June 24, 2026 • 25 mins
One of the hardest things for any mayor to do is convince people that a problem can actually be solved.
That may sound obvious, but when a city has struggled with violence for decades, cynicism starts to set in. Residents get frustrated. Headlines get harsher. And people assume that high levels of violence are simply part of life.
My guest today rejects that idea.
Quinton Lucas has served as mayor of Kansas City since 2019, a period that included both record levels of violence and, more recently, significant declines in homicides and shootings across the city .
In this episode, we talk about how Kansas City approached violence reduction and how to communicate complex solutions to an intractable problem.
Born and raised in Kansas City's inner city, Quinton Lucas serves as the 55th mayor of Kansas City, the youngest person elected to the role since 1855. Recognizing the importance of safety in our communities, Mayor Lucas serves as national chair for criminal justice efforts in the United States Conference of Mayors and as an advocate to reduce gun violence on America's streets as co-chair of Mayors Against Illegal Guns.
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Episode Transcript
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SPEAKER_00 (00:00):
I'm Jeff Asher and this is the Jeffalytics Podcast.
(00:04):
One of the hardest things forany mayor to do is to convince
people that a problem canactually be solved.
That may sound obvious, but whena city has struggled with
violence for decades, cynicismstarts to set in, residents get
frustrated, headlines getharsher, and people assume that
high levels of violence aresimply parts of life.
My guest today rejects thatidea.
Quentin Lucas has served asmayor of Kansas City since 2019,
(00:26):
a period that has included bothrecord levels of violence and
more recently significantdeclines in both homicides and
shootings across the city.
In this episode, we talked abouthow Kansas City has approached
violence reduction and how tocommunicate complex solutions to
an intractable problem.
We discussed police staffing,technology, community trust, and
the pressure elected officialsface during crime spikes.
(00:47):
At its core, this is aconversation about leadership,
persistence, and what it takesto keep working on a problem
after most people have decidedit can't be fixed.
Let's dive in.
There we go.
Can you hear me?
Okay.
All right.
We did it.
I got sound.
SPEAKER_01 (01:04):
We've got her figured out.
SPEAKER_00 (01:06):
Amazing.
How are you, sir?
SPEAKER_01 (01:08):
I you know what?
I can't complain.
Nothing but sun shining on me onthis beautiful day in Kansas
City.
SPEAKER_00 (01:12):
I hope you're doing all right.
I'm doing okay.
I gotta say, I'm I'm a little uhI don't know if annoyed the
right word, but you're thesecond mayor now that I've
talked to and interviewed thatis actually younger than me.
And I'm not the old man.
It makes me feel veryunaccomplished to talk to
somebody that is in my age rangebut has accomplished more.
SPEAKER_01 (01:31):
Man, I have so many young haters, though, that uh I
feel like I'm just the oldinstitutional guy now.
SPEAKER_00 (01:36):
So well, uh let's dive in.
Uh I really appreciate you.
This is uh I think it'scertainly my first Substack
Live.
So excited to be here andexcited to uh test out this new
medium for talking to people.
So could you just talk methrough like what is your
background?
How did you get to be in thisposition?
SPEAKER_01 (01:54):
You know, I mean, it's uh it's been a blessing.
So I've been mayor of KansasCity since 2019.
Uh I am born and raised inKansas City, Missouri, went away
for school, but otherwise havebeen here my entire life.
And uh, you know, I think theway I get here is actually the
way I came up.
I grew up with a hardworkingwoman.
I was the youngest of threechildren.
We knew homelessness a bit as akid.
I knew some other challenges,but on the whole, I always saw
(02:17):
how government, particularlylocal government, could make a
positive difference.
And so that has inspired methroughout.
Became an attorney.
Uh, when I came back home, Ithink I saw a few issues that
have been around for my entirelife.
So that inspired me for citycouncil.
I was lucky enough to getelected.
Then the mayoral suit was open,12-person primary, which means
(02:38):
that all you need is like yourmama and 500 people to vote for
you.
I was able to, you know, jumpover that hurdle and uh, you
know, and have been mayor eversince.
The issues, though, I mean, so Ibecame a mayor during the first
Trump administration.
Some issues are the same, somehave changed mightily.
I think that uh, you know, backin 2019, we were talking a lot
of how do we ever getinfrastructure funding?
(02:59):
We were able to get that, thatpark change.
We were talking, you know, Imean, just uh unimaginable
street-level violence in a lotof our communities.
I remember I spoke to the mayorof Baltimore before Brandon
Scott at one point.
We had a call because both ofour cities were reeling for
murder crises.
And uh that's what you wereseeing in a lot of places with
Mayor Lifewood in Chicago, withlots of other folks that I
(03:21):
worked with then.
So a lot has changed, but a lotstays the same.
I think one of the best thingsthat's changed is our commitment
to having good solutions to theproblems that confront the
American city.
SPEAKER_00 (03:32):
So talk me through that.
What has been sort of yourapproach?
Uh just sort of doing mybackground research.
I saw from the start of yourcampaign and from the start of
your administration, gunviolence reduction has been sort
of at the forefront.
So what has been your approachand what have you sort of found
that's been successful, and whathave you found that maybe hasn't
been as successful?
SPEAKER_01 (03:52):
I think step one, what you need to do is uh you
need to make sure that youbelieve that things can change
for the better.
I think the biggest mistake thatwe make is something that I
heard when I was running formayor, actually.
I have this wonderfulcouncilwoman who was from kind
of a suburban-ish area of thecity.
Imagine somebody who's fromStaten Island.
I'd gotten her to endorse me.
(04:13):
Things were great.
She said, uh, you know, she'sold smoker, and she said, you
know, you gotta stop talkingabout the murders.
I was like, huh?
Uh and she said, look, they'llnever change, right?
Like, everybody's tried, it'sjust the way it's gonna be.
You gotta be about everythingelse in the city.
And I told myself, like, well,thank you, ma'am, but that ain't
it ain't gonna be how I live.
This is the crisis, not just inthe American city.
(04:35):
I think it's fair to say it's acrisis, it's an epidemic in the
black community.
And so I think the first thingyou do is try to commit to
saying, I'm gonna talk about it.
I may not solve it, but I'mgonna talk about it.
But respect these people'slives.
I'm gonna make sure that peopleknow we can do something
different.
So that was that first step.
The next step was, I'll be quitehonest with you, a lot of
battling with uh institutions atthe time.
(04:58):
We had a police chief when Ifirst became mayor who I don't
think had this sort oftransformational view on how we
can reduce homicides andshootings.
He came from an old school, andan old school that, by the way,
in 2020 was still very active inthe fight, which was saying, no,
the problem isn't that we don'tinvest in young people, that we
aren't actually trying to treatsymptoms.
It's a problem that we justain't thrown, we ain't put
(05:20):
enough people in jail.
We have not said that these guysare bad guys, right?
We haven't, you know, yelledabout it in the right way.
So there was a lot of change ofthe mentality.
And it took years, by the way,years.
And so we've changed leadershipwith the police department.
We have a new prosecutor now whoI think subscribes to my view of
how you do focused deterrence.
(05:41):
She came out of my office, proudof that.
And I think that, you know, wekeep chipping away, recognizing
that the misfortune and thegreatest challenge to the
American city, and watching themayor's race in LA right now and
everything else, whether it'sviolent crime or homelessness or
other certain issues, you'redealing with an individual
curse.
Human beings aren't widgets.
(06:02):
And so you can't just be like,all right, we got 2,000 people
on the streets, let's just buildthis thing.
They're all gonna go there,they're gonna operate
nationally, naturally, it'sgonna be great.
Same thing with violent crime.
You can't just open a gym, throwin 10 basketballs, and be like,
hey, y'all, it's open until 2a.m.
Good luck.
You need to continue to adapt,fail, deal with a tough
(06:22):
narrative sometimes, becausepeople expect you to fix it from
day one.
But I think Kansas City wasready to commit.
And uh I think that's wherewe're seeing progress now.
SPEAKER_00 (06:31):
And sort of what what do you do ascribe that that
progress to sort of in light ofyour successes?
I'm just looking at the numbers,you're down.
Obviously, 48 murders is 48 toomany, but it's down
substantially in 2023.
You had 74 at this point, 66 in2022.
What do you ascribe that successto right now, especially in
light of sort of that thoughtthat it is happening everywhere,
(06:55):
but it's happening bigger someplaces than others?
SPEAKER_01 (06:57):
Yeah.
I mean, I think the the firstthing I will say, and I
mentioned focus deterrencebefore, for those who may have
stumbled upon this substack anddon't give a hoot about like
what that is or what it means.
It's very much this.
In any American city, you have asmall number of people who are
engaged in lots of the violentcrime and also
disproportionately become thevictims.
To the extent that yourcommunity focuses on those
(07:19):
folks.
And so we have a group by thename of Stand Against Violence
Casey, save like Save Casey.
We visit with this group ofpeople, we tell them, look, here
are our exceptional lifeopportunities we're gonna
provide for you job training,housing, counseling, right?
All these sorts of things youmay need, help reunifying
yourself with your children ifyou follow the straight narrow
(07:41):
path.
If you do not, however, we aregonna come down on you, on
prosecution.
The police are watching you, butdon't force us to do that
approach.
And we see that program payingincredible dividends,
particularly in wards, patroldivisions of the city where
violence is the most pronounced.
I think that has been atransformational difference
(08:03):
maker in terms of what we aretrying to do.
The other things that we aredoing are specialty courts in
our municipal court system.
And why municipal court?
Obviously, your homicides aren'tbeing prosecuted there, but
that's usually the gateway intomore serious level offenses.
And we recognize that fromhaving a gun court, for example,
if you are actually somebody,which takes some work, by the
(08:25):
way, in a jurisdiction with alot of crimes, if you're
somebody who's gun play, gets tothe level of having the
attention of the police, but youdidn't get shot or you didn't
shoot somebody, this is a greatmoment for us to warn you is
stop.
Put it down, don't take it tothe same places, get out of that
trouble.
That's one specialty court, adomestic violence court, does, I
think, frankly, similar work aswell.
(08:46):
So that is, I think, how we'vegotten started, and I think it's
how we're seeing progress.
SPEAKER_00 (08:51):
And a lot of cities, especially medium and big size
cities, are dealing with theissue of fewer police officers
to do sort of the enforcementside of all of this work.
How has have you adapted tohaving a smaller police force
post-COVID?
SPEAKER_01 (09:05):
Yeah.
I mean, look, here's thereality, which is the reality,
which is the reality.
I hope my staff cuts this linelater.
1987 is not coming back.
This has nothing to do withdefund, refund, massively fund,
or anything like that.
The way we deliver core basicservices, including American
policing, will not be the same.
I was in Baltimore.
(09:26):
They were talking about how theyused to have, gosh, right, 3,500
or something officers.
In Kansas City, we used to havea lot more, too.
What did we not have, by theway?
We didn't have cameras that weredeployable.
We didn't actually have theability to break down cell
phones and get lots ofinvestigative information.
We didn't have people who werethreatening to kill each other
on TikTok, on Snap, like we donow.
(09:48):
Things have changedfundamentally, but too many of
our discussions on how lawenforcement works is still based
on a model that frankly wascreated by Darrell Gates at the
LAPD, right?
Have a ton of officers inplaces, build some SWAT teams,
have that rapid response,frankly, kind of treat your city
like you're an army, and that'sthe way it's going to work.
It does not work.
(10:08):
It is not working in anyAmerican city.
And I will even go with suburbancommunities that contend it
does.
Their numbers may be there wherethey think they are approaching
that same level, but lawenforcement today, just like it
was before, I'll say, but justin a different way.
It is based on trust.
It is based on some belief thatthere are consequences, and it
(10:31):
is based on the fact that weneed to continue to have a
community that buys into what'shappening.
What my city, what otherAmerican cities, and I will give
shout-outs to ones that don'tget attention.
St.
Louis is one example, that haveseen dramatic reductions in
homicides from, frankly,historic highs of just a few
(10:51):
years ago to frankly ratherhistoric drops at 40, 50 year
labos.
The way they're doing that iscommunity trust, technology,
engagement, focused deterrence,and making sure that you are
investing in other alternativeresponsibilities.
SPEAKER_00 (11:06):
I want to harp on that because it's an issue ideal
with it.
We had 1,600 in 2006,immediately after Katrina.
We have 900 now.
And it's like, what is ournumber of ideal officers?
And the answer is you have whatyou have, and you sort of need
to deal with that.
(11:27):
How do you have thisconversation where you have a
sort of adult professionalconversation about crime and
crime reduction that doesn't getinto sort of the activist
political, you know, defund,refund?
This is a this is a logisticalstrategic enforcement
discussion, if that makes anysense.
(11:48):
Like how do you communicate thisto a wider audience?
It is very hard, first of all.
SPEAKER_01 (11:52):
And I will, you know, say that.
I don't know what is in my lifeafter being mayor, but if I
could just get paid to be likethe music man, but going to be
like, crime.
Actually, it takes reallycreative strategies, right?
I mean, it's it's just likeeverybody on every end, it is
not just that commercial rightthere.
Right.
Like, yeah, no, it's likeeverything else.
I mean, isn't it astonishing tome that nobody is saying we
(12:17):
should treat cancer the same waywe did 35 years ago?
Nobody goes in and says, oh,well, you know, I think you just
gotta go ahead and do this,right?
Or that Nurse Hatchet is goingto saw off a leg that nowadays
we found new treatments for.
But it seems like in lawenforcement we still do that.
Some of that is the advocacythat exists within it.
(12:38):
But I think another big part is,you know, we need to be, there
are two things that I think arereally problematic in
government.
The first, and I'm guilty ofthis as much as anybody, there
is this, there's this desire ingovernment at the local, state,
and federal level, when youdon't know how to solve
something, to just say I put alot of money into something.
If you ask me, if you blindsidedme with a question, which is a
(13:00):
fair one, just say it, QuentinLucas, preschoolers don't read
at the level they need to inKansas City.
What are you going to do?
I say, well, in next year'sbudget, we're going to commit$40
million, 50% increase toensuring that preschoolers can
read.
Everybody will applaud, be like,damn right.
Yeah.
And then after that, no one willknow what happened.
So in public safety, what wehave done for vastly too long of
(13:22):
all political stripes is to saythat we will make sure that this
year's police budget isincreased, and that will make
the difference.
And by the way, lest you thinkI'm letting my defund friends
off, right?
They were doing in some ways theopposite and saying, right, by
cutting budgets, spending themsomewhere else, we don't know
what the hell it's going to be,but you know, spend it somewhere
else, then we will solve forthings.
(13:44):
Funding and budgets alone arenot the solution.
You need to talk about thestrategies, you need to talk
about the tactics.
For those of us who are parents,right, what we don't just say
is, well, honey, the way I thinkwe're going to raise these kids
is I'm going to make an aboveaverage income for the next 18
years, and I assume it's goingto be okay.
Right?
No, you actually like, maybe weshould live in this
neighborhood, maybe we should dothat, we should put them in this
(14:05):
more.
That's the first thing that weneed to fix in Gebber.
Thing number two, we can't beafraid of failure.
And frankly, every politician wespend all this time in our
career basically havingpolitical capital to spend.
And look, I'm guilty of thistoo.
And what do we usually blow itup?
We usually blow our politicalcapital on.
(14:26):
All right, I really want to makesure the Saints stay in New
Orleans.
So even though the city's brokeas hell, we're going to make
sure that we fix the dome or theSmoothie King arena for the
Pelicans.
And that's what we're going todo.
Not in that battle, but what weneed to actually do is say, more
often, spend that capital onsaying, I know y'all.
I know it is violent right now,but we also have the stories of
(14:49):
the people that we've helped.
And in year one, you are notgoing to hit the homicide
numbers you want.
My dream, if you're asking mefor real, and when I ran for
office, I said I'd like to gethomicides in Kansas City down
below 100.
It is almost halfway through theyear.
We are actually below 50.
Who knows what happens?
But right, but we are finallygetting closer.
(15:10):
This is my seventh year as May.
What I will take from that,though, right?
And I had editorials and theywrote like he didn't meet this
promise, all that sort of stuff.
I'm still around.
I was still re-elected.
And I want to say part of thatis not that Kansas City and
stopped caring about crime.
But they said we think he'sactually trying to do something
and something that will last.
(15:31):
This, the way you treat thesethings is not a one-off
campaign.
It is not just bringing, youknow, federal agents, 200
federal agents in and sayingwe're going to arrest everybody
who wants, and that's going tomake a difference.
That, by the way, the year wedid that was the most violent
year in the history of KansasCity.
Right.
We're going to actually do morethan sustain.
SPEAKER_00 (15:48):
And how, you know, I would love if you got to, you
know, zero murders.
That would be fantastic.
At some point nationally, we'reseeing this decline.
At some point, it's going tostop declining.
How do we have that conversationwhen, hey, okay, we've, you
know, reduced murder a lot.
There's still hard choices tomake.
There's the strategies thatwe've done work.
(16:10):
How do you then not just fallback on sort of that tough on
crime?
We're going to, you know, morejail, more police, more
toughness is the answer.
That we know that there's asmarter answer.
How do you communicate that?
SPEAKER_01 (16:23):
You know, you I heard this line.
Actually, I think it comes fromJustice Ruth Bader-Ginsburg,
RIP.
Uh, and it was uh, you don'tthrow away your umbrella when
it's raining.
Right?
And I think what we need to makesure we continue to do is to
first be innovative.
So the really the big thing youhave to decide, I'll go back to
(16:44):
my raising children analogy.
From age three to five, I don'tknow, my son loved me and I
could, you know, I could holdhim and keep him from running
away.
Oh, he's faster and bigger.
So I gotta parent in a slightlydifferent way.
I think in terms of publicsafety, we need to recognize
trends change.
If you were following violence,you know, several decades ago,
graffiti, the most interestingthing about it, right, was often
(17:06):
people making threats to eachother, right?
They're not quite doing that thesame now.
It is on social media, it'smorphed.
So what does that mean?
It means law enforcementattention may need to be in
something different.
And frankly, to save yourselfsome police budget, maybe you
get some analysts who actuallyunderstand the social media
discussion and all of that.
And so you're actually having anon-deputized or sworn person
(17:28):
who doesn't need the gun, thepension, and all the same stuff
that's helping you actuallyaddress crime strategy issues.
I mean, I think it is agreeingto be innovative.
It is not being too possessiveof just one plan, and it is
understanding that this is acontinuous battle for American
cities.
(17:48):
You know, I um I'll use anotheranalogy.
I don't know, I'm in a goodmood.
It's a Friday.
For anyone, which is, I thinkmost people, right, whoever
think about their weight, right?
Like you can't stop like eatingright or working out or
whatever, right?
You have to just keep doing it.
Oddly enough, forever.
Right?
There's never this moment whereyou're like, I'm perfect, I'm a
(18:10):
be perfect, bring me the bucketof whatever my favorite food is,
and I am going on a walk everagain.
Instead, you keep doing it.
And so I think what mayors, whatAmerican cities need to make
sure they do is to say, how arewe innovating?
How are we continuing to committo programmatic efforts?
And I would implore people,implore them, get away from the
(18:33):
budget.
And that does not mean don'thurt your people.
You know, don't, don't, youknow, undervalue people who have
committed themselves to yourcity and safety.
But what we need to do in moresituations is ask police chiefs,
all right, what were your crimestrategies?
How do you think they worked?
And how do you think we can dobetter next year?
And that's how we go from justsaying, all right, we finally
(18:54):
hit a hundred homicides, afterthat being like, we hit 70, we
hit 50.
I mean, my favorite there arelike a few American city
stories.
I find the Boston transformationover the last 40 years just
exceptional.
But a mayor I've read about,because I'm into black mayors,
as you might expect.
When David Dinkins was mayor ofNew York City, they averaged,
(19:15):
what, about 2200 murders attheir high point.
2200.
New York City is less than aquarter of that these days.
I mean, it's it's astonishing.
When I was in law school, Itaught in a prison in upstate
New York with a lot of men whoactually were from down in the
city.
And they would talk about allthese things.
I'd be like, brother man, thingshave changed.
(19:35):
And the same way that things canchange, Tara can change in your
city, but you have to stayactive on it.
I think Mayor Dinkins would haveloved to get below a thousand in
his time.
Now, when you get above 500,people are kind of saying, Oh my
gosh, right, things are out ofway.
SPEAKER_00 (19:49):
90%, some 711, I think, through April, asking for
just advice.
What is the what are the firstthings that you tell them?
And do you have sort of a spielthat you would give them of
these are the things that Ithink you should do?
SPEAKER_01 (20:01):
Yeah.
So first thing, stay strong,sister, stay strong, brother.
The way that crime usually mostdirectly impacts a mayor's
office, right?
Some of us hire our chiefsdirectly, others of us have more
interesting controls and they'recivil servants, so it's not like
they're as easy to fire as youwould think.
Uh but once you get past all thebureaucratic and administrative
stuff, the way you will usuallyget hit on violence issues as a
(20:23):
mayor is either there is anabsolutely horrific homicide
that breaks your heart to, oryou have some children,
teenagers that are wild and out,and they're like, wow, this city
is a madhouse.
What have you done, or whyhaven't you done enough?
You come up with answers in themoment, but you don't come up
with radical responses tooquickly.
Don't just be like, all right,I'm now deploying, you know, the
(20:44):
National Guard to every bus stopin my city.
The other thing that I think youdo is say, I have a plan and I'm
gonna stick with it.
And that is hard, and sometimesyou need to adjust, but don't
let the adjustment be based onone incident.
Don't let the adjustment be onyour haters and your skeptics.
You need to actually go withthe, you know, the plan itself.
(21:07):
Next thing you need to do isabsolutely talk to people.
Call other mayors.
They're much easier to accessthan you would ever think.
When I first became a mayor, weneeded to talk to the mayor of
Chicago.
At that point, I did not have arelationship with her of the
time.
And uh, like I just had my staffcall the main office and we got
through in just a few minutes.
It could have been a prankster,but whatever.
Work.
You know, see what's working.
(21:29):
In fairness, see what's notworking.
And what I would encourage toany mayor or elected or person
is, you know, when you hearstruggles, don't be scared.
I mean, this is just mypersonality.
I love talking to people whohave persevered and who have
persevered through strugglingmoments.
That's why St.
Louis, Baltimore are interestingtest cases to me.
(21:49):
Right?
Boston, you know, cool.
I love I and I love Mayor Wu,consider her a friend, right?
We've had good things.
She's coming from a differentspace from the time she became
mayor than, say, Brandon Scottwas.
And so, I mean, I think that'swhy you make sure you talk to
people who've been in thatstruggle and it can work well
for you.
SPEAKER_00 (22:06):
So, last two questions.
I want to get away from crimespecifically.
Um, I did want to ask, you'vegot the World Cup coming up.
I was just wondering, you know,how have you and your office and
your city prepared for all ofthat?
And is there a matchup or a teamthat you're cheering for
specifically, or can you justyou're not allowed to take
sides?
SPEAKER_01 (22:22):
Well, I mean, look, let me tell you something about
your last question.
I had some journalists fromEngland here.
They would be practicing inKansas City, and I happen to
have a uh Lionel Messi jersey inmy office.
And I promise you that got intothe newspaper in London, right?
And people were like, thisbiased guy is against England.
(22:45):
So no, no favorites.
I'm here for everybody who comesfrom Curacao who's playing here,
to Argentina who's playing here.
Obviously, I want the mosteyeballs possible on Kansas
City.
And so uh, you know, we'll justsee how that all works.
You can probably suspect who Imay want to see go forward.
In terms of preparation, I feelgreat.
I feel great about the networkthat we built out, law
(23:08):
enforcement.
We've seen great collaborationacross two different states,
Missouri and Kansas, a number ofsuburban jurisdictions in
opposite city.
We've built out a transportationnetwork.
Frankly, we need all the timehere, free buses that get you
from the airport to the downtownarea of the city, reduced cost
buses that are getting you outto the stadium.
We are ready and we are excited,and I'm gonna get really, really
(23:29):
into soccer this summer, eventhough I do need to see who ends
up winning the NBA finals beforethat.
SPEAKER_00 (23:34):
There you go.
And then last question is evenmore out of left field.
And I think I posted this onLinkedIn, and one of my
followers mentioned that we havea shared affinity for uh the
Bravo show Summer House.
And so I was just gonna ask,what are your takeaways from the
first part of the reunion?
SPEAKER_01 (23:50):
My God, you know, I think I did not expect that.
I told you it was left field.
You know, I'm gonna stick withuh KJ and just kind of talk
about how you're learning aboutthe human being, uh the
interactions, I think maturitythat we're getting kind of out
of it.
And I think we're seeing moreexamples that I hope more men,
particularly young men, can takeon in our country.
(24:11):
I think it's a good message forour community more broadly.
That's great.
All right.
Part two, Aaron, next week forthose of you that are
interested.
SPEAKER_00 (24:18):
Soon they come the Bravo Sphere, right?
It's uh, you know, we'll haveyou back.
We'll talk Summerhouse, we'lltalk uh Vanderpump, we'll talk
uh, you know, Southern Charm,all of them.
SPEAKER_01 (24:28):
I have to say I'm very grateful to my wonderful
wife who uh has helped me getinto more of this stuff.
And uh she can really go to townon it, but I'll make sure I get
some of the other shows in myrepertoire before we turn and
we're gonna we're gonna launch apodcast that's weekly.
SPEAKER_00 (24:42):
You and I just reviewing Bravo Chairs.
SPEAKER_01 (24:44):
That's outstanding.
SPEAKER_00 (24:45):
Thank you so much for joining us.
This has been so wonderful and Ireally appreciate it.
Hey, thanks so much.
Have a great day.
Thanks for listening to theJeffalytics Podcast.
Be sure to subscribe and tolearn more, head on over to
ahdatalytics.com for moreinformation and previous
episodes.
If you like what you heard,please leave a glowing review,
which will help others todiscover the show.
Until next time, I'm Jeff Asher.
I'm Jeff Asher and this is the Jeffalytics Podcast.
(00:04):
One of the hardest things forany mayor to do is to convince
people that a problem canactually be solved.
That may sound obvious, but whena city has struggled with
violence for decades, cynicismstarts to set in, residents get
frustrated, headlines getharsher, and people assume that
high levels of violence aresimply parts of life.
My guest today rejects thatidea.
Quentin Lucas has served asmayor of Kansas City since 2019,
(00:26):
a period that has included bothrecord levels of violence and
more recently significantdeclines in both homicides and
shootings across the city.
In this episode, we talked abouthow Kansas City has approached
violence reduction and how tocommunicate complex solutions to
an intractable problem.
We discussed police staffing,technology, community trust, and
the pressure elected officialsface during crime spikes.
(00:47):
At its core, this is aconversation about leadership,
persistence, and what it takesto keep working on a problem
after most people have decidedit can't be fixed.
Let's dive in.
There we go.
Can you hear me?
Okay.
All right.
We did it.
I got sound.
SPEAKER_01 (01:04):
We've got her figured out.
SPEAKER_00 (01:06):
Amazing.
How are you, sir?
SPEAKER_01 (01:08):
I you know what?
I can't complain.
Nothing but sun shining on me onthis beautiful day in Kansas
City.
SPEAKER_00 (01:12):
I hope you're doing all right.
I'm doing okay.
I gotta say, I'm I'm a little uhI don't know if annoyed the
right word, but you're thesecond mayor now that I've
talked to and interviewed thatis actually younger than me.
And I'm not the old man.
It makes me feel veryunaccomplished to talk to
somebody that is in my age rangebut has accomplished more.
SPEAKER_01 (01:31):
Man, I have so many young haters, though, that uh I
feel like I'm just the oldinstitutional guy now.
SPEAKER_00 (01:36):
So well, uh let's dive in.
Uh I really appreciate you.
This is uh I think it'scertainly my first Substack
Live.
So excited to be here andexcited to uh test out this new
medium for talking to people.
So could you just talk methrough like what is your
background?
How did you get to be in thisposition?
SPEAKER_01 (01:54):
You know, I mean, it's uh it's been a blessing.
So I've been mayor of KansasCity since 2019.
Uh I am born and raised inKansas City, Missouri, went away
for school, but otherwise havebeen here my entire life.
And uh, you know, I think theway I get here is actually the
way I came up.
I grew up with a hardworkingwoman.
I was the youngest of threechildren.
We knew homelessness a bit as akid.
I knew some other challenges,but on the whole, I always saw
(02:17):
how government, particularlylocal government, could make a
positive difference.
And so that has inspired methroughout.
Became an attorney.
Uh, when I came back home, Ithink I saw a few issues that
have been around for my entirelife.
So that inspired me for citycouncil.
I was lucky enough to getelected.
Then the mayoral suit was open,12-person primary, which means
(02:38):
that all you need is like yourmama and 500 people to vote for
you.
I was able to, you know, jumpover that hurdle and uh, you
know, and have been mayor eversince.
The issues, though, I mean, so Ibecame a mayor during the first
Trump administration.
Some issues are the same, somehave changed mightily.
I think that uh, you know, backin 2019, we were talking a lot
of how do we ever getinfrastructure funding?
(02:59):
We were able to get that, thatpark change.
We were talking, you know, Imean, just uh unimaginable
street-level violence in a lotof our communities.
I remember I spoke to the mayorof Baltimore before Brandon
Scott at one point.
We had a call because both ofour cities were reeling for
murder crises.
And uh that's what you wereseeing in a lot of places with
Mayor Lifewood in Chicago, withlots of other folks that I
(03:21):
worked with then.
So a lot has changed, but a lotstays the same.
I think one of the best thingsthat's changed is our commitment
to having good solutions to theproblems that confront the
American city.
SPEAKER_00 (03:32):
So talk me through that.
What has been sort of yourapproach?
Uh just sort of doing mybackground research.
I saw from the start of yourcampaign and from the start of
your administration, gunviolence reduction has been sort
of at the forefront.
So what has been your approachand what have you sort of found
that's been successful, and whathave you found that maybe hasn't
been as successful?
SPEAKER_01 (03:52):
I think step one, what you need to do is uh you
need to make sure that youbelieve that things can change
for the better.
I think the biggest mistake thatwe make is something that I
heard when I was running formayor, actually.
I have this wonderfulcouncilwoman who was from kind
of a suburban-ish area of thecity.
Imagine somebody who's fromStaten Island.
I'd gotten her to endorse me.
(04:13):
Things were great.
She said, uh, you know, she'sold smoker, and she said, you
know, you gotta stop talkingabout the murders.
I was like, huh?
Uh and she said, look, they'llnever change, right?
Like, everybody's tried, it'sjust the way it's gonna be.
You gotta be about everythingelse in the city.
And I told myself, like, well,thank you, ma'am, but that ain't
it ain't gonna be how I live.
This is the crisis, not just inthe American city.
(04:35):
I think it's fair to say it's acrisis, it's an epidemic in the
black community.
And so I think the first thingyou do is try to commit to
saying, I'm gonna talk about it.
I may not solve it, but I'mgonna talk about it.
But respect these people'slives.
I'm gonna make sure that peopleknow we can do something
different.
So that was that first step.
The next step was, I'll be quitehonest with you, a lot of
battling with uh institutions atthe time.
(04:58):
We had a police chief when Ifirst became mayor who I don't
think had this sort oftransformational view on how we
can reduce homicides andshootings.
He came from an old school, andan old school that, by the way,
in 2020 was still very active inthe fight, which was saying, no,
the problem isn't that we don'tinvest in young people, that we
aren't actually trying to treatsymptoms.
It's a problem that we justain't thrown, we ain't put
(05:20):
enough people in jail.
We have not said that these guysare bad guys, right?
We haven't, you know, yelledabout it in the right way.
So there was a lot of change ofthe mentality.
And it took years, by the way,years.
And so we've changed leadershipwith the police department.
We have a new prosecutor now whoI think subscribes to my view of
how you do focused deterrence.
(05:41):
She came out of my office, proudof that.
And I think that, you know, wekeep chipping away, recognizing
that the misfortune and thegreatest challenge to the
American city, and watching themayor's race in LA right now and
everything else, whether it'sviolent crime or homelessness or
other certain issues, you'redealing with an individual
curse.
Human beings aren't widgets.
(06:02):
And so you can't just be like,all right, we got 2,000 people
on the streets, let's just buildthis thing.
They're all gonna go there,they're gonna operate
nationally, naturally, it'sgonna be great.
Same thing with violent crime.
You can't just open a gym, throwin 10 basketballs, and be like,
hey, y'all, it's open until 2a.m.
Good luck.
You need to continue to adapt,fail, deal with a tough
(06:22):
narrative sometimes, becausepeople expect you to fix it from
day one.
But I think Kansas City wasready to commit.
And uh I think that's wherewe're seeing progress now.
SPEAKER_00 (06:31):
And sort of what what do you do ascribe that that
progress to sort of in light ofyour successes?
I'm just looking at the numbers,you're down.
Obviously, 48 murders is 48 toomany, but it's down
substantially in 2023.
You had 74 at this point, 66 in2022.
What do you ascribe that successto right now, especially in
light of sort of that thoughtthat it is happening everywhere,
(06:55):
but it's happening bigger someplaces than others?
SPEAKER_01 (06:57):
Yeah.
I mean, I think the the firstthing I will say, and I
mentioned focus deterrencebefore, for those who may have
stumbled upon this substack anddon't give a hoot about like
what that is or what it means.
It's very much this.
In any American city, you have asmall number of people who are
engaged in lots of the violentcrime and also
disproportionately become thevictims.
To the extent that yourcommunity focuses on those
(07:19):
folks.
And so we have a group by thename of Stand Against Violence
Casey, save like Save Casey.
We visit with this group ofpeople, we tell them, look, here
are our exceptional lifeopportunities we're gonna
provide for you job training,housing, counseling, right?
All these sorts of things youmay need, help reunifying
yourself with your children ifyou follow the straight narrow
(07:41):
path.
If you do not, however, we aregonna come down on you, on
prosecution.
The police are watching you, butdon't force us to do that
approach.
And we see that program payingincredible dividends,
particularly in wards, patroldivisions of the city where
violence is the most pronounced.
I think that has been atransformational difference
(08:03):
maker in terms of what we aretrying to do.
The other things that we aredoing are specialty courts in
our municipal court system.
And why municipal court?
Obviously, your homicides aren'tbeing prosecuted there, but
that's usually the gateway intomore serious level offenses.
And we recognize that fromhaving a gun court, for example,
if you are actually somebody,which takes some work, by the
(08:25):
way, in a jurisdiction with alot of crimes, if you're
somebody who's gun play, gets tothe level of having the
attention of the police, but youdidn't get shot or you didn't
shoot somebody, this is a greatmoment for us to warn you is
stop.
Put it down, don't take it tothe same places, get out of that
trouble.
That's one specialty court, adomestic violence court, does, I
think, frankly, similar work aswell.
(08:46):
So that is, I think, how we'vegotten started, and I think it's
how we're seeing progress.
SPEAKER_00 (08:51):
And a lot of cities, especially medium and big size
cities, are dealing with theissue of fewer police officers
to do sort of the enforcementside of all of this work.
How has have you adapted tohaving a smaller police force
post-COVID?
SPEAKER_01 (09:05):
Yeah.
I mean, look, here's thereality, which is the reality,
which is the reality.
I hope my staff cuts this linelater.
1987 is not coming back.
This has nothing to do withdefund, refund, massively fund,
or anything like that.
The way we deliver core basicservices, including American
policing, will not be the same.
I was in Baltimore.
(09:26):
They were talking about how theyused to have, gosh, right, 3,500
or something officers.
In Kansas City, we used to havea lot more, too.
What did we not have, by theway?
We didn't have cameras that weredeployable.
We didn't actually have theability to break down cell
phones and get lots ofinvestigative information.
We didn't have people who werethreatening to kill each other
on TikTok, on Snap, like we donow.
(09:48):
Things have changedfundamentally, but too many of
our discussions on how lawenforcement works is still based
on a model that frankly wascreated by Darrell Gates at the
LAPD, right?
Have a ton of officers inplaces, build some SWAT teams,
have that rapid response,frankly, kind of treat your city
like you're an army, and that'sthe way it's going to work.
It does not work.
(10:08):
It is not working in anyAmerican city.
And I will even go with suburbancommunities that contend it
does.
Their numbers may be there wherethey think they are approaching
that same level, but lawenforcement today, just like it
was before, I'll say, but justin a different way.
It is based on trust.
It is based on some belief thatthere are consequences, and it
(10:31):
is based on the fact that weneed to continue to have a
community that buys into what'shappening.
What my city, what otherAmerican cities, and I will give
shout-outs to ones that don'tget attention.
St.
Louis is one example, that haveseen dramatic reductions in
homicides from, frankly,historic highs of just a few
(10:51):
years ago to frankly ratherhistoric drops at 40, 50 year
labos.
The way they're doing that iscommunity trust, technology,
engagement, focused deterrence,and making sure that you are
investing in other alternativeresponsibilities.
SPEAKER_00 (11:06):
I want to harp on that because it's an issue ideal
with it.
We had 1,600 in 2006,immediately after Katrina.
We have 900 now.
And it's like, what is ournumber of ideal officers?
And the answer is you have whatyou have, and you sort of need
to deal with that.
(11:27):
How do you have thisconversation where you have a
sort of adult professionalconversation about crime and
crime reduction that doesn't getinto sort of the activist
political, you know, defund,refund?
This is a this is a logisticalstrategic enforcement
discussion, if that makes anysense.
(11:48):
Like how do you communicate thisto a wider audience?
It is very hard, first of all.
SPEAKER_01 (11:52):
And I will, you know, say that.
I don't know what is in my lifeafter being mayor, but if I
could just get paid to be likethe music man, but going to be
like, crime.
Actually, it takes reallycreative strategies, right?
I mean, it's it's just likeeverybody on every end, it is
not just that commercial rightthere.
Right.
Like, yeah, no, it's likeeverything else.
I mean, isn't it astonishing tome that nobody is saying we
(12:17):
should treat cancer the same waywe did 35 years ago?
Nobody goes in and says, oh,well, you know, I think you just
gotta go ahead and do this,right?
Or that Nurse Hatchet is goingto saw off a leg that nowadays
we found new treatments for.
But it seems like in lawenforcement we still do that.
Some of that is the advocacythat exists within it.
(12:38):
But I think another big part is,you know, we need to be, there
are two things that I think arereally problematic in
government.
The first, and I'm guilty ofthis as much as anybody, there
is this, there's this desire ingovernment at the local, state,
and federal level, when youdon't know how to solve
something, to just say I put alot of money into something.
If you ask me, if you blindsidedme with a question, which is a
(13:00):
fair one, just say it, QuentinLucas, preschoolers don't read
at the level they need to inKansas City.
What are you going to do?
I say, well, in next year'sbudget, we're going to commit$40
million, 50% increase toensuring that preschoolers can
read.
Everybody will applaud, be like,damn right.
Yeah.
And then after that, no one willknow what happened.
So in public safety, what wehave done for vastly too long of
(13:22):
all political stripes is to saythat we will make sure that this
year's police budget isincreased, and that will make
the difference.
And by the way, lest you thinkI'm letting my defund friends
off, right?
They were doing in some ways theopposite and saying, right, by
cutting budgets, spending themsomewhere else, we don't know
what the hell it's going to be,but you know, spend it somewhere
else, then we will solve forthings.
(13:44):
Funding and budgets alone arenot the solution.
You need to talk about thestrategies, you need to talk
about the tactics.
For those of us who are parents,right, what we don't just say
is, well, honey, the way I thinkwe're going to raise these kids
is I'm going to make an aboveaverage income for the next 18
years, and I assume it's goingto be okay.
Right?
No, you actually like, maybe weshould live in this
neighborhood, maybe we should dothat, we should put them in this
(14:05):
more.
That's the first thing that weneed to fix in Gebber.
Thing number two, we can't beafraid of failure.
And frankly, every politician wespend all this time in our
career basically havingpolitical capital to spend.
And look, I'm guilty of thistoo.
And what do we usually blow itup?
We usually blow our politicalcapital on.
(14:26):
All right, I really want to makesure the Saints stay in New
Orleans.
So even though the city's brokeas hell, we're going to make
sure that we fix the dome or theSmoothie King arena for the
Pelicans.
And that's what we're going todo.
Not in that battle, but what weneed to actually do is say, more
often, spend that capital onsaying, I know y'all.
I know it is violent right now,but we also have the stories of
(14:49):
the people that we've helped.
And in year one, you are notgoing to hit the homicide
numbers you want.
My dream, if you're asking mefor real, and when I ran for
office, I said I'd like to gethomicides in Kansas City down
below 100.
It is almost halfway through theyear.
We are actually below 50.
Who knows what happens?
But right, but we are finallygetting closer.
(15:10):
This is my seventh year as May.
What I will take from that,though, right?
And I had editorials and theywrote like he didn't meet this
promise, all that sort of stuff.
I'm still around.
I was still re-elected.
And I want to say part of thatis not that Kansas City and
stopped caring about crime.
But they said we think he'sactually trying to do something
and something that will last.
(15:31):
This, the way you treat thesethings is not a one-off
campaign.
It is not just bringing, youknow, federal agents, 200
federal agents in and sayingwe're going to arrest everybody
who wants, and that's going tomake a difference.
That, by the way, the year wedid that was the most violent
year in the history of KansasCity.
Right.
We're going to actually do morethan sustain.
SPEAKER_00 (15:48):
And how, you know, I would love if you got to, you
know, zero murders.
That would be fantastic.
At some point nationally, we'reseeing this decline.
At some point, it's going tostop declining.
How do we have that conversationwhen, hey, okay, we've, you
know, reduced murder a lot.
There's still hard choices tomake.
There's the strategies thatwe've done work.
(16:10):
How do you then not just fallback on sort of that tough on
crime?
We're going to, you know, morejail, more police, more
toughness is the answer.
That we know that there's asmarter answer.
How do you communicate that?
SPEAKER_01 (16:23):
You know, you I heard this line.
Actually, I think it comes fromJustice Ruth Bader-Ginsburg,
RIP.
Uh, and it was uh, you don'tthrow away your umbrella when
it's raining.
Right?
And I think what we need to makesure we continue to do is to
first be innovative.
So the really the big thing youhave to decide, I'll go back to
(16:44):
my raising children analogy.
From age three to five, I don'tknow, my son loved me and I
could, you know, I could holdhim and keep him from running
away.
Oh, he's faster and bigger.
So I gotta parent in a slightlydifferent way.
I think in terms of publicsafety, we need to recognize
trends change.
If you were following violence,you know, several decades ago,
graffiti, the most interestingthing about it, right, was often
(17:06):
people making threats to eachother, right?
They're not quite doing that thesame now.
It is on social media, it'smorphed.
So what does that mean?
It means law enforcementattention may need to be in
something different.
And frankly, to save yourselfsome police budget, maybe you
get some analysts who actuallyunderstand the social media
discussion and all of that.
And so you're actually having anon-deputized or sworn person
(17:28):
who doesn't need the gun, thepension, and all the same stuff
that's helping you actuallyaddress crime strategy issues.
I mean, I think it is agreeingto be innovative.
It is not being too possessiveof just one plan, and it is
understanding that this is acontinuous battle for American
cities.
(17:48):
You know, I um I'll use anotheranalogy.
I don't know, I'm in a goodmood.
It's a Friday.
For anyone, which is, I thinkmost people, right, whoever
think about their weight, right?
Like you can't stop like eatingright or working out or
whatever, right?
You have to just keep doing it.
Oddly enough, forever.
Right?
There's never this moment whereyou're like, I'm perfect, I'm a
(18:10):
be perfect, bring me the bucketof whatever my favorite food is,
and I am going on a walk everagain.
Instead, you keep doing it.
And so I think what mayors, whatAmerican cities need to make
sure they do is to say, how arewe innovating?
How are we continuing to committo programmatic efforts?
And I would implore people,implore them, get away from the
(18:33):
budget.
And that does not mean don'thurt your people.
You know, don't, don't, youknow, undervalue people who have
committed themselves to yourcity and safety.
But what we need to do in moresituations is ask police chiefs,
all right, what were your crimestrategies?
How do you think they worked?
And how do you think we can dobetter next year?
And that's how we go from justsaying, all right, we finally
(18:54):
hit a hundred homicides, afterthat being like, we hit 70, we
hit 50.
I mean, my favorite there arelike a few American city
stories.
I find the Boston transformationover the last 40 years just
exceptional.
But a mayor I've read about,because I'm into black mayors,
as you might expect.
When David Dinkins was mayor ofNew York City, they averaged,
(19:15):
what, about 2200 murders attheir high point.
2200.
New York City is less than aquarter of that these days.
I mean, it's it's astonishing.
When I was in law school, Itaught in a prison in upstate
New York with a lot of men whoactually were from down in the
city.
And they would talk about allthese things.
I'd be like, brother man, thingshave changed.
(19:35):
And the same way that things canchange, Tara can change in your
city, but you have to stayactive on it.
I think Mayor Dinkins would haveloved to get below a thousand in
his time.
Now, when you get above 500,people are kind of saying, Oh my
gosh, right, things are out ofway.
SPEAKER_00 (19:49):
90%, some 711, I think, through April, asking for
just advice.
What is the what are the firstthings that you tell them?
And do you have sort of a spielthat you would give them of
these are the things that Ithink you should do?
SPEAKER_01 (20:01):
Yeah.
So first thing, stay strong,sister, stay strong, brother.
The way that crime usually mostdirectly impacts a mayor's
office, right?
Some of us hire our chiefsdirectly, others of us have more
interesting controls and they'recivil servants, so it's not like
they're as easy to fire as youwould think.
Uh but once you get past all thebureaucratic and administrative
stuff, the way you will usuallyget hit on violence issues as a
(20:23):
mayor is either there is anabsolutely horrific homicide
that breaks your heart to, oryou have some children,
teenagers that are wild and out,and they're like, wow, this city
is a madhouse.
What have you done, or whyhaven't you done enough?
You come up with answers in themoment, but you don't come up
with radical responses tooquickly.
Don't just be like, all right,I'm now deploying, you know, the
(20:44):
National Guard to every bus stopin my city.
The other thing that I think youdo is say, I have a plan and I'm
gonna stick with it.
And that is hard, and sometimesyou need to adjust, but don't
let the adjustment be based onone incident.
Don't let the adjustment be onyour haters and your skeptics.
You need to actually go withthe, you know, the plan itself.
(21:07):
Next thing you need to do isabsolutely talk to people.
Call other mayors.
They're much easier to accessthan you would ever think.
When I first became a mayor, weneeded to talk to the mayor of
Chicago.
At that point, I did not have arelationship with her of the
time.
And uh, like I just had my staffcall the main office and we got
through in just a few minutes.
It could have been a prankster,but whatever.
Work.
You know, see what's working.
(21:29):
In fairness, see what's notworking.
And what I would encourage toany mayor or elected or person
is, you know, when you hearstruggles, don't be scared.
I mean, this is just mypersonality.
I love talking to people whohave persevered and who have
persevered through strugglingmoments.
That's why St.
Louis, Baltimore are interestingtest cases to me.
(21:49):
Right?
Boston, you know, cool.
I love I and I love Mayor Wu,consider her a friend, right?
We've had good things.
She's coming from a differentspace from the time she became
mayor than, say, Brandon Scottwas.
And so, I mean, I think that'swhy you make sure you talk to
people who've been in thatstruggle and it can work well
for you.
SPEAKER_00 (22:06):
So, last two questions.
I want to get away from crimespecifically.
Um, I did want to ask, you'vegot the World Cup coming up.
I was just wondering, you know,how have you and your office and
your city prepared for all ofthat?
And is there a matchup or a teamthat you're cheering for
specifically, or can you justyou're not allowed to take
sides?
SPEAKER_01 (22:22):
Well, I mean, look, let me tell you something about
your last question.
I had some journalists fromEngland here.
They would be practicing inKansas City, and I happen to
have a uh Lionel Messi jersey inmy office.
And I promise you that got intothe newspaper in London, right?
And people were like, thisbiased guy is against England.
(22:45):
So no, no favorites.
I'm here for everybody who comesfrom Curacao who's playing here,
to Argentina who's playing here.
Obviously, I want the mosteyeballs possible on Kansas
City.
And so uh, you know, we'll justsee how that all works.
You can probably suspect who Imay want to see go forward.
In terms of preparation, I feelgreat.
I feel great about the networkthat we built out, law
(23:08):
enforcement.
We've seen great collaborationacross two different states,
Missouri and Kansas, a number ofsuburban jurisdictions in
opposite city.
We've built out a transportationnetwork.
Frankly, we need all the timehere, free buses that get you
from the airport to the downtownarea of the city, reduced cost
buses that are getting you outto the stadium.
We are ready and we are excited,and I'm gonna get really, really
(23:29):
into soccer this summer, eventhough I do need to see who ends
up winning the NBA finals beforethat.
SPEAKER_00 (23:34):
There you go.
And then last question is evenmore out of left field.
And I think I posted this onLinkedIn, and one of my
followers mentioned that we havea shared affinity for uh the
Bravo show Summer House.
And so I was just gonna ask,what are your takeaways from the
first part of the reunion?
SPEAKER_01 (23:50):
My God, you know, I think I did not expect that.
I told you it was left field.
You know, I'm gonna stick withuh KJ and just kind of talk
about how you're learning aboutthe human being, uh the
interactions, I think maturitythat we're getting kind of out
of it.
And I think we're seeing moreexamples that I hope more men,
particularly young men, can takeon in our country.
(24:11):
I think it's a good message forour community more broadly.
That's great.
All right.
Part two, Aaron, next week forthose of you that are
interested.
SPEAKER_00 (24:18):
Soon they come the Bravo Sphere, right?
It's uh, you know, we'll haveyou back.
We'll talk Summerhouse, we'lltalk uh Vanderpump, we'll talk
uh, you know, Southern Charm,all of them.
SPEAKER_01 (24:28):
I have to say I'm very grateful to my wonderful
wife who uh has helped me getinto more of this stuff.
And uh she can really go to townon it, but I'll make sure I get
some of the other shows in myrepertoire before we turn and
we're gonna we're gonna launch apodcast that's weekly.
SPEAKER_00 (24:42):
You and I just reviewing Bravo Chairs.
SPEAKER_01 (24:44):
That's outstanding.
SPEAKER_00 (24:45):
Thank you so much for joining us.
This has been so wonderful and Ireally appreciate it.
Hey, thanks so much.
Have a great day.
Thanks for listening to theJeffalytics Podcast.
Be sure to subscribe and tolearn more, head on over to
ahdatalytics.com for moreinformation and previous
episodes.
If you like what you heard,please leave a glowing review,
which will help others todiscover the show.
Until next time, I'm Jeff Asher.
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