April 4, 2026 • 24 mins
The Fisch Bowl Podcast had the pleasure of attending Pittsburgh's 2026 Horror Realm Convention, and interview many actors and filmmakers behind the scenes of your favorite horror and sci-fi films! Today's episode is with actor Andrew Divoff from Wishmaster and Another 48 Hours, and actress Caroline Williams known from The Texas Chainsaw Massacre Part 2 and Leprechaun 3.
Listen
Watch
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_02 (00:00):
Attention all the fishes in the scene.
Welcome to the Fishbowl with SamFish.
SPEAKER_01 (00:08):
Sam Fish the Fish Bowl here at Horror Realm Con
2026 with the infamous, thevillainous Andrew Debau.
Thank you for taking the time toswim in the bowl with him.
Thank you, Fish.
Absolutely.
As I started to tell youyesterday, I've literally been
following your career since Iwas a kid.
(00:28):
So many roles, not enough timeto talk about everything.
Number one, obviously, Wishmas.
Thank you.
I've interviewed RobertKurtzman, the director, and one
of the masterminds behind themakeup and everything.
Any stories from the set uhmakeup process?
SPEAKER_02 (00:51):
You know, um really the story, when especially when
I think about Robert, was how weuh we sort of collaborated and
and and the collaboration becamereally at first it was the
question, what do we do with thevoice?
And uh and uh with a bit of uhserendipity, so after after
having first started taking mylunch breaks and and eating
(01:15):
whole food and trying to getthat into the into the mask, uh
which was uh apropos of that,but but one of the things that
Robert said to me was we'rereally gonna have to exaggerate
to make that mask move, and uheven the slightest gesture.
So you'll feel like you'reoveracting, but really go for
it.
So we got that, but then Inoticed after lunch that uh one
(01:36):
of the most humbling things wasuh was having the uh the makeup
crew pick out pieces of foodfrom between the mask and my
face, and I I said, Well, wehave to uh we have to stop that
and we have to change it.
And so what that became, mylunch essentially became a
protein shake.
And because of the whey and theprotein shake, thankfully that
(01:59):
that got the voice, it made thevoice a little more gurgly.
And so the first night we weredown in Wilmington and we filmed
uh the scene just outside of thewell with Buckflowers at the
dumpster and with ReggieBannister in the pharmacy.
And I think the end of that thatwhole scene was was uh
Buckflowers running away afterhe sees that this is a monster.
(02:22):
And I and I do that.
Uh my one of my favorite quotesfrom the movie, which is
Ravensa.
And so uh all I had to see wasthat Robert was quite pleased
with that, and and so we knew atthat point that we had the
voice.
We had gone, is it gonna be aBritish accent?
What is it gonna be?
And and I thought whatever itwould be, whatever accent wasn't
(02:42):
the important thing, it was thefact that the voice had to sound
like it was it was coming up outof the earth, you know, like
from the bowels of the earth.
I think we got that.
SPEAKER_01 (02:53):
Oh, 100%.
The the voice is one of the mosticonic villainous voices,
especially for again one of themost iconic movie movie monster
villains.
One of my all-time favorites.
Another film they've beenplaying it like crazy on, I
believe, Showtime another 48hours.
(03:13):
Oh, wonderful, man.
SPEAKER_02 (03:14):
What a what a what a fun thing that was.
And the fun thing about that wasthat I got to write a Harley on
somebody else's dime,essentially.
So they put the gas in it, andall I had to do was uh you know
crank the throttle.
I had a lot of fun, you know,just working with that whole
crew, being part of a of a moviewith Eddie Murphy and Nolte.
(03:35):
Uh, but uh but the funnest partof it was hanging out with the
bad guys, my good friend DavidAnthony Marshall and uh Ted
Markland.
We uh you know, we we literallyhung out together and we sort of
became a gang so that by thetime we got to that set in Baker
on uh uh in Dumont Dunes out inthe desert, you know, we we had
(03:58):
sort of figured each other out.
We we we were essentially wewere we were a gang.
And that uh I'll never forgetthat first day of shooting.
I uh I remember my mom hadpassed away before we began uh
uh filming three days before webegan.
Oh wow.
And uh and so I was uh fortunateenough to to go see her.
(04:20):
Uh she uh was an expat, havingbeen uh uh part of a consulate
in the embassy in Barcelona,Spain, long story short, and and
uh Guatemala City, Guatemala.
I was fortunate enough to uhvisit her and be with her when
she passed.
And so uh that morning Iremember when we started, it was
December 4th, and uh I took alittle bit of a walk into the uh
(04:44):
into the desert, and I uh I justremembered uh I just remembered
my mom.
Another great uh villainousrole, I loved you in Air Force
One.
Oh, well thank you, thank you.
What a wonderful thing that was,uh being able to work with uh
Mr.
Poor.
What a brilliant guy and a and agenerous guy on film, and uh and
I think really after all, whatwhat made him, if I can even
(05:06):
say, uh a small Andy fan was thefact that uh that we hit it off
so well for the stunts.
Uh that fight in the uh in thegalley, I'll never forget that.
And I'll I'll never forget, Imean, as far as I'm concerned,
Harrison is the king of actorswho do stunts.
Uh and and he really, I mean,because for him it's not it's
(05:29):
not an ego trip, it's not aboutbeing able to say that, it's
it's about the continuity of thecharacter.
And and he was that that was histhing, that was what he
emphasized, and I could telljust by watching him.
And so to be able to have afight as a as a newbie with Mr.
Ford made my day.
And by the way, if he heard mecall him Mr.
Ford, he'd say, my my father'sMr.
(05:53):
Ford.
Call me Harrison or Harry.
SPEAKER_01 (05:56):
So love you, Harry.
And I I just found this out nottoo long ago about Harrison
Ford.
Before he was known as HarrisonFord, he was a carpenter and a
roadie for the doors.
Oh, I didn't know that.
SPEAKER_02 (06:11):
Yeah.
Holy goodness, man.
Yeah, yeah.
Holy goodness, how cool is that?
You talk about a coolbackground, man.
Right, right.
I would have would have liked tobe a fly on that wall.
SPEAKER_01 (06:22):
Exactly, exactly.
Another horror film that I loveof yours, The Graveyard Shift.
Oh, wonderful, wonderful.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (06:30):
I have uh I have good memories from that.
I remember we were filming inBangor, Maine, in in this
warehouse, in the basement of awarehouse, of a working mill, as
a matter of fact.
And so we were always told, uh,especially because the uh the
mills were going to be working,and these things were like
monsters in their own right.
They had these claws that wouldthat would shred the wool and
(06:53):
separate uh you know the thegris, I guess, from what would
become the wool thread.
That was uh that was a trip, andthey always told us when you
walk by these things, be veryaware and be careful because
they'll eat you.
And uh, and I remember one ofthe one of the quickest sides
about that was uh was I rememberMr.
King coming down to the set, andand I was at the craft service
(07:15):
table and just kind of pickingout, figuring out, and I looked
up and I said, Oh, hey Mr.
King.
And he looked over at me throughthe glasses and he nodded, which
I I thought, oh wow, he noddedat me.
So I was I was quite it wasquite a beautiful, uh, beautiful
film and a and a beautiful time.
I uh I remember in in my daysoff I would head down to Bar
(07:37):
Harbor and just walk along thatbeautiful town and and breathe
in some of that beautiful seaair.
Never forget that.
Good good memories for that.
And uh, and at night when wewere filming at night, I
remember we had buzz bombers,which uh they call black flies.
Apparently those things neversweep, but uh but it was it was
a it was a beautiful time and abeautiful memory.
SPEAKER_01 (07:59):
One of my top favorite, I guess, monster movie
Stephen King films.
The kind of the whole concept oflike a giant like bat kind of
rodent thing hiding in a uh youknow graveyardist thing.
SPEAKER_02 (08:15):
It's it's B movie brilliantness.
It is, it is.
And I and I must give a shoutout to Ralph Singleton.
Uh this was, I believe, if I'mnot mistaken, his first time
directing, and he was wonderful.
Uh it was wonderful working withuh with uh David Andrews and
with uh with Stephen Macht.
What a beautiful human uhStephen Mocht is, and and and
(08:36):
and the fact that he got thataccent down, not an easy accent
to get that that Mana accent.
Right, right.
He uh he did it beautifully, anduh, and uh and was if I if I may
say he was quite hated by thecast, as I suppose makes sense
because of that character, toughcharacter, a guy, a guy, if you
(08:56):
were in the army, you wouldn'twant him to be your stash.
SPEAKER_01 (08:59):
Right, right, right.
Awesome, awesome.
Andrew, thank you so much fortaking the time to swim in the
pole.
SPEAKER_02 (09:06):
If I may call you fish, absolutely, absolutely.
SPEAKER_01 (09:09):
I appreciate it.
It was a pleasure.
Sam Fish, the fishbowl here foraround 2026 with the great and
wonderful Caroline Williams.
SPEAKER_00 (09:18):
Thank you, Fish.
SPEAKER_01 (09:20):
Absolutely.
We're swimming, we're swimmingin the bowl.
Awesome.
Texas Chainsaw Massacre Part 2,my absolute favorite in the
entire franchise.
Thank you.
I think we're talking about apossible remake, reboot.
SPEAKER_00 (09:35):
The reboot is definitely happening.
Glenn Powell's BarnstormProductions won the contest with
Tim Hankles Vortex, which is theholding company for the IP.
Uh JT Molner of Austin, Texas,is gonna be directing.
He's terrific.
He did Strange Darling, which isa terrific.
SPEAKER_01 (09:56):
Yes, that's a great one.
SPEAKER_00 (09:57):
I think the movie is gonna really fulfill Toby's
original vision for the TexasChainsaw Original, which is, you
know, was inducted into theMetropolitan Museum of Art, and
then Chainsaw 2, where Texas isa character in the film.
Absolutely.
And I I I look forward to seeingthat return because I think the
(10:23):
franchise overall has lost mostof its authenticity because of
just simply the wrong locations.
SPEAKER_01 (10:30):
Yes, yes.
I I mean part three, I think wasthe last maybe like watchable,
watchable one.
As much as I like seeing MattMcConaughey as a crazy
psychopath, which I think he'sreally underrated at like not
getting enough of those types ofroles, like seeing him and the
next generation, he was actuallymy favorite character in next
(10:53):
generation.
Yeah.
Um, but as far as part two goes,the characters are so unique.
There's something like reallywacky, but like special and and
artistic as well about uh parttwo and coming from Pittsburgh,
the great Tom Savini.
(11:13):
Oh, the effects.
SPEAKER_00 (11:15):
It was wonderful.
Yeah, he's wonderful.
SPEAKER_01 (11:18):
Yes.
Any stories about Toby Hooper orDennis Hopper from the shoot?
SPEAKER_00 (11:23):
Well, I mean, Toby was really under the gun with
Canon because he was editingInvaders from Mars at the same
time that he was directingChainsaw 2, our film.
So I don't know that he wasgetting much sleep at all.
I I know it was very, verychallenging for him.
Toby was always real simpleabout his direction.
(11:47):
Bigger, stronger, louder,smaller, make your crazy face,
more screaming.
I mean, it was always verybasic, which works well for me.
I don't want to hear a longpsychological dissertation about
things.
I want to, we want to make ourshots, we want to make our day.
And the movie is very hard andfast.
(12:08):
I'm in nearly every frame of thefilm.
So my responsibility was huge,but I enjoyed it so much.
I enjoyed the athleticism, Ienjoyed the underground lair.
It was just, it was play.
I was playing and I was having agood time.
As far as Dennis Hopper, youknow, his filmography is so
(12:29):
extraordinary.
SPEAKER_03 (12:30):
Right, right.
SPEAKER_00 (12:31):
And to hear his stories about his friends,
Natalie Wood, James Dean, NickAdams, it was just, you know,
working for Nick Ray, workingfor George Stevens, hearing
about Elizabeth Taylor and RockHudson, and uh he he he was
(12:51):
living Hollywood movie history.
And he made history with hisfilm Easy Rider.
SPEAKER_01 (13:00):
Yes.
SPEAKER_00 (13:01):
Now he was very much, and he had a long history
of drug and alcohol use.
And you know, both of us were 18months sober when we started
making the film.
So we really did have a lot ofsobriety that we could that we
could share with each other.
One of my best stories that Ihave about Dennis, you know, he
(13:22):
knew Miles Davis.
He knew he knew Felonious Monk.
I mean, some of the greatestsaxophone players who ever
lived.
And I invited him to join me on6th Street in Austin to hear of
a saxophone player I love namedKirk Whelum.
We go to the show, and you know,he reminds me, he knows all
(13:44):
these world-famous musicians.
We get there, Dennis is right infront of the stage.
He is watching Kirk play.
He is transported by this, he isdigging the scene, he's into it.
We go to work the next morningand he shows up and he goes, you
know, I took Caroline to seethis really great saxophone
(14:05):
player I love named Kirk Wallam.
So, yeah, exactly.
You know, he was verycharismatic.
Everything I know about actingfor film, I learned from him.
And it was so illuminating andinsightful to learn about lens
sizes, composition, lighting,things I'd never really paid
(14:28):
attention to, because as anactor, you're sort of trained
for stage, you're not trainedfor film.
So it was an absolute revelationto have learned these things.
And I I do think it informed myperformance really strongly.
SPEAKER_01 (14:44):
Was there any type of like improvisation in Texas
Part 2 or well, not for me somuch.
SPEAKER_00 (14:52):
My role, you know, I'm Dorothy in Oz.
SPEAKER_01 (14:55):
Right, right.
SPEAKER_00 (14:56):
And so, you know, being that principal character,
you know, everything in my worldis scripted, and all these crazy
characters just revolve aroundme.
LG, lefty, top top, the cook,leatherface.
Right, you know, I uh and myimprovisational stuff was very
(15:16):
limited, and plus my role is sophysical.
Yes, I'm always running,jumping, playing, falling down,
fighting.
It's always something.
So, but it was fantastic to besurrounded by these great
actors, especially Bill Mosleyplaying Chop Top.
Yes, because they just let himgo.
And he was feeling the characterso much, he was enjoying the
(15:39):
moment so much, and he keptcoming, he kept embroidering.
There was always more and moreand more, and it gave me so much
to work with and react to.
It was, you know, it was the itwas the role of a lifetime.
SPEAKER_01 (15:56):
Well, I have to say, and I'm I'm sorry if I'm giving
away any spoilers here, but thechainsaw battle between Dennis
Hopper and Leatherface.
SPEAKER_00 (16:07):
Oh my god, like Dennis Hopper had the most
amazing stunt double.
His name was Jim Stevenson.
He was literally an acrobat.
He could go from standing stillto jumping up on top of that
table, doing all the chainsawstuff.
He he was very powerful, he wasvery strong, and that certainly
(16:30):
informed a lot of Dennis'sperformance.
My favorite scene in the moviepersonally uh is not even one of
my scenes, it's the scene on thebridge.
SPEAKER_01 (16:42):
At the beginning.
SPEAKER_00 (16:43):
At the beginning.
SPEAKER_01 (16:43):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (16:45):
It's absolutely masterful because you've got the
actor in the leatherfacecostume, but he's obscured by
nubbins.
SPEAKER_01 (16:53):
Right, right.
SPEAKER_00 (16:54):
Built up on a platform on a truck.
They're traveling at an extremeabout 35 miles per hour on a
bridge that is, in fact, veryshort.
SPEAKER_01 (17:03):
Yes.
SPEAKER_00 (17:04):
But Toby made it look like it was a mile long,
and the way everything is editedtogether, I think it's one of
the most exciting scenes inalmost any horror film.
SPEAKER_01 (17:14):
I would agree, and it also has like the clap what
has become a classic trope whereit's like you introduce a bunch
of characters right off the batof the beginning that you think
are somehow could be, you know,the protagonists, and then you
kill them off as like the firstvictims.
SPEAKER_00 (17:35):
Exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (17:35):
You know, exactly.
And I thought that wasbrilliant, you know, confusing
the audience and into yourcharacter archetype, the the
heroic, you know, female lead.
And what just it's it's anamazing performance.
And I also have to say, like,you mentioned something before
about how it's very like bam,bam, bam the whole way through.
(17:59):
Yes.
And then the track that theyplay at the end when the credits
roll.
The only film that I can thinkof that pretty much copied like
the same format was ReservoirDarks.
SPEAKER_00 (18:11):
Oh! I didn't realize that.
SPEAKER_01 (18:14):
It's well, in the sense of like the I had never
thought of it before.
The the I I kind of followed itbecause I remember like the time
I was really watching Texas parttwo, and I was really getting
re-familiarized with likeQuentin Tarantino and his his
filmography, and the way TexasChainsaw like starts out, and
(18:35):
then like it's very like bam bambam, and then like it almost
like an abrupt ending.
Sure.
Resbor Dogs kind of does thesame thing, and then literally
the climax, and then playing,you know, the famous song at the
end, which is going against thethe tone of of the film, yeah.
This like heavy kind of youknow, in your face kind of
(18:58):
thing, and then a like a mellowalmost kind of song to kind of
top it off, both ending kind ofabruptly.
So sure.
That's just my own personal filmanalogy for uh Texas and
Reservoir Dogs, but another uhone of my all-time favorites,
Leprechaun 3.
SPEAKER_00 (19:16):
Oh, thank you.
I love that film.
Yes, had so much fun on it.
SPEAKER_01 (19:20):
I and I also have to say, no spoilers alert, but you
have the best death scene in theentire franchise.
SPEAKER_00 (19:27):
To this day, it's one of the top five horror
deaths, absolutely.
SPEAKER_01 (19:33):
And I had a chance to meet Warwick at one of the uh
other conventions we had here inPittsburgh a few years back.
I've been a fan of Warwickprobably as long as I've been a
fan of yours.
SPEAKER_00 (19:43):
And I was wondering, what was it like working with
Warwick and how how much of theleprechaun is is like in the
script, and how much is is islike Warwick's own contribution
to the well as Warwick himselfhas said, you know, he's buried
under pounds of latex andcostume and his hat, and he's
(20:04):
all the Warwick we know is isobscured by all these
appliances.
So, you know, he he basicallyjust animates, you know, the
makeup.
And his job is very hard.
You know, it's very hot underall that stuff, and he's always
in motion, he's always doingsomething.
(20:26):
So his challenge was really verychallenge, playing that
character very, very unique.
You know, the rest of us got tobe a little bit more kind of
normal characters.
I have to say, Brian TrentardSmith is masterful about telling
the story, once again, with alot of unique and interesting
(20:47):
characters.
And you know, I got to do atransformation scene.
You don't get to do that verymuch in the business.
Go from this frumpy, frowzy, sadlittle person to being somebody
really fabulous and then blowingup.
So, and I have to say, it'senjoying a lot of new life.
(21:08):
We do a lot of screenings aroundSt.
Patrick's Day, uh, we do a lotof signings.
The the character has reallycaught on again with the public.
And when I come to the signingshows, people are really
interested in Leprechaun, theyreally enjoy it.
SPEAKER_01 (21:24):
That's one franchise I would love.
Uh only if Warwick would return.
Like it wouldn't, I don't thinkit would be the same without
Warwick.
But like I I remember hearingthat there were possible talks
that the original creator wastrying to get the rights back,
and then unfortunately I he justpassed away.
But I I give it to the in theright hands and get Warwick to
(21:48):
come back.
Let's let's get a whole newgeneration of Leprechaun fans
and leprechaun reboots going.
SPEAKER_00 (21:55):
Like that's well, they did Leprechaun 10 and
brought in somebody else that.
newer and much youngerphysically speaking I don't know
that it's something he wouldwant to take on again because
he's gotten older and rightright you know we all get a
little we all get a littlecreaky but he's an utterly
remarkable guy creepy or creepywe get creepy yourself that was
(22:21):
Bill that was my buddy BillMosley but yeah I uh you know
I've I've had a nice long careerand you know taking a little uh
sabbatical during marriage andmotherhood but uh the last eight
years I've been hitting itpretty hard and I've got six
films that'll be out this yearuh one is going to festival will
(22:44):
be at Fantastic Fest it's calledWhat Did You Do it stars an
incredible young actor namedJohnny Stoddard he's currently
doing series television and it'sa film noir we shot in Austin
Steven Romano wrote and directedI'm very excited about that and
(23:04):
we have a documentary about themaking of the Texas Chainsaw
Massacre too that's gonna becoming out from Heather Buckley
she's she did the short life andghastly death of Al Adamson
which is one of the all-timegreat horror kind of grindhouse
documentaries and it's it's areally cool thing so it's it's
(23:26):
gonna be a fun year for me I'mreally excited about it and I
thank you so much absolutely forletting me take a swim thank you
for diving in head first ofcourse and we came out on top
and uh we're riding the wavesabsolutely Caroline Williams
everyone thank you so much tuneinto the fishbowl hey there all
(23:49):
my fishes in the sea thanks fortuning in to today's episode and
for being a subscriber yourcontinued listenership and
support means the most and helpskeep the show growing to deeper
and deeper depths.
SPEAKER_01 (23:59):
I want to let all my guppies in the sea know the
fishbowl has now officiallypartnered with
Fastcustomshirts.com wherethey're now selling custom
fishbowl t-shirts under theirpodcast and website section.
Every t-shirt that's purchasedhelps and goes a long way to
keep the show growing to deeperand deeper in higher higher
(24:20):
depths.
I also now have custom hats,beanies, handbags, pens, mouse
pads, everything to make youlook like the coolest looking
fish in the sea, which you canDM me directly on Instagram at
the Fishbull88 or on Facebook atjust the fishbowl or you can
friend request me Sam Fishdirectly and get yours today.
(24:41):
Your continued listenership andsupport again means the most
it's the most important fishesthat flock together.
We are a school of fish and wekeep the unit going.
Let's all keep swimmingupstream.
Attention all the fishes in the scene.
Welcome to the Fishbowl with SamFish.
SPEAKER_01 (00:08):
Sam Fish the Fish Bowl here at Horror Realm Con
2026 with the infamous, thevillainous Andrew Debau.
Thank you for taking the time toswim in the bowl with him.
Thank you, Fish.
Absolutely.
As I started to tell youyesterday, I've literally been
following your career since Iwas a kid.
(00:28):
So many roles, not enough timeto talk about everything.
Number one, obviously, Wishmas.
Thank you.
I've interviewed RobertKurtzman, the director, and one
of the masterminds behind themakeup and everything.
Any stories from the set uhmakeup process?
SPEAKER_02 (00:51):
You know, um really the story, when especially when
I think about Robert, was how weuh we sort of collaborated and
and and the collaboration becamereally at first it was the
question, what do we do with thevoice?
And uh and uh with a bit of uhserendipity, so after after
having first started taking mylunch breaks and and eating
(01:15):
whole food and trying to getthat into the into the mask, uh
which was uh apropos of that,but but one of the things that
Robert said to me was we'rereally gonna have to exaggerate
to make that mask move, and uheven the slightest gesture.
So you'll feel like you'reoveracting, but really go for
it.
So we got that, but then Inoticed after lunch that uh one
(01:36):
of the most humbling things wasuh was having the uh the makeup
crew pick out pieces of foodfrom between the mask and my
face, and I I said, Well, wehave to uh we have to stop that
and we have to change it.
And so what that became, mylunch essentially became a
protein shake.
And because of the whey and theprotein shake, thankfully that
(01:59):
that got the voice, it made thevoice a little more gurgly.
And so the first night we weredown in Wilmington and we filmed
uh the scene just outside of thewell with Buckflowers at the
dumpster and with ReggieBannister in the pharmacy.
And I think the end of that thatwhole scene was was uh
Buckflowers running away afterhe sees that this is a monster.
(02:22):
And I and I do that.
Uh my one of my favorite quotesfrom the movie, which is
Ravensa.
And so uh all I had to see wasthat Robert was quite pleased
with that, and and so we knew atthat point that we had the
voice.
We had gone, is it gonna be aBritish accent?
What is it gonna be?
And and I thought whatever itwould be, whatever accent wasn't
(02:42):
the important thing, it was thefact that the voice had to sound
like it was it was coming up outof the earth, you know, like
from the bowels of the earth.
I think we got that.
SPEAKER_01 (02:53):
Oh, 100%.
The the voice is one of the mosticonic villainous voices,
especially for again one of themost iconic movie movie monster
villains.
One of my all-time favorites.
Another film they've beenplaying it like crazy on, I
believe, Showtime another 48hours.
(03:13):
Oh, wonderful, man.
SPEAKER_02 (03:14):
What a what a what a fun thing that was.
And the fun thing about that wasthat I got to write a Harley on
somebody else's dime,essentially.
So they put the gas in it, andall I had to do was uh you know
crank the throttle.
I had a lot of fun, you know,just working with that whole
crew, being part of a of a moviewith Eddie Murphy and Nolte.
(03:35):
Uh, but uh but the funnest partof it was hanging out with the
bad guys, my good friend DavidAnthony Marshall and uh Ted
Markland.
We uh you know, we we literallyhung out together and we sort of
became a gang so that by thetime we got to that set in Baker
on uh uh in Dumont Dunes out inthe desert, you know, we we had
(03:58):
sort of figured each other out.
We we we were essentially wewere we were a gang.
And that uh I'll never forgetthat first day of shooting.
I uh I remember my mom hadpassed away before we began uh
uh filming three days before webegan.
Oh wow.
And uh and so I was uh fortunateenough to to go see her.
(04:20):
Uh she uh was an expat, havingbeen uh uh part of a consulate
in the embassy in Barcelona,Spain, long story short, and and
uh Guatemala City, Guatemala.
I was fortunate enough to uhvisit her and be with her when
she passed.
And so uh that morning Iremember when we started, it was
December 4th, and uh I took alittle bit of a walk into the uh
(04:44):
into the desert, and I uh I justremembered uh I just remembered
my mom.
Another great uh villainousrole, I loved you in Air Force
One.
Oh, well thank you, thank you.
What a wonderful thing that was,uh being able to work with uh
Mr.
Poor.
What a brilliant guy and a and agenerous guy on film, and uh and
I think really after all, whatwhat made him, if I can even
(05:06):
say, uh a small Andy fan was thefact that uh that we hit it off
so well for the stunts.
Uh that fight in the uh in thegalley, I'll never forget that.
And I'll I'll never forget, Imean, as far as I'm concerned,
Harrison is the king of actorswho do stunts.
Uh and and he really, I mean,because for him it's not it's
(05:29):
not an ego trip, it's not aboutbeing able to say that, it's
it's about the continuity of thecharacter.
And and he was that that was histhing, that was what he
emphasized, and I could telljust by watching him.
And so to be able to have afight as a as a newbie with Mr.
Ford made my day.
And by the way, if he heard mecall him Mr.
Ford, he'd say, my my father'sMr.
(05:53):
Ford.
Call me Harrison or Harry.
SPEAKER_01 (05:56):
So love you, Harry.
And I I just found this out nottoo long ago about Harrison
Ford.
Before he was known as HarrisonFord, he was a carpenter and a
roadie for the doors.
Oh, I didn't know that.
SPEAKER_02 (06:11):
Yeah.
Holy goodness, man.
Yeah, yeah.
Holy goodness, how cool is that?
You talk about a coolbackground, man.
Right, right.
I would have would have liked tobe a fly on that wall.
SPEAKER_01 (06:22):
Exactly, exactly.
Another horror film that I loveof yours, The Graveyard Shift.
Oh, wonderful, wonderful.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (06:30):
I have uh I have good memories from that.
I remember we were filming inBangor, Maine, in in this
warehouse, in the basement of awarehouse, of a working mill, as
a matter of fact.
And so we were always told, uh,especially because the uh the
mills were going to be working,and these things were like
monsters in their own right.
They had these claws that wouldthat would shred the wool and
(06:53):
separate uh you know the thegris, I guess, from what would
become the wool thread.
That was uh that was a trip, andthey always told us when you
walk by these things, be veryaware and be careful because
they'll eat you.
And uh, and I remember one ofthe one of the quickest sides
about that was uh was I rememberMr.
King coming down to the set, andand I was at the craft service
(07:15):
table and just kind of pickingout, figuring out, and I looked
up and I said, Oh, hey Mr.
King.
And he looked over at me throughthe glasses and he nodded, which
I I thought, oh wow, he noddedat me.
So I was I was quite it wasquite a beautiful, uh, beautiful
film and a and a beautiful time.
I uh I remember in in my daysoff I would head down to Bar
(07:37):
Harbor and just walk along thatbeautiful town and and breathe
in some of that beautiful seaair.
Never forget that.
Good good memories for that.
And uh, and at night when wewere filming at night, I
remember we had buzz bombers,which uh they call black flies.
Apparently those things neversweep, but uh but it was it was
a it was a beautiful time and abeautiful memory.
SPEAKER_01 (07:59):
One of my top favorite, I guess, monster movie
Stephen King films.
The kind of the whole concept oflike a giant like bat kind of
rodent thing hiding in a uh youknow graveyardist thing.
SPEAKER_02 (08:15):
It's it's B movie brilliantness.
It is, it is.
And I and I must give a shoutout to Ralph Singleton.
Uh this was, I believe, if I'mnot mistaken, his first time
directing, and he was wonderful.
Uh it was wonderful working withuh with uh David Andrews and
with uh with Stephen Macht.
What a beautiful human uhStephen Mocht is, and and and
(08:36):
and the fact that he got thataccent down, not an easy accent
to get that that Mana accent.
Right, right.
He uh he did it beautifully, anduh, and uh and was if I if I may
say he was quite hated by thecast, as I suppose makes sense
because of that character, toughcharacter, a guy, a guy, if you
(08:56):
were in the army, you wouldn'twant him to be your stash.
SPEAKER_01 (08:59):
Right, right, right.
Awesome, awesome.
Andrew, thank you so much fortaking the time to swim in the
pole.
SPEAKER_02 (09:06):
If I may call you fish, absolutely, absolutely.
SPEAKER_01 (09:09):
I appreciate it.
It was a pleasure.
Sam Fish, the fishbowl here foraround 2026 with the great and
wonderful Caroline Williams.
SPEAKER_00 (09:18):
Thank you, Fish.
SPEAKER_01 (09:20):
Absolutely.
We're swimming, we're swimmingin the bowl.
Awesome.
Texas Chainsaw Massacre Part 2,my absolute favorite in the
entire franchise.
Thank you.
I think we're talking about apossible remake, reboot.
SPEAKER_00 (09:35):
The reboot is definitely happening.
Glenn Powell's BarnstormProductions won the contest with
Tim Hankles Vortex, which is theholding company for the IP.
Uh JT Molner of Austin, Texas,is gonna be directing.
He's terrific.
He did Strange Darling, which isa terrific.
SPEAKER_01 (09:56):
Yes, that's a great one.
SPEAKER_00 (09:57):
I think the movie is gonna really fulfill Toby's
original vision for the TexasChainsaw Original, which is, you
know, was inducted into theMetropolitan Museum of Art, and
then Chainsaw 2, where Texas isa character in the film.
Absolutely.
And I I I look forward to seeingthat return because I think the
(10:23):
franchise overall has lost mostof its authenticity because of
just simply the wrong locations.
SPEAKER_01 (10:30):
Yes, yes.
I I mean part three, I think wasthe last maybe like watchable,
watchable one.
As much as I like seeing MattMcConaughey as a crazy
psychopath, which I think he'sreally underrated at like not
getting enough of those types ofroles, like seeing him and the
next generation, he was actuallymy favorite character in next
(10:53):
generation.
Yeah.
Um, but as far as part two goes,the characters are so unique.
There's something like reallywacky, but like special and and
artistic as well about uh parttwo and coming from Pittsburgh,
the great Tom Savini.
(11:13):
Oh, the effects.
SPEAKER_00 (11:15):
It was wonderful.
Yeah, he's wonderful.
SPEAKER_01 (11:18):
Yes.
Any stories about Toby Hooper orDennis Hopper from the shoot?
SPEAKER_00 (11:23):
Well, I mean, Toby was really under the gun with
Canon because he was editingInvaders from Mars at the same
time that he was directingChainsaw 2, our film.
So I don't know that he wasgetting much sleep at all.
I I know it was very, verychallenging for him.
Toby was always real simpleabout his direction.
(11:47):
Bigger, stronger, louder,smaller, make your crazy face,
more screaming.
I mean, it was always verybasic, which works well for me.
I don't want to hear a longpsychological dissertation about
things.
I want to, we want to make ourshots, we want to make our day.
And the movie is very hard andfast.
(12:08):
I'm in nearly every frame of thefilm.
So my responsibility was huge,but I enjoyed it so much.
I enjoyed the athleticism, Ienjoyed the underground lair.
It was just, it was play.
I was playing and I was having agood time.
As far as Dennis Hopper, youknow, his filmography is so
(12:29):
extraordinary.
SPEAKER_03 (12:30):
Right, right.
SPEAKER_00 (12:31):
And to hear his stories about his friends,
Natalie Wood, James Dean, NickAdams, it was just, you know,
working for Nick Ray, workingfor George Stevens, hearing
about Elizabeth Taylor and RockHudson, and uh he he he was
(12:51):
living Hollywood movie history.
And he made history with hisfilm Easy Rider.
SPEAKER_01 (13:00):
Yes.
SPEAKER_00 (13:01):
Now he was very much, and he had a long history
of drug and alcohol use.
And you know, both of us were 18months sober when we started
making the film.
So we really did have a lot ofsobriety that we could that we
could share with each other.
One of my best stories that Ihave about Dennis, you know, he
(13:22):
knew Miles Davis.
He knew he knew Felonious Monk.
I mean, some of the greatestsaxophone players who ever
lived.
And I invited him to join me on6th Street in Austin to hear of
a saxophone player I love namedKirk Whelum.
We go to the show, and you know,he reminds me, he knows all
(13:44):
these world-famous musicians.
We get there, Dennis is right infront of the stage.
He is watching Kirk play.
He is transported by this, he isdigging the scene, he's into it.
We go to work the next morningand he shows up and he goes, you
know, I took Caroline to seethis really great saxophone
(14:05):
player I love named Kirk Wallam.
So, yeah, exactly.
You know, he was verycharismatic.
Everything I know about actingfor film, I learned from him.
And it was so illuminating andinsightful to learn about lens
sizes, composition, lighting,things I'd never really paid
(14:28):
attention to, because as anactor, you're sort of trained
for stage, you're not trainedfor film.
So it was an absolute revelationto have learned these things.
And I I do think it informed myperformance really strongly.
SPEAKER_01 (14:44):
Was there any type of like improvisation in Texas
Part 2 or well, not for me somuch.
SPEAKER_00 (14:52):
My role, you know, I'm Dorothy in Oz.
SPEAKER_01 (14:55):
Right, right.
SPEAKER_00 (14:56):
And so, you know, being that principal character,
you know, everything in my worldis scripted, and all these crazy
characters just revolve aroundme.
LG, lefty, top top, the cook,leatherface.
Right, you know, I uh and myimprovisational stuff was very
(15:16):
limited, and plus my role is sophysical.
Yes, I'm always running,jumping, playing, falling down,
fighting.
It's always something.
So, but it was fantastic to besurrounded by these great
actors, especially Bill Mosleyplaying Chop Top.
Yes, because they just let himgo.
And he was feeling the characterso much, he was enjoying the
(15:39):
moment so much, and he keptcoming, he kept embroidering.
There was always more and moreand more, and it gave me so much
to work with and react to.
It was, you know, it was the itwas the role of a lifetime.
SPEAKER_01 (15:56):
Well, I have to say, and I'm I'm sorry if I'm giving
away any spoilers here, but thechainsaw battle between Dennis
Hopper and Leatherface.
SPEAKER_00 (16:07):
Oh my god, like Dennis Hopper had the most
amazing stunt double.
His name was Jim Stevenson.
He was literally an acrobat.
He could go from standing stillto jumping up on top of that
table, doing all the chainsawstuff.
He he was very powerful, he wasvery strong, and that certainly
(16:30):
informed a lot of Dennis'sperformance.
My favorite scene in the moviepersonally uh is not even one of
my scenes, it's the scene on thebridge.
SPEAKER_01 (16:42):
At the beginning.
SPEAKER_00 (16:43):
At the beginning.
SPEAKER_01 (16:43):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (16:45):
It's absolutely masterful because you've got the
actor in the leatherfacecostume, but he's obscured by
nubbins.
SPEAKER_01 (16:53):
Right, right.
SPEAKER_00 (16:54):
Built up on a platform on a truck.
They're traveling at an extremeabout 35 miles per hour on a
bridge that is, in fact, veryshort.
SPEAKER_01 (17:03):
Yes.
SPEAKER_00 (17:04):
But Toby made it look like it was a mile long,
and the way everything is editedtogether, I think it's one of
the most exciting scenes inalmost any horror film.
SPEAKER_01 (17:14):
I would agree, and it also has like the clap what
has become a classic trope whereit's like you introduce a bunch
of characters right off the batof the beginning that you think
are somehow could be, you know,the protagonists, and then you
kill them off as like the firstvictims.
SPEAKER_00 (17:35):
Exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (17:35):
You know, exactly.
And I thought that wasbrilliant, you know, confusing
the audience and into yourcharacter archetype, the the
heroic, you know, female lead.
And what just it's it's anamazing performance.
And I also have to say, like,you mentioned something before
about how it's very like bam,bam, bam the whole way through.
(17:59):
Yes.
And then the track that theyplay at the end when the credits
roll.
The only film that I can thinkof that pretty much copied like
the same format was ReservoirDarks.
SPEAKER_00 (18:11):
Oh! I didn't realize that.
SPEAKER_01 (18:14):
It's well, in the sense of like the I had never
thought of it before.
The the I I kind of followed itbecause I remember like the time
I was really watching Texas parttwo, and I was really getting
re-familiarized with likeQuentin Tarantino and his his
filmography, and the way TexasChainsaw like starts out, and
(18:35):
then like it's very like bam bambam, and then like it almost
like an abrupt ending.
Sure.
Resbor Dogs kind of does thesame thing, and then literally
the climax, and then playing,you know, the famous song at the
end, which is going against thethe tone of of the film, yeah.
This like heavy kind of youknow, in your face kind of
(18:58):
thing, and then a like a mellowalmost kind of song to kind of
top it off, both ending kind ofabruptly.
So sure.
That's just my own personal filmanalogy for uh Texas and
Reservoir Dogs, but another uhone of my all-time favorites,
Leprechaun 3.
SPEAKER_00 (19:16):
Oh, thank you.
I love that film.
Yes, had so much fun on it.
SPEAKER_01 (19:20):
I and I also have to say, no spoilers alert, but you
have the best death scene in theentire franchise.
SPEAKER_00 (19:27):
To this day, it's one of the top five horror
deaths, absolutely.
SPEAKER_01 (19:33):
And I had a chance to meet Warwick at one of the uh
other conventions we had here inPittsburgh a few years back.
I've been a fan of Warwickprobably as long as I've been a
fan of yours.
SPEAKER_00 (19:43):
And I was wondering, what was it like working with
Warwick and how how much of theleprechaun is is like in the
script, and how much is is islike Warwick's own contribution
to the well as Warwick himselfhas said, you know, he's buried
under pounds of latex andcostume and his hat, and he's
(20:04):
all the Warwick we know is isobscured by all these
appliances.
So, you know, he he basicallyjust animates, you know, the
makeup.
And his job is very hard.
You know, it's very hot underall that stuff, and he's always
in motion, he's always doingsomething.
(20:26):
So his challenge was really verychallenge, playing that
character very, very unique.
You know, the rest of us got tobe a little bit more kind of
normal characters.
I have to say, Brian TrentardSmith is masterful about telling
the story, once again, with alot of unique and interesting
(20:47):
characters.
And you know, I got to do atransformation scene.
You don't get to do that verymuch in the business.
Go from this frumpy, frowzy, sadlittle person to being somebody
really fabulous and then blowingup.
So, and I have to say, it'senjoying a lot of new life.
(21:08):
We do a lot of screenings aroundSt.
Patrick's Day, uh, we do a lotof signings.
The the character has reallycaught on again with the public.
And when I come to the signingshows, people are really
interested in Leprechaun, theyreally enjoy it.
SPEAKER_01 (21:24):
That's one franchise I would love.
Uh only if Warwick would return.
Like it wouldn't, I don't thinkit would be the same without
Warwick.
But like I I remember hearingthat there were possible talks
that the original creator wastrying to get the rights back,
and then unfortunately I he justpassed away.
But I I give it to the in theright hands and get Warwick to
(21:48):
come back.
Let's let's get a whole newgeneration of Leprechaun fans
and leprechaun reboots going.
SPEAKER_00 (21:55):
Like that's well, they did Leprechaun 10 and
brought in somebody else that.
newer and much youngerphysically speaking I don't know
that it's something he wouldwant to take on again because
he's gotten older and rightright you know we all get a
little we all get a littlecreaky but he's an utterly
remarkable guy creepy or creepywe get creepy yourself that was
(22:21):
Bill that was my buddy BillMosley but yeah I uh you know
I've I've had a nice long careerand you know taking a little uh
sabbatical during marriage andmotherhood but uh the last eight
years I've been hitting itpretty hard and I've got six
films that'll be out this yearuh one is going to festival will
(22:44):
be at Fantastic Fest it's calledWhat Did You Do it stars an
incredible young actor namedJohnny Stoddard he's currently
doing series television and it'sa film noir we shot in Austin
Steven Romano wrote and directedI'm very excited about that and
(23:04):
we have a documentary about themaking of the Texas Chainsaw
Massacre too that's gonna becoming out from Heather Buckley
she's she did the short life andghastly death of Al Adamson
which is one of the all-timegreat horror kind of grindhouse
documentaries and it's it's areally cool thing so it's it's
(23:26):
gonna be a fun year for me I'mreally excited about it and I
thank you so much absolutely forletting me take a swim thank you
for diving in head first ofcourse and we came out on top
and uh we're riding the wavesabsolutely Caroline Williams
everyone thank you so much tuneinto the fishbowl hey there all
(23:49):
my fishes in the sea thanks fortuning in to today's episode and
for being a subscriber yourcontinued listenership and
support means the most and helpskeep the show growing to deeper
and deeper depths.
SPEAKER_01 (23:59):
I want to let all my guppies in the sea know the
fishbowl has now officiallypartnered with
Fastcustomshirts.com wherethey're now selling custom
fishbowl t-shirts under theirpodcast and website section.
Every t-shirt that's purchasedhelps and goes a long way to
keep the show growing to deeperand deeper in higher higher
(24:20):
depths.
I also now have custom hats,beanies, handbags, pens, mouse
pads, everything to make youlook like the coolest looking
fish in the sea, which you canDM me directly on Instagram at
the Fishbull88 or on Facebook atjust the fishbowl or you can
friend request me Sam Fishdirectly and get yours today.
(24:41):
Your continued listenership andsupport again means the most
it's the most important fishesthat flock together.
We are a school of fish and wekeep the unit going.
Let's all keep swimmingupstream.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
Kingdom of Fraud
It’s the unlikeliest of criminal partnerships: a devout polygamist from an insular Utah sect joining forces with a shadowy Armenian tycoon from LA. The result - a billion dollar fraud conspiracy. In Kingdom of Fraud, investigative reporter Michele McPhee traces the origins of the extraordinary alliance between Jacob Kingston and Levon Termendzhyan. Together, the two men trigger the largest tax investigation in American history and weave around themselves a web of dirty cops, influential political relationships and transnational money laundering. All this is set against the backdrop of Jacob Kingston’s clan – The Order. A powerful and secretive polygamist organization in Salt Lake City. To whom Jacob is desperate to prove his worth. Kingdom of Fraud is produced by Novel for iHeart Podcasts. For more from Novel, visit https://novel.audio/. You can listen to new episodes of Kingdom of Fraud completely ad-free and 1 week early with an iHeart True Crime+ subscription, available exclusively on Apple Podcasts. Open your Apple Podcasts app, search for “iHeart True Crime+, and subscribe today!