November 11, 2025 • 52 mins
What happens when the keen eye of a museologist meets the ancient craft of rug-making? The answer lies in the remarkable journey of Shailen Smith, CEO of Raj Group, a heritage brand with roots stretching back to 1939 in the historic city of Panipat, India.
"When an archaeologist's job is over, the museologist's job begins," explains Smith, whose unique background brought fresh perspective to a centuries-old craft. Initially arriving to document weaving as an artistic practice, Smith discovered a company at a crossroads – torn between preserving handcrafted traditions and embracing modern technology. Rather than choosing sides, she pioneered a third path: using technology to enhance craftsmanship without replacing it.
This delicate balance between heritage and innovation forms the cornerstone of Raj's identity today. "If we are to stay unique, there must be that perfect balance where handcrafted is aided by technology," Smith reflects. This philosophy extends beyond production to encompass everything from sustainability practices to leadership style. The company demonstrated its commitment to its artisans during COVID by maintaining its entire workforce despite production slowdowns – recognizing that their people aren't just employees but guardians of cultural heritage.
As one of few female CEOs in a deeply patriarchal region, Smith brings a distinctive leadership approach that blends strength with empathy. Raised by her father "as a neutral gender" with focus on inherent strengths rather than societal expectations, she navigates traditional business structures while championing greater opportunities for women throughout the organization.
Smith's observations about today's consumers resonate deeply: we're experiencing a revolution in home goods similar to what happened in beauty – questioning artificial standards and returning to authenticity. "We've been feeding consumers something unnatural," she notes, as more people seek products with meaningful stories, sustainable materials, and ethical production.
Discover how this heritage brand stays rooted in tradition while confidently embracing the future. As Smith puts it, "If you know what your roots are, you will move forward without doubt, and you will thrive and survive."
Listen
Watch
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
Hello and welcome to the Retail Journey podcast.
I'm one of your hosts, charlesGreathouse, and.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
I'm one of your hosts as well.
I'm James Harris, and today weare talking to Shailen Smith.
Shailen is the CEO of Raj Group, and Raj is a heritage brand
established in 1939 in Panipat,India, specializing in carpets,
rugs and other floor coverings.
Thank you so much for joiningus, Shailen.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
Thank you so much, James and Charles.
I think it's both an honor anda pleasure to be part of this
podcast, and thank you so muchfor thinking of me and including
me here.
Speaker 1 (00:43):
Absolutely yeah.
You're our first guest totravel, you know, across an
entire ocean just for thepodcast here in Bentonville.
What a treat.
No, but welcome to Bentonville.
I know you just arrived forthis trip.
I hope you get to enjoy, youknow, the wonderful place that
is Bentonville, arkansas, andget to see some things while
(01:05):
you're here, crystal Bridgesbeing one of those.
That will be fun, especiallygiven some of your background,
which I'd love to share with ourlisteners, because your journey
to retail was a little bit lesstraditional.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
Absolutely, I think I'm really looking forward to
exploring this city and seeing alittle more of it.
Definitely, I think I'm lookingforward to the museum
walkthrough in particular,because I believe there's a
beautiful collection there andit's also pretty close to how I
feel about knowing andunderstanding a culture and a
(01:41):
space is really through a museum.
It has a lot to do with thebackground and where I'm coming
from.
I'm a trained museologist and Ispecialized in museum sciences.
If I were to simply explain it,you know, when an
archaeologist's job is over, themuseologist's job begins.
Ah, I like that, so the momentthe artifact is pulled out of
(02:04):
the ground, it's really the jobof a museologist to give it both
context as well as give itcontent and give it a new home,
so that whoever is theninteracting with the artifact
really knows where it's comingfrom.
And that's how my journeyreally started with Raj is
because you know, there wassomething beautiful in
(02:24):
Handcrafted that was sittingthere in Panipat, but in order
to give it context and somecontent, I think there was a lot
of theorization that wasmissing over there, and I think
that's where I really came in tobring in theory into that
practical form of craftsmanship,which was weaving, and as I
(02:46):
started the journey, it waspurely about documenting weaving
as a craft and finding a newdefinition for it for it to go
down into posterity, becauseIndia was at that turn, at that
point, where either it washandcrafted or it was technology
(03:07):
infused manufacturing.
And I came in at a reallyinteresting time where I think
the company at that point wasintrospecting on what their
journey should be Should theycontinue with the handcrafted
journey or should they infusetechnology?
And if they do, how relevantwould either or be in terms of
its survival?
And as a museologist, I came inand saw it very differently.
(03:28):
I wasn't part of the business.
I wasn't looking at it as amonetary operation.
I was looking at more as anartistic space and I really
started bringing the craftforward in unique ways, bringing
artists to work on the factoryfloor.
Do an artist in residencereally find a new definition for
(03:50):
every process that we weredoing?
And then eventually I stayed on, learned a little more about
the business and I'm still there.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
Turns out pretty good at understanding the business,
figuring out how to grow and, inthis kind of space, being able
to inspire a customer in apretty rapid way.
And then you know, from afarbeing inspired is one thing and
then as you get closer, thebetter you know texture, the
better depth of artistry withinthe product really reveals
(04:23):
itself.
Depth of artistry within theproduct really reveals itself
and that's what I've been mostimpressed with with Raj.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
You know, overall, as we've gotten to know each other
, and from some of our firstconversations going back almost
a year now, you've been veryconsistent that the work is art
and you've been very consistenton the value of the people that
are making that art.
I believe you shared with usthat through COVID, even when
production slowed down quite abit because of demand and the
(04:51):
illness that you kept yourentire staff on factory floor
included.
Just that stood out to me asreally valuing the people that
make the product that you'reputting into the marketplace.
Speaker 3 (05:03):
You know, james.
I think it's very important forany company to understand what
their roots are.
I think if you know what yourroots are, you will move forward
into the future without doubt,and you will thrive and survive.
And I think this is where we'vebeen a little successful is
focusing on our roots, reallyunderstanding where we come from
(05:25):
and who we are.
So where we come from isobviously the region.
The region has a great historyHistorically.
The city of Panipat in ancientand medieval India has played a
very pivotal role in shaping thegeographical map that we see
today of India.
Really, india was just thebottom half of the subcontinent.
(05:47):
It was really with theinvasions and different rulers
coming in, and Panipat beingthat massive battlefield where
three very, very foundationalwars were fought, that you see
the geographical map of Indiatoday, the way it is and how it
has been formed.
Of course, there have beenother reasons also why that
geographical map has been formed, but the Battles of Panipat
(06:10):
were really the three veryfoundational, I think, time
periods in India's history.
That really has set thatgeographical space as it is
visible today.
But, having said that, it alsobecame a region for a lot of
people to find purpose, to moveforward back and forth between
the north and south of India,and that's where Panipat
(06:31):
developed as a region forcraftsmen, for herders, and it
became a center for both.
It became a center for herdersto come in and flock their sheep
, it became a center for weaversto take all the wool that was
coming from there and to findpurpose for it, and it became a
center for weaving.
(06:51):
And when we look at that, it'svery easy for us to say that's.
One of the key foundations ofRaj is the fact that weavers for
generations have made thisplace their home and built a
certain expertise that you willnot find across any other place
in India, but also anywhereacross the world.
And this is, I think, where thebackground in museology comes
(07:14):
in, when it tries to look atsomething with a very, very deep
and a keen eye to see wherethat history and that legacy is
coming from.
I think that's really helped meput, I think, thought to this
being one of the very keyfoundations of the company.
I do have to give it to thefamily, though.
The family has been veryinstrumental in protecting its
people, ensuring they give backin whatever way they can to the
(07:37):
community, but I think they werecoming more from a place of
philanthropy.
I think where I'm coming is morea place from protection of
artistry, protection ofcraftsmanship, protection of a
legacy, and then, of course, theother part of it is that we are
dependent on the craft, forsure, but we're dependent on the
(07:58):
people who make that craft.
We're dependent on those hands,we're dependent on all those
families who put their trustinto bringing themselves there,
setting up home there, and wemust understand that India is an
agricultural economy, even tilldate.
Everyone has and owns a pieceof land, everyone cultivates
(08:20):
that piece of land, and there isa season in India where you'll
find very, very less labor onthe factory floor, very less
workforce on the factory floor,because they've all gone back
home to harvest the crop thatthey've cultivated and we are
still so dependent on thatentire agricultural aspect of
(08:41):
our economy.
But at the same time, we'realso developing all these other
skill sets, and definitelyhandcrafted artisanal has been
one of those key developmentsthat we've seen over the years.
So I think the fact that we werevery clear as to what our
foundation is and was is whathas helped us along the way,
james, where I think it was justorganic that, given a real
(09:04):
crisis, given a time like COVID,we had no choice but to ensure
that we protected our people,because they were there for
survival.
But they were there for adifferent kind of a survival.
They were not there for asurvival to be through COVID.
They were there for thesurvival of mankind in general,
at a time when none of us knewwhat the future is going to hold
(09:26):
.
We didn't know if any of us,any of us, would survive, but we
also didn't know if theindustry would survive and we
just had to hold our head uphigh and walk through that time.
The fact that we had a lot ofsupport from local
administration, coming to thefactory floor, setting up small
little clinics within thefactory, administering the
(09:47):
vaccine to everyone not once butthrice, I think, was massive
support for us to continue withthe confidence that we were able
to carry through.
Speaker 2 (09:57):
That's excellent.
We've spoken some about Ponipat.
Ponipat.
I'm sorry, I'm trying topronounce it correctly.
Speaker 3 (10:07):
Ponipat, that's.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
I'm sorry, I'm trying to pronounce it correctly
panipat like that.
That's correct.
Well, india in general.
You know there's a lot ofdiscussion around india.
There's obviously been um atremendous amount of
manufacturing base being builtup across the enormous country.
Um what, what kind of setsindia as a manufacturing partner
, as a country?
Speaker 3 (10:29):
That's a very deep question, james, and I'll tell
you why.
For an economist, it would beon the periphery and everyone
would talk about investment andeveryone would talk about the
way the administration islooking at the growth of the
economy.
But I understand it verydifferently.
You know, we've beenindependent as a country only
(10:50):
for not even a century, yet alittle less than a century, and
I think what has been ripped offthis country has been pride.
Whenever we've had somebodyrule us, the first thing they've
done is they've ripped thepride off us, and I think that's
largely why India could notprogress and grow as an economy.
(11:16):
India could not progress andgrow in various industries was
because we had no sense of pride.
We were not proud of what wewere doing, and I must give it
to the past 15 years, and I'mnot pro anyone, I'm pro progress
.
So anyone who brings progress,I'm on their side and I think
(11:36):
for me this government bringsprogress from a very different
perspective.
It has brought progress withfirst instilling a sense of
pride.
No-transcript, they're willingto invest back in it monetarily
(12:08):
and the moment we've done that,the whole world is looking at us
today, the whole world islooking at us as unique.
The whole world is looking atus as us bringing something
completely different to thetable.
Speaker 2 (12:20):
As a powerhouse.
Speaker 3 (12:22):
And as a powerhouse.
Now, today, because that's whatwe've been working on is in
reinstilling that sense of pride, and I'm actually I'm a little
proud to say that, James, thisis also something that, when I
joined Raj, and with a verydifferent agenda, I think the
first thing that we said wasthat we want to instill a sense
(12:45):
of pride in what ourcraftspeople do, and the best
way to do it was to bringsomebody from the outside to
come back onto the factory floorand say you do something really
unique.
So when an artist wouldinteract with a craftsperson and
say you are doing something sobeautiful and unique, it
automatically instilled a senseof pride.
And if I were to use that as anexample today, I think that's
(13:08):
exactly what we are doing as acountry is bringing in people
from different walks of life,from different industries and
showing the best that we have,and when they talk about our
uniqueness, it automatically, Ithink it allows us to introspect
, to sort of, to look within andreally feel that sense of pride
(13:30):
, and I think that's what'sreflecting itself as India
emerging into this powerhouse.
We've always had these values,james, and we've had these
capabilities, but unfortunately,we never looked within.
We were always dependent onsomebody else telling us what we
could do.
It comes a lot with being ruled, I think, for centuries and
(13:51):
decades, but today, as weindependently walk through it's,
it's something that we're doingourselves and because it's
something that we're doingourselves, we're able to open
our doors for investment.
We're able to open our doorsfor investment, we're able to
open our doors for growth.
And the most interesting part,james, is that while we are
(14:11):
looking at external sources ofinvestment, we've also become a
country that is looking atreinvesting its profits back
into our own personal growth.
And if I were to equate that,today, raj is a company where
our profits are not measured by.
Our profits are not measured bya percentage or a margin.
(14:37):
Our profits are measured bywhat are we doing to bring
growth back into theorganization.
Are we adding more technology?
Are we expanding category?
Are we acquiring new buildingsto expand certain manufacturing
capabilities?
We run our own processesin-house.
(14:59):
So we're a complete verticalorganization where just the
fiber comes in and we processall that fiber we spin, we dye,
we weave, we of course finishand package and dispatch our
final product.
But we're looking at re.
We're re-looking at all theprocesses to see how can we
improve them better?
How can we bring in technologyto aid all those processes?
(15:21):
That's true, yes Is when youcan reinvest back in yourself to
make yourself more efficient,to, to to, I would say, to
improve the way your dailyoperations are and to aid
yourself to.
To just go into a space ofcategory expansion, not being
(15:43):
just a manufacturer of rugs, butbeing a manufacturer of pillows
, being a manufacturer of throws, being a manufacturer of top of
bed, taking a machinery thatweaves rugs and re the country
at large.
That's also one of the reasonswhy we are emerging into a
powerhouse today.
Speaker 2 (16:11):
And speaking of your rugs, at least in our wide shot
we're using one of them today.
Speaker 3 (16:18):
Absolutely.
It's a moment of pride to beable to sit here as Charles said
, traveling across, you know, anentire sort of a couple of
continents, an entire ocean tobe here today for this podcast,
but also to be able to sit herewith the product at our feet at
the same time and for it to befeatured in the podcast as well.
(16:40):
I think that's also a sense ofpride that I hold Excellent.
Speaker 1 (16:44):
Excellent.
Yeah, a little insider info thepillows are also a Raj product
that we've had on set forseveral of these.
When I got to visit thefacilities in Potty Pot this
past summer, the showroomabsolutely blew me away and I
(17:05):
felt like that was going to bethe most impressive thing.
And then I saw a weaver weavingwith such expertise, grace,
efficiency.
It was like wow, this is anincredible feat to be able to
accomplish the things that areaccomplished in this
manufacturing, and I love howyou talked about heritage as
well as innovation, bringingtechnology while not losing
(17:26):
sight of heritage.
I'd love for you to elaborate,as a manufacturer, what it looks
like to both protect heritageas well as make the progress
that's necessary to compete inan increasingly competitive
environment.
Speaker 3 (17:47):
I can tell you, charles, it's a very difficult
job to balance the two, becauseheritage demands patronization,
and patronization demandsfunding, and technology
cannibalizes on heritage, forcertain, because it is so
efficient, it is so quick, it'sso easy and definitely it's.
(18:08):
It definitely produces aproduct that's less expensive
that it it's.
It's always a question as towhat do you go with.
Do you go with heritage or doyou go with technology?
Like I said in the beginning,the fact that we've invested
ourselves in knowing our rootsand where our foundation lies
has really helped us tocircumnavigate times where we've
(18:31):
been always challenged forproduct pricing, always
challenged for a more consciousprice product, always challenged
by retailers to give them abetter deal, and we've been able
to put our product that ishandmade and artisanal in front
of them and push them back toselect a perfect balance between
(18:53):
the two.
A product that's aided bytechnology, but also a product
that's truly handcrafted hasreally been a mantra, so to say,
if I were to call it that,because that's the only way to
go, that's the only way to stayunique, that's the only way for
Raj to not be like every othermanufacturer, that's the only
way for Raj to ensure that it'spart of a heritage and a legacy
(19:19):
that cannot be aped by orfollowed by anyone else.
I think if we are to stayunique, there has to be that
perfect balance that we createfor ourselves where handcrafted
is aided by technology.
Technology brings in efficiencyinto the processes that
handcrafted has, but nevercannibalizes on.
It never becomes the center ofour agenda.
(19:41):
It obviously is extremely easyfor us to move away from
artisanal into technology at atime where labor is challenged,
at a time where handcrafted ischallenged, at a time when
everyone's looking um at beinguh, at a time when economy in
general is challenged, and it'sreally simple and easy to make a
decision in favor of technologyand to move away from all the
(20:04):
challenges that handcraftedbrings and artisanal brings.
Because, as as beautiful as itsounds, it's also people
management.
At the end of the day, you'relooking at a migratory community
.
You're looking at changingtimes.
You're looking at legacychanging.
It's not necessarily beingpassed down from generation to
(20:27):
generation.
It's now being passed down fromwho's better at the skill and
who's willing to learn the skillto come back onto the factory
floor and weave the product andbe part of the entire process of
handcrafted.
So the real challenge, I think,charles, over here, is to be
level-headed and maintain thebalance, to keep going back to
(20:49):
your roots and keep going backto foundation to say what is it
that we truly stand for?
Are we going to be that companythat is going to allow
technology to take oversomething that's unique?
Are we going to go the age-oldprocess and continue being
handcrafted, but not improve ourprocesses and bring in
technology to help us there?
(21:11):
So I think the perfect answerover there is balance and
balancing ourselves in a waythat we still stay unique even
if we bring in technology, andwe are not superseded, uh, by
being age old, by just dependingon handcrafted, and ensuring
(21:32):
that we have the two to balanceeach other yeah, I love that.
Speaker 1 (21:35):
Yeah, from a customer point of view, being able to
access something that's uniqueis uh can be a challenge for a
lot of customers who can'tafford or don't quite understand
the value of what they would beable to acquire.
You know, walmart tends toserve this need very often.
(21:56):
At the same time, thebitterness of poor quality will
always outlast the sweetness ofa good deal, and so the balance
of quality and value is one thatevery merchant fights
aggressively on behalf of thecustomer to go insert as much
value as possible.
(22:17):
Some find themselves a bitshort-sighted on simple price,
but at the end of the day, thecustomer will vote with the like
hey, I bought this thing, itwas very cheap and yes, it was
very cheap, and I'm not doingthat again.
You don't make that mistake somany times, I'd love With online
(22:38):
reviews you can't afford to.
Yeah, Online reviews are one waythat that shows up.
The dollars certainly are thething that last as far as I'm
not going to buy this categoryeven and Walmart's on a journey
to deepen trust with customersas they expand into categories
(23:00):
that they've touched in but aremaking a bit more of a foothold,
especially across the home area, and so I'd love to hear your I
don't know counsel to thosethat are fighting on behalf of
the customer, want to bringheritage.
You know there's a certain setof customers that understand
true heritage and would neverwant anything that wasn't truly
(23:20):
all the way handcrafted.
And there's the others thatlove that sort of inspiration.
And I recall across yourshowroom, you know, here's one
that's like a hundred percent,all of the things are artisanal,
and then here's how we makethat more affordable as well.
But, yeah, I'd love to hearyour sort of counsel for those
across retail that are trying tofight that balance of value as
(23:43):
well as uniqueness.
Speaker 3 (23:45):
Charles, I think the key word here is understanding.
When you put that question outthere for me, you said that the
customer does not understand theproduct.
I think that's the key word.
There is what we fed thecustomer with.
We must understand thatadvertising, manufacturing all
of them play a very key role incustomer choices.
(24:06):
A customer does not know what'sout there until somebody
packages that and tells themwhat's available for them to buy
off the shelves, or what's goodfor their homes, what's good
for their personal health needs,what's great for their skin,
what's good for their hair.
(24:29):
It's pretty much like the beautyindustry went through a
revolution where everyone wastalking about a perfect body
type, everyone was talking abouta perfect skin type, everyone
was talking about a particularhair type, and suddenly the
entire beauty industry wasrevolutionized when someone said
who is making these beautystandards and why are they
making these beauty standards?
Is it to sell a product or isit what human beings are framed
(24:51):
out to be?
And if you look at human beingsfrom across the world, we're
all so different.
We could be from the same homeand yet we'd all be so unique
looking, the same DNA, but yetso different, right, and I think
that's exactly how we'relooking at the entire industry
for home today.
We're looking at what isselling and why have we been
(25:12):
selling this?
Why have we been feeding ourconsumers with something that is
so unnatural, that is soplastic?
In many ways we're talkingabout conscious manufacturing,
we're talking aboutsustainability, but these are
not customer choices.
The consumer has never knownany better because that's all
they've been fed with.
So if we are to talk aboutunderstanding, we are to talk
(25:36):
about education and we are totalk about the right choices.
I think it's somethingcollective that we had to do.
You know, india today isemerging as an industry, as a
manufacturing industry, tosupport the needs of consumers
and brands across.
But we weren't ready about adecade plus back.
We weren also ill-equipped backthen to participate in this
(25:58):
whole requirement and the needthat home had in general.
And there were other regionswho were willing and
participative and out there theywere not able to give a
handcrafted product, but theywere able to give a beautiful,
cheap, machine-made product thatserviced the needs back then.
(26:21):
True that the consumer has hadenough of that.
True that the consumer isquestioning everything.
But the consumer is questioningeverything because brands are
questioning everything.
Manufacturers are questioningeverything.
Manufacturers are there to saythat there's something else for
you.
You don't have to necessarilyrely on this.
So I think we're at that placeof of I think a revolution as
(26:44):
far as home is concerned,exactly how we were at a place
of revolution where beautystandards and the fashion
industry was concerned.
And I think, uh, charles, whenwe put a product out there,
that's better, not in terms ofvalue for money, but better
because it is better to theenvironment, it's better to the
process and it's better to thestoryline, then automatically
(27:08):
the consumer will get used to itand will want to have it.
You know, everyone is looking atan experience today because
we've had everything else otherthan an experience.
I think, as a human race, we'vefocused on everything other
than the experience itself.
So people are turning towardsspirituality.
People are turning towardsfinding new purpose in life.
(27:30):
People are turning towardsbetter relationships.
People are questioning anythingthat does not make them happy
or comfortable, creates a senseof anxiety in them.
People are questioning that ingeneral and they're looking for
a better experience.
And that People are questioningthat in general and they're
looking for a better experience.
And that's where home's comingin.
We're looking at something thathas a story behind it.
(27:50):
We're looking at a softer handfeel, we're looking at material
that is conscious, that is notpolluting the environment, and I
think as we pivot and movetowards there, charles and I
think as we pivot and movetowards there, charles we have
half the battle won for usalready.
The other half has to be.
I think the other half has tobe won with understanding.
(28:14):
The other half has to be wonwith education.
The other half has to be wonwith a storyline, and a
storyline that's not just madefor advertising, a storyline
that has true meaning to it.
So I think that's where you know, charles, I think it is our
responsibility as a manufacturerto really shed light on the
(28:34):
story behind the product andwhat it brings to the table,
when it's not just made, buteven in terms of its life and
how that life ends as a cycleand how that life ends as a
cycle.
If that life ends as a cyclewith polluting the environment
and causing harm to everythingaround us, we all don't want
that product as well, even ifit's beautifully handcrafted, it
(28:57):
should have a meaningfulpurpose to it in its end journey
, as it should have a meaningfulpurpose to it in the beginning
of its journey.
So I think that otherresponsibility lies on the
manufacturer to bring somethingunique to the brand, to give
that perfect balance.
Like I said, if you usetechnology to aid the process of
handcrafted, you've alreadybrought some sense of efficiency
(29:20):
to it, which automatically, Ithink, supports the challenges
that price have today.
But I feel even this is part ofthat whole cycle.
The economy will go up and theeconomy will go down, there will
be supply, there will be demand, and I think you just have to
wade through every challengethat comes along your way to
ensure that you stand yourground.
(29:41):
Keep portraying what you bringto the table.
In the case of Raj, we'll keepworking on the story of
Handcrafted.
We'll keep trying to make theproduct more efficient so that
it meets certain pricechallenges not all price
challenges.
It cannot ape another region.
We cannot be as efficient as amachine made, but we can
(30:01):
definitely be the best versionof ourselves.
Speaker 1 (30:05):
Yeah Well, and the authenticity of a product that
was good for the environment,good for the people that made it
, as well as good for those thatare going to put it in their
home for, you know, hopefully,decades.
I believe that the transparencyof the reality of cheap goods,
that bitterness of somethingthat doesn't last, is far more
known today than it was, youknow, 15, 10 years ago, and I
(30:29):
see the customer moving in thedirection of I don't actually
want, you know, as a pillow, apillow that's going to last six
months in fine condition, nineinadequate, and then from there
sort of uh level of quality inmy home.
I'd rather have something thatI know I'll be able to stand
behind.
Speaker 2 (30:48):
yeah, something of value yeah, so you've spoken, uh
, about some of the, I would say, values of raj and undoubtedly
yourself of sustainability,really valuing the craft and the
art and the people and thehands that make it.
What other values really driveyou personally and Raj as an
(31:08):
organization?
Speaker 3 (31:10):
Personally, you know, james, I think the value that
drives me every day and thatkeeps me grounded is that, you
know, I always I'm a believer.
I believe that there is ahigher power that drives all of
us.
I think submitting yourself tothe higher power and ensuring
that you're open to the rightenergy every single day, I think
(31:33):
is extremely important.
It's something that keeps yougrounded, it's something that
keeps you level-headed and it'ssomething that really
circumnavigates through all theanxieties that one can have
through the entire day, personalor professional.
So I think, for me, that's whatdrives me is definitely the
belief in the presence of ahigher power, something that I
(31:54):
can submit to and ensure thatI'm the best version of myself
every single day.
Um and for Raj, I think it's thesame Raj submits itself to the
process, uh to the people, anddefinitely uh submits itself to
whatever it's done to theenvironment, for decades of
(32:14):
manufacturing is trying to undoit in whatever way possible.
So, if it means investing inbetter sources of energy, if it
means cleaning the water that weconsume for all our wet
processes, if it meansrepurposing water bodies in and
around Panipat that have driedup at their source, if it means
(32:36):
tree plantation, if it meansinvestment in sustainable
material and a sustainablesupply chain, no matter how much
that burdens us every singleday and it's such a difficult
journey to walk the path ofsustainability.
I always say sustainabilityrequires one investment and that
investment is not resources,that investment is intent,
(32:59):
because only if you have theintent can you circumnavigate
all the challenges that you'llhave with walking the line of
sustainability.
Because it is such a resourceinvestment process it is
absolutely every single day.
It is a true challenge to beable to walk that path.
So I think Raj, as a company,submits itself every single day
(33:20):
to the process, to the peopleand to the planet, and through
that submission, I think that'swhat takes us forward, that's
also our future vision, that'swhat we also speak about
continuously as far as our goalsand our vision is and as far as
our foundation is.
So really, that submission, Ithink, on a personal level and
(33:44):
that submission as far as thecompany is concerned, I think
submission is very important intoday's time because I think
that's what leaves you open toeverything that happens and
everything that is a challengeevery single day.
Speaker 2 (33:57):
That's well said.
So you talk about your businessand the industry as a whole in
really a unique way, and I feellike you're coming at your CEO
role from your femaleness in away that is very unique, and I'm
(34:20):
sorry if I'm not saying thatwell, but as a woman, how
important is that in India, onthe factory floor, for the CEO
to be you?
Speaker 3 (34:31):
You know, it's a really funny anecdote.
Just the other day Sumit, themanaging partner of Raj, turned
around and told somebody she'smuch more of a man than any of
us.
So the fact that you say mybeing a woman and my being a
(34:54):
woman, CEO, just thethoughtfulness with which you've
approached.
Speaker 2 (34:56):
this is what I mean.
Speaker 3 (34:57):
Well, you know honestly, james, it is an
extremely difficult place to beat and it's been a challenge
every single day because theregion that we are a part of is
a deep-rooted patriarchal region.
For a man to take instructionsfrom a woman is unheard of and
(35:19):
unthought of, because they'vereally that part of the country.
The man is really the breadearner, the decision maker, the
be all and the end all of anentire family unit.
And families in India are notnuclear four or five member
families.
Families in India are 10, 15,20, 25 member families, extended
(35:41):
families that literally reportto one patriarch who's the
decision maker.
So for that region really torespond to female leadership, to
a woman and, I think, to beable to follow up, follow the
path set by a woman, is only metwith resilience, because that's
(36:03):
not something that they've beenbrought up with or they
understand.
I think for me what's beenreally helpful is that my father
really brought me up as aneutral gender.
My father never really broughtme up as a woman, but never
really brought me up as a boy.
He always brought me up assomebody who had inherently
(36:26):
certain strengths, and I think Iwas always.
That's something that I alwaysrecognize myself with is
strengths, not as a gender, tobe honest, and I think that's
really what helped me in thisrole is also for me to really
blend in with this group of verystrong Indian patriarchs.
(36:46):
Find my path and find my waywas only a journey that I think
I was able to undertake Becauseall my life I had an upbringing
of being a very neutralindividual in terms of skill
sets are concerned and skillstrengths are concerned.
And if I were to look at it anyother way, james, it was also
(37:12):
easier for me.
It was easier for me because Iwas able to see both sides.
I was able to read them forwhat they are and who they are,
maybe because of the littlebackground of history, uh,
geopolitics that I understoodfrom you know, my background,
education uh, I was able tounderstand where the men were
coming from and where thatpatriarchy was so deep-rooted
(37:33):
and coming from.
And then I was able toobviously use the feminine part
of my gender to kind of probablysoften certain aspects of how
we operate, how we run theorganization, how we look at
ourselves.
I was also able to use thatpart, I think, to rebrand
ourselves in many ways For years, I think that company was being
(37:56):
run by only men, and here Imust give credit to Sumit,
because I think Sumit has beenvery instrumental in allowing me
to have my own path, allowingme to, I think, see things in a
different way, allowing me toredefine a lot of things that
were essentially set in tone byhis family.
(38:18):
It's a family-owned business andI think that uniqueness of
flexibility that he has as anindividual has paid well off for
him, because it's allowed me toreally create a new path, a
path that's less resilient, apath that's more open, but a
path that's also modern and hasits own definition.
Because if I were to look atfamily-owned businesses and
(38:40):
legacy in general in India,they're very, very typical and
set in their own ways and rigidin many ways rigid to change,
rigid to evolution, rigid to newways of thinking.
I would say and I think that'sthose are the areas that I feel
James have able to been able tobring in is a sense of
(39:01):
difference because, um, becausethe company has been open to it,
uh, the managing partner andsumit have been open to it I've
been able to bring that, thatdifference, in.
I've been able to bring adifferent, uh, way of running
the organization, new definitionfor how we see handcrafted and
the journey at large.
So I think less to do with thefact that I was, that I am a
(39:24):
woman, not was.
I almost forgot that yeah, thatI am a woman, but I think more
to do with James.
The way I was brought up as achild by my father, that has
really, I think, aided me inthis leadership role that I have
as the CEO of the company.
Speaker 2 (39:40):
That's a really beautiful story.
I can only hope that I'mbringing up my daughter in a
similar manner.
Speaker 3 (39:49):
Well, I think all fathers and daughters have a
really unique relationship wherethe father brings in, I think,
the male gender of understandinglife and the daughter brings in
the female gender ofunderstanding life, and when
both the father and daughtershare a beautiful relationship,
this understanding crosses overand really leads to the
(40:12):
evolution of a very strong woman.
So I feel blessed that I have afather who is participative in
my upbringing, who'sparticipative in my upbringing,
and I'm sure every father who'sparticipative in the upbringing
of his daughter is doingsomething so unique and
beautiful for a futuregeneration.
And here is where I would wantto plug in a little bit more is
(40:32):
our agenda at Raj?
Number one, of course, that thecompany is led by a woman, but
also for us to have more womenbeing part of the factory, more
women being part of operationsfactory, more women being part
of operations, not at theadministrative level, but really
on the shop floor, on thefactory floor, walking shoulder
to shoulder with men on a lot ofmale driven processes is a
(40:57):
really important part of ourjourney, james, because the
woman is the heart of the familyand if the heart turns and
changes, it sets trend for thenext generation to be very, very
open and unique in their way ofthinking.
And if we are to break barriersin general, the women have to be
stronger in their approach,have to be stronger in their
(41:23):
approach.
So you know, while we'retalking about the whole
beautiful father-daughterrelationship and bringing women,
bringing up girls to be thesewonderful independent women, I
think, at the same time, theexisting group of women that we
have, if there's a little bit ofa push, and especially at the
region that we come from inPanipat, if there's a little
push to aid them in their senseof independent thinking and
belief, little push to aid themin their sense of independent
(41:43):
thinking and belief, itautomatically changes the entire
family structure that currentlyexists for us to be able to
help a generation, a newgeneration of individual
thinkers expectations and howthey respond to this whole
understanding of patriarchy atlarge.
Speaker 1 (42:01):
on to this whole understanding of patriarchy at
large.
It's beautiful and, having beenand seen your leadership as
well as the team at largeoperate the beauty of this sort
of diversity of thought andexecution is a very holistic
team, very intentional movementacross everyone and a tremendous
(42:22):
amount of respect across theteam Really enjoyed seeing it
and have incredibly high hopesfor how Raj will continue to
innovate and bring depth toevery product that you guys
create.
Speaker 3 (42:35):
I appreciate that, charles.
You know, we're only as good asthe partnership that supports us
, only as good as thepartnership that supports us.
Here I'd like to give a littlebit of a pivot and say that you
know, when we have a partnershiplike High Impact, who is
willing to invest in our beliefand support us, I think those
partnerships really matterbecause that's the symbiotic
(42:57):
relationship that can reallymake a manufacturer who's
sitting in some part of Indiasuccessful in a totally
different part of the worldwhere they would be completely
unknown, their process would becompletely unknown.
I think to be able to carry thatstory and that journey forward,
charles, to be able torecognize it you've made just
one trip to Panipat but to beable to have the good sense and
(43:19):
understanding to absorb all ofthat on the factory floor, I
think is unique in itself.
So I think the organizationhere, the fact that you're able
to look at manufacturers asunique as they are, to be able
to literally cherry pick them, Iwould say, in so many ways and
represent them, I think is alsounique and very interesting.
(43:40):
And to give a platform likethat for us to express ourselves
, for example, to have me todayon a podcast and really talk in
depth about who we are, what wedo, why we are here and what
makes us so relevant is alsovery unique, james.
Speaker 2 (43:55):
We're honored that you've entrusted us with a
portion of your business here inBentonville, Arkansas, and
definitely honored that youjoined us today.
Speaker 3 (44:06):
I think it's both ways likewise.
Speaker 1 (44:09):
We have a lightning round which is how we tend to
wrap it up which gets into acouple of questions in somewhat
rapid succession.
So first one is kind of it'snot meant to be a zinger, but we
love talking about failure.
We love talking about where andhow we failed in big, perhaps
(44:34):
fun stories to tell ways and howwe learn.
So what's some of the biggestfailure story that you've
experienced in this journey ofretail?
Speaker 3 (44:45):
Well, charles, every time I think it's the biggest
failure.
There's something right aroundthe corner.
That's a bigger failure.
That's waiting to define itselfand prove that it's bigger than
the other An expanding pie.
We are faced with failure everysingle day.
And in my initial journey, Ialways thought that there could
(45:06):
be no bigger failure than thecurrent situation that I was in,
and then there would besomething else, but it would
always have a learning curve toit.
We would always get better atwhat we were and where we stood.
I think the recent and thebiggest failure that I would
(45:29):
attribute to the company and tothe organization it's actually a
really funny story is, whileothers would look at it as an
opportunity, I looked at it as afailure when we actually were
approached by a certain businessto support them and to
(45:50):
manufacture for them, because Ifelt that we could have done
better and because we were at aposition where, you know, we
were pressed against certainfinancial conditions, we were
(46:10):
pressed against manufacturingnot being adequate and we had to
sustain and support the entireteam on ground is we had to
accept that brand and we had toaccept the manufacturing for
them and in some ways, go down alittle on our values, on our
set values, and that, for me, isa big failure is that you had
(46:32):
to compromise a bit of yourvalues to take on a manufacturer
, to take on a brand, tomanufacture for them, because
you had to keep yourself,sustain yourself every single
day to move forward.
I think those for me,unfortunately, charles are
bigger failures than failing ata production delivery, failing
at a quality standard, failingat um commitments made, um in
(46:57):
terms of sampling, failing onyou know a what do you say?
One of our factories shuttingdown, failing on purchase of
machinery that didn't work inour favor, and we've lost some
financials over there.
So I think those failuresreally are lesser failures.
The failures for me are whenyou have to let go of your
(47:19):
values and bring in someonebecause there isn't anything
better that you could think of.
Speaker 1 (47:24):
And interesting, as all of them learn to pretty
rapid learning and then progressas we learn from them and
realize, yep, not going to dothat again.
Speaker 3 (47:34):
So I'm pretty sure that in the next couple of years
we're going to say goodbye tothat brand and move forward.
Speaker 1 (47:40):
Yeah, yeah, I think we've all, we've all been there
in different ways and shapes andforms in the last year.
Speaker 2 (47:47):
What's, uh, what's been?
Speaker 3 (47:48):
just one thing that stood out to you as like a
revelation or learning um thatyou've incorporated you know,
james, we went through a littlebit of a curve last year and I
really thought that we couldn'tovercome it and this was a
personal challenge that thecompany had Unfortunately, I'm
(48:11):
not privy to detail it over hereon this podcast and I really
felt that we couldn't comethrough and I felt that that
would break us.
But actually it actuallystrengthened us and made us
introspect, look at our ownprocesses and find a new way of
reinventing and runningourselves, and that, honestly,
(48:35):
has given me so much strength asa leadership, as a leader after
that, it's added so much to myleadership role.
It's added so much to myleadership role, it's added so
much to Sumit's leadership rolethat it's literally put us on a
path of growth and at an expressrate, what we would have
thought would be our vision forthe next five years has actually
(48:56):
been our vision over a year.
So, that has been a reallyinteresting event that happened
to the company, which brought usall down, personally and as a
company, but also pushed us allright back on our feet.
Speaker 2 (49:12):
Amazing how that works.
Speaker 1 (49:14):
Yeah, I love that.
All right, and last one what'ssomething you're reading lately
and if it's reading or podcasts,what's some content you're
consuming that you'd like toshare?
Speaker 3 (49:28):
So there's this book that I'm reading called Hidden
Forces.
All right, it's a book onspirituality.
It's a book that really talksabout things that drive us every
single day, energies that driveus every single day.
Energies that drive us everysingle day and forces that drive
us every single day, and how doyou recognize those forces and
(49:50):
how do you enable them to aidyou and not bring you down.
So that's the book that I'mreading right now.
Speaker 1 (49:57):
Hidden Forces.
Do you know the author's name?
Speaker 3 (50:00):
I don't remember the author's name offhand Charles.
It is an Indian author and he'sa spiritual master and he's
written the book.
But it's derived from themother and Aurobindo.
I don't know if many people arefamiliar with the Aurobindo
ashram, but there was a livingmaster, aurobindo andam.
(50:20):
But there was a living master,aurobindo, and he was inspired
by the mother.
Everyone most people, wouldknow who the mother is and she
was called the mother, who'salso a living master.
So the book is basicallywritten by another living master
who's derived all thephilosophy and the teachings
from Aurobindo and the motherand basically conversations with
(50:41):
them like a podcast.
Back then the podcast wasmostly detailed and written and
put into as excerpts into a bookand this is really that book
that has all these excerpts onhidden forces, hidden energies,
how do you see them and how doyou help them, aid you versus
bring you down.
Speaker 1 (50:59):
Awesome.
Well, shailen, thank you somuch for joining us as we sort
of wrap the podcast.
Anything you'd like to share onbehalf of Raj.
Speaker 3 (51:12):
Not share, I think just add on to everything that
I've said.
I think I've.
I hope I'm not overshared today.
No, not at all.
But just in interest ofeverything that I said and to
quickly wrap it up as well,charles and James's, you know, I
think every organization andevery human being has a time and
(51:33):
when that time's there, if youdon't shine, you've lost that
opportunity.
I think this is the time forRaj to shine.
Opportunity.
I think this is the time forRaj to shine.
This is the opportunity forleadership to really come
through and pull thisorganization, I think, into its
peak.
And we're at that curve, we'reright there and I'm only looking
(51:55):
forward to the most fundamentalbut most beautiful next five
years.
I hope I'm still there to leadthem into the next five years.
If I'm not, I think I've doneenough to lay a good foundation.
But if I'm there, I'm more thanexcited to ride that wave.
Speaker 2 (52:14):
That's beautiful.
Speaker 3 (52:15):
Thank you for joining us today, thank you, thank you
so much, and to anybodylistening watching thank you for
joining us as well.
Speaker 2 (52:19):
You can find all of our podcasts.
Anybody listening watching.
Thank you for joining us aswell.
You can find all of ourpodcasts, videos and audios on
our website, athighimpactanalyticscom, youtube
or wherever you get yourpodcasts.
Thank you.
Hello and welcome to the Retail Journey podcast.
I'm one of your hosts, charlesGreathouse, and.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
I'm one of your hosts as well.
I'm James Harris, and today weare talking to Shailen Smith.
Shailen is the CEO of Raj Group, and Raj is a heritage brand
established in 1939 in Panipat,India, specializing in carpets,
rugs and other floor coverings.
Thank you so much for joiningus, Shailen.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
Thank you so much, James and Charles.
I think it's both an honor anda pleasure to be part of this
podcast, and thank you so muchfor thinking of me and including
me here.
Speaker 1 (00:43):
Absolutely yeah.
You're our first guest totravel, you know, across an
entire ocean just for thepodcast here in Bentonville.
What a treat.
No, but welcome to Bentonville.
I know you just arrived forthis trip.
I hope you get to enjoy, youknow, the wonderful place that
is Bentonville, arkansas, andget to see some things while
(01:05):
you're here, crystal Bridgesbeing one of those.
That will be fun, especiallygiven some of your background,
which I'd love to share with ourlisteners, because your journey
to retail was a little bit lesstraditional.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
Absolutely, I think I'm really looking forward to
exploring this city and seeing alittle more of it.
Definitely, I think I'm lookingforward to the museum
walkthrough in particular,because I believe there's a
beautiful collection there andit's also pretty close to how I
feel about knowing andunderstanding a culture and a
(01:41):
space is really through a museum.
It has a lot to do with thebackground and where I'm coming
from.
I'm a trained museologist and Ispecialized in museum sciences.
If I were to simply explain it,you know, when an
archaeologist's job is over, themuseologist's job begins.
Ah, I like that, so the momentthe artifact is pulled out of
(02:04):
the ground, it's really the jobof a museologist to give it both
context as well as give itcontent and give it a new home,
so that whoever is theninteracting with the artifact
really knows where it's comingfrom.
And that's how my journeyreally started with Raj is
because you know, there wassomething beautiful in
(02:24):
Handcrafted that was sittingthere in Panipat, but in order
to give it context and somecontent, I think there was a lot
of theorization that wasmissing over there, and I think
that's where I really came in tobring in theory into that
practical form of craftsmanship,which was weaving, and as I
(02:46):
started the journey, it waspurely about documenting weaving
as a craft and finding a newdefinition for it for it to go
down into posterity, becauseIndia was at that turn, at that
point, where either it washandcrafted or it was technology
(03:07):
infused manufacturing.
And I came in at a reallyinteresting time where I think
the company at that point wasintrospecting on what their
journey should be Should theycontinue with the handcrafted
journey or should they infusetechnology?
And if they do, how relevantwould either or be in terms of
its survival?
And as a museologist, I came inand saw it very differently.
(03:28):
I wasn't part of the business.
I wasn't looking at it as amonetary operation.
I was looking at more as anartistic space and I really
started bringing the craftforward in unique ways, bringing
artists to work on the factoryfloor.
Do an artist in residencereally find a new definition for
(03:50):
every process that we weredoing?
And then eventually I stayed on, learned a little more about
the business and I'm still there.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
Turns out pretty good at understanding the business,
figuring out how to grow and, inthis kind of space, being able
to inspire a customer in apretty rapid way.
And then you know, from afarbeing inspired is one thing and
then as you get closer, thebetter you know texture, the
better depth of artistry withinthe product really reveals
(04:23):
itself.
Depth of artistry within theproduct really reveals itself
and that's what I've been mostimpressed with with Raj.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
You know, overall, as we've gotten to know each other
, and from some of our firstconversations going back almost
a year now, you've been veryconsistent that the work is art
and you've been very consistenton the value of the people that
are making that art.
I believe you shared with usthat through COVID, even when
production slowed down quite abit because of demand and the
(04:51):
illness that you kept yourentire staff on factory floor
included.
Just that stood out to me asreally valuing the people that
make the product that you'reputting into the marketplace.
Speaker 3 (05:03):
You know, james.
I think it's very important forany company to understand what
their roots are.
I think if you know what yourroots are, you will move forward
into the future without doubt,and you will thrive and survive.
And I think this is where we'vebeen a little successful is
focusing on our roots, reallyunderstanding where we come from
(05:25):
and who we are.
So where we come from isobviously the region.
The region has a great historyHistorically.
The city of Panipat in ancientand medieval India has played a
very pivotal role in shaping thegeographical map that we see
today of India.
Really, india was just thebottom half of the subcontinent.
(05:47):
It was really with theinvasions and different rulers
coming in, and Panipat beingthat massive battlefield where
three very, very foundationalwars were fought, that you see
the geographical map of Indiatoday, the way it is and how it
has been formed.
Of course, there have beenother reasons also why that
geographical map has been formed, but the Battles of Panipat
(06:10):
were really the three veryfoundational, I think, time
periods in India's history.
That really has set thatgeographical space as it is
visible today.
But, having said that, it alsobecame a region for a lot of
people to find purpose, to moveforward back and forth between
the north and south of India,and that's where Panipat
(06:31):
developed as a region forcraftsmen, for herders, and it
became a center for both.
It became a center for herdersto come in and flock their sheep
, it became a center for weaversto take all the wool that was
coming from there and to findpurpose for it, and it became a
center for weaving.
(06:51):
And when we look at that, it'svery easy for us to say that's.
One of the key foundations ofRaj is the fact that weavers for
generations have made thisplace their home and built a
certain expertise that you willnot find across any other place
in India, but also anywhereacross the world.
And this is, I think, where thebackground in museology comes
(07:14):
in, when it tries to look atsomething with a very, very deep
and a keen eye to see wherethat history and that legacy is
coming from.
I think that's really helped meput, I think, thought to this
being one of the very keyfoundations of the company.
I do have to give it to thefamily, though.
The family has been veryinstrumental in protecting its
people, ensuring they give backin whatever way they can to the
(07:37):
community, but I think they werecoming more from a place of
philanthropy.
I think where I'm coming is morea place from protection of
artistry, protection ofcraftsmanship, protection of a
legacy, and then, of course, theother part of it is that we are
dependent on the craft, forsure, but we're dependent on the
(07:58):
people who make that craft.
We're dependent on those hands,we're dependent on all those
families who put their trustinto bringing themselves there,
setting up home there, and wemust understand that India is an
agricultural economy, even tilldate.
Everyone has and owns a pieceof land, everyone cultivates
(08:20):
that piece of land, and there isa season in India where you'll
find very, very less labor onthe factory floor, very less
workforce on the factory floor,because they've all gone back
home to harvest the crop thatthey've cultivated and we are
still so dependent on thatentire agricultural aspect of
(08:41):
our economy.
But at the same time, we'realso developing all these other
skill sets, and definitelyhandcrafted artisanal has been
one of those key developmentsthat we've seen over the years.
So I think the fact that we werevery clear as to what our
foundation is and was is whathas helped us along the way,
james, where I think it was justorganic that, given a real
(09:04):
crisis, given a time like COVID,we had no choice but to ensure
that we protected our people,because they were there for
survival.
But they were there for adifferent kind of a survival.
They were not there for asurvival to be through COVID.
They were there for thesurvival of mankind in general,
at a time when none of us knewwhat the future is going to hold
(09:26):
.
We didn't know if any of us,any of us, would survive, but we
also didn't know if theindustry would survive and we
just had to hold our head uphigh and walk through that time.
The fact that we had a lot ofsupport from local
administration, coming to thefactory floor, setting up small
little clinics within thefactory, administering the
(09:47):
vaccine to everyone not once butthrice, I think, was massive
support for us to continue withthe confidence that we were able
to carry through.
Speaker 2 (09:57):
That's excellent.
We've spoken some about Ponipat.
Ponipat.
I'm sorry, I'm trying topronounce it correctly.
Speaker 3 (10:07):
Ponipat, that's.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
I'm sorry, I'm trying to pronounce it correctly
panipat like that.
That's correct.
Well, india in general.
You know there's a lot ofdiscussion around india.
There's obviously been um atremendous amount of
manufacturing base being builtup across the enormous country.
Um what, what kind of setsindia as a manufacturing partner
, as a country?
Speaker 3 (10:29):
That's a very deep question, james, and I'll tell
you why.
For an economist, it would beon the periphery and everyone
would talk about investment andeveryone would talk about the
way the administration islooking at the growth of the
economy.
But I understand it verydifferently.
You know, we've beenindependent as a country only
(10:50):
for not even a century, yet alittle less than a century, and
I think what has been ripped offthis country has been pride.
Whenever we've had somebodyrule us, the first thing they've
done is they've ripped thepride off us, and I think that's
largely why India could notprogress and grow as an economy.
(11:16):
India could not progress andgrow in various industries was
because we had no sense of pride.
We were not proud of what wewere doing, and I must give it
to the past 15 years, and I'mnot pro anyone, I'm pro progress
.
So anyone who brings progress,I'm on their side and I think
(11:36):
for me this government bringsprogress from a very different
perspective.
It has brought progress withfirst instilling a sense of
pride.
No-transcript, they're willingto invest back in it monetarily
(12:08):
and the moment we've done that,the whole world is looking at us
today, the whole world islooking at us as unique.
The whole world is looking atus as us bringing something
completely different to thetable.
Speaker 2 (12:20):
As a powerhouse.
Speaker 3 (12:22):
And as a powerhouse.
Now, today, because that's whatwe've been working on is in
reinstilling that sense of pride, and I'm actually I'm a little
proud to say that, James, thisis also something that, when I
joined Raj, and with a verydifferent agenda, I think the
first thing that we said wasthat we want to instill a sense
(12:45):
of pride in what ourcraftspeople do, and the best
way to do it was to bringsomebody from the outside to
come back onto the factory floorand say you do something really
unique.
So when an artist wouldinteract with a craftsperson and
say you are doing something sobeautiful and unique, it
automatically instilled a senseof pride.
And if I were to use that as anexample today, I think that's
(13:08):
exactly what we are doing as acountry is bringing in people
from different walks of life,from different industries and
showing the best that we have,and when they talk about our
uniqueness, it automatically, Ithink it allows us to introspect
, to sort of, to look within andreally feel that sense of pride
(13:30):
, and I think that's what'sreflecting itself as India
emerging into this powerhouse.
We've always had these values,james, and we've had these
capabilities, but unfortunately,we never looked within.
We were always dependent onsomebody else telling us what we
could do.
It comes a lot with being ruled, I think, for centuries and
(13:51):
decades, but today, as weindependently walk through it's,
it's something that we're doingourselves and because it's
something that we're doingourselves, we're able to open
our doors for investment.
We're able to open our doorsfor investment, we're able to
open our doors for growth.
And the most interesting part,james, is that while we are
(14:11):
looking at external sources ofinvestment, we've also become a
country that is looking atreinvesting its profits back
into our own personal growth.
And if I were to equate that,today, raj is a company where
our profits are not measured by.
Our profits are not measured bya percentage or a margin.
(14:37):
Our profits are measured bywhat are we doing to bring
growth back into theorganization.
Are we adding more technology?
Are we expanding category?
Are we acquiring new buildingsto expand certain manufacturing
capabilities?
We run our own processesin-house.
(14:59):
So we're a complete verticalorganization where just the
fiber comes in and we processall that fiber we spin, we dye,
we weave, we of course finishand package and dispatch our
final product.
But we're looking at re.
We're re-looking at all theprocesses to see how can we
improve them better?
How can we bring in technologyto aid all those processes?
(15:21):
That's true, yes Is when youcan reinvest back in yourself to
make yourself more efficient,to, to to, I would say, to
improve the way your dailyoperations are and to aid
yourself to.
To just go into a space ofcategory expansion, not being
(15:43):
just a manufacturer of rugs, butbeing a manufacturer of pillows
, being a manufacturer of throws, being a manufacturer of top of
bed, taking a machinery thatweaves rugs and re the country
at large.
That's also one of the reasonswhy we are emerging into a
powerhouse today.
Speaker 2 (16:11):
And speaking of your rugs, at least in our wide shot
we're using one of them today.
Speaker 3 (16:18):
Absolutely.
It's a moment of pride to beable to sit here as Charles said
, traveling across, you know, anentire sort of a couple of
continents, an entire ocean tobe here today for this podcast,
but also to be able to sit herewith the product at our feet at
the same time and for it to befeatured in the podcast as well.
(16:40):
I think that's also a sense ofpride that I hold Excellent.
Speaker 1 (16:44):
Excellent.
Yeah, a little insider info thepillows are also a Raj product
that we've had on set forseveral of these.
When I got to visit thefacilities in Potty Pot this
past summer, the showroomabsolutely blew me away and I
(17:05):
felt like that was going to bethe most impressive thing.
And then I saw a weaver weavingwith such expertise, grace,
efficiency.
It was like wow, this is anincredible feat to be able to
accomplish the things that areaccomplished in this
manufacturing, and I love howyou talked about heritage as
well as innovation, bringingtechnology while not losing
(17:26):
sight of heritage.
I'd love for you to elaborate,as a manufacturer, what it looks
like to both protect heritageas well as make the progress
that's necessary to compete inan increasingly competitive
environment.
Speaker 3 (17:47):
I can tell you, charles, it's a very difficult
job to balance the two, becauseheritage demands patronization,
and patronization demandsfunding, and technology
cannibalizes on heritage, forcertain, because it is so
efficient, it is so quick, it'sso easy and definitely it's.
(18:08):
It definitely produces aproduct that's less expensive
that it it's.
It's always a question as towhat do you go with.
Do you go with heritage or doyou go with technology?
Like I said in the beginning,the fact that we've invested
ourselves in knowing our rootsand where our foundation lies
has really helped us tocircumnavigate times where we've
(18:31):
been always challenged forproduct pricing, always
challenged for a more consciousprice product, always challenged
by retailers to give them abetter deal, and we've been able
to put our product that ishandmade and artisanal in front
of them and push them back toselect a perfect balance between
(18:53):
the two.
A product that's aided bytechnology, but also a product
that's truly handcrafted hasreally been a mantra, so to say,
if I were to call it that,because that's the only way to
go, that's the only way to stayunique, that's the only way for
Raj to not be like every othermanufacturer, that's the only
way for Raj to ensure that it'spart of a heritage and a legacy
(19:19):
that cannot be aped by orfollowed by anyone else.
I think if we are to stayunique, there has to be that
perfect balance that we createfor ourselves where handcrafted
is aided by technology.
Technology brings in efficiencyinto the processes that
handcrafted has, but nevercannibalizes on.
It never becomes the center ofour agenda.
(19:41):
It obviously is extremely easyfor us to move away from
artisanal into technology at atime where labor is challenged,
at a time where handcrafted ischallenged, at a time when
everyone's looking um at beinguh, at a time when economy in
general is challenged, and it'sreally simple and easy to make a
decision in favor of technologyand to move away from all the
(20:04):
challenges that handcraftedbrings and artisanal brings.
Because, as as beautiful as itsounds, it's also people
management.
At the end of the day, you'relooking at a migratory community
.
You're looking at changingtimes.
You're looking at legacychanging.
It's not necessarily beingpassed down from generation to
(20:27):
generation.
It's now being passed down fromwho's better at the skill and
who's willing to learn the skillto come back onto the factory
floor and weave the product andbe part of the entire process of
handcrafted.
So the real challenge, I think,charles, over here, is to be
level-headed and maintain thebalance, to keep going back to
(20:49):
your roots and keep going backto foundation to say what is it
that we truly stand for?
Are we going to be that companythat is going to allow
technology to take oversomething that's unique?
Are we going to go the age-oldprocess and continue being
handcrafted, but not improve ourprocesses and bring in
technology to help us there?
(21:11):
So I think the perfect answerover there is balance and
balancing ourselves in a waythat we still stay unique even
if we bring in technology, andwe are not superseded, uh, by
being age old, by just dependingon handcrafted, and ensuring
(21:32):
that we have the two to balanceeach other yeah, I love that.
Speaker 1 (21:35):
Yeah, from a customer point of view, being able to
access something that's uniqueis uh can be a challenge for a
lot of customers who can'tafford or don't quite understand
the value of what they would beable to acquire.
You know, walmart tends toserve this need very often.
(21:56):
At the same time, thebitterness of poor quality will
always outlast the sweetness ofa good deal, and so the balance
of quality and value is one thatevery merchant fights
aggressively on behalf of thecustomer to go insert as much
value as possible.
(22:17):
Some find themselves a bitshort-sighted on simple price,
but at the end of the day, thecustomer will vote with the like
hey, I bought this thing, itwas very cheap and yes, it was
very cheap, and I'm not doingthat again.
You don't make that mistake somany times, I'd love With online
(22:38):
reviews you can't afford to.
Yeah, Online reviews are one waythat that shows up.
The dollars certainly are thething that last as far as I'm
not going to buy this categoryeven and Walmart's on a journey
to deepen trust with customersas they expand into categories
(23:00):
that they've touched in but aremaking a bit more of a foothold,
especially across the home area, and so I'd love to hear your I
don't know counsel to thosethat are fighting on behalf of
the customer, want to bringheritage.
You know there's a certain setof customers that understand
true heritage and would neverwant anything that wasn't truly
(23:20):
all the way handcrafted.
And there's the others thatlove that sort of inspiration.
And I recall across yourshowroom, you know, here's one
that's like a hundred percent,all of the things are artisanal,
and then here's how we makethat more affordable as well.
But, yeah, I'd love to hearyour sort of counsel for those
across retail that are trying tofight that balance of value as
(23:43):
well as uniqueness.
Speaker 3 (23:45):
Charles, I think the key word here is understanding.
When you put that question outthere for me, you said that the
customer does not understand theproduct.
I think that's the key word.
There is what we fed thecustomer with.
We must understand thatadvertising, manufacturing all
of them play a very key role incustomer choices.
(24:06):
A customer does not know what'sout there until somebody
packages that and tells themwhat's available for them to buy
off the shelves, or what's goodfor their homes, what's good
for their personal health needs,what's great for their skin,
what's good for their hair.
(24:29):
It's pretty much like the beautyindustry went through a
revolution where everyone wastalking about a perfect body
type, everyone was talking abouta perfect skin type, everyone
was talking about a particularhair type, and suddenly the
entire beauty industry wasrevolutionized when someone said
who is making these beautystandards and why are they
making these beauty standards?
Is it to sell a product or isit what human beings are framed
(24:51):
out to be?
And if you look at human beingsfrom across the world, we're
all so different.
We could be from the same homeand yet we'd all be so unique
looking, the same DNA, but yetso different, right, and I think
that's exactly how we'relooking at the entire industry
for home today.
We're looking at what isselling and why have we been
(25:12):
selling this?
Why have we been feeding ourconsumers with something that is
so unnatural, that is soplastic?
In many ways we're talkingabout conscious manufacturing,
we're talking aboutsustainability, but these are
not customer choices.
The consumer has never knownany better because that's all
they've been fed with.
So if we are to talk aboutunderstanding, we are to talk
(25:36):
about education and we are totalk about the right choices.
I think it's somethingcollective that we had to do.
You know, india today isemerging as an industry, as a
manufacturing industry, tosupport the needs of consumers
and brands across.
But we weren't ready about adecade plus back.
We weren also ill-equipped backthen to participate in this
(25:58):
whole requirement and the needthat home had in general.
And there were other regionswho were willing and
participative and out there theywere not able to give a
handcrafted product, but theywere able to give a beautiful,
cheap, machine-made product thatserviced the needs back then.
(26:21):
True that the consumer has hadenough of that.
True that the consumer isquestioning everything.
But the consumer is questioningeverything because brands are
questioning everything.
Manufacturers are questioningeverything.
Manufacturers are there to saythat there's something else for
you.
You don't have to necessarilyrely on this.
So I think we're at that placeof of I think a revolution as
(26:44):
far as home is concerned,exactly how we were at a place
of revolution where beautystandards and the fashion
industry was concerned.
And I think, uh, charles, whenwe put a product out there,
that's better, not in terms ofvalue for money, but better
because it is better to theenvironment, it's better to the
process and it's better to thestoryline, then automatically
(27:08):
the consumer will get used to itand will want to have it.
You know, everyone is looking atan experience today because
we've had everything else otherthan an experience.
I think, as a human race, we'vefocused on everything other
than the experience itself.
So people are turning towardsspirituality.
People are turning towardsfinding new purpose in life.
(27:30):
People are turning towardsbetter relationships.
People are questioning anythingthat does not make them happy
or comfortable, creates a senseof anxiety in them.
People are questioning that ingeneral and they're looking for
a better experience.
And that People are questioningthat in general and they're
looking for a better experience.
And that's where home's comingin.
We're looking at something thathas a story behind it.
(27:50):
We're looking at a softer handfeel, we're looking at material
that is conscious, that is notpolluting the environment, and I
think as we pivot and movetowards there, charles and I
think as we pivot and movetowards there, charles we have
half the battle won for usalready.
The other half has to be.
I think the other half has tobe won with understanding.
(28:14):
The other half has to be wonwith education.
The other half has to be wonwith a storyline, and a
storyline that's not just madefor advertising, a storyline
that has true meaning to it.
So I think that's where you know, charles, I think it is our
responsibility as a manufacturerto really shed light on the
(28:34):
story behind the product andwhat it brings to the table,
when it's not just made, buteven in terms of its life and
how that life ends as a cycleand how that life ends as a
cycle.
If that life ends as a cyclewith polluting the environment
and causing harm to everythingaround us, we all don't want
that product as well, even ifit's beautifully handcrafted, it
(28:57):
should have a meaningfulpurpose to it in its end journey
, as it should have a meaningfulpurpose to it in the beginning
of its journey.
So I think that otherresponsibility lies on the
manufacturer to bring somethingunique to the brand, to give
that perfect balance.
Like I said, if you usetechnology to aid the process of
handcrafted, you've alreadybrought some sense of efficiency
(29:20):
to it, which automatically, Ithink, supports the challenges
that price have today.
But I feel even this is part ofthat whole cycle.
The economy will go up and theeconomy will go down, there will
be supply, there will be demand, and I think you just have to
wade through every challengethat comes along your way to
ensure that you stand yourground.
(29:41):
Keep portraying what you bringto the table.
In the case of Raj, we'll keepworking on the story of
Handcrafted.
We'll keep trying to make theproduct more efficient so that
it meets certain pricechallenges not all price
challenges.
It cannot ape another region.
We cannot be as efficient as amachine made, but we can
(30:01):
definitely be the best versionof ourselves.
Speaker 1 (30:05):
Yeah Well, and the authenticity of a product that
was good for the environment,good for the people that made it
, as well as good for those thatare going to put it in their
home for, you know, hopefully,decades.
I believe that the transparencyof the reality of cheap goods,
that bitterness of somethingthat doesn't last, is far more
known today than it was, youknow, 15, 10 years ago, and I
(30:29):
see the customer moving in thedirection of I don't actually
want, you know, as a pillow, apillow that's going to last six
months in fine condition, nineinadequate, and then from there
sort of uh level of quality inmy home.
I'd rather have something thatI know I'll be able to stand
behind.
Speaker 2 (30:48):
yeah, something of value yeah, so you've spoken, uh
, about some of the, I would say, values of raj and undoubtedly
yourself of sustainability,really valuing the craft and the
art and the people and thehands that make it.
What other values really driveyou personally and Raj as an
(31:08):
organization?
Speaker 3 (31:10):
Personally, you know, james, I think the value that
drives me every day and thatkeeps me grounded is that, you
know, I always I'm a believer.
I believe that there is ahigher power that drives all of
us.
I think submitting yourself tothe higher power and ensuring
that you're open to the rightenergy every single day, I think
(31:33):
is extremely important.
It's something that keeps yougrounded, it's something that
keeps you level-headed and it'ssomething that really
circumnavigates through all theanxieties that one can have
through the entire day, personalor professional.
So I think, for me, that's whatdrives me is definitely the
belief in the presence of ahigher power, something that I
(31:54):
can submit to and ensure thatI'm the best version of myself
every single day.
Um and for Raj, I think it's thesame Raj submits itself to the
process, uh to the people, anddefinitely uh submits itself to
whatever it's done to theenvironment, for decades of
(32:14):
manufacturing is trying to undoit in whatever way possible.
So, if it means investing inbetter sources of energy, if it
means cleaning the water that weconsume for all our wet
processes, if it meansrepurposing water bodies in and
around Panipat that have driedup at their source, if it means
(32:36):
tree plantation, if it meansinvestment in sustainable
material and a sustainablesupply chain, no matter how much
that burdens us every singleday and it's such a difficult
journey to walk the path ofsustainability.
I always say sustainabilityrequires one investment and that
investment is not resources,that investment is intent,
(32:59):
because only if you have theintent can you circumnavigate
all the challenges that you'llhave with walking the line of
sustainability.
Because it is such a resourceinvestment process it is
absolutely every single day.
It is a true challenge to beable to walk that path.
So I think Raj, as a company,submits itself every single day
(33:20):
to the process, to the peopleand to the planet, and through
that submission, I think that'swhat takes us forward, that's
also our future vision, that'swhat we also speak about
continuously as far as our goalsand our vision is and as far as
our foundation is.
So really, that submission, Ithink, on a personal level and
(33:44):
that submission as far as thecompany is concerned, I think
submission is very important intoday's time because I think
that's what leaves you open toeverything that happens and
everything that is a challengeevery single day.
Speaker 2 (33:57):
That's well said.
So you talk about your businessand the industry as a whole in
really a unique way, and I feellike you're coming at your CEO
role from your femaleness in away that is very unique, and I'm
(34:20):
sorry if I'm not saying thatwell, but as a woman, how
important is that in India, onthe factory floor, for the CEO
to be you?
Speaker 3 (34:31):
You know, it's a really funny anecdote.
Just the other day Sumit, themanaging partner of Raj, turned
around and told somebody she'smuch more of a man than any of
us.
So the fact that you say mybeing a woman and my being a
(34:54):
woman, CEO, just thethoughtfulness with which you've
approached.
Speaker 2 (34:56):
this is what I mean.
Speaker 3 (34:57):
Well, you know honestly, james, it is an
extremely difficult place to beat and it's been a challenge
every single day because theregion that we are a part of is
a deep-rooted patriarchal region.
For a man to take instructionsfrom a woman is unheard of and
(35:19):
unthought of, because they'vereally that part of the country.
The man is really the breadearner, the decision maker, the
be all and the end all of anentire family unit.
And families in India are notnuclear four or five member
families.
Families in India are 10, 15,20, 25 member families, extended
(35:41):
families that literally reportto one patriarch who's the
decision maker.
So for that region really torespond to female leadership, to
a woman and, I think, to beable to follow up, follow the
path set by a woman, is only metwith resilience, because that's
(36:03):
not something that they've beenbrought up with or they
understand.
I think for me what's beenreally helpful is that my father
really brought me up as aneutral gender.
My father never really broughtme up as a woman, but never
really brought me up as a boy.
He always brought me up assomebody who had inherently
(36:26):
certain strengths, and I think Iwas always.
That's something that I alwaysrecognize myself with is
strengths, not as a gender, tobe honest, and I think that's
really what helped me in thisrole is also for me to really
blend in with this group of verystrong Indian patriarchs.
(36:46):
Find my path and find my waywas only a journey that I think
I was able to undertake Becauseall my life I had an upbringing
of being a very neutralindividual in terms of skill
sets are concerned and skillstrengths are concerned.
And if I were to look at it anyother way, james, it was also
(37:12):
easier for me.
It was easier for me because Iwas able to see both sides.
I was able to read them forwhat they are and who they are,
maybe because of the littlebackground of history, uh,
geopolitics that I understoodfrom you know, my background,
education uh, I was able tounderstand where the men were
coming from and where thatpatriarchy was so deep-rooted
(37:33):
and coming from.
And then I was able toobviously use the feminine part
of my gender to kind of probablysoften certain aspects of how
we operate, how we run theorganization, how we look at
ourselves.
I was also able to use thatpart, I think, to rebrand
ourselves in many ways For years, I think that company was being
(37:56):
run by only men, and here Imust give credit to Sumit,
because I think Sumit has beenvery instrumental in allowing me
to have my own path, allowingme to, I think, see things in a
different way, allowing me toredefine a lot of things that
were essentially set in tone byhis family.
(38:18):
It's a family-owned business andI think that uniqueness of
flexibility that he has as anindividual has paid well off for
him, because it's allowed me toreally create a new path, a
path that's less resilient, apath that's more open, but a
path that's also modern and hasits own definition.
Because if I were to look atfamily-owned businesses and
(38:40):
legacy in general in India,they're very, very typical and
set in their own ways and rigidin many ways rigid to change,
rigid to evolution, rigid to newways of thinking.
I would say and I think that'sthose are the areas that I feel
James have able to been able tobring in is a sense of
(39:01):
difference because, um, becausethe company has been open to it,
uh, the managing partner andsumit have been open to it I've
been able to bring that, thatdifference, in.
I've been able to bring adifferent, uh, way of running
the organization, new definitionfor how we see handcrafted and
the journey at large.
So I think less to do with thefact that I was, that I am a
(39:24):
woman, not was.
I almost forgot that yeah, thatI am a woman, but I think more
to do with James.
The way I was brought up as achild by my father, that has
really, I think, aided me inthis leadership role that I have
as the CEO of the company.
Speaker 2 (39:40):
That's a really beautiful story.
I can only hope that I'mbringing up my daughter in a
similar manner.
Speaker 3 (39:49):
Well, I think all fathers and daughters have a
really unique relationship wherethe father brings in, I think,
the male gender of understandinglife and the daughter brings in
the female gender ofunderstanding life, and when
both the father and daughtershare a beautiful relationship,
this understanding crosses overand really leads to the
(40:12):
evolution of a very strong woman.
So I feel blessed that I have afather who is participative in
my upbringing, who'sparticipative in my upbringing,
and I'm sure every father who'sparticipative in the upbringing
of his daughter is doingsomething so unique and
beautiful for a futuregeneration.
And here is where I would wantto plug in a little bit more is
(40:32):
our agenda at Raj?
Number one, of course, that thecompany is led by a woman, but
also for us to have more womenbeing part of the factory, more
women being part of operationsfactory, more women being part
of operations, not at theadministrative level, but really
on the shop floor, on thefactory floor, walking shoulder
to shoulder with men on a lot ofmale driven processes is a
(40:57):
really important part of ourjourney, james, because the
woman is the heart of the familyand if the heart turns and
changes, it sets trend for thenext generation to be very, very
open and unique in their way ofthinking.
And if we are to break barriersin general, the women have to be
stronger in their approach,have to be stronger in their
(41:23):
approach.
So you know, while we'retalking about the whole
beautiful father-daughterrelationship and bringing women,
bringing up girls to be thesewonderful independent women, I
think, at the same time, theexisting group of women that we
have, if there's a little bit ofa push, and especially at the
region that we come from inPanipat, if there's a little
push to aid them in their senseof independent thinking and
belief, little push to aid themin their sense of independent
(41:43):
thinking and belief, itautomatically changes the entire
family structure that currentlyexists for us to be able to
help a generation, a newgeneration of individual
thinkers expectations and howthey respond to this whole
understanding of patriarchy atlarge.
Speaker 1 (42:01):
on to this whole understanding of patriarchy at
large.
It's beautiful and, having beenand seen your leadership as
well as the team at largeoperate the beauty of this sort
of diversity of thought andexecution is a very holistic
team, very intentional movementacross everyone and a tremendous
(42:22):
amount of respect across theteam Really enjoyed seeing it
and have incredibly high hopesfor how Raj will continue to
innovate and bring depth toevery product that you guys
create.
Speaker 3 (42:35):
I appreciate that, charles.
You know, we're only as good asthe partnership that supports us
, only as good as thepartnership that supports us.
Here I'd like to give a littlebit of a pivot and say that you
know, when we have a partnershiplike High Impact, who is
willing to invest in our beliefand support us, I think those
partnerships really matterbecause that's the symbiotic
(42:57):
relationship that can reallymake a manufacturer who's
sitting in some part of Indiasuccessful in a totally
different part of the worldwhere they would be completely
unknown, their process would becompletely unknown.
I think to be able to carry thatstory and that journey forward,
charles, to be able torecognize it you've made just
one trip to Panipat but to beable to have the good sense and
(43:19):
understanding to absorb all ofthat on the factory floor, I
think is unique in itself.
So I think the organizationhere, the fact that you're able
to look at manufacturers asunique as they are, to be able
to literally cherry pick them, Iwould say, in so many ways and
represent them, I think is alsounique and very interesting.
(43:40):
And to give a platform likethat for us to express ourselves
, for example, to have me todayon a podcast and really talk in
depth about who we are, what wedo, why we are here and what
makes us so relevant is alsovery unique, james.
Speaker 2 (43:55):
We're honored that you've entrusted us with a
portion of your business here inBentonville, Arkansas, and
definitely honored that youjoined us today.
Speaker 3 (44:06):
I think it's both ways likewise.
Speaker 1 (44:09):
We have a lightning round which is how we tend to
wrap it up which gets into acouple of questions in somewhat
rapid succession.
So first one is kind of it'snot meant to be a zinger, but we
love talking about failure.
We love talking about where andhow we failed in big, perhaps
(44:34):
fun stories to tell ways and howwe learn.
So what's some of the biggestfailure story that you've
experienced in this journey ofretail?
Speaker 3 (44:45):
Well, charles, every time I think it's the biggest
failure.
There's something right aroundthe corner.
That's a bigger failure.
That's waiting to define itselfand prove that it's bigger than
the other An expanding pie.
We are faced with failure everysingle day.
And in my initial journey, Ialways thought that there could
(45:06):
be no bigger failure than thecurrent situation that I was in,
and then there would besomething else, but it would
always have a learning curve toit.
We would always get better atwhat we were and where we stood.
I think the recent and thebiggest failure that I would
(45:29):
attribute to the company and tothe organization it's actually a
really funny story is, whileothers would look at it as an
opportunity, I looked at it as afailure when we actually were
approached by a certain businessto support them and to
(45:50):
manufacture for them, because Ifelt that we could have done
better and because we were at aposition where, you know, we
were pressed against certainfinancial conditions, we were
(46:10):
pressed against manufacturingnot being adequate and we had to
sustain and support the entireteam on ground is we had to
accept that brand and we had toaccept the manufacturing for
them and in some ways, go down alittle on our values, on our
set values, and that, for me, isa big failure is that you had
(46:32):
to compromise a bit of yourvalues to take on a manufacturer
, to take on a brand, tomanufacture for them, because
you had to keep yourself,sustain yourself every single
day to move forward.
I think those for me,unfortunately, charles are
bigger failures than failing ata production delivery, failing
at a quality standard, failingat um commitments made, um in
(46:57):
terms of sampling, failing onyou know a what do you say?
One of our factories shuttingdown, failing on purchase of
machinery that didn't work inour favor, and we've lost some
financials over there.
So I think those failuresreally are lesser failures.
The failures for me are whenyou have to let go of your
(47:19):
values and bring in someonebecause there isn't anything
better that you could think of.
Speaker 1 (47:24):
And interesting, as all of them learn to pretty
rapid learning and then progressas we learn from them and
realize, yep, not going to dothat again.
Speaker 3 (47:34):
So I'm pretty sure that in the next couple of years
we're going to say goodbye tothat brand and move forward.
Speaker 1 (47:40):
Yeah, yeah, I think we've all, we've all been there
in different ways and shapes andforms in the last year.
Speaker 2 (47:47):
What's, uh, what's been?
Speaker 3 (47:48):
just one thing that stood out to you as like a
revelation or learning um thatyou've incorporated you know,
james, we went through a littlebit of a curve last year and I
really thought that we couldn'tovercome it and this was a
personal challenge that thecompany had Unfortunately, I'm
(48:11):
not privy to detail it over hereon this podcast and I really
felt that we couldn't comethrough and I felt that that
would break us.
But actually it actuallystrengthened us and made us
introspect, look at our ownprocesses and find a new way of
reinventing and runningourselves, and that, honestly,
(48:35):
has given me so much strength asa leadership, as a leader after
that, it's added so much to myleadership role.
It's added so much to myleadership role, it's added so
much to Sumit's leadership rolethat it's literally put us on a
path of growth and at an expressrate, what we would have
thought would be our vision forthe next five years has actually
(48:56):
been our vision over a year.
So, that has been a reallyinteresting event that happened
to the company, which brought usall down, personally and as a
company, but also pushed us allright back on our feet.
Speaker 2 (49:12):
Amazing how that works.
Speaker 1 (49:14):
Yeah, I love that.
All right, and last one what'ssomething you're reading lately
and if it's reading or podcasts,what's some content you're
consuming that you'd like toshare?
Speaker 3 (49:28):
So there's this book that I'm reading called Hidden
Forces.
All right, it's a book onspirituality.
It's a book that really talksabout things that drive us every
single day, energies that driveus every single day.
Energies that drive us everysingle day and forces that drive
us every single day, and how doyou recognize those forces and
(49:50):
how do you enable them to aidyou and not bring you down.
So that's the book that I'mreading right now.
Speaker 1 (49:57):
Hidden Forces.
Do you know the author's name?
Speaker 3 (50:00):
I don't remember the author's name offhand Charles.
It is an Indian author and he'sa spiritual master and he's
written the book.
But it's derived from themother and Aurobindo.
I don't know if many people arefamiliar with the Aurobindo
ashram, but there was a livingmaster, aurobindo andam.
(50:20):
But there was a living master,aurobindo, and he was inspired
by the mother.
Everyone most people, wouldknow who the mother is and she
was called the mother, who'salso a living master.
So the book is basicallywritten by another living master
who's derived all thephilosophy and the teachings
from Aurobindo and the motherand basically conversations with
(50:41):
them like a podcast.
Back then the podcast wasmostly detailed and written and
put into as excerpts into a bookand this is really that book
that has all these excerpts onhidden forces, hidden energies,
how do you see them and how doyou help them, aid you versus
bring you down.
Speaker 1 (50:59):
Awesome.
Well, shailen, thank you somuch for joining us as we sort
of wrap the podcast.
Anything you'd like to share onbehalf of Raj.
Speaker 3 (51:12):
Not share, I think just add on to everything that
I've said.
I think I've.
I hope I'm not overshared today.
No, not at all.
But just in interest ofeverything that I said and to
quickly wrap it up as well,charles and James's, you know, I
think every organization andevery human being has a time and
(51:33):
when that time's there, if youdon't shine, you've lost that
opportunity.
I think this is the time forRaj to shine.
Opportunity.
I think this is the time forRaj to shine.
This is the opportunity forleadership to really come
through and pull thisorganization, I think, into its
peak.
And we're at that curve, we'reright there and I'm only looking
(51:55):
forward to the most fundamentalbut most beautiful next five
years.
I hope I'm still there to leadthem into the next five years.
If I'm not, I think I've doneenough to lay a good foundation.
But if I'm there, I'm more thanexcited to ride that wave.
Speaker 2 (52:14):
That's beautiful.
Speaker 3 (52:15):
Thank you for joining us today, thank you, thank you
so much, and to anybodylistening watching thank you for
joining us as well.
Speaker 2 (52:19):
You can find all of our podcasts.
Anybody listening watching.
Thank you for joining us aswell.
You can find all of ourpodcasts, videos and audios on
our website, athighimpactanalyticscom, youtube
or wherever you get yourpodcasts.
Thank you.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by Audiochuck Media Company.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com