Fast food chains are now launching burgers with 80 grams of protein and calling it high performance. But is that actually good for you, or has the protein craze officially gone too far?
This week Leanne and Susie answer the question the fitness industry does not want to talk about: how much protein is actually too much, what your body does with the excess, and why the race to push protein higher in every product on the market is starting to work against the very goals it claims to support.
Then they cover a brand new study published in JAMA Network Open that identified two very different dietary patterns linked to weight management through the menopausal years, including one that most people have never heard of and that contradicts almost everything being said about menopause diets online right now.
In this episode:
- The new Grilled High Performance burger range: 80 grams of protein, over 700 calories, and why Leanne thinks even her beloved Grilled has gone too far with this one
- How much protein the body can actually utilise in a single meal, why the old 30-gram rule has been updated by recent research, and what happens to protein calories your body does not need
- Why small women are often overdoing protein at the expense of good fats, and why the macronutrient ratio matters as much as the total protein number
- A brand new 12-year study of over 38,000 women from the Nurses Health Study published in JAMA Network Open: the two dietary patterns most effective at preventing weight gain through the menopausal years, and why their results are surprisingly contradictory
- The planetary health diet and the low insulinaemic diet: what they actually are, how differently they approach carbohydrate and fat, and what Susie thinks the contrasting results reveal about the two main metabolic subtypes in perimenopause and menopause
- Why there is still no single magic menopause diet, and why working with a dietitian to personalise macronutrient ratios to your own glucose regulation and metabolic response remains the most effective approach
- A high-fiber vanilla custard from the South Australian Gourmet Food Company reviewed: who this product is actually for, why inulin is not Leanne's favourite fiber type for digestive health, and why she would reach for kiwi fruit or oats first
- How to take collagen and creatine consistently every day without having to force yourself to drink a shake: the coffee method, the yogurt method, the supplement stack, and why the research really does require eight to twelve weeks of daily use before results appear
- Why collagen peptides dissolve perfectly well in hot drinks despite what you may have heard, and the simple trick for avoiding clumping
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
There is a brand new range of high protein burgers
at a popular fast food chain that have more than
80 grams of protein per burger. And while that might
sound like a good thing, it does prompt us to
ask how much protein is actually too much.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
Hi, I'm Susie Burrell.
Speaker 3 (00:19):
And I'm Leanne Ward.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
And together we bring you The Nutrition Couch, the weekly
podcast that keeps you up to date with everything you
need to know in the world of nutrition. as well
as how much protein is too much, we have some
new research on the best.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Diet for menopause.
Speaker 1 (00:32):
We have a supermarket custard to review, and our listener
question is all about making supplement intake a little bit easier. So, Leanne,
I don't know if you got this media release, but
I got this media came through from, I can say
it's grilled.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
It wasn't a secret. Was it grilled? Yeah.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
Oh, God.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Yeah, it was grilled. Doing well today.
Speaker 1 (00:54):
And The PR person was very, very excited because they
had a few menu items that had higher protein varieties.
And the one that stuck out to me was that
it had 80 grams of protein. And I straight away
asked the PR girl, what was the calories on that?
(01:14):
Because whilst protein in isolation might be considered a good, strong,
positive nutrient, ultimately anything that's got that many grams of
any nutrient in it is going to have a significant
calorie load. And sure enough, I think from memory, it
was seven or 800 calories for this.
Speaker 2 (01:31):
Wrap or burger or whatever it was.
Speaker 1 (01:33):
But when we discussed it, you had said to me,
I think it's worth talking about how much is too much.
And I think that's a really good topic because we're
really being programmed to believe that more is better. And
we've certainly been seeing this from fast food outlets, Subway, Grilled,
you know, they're really focusing on higher protein meals.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Eljana's another one.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
Coming in, this has got so many grams of protein,
but it's sort of just ignoring the fact that it's
not about having more and more and more. You can
certainly have too much for a couple of reasons. So
I'm going to hand over to you to take us
through why more is certainly not better, particularly for small females.
Speaker 3 (02:10):
Yeah. And look, let's be honest. I will never talk
bad about my beloved grilled. Anyone who listens to the
podcast knows that I'm obsessed with grilled. However, I don't
like this new range, Susie. It's called their new high
performance range and they market it as high protein, low sugar,
nutrient stacked. And they've got some clever marketing. I'll be honest.
Like one of the burgers you were talking about is
a protein pro it's 3000 kilojoules. So just over 700
(02:33):
calories for 81 grams of protein. The other one they've
got is a Cluck Norris, which is quite funny. And
the last one is a Big Dill Energy. So they're clever,
funny names. The Cluck Norris has got 80 grams of protein,
79.9 grams of protein, just shy of 3000 kilojoules. And
the Big Dill Energy is 3800 kilojoules. So that's over
(02:55):
900 calories in one burger and 56 grams of protein.
So it's an interesting observation, like you said, where we're
seeing this trend at the moment where it's like a
race to get every product higher in protein. We're seeing
high protein custards and high protein burgers. And, you know,
one would argue a burger is high protein, yet we're
(03:15):
making these ultra high protein, there's high protein chocolate, high
protein chips, like when will it end? And with the
launch of this new range of grilled, I absolutely believe
they're just focused on the protein craze at the moment.
But the question is like, how much protein is too
much and is 80 grams actually dangerous for you? And
I think it's a good question to answer because I
(03:37):
think there's a little bit of a myth circulating that
too much protein will actually harm your kidneys or damage
your kidneys. And that's actually not true. That is a
myth that we want to put to bed. So 80
grams of protein in a meal you know, for a
healthy person is not actually dangerous. Is it needed? Is
it excessive? Most people would argue probably it's excessive, but
you know, your protein requirements are very dependent. They're dependent
(03:58):
on how big you are, your body size, your age,
your gender, your activity levels, how much muscle you have,
what your goals are. Now we always used to think,
and certainly myself, if you asked me five or so
years ago, the research has actually changed a You know,
there used to be quite a strict limit on how
much protein one could utilize within a certain meal. We
(04:20):
used to kind of think around about that 30 to
40 grams, much more than that. The body doesn't, you know,
it's not really going to utilize it. However, in the
last few years, there's newer research that tells us that
the utilization of protein is a little bit more nuanced
than what we first thought. So if you have like
underdone your protein throughout the day, say for example, you've
done intermittent fasting for breakfast you haven't eaten or you've
(04:41):
skipped breakfast unintentionally, lunch, you were stuck in a work meeting.
So you had an extra coffee and a banana or
just a handful of crackers, and you've basically had very
minimal protein, maybe 10 grams throughout the day or something.
You can actually pick up a lot more protein in
a meal and the body has the ability to kind
of distribute that out across the day far better than
we sort of ever thought. So you can actually, your
(05:02):
body can utilize a much higher protein meal if you've
underdone your protein throughout the rest of the day. Does
this mean that it's a good thing? Probably not. I
think for most people, the guidance from dietitians is around
about 25 to 40 grams of good quality protein per
meal is kind of the range that we're aiming for.
(05:23):
If your goal is to maximize performance, help your recovery,
lose body fat, you're going through perimenopause, you want to
maintain muscle mass, to maximize growth, like muscle repair and growth,
you're looking at about 30 to 40 grams of quality
protein per meal. And if you are someone who's living
in a much larger body or you have significant training demands,
(05:44):
perhaps you're somewhere around that 40 to 50 grams. That
might make sense for a larger person or someone who's super,
super active. But a lot of us don't actually need
as much protein as what is being marketed at us
right now. And I think we're also forgetting that with protein,
like Susie said, there comes a calorie cost. So just
because it's high in protein doesn't mean that it just
cancels out the calories. So for every gram of protein
(06:06):
that you eat, your body actually, it actually provides four
calories per gram. So if you're thinking about 80 grams
of protein, you're getting a significant whack of calories with that.
Then you've also got the carbohydrates in the bun, A
lot of these burgers have got stacked, you know, two
chicken breasts, a bit of bacon, a slice of cheese.
They've got guacamole. They've got aioli on there. So you're
getting a good whack of fat with that. And then yes,
(06:27):
you're getting some vegetables as well, but it doesn't mean
that just because it's ultra high protein, it means that
it's better. or it's leaner, or it's like a fat
loss friendly meal, the overall bulk of calories actually matter
as well. And I think that sometimes people forget that
because if you are eating more than what your body
actually requires, ultimately the body is just going to store
that as body fat. It doesn't have anything to do
(06:48):
with those calories. It can't utilize them and use them
as energy. if you're eating too much overall across the day,
it's actually going to end up storing that. So more
protein is not necessarily better. And one would probably argue
for the average person, 80 grams of protein in a
meal and a 900 calorie burger is probably a little
bit too much. So the message is not that we
(07:09):
think protein foods are bad, far from it. Susie and
I have always advocated that high protein is incredibly important,
particularly as we age you know, as we lose weight,
that kind of thing. But I think most people would
actually benefit from more evenly spreading their protein intake out
throughout the day and choosing just one of their normal
burgers with a single chicken breast or a single beef patty,
clocking in around that kind of 30, 40 grams. That
(07:31):
is a much more balanced choice to make for the
average person who would probably be listening to the podcast
rather than focusing on this high performance range. Because I
would argue a standard grilled burger would is a high-performance
meal anyway. You've got a good source of lean quality protein.
You might have some avocado, guacamole on there. You've got
some salads. You've got a bun for carbohydrate. I would
argue that that is in itself a high-quality performance meal.
(07:54):
I don't think we need to triple down on these
things and make them 80, 90 grams of protein because
I just think it's just getting away from us a
little bit, isn't it?
Speaker 1 (08:02):
I think it's funny because going back 20, 30 years,
we weren't focused on protein at all and people were
actually pretty much okay without all the extra You know,
I've got clients who order double meat constantly on Subway
and I'm like, why? Like you don't need, you're training
your body to eat more than it needs all of
the time. And generally for women, I'm working on 20,
30 grams, maybe up to 40.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
For women at a meal at most, you certainly don't
need 80 grams.
Speaker 1 (08:28):
You know, the small female at most might need 120
grams of protein in total per day. And as mentioned previously,
one of the biggest issues I'm having with a lot
of my small female clients is they're overdoing the protein.
And they're often not getting enough good fat. So it's
about the macronutrient ratios more than anything. So yeah, I
think overall, when you look at the fast food, the
grilled chicken burgers are pretty high in protein overall.
Speaker 2 (08:51):
They're often the best choice.
Speaker 1 (08:52):
And yeah, like you described, it's the aiolis and the
mayo that bumps up the fat and the calories. So
if you can get rid of those a little bit,
it's going to mean you can create a relatively, the
healthiest of a meal on the go if you need
to when you are eating out. All right, Leanne, we've
got some new research and we like research here on
the Nutrition Couch podcast. And this was published quite recently
(09:12):
and looked at dietary patterns that were conducive to weight
control throughout the menopausal years, which is fantastic because whilst
there's a lot of chat about menopause and perimenopause in
mainstream media, there's not a huge amount of research because
as well documented, there is not a lot of research
on women's health in general, let alone that age group
that's sort of just been popular in the last three
to five years to explore what's going on. So This
(09:34):
was an analysis of a large data set from the Nurses'
Health Study that's been going on for many years. And basically,
they've taken some of the data from the participants in
that and analyzed it for dietary intake patterns and to
have a look and see what is the best apparent
best dietary pattern associated with weight control. So I will
(09:57):
say this isn't about weight loss. This is purely about
what are people who control their weight and prevent gaining
weight in.
Speaker 2 (10:03):
The menopausal years, how are they eating?
Speaker 1 (10:06):
It was a 12-year study of over 38,000 women and
recently published in the Journal of the American Medical Association
Network Open. It's available online for anyone who would like
to have a read of it. And basically they compared
or had a look at food frequency questionnaires to depict
dietary patterns.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
So looking at things like.
Speaker 1 (10:25):
A Mediterranean diet pattern or a DASH diet pattern or
a low carb diet pattern and what they found from
this data set. So whilst a food frequency questionnaire is
not overly accurate in terms of individuals' dietary patterns, at
such a big level with so many people, the patterns
emerge so we can take the data as quite strong data.
(10:45):
And basically, they found there were two dietary patterns that
appeared to be most effective at preventing weight gain and
reducing the risk of obesity. So not managing obesity once
it's there, but preventing it happening. And the two diets
are the planetary health diet and what they describe as
the low intralimic diet. Now, what tickled my fancy with
(11:09):
this is that I've never heard of either of these diets.
So I had to actually put it through AI. to
see exactly what was going on. So I'll tell you
what they are in a second. And then I've got
a few questions I'm keen for Leanne's thoughts on. But
before I kick off, Leanne, have you heard of either
of those diets?
Speaker 3 (11:24):
I've heard of the planetary health diet, but not the low,
what is it? Inchelemia diet. I think it's interesting, but yeah,
the planetary health diet was developed by, I think, like
Eat Lancet Commission, like a big commission study. It was
basically how to eat the best and also the least
environmental impacts as well. So it's quite a fascinating diet.
It's only new in the last few years, I believe. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (11:45):
But what is interesting to me, because first of all,
they've found two dietary patterns that are low risk. But
when you look at the two dietary patterns, they're very,
very different. So the Planetary Health Diet is actually a
high carbohydrate diet.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
So it's actually about 60% carbohydrates. It's quite low in protein.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
It's sort of more against sort of vegetarian approach of 10%, 15% protein.
And it's basically plant forward. So it's really promoting whole
grains and lots of fruits and vegetables and very little
processed food, which is fine. But their low-intenalemic diet is
completely different. So the average calories of a planetary health
diet are around 1600, so not overly low either. And
(12:27):
the low-insulinolimic diet is about 1,500, but the macronutrient ratio
is completely different. It's 50% fat. It's 25% carbohydrate. So
even lower than what we would call a reduced-carb diet
like a CSIRO, which is about 40% carbohydrate. What I
put my women on in peri and menopause is around, well,
(12:47):
if they've got insulin issues, I'll put them on about 30%
And so, yeah, I was just surprised that whilst I
completely understand the insulinemic diet, because to me that's supporting
blood glucose control and we know pro-inflammatory pathways, which increase
in the menopausal years, respond better to lower carbohydrate diets. Note,
we're not saying low, we're saying lower. So we're not
(13:08):
saying 10% carb diets like keto, we're saying 25, 30, 40%,
which is still a lower carbohydrate diet compared to a 60%,
which is in the planetary health diet. But I just
thought basically that tells me that there's a group of
people who need support with blood glucose control and they
respond better to lower carb diets. And there's a group
who have good glucose control and respond better to a
(13:29):
vegetarian diet.
Speaker 2 (13:30):
That's what I took from that.
Speaker 1 (13:32):
To me, it was completely like contrasting results that depict
the differences in metabolic systems through these years. But yeah,
as I said, I'd never heard of this diet before.
And really it's probably, you know, 50% fat diet is
actually not that easy to achieve either. Like you're basically
having one slice of bread, half an avocado for breakfast
and then an egg. So like it's quite a specific diet.
(13:55):
You're loading the fat up a lot to get it
to 50%. That's what I took away from it.
Speaker 3 (13:59):
I think it's really interesting. Like you said, there are
certainly two subgroups of people, but probably the thing that
I really took away from it was there are quite
a lot of similarities between both of the diets as well.
And they both obviously focus on whole foods, tons of vegetables,
lots of fruit, lots of legumes, healthy fats like nuts, avocado,
olive oil, whole grains. Yes, that differed in terms of
(14:21):
the amount, but both diets really focus on those high-fiber,
good-quality carbohydrates. And I think that's really interesting. lean protein sources.
We're not talking about sausages and lamb chops and salami.
We're talking about the leaner protein cuts and definitely very,
very minimal ultra-processed foods. But what I find interesting is
that if that was weight maintenance, maintaining your weight, 1,500
(14:44):
to 1,600 calories is very low. These must have been
very small people. If you're only eating 1,600 calories to
maintain your weight, you are not a very big person
at all. I think most people that I work with
are sort of maintaining their weight around that sort of 1800,
maybe to 2000 calories. So I imagine a lot of
these people weren't doing a hell of a lot of
exercise either. But I do like the planetary health diet.
(15:05):
But my main concern would be with quite low protein intakes,
you do start to lose your muscle mass about 2%.
The research shows this every year after you turn about 40.
So I love that planetary health diet with a better
quality protein source. three times a day. That's why I
think the B is sort of optimized eating and menopause.
So there's no magic menopause diet, but there are certainly
(15:28):
eating patterns that are associated with less weight gain and
better health outcomes overall. And if you look at any
diet across, or most of the diets that have always
come up as better quality, CSIRO, DASH, Mediterranean, they all
have the same focus, right? Plenty of fruits and vegetables,
whole food focus, legumes, nuts, better quality carbohydrates, less takeaway,
(15:48):
less alcohol, less sugar, less processed foods. So we're not
hearing anything new or magical. We're sort of understanding that
this is the way to good health. As boring as
it is, this is what we need to do consistently.
And then that level of personalization, actually working with a
dietician to come up with what is the best response
for you in terms of peri or menopause? Is it
(16:09):
lowering carbohydrates? Is it increasing fats? Is it keeping protein
lower or higher to actually come up with the outcome
that works better for you? Because the issue is that
we're all different, isn't it? We're all individuals and we
all sort of need that slight tweak or adaption to
come up with the best personalized plan for us. True.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
And I liked it because it was the first study
I've ever seen that names a different diet other than Mediterranean.
Speaker 2 (16:33):
Dash, like same, same. To me, this was the first.
Speaker 1 (16:36):
Time I've heard of this kind of described as a
proactive management tool for women in these years.
Speaker 2 (16:43):
And yeah, I just thought it was really, really interesting.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
And as I said, it's not about a matter of
losing weight if you have gain weight. It was purely
just preventing obesity risk. and how to sort of eat
the best you can through those years. So yeah, I
think it's definitely worth being across that, particularly if you've
got genetic risk for blood glucose regulation issues. You know,
this is showing you that adjusting those macros, it's going
to be important for you. It's not basically a one-size-fits-all
(17:09):
model with diet, which is, as I've described before, my
current issue with the amount of information on peri and
diets that's around at the moment. All right, Leanne. Now,
I controlled myself in the supermarket this week and did
not reach for a high-protein product, but I did find
a novel product and a product that we haven't discussed
before on the Nutrition Couch is custard.
Speaker 2 (17:30):
Now, Leanne, I think custard's for kids or for pudding
at Christmas.
Speaker 3 (17:35):
On your birthday?
Speaker 1 (17:35):
I find it to be, yeah, like a food like,
I don't know, when I see these sort of high-protein custards,
I'm like, who's eating custard?
Speaker 2 (17:42):
Like, how old are you?
Speaker 1 (17:43):
I know in sort of our grandma's era, like custard
was a popular dessert, but I think it's sort of
lost its sexiness in recent years. But now these high
protein custards are making a comeback. So it's not a
food I generally reach for or even enjoy. But as
I said, there seems to be a growing range of them,
particularly in that high fiber zone. But the one I
found was different. Did I say high fiber? High protein zone,
(18:05):
I should say. But this was a brand that I've
seen in the soup aisle, the South Australian Gourmet Food Company.
And it caught my eye because it was a high
fiber vanilla custard.
Speaker 2 (18:16):
And I thought that's random and we will review it.
Speaker 1 (18:18):
So first of all, have you seen this product in
the supermarket?
Speaker 3 (18:22):
No, I haven't. But I agree with you. That's random.
When you first said the script, I thought, oh no,
not another high protein product. We promised our listeners we
won't do it. And then I realized it was high
fiber and I had the same thought. That's random.
Speaker 1 (18:33):
So I was going to do the Muscle Nation custard.
And then I thought, oh, we said we weren't doing
any more high protein products. And so I was just
doing a Google search of custard and this popped up
and I was like, oh my God, we have to
do this. So first of all, it's actually pretty cheap.
It's $ 1. 70 per 120 gram serve. And there's a few
(18:54):
different flavors, but the one I've got is, I'm just
having a look.
Speaker 2 (18:57):
What is it, Leanne? Is it banana? It's yellow.
Speaker 3 (18:59):
Vanilla.
Speaker 2 (19:00):
Vanilla. So nutritionally, very interesting. And Leanne, we'll have some thoughts.
So it is a locally produced product.
Speaker 1 (19:07):
And it has got per serve 152 calories, so certainly
not low-cal. Keep in mind that high-protein yogurts are less
than 100-cal. It's got 3 grams of protein per serve,
so certainly not high. It's got 4.7 grams of fat
per serve, 3.5 saturated. So it's not a low-fat product overall. Carbohydrate,
(19:29):
24 grams per 120-gram tube. Now, that's not insignificant. You know,
two slices of bergam bread is just slightly higher than that.
14.4 grams of sugar. So it's not a low sugar
product either. That's about three teaspoons. Now, sometimes we will
say it's not including added sugars in there, but here
it does have added sugar on the nutrition. 7.3 grams
(19:52):
of dietary fiber, which is very high because usually you
wouldn't get any fiber in a yogurt or a custard.
So if I look at the ingredients, it's water, milk
powder at 10%, which is where the little bit of
protein is coming from. But also I'm surprised they haven't
listed calcium because it's you would normally get some calcium
in a custard, like around 100 milligrams at least, followed
by sugar, then fiber, which is inulin, cream, modified tapioca starch,
(20:17):
xanthan gum, natural flavor, natural color. Now, the thought I
have is the best person I think for this product
would be an older person who's not eating a lot
and is trying to get extra nutrition in their diet.
So if you have an aging parent, who wasn't eating
very well and you needed to get them calories and
(20:41):
nutrition and even fiber because they were constipated, this is
potentially a product I would use. Possibly with children, but
that's a lot of sugar for a child's diet to
get 14 or 7.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
Grams of fiber. And it's processed fiber as well. It's
not natural. So it's just random. I just don't know
who's it for. Who do you think it's for?
Speaker 3 (21:03):
I don't know. I wouldn't buy it. I wouldn't put
it in a meal plan. I can't work out why
they've done it, really. But the milk powder is only 10%,
which I think is why. I think there'd be a
very minimal amount of custard in here. So I certainly
wouldn't be prescribing it from a bone health perspective. You'd
be far better with yogurt or milk. But yeah, it's
got my least type of what we call an isolated
fiber in there called inulin. If you're someone who has
(21:23):
a sensitive tummy or suffer with IBS, inulin is not
your friend. Generally, it's quite high in blood maps. And
it's also not the right type of fiber that would
really be helping with a huge amount of constipation. I'd
much rather give someone, if I had an elderly person
or a young person who was quite constipated, I'd dilute
some pear juice or some prune juice or give them
a couple of kiwi fruits. I'd much rather... the soluble
(21:44):
type of fiber from fruit or gives them a bit
of oats and chia or a bowl of porridge or something,
I think you'd have a much better chance in terms
of fiber there. Inulin is more of a prebiotic type fiber,
so you're helping to feed the good bacteria in your gut.
It's not a bad type of fiber. It's fine, but
it's certainly not one of my favorite types of fiber.
I think a lot of different types of fiber is
(22:04):
important in your diet, particularly if you struggle with things
like a digestive health perspective, if you are suffering from
a I would be aiming to get a whole range
of different fibers in your diet, not just a whole
heap of isolated fiber from something like Inulin in a
custard product. Because if I'm being honest, Susie, if you're
looking to custard for your fiber intake, I don't think
(22:26):
you're doing it right.
Speaker 1 (22:28):
No, and that's why I think it's people who perhaps
are not consuming a lot of food in general. And
I think people who are sometimes in aged care homes
or maybe have dementia and really struggling to get calories in,
this could be a really good product to get some
nutrition in when they're not eating a lot. And they
certainly need the calories and they need the sugars. But yeah,
(22:50):
I'm not quite sure how you reach that group because
often they're being fed by bigger organizations. So yeah, I
think for aging population, people in their 80s, 90s who've
got low oral intake, it could be a great product.
That's the only person potentially. And yeah, I just thought
it was a little bit random. So Yes, if you
like custard, I think there's better options. And in general,
(23:11):
I think if you're a grown-up, there's probably better options
in general to get a sweet hit at the end
of the day than having custard. So in terms of
the higher protein ranges of custard, I think they're just
trying to mimic that market who are having these puddings
all the time. And I've got my clients having a
big dinner and then a whole pudding. You don't need 14,
20 grams of protein after you've just eaten dinner. So
(23:31):
they've got a place in the diet as well to consider.
And that leads back to our discussion that more protein
is not always better. So just be mindful of that.
I saw, what did I see the other day? High
protein dessert cakes, like lava cakes. Anyway, it gives us
plenty to talk about on the nutrition couch. All right, Leanne,
for the final question of today's episode, I've had a
(23:52):
few questions about taking supplements because it can be tricky
to get supplements in, particularly if you're trying to get
powders in every single day and you might not be
a shake person. So specifically this question was around collagen.
How do I take it every day to make it easier?
But I think it also links to creatine Now, if
I go back to my sports nutrition days, Leanne, where
the players would just take their supplements with a spoon
(24:14):
and water before they hit the gym, including their pre-trainer,
their glutamine and their creatine.
Speaker 2 (24:20):
With a big glob of water.
Speaker 1 (24:22):
It's not for everybody, but certainly you can shot things
like collagen if you wanted to. But yeah, we're looking
for some strategies to make supplement intake on a daily
basis easier.
Speaker 2 (24:32):
Leanne, what do you got for us?
Speaker 3 (24:33):
I wouldn't shut my collagen. I think it'd be a
big sticky mess. I would not recommend doing that. I
personally have my supplement, what I call my supplement stack
once a day. So I add a scoop of my protein.
I add two scoops of creatine and a scoop of
collagen into that. And I just drink that down. If
I'm feeling a bit bougie, I'll add some berries and spinach,
the milk and make it more of like a mini meal.
But I normally just do my stack and get it down.
(24:54):
And I know that I'm routinely getting in 30 grams
of protein. 5-10 grams of collagen, about 5-6 grams of
creatine as well. So for me, it's easy. It's like
a habit. It boosts my overall protein intake for the
day and it's done. Whereas a lot of my clients
drink collagen in their coffee, funnily enough. So you can
add collagen to your morning coffee, your tea, you can
put it into a smoothie, you can mix it into
(25:15):
yogurt if you're someone that likes to have a yogurt
like mid-morning or mid-afternoon. goes into porridge, overnight oats. You
can even put it into sauces or even like soups
and things as well. Because a big myth that we
hear a lot, Susie, is that you can't put collagen
into hot drinks, but that is not actually true. And
I think a lot of the confusion comes from the
fact that yes, collagen is a protein, And like all protein,
(25:36):
heat generally causes protein to denature or like change its structure.
But denaturing is not the same thing as destroying the protein, right?
So actually collagen peptides, which are found in most supplements
and certainly in our Design by Dietitian Renew Collagen Reins,
we use hydrolyzed collagen peptides. So that means that they've
actually been broken down into smaller peptides that are specifically
(25:59):
designed to actually dissolve in both hot or cold liquids.
I actually find that collagen mixes down better into a
warmer hot liquid. So adding it into your morning coffee
or tea is completely fine, but I think the best
thing to do is find a habit and kind of
stick to that. Like if you're someone that has a
cup of coffee or tea every single morning and adding
your collagen into that is a really great option. If
(26:19):
you're someone that has a yogurt every afternoon, stirring your
collagen into that is a good option because consistency with
your supplements, particularly the two most important ones to be
consistent with on a daily basis are collagen and creatine,
because the research shows us you need to be consistent
with both of them. If you're not consistent, you're not
going to get the best benefits. If you take your
collagen for a week, then forget about it for three
(26:40):
weeks and come back onto it. You're certainly not going
to get the best evidence. The research really shows us
about eight to 12 weeks of consistent daily use. That's
where a lot of the participants and research studies showed
some really good outcomes from a collagen supplementation perspective. So personally,
I would just keep it next to like your coffee
machine or your kettle or, you know, next to your
morning snack or something as like a reminder or a
(27:03):
jog to help you take it regularly. But you can
pretty much put it into any foods basically. But I
do find if you want to mix it in and
have it sort of dissolve down a little bit, your
best bet is into like a warm, a warmer type
of liquid like a tea or a coffee.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
Well, I have the collagen in the hot chocolate. Oh,
that's a good idea. But you told me I had
to do it differently. You said to me I've got
to put it in first and then stir it in.
Speaker 3 (27:26):
Yeah, because otherwise it can go a little bit clumpy.
Speaker 2 (27:28):
Yeah, and I just keep like vigorously, vigorously stirring.
Speaker 3 (27:32):
You can get one of our hand mixers.
Speaker 1 (27:35):
That's true.
Speaker 2 (27:36):
I could do that actually.
Speaker 3 (27:36):
Make it easy for yourself.
Speaker 1 (27:38):
I know. This is why Leanne, she's much smarter than
I am. All right, Leanne, thanks for those tips. Well,
that brings us to the end of the Nutrition Catch
for another Wednesday. Please keep telling your friends about us
so we can continue to grow and we look forward
to seeing you next week for our regular episode drop.
Speaker 2 (27:51):
Have a great week.
Speaker 3 (27:52):
Catch you next week.
Speaker 1 (27:53):
Bye.
There is a brand new range of high protein burgers
at a popular fast food chain that have more than
80 grams of protein per burger. And while that might
sound like a good thing, it does prompt us to
ask how much protein is actually too much.
Speaker 2 (00:17):
Hi, I'm Susie Burrell.
Speaker 3 (00:19):
And I'm Leanne Ward.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
And together we bring you The Nutrition Couch, the weekly
podcast that keeps you up to date with everything you
need to know in the world of nutrition. as well
as how much protein is too much, we have some
new research on the best.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Diet for menopause.
Speaker 1 (00:32):
We have a supermarket custard to review, and our listener
question is all about making supplement intake a little bit easier. So, Leanne,
I don't know if you got this media release, but
I got this media came through from, I can say
it's grilled.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
It wasn't a secret. Was it grilled? Yeah.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
Oh, God.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Yeah, it was grilled. Doing well today.
Speaker 1 (00:54):
And The PR person was very, very excited because they
had a few menu items that had higher protein varieties.
And the one that stuck out to me was that
it had 80 grams of protein. And I straight away
asked the PR girl, what was the calories on that?
(01:14):
Because whilst protein in isolation might be considered a good, strong,
positive nutrient, ultimately anything that's got that many grams of
any nutrient in it is going to have a significant
calorie load. And sure enough, I think from memory, it
was seven or 800 calories for this.
Speaker 2 (01:31):
Wrap or burger or whatever it was.
Speaker 1 (01:33):
But when we discussed it, you had said to me,
I think it's worth talking about how much is too much.
And I think that's a really good topic because we're
really being programmed to believe that more is better. And
we've certainly been seeing this from fast food outlets, Subway, Grilled,
you know, they're really focusing on higher protein meals.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Eljana's another one.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
Coming in, this has got so many grams of protein,
but it's sort of just ignoring the fact that it's
not about having more and more and more. You can
certainly have too much for a couple of reasons. So
I'm going to hand over to you to take us
through why more is certainly not better, particularly for small females.
Speaker 3 (02:10):
Yeah. And look, let's be honest. I will never talk
bad about my beloved grilled. Anyone who listens to the
podcast knows that I'm obsessed with grilled. However, I don't
like this new range, Susie. It's called their new high
performance range and they market it as high protein, low sugar,
nutrient stacked. And they've got some clever marketing. I'll be honest.
Like one of the burgers you were talking about is
a protein pro it's 3000 kilojoules. So just over 700
(02:33):
calories for 81 grams of protein. The other one they've
got is a Cluck Norris, which is quite funny. And
the last one is a Big Dill Energy. So they're clever,
funny names. The Cluck Norris has got 80 grams of protein,
79.9 grams of protein, just shy of 3000 kilojoules. And
the Big Dill Energy is 3800 kilojoules. So that's over
(02:55):
900 calories in one burger and 56 grams of protein.
So it's an interesting observation, like you said, where we're
seeing this trend at the moment where it's like a
race to get every product higher in protein. We're seeing
high protein custards and high protein burgers. And, you know,
one would argue a burger is high protein, yet we're
(03:15):
making these ultra high protein, there's high protein chocolate, high
protein chips, like when will it end? And with the
launch of this new range of grilled, I absolutely believe
they're just focused on the protein craze at the moment.
But the question is like, how much protein is too
much and is 80 grams actually dangerous for you? And
I think it's a good question to answer because I
(03:37):
think there's a little bit of a myth circulating that
too much protein will actually harm your kidneys or damage
your kidneys. And that's actually not true. That is a
myth that we want to put to bed. So 80
grams of protein in a meal you know, for a
healthy person is not actually dangerous. Is it needed? Is
it excessive? Most people would argue probably it's excessive, but
you know, your protein requirements are very dependent. They're dependent
(03:58):
on how big you are, your body size, your age,
your gender, your activity levels, how much muscle you have,
what your goals are. Now we always used to think,
and certainly myself, if you asked me five or so
years ago, the research has actually changed a You know,
there used to be quite a strict limit on how
much protein one could utilize within a certain meal. We
(04:20):
used to kind of think around about that 30 to
40 grams, much more than that. The body doesn't, you know,
it's not really going to utilize it. However, in the
last few years, there's newer research that tells us that
the utilization of protein is a little bit more nuanced
than what we first thought. So if you have like
underdone your protein throughout the day, say for example, you've
done intermittent fasting for breakfast you haven't eaten or you've
(04:41):
skipped breakfast unintentionally, lunch, you were stuck in a work meeting.
So you had an extra coffee and a banana or
just a handful of crackers, and you've basically had very
minimal protein, maybe 10 grams throughout the day or something.
You can actually pick up a lot more protein in
a meal and the body has the ability to kind
of distribute that out across the day far better than
we sort of ever thought. So you can actually, your
(05:02):
body can utilize a much higher protein meal if you've
underdone your protein throughout the rest of the day. Does
this mean that it's a good thing? Probably not. I
think for most people, the guidance from dietitians is around
about 25 to 40 grams of good quality protein per
meal is kind of the range that we're aiming for.
(05:23):
If your goal is to maximize performance, help your recovery,
lose body fat, you're going through perimenopause, you want to
maintain muscle mass, to maximize growth, like muscle repair and growth,
you're looking at about 30 to 40 grams of quality
protein per meal. And if you are someone who's living
in a much larger body or you have significant training demands,
(05:44):
perhaps you're somewhere around that 40 to 50 grams. That
might make sense for a larger person or someone who's super,
super active. But a lot of us don't actually need
as much protein as what is being marketed at us
right now. And I think we're also forgetting that with protein,
like Susie said, there comes a calorie cost. So just
because it's high in protein doesn't mean that it just
cancels out the calories. So for every gram of protein
(06:06):
that you eat, your body actually, it actually provides four
calories per gram. So if you're thinking about 80 grams
of protein, you're getting a significant whack of calories with that.
Then you've also got the carbohydrates in the bun, A
lot of these burgers have got stacked, you know, two
chicken breasts, a bit of bacon, a slice of cheese.
They've got guacamole. They've got aioli on there. So you're
getting a good whack of fat with that. And then yes,
(06:27):
you're getting some vegetables as well, but it doesn't mean
that just because it's ultra high protein, it means that
it's better. or it's leaner, or it's like a fat
loss friendly meal, the overall bulk of calories actually matter
as well. And I think that sometimes people forget that
because if you are eating more than what your body
actually requires, ultimately the body is just going to store
that as body fat. It doesn't have anything to do
(06:48):
with those calories. It can't utilize them and use them
as energy. if you're eating too much overall across the day,
it's actually going to end up storing that. So more
protein is not necessarily better. And one would probably argue
for the average person, 80 grams of protein in a
meal and a 900 calorie burger is probably a little
bit too much. So the message is not that we
(07:09):
think protein foods are bad, far from it. Susie and
I have always advocated that high protein is incredibly important,
particularly as we age you know, as we lose weight,
that kind of thing. But I think most people would
actually benefit from more evenly spreading their protein intake out
throughout the day and choosing just one of their normal
burgers with a single chicken breast or a single beef patty,
clocking in around that kind of 30, 40 grams. That
(07:31):
is a much more balanced choice to make for the
average person who would probably be listening to the podcast
rather than focusing on this high performance range. Because I
would argue a standard grilled burger would is a high-performance
meal anyway. You've got a good source of lean quality protein.
You might have some avocado, guacamole on there. You've got
some salads. You've got a bun for carbohydrate. I would
argue that that is in itself a high-quality performance meal.
(07:54):
I don't think we need to triple down on these
things and make them 80, 90 grams of protein because
I just think it's just getting away from us a
little bit, isn't it?
Speaker 1 (08:02):
I think it's funny because going back 20, 30 years,
we weren't focused on protein at all and people were
actually pretty much okay without all the extra You know,
I've got clients who order double meat constantly on Subway
and I'm like, why? Like you don't need, you're training
your body to eat more than it needs all of
the time. And generally for women, I'm working on 20,
30 grams, maybe up to 40.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
For women at a meal at most, you certainly don't
need 80 grams.
Speaker 1 (08:28):
You know, the small female at most might need 120
grams of protein in total per day. And as mentioned previously,
one of the biggest issues I'm having with a lot
of my small female clients is they're overdoing the protein.
And they're often not getting enough good fat. So it's
about the macronutrient ratios more than anything. So yeah, I
think overall, when you look at the fast food, the
grilled chicken burgers are pretty high in protein overall.
Speaker 2 (08:51):
They're often the best choice.
Speaker 1 (08:52):
And yeah, like you described, it's the aiolis and the
mayo that bumps up the fat and the calories. So
if you can get rid of those a little bit,
it's going to mean you can create a relatively, the
healthiest of a meal on the go if you need
to when you are eating out. All right, Leanne, we've
got some new research and we like research here on
the Nutrition Couch podcast. And this was published quite recently
(09:12):
and looked at dietary patterns that were conducive to weight
control throughout the menopausal years, which is fantastic because whilst
there's a lot of chat about menopause and perimenopause in
mainstream media, there's not a huge amount of research because
as well documented, there is not a lot of research
on women's health in general, let alone that age group
that's sort of just been popular in the last three
to five years to explore what's going on. So This
(09:34):
was an analysis of a large data set from the Nurses'
Health Study that's been going on for many years. And basically,
they've taken some of the data from the participants in
that and analyzed it for dietary intake patterns and to
have a look and see what is the best apparent
best dietary pattern associated with weight control. So I will
(09:57):
say this isn't about weight loss. This is purely about
what are people who control their weight and prevent gaining
weight in.
Speaker 2 (10:03):
The menopausal years, how are they eating?
Speaker 1 (10:06):
It was a 12-year study of over 38,000 women and
recently published in the Journal of the American Medical Association
Network Open. It's available online for anyone who would like
to have a read of it. And basically they compared
or had a look at food frequency questionnaires to depict
dietary patterns.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
So looking at things like.
Speaker 1 (10:25):
A Mediterranean diet pattern or a DASH diet pattern or
a low carb diet pattern and what they found from
this data set. So whilst a food frequency questionnaire is
not overly accurate in terms of individuals' dietary patterns, at
such a big level with so many people, the patterns
emerge so we can take the data as quite strong data.
(10:45):
And basically, they found there were two dietary patterns that
appeared to be most effective at preventing weight gain and
reducing the risk of obesity. So not managing obesity once
it's there, but preventing it happening. And the two diets
are the planetary health diet and what they describe as
the low intralimic diet. Now, what tickled my fancy with
(11:09):
this is that I've never heard of either of these diets.
So I had to actually put it through AI. to
see exactly what was going on. So I'll tell you
what they are in a second. And then I've got
a few questions I'm keen for Leanne's thoughts on. But
before I kick off, Leanne, have you heard of either
of those diets?
Speaker 3 (11:24):
I've heard of the planetary health diet, but not the low,
what is it? Inchelemia diet. I think it's interesting, but yeah,
the planetary health diet was developed by, I think, like
Eat Lancet Commission, like a big commission study. It was
basically how to eat the best and also the least
environmental impacts as well. So it's quite a fascinating diet.
It's only new in the last few years, I believe. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (11:45):
But what is interesting to me, because first of all,
they've found two dietary patterns that are low risk. But
when you look at the two dietary patterns, they're very,
very different. So the Planetary Health Diet is actually a
high carbohydrate diet.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
So it's actually about 60% carbohydrates. It's quite low in protein.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
It's sort of more against sort of vegetarian approach of 10%, 15% protein.
And it's basically plant forward. So it's really promoting whole
grains and lots of fruits and vegetables and very little
processed food, which is fine. But their low-intenalemic diet is
completely different. So the average calories of a planetary health
diet are around 1600, so not overly low either. And
(12:27):
the low-insulinolimic diet is about 1,500, but the macronutrient ratio
is completely different. It's 50% fat. It's 25% carbohydrate. So
even lower than what we would call a reduced-carb diet
like a CSIRO, which is about 40% carbohydrate. What I
put my women on in peri and menopause is around, well,
(12:47):
if they've got insulin issues, I'll put them on about 30%
And so, yeah, I was just surprised that whilst I
completely understand the insulinemic diet, because to me that's supporting
blood glucose control and we know pro-inflammatory pathways, which increase
in the menopausal years, respond better to lower carbohydrate diets. Note,
we're not saying low, we're saying lower. So we're not
(13:08):
saying 10% carb diets like keto, we're saying 25, 30, 40%,
which is still a lower carbohydrate diet compared to a 60%,
which is in the planetary health diet. But I just
thought basically that tells me that there's a group of
people who need support with blood glucose control and they
respond better to lower carb diets. And there's a group
who have good glucose control and respond better to a
(13:29):
vegetarian diet.
Speaker 2 (13:30):
That's what I took from that.
Speaker 1 (13:32):
To me, it was completely like contrasting results that depict
the differences in metabolic systems through these years. But yeah,
as I said, I'd never heard of this diet before.
And really it's probably, you know, 50% fat diet is
actually not that easy to achieve either. Like you're basically
having one slice of bread, half an avocado for breakfast
and then an egg. So like it's quite a specific diet.
(13:55):
You're loading the fat up a lot to get it
to 50%. That's what I took away from it.
Speaker 3 (13:59):
I think it's really interesting. Like you said, there are
certainly two subgroups of people, but probably the thing that
I really took away from it was there are quite
a lot of similarities between both of the diets as well.
And they both obviously focus on whole foods, tons of vegetables,
lots of fruit, lots of legumes, healthy fats like nuts, avocado,
olive oil, whole grains. Yes, that differed in terms of
(14:21):
the amount, but both diets really focus on those high-fiber,
good-quality carbohydrates. And I think that's really interesting. lean protein sources.
We're not talking about sausages and lamb chops and salami.
We're talking about the leaner protein cuts and definitely very,
very minimal ultra-processed foods. But what I find interesting is
that if that was weight maintenance, maintaining your weight, 1,500
(14:44):
to 1,600 calories is very low. These must have been
very small people. If you're only eating 1,600 calories to
maintain your weight, you are not a very big person
at all. I think most people that I work with
are sort of maintaining their weight around that sort of 1800,
maybe to 2000 calories. So I imagine a lot of
these people weren't doing a hell of a lot of
exercise either. But I do like the planetary health diet.
(15:05):
But my main concern would be with quite low protein intakes,
you do start to lose your muscle mass about 2%.
The research shows this every year after you turn about 40.
So I love that planetary health diet with a better
quality protein source. three times a day. That's why I
think the B is sort of optimized eating and menopause.
So there's no magic menopause diet, but there are certainly
(15:28):
eating patterns that are associated with less weight gain and
better health outcomes overall. And if you look at any
diet across, or most of the diets that have always
come up as better quality, CSIRO, DASH, Mediterranean, they all
have the same focus, right? Plenty of fruits and vegetables,
whole food focus, legumes, nuts, better quality carbohydrates, less takeaway,
(15:48):
less alcohol, less sugar, less processed foods. So we're not
hearing anything new or magical. We're sort of understanding that
this is the way to good health. As boring as
it is, this is what we need to do consistently.
And then that level of personalization, actually working with a
dietician to come up with what is the best response
for you in terms of peri or menopause? Is it
(16:09):
lowering carbohydrates? Is it increasing fats? Is it keeping protein
lower or higher to actually come up with the outcome
that works better for you? Because the issue is that
we're all different, isn't it? We're all individuals and we
all sort of need that slight tweak or adaption to
come up with the best personalized plan for us. True.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
And I liked it because it was the first study
I've ever seen that names a different diet other than Mediterranean.
Speaker 2 (16:33):
Dash, like same, same. To me, this was the first.
Speaker 1 (16:36):
Time I've heard of this kind of described as a
proactive management tool for women in these years.
Speaker 2 (16:43):
And yeah, I just thought it was really, really interesting.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
And as I said, it's not about a matter of
losing weight if you have gain weight. It was purely
just preventing obesity risk. and how to sort of eat
the best you can through those years. So yeah, I
think it's definitely worth being across that, particularly if you've
got genetic risk for blood glucose regulation issues. You know,
this is showing you that adjusting those macros, it's going
to be important for you. It's not basically a one-size-fits-all
(17:09):
model with diet, which is, as I've described before, my
current issue with the amount of information on peri and
diets that's around at the moment. All right, Leanne. Now,
I controlled myself in the supermarket this week and did
not reach for a high-protein product, but I did find
a novel product and a product that we haven't discussed
before on the Nutrition Couch is custard.
Speaker 2 (17:30):
Now, Leanne, I think custard's for kids or for pudding
at Christmas.
Speaker 3 (17:35):
On your birthday?
Speaker 1 (17:35):
I find it to be, yeah, like a food like,
I don't know, when I see these sort of high-protein custards,
I'm like, who's eating custard?
Speaker 2 (17:42):
Like, how old are you?
Speaker 1 (17:43):
I know in sort of our grandma's era, like custard
was a popular dessert, but I think it's sort of
lost its sexiness in recent years. But now these high
protein custards are making a comeback. So it's not a
food I generally reach for or even enjoy. But as
I said, there seems to be a growing range of them,
particularly in that high fiber zone. But the one I
found was different. Did I say high fiber? High protein zone,
(18:05):
I should say. But this was a brand that I've
seen in the soup aisle, the South Australian Gourmet Food Company.
And it caught my eye because it was a high
fiber vanilla custard.
Speaker 2 (18:16):
And I thought that's random and we will review it.
Speaker 1 (18:18):
So first of all, have you seen this product in
the supermarket?
Speaker 3 (18:22):
No, I haven't. But I agree with you. That's random.
When you first said the script, I thought, oh no,
not another high protein product. We promised our listeners we
won't do it. And then I realized it was high
fiber and I had the same thought. That's random.
Speaker 1 (18:33):
So I was going to do the Muscle Nation custard.
And then I thought, oh, we said we weren't doing
any more high protein products. And so I was just
doing a Google search of custard and this popped up
and I was like, oh my God, we have to
do this. So first of all, it's actually pretty cheap.
It's $ 1. 70 per 120 gram serve. And there's a few
(18:54):
different flavors, but the one I've got is, I'm just
having a look.
Speaker 2 (18:57):
What is it, Leanne? Is it banana? It's yellow.
Speaker 3 (18:59):
Vanilla.
Speaker 2 (19:00):
Vanilla. So nutritionally, very interesting. And Leanne, we'll have some thoughts.
So it is a locally produced product.
Speaker 1 (19:07):
And it has got per serve 152 calories, so certainly
not low-cal. Keep in mind that high-protein yogurts are less
than 100-cal. It's got 3 grams of protein per serve,
so certainly not high. It's got 4.7 grams of fat
per serve, 3.5 saturated. So it's not a low-fat product overall. Carbohydrate,
(19:29):
24 grams per 120-gram tube. Now, that's not insignificant. You know,
two slices of bergam bread is just slightly higher than that.
14.4 grams of sugar. So it's not a low sugar
product either. That's about three teaspoons. Now, sometimes we will
say it's not including added sugars in there, but here
it does have added sugar on the nutrition. 7.3 grams
(19:52):
of dietary fiber, which is very high because usually you
wouldn't get any fiber in a yogurt or a custard.
So if I look at the ingredients, it's water, milk
powder at 10%, which is where the little bit of
protein is coming from. But also I'm surprised they haven't
listed calcium because it's you would normally get some calcium
in a custard, like around 100 milligrams at least, followed
by sugar, then fiber, which is inulin, cream, modified tapioca starch,
(20:17):
xanthan gum, natural flavor, natural color. Now, the thought I
have is the best person I think for this product
would be an older person who's not eating a lot
and is trying to get extra nutrition in their diet.
So if you have an aging parent, who wasn't eating
very well and you needed to get them calories and
(20:41):
nutrition and even fiber because they were constipated, this is
potentially a product I would use. Possibly with children, but
that's a lot of sugar for a child's diet to
get 14 or 7.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
Grams of fiber. And it's processed fiber as well. It's
not natural. So it's just random. I just don't know
who's it for. Who do you think it's for?
Speaker 3 (21:03):
I don't know. I wouldn't buy it. I wouldn't put
it in a meal plan. I can't work out why
they've done it, really. But the milk powder is only 10%,
which I think is why. I think there'd be a
very minimal amount of custard in here. So I certainly
wouldn't be prescribing it from a bone health perspective. You'd
be far better with yogurt or milk. But yeah, it's
got my least type of what we call an isolated
fiber in there called inulin. If you're someone who has
(21:23):
a sensitive tummy or suffer with IBS, inulin is not
your friend. Generally, it's quite high in blood maps. And
it's also not the right type of fiber that would
really be helping with a huge amount of constipation. I'd
much rather give someone, if I had an elderly person
or a young person who was quite constipated, I'd dilute
some pear juice or some prune juice or give them
a couple of kiwi fruits. I'd much rather... the soluble
(21:44):
type of fiber from fruit or gives them a bit
of oats and chia or a bowl of porridge or something,
I think you'd have a much better chance in terms
of fiber there. Inulin is more of a prebiotic type fiber,
so you're helping to feed the good bacteria in your gut.
It's not a bad type of fiber. It's fine, but
it's certainly not one of my favorite types of fiber.
I think a lot of different types of fiber is
(22:04):
important in your diet, particularly if you struggle with things
like a digestive health perspective, if you are suffering from
a I would be aiming to get a whole range
of different fibers in your diet, not just a whole
heap of isolated fiber from something like Inulin in a
custard product. Because if I'm being honest, Susie, if you're
looking to custard for your fiber intake, I don't think
(22:26):
you're doing it right.
Speaker 1 (22:28):
No, and that's why I think it's people who perhaps
are not consuming a lot of food in general. And
I think people who are sometimes in aged care homes
or maybe have dementia and really struggling to get calories in,
this could be a really good product to get some
nutrition in when they're not eating a lot. And they
certainly need the calories and they need the sugars. But yeah,
(22:50):
I'm not quite sure how you reach that group because
often they're being fed by bigger organizations. So yeah, I
think for aging population, people in their 80s, 90s who've
got low oral intake, it could be a great product.
That's the only person potentially. And yeah, I just thought
it was a little bit random. So Yes, if you
like custard, I think there's better options. And in general,
(23:11):
I think if you're a grown-up, there's probably better options
in general to get a sweet hit at the end
of the day than having custard. So in terms of
the higher protein ranges of custard, I think they're just
trying to mimic that market who are having these puddings
all the time. And I've got my clients having a
big dinner and then a whole pudding. You don't need 14,
20 grams of protein after you've just eaten dinner. So
(23:31):
they've got a place in the diet as well to consider.
And that leads back to our discussion that more protein
is not always better. So just be mindful of that.
I saw, what did I see the other day? High
protein dessert cakes, like lava cakes. Anyway, it gives us
plenty to talk about on the nutrition couch. All right, Leanne,
for the final question of today's episode, I've had a
(23:52):
few questions about taking supplements because it can be tricky
to get supplements in, particularly if you're trying to get
powders in every single day and you might not be
a shake person. So specifically this question was around collagen.
How do I take it every day to make it easier?
But I think it also links to creatine Now, if
I go back to my sports nutrition days, Leanne, where
the players would just take their supplements with a spoon
(24:14):
and water before they hit the gym, including their pre-trainer,
their glutamine and their creatine.
Speaker 2 (24:20):
With a big glob of water.
Speaker 1 (24:22):
It's not for everybody, but certainly you can shot things
like collagen if you wanted to. But yeah, we're looking
for some strategies to make supplement intake on a daily
basis easier.
Speaker 2 (24:32):
Leanne, what do you got for us?
Speaker 3 (24:33):
I wouldn't shut my collagen. I think it'd be a
big sticky mess. I would not recommend doing that. I
personally have my supplement, what I call my supplement stack
once a day. So I add a scoop of my protein.
I add two scoops of creatine and a scoop of
collagen into that. And I just drink that down. If
I'm feeling a bit bougie, I'll add some berries and spinach,
the milk and make it more of like a mini meal.
But I normally just do my stack and get it down.
(24:54):
And I know that I'm routinely getting in 30 grams
of protein. 5-10 grams of collagen, about 5-6 grams of
creatine as well. So for me, it's easy. It's like
a habit. It boosts my overall protein intake for the
day and it's done. Whereas a lot of my clients
drink collagen in their coffee, funnily enough. So you can
add collagen to your morning coffee, your tea, you can
put it into a smoothie, you can mix it into
(25:15):
yogurt if you're someone that likes to have a yogurt
like mid-morning or mid-afternoon. goes into porridge, overnight oats. You
can even put it into sauces or even like soups
and things as well. Because a big myth that we
hear a lot, Susie, is that you can't put collagen
into hot drinks, but that is not actually true. And
I think a lot of the confusion comes from the
fact that yes, collagen is a protein, And like all protein,
(25:36):
heat generally causes protein to denature or like change its structure.
But denaturing is not the same thing as destroying the protein, right?
So actually collagen peptides, which are found in most supplements
and certainly in our Design by Dietitian Renew Collagen Reins,
we use hydrolyzed collagen peptides. So that means that they've
actually been broken down into smaller peptides that are specifically
(25:59):
designed to actually dissolve in both hot or cold liquids.
I actually find that collagen mixes down better into a
warmer hot liquid. So adding it into your morning coffee
or tea is completely fine, but I think the best
thing to do is find a habit and kind of
stick to that. Like if you're someone that has a
cup of coffee or tea every single morning and adding
your collagen into that is a really great option. If
(26:19):
you're someone that has a yogurt every afternoon, stirring your
collagen into that is a good option because consistency with
your supplements, particularly the two most important ones to be
consistent with on a daily basis are collagen and creatine,
because the research shows us you need to be consistent
with both of them. If you're not consistent, you're not
going to get the best benefits. If you take your
collagen for a week, then forget about it for three
(26:40):
weeks and come back onto it. You're certainly not going
to get the best evidence. The research really shows us
about eight to 12 weeks of consistent daily use. That's
where a lot of the participants and research studies showed
some really good outcomes from a collagen supplementation perspective. So personally,
I would just keep it next to like your coffee
machine or your kettle or, you know, next to your
morning snack or something as like a reminder or a
(27:03):
jog to help you take it regularly. But you can
pretty much put it into any foods basically. But I
do find if you want to mix it in and
have it sort of dissolve down a little bit, your
best bet is into like a warm, a warmer type
of liquid like a tea or a coffee.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
Well, I have the collagen in the hot chocolate. Oh,
that's a good idea. But you told me I had
to do it differently. You said to me I've got
to put it in first and then stir it in.
Speaker 3 (27:26):
Yeah, because otherwise it can go a little bit clumpy.
Speaker 2 (27:28):
Yeah, and I just keep like vigorously, vigorously stirring.
Speaker 3 (27:32):
You can get one of our hand mixers.
Speaker 1 (27:35):
That's true.
Speaker 2 (27:36):
I could do that actually.
Speaker 3 (27:36):
Make it easy for yourself.
Speaker 1 (27:38):
I know. This is why Leanne, she's much smarter than
I am. All right, Leanne, thanks for those tips. Well,
that brings us to the end of the Nutrition Catch
for another Wednesday. Please keep telling your friends about us
so we can continue to grow and we look forward
to seeing you next week for our regular episode drop.
Speaker 2 (27:51):
Have a great week.
Speaker 3 (27:52):
Catch you next week.
Speaker 1 (27:53):
Bye.
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