February 5, 2026 • 32 mins
Lauren Groshong, GTM Recruiting Leader at Vanta, shares how growing up with grit and humor was foundational to her leadership style. Lauren talks about her time leading business recruiting at Grammarly, and how the leadership team has supported staff based in Ukraine throughout the war with Russia.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_01 (00:46):
Lauren Grosong, welcome to the show today.
Everyone tuning in, Lauren iscurrently in the role of GTM
recruiting leader over at Fanta.
Well, Lauren, thank you verymuch for uh joining us on the
show today.
SPEAKER_00 (01:00):
Excited to be here.
Thanks so much for having me.
SPEAKER_01 (01:02):
Yeah, thank you.
So, yeah, Lauren, where are youfrom?
SPEAKER_00 (01:06):
I am born and raised in uh California, specifically
outside the Bay Area.
Right now I'm in Sonoma County,which is like the gateway to
wine country.
Hopefully, people have beenthere.
Um, but growing up, I grew up ina really small town of
Westmarin.
It was Woodacre.
We had no strict like stop sign,streetlights, that type of
stuff.
Haven't gone far, but far enoughin my eyes.
SPEAKER_01 (01:26):
Okay, gotcha.
What were you like as a kid?
SPEAKER_00 (01:29):
As a kid, I love humor.
I think that's something thathas rung through and it's
something that within my family.
So jokes, all jokes.
Growing up, though, I was reallyinto sports.
So soccer, basketball was mypassion, but I would try
everything.
Uh grew up in, again, a reallysmall town.
And so, like, we had 12-personclassrooms and things like that.
So, just really deep ties intothe community that was there,
(01:52):
which was really awesome.
Um, and have maintained,thankfully, all of those friend
groups, which is pretty awesome.
SPEAKER_01 (01:58):
It seems like your personality type from what I'm
just seeing with uh your energythus far, you're probably
constantly on the go, playing alot of sports.
Very see you seem like a verydriven person.
SPEAKER_00 (02:08):
Definitely really driven.
I got that from my dad.
My dad was um a kind of a smallbusiness owner, if you will.
Um, and he saw a lot of, youknow, challenges in his life.
He actually was in the Navyduring Vietnam and he actually
fell off the aircraft carrierand broke his back and neck.
And so growing up, there waslike, it wasn't always talked
about.
It wasn't like the elephant inthe room, if you will, but like
(02:30):
it was there.
He definitely was in pain andthings like that.
But he was successful and hepushed through it.
And so, like that type ofperseverance and like that work
ethic and that drive was alwayssomething that resonated me.
Um, it also was like somethingwhere I think I learned very
early that you have to workhard.
Nothing is given.
And if you want to succeed, youhave to put in the effort.
And so, like that was ingrainedin me in like a really young
(02:52):
age.
I took that into sports, I tookthat into classes, even though
education is probably not likemy favorite thing.
Um, but I took that dedicationand just like seeing it as I
need to get through itcompetitive to push myself
through it to kind of get to thenext things, things that excite
me.
SPEAKER_01 (03:07):
I'm curious to get your thoughts on this.
Like what you said about yourdad, not necessarily it's
something that was, it wasn'treally talked about very often.
And a business owner, which isan incredibly demanding career,
potentially even more so, orpotentially even more
challenging for your dad.
I wonder if one of his keys tosuccess was the fact that it's
like even when you havechallenges in life or something
(03:29):
that is really hard for you towork through, it's not putting
the focus or the emphasis onthat and focusing on what you
have to do.
I'm wondering if that just shedsome insight into your
psychology and potentially hisgoing through that hardship.
Do you think that that was oneof the keys that helped him be
successful in business?
SPEAKER_00 (03:48):
Absolutely.
I think about it like he hadmultiple surgeries, was in like
a bed for a couple months onend.
And it was never like a feelsorry for me or like overly help
me.
Like he hated to be like theburden.
Um, and I think it was more ofwe rise despite of things.
And I think that is somethinglike I always to this day try to
look at things very glass hapfull, be positive.
(04:10):
I really don't even like to liketurn on the news these days
because a lot of things can likebring you down.
Um, but I think it really helpedme like shape how I look and how
I approach issues and problemsand things like that, with
always trying to like thingshappen.
Let's try to not keep them, keepus weighing us down, type of
thing.
But how do we continue to liketrudge and move forward?
SPEAKER_01 (04:30):
Yeah, 100%.
He seems like he was a greatmentor for he was.
SPEAKER_00 (04:35):
And he has this like charisma.
He is one of those, and I thinkthat's like the humor comes into
play there, which is like how Iwas born and raised.
It's just, you know, familyfirst type of environment.
But I think we laugh ateverything.
Unfortunately, sometimes ifsomebody were to get injured
younger, like the first reactionwas to laugh.
I've had to not do that now inmy professional life, and as
(04:56):
I've become a mom, becausethat's not a good thing.
Um, but it was just like one ofthose, like it's just how we
approach things is humor.
Let's laugh through it.
Again, challenges, like you canhave a fight, but then like
laugh about it and move forward.
SPEAKER_01 (05:08):
Yeah, I love that.
So, what kind of business did hehave?
SPEAKER_00 (05:11):
Or I don't know if he's still on a so uh one of his
best friends was a scientist,which is he is not scientific by
any means.
So the two of them comingtogether were like total
opposites, which is great.
He and his scientist best friendcreated a um, it's technically
like a bug that cleanscontaminated soil.
Uh so they started in the US andthen they actually ended up
(05:32):
doing most of their businessoutside the US because the US
changed their laws of how youclean, if you will, like
contaminated soil.
So he in my high school yearsand college years, he did the
majority of his business inEgypt and Mexico.
SPEAKER_01 (05:47):
This that sounds fascinating.
So what do you what do you meanby that?
Like created a bug?
SPEAKER_00 (05:51):
Like it's like uh bacteria and and like food for
the bacteria where they actuallygo in.
And so like you feed thebacteria a certain, you know,
recipe, if you will, and theyactually clean contaminated
soil.
So you think of like old gasstations and all the stuff that
they leave in the soil.
So you basically go in and it'san organic way to like clean the
soil.
You have to like rotate and getthe topsoil and things like
(06:13):
that.
But over time, this likebacteria bug um eats that and
then leaves very clean, freshtopsoil that you can then build
on and not have that leftovercontamination.
SPEAKER_01 (06:24):
That's fascinating.
So you said he was working a lotin Egypt and worlds, Mexico.
Did you ever get to travel withhim?
SPEAKER_00 (06:33):
I did not.
Mexico, we would go on likefamily vacations and then he
would like go off for a coupledays and go do like business and
things like that, but we wereleft at the pool, so to speak.
Um, never to Egypt.
It's definitely on my list ofplaces to go.
He has some awesome pictures ofthe Red Sea and things like
that.
And he just has always said suchpositive things about the
colleagues over there and likethe culture and all that kind of
(06:55):
stuff.
So definitely it's on my bucketlist.
SPEAKER_01 (06:58):
I love that.
Then a little later on when youwent to college, I think um, so
you initially, well, yougraduated with a degree in
business marketing, right?
SPEAKER_00 (07:06):
Mm-hmm.
Uh my whole life.
My dad is Jewish.
And so growing up, I had myBubby.
His mom lived really close tous.
And like we were, she wasobsessed with fashion and the
garment industry.
And I always thought I wanted tobe a fashion buyer.
I was obsessed, I was prettygirly in that sense, but then
also balanced the sports.
But I was set on, I want to be afashion buyer, I want to go into
(07:30):
the fashion industry.
Um, and so I kind of picked mymajor as business marketing that
can go across everything.
I knew I wanted something alittle bit more generalized.
My dad has a friend who owns abusiness in LA, and he had kind
of said, like, you can come inand you can start low, but you
can work your way up here.
And so it kind of had like mypath, what I thought figured out
(07:50):
and set on.
So like my mission was go tocollege, have fun, but get to
that next step, which is alwayswhat I've wanted to do.
Um, so went through college,worked my way through college,
held a full-time job, and Iworked at a small boutique to
gain insights into in Heelsburg,if ever anybody has ever gone.
It's absolutely beautiful in thewine country.
(08:11):
Small denim boutique where thecreator and like the owner of it
was an ex-Levi's head designer.
So she just had like a lot ofreally great knowledge.
And I got to see exactly likehow small businesses run, from
like the buying to like thecleaning the bathrooms to
literally everything.
And so that was awesome.
And I actually had started atNordstroms when I was in high
(08:31):
school on an internship andstayed on and off with
Nordstroms throughout collegetoo.
And so I ended up being therefull time and I saw I worked in
like every department from likestock to lingerie to the juniors
section.
And then the last one I ended upbeing in uh the HR at
Nordstroms, which changed myperspective a little bit on what
(08:54):
I wanted to do.
SPEAKER_01 (08:55):
And then from there, when you went to Salesforce,
that was your first time inrecruiting, right?
SPEAKER_00 (09:00):
Correct.
So at Nordstrom's my last rolethere when I was assistant HR
manager for the store in CuertoMadeira, I was responsible for
the staffing.
So we have like our bigholidays.
You think of Christmas, but theyhave their anniversary sale,
which is like their one of theirbiggest milestones for the
company and where they bring inthe most revenue.
And so I was tasked withliterally hiring like 160 people
to get the store to its seasonalneeds.
(09:22):
And so I was doing all theinterviewing and onboarding and
all that kind of stuff.
And so I wore like a lot ofdifferent hats.
I didn't unfortunately firingtoo, um, but compliance, kind of
like you name it.
Um, and I realized that theinterviewing and like the hiring
was like that gave me a lot ofjuices.
I hated the firing.
Not my thing.
Um, and I didn't like a lot oflike the compliance stuff.
(09:43):
It wasn't something that likebrought me joy, if you will.
And so I had a couple colleagueswho left Nordstroms as they were
full the frontline managers andthey went over to Salesforce.
And so they actually referred meand I was like, Salesforce, like
what is this thing?
And I remember telling mygrandma, and she was like, You
are an idiot.
You don't leave Nordstroms,everybody knows Nordstroms,
who's Salesforce?
(10:04):
And so it was just like one ofthose things of changing my
identity because everybody in myfamily, I had told everybody
because I was pretty crystalclear that I wanted to be a
fashion buyer and go into that.
Um, and so it kind of reallychanged what I wanted to do in
the trajectory of my career.
SPEAKER_01 (10:19):
Nice, nice.
You were at Grammarly for uhabout five years, and during
your tenure, and you're in therole of a head of uh global
business recruiting.
The Ukraine-Russian war brokeout, and uh you had told me
before we hit record that thefounders of Grammarly are
actually from Ukraine, and a lotof your team was in Ukraine from
(10:41):
day one when the war started.
Grammarly is like thecategory-defining and leading
solution for what they do, andthey've continued to be so.
I my understanding they stillare today.
I mean, I use it, and mostpeople I know use it.
I think it's really fascinatingthat they've been able to
maintain that competitiveadvantage and category-leading
(11:02):
status through an incrediblybrutal war in Ukraine.
What was that like, right?
Like working with the team andhow did you adapt with day one
when that the war broke out?
Like, what was that like atGrammarly?
SPEAKER_00 (11:16):
100%.
So I would say it wasdefinitely, I think, where I've
learned the most and probablychanged the most as an
individual, personally andprofessionally, I would say.
Um, when I first startedGrammarly, it was actually like
it was just all kinds of change.
So, like when I first startedliterally the my first day, it
was like COVID had just hit.
And so they were like, Oh, we'rein office.
(11:36):
Oh, we're gonna ship yourlaptop, you'll come in in about
a month.
And then I never went in and weswitched to like remote first.
So day one with that company, itwas like always leading through
change and things like that.
Um, but I think it was my thirdor second year when the war
actually broke out.
The company honestly handled itfantastically.
They had been monitoring it.
People was their most importantthing.
(11:57):
Like I mentioned, ourco-founders were from Ukraine,
specifically Kyiv, Ukraine,which is where we had the office
for Grammarly, and we still havethe office today, which is
pretty awesome.
But it was wild to justbasically put business aside and
just literally thinking aboutlives and safety and well-being
of your team.
And it was so inspiring,honestly, to see people leading
(12:21):
through so much in their livesand still showing up.
I had an individual on my team.
And when everything kind of likebroke out, I was like, don't
worry about work.
I'm the last thing.
Just keep me in mind.
Please tell me we're safe andwhen you've made it out of the
country and all these things.
And I remember her saying, no, Ineed to work.
This is like the only stable Ihave in my life right now.
And so it was like trying toshow up and support people when
(12:44):
they were going through so much.
Again, it made you realize likethe little things like having a
bad hair day, getting a zit, orwhatever those like little
things that sometimes can bringpeople down really don't matter.
And I think it gave me adifferent perspective.
Um, but it also changed myleadership and my style and kind
of like how I show up at work.
I try to lead with positive polyenergy, right?
(13:05):
Like I really try to do empathyfirst, really get to know
somebody as a human first andthen integrate like the business
stuff and figure out whatmotivates them, what gives them
like psychological safety andlead through that.
Um it's funny too, if I were toreflect back, feedback I got
when I was a manager at Dropboxwas I'm too empathetic.
(13:26):
Um, that that was like a faultof mine almost as a manager, is
that I lean too much withempathy uh when I'm leading my
team.
And I think actually, I think itwas the Times had actually, or
Harvard, one of the two, put outan article and it was about how
during the time of COVID andimmense change, empathy was like
the top trait of like the bestleaders.
(13:46):
And that was really eye-openingfor me is I was like, okay, I'm
allowed to be this empathetic.
I'm allowed to kind of show upas authentic as I want and lead.
And I feel like it just like itchanged my tune.
And I'm happy that I was able todo it.
I'm still the war is ongoing.
I still am very connected with alot of the individuals.
It is heartbreaking.
Um, but again, like if I were tolook at back at Grammly, I think
(14:07):
how they showed up for theirpeople one and how they led
through that was like soinspiring and honestly what kept
me there for such a long time.
unknown (14:15):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (14:15):
I'd be curious.
I'm sure there was theco-founders.
I'm assuming would you have allhands or meetings or um just the
communication with the team?
Were there any themes or likevalues or or what did the key
things you remember in terms ofhow they helped the team like
navigate those challenges interms of how they were
(14:36):
communicating and trying to liftpeople up and support people?
Are there any memories there?
SPEAKER_00 (14:41):
I think yes.
Like again, Gram really did anamazing job of the foresight
into this and like the planningthat they did.
And so, like satellite cellphones, transportation in and
out, just like all hands ondeck, crazy communication, like
every 20 minutes, check-ins,like things like that.
So, like really showing upagainst safety was at the end of
the day the biggest thing forus.
And it was making sure that umpeople got out if they were
(15:04):
allowed to get out.
And then the men that wereenlisted, you know, like making
sure we were there to supportthem and support the country.
Like Grammarly sponsored acouple ambulances and seeing
those who go around the rubble,like with the Grammarly logo,
brought like immense pride.
And that was stuff that like youjust again, it makes all little
things like that is reallywhat's important, I would say.
(15:25):
Um, I remember a couple meetingstoo, where we were doing just
normal team meetings.
And anybody who they all duringZoom, they'd have to like unplug
from their Zoom because the thesirens go would go off and there
was um bombs and things likethat flying around.
And so they would all have to gointo the basement.
So you'd be on a Zoom, you'd seeeverybody, and then all of a
sudden you'd see the flashingsof the sirens, and then they'd
(15:47):
they'd disappear and then theywould show back on like nothing
had happened.
There were days where the sirenswere going off like 24-7 for
like weeks on end, and they hadno sleep, but they still showed
up like their authentic selves,and they were so driven, so
gritty, and honestly, again,inspiring.
Like they are the Ukrainianpeople are so inspiring for what
(16:08):
they're still going through tothis day.
SPEAKER_01 (16:10):
Yeah, they really are.
They truly are.
Well, I think it's what youmentioned is how it
fundamentally changed you as amanager and leader, is really
interesting.
I think seeing there are a fewthings, seeing and living
through hardship, as well asjust doing really hard things,
like being a parent, right?
I think that there's a level ofempathy that that unlocks in
(16:31):
people.
And I think at least obviouslyfor myself too, I feel like it's
some of the harder things I'vehad to go through definitely, I
think, have made me moreempathetic.
I think being a dad isdefinitely like having having a
little girl is has made me a lotmore empathetic.
But it's interesting thosechapters where you what you
experienced at Grammarly, andthen also how you saw other you
know, leadership, the foundersrespond must have been
(16:53):
incredibly impactful andprobably still impacts how you
you make decisions today, Iwould assume, and how you lead
today.
SPEAKER_00 (16:59):
Yeah, people first.
Again, I think it's like ascheesy as it is, but it's like
the one team, one dream.
Like you and any company, likereally, I think like they are
only as strong as the employeesthat they they hire and that
they have and how they treatthem.
And so for me, it's actuallybeen, I would say, a theme of
how I pick companies is lookingat how the leadership treats
their employees.
Um, and that's like the biggestone for me.
(17:21):
So leadership is always mything, and that's now a lens
that I really look through is Idon't want to work with people.
We used to say a term likebrilliant jerks, right?
Like they may be amazing, butthey're like not a nice human.
Like, that's not um who I wantto work side by side and like
pour my hours into.
I want to work along people thatare genuinely nice people and
we're on a mission, and it'sexciting to do it together.
SPEAKER_01 (17:42):
Yeah, fantastic, 100%.
So when it comes to now, right,you have more experience as a
leader.
Um, now you're advantageous.
So you're on to your nextleadership role.
At this point, what do you thinkis most important as a talent
acquisition leader for othertalent acquisition leaders, or
(18:02):
even more generally, anybodywho's trying to build amazing
teams?
What advice do you have to them?
You talked about bringing peopleup.
Can you explain what that means?
SPEAKER_00 (18:12):
Yeah, I would say like first, my biggest advice to
them is for anybody in this typeof role is like recruiting is
only going to be successful ifyou understand the businesses
you support.
What keeps them up at night andhow can we eliminate that
nervousness or whatever it is?
I think the people are thebiggest thing.
And so making sure that we'rebringing the right level of
talent, but you have to bereally in tune with the business
(18:33):
on their wants, what's working,not working, and then like the
proactiveness to get ahead ofthings before they happen or
don't happen, whatever that kindof like would mean.
Um so I would say that's thebiggest advice I would have uh
for leaders specifically.
SPEAKER_01 (18:49):
And I know also, yeah, you really also talked
about understanding businessneeds, communicating with the
different departments.
It sounds like really dialinginto business outcomes, right?
In terms of how you shape yourdepartment and how you lead your
recruiters.
Can you tell us more about howyou how you do that?
SPEAKER_00 (19:07):
Yeah, for sure.
I would say first and foremost,I think recruiting and sales
walk a really, really fine line.
I've always been drawn to thesales side.
I specifically didn't go on theengineering side just because I
I like that excitement and thatlike that pace, if you will.
That's the exciting thing.
Since we do walk a fine line, Ithink it's sometimes talking in
the language of the salesorganizations that you're
(19:27):
supporting and showing themexactly you know what the end
goal is, if it's revenue, ifit's NRR, whatever it may be,
how can we best support that?
And so again, just knowing thethe insides and outs, so to
speak.
Like with sales, when you'rehiring people, sometimes like
you have to understand that ifyou don't get a butt in a seat
for your VP of sales, forexample, like there's an open
(19:50):
quota that they may not hit.
And so you're actually likeimpacting people's paychecks and
like the business's success.
At the end of the day, that's alot of pressure.
And so you never want to be atthe like the end of a finger.
Like recruiting was the reasonwe weren't able to hit our goals
or hit our quarters because theycouldn't get kind of like butts
and seats.
And so I think like that, I takethat, I start with that, and
(20:10):
then it's how do we want to showup to the business?
How do we make sure we don't getto that spot from creating goals
and how we report out and howour frequent communication,
having, you know, um my teammembers like be in team
meetings, be vocal, but reallyalso be really cross-functional.
I think you have to have anamazing partnership with like
your PvPs, with your recruitingops, but also like the revenue
(20:30):
ops teams, the people who createthe quotas, who create the comp
plans, like all the things.
So again, I think it's likereally being integrated and not
just like one point of thebusiness, but a lot of them to
actually show up successful andmore as a partner versus like a
true support function, which Ithink a lot of people will look
at recruiting and say, it's asupport function.
It is, but it's really necessaryfor a company's success.
SPEAKER_01 (20:53):
Yeah, and I think I definitely agree with you.
And I've experienced this toothroughout my career.
And I look at my like my ownjourney and my level of impact
with the companies that I I helpgrow and within the tech
industry.
And it's just so different thanwhen I was starting out, where
it really was like you sort ofwhen you're starting out as a
(21:14):
recruiter, you almost feel likemore of an order taker, right?
Like you're writing down, you'redoing your sourcing.
So now when I think aboutleading hiring engagements with
a lot of our customers, it'swe're sitting down with the
founders and the CEOs and thetown acquisition leaders, and
we're talking about likebusiness strategy.
And we're really trying tounderstand like how people fits
(21:37):
and people fit into that.
And it's like really beingcritical about like the hiring
plans and making sure thatthere's alignment.
And I think that's just a skillthat takes like years to
develop, right?
It's critical.
Like that's really what ittakes.
It takes a culture, I think, tolike of an organization to
really understand that's thelevel that you need to be
playing at to win at recruiting.
SPEAKER_00 (21:59):
I think different size companies too.
I would say early days,Salesforce started out as a
recruiting coordinator, didsourcing as a full-time job, and
then moved into like the fullcycle of recruiting.
And that was 100% order taking.
And that was 25 hires a quarter,don't stop, go, go, go.
And then I was like, oh, I kindof want to build.
And that's what gave me thatbug.
(22:19):
And so, like, I think like myjourney of going from large to
smaller companies has been thatbuilding, taking more of that
strategic level, if you will,and like going deeper and
understanding that.
And then I will say, post COVID,I mean, recruiting has seen the
most rocks out of any gosh,yeah.
It's been terrible, to becompletely frank.
Right.
(22:39):
And like having been on theother side of having to do
layoffs, I want to never ever dothose ever again.
Um So I do think there's likethis theme now of like do more
with less, especially with AI.
Recruiters are tasked with takeon more roles and hire more, but
with less people and try to doit faster and try to, you know,
do all these things.
And so it's like, how do you onelead through that?
(23:02):
But also how do we lean in andfigure out how we can get more
strategic?
And again, staying your keepingyour pulse on the business and
understanding what it takes andwhat it means.
And also, like I try to be veryeyes wide open and have my team
be very eyes wide open untillike a bad hire will screw
things up, not just cost, butlike time in the business and
things like that.
And so um again, I picked kindof earlier building kind of
(23:24):
stage companies because I reallydo think it's like talent is
number one and you have to getthat hire right.
I never want to force a hiredown a hiring manager's like
throat, so to speak.
Like I want it to be the fit forthe business.
Um, and I want all people withinlike the recruiting cycle.
So like the RCs, if you'reworking with a candidate that's
terrible or is rude or doesn'tisn't responsive, like I want
(23:45):
that voice, I want that echoedup.
So again, the business can makethe best decision on who to
hire.
Um, because at the end, like wewait, we want to make sure we
get it right.
SPEAKER_01 (23:54):
Yeah, definitely.
So so at this point, I'mcurious.
You know, the when you look atat your your future, right?
And uh you know recently startedthis this new job.
I guess it's coming up on ayear, right?
Coming up on a year.
It's wild.
Um yeah, yeah, time flies,right?
Particularly in tech, likeparticularly when you're in like
Italian position leadershiprole, it just seems like things
(24:15):
just fly, fly, fly.
SPEAKER_00 (24:17):
Um I feel like I'm day two or a veteran.
It depends on the hour on likewhat question harping I get.
So it's it's great, but I lovethat.
That's the excitement of like,again, I know I'm in the right
place because like I'm excited.
I don't have Sunday scaries.
I sure have like Sunday wake upand I'm like, woo, we got some
stuff to do this week, but it'snot like I don't want to be
here.
Um, and that's when you knowyou're in the right spot, my
(24:39):
opinion.
SPEAKER_01 (24:39):
Yes, I love that.
Um so hey, like I I'm curious,how do you feel like your
definition of success haschanged over the years?
What are you really focused onright now?
SPEAKER_00 (24:49):
I would say for me, I I learned this earlier, I
would say, but I think it's likejust been cemented.
Every like change I've done islike I have learned to not look
for accolades.
I think early days atSalesforce, like your title
mattered.
If you weren't getting promotedevery six months, it was an
issue.
You weren't as good as yourpeer.
And then it would just likestarted a spiral within you.
(25:09):
Um, and so I really started tolike, what do I enjoy?
What brings me good challenges?
How can I continue to grow andwhat skills or what like type of
people do I want to be in frontof and kind of like work with?
And so that's what's really, Ithink, of like career growth for
me is like again, who would whodo I want to be in my Zoom
rooms?
Um, and to like challengemyself.
I love not never being like thesmartest person in a room.
(25:32):
I will never say that I ambecause I can always learn
something from anotherindividual.
And I think um I want tocontinue to do that.
I don't know what I want to donext, if I'm gonna be completely
honest.
Um, I've heard a lot of peoplebe like, you should go for like
a head of talent role.
I don't know that much aboutEng.
I've always had amazingcounterparts on the EPD side.
Um, and so like I've alwaysreally stayed in my go-to-market
(25:54):
bubble.
I love go to market.
It's the juice that like fuelsme.
I think if I had the right salesleader early in my career, I
probably would be in a salesrole.
Um, so like I really don't knowwhat next is for me or like the
next step.
I'm really happy with where Iam.
So I want to stay here for along time.
So don't worry, Siobhan.
I'm I'm staying put.
But definitely also just likeit's continuing to again
(26:16):
surround myself with reallystrong leaders that I can
continue to learn from, be ableto chew on like meaningful
problems or challenges, whetherthat's like growth scale, like
right now we're going into newmarkets, which is super exciting
and using like a different partof my brain.
There's always like these funthings that I think um can kind
of re-excite and you knowmotivate.
SPEAKER_01 (26:35):
Folks tuning in, a lot of them are leaders similar
to yourself.
And typically lifelong learners,usually pretty ambitious.
And when they're entering theirprime, right?
Which I told you I said I waslike, Oh, you're you know,
you're your prime and you'relike, I don't even know if I'm
there yet, you know.
Um so I don't know how you seethat.
I also I kind of see it the wayyou do.
I'm like, oh, I haven't evengotten started.
I've always had that uh becauseI think that's normal for
(26:57):
lifelong learners, right?
It's like we always there'salways that next level, right?
Absolutely.
I want to learn from you, and Ithink we all want to learn from
each other.
And it's like, how do you thinkabout your own personal
development?
Like, what are what are yourgoals, you know, outside of your
career?
What's most important to youright now?
SPEAKER_00 (27:13):
I have two small kids.
So I have a about to beseven-year-old and a three and a
half year old.
Um, my oldest is a girl, andthen my son is the three and a
half year old.
He's like my little teenytornado, I call him right now.
Um, for me, it's really likefamilies first.
That is like the biggest one.
And so, like making sure I canlike build a life for my
children that they're happywith, right?
(27:34):
Like they're if they don't lookback and they're like, oh, that
scarred me.
That is like every parent's likegoal.
Um, I think I'm doing prettywell there.
I, you know, I haven't asked mykids for my grade yet, but we
will see.
Um, but like that's like on thepersonal side.
It's just give them the bestlife we can, like make sure that
we can give them all theopportunities that they want and
kind of need.
I'm not talking like crazylavish.
I mean, we live in Petaluma,California.
(27:56):
It's not that, not that lavish,but like just like again, show
up, be be present for them.
Uh, my daughter like has thesecute little like tea parties in
class, or like she'll have aValentine's Day celebration, or
she had like, you know, likethey're little jogathons.
And I think there's like nothingmore important than being able
to like show up and see thesmile on her face and like the
pride she gets from like huggingme and like introducing me.
(28:18):
I want to make sure that that isstill like my priority and like
how I show up.
But then um, on the businessside, I want to make sure that
if people ask, how's Laurendoing?
I hope it's, oh, she's a greatpartner, she's doing well.
And if not, I want to make sureI can get there.
And so I think like that's whatfuels me.
I want to do a good job umwherever I am and in like
whatever role I am.
And so like constantly askingthe feedback and things like
(28:40):
that.
One of my old bosses used to sayfeedback was a gift.
And I always would be like, ohGod, I loathe that saying.
I say it all the time now.
Um, and so it's just like one ofthose things.
That's kind of how I look atthings.
SPEAKER_01 (28:51):
Yeah, for sure.
I have a six-year-old daughter.
I only have one.
SPEAKER_00 (28:54):
Fun.
SPEAKER_01 (28:55):
Yeah, yeah, it's it's a fun age for sure.
Um, you know, it's funny becauseyou said uh you hadn't asked for
a grade yet.
Now they're reminding me of.
I don't know if you you knowthis uh cartoon strip.
Do you remember?
Did you ever read uh or hear ofuh Calvin and Hobbes?
SPEAKER_00 (29:07):
I did not.
I do not.
SPEAKER_01 (29:09):
Well, Calvin and Hobbes is like uh it's a fun
little like cartoon strip thatwas used to be in the
newspapers.
I think it was like in the 80sor something.
But Calvin's like this littleboy, he's like your daughter's
age, I think he is six,something something like that.
And so like one on some of thecomic strips, like he'd walk up
to his dad and he would act likethere was like a polling, like
his dad was a politician, andhe'd just walk up like dad, the
(29:31):
latest numbers are in and you'reunderperforming.
Like, you know, you're not likedoing X, Y, and Z, or you know,
people say that you really needto make this adjustment or you
should find a new line of work.
You know, something like that.
It was just hilarious.
Um, they're kind of like reallycute cartoons I used to read as
a kid, and now my daughter lovesthem.
But uh yeah, anyway, just thisrandom like thought or
(29:52):
connection I made.
It's really funny stuff.
SPEAKER_00 (29:54):
I love that.
I will say, like, my daughterwas definitely like the first to
critique an outfit.
Mom, that is not a good look.
Like those types of things, andlike, you know, their innocence
and things like that, theirtruth serum that they throw at
you is like it'll hit you at theknees.
But again, you gotta laugh withit and move forward again.
I think that's like how Iapproach life is like laugh,
class, glass app full for sure.
SPEAKER_01 (30:15):
Oh, yeah, for sure.
I'm curious.
So you're a very ambitiousperson, right?
Driven, right?
You seem like a go, go, go uhtype of individual.
Being a parent's hard and to begood at it is very hard, right?
Like when we're trying to yeah,it's you know, it's kind of
interesting.
It's like I do, I do trulybelieve like being a parent is
like the hardest job in theworld.
And what's wild about it is thateverybody has, you know, almost
everybody has that job.
(30:36):
It's funny when you think aboutit from a recruiting
perspective, because it's likeit's like that it's incredibly
challenging.
I I'm wondering how do you thinklike finding that balance and
like maintaining yourprofessional progression, but
now in a place too where youclearly it's very important to
you to make sure your kids havethe best opportunities.
It's like the first thing youbrought up with with uh your
personal growth.
So um, do you have any advice toparents out there that are also
(30:59):
like really ambitious?
SPEAKER_00 (31:00):
I would say like the biggest thing is like be
authentic to yourself, don'tapologize.
I think that's like one of thebiggest things.
Is like I remember when I wasreally green in my career and I
was supporting somebody and shebecame a new mom.
And I was like, God, her work isslacking.
She hasn't been able to do this.
And then of course, it wasn'tuntil I became a mom.
And I was like, oh my, the stuffyou juggle, the things that are
happening, like the sleeplessnights, the trying to figure out
(31:23):
feeding.
And if you're working, you'repumping.
Like there's just like so muchmore to it.
And again, I think it's thatempathy that like really brings
it forward.
And so I would say, beauthentic, show up and know what
you need to do.
I'm very big on like calendarblocking.
Like I do my son's preschool,it's not till 8:30, right?
So, like some days I'll get upand I'll take my Amiha calls at
6 a.m.
And then I'll get back and I'lldo my eight-pack like ones at
(31:44):
like 6 p.m.
So I think it's just like dowhat you need to do, but always
make sure your priority is inorder.
And I think it's like thecommunication and how you can
communicate that out that isreally important.
SPEAKER_01 (31:54):
I love it.
I love it.
Well, Lauren, this has been areally fun conversation.
Thank you so much for coming ontoday and sharing more about
your journey and your values andhow you're approaching life and
your career.
It's been a lot of fun.
SPEAKER_00 (32:06):
Awesome.
Well, thank you.
It was uh been a greatconversation for me as well.
I appreciate it.
Lauren Grosong, welcome to the show today.
Everyone tuning in, Lauren iscurrently in the role of GTM
recruiting leader over at Fanta.
Well, Lauren, thank you verymuch for uh joining us on the
show today.
SPEAKER_00 (01:00):
Excited to be here.
Thanks so much for having me.
SPEAKER_01 (01:02):
Yeah, thank you.
So, yeah, Lauren, where are youfrom?
SPEAKER_00 (01:06):
I am born and raised in uh California, specifically
outside the Bay Area.
Right now I'm in Sonoma County,which is like the gateway to
wine country.
Hopefully, people have beenthere.
Um, but growing up, I grew up ina really small town of
Westmarin.
It was Woodacre.
We had no strict like stop sign,streetlights, that type of
stuff.
Haven't gone far, but far enoughin my eyes.
SPEAKER_01 (01:26):
Okay, gotcha.
What were you like as a kid?
SPEAKER_00 (01:29):
As a kid, I love humor.
I think that's something thathas rung through and it's
something that within my family.
So jokes, all jokes.
Growing up, though, I was reallyinto sports.
So soccer, basketball was mypassion, but I would try
everything.
Uh grew up in, again, a reallysmall town.
And so, like, we had 12-personclassrooms and things like that.
So, just really deep ties intothe community that was there,
(01:52):
which was really awesome.
Um, and have maintained,thankfully, all of those friend
groups, which is pretty awesome.
SPEAKER_01 (01:58):
It seems like your personality type from what I'm
just seeing with uh your energythus far, you're probably
constantly on the go, playing alot of sports.
Very see you seem like a verydriven person.
SPEAKER_00 (02:08):
Definitely really driven.
I got that from my dad.
My dad was um a kind of a smallbusiness owner, if you will.
Um, and he saw a lot of, youknow, challenges in his life.
He actually was in the Navyduring Vietnam and he actually
fell off the aircraft carrierand broke his back and neck.
And so growing up, there waslike, it wasn't always talked
about.
It wasn't like the elephant inthe room, if you will, but like
(02:30):
it was there.
He definitely was in pain andthings like that.
But he was successful and hepushed through it.
And so, like that type ofperseverance and like that work
ethic and that drive was alwayssomething that resonated me.
Um, it also was like somethingwhere I think I learned very
early that you have to workhard.
Nothing is given.
And if you want to succeed, youhave to put in the effort.
And so, like that was ingrainedin me in like a really young
(02:52):
age.
I took that into sports, I tookthat into classes, even though
education is probably not likemy favorite thing.
Um, but I took that dedicationand just like seeing it as I
need to get through itcompetitive to push myself
through it to kind of get to thenext things, things that excite
me.
SPEAKER_01 (03:07):
I'm curious to get your thoughts on this.
Like what you said about yourdad, not necessarily it's
something that was, it wasn'treally talked about very often.
And a business owner, which isan incredibly demanding career,
potentially even more so, orpotentially even more
challenging for your dad.
I wonder if one of his keys tosuccess was the fact that it's
like even when you havechallenges in life or something
(03:29):
that is really hard for you towork through, it's not putting
the focus or the emphasis onthat and focusing on what you
have to do.
I'm wondering if that just shedsome insight into your
psychology and potentially hisgoing through that hardship.
Do you think that that was oneof the keys that helped him be
successful in business?
SPEAKER_00 (03:48):
Absolutely.
I think about it like he hadmultiple surgeries, was in like
a bed for a couple months onend.
And it was never like a feelsorry for me or like overly help
me.
Like he hated to be like theburden.
Um, and I think it was more ofwe rise despite of things.
And I think that is somethinglike I always to this day try to
look at things very glass hapfull, be positive.
(04:10):
I really don't even like to liketurn on the news these days
because a lot of things can likebring you down.
Um, but I think it really helpedme like shape how I look and how
I approach issues and problemsand things like that, with
always trying to like thingshappen.
Let's try to not keep them, keepus weighing us down, type of
thing.
But how do we continue to liketrudge and move forward?
SPEAKER_01 (04:30):
Yeah, 100%.
He seems like he was a greatmentor for he was.
SPEAKER_00 (04:35):
And he has this like charisma.
He is one of those, and I thinkthat's like the humor comes into
play there, which is like how Iwas born and raised.
It's just, you know, familyfirst type of environment.
But I think we laugh ateverything.
Unfortunately, sometimes ifsomebody were to get injured
younger, like the first reactionwas to laugh.
I've had to not do that now inmy professional life, and as
(04:56):
I've become a mom, becausethat's not a good thing.
Um, but it was just like one ofthose, like it's just how we
approach things is humor.
Let's laugh through it.
Again, challenges, like you canhave a fight, but then like
laugh about it and move forward.
SPEAKER_01 (05:08):
Yeah, I love that.
So, what kind of business did hehave?
SPEAKER_00 (05:11):
Or I don't know if he's still on a so uh one of his
best friends was a scientist,which is he is not scientific by
any means.
So the two of them comingtogether were like total
opposites, which is great.
He and his scientist best friendcreated a um, it's technically
like a bug that cleanscontaminated soil.
Uh so they started in the US andthen they actually ended up
(05:32):
doing most of their businessoutside the US because the US
changed their laws of how youclean, if you will, like
contaminated soil.
So he in my high school yearsand college years, he did the
majority of his business inEgypt and Mexico.
SPEAKER_01 (05:47):
This that sounds fascinating.
So what do you what do you meanby that?
Like created a bug?
SPEAKER_00 (05:51):
Like it's like uh bacteria and and like food for
the bacteria where they actuallygo in.
And so like you feed thebacteria a certain, you know,
recipe, if you will, and theyactually clean contaminated
soil.
So you think of like old gasstations and all the stuff that
they leave in the soil.
So you basically go in and it'san organic way to like clean the
soil.
You have to like rotate and getthe topsoil and things like
(06:13):
that.
But over time, this likebacteria bug um eats that and
then leaves very clean, freshtopsoil that you can then build
on and not have that leftovercontamination.
SPEAKER_01 (06:24):
That's fascinating.
So you said he was working a lotin Egypt and worlds, Mexico.
Did you ever get to travel withhim?
SPEAKER_00 (06:33):
I did not.
Mexico, we would go on likefamily vacations and then he
would like go off for a coupledays and go do like business and
things like that, but we wereleft at the pool, so to speak.
Um, never to Egypt.
It's definitely on my list ofplaces to go.
He has some awesome pictures ofthe Red Sea and things like
that.
And he just has always said suchpositive things about the
colleagues over there and likethe culture and all that kind of
(06:55):
stuff.
So definitely it's on my bucketlist.
SPEAKER_01 (06:58):
I love that.
Then a little later on when youwent to college, I think um, so
you initially, well, yougraduated with a degree in
business marketing, right?
SPEAKER_00 (07:06):
Mm-hmm.
Uh my whole life.
My dad is Jewish.
And so growing up, I had myBubby.
His mom lived really close tous.
And like we were, she wasobsessed with fashion and the
garment industry.
And I always thought I wanted tobe a fashion buyer.
I was obsessed, I was prettygirly in that sense, but then
also balanced the sports.
But I was set on, I want to be afashion buyer, I want to go into
(07:30):
the fashion industry.
Um, and so I kind of picked mymajor as business marketing that
can go across everything.
I knew I wanted something alittle bit more generalized.
My dad has a friend who owns abusiness in LA, and he had kind
of said, like, you can come inand you can start low, but you
can work your way up here.
And so it kind of had like mypath, what I thought figured out
(07:50):
and set on.
So like my mission was go tocollege, have fun, but get to
that next step, which is alwayswhat I've wanted to do.
Um, so went through college,worked my way through college,
held a full-time job, and Iworked at a small boutique to
gain insights into in Heelsburg,if ever anybody has ever gone.
It's absolutely beautiful in thewine country.
(08:11):
Small denim boutique where thecreator and like the owner of it
was an ex-Levi's head designer.
So she just had like a lot ofreally great knowledge.
And I got to see exactly likehow small businesses run, from
like the buying to like thecleaning the bathrooms to
literally everything.
And so that was awesome.
And I actually had started atNordstroms when I was in high
(08:31):
school on an internship andstayed on and off with
Nordstroms throughout collegetoo.
And so I ended up being therefull time and I saw I worked in
like every department from likestock to lingerie to the juniors
section.
And then the last one I ended upbeing in uh the HR at
Nordstroms, which changed myperspective a little bit on what
(08:54):
I wanted to do.
SPEAKER_01 (08:55):
And then from there, when you went to Salesforce,
that was your first time inrecruiting, right?
SPEAKER_00 (09:00):
Correct.
So at Nordstrom's my last rolethere when I was assistant HR
manager for the store in CuertoMadeira, I was responsible for
the staffing.
So we have like our bigholidays.
You think of Christmas, but theyhave their anniversary sale,
which is like their one of theirbiggest milestones for the
company and where they bring inthe most revenue.
And so I was tasked withliterally hiring like 160 people
to get the store to its seasonalneeds.
(09:22):
And so I was doing all theinterviewing and onboarding and
all that kind of stuff.
And so I wore like a lot ofdifferent hats.
I didn't unfortunately firingtoo, um, but compliance, kind of
like you name it.
Um, and I realized that theinterviewing and like the hiring
was like that gave me a lot ofjuices.
I hated the firing.
Not my thing.
Um, and I didn't like a lot oflike the compliance stuff.
(09:43):
It wasn't something that likebrought me joy, if you will.
And so I had a couple colleagueswho left Nordstroms as they were
full the frontline managers andthey went over to Salesforce.
And so they actually referred meand I was like, Salesforce, like
what is this thing?
And I remember telling mygrandma, and she was like, You
are an idiot.
You don't leave Nordstroms,everybody knows Nordstroms,
who's Salesforce?
(10:04):
And so it was just like one ofthose things of changing my
identity because everybody in myfamily, I had told everybody
because I was pretty crystalclear that I wanted to be a
fashion buyer and go into that.
Um, and so it kind of reallychanged what I wanted to do in
the trajectory of my career.
SPEAKER_01 (10:19):
Nice, nice.
You were at Grammarly for uhabout five years, and during
your tenure, and you're in therole of a head of uh global
business recruiting.
The Ukraine-Russian war brokeout, and uh you had told me
before we hit record that thefounders of Grammarly are
actually from Ukraine, and a lotof your team was in Ukraine from
(10:41):
day one when the war started.
Grammarly is like thecategory-defining and leading
solution for what they do, andthey've continued to be so.
I my understanding they stillare today.
I mean, I use it, and mostpeople I know use it.
I think it's really fascinatingthat they've been able to
maintain that competitiveadvantage and category-leading
(11:02):
status through an incrediblybrutal war in Ukraine.
What was that like, right?
Like working with the team andhow did you adapt with day one
when that the war broke out?
Like, what was that like atGrammarly?
SPEAKER_00 (11:16):
100%.
So I would say it wasdefinitely, I think, where I've
learned the most and probablychanged the most as an
individual, personally andprofessionally, I would say.
Um, when I first startedGrammarly, it was actually like
it was just all kinds of change.
So, like when I first startedliterally the my first day, it
was like COVID had just hit.
And so they were like, Oh, we'rein office.
(11:36):
Oh, we're gonna ship yourlaptop, you'll come in in about
a month.
And then I never went in and weswitched to like remote first.
So day one with that company, itwas like always leading through
change and things like that.
Um, but I think it was my thirdor second year when the war
actually broke out.
The company honestly handled itfantastically.
They had been monitoring it.
People was their most importantthing.
(11:57):
Like I mentioned, ourco-founders were from Ukraine,
specifically Kyiv, Ukraine,which is where we had the office
for Grammarly, and we still havethe office today, which is
pretty awesome.
But it was wild to justbasically put business aside and
just literally thinking aboutlives and safety and well-being
of your team.
And it was so inspiring,honestly, to see people leading
(12:21):
through so much in their livesand still showing up.
I had an individual on my team.
And when everything kind of likebroke out, I was like, don't
worry about work.
I'm the last thing.
Just keep me in mind.
Please tell me we're safe andwhen you've made it out of the
country and all these things.
And I remember her saying, no, Ineed to work.
This is like the only stable Ihave in my life right now.
And so it was like trying toshow up and support people when
(12:44):
they were going through so much.
Again, it made you realize likethe little things like having a
bad hair day, getting a zit, orwhatever those like little
things that sometimes can bringpeople down really don't matter.
And I think it gave me adifferent perspective.
Um, but it also changed myleadership and my style and kind
of like how I show up at work.
I try to lead with positive polyenergy, right?
(13:05):
Like I really try to do empathyfirst, really get to know
somebody as a human first andthen integrate like the business
stuff and figure out whatmotivates them, what gives them
like psychological safety andlead through that.
Um it's funny too, if I were toreflect back, feedback I got
when I was a manager at Dropboxwas I'm too empathetic.
(13:26):
Um, that that was like a faultof mine almost as a manager, is
that I lean too much withempathy uh when I'm leading my
team.
And I think actually, I think itwas the Times had actually, or
Harvard, one of the two, put outan article and it was about how
during the time of COVID andimmense change, empathy was like
the top trait of like the bestleaders.
(13:46):
And that was really eye-openingfor me is I was like, okay, I'm
allowed to be this empathetic.
I'm allowed to kind of show upas authentic as I want and lead.
And I feel like it just like itchanged my tune.
And I'm happy that I was able todo it.
I'm still the war is ongoing.
I still am very connected with alot of the individuals.
It is heartbreaking.
Um, but again, like if I were tolook at back at Grammly, I think
(14:07):
how they showed up for theirpeople one and how they led
through that was like soinspiring and honestly what kept
me there for such a long time.
unknown (14:15):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (14:15):
I'd be curious.
I'm sure there was theco-founders.
I'm assuming would you have allhands or meetings or um just the
communication with the team?
Were there any themes or likevalues or or what did the key
things you remember in terms ofhow they helped the team like
navigate those challenges interms of how they were
(14:36):
communicating and trying to liftpeople up and support people?
Are there any memories there?
SPEAKER_00 (14:41):
I think yes.
Like again, Gram really did anamazing job of the foresight
into this and like the planningthat they did.
And so, like satellite cellphones, transportation in and
out, just like all hands ondeck, crazy communication, like
every 20 minutes, check-ins,like things like that.
So, like really showing upagainst safety was at the end of
the day the biggest thing forus.
And it was making sure that umpeople got out if they were
(15:04):
allowed to get out.
And then the men that wereenlisted, you know, like making
sure we were there to supportthem and support the country.
Like Grammarly sponsored acouple ambulances and seeing
those who go around the rubble,like with the Grammarly logo,
brought like immense pride.
And that was stuff that like youjust again, it makes all little
things like that is reallywhat's important, I would say.
(15:25):
Um, I remember a couple meetingstoo, where we were doing just
normal team meetings.
And anybody who they all duringZoom, they'd have to like unplug
from their Zoom because the thesirens go would go off and there
was um bombs and things likethat flying around.
And so they would all have to gointo the basement.
So you'd be on a Zoom, you'd seeeverybody, and then all of a
sudden you'd see the flashingsof the sirens, and then they'd
(15:47):
they'd disappear and then theywould show back on like nothing
had happened.
There were days where the sirenswere going off like 24-7 for
like weeks on end, and they hadno sleep, but they still showed
up like their authentic selves,and they were so driven, so
gritty, and honestly, again,inspiring.
Like they are the Ukrainianpeople are so inspiring for what
(16:08):
they're still going through tothis day.
SPEAKER_01 (16:10):
Yeah, they really are.
They truly are.
Well, I think it's what youmentioned is how it
fundamentally changed you as amanager and leader, is really
interesting.
I think seeing there are a fewthings, seeing and living
through hardship, as well asjust doing really hard things,
like being a parent, right?
I think that there's a level ofempathy that that unlocks in
(16:31):
people.
And I think at least obviouslyfor myself too, I feel like it's
some of the harder things I'vehad to go through definitely, I
think, have made me moreempathetic.
I think being a dad isdefinitely like having having a
little girl is has made me a lotmore empathetic.
But it's interesting thosechapters where you what you
experienced at Grammarly, andthen also how you saw other you
know, leadership, the foundersrespond must have been
(16:53):
incredibly impactful andprobably still impacts how you
you make decisions today, Iwould assume, and how you lead
today.
SPEAKER_00 (16:59):
Yeah, people first.
Again, I think it's like ascheesy as it is, but it's like
the one team, one dream.
Like you and any company, likereally, I think like they are
only as strong as the employeesthat they they hire and that
they have and how they treatthem.
And so for me, it's actuallybeen, I would say, a theme of
how I pick companies is lookingat how the leadership treats
their employees.
Um, and that's like the biggestone for me.
(17:21):
So leadership is always mything, and that's now a lens
that I really look through is Idon't want to work with people.
We used to say a term likebrilliant jerks, right?
Like they may be amazing, butthey're like not a nice human.
Like, that's not um who I wantto work side by side and like
pour my hours into.
I want to work along people thatare genuinely nice people and
we're on a mission, and it'sexciting to do it together.
SPEAKER_01 (17:42):
Yeah, fantastic, 100%.
So when it comes to now, right,you have more experience as a
leader.
Um, now you're advantageous.
So you're on to your nextleadership role.
At this point, what do you thinkis most important as a talent
acquisition leader for othertalent acquisition leaders, or
(18:02):
even more generally, anybodywho's trying to build amazing
teams?
What advice do you have to them?
You talked about bringing peopleup.
Can you explain what that means?
SPEAKER_00 (18:12):
Yeah, I would say like first, my biggest advice to
them is for anybody in this typeof role is like recruiting is
only going to be successful ifyou understand the businesses
you support.
What keeps them up at night andhow can we eliminate that
nervousness or whatever it is?
I think the people are thebiggest thing.
And so making sure that we'rebringing the right level of
talent, but you have to bereally in tune with the business
(18:33):
on their wants, what's working,not working, and then like the
proactiveness to get ahead ofthings before they happen or
don't happen, whatever that kindof like would mean.
Um so I would say that's thebiggest advice I would have uh
for leaders specifically.
SPEAKER_01 (18:49):
And I know also, yeah, you really also talked
about understanding businessneeds, communicating with the
different departments.
It sounds like really dialinginto business outcomes, right?
In terms of how you shape yourdepartment and how you lead your
recruiters.
Can you tell us more about howyou how you do that?
SPEAKER_00 (19:07):
Yeah, for sure.
I would say first and foremost,I think recruiting and sales
walk a really, really fine line.
I've always been drawn to thesales side.
I specifically didn't go on theengineering side just because I
I like that excitement and thatlike that pace, if you will.
That's the exciting thing.
Since we do walk a fine line, Ithink it's sometimes talking in
the language of the salesorganizations that you're
(19:27):
supporting and showing themexactly you know what the end
goal is, if it's revenue, ifit's NRR, whatever it may be,
how can we best support that?
And so again, just knowing thethe insides and outs, so to
speak.
Like with sales, when you'rehiring people, sometimes like
you have to understand that ifyou don't get a butt in a seat
for your VP of sales, forexample, like there's an open
(19:50):
quota that they may not hit.
And so you're actually likeimpacting people's paychecks and
like the business's success.
At the end of the day, that's alot of pressure.
And so you never want to be atthe like the end of a finger.
Like recruiting was the reasonwe weren't able to hit our goals
or hit our quarters because theycouldn't get kind of like butts
and seats.
And so I think like that, I takethat, I start with that, and
(20:10):
then it's how do we want to showup to the business?
How do we make sure we don't getto that spot from creating goals
and how we report out and howour frequent communication,
having, you know, um my teammembers like be in team
meetings, be vocal, but reallyalso be really cross-functional.
I think you have to have anamazing partnership with like
your PvPs, with your recruitingops, but also like the revenue
(20:30):
ops teams, the people who createthe quotas, who create the comp
plans, like all the things.
So again, I think it's likereally being integrated and not
just like one point of thebusiness, but a lot of them to
actually show up successful andmore as a partner versus like a
true support function, which Ithink a lot of people will look
at recruiting and say, it's asupport function.
It is, but it's really necessaryfor a company's success.
SPEAKER_01 (20:53):
Yeah, and I think I definitely agree with you.
And I've experienced this toothroughout my career.
And I look at my like my ownjourney and my level of impact
with the companies that I I helpgrow and within the tech
industry.
And it's just so different thanwhen I was starting out, where
it really was like you sort ofwhen you're starting out as a
(21:14):
recruiter, you almost feel likemore of an order taker, right?
Like you're writing down, you'redoing your sourcing.
So now when I think aboutleading hiring engagements with
a lot of our customers, it'swe're sitting down with the
founders and the CEOs and thetown acquisition leaders, and
we're talking about likebusiness strategy.
And we're really trying tounderstand like how people fits
(21:37):
and people fit into that.
And it's like really beingcritical about like the hiring
plans and making sure thatthere's alignment.
And I think that's just a skillthat takes like years to
develop, right?
It's critical.
Like that's really what ittakes.
It takes a culture, I think, tolike of an organization to
really understand that's thelevel that you need to be
playing at to win at recruiting.
SPEAKER_00 (21:59):
I think different size companies too.
I would say early days,Salesforce started out as a
recruiting coordinator, didsourcing as a full-time job, and
then moved into like the fullcycle of recruiting.
And that was 100% order taking.
And that was 25 hires a quarter,don't stop, go, go, go.
And then I was like, oh, I kindof want to build.
And that's what gave me thatbug.
(22:19):
And so, like, I think like myjourney of going from large to
smaller companies has been thatbuilding, taking more of that
strategic level, if you will,and like going deeper and
understanding that.
And then I will say, post COVID,I mean, recruiting has seen the
most rocks out of any gosh,yeah.
It's been terrible, to becompletely frank.
Right.
(22:39):
And like having been on theother side of having to do
layoffs, I want to never ever dothose ever again.
Um So I do think there's likethis theme now of like do more
with less, especially with AI.
Recruiters are tasked with takeon more roles and hire more, but
with less people and try to doit faster and try to, you know,
do all these things.
And so it's like, how do you onelead through that?
(23:02):
But also how do we lean in andfigure out how we can get more
strategic?
And again, staying your keepingyour pulse on the business and
understanding what it takes andwhat it means.
And also, like I try to be veryeyes wide open and have my team
be very eyes wide open untillike a bad hire will screw
things up, not just cost, butlike time in the business and
things like that.
And so um again, I picked kindof earlier building kind of
(23:24):
stage companies because I reallydo think it's like talent is
number one and you have to getthat hire right.
I never want to force a hiredown a hiring manager's like
throat, so to speak.
Like I want it to be the fit forthe business.
Um, and I want all people withinlike the recruiting cycle.
So like the RCs, if you'reworking with a candidate that's
terrible or is rude or doesn'tisn't responsive, like I want
(23:45):
that voice, I want that echoedup.
So again, the business can makethe best decision on who to
hire.
Um, because at the end, like wewait, we want to make sure we
get it right.
SPEAKER_01 (23:54):
Yeah, definitely.
So so at this point, I'mcurious.
You know, the when you look atat your your future, right?
And uh you know recently startedthis this new job.
I guess it's coming up on ayear, right?
Coming up on a year.
It's wild.
Um yeah, yeah, time flies,right?
Particularly in tech, likeparticularly when you're in like
Italian position leadershiprole, it just seems like things
(24:15):
just fly, fly, fly.
SPEAKER_00 (24:17):
Um I feel like I'm day two or a veteran.
It depends on the hour on likewhat question harping I get.
So it's it's great, but I lovethat.
That's the excitement of like,again, I know I'm in the right
place because like I'm excited.
I don't have Sunday scaries.
I sure have like Sunday wake upand I'm like, woo, we got some
stuff to do this week, but it'snot like I don't want to be
here.
Um, and that's when you knowyou're in the right spot, my
(24:39):
opinion.
SPEAKER_01 (24:39):
Yes, I love that.
Um so hey, like I I'm curious,how do you feel like your
definition of success haschanged over the years?
What are you really focused onright now?
SPEAKER_00 (24:49):
I would say for me, I I learned this earlier, I
would say, but I think it's likejust been cemented.
Every like change I've done islike I have learned to not look
for accolades.
I think early days atSalesforce, like your title
mattered.
If you weren't getting promotedevery six months, it was an
issue.
You weren't as good as yourpeer.
And then it would just likestarted a spiral within you.
(25:09):
Um, and so I really started tolike, what do I enjoy?
What brings me good challenges?
How can I continue to grow andwhat skills or what like type of
people do I want to be in frontof and kind of like work with?
And so that's what's really, Ithink, of like career growth for
me is like again, who would whodo I want to be in my Zoom
rooms?
Um, and to like challengemyself.
I love not never being like thesmartest person in a room.
(25:32):
I will never say that I ambecause I can always learn
something from anotherindividual.
And I think um I want tocontinue to do that.
I don't know what I want to donext, if I'm gonna be completely
honest.
Um, I've heard a lot of peoplebe like, you should go for like
a head of talent role.
I don't know that much aboutEng.
I've always had amazingcounterparts on the EPD side.
Um, and so like I've alwaysreally stayed in my go-to-market
(25:54):
bubble.
I love go to market.
It's the juice that like fuelsme.
I think if I had the right salesleader early in my career, I
probably would be in a salesrole.
Um, so like I really don't knowwhat next is for me or like the
next step.
I'm really happy with where Iam.
So I want to stay here for along time.
So don't worry, Siobhan.
I'm I'm staying put.
But definitely also just likeit's continuing to again
(26:16):
surround myself with reallystrong leaders that I can
continue to learn from, be ableto chew on like meaningful
problems or challenges, whetherthat's like growth scale, like
right now we're going into newmarkets, which is super exciting
and using like a different partof my brain.
There's always like these funthings that I think um can kind
of re-excite and you knowmotivate.
SPEAKER_01 (26:35):
Folks tuning in, a lot of them are leaders similar
to yourself.
And typically lifelong learners,usually pretty ambitious.
And when they're entering theirprime, right?
Which I told you I said I waslike, Oh, you're you know,
you're your prime and you'relike, I don't even know if I'm
there yet, you know.
Um so I don't know how you seethat.
I also I kind of see it the wayyou do.
I'm like, oh, I haven't evengotten started.
I've always had that uh becauseI think that's normal for
(26:57):
lifelong learners, right?
It's like we always there'salways that next level, right?
Absolutely.
I want to learn from you, and Ithink we all want to learn from
each other.
And it's like, how do you thinkabout your own personal
development?
Like, what are what are yourgoals, you know, outside of your
career?
What's most important to youright now?
SPEAKER_00 (27:13):
I have two small kids.
So I have a about to beseven-year-old and a three and a
half year old.
Um, my oldest is a girl, andthen my son is the three and a
half year old.
He's like my little teenytornado, I call him right now.
Um, for me, it's really likefamilies first.
That is like the biggest one.
And so, like making sure I canlike build a life for my
children that they're happywith, right?
(27:34):
Like they're if they don't lookback and they're like, oh, that
scarred me.
That is like every parent's likegoal.
Um, I think I'm doing prettywell there.
I, you know, I haven't asked mykids for my grade yet, but we
will see.
Um, but like that's like on thepersonal side.
It's just give them the bestlife we can, like make sure that
we can give them all theopportunities that they want and
kind of need.
I'm not talking like crazylavish.
I mean, we live in Petaluma,California.
(27:56):
It's not that, not that lavish,but like just like again, show
up, be be present for them.
Uh, my daughter like has thesecute little like tea parties in
class, or like she'll have aValentine's Day celebration, or
she had like, you know, likethey're little jogathons.
And I think there's like nothingmore important than being able
to like show up and see thesmile on her face and like the
pride she gets from like huggingme and like introducing me.
(28:18):
I want to make sure that that isstill like my priority and like
how I show up.
But then um, on the businessside, I want to make sure that
if people ask, how's Laurendoing?
I hope it's, oh, she's a greatpartner, she's doing well.
And if not, I want to make sureI can get there.
And so I think like that's whatfuels me.
I want to do a good job umwherever I am and in like
whatever role I am.
And so like constantly askingthe feedback and things like
(28:40):
that.
One of my old bosses used to sayfeedback was a gift.
And I always would be like, ohGod, I loathe that saying.
I say it all the time now.
Um, and so it's just like one ofthose things.
That's kind of how I look atthings.
SPEAKER_01 (28:51):
Yeah, for sure.
I have a six-year-old daughter.
I only have one.
SPEAKER_00 (28:54):
Fun.
SPEAKER_01 (28:55):
Yeah, yeah, it's it's a fun age for sure.
Um, you know, it's funny becauseyou said uh you hadn't asked for
a grade yet.
Now they're reminding me of.
I don't know if you you knowthis uh cartoon strip.
Do you remember?
Did you ever read uh or hear ofuh Calvin and Hobbes?
SPEAKER_00 (29:07):
I did not.
I do not.
SPEAKER_01 (29:09):
Well, Calvin and Hobbes is like uh it's a fun
little like cartoon strip thatwas used to be in the
newspapers.
I think it was like in the 80sor something.
But Calvin's like this littleboy, he's like your daughter's
age, I think he is six,something something like that.
And so like one on some of thecomic strips, like he'd walk up
to his dad and he would act likethere was like a polling, like
his dad was a politician, andhe'd just walk up like dad, the
(29:31):
latest numbers are in and you'reunderperforming.
Like, you know, you're not likedoing X, Y, and Z, or you know,
people say that you really needto make this adjustment or you
should find a new line of work.
You know, something like that.
It was just hilarious.
Um, they're kind of like reallycute cartoons I used to read as
a kid, and now my daughter lovesthem.
But uh yeah, anyway, just thisrandom like thought or
(29:52):
connection I made.
It's really funny stuff.
SPEAKER_00 (29:54):
I love that.
I will say, like, my daughterwas definitely like the first to
critique an outfit.
Mom, that is not a good look.
Like those types of things, andlike, you know, their innocence
and things like that, theirtruth serum that they throw at
you is like it'll hit you at theknees.
But again, you gotta laugh withit and move forward again.
I think that's like how Iapproach life is like laugh,
class, glass app full for sure.
SPEAKER_01 (30:15):
Oh, yeah, for sure.
I'm curious.
So you're a very ambitiousperson, right?
Driven, right?
You seem like a go, go, go uhtype of individual.
Being a parent's hard and to begood at it is very hard, right?
Like when we're trying to yeah,it's you know, it's kind of
interesting.
It's like I do, I do trulybelieve like being a parent is
like the hardest job in theworld.
And what's wild about it is thateverybody has, you know, almost
everybody has that job.
(30:36):
It's funny when you think aboutit from a recruiting
perspective, because it's likeit's like that it's incredibly
challenging.
I I'm wondering how do you thinklike finding that balance and
like maintaining yourprofessional progression, but
now in a place too where youclearly it's very important to
you to make sure your kids havethe best opportunities.
It's like the first thing youbrought up with with uh your
personal growth.
So um, do you have any advice toparents out there that are also
(30:59):
like really ambitious?
SPEAKER_00 (31:00):
I would say like the biggest thing is like be
authentic to yourself, don'tapologize.
I think that's like one of thebiggest things.
Is like I remember when I wasreally green in my career and I
was supporting somebody and shebecame a new mom.
And I was like, God, her work isslacking.
She hasn't been able to do this.
And then of course, it wasn'tuntil I became a mom.
And I was like, oh my, the stuffyou juggle, the things that are
happening, like the sleeplessnights, the trying to figure out
(31:23):
feeding.
And if you're working, you'repumping.
Like there's just like so muchmore to it.
And again, I think it's thatempathy that like really brings
it forward.
And so I would say, beauthentic, show up and know what
you need to do.
I'm very big on like calendarblocking.
Like I do my son's preschool,it's not till 8:30, right?
So, like some days I'll get upand I'll take my Amiha calls at
6 a.m.
And then I'll get back and I'lldo my eight-pack like ones at
(31:44):
like 6 p.m.
So I think it's just like dowhat you need to do, but always
make sure your priority is inorder.
And I think it's like thecommunication and how you can
communicate that out that isreally important.
SPEAKER_01 (31:54):
I love it.
I love it.
Well, Lauren, this has been areally fun conversation.
Thank you so much for coming ontoday and sharing more about
your journey and your values andhow you're approaching life and
your career.
It's been a lot of fun.
SPEAKER_00 (32:06):
Awesome.
Well, thank you.
It was uh been a greatconversation for me as well.
I appreciate it.
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