Most women who are trying to eat well are getting carbohydrates wrong. Not because they are eating too many, which is what they usually assume. Often because they are eating too few of the right ones and too many of the wrong ones at the wrong times.
This week Leanne and Susie break down one of the most misunderstood topics in women's nutrition, what too little carbohydrate actually looks like in the body, what too much of the wrong kind does over time, and how to find the sweet spot that matches your actual activity level, hormones, and goals.
Plus, PCOS has a new name. Published in The Lancet in May this year, it is now being referred to as PMOS, and the reason behind the change tells you a lot about how the medical world is finally starting to understand this condition more accurately.
In this episode:
Why PCOS has been renamed PMOS in a landmark article published in The Lancet, what the name change actually reflects about the condition, and why it matters for the 8 to 13% of women living with it right now
The surprising truth about polycystic ovaries: why there are not actually more cysts, and what is really happening in the ovaries of women with this condition
Why an anti-inflammatory diet, inositol, and working with a dietitian long-term are central to managing PMOS, and why medication alone will not move the needle the way lifestyle can
The signs you are not eating enough carbohydrate: ongoing fatigue despite normal blood tests, poor exercise performance, constant cravings, difficulty concentrating, and never feeling full after meals
The signs you are eating too many of the wrong carbohydrates, why the combination of too few quality carbs and too many refined ones is the pattern Leanne and Susie see most consistently in their clinics
Why being in carbohydrate no man's land, not low enough for ketosis but not high enough to support metabolism, is one of the most common reasons women stall when trying to lose body fat
How carbohydrate needs are highly individual and change depending on body size, activity level, hormones, life stage, and whether you are breastfeeding, perimenopausal, or training intensively
The quality carbohydrates to focus on at each meal, and the refined ones that are quietly slipping in while women are avoiding rice at lunch and sweet potato at dinner
The new Uncle Tobys Protein Quick Oats reviewed: where the 8 to 9 grams of protein is actually coming from, whether it is enough for women with fat loss or body composition goals, and when Leanne would and would not recommend it
The best frozen fish in Australian supermarkets ranked: Sealord, Birdseye, Findus, the Coles wild caught fish fingers, and the steam fresh range reviewed by fish percentage, protein, and taste
Work with Leanne or Susie:
Winter is one of the best times to work with a dietitian, with fewer social events and more structure. Leanne is at leannewardnutrition.com.au and Susie is at susieburrell.com.au.
Shop Designed by Dietitians:
Support your protein, creatine, magnesium, and collagen needs with science-backed supplements at designedbydietitians.com
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
Do you know how much carbohydrate you eat?
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Maybe you eat carbs at every meal, or maybe you
actively try and limit your calves, but you're not sure
if you're having enough. On today's episode of The Nutrition Couch,
we deep dive carbohydrates and share the signs that you
may be having too much or too little.
Speaker 1 (00:18):
Hi.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
I'm Leanne Wood and I'm Sissy Burrel, and together we
bring you The Nutrition Couch, your weekly podcast with everything
that you need to know in the world of nutrition
and as well as all things calves. PCOS has a
new name and we'll deep dive into that today. We
have a new high protein oat product purpose for winter,
and our listener question is all about frozen fish today.
(00:39):
So to kick us off today, Susie, Lately, PCOS has
had a bit of a name change, hasn't it. In
there was an article published in The Lanset on May
the twelfth this year that basically said that PCOS has
been changed to PMOS and it basically reflects the broader
polyendocrime disturbances that occur in this condition for women, including
(01:01):
things like insulin androgens, neuroendocrine and ovarian hormones as well.
So it basically highlights that it has more of a
metabolic impact on people's lives, more so than just the
ovariant impact which PCOS was really hyper focused on. So
the PMOS, the p is the polyendocrine system, which means
that there are multiple hormone systems involved. The M is metabolic,
(01:24):
which basically plays into the insulin, blood sugar regulation issues,
some weight regulation issues some women have, and metabolic health
in general. The O is similar to ovarian and the
SSSA and for syndrome which is the collection of symptoms
and features of PCOS which we now know is PMOS,
but it doesn't quite roll off the tongue as easily
(01:46):
does it now.
Speaker 1 (01:48):
It's super interesting actually deep diving why this change came about,
and it's not an insignificant number of women in Australia.
It's estimated between eight and thirteen percent of women suffer
from PMOS have profound effects on things like fertility, weight control, mood, energy,
and overall health and well being. So what I found
most fascinating was a review on why it was changed,
(02:10):
because it's kind of rare that you change a whole
name of something, but I guess it follows on from
what we know about women's health is that we're down
the wrong of priorities. I was listening to an American
podcast of Maria Shreiver from a couple of years back,
and I think she said the US budget for health
for women was something like eight to ten percent of
total health funding, like just phenomenally far short of where
(02:31):
it needs to be. And it follows on from that
whole history that we studied men's health in research studies,
it's men and women are way down the line despite
being I think fifty one percent of the population. So
we're slowly, slowly cottoning on. But the reason the name
change came about was that they said the term PCOS
was inaccurate because actually, contrary to popular opinion or belief
(02:54):
based on the name, there's no increase in abnormal A varianceists.
So we think about polycystic over is that there's more cysts,
and there's actually not. Rather, it says the condition is
based on the impact on the follicles or the developing cells,
or the fluid sacs that around partially developed eggs, and
this is where there's extra of those as opposed to
(03:15):
extra cysts. So I thought that was super interesting because
I didn't actually know that myself. But it's also taking
into account, as you described, the broader implications of the disease,
which means it can it basically increases inflammatory pathways, indirectly
impacting mood, fertility, weight gain, and can really be quite debilitating,
(03:36):
particularly for young women when it comes to acne excess
hair growth impacting their cycles and long term of course
the ability to conceive can be challenged. So yeah, basically
PMS is the new one. It doesn't, like you said,
roll off the tongue as easily. But I think that
it'll be interesting in the next few years to see
because often it came to light when people would go
(03:59):
to get pregnant and there was issues with cycle cycle length.
I think hopefully now we'll see more early identification and
management and treatment of it as a broader whole health perspective.
Going back twenty thirty years there was like one endochronologist
in Sydney who specialized in it. That was it, you know,
so certainly given the number of women it impacts, you know,
(04:20):
this is one or two people in every ten fifteen,
we know it's not insignificant. So yeah, that was I
thought worth discussing. Knowing that a lot of our listeners, well,
not a lot of our listeners, but a significant umber
our listeners are interested in this, and it's also one
of the reasons that we put inocetol in our women's
protein for design by dietitians because there is some clinical
(04:41):
evidence to show that an ocetol as a supplement can
benefit women with PMOS. And certainly it's a higher protein,
lower carbohydrate diet, a particular focus on nutrient density, high
anti inflammatory eating, high in amega threes, and inositol does
have some benefits to improve cycle frequency and and regularity.
So yeah, I thought it was just a topic good
(05:03):
worth discussing and something that does have profound effects in
terms of the way we eat, because ultimately it's not
always something that can be medically managed. No, it's often
lifestyle that is impacting inflammatory pathways. There's often a genetic component.
It does impact indirectly in sulin and glucose level, so
as such can be sort of managed from a weight perspective.
(05:24):
But what this new naming says is that it's, like
you said, multisystem variables and diet is a huge component
of actually managing it long term as opposed to there's
not a medication you can just take to fix this.
You know, it's about managing it from a lifestyle perspective
and as such, anti inflammatory styles of eating and targeting
(05:46):
metabolic efficiency, which takes time. You know, if you're helping
someone with PMOS, it might take six twelve months, but
yet that's what you're working on over time, is reducing
the inflammatory load of the diet, superloading key nutrients that
are shown to be beneficial at reducing inflammation and inflammatory pathways,
and then setting themselves up for success long term, because
(06:07):
on one hand, you've got the late teenagers who first
of all notice issues with their cycle and maybe diagnosed early.
And then you have the goals in their twenties who
might be struggling with things like the acne, the abnormal
hair growth, and then women in their twenties and thirties
looking at fertility. But then it's managing it through the
lifespan that once people are getting to the perian menopausal years,
(06:28):
making sure that the reduction in estrogen is not being
exacerbated by the PMOS, and then setting themselves up long
term for hormonal control when they at much higher risk
of things like type two diabetes so it's really a
long term approach to women with hormone issues, and it
just encapsulates that broader system perspective of it. So, yeah,
it was it was certainly interesting. Did you read much
(06:49):
else on it when it came through?
Speaker 2 (06:51):
Yeah, I was reading a bit about it, and what
I was reading was that it hasn't like officially officially
had a proper name change, Like it's not like we're
going to see it. You know, all the journals be
re up as pomos, and you know, it takes time,
particularly worldwide, for a lot of these medical studies and
research in things to really adopt new changes. So I
think it'll be filtered through over the next dare I
(07:12):
say five to ten years even? But I do think,
as you mentioned, it is so important for women because
it's not just simply a fertility issue. It's not simply
like a period problem. There are profound metabolic effects that
a lot of women experience with pomos, and like you said,
actually linking in with a diegesim is so so incredibly
important if you do have pmos because of things like
(07:35):
insulin resistance, blood sugar regulation, long term cardiovascular health issues,
and just the overall metabolic risk as well, which is
really it is central to the condition. So I am
all for the name change. I think it is really
a positive step in the right direction. It may not
sound as recognizable as PCOS. It may take some time
to filter through, you know, the medical kind of world itself,
(07:57):
but I do think that the women, it is a
broader encompassing of the condition and the things that so
many women struggle with. It's not simply oh, you can't
get pregnant, you've got PCOS. This is a broader metabolic
syndrome that there is actually a lot that can be
done from a lifestyle and a medical perspective. So I
think PMOS just doesn't roll up the tunges easy, suzy.
(08:18):
PMOS is a positive step in the right direction.
Speaker 1 (08:21):
Definitely too true, all rightly. And one other thing I
wanted to talk about today, I'll give you a lead
in before I hand over, was that in the last
few weeks I've had several clients who have been following
sort of their meal well following their meal pan loosely,
but they've been being so strict with their food that
I said to them, I think you're actually eating too
(08:42):
few carbohydrates and in their quest to be super healthy
and cut out sort of processed food and a lot
of snacks. When I've put their diets through my fitness power,
they're having sort of sixty eighty grams of carbohydrate per day,
and unfortunately, as we know, that is too low, because
it is entirely possible to eat to little carbohydrate. And
I find with clients who are very strict with themselves
(09:04):
and who exercise a lot, and who might be wanting
just to lean up a few kilos, they're shocked and
surprised to hear that they're actually not eating enough. So
this actually is a real thing, isn't it?
Speaker 2 (09:15):
In one hundred percent is and it might, I guess,
be shocking for some people to hear that carbohydrates are
not actually technically essential. They are very beneficial, but unlike
protein and fat, carbohydrates are not technically essential for survival.
There are some people that exist on extremely low, you know,
ketogenic diets for perhaps conditions like epilepsy for example. So
(09:36):
they're not actually essential, but they absolutely particularly for women,
and hormones are hugely, hugely beneficial. And if you put
a thousand women in front of me, I'd say, you know,
ninety nine point nine percent of them would benefit from
an adequate amount of the right type of carbohydrates because
carbs are actually the body's preferred fuel source. So yes,
the body can utilize protein in fat and basically switch
(09:58):
that into carbohydrate for that you know, quicker energy, but
it's a longer pathway. The body doesn't like to do that.
It actually prefers to use carbohydrate as the primary fuel source,
and in particular the brain, the brain uses glucose as
it's preferred fuel source as well. And then when we
talk about exercise, carbohydrates support exercise second to none. Again, yes,
(10:18):
you can be fat adapted, you can utilize some protein
when you're exercising, but it is not an efficient way
to do it. Carbohydrates absolutely are just preferred by the body,
and they also help preserve muscle mass post training. And
of course we know they provide lots of things like vitamins, minerals, fiber,
all that sorts of things. So from a gut health perspective,
a digestive health perspective, carbohydrates are essential as well. But
(10:42):
what I see, and I'm sure that you're very similar,
Susie with your clients, with my women, The problem is
in carbohydrate themselves, right, The problem is the type of
carbohydrate and the amount of carbohydrate. Nobody is out here
saying that bread is bad or pasta is bad, or
potato is bad. But if you're going to deep fry
your potatoes, leather it in sour cream, topple with bacon
(11:02):
and cheese, you know, we may have a problem if
that's happening too regularly. So it's not that carbs itself
are bad. And I think that with the rise of
social media being twenty twenty six, I think that message
is finally getting through that carbohydrates are important, but it
is really the right type of carbohydrate. So one of
the biggest things I see is that many women are
actually under eating what we call quality carbohydrates, the right
(11:26):
types of carbohydrates, and particularly women are doing this in
their quest to lose weight basically, or that you know,
there may be women in perimenopause I've heard reducing carbohydrates
may be a good thing, or they've just got like
a chronic kind of dieting background where they're constantly cutting
carbs on, keto off keto, that kind of thing. So
if you are under eating your quality carbohydrates. Signs that
(11:48):
somebody may experience would just be ongoing fatigue. And that's
you know, when things blood tests have been done, your
in's fine, but you still have just have ongoing fatigue.
You've got really poor exercise performance. You're just not able
to progress in your exercise or training or lift a
little bit heavier. You experience regular or constant cravings. You
may have difficulty concentrating, you may just often feel constantly hungry,
(12:12):
even though you have eaten a decent sized meal. You
just never really feel satisfied, and you don't really recover
properly from exercise either. Now a lot of women are
underdoing the carbohydrates when they're doing things such as intimate
and fasting, skipping breakfast, just having a salad with lunch.
You know, worried about the sugar in fruits, so they're
(12:32):
not having any fruit, and they're worried about, you know,
say the sugar in sweet potatoes, so they're not including
that in their meal.
Speaker 1 (12:38):
Or they're just having.
Speaker 2 (12:39):
Really really really tiny portions of rice or pasta because
they're almost fearful of the carbohydrates. So that's one scenario
where I see women are under eating what we call
the good quality cubs. And then often what I feel
that's coupled with is at the same time, they're under
eating the good quality cubs, but a lot of women
are overdoing what we call the refined carbohydrates. Right, So
(13:03):
overall they may be getting in enough carp but it's
not matched properly, right, they're underdoing the good quality carbs
and overdoing the refined ones. And by refined carbohydrates, we're
talking about things like biscuits, cakes, muffins, chips, lollies, sugary drinks,
juice is smoothies, you know, the bubble teas, pastries, really
highly processed snack foods. Even things like rice crackers we
(13:24):
would not define as a really good quality carb.
Speaker 1 (13:26):
Right.
Speaker 2 (13:27):
So I guess what I'm trying to say is a
lot of women are so fearful of eating rice in
their lunch or having too much potato at dinner. Yet
then they're downing half a block of chocolate at night time,
or they're having an ice cream every single night, or
they're having biscuits with their tea every single day, or
a croissant or a muffin with their coffee most mornings.
So I guess for a lot of it's it's not
(13:47):
where you know, we're fearful of the good types of
carbs and we forget about the other types of carbs
that are slipping in. Basically, so what I think needs
to happen more is matching your carbs to your needs
and finding that sweet spot can be a little bit
difficult because it is different for everybody. Right If you
had a client who walked three times a week and
that was as much exercise as they did, their carbohydrate
(14:09):
needs are very different to somebody who might be training
CrossFit or fitstop, that high intensity type conditioning in heavyweight,
say five days a week, or prepping for their first marathon,
or postpartum and breastfeeding, or you've got teenage boys who
are growing. Their carbohydrate needs are very very different to
someone who has a desk job and might just walk
a couple of times a week. So carbohydrate needs are
(14:31):
very very individualized. But as Susie said, as dietitians, we
like to have a quality carbohydrate source in our main
meals and then we can think about including some of
it in our stacking as well. But what we see
in a lot of our women and we're dropping it
out of main meals, and then we're having too much
of the overly processed carb in a snack time and
after dinner. So when you think about a quality carve
(14:52):
source at breakfast, think about things like rolledoats, a whole
grain cereal, a grainy ceedy bread or toast, and some
fruit onto your breakfast. When you think about lunch, you
can use a whole grain bread. We're not huge fans
of wraps because they are a bit more processed, even
though they are convenient.
Speaker 1 (15:07):
My preference is always for a dense seeded bread.
Speaker 2 (15:10):
Things like brown rice, kinoa, sweet potato, of beans or
legumes great carbohydrates sources at lunch time and they carry
through to dinner as well. You might want to also
include a bit of rice, kinoir pasta, different types of legumes.
So there, when we say good quality carbohydrates, they're the
ones we want you focusing on, not skipping carbet lunch,
inhaling two or three rows of rice crackers that afternoon tea,
(15:31):
and then skipping carbohydrate at dinner again, because that's where
we start to see our women running into problems where
overall they may be getting in enough, but the carbohydrate
is going into the bloodstream far too quickly. You don't
have the fiber there to support the gut health, and
you're not getting a lot of the micro nutrients that quality.
Speaker 1 (15:47):
Carbohydrates provide as well.
Speaker 3 (15:49):
Would you say that that's something that you see offered
in your clinic as well.
Speaker 1 (15:52):
Absolutely, And I think that what can be tricky to
understand metabolically is that, like you describe the sort of
situations with carbohydrate metabolism, because it doesn't necessarily make sense
that you think I'm eating less, why doesn't the body
lose weight? And it's because of an sort of intricate
metabolic system. So what happens is if carbohydrate intake and
(16:13):
calorie intake is so low, so say below twenty forty
grams of total carb which would be very much like
you said, a keto diet of say just eggs for breakfast,
china salad for lunch, and then meat and veggies for dinner.
In theory, you if your calories were controlled, you go
into ketosis where you're burning fat. So that's one scenario.
But then if your calories are too high and your
(16:36):
carbohydrate intake is far less than what the body needs,
so say a small female sixty kilos might need at
least one hundred, one hundred and twenty grams of carbohydrated
day at minimum. Then if they're exercising, the muscles need more.
So what happens is if you keep it below sort
of baseline and you're not in keytosis. So say you're
getting sixty eighty grams per day and you you are
(17:00):
only wanting to lose three or four kilos, metabolic rates slows,
and this is the no man's land I find myself
in with my clients, particularly if they're using a golp
one and they're not eating a lot. So they might
for breakfast have say a coffee and an egg on toast,
so that might be twenty grams of carb. Then at
lunch they might have some tuna crackers which might be
as little as ten grams of carb or a salad,
(17:21):
so that only takes them to say thirty, and then
they might have a snack of a cheese and crackers
in the afternoon or a nutbar again that might only
be ten grams of carbohydrate, so that takes you to
fifty or forty or fifty. And then at dinner, if
they've cut the carb you can see, you end up
in this no man's land, and if you're eighty one
hundred kilos, you probably need one hundred and twenty grams
(17:41):
of carbohydrate a day minimum to lose weight. And that's
why if you're on a golp one, even though you're
eating well, you're not losing weight. You've got this issue
with calories are OK, so you're not starving, but your
carbohydrate is in this no man's land zone. So what
I then do is try and rate it up and
get people up to around that one hundred one twenty.
(18:02):
But everyone's different because it's depending on your size, your level,
their activity, your age, your glucose and insulin function. But
I see it commonly, and I see it with my
very strict girls who are young and they might be
you know, one hundred and seventy centimeters and they're exercising
and walking the dog and going to pilates and they're
being super clean with their diet and yet and they're
(18:24):
you know, five foot ten, and they don't understand why
they're not leaning up. But the reason is that they're
compromising metabolism because they're too strict on their diet and
they're only getting eighty grams of carbon day. You know,
they're having almond milk and a coffee, so there's not
much carb in that, and they're eating sashimi and salad
for lunch or leftovers which is meat and veggies. And
again their carb might come in at eighty and they
think they're eating a lot, but that's why they're not
(18:45):
losing body fat. There's only two scenarios. If you're not
eating too much and not eating too much carbohydrate and
you're eating well, it has to be you're eating too little.
These are the only two scenarios, so it is worth
sticking it in my fitness power. And you might be
surprised that some days you may blow right out, and
this is what I see. I see people blowing out
to huge amounts and then other days not enough. It
(19:08):
doesn't work. You've got to have that consistency where you
might have one light day most days are what you need,
and then a couple of one or two days that
are higher and then you'll be in fat loss. But
that's the only answer. If you're not losing body fat,
chances are you're not having enough of the right mix
of fuel and possibly too many calories overall. And that's
the specificity that when you do see a dietitian you get.
(19:30):
That's what AI can't tell you. That's what people who
hand you a diet plan can't tell you. That's the difference,
because you'll get that specificity, and in many cases we'll
be retraining to burn body fat effectively and actually be
in fat loss versus maintenance or even gaining, which is
where many people find themselves. Yeah, one hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
And I think it's a really nice time to just say,
as well, winter is the best time to work with
a dietitian. We'll just give ourselves a cheeky little plug here, Susie.
Winter is the best time to work with dietitians because
you know, everyone kind of oh well, you know, we'll
start again in summer. Winter's the best time because there's
less social things happening, Like people are just less busy.
I actually find it's better to focus on the diet
(20:09):
and make some real results with your training as well.
So if you're looking to work with either Sez or myself,
reach out to us. And we've definitely got some openings
for winter because we actually find it's one of the
best times to really make some progress with your nutrition
because the reality is it's now dune heading into July.
If you're still struggling and trying to do it yourself,
you probably do need some support and accountability as well.
(20:29):
So Susie is at Susie Borrow dot com dot a
U and I'm at leanne Ward Nutrition dot com dot AU.
So reach out to us and we can have a
little chat. But the product of the week, Susie, is
an interesting one. I haven't sitting up in my pantry.
I have not tried it yet.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
Oh you bought it or did they send it to Mia?
Speaker 3 (20:46):
Picked it up the shelves? No, no, no, I bought it
from the shops.
Speaker 1 (20:49):
Yeah. Mia found she loves blueberries. She's loose maya.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
Yeah, I know you got You gotta worry when you
take it to the shop. So a lot of things
end up in the pantry. But she really likes this.
She loves porrogin, she loves blueberries. So I for thought
we'd give it a whorse. So I think they're at
Colson will Worse. They are the Uncle Toby's new protein
Quick oats. So we chose the blueberry maple pancake flavor
at the time of recording. They're actually half priced, so
they're three dollars fifty four eight sachets, which is actually
(21:14):
very budget friendly. But when they're not on Dale, they
are seven dollars, so I would be waiting until they're
half price, sousy. I did buy them half price just
this week actually, so three dollars fifty half price or
seven dollars for an eight pack.
Speaker 1 (21:26):
It's still you know, less.
Speaker 2 (21:27):
Than a dollar a serving. Now from an ingredient perspective. Now,
on the front of the pack, they've got a big
marketing statement saying eight grams of protein per serve. And
for reference, what are traditional instant oats, Like a packet
of instant oats are about three or four grams five
grams five five grams, okay, so that's a reference. And
obviously that's made on water, not milk. If you're going
to add half a couple so of milk to that,
you're going to get an extra If it's dairy milk,
(21:49):
you know, four five grams of.
Speaker 1 (21:50):
Protein boost to that.
Speaker 2 (21:51):
If you're using more of almond milk or something, you're
not really going to get much protein. So as a
base alone, eight grams is pretty strong. And when I
looked at the ingredient SUSI my first thought was where
is the agrams coming from? Expecting to see some sort
of protein powder or some sort of milk blend in there.
So the ingredients of fifty eight percent whole grain oats,
wheat gluten, sugar, and natural flavors, so only four ingredients
(22:14):
and reading the ingredient's list tells me that wheat gluten
is how they're getting the extra protein in. So essentially,
wheat gluten is like an ultra concentrated gluten protein. So
gluten itself is a protein, and you can concentrate it
and add it into products because it's super cheap and
it's very neutral tasting. You'll often see wheat gluten added
to things like breads or wraps or cereals to increase
(22:34):
that protein content without adding extra dairy products in such
as way or milk powder, and it blends pretty easily
as well. And wheat gluten itself is around seventy to
eighty percent protein from memory, so it's a good little
protein boost to a product. Obviously, this is not a
celia friendly product, but for those of you who tolerate
wheat just fine, it may be an option for you
(22:55):
to get a couple of extra grams in because it's
basically giving you about a three or four gram boost
of protein from standard traditional you know, just a packet
of normal oats, and when you add milk to that,
you can probably get yourself up close to about fifteen grams.
So nutrition information panel wise, as we said, there's eight
little sachets and a packet. One sachet is thirty five grams.
(23:15):
Five hundred and sixty kilo dules are served, so pretty
low calorie.
Speaker 1 (23:18):
I know. That's why I'm looking thinking is that incorrect?
Or let me check on the label because it says
nine grams, because I don't think they could claim high
protein if it had a little bit more. Yeah, so
the late so the front of packet says eight grams
and the label says nine grams. The Nutrition Information Panel
says nine grams. Weird anyway, we'll go with nine grams
fat total two grams which we wouldn't expect you know
(23:40):
much about in this product. Eighteen point eight grams of
carbohydrate for the sachet, with six point three grams of
that being sugar. One point nine grams of dietary fiber
predominantly coming from the rolled oaks, which is good, and
an insignificant amount of sodium fourteen milligrams, which is nothing.
So yeah, So I think ingredient wise, fine, fine.
Speaker 2 (23:57):
If you're looking for a couple of extra grams of
protein boost, I think this is a good option. I
would recommend it to my clients. But what I will say, Susie,
is that even though this is a slightly higher protein
option than most standard porridge saches, and let's be honest
with who doesn't love a quick sasho of porridge in winter,
it is not enough for most women for breakfast. If
your goal is fat loss or body recomposition. I'm working
(24:19):
with a lot of women at the moment, Susie, who
have goals around fat loss and body recomposition. Are you
leaning up, gaining some lean muscle mass, leaning out, toning out,
whatever you want to call it, basically dropping body fat
and putting on a little bit of lean muscle mass.
Fifteen grams of protein is not enough protein for breakfast. Okay,
So I've got if my ladies want to have this,
I'd get them to have that with a scoop of
(24:39):
designed by dieticians protein powder on the side to boost
that up. I'd get them to have that with a
bit of high protein yogurt on the side. I get
that it kind of defeats the purpose of a porridge
because you're like, why would I have porridge with yoga.
Speaker 1 (24:50):
It's kind of weird to have hot cold in the
middle of winter.
Speaker 2 (24:52):
But I just want to put it out there that
for most women, fifteen grams or nine grams of protein,
if you make it on water or almond milk, is
not enough protein. If you're giving this to a child,
no problem. But if you've got a growing teenage boy
who's sixteen, seventeen, eighteen, or you're a woman who's trying
to lose weight. Really, no matter what your age, but
even more so if you're over forty, you need to
(25:14):
be clocking in around that thirty grams of protein a
day for breakfast. Ideally, some of my ladies USY I
push higher thirty five to forty grams, depending on their goals,
but particularly if we have goals and body recomposition, I'm
a little bit higher in protein, particularly for breakfast, So
I think it's a good option for me. It's more
of that fast travel option. Hey, it's better than skipping breakfast,
but it's certainly not an everyday option. If the goal
(25:36):
is weight loss, I'd be wanting to pair that with
more protein. You could add a couple of eggs on
the side if you want, but again, porroge and eggs
bit of a weird combo. But to me, it's just
not quite there in terms of nutrition.
Speaker 1 (25:47):
What do you think, Well, it is almost twenty percent sugar,
so you know, even though per serve it's not that much,
it is eighteen percent sugar overall. And I think the
standout thing for me is it's only fifty eight percent
os Like, that's only just over half the packet is
giving you oats. The rest is sugar. So I think
that for active people on the go, I would use
the high protein milk with this. I think that can
(26:08):
be a great product if and I've been using it
more and more with my ladies who like cereal in
the morning. And I think there's a couple of different brands.
Complete Protein is one. It's not inexpensive, but it's a
very good product to bump protein out. So for example,
you could have some of that with your oats and
do a sort of milky oats and then have your
coffee on milk and you're easily then getting over thirty
grams of protein and still enjoying your cereal. So I'm
(26:31):
with you. I think that it is too high in
sugar for everyday product, and I think there are better
sachet oats out there, But I think that it is
cost effective, particularly when it's half priced. You know, some
of the brands out there who have no added sugar
don't go on half priced sale. So in this point
in time where the cost of living is so high
for people, if you're getting eight breakfast seraved for three
(26:53):
point fifty, I wouldn't have an issue with it if
you were getting enough protein and if you were quite active.
But if I had someone who struggled with sweet food
tended to have too much sugar overall, I might be
a little bit stricter on it. So I think it's
that middle ground, isn't it It sort of six seven
out of ten. There are better products, there are worse products,
but the key will be teaming it with more protein,
(27:14):
and certainly, if you can get it for three point fifty,
it's a very good price point. Yeah, absolutely, all right, Lenne.
Actually I had a little bit of feedback a few
months ago, we covered a product that was a high
protein oat. Do you remember that. It was like a
boutique brand. It was like twenty dollars in supermarket and
it sort of was a supplement company who'd put a
high protein oats into the mainstream cereal section. And I
(27:38):
think it was like twenty grams of protein per serve.
And we talked about it, and then we had feedback online.
People said it tasted terror, it wasn't good. But I've
got a client who loves it. I can't remember the
name of it, but I think it's Muscle Nation, Yeah,
and it's in the yellow box and it's, as I said,
not inexpensive. But I've got a client who travels regularly
for work. She's an executive, and she takes it with
(27:59):
her everywhere because even though it's got artificial sweetener in it,
it just means that no matter where she is in
the world, she's got a high protein breakfast option that
she can have with yogurt or milk from the breakfast buffet.
And it's really convenient, and I just it's a good
reminder that there's different strokes for different folks. There are
some products that will suit different people for different reasons,
and as we discussed, I discussed with her it's not
(28:20):
great with the sweetener, but you're using it occasionally and
it's fulfilling your dietary needs when you're traveling, so it's
great product and she likes it. So yeah, I thought
that was a little bit of feedback because a lot
of people had said it was terrible, but she actually
really likes it. So that's funny because all my clients
have said it was terrible.
Speaker 2 (28:35):
Yeah, so what I've started doing is using the better
quality quick oats and getting them to take a scuba
protein with them, shaking that up in cold water, then
just having the oats separately because then you're getting you know,
one hundred percent oats with a bit of cheer or
flax or something, so a bit of better quality. But
as you said, people have different taste preferences and profiles.
Speaker 1 (28:50):
So just because someone says it's awesome, just ease. If
you like it, it's one Sasha you don't have to mix.
So yeah, anyway, it was a bit of a follow up,
so we do take your feedback on around the products,
which I've got another point because our listener question is
all about what is the best frozen fish on the market.
And I remember as well, we reviewed. I think the
coals Perform high protein fish. Now I hadn't bought that
(29:11):
product because I either crumb mysell fish. I like plane filet. Really,
if I'm getting half price, I'll probably get my boys
like like a battered filet, like I usually get the
Bird's Eye. I think it's like fifty five percent fish,
maybe sixty. I think the highest crumbed or battered fish
out there, I think is about sixty percent, which is
(29:32):
I think that Sea Lord brand. But we'll talk about
what we think is the best in a minute. But
I also had client feedback that they'd bought the Coals
Perform and it was terrible. They didn't like it. So again,
each to their own. It's different tastes, isn't it. And
straight away I said to her, well, do you like
the steam fresh filets, because by far and away, the
best frozen fish in the supermarket is the steam fresh
(29:54):
filet with the sauce. So it's like that old fish
in a bag of the eighties and eighties and nineties,
but it's eighty percent fish with a source that I
find most clients really enjoy. So that is by far
and away the best. And then if you then go
down the rung to the crumbed options, they're all pretty similar. Yeah,
I think you had a summary of them. Yeah, yeah,
most of them.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
Basically, if you can find a crumbed or bad adoption
that's over about sixty percent, you're probably looking at the
top percentile at the supermarket. So most of it is
sitting around that sort of you know, sometimes as long
as forty, but mostly in that fifty percent range. Some
of the sixty percent brands are a little bit better,
as you said, the steam Fresh one, I think it's
Bird's Eye. There's a really nice tie red curry one
at clients of mine, quite like that. They deal with
(30:36):
some you know, Asian greens, broccolini that kind of thing,
and a bit of sort of brown rice on the side.
Speaker 1 (30:40):
It comes up really nicely.
Speaker 2 (30:42):
The problem is, I think it is from Vietnam, so
if you're after a strange fish, probably not the product
for you. The other two that we reviewed on the
podcast before, after going through most of the frozen fish
in the supermarket SUSI, they still hold strong. We reviewed
Findus months ago and see Lord the whole Mill crumb
years ago, I would say yea years ago on the podcast,
they are still two of the most outstanding filets in
(31:04):
terms of crumbing or battered in the frozen food section.
So the Finders, you got two lightly dusted fish filets.
They're eighty percent fish. They have a very very light dusting.
That's how they can actually get more fish in there.
A lot of them actually have quite thick batter or
quite a lot of crumbing on them, and that's why
the carbohydrate is a bit higher and the protein is
a lot lower. And then the Sea Lord New Zealand Hoki,
(31:26):
the homeal crumb. It's probably one of my favorites. If
I buy that for the girls, that's what I buy.
And the filets are quite big. My girl's only little,
so I split one of them between the two of them,
and so that one is sixty five percent fish, which
is really really strong, and these steam fresh tie red
curry ones are seventy four percent fish. The other one
that's actually not too bad is the Sea Lord one. Again,
if you want a batter, the Japanese style tempura batter
(31:49):
is quite strong, that sixty five percent. And you mentioned
Bird's Eye as well, So the steam fresh range is ideal.
But if you ask someone who wants a batter, there's
a Deli Barrey Mundi, which is a crisp, light batter
sixty percent fish, so that's pretty strong as well. So
basically the two best brands over all a Sea Lord
and bird s Eye. I feel like in the frozen
fish departments, if you go to those brands, you're probably
(32:10):
onto a good thing.
Speaker 1 (32:11):
If you're at.
Speaker 2 (32:12):
Aldi, there's that Ocean Royal brand. They do a cafe series.
The Lemon pepper ones actually sixty four percent crumb tokey,
so that's not bad as well. And you can find that.
Findus one that sort of sits right at the top
of the list. It is a little bit harder to find.
I think it's wool worse, but yeah, not as I
guess indulging as the other battered and crumb ones on
the market, because it is a very light dusting of
(32:33):
I don't know what is it crumbing anyway, So yeah,
so that's probably.
Speaker 1 (32:36):
The top ones. Can we talk about this one I've
never seen before, the Coal's wild caught fish fingers, which
is sixty five percent fish. Who would have thought?
Speaker 2 (32:46):
Okay, my question is at what calorie costs though, because
I always think like, when you've got a fill it
of fish, you're gonna get less crumbing than if you've
got individual fingers.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
Two five cows or how much fin though twoelve grams
for kids though, all right for kids, not for adults,
it's no. But yeah, it's hard to get the protein
up with fish, like, let's be honest, they're not high enough.
That's why you've got to try and get the steam
fresh if you can. But yeah, they're actually quite a
good product for you. Good And that was always on
(33:18):
I've got a fish fingers, no coals, coals, wild holes.
I'm happy with coals at the moment. They're doing a
lot of good stuff. So great. Well, there you go,
you had your first fish.
Speaker 3 (33:26):
Fish fingers are on the on the menu at coals
back on the.
Speaker 1 (33:33):
Not for adults, the kids exactly.
Speaker 2 (33:36):
Alrighty Well, that brings us to the end of nutrition
Gutch for another week. If you would like to support
the podcast, you can check out our range of science
back supplements at designed by dietitians dot com, created by
Susi and myself to make kelsy habits and getting in
adequate nutrients like protein creating and magnesium just that little
bit easier. We also do some fabulous collagen.
Speaker 3 (33:55):
We will see you on next week's podcast.
Speaker 1 (33:57):
Have a great week.
Speaker 2 (34:00):
A mand
Do you know how much carbohydrate you eat?
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Maybe you eat carbs at every meal, or maybe you
actively try and limit your calves, but you're not sure
if you're having enough. On today's episode of The Nutrition Couch,
we deep dive carbohydrates and share the signs that you
may be having too much or too little.
Speaker 1 (00:18):
Hi.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
I'm Leanne Wood and I'm Sissy Burrel, and together we
bring you The Nutrition Couch, your weekly podcast with everything
that you need to know in the world of nutrition
and as well as all things calves. PCOS has a
new name and we'll deep dive into that today. We
have a new high protein oat product purpose for winter,
and our listener question is all about frozen fish today.
(00:39):
So to kick us off today, Susie, Lately, PCOS has
had a bit of a name change, hasn't it. In
there was an article published in The Lanset on May
the twelfth this year that basically said that PCOS has
been changed to PMOS and it basically reflects the broader
polyendocrime disturbances that occur in this condition for women, including
(01:01):
things like insulin androgens, neuroendocrine and ovarian hormones as well.
So it basically highlights that it has more of a
metabolic impact on people's lives, more so than just the
ovariant impact which PCOS was really hyper focused on. So
the PMOS, the p is the polyendocrine system, which means
that there are multiple hormone systems involved. The M is metabolic,
(01:24):
which basically plays into the insulin, blood sugar regulation issues,
some weight regulation issues some women have, and metabolic health
in general. The O is similar to ovarian and the
SSSA and for syndrome which is the collection of symptoms
and features of PCOS which we now know is PMOS,
but it doesn't quite roll off the tongue as easily
(01:46):
does it now.
Speaker 1 (01:48):
It's super interesting actually deep diving why this change came about,
and it's not an insignificant number of women in Australia.
It's estimated between eight and thirteen percent of women suffer
from PMOS have profound effects on things like fertility, weight control, mood, energy,
and overall health and well being. So what I found
most fascinating was a review on why it was changed,
(02:10):
because it's kind of rare that you change a whole
name of something, but I guess it follows on from
what we know about women's health is that we're down
the wrong of priorities. I was listening to an American
podcast of Maria Shreiver from a couple of years back,
and I think she said the US budget for health
for women was something like eight to ten percent of
total health funding, like just phenomenally far short of where
(02:31):
it needs to be. And it follows on from that
whole history that we studied men's health in research studies,
it's men and women are way down the line despite
being I think fifty one percent of the population. So
we're slowly, slowly cottoning on. But the reason the name
change came about was that they said the term PCOS
was inaccurate because actually, contrary to popular opinion or belief
(02:54):
based on the name, there's no increase in abnormal A varianceists.
So we think about polycystic over is that there's more cysts,
and there's actually not. Rather, it says the condition is
based on the impact on the follicles or the developing cells,
or the fluid sacs that around partially developed eggs, and
this is where there's extra of those as opposed to
(03:15):
extra cysts. So I thought that was super interesting because
I didn't actually know that myself. But it's also taking
into account, as you described, the broader implications of the disease,
which means it can it basically increases inflammatory pathways, indirectly
impacting mood, fertility, weight gain, and can really be quite debilitating,
(03:36):
particularly for young women when it comes to acne excess
hair growth impacting their cycles and long term of course
the ability to conceive can be challenged. So yeah, basically
PMS is the new one. It doesn't, like you said,
roll off the tongue as easily. But I think that
it'll be interesting in the next few years to see
because often it came to light when people would go
(03:59):
to get pregnant and there was issues with cycle cycle length.
I think hopefully now we'll see more early identification and
management and treatment of it as a broader whole health perspective.
Going back twenty thirty years there was like one endochronologist
in Sydney who specialized in it. That was it, you know,
so certainly given the number of women it impacts, you know,
(04:20):
this is one or two people in every ten fifteen,
we know it's not insignificant. So yeah, that was I
thought worth discussing. Knowing that a lot of our listeners, well,
not a lot of our listeners, but a significant umber
our listeners are interested in this, and it's also one
of the reasons that we put inocetol in our women's
protein for design by dietitians because there is some clinical
(04:41):
evidence to show that an ocetol as a supplement can
benefit women with PMOS. And certainly it's a higher protein,
lower carbohydrate diet, a particular focus on nutrient density, high
anti inflammatory eating, high in amega threes, and inositol does
have some benefits to improve cycle frequency and and regularity.
So yeah, I thought it was just a topic good
(05:03):
worth discussing and something that does have profound effects in
terms of the way we eat, because ultimately it's not
always something that can be medically managed. No, it's often
lifestyle that is impacting inflammatory pathways. There's often a genetic component.
It does impact indirectly in sulin and glucose level, so
as such can be sort of managed from a weight perspective.
(05:24):
But what this new naming says is that it's, like
you said, multisystem variables and diet is a huge component
of actually managing it long term as opposed to there's
not a medication you can just take to fix this.
You know, it's about managing it from a lifestyle perspective
and as such, anti inflammatory styles of eating and targeting
(05:46):
metabolic efficiency, which takes time. You know, if you're helping
someone with PMOS, it might take six twelve months, but
yet that's what you're working on over time, is reducing
the inflammatory load of the diet, superloading key nutrients that
are shown to be beneficial at reducing inflammation and inflammatory pathways,
and then setting themselves up for success long term, because
(06:07):
on one hand, you've got the late teenagers who first
of all notice issues with their cycle and maybe diagnosed early.
And then you have the goals in their twenties who
might be struggling with things like the acne, the abnormal
hair growth, and then women in their twenties and thirties
looking at fertility. But then it's managing it through the
lifespan that once people are getting to the perian menopausal years,
(06:28):
making sure that the reduction in estrogen is not being
exacerbated by the PMOS, and then setting themselves up long
term for hormonal control when they at much higher risk
of things like type two diabetes so it's really a
long term approach to women with hormone issues, and it
just encapsulates that broader system perspective of it. So, yeah,
it was it was certainly interesting. Did you read much
(06:49):
else on it when it came through?
Speaker 2 (06:51):
Yeah, I was reading a bit about it, and what
I was reading was that it hasn't like officially officially
had a proper name change, Like it's not like we're
going to see it. You know, all the journals be
re up as pomos, and you know, it takes time,
particularly worldwide, for a lot of these medical studies and
research in things to really adopt new changes. So I
think it'll be filtered through over the next dare I
(07:12):
say five to ten years even? But I do think,
as you mentioned, it is so important for women because
it's not just simply a fertility issue. It's not simply
like a period problem. There are profound metabolic effects that
a lot of women experience with pomos, and like you said,
actually linking in with a diegesim is so so incredibly
important if you do have pmos because of things like
(07:35):
insulin resistance, blood sugar regulation, long term cardiovascular health issues,
and just the overall metabolic risk as well, which is
really it is central to the condition. So I am
all for the name change. I think it is really
a positive step in the right direction. It may not
sound as recognizable as PCOS. It may take some time
to filter through, you know, the medical kind of world itself,
(07:57):
but I do think that the women, it is a
broader encompassing of the condition and the things that so
many women struggle with. It's not simply oh, you can't
get pregnant, you've got PCOS. This is a broader metabolic
syndrome that there is actually a lot that can be
done from a lifestyle and a medical perspective. So I
think PMOS just doesn't roll up the tunges easy, suzy.
(08:18):
PMOS is a positive step in the right direction.
Speaker 1 (08:21):
Definitely too true, all rightly. And one other thing I
wanted to talk about today, I'll give you a lead
in before I hand over, was that in the last
few weeks I've had several clients who have been following
sort of their meal well following their meal pan loosely,
but they've been being so strict with their food that
I said to them, I think you're actually eating too
(08:42):
few carbohydrates and in their quest to be super healthy
and cut out sort of processed food and a lot
of snacks. When I've put their diets through my fitness power,
they're having sort of sixty eighty grams of carbohydrate per day,
and unfortunately, as we know, that is too low, because
it is entirely possible to eat to little carbohydrate. And
I find with clients who are very strict with themselves
(09:04):
and who exercise a lot, and who might be wanting
just to lean up a few kilos, they're shocked and
surprised to hear that they're actually not eating enough. So
this actually is a real thing, isn't it?
Speaker 2 (09:15):
In one hundred percent is and it might, I guess,
be shocking for some people to hear that carbohydrates are
not actually technically essential. They are very beneficial, but unlike
protein and fat, carbohydrates are not technically essential for survival.
There are some people that exist on extremely low, you know,
ketogenic diets for perhaps conditions like epilepsy for example. So
(09:36):
they're not actually essential, but they absolutely particularly for women,
and hormones are hugely, hugely beneficial. And if you put
a thousand women in front of me, I'd say, you know,
ninety nine point nine percent of them would benefit from
an adequate amount of the right type of carbohydrates because
carbs are actually the body's preferred fuel source. So yes,
the body can utilize protein in fat and basically switch
(09:58):
that into carbohydrate for that you know, quicker energy, but
it's a longer pathway. The body doesn't like to do that.
It actually prefers to use carbohydrate as the primary fuel source,
and in particular the brain, the brain uses glucose as
it's preferred fuel source as well. And then when we
talk about exercise, carbohydrates support exercise second to none. Again, yes,
(10:18):
you can be fat adapted, you can utilize some protein
when you're exercising, but it is not an efficient way
to do it. Carbohydrates absolutely are just preferred by the body,
and they also help preserve muscle mass post training. And
of course we know they provide lots of things like vitamins, minerals, fiber,
all that sorts of things. So from a gut health perspective,
a digestive health perspective, carbohydrates are essential as well. But
(10:42):
what I see, and I'm sure that you're very similar,
Susie with your clients, with my women, The problem is
in carbohydrate themselves, right, The problem is the type of
carbohydrate and the amount of carbohydrate. Nobody is out here
saying that bread is bad or pasta is bad, or
potato is bad. But if you're going to deep fry
your potatoes, leather it in sour cream, topple with bacon
(11:02):
and cheese, you know, we may have a problem if
that's happening too regularly. So it's not that carbs itself
are bad. And I think that with the rise of
social media being twenty twenty six, I think that message
is finally getting through that carbohydrates are important, but it
is really the right type of carbohydrate. So one of
the biggest things I see is that many women are
actually under eating what we call quality carbohydrates, the right
(11:26):
types of carbohydrates, and particularly women are doing this in
their quest to lose weight basically, or that you know,
there may be women in perimenopause I've heard reducing carbohydrates
may be a good thing, or they've just got like
a chronic kind of dieting background where they're constantly cutting
carbs on, keto off keto, that kind of thing. So
if you are under eating your quality carbohydrates. Signs that
(11:48):
somebody may experience would just be ongoing fatigue. And that's
you know, when things blood tests have been done, your
in's fine, but you still have just have ongoing fatigue.
You've got really poor exercise performance. You're just not able
to progress in your exercise or training or lift a
little bit heavier. You experience regular or constant cravings. You
may have difficulty concentrating, you may just often feel constantly hungry,
(12:12):
even though you have eaten a decent sized meal. You
just never really feel satisfied, and you don't really recover
properly from exercise either. Now a lot of women are
underdoing the carbohydrates when they're doing things such as intimate
and fasting, skipping breakfast, just having a salad with lunch.
You know, worried about the sugar in fruits, so they're
(12:32):
not having any fruit, and they're worried about, you know,
say the sugar in sweet potatoes, so they're not including
that in their meal.
Speaker 1 (12:38):
Or they're just having.
Speaker 2 (12:39):
Really really really tiny portions of rice or pasta because
they're almost fearful of the carbohydrates. So that's one scenario
where I see women are under eating what we call
the good quality cubs. And then often what I feel
that's coupled with is at the same time, they're under
eating the good quality cubs, but a lot of women
are overdoing what we call the refined carbohydrates. Right, So
(13:03):
overall they may be getting in enough carp but it's
not matched properly, right, they're underdoing the good quality carbs
and overdoing the refined ones. And by refined carbohydrates, we're
talking about things like biscuits, cakes, muffins, chips, lollies, sugary drinks,
juice is smoothies, you know, the bubble teas, pastries, really
highly processed snack foods. Even things like rice crackers we
(13:24):
would not define as a really good quality carb.
Speaker 1 (13:26):
Right.
Speaker 2 (13:27):
So I guess what I'm trying to say is a
lot of women are so fearful of eating rice in
their lunch or having too much potato at dinner. Yet
then they're downing half a block of chocolate at night time,
or they're having an ice cream every single night, or
they're having biscuits with their tea every single day, or
a croissant or a muffin with their coffee most mornings.
So I guess for a lot of it's it's not
(13:47):
where you know, we're fearful of the good types of
carbs and we forget about the other types of carbs
that are slipping in. Basically, so what I think needs
to happen more is matching your carbs to your needs
and finding that sweet spot can be a little bit
difficult because it is different for everybody. Right If you
had a client who walked three times a week and
that was as much exercise as they did, their carbohydrate
(14:09):
needs are very different to somebody who might be training
CrossFit or fitstop, that high intensity type conditioning in heavyweight,
say five days a week, or prepping for their first marathon,
or postpartum and breastfeeding, or you've got teenage boys who
are growing. Their carbohydrate needs are very very different to
someone who has a desk job and might just walk
a couple of times a week. So carbohydrate needs are
(14:31):
very very individualized. But as Susie said, as dietitians, we
like to have a quality carbohydrate source in our main
meals and then we can think about including some of
it in our stacking as well. But what we see
in a lot of our women and we're dropping it
out of main meals, and then we're having too much
of the overly processed carb in a snack time and
after dinner. So when you think about a quality carve
(14:52):
source at breakfast, think about things like rolledoats, a whole
grain cereal, a grainy ceedy bread or toast, and some
fruit onto your breakfast. When you think about lunch, you
can use a whole grain bread. We're not huge fans
of wraps because they are a bit more processed, even
though they are convenient.
Speaker 1 (15:07):
My preference is always for a dense seeded bread.
Speaker 2 (15:10):
Things like brown rice, kinoa, sweet potato, of beans or
legumes great carbohydrates sources at lunch time and they carry
through to dinner as well. You might want to also
include a bit of rice, kinoir pasta, different types of legumes.
So there, when we say good quality carbohydrates, they're the
ones we want you focusing on, not skipping carbet lunch,
inhaling two or three rows of rice crackers that afternoon tea,
(15:31):
and then skipping carbohydrate at dinner again, because that's where
we start to see our women running into problems where
overall they may be getting in enough, but the carbohydrate
is going into the bloodstream far too quickly. You don't
have the fiber there to support the gut health, and
you're not getting a lot of the micro nutrients that quality.
Speaker 1 (15:47):
Carbohydrates provide as well.
Speaker 3 (15:49):
Would you say that that's something that you see offered
in your clinic as well.
Speaker 1 (15:52):
Absolutely, And I think that what can be tricky to
understand metabolically is that, like you describe the sort of
situations with carbohydrate metabolism, because it doesn't necessarily make sense
that you think I'm eating less, why doesn't the body
lose weight? And it's because of an sort of intricate
metabolic system. So what happens is if carbohydrate intake and
(16:13):
calorie intake is so low, so say below twenty forty
grams of total carb which would be very much like
you said, a keto diet of say just eggs for breakfast,
china salad for lunch, and then meat and veggies for dinner.
In theory, you if your calories were controlled, you go
into ketosis where you're burning fat. So that's one scenario.
But then if your calories are too high and your
(16:36):
carbohydrate intake is far less than what the body needs,
so say a small female sixty kilos might need at
least one hundred, one hundred and twenty grams of carbohydrated
day at minimum. Then if they're exercising, the muscles need more.
So what happens is if you keep it below sort
of baseline and you're not in keytosis. So say you're
getting sixty eighty grams per day and you you are
(17:00):
only wanting to lose three or four kilos, metabolic rates slows,
and this is the no man's land I find myself
in with my clients, particularly if they're using a golp
one and they're not eating a lot. So they might
for breakfast have say a coffee and an egg on toast,
so that might be twenty grams of carb. Then at
lunch they might have some tuna crackers which might be
as little as ten grams of carb or a salad,
(17:21):
so that only takes them to say thirty, and then
they might have a snack of a cheese and crackers
in the afternoon or a nutbar again that might only
be ten grams of carbohydrate, so that takes you to
fifty or forty or fifty. And then at dinner, if
they've cut the carb you can see, you end up
in this no man's land, and if you're eighty one
hundred kilos, you probably need one hundred and twenty grams
(17:41):
of carbohydrate a day minimum to lose weight. And that's
why if you're on a golp one, even though you're
eating well, you're not losing weight. You've got this issue
with calories are OK, so you're not starving, but your
carbohydrate is in this no man's land zone. So what
I then do is try and rate it up and
get people up to around that one hundred one twenty.
(18:02):
But everyone's different because it's depending on your size, your level,
their activity, your age, your glucose and insulin function. But
I see it commonly, and I see it with my
very strict girls who are young and they might be
you know, one hundred and seventy centimeters and they're exercising
and walking the dog and going to pilates and they're
being super clean with their diet and yet and they're
(18:24):
you know, five foot ten, and they don't understand why
they're not leaning up. But the reason is that they're
compromising metabolism because they're too strict on their diet and
they're only getting eighty grams of carbon day. You know,
they're having almond milk and a coffee, so there's not
much carb in that, and they're eating sashimi and salad
for lunch or leftovers which is meat and veggies. And
again their carb might come in at eighty and they
think they're eating a lot, but that's why they're not
(18:45):
losing body fat. There's only two scenarios. If you're not
eating too much and not eating too much carbohydrate and
you're eating well, it has to be you're eating too little.
These are the only two scenarios, so it is worth
sticking it in my fitness power. And you might be
surprised that some days you may blow right out, and
this is what I see. I see people blowing out
to huge amounts and then other days not enough. It
(19:08):
doesn't work. You've got to have that consistency where you
might have one light day most days are what you need,
and then a couple of one or two days that
are higher and then you'll be in fat loss. But
that's the only answer. If you're not losing body fat,
chances are you're not having enough of the right mix
of fuel and possibly too many calories overall. And that's
the specificity that when you do see a dietitian you get.
(19:30):
That's what AI can't tell you. That's what people who
hand you a diet plan can't tell you. That's the difference,
because you'll get that specificity, and in many cases we'll
be retraining to burn body fat effectively and actually be
in fat loss versus maintenance or even gaining, which is
where many people find themselves. Yeah, one hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
And I think it's a really nice time to just say,
as well, winter is the best time to work with
a dietitian. We'll just give ourselves a cheeky little plug here, Susie.
Winter is the best time to work with dietitians because
you know, everyone kind of oh well, you know, we'll
start again in summer. Winter's the best time because there's
less social things happening, Like people are just less busy.
I actually find it's better to focus on the diet
(20:09):
and make some real results with your training as well.
So if you're looking to work with either Sez or myself,
reach out to us. And we've definitely got some openings
for winter because we actually find it's one of the
best times to really make some progress with your nutrition
because the reality is it's now dune heading into July.
If you're still struggling and trying to do it yourself,
you probably do need some support and accountability as well.
(20:29):
So Susie is at Susie Borrow dot com dot a
U and I'm at leanne Ward Nutrition dot com dot AU.
So reach out to us and we can have a
little chat. But the product of the week, Susie, is
an interesting one. I haven't sitting up in my pantry.
I have not tried it yet.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
Oh you bought it or did they send it to Mia?
Speaker 3 (20:46):
Picked it up the shelves? No, no, no, I bought it
from the shops.
Speaker 1 (20:49):
Yeah. Mia found she loves blueberries. She's loose maya.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
Yeah, I know you got You gotta worry when you
take it to the shop. So a lot of things
end up in the pantry. But she really likes this.
She loves porrogin, she loves blueberries. So I for thought
we'd give it a whorse. So I think they're at
Colson will Worse. They are the Uncle Toby's new protein
Quick oats. So we chose the blueberry maple pancake flavor
at the time of recording. They're actually half priced, so
they're three dollars fifty four eight sachets, which is actually
(21:14):
very budget friendly. But when they're not on Dale, they
are seven dollars, so I would be waiting until they're
half price, sousy. I did buy them half price just
this week actually, so three dollars fifty half price or
seven dollars for an eight pack.
Speaker 1 (21:26):
It's still you know, less.
Speaker 2 (21:27):
Than a dollar a serving. Now from an ingredient perspective. Now,
on the front of the pack, they've got a big
marketing statement saying eight grams of protein per serve. And
for reference, what are traditional instant oats, Like a packet
of instant oats are about three or four grams five
grams five five grams, okay, so that's a reference. And
obviously that's made on water, not milk. If you're going
to add half a couple so of milk to that,
you're going to get an extra If it's dairy milk,
(21:49):
you know, four five grams of.
Speaker 1 (21:50):
Protein boost to that.
Speaker 2 (21:51):
If you're using more of almond milk or something, you're
not really going to get much protein. So as a
base alone, eight grams is pretty strong. And when I
looked at the ingredient SUSI my first thought was where
is the agrams coming from? Expecting to see some sort
of protein powder or some sort of milk blend in there.
So the ingredients of fifty eight percent whole grain oats,
wheat gluten, sugar, and natural flavors, so only four ingredients
(22:14):
and reading the ingredient's list tells me that wheat gluten
is how they're getting the extra protein in. So essentially,
wheat gluten is like an ultra concentrated gluten protein. So
gluten itself is a protein, and you can concentrate it
and add it into products because it's super cheap and
it's very neutral tasting. You'll often see wheat gluten added
to things like breads or wraps or cereals to increase
(22:34):
that protein content without adding extra dairy products in such
as way or milk powder, and it blends pretty easily
as well. And wheat gluten itself is around seventy to
eighty percent protein from memory, so it's a good little
protein boost to a product. Obviously, this is not a
celia friendly product, but for those of you who tolerate
wheat just fine, it may be an option for you
(22:55):
to get a couple of extra grams in because it's
basically giving you about a three or four gram boost
of protein from standard traditional you know, just a packet
of normal oats, and when you add milk to that,
you can probably get yourself up close to about fifteen grams.
So nutrition information panel wise, as we said, there's eight
little sachets and a packet. One sachet is thirty five grams.
(23:15):
Five hundred and sixty kilo dules are served, so pretty
low calorie.
Speaker 1 (23:18):
I know. That's why I'm looking thinking is that incorrect?
Or let me check on the label because it says
nine grams, because I don't think they could claim high
protein if it had a little bit more. Yeah, so
the late so the front of packet says eight grams
and the label says nine grams. The Nutrition Information Panel
says nine grams. Weird anyway, we'll go with nine grams
fat total two grams which we wouldn't expect you know
(23:40):
much about in this product. Eighteen point eight grams of
carbohydrate for the sachet, with six point three grams of
that being sugar. One point nine grams of dietary fiber
predominantly coming from the rolled oaks, which is good, and
an insignificant amount of sodium fourteen milligrams, which is nothing.
So yeah, So I think ingredient wise, fine, fine.
Speaker 2 (23:57):
If you're looking for a couple of extra grams of
protein boost, I think this is a good option. I
would recommend it to my clients. But what I will say, Susie,
is that even though this is a slightly higher protein
option than most standard porridge saches, and let's be honest
with who doesn't love a quick sasho of porridge in winter,
it is not enough for most women for breakfast. If
your goal is fat loss or body recomposition. I'm working
(24:19):
with a lot of women at the moment, Susie, who
have goals around fat loss and body recomposition. Are you
leaning up, gaining some lean muscle mass, leaning out, toning out,
whatever you want to call it, basically dropping body fat
and putting on a little bit of lean muscle mass.
Fifteen grams of protein is not enough protein for breakfast. Okay,
So I've got if my ladies want to have this,
I'd get them to have that with a scoop of
(24:39):
designed by dieticians protein powder on the side to boost
that up. I'd get them to have that with a
bit of high protein yogurt on the side. I get
that it kind of defeats the purpose of a porridge
because you're like, why would I have porridge with yoga.
Speaker 1 (24:50):
It's kind of weird to have hot cold in the
middle of winter.
Speaker 2 (24:52):
But I just want to put it out there that
for most women, fifteen grams or nine grams of protein,
if you make it on water or almond milk, is
not enough protein. If you're giving this to a child,
no problem. But if you've got a growing teenage boy
who's sixteen, seventeen, eighteen, or you're a woman who's trying
to lose weight. Really, no matter what your age, but
even more so if you're over forty, you need to
(25:14):
be clocking in around that thirty grams of protein a
day for breakfast. Ideally, some of my ladies USY I
push higher thirty five to forty grams, depending on their goals,
but particularly if we have goals and body recomposition, I'm
a little bit higher in protein, particularly for breakfast, So
I think it's a good option for me. It's more
of that fast travel option. Hey, it's better than skipping breakfast,
but it's certainly not an everyday option. If the goal
(25:36):
is weight loss, I'd be wanting to pair that with
more protein. You could add a couple of eggs on
the side if you want, but again, porroge and eggs
bit of a weird combo. But to me, it's just
not quite there in terms of nutrition.
Speaker 1 (25:47):
What do you think, Well, it is almost twenty percent sugar,
so you know, even though per serve it's not that much,
it is eighteen percent sugar overall. And I think the
standout thing for me is it's only fifty eight percent
os Like, that's only just over half the packet is
giving you oats. The rest is sugar. So I think
that for active people on the go, I would use
the high protein milk with this. I think that can
(26:08):
be a great product if and I've been using it
more and more with my ladies who like cereal in
the morning. And I think there's a couple of different brands.
Complete Protein is one. It's not inexpensive, but it's a
very good product to bump protein out. So for example,
you could have some of that with your oats and
do a sort of milky oats and then have your
coffee on milk and you're easily then getting over thirty
grams of protein and still enjoying your cereal. So I'm
(26:31):
with you. I think that it is too high in
sugar for everyday product, and I think there are better
sachet oats out there, But I think that it is
cost effective, particularly when it's half priced. You know, some
of the brands out there who have no added sugar
don't go on half priced sale. So in this point
in time where the cost of living is so high
for people, if you're getting eight breakfast seraved for three
(26:53):
point fifty, I wouldn't have an issue with it if
you were getting enough protein and if you were quite active.
But if I had someone who struggled with sweet food
tended to have too much sugar overall, I might be
a little bit stricter on it. So I think it's
that middle ground, isn't it It sort of six seven
out of ten. There are better products, there are worse products,
but the key will be teaming it with more protein,
(27:14):
and certainly, if you can get it for three point fifty,
it's a very good price point. Yeah, absolutely, all right, Lenne.
Actually I had a little bit of feedback a few
months ago, we covered a product that was a high
protein oat. Do you remember that. It was like a
boutique brand. It was like twenty dollars in supermarket and
it sort of was a supplement company who'd put a
high protein oats into the mainstream cereal section. And I
(27:38):
think it was like twenty grams of protein per serve.
And we talked about it, and then we had feedback online.
People said it tasted terror, it wasn't good. But I've
got a client who loves it. I can't remember the
name of it, but I think it's Muscle Nation, Yeah,
and it's in the yellow box and it's, as I said,
not inexpensive. But I've got a client who travels regularly
for work. She's an executive, and she takes it with
(27:59):
her everywhere because even though it's got artificial sweetener in it,
it just means that no matter where she is in
the world, she's got a high protein breakfast option that
she can have with yogurt or milk from the breakfast buffet.
And it's really convenient, and I just it's a good
reminder that there's different strokes for different folks. There are
some products that will suit different people for different reasons,
and as we discussed, I discussed with her it's not
(28:20):
great with the sweetener, but you're using it occasionally and
it's fulfilling your dietary needs when you're traveling, so it's
great product and she likes it. So yeah, I thought
that was a little bit of feedback because a lot
of people had said it was terrible, but she actually
really likes it. So that's funny because all my clients
have said it was terrible.
Speaker 2 (28:35):
Yeah, so what I've started doing is using the better
quality quick oats and getting them to take a scuba
protein with them, shaking that up in cold water, then
just having the oats separately because then you're getting you know,
one hundred percent oats with a bit of cheer or
flax or something, so a bit of better quality. But
as you said, people have different taste preferences and profiles.
Speaker 1 (28:50):
So just because someone says it's awesome, just ease. If
you like it, it's one Sasha you don't have to mix.
So yeah, anyway, it was a bit of a follow up,
so we do take your feedback on around the products,
which I've got another point because our listener question is
all about what is the best frozen fish on the market.
And I remember as well, we reviewed. I think the
coals Perform high protein fish. Now I hadn't bought that
(29:11):
product because I either crumb mysell fish. I like plane filet. Really,
if I'm getting half price, I'll probably get my boys
like like a battered filet, like I usually get the
Bird's Eye. I think it's like fifty five percent fish,
maybe sixty. I think the highest crumbed or battered fish
out there, I think is about sixty percent, which is
(29:32):
I think that Sea Lord brand. But we'll talk about
what we think is the best in a minute. But
I also had client feedback that they'd bought the Coals
Perform and it was terrible. They didn't like it. So again,
each to their own. It's different tastes, isn't it. And
straight away I said to her, well, do you like
the steam fresh filets, because by far and away, the
best frozen fish in the supermarket is the steam fresh
(29:54):
filet with the sauce. So it's like that old fish
in a bag of the eighties and eighties and nineties,
but it's eighty percent fish with a source that I
find most clients really enjoy. So that is by far
and away the best. And then if you then go
down the rung to the crumbed options, they're all pretty similar. Yeah,
I think you had a summary of them. Yeah, yeah,
most of them.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
Basically, if you can find a crumbed or bad adoption
that's over about sixty percent, you're probably looking at the
top percentile at the supermarket. So most of it is
sitting around that sort of you know, sometimes as long
as forty, but mostly in that fifty percent range. Some
of the sixty percent brands are a little bit better,
as you said, the steam Fresh one, I think it's
Bird's Eye. There's a really nice tie red curry one
at clients of mine, quite like that. They deal with
(30:36):
some you know, Asian greens, broccolini that kind of thing,
and a bit of sort of brown rice on the side.
Speaker 1 (30:40):
It comes up really nicely.
Speaker 2 (30:42):
The problem is, I think it is from Vietnam, so
if you're after a strange fish, probably not the product
for you. The other two that we reviewed on the
podcast before, after going through most of the frozen fish
in the supermarket SUSI, they still hold strong. We reviewed
Findus months ago and see Lord the whole Mill crumb
years ago, I would say yea years ago on the podcast,
they are still two of the most outstanding filets in
(31:04):
terms of crumbing or battered in the frozen food section.
So the Finders, you got two lightly dusted fish filets.
They're eighty percent fish. They have a very very light dusting.
That's how they can actually get more fish in there.
A lot of them actually have quite thick batter or
quite a lot of crumbing on them, and that's why
the carbohydrate is a bit higher and the protein is
a lot lower. And then the Sea Lord New Zealand Hoki,
(31:26):
the homeal crumb. It's probably one of my favorites. If
I buy that for the girls, that's what I buy.
And the filets are quite big. My girl's only little,
so I split one of them between the two of them,
and so that one is sixty five percent fish, which
is really really strong, and these steam fresh tie red
curry ones are seventy four percent fish. The other one
that's actually not too bad is the Sea Lord one. Again,
if you want a batter, the Japanese style tempura batter
(31:49):
is quite strong, that sixty five percent. And you mentioned
Bird's Eye as well, So the steam fresh range is ideal.
But if you ask someone who wants a batter, there's
a Deli Barrey Mundi, which is a crisp, light batter
sixty percent fish, so that's pretty strong as well. So
basically the two best brands over all a Sea Lord
and bird s Eye. I feel like in the frozen
fish departments, if you go to those brands, you're probably
(32:10):
onto a good thing.
Speaker 1 (32:11):
If you're at.
Speaker 2 (32:12):
Aldi, there's that Ocean Royal brand. They do a cafe series.
The Lemon pepper ones actually sixty four percent crumb tokey,
so that's not bad as well. And you can find that.
Findus one that sort of sits right at the top
of the list. It is a little bit harder to find.
I think it's wool worse, but yeah, not as I
guess indulging as the other battered and crumb ones on
the market, because it is a very light dusting of
(32:33):
I don't know what is it crumbing anyway, So yeah,
so that's probably.
Speaker 1 (32:36):
The top ones. Can we talk about this one I've
never seen before, the Coal's wild caught fish fingers, which
is sixty five percent fish. Who would have thought?
Speaker 2 (32:46):
Okay, my question is at what calorie costs though, because
I always think like, when you've got a fill it
of fish, you're gonna get less crumbing than if you've
got individual fingers.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
Two five cows or how much fin though twoelve grams
for kids though, all right for kids, not for adults,
it's no. But yeah, it's hard to get the protein
up with fish, like, let's be honest, they're not high enough.
That's why you've got to try and get the steam
fresh if you can. But yeah, they're actually quite a
good product for you. Good And that was always on
(33:18):
I've got a fish fingers, no coals, coals, wild holes.
I'm happy with coals at the moment. They're doing a
lot of good stuff. So great. Well, there you go,
you had your first fish.
Speaker 3 (33:26):
Fish fingers are on the on the menu at coals
back on the.
Speaker 1 (33:33):
Not for adults, the kids exactly.
Speaker 2 (33:36):
Alrighty Well, that brings us to the end of nutrition
Gutch for another week. If you would like to support
the podcast, you can check out our range of science
back supplements at designed by dietitians dot com, created by
Susi and myself to make kelsy habits and getting in
adequate nutrients like protein creating and magnesium just that little
bit easier. We also do some fabulous collagen.
Speaker 3 (33:55):
We will see you on next week's podcast.
Speaker 1 (33:57):
Have a great week.
Speaker 2 (34:00):
A mand
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