did this first focus group,and basically I said, you know,
how can we help?
And what the answer was that Imostly got was nothing.
(05:07):
We're doing it all by ourselves.
And I was like, oh, that's whatthe independent in independent
filmmakers means.
I do it all by myself, I don'tneed any help, but that kind of
thinking.
And that was a big moment for mebecause I realized, but you
know, fundraising, there are allthere's all kinds of techniques,
(05:28):
there's all kinds of strategies.
They don't know any of thesetechniques and strategies, but
they also don't know that theydon't know how much they would
benefit from them.
And it's interesting becausestill to this day I find that at
least half the filmmakers Ispeak to, and I speak to a lot,
don't actually know that thereis a possibility to learn
(05:52):
fundraising.
That's that's the first thing.
So you can become a betterfundraiser, you can become a
better, a more experienced, moreeducated fundraiser.
It's a skill that you can learnjust the same way you learned
lighting, just the same way youlearned interview techniques.
Um, but they don't realizethat's a possibility.
(06:14):
And then the other half I speakto know that fundraising is
important and they don't knowhow to do it or how to get
better at it.
And um so that there are sort oftwo types of filmmakers: the
ones that don't know anything,you know, that there is such a
(06:36):
thing as fundraising, and theothers that do, but but realize
that they don't know anythingabout it and don't understand.
And it's not their fault.
I write about this in my book.
Even the top film schools, I wasspeaking to AFI recently, do not
teach anything about raisingmoney in their programs.
(06:57):
So you can get a film schooldegree and not know the first
thing about raising money tomake your films.
SPEAKER_02 (07:05):
I know that because working as a sponsor and uh
you're having taking people onwhen they've graduated from some
of the top colleges, it's it'sreally shocking when they come
out and they know how to make afilm, but they don't know the
first thing of fundraising.
Joanne, you're so right.
SPEAKER_01 (07:25):
Um, they did teach me.
I have a client, I have a clientwho graduated from NYU film
school.
Yes.
And he was a very young man.
I met him through his mother,actually.
And he told me, you know, I wantto make my own film, and I don't
have any idea.
My film school training taughtme to go to LA and get a job,
(07:46):
and I don't want a job.
And he made his first featurefilm with me, a micro-budget
horror film.
He made his second feature filmwith me, a micro-budget horror
film.
It was supposed to come out indistribution in January, and
about two days before it wassupposed to get released,
Bloomhouse swooped in and pickedup the film.
(08:07):
So I have my first like hot inHollywood client, but that's
exactly the trajectory.
He graduated from NYV FilmSchool, can't do better than
that, and knew not a clue abouthow to get his first film made.
And now he's going to be famous.
SPEAKER_02 (08:26):
Isn't that wonderful?
This is the kind of stories welike to hear.
Well, let's talk about the titleof your book because it's very
bold.
Getting your film funded,produced, and distributed
globally.
So, why did you put globally inthe title?
And what do most American indiefilmmakers misunderstand about
(08:48):
the international market?
SPEAKER_01 (08:51):
Oh, what a great question.
Um, well, what I saw when Ilooked around me and saw uh my
friends making, you know,multimillion dollar films, um
independent but still, you know,with A-list actors and
everything, what I saw was thatthey already had distribution
before they made the film.
(09:12):
And so I thought, well, if myclient is making a$200,000 film,
a$500,000 film, a$2 millionfilm, then I want them to have
distribution before they beginas well.
So uh the way that I work thatis I work with a couple of sales
agents, and um, you know, Icould work with more, but I
(09:32):
there's a couple that I'vegotten used to working with.
And uh we actually created somelanguage um that my clients can
use in their pitch decks.
Uh it doesn't say we alreadyhave distribution, but it does
say we already have access tosales agents and access to
distribution once the movie iscomplete.
(09:54):
And I actually kept it on thatlevel because I don't really
want my clients to signanything, right?
Even that story I just told, um,I wouldn't before he made the
film, I wouldn't have wanted tosign with a sales agent because
I don't want them locked in.
You know, what if Bloomhousedoes come calling?
You want to be able?
(10:14):
And actually, it was a bit messybecause of the sales agent he
was signed up with, which wasn'tone of mine.
But um so um I have my clientsbegin with the end in mind,
begin with, I'm gettingdistribution for this film, and
then we reverse engineerbackwards.
And so learning how to be ableto speak about a film that's
(10:39):
going into distribution asopposed to a story that I want
to tell, has the conversationstart being about business from
day one.
Does that make sense?
Could I explain it?
SPEAKER_02 (10:52):
Absolutely, that's really great.
You're so right.
This is um, it's really verydifficult for filmmakers when
they get two-thirds finished andsay, okay, now what about
distribution?
Where they would have beenthinking of that since day one.
That's very so terrific.
(11:12):
That's the number one thing isto let them know.
So let's walk our listenersthrough the framework of your
book because it's built aroundthe success formula, a
seven-step system.
So you take the word success andbreak each letter down.
So um give us a high-level tourof what each letter stands for
(11:37):
and why that order matters, andthen we can go through it
together.
SPEAKER_01 (11:43):
Lovely.
Um, so if I I guess if I reallyspoke to a filmmaker and said,
we're going to start withdistribution, they might not
want to listen to me.
So S, the first letter insuccess, stands for script.
Now every book filmmaker ishappy, you know.
Oh, we're talking about ascript.
That's the most important thing,right?
We all agree on that.
(12:03):
What I teach them is how do wemake this not so much a more
excellent script?
They've already been working onthat by the time they find me,
most of them.
Um, they want it to be the bestscript it can be.
They've worked on it sometimesfor years.
And then I come along and I'mlike, how do we make this more
marketable?
(12:24):
How do we make this moreappealing for a sales agent?
And I have people who have likeI have a client right now, he's
written a crime thriller inLondon, and um he realized as he
was going through the processwith me that he wanted to make
(12:45):
it a faith-based movie.
So we're going to have afaith-based crime thriller.
It was already there in thebones of the story, but now it's
it's clearly from a marketingstandpoint a faith-based film.
And um, interestingly, we haveattached a casting director who
was particularly interested infaith-based films, who's
(13:06):
bringing along with him aninvestor who's particularly
interested in faith-based films.
So again, the story is reallythe same, but the butt the
approach makes it much moremarketable.
Another uh client I had, she wasmaking a um a drama, she told
me.
And then um first thing I do isI read my client's scripts.
(13:30):
I read the story and I said, butthis is um a thriller, Debbie,
it's a thriller.
She said, No, it's not, it's adrama.
I said, No, it's a thriller.
She said, No, it's a thrillerdrama.
I said, No, it's a thriller.
I said, Because the maincharacter ends up being jumped
by a gang.
For several minutes of the film,we don't know where she is or
(13:51):
what happened to her or if she'seven alive.
She wakes up in a hospital andthen she gets herself out of the
hospital and she goes to theplace where she had seen that
hidden gun and she goes andrescues the child.
It's a thriller.
Yes.
And she had not seen that.
Most most filmmakers don't.
For some reason, every filmmakerI say, what's the genre of your
(14:13):
film?
It's a drama.
I don't know what that's about.
Well, it's about notunderstanding the industry.
So if she had gone out with a,if she had made that film and it
had been a drama with no namesand, you know, very micro
budget, she would have had nooffice of distribution.
Instead, she did a one-pagerewrite, took it out as a
(14:34):
thriller, and she got 15 offersof distribution.
Oh wow.
How incredible! Yeah, yeah.
One page rewrite.
But that one page turned it intoa far more marketable script.
And that's the kind of work thatI'm doing with my clients.
SPEAKER_02 (14:53):
Most people that are interested in investing often
just read that one or one and ahalf pages, right?
SPEAKER_01 (15:01):
Well, uh, or just the log line, or um, I train my
clients, uh I do a lot oftraining in their verbal pitch,
and I train them to really givevery little more than the log
line, whether it's a documentaryor a fiction film.
Um, the rest is about you knowthe business.
SPEAKER_02 (15:21):
Okay, so step one is the script.
Create a marketable script.
So one creates the script thatinvestors and distributors will
actually back from one that'sbeloved by the writer.
I mean, this sometimes they tellme I channel this script.
(15:43):
I'm not changing a word.
SPEAKER_01 (15:45):
Yes, yes, that's common.
Well, if you're making a filmwith an A-list actor, then
that's your marketability.
You don't say I'm making um afive million dollar film um
without mentioning that you havea star in it, right?
The only way you have to pitchthat film is I have a star in my
(16:06):
film.
That's it.
Um when you're making amicro-budget film, the the thing
that separates some micro-budgetfilms from others is that there
are genres that sell.
So I could go to any sales agentwith a horror film, they're
going to be interested.
(16:26):
I can go to any sales agent witha thriller, they're going to be
interested.
I can go to certain sales agentswith a faith-based film, they'll
be interested.
And so there are certain genresthat sell, and because
filmmakers don't think very muchin terms of genre, for again, I
often in my book I'll say, Idon't necessarily understand
(16:48):
this, but this is how filmmakersthink.
And so genre is one of thethings that they just are not
thinking about.
But um, those genres are verymarketable, and there there are
certain genres that are verymarketable.
Um, the least marketable genresare drama and comedy.
If you have a drama,micro-budget drama or a comedy,
(17:11):
it's going to be very difficultto get distribution.
What are the majority offirst-time feature filmmakers
doing?
They're making dramas andcomedies.
In fact, when I ask them thequestion, what are the most
marketable genres?
They'll say drama.
The next answer will be comedy.
That's what they think.
(17:31):
That's what they think.
SPEAKER_02 (17:32):
Right, it's a long way from true, but I'll guess.
So many filmmakers want to jumpstraight into fundraising, but
your formula puts calculate thevalue of your film before you
ever ask for a dollar.
So, how does a first-timefilmmaker realistically
(17:53):
calculate that value?
And why does skipping this stepkill so many projects?
SPEAKER_01 (18:01):
Yes, near a I would say half the filmmakers, I mean
more than half, uh, you know, ifI say what's your budget,
they'll say whatever it is,300,000, a million.
Um, but they can't tell me howmuch the film is going to make.
Because they've never actuallythought of that question.
(18:23):
And then the next thing theywill say is, well, there's no
way you can know how much a filmis going to make.
But there are plenty of ways youcan know how much a film is
going to make.
For example, I don't have anA-lister in my film.
My film is probably not going tobe making, you know, in the
millions.
Probably.
Um, I have a micro-budget drama,I can pretty much be with no
(18:46):
names, I can be pretty sure it'sgoing to make nothing.
So those are just kind of broadstrokes, but there are lots of
ways.
And the first session that Ihave with my clients, we go
through a checklist of how toincrease the value of the film.
And so, for example, I have adocumentary filmmaker, and one
(19:10):
of the ways he increased thevalue of his film was he got the
narration done by a very famous,probably famous to you and I,
Carol, not necessarily to ouryounger generation, but uh he
got Allie McGraw to do thenarration on his film.
Allie McGraw was a huge filmstar in the 70s, and um and she
(19:36):
is a big, big supporter of film.
And uh, you know, he said, Well,how much will I need to pay you
to do the narration?
She said, Oh, uh, if I chargedyou what I would have to charge
you, you wouldn't be able toafford me.
And it and so I'm gonna be doingit for free.
She shows up at all his events,she's doing the narration on his
(20:00):
second film.
They've become really goodfriends.
And the audience for his filmswill show up at a at a
screening, and uh Ali McGraw isgonna be there, right?
So she brings a lot of value toa film, and um, you know,
fiction filmmakers are used tothinking about celebrities, but
(20:21):
documentary filmmakers not somuch, but that can be very, very
valuable for your film.
Um, so in my very first sessionwith my clients, we go through
this checklist.
How do we increase the valuehere?
How do we increase the valuehere?
How do we increase the valuehere?
So if we start off with a valueof zero, by the end of that
(20:42):
first session, we have ended upadding dollars onto the value of
our film.
So um, but it's a very, veryimportant, and that's why I make
it the first thing.
It's a very foundational way ofthinking.
Stop thinking about what I wantto spend and start thinking
about how is this film going tomake money?
SPEAKER_02 (21:05):
Well done.
That's a great idea becausesometimes I see films that are a
business, actually, that thefilm starts out to be one thing
like forks over knives, wherethere's a way of how to eat
better, healthier, and then itthe film has become such a tiny
(21:27):
part, it became a big business.
They I last time I looked, theywere charging$350 to learn how
to cook the proper food.
So it became a very lucrativebusiness for them, and sometimes
people have that with theirfilms and don't recognize it.
(21:47):
You're the only one I've everheard talk about increase the
value of your film so terrific.
Um would that ever include uhbooks or creating a book to go
with it or um anything likethat, a secondary product?
SPEAKER_01 (22:07):
You know, it is extremely hard to market a film.
And I hear, in fact, I justheard from a filmmaker today
saying I'm I'm going to becreating a book.
The thing is, it's verydifficult to market a book.
So um I am not sure of the valueof adding a book to a film.
(22:31):
Um, however, I have a client umand she has a business as a
coach and she is making herfirst feature film.
It's got nothing to do with hercoaching or anything like that.
Um, but that film will actuallyincrease her coaching business.
(22:52):
And the second film, which isabout around the topic of her
coaching business, willdefinitely increase that
business.
So it's not that I think any ofthat doesn't work.
It it it does, but I think thatthe heavy lift of marketing, um,
I wouldn't suggest, you know, Idon't I don't really.
(23:12):
Believe in that model, althoughit's certainly worked in the
past.
But I think that yeah, peoplewill end up with a film that
they don't know how to marketand a book that they don't know
how to market, and that's a lot.
Okay.
I don't need to be negativeabout it, but I just think, you
(23:33):
know, just make raise yourmoney, make your film.
SPEAKER_02 (23:36):
Yes.
This is it.
One focus.
All right.
So you teach that creating adistribution plan comes before
fundraising, not after the filmis finished.
That's the opposite of what mostindie filmmakers think.
So why is this reversal of theirthinking so critical?
SPEAKER_01 (23:58):
Because even though I start my clients thinking
about distribution from day oneand I teach them a lot about
distribution, they can speakvery confidently with a lot of
clarity about distribution.
I also want them to thinkthrough what does distribution,
(24:19):
what would your idealdistribution plan look for you?
Right.
So my client who made the horrorfilm that got picked up by
Bloomhouse, that would have beenhis ideal choice.
Or A24, and they were actuallyin a in a bidding war for a
little while over his film.
You know, um maybe not everybodyis gonna have that experience,
(24:44):
you know, um, but it's stillsomething to look at because one
of my clients said to meyesterday, oh, my film is an A24
film.
That's a big thing to say, butum it fits that model, his film
fits that model better thanmost, right?
(25:05):
And so um, you know, he canstart now, he can he he watched
an A24 film the other night,he's gonna watch another one
tonight.
He's gonna start familiarizinghimself with that whole tone,
and that might change things inhis script.
Um, and then one day when thatfilm goes into distribution, um
(25:26):
whether A24 picks it up or notis is not necessarily the point,
but it will have been part ofthe vision and part of shaping
the film.
Um I have a uh documentaryclient right now, and I taught
her as I teach all documentaryfilmmakers the concept of an
(25:49):
impact campaign.
And so um an impact can well,you know what an impact campaign
is, but for the audience, Iwould just say um the simplest
way I think of an impactcampaign is say for the for the
documentary bully that was aboutbullying in middle schools.
And if I were making that filmtoday, maybe I would start my
(26:10):
impact campaign small and Iwould say, I'm gonna have one
screening a month at a middleschool, or I'm gonna have one
screening a month at an eventfor middle school teachers, and
I'm gonna uh raise money to payfor that uh those 12 screenings.
That's kind of the minimumversion of an impact campaign as
(26:33):
I can describe it.
But an impact campaign is totake a film and put it in front
of the audiences who need to seeit.
Um with my client, now that sheunderstands the concept of an
impact campaign, she's raisinguh$300,000 for her documentary.
(26:54):
Um, I ask my clients now toraise a minimum of$60,000 for
their impact campaigns.
And if you really had asuccessful impact campaign like
the campaign for bully, whichwas made like 30 years ago, and
still hires three full-timepeople to get that movie in
front of middle school teachers,right?
And middle school districts.
(27:15):
Yes, um that that her impactcampaign could eventually raise
more than the money it took tomake a film because it's about
screenings and getting in frontof people and um some films are
used to change legislation, youknow, uh the impact of a film.
Like you mentioned, forks overknives.
(27:36):
Forks over knives, that's not abusiness, that's a movement.
I I have a client, she made whenshe told me the film she wanted
to make, she wanted to make afilm about um racism and sexism
at the highest levels of thecorporate world in the UK.
Yes, and I said, that's not amovie, that's a movement.
(27:57):
And she she raised uh money tomake her films, very small
budget.
She made over a hundred thousanddollars in her first year with
that film, showing it incorporations that wanted to
retain uh black and minorityhires that they're losing, you
know, at a huge rate.
(28:18):
And um, and so for for employeeretention and and hiring, um,
she just did very, very wellwith her film.
She was a first-time filming.
SPEAKER_02 (28:30):
That is wonderful, and that's very true.
So you're really making themfocus on it, put it in uh the uh
budget and actually think andplan ahead of time.
So I'm all about intention,visualization to create the
future.
(28:50):
So this is exactly what you'redoing.
You're helping them create thatfuture ahead of time because too
many people have no idea.
They wait till they get there,then when they find out the
cost, they're shocked.
Um, and they're not ready to goback on the street and start
raising money.
So that's a great idea to put itin the budget.
SPEAKER_01 (29:13):
Wonderful.
Yeah, for an impact campaign, Ido advise filmmakers not to
spend any money on distributionif they're going a traditional
way with a sales agent and soon.
Um, there are uh a number ofschemes out there that charge
filmmakers money, and I don'tbelieve in any of that.
SPEAKER_02 (29:32):
Good.
Good.
Well, in your work as aconsulting producer, you've
helped people get 21 featuresinto distribution and 150 more
into development.
So, what are the patterns yousee again and again in
filmmakers who actually finishand distribute their films
(29:53):
versus the ones who stall?
SPEAKER_01 (29:57):
That's that's a great question.
Um it's we're now up to 25.
We have 25 films in distributionon my website.
We have another 10 to 15 comingout this year.
So um by the end of the year,we'll be at about 40.
And so out of the 150 projects,40 are already in distribution.
(30:21):
And then there are some clients,um, I call them my failures.
So I had this one client, shewas going to make her first
short film with me and raisemoney to make it, and but she
loved working as a PA.
And I said, Oh, let me um, I I Igot her a job interview with
with a friend of mine.
(30:42):
That didn't really lead toanything, but but I have all my
clients work on their resumesand you know, things like that.
So then she got a job as a PAdoing something or other.
Then she got a job at HBO, nowshe's an executive at uh CAA.
So I call her one of myfailures.
Oh okay.
(31:03):
She kept failing upwards.
So, you know, sometimes uhpeople find out that maybe the
filmmaking isn't what theyreally wanted.
I had a client who made ahistoric documentary, and he is
now a history professor.
SPEAKER_02 (31:21):
Oh, how wonderful!
SPEAKER_01 (31:22):
Yes, he found his colleague from filmmaking.
Yes, that's great.
It was not filmmaking, but itwas that deep interest in
history.
I have a I had a client who wasa VR filmmaker, and I ended up
getting her a job interview at auniversity, and that didn't pan
(31:43):
out, but the next job interviewdid, and she's been working
there now for about five years,full-time, running their VR lab
and teaching and making her ownfilms.
Oh, wonderful.
So so those are, you know, andthen I think that some people um
just sort of give up.
(32:05):
Uh, they get they uh they thinkthey can't do it, or or maybe
life happens, you know.
I had two filmmakers who weremaking this wonderful um
children's film, and andsomething happened, and I was
like, why are they notcommunicating with me and what's
(32:26):
going on?
Well, they went through abreakup, and now it's you know a
while's gone by, so it's timefor him to get back on the
horse.
But all kinds of things canhappen, but I think that giving
up is is the probably the mostdifficult um thing to get over.
(32:50):
Um, and you know, when I'mworking as a coach with someone
and they have the support, thatis really what they they need,
and probably what they need todo is to to continue coaching
rather than to to give up.
Um, but that's that's alwayssomething that we negotiate.
(33:10):
But um, you know, I I just um acolleague of mine, we'd become
friends and we've tried to workon projects over the years, he
just uh contacted me.
He's gonna be the head of astudio, a new studio that's
being built, and he's lookingfor projects.
And so I ended up, we actuallywent through my 150, well, minus
(33:30):
40 projects, and um he pickedout six.
He read the scripts, and he ismoving forward with two of them,
and um really wanted to moveforward with a third, and we
can't find that filmmaker, so uhI don't know what's going on
there.
Yeah.
(33:51):
But this has happened.
I I've had a client die and notget her film made, you know.
Yes, um, she has health issues,and various things happen in
life.
SPEAKER_02 (34:04):
I know from mentoring people too, life gets
in the way, and you have to staywith them through the life
trauma and keep them uh usingthe film to for because
sometimes when you have acreative project to put your
your attentions and your focuson, it helps you get through the
difficulties of life, but it'sall your work.
(34:29):
Well, your book talks aboutfinding the easiest fundraising
plan.
So not one size fits all.
So the question is how do youhelp a filmmaker identify which
strategy of fundraising fitstheir personality, their
network, their project, and uh,whether that's equity, grants,
(34:52):
crowdfunding, tax incentive,free sales, how do you handle
that?
SPEAKER_01 (35:00):
Well, it's different for everybody because it's
different not only for everyfilm, every filmmaker, and every
different place they're at intheir careers.
So I have a client who's a verywell-known filmmaker, his name
is Thomas Allen Harris, and weare currently finishing a$1.3
(35:23):
million documentary.
And, you know, when we firststarted working together, he was
certainly not working at thosebudgets, and he didn't have me.
So, and he was already a goodfundraiser when I met him.
Um, but we have uh grownexponentially.
We also, for that project, wewon a grant from the National
(35:44):
Science Foundation for$3.2million.
Oh, okay.
And now the NSF is reaching outto us to ask us to apply again.
So um, but in a in a somewhatdifferent program.
But um so, you know, uh, but notall my clients are at that
(36:06):
level.
So this one client that I wasjust talking about, her impact
campaign, for her, it's herfirst feature documentary.
She's raising$300,000 to dothat.
And we started, she worked withyou, thank you very much.
She worked with Alyra and sheraised about$10,000 on her
crowdfunding campaign.
(36:28):
And uh then she uh startedworking with a major donor, she
won her first grant that she andI worked on.
That was another$10,000.
Now we're working with a brandsponsorship person who's going
to be bringing uh brands.
The film is going to be on PBS.
Um, brands love to be on PBS.
(36:48):
Um, so you know that works forsome.
And then another documentaryfilmmaker I was talking to
yesterday, we just decided tonot go with PBS.
So um every film is different,things can change, um, but the
funding strategies uh workdifferently for everyone.
(37:11):
So I ended up, I had my myfilmmaker group about a month or
two ago.
It's like, oh wait, everybody inthis group is running a
crowdfunding campaign.
Um but uh now I have a clientwho's not, he's raising$1.5
million to make his campaign.
I mean, sorry, to make his film.
(37:32):
And um, he's not gonna run acrowdfunding campaign, he's just
gonna be going to investors.
It's what works for the person,you know.
But a lot of my clients gotreally excited about
crowdfunding all the same time.
I was like, yay, because I loveit when my clients decide to do
a crowdfunding campaign.
It's a great way to startfundraising, it's a great way to
(37:53):
practice talking to people aboutyour film and money.
It's a great starter.
Um, we I have a client whoraised um, what was it,$13,000
on her crowdfunding campaign.
She also is with you.
And thank you very much.
(38:14):
And she took$10,000 of thosedollars to pay hire one of the
casting directors I work withwho is an A-list casting
director.
So now we're we're still gonnamake her film for$300,000, but
it's gonna have much higherlevel actors in it.
So we've increased the value ofher film radically by adding
(38:38):
this uh casting director.
So all of these are, I think, Ithink in terms of business
models, right?
So if we're making a smallbudget film, what can we do to
increase the value?
It might be attaching a castingdirector.
So it might be simplest to do acrowdfunding campaign.
(39:00):
Now we can hire the castingdirector.
You know, so um there are somany paths, and I'm I'm just
good at you know, seeing whatthe best path is.
And then the truth is,documentary filmmakers, um, I
teach seven different types offundraising.
They often have access to moretypes of fundraising than a
fiction filmmaker has.
(39:21):
You know, for a fictionfilmmaker, it might be
crowdfunding than investors.
That's only two.
But um now I'm working with thisuh brand sponsor person, so uh
some of my clients are workingwith her.
Um, and that's great becausethat was always the one I knew
the least about.
We often we get a lot of um uhcompanies working with my
(39:45):
clients.
I have them work on that fromday one, you know, uh, giving
locations, food, all kinds ofthings to bring down the budget
because there's two ways you canraise money.
You can raise money or you canlower your budget.
You know, those are the two waysyou can do it.
Um, so we've done that for along time, but now I'm working
with somebody who's bringingcash to films.
(40:08):
So that's really exciting andand uh very, very, very
exciting.
SPEAKER_02 (40:13):
Yes, this is what the big and uh in filmmakers do.
I mean, sometimes when they'remulti-million dollar budget,
they're still they've got Ford,their Chevrolet with all their
cars, they've got theirbranding.
They open a cabinet, there'sAnne Jeremima's something or
another.
Right.
(40:34):
Right, and so you're working nowwith a branding person.
This is brilliant.
SPEAKER_01 (40:40):
Yes, yes, that's very recent.
I I I've discovered I have acousin who works in product
placement, but he only workswith A-list actors, right?
So I I didn't have uh films thatwould work for him, right?
But now I didn't even think ofthis till this minute.
(41:02):
But now that we have a castingdirector who can cast A-listers,
maybe I can go back to him andsay, what brands can you bring?
So yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (41:12):
It's wonderful.
So documentary filmmakers andfiction filmmakers often feel
like they live in two differentfinancing worlds.
So, from your vantage point,coaching both of them, where do
these worlds overlap and wheredo filmmakers get in trouble by
borrowing the wrong playbook?
SPEAKER_01 (41:35):
I don't see um filmmakers so much borrowing the
wrong playbook as using alimited playbook, a too-limited
playbook.
Um, I was once hired as aconsultant by a large women's
documentary um organization, andI had five filmmakers to work
with, and each of the five hadreceived a$100,000 grant.
(41:59):
That's really amazing,$100,000grant.
So they were doing somethingvery well, right?
But documentary filmmakers tendto have an obsession with
grants, which is fine.
Um, but they don't know thestrategies I teach around grant
writing, because grant writingis kind of my superpower, but
(42:22):
they don't know thosestrategies, so they often spend
way too much time working ongrants and burning themselves
out, and they they they don'tknow how to do it more
efficiently.
But what happened with each ofthese brilliant women was that
not one of them except one hadraised any other money.
(42:42):
And one of them had raised athousand dollars from a donor.
I'm like, uh, you raise athousand dollars from a grant,
you need to be matching thatwith donors, and they were like,
what?
And you know, and I talkedabout, you know, all my clients,
we start out, you know, with a$20,000 crowdfunding campaign.
(43:06):
Um they were like, what?
So documentary filmmakers thinkin terms of grants and they're
very not thinking about anythingelse.
Um, but there are certain waysof fundraising that are open to
them.
So I tend to, when I teach, Itend to not do something like a
(43:26):
grant writing workshop.
I'm always wanting to teach thisconcept of expanding your
portfolio.
And when I was a consultant tononprofits, I did I saw the same
thing.
They would land on a couple ofways of fundraising and not do
anything with anything else.
And I would just start them outwith the other ones, and that
(43:49):
can grow over time, but youdon't want to be only focused in
one or two types of fundraising,it's just there's all this other
money available, you know, andum and they're just missing out
with fiction filmmakers.
They never think about grants.
And I remember one of my clientsone time we were in a class, and
(44:11):
he I saw this light bulb goingoff in his head about something
I'd been talking about for aboutan hour, and this light bulb
went off, and he's like, Wait,are there grants for fiction
filmmakers?
unknown (44:25):
I was like, Yes.
SPEAKER_01 (44:27):
Yes, there are screenwriting grants, production
grants, post-production grants,all kinds of grants.
Great.
So it's not it's not thatthey're in the wrong playbook,
they're just not they they'renot aware of all the
possibilities.
So film fiction filmmakers thinkthe only way to raise money is
(44:48):
either crowdfunding orinvestors, they don't realize,
oh, we could do both.
How about that?
That would be useful.
Um, so all my fiction filmmakerswho chose to do that
crowdfunding campaign, they'rethey're also using that to
leverage looking for investors.
So, and and and each and onceyou Playing with this whole um
(45:16):
these all these differentopportunities, one helps the
other, you know.
So you write a grant, and all ofa sudden you're communicating
better about your film, and yourfilm improves, all the grants
improve your film.
And once you run a crowdfundingcampaign, you know, my clients
start to have, they're like, ohmy God, I'm so scared to speak
(45:38):
to people.
And by the end, they're like, Ohyeah, I'm talking to all these
different people, and it becomeslike a normal thing.
Yeah, they don't know that atthe beginning, and they have all
this emotional baggage,spiritual baggage, and then by
the end it's become normalized,and now they're ready, they're
much in a much more ready placeto talk to investors.
(46:03):
Exactly.
SPEAKER_02 (46:05):
Yes, this is wonderful.
It's a confidence, you're givingthem confidence, and the
crowdfunding gives themconfidence.
That's wonderful.
unknown (46:15):
Yes.
SPEAKER_02 (46:15):
Now, as a biracial woman and a global ambassador,
you've been very clear that youwant all filmmakers to have the
capacity to tell their storieswell.
So, what specific advice do yougive to filmmakers from
underrepresented backgrounds whoare walking into fundraising
rooms for the first time?
SPEAKER_01 (46:37):
I think the most important thing that I've seen
with my uh I'm half Trinidadian,I've had several clients from
Trinidad and Tobago, I've hadclients from South Africa, um,
Australia, England.
And the most important thingthat they have to learn is that
Americans are not superior,which is what they really have
(47:03):
been taught by their cultures.
And I remember years ago, Iworked with the Brazilian Film
Festival here in Miami for like28 years, and we used to, I used
to run their trade show, and wehad panels on filmmaking, and we
had simultaneous translation.
They would bring 200 Brazilianfilmmakers up every year, and I
would bring Americans who wereproducers and different things.
(47:26):
And I had this producing teamwho were friends of mine.
Um, and uh so all the Braziliansare there to listen to how
they're gonna make money likeAmericans, because America, you
know, they get money.
In the middle of the talk, thesetwo producers, they're listening
to questions and everything, andthey're saying, wait, they said,
Are you telling me that you'regetting money from your
(47:47):
government to make films?
And the Brazilians are all yes,and they're like, the producers
are like, What?
Could you tell us more aboutthat?
Every other country in the worldhas um government funding for
films, except America.
The only one that doesn't havethe federal government funds as
(48:08):
other funds.
But uh it was so funny, and allthe Brazilians are thinking, Oh,
we've got to learn from theAmericans because we want to be
in the American market and wewant to make films like
Americans and we want to beAmerican, and the Americans are
like, You said what now you'reraising how much to make your
(48:30):
movies?
SPEAKER_02 (48:32):
Right.
Okay.
Well, let's get tactical for ourlisteners.
If a filmmaker is sitting attheir kitchen table listening to
this with a script and no money,what are the first three
concrete actions from your bookthat they should take this week
to start moving towards a fundedproduction?
SPEAKER_01 (48:56):
Well, the first thing is call me.
No, the first thing is in thebook uh we talk about the
marketability.
There's a long section in thebook about getting that script,
or if you're a documentaryfilmmaker, getting that
documentary to a more marketableplace.
(49:17):
Whatever place it's at today,you can get it to a more
marketable place by thinkingthrough the marketability
question.
Um the second thing I would sayis to um decide which of the
seven types of fundraisingyou're gonna raise, you're gonna
(49:37):
use.
I would commit to a minimum oftwo and as close to seven as you
possibly can get.
And then uh to do all thepreparation going through the
box office success formula, doall that preparation before you
(49:57):
start fundraising.
So even if you're looking toraise, you know, I have my short
film clients raise$11,000 or$12,000 to make a short.
But even if that's what you'redoing what you decide you're
gonna do, you want to do all thepreparation that's in the book
first before you start yourfundraising.
(50:19):
You're a much better.
SPEAKER_02 (50:22):
Yes, this is good advice.
Thank you.
So, where can the listeners findyou and get your book and
possibly even work directly withyou?
SPEAKER_01 (50:33):
The uh you can get the book on Amazon, you can just
um go to Amazon, put my name in,and the book will pop up and you
can get it there.
You can get it in most countriesuh in the world, I believe,
which is uh interesting.
Um, and then if they want tospeak to me, um either email me.
(50:55):
My email address is Joanne atfilmmakersuccess.com.
My business is called FilmmakerSuccess.
Uh, or um there's a link to mycalendar at
www.filmmakersuccess.com slashbook hyphen a hyphen call.
That might be a lot to remember,but um if you go to my website,
(51:19):
you'll find a link to mycalendar so that you can book a
call with me.
And my website iswww.filmmakersuccess.com.
I would love to hear from you.
I love talking to filmmakers.
Filmmakers are my favoritepeople.
SPEAKER_02 (51:33):
Oh, how nice.
This is a they will love to hearthat.
Filmmakersuccess.com.
SPEAKER_01 (51:40):
Got it.
Filmmaker, it's one filmmaker,so filmmakersuccess.com.
Singular.
Okay.
SPEAKER_02 (51:49):
And now, um, what's one piece of encouragement you'd
leave with the filmmaker who'sbeen told no too many times and
wants to know, do I keep goingor not?
SPEAKER_01 (52:04):
Fundraising is a profoundly spiritual practice.
And I had to have a conversationwith one of my clients the other
day and say every time we have acall, you show up with a
negative comment.
It has to go.
We're we are graduating frombeing filmmakers to being
(52:24):
fundraisers.
The filmmaking is never going togo anywhere.
The fundraising is going tochange, it's going to keep
changing.
And eventually we have to make adecision that we're going to let
go of negative thinking for themoney to arrive.
So that may not sound like apractical thing, but it's
everything.
(52:44):
It's absolutely everything.
SPEAKER_02 (52:47):
I totally agree with you.
Totally agree with you.
Your mind is your greatestbenefit in funding films.
It has to be working with you100%, Joanne.
SPEAKER_01 (53:01):
But if a filmmaker has been trying and trying and
trying and trying and gettingno, it's because they don't have
the correct strategy.
It's not because of something todo with their work.
It's they don't have thefundraising strategy.
I like to tell people (53:14):
if you were to sign up today for a
class to fly a plane and youwould know in three months how
to fly a plane, you would not goout there today and get in a
plane and turn the key on andtry and fly it.
You would know that you neededto do the study in the practice
for three months.
And that's that's what I'mtrying to get across is that you
(53:38):
can't just filmmakers have thisidea that they can start from
standing zero and become afundraiser.
No.
And within a very few minutes ofa conversation, I can I know
exactly where the filmmaker isin is in the wrong strategy.
(53:59):
And that's always what it isthat's getting them the nose.
Always, not sometimes, always.
SPEAKER_02 (54:09):
This is marvelous.
So thank you so much for sharingyour wisdom, your experience,
and your generous spirit withour listeners.
And what I love about yourapproach is that you take
something that feelsoverwhelming to filmmakers,
which is raising money, and youturn it into a practical,
hopeful, step-by-step processthat people can actually follow.
(54:33):
Your success formula remindsfilmmakers that funding is not
magic, it's preparation,clarity, strategy, and believing
enough in your story to keepmoving forward one step at a
time.
So, for those of you listening,you can learn more about Joanne
Butcher, her coaching programs,and her wonderful book, Getting
(54:55):
Your Film Funded, Produced andDistributed Globally, a Seven
Step System, the Film Box Officesuccess formula at
JoanneButcher.com and FilmmakersSuccess.com.
Filmmakersuccess.com.
(55:16):
And to every filmmaker out therewho may be discouraged or
wondering if your project willever get made, please remember
this.
Every great film begins withsomeone who refused to give up
on a story they believed thatthey needed to tell.
So you have to keep learning,keep going, and keep taking the
(55:37):
next step forward because yourvoice matters.
You are the magic.
Hollywood needs you.
I'm Carol Dean, and this is theArt of Film Funding.
Thanks for listening, and ClairePapan and I will see you next
week.
Thank you so much, Carol.
Thank you, Joanne.
(55:58):
You're so good to filmmakers.
You're greatly appreciated.
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