Episode Transcript
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SPEAKER_01 (00:00):
Welcome to the deep
dive, where we extract the core
insights from, well, some of theworld's most compelling academic
discussions, and we deliver thatactionable knowledge straight to
you.
Today we are taking on, I think,the most ambitious topic of all:
happiness.
SPEAKER_00 (00:15):
That's right.
And we're not just here to talkabout, you know, fleeting
positive feelings.
We're distilling these reallyprofound conversations from
people like Dr.
Laurie Santos and Dr.
Andrew Huberman, and we'remixing that with the academic
literature to really redefinehappiness.
Because the sources, they allreveal that happiness isn't just
one single thing.
It's more of a concept that's uhfiltered through these really
distinct layers, and each one istied to a different timescale.
SPEAKER_01 (00:38):
And that's our
mission today.
We want to understand thosethree distinct levels the
immediate, the intermediate, andthen that long-term meaning.
And crucially, we want to find apractical roadmap.
We want to show you how toidentify your core values, your
what they call signaturestrengths, and then use them to
bridge that, you know, immediatesatisfaction with some genuine,
(00:59):
lasting purpose.
We're going to try to makepurpose feel practical, not so
abstract.
SPEAKER_00 (01:04):
Okay, let's unpack
this.
Let's start with that essentialframework.
When we think about whetherwe're happy, uh, researchers are
suggesting that our brains areprocessing information across at
least three distinct levels.
Three layers.
And each one corresponds to adifferent time horizon.
SPEAKER_01 (01:18):
Aaron Powell Right.
And the first layer is the mostprimitive one.
It's the most immediate, we'llcall the sensory experience that
operates purely on the presentmoment timescale.
And what's so fascinating hereis that the positive feeling at
this level is profoundly definedby contrast.
SPEAKER_00 (01:32):
The idea of
contrast.
That seems kind ofcounterintuitive, right?
Why would a good feeling beamplified by having a bad
experience first?
Why can't we just, you know,jump straight to the good
feeling?
Well, it's about the biology ofexperience.
The sources really point outthat this is the scientific
reason for these ancientphilosophical ideas, like
memento mori.
You know, consciously thinkingabout difficulty or death.
(01:53):
The reason that works is rootedin neurobiology.
Our brains adapt to a steadystate incredibly, incredibly
quickly.
So if you always have comfort,comfort just becomes the new
neutral.
It's your baseline.
SPEAKER_01 (02:05):
And that's the
classic cold shower example.
The cold part is awful, but thenthe warm shower that follows
feels like a genuine luxury.
It's not just a standardexperience anymore.
SPEAKER_00 (02:14):
Exactly.
The contrast breaks what weoften call the hedonic
treadmill, that sensorydifficulty, you know, being
hungry, being cold, beingexhausted.
It creates a profound contrast.
And that allows the warmth orthe food or the rest to just
flood your system with a truelevel one appreciation.
You know, dogs seem to bemasters of this.
They seem to live entirely inthis immediate sensory realm.
SPEAKER_01 (02:35):
Right.
But humans with this massiveprefrontal cortex we have, we
just can't survive on that firstlevel alone.
It would feel like something isreally missing.
So we have to introduce thesecond layer, which is the
intermediate time scale.
And this is where things getcomplicated.
This is the layer called story.
SPEAKER_00 (02:51):
And story is all
perception-based.
It's heavily tied into ourdopamine systems, our reward and
punishment systems.
But you hit on a crucial pointthere.
If it's tied to dopamine,doesn't that make it inherently
unstable?
SPEAKER_01 (03:03):
Yeah, that's what I
was thinking.
If I'm just chasing a dopaminehit, isn't that just a
manufactured level onehappiness, but I'm dressing it
up like it's a long-term plan, Ifeel like this is the layer that
causes the most anxiety forpeople.
SPEAKER_00 (03:15):
That's the critical
insight.
Dopamine here isn't just aboutthe reward, it's about
anticipation.
And it's about relativecomparison.
It's the story we tell ourselvesabout where we should be, based
on our own history or who we'recomparing ourselves to.
And the research shows ourbrains react fiercely not just
to having less, but to decliningrelative to our own story.
SPEAKER_01 (03:36):
Can you give us a
concrete example of that, of
that internal story failingsomebody?
SPEAKER_00 (03:41):
Sure.
Think of an executive who has aspectacular, objectively high
salary, let's say$400,000.
But for the last two years, theywere making$500,000, and maybe
the company hit a rough patch.
So objectively, they're wildlysuccessful.
But their personal story is oneof decline.
So they are unhappy.
They're driven by the perceivedpunishment of falling short of
(04:03):
their own narrative.
The happiness they feel isentirely dictated by the
direction of the arrow, not theactual number.
SPEAKER_01 (04:09):
So, okay, level one,
sensory happiness, is defined by
contrast.
And level two, story happiness,is all about comparison.
So if you're always acceleratingin your story, you feel good.
But the moment you justmaintain, or God forbid, slow
down, your brain registers thatas a problem.
SPEAKER_00 (04:25):
Exactly.
And that unstable system is whatnecessitates the third layer,
meaning this operates on thewhole picture or the long time
scale.
This is purpose.
It's about connecting thosedaily actions, regardless of how
they stack up in your comparisonstory, to something bigger than
yourself, to your core values.
SPEAKER_01 (04:40):
Which allows you to
kind of detach from that
immediate sensory input and thatreally unstable comparison
narrative.
SPEAKER_00 (04:46):
Precisely.
Think about um spending timewith extended family, especially
bringing different generationstogether.
Is every single moment of thatfamily dinner awesome?
No.
Of course not.
There might be tension, sensoryoverload, maybe some boring
small talk, but the act itselfis profoundly meaningful.
It aligns with core values likeconnection or heritage or
(05:09):
whatever it might be for you.
So you might not be happy inevery moment, but you're
profoundly happy with your lifebecause of that long-term
meaning.
SPEAKER_01 (05:17):
And that just
perfectly encapsulates the
challenge, doesn't it?
We need a bridge between ourlocal daily actions and that
huge level three purpose.
How do you take something asmassive as my purpose and make
it a daily input?
SPEAKER_00 (05:29):
Well, that's the
critical structural element we
can take from these sources.
To achieve that long-termpurpose, you have to
consistently engage inactivities at the short-term
level that align with yourdeepest values.
And this is where we need tostop talking about purpose in
the abstract and start talkingabout concrete character
strengths.
SPEAKER_01 (05:44):
I think so many
people hear the word values and
they immediately think, oh, Ivalue family and success, which
is just too vague to be useful,right?
So how do we find the precisevalues that really drive our
sense of meaning?
SPEAKER_00 (05:56):
Aaron Powell
Researchers, uh notably Chris
Peterson and his colleagues,took turpis and they
systematically operationalizedit.
They scoured human history,philosophy, cultures all over
the world to identify theseuniversally valuable things that
people can do.
And this resulted in a list of24 distinct character strengths.
SPEAKER_01 (06:15):
So 24 specific
universal building blocks that
contribute to human flourishing.
SPEAKER_00 (06:20):
Yes.
Things like curiosity, bravery,judgment, humor, social
intelligence, level learning,prudence, empathy, fairness.
The list goes on.
They're all good things thathumans value, but we all differ
dramatically in which ones weprioritize.
And the ones you resonate withmost deeply, those are your
signature strengths.
When you do those things, younaturally feel this internal
validating sense of purpose.
(06:41):
That's level three meaning.
SPEAKER_01 (06:43):
So the goal isn't to
be good at all 24.
The goal is to identify the,what, five or seven that are
most you?
And for anyone listening, we'dstrongly recommend checking out
the formal validated assessment.
It's the VIACharacterStrengths.org website.
It just transforms this vagueidea of purpose into a checklist
of actionable behaviors.
SPEAKER_00 (07:02):
Aaron Powell And
once you know those behaviors,
you basically have a blueprintfor meaning.
So now the question becomes howdo you deploy that blueprint in
the arena where most of us spendthe vast majority of our lives
at work?
SPEAKER_01 (07:13):
And here's where it
gets really, really interesting
and practical.
Knowing your signature strengthis one thing, but how do you
actually use it when you have anormal, you know, non-flexible
job?
This brings us to thefascinating research on job
crafting, which was pioneered byAmy Rosnewski.
SPEAKER_00 (07:28):
Rosnitsky, she's a
professor at UPenn, and she
recognized that most peoplebelieve their job is defined
entirely by, you know, thatHR-aproved job description.
But she defines job crafting astaking that standard job and
actively figuring out ways toinfuse your own signature
strengths into it.
SPEAKER_01 (07:44):
So if your strength
is creativity, you find a way to
make that report look visuallystunning, even if your job
doesn't technically require it.
Or if your strength is bravery,maybe you finally step up and
you run that difficult teammeeting that everyone else tries
to avoid.
SPEAKER_00 (07:58):
Exactly.
You are subtly, or maybe not sosubtly, redesigning your own
role to meet your psychologicalneed for purpose.
But I know a lot of ourlisteners right now are
thinking, okay, but I'm anauditor or I work on an assembly
line.
My boss doesn't let me jobcraft.
This is for, you know, people inSilicon Valley.
SPEAKER_01 (08:16):
Aaron Powell Right.
We need a solid proof of conceptfor rigid environments.
Where did Rasnowski look toprove that this kind of
flexibility isn't just formanagers and consultants?
SPEAKER_00 (08:25):
She went to the most
structurally rigid environment
she could think of.
SPEAKER_01 (08:28):
Uh-huh.
SPEAKER_00 (08:28):
Hospital genitorial
staff.
Their job is defined by physicaltasks, cleaning, disinfecting,
moving supplies.
On paper, there's virtually zeroroom for self-expression.
And yet she found that a massiveportion, somewhere between a
quarter and a third of theseworkers, reported that their job
was a calling.
They loved it.
They got huge amounts of turpistfrom it.
SPEAKER_01 (08:49):
Wow.
That is the ultimate aha momentright there.
The only difference between thejanitors who hated their job and
the ones who saw it as a callingwas just the intentional
deployment of their signaturestrengths.
SPEAKER_00 (09:00):
And the detailed
anecdotes she collected are just
profound.
She spoke with a man who workedon a chemotherapy ward.
As we know, chemo often leads tonausea, so cleaning up vomit was
a major, major part of his dailytask.
His core job description wascleanliness, but his signature
strengths were humor and socialintelligence.
SPEAKER_01 (09:20):
And how in the world
did he craft the job around
those strengths?
SPEAKER_00 (09:24):
He fundamentally
reframed his purpose.
Yeah.
He told Roznevsky that his jobwasn't cleaning vomit, his job
was restoring dignity.
So when a patient was at theirabsolute lowest, post nausea, he
would come in and he had thisstandard self-deprecating joke
about the size of the mess.
Just a moment of levity to makethe patient feel seen, cared
for, and for a brief second makethem laugh on what was a truly
(09:44):
awful day.
He took a level one sensory taskand layered level three meaning
directly onto it by justdeploying humor and social
intelligence.
SPEAKER_01 (09:52):
That is so powerful.
He didn't change his job dutiesat all.
He just changed the why and thehow he did them.
SPEAKER_00 (09:57):
Here's another
example.
A worker in a coma ward, wherethe patient interaction is
basically zero.
Her strength was creativity.
So since she couldn't talk tothe patients, she would
rearrange the artwork, theplants, the decorations in the
room every single day.
She saw this as exercising hercreativity, bringing this
subtle, positive energy into theroom, even if it had absolutely
(10:18):
no medical effect.
The outcome was irrelevant.
The feeling of purposefulexecution was everything to her.
SPEAKER_01 (10:25):
The ultimate
takeaway here seems to be that
you don't need to quit your joband completely redesign your
whole life.
You just need to identify yourstrengths and then find the
window, however small it is, tobuild them into your current
role.
SPEAKER_00 (10:37):
Right.
The flexibility is oftenpsychological before it's
procedural.
SPEAKER_01 (10:40):
So, okay, let's
pivot this to life outside of
work.
We spend a huge amount of timeand leisure, but often that time
is just so passive.
How do we apply these signaturestrengths to our free hours?
SPEAKER_00 (10:51):
This is a huge
missed opportunity, I think.
Because many people they kind ofgravitate toward careers that
use their strengths, but thenthey completely neglect those
same strengths in their leisuretime.
We just default to passiveconsumption, you know, the
plopping down and watchingNetflix behavior.
And that passive time, it's finefor sensory relief for level
(11:12):
one, but it doesn't contributeat all to level three purpose.
SPEAKER_01 (11:15):
So our leisure time
can and really should do double
duty.
SPEAKER_00 (11:19):
Absolutely.
The research suggestsdeliberately integrating your
strengths into your leisure.
Start by contrasting passiveconsumption with active
deployment.
So if your strength is love oflearning, simply watching a
documentary is fine.
But actively taking a class orlearning a language or tackling
a really difficult history book,that is the active deployment of
(11:40):
that strength.
SPEAKER_01 (11:41):
It transforms
consumption into contribution,
and you don't even have to do italone.
SPEAKER_00 (11:45):
And that's where
this idea of the strength date
comes in.
It works for friends, forromantic partners, anyone.
You both do the characterstrengths test together and find
your shared, your convergentsignature strengths.
Then you plan an activity thatrequires you to execute that
strength together.
SPEAKER_01 (12:00):
So if you both share
bravery instead of just dinner
and a movie, you go tackle thatterrifyingly steep local hike.
Or maybe try an obstacle coursethat pushes you way past your
comfort zone.
SPEAKER_00 (12:11):
Or what if you share
a high strength for prudence and
judgment?
Maybe your ideal date isresearching and planning a
complex financial goal or a hugetrip.
You get to deploy yourorganizational strength
together.
That feels incredibly purposefuland connecting, far beyond just
relaxing together.
It extends the opportunity touse your strengths beyond work,
making your personal time feeljust as purposeful.
SPEAKER_01 (12:34):
This has been such a
clear path forward.
By first understanding thathappiness has those three
levels, sensory, story, andmeaning, we can stop chasing
just immediate satisfaction or,you know, that unstable
comparison game.
SPEAKER_00 (12:46):
And by consciously
identifying and then
implementing your signaturestrengths, not just in some huge
career change, but through jobcrafting and purposeful leisure,
you actively create that levelthree purpose in both your
professional and your personallife.
The synthesis allows you to stopworrying so much about being
happy in every single moment andstart focusing on being happy
(13:08):
with your life.
SPEAKER_01 (13:08):
Thank you for
joining us on this deep dive
into crafting a meaningful life.
We really hope this knowledgehelps you inject your own
signature strengths into yourweek ahead, maybe even starting
today.
SPEAKER_00 (13:18):
And before we go, we
spend a lot of time talking
about the power of convergentstrengths.
You know, when two people sharethe same trait, like humor, and
use it together.
But let's consider the oppositedivergent strengths.
What if one person's signaturestrength is prudence, careful
planning, foresight, and theirpartners is bravery, all daring
(13:38):
and excitement.
How could that prudent personintentionally deploy their
strength to support the braveperson's goal?
Think about what that kind ofcomplimentary strength pairing
looks like in your life.
That's something to mull overuntil next time.