July 21, 2026 • 48 mins
Today on the show I speak with Steve Vai Drummer - Jeremy Colson. In addition to Jeremy's work with Vai, he has also worked with acts/artists like - Billy Idol, Sebastian Bach, Marty Friedman and Michael Schenker - to name just a few.Jeremy talks to me about his 1995 Guitar Center Drum Off placing, touring, what he defines as success and so much more. For more information on Jeremy Colson, please search for him across all socials (@)JeremyColson For further information on Travis Marc or 'Musicians-Mentor' website, please visit www.musicians-mentor.com As usual, thanks for checking out the channel and if you're getting anything useful from this content, please feel free to comment, like, share and subscribe, thank you. You can support this channel by - Visiting our affiliate pages with the lovely folks over at - 'EarPeace'.https://www.earpeace.com?sca_ref=11800704.qqfSYXvMI8'Soundbrenner'. https://www.soundbrenner.com (Use code TRAVISMARC-DEAL for 20% off).Big thank you to our good friends over at - 'Boom Boom Drum Pillows' for sponsoring today's episode. Make sure you check them out for the best drum dampeners and handcrafted drum accessories - via www.boomboomdrumpillows.com
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Episode Transcript
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(00:03):
Ladies and gentlemen, welcome tothe Musicians Mentor Podcast.
As usual, I'm your host, Travis Mark.
And before I get into today's introduction, please let me
introduce you once again to today's wonderful show sponsor,
Boom Boom Drum Pillows. Boom Boom Drum Pillows and
(00:23):
Dampness enhance and secure yourdrum tone with an array of
handmade products and accessories.
I'm happy to say that I'm using these products myself now, and
if I didn't believe in them, I would not talk about them on the
show. So if you're a drummer and
serious about tone, make sure you check out Boom Boom Drum
Pillows at Boom Boom Drum pillows.com.
(00:46):
And what better way to segue from a great drum product to
talking with a great drummer? Today's guest is
california-based drummer to the stars, Jeremy Coulson.
Many of you may already know of Jeremy from his years of work
with the guitar maestro himself,Steve Vai.
But in addition to his work withSteve, he has also worked with
(01:07):
artists like Billy Idol, Sebastian Bach, Marty Friedman,
and Michael Schenker. Jeremy and I've spoken before,
so I tried to adapt some of these questions so he wouldn't
be answering things I've alreadyasked him.
And as usual, he was super kind and humble and just willing to
accommodate. So I want to publicly thank him
for that and for his time. As usual, I want to thank each
(01:28):
and everyone of you for your time.
If you are getting insight that might be helping you in any way,
shape or form, please leave us arating or a view on your
preferred streaming service. Likewise, let me remind you that
I'm on YouTube now. I'm really trying to build that
Channel. So if you use YouTube as a
service, please head over to Musicians Mentor and hit that
(01:49):
subscribe button. As usual, I want to remind you
to please check out our discounted affiliate links with
the wonderful Sound Brainer company.
They make great in ear monitors and metronomic devices that make
it easy to play live and easy topractice pretty much anywhere.
And I also want to welcome to the show a new brand partnership
with the lovely folks over at Earpiece.
(02:12):
Earpiece is currently one of theleading ear plug and ear
protection manufacturers in the world.
So if you know how serious I am with protecting your hearing,
especially if you're a musician,you should totally check them
out. All the links are on the show
notes, as are all of Jeremy's links, but I think I've probably
blabbered on enough. So let's get straight into
(02:32):
today's episode. Ladies and gentlemen, please
help me welcome the one and onlyJeremy Coulson.
Well, with me on the Musicians Mentor podcast today is Drummer
to the Stars and just. World.
Class drummer, in my opinion, Jeremy Coulson.
To the listeners who might not be aware as to who Jeremy is, He
(02:55):
has played with Steve by Billy Idol, Sebastian Bach, Marty
Friedman. There's a bunch we'll get
talking about that and so much more.
But Jeremy, what I typically do is I asked my guests to give a
bit of a brief introduction as to who they are rather than me
just doing it all off the cuff because that way listeners have
(03:16):
an idea as to your mindset in today's interview.
So if you wouldn't mind, Tell the World to Jeremy Coulson is.
All right, with Jeremy Coulson. I'm from Northern California
outside of San Francisco, and I I discovered music when I was a
little kid. I got into like Ozzy Osbourne
(03:39):
was my childhood hero and he I discovered him and I just loved
all the the way that he was and,and the theatrics of of it all.
And then I started playing drumswhen I was around 10.
And but you know, I really got into what I, I was 15, I
discovered Rush and I decided toreally get into drumming in the
(04:02):
sense of, of being a drummer's drummer, like really study the
drums, study with an instructor,practice stuff, like really
getting into all that. So eventually I met a guy named
Mike Barney when I was around 1718 years old who owned a label
called Shrapnel. And he got me in touch with,
starting doing work with, with his label.
(04:25):
So I started working with a band, this progressive metal
band I was in called Dolly's Dilemma and it was kind of like
a Dream Theater style band. And then after that I, you know,
I started working with Michael Shanker and then I started
working with Marty Friedman. And then Mike Varney recommended
(04:45):
me to Steve. I, I was 26 years old and I went
down and I auditioned and I got the gig and started touring with
him kind of all over the world really.
And then in 2010 I auditioned for Billy Idol and got that gig
and I did that for a couple of years while I was doing Steve, I
(05:08):
gig. So I was kind of juggling and
I'd actually, I kind of had to make a decision.
So I stuck with Steve just 'cause I'd been with him for a
while and, and I really enjoy, you know, I've enjoyed doing the
stuff with him And so touring with him for a while and then,
you know, working with, you know, that I did best Sebastian
(05:30):
Bach's album and I said touring with him.
So just working with a lot of, alot of artists, instrumental
guitar players. For some reason, it's something
that I've, I've been even now, like when I, I record for
people, I do remote recording. And so much of the time it's,
it's a lot of times it's instrumental guitar players just
(05:52):
because they know me from VI or Marty Friedman and I love it.
You know, I enjoy it and I enjoythat I get to, you know, there's
a, there's a creative aspect of playing instrumental music that
you don't always get with singing, because with singing
you just have this chorus, verse, chorus, you know, kind of
thing. Instrumental music is different.
(06:13):
You can speak sometimes a littlebit more.
So doing that and you know, I, Iam a avid cyclist and I have
cats. I love animals and I'm pretty
laid back. I live in Southern California
(06:35):
and I am just, yeah, I bet that's about it.
So as usual with these kinds of things, there's lots of things
that I can dissect from the. I'm going to kind of try hit
heavy from the start. OK, so you mentioned auditioning
for BI, You mentioned auditioning for Billy Idol.
(06:58):
This is a bit of a weird question, but just answer as
organically as you would like. Nowadays, drumming, especially
with the invent of social media,has become such a viral thing.
Music in general, not just drumming.
It's like it's all about these viral moments.
Or at least that's what it appears to be about.
Especially from outsiders looking in.
(07:19):
They might just think, well, hey, you, you get a viral thing
and you're a star, right? I don't necessarily agree with
all of that, but what in your opinion, do you feel makes for a
good drummer? And let's try and twist it
slightly into an audition process.
Once a drummer feels comfortableand good and competent, shall we
(07:44):
say, how can they get comfortable doing auditions for
artists like Steve By or Billy Idol?
Because a lot of guys are incredibly talented and they
never go do any gigs. And now again, if you bring it
back into the theme at hand, youalmost see a lot of really
(08:07):
incredible Olympic kind of cats on Instagram and TikTok and
stuff. They've never seemed to have a
gig. And, and I get the monetized
side of that because if they getin enough views, they don't even
have to leave the house. That's great.
But how do you think being a good drummer could relate to
eventually getting auditions andeventually being comfortable at
(08:29):
those auditions to hopefully geta gig if that's what they want?
That's a great question and I want to answer it in a way where
I'm not sounding like an old elitist person That is, you
(08:52):
know, social media, you know, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Because the Instagram drummer, the social media drummer
musician is it exists now it is a thing.
And you like you said, these guys don't even have to go play.
(09:13):
They can they can make a living being Olympic Instagram
drummers. And it's fascinating to watch to
a point. But the one thing that I have
noticed with drummers that are, you know, social media stars
(09:38):
with everything like that, there's a difference between
recording yourself playing something and actually working
with other musicians, which has become a lost art.
Yeah, even with, you know, bandsthat just, you know, and I'm not
(09:59):
against that. Look, I, I work with bands that
do backing tracks. Believe me.
It's, it's not if it, if it's there to enhance.
But when you play with other people, it's not just you're
playing. Do you know how to listen?
(10:20):
Do you know how to listen to thebass player?
Do you know how to vibe with thepeople?
Do you understand, like how to push and pull the music?
Do you understand how to improvise?
You know, there's a lot of thesedrummers, younger drummers,
They're amazing drummers. But when you improvise, when
(10:43):
you're playing with other people, are you listening to
compliment what the other person's doing?
Like when I'm improvising with BI, him and I, I'm, I'm
listening to what he's doing so I can kind of cop it on the
drums. I'm not going to just OK, I'm
going to improvise and play whatever I want.
And nowadays I just see it's just like they just start going
(11:04):
like this over everything and they get a lot, you know, the,
the people get a lot of views for that.
There is something to be said for the social aspect of
auditioning. And I'll give you an example
when I got the Billy Idol and, and I, you know, I've never been
(11:26):
somebody that has tried to go out there and, and promote like,
look, I, I have had, you know, struggles in my life with drugs
and alcohol, staying sober, all of these things.
My life has been a lot of ups and downs, but I, I live for the
moment and I just, if something,if something, if I get an
(11:48):
opportunity for something, I feel like it's the, you know,
bringing me an opportunity. So like the Billy Idol thing.
I, I was living in Northern California with my parents at
the time. I wasn't looking for a gig.
And Steve Stevens called me up and he said, Hey, you know, you
won't come down and, and, and audition.
We're, we're looking for, we're looking for a drummer.
(12:09):
And this was Billy Idol and I had never played any Billy Idol
songs. So I, you know, I got the tunes
that I was going to audition with and I went in and I
practiced them and I really, I focused on the consistency with
being powerful, solid. But there's also a vibe thing
(12:30):
like I went down there and I gotinto the room, they were
smoking. I lit up a cigarette.
I fucking took my shirt off. I started playing Rebel Yell and
it was like, and I was joking and were joking around and I was
smiling and I was vibing out with everybody.
Like that is you cannot get thatfrom a teacher.
(12:51):
That is the kind of attitude. And for me, like, you know, I'm,
I, I like a lot of punk rock andI like the I like the punk rock
attitude of just like this is who I am.
And when you're confident like that, even if you don't know
particularly this the music or you don't know what you you
don't understand it all yet, if you have the attitude and you
(13:13):
can emote that, then the other people you're playing with will
feel it. And with the drummer, that's
everything because we're we're in charge of that.
Like that has to be where the heartbeat.
So the more attitude you have, and that was always the thing.
It's kind of like this, this, yeah, that kind of punk rock
mentality, regardless of what solid music it is.
(13:36):
And so when you can gel with other people, that's what I
don't see in the social media world, to answer your question.
I do have to agree and it kind of has even come further.
You mentioned remote recording earlier.
Yeah, like, you know, budgets have been cut to such a point
that remote recording is a real thing now to to be a contender
(13:59):
as a musician, you have to have some kind of way to record.
Otherwise you're not going to get that work unless you're one
of the guys who's ingrained, youknow, the Vinnies and the
Winkles and like, they, they still going to get those calls.
But yeah, man, the vibe, I I talk about vibe and chemistry a
lot because I'm a big believer. Kind of like your punk ethos
(14:21):
sort of mentality, like gangs used to have this sense of
brotherhood, chemistry, gang mentality, whatever you want to
call it. And I'm sure that still exists
in certain aspects of certain bands and certain genres.
But yeah, with the doing everything alone, you don't see
(14:45):
a lot of that, you know? And it's like, it's cool because
like you say, like, yeah, some of these dudes are just wow.
Like, I mean, every day I see something that I'm just like,
whoa, like what's? I'll watch it two or three
times. But also without trying to sound
like an old dude, I sometimes dowonder.
I'm very interested to see whereit's going to go.
(15:08):
Because like, coming up in bandsas a kid myself, you had the
opportunity and it wasn't alwayspleasant, but you had the
opportunity to be told that something was too much or too
little or not, right? And now all those critiques seem
to be coming through comments. And I don't think you can take
comments too heavy because, well, if you do that, like,
(15:32):
that's no good for your mental health, right?
Like, so it's like, it's a real strange place.
OK, well, let's keep along this train.
So Steve Stevens calls you, which is great.
Had you met Steve before? Not really.
He had seen my I did this this show, this show with with VI in
(15:54):
O four. It was the Crossroads Festival.
And there's the video that came out of it.
It's where, you know, Billy Sheehan and Tony McAlpine,
everybody's like playing and stuff.
We're out. And this song had the beat that
was, which is pretty much all the Billy Idol songs there is.
Yeah. So he saw that.
He's like, I think this, you know, so he got my number from
(16:16):
somebody else. And yeah, he just, he called and
then like three or three days later, I, I took a flight down
to, to LA. And, you know, I, I, I, I, I did
exactly what I said. I just came in there, You know,
I used to like took shirt off, you know, lit a cigarette and
let's go, let's play you guys. And it was like, you know, just
(16:42):
going into it. And that was, yeah, that was the
start of it. That's amazing.
So let's talk a little bit aboutnetworking, OK?
Because obviously having the theplatform of VI creates a
network. But before that you had to
network so that you get to know the guys from Shrapnel etcetera,
etcetera, etcetera. Again, things with networking
(17:03):
have changed because of social media.
So let's create a hypothetical situation.
New guy in town, whatever town that may be, besides he or she
wants to start getting into the music industry.
What advice would you give to that person, regardless of the
instrument that they're playing on, trying to start getting into
(17:27):
their local scene so that maybe eventually they network and meet
enough people that might broadentheir opportunities?
It's a great question. And sometimes I'll meet younger
drummers that, that, that asked about that and where we are in
(17:48):
the world now. I, I, it's, I really wish I
could give a specific answer, but I think some of it now
depends on you have to ask yourself, what do I want to do?
Do I want to get a gig? You know, do I want to get the
gig for Lady Gaga? Do I want to get you that kind
(18:11):
of like the Taylor Swift gig and, and, and go out and do
that? Do I want to be in a, a band?
Do I want to be a Instagram star?
Do I want to be a social media *?
And what, you know, what is it'skind of like going within and
(18:32):
saying, what do I really, what do I really want to do?
And sometimes you don't know, yeah.
So you have to try things out. And this is one of the the
hardest businesses there is to be in is the music business.
It's it is so disorganized. It is so flaky.
(18:59):
It will tear families apart. It will, you know, I mean, it's
it, there's so much. Well, I think, I think the tour
is all well, I don't know yet. There's so much waiting.
There's so much. Well, this might happen, but we
don't know. There's there's just, you know,
and there's not a lot of money in it.
It's really, you know, unless you're, you know, unless you get
(19:22):
in a band and get a cut, unless you're metallic or whatever,
it's, it's really you got to just you got to, for me, I like
to do a lot of different things.So like right before that we
were doing this, I'm working on this tune that I'm a remote
recording because that's one of the things I do.
That's how I make you know, And then later today I have a couple
(19:47):
lessons. So and you know, in October, I
go back, I go to Europe for likea week and 1/2 with this guitar
player I'm working with. And then I come back and.
So like, I have to, I, I do all these different things.
(20:09):
You know, it'd be nice if it was, you know, there's a lot of
people that's just like, well, how do I, how do I, how do I
make it? Yeah, I don't really, I don't
know what it is these days to make it except to just be open
(20:30):
to doing different things. Yeah, really is what it comes
down to. And there are all.
And again, I don't, I mean, there's all sorts of way there.
And, you know, you can't not saythat there's sometimes there's
just luck involved. Sometimes the right person hears
something and that does it. And you know, there are examples
(20:53):
of Instagram drummers getting really rad gigs.
Very rad gigs. Tosh.
Oh yeah, he's got some big gigs.Top the line trio.
I got Lady Gaga. And I believe he was, you know,
he's a young kid and he was likea, you know, Instagram thing.
You know, there's this other kid, this metal drummer kid
(21:16):
Luigi, I think something just, you know, insane, you know, just
crazy. Yeah, and he's in, he's in a
metal band now. So there, yeah, there's examples
of like, hey, make a video of you playing covers or playing
whatever and, and post that. That's that's part of how you
(21:39):
get gigs now. That's part of how you work.
So you have to be, you have to just constantly be doing that.
I agree. How would you define pulse or
pockets? Pocket and pulse are some are.
(22:07):
It is something that you almost can't define, but when you feel
it you know it. And when somebody is not with
the pulse or with the pocket, you absolutely feel it, you know
what I'm saying? It's a great answer dude.
(22:27):
Like it's just it's, it's like, OK, watch Steve Jordan play
drums. That's my definition of pulse
and pocket. Watch him play, watch him play,
(22:49):
and that's it. Yeah.
There it is. And that and, and, and how do
you you, how do you dissect that?
It's, it's again, it's like you can't.
It's just like it's, it's it's you just you feel it.
Yeah. And then when you watch another
person try to play that and it'sjust like you're not, you don't
(23:09):
feel that. It, it, it's very obvious.
So that's my definition. I thought that was great.
I've seen so many debates onlinelately about Pulse pocket
tightness, metronome usage, and it's really interesting because
of Facebook pages and groups. Now it's like all these
(23:30):
essential drum boards and like, wow, sometimes I definitely get
caught in the doom scroll of it all because you just like read
all these different things and no one's necessarily 100% wrong,
but but there's definitely some interesting arguments.
So I think great answer. The feel of it man is wonderful
(23:52):
one. Thing I will say because we live
in a world now where and this isalways brought up.
You know when you when you hear about bands that these this band
plays to tracks or this, but youknow it's playing with a click.
Another example is like when you, when you watch Rage Against
the Machine play, OK, you can't have you can't play that with
(24:16):
the click track. There's parts that slow down
because that's the that's the pulse.
The pocket is, is for it to slowdown.
Nowadays, there's less bands that go out and, and play like
that. There's a lot of bands that you
know, and, and there was a drummer on the platform that was
(24:37):
talking about this recently. Tommy, what's?
The time I go. Yeah, and he was saying
something really, really. I thought that was really great
because how easy it is for drummers to get replaced these
days. Because it's not.
The drummer isn't getting. The drummer isn't getting hired
for necessarily his feel. It does so many other things
(25:00):
like so they're going to pay youless and then if you say no,
they'll just get another guy because most of the time they're
playing with the click. They're going to have tracks.
That's why it's it's harder these days.
It's. It's a different model and and.
That was one of them actually, where I was just like, whoa,
there's some, there's some controversial comments going on
here, you know, and it's also, Iunderstand the mentality, right?
(25:23):
Because OK, maybe not so much now because you don't have drum
magazines anymore, really. But drum magazines and drum
tutorial DVDs and all those things would always tell you
about practice with a metronome.Like you want to be good
practice with a metronome. Hey, practice all your exercise
with metronome. Do all your rhythms metronome
try, you know, and then you reada post like that and he's
basically saying like you shouldhave your, your own feel in it.
(25:48):
And I think it got a little taken out of context because I
don't think he was trying to imply that you should never
practice with mission. I think he was just trying to
say that like get to a certain point that you can bring your
vibe, you know, But there was definitely.
Say these days that isn't going to be taken out of there's
always going to be dude, it's. It's.
(26:10):
Fascinating. You just get an opinion on
something and then everybody is everybody is now an expert.
Everybody. In fact, it's so funny you
mentioned that. I was having lunch with my wife
a little bit earlier. She works as a wedding planner,
and she saw some stuff on onlinethis morning.
And she's just like, man, I got to stop going on social media.
Like, everybody knows everythingabout everything.
(26:31):
And I was like, I try to stay away from all of that, man,
because it's like, it'll bring you down, dude.
OK. What, in your opinion, has been
the hardest part about being a career musician?
The hardest part I would say is the is the not knowing always
(27:04):
what the future is going to hold.
Not having a, you know, even if you, even these bands that even
these guys that have steady gigs, you know, in the music
business, like in a, in every, any other kind of job, you go to
a job and you apply for the job,you get the job.
(27:28):
That job gives you health insurance, dental insurance, you
know, vacation time, you know, all these things.
Now you have granted, you might have to go to an office and work
and it's, you know, not, but butyou know, you, you are taken
care of, you know, and it's not like that in the music business,
(27:49):
even if you have a big gig, it'sjust not.
The other thing is like nowadaysin the music business, like if
you have a normal job, you startoff with your salary and each
year, most likely you would learn a little bit more music
business. Not like that.
(28:10):
It can be, but there's also times where it's like, look, we
got to do this tour. The budget, here's the budget.
This is what I can pay you. I can't pay you what I paid you
before. Yeah.
And then it comes down to what'smy worth and what it, what
everything like that is. And, and so I, I, you have to
make that decision is, is playing music and doing
(28:33):
something that you love so much?Is it worth maybe not having
health insurance? Is it worth not having that
security? Is it worth leaving your family
and traveling and, and going away for a long time and coming
back not with is, you know, not with a, with a lot of money,
(28:58):
like is it worth doing that? And that's the hardest part
about it is, is, is, is, you know, really feeling that in
your heart is like, is this, is this worth it to me?
And you know, for a lot of musicians, because they have
that experience of going on stage and playing and what that
(29:21):
feeling is, it's like a drug. It's absolutely.
So you will chase that. And I see it.
I have, I have a student that, you know, is 15 years old.
His band just played at the Whiskey in LA and it was their
first show and it was awesome. And the way that they felt
afterwards, it's like once that happens, you know, I mean, I got
to, to give a weird example, butit's like a, a junk, you know,
(29:44):
somebody that shoots heroin for the first time, it's like
they're going to chase that. And so, you know, you'll end up
eating, you'll end up strugglingand losing a lot of things just
in order to be able to go do that.
So you have to have to ask, you have to ask yourself is that is
that, is that worth it? And, and that's what that's the
(30:11):
hardest thing in my page for me about the, the music, you know,
business. If you could potentially change
one thing about the music business for the better in a
positive way, what do you think you could change?
(30:38):
I don't know, maybe, you know, there being some something more
of like what the way unions are and the way, the way, you know,
with workers and stuff like that.
A way of, of providing working musicians with some more, you
know, some more security. So they can, they can continue
(31:02):
to do what they do and have someof that security like like, you
know, health insurance and things like, I don't know, just
I, I think that it's kind of like when in school, when you
know, the, the money is taken away for the music programs, you
know, it's like, why is that? And I think that sometimes it's
(31:25):
worth, I think it'd be nice if if there was more investment in
working musicians so they didn'thave to struggle as hard and
even successful ones. I mean, I've seen amazing
virtuoso, amazing musicians who play benefit concerts when they
(31:45):
get cancer because they can't pay the bills for that, you
know, amazing musicians like virtuoso players.
And then they can't, you know, they, they, they, they have to
have a benefit show in order to pay for their treatment.
And I, I wish, I, I wish there was more help with that, that,
(32:08):
that that's what I would change,yeah.
Well, on that note, medical stuff, drumming very physical,
especially the way Someone Like You play very physical.
Have you got any drumming related injuries that you'd be
happy to share with us? Yeah, I have.
(32:30):
I have a few injuries, nothing crazy.
I mean, more the injuries that I've gotten have been from from
cycling in the last few years. Like I'm, I'm really in this,
it's called gravel biking. So it's a cross between a road
bike and a mountain bike. And I really like doing that.
And it's just, it's like I like getting outside and doing all
(32:51):
that. But a year ago I was riding and
I snapped my collarbone and I broke.
I didn't just fracture it, I broke it and so I had that.
I have a metal plate and 8 screws right here.
Wow. Thankfully I healed up great.
But you know, like I have, I have bones this bone spur in my
(33:14):
big toe just from the pedal for you know, I, I like to bury the
beater in the head. I'm just one of those guys.
I like to do that. But from doing all that in my,
my toe bending like that, I had this bone spur that hurts.
So I get, I'll get cortisone shots and that nothing, you
know, major I've, I've, you know, had a little tendonitis
here at one point. But for me, I, I stay in pretty
(33:37):
good shape and I do a lot of thestretching stuff.
And I'm grateful that I had a great teacher when I was growing
up that really taught me technique about holding the
sticks and not not gripping themtoo tight to where a lot of
drummers who get injuries, you know, there's, there's, that's
(33:57):
why I'm really big with all my students.
I'm really big with with just spending that time with the
technique stuff because it will help in the end.
So away from just technique, is there any advice you could offer
drummers? I suppose really any musicians
but drummers on trying to stay healthy physically, like you
(34:19):
mentioned stretching. I know you said the cycling
thing like, you know, I get it. Everyone's got a different body
and everybody's body works different.
But yeah, you know, any, any Nuggets that you, I mean,
attention to share? Look, I have practice pads all
around my house. You know, I have my my sticks.
(34:40):
I have a practice pad always andI'm always kind of, and I have
all sometimes warm up with, withmarching sticks.
Just have your stick to kind of,you know, it's like that base
putting the doughnut on a baseball bat kind of thing.
And that helps a little bit. I like that.
But I think the whole kind of concept of, of being being loose
(35:04):
and relaxed, you know, it's likeyou see guys that do martial
arts and you see Tai chi and yousee movements like that and
it's, it flows, you know, drummers that are going to play
when their backs like this and they're just like going like
this, you know, eventually that's going to catch up.
So the more you're aware and youknow, I thought I've had, I've
(35:26):
always had to try to think aboutmy posture and I always try to
think about, you know, I'm always having the sticks in my
hands. I'm always just trying to be
loose, you know, because then it's that's such an important
thing. And the more you're on a
practice pad, the more the more you have a stick in your hand,
the more confident you are, the more you can, you can be loose
(35:47):
because it's like if you haven'tplayed in the wild and you pick
up the sticks and you're dripping tighter in there.
You know, like you can really dial in your technique if you're
always, you know, kind of practicing that.
Yeah, please correct me if I'm wrong, but I think from when I
was doing my research, you placed third in the guitar
sensor drum of spec in 95. That correct?
(36:10):
Yeah. Yeah.
OK, good. That's a great setup for my next
question. So 95 S that's 31 years ago,
which means you were drumming before then, obviously.
So talk to me about longevity. Like, again, drumming is so
physical. Phil Collins needs a wheelchair
now. The Wardy announced that he's
(36:31):
he's using a wheelchair now. Now I'm not trying to scare
people and say that every drummer is going to land up in a
wheelchair and I'm not even trying to make it just a
physical thing, but longevity inthis industry, firstly as a
drummer from a physical perspective, and secondly, the
mental games that it plays on your psyche, your mental states
(36:56):
when you're basically, I don't want to, I don't want to term it
trying to make it every day, butI saw a very interesting post
and I got to be honest, I thought it was a great way to
phrase things, but it might meanmore to me than what it to most.
It said something like being a musician or a creative
personality is essentially beingstuck in a midlife crisis your
(37:19):
entire life. Why he meant that was because
like you're constantly second guessing yourself.
You're you're second guessing your future, you're second
guessing decisions, your security, all these things.
Now I'm not trying to overload the question, but I guess if I
was trying to simplify what I'm trying to ask, how does one
(37:40):
maintain a positive attitude, especially in a career where it
is so hard to maintain longevity?
That's a great question. Yeah.
Well, I think I think creative people can have a really hard
(38:04):
time in the world. You know, when you always hear
that thing, that kind of that term tortured artist, because
creative people tend to be really hypersensitive, insecure
(38:24):
and second guessing themselves. But yet when they go perform,
those things go away and they feel validated, especially when
the people who are watching enjoy what they're, you know,
(38:46):
give applause and everything like that.
And then you get caught in that yourself esteem is based on who
you're playing with, if you're touring, if you're not what
yeah, what gig you have. And it's very easy to turning
(39:09):
greatly to self pity being a musician, being a creative
person, because most musicians are going to have low periods
where they don't have a gig, where they're not working, where
they're questioning that. And I'm not one of those.
(39:33):
You know, there's a lot of people on social media now that
are just very, you know, like this whole alpha male thing of
like, you got to grind, bro, yougot to get up, you know, you got
to do it. You know, you got to do this.
And I'm not really into that. I get to just because I, I
(39:55):
don't, I don't, I don't have that personality, you know, but
there is this thing of everybody's an entrepreneur now.
Like I'm just entrepreneur. You like, you got to get up and
everybody's got advice. Like all of a sudden everybody's
going to medical school and theyknow how to do everything.
So. For me, the things that I have
found that have that have helped, like is my, the
(40:20):
spiritual side of my life, you know, meditation and
discovering, discovering different people who talk about,
you know, being present because a musician is constantly
thinking about when's the next tour?
When's the next gig? Am I going to get this?
(40:41):
You're constantly stuck in that.And so you can't, you know, when
you're playing, when you're performing, you're in the moment
'cause you're, it's like it's right there.
But then that's over. And then you go into this low.
And that was my problem in my life with substance abuse and
the highs and lows of touring. I'd be on a bus.
You go tour for three months, you're on a bus and you don't
(41:05):
have any responsibility except to wake up, go to soundtrack,
play the show. And then you get to laugh with
your friends and you're having agood time, everything like that.
And then you come home. And I, I never knew how to, to
adapt back to being home. And then I just wanted to go
back out on the road. So when I would get home, I
would, you know, at, at one point I was going, you know, I
(41:27):
went deep into drugs and alcoholand I, I hit a low that was
needed for myself where I got out of it and I got clean and
sober and I, I kind of turned mylife around and decided to live
differently than, than the way that I was living.
And now what's going to happen in the future is not as
(41:50):
important to me is as I look at like today I'm working on this
song and I'm going to record next Tuesday.
I'm talking to you about drums. I love drums.
I got a few students a little bit later like that's.
I went for AII, rode almost 50 miles this morning on my.
(42:11):
Bike good for you. Yeah, so like what?
What am I? This is, this is, this is
perfect. And I'm clean and sober and I,
I'm, I'm aware and I, I'm trusted and people I, I can be
relied upon like that's, that's perfect.
I don't anything more than that because financially I'm OK.
(42:35):
Everything's going to be taken care of.
That is that's what's most important as opposed to being
like, OK, I got to, I got to geton, I got to, I got to make some
calls. I got to try.
I got to try to find this next gig.
I got, I got to put myself out there.
You get into that mindset and I'm just not, that's not who I
am. I like to just be, just be.
(42:56):
The more present that I can be, the more amazing things happen
to be coming into my life. I'm grateful for that.
Well, you may have just answeredmy next question, but I'm going
to ask it anyway in case you want to add anything at this
point in your career. Big tours, big artists.
Firstly, well done on sobriety. That's incredible.
(43:19):
What do you define as success? Some people would say, like to
me, success is getting paid to do what you love and I I don't
That's not what I define successas.
(43:42):
To me, success is to wake up andto be able to be grateful for
the things that you have and to not be regretful about what you
(44:07):
didn't get and to not be concerned about what you want,
but to be right in. The middle, yeah.
And just to be happy with, with,with what you have.
And like I just said, for me, what today is, is 100% success.
(44:30):
Like I said, I got to go for, I got to go for a, a ride.
I'm working on some drum stuff. I'm talking to you.
I have some students that I workwith.
That's to be, for me, a success.It's great, man.
Jeremy, last question, what do you think at this point in your
(44:52):
life, especially in regards to music, has either been the best
piece of advice you've ever received?
Or if you can't think of a specific piece of advice that
you've received, what do you think is something you've
learned along your own journey that might serve as good advice
to another musician or even justanother person you know?
(45:16):
It doesn't have to be just music, but.
To me, that I the thing that I always felt and always was big
with is to just be be yourself and be OK with being yourself.
You know, like you can tell whenpeople try to play a play the
(45:46):
part of somebody that they're not, you know, somebody that's
they're not authentic, You know,like whether it's they put on an
outfit or they're trying to do this or they're playing a
certain way or, or doing something and, and it's not
really, it doesn't seem like it's them, you know, authentic.
(46:07):
And sometimes that takes a lot of trying to play different
roles in your life because you think that's what you're
supposed to be doing, but it's not who you really are, you
know? And like, for me, I am who I am
(46:29):
unapologetically, you know, I have tattoos on everywhere.
I wear shorts. I don't like to wear fucking
pants. I am the way that I am and
because of that, other people will will see your authenticity
and they they're attracted to that as opposed to somebody just
(46:51):
trying to, to fit in. So the more you you are
yourself, the more you will attract good things, I think.
I think you're on the money, dude.
Listen, I can't thank you enoughfor your time.
It was wonderful, man, and and Ilove the authentic kind of stuff
(47:12):
because like, I get it, we're indifferent, you know, places, but
like you can feel it. It's like it doesn't feel like I
don't want to use the word preachy, but again, we're in a
time where people are so happy to just spew and I didn't feel
like you were just spewing. I feel like you, you took the
time to think. You took the time to be honest.
(47:33):
It's can't thank you enough. And anytime, man, I really
appreciate this. I love, I love talking about
great questions. I love talking about this stuff
and I I'm I'm happy to do it anytime.
Amazing dude. Well enjoy the rest of your day
and I'll talk to you soon. Enjoy everything, keep on
rocking man. All right.
You too, brother. Thank you dude.
All right, see you. Bye bye.
(47:56):
There we have it, Jeremy Coulson, everybody.
Once again I want to thank Jeremy for his time.
I want to once again thank you for your time.
My name is Travis Mark, you can find out more about me at
musicians-mentor.com. If I can help you in any way or
advise you in any regard in relation to your artistic or
band career, please do drop me an e-mail or Adm.
(48:18):
I'm always happy to help, but for now I'm going to go make a
little bit of music myself. Until the next time, work hard,
be diligent, but have some fun. Peace.
Ladies and gentlemen, welcome tothe Musicians Mentor Podcast.
As usual, I'm your host, Travis Mark.
And before I get into today's introduction, please let me
introduce you once again to today's wonderful show sponsor,
Boom Boom Drum Pillows. Boom Boom Drum Pillows and
(00:23):
Dampness enhance and secure yourdrum tone with an array of
handmade products and accessories.
I'm happy to say that I'm using these products myself now, and
if I didn't believe in them, I would not talk about them on the
show. So if you're a drummer and
serious about tone, make sure you check out Boom Boom Drum
Pillows at Boom Boom Drum pillows.com.
(00:46):
And what better way to segue from a great drum product to
talking with a great drummer? Today's guest is
california-based drummer to the stars, Jeremy Coulson.
Many of you may already know of Jeremy from his years of work
with the guitar maestro himself,Steve Vai.
But in addition to his work withSteve, he has also worked with
(01:07):
artists like Billy Idol, Sebastian Bach, Marty Friedman,
and Michael Schenker. Jeremy and I've spoken before,
so I tried to adapt some of these questions so he wouldn't
be answering things I've alreadyasked him.
And as usual, he was super kind and humble and just willing to
accommodate. So I want to publicly thank him
for that and for his time. As usual, I want to thank each
(01:28):
and everyone of you for your time.
If you are getting insight that might be helping you in any way,
shape or form, please leave us arating or a view on your
preferred streaming service. Likewise, let me remind you that
I'm on YouTube now. I'm really trying to build that
Channel. So if you use YouTube as a
service, please head over to Musicians Mentor and hit that
(01:49):
subscribe button. As usual, I want to remind you
to please check out our discounted affiliate links with
the wonderful Sound Brainer company.
They make great in ear monitors and metronomic devices that make
it easy to play live and easy topractice pretty much anywhere.
And I also want to welcome to the show a new brand partnership
with the lovely folks over at Earpiece.
(02:12):
Earpiece is currently one of theleading ear plug and ear
protection manufacturers in the world.
So if you know how serious I am with protecting your hearing,
especially if you're a musician,you should totally check them
out. All the links are on the show
notes, as are all of Jeremy's links, but I think I've probably
blabbered on enough. So let's get straight into
(02:32):
today's episode. Ladies and gentlemen, please
help me welcome the one and onlyJeremy Coulson.
Well, with me on the Musicians Mentor podcast today is Drummer
to the Stars and just. World.
Class drummer, in my opinion, Jeremy Coulson.
To the listeners who might not be aware as to who Jeremy is, He
(02:55):
has played with Steve by Billy Idol, Sebastian Bach, Marty
Friedman. There's a bunch we'll get
talking about that and so much more.
But Jeremy, what I typically do is I asked my guests to give a
bit of a brief introduction as to who they are rather than me
just doing it all off the cuff because that way listeners have
(03:16):
an idea as to your mindset in today's interview.
So if you wouldn't mind, Tell the World to Jeremy Coulson is.
All right, with Jeremy Coulson. I'm from Northern California
outside of San Francisco, and I I discovered music when I was a
little kid. I got into like Ozzy Osbourne
(03:39):
was my childhood hero and he I discovered him and I just loved
all the the way that he was and,and the theatrics of of it all.
And then I started playing drumswhen I was around 10.
And but you know, I really got into what I, I was 15, I
discovered Rush and I decided toreally get into drumming in the
(04:02):
sense of, of being a drummer's drummer, like really study the
drums, study with an instructor,practice stuff, like really
getting into all that. So eventually I met a guy named
Mike Barney when I was around 1718 years old who owned a label
called Shrapnel. And he got me in touch with,
starting doing work with, with his label.
(04:25):
So I started working with a band, this progressive metal
band I was in called Dolly's Dilemma and it was kind of like
a Dream Theater style band. And then after that I, you know,
I started working with Michael Shanker and then I started
working with Marty Friedman. And then Mike Varney recommended
(04:45):
me to Steve. I, I was 26 years old and I went
down and I auditioned and I got the gig and started touring with
him kind of all over the world really.
And then in 2010 I auditioned for Billy Idol and got that gig
and I did that for a couple of years while I was doing Steve, I
(05:08):
gig. So I was kind of juggling and
I'd actually, I kind of had to make a decision.
So I stuck with Steve just 'cause I'd been with him for a
while and, and I really enjoy, you know, I've enjoyed doing the
stuff with him And so touring with him for a while and then,
you know, working with, you know, that I did best Sebastian
(05:30):
Bach's album and I said touring with him.
So just working with a lot of, alot of artists, instrumental
guitar players. For some reason, it's something
that I've, I've been even now, like when I, I record for
people, I do remote recording. And so much of the time it's,
it's a lot of times it's instrumental guitar players just
(05:52):
because they know me from VI or Marty Friedman and I love it.
You know, I enjoy it and I enjoythat I get to, you know, there's
a, there's a creative aspect of playing instrumental music that
you don't always get with singing, because with singing
you just have this chorus, verse, chorus, you know, kind of
thing. Instrumental music is different.
(06:13):
You can speak sometimes a littlebit more.
So doing that and you know, I, Iam a avid cyclist and I have
cats. I love animals and I'm pretty
laid back. I live in Southern California
(06:35):
and I am just, yeah, I bet that's about it.
So as usual with these kinds of things, there's lots of things
that I can dissect from the. I'm going to kind of try hit
heavy from the start. OK, so you mentioned auditioning
for BI, You mentioned auditioning for Billy Idol.
(06:58):
This is a bit of a weird question, but just answer as
organically as you would like. Nowadays, drumming, especially
with the invent of social media,has become such a viral thing.
Music in general, not just drumming.
It's like it's all about these viral moments.
Or at least that's what it appears to be about.
Especially from outsiders looking in.
(07:19):
They might just think, well, hey, you, you get a viral thing
and you're a star, right? I don't necessarily agree with
all of that, but what in your opinion, do you feel makes for a
good drummer? And let's try and twist it
slightly into an audition process.
Once a drummer feels comfortableand good and competent, shall we
(07:44):
say, how can they get comfortable doing auditions for
artists like Steve By or Billy Idol?
Because a lot of guys are incredibly talented and they
never go do any gigs. And now again, if you bring it
back into the theme at hand, youalmost see a lot of really
(08:07):
incredible Olympic kind of cats on Instagram and TikTok and
stuff. They've never seemed to have a
gig. And, and I get the monetized
side of that because if they getin enough views, they don't even
have to leave the house. That's great.
But how do you think being a good drummer could relate to
eventually getting auditions andeventually being comfortable at
(08:29):
those auditions to hopefully geta gig if that's what they want?
That's a great question and I want to answer it in a way where
I'm not sounding like an old elitist person That is, you
(08:52):
know, social media, you know, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Because the Instagram drummer, the social media drummer
musician is it exists now it is a thing.
And you like you said, these guys don't even have to go play.
(09:13):
They can they can make a living being Olympic Instagram
drummers. And it's fascinating to watch to
a point. But the one thing that I have
noticed with drummers that are, you know, social media stars
(09:38):
with everything like that, there's a difference between
recording yourself playing something and actually working
with other musicians, which has become a lost art.
Yeah, even with, you know, bandsthat just, you know, and I'm not
(09:59):
against that. Look, I, I work with bands that
do backing tracks. Believe me.
It's, it's not if it, if it's there to enhance.
But when you play with other people, it's not just you're
playing. Do you know how to listen?
(10:20):
Do you know how to listen to thebass player?
Do you know how to vibe with thepeople?
Do you understand, like how to push and pull the music?
Do you understand how to improvise?
You know, there's a lot of thesedrummers, younger drummers,
They're amazing drummers. But when you improvise, when
(10:43):
you're playing with other people, are you listening to
compliment what the other person's doing?
Like when I'm improvising with BI, him and I, I'm, I'm
listening to what he's doing so I can kind of cop it on the
drums. I'm not going to just OK, I'm
going to improvise and play whatever I want.
And nowadays I just see it's just like they just start going
(11:04):
like this over everything and they get a lot, you know, the,
the people get a lot of views for that.
There is something to be said for the social aspect of
auditioning. And I'll give you an example
when I got the Billy Idol and, and I, you know, I've never been
(11:26):
somebody that has tried to go out there and, and promote like,
look, I, I have had, you know, struggles in my life with drugs
and alcohol, staying sober, all of these things.
My life has been a lot of ups and downs, but I, I live for the
moment and I just, if something,if something, if I get an
(11:48):
opportunity for something, I feel like it's the, you know,
bringing me an opportunity. So like the Billy Idol thing.
I, I was living in Northern California with my parents at
the time. I wasn't looking for a gig.
And Steve Stevens called me up and he said, Hey, you know, you
won't come down and, and, and audition.
We're, we're looking for, we're looking for a drummer.
(12:09):
And this was Billy Idol and I had never played any Billy Idol
songs. So I, you know, I got the tunes
that I was going to audition with and I went in and I
practiced them and I really, I focused on the consistency with
being powerful, solid. But there's also a vibe thing
(12:30):
like I went down there and I gotinto the room, they were
smoking. I lit up a cigarette.
I fucking took my shirt off. I started playing Rebel Yell and
it was like, and I was joking and were joking around and I was
smiling and I was vibing out with everybody.
Like that is you cannot get thatfrom a teacher.
(12:51):
That is the kind of attitude. And for me, like, you know, I'm,
I, I like a lot of punk rock andI like the I like the punk rock
attitude of just like this is who I am.
And when you're confident like that, even if you don't know
particularly this the music or you don't know what you you
don't understand it all yet, if you have the attitude and you
(13:13):
can emote that, then the other people you're playing with will
feel it. And with the drummer, that's
everything because we're we're in charge of that.
Like that has to be where the heartbeat.
So the more attitude you have, and that was always the thing.
It's kind of like this, this, yeah, that kind of punk rock
mentality, regardless of what solid music it is.
(13:36):
And so when you can gel with other people, that's what I
don't see in the social media world, to answer your question.
I do have to agree and it kind of has even come further.
You mentioned remote recording earlier.
Yeah, like, you know, budgets have been cut to such a point
that remote recording is a real thing now to to be a contender
(13:59):
as a musician, you have to have some kind of way to record.
Otherwise you're not going to get that work unless you're one
of the guys who's ingrained, youknow, the Vinnies and the
Winkles and like, they, they still going to get those calls.
But yeah, man, the vibe, I I talk about vibe and chemistry a
lot because I'm a big believer. Kind of like your punk ethos
(14:21):
sort of mentality, like gangs used to have this sense of
brotherhood, chemistry, gang mentality, whatever you want to
call it. And I'm sure that still exists
in certain aspects of certain bands and certain genres.
But yeah, with the doing everything alone, you don't see
(14:45):
a lot of that, you know? And it's like, it's cool because
like you say, like, yeah, some of these dudes are just wow.
Like, I mean, every day I see something that I'm just like,
whoa, like what's? I'll watch it two or three
times. But also without trying to sound
like an old dude, I sometimes dowonder.
I'm very interested to see whereit's going to go.
(15:08):
Because like, coming up in bandsas a kid myself, you had the
opportunity and it wasn't alwayspleasant, but you had the
opportunity to be told that something was too much or too
little or not, right? And now all those critiques seem
to be coming through comments. And I don't think you can take
comments too heavy because, well, if you do that, like,
(15:32):
that's no good for your mental health, right?
Like, so it's like, it's a real strange place.
OK, well, let's keep along this train.
So Steve Stevens calls you, which is great.
Had you met Steve before? Not really.
He had seen my I did this this show, this show with with VI in
(15:54):
O four. It was the Crossroads Festival.
And there's the video that came out of it.
It's where, you know, Billy Sheehan and Tony McAlpine,
everybody's like playing and stuff.
We're out. And this song had the beat that
was, which is pretty much all the Billy Idol songs there is.
Yeah. So he saw that.
He's like, I think this, you know, so he got my number from
(16:16):
somebody else. And yeah, he just, he called and
then like three or three days later, I, I took a flight down
to, to LA. And, you know, I, I, I, I, I did
exactly what I said. I just came in there, You know,
I used to like took shirt off, you know, lit a cigarette and
let's go, let's play you guys. And it was like, you know, just
(16:42):
going into it. And that was, yeah, that was the
start of it. That's amazing.
So let's talk a little bit aboutnetworking, OK?
Because obviously having the theplatform of VI creates a
network. But before that you had to
network so that you get to know the guys from Shrapnel etcetera,
etcetera, etcetera. Again, things with networking
(17:03):
have changed because of social media.
So let's create a hypothetical situation.
New guy in town, whatever town that may be, besides he or she
wants to start getting into the music industry.
What advice would you give to that person, regardless of the
instrument that they're playing on, trying to start getting into
(17:27):
their local scene so that maybe eventually they network and meet
enough people that might broadentheir opportunities?
It's a great question. And sometimes I'll meet younger
drummers that, that, that asked about that and where we are in
(17:48):
the world now. I, I, it's, I really wish I
could give a specific answer, but I think some of it now
depends on you have to ask yourself, what do I want to do?
Do I want to get a gig? You know, do I want to get the
gig for Lady Gaga? Do I want to get you that kind
(18:11):
of like the Taylor Swift gig and, and, and go out and do
that? Do I want to be in a, a band?
Do I want to be a Instagram star?
Do I want to be a social media *?
And what, you know, what is it'skind of like going within and
(18:32):
saying, what do I really, what do I really want to do?
And sometimes you don't know, yeah.
So you have to try things out. And this is one of the the
hardest businesses there is to be in is the music business.
It's it is so disorganized. It is so flaky.
(18:59):
It will tear families apart. It will, you know, I mean, it's
it, there's so much. Well, I think, I think the tour
is all well, I don't know yet. There's so much waiting.
There's so much. Well, this might happen, but we
don't know. There's there's just, you know,
and there's not a lot of money in it.
It's really, you know, unless you're, you know, unless you get
(19:22):
in a band and get a cut, unless you're metallic or whatever,
it's, it's really you got to just you got to, for me, I like
to do a lot of different things.So like right before that we
were doing this, I'm working on this tune that I'm a remote
recording because that's one of the things I do.
That's how I make you know, And then later today I have a couple
(19:47):
lessons. So and you know, in October, I
go back, I go to Europe for likea week and 1/2 with this guitar
player I'm working with. And then I come back and.
So like, I have to, I, I do all these different things.
(20:09):
You know, it'd be nice if it was, you know, there's a lot of
people that's just like, well, how do I, how do I, how do I
make it? Yeah, I don't really, I don't
know what it is these days to make it except to just be open
(20:30):
to doing different things. Yeah, really is what it comes
down to. And there are all.
And again, I don't, I mean, there's all sorts of way there.
And, you know, you can't not saythat there's sometimes there's
just luck involved. Sometimes the right person hears
something and that does it. And you know, there are examples
(20:53):
of Instagram drummers getting really rad gigs.
Very rad gigs. Tosh.
Oh yeah, he's got some big gigs.Top the line trio.
I got Lady Gaga. And I believe he was, you know,
he's a young kid and he was likea, you know, Instagram thing.
You know, there's this other kid, this metal drummer kid
(21:16):
Luigi, I think something just, you know, insane, you know, just
crazy. Yeah, and he's in, he's in a
metal band now. So there, yeah, there's examples
of like, hey, make a video of you playing covers or playing
whatever and, and post that. That's that's part of how you
(21:39):
get gigs now. That's part of how you work.
So you have to be, you have to just constantly be doing that.
I agree. How would you define pulse or
pockets? Pocket and pulse are some are.
(22:07):
It is something that you almost can't define, but when you feel
it you know it. And when somebody is not with
the pulse or with the pocket, you absolutely feel it, you know
what I'm saying? It's a great answer dude.
(22:27):
Like it's just it's, it's like, OK, watch Steve Jordan play
drums. That's my definition of pulse
and pocket. Watch him play, watch him play,
(22:49):
and that's it. Yeah.
There it is. And that and, and, and how do
you you, how do you dissect that?
It's, it's again, it's like you can't.
It's just like it's, it's it's you just you feel it.
Yeah. And then when you watch another
person try to play that and it'sjust like you're not, you don't
(23:09):
feel that. It, it, it's very obvious.
So that's my definition. I thought that was great.
I've seen so many debates onlinelately about Pulse pocket
tightness, metronome usage, and it's really interesting because
of Facebook pages and groups. Now it's like all these
(23:30):
essential drum boards and like, wow, sometimes I definitely get
caught in the doom scroll of it all because you just like read
all these different things and no one's necessarily 100% wrong,
but but there's definitely some interesting arguments.
So I think great answer. The feel of it man is wonderful
(23:52):
one. Thing I will say because we live
in a world now where and this isalways brought up.
You know when you when you hear about bands that these this band
plays to tracks or this, but youknow it's playing with a click.
Another example is like when you, when you watch Rage Against
the Machine play, OK, you can't have you can't play that with
(24:16):
the click track. There's parts that slow down
because that's the that's the pulse.
The pocket is, is for it to slowdown.
Nowadays, there's less bands that go out and, and play like
that. There's a lot of bands that you
know, and, and there was a drummer on the platform that was
(24:37):
talking about this recently. Tommy, what's?
The time I go. Yeah, and he was saying
something really, really. I thought that was really great
because how easy it is for drummers to get replaced these
days. Because it's not.
The drummer isn't getting. The drummer isn't getting hired
for necessarily his feel. It does so many other things
(25:00):
like so they're going to pay youless and then if you say no,
they'll just get another guy because most of the time they're
playing with the click. They're going to have tracks.
That's why it's it's harder these days.
It's. It's a different model and and.
That was one of them actually, where I was just like, whoa,
there's some, there's some controversial comments going on
here, you know, and it's also, Iunderstand the mentality, right?
(25:23):
Because OK, maybe not so much now because you don't have drum
magazines anymore, really. But drum magazines and drum
tutorial DVDs and all those things would always tell you
about practice with a metronome.Like you want to be good
practice with a metronome. Hey, practice all your exercise
with metronome. Do all your rhythms metronome
try, you know, and then you reada post like that and he's
basically saying like you shouldhave your, your own feel in it.
(25:48):
And I think it got a little taken out of context because I
don't think he was trying to imply that you should never
practice with mission. I think he was just trying to
say that like get to a certain point that you can bring your
vibe, you know, But there was definitely.
Say these days that isn't going to be taken out of there's
always going to be dude, it's. It's.
(26:10):
Fascinating. You just get an opinion on
something and then everybody is everybody is now an expert.
Everybody. In fact, it's so funny you
mentioned that. I was having lunch with my wife
a little bit earlier. She works as a wedding planner,
and she saw some stuff on onlinethis morning.
And she's just like, man, I got to stop going on social media.
Like, everybody knows everythingabout everything.
(26:31):
And I was like, I try to stay away from all of that, man,
because it's like, it'll bring you down, dude.
OK. What, in your opinion, has been
the hardest part about being a career musician?
The hardest part I would say is the is the not knowing always
(27:04):
what the future is going to hold.
Not having a, you know, even if you, even these bands that even
these guys that have steady gigs, you know, in the music
business, like in a, in every, any other kind of job, you go to
a job and you apply for the job,you get the job.
(27:28):
That job gives you health insurance, dental insurance, you
know, vacation time, you know, all these things.
Now you have granted, you might have to go to an office and work
and it's, you know, not, but butyou know, you, you are taken
care of, you know, and it's not like that in the music business,
(27:49):
even if you have a big gig, it'sjust not.
The other thing is like nowadaysin the music business, like if
you have a normal job, you startoff with your salary and each
year, most likely you would learn a little bit more music
business. Not like that.
(28:10):
It can be, but there's also times where it's like, look, we
got to do this tour. The budget, here's the budget.
This is what I can pay you. I can't pay you what I paid you
before. Yeah.
And then it comes down to what'smy worth and what it, what
everything like that is. And, and so I, I, you have to
make that decision is, is playing music and doing
(28:33):
something that you love so much?Is it worth maybe not having
health insurance? Is it worth not having that
security? Is it worth leaving your family
and traveling and, and going away for a long time and coming
back not with is, you know, not with a, with a lot of money,
(28:58):
like is it worth doing that? And that's the hardest part
about it is, is, is, is, you know, really feeling that in
your heart is like, is this, is this worth it to me?
And you know, for a lot of musicians, because they have
that experience of going on stage and playing and what that
(29:21):
feeling is, it's like a drug. It's absolutely.
So you will chase that. And I see it.
I have, I have a student that, you know, is 15 years old.
His band just played at the Whiskey in LA and it was their
first show and it was awesome. And the way that they felt
afterwards, it's like once that happens, you know, I mean, I got
to, to give a weird example, butit's like a, a junk, you know,
(29:44):
somebody that shoots heroin for the first time, it's like
they're going to chase that. And so, you know, you'll end up
eating, you'll end up strugglingand losing a lot of things just
in order to be able to go do that.
So you have to have to ask, you have to ask yourself is that is
that, is that worth it? And, and that's what that's the
(30:11):
hardest thing in my page for me about the, the music, you know,
business. If you could potentially change
one thing about the music business for the better in a
positive way, what do you think you could change?
(30:38):
I don't know, maybe, you know, there being some something more
of like what the way unions are and the way, the way, you know,
with workers and stuff like that.
A way of, of providing working musicians with some more, you
know, some more security. So they can, they can continue
(31:02):
to do what they do and have someof that security like like, you
know, health insurance and things like, I don't know, just
I, I think that it's kind of like when in school, when you
know, the, the money is taken away for the music programs, you
know, it's like, why is that? And I think that sometimes it's
(31:25):
worth, I think it'd be nice if if there was more investment in
working musicians so they didn'thave to struggle as hard and
even successful ones. I mean, I've seen amazing
virtuoso, amazing musicians who play benefit concerts when they
(31:45):
get cancer because they can't pay the bills for that, you
know, amazing musicians like virtuoso players.
And then they can't, you know, they, they, they, they have to
have a benefit show in order to pay for their treatment.
And I, I wish, I, I wish there was more help with that, that,
(32:08):
that that's what I would change,yeah.
Well, on that note, medical stuff, drumming very physical,
especially the way Someone Like You play very physical.
Have you got any drumming related injuries that you'd be
happy to share with us? Yeah, I have.
(32:30):
I have a few injuries, nothing crazy.
I mean, more the injuries that I've gotten have been from from
cycling in the last few years. Like I'm, I'm really in this,
it's called gravel biking. So it's a cross between a road
bike and a mountain bike. And I really like doing that.
And it's just, it's like I like getting outside and doing all
(32:51):
that. But a year ago I was riding and
I snapped my collarbone and I broke.
I didn't just fracture it, I broke it and so I had that.
I have a metal plate and 8 screws right here.
Wow. Thankfully I healed up great.
But you know, like I have, I have bones this bone spur in my
(33:14):
big toe just from the pedal for you know, I, I like to bury the
beater in the head. I'm just one of those guys.
I like to do that. But from doing all that in my,
my toe bending like that, I had this bone spur that hurts.
So I get, I'll get cortisone shots and that nothing, you
know, major I've, I've, you know, had a little tendonitis
here at one point. But for me, I, I stay in pretty
(33:37):
good shape and I do a lot of thestretching stuff.
And I'm grateful that I had a great teacher when I was growing
up that really taught me technique about holding the
sticks and not not gripping themtoo tight to where a lot of
drummers who get injuries, you know, there's, there's, that's
(33:57):
why I'm really big with all my students.
I'm really big with with just spending that time with the
technique stuff because it will help in the end.
So away from just technique, is there any advice you could offer
drummers? I suppose really any musicians
but drummers on trying to stay healthy physically, like you
(34:19):
mentioned stretching. I know you said the cycling
thing like, you know, I get it. Everyone's got a different body
and everybody's body works different.
But yeah, you know, any, any Nuggets that you, I mean,
attention to share? Look, I have practice pads all
around my house. You know, I have my my sticks.
(34:40):
I have a practice pad always andI'm always kind of, and I have
all sometimes warm up with, withmarching sticks.
Just have your stick to kind of,you know, it's like that base
putting the doughnut on a baseball bat kind of thing.
And that helps a little bit. I like that.
But I think the whole kind of concept of, of being being loose
(35:04):
and relaxed, you know, it's likeyou see guys that do martial
arts and you see Tai chi and yousee movements like that and
it's, it flows, you know, drummers that are going to play
when their backs like this and they're just like going like
this, you know, eventually that's going to catch up.
So the more you're aware and youknow, I thought I've had, I've
(35:26):
always had to try to think aboutmy posture and I always try to
think about, you know, I'm always having the sticks in my
hands. I'm always just trying to be
loose, you know, because then it's that's such an important
thing. And the more you're on a
practice pad, the more the more you have a stick in your hand,
the more confident you are, the more you can, you can be loose
(35:47):
because it's like if you haven'tplayed in the wild and you pick
up the sticks and you're dripping tighter in there.
You know, like you can really dial in your technique if you're
always, you know, kind of practicing that.
Yeah, please correct me if I'm wrong, but I think from when I
was doing my research, you placed third in the guitar
sensor drum of spec in 95. That correct?
(36:10):
Yeah. Yeah.
OK, good. That's a great setup for my next
question. So 95 S that's 31 years ago,
which means you were drumming before then, obviously.
So talk to me about longevity. Like, again, drumming is so
physical. Phil Collins needs a wheelchair
now. The Wardy announced that he's
(36:31):
he's using a wheelchair now. Now I'm not trying to scare
people and say that every drummer is going to land up in a
wheelchair and I'm not even trying to make it just a
physical thing, but longevity inthis industry, firstly as a
drummer from a physical perspective, and secondly, the
mental games that it plays on your psyche, your mental states
(36:56):
when you're basically, I don't want to, I don't want to term it
trying to make it every day, butI saw a very interesting post
and I got to be honest, I thought it was a great way to
phrase things, but it might meanmore to me than what it to most.
It said something like being a musician or a creative
personality is essentially beingstuck in a midlife crisis your
(37:19):
entire life. Why he meant that was because
like you're constantly second guessing yourself.
You're you're second guessing your future, you're second
guessing decisions, your security, all these things.
Now I'm not trying to overload the question, but I guess if I
was trying to simplify what I'm trying to ask, how does one
(37:40):
maintain a positive attitude, especially in a career where it
is so hard to maintain longevity?
That's a great question. Yeah.
Well, I think I think creative people can have a really hard
(38:04):
time in the world. You know, when you always hear
that thing, that kind of that term tortured artist, because
creative people tend to be really hypersensitive, insecure
(38:24):
and second guessing themselves. But yet when they go perform,
those things go away and they feel validated, especially when
the people who are watching enjoy what they're, you know,
(38:46):
give applause and everything like that.
And then you get caught in that yourself esteem is based on who
you're playing with, if you're touring, if you're not what
yeah, what gig you have. And it's very easy to turning
(39:09):
greatly to self pity being a musician, being a creative
person, because most musicians are going to have low periods
where they don't have a gig, where they're not working, where
they're questioning that. And I'm not one of those.
(39:33):
You know, there's a lot of people on social media now that
are just very, you know, like this whole alpha male thing of
like, you got to grind, bro, yougot to get up, you know, you got
to do it. You know, you got to do this.
And I'm not really into that. I get to just because I, I
(39:55):
don't, I don't, I don't have that personality, you know, but
there is this thing of everybody's an entrepreneur now.
Like I'm just entrepreneur. You like, you got to get up and
everybody's got advice. Like all of a sudden everybody's
going to medical school and theyknow how to do everything.
So. For me, the things that I have
found that have that have helped, like is my, the
(40:20):
spiritual side of my life, you know, meditation and
discovering, discovering different people who talk about,
you know, being present because a musician is constantly
thinking about when's the next tour?
When's the next gig? Am I going to get this?
(40:41):
You're constantly stuck in that.And so you can't, you know, when
you're playing, when you're performing, you're in the moment
'cause you're, it's like it's right there.
But then that's over. And then you go into this low.
And that was my problem in my life with substance abuse and
the highs and lows of touring. I'd be on a bus.
You go tour for three months, you're on a bus and you don't
(41:05):
have any responsibility except to wake up, go to soundtrack,
play the show. And then you get to laugh with
your friends and you're having agood time, everything like that.
And then you come home. And I, I never knew how to, to
adapt back to being home. And then I just wanted to go
back out on the road. So when I would get home, I
would, you know, at, at one point I was going, you know, I
(41:27):
went deep into drugs and alcoholand I, I hit a low that was
needed for myself where I got out of it and I got clean and
sober and I, I kind of turned mylife around and decided to live
differently than, than the way that I was living.
And now what's going to happen in the future is not as
(41:50):
important to me is as I look at like today I'm working on this
song and I'm going to record next Tuesday.
I'm talking to you about drums. I love drums.
I got a few students a little bit later like that's.
I went for AII, rode almost 50 miles this morning on my.
(42:11):
Bike good for you. Yeah, so like what?
What am I? This is, this is, this is
perfect. And I'm clean and sober and I,
I'm, I'm aware and I, I'm trusted and people I, I can be
relied upon like that's, that's perfect.
I don't anything more than that because financially I'm OK.
(42:35):
Everything's going to be taken care of.
That is that's what's most important as opposed to being
like, OK, I got to, I got to geton, I got to, I got to make some
calls. I got to try.
I got to try to find this next gig.
I got, I got to put myself out there.
You get into that mindset and I'm just not, that's not who I
am. I like to just be, just be.
(42:56):
The more present that I can be, the more amazing things happen
to be coming into my life. I'm grateful for that.
Well, you may have just answeredmy next question, but I'm going
to ask it anyway in case you want to add anything at this
point in your career. Big tours, big artists.
Firstly, well done on sobriety. That's incredible.
(43:19):
What do you define as success? Some people would say, like to
me, success is getting paid to do what you love and I I don't
That's not what I define successas.
(43:42):
To me, success is to wake up andto be able to be grateful for
the things that you have and to not be regretful about what you
(44:07):
didn't get and to not be concerned about what you want,
but to be right in. The middle, yeah.
And just to be happy with, with,with what you have.
And like I just said, for me, what today is, is 100% success.
(44:30):
Like I said, I got to go for, I got to go for a, a ride.
I'm working on some drum stuff. I'm talking to you.
I have some students that I workwith.
That's to be, for me, a success.It's great, man.
Jeremy, last question, what do you think at this point in your
(44:52):
life, especially in regards to music, has either been the best
piece of advice you've ever received?
Or if you can't think of a specific piece of advice that
you've received, what do you think is something you've
learned along your own journey that might serve as good advice
to another musician or even justanother person you know?
(45:16):
It doesn't have to be just music, but.
To me, that I the thing that I always felt and always was big
with is to just be be yourself and be OK with being yourself.
You know, like you can tell whenpeople try to play a play the
(45:46):
part of somebody that they're not, you know, somebody that's
they're not authentic, You know,like whether it's they put on an
outfit or they're trying to do this or they're playing a
certain way or, or doing something and, and it's not
really, it doesn't seem like it's them, you know, authentic.
(46:07):
And sometimes that takes a lot of trying to play different
roles in your life because you think that's what you're
supposed to be doing, but it's not who you really are, you
know? And like, for me, I am who I am
(46:29):
unapologetically, you know, I have tattoos on everywhere.
I wear shorts. I don't like to wear fucking
pants. I am the way that I am and
because of that, other people will will see your authenticity
and they they're attracted to that as opposed to somebody just
(46:51):
trying to, to fit in. So the more you you are
yourself, the more you will attract good things, I think.
I think you're on the money, dude.
Listen, I can't thank you enoughfor your time.
It was wonderful, man, and and Ilove the authentic kind of stuff
(47:12):
because like, I get it, we're indifferent, you know, places, but
like you can feel it. It's like it doesn't feel like I
don't want to use the word preachy, but again, we're in a
time where people are so happy to just spew and I didn't feel
like you were just spewing. I feel like you, you took the
time to think. You took the time to be honest.
(47:33):
It's can't thank you enough. And anytime, man, I really
appreciate this. I love, I love talking about
great questions. I love talking about this stuff
and I I'm I'm happy to do it anytime.
Amazing dude. Well enjoy the rest of your day
and I'll talk to you soon. Enjoy everything, keep on
rocking man. All right.
You too, brother. Thank you dude.
All right, see you. Bye bye.
(47:56):
There we have it, Jeremy Coulson, everybody.
Once again I want to thank Jeremy for his time.
I want to once again thank you for your time.
My name is Travis Mark, you can find out more about me at
musicians-mentor.com. If I can help you in any way or
advise you in any regard in relation to your artistic or
band career, please do drop me an e-mail or Adm.
(48:18):
I'm always happy to help, but for now I'm going to go make a
little bit of music myself. Until the next time, work hard,
be diligent, but have some fun. Peace.
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