August 17, 2026 • 40 mins
Tariffs were supposed to bring manufacturing back to America. But for many companies, moving production out of China and Asia simply doesn't make financial or operational sense. So why aren't U.S. factories coming back, and what does reshoring actually cost?
In this episode of "The Money Signal: From Main Street to Wall Street", Kerim Kfuri, President and CEO of The Atlas Network and Alibaba.com's first U.S.-based verified supplier, breaks down the real economics of tariffs, U.S. manufacturing, global supply chains, reshoring, AI sourcing, e-commerce, and bringing a product to market.
Kerim explains why saving 50 cents per unit can create $5 worth of problems, what happens when a new factory can only produce a tenth of the volume your market needs, and why the mental shift toward moving manufacturing is happening much faster than the practical reality.
We also explore how Alibaba's AI sourcing engine Accio can turn a photograph of a product into potential suppliers, how AI is changing product development before entrepreneurs ever speak to a designer or factory, and the three pillars Kerim uses to keep production runs from going off the tracks.
Kerim also explains how new e-commerce brands can test and sell a virtual product before manufacturing a single unit, why trade schools may not be the automatic answer to an AI-driven future, and what entrepreneurs misunderstand about trying to build everything alone.
We also discuss:
- Why bringing manufacturing back to America is harder than it sounds
- The real cost of relocating a global supply chain
- Tariffs and the changing economics of sourcing from China and Asia
- Why production capacity can matter more than price
- What factory-direct, Temu-style shipping means for traditional warehousing
- How AI can generate dozens of product concepts before production begins
- How Alibaba and Accio are changing global product sourcing
- Why packaging is becoming a strategic issue for major consumer brands
- The one question Kerim believes you should ask before starting a product business
- What he would tell his younger self about entrepreneurship and trying to do everything alone
If you're interested in U.S. manufacturing, tariffs, China, global supply chains, reshoring, Alibaba, AI sourcing, e-commerce, product development, entrepreneurship, or bringing a product idea to market, this episode is for you
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The content presented on The Money Signal: From Main Street to Wall Street is for informational and entertainment purposes only and does not constitute financial, investment, legal, tax, or other professional advice.
The views expressed by hosts and guests are their own and do not necessarily reflect the views of GLORION Media or its affiliates. Any discussion of companies, securities, markets, or investment strategies is intended solely as commentary and should not be interpreted as a recommendation to buy, sell, or hold any financial instrument.
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SPEAKER_00 (00:00):
The biggest topic in the last couple of months years
has been there for months, andthat's in relation to AI.
SPEAKER_01 (00:12):
And that's what I think we need to think about.
We need to look at and sayhistory repeats itself in both
the negative and the positivedays the last couple of years.
SPEAKER_00 (00:22):
Have you seen a shift?
SPEAKER_02 (00:23):
I've seen a mental shift, but a practical shift is
a different conversation title.
SPEAKER_00 (00:29):
Who explains the AI classified and automation in the
supply chain?
SPEAKER_02 (00:33):
Yes.
SPEAKER_00 (00:37):
What I would say, and I'll not try to parent
anybody, but the reality of itis is that welcome to the Money
Signal podcast from Main Streetto Wall Street, where I am
joined by Kareem Kafori, a verydear friend of mine, who um has
become one of my inner circleconnections um as of recent.
(01:02):
So that story to our firstoriginal meeting, which I'd love
to share with audiencelisteners.
In September uh 2025, I wasinvited to speak at the Ali
Bottle Co-Pray conference in LasVegas, where it was there were
5,000 people, there were manyspeakers.
Uh, mainstage was one of themain one of the stages, then
(01:24):
there were two other stages.
It felt like a very busy event.
Yeah.
And everyone was trying tonetwork so fast, like meeting
people, shaking hands, gettingyour car, giving your lens in
Let's Connect, what's yourInstagram?
And I think one of the onlypeople who actually took the
time to talk to me out ofinterest were you.
So I always appreciate genuineuh conversations, genuine
(01:46):
relationships, also genuine uhconnections of mind and heart.
SPEAKER_02 (01:51):
Yes, agreed.
100%.
And it's good to be here withyou, Svet, and I'm so excited
about this uh beautiful podcast.
SPEAKER_00 (01:58):
Thank you.
You've been part of thisjourney.
I feel like you've been hearingabout the podcast for so long,
ever since I started putting ittogether.
Yes, I think you know how hardit is to put together a podcast
yourself.
Yes.
Uh for our audience, uh, I'dlove to just do a quick intro.
So when I met you, and I'll doit in my own words, and again,
I'd love to hear more about you.
Sure.
Um, so we don't have ateleprompter, so I hate uh
(02:22):
reading anything.
I on purpose just because I'dlike to keep it more
conversational.
But when I met you in Vegas, oneof the first things you told me
was, hi, my name is Corrine, andI'm in supply chain.
And this is just a genuine,obviously, me sharing my
thoughts.
And I thought, oh, supply chain,that sounds interesting, but
supply chain is so vast and sovague in terms of what exactly
(02:45):
you could be doing.
And as I got to know you more, Iactually realized that you
basically do literally the vastand vague meaning of supply
chain, which is that you helpinventors, careers, brand
owners, and anyone who has anyidea with the whole process of
(03:06):
manufacturing, identifying themanufacturers, bringing the
product to life, bringing theproduct to the US, if it's
manufactured outside of the US,and you have a massive wide
knowledge around all thelegalities and the processes
that come with bulk net.
So that's my version of yourintroduction.
(03:27):
Uh, but I'd love to hear if youwere to describe and introduce
yourself, who is Korean Fort?
SPEAKER_02 (03:33):
I would say, first of all, that I'm a problem
solver.
I would say I'm an optimist.
I'm definitely a person wholooks to create solutions.
And I always say when we talkabout what we do that we're a
global supply chain solutionsprovider, because in the end of
the day, supply chain has a lotof issues and it uh is a
(03:54):
challenge consistently.
There are these controllable anduncontrollable things that you
can actively manage and somedays can't manage.
Right.
And the idea there is that youcan't avoid disruptions.
So to really be disruption proofis to understand that there will
be disruptions and how are yougoing to get ahead of that?
(04:14):
How are you gonna havecontingency plans and think
about the worst case scenariosand will your business still be
able to survive?
So, you know, you said a verynice intro for me.
So I feel like I don't even haveto say anything, but I will say
something, you know, uh shortabout it is that, you know, my
hope and the goal of my company,and why I can call it the Atlas
(04:35):
Network, which is Atlas, youknow, carrying the birth on his
shoulders, is to remediate andremove those barriers and those
headaches for the clients uh sothat they can thrive and grow
and scale.
So that they don't have to befearful that are my goods going
to get there on time?
Are they going to be uhwell-managed?
(04:56):
Am I going to go out of businessbecause of whatever disruption
can and does happen?
SPEAKER_04 (05:01):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (05:01):
And that they have a trusted entity to help them to
do that.
Small to mid-sized businessesare definitely the forte and the
sweet spot because they're notchasing the pennies and the
dollars, but actually see, theycan understand that if it costs
an extra 10 or 20 cents, whatsaves them$5 and headaches or
could blow up their businessentirely if not well managed,
(05:24):
that it's well worth it.
Whereas larger companies, wework with them too, but the
difference there is that they'reable to build their own
infrastructures, they're able tobuild their own networks.
And so it's easy for them tokind of pivot or change if
something isn't working outexactly the way they want it to.
Um, so it's a little bit more ofa fickle relationship when it
comes to the larger scaleentities.
(05:44):
So we tend to focus a lot onsmaller, mid-sized businesses,
and like I said, turning ideasinto reality.
That's the focus.
Uh businesses come through thedoor and they're in various, you
know, um, areas of theirbusiness life cycle.
They are either, you know, withan idea on a napkin, or they
are, you know, somewhatestablished but are having
(06:05):
problems.
They're looking foropportunities, or in the terms
of like, let's say, recentpandemic or tariff situations,
they're looking foralternatives, where to go in the
world, or how to cost-engineersomething, or make it for less,
or different materials, how tobreak the mold.
And we try to let them connectthose dots that they themselves
(06:25):
don't see.
And in doing so, we developthese long-term relationships
that go for years upon yearsupon years.
Because when you build a trustedsupply chain, you really just
want to have it continue goingand continue building and
developing and being managed.
And that's what we try to dofrom science too.
So it's it's very interesting.
It's a it's a long life cycle,like as you said, that starts
(06:48):
with ideas and partner andfactory selection,
manufacturing, quality control,shipping and logistics, import,
customs clearance, trucking,warehousing, delivery,
fulfillment, reordering, andthen back through again.
For some clients, we can doeverything I just said.
For some clients, it's half orit's a certain part.
(07:10):
And it really just depends uponwhere you sort of sit the
meeting question.
So that's it.
SPEAKER_00 (07:15):
Well, that's it.
It's it's a very complicated uhprocess.
And I love the name of thebusiness itself, Atlas Network.
Atlas, as you mentioned, isobviously carrying the globe.
Because you you do travel allaround the globe when it comes
to producing and manufacturing.
Yes.
(07:35):
Um, question for you is in thebusiness, so you've been in the
industry for a while.
Within the last couple of years,have you seen the shift from
manufacturing and up from othercountries, whether they're China
or somewhere else, towards theUS?
And I asked that question.
It's a little bit of umobviously political slash um,
(07:57):
you know, we're in the tariffera, sure, but also we're in the
era of America first, right?
SPEAKER_04 (08:03):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (08:03):
So have you really seen a shift in those last few
years that has movedmanufacturing more towards the
US?
SPEAKER_02 (08:11):
I've seen a mental shift, but a practical shift is
a different conversationentirely.
So the mental shift is hey, canwe make this in other places in
the world that are not Asia?
Could we go to Mexico, can we goto the United States, or do
things in Canada, Europe,whatever it may be?
But the unfortunate side is nota full kind of end-to-end
(08:37):
solution, which really allowsyou to have probably all the
composite bells and whistles andcost structures and efficiencies
and so forth as some of theexisting manufacturing networks
in a world.
So the mentality may be there,but what lags behind there by
you know a decade, possibly asmuch as a decade, is the
(08:59):
capability to fully um producethose results or to do it at
scale that a business couldstill survive at.
You know, we could say, let'smove it from point A to point B.
But if at point B, even thoughthey can make it, they can only
have an output of a tenth ofwhat your market needs.
Then you basically create ascenario of scarcity.
The cost of your prices have togo up because you're only able
(09:22):
to produce a certain amount ofunits, and then you have a major
challenge there.
And that's what really camedown, I think, with the whole
scenario with tariffs.
What people were looking at, youknow, how are we gonna manage
this and deal with this?
And what the vast majority ofcompanies ended up doing is not
moving.
They just said, you know what,when I look at the whole
equation, even though it's gonnacost us or our customers more,
(09:44):
or we'll absorb some, or thesupplier will absorb some, or
the customer will absorb some,it doesn't make sense
technically, logistically,output-wise, quality-wise, to
move the whole operation tosomewhere else, where again,
saving 50 cents may end upcausing you, you know, five
dollars in tops because they maynot have the skilled workforce,
(10:07):
they may not have the technologythat's needed, they may not have
the output and the resources andso on and so forth.
Uh, so for all of those reasons,it's a it's always a great idea
to promote doing more businessin the local economy or domestic
economy because it strengthensthe you know the domestic side
of things.
But is it feasible?
(10:28):
Some industries I would say moreso than others.
Things like that are moremechanized.
For example, to make paperproducts engagement, I mean make
paper products in the UnitedStates where it's just done by
machine either way.
Pretty much a simple idea.
The inputs are there, you've gotpulk, you've got other things
that are, you know, readilyavailable.
So it would work out okay.
(10:50):
But for other products where youdon't have the materials, you
have to import those in, and youdon't have the labor who knows
what to do, what to do, and youdon't have the machinery to
detect someone, then the cost ofthat product could go up by
five, ten, a hundred times whereit is somewhere else in the
world.
So it will make a difference.
And then the other thing I thinkthat will create, let's say, the
ability to be more domestic in ashorter time horizon will be the
(11:13):
use of automation and the use ofmore tech that is less reliant
upon skills and workforces andis more reliant upon automation
and robotics.
So as that rises up, I thinkthat's where we will get more
and more opportunities indomestic work.
SPEAKER_00 (11:29):
Nah, thank you.
Got straight to my actually nextquestion.
Thank you so much for the greatexplanation.
Sure.
So talking about automation androbotics, I would love to hear
your thought on and your opinionon who is winning the
AI/robotics and automation gamein the supply chain.
I analyze consumer data all thetime.
I can tell you anything you wantabout any consumer, any topic,
(11:51):
any language, anywhere in theworld.
The big topics in the last 12months for consumers have been
tariffs, yeah, employment, yes,and that's in relation to AI and
AI taking jobs away.
So automation taking jobs away.
Sure.
In your field, there's severalthings that you mentioned that
(12:12):
I'm very intrigued by.
The first one was the scalepiece, but then on the robotics
and AI piece, I keep on seeingcomments from consumers and I
keep on reading the news andhearing again from in the news
from sources, uh, claims thatthe US is obviously like we're
first in the AI roboticsautomation game.
In the supply chain uh field,which we just talked about, you
(12:36):
mentioned that obviously wecan't always produce everything
at mass scale.
So does that mean that the UStechnically doesn't have the
capacity because of lack of AIautomation or that we're behind?
Or is it really does it reallyhave to do with the fact that
maybe other manufacturers abroaduh either have better automation
(12:57):
or maybe they just have thebetter scale, or both?
SPEAKER_02 (13:00):
I think it's both.
And I think it's definitely thatthere are parts of the world
that have better automation umthan we have here because their
focus has been on being amanufacturing nation.
Whereas this is a new idea forus.
You know, we haven't beenthinking about being a
manufacturing nation in a in 70years.
(13:20):
You know, we're so far away fromthose assembly lines where we
were manufacturing steel and youknow, all of these products
domestically and leading theworld in kind of the industrial
revolution that really wasoccurring here, you know, and
and in that way, even more so,then tariffs were being put on
to dissuade international trade.
(13:40):
We were trying to keepeverything here, we weren't
trying to put anything away.
But as we had changes that occurhere in the US, especially with
regards like PPA regulations andother kinds of legal um, you
know, areas of concern aroundmanufacturing and quality of
life and labor force and thingsof that nature, and we shipped
(14:02):
jobs away and shippedcapabilities away, um, we lost
that ability to scale thosethings because we said we're
just not going to be amanufacturing nation anymore.
Um why did that happen?
We could say it was because ofglobalization, we could say
because it was of greed, wecould say it was because of uh
being more protective of ourown, you know, environment in
(14:26):
this part of the world, althoughwe all know what happens on the
other side of the planet stillimpacts us today, right?
We understand that with climatechange and globalization and the
rest of it.
Um but the truth of it is that Ido think that with AI and
automation, back to yourconversation about fears and
jobs and so on and so forth.
I believe that we're goingtowards an era of expansive
(14:50):
growth and that there's gonna bea whole host of jobs and
industries, but they're new jobsand they're new industries.
They're not the the jobs as weknow them today.
And that is where the dynamicshift is going to happen, where
people are either gonna have toget with the program or not get
with the program.
(15:11):
And we've seen that with anyother technological revolution.
I mean, just think about it.
There was a time where there washorses and bugboons, right?
And then all of a sudden someonesaid, Hey, you know what?
There's this new thing.
It's called the automobile.
So what happened to the guy whowas making horses and bugoons?
Well, he went out of business,but instead of one guy making
the buggies, now you've got ahundred people making cars.
(15:33):
Same thing goes with the nextinnovation, which was, let's
say, the airplane.
And what ended up happening withthere?
Now you've got an industry ofpeople who are pilots and
stewards and airports and thecommerce that comes with that,
and so on and so forth.
So with each of these differentinnovations and technology, same
thing with a computer, right?
I mean, you and I, or at leastI'm gonna say I saw the
(15:56):
development of the computer.
You know, I saw the verybeginnings of it, I saw the
development of cell phones.
Well, how much business has beengenerated because of the world
of cell phones in the past 10,20, 30 years?
So if we all sat around andsaid, oh, it's gonna take away
jobs because people aren't gonnalike use the landlines anymore.
You know, we and that's what Ithink we need to think about.
(16:18):
We need to look back and sayhistory repeats itself in both
the negative and the positives.
So if we look at it in terms ofpositives, we say breakthrough
technologies can createindustries which create
opportunity, employment, andeconomic development.
And that's how we have to lookat things like automation,
robotics, and AI, and how thefuture is gonna look.
(16:39):
Not so much that we're afraidabout jobs that are gonna get
lost, but we should be excitedabout the jobs that are gonna be
gained.
That to my idea of being anoptimist.
SPEAKER_00 (16:48):
Which we should be at all times.
Yeah.
I And that's not a politicalidea.
SPEAKER_02 (16:52):
That that's just an economics technological idea,
very non-political.
Even though I grew up in DCarea.
SPEAKER_00 (16:58):
But I'm very non-political.
Well, that's good.
We like to keep it non-politicalhere, although obviously
politics is involved in everyaspect of our lives.
I love what you said about theboogeing and obviously the horse
and the people who went toproduce cars.
(17:19):
I feel like we see a shift goingback to the regular um jobs that
once disappeared, not fullyextinct, but for example,
carpenters and plumbers.
SPEAKER_02 (17:31):
Yes, trades.
SPEAKER_00 (17:32):
The trades and trade schools, um, at least in what
I've seen uh with from parentconversations, we analyze
multiple segments of audiencesfor variety of our customers.
Sure.
And the parent conversation,some of the most interesting
discussions have been on socialmedia that parents are sending
their kids to trade schools uhbecause of that AI shit and AI
(17:56):
and boo and the fact thatparents are scared that those
jobs will be easily replaceableby automation and robotics.
So anything that has to do withobviously your marketing, your
just accounting, even finance,some of these jobs they fear are
going to be replaced.
But trade school, for example,plumbing and your plumbers and
(18:19):
your carpenters, and again yourroof, roofers and construction
are basically the jobs that uhthere's a notable shift that
I've seen in conversation onsocial media among parents.
So I find that so interesting tohear.
SPEAKER_02 (18:35):
It is, it is interesting, but I would say,
and you know, I'm not trying toparent anybody, but the reality
of it is that I think that we doour future generation a
disservice by kind of being thehorse with the blinders on.
And I feel like by taking thatdecision to almost be like
anti-development,anti-technology, and say, let's
(18:57):
just like go backwards in time,is a protective stance around,
let's say, future employment andgrowth and being able to survive
in this world.
But it's a disservice becauseit's not, again, the way of
development.
So should people have more orshould there be more emphasis on
trades and trade schools?
(19:18):
Sure, there could be, but forthe right reasons, not because
we're fearful.
It should be because there's aneed for that.
And at the same time, we stillhave an understanding of what's
happening in the world as atechnology and so on, because
it's only a matter of timebefore tech will be infused into
the world of plumbing in someway, or into the world of
(19:39):
roofing in some way.
And guess what?
Those people who have becomemasters of roofing or plumbing
and so on will need to take thatknowledge set and incorporate it
with what's the best oftechnology and combine those
two.
And that will be for the benefitof humanity.
All of these things that we doshould all be with that kind of
(20:00):
a lens or that idea in mind ofhow can we most benefit the
global economy?
How can we both most benefithumanity?
And if that's technological orthat's trades, or that's you
know, just being good to eachother, whatever it may be.
It's all about that kind ofimpact that we need to do with
what we do in our lives and inour work and our relationships
(20:23):
and everything else.
So, you know, I I'm not a fan oflet's just put a bunch of people
in this industry because we'refearful of what's coming.
I'm not a fan of that at all.
I think it's anti-progress.
SPEAKER_00 (20:35):
Well, it's a mixture, right?
So to understand like where isthe world going to go?
Do you think AI is going to comeinto the supply chain and like
basically cut the time of thewhole process of supply chain?
And also these, I mean, I keepon reading about now uh with the
war, like the shipments gettingdelays.
(20:56):
Yeah.
How how is AI used in the supplychain space right now?
SPEAKER_02 (21:01):
It's already being used and it's being used in
many, many different ways.
Um, you know, I do a lot of workwith Alibaba, you know that.
And we met there, right?
And I'm an ambassador ofAlibaba.
And so I was there when theyreleased the first AI sourcing
engine, which was called Axia,and it's out there right now.
And that's really unbelievablebecause let's say I'm trying to
(21:23):
build something or makesomething, you know, I would
have historically have to golooking for suppliers, maybe get
on an airplane, you know, haveback and forth broken
conversations with people, notknow what kind of business plan
I'm gonna write, when am I gonnamake samples, prototype them,
what's good, what's bad, so onand so forth.
You can push some buttons now,and a lot of that work is done
(21:46):
for you in a matter of seconds,minutes, rather than taking
months of headache and nothaving any kind of guidance and
so forth.
I mean, a platform like that canwrite a business plan for you in
two seconds.
It can find the time you cantake A picture of something
using like a Alibaba lens, andit'll show you the top five
factories in the world that makethat thing.
SPEAKER_00 (22:06):
Wow.
SPEAKER_02 (22:06):
And you and connect you to them and communicate with
them immediately.
And then it will then beprototyped within a matter of a
short period of time and show upon your doorstep and they show
their verification credentials.
So you don't have to be like, isit good or is it a bad group?
And then there's tradeassurance, which makes sure that
you're protected in that world.
SPEAKER_00 (22:24):
And so there's just it's so you don't even have to
leave your house anymore.
SPEAKER_02 (22:28):
They have to leave your house.
And then on top of it, the otherpart that's really interesting
is that you know you'd spend allthis time with design firms or
engineering firms to try to makewhat's in your brain like real
or a design or rendering, itdoes it for you too.
Why say take these five thingsand just make me something new
that combines this element, thiselement, this element, this
element, and you push a button,and then it's like, here's 30
(22:51):
mock-ups.
What do you like?
Well, well, I like that one, butit's too big, it's too short.
I want it wider here, short, andthen and then you refine it,
refine it, refine it withouteven talking to anybody.
SPEAKER_00 (23:00):
That's crazy.
SPEAKER_02 (23:01):
So the positive side of that is that you talk about
how it impacts the industry, isit gets more products to
industry quicker, which thencreates more opportunities for
product, business, employment,growth, commerce.
So in that way, AI is shorteningthe curve to get ideas into
(23:22):
reality.
That's one side.
SPEAKER_04 (23:24):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (23:25):
The other things that are happening too are in
the realm of like shipping andlogistics, looking at the most
effective routings, what gets itthere faster, what has the least
kind of carbon footprint,they're measuring those things,
uh reorder rates, inventorymanagement, warehousing and
fulfillment that are beingfacilitated via drones,
(23:46):
automated trucking, you know,all of that.
In so many ways.
From the beginnings all the wayto the last mile, the last mile
being like how the truckliterally takes your stuff from
the warehouse and puts it onyour doorstep of Amazon, right?
Um, yeah.
I mean, we're we're five to tenyears away from being able to
kind of push some buttons andnot a lot of humans being
(24:07):
involved.
SPEAKER_04 (24:08):
Wow.
SPEAKER_02 (24:08):
A lot of human impacts, a lot of other jobs
that are shifted over orchanged.
Um, but yeah, certain certainthings are gonna change.
SPEAKER_00 (24:19):
And do you think that um there's one basically
with the AI coming in?
I actually have not used Axio,although I heard several
presentations of it.
I definitely will check it out.
Do you think that with AI comingin, e-commerce is also changing
the way that we're operating asshoppers and also as sellers?
SPEAKER_02 (24:39):
Yes, I do.
I think as sellers, because ofthe fact that you're going to be
able to get access to moreefficient supply chains that
will allow you to sell more, getproducts in advance, do things
like the release of new SKUswithout taking on inventory.
Like you could go on, as I saidbefore, onto a platform, you
(24:59):
know, basically create a virtualproduct, put it out there, sell
it, hit a certain criticalnumber, and then buy the goods
and make it.
SPEAKER_04 (25:09):
Wow.
SPEAKER_02 (25:09):
So you don't even have to like make it, buy it,
store it in your garage or insome kind of a warehouse and
pray and hope that there aresales.
And that's how a lot of newe-commerce brands are doing it.
They're saying, hey, you knowwhat?
I'm not gonna buy this until Ihit a certain critical mass.
So they look to build up theirmarket.
They put out a virtual versionof the product, almost like a
(25:33):
pre-sale, if you want to say,but not call it a pre-sale.
They see what the volumes looklike when they hit a certain
margin level, then they placeyou up.
So basically, not even withtheir money, with other people's
money.
SPEAKER_00 (25:43):
Wow.
This is a money signal podcast.
We're like we like liberty.
Other people's money.
SPEAKER_02 (25:50):
OPM, that's what it is.
SPEAKER_00 (25:51):
OPM, we're gonna work in retail.
So warehousing, I mean, a lot ofthe products are built
everywhere.
US, I assume, a lot in Visa,China, other countries.
Warehousing it gets could bewith these virtual problems,
could it be done abroad or couldit be done in the US?
Like now it's especially likeshipments it was get back to the
(26:13):
fact that currently werestruggling with getting
shipments to the US because ofclosure, tariffs, closure of
specific geographic routes.
Yes.
Um, how how would warehousingtechnically work?
If you were to have the virtualproduct, you store it, you do.
SPEAKER_02 (26:29):
You don't store it.
You don't even make it until youhave certain critical mass of
orders, and then you don't storeanything.
It literally goes from thefactory floor directly to the
well, in the case of Timu,basically, and those kinds of
companies shipping directly tocustomer A, B, C, D, E, F, G,
not even to a centralizedwarehouse and so forth.
(26:50):
I see.
SPEAKER_00 (26:50):
That's very interesting.
See, I learned something new,which I love.
SPEAKER_02 (26:55):
Yeah, no, it's it it is very fascinating, and it's
it's basically this idea ofalmost kind of like not mass
production, but it's like masscustomization.
SPEAKER_00 (27:05):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (27:06):
Almost.
SPEAKER_00 (27:06):
And most of the products that you work on
varying, right?
It could be glass products, itcould be plastic.
Yeah, you know, yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (27:15):
Yeah, we've I mean through the years, I mean,
through the years, we've prettymuch done everything from baby
products to uh FDA certifiedproducts, PPE during the
pandemic, consumer packagegoods.
We do a lot in the realm of foodand beverage.
We have like 450 spirits andbeverage clients where we
manufacture all their bottlesand closures and packaging.
(27:35):
We've done machinery,large-scale machinery, AI stuff,
um, a lot of apparel, luxurygoods, watches, and golf
products, and so through youknow, more than two decades,
there's been a lot.
And the reason why is is becausethe methodology, I think, of
what of how we do it is a verysound one.
It's three pillars.
(27:56):
It's picking the right supplier,thus, the network part of our
name, the Atlas network.
We have 2,000 suppliers that arenetwork, vetted suppliers.
And then it's eyes and ears onthe ground, because you have to
have an active babysitting.
If you don't have that, thenthat's when the train goes off
the tracks pretty quick.
And then third-partyattestation, just like in the
world of you know, publicfinance where you have
(28:18):
accounting firms and auditingfirms, we bring in uh auditing
firms and QC firms to also kimpthe tires to say it's not
because the factory didn't do agood job or we didn't do a good
job, but let's just grab a groupthat's pain-defined as stakes.
Have them come in, look it over,make sure everything's good, get
a clean bill of health.
And in this mechanism, that'swhy you can then end up making a
(28:40):
chair or a machine or whateverelse it is, because you've got
the right supplier, the rightlayer of sort of management and
babysitting, and then a rightlayer of audit.
And that, I believe, is thesecret sauce to how we do what
we do pretty well.
SPEAKER_00 (28:55):
Wow.
Our our signals are businessesyou want to work, you have a
sweet spot for small and medium.
Yes.
Which is very lovely to hear asa small business owner, although
I'm in your field.
Yes, yes.
I always appreciate people whohelp uh the small guy um get
bigger.
Have you seen some kind of likea push towards organic?
Is there products organicproducts and yeah, organic
(29:19):
everything?
So I've been uh I'm a mom and Ihave two kids, and I think my
husband and I spend most of theday and night on their these new
apps where you can check likewhat's what has you know like
chemicals in it, what's toxic.
Um, I'm very intrigued to heatto see and hear, especially you
mentioned now with CPG and withfood and beverage.
(29:41):
I am working on a food andbeverage by the way project at
the moment.
Um, like how are how are thesemanufacturers and also the
companies that are hiring youguys approaching organic and
chemicals and toxins?
Is there a heightened interestfrom their side and making
obviously products safer?
(30:01):
I know there are a lot ofregulations in the US, but I'm
really not sure how does thatstart really look like, I guess,
from start to finish when youthink of you have to take into
account all the laws and theregulations, but also the
consumer at mind.
SPEAKER_02 (30:15):
Yes.
Uh I mean that's a very goodquestion.
And the truth of it is thatevery industry and every product
has sort of different mandatesthat that kind of govern that
decision.
In some cases, they're forced todo it, right?
A company or an industry isforced to maintain certain FBA
standards or whatever else itmay be.
(30:35):
And as those standards change orshift towards more uh recyclable
products or more uh naturalingredients that must be in
there, or the removal ofparabens or whatever it may be,
then all the industry has tokind of follow suit.
I believe, and it'sunfortunately more rare that
brands in and of themselves wakeup one day and say, let's just
(30:58):
go ahead and you know make thisinfinitely more expensive,
complicated to do, and we'regonna do it for the benefit of
society and humanity.
Because there's an idea therethat it's at odds with business
and you know, money money interms of this podcast is
concerned, or at least in thatway.
But the truth of it is, is thatI think it's a mixture of both
(31:21):
of those things.
You have to have the ability todo what's best for consumers,
what's best for humanity, be atrendsetter, and then figure out
a way to also be able to make itstill be profitable.
And it's that balancing act, Ithink, that really allows you to
advance within an industry orfield.
Like I think about groups likeBen and Jerry's, right?
(31:44):
And you know, who were pioneersin the realm of ice cream.
That's just like, no, I want icecream.
I shouldn't have said that.
I shouldn't have said it rightaround lunchtime.
I shouldn't have said it.
I'm having ice cream for lunch.
Um, but you know, naturalingredients, you know, locally
sourced milks, this, that, andthe other, whatever they were
doing at the time in differentways, you know, trend setting
(32:06):
and then creating an entiremarket or industry around
something like that.
Um, same thing goes with, youknow, paper-related products, or
when uh, you know, some of thelarge multi-conglomerates in
spirits industry said no moreplastic.
And they just said we're justnot gonna use plastic bottles
anymore because it's ending upin our oceans, and we're gonna
take a mandate that even thoughit's more expensive, we're gonna
(32:28):
only do glass or paper-relatedpackaging, or otherwise that's
recyclable and we're not gonnado plastic anymore.
And, you know, was that formoney?
Was that because they're reallytrying to be the trend center in
the larger industry?
You know, there's a balancingact, you know, on where and how.
I think too that unfortunatelywe try to make these micro moves
(32:50):
in our daily lives, as far aslike what we feed and what we're
what things are packaged and soforth, and try to remove as many
taxas as we can.
But the problem that we face isthat the rest of the world out
here is not making as big of aconscious effort.
And I think that that is reallywhere we have to be looking at
policy, we have to be looking atgovernment, what is the real
(33:13):
role, why are we moving towardscertain shifts and changes?
And that's somewhere where Ithink that we as just members of
society are not as vested in howwe make the bigger impact rather
than just what we're buying inthe supermarket that day, or if,
you know, our product is made oforganic corn.
SPEAKER_04 (33:37):
You know?
SPEAKER_02 (33:37):
And what good is it if your product is made of
organic corn and you walk outand the air pollution is like,
you know, 10 times what it needsto be?
Or even a perfect example, youknow, I I I go out and in New
York and I go to the water inthe summertime and everything
else.
I just found out yesterday thata lot of the natural waters and
like uh bays around where I amuh are all infested with
(34:00):
flesh-eating bacteria.
SPEAKER_00 (34:02):
I saw that news too.
SPEAKER_02 (34:03):
20% chance of death if you're in if you're you know
touching these things orwhatever, uh whatever it is.
And why is that why did thathappen?
And when you look at it, it'sbecause of government and it's
because of infrastructure andopen cesspools and things that
generate the high levels ofnitrogen in our bodies of water,
(34:24):
and because of that now,shellfish is at risk, right?
And we we live in an area whereyou know shellfish and and
seafood and things is a bigthing.
That's all at risk.
What about the jobs of thepeople that are involved with
that?
What about just people justwanting to enjoy the water and
stuff with their kids?
So we can eat all the organiccorn we want to eat, but at the
end of the day, we gotflesh-eating bacteria.
(34:46):
What are you doing about that?
And that's a huge deal.
So, you know, I don't know.
It's this balancing, I think.
SPEAKER_00 (34:52):
Yeah, I mean, it's how the world's made, right?
You have to take the good andthe bad.
Yes, and yes, right in order tostill be US, we're consumers, we
love uh products.
SPEAKER_02 (35:03):
Yes, we do.
SPEAKER_00 (35:03):
Although my friend Peter Tuckman, the Einstein of
Wall Street always says, buystock, not stuff.
I have to say I love stuff.
SPEAKER_02 (35:11):
Yeah, I know.
We all love stuff.
SPEAKER_00 (35:13):
So I do I do love to buy stuff and and obviously um
finding the brains thatcorrelate or you relate to the
most, yes, uh, and you're theclose closest to the most.
Before we wrap up ourconversation, I wanted to hear
more where we can find out aboutthe Atlas Network.
Yes.
And if someone wanted to start abusiness with a product, um, how
(35:38):
how they go about it?
SPEAKER_02 (35:39):
Sure.
So, I mean, our website istheatlasnetwork.com, pretty
easy.
Theatlasnetwork.com.
Uh, if somebody wanted to get intouch, it's theatlasnetwork.com
forward slash connect.
Um, and we have a bunch ofplaces where people can come in
and tell us about their idea andwhat they're trying to do and
how to work and so on.
If anybody wanted to reach outto me, because I do a lot of uh
(36:02):
you know fall leadership side ofthings like you do as well, it's
just KareemKrefori.com orKareemKfori.com forward slash
connect in that way.
And you know, if somebody reallywanted to generate or do a new
business, I think the key is isto first start with a question.
And the question is why doessociety need this?
(36:26):
Because the biggest enemy ofstarting a new company is an
entrepreneur who's blind toconsumer behaviors or needs and
just says, I want to make thisbecause I want to make it, or I
want to make it because of thefact that I think it's cool.
The truth of it is that ifyou're trying to do a business
and not a hobby, it's not aboutwhat you think.
(36:47):
It's about what the industrythinks.
So you have to look at whosecompetitors and why the industry
is trending or shifting.
And yes, if you're makingsomething that's never been done
before, that's kind of hard totell.
But at least there's some levelsof consumer behavior that can
maybe give you somejustifications or interest that
there's an interest in thiscategory in this area, but there
isn't a solution yet.
(37:08):
So you start with this generalidea of why people need what it
is that you're trying to do.
And then the next part of thatis then figuring out how you're
gonna do it and where you'regonna do it, only who you're
gonna do it.
And I would tell you that, andI've made this mistake a hundred
times, like every otherentrepreneur has, is we roll up
(37:28):
our sleeves and we say, okay,we're just gonna do it all.
And if I was to go back in time,all of those times that I said
that, and I can say to myself,it may cost me 10% more or 20%
more, but if I work with peoplewho can do this every day and
can lessen the chances of theheadache, get it to the market
faster, do it in a dependablemanner, and so on, that's what I
(37:52):
would tell myself, you know, togo back in time and to do that
in those ways.
And that's what we try to do forbrands and companies to say,
you're not in an alone.
There are resources that existthat can help you to take
advantage of the things that youdon't even know or see.
Sometimes we have entrepreneursthat come through the door and
they say, I want to make itexactly like this.
(38:12):
We open it up to a panel of,let's say, two or three
suppliers, and the supplierscome back with new ideas and new
ways to do it and that are notjust cost-effective and more
efficient or unique in conceptand thought.
We share those ideas from theentrepreneurs and the
entrepreneurs who nine times outof ten say, Oh, yeah, let's do
it that way.
Like what they may have beenthinking about this one way to
(38:34):
do it for 10 years, and it is anidea under their pillow, and
then just with one conversation,you're like, oh yeah, I didn't
even know that.
It's just it's umentrepreneurial blindness.
So you got to find the rightpartners.
And when you find the rightpartners, then it's about
execution.
That once you get these productsand you know that there's a need
for it and an interest, you havetrusted partners.
(38:54):
How are you gonna then build themarket?
And that's focusing in on, youknow, the sales, the marketing,
the presentation, and things ofthat nature.
And look for strategicpartnerships.
That's another big mistake Ithink that a lot of
entrepreneurs make when theysay, I'm not gonna tell anybody
about my idea.
I don't want to share the piewith anybody, I just want to do
me.
Sometimes it's great to sharethe pie with a lot of people and
(39:16):
make 10% of a much bigger piethan 100% of a very small pie.
So these are kind of some of thephilosophies or ideas I would
say for an entrepreneur who'strying to do something.
SPEAKER_00 (39:26):
Yeah, these are all very valid and useful.
I actually agree with all ofthem.
That's been my entrepreneurialjourney, what I've learned.
Yes.
Karim Kafori, who was amazinghaving you.
I'm honored to have you on thepodcast and hopefully see you
soon.
Um, we'll be talking more aboutproducts and ideas and getting
uh to where the money is,because that's what we analyze
(39:48):
here with money signals and howto fit to uh to success.
Thank you so much for uhlistening and being with us.
This is the Money Signal Podcastfrom Main Street to Wall Street
with Karim Kafori and NatalSpencer.
SPEAKER_01 (40:02):
Thank you so much.
SPEAKER_00 (40:03):
Thank you.
The biggest topic in the last couple of months years
has been there for months, andthat's in relation to AI.
SPEAKER_01 (00:12):
And that's what I think we need to think about.
We need to look at and sayhistory repeats itself in both
the negative and the positivedays the last couple of years.
SPEAKER_00 (00:22):
Have you seen a shift?
SPEAKER_02 (00:23):
I've seen a mental shift, but a practical shift is
a different conversation title.
SPEAKER_00 (00:29):
Who explains the AI classified and automation in the
supply chain?
SPEAKER_02 (00:33):
Yes.
SPEAKER_00 (00:37):
What I would say, and I'll not try to parent
anybody, but the reality of itis is that welcome to the Money
Signal podcast from Main Streetto Wall Street, where I am
joined by Kareem Kafori, a verydear friend of mine, who um has
become one of my inner circleconnections um as of recent.
(01:02):
So that story to our firstoriginal meeting, which I'd love
to share with audiencelisteners.
In September uh 2025, I wasinvited to speak at the Ali
Bottle Co-Pray conference in LasVegas, where it was there were
5,000 people, there were manyspeakers.
Uh, mainstage was one of themain one of the stages, then
(01:24):
there were two other stages.
It felt like a very busy event.
Yeah.
And everyone was trying tonetwork so fast, like meeting
people, shaking hands, gettingyour car, giving your lens in
Let's Connect, what's yourInstagram?
And I think one of the onlypeople who actually took the
time to talk to me out ofinterest were you.
So I always appreciate genuineuh conversations, genuine
(01:46):
relationships, also genuine uhconnections of mind and heart.
SPEAKER_02 (01:51):
Yes, agreed.
100%.
And it's good to be here withyou, Svet, and I'm so excited
about this uh beautiful podcast.
SPEAKER_00 (01:58):
Thank you.
You've been part of thisjourney.
I feel like you've been hearingabout the podcast for so long,
ever since I started putting ittogether.
Yes, I think you know how hardit is to put together a podcast
yourself.
Yes.
Uh for our audience, uh, I'dlove to just do a quick intro.
So when I met you, and I'll doit in my own words, and again,
I'd love to hear more about you.
Sure.
Um, so we don't have ateleprompter, so I hate uh
(02:22):
reading anything.
I on purpose just because I'dlike to keep it more
conversational.
But when I met you in Vegas, oneof the first things you told me
was, hi, my name is Corrine, andI'm in supply chain.
And this is just a genuine,obviously, me sharing my
thoughts.
And I thought, oh, supply chain,that sounds interesting, but
supply chain is so vast and sovague in terms of what exactly
(02:45):
you could be doing.
And as I got to know you more, Iactually realized that you
basically do literally the vastand vague meaning of supply
chain, which is that you helpinventors, careers, brand
owners, and anyone who has anyidea with the whole process of
(03:06):
manufacturing, identifying themanufacturers, bringing the
product to life, bringing theproduct to the US, if it's
manufactured outside of the US,and you have a massive wide
knowledge around all thelegalities and the processes
that come with bulk net.
So that's my version of yourintroduction.
(03:27):
Uh, but I'd love to hear if youwere to describe and introduce
yourself, who is Korean Fort?
SPEAKER_02 (03:33):
I would say, first of all, that I'm a problem
solver.
I would say I'm an optimist.
I'm definitely a person wholooks to create solutions.
And I always say when we talkabout what we do that we're a
global supply chain solutionsprovider, because in the end of
the day, supply chain has a lotof issues and it uh is a
(03:54):
challenge consistently.
There are these controllable anduncontrollable things that you
can actively manage and somedays can't manage.
Right.
And the idea there is that youcan't avoid disruptions.
So to really be disruption proofis to understand that there will
be disruptions and how are yougoing to get ahead of that?
(04:14):
How are you gonna havecontingency plans and think
about the worst case scenariosand will your business still be
able to survive?
So, you know, you said a verynice intro for me.
So I feel like I don't even haveto say anything, but I will say
something, you know, uh shortabout it is that, you know, my
hope and the goal of my company,and why I can call it the Atlas
(04:35):
Network, which is Atlas, youknow, carrying the birth on his
shoulders, is to remediate andremove those barriers and those
headaches for the clients uh sothat they can thrive and grow
and scale.
So that they don't have to befearful that are my goods going
to get there on time?
Are they going to be uhwell-managed?
(04:56):
Am I going to go out of businessbecause of whatever disruption
can and does happen?
SPEAKER_04 (05:01):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (05:01):
And that they have a trusted entity to help them to
do that.
Small to mid-sized businessesare definitely the forte and the
sweet spot because they're notchasing the pennies and the
dollars, but actually see, theycan understand that if it costs
an extra 10 or 20 cents, whatsaves them$5 and headaches or
could blow up their businessentirely if not well managed,
(05:24):
that it's well worth it.
Whereas larger companies, wework with them too, but the
difference there is that they'reable to build their own
infrastructures, they're able tobuild their own networks.
And so it's easy for them tokind of pivot or change if
something isn't working outexactly the way they want it to.
Um, so it's a little bit more ofa fickle relationship when it
comes to the larger scaleentities.
(05:44):
So we tend to focus a lot onsmaller, mid-sized businesses,
and like I said, turning ideasinto reality.
That's the focus.
Uh businesses come through thedoor and they're in various, you
know, um, areas of theirbusiness life cycle.
They are either, you know, withan idea on a napkin, or they
are, you know, somewhatestablished but are having
(06:05):
problems.
They're looking foropportunities, or in the terms
of like, let's say, recentpandemic or tariff situations,
they're looking foralternatives, where to go in the
world, or how to cost-engineersomething, or make it for less,
or different materials, how tobreak the mold.
And we try to let them connectthose dots that they themselves
(06:25):
don't see.
And in doing so, we developthese long-term relationships
that go for years upon yearsupon years.
Because when you build a trustedsupply chain, you really just
want to have it continue goingand continue building and
developing and being managed.
And that's what we try to dofrom science too.
So it's it's very interesting.
It's a it's a long life cycle,like as you said, that starts
(06:48):
with ideas and partner andfactory selection,
manufacturing, quality control,shipping and logistics, import,
customs clearance, trucking,warehousing, delivery,
fulfillment, reordering, andthen back through again.
For some clients, we can doeverything I just said.
For some clients, it's half orit's a certain part.
(07:10):
And it really just depends uponwhere you sort of sit the
meeting question.
So that's it.
SPEAKER_00 (07:15):
Well, that's it.
It's it's a very complicated uhprocess.
And I love the name of thebusiness itself, Atlas Network.
Atlas, as you mentioned, isobviously carrying the globe.
Because you you do travel allaround the globe when it comes
to producing and manufacturing.
Yes.
(07:35):
Um, question for you is in thebusiness, so you've been in the
industry for a while.
Within the last couple of years,have you seen the shift from
manufacturing and up from othercountries, whether they're China
or somewhere else, towards theUS?
And I asked that question.
It's a little bit of umobviously political slash um,
(07:57):
you know, we're in the tariffera, sure, but also we're in the
era of America first, right?
SPEAKER_04 (08:03):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (08:03):
So have you really seen a shift in those last few
years that has movedmanufacturing more towards the
US?
SPEAKER_02 (08:11):
I've seen a mental shift, but a practical shift is
a different conversationentirely.
So the mental shift is hey, canwe make this in other places in
the world that are not Asia?
Could we go to Mexico, can we goto the United States, or do
things in Canada, Europe,whatever it may be?
But the unfortunate side is nota full kind of end-to-end
(08:37):
solution, which really allowsyou to have probably all the
composite bells and whistles andcost structures and efficiencies
and so forth as some of theexisting manufacturing networks
in a world.
So the mentality may be there,but what lags behind there by
you know a decade, possibly asmuch as a decade, is the
(08:59):
capability to fully um producethose results or to do it at
scale that a business couldstill survive at.
You know, we could say, let'smove it from point A to point B.
But if at point B, even thoughthey can make it, they can only
have an output of a tenth ofwhat your market needs.
Then you basically create ascenario of scarcity.
The cost of your prices have togo up because you're only able
(09:22):
to produce a certain amount ofunits, and then you have a major
challenge there.
And that's what really camedown, I think, with the whole
scenario with tariffs.
What people were looking at, youknow, how are we gonna manage
this and deal with this?
And what the vast majority ofcompanies ended up doing is not
moving.
They just said, you know what,when I look at the whole
equation, even though it's gonnacost us or our customers more,
(09:44):
or we'll absorb some, or thesupplier will absorb some, or
the customer will absorb some,it doesn't make sense
technically, logistically,output-wise, quality-wise, to
move the whole operation tosomewhere else, where again,
saving 50 cents may end upcausing you, you know, five
dollars in tops because they maynot have the skilled workforce,
(10:07):
they may not have the technologythat's needed, they may not have
the output and the resources andso on and so forth.
Uh, so for all of those reasons,it's a it's always a great idea
to promote doing more businessin the local economy or domestic
economy because it strengthensthe you know the domestic side
of things.
But is it feasible?
(10:28):
Some industries I would say moreso than others.
Things like that are moremechanized.
For example, to make paperproducts engagement, I mean make
paper products in the UnitedStates where it's just done by
machine either way.
Pretty much a simple idea.
The inputs are there, you've gotpulk, you've got other things
that are, you know, readilyavailable.
So it would work out okay.
(10:50):
But for other products where youdon't have the materials, you
have to import those in, and youdon't have the labor who knows
what to do, what to do, and youdon't have the machinery to
detect someone, then the cost ofthat product could go up by
five, ten, a hundred times whereit is somewhere else in the
world.
So it will make a difference.
And then the other thing I thinkthat will create, let's say, the
ability to be more domestic in ashorter time horizon will be the
(11:13):
use of automation and the use ofmore tech that is less reliant
upon skills and workforces andis more reliant upon automation
and robotics.
So as that rises up, I thinkthat's where we will get more
and more opportunities indomestic work.
SPEAKER_00 (11:29):
Nah, thank you.
Got straight to my actually nextquestion.
Thank you so much for the greatexplanation.
Sure.
So talking about automation androbotics, I would love to hear
your thought on and your opinionon who is winning the
AI/robotics and automation gamein the supply chain.
I analyze consumer data all thetime.
I can tell you anything you wantabout any consumer, any topic,
(11:51):
any language, anywhere in theworld.
The big topics in the last 12months for consumers have been
tariffs, yeah, employment, yes,and that's in relation to AI and
AI taking jobs away.
So automation taking jobs away.
Sure.
In your field, there's severalthings that you mentioned that
(12:12):
I'm very intrigued by.
The first one was the scalepiece, but then on the robotics
and AI piece, I keep on seeingcomments from consumers and I
keep on reading the news andhearing again from in the news
from sources, uh, claims thatthe US is obviously like we're
first in the AI roboticsautomation game.
In the supply chain uh field,which we just talked about, you
(12:36):
mentioned that obviously wecan't always produce everything
at mass scale.
So does that mean that the UStechnically doesn't have the
capacity because of lack of AIautomation or that we're behind?
Or is it really does it reallyhave to do with the fact that
maybe other manufacturers abroaduh either have better automation
(12:57):
or maybe they just have thebetter scale, or both?
SPEAKER_02 (13:00):
I think it's both.
And I think it's definitely thatthere are parts of the world
that have better automation umthan we have here because their
focus has been on being amanufacturing nation.
Whereas this is a new idea forus.
You know, we haven't beenthinking about being a
manufacturing nation in a in 70years.
(13:20):
You know, we're so far away fromthose assembly lines where we
were manufacturing steel and youknow, all of these products
domestically and leading theworld in kind of the industrial
revolution that really wasoccurring here, you know, and
and in that way, even more so,then tariffs were being put on
to dissuade international trade.
(13:40):
We were trying to keepeverything here, we weren't
trying to put anything away.
But as we had changes that occurhere in the US, especially with
regards like PPA regulations andother kinds of legal um, you
know, areas of concern aroundmanufacturing and quality of
life and labor force and thingsof that nature, and we shipped
(14:02):
jobs away and shippedcapabilities away, um, we lost
that ability to scale thosethings because we said we're
just not going to be amanufacturing nation anymore.
Um why did that happen?
We could say it was because ofglobalization, we could say
because it was of greed, wecould say it was because of uh
being more protective of ourown, you know, environment in
(14:26):
this part of the world, althoughwe all know what happens on the
other side of the planet stillimpacts us today, right?
We understand that with climatechange and globalization and the
rest of it.
Um but the truth of it is that Ido think that with AI and
automation, back to yourconversation about fears and
jobs and so on and so forth.
I believe that we're goingtowards an era of expansive
(14:50):
growth and that there's gonna bea whole host of jobs and
industries, but they're new jobsand they're new industries.
They're not the the jobs as weknow them today.
And that is where the dynamicshift is going to happen, where
people are either gonna have toget with the program or not get
with the program.
(15:11):
And we've seen that with anyother technological revolution.
I mean, just think about it.
There was a time where there washorses and bugboons, right?
And then all of a sudden someonesaid, Hey, you know what?
There's this new thing.
It's called the automobile.
So what happened to the guy whowas making horses and bugoons?
Well, he went out of business,but instead of one guy making
the buggies, now you've got ahundred people making cars.
(15:33):
Same thing goes with the nextinnovation, which was, let's
say, the airplane.
And what ended up happening withthere?
Now you've got an industry ofpeople who are pilots and
stewards and airports and thecommerce that comes with that,
and so on and so forth.
So with each of these differentinnovations and technology, same
thing with a computer, right?
I mean, you and I, or at leastI'm gonna say I saw the
(15:56):
development of the computer.
You know, I saw the verybeginnings of it, I saw the
development of cell phones.
Well, how much business has beengenerated because of the world
of cell phones in the past 10,20, 30 years?
So if we all sat around andsaid, oh, it's gonna take away
jobs because people aren't gonnalike use the landlines anymore.
You know, we and that's what Ithink we need to think about.
(16:18):
We need to look back and sayhistory repeats itself in both
the negative and the positives.
So if we look at it in terms ofpositives, we say breakthrough
technologies can createindustries which create
opportunity, employment, andeconomic development.
And that's how we have to lookat things like automation,
robotics, and AI, and how thefuture is gonna look.
(16:39):
Not so much that we're afraidabout jobs that are gonna get
lost, but we should be excitedabout the jobs that are gonna be
gained.
That to my idea of being anoptimist.
SPEAKER_00 (16:48):
Which we should be at all times.
Yeah.
I And that's not a politicalidea.
SPEAKER_02 (16:52):
That that's just an economics technological idea,
very non-political.
Even though I grew up in DCarea.
SPEAKER_00 (16:58):
But I'm very non-political.
Well, that's good.
We like to keep it non-politicalhere, although obviously
politics is involved in everyaspect of our lives.
I love what you said about theboogeing and obviously the horse
and the people who went toproduce cars.
(17:19):
I feel like we see a shift goingback to the regular um jobs that
once disappeared, not fullyextinct, but for example,
carpenters and plumbers.
SPEAKER_02 (17:31):
Yes, trades.
SPEAKER_00 (17:32):
The trades and trade schools, um, at least in what
I've seen uh with from parentconversations, we analyze
multiple segments of audiencesfor variety of our customers.
Sure.
And the parent conversation,some of the most interesting
discussions have been on socialmedia that parents are sending
their kids to trade schools uhbecause of that AI shit and AI
(17:56):
and boo and the fact thatparents are scared that those
jobs will be easily replaceableby automation and robotics.
So anything that has to do withobviously your marketing, your
just accounting, even finance,some of these jobs they fear are
going to be replaced.
But trade school, for example,plumbing and your plumbers and
(18:19):
your carpenters, and again yourroof, roofers and construction
are basically the jobs that uhthere's a notable shift that
I've seen in conversation onsocial media among parents.
So I find that so interesting tohear.
SPEAKER_02 (18:35):
It is, it is interesting, but I would say,
and you know, I'm not trying toparent anybody, but the reality
of it is that I think that we doour future generation a
disservice by kind of being thehorse with the blinders on.
And I feel like by taking thatdecision to almost be like
anti-development,anti-technology, and say, let's
(18:57):
just like go backwards in time,is a protective stance around,
let's say, future employment andgrowth and being able to survive
in this world.
But it's a disservice becauseit's not, again, the way of
development.
So should people have more orshould there be more emphasis on
trades and trade schools?
(19:18):
Sure, there could be, but forthe right reasons, not because
we're fearful.
It should be because there's aneed for that.
And at the same time, we stillhave an understanding of what's
happening in the world as atechnology and so on, because
it's only a matter of timebefore tech will be infused into
the world of plumbing in someway, or into the world of
(19:39):
roofing in some way.
And guess what?
Those people who have becomemasters of roofing or plumbing
and so on will need to take thatknowledge set and incorporate it
with what's the best oftechnology and combine those
two.
And that will be for the benefitof humanity.
All of these things that we doshould all be with that kind of
(20:00):
a lens or that idea in mind ofhow can we most benefit the
global economy?
How can we both most benefithumanity?
And if that's technological orthat's trades, or that's you
know, just being good to eachother, whatever it may be.
It's all about that kind ofimpact that we need to do with
what we do in our lives and inour work and our relationships
(20:23):
and everything else.
So, you know, I I'm not a fan oflet's just put a bunch of people
in this industry because we'refearful of what's coming.
I'm not a fan of that at all.
I think it's anti-progress.
SPEAKER_00 (20:35):
Well, it's a mixture, right?
So to understand like where isthe world going to go?
Do you think AI is going to comeinto the supply chain and like
basically cut the time of thewhole process of supply chain?
And also these, I mean, I keepon reading about now uh with the
war, like the shipments gettingdelays.
(20:56):
Yeah.
How how is AI used in the supplychain space right now?
SPEAKER_02 (21:01):
It's already being used and it's being used in
many, many different ways.
Um, you know, I do a lot of workwith Alibaba, you know that.
And we met there, right?
And I'm an ambassador ofAlibaba.
And so I was there when theyreleased the first AI sourcing
engine, which was called Axia,and it's out there right now.
And that's really unbelievablebecause let's say I'm trying to
(21:23):
build something or makesomething, you know, I would
have historically have to golooking for suppliers, maybe get
on an airplane, you know, haveback and forth broken
conversations with people, notknow what kind of business plan
I'm gonna write, when am I gonnamake samples, prototype them,
what's good, what's bad, so onand so forth.
You can push some buttons now,and a lot of that work is done
(21:46):
for you in a matter of seconds,minutes, rather than taking
months of headache and nothaving any kind of guidance and
so forth.
I mean, a platform like that canwrite a business plan for you in
two seconds.
It can find the time you cantake A picture of something
using like a Alibaba lens, andit'll show you the top five
factories in the world that makethat thing.
SPEAKER_00 (22:06):
Wow.
SPEAKER_02 (22:06):
And you and connect you to them and communicate with
them immediately.
And then it will then beprototyped within a matter of a
short period of time and show upon your doorstep and they show
their verification credentials.
So you don't have to be like, isit good or is it a bad group?
And then there's tradeassurance, which makes sure that
you're protected in that world.
SPEAKER_00 (22:24):
And so there's just it's so you don't even have to
leave your house anymore.
SPEAKER_02 (22:28):
They have to leave your house.
And then on top of it, the otherpart that's really interesting
is that you know you'd spend allthis time with design firms or
engineering firms to try to makewhat's in your brain like real
or a design or rendering, itdoes it for you too.
Why say take these five thingsand just make me something new
that combines this element, thiselement, this element, this
element, and you push a button,and then it's like, here's 30
(22:51):
mock-ups.
What do you like?
Well, well, I like that one, butit's too big, it's too short.
I want it wider here, short, andthen and then you refine it,
refine it, refine it withouteven talking to anybody.
SPEAKER_00 (23:00):
That's crazy.
SPEAKER_02 (23:01):
So the positive side of that is that you talk about
how it impacts the industry, isit gets more products to
industry quicker, which thencreates more opportunities for
product, business, employment,growth, commerce.
So in that way, AI is shorteningthe curve to get ideas into
(23:22):
reality.
That's one side.
SPEAKER_04 (23:24):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (23:25):
The other things that are happening too are in
the realm of like shipping andlogistics, looking at the most
effective routings, what gets itthere faster, what has the least
kind of carbon footprint,they're measuring those things,
uh reorder rates, inventorymanagement, warehousing and
fulfillment that are beingfacilitated via drones,
(23:46):
automated trucking, you know,all of that.
In so many ways.
From the beginnings all the wayto the last mile, the last mile
being like how the truckliterally takes your stuff from
the warehouse and puts it onyour doorstep of Amazon, right?
Um, yeah.
I mean, we're we're five to tenyears away from being able to
kind of push some buttons andnot a lot of humans being
(24:07):
involved.
SPEAKER_04 (24:08):
Wow.
SPEAKER_02 (24:08):
A lot of human impacts, a lot of other jobs
that are shifted over orchanged.
Um, but yeah, certain certainthings are gonna change.
SPEAKER_00 (24:19):
And do you think that um there's one basically
with the AI coming in?
I actually have not used Axio,although I heard several
presentations of it.
I definitely will check it out.
Do you think that with AI comingin, e-commerce is also changing
the way that we're operating asshoppers and also as sellers?
SPEAKER_02 (24:39):
Yes, I do.
I think as sellers, because ofthe fact that you're going to be
able to get access to moreefficient supply chains that
will allow you to sell more, getproducts in advance, do things
like the release of new SKUswithout taking on inventory.
Like you could go on, as I saidbefore, onto a platform, you
(24:59):
know, basically create a virtualproduct, put it out there, sell
it, hit a certain criticalnumber, and then buy the goods
and make it.
SPEAKER_04 (25:09):
Wow.
SPEAKER_02 (25:09):
So you don't even have to like make it, buy it,
store it in your garage or insome kind of a warehouse and
pray and hope that there aresales.
And that's how a lot of newe-commerce brands are doing it.
They're saying, hey, you knowwhat?
I'm not gonna buy this until Ihit a certain critical mass.
So they look to build up theirmarket.
They put out a virtual versionof the product, almost like a
(25:33):
pre-sale, if you want to say,but not call it a pre-sale.
They see what the volumes looklike when they hit a certain
margin level, then they placeyou up.
So basically, not even withtheir money, with other people's
money.
SPEAKER_00 (25:43):
Wow.
This is a money signal podcast.
We're like we like liberty.
Other people's money.
SPEAKER_02 (25:50):
OPM, that's what it is.
SPEAKER_00 (25:51):
OPM, we're gonna work in retail.
So warehousing, I mean, a lot ofthe products are built
everywhere.
US, I assume, a lot in Visa,China, other countries.
Warehousing it gets could bewith these virtual problems,
could it be done abroad or couldit be done in the US?
Like now it's especially likeshipments it was get back to the
(26:13):
fact that currently werestruggling with getting
shipments to the US because ofclosure, tariffs, closure of
specific geographic routes.
Yes.
Um, how how would warehousingtechnically work?
If you were to have the virtualproduct, you store it, you do.
SPEAKER_02 (26:29):
You don't store it.
You don't even make it until youhave certain critical mass of
orders, and then you don't storeanything.
It literally goes from thefactory floor directly to the
well, in the case of Timu,basically, and those kinds of
companies shipping directly tocustomer A, B, C, D, E, F, G,
not even to a centralizedwarehouse and so forth.
(26:50):
I see.
SPEAKER_00 (26:50):
That's very interesting.
See, I learned something new,which I love.
SPEAKER_02 (26:55):
Yeah, no, it's it it is very fascinating, and it's
it's basically this idea ofalmost kind of like not mass
production, but it's like masscustomization.
SPEAKER_00 (27:05):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (27:06):
Almost.
SPEAKER_00 (27:06):
And most of the products that you work on
varying, right?
It could be glass products, itcould be plastic.
Yeah, you know, yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (27:15):
Yeah, we've I mean through the years, I mean,
through the years, we've prettymuch done everything from baby
products to uh FDA certifiedproducts, PPE during the
pandemic, consumer packagegoods.
We do a lot in the realm of foodand beverage.
We have like 450 spirits andbeverage clients where we
manufacture all their bottlesand closures and packaging.
(27:35):
We've done machinery,large-scale machinery, AI stuff,
um, a lot of apparel, luxurygoods, watches, and golf
products, and so through youknow, more than two decades,
there's been a lot.
And the reason why is is becausethe methodology, I think, of
what of how we do it is a verysound one.
It's three pillars.
(27:56):
It's picking the right supplier,thus, the network part of our
name, the Atlas network.
We have 2,000 suppliers that arenetwork, vetted suppliers.
And then it's eyes and ears onthe ground, because you have to
have an active babysitting.
If you don't have that, thenthat's when the train goes off
the tracks pretty quick.
And then third-partyattestation, just like in the
world of you know, publicfinance where you have
(28:18):
accounting firms and auditingfirms, we bring in uh auditing
firms and QC firms to also kimpthe tires to say it's not
because the factory didn't do agood job or we didn't do a good
job, but let's just grab a groupthat's pain-defined as stakes.
Have them come in, look it over,make sure everything's good, get
a clean bill of health.
And in this mechanism, that'swhy you can then end up making a
(28:40):
chair or a machine or whateverelse it is, because you've got
the right supplier, the rightlayer of sort of management and
babysitting, and then a rightlayer of audit.
And that, I believe, is thesecret sauce to how we do what
we do pretty well.
SPEAKER_00 (28:55):
Wow.
Our our signals are businessesyou want to work, you have a
sweet spot for small and medium.
Yes.
Which is very lovely to hear asa small business owner, although
I'm in your field.
Yes, yes.
I always appreciate people whohelp uh the small guy um get
bigger.
Have you seen some kind of likea push towards organic?
Is there products organicproducts and yeah, organic
(29:19):
everything?
So I've been uh I'm a mom and Ihave two kids, and I think my
husband and I spend most of theday and night on their these new
apps where you can check likewhat's what has you know like
chemicals in it, what's toxic.
Um, I'm very intrigued to heatto see and hear, especially you
mentioned now with CPG and withfood and beverage.
(29:41):
I am working on a food andbeverage by the way project at
the moment.
Um, like how are how are thesemanufacturers and also the
companies that are hiring youguys approaching organic and
chemicals and toxins?
Is there a heightened interestfrom their side and making
obviously products safer?
(30:01):
I know there are a lot ofregulations in the US, but I'm
really not sure how does thatstart really look like, I guess,
from start to finish when youthink of you have to take into
account all the laws and theregulations, but also the
consumer at mind.
SPEAKER_02 (30:15):
Yes.
Uh I mean that's a very goodquestion.
And the truth of it is thatevery industry and every product
has sort of different mandatesthat that kind of govern that
decision.
In some cases, they're forced todo it, right?
A company or an industry isforced to maintain certain FBA
standards or whatever else itmay be.
(30:35):
And as those standards change orshift towards more uh recyclable
products or more uh naturalingredients that must be in
there, or the removal ofparabens or whatever it may be,
then all the industry has tokind of follow suit.
I believe, and it'sunfortunately more rare that
brands in and of themselves wakeup one day and say, let's just
(30:58):
go ahead and you know make thisinfinitely more expensive,
complicated to do, and we'regonna do it for the benefit of
society and humanity.
Because there's an idea therethat it's at odds with business
and you know, money money interms of this podcast is
concerned, or at least in thatway.
But the truth of it is, is thatI think it's a mixture of both
(31:21):
of those things.
You have to have the ability todo what's best for consumers,
what's best for humanity, be atrendsetter, and then figure out
a way to also be able to make itstill be profitable.
And it's that balancing act, Ithink, that really allows you to
advance within an industry orfield.
Like I think about groups likeBen and Jerry's, right?
(31:44):
And you know, who were pioneersin the realm of ice cream.
That's just like, no, I want icecream.
I shouldn't have said that.
I shouldn't have said it rightaround lunchtime.
I shouldn't have said it.
I'm having ice cream for lunch.
Um, but you know, naturalingredients, you know, locally
sourced milks, this, that, andthe other, whatever they were
doing at the time in differentways, you know, trend setting
(32:06):
and then creating an entiremarket or industry around
something like that.
Um, same thing goes with, youknow, paper-related products, or
when uh, you know, some of thelarge multi-conglomerates in
spirits industry said no moreplastic.
And they just said we're justnot gonna use plastic bottles
anymore because it's ending upin our oceans, and we're gonna
take a mandate that even thoughit's more expensive, we're gonna
(32:28):
only do glass or paper-relatedpackaging, or otherwise that's
recyclable and we're not gonnado plastic anymore.
And, you know, was that formoney?
Was that because they're reallytrying to be the trend center in
the larger industry?
You know, there's a balancingact, you know, on where and how.
I think too that unfortunatelywe try to make these micro moves
(32:50):
in our daily lives, as far aslike what we feed and what we're
what things are packaged and soforth, and try to remove as many
taxas as we can.
But the problem that we face isthat the rest of the world out
here is not making as big of aconscious effort.
And I think that that is reallywhere we have to be looking at
policy, we have to be looking atgovernment, what is the real
(33:13):
role, why are we moving towardscertain shifts and changes?
And that's somewhere where Ithink that we as just members of
society are not as vested in howwe make the bigger impact rather
than just what we're buying inthe supermarket that day, or if,
you know, our product is made oforganic corn.
SPEAKER_04 (33:37):
You know?
SPEAKER_02 (33:37):
And what good is it if your product is made of
organic corn and you walk outand the air pollution is like,
you know, 10 times what it needsto be?
Or even a perfect example, youknow, I I I go out and in New
York and I go to the water inthe summertime and everything
else.
I just found out yesterday thata lot of the natural waters and
like uh bays around where I amuh are all infested with
(34:00):
flesh-eating bacteria.
SPEAKER_00 (34:02):
I saw that news too.
SPEAKER_02 (34:03):
20% chance of death if you're in if you're you know
touching these things orwhatever, uh whatever it is.
And why is that why did thathappen?
And when you look at it, it'sbecause of government and it's
because of infrastructure andopen cesspools and things that
generate the high levels ofnitrogen in our bodies of water,
(34:24):
and because of that now,shellfish is at risk, right?
And we we live in an area whereyou know shellfish and and
seafood and things is a bigthing.
That's all at risk.
What about the jobs of thepeople that are involved with
that?
What about just people justwanting to enjoy the water and
stuff with their kids?
So we can eat all the organiccorn we want to eat, but at the
end of the day, we gotflesh-eating bacteria.
(34:46):
What are you doing about that?
And that's a huge deal.
So, you know, I don't know.
It's this balancing, I think.
SPEAKER_00 (34:52):
Yeah, I mean, it's how the world's made, right?
You have to take the good andthe bad.
Yes, and yes, right in order tostill be US, we're consumers, we
love uh products.
SPEAKER_02 (35:03):
Yes, we do.
SPEAKER_00 (35:03):
Although my friend Peter Tuckman, the Einstein of
Wall Street always says, buystock, not stuff.
I have to say I love stuff.
SPEAKER_02 (35:11):
Yeah, I know.
We all love stuff.
SPEAKER_00 (35:13):
So I do I do love to buy stuff and and obviously um
finding the brains thatcorrelate or you relate to the
most, yes, uh, and you're theclose closest to the most.
Before we wrap up ourconversation, I wanted to hear
more where we can find out aboutthe Atlas Network.
Yes.
And if someone wanted to start abusiness with a product, um, how
(35:38):
how they go about it?
SPEAKER_02 (35:39):
Sure.
So, I mean, our website istheatlasnetwork.com, pretty
easy.
Theatlasnetwork.com.
Uh, if somebody wanted to get intouch, it's theatlasnetwork.com
forward slash connect.
Um, and we have a bunch ofplaces where people can come in
and tell us about their idea andwhat they're trying to do and
how to work and so on.
If anybody wanted to reach outto me, because I do a lot of uh
(36:02):
you know fall leadership side ofthings like you do as well, it's
just KareemKrefori.com orKareemKfori.com forward slash
connect in that way.
And you know, if somebody reallywanted to generate or do a new
business, I think the key is isto first start with a question.
And the question is why doessociety need this?
(36:26):
Because the biggest enemy ofstarting a new company is an
entrepreneur who's blind toconsumer behaviors or needs and
just says, I want to make thisbecause I want to make it, or I
want to make it because of thefact that I think it's cool.
The truth of it is that ifyou're trying to do a business
and not a hobby, it's not aboutwhat you think.
(36:47):
It's about what the industrythinks.
So you have to look at whosecompetitors and why the industry
is trending or shifting.
And yes, if you're makingsomething that's never been done
before, that's kind of hard totell.
But at least there's some levelsof consumer behavior that can
maybe give you somejustifications or interest that
there's an interest in thiscategory in this area, but there
isn't a solution yet.
(37:08):
So you start with this generalidea of why people need what it
is that you're trying to do.
And then the next part of thatis then figuring out how you're
gonna do it and where you'regonna do it, only who you're
gonna do it.
And I would tell you that, andI've made this mistake a hundred
times, like every otherentrepreneur has, is we roll up
(37:28):
our sleeves and we say, okay,we're just gonna do it all.
And if I was to go back in time,all of those times that I said
that, and I can say to myself,it may cost me 10% more or 20%
more, but if I work with peoplewho can do this every day and
can lessen the chances of theheadache, get it to the market
faster, do it in a dependablemanner, and so on, that's what I
(37:52):
would tell myself, you know, togo back in time and to do that
in those ways.
And that's what we try to do forbrands and companies to say,
you're not in an alone.
There are resources that existthat can help you to take
advantage of the things that youdon't even know or see.
Sometimes we have entrepreneursthat come through the door and
they say, I want to make itexactly like this.
(38:12):
We open it up to a panel of,let's say, two or three
suppliers, and the supplierscome back with new ideas and new
ways to do it and that are notjust cost-effective and more
efficient or unique in conceptand thought.
We share those ideas from theentrepreneurs and the
entrepreneurs who nine times outof ten say, Oh, yeah, let's do
it that way.
Like what they may have beenthinking about this one way to
(38:34):
do it for 10 years, and it is anidea under their pillow, and
then just with one conversation,you're like, oh yeah, I didn't
even know that.
It's just it's umentrepreneurial blindness.
So you got to find the rightpartners.
And when you find the rightpartners, then it's about
execution.
That once you get these productsand you know that there's a need
for it and an interest, you havetrusted partners.
(38:54):
How are you gonna then build themarket?
And that's focusing in on, youknow, the sales, the marketing,
the presentation, and things ofthat nature.
And look for strategicpartnerships.
That's another big mistake Ithink that a lot of
entrepreneurs make when theysay, I'm not gonna tell anybody
about my idea.
I don't want to share the piewith anybody, I just want to do
me.
Sometimes it's great to sharethe pie with a lot of people and
(39:16):
make 10% of a much bigger piethan 100% of a very small pie.
So these are kind of some of thephilosophies or ideas I would
say for an entrepreneur who'strying to do something.
SPEAKER_00 (39:26):
Yeah, these are all very valid and useful.
I actually agree with all ofthem.
That's been my entrepreneurialjourney, what I've learned.
Yes.
Karim Kafori, who was amazinghaving you.
I'm honored to have you on thepodcast and hopefully see you
soon.
Um, we'll be talking more aboutproducts and ideas and getting
uh to where the money is,because that's what we analyze
(39:48):
here with money signals and howto fit to uh to success.
Thank you so much for uhlistening and being with us.
This is the Money Signal Podcastfrom Main Street to Wall Street
with Karim Kafori and NatalSpencer.
SPEAKER_01 (40:02):
Thank you so much.
SPEAKER_00 (40:03):
Thank you.
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