Birth control is a topic that touches on our deepest values around family, faith, and God's design for marriage. In this thoughtful exploration, we dive into the motives behind contraception decisions and how Christians can approach this sensitive subject with biblical wisdom.
We start by clarifying important distinctions between contraception (preventing the meeting of sperm and egg) and birth control methods that might prevent implantation after conception occurs. This foundational understanding helps frame the discussion around when and why Christians might consider family planning methods.
Scripture consistently portrays children as blessings from God – gifts to be received with gratitude rather than inconveniences to be avoided. Yet contemporary Christians face complex questions around stewardship, timing, and medical necessities that weren't explicitly addressed in biblical times. We examine how the church's position has evolved from nearly universal opposition to birth control before the 1940s to the more nuanced approaches many denominations take today.
Our conversation tackles challenging questions: Does responsible stewardship sometimes mean delaying children? Are there legitimate medical reasons that make contraception necessary? How do we discern between cultural preferences for comfort and genuine wisdom in family planning? The answers require balancing faithful trust in God's provision with thoughtful consideration of specific circumstances.
What emerges is a framework for decision-making that places glorifying God at the center. Rather than following cultural norms or prioritizing convenience, we encourage couples to seek pastoral counsel alongside medical advice, approaching these deeply personal choices with prayer and biblical wisdom.
Have questions about this topic or other life challenges? Connect with us at lifechallenges.us or email podcast@christianliferesources.com. We're here to help you navigate these complex issues with biblical clarity and compassion.
Would you like to learn more about different birth control methods? Stay tuned for next week's episode. You can also purchase a copy of our book, "The Christian and Birth Control" here: https://christianliferesources.com/product/the-christian-and-birth-control-book-second-edition/
Find strength and courage in your faith at this year’s FEARLESS FAITH Conference. Inspired by Joshua 1:9, “Be strong and courageous,” join us Saturday, September 13, at Kettle Moraine Lutheran High School in Jackson, Wisconsin, for presentations on navigating life’s storms, understanding God’s peace, and engaging in crucial conversations about euthanasia, anorexia, abortion, prenatal genetic testing, and more. Hear powerful journeys of faith through loss and hope. Don’t miss this empowering event! $50 in person or $40 virtual. Register now: https://christianliferesources.com/resources/events/2025-conference/
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 2 (00:19):
On today's episode, control or forbid having it.
And the reason you start fromthat perspective is that you
kind of ask yourself why am Idoing this in the first place?
And that is your entire life isa statement of thanksgiving to
God.
So you're always digging deepinto Scripture, finding out what
it is that pleases God not toearn salvation, but because of
(00:40):
the salvation we have.
So you're always looking not toearn salvation, but because of
the salvation we have.
Speaker 3 (00:45):
So you're always looking.
Welcome to the Life Challengespodcast from Christian Life
Resources.
People today face manyopportunities and struggles when
it comes to issues of life anddeath, marriage and family,
health and science.
We're here to bring a freshbiblical perspective to these
issues and more.
Join us now for Life Challenges.
Speaker 1 (01:13):
Hi and welcome back.
I'm Krista Potratz and I'm heretoday with Pastors Bob
Fleischman and Jeff Samuelson,and today we're going to talk
about birth control motives.
Birth control is a topic that Idon't think we've ever devoted
a whole episode to the podcastbefore, and we do want to tackle
(01:35):
birth control in a few episodeshere, but we did want to start
by talking about the differentmotives.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
First of all, let's just answer the question what do
we mean by birth control?
It sounds dumb.
I mean it sounds like we'retalking about controlling birth.
But you have to remember that,really, truly, it could be
divided into two categoriesthere's contraception and
there's birth control.
And the reason I make thedistinction is contraception.
I make the distinction iscontraception prevents the
(02:08):
beginning of life, whereas birthcontrol prevents birth.
And when we get into methods,we're going to be talking about
some forms of birth control.
Don't even have life beginning.
That's a true contraceptive.
But then birth control.
There are some methods of birthcontrol in which life begins
developing, it ends forming,it's coming down the fallopian
tube and then it's somehowterminated.
(02:28):
So sometimes the loose word,the loose phrase is birth
control.
But we'll define that a littlebit later when we get into the
methods.
But you know my motive is that alot of times we get lost in do
I want to start a family now?
Do I want to wait?
Do we want to wait till he'sback from the military?
Do we want to be?
There's many reasons why, andwhat we do is when you're
(02:52):
talking about reason, why.
Remember that's what the topicmotive is, we're talking about.
Why am I even engaged in thisdiscussion?
There was a time where peopledidn't worry about this.
It's just like we're married,we're having sexual relations,
oh, you're pregnant, okay, andthat's why oftentimes the
families, large number of womenwho were dying in childbirth,
(03:30):
and that raised a question about, well, maybe you shouldn't have
such large families if it'sgoing to terminate the life of
the mother.
So the questions started comingup there.
And then the questions wouldcome up due to other
circumstances, as our medicalpractices improved and we began
to understand well, there's acancer diagnosis, there's
something else that might makeit difficult, again, the focus
very much on maternal health,that she might not be able to
(03:52):
carry a pregnancy at this time,and so is there a role for birth
control.
The cervix is not able tosustain a pregnancy.
So if a couple engages in somesort of sexual activity and you
don't want a pregnancy to occurbecause she'll miscarry, the
body can't handle it.
So as we began to learn moreabout these things, all these
(04:14):
reasons started coming up as tomaybe we shouldn't have too many
children, or something.
But then, human nature beingwhat it is, it begins to get off
rails.
Then, all of a sudden, it'slike well, we don't want a world
population bomb to occur.
We don't want too many children.
We want to pursue certainmaterial things in this world,
(04:35):
we want to wait to get ourcareer under order.
And then all of a sudden youget all these other things and
now motive starts getting verycomplex.
Speaker 4 (04:43):
Yeah, with Bob's mention of world population, and
wanted to just go back a bit tothe term birth control.
Birth control is a great termwhen you're talking about
populations and when you'retalking about politics and
policies, when you're talkingabout large groups of people and
statistics.
We want more of this, we wantless of that.
So you talk about birth controlbut see that it doesn't work so
(05:07):
well when you bring the termdown to the level of the couple,
because the couple cannotreally control.
Yes, we're going to controlthat we have a birth, because
that's not entirely possible.
All you really can control isstopping that from happening.
And so what most people really,when they're talking about this
(05:28):
, when they're considering it,it's pregnancy control that
they're really interested in.
How can I keep from gettingpregnant?
How can I keep my wife or mygirlfriend from getting pregnant
?
And that's really what it comesdown to, and not so much birth
control.
Yeah, no, I mean that's realinteresting and that's really
what it comes down to, and notso much birth control.
Speaker 1 (05:47):
Yeah, no, I mean, that's real interesting.
And I mean I just remember too,talking with a friend years
back and she had done some sortof pill type of birth control,
and then they were ready now tohave kids.
And she's like and now I wantto get pregnant and I can't, and
so kind of just to your pointof like just this idea, I think,
(06:09):
in our society of it being thepregnancy control aspect of it.
Speaker 2 (06:13):
There's a lot of this notion that it's almost like a
matter of the will, like, ohyeah, we want to start right off
by having children or we wantto hold off having children.
And I like the way Jeffdescribed it, because you're
really talking about blocking anatural process.
You're not talking aboutenhancing natural process.
Now, when there's infertilityissues and we get into
(06:33):
infertility discussions, thereare things they can do to
enhance fertility, but generallyall we're talking about here is
stopping something thatotherwise occurs naturally in
God's timetable.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
Now, Bob, you did touch on contraception.
Can you expand a little bitmore on what is and isn't
contraception?
Speaker 2 (06:54):
The goal of contraception is to prevent the
meeting of the sperm and the egg.
So you're trying to preventconception.
That's the distinguishing markbetween that and what might be
other forms of birth control.
Which other forms of birthcontrol?
Some will specifically work inan abortifacient way, some will
(07:15):
have an abortifacient way as oneof the possible mechanisms, and
you know we'll do a deeper diveinto that when we get into
those episodes.
But contraception itself isjust how do we prevent sperm and
egg from meeting?
And that occurs through a lotof times, through barrier
methods and so forth.
Speaker 4 (07:33):
And I'll just mention one of the advantages of
limiting our discussion tocontraception is that in that
broader term birth control somepeople have included abortion in
various places and times andthings and for various purposes,
and we want to keep that farfrom our discussion when we're
talking about this, which is whythey always include it under
(07:54):
the umbrella of reproductiverights.
Speaker 2 (07:56):
They talk about, like we're talking about
reproduction.
No, no, when we're talkingabout abortion, reproduction's
already taken place.
We're talking about againending a different natural
process, which is life.
Dr Justin Marchegiani.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
Now just maybe kind of shift a little bit into
talking about the church andtalking about what the church's
stance is.
I guess maybe they're for oragainst birth control.
Just I feel like, okay,catholic against.
But I mean, even that kind ofseems to be changing too a
little bit.
(08:27):
So can you just tell us alittle bit of where the church
stands with this?
Speaker 4 (08:32):
Well, if you had checked just about I think,
probably just about anyChristian church and their
teaching, I'll say anyone thatpresumed to actually try to
follow God's will on things upuntil the 1940s probably, it was
pretty much universal that said, no, this is really something
that they would at least sayit's not best for Christians,
(08:55):
because for them any method ofbirth control was seen as
somehow trying to get aroundGod's will for a marriage or get
around God's will forprocreation, and it was just
pretty much generally said no,no, no, this is not something
you do.
And so, although we tend todayto associate primarily as a
(09:17):
Roman Catholic issue, it reallywas a universally Christian
issue for most of Christianhistory that this was not
something that you would messwith.
But in the 20th century,particularly starting in the 50s
or so, birth control becamemuch more available, became much
more effective and, because ofthat, started becoming much more
(09:40):
common, and so the church hadto deal with it and some adapted
in some ways and some adaptedin other ways.
It's interesting.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
In ancient history there were proposals on birth
control, let's say, because italmost always was a cover-up for
adultery.
You know, the soldiers would beout fighting in the Roman army,
their wives back home wouldhave relations with other men or
servants and so forth.
There'd be a pregnancy In thewritings, like Serranus of
(10:11):
Ephesus would write differentmethods a woman could try to do,
to try to kind of force amiscarriage and so forth, and
different chemicals that theycould use Seaweed was one I
remember, but it always was kindof a cover for infidelity and
so the church seemed to walkinto it, kind of naturally.
It's interesting.
(10:32):
I've been in the middle ofwatching a film series and I saw
this incorrect historicalreference talking about Thomas
Malthus in the late 1700s.
The Malthusian theory was thatwe were going to overpopulate
the world and not have theresources to feed the world, and
(10:53):
so they said well, ThomasMalthus really kind of kicked
off the interest on controllingbirth and so forth.
Thomas Malthus was a ministerand he was against contraception
.
He was simply creating thisidea that maybe we shouldn't
have as many children.
It wasn't nearly asinflammatory as this video had
made it out to be, but the pointis, is that up until that time,
(11:16):
even when there was concernabout the size of families and
so forth, the church always kindof stayed away from the topic
because it was so tied toinfidelity.
And then, like Jeff said, youget into the early 1900s and
that's kind of where it had itsclose tie-in with eugenics and
with that tie-in there was aconcern about people, especially
(11:38):
people with money, who maybewere worried about proliferating
schizophrenia and so forth.
They were interested in beingable to still have intimate
relations but not creating thechild.
I think it becomes an issuewhen it came into the marriage
bedroom.
If we confine this discussionthat's where it is is when we're
talking about when it gets intothe marriage relationship.
Speaker 1 (12:01):
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, I mean.
Obviously the words birthcontrol are not in the Bible,
but—.
Speaker 4 (12:08):
Not in that order anyway, are not in the Bible.
Not in that order anyway.
Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 1 (12:13):
Yes, birth and control are in the Bible.
But what can we kind of drawfrom with the Bible, with what
it says, at least about ideasaround birth control?
Speaker 4 (12:27):
The main thing is the positive that we take from
Scripture, which is thatchildren are consistently
referred to in the Bible as arich blessing from the Lord.
It's a good thing.
Children are great.
What a wonderful, amazing,miraculous thing it is when
women are able to conceive.
(12:47):
There are stories of barrenwomen who want nothing more than
to have children.
I mean, the idea of bearingchildren is something that's put
forward as very much a positive.
Nowhere is it referred to as anegative, except in the cases of
some of the laments and thingslike that, where it talks about
things are going to be so badthat women are going to be
wishing they never had kids.
(13:08):
That's actually making thepoint with the negative language
there.
But the other thing is thatchildren are an essential
feature of marriage.
They're not a bug and marriageis expected in most cases to
produce children.
And the idea of birth control orcontraception or whatever
(13:32):
wording you use for it todeliberately tell God, yes, we
want the pleasures of marriagebut no, we don't want your gift
of children it's a kind ofrebellion if you put it in that
extreme way.
And Bob talked about bringingthings into the marriage bedroom
way.
(13:52):
And Bob talked about bringingthings into the marriage bedroom
, and that's part of it is that,since scripture is very clear
that people who are not marriedto each other should not be
having sexual relations andshould not be doing the thing
that creates babies, there'sreally no need for them to be
taking any steps to keep frombecoming pregnant, and so that's
again one of the reasons whyit's not directly addressed, and
so that's again one of thereasons why it's not directly
addressed.
Speaker 2 (14:12):
Remember that this topic centering on the word
motive, and when we look atmotive we ask ourselves why do I
look at this?
Why would I, as a marriedcouple or as a couple looking to
get married, consider that Iwould want to control or forbid
having it?
And the reason you start fromthat perspective is that you
(14:34):
kind of ask yourself why am Idoing this in the first place?
And that is your entire life isa statement of thanksgiving to
God.
So you're always digging deepinto Scripture, finding out what
it is that pleases God, not toearn salvation, but because of
the salvation we have.
So you're always looking,you're always asking.
So the first time you encounterthis is you know, he created
(14:56):
man and woman.
Be fruitful and multiply.
It's a command, it's a blessing.
People will argue about thattill the end of time, but you
know, for the most part it'sbeen fulfilled.
I mean, we have filled theearth, there are people all over
, and that's good.
And it involves the humanactivity between two people.
So there is always a choiceinvolved, because you make a
(15:18):
choice for the intimaterelationship, so you always have
a choice involved for that.
So God actually gives you that.
Involvement in the process.
So there's an implied choiceinvolved.
Involvement in the process sothere's an implied choice
involved.
But you can't overlook whatJeff has pointed out, that
children are always defined as ablessing and something that you
(15:39):
desire.
And barrenness is somethingthat's wept about in Scripture,
it's mourned about, so it givesGod's attitude about it.
So I think you always want toremember that from the biblical
perspective, you're making achoice to say I wish to forego
something God has decided as ablessing and you have to frame
(16:00):
it that way.
Now that doesn't mean thatyou're wrong because we forego a
lot of blessings God has.
You know, like we say God hasblessed you with a lot of money,
we call it a blessing, I canuse it to further the kingdom
and so forth.
But you actually may say Godhas blessed you with a lot of
money.
We call it a blessing, I canuse it to further the kingdom
and so forth.
But you actually may say enoughis enough, I don't want more
money.
I don't play the lottery, I winall that money.
What am I going to do with allthat money?
(16:20):
It corrupts everybody.
I don't want to be corrupted.
So sometimes you step back fromblessing.
So you can certainly do that,but again, where's your motive?
What are you looking toaccomplish?
How are you trying to walk in away that's consistent with
which telegraphs to God?
Speaker 1 (16:38):
I adore you for what you've done for me, and it does
seem like you know, once we havea proper understanding of that,
that really does help and has aplace in this discussion too.
Speaker 4 (17:04):
Do principles of stewardship have a place in
making decisions aboutcontraception?
I'd say yes, they have a place,but not the primary place.
There will be short-termconsiderations of stewardship.
Say, a couple is about to moveacross the country and the new
job's not going to start for acouple of months yet.
It may be a good decision ofstewardship to say now is not
(17:28):
the best time for this gift, butsoon it will be.
You're not closing the door onit in any way.
There might be medicalinsurance concerns or the need
to.
You know that there's somemedical issues, so you want to
make sure you've got a nest eggin place before you proceed with
something like this.
Those can be legitimate.
Again, short-term stewardshipconsiderations.
(17:51):
But it's really important toremember that stewardship does
not mean it's all up to us totake care of us.
Stewardship is it means that wedo the best that we can with
what God has given us.
But we recognize in the endit's all up to him and the
(18:11):
sentiment that is well, we justcan't afford to have a child,
another baby, is absolutely morethan we can ever handle.
These are taking things alittle farther because they're
well.
It often shows I'm not going tosay always or necessarily, but
it often shows actually a lackof faith that God can actually
(18:31):
provide you what you need totake care of that child.
All sorts of stories of peoplewho said, oh yeah, we thought we
were done at two, we had ourhands full and then boom, what a
surprise.
And boy, we can't imagine lifeany different.
This is so wonderful.
Maybe we'll have another.
You really have to have anopenness of faith to say that,
(18:56):
yeah, we're going to make ourdecisions about what seems best
in the short term, but we'regoing to trust that, whatever
God wants to give us is for ourgood and that he's going to make
sure we're able to handle it.
Speaker 3 (19:08):
Yeah, I mean I seem to remember, recall Bob saying
that God always gets his way.
Speaker 1 (19:12):
That's kind of what it reminds me of when you were
talking too.
I mean, I think I do have likea little it is a little hard
right Like just the planningaspect that goes into it,
because we are I do feel likethat is one thing that is has
gotten more and more acceptableto like okay.
I mean, yeah, maybe wait tillyou're out of school or wait for
this or wait for that or thattype of thing, but people have
(19:36):
been having babies while theywere in college or seminary, or
people have brought babies intoapartments and, you know,
haven't waited for the house yet.
I don't know, it's justsometimes.
I think some of that maybe doesget into the way, as you were
saying, of just really trustingon what God has promised for us
(19:59):
too.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
Well, you know, stewardship issues are a topic
all of their own because we'revery conditioned by our culture,
the idea like, well, we can'thave another child or a child
because we can't afford it, andwe both have to work, you know,
and then somebody has to stayhome and child care is so
expensive.
We got all of these things andthat's our culture.
And yet, you know, you pokearound a little bit, you find
(20:30):
other people who show you thatyou might be wrong on that, that
there is a way to get around itand there is a way to do it,
and so forth, but it's verydifficult.
And I probably would haveadvised differently on this
younger than I do, older foundthat no matter how often I
invoked the name of God, nomatter how often I talked to God
in prayer, I oftentimes wasalways trying to manipulate God
to pretty much follow my plan.
(20:51):
So you're always kind oftalking to God okay, we'd like a
child.
Now would be nice, this wouldbe a good time to have a child,
or this would not be—we'regetting ready to move.
I used to joke that God alwaysplanned that there would be a
pregnancy in our family rightabout the time I was ready to
move.
So the wife could not liftboxes and stuff.
And with five children andhaving gone to college and the
(21:14):
seminary as a married studentand my first call and then it
was a temporary housing we wereliving into and moving in it
just seemed like every time wehad to move she was pregnant.
So you find yourself kind ofnegotiating with God a little
bit, but very much.
We got past all that.
It's not a big deal, but thething is, is that motive?
(21:34):
I think when you think aboutmotive and stewardship, I like
the way Jeff put it.
You know it's a component, butit's not the component.
The component is the hardestcomponent of all, and that is
how may I best glorify God withthis decision?
And we don't like to start withthat one, we'd like to solve
(21:55):
all the other ones and then saydo I feel comfortable that I'm
still glorifying God with this?
No, no, start with theglorifying God and then work
down the line.
Speaker 4 (22:04):
One of the things I like about this question asking
about stewardship and its placein the decision is because
stewardship putting it inquotation marks, you know it's
too often used in as kind of aChristian-ish way to say, well,
we don't want to interrupt ourcomfortable lifestyle to have
(22:27):
children now or maybe ever.
But you know it's kind ofselfish and self-centered to be
saying that.
And so you say, well, you know,we've just considered we don't
really have the resources forthat right now and we may never.
And it's really just saying,well, we want what we want right
now and we're not going totrust well, we want what we want
right now and we're not goingto trust that if God gives us a
(22:49):
kid that we're going to be happywith that.
Speaker 2 (22:51):
That's why we got to be careful to make sure that
stewardship is in its properplace when we're making
decisions about contraceptionand such you know, when you look
at God's original blessing ofbe fruitful, multiply and fill
the earth, god's originalblessing of be fruitful,
multiply and fill the earth,it's one of those kind of really
unique out of all the blessingsthat life comes out of the
woman and it perpetuates and itcreates further life and then it
(23:15):
keeps going down through thegenerations.
And you know, when we thinkabout motive and we look at
children, a lot of times wethink about the here and now,
like maybe it's not the righttime, maybe it's not a good time
and so forth.
Children are an incredibleblessing when you're older and
you know, I had a sciatic nerveissue and one of the kids came
(23:37):
over and helped me take downChristmas decorations and stuff.
They're adults, they gotfamilies of their own.
The children helped me incaring for Diane.
I have dealt with couples whohad made a conscious decision
when they were childbearingyears not to have children and
then, as they got older, theywere filled with fear over how
(23:59):
they would be cared for andwithout the children to be there
to carry that on.
And one of the things that'sbeen very indoctrinated in our
family is we take care of ourparents and even though I'm the
one who lives closest to myparents.
My brothers are always checkingin anything we can do.
How are things going?
That's part of theresponsibility.
(24:21):
So when you're told to befruitful and multiply,
stewardship also says maybe nota bad idea for you later on.
Speaker 4 (24:30):
One of my vices is I read advice columns and things
like that, and a number ofpeople have written in with
situations that I've noticedover the last few months or
whatever where, and I was like,well, aunt Mary is has moved
into town and you know shedoesn't have any kids and she's
not married and she seems to beexpecting me and my wife to take
(24:52):
care of her as she ages and wenever really volunteered for
this.
You know we love her, but whyshould we be on the hook for
this?
And you know I was like, well,and it's a repeated kind of
thing that is like, yeah, what?
Who is going to take care ofyou?
Who's going to look out for youwhen you reach there?
And a lot of people arethinking, ok, well, what about
(25:12):
when I'm at the nursing homestage?
For most people, there's a verylong period in between the
nursing home stage and notcompletely able to do everything
I want on my own, completelyable to do everything I want on
my own.
Speaker 1 (25:25):
So a question here are there any situations in
which there are really noquestions?
Birth control would absolutelybe necessary.
Speaker 2 (25:39):
Definitely, I think, health issues with one of the
parents, like there's been acancer diagnosis.
If the body can't handle it andpeople will say, well, you've
got to trust God.
You also have to use judgment.
That's part of managing.
A blessing is that you usejudgment.
And there are the really clearcases where she might not
(26:00):
survive.
Another one, another pregnancy,and I've been involved where
families have called me and havesaid you know, we just got
married and she just wasdiagnosed with a cancer and it's
going to require aggressivetreatment, and we're told that
with the treatment she mightsurvive, but without the
treatment it's very likely shewon't survive and if she's
(26:21):
pregnant, the treatment willharm or kill an unborn child.
I think that that's a crystalclear case.
You just got to wait.
And it's interesting becausethe couples who call with those
questions are heartbroken thatthey have to wait.
You know it's interesting.
The ones who don't call withthose questions oftentimes are
(26:42):
the ones that seem to be almostlike looking for an excuse, but
the ones who call genuinely lovechildren and just feel like,
are we all right with waiting.
I think it's a wise thing.
Speaker 4 (26:56):
Yeah, and another medical condition I think Bob
alluded to this earlier would bemaybe there's something with
the mother where, if she were toget pregnant, she would not
give birth to a.
Maybe there's something withthe mother where, if she were to
get pregnant, she would notgive birth to a live child, or
high likelihood of miscarriage,or high likelihood of a birth
defect or something like that.
Again, a case where the childmight be wanted, but making a
(27:16):
responsible decision in thatcase says well, we don't want to
bring life into the world onlyto see it destroyed because of
the medical condition.
And we can even bringpsychological conditions into
this.
Perhaps the mother has somekind of situation where she is
not in a proper mental state totake care of herself, let alone
(27:37):
the child within her womb or,after birth, to be able to take
care of that child.
Those would be cases where youmight say, okay, yeah, this is
not an environment in which tobring a new life into the world.
Speaker 1 (27:49):
What does God leave to our judgment when it comes to
contraception?
Speaker 2 (27:55):
Well, scripture would say, and then Adam lay with his
wife.
I mean, there's a consciousdecision to have intercourse,
which is the method that God'sgiven us to result in childbirth
, and so there's a consciousdecision there.
And when we get talking aboutmethods, we'll get into a
discussion on natural familyplanning method and so forth,
(28:17):
where couples will maybe make aconscious decision that that's
their birth control method andthey will withhold having sexual
relations and so forth.
First of all, there's just anatural built-in mechanism of a
matter of the will to do it.
It gets to be hard.
When we got the child numberfive.
I can't deny the fact that youdo get weary, that you do get
(28:44):
weary.
But when the doctor hadsuggested to us that this is
creating serious problems on thewife, the mother, that she was
retaining way too much fluid,the last pregnancy was
particularly difficult and soforth, it hurt a little bit.
It's kind of one of thosethings where, well, maybe we
can't have more, it just feltbad a little bit.
It's kind of one of thosethings where, well, maybe we've
(29:04):
had, well, we can't have more.
It just it felt bad a littlebit.
And so when you begin to keepshifting your focus from
yourselves to God, fromyourselves to God, you begin to
view it a lot differently andyou begin to feel bad when you
can't and are excited when itworks, are excited when it works
.
Speaker 4 (29:24):
Yeah, just the only thing I'd add is that you know
when we're exercising ourjudgment when it comes to
contraception, that who is itthat people usually go to?
They listen to their doctors,maybe.
They maybe do some research onthe internet, probably.
They just, you know, say totheir friends who are already
married, or whatever it's likewhat do you use?
What do you?
Speaker 3 (29:45):
do you know?
Speaker 4 (29:45):
it would be really good, because this is a matter
with spiritual implications.
Talk to your pastor about it,and probably not just in your
premarital counseling sessions,where I think most pastors cover
contraception at least brieflyin it, because it's a decision
that you'll probably revisit anumber of times during your
marriage.
(30:05):
You know what about now, whatabout tomorrow, and things like
that.
It should be the kind of thingthat you know you're free to
talk about, and it's a good ideato, particularly because there
are so many things out therethat people think they know that
they don't really know when itcomes to contraception, and when
we get into the other episodeon birth control methods, we'll
(30:26):
probably reveal a few of those.
Speaker 1 (30:28):
LESLIE KENDRICK.
Thank you both for thisdiscussion on birth control
motives and we'll definitelytackle more on birth control in
the future, but we just thankeveryone for joining us today
and if you have any questions onthis topic at all, you can
reach us at lifechallengesus.
(30:48):
We look forward to having youback next time.
Thanks a lot, bye.
Speaker 3 (30:54):
Thank you for joining us for this episode of the Life
Challenges podcast fromChristian Life Resources.
Please consider subscribing tothis podcast, giving us a review
wherever you access it andsharing it with friends.
We're sure you have questionson today's topic or other life
issues.
Our goal is to help you throughthese tough topics and we want
(31:14):
you to know we're here to help.
You can submit your questions,as well as comments or
suggestions for future episodes,at lifechallengesus or email us
at podcast atchristianliferesourcescom.
In addition to the podcasts, weinclude other valuable
information at lifechallengesus,so be sure to check it out.
(31:37):
For more about our parentorganization, please visit
christianliferesourcescom.
May God give you wisdom, love,strength and peace in Christ for
every life challenge.
On today's episode, control or forbid having it.
And the reason you start fromthat perspective is that you
kind of ask yourself why am Idoing this in the first place?
And that is your entire life isa statement of thanksgiving to
God.
So you're always digging deepinto Scripture, finding out what
it is that pleases God not toearn salvation, but because of
(00:40):
the salvation we have.
So you're always looking not toearn salvation, but because of
the salvation we have.
Speaker 3 (00:45):
So you're always looking.
Welcome to the Life Challengespodcast from Christian Life
Resources.
People today face manyopportunities and struggles when
it comes to issues of life anddeath, marriage and family,
health and science.
We're here to bring a freshbiblical perspective to these
issues and more.
Join us now for Life Challenges.
Speaker 1 (01:13):
Hi and welcome back.
I'm Krista Potratz and I'm heretoday with Pastors Bob
Fleischman and Jeff Samuelson,and today we're going to talk
about birth control motives.
Birth control is a topic that Idon't think we've ever devoted
a whole episode to the podcastbefore, and we do want to tackle
(01:35):
birth control in a few episodeshere, but we did want to start
by talking about the differentmotives.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
First of all, let's just answer the question what do
we mean by birth control?
It sounds dumb.
I mean it sounds like we'retalking about controlling birth.
But you have to remember that,really, truly, it could be
divided into two categoriesthere's contraception and
there's birth control.
And the reason I make thedistinction is contraception.
I make the distinction iscontraception prevents the
(02:08):
beginning of life, whereas birthcontrol prevents birth.
And when we get into methods,we're going to be talking about
some forms of birth control.
Don't even have life beginning.
That's a true contraceptive.
But then birth control.
There are some methods of birthcontrol in which life begins
developing, it ends forming,it's coming down the fallopian
tube and then it's somehowterminated.
(02:28):
So sometimes the loose word,the loose phrase is birth
control.
But we'll define that a littlebit later when we get into the
methods.
But you know my motive is that alot of times we get lost in do
I want to start a family now?
Do I want to wait?
Do we want to wait till he'sback from the military?
Do we want to be?
There's many reasons why, andwhat we do is when you're
(02:52):
talking about reason, why.
Remember that's what the topicmotive is, we're talking about.
Why am I even engaged in thisdiscussion?
There was a time where peopledidn't worry about this.
It's just like we're married,we're having sexual relations,
oh, you're pregnant, okay, andthat's why oftentimes the
families, large number of womenwho were dying in childbirth,
(03:30):
and that raised a question about, well, maybe you shouldn't have
such large families if it'sgoing to terminate the life of
the mother.
So the questions started comingup there.
And then the questions wouldcome up due to other
circumstances, as our medicalpractices improved and we began
to understand well, there's acancer diagnosis, there's
something else that might makeit difficult, again, the focus
very much on maternal health,that she might not be able to
(03:52):
carry a pregnancy at this time,and so is there a role for birth
control.
The cervix is not able tosustain a pregnancy.
So if a couple engages in somesort of sexual activity and you
don't want a pregnancy to occurbecause she'll miscarry, the
body can't handle it.
So as we began to learn moreabout these things, all these
(04:14):
reasons started coming up as tomaybe we shouldn't have too many
children, or something.
But then, human nature beingwhat it is, it begins to get off
rails.
Then, all of a sudden, it'slike well, we don't want a world
population bomb to occur.
We don't want too many children.
We want to pursue certainmaterial things in this world,
(04:35):
we want to wait to get ourcareer under order.
And then all of a sudden youget all these other things and
now motive starts getting verycomplex.
Speaker 4 (04:43):
Yeah, with Bob's mention of world population, and
wanted to just go back a bit tothe term birth control.
Birth control is a great termwhen you're talking about
populations and when you'retalking about politics and
policies, when you're talkingabout large groups of people and
statistics.
We want more of this, we wantless of that.
So you talk about birth controlbut see that it doesn't work so
(05:07):
well when you bring the termdown to the level of the couple,
because the couple cannotreally control.
Yes, we're going to controlthat we have a birth, because
that's not entirely possible.
All you really can control isstopping that from happening.
And so what most people really,when they're talking about this
(05:28):
, when they're considering it,it's pregnancy control that
they're really interested in.
How can I keep from gettingpregnant?
How can I keep my wife or mygirlfriend from getting pregnant
?
And that's really what it comesdown to, and not so much birth
control.
Yeah, no, I mean that's realinteresting and that's really
what it comes down to, and notso much birth control.
Speaker 1 (05:47):
Yeah, no, I mean, that's real interesting.
And I mean I just remember too,talking with a friend years
back and she had done some sortof pill type of birth control,
and then they were ready now tohave kids.
And she's like and now I wantto get pregnant and I can't, and
so kind of just to your pointof like just this idea, I think,
(06:09):
in our society of it being thepregnancy control aspect of it.
Speaker 2 (06:13):
There's a lot of this notion that it's almost like a
matter of the will, like, ohyeah, we want to start right off
by having children or we wantto hold off having children.
And I like the way Jeffdescribed it, because you're
really talking about blocking anatural process.
You're not talking aboutenhancing natural process.
Now, when there's infertilityissues and we get into
(06:33):
infertility discussions, thereare things they can do to
enhance fertility, but generallyall we're talking about here is
stopping something thatotherwise occurs naturally in
God's timetable.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
Now, Bob, you did touch on contraception.
Can you expand a little bitmore on what is and isn't
contraception?
Speaker 2 (06:54):
The goal of contraception is to prevent the
meeting of the sperm and the egg.
So you're trying to preventconception.
That's the distinguishing markbetween that and what might be
other forms of birth control.
Which other forms of birthcontrol?
Some will specifically work inan abortifacient way, some will
(07:15):
have an abortifacient way as oneof the possible mechanisms, and
you know we'll do a deeper diveinto that when we get into
those episodes.
But contraception itself isjust how do we prevent sperm and
egg from meeting?
And that occurs through a lotof times, through barrier
methods and so forth.
Speaker 4 (07:33):
And I'll just mention one of the advantages of
limiting our discussion tocontraception is that in that
broader term birth control somepeople have included abortion in
various places and times andthings and for various purposes,
and we want to keep that farfrom our discussion when we're
talking about this, which is whythey always include it under
(07:54):
the umbrella of reproductiverights.
Speaker 2 (07:56):
They talk about, like we're talking about
reproduction.
No, no, when we're talkingabout abortion, reproduction's
already taken place.
We're talking about againending a different natural
process, which is life.
Dr Justin Marchegiani.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
Now just maybe kind of shift a little bit into
talking about the church andtalking about what the church's
stance is.
I guess maybe they're for oragainst birth control.
Just I feel like, okay,catholic against.
But I mean, even that kind ofseems to be changing too a
little bit.
(08:27):
So can you just tell us alittle bit of where the church
stands with this?
Speaker 4 (08:32):
Well, if you had checked just about I think,
probably just about anyChristian church and their
teaching, I'll say anyone thatpresumed to actually try to
follow God's will on things upuntil the 1940s probably, it was
pretty much universal that said, no, this is really something
that they would at least sayit's not best for Christians,
(08:55):
because for them any method ofbirth control was seen as
somehow trying to get aroundGod's will for a marriage or get
around God's will forprocreation, and it was just
pretty much generally said no,no, no, this is not something
you do.
And so, although we tend todayto associate primarily as a
(09:17):
Roman Catholic issue, it reallywas a universally Christian
issue for most of Christianhistory that this was not
something that you would messwith.
But in the 20th century,particularly starting in the 50s
or so, birth control becamemuch more available, became much
more effective and, because ofthat, started becoming much more
(09:40):
common, and so the church hadto deal with it and some adapted
in some ways and some adaptedin other ways.
It's interesting.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
In ancient history there were proposals on birth
control, let's say, because italmost always was a cover-up for
adultery.
You know, the soldiers would beout fighting in the Roman army,
their wives back home wouldhave relations with other men or
servants and so forth.
There'd be a pregnancy In thewritings, like Serranus of
(10:11):
Ephesus would write differentmethods a woman could try to do,
to try to kind of force amiscarriage and so forth, and
different chemicals that theycould use Seaweed was one I
remember, but it always was kindof a cover for infidelity and
so the church seemed to walkinto it, kind of naturally.
It's interesting.
(10:32):
I've been in the middle ofwatching a film series and I saw
this incorrect historicalreference talking about Thomas
Malthus in the late 1700s.
The Malthusian theory was thatwe were going to overpopulate
the world and not have theresources to feed the world, and
(10:53):
so they said well, ThomasMalthus really kind of kicked
off the interest on controllingbirth and so forth.
Thomas Malthus was a ministerand he was against contraception
.
He was simply creating thisidea that maybe we shouldn't
have as many children.
It wasn't nearly asinflammatory as this video had
made it out to be, but the pointis, is that up until that time,
(11:16):
even when there was concernabout the size of families and
so forth, the church always kindof stayed away from the topic
because it was so tied toinfidelity.
And then, like Jeff said, youget into the early 1900s and
that's kind of where it had itsclose tie-in with eugenics and
with that tie-in there was aconcern about people, especially
(11:38):
people with money, who maybewere worried about proliferating
schizophrenia and so forth.
They were interested in beingable to still have intimate
relations but not creating thechild.
I think it becomes an issuewhen it came into the marriage
bedroom.
If we confine this discussionthat's where it is is when we're
talking about when it gets intothe marriage relationship.
Speaker 1 (12:01):
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, I mean.
Obviously the words birthcontrol are not in the Bible,
but—.
Speaker 4 (12:08):
Not in that order anyway, are not in the Bible.
Not in that order anyway.
Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 1 (12:13):
Yes, birth and control are in the Bible.
But what can we kind of drawfrom with the Bible, with what
it says, at least about ideasaround birth control?
Speaker 4 (12:27):
The main thing is the positive that we take from
Scripture, which is thatchildren are consistently
referred to in the Bible as arich blessing from the Lord.
It's a good thing.
Children are great.
What a wonderful, amazing,miraculous thing it is when
women are able to conceive.
(12:47):
There are stories of barrenwomen who want nothing more than
to have children.
I mean, the idea of bearingchildren is something that's put
forward as very much a positive.
Nowhere is it referred to as anegative, except in the cases of
some of the laments and thingslike that, where it talks about
things are going to be so badthat women are going to be
wishing they never had kids.
(13:08):
That's actually making thepoint with the negative language
there.
But the other thing is thatchildren are an essential
feature of marriage.
They're not a bug and marriageis expected in most cases to
produce children.
And the idea of birth control orcontraception or whatever
(13:32):
wording you use for it todeliberately tell God, yes, we
want the pleasures of marriagebut no, we don't want your gift
of children it's a kind ofrebellion if you put it in that
extreme way.
And Bob talked about bringingthings into the marriage bedroom
way.
(13:52):
And Bob talked about bringingthings into the marriage bedroom
, and that's part of it is that,since scripture is very clear
that people who are not marriedto each other should not be
having sexual relations andshould not be doing the thing
that creates babies, there'sreally no need for them to be
taking any steps to keep frombecoming pregnant, and so that's
again one of the reasons whyit's not directly addressed, and
so that's again one of thereasons why it's not directly
addressed.
Speaker 2 (14:12):
Remember that this topic centering on the word
motive, and when we look atmotive we ask ourselves why do I
look at this?
Why would I, as a marriedcouple or as a couple looking to
get married, consider that Iwould want to control or forbid
having it?
And the reason you start fromthat perspective is that you
(14:34):
kind of ask yourself why am Idoing this in the first place?
And that is your entire life isa statement of thanksgiving to
God.
So you're always digging deepinto Scripture, finding out what
it is that pleases God, not toearn salvation, but because of
the salvation we have.
So you're always looking,you're always asking.
So the first time you encounterthis is you know, he created
(14:56):
man and woman.
Be fruitful and multiply.
It's a command, it's a blessing.
People will argue about thattill the end of time, but you
know, for the most part it'sbeen fulfilled.
I mean, we have filled theearth, there are people all over
, and that's good.
And it involves the humanactivity between two people.
So there is always a choiceinvolved, because you make a
(15:18):
choice for the intimaterelationship, so you always have
a choice involved for that.
So God actually gives you that.
Involvement in the process.
So there's an implied choiceinvolved.
Involvement in the process sothere's an implied choice
involved.
But you can't overlook whatJeff has pointed out, that
children are always defined as ablessing and something that you
(15:39):
desire.
And barrenness is somethingthat's wept about in Scripture,
it's mourned about, so it givesGod's attitude about it.
So I think you always want toremember that from the biblical
perspective, you're making achoice to say I wish to forego
something God has decided as ablessing and you have to frame
(16:00):
it that way.
Now that doesn't mean thatyou're wrong because we forego a
lot of blessings God has.
You know, like we say God hasblessed you with a lot of money,
we call it a blessing, I canuse it to further the kingdom
and so forth.
But you actually may say Godhas blessed you with a lot of
money.
We call it a blessing, I canuse it to further the kingdom
and so forth.
But you actually may say enoughis enough, I don't want more
money.
I don't play the lottery, I winall that money.
What am I going to do with allthat money?
(16:20):
It corrupts everybody.
I don't want to be corrupted.
So sometimes you step back fromblessing.
So you can certainly do that,but again, where's your motive?
What are you looking toaccomplish?
How are you trying to walk in away that's consistent with
which telegraphs to God?
Speaker 1 (16:38):
I adore you for what you've done for me, and it does
seem like you know, once we havea proper understanding of that,
that really does help and has aplace in this discussion too.
Speaker 4 (17:04):
Do principles of stewardship have a place in
making decisions aboutcontraception?
I'd say yes, they have a place,but not the primary place.
There will be short-termconsiderations of stewardship.
Say, a couple is about to moveacross the country and the new
job's not going to start for acouple of months yet.
It may be a good decision ofstewardship to say now is not
(17:28):
the best time for this gift, butsoon it will be.
You're not closing the door onit in any way.
There might be medicalinsurance concerns or the need
to.
You know that there's somemedical issues, so you want to
make sure you've got a nest eggin place before you proceed with
something like this.
Those can be legitimate.
Again, short-term stewardshipconsiderations.
(17:51):
But it's really important toremember that stewardship does
not mean it's all up to us totake care of us.
Stewardship is it means that wedo the best that we can with
what God has given us.
But we recognize in the endit's all up to him and the
(18:11):
sentiment that is well, we justcan't afford to have a child,
another baby, is absolutely morethan we can ever handle.
These are taking things alittle farther because they're
well.
It often shows I'm not going tosay always or necessarily, but
it often shows actually a lackof faith that God can actually
(18:31):
provide you what you need totake care of that child.
All sorts of stories of peoplewho said, oh yeah, we thought we
were done at two, we had ourhands full and then boom, what a
surprise.
And boy, we can't imagine lifeany different.
This is so wonderful.
Maybe we'll have another.
You really have to have anopenness of faith to say that,
(18:56):
yeah, we're going to make ourdecisions about what seems best
in the short term, but we'regoing to trust that, whatever
God wants to give us is for ourgood and that he's going to make
sure we're able to handle it.
Speaker 3 (19:08):
Yeah, I mean I seem to remember, recall Bob saying
that God always gets his way.
Speaker 1 (19:12):
That's kind of what it reminds me of when you were
talking too.
I mean, I think I do have likea little it is a little hard
right Like just the planningaspect that goes into it,
because we are I do feel likethat is one thing that is has
gotten more and more acceptableto like okay.
I mean, yeah, maybe wait tillyou're out of school or wait for
this or wait for that or thattype of thing, but people have
(19:36):
been having babies while theywere in college or seminary, or
people have brought babies intoapartments and, you know,
haven't waited for the house yet.
I don't know, it's justsometimes.
I think some of that maybe doesget into the way, as you were
saying, of just really trustingon what God has promised for us
(19:59):
too.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
Well, you know, stewardship issues are a topic
all of their own because we'revery conditioned by our culture,
the idea like, well, we can'thave another child or a child
because we can't afford it, andwe both have to work, you know,
and then somebody has to stayhome and child care is so
expensive.
We got all of these things andthat's our culture.
And yet, you know, you pokearound a little bit, you find
(20:30):
other people who show you thatyou might be wrong on that, that
there is a way to get around itand there is a way to do it,
and so forth, but it's verydifficult.
And I probably would haveadvised differently on this
younger than I do, older foundthat no matter how often I
invoked the name of God, nomatter how often I talked to God
in prayer, I oftentimes wasalways trying to manipulate God
to pretty much follow my plan.
(20:51):
So you're always kind oftalking to God okay, we'd like a
child.
Now would be nice, this wouldbe a good time to have a child,
or this would not be—we'regetting ready to move.
I used to joke that God alwaysplanned that there would be a
pregnancy in our family rightabout the time I was ready to
move.
So the wife could not liftboxes and stuff.
And with five children andhaving gone to college and the
(21:14):
seminary as a married studentand my first call and then it
was a temporary housing we wereliving into and moving in it
just seemed like every time wehad to move she was pregnant.
So you find yourself kind ofnegotiating with God a little
bit, but very much.
We got past all that.
It's not a big deal, but thething is, is that motive?
(21:34):
I think when you think aboutmotive and stewardship, I like
the way Jeff put it.
You know it's a component, butit's not the component.
The component is the hardestcomponent of all, and that is
how may I best glorify God withthis decision?
And we don't like to start withthat one, we'd like to solve
(21:55):
all the other ones and then saydo I feel comfortable that I'm
still glorifying God with this?
No, no, start with theglorifying God and then work
down the line.
Speaker 4 (22:04):
One of the things I like about this question asking
about stewardship and its placein the decision is because
stewardship putting it inquotation marks, you know it's
too often used in as kind of aChristian-ish way to say, well,
we don't want to interrupt ourcomfortable lifestyle to have
(22:27):
children now or maybe ever.
But you know it's kind ofselfish and self-centered to be
saying that.
And so you say, well, you know,we've just considered we don't
really have the resources forthat right now and we may never.
And it's really just saying,well, we want what we want right
now and we're not going totrust well, we want what we want
right now and we're not goingto trust that if God gives us a
(22:49):
kid that we're going to be happywith that.
Speaker 2 (22:51):
That's why we got to be careful to make sure that
stewardship is in its properplace when we're making
decisions about contraceptionand such you know, when you look
at God's original blessing ofbe fruitful, multiply and fill
the earth, god's originalblessing of be fruitful,
multiply and fill the earth,it's one of those kind of really
unique out of all the blessingsthat life comes out of the
woman and it perpetuates and itcreates further life and then it
(23:15):
keeps going down through thegenerations.
And you know, when we thinkabout motive and we look at
children, a lot of times wethink about the here and now,
like maybe it's not the righttime, maybe it's not a good time
and so forth.
Children are an incredibleblessing when you're older and
you know, I had a sciatic nerveissue and one of the kids came
(23:37):
over and helped me take downChristmas decorations and stuff.
They're adults, they gotfamilies of their own.
The children helped me incaring for Diane.
I have dealt with couples whohad made a conscious decision
when they were childbearingyears not to have children and
then, as they got older, theywere filled with fear over how
(23:59):
they would be cared for andwithout the children to be there
to carry that on.
And one of the things that'sbeen very indoctrinated in our
family is we take care of ourparents and even though I'm the
one who lives closest to myparents.
My brothers are always checkingin anything we can do.
How are things going?
That's part of theresponsibility.
(24:21):
So when you're told to befruitful and multiply,
stewardship also says maybe nota bad idea for you later on.
Speaker 4 (24:30):
One of my vices is I read advice columns and things
like that, and a number ofpeople have written in with
situations that I've noticedover the last few months or
whatever where, and I was like,well, aunt Mary is has moved
into town and you know shedoesn't have any kids and she's
not married and she seems to beexpecting me and my wife to take
(24:52):
care of her as she ages and wenever really volunteered for
this.
You know we love her, but whyshould we be on the hook for
this?
And you know I was like, well,and it's a repeated kind of
thing that is like, yeah, what?
Who is going to take care ofyou?
Who's going to look out for youwhen you reach there?
And a lot of people arethinking, ok, well, what about
(25:12):
when I'm at the nursing homestage?
For most people, there's a verylong period in between the
nursing home stage and notcompletely able to do everything
I want on my own, completelyable to do everything I want on
my own.
Speaker 1 (25:25):
So a question here are there any situations in
which there are really noquestions?
Birth control would absolutelybe necessary.
Speaker 2 (25:39):
Definitely, I think, health issues with one of the
parents, like there's been acancer diagnosis.
If the body can't handle it andpeople will say, well, you've
got to trust God.
You also have to use judgment.
That's part of managing.
A blessing is that you usejudgment.
And there are the really clearcases where she might not
(26:00):
survive.
Another one, another pregnancy,and I've been involved where
families have called me and havesaid you know, we just got
married and she just wasdiagnosed with a cancer and it's
going to require aggressivetreatment, and we're told that
with the treatment she mightsurvive, but without the
treatment it's very likely shewon't survive and if she's
(26:21):
pregnant, the treatment willharm or kill an unborn child.
I think that that's a crystalclear case.
You just got to wait.
And it's interesting becausethe couples who call with those
questions are heartbroken thatthey have to wait.
You know it's interesting.
The ones who don't call withthose questions oftentimes are
(26:42):
the ones that seem to be almostlike looking for an excuse, but
the ones who call genuinely lovechildren and just feel like,
are we all right with waiting.
I think it's a wise thing.
Speaker 4 (26:56):
Yeah, and another medical condition I think Bob
alluded to this earlier would bemaybe there's something with
the mother where, if she were toget pregnant, she would not
give birth to a.
Maybe there's something withthe mother where, if she were to
get pregnant, she would notgive birth to a live child, or
high likelihood of miscarriage,or high likelihood of a birth
defect or something like that.
Again, a case where the childmight be wanted, but making a
(27:16):
responsible decision in thatcase says well, we don't want to
bring life into the world onlyto see it destroyed because of
the medical condition.
And we can even bringpsychological conditions into
this.
Perhaps the mother has somekind of situation where she is
not in a proper mental state totake care of herself, let alone
(27:37):
the child within her womb or,after birth, to be able to take
care of that child.
Those would be cases where youmight say, okay, yeah, this is
not an environment in which tobring a new life into the world.
Speaker 1 (27:49):
What does God leave to our judgment when it comes to
contraception?
Speaker 2 (27:55):
Well, scripture would say, and then Adam lay with his
wife.
I mean, there's a consciousdecision to have intercourse,
which is the method that God'sgiven us to result in childbirth
, and so there's a consciousdecision there.
And when we get talking aboutmethods, we'll get into a
discussion on natural familyplanning method and so forth,
(28:17):
where couples will maybe make aconscious decision that that's
their birth control method andthey will withhold having sexual
relations and so forth.
First of all, there's just anatural built-in mechanism of a
matter of the will to do it.
It gets to be hard.
When we got the child numberfive.
I can't deny the fact that youdo get weary, that you do get
(28:44):
weary.
But when the doctor hadsuggested to us that this is
creating serious problems on thewife, the mother, that she was
retaining way too much fluid,the last pregnancy was
particularly difficult and soforth, it hurt a little bit.
It's kind of one of thosethings where, well, maybe we
can't have more, it just feltbad a little bit.
It's kind of one of thosethings where, well, maybe we've
(29:04):
had, well, we can't have more.
It just it felt bad a littlebit.
And so when you begin to keepshifting your focus from
yourselves to God, fromyourselves to God, you begin to
view it a lot differently andyou begin to feel bad when you
can't and are excited when itworks, are excited when it works
.
Speaker 4 (29:24):
Yeah, just the only thing I'd add is that you know
when we're exercising ourjudgment when it comes to
contraception, that who is itthat people usually go to?
They listen to their doctors,maybe.
They maybe do some research onthe internet, probably.
They just, you know, say totheir friends who are already
married, or whatever it's likewhat do you use?
What do you?
Speaker 3 (29:45):
do you know?
Speaker 4 (29:45):
it would be really good, because this is a matter
with spiritual implications.
Talk to your pastor about it,and probably not just in your
premarital counseling sessions,where I think most pastors cover
contraception at least brieflyin it, because it's a decision
that you'll probably revisit anumber of times during your
marriage.
(30:05):
You know what about now, whatabout tomorrow, and things like
that.
It should be the kind of thingthat you know you're free to
talk about, and it's a good ideato, particularly because there
are so many things out therethat people think they know that
they don't really know when itcomes to contraception, and when
we get into the other episodeon birth control methods, we'll
(30:26):
probably reveal a few of those.
Speaker 1 (30:28):
LESLIE KENDRICK.
Thank you both for thisdiscussion on birth control
motives and we'll definitelytackle more on birth control in
the future, but we just thankeveryone for joining us today
and if you have any questions onthis topic at all, you can
reach us at lifechallengesus.
(30:48):
We look forward to having youback next time.
Thanks a lot, bye.
Speaker 3 (30:54):
Thank you for joining us for this episode of the Life
Challenges podcast fromChristian Life Resources.
Please consider subscribing tothis podcast, giving us a review
wherever you access it andsharing it with friends.
We're sure you have questionson today's topic or other life
issues.
Our goal is to help you throughthese tough topics and we want
(31:14):
you to know we're here to help.
You can submit your questions,as well as comments or
suggestions for future episodes,at lifechallengesus or email us
at podcast atchristianliferesourcescom.
In addition to the podcasts, weinclude other valuable
information at lifechallengesus,so be sure to check it out.
(31:37):
For more about our parentorganization, please visit
christianliferesourcescom.
May God give you wisdom, love,strength and peace in Christ for
every life challenge.
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