Humor Heals: Elaine Williams on Comedy and Recovery

Episode Transcript
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Track 1 (00:03):
hello.
Hello.
And welcome back to the soberbutterfly podcast, where we
embrace the beauty of sobrietyand empower each other to live
our very best lives withoutalcohol.
I am thrilled today to have MissElaine Williams, join us for a
very special episode where wewill explore the importance of
humor in the journey ofrecovery.

(00:24):
Elaine.
Thank you so much for beinghere.
I'm just so honored to have youon the show.
How are you today?

elaine-williams_1_04-07-2 (00:30):
Well, thank you, Nadine.
Thanks for having me.
And I was, I was stalking youand I've been listening to
several episodes and I just lovewhat you're doing.
And, you know, I think we'rejust going to dive right in.
So, you know, I've been aroundthe rooms of AA for a long time
I've always tried to be a powerof example to, Younger women and

(00:52):
men, but especially women thatyou can still have a lot of

Track 1 (00:54):
Yes, I

elaine-williams_1_04-07-202 (00:56):
You know, when I, when I first
stopped drinking, I was like,Oh, nothing's going to be fun.
And how am I going to do theboring things and the boring
parties and you know, and, and Ithink everybody goes through
that, but I've always tried to,share my experience and talk
about like, you can still dowild and crazy things.
You're just sober, but you canstill, you know, and if you're

(01:19):
really.
Tuned into like life and yourevolution.
It's pretty exciting, you know?

Track 1 (01:26):
100 percent agree with you.
And I think so many people canrelate to this idea of.
sobriety.
We know the, the commonmistropes, which is like, it's
boring.
Like quite literally the wordsobering sounds terrible.
And I too felt like it was adeath sentence.
I was literally like, Oh myGod,, first of all, the problem
I faced was I didn't know anysober people.

(01:46):
Well, I knew like one soberperson, but they weren't fun.
So it wasn't like a very goodexample of what it could look
like.
So I appreciate that.
And I think you and I just.
connect so much in this ideathat, like, we love to bring
humor and lightness into oursober journeys because, while
there is, like, very realhardship that can be attached to
that and associated with that,for the most part, I feel like

(02:08):
the fun I have today is 10 timesreal and authentic and better
than the fun that I thought Iwas having when I was using
substances.

Yes.
That's such a good point.
And, you know, I mean, I thinkof also how many times I wanted
to go do things, but I didn'tcause I was drinking or drugging
or whatever.
And in sobriety, I've made a tonof mistakes, but I'm learning
and growing that I just wouldn'tbe able to do if I was.
Filling myself in thesubstances,

Track 1 (02:37):
Agreed, agreed.
So I feel like just to lay thescene for people, I would love
for you to share with us,Elaine, a little bit of your
background, some of yourearliest associations with
substances.
I like to start from thebeginning.
So paint a picture for us, likeearly associations with
substances, what that lookedlike for you.
And then I know that you alsospent time in New York, so I

(02:59):
would love to touch on that aswell.
So if you don't mind, take itaway.

Okay, sure.
I love it.
So, you know, I'm, I'm

Track 1 (03:06):
Wow.
You look amazing.
Sorry.

elaine-williams_1_04-07 (03:08):
parents divorced, it's a good filters
and lighting.
No you know, my parents divorcedwhen I was four.
And at the time it felt likenobody else did that.
I remember feeling like I had ahuge hole from a very early age.
And I always felt like somethingwas wrong with me and something
was definitely wrong with myfamily.
I can just remember feeling likenot at ease most of my life and

(03:30):
really in my head.
And, and I didn't understand thedivorce.
And so I always felt likesomething is wrong.
And so I was trying to fill thevoid from like at an early age
from food.
And then I found theater and Iwas like, Oh, my God, lights,
camera, action, audience, love,sign me up.
And I'm grateful because theaterreally saved my life.

(03:51):
It was one of the few constants.
And so, my father was a dentistand a pharmacist, which I have
jokes

Track 1 (03:57):
wow.

elaine-williams_1_04-07-202 (03:58):
but it's really true.
He wouldn't let us eat candy.
We could snort it.
We just couldn't eat it.
That was a joke.
Anyway, so he married this forhim and she was probably
undiagnosed bipolar and she hadhad a lot of trauma.
She'd been a victim of theHolocaust.
And so she became a ragingaddict.
And so it's so interesting, likeit's such a crazy disease

(04:22):
because my dad would be like,oh, all these drug addicts are
calling, trying to get moredrugs.
Meanwhile, his wife is taking atons of drugs.
And, you know, so I, I rememberjust being around drinking and
drugs from a very early age.
And I thought everybody tookcodeine.
Like I thought codeine was justlike aspirin, you know?
And then when I had my firstdrink, it was a grasshopper, you

(04:45):
know, like the creme de mentheand ice cream.
And I remember loving the

Track 1 (04:49):
Mm hmm.

elaine-williams_1_04-07-2024 (04:49):
of kind of like, Ooh, and wanting
more.
Immediately, like just wantingmore.
And I feel like that's mypersonality.
So anyway, so I'm growing up inthis family.
Some bad things happen to mewith my brother's friends and
then a cousin who was an adult.
I was molested and I didn't knowI could say no.

(05:10):
And.
was very confusing because Iliked the attention, but I felt
dirty about it.
But I, you know, it was like,and there's nobody who can
really talk about,

Track 1 (05:20):
Mm hmm.

elaine-williams_1_04-07-202 (05:21):
And so, so that was part of, that's
when I started becoming bulimic.
So I was, I was put on my firstdiet in the first grade.
And then when I was 12, that'swhen the sexual stuff started
happening.
And then I started takinglaxatives in Texas in the
eighties, the worst thing youcould be was fat.
It was all about Dallas andimage and big

Track 1 (05:41):
Right.

elaine-williams_1_04-07- (05:42):
makeup and, and God forbid.
And I, and what's funny, Nadineis I look back, I was never fat.
I just was short and curvy.
I was muscular, but I didn'tlook like a Dallas Cowboy
cheerleader.
And so I remember taking laxesand thinking, Oh my God, I feel
thin.
It never occurred to me like,yeah, Karen Carpenter died from
taking laxatives,

Track 1 (06:01):
Yes.
Tragic.

when you're, when you're, And when
you're in trauma and you don'thave tools and, and I know my
parents tried the, the best theycould, but they were dealing
with their own isms, you know?
And so fast forward, I go tocollege, I made a deal as long
as I could make good grades.
I could do anything.
So I, I was doing ecstasy andthen my friend lost all this
weight and I said, how did youdo it?

(06:23):
Oh, crystal meth.
Sign me up.
You're like, I started snorting.
I was number eight in my classin high school.
it was, it was always like thisconundrum of like.
Grades were really important tome, but partying was too.
And thank God after semesters oncrystal meth, my grades started
to plummet.
And even though I was skinny, Iwas all broken out.

(06:45):
And, and I remember justthinking, Elaine, this is going
to screw up your GPA.
And so somehow I was able toquit on my own, which is a

Track 1 (06:53):
Right.

elaine-williams_1_04-07-202 (06:53):
And then I had a roommate when I was
24 who said, Elaine, I confessthat sometimes I took laxative.
Blackstiffs and he said, butthat's so bad for you.
in that moment I was finallyable to go.
You're right.
So like miracles, Right.
So then, so the last thing I wasdoing, I'm like 30, I was still

(07:16):
drinking, but it was verycontrolled.
You know, I would, would befine.
And then all of a sudden have acrazy night where I wasn't.
I did the landmark forum and Ihad a huge breakthrough, a
spiritual awakening, and I wasable to forgive my dad and my
stepmother and ask for theirforgiveness.
And I literally sat theresweating and shaking.
And I felt like I had blackclouds of energy leaving my

(07:37):
body.
It was powerful and profound.
And cause you know, you can, sopeople can tell you.
You need to forgive, but if youdon't know how,

Track 1 (07:45):
Right.

like I didn't have access to it.
And so I remember thinking, Idon't know what just happened.
I feel free and peaceful for thefirst time in my entire life.
Let me do more of this.
So I did some more courses withlandmark, but I'm still
drinking.
And then I realized I wanted tomove to New York.
Like I had to, it wasn't achoice.
I would see the skyline and myheart would go pity Pat.

(08:08):
And all these people were givingme like going away.
Yeah.
Parties and giving me money.
And it was so overwhelming.
Nadine, like my whole life I'dbeen trying to get love and then
here it is coming at me and itwas overwhelming.
And I, I took half a row hypno.
I mean, who does that?
I roofied myself.
Like who does that?

(08:28):
So took half a row hypno and I'mlike drinking all weekend and
I'm trying to like pack and saygoodbye to everybody.
And.
I'm in the gutter next to my carand these guys are shining their
lights and I'm like, that is soreal.
Oh, hello officer.
And they should have taken me tojail I was that messed up.
And thank God I wasn't in thecar, they, they poured me into a

(08:50):
cab and the next day my roommatewas like, you can't do that.
When you moved to New York,Elaine, you're going to, you
know, it's not Austin.
like, okay, okay, okay, okay.
You know, you know, you justreally hung over.
So I remember going and havingmy last glass of wine.
Like hair of the dog.
And my boyfriend had been up allnight trying to find me.
And he was like, Elaine, I'm notdoing long distance.

(09:10):
If you, if you keep drinking,cause he was going to stay in
Austin.
And so I said, okay, okay, okay.
But my denial was so strongbecause I had money in the bank.
I worked at the best restaurant.
I, I showed up.
then I would just have thesesort of bulimic weekends of
craziness.
so I went to my first AA meetingand I was like, these people,

(09:32):
you know, one guy goes, itdoesn't matter if you're from
Yale or jail.
And I was just like, thesepeople, but something kept me
going.
And I, I went and the next day Iwent on the plane and I had four
suitcases.
And I remember thinking I coulddrink.
I'm not, I'm not, Anywhere.
I'm not in Texas.
I'm not in New York, I heardthis voice that said, you gave

(09:55):
your word.
that was God.
That was not Elaine.
That was God.
And just because all my coursesat landmark had talked about
integrity and honoring your wordas yourself.
And, and so I got off the planeand the next day I went to my
second meeting on park Avenueand 50th at St.
Bartholomew.
And I kept going, even when Ididn't understand it, even when

(10:19):
I thought of these people crazybecause they're New Yorkers or
because they're alcoholics.
And then I was like, okay, both,I think it's both.
But I am, I'm so grateful,Nadine, that I kept going
because I would hear stories ofpeople who were like, I was a
CEO, blah, blah, blah.
I was a stay at home mom.
And I became homeless.
I, you know, you hear thesestories of smart people who lost

(10:44):
because of.
Crack or drinking or, you know,and it, it scared me just enough
to keep coming.
but I was still like for a wholeyear, kind of like, do I have to
do that?
I was just, mean, I had asponsor, but I was just kind of
like, I call it auditing, youknow, and then my boyfriend came
to visit and then when he wenthome, he broke up with me it

(11:05):
devastated me.
And it was, that's when I reallycame to my knees and I had a new
emotional bottom and that's whenI surrendered because I didn't
have him as a crutch anymore andI needed the program and I'm so
grateful.
And then I proved that I wasstaying sober for me, not for
him.

(11:25):
And so it took.
You know, that was a whole year,which I don't recommend, but
that's how I did it of, youknow, I mean, I was going, I
wasn't drinking and I was sortof begrudgingly working the
steps, but I was, I had notsurrendered fully.
On an emotional.
level.
And now I love the program morethan ever and I'm so grateful.
But yeah, that, that was my

Track 1 (11:47):
Wow.
And I'm grateful to you forsharing parts of your story with
us.
There is a saying in theprogram, we are all terminally
unique.
That's the first time I'mhearing parts of your story, and
I'm like, Oh my God, I canconnect to this, I can connect
to that, and it's just abeautiful reminder that we are
connected, right?

(12:07):
We like to deny that our problemis the addiction.
As worse as maybe someoneelse's, but they were just
moments that you cannot denywhen you have this like parallel
or like this, this similaritythat might not be the exact, but
it's like, wow, when youmentioned, for example, that you
had struggles with ed, eatingdisorders, there's a term called

(12:29):
drunkorexia.
So I would binge drink and Iwould starve myself so that when
I went out, the alcohol wouldhit me faster and also I would
feel skinny, like I wanted to goout present a certain way and
then it would just take less forme to get drunk because my
tolerance was so high.
So I would just starve myselfand I would, I, Remember being
in this perpetual cycle foryears and years and years also

(12:51):
the part where it's like youmentioned, I'm sorry about the
sexual molestation that youfaced, but the part where it's
like, you feel as though there'sthis attention that you're
getting, and even though it maynot be positive attention, you
crave the attention because you,you really crave the attention.
A sense of loving and a sense ofbelonging and a sense of wanting
that self love that maybe youcan't give yourself in the

(13:12):
moment.
So someone else is giving youthat attention and we conflate
the two and then like the crutchof having your ex boyfriend be
in your life.
And when he finally left, likethat was your full reckoning
moment where you came and yousurrendered.
Like all of that are things thatI can very much relate to.
So I really, really thank youfor sharing that.
And it's interesting that youYou know, so you moved to New

(13:34):
York in your thirties So whatwas that experience now?
Like, this is you after a yearof being in the city, which is
like, probably 1 of, you know,the most.
amazing cities, but also there'sso much, at your disposal.
There's a lot of temptation isthe point I'm trying to make.
So I moved here in my earlytwenties and I did all the
things and it was a very tenuousexperience for me.

(13:55):
But I'm wondering for you, whatwas that like?
Was it hard for you to withstandsome of the outside pressures of
being newly sober, fully soberin a city like New York?

that's a great question.
Thank you, Nadine.
You know, I, I really do thinkit was God's plan for me because
like I was doing The Artist'sWay, which is a 12 week program
and it's all spiritual.
And the woman who wrote the bookis Julia Cameron.
She's sober.
And I sort of accidentallystarted this was 12 weeks to
when I moved, like there were somany things, but I think for me,

(14:29):
if I'd stayed in Austin, becauseI knew every bartender I'd
worked in restaurants for years,I, I partied with Willie Nelson.
Like it would have been 20 timesharder for me in Austin, because
that was like my old stompingground.
That's where I first went tocollege, you know?
and then here I am pluck in NewYork?
and I'd visited, but it's verydifferent when you live there.

(14:50):
But it was still really hardbecause they they would say
don't change anything in yourfirst 90 days and I was like Ah,
you know,

Track 1 (14:58):
New city, newly single, like just everything was
different.
I'm assuming.

elaine-williams_1_04-07-2024 (15:03):
it was hard and I had to keep
moving.
And then they're like, you can'twait tables, you have to wait.
And I was like, that's all Iknow, waitressing and acting.
And so I'm like, temping.
And I remember I got my firstcheck and, and I got half, like,
they take out so much more intaxes and we were just bawling.
And you know, I'd never beenthat broke before, except when I

(15:24):
was like 18, you know?
And so like, Something I justknew I was supposed to be there
and I was in this amazing actingclass and I really lived for
that.
And I had this amazing teacher,but yeah, I was intense.
Nadine people, and I'd runaround to auditions and people
go, you're funny.
And I'd be like, what do youmean?

(15:44):
Like, cause I was just so angry.
Cause you know, I had missed myvodka, my friend, my, you know,
just being able to check outand., Learning to adjust then
that's how I fell into doingimprov and then stand up because
kept saying, you're reallyfunny.
And I was like, I couldn't seeit.

(16:05):
I thought of myself as like theingenue that I no longer was.
I hadn't caught up with myself.
And then luckily, I kept gettingit from casting directors and
people and friends.
And so I was like, okay, I guessI'll try improv.
And then I did a one woman showworkshop and then I did some
improv at UCB.

(16:25):
And then I took a comedy classand, you know, my whole life, I
was funny in the moment, right?
Improv, you know, Neil Simon,but like trying to write on
demand.
It was like crickets.
So I go home and I eat ice creamand cry.
I was like, what the hell?
I was so uncomfortable.
And I said, Elaine, just finishthe darn class.

(16:45):
Just, just go to the show,expect no laughs and just say
you tried it.
So the night of the show, I getup there and when I start
talking about my dysfunctionalfamily stuff, people are howling
and I wasn't even trying to befunny.

Track 1 (16:59):
Telling your story.

light bulb Oh my God.
Oh my God, I'm supposed to helppeople.
I'm supposed to help people whomaybe won't go to the forum or
do therapy.
And my life made sense becausethere had been domestic
violence, many sexual assaults,who stole from me, parents who
stole from me.
I mean, the list was long, and.

(17:22):
And I thought, Oh, the more Iheal myself, the more I can help
others.
Wow.
You know, and it just made sense

Track 1 (17:31):
That's beautiful.

thought about it, you know, in that way
before.
And so, yeah.
And that's how I startedspeaking on college campuses.
I had this woman.
said, I need a girl on myroster.
I've got all these guys and Iwanted to do comedy because it
pays well if you can getbookings, but they're like,
you're going to be up againstpeople who've been on the
tonight show 10 times.
Elaine, you're, you're notready.
You're funny, but you're, youknow, but then they said, didn't

(17:54):
you have a bunch of addictions?
And I was like, yeah.
So I came in, but you won'tbelieve this, but I came in as
the funny eating disorder girl.
I was very real and raw.
And I was like, I don't believein diets.
And they were like, ah, like thekids loved it.
And I have beginner's luck.
Like I booked the first movie Iever auditioned for.
So the first college conference,I booked like 15 schools

Track 1 (18:16):
Wow.

elaine-williams_1_04-07-202 (18:17):
Oh, is easy.
Well, always.
So anyway, and then my nextagent said, can you start talk,
can you talk about drugs andalcohol?
And I was like, okay.
So it kept morphing.
And then my next agent was like,can you talk about your sexual
assault?
And I was like,

Track 1 (18:33):
Ooh.

elaine-williams_1_04-07-202 (18:33):
let me, let me think about that.
You know, I prayed on it.
And I thought, Elaine, if youcan save one kid.
From half of the stuff you'vebeen through, the self hatred,
the shame, the isolation, theloneliness, the, all the things
you didn't even know.
So I, I started speaking on itand this was before Me Too was
so mainstream.
So it was, it was hard Nadine.

(18:55):
People would, if I was tooflippant, they didn't like it.
If I was too dramatic, you know,it's like, I tried to be very
neutral, but you know, peoplewould get triggered.
But And then I had some friendssay, but Elaine, isn't your
commitment bigger than, youknow, being popular or whatever.
And I helped kids stop cutting.
I got kids into Al Anon.

(19:16):
This one guy in New Mexico, hesaid he had just been assaulted
and he had stopped going toclass.
And so.
So he thanked me and now he'sthriving.
So about the dogs.

Track 1 (19:27):
It's okay.
There's so many sounds in mybackground too.

okay.
so anyway, so I, I really lovedthe work, but then my agent was
like, I'm quitting the business.
And I was like, so I still speakon those topics if I'm asked,
I've been focusing on buildingmy coaching and other things,
but I feel like.
We need to have conversations sothat we can stop the cycles,

(19:54):
there's generational abuse,there's generational trauma and
not to wallow in it, but when wecan talk about it in a
constructive way, so for somepeople, it's therapy for some
people go work with horses forsome people, it's go to church
for some people, it's go to a 12step program for some People
it's all of the above.
Right?
But I feel like when we can talkabout it, then we can break the

(20:16):
pattern and help people whodon't know.
Like people still don't knowabout Al Anon.

Track 1 (20:22):
I just want to commend you because I think it is really
a fine balance trying to helppeople through humor, but also
telling your stories and beingvulnerable enough to share.
Really, really difficult troopswith people in hopes of helping
them,

thank you.
I received that.
I received that.
And yeah, comedy.
I mean, I, I love comedybecause.
It helped me lighten up, youknow, I have a joke like when
New Yorkers tell you you're toointense.
It's not a good look,

Track 1 (20:49):
It is not a good book.
Like calm, calm down.

Yeah, calm, down, calm down.
And So I'm grateful because Ifound this outlet and I could
get on stage and perform and itmade me a better actor and a
better human being.
I lightened up for God's sake.
I was, I was like, I got to makeup for lost time.
You know, I mean, my, my actingteacher and when we started our
second year, he goes, Elaine,that's the first time I've ever

(21:15):
heard you laugh

Track 1 (21:16):
Wow.

like

Track 1 (21:18):
so were you a, were you super serious before getting
sober and like moving to thecity and wow.

Well,, I was this sort of high
functioning girl, but I could, along time, I could sort of like
put it in categories, you know,until, until the last year where
I, I really couldn't, but I wasstudying Meisner you know, I was
always doing acting actingclasses.
Professionally in Texas on somelevel, voiceover, some movies,
theater.

(21:45):
I sang, so I was doing thisreally intense Meisner where you
like do this repetition andit's, it, it's like, it pulls
away your masks and it'sconfronting you, you have a
partner and you just, you know,Repeat back and forth like blue
shirt

Track 1 (22:00):
Blue shirt.
Wow.
Yeah.

about the words It's about the energy
you're getting and allowingyourself to be affected by it
and then giving it back Becausethink about kit like kids were
in the moment.
We're like, you know, we don'thold on to things We went ice
cream we cry until we get it Youknow, and that's why kids are
like naturally good actors.

(22:25):
And then as we get socialized,we learn to lie.
How are you doing?
I'm fine.
I'm great.
Which really means I haven't hadmy coffee.
Fuck

Track 1 (22:31):
Right.
Right.

Right.

Track 1 (22:33):
right.

elaine-williams_1_04-07-2024 (22:34):
so the repetition is a way to.
Really unmask and let yourselfreally be affected.
So here I am newly sober.
I would cry in class.
Like was so good at it.
Cause I'd been studying it inAustin for two years, but also
cause I was newly sober.
So I kind of led our class in away.

(22:56):
Cause I just had access toemotions.
Cause I was so

Track 1 (23:00):
Rawness.
Yes.

elaine-williams_1_04-07-2024 (23:01):
So I'm so grateful for all of that
work.
And actually I, use some of thatwork when I work with speakers
to help them, you know, justwaking up their instruments.
Cause we have these amazingbodies and a lot of us don't.
them, you know, We're trying tobe polite and polished and all
the

Track 1 (23:17):
yeah, I definitely think that a part of, for me
too, I compartmentalize parts ofmyself.
And when I got sober, I was metwith the real me or not even the
real me.
It just like a base levelrawness, right?
Like I hadn't experienced beforeor in a long time.
And I think that's why so many.
Many people find solace inactivities that they did when

(23:39):
they were a kid, like even likeyou kind of regret back to I
started drinking around age 13,14, like, I went back to finding
some of the things that boughtme joy.
Then it's almost like I was.
Stuck in that period for alittle bit, but fast forward, I
just think it's so powerful thatyou're able to tap into humor.
And I'm wondering whatconnections do you see, or do

(24:02):
you find that there areparallels between sobriety and
humor and how does that helpsomeone through their sober
journey?

elaine-williams_1_04-07-202 (24:09):
I'm like, how long do you have?
And I love that.
Maybe we can do a part

Track 1 (24:13):
I would love that.
Yes.

elaine-williams_1_04-07-202 (24:15):
So, you know, I mean, here's the
thing, like we come in and we'retrying to figure out how to live
life without our thing, whetherit's drugs or bad boys or
whatever, cocaine, you know, I'mlike, it's easy to quit cocaine.
You just stop dating your

Track 1 (24:30):
Oh my God.

That was one of my jokes, but you
know,

Track 1 (24:33):
All right.
That's like so real, but it'sactually really Yeah.

love addicts, like we all need Love
So we need to be inrelationships with people.
But what if we use relationshipsaddictively, which is something
I've been looking at, you know?
And I mean, there's alwaysanother layer, but what I've
realized is there's so little oflife we can control, right?
We get to respond to things.

(24:57):
We set intentions.
We work.
I take a lot of action.
I'm a big action taker.
And I've made a lot of thingshappen or co created, but then
there's a lot of other thingsthat I'm like, are you kidding
me?
What?
Right.
so if you can learn to withhumor it's, it will help you on

(25:18):
so many levels.
It's kind of like when, youknow, people start meditating,
it helps you be less reactive.
Right.
So one of my things that I talkabout in my keynote is having a
comedic mindset, right?
Cause we all have those dayswhere like, everything's groovy.
You get all the green lights andthey say yes to the proposal.
And you're just like, I feelskinny.
I feel good.

(25:38):
You know?
And then we have those dayswhere you spill coffee on your
favorite shirt and you know, youscrew up the podcast.
You were so excited about, youknow, all the things.
So I started noticing that Iwould go, okay, this isn't funny
right now, but this could be ajoke.
This could be material.
And I started catching that andI realized it helped me have

(25:59):
some space and some compassionfor myself and others in life.
And so just having like thatcomedic, like, all right, this
right now in the moment, thisreally sucks, but in three
months, can be freaking funny,you know?
And so training myself.
And so when I'm working withentrepreneurial women, I say,
you know, it's content.

(26:19):
This can be content.
And sometimes they're like,Elaine, are you kidding?
And I'm like, okay, so maybewe'll change some names, but
like, You know, everything canbecome content or can become
funny.
And you get to say, like, Idon't like to do, I'm not going
to do rape jokes.
I, I don't do homeless jokes.
Like there are some, I feel likethere's so many other things to

(26:39):
make fun of with myself and myexperience.
So just like having that comedicmindset can really help you feel
empowered in the moment, asopposed to, Oh my God, I can't,
I always do this or

Track 1 (26:53):
Love that so much.
It reminds me of back in myearly wee moments of sobriety.
I'm coming up to three years,but the first like three months
I'll say, thank you so much.
But I used to journal a lot.
And so I got ahold of some, someof my

right.

Track 1 (27:09):
and they were, they were, you would think I was
dying.
Like it was so dramatic.
But now I see is almost like ifI were to write a screenplay of
my life, like almost like asitcom.
It's very comedic.
Like if you were to orchestrate,like the music and the lighting
and the sound and like, you justthink about it from a dark
comedy perspective, it'sactually pretty good.

(27:30):
And it just reminds me that whenyou're going through a bad
moment, Oh, you spilled coffeeon your shirt and maybe you
missed the train as you wererunning down the stairs and you
slipped and you fell like all ofthese things.
Yes, they're bad.
However, it's not a bad life,right?
It's a bad five minutes.
It's a bad day.
Maybe it's a bad week, but it'snot a bad life.
I think anything, my worstmoments, you've probably heard

(27:52):
this, but my worst moments insobriety are better than my.
Best days when I was using soI'm like, you know what, no
matter what happens, life isgood.
Like, it is funny.
if you take yourself out of thesituation and almost look at it
from, like, an outsideperspective as if you're
narrating your own life, it'sFunny.
And I feel like that's probablywhat you're telling your clients

(28:13):
when you're like, yeah, butlike, this is content.
This can be used to change somenames and places.
Right.
So I love that so much.
And you mentioned that you arethe CFO.
Can you break that down?
What is the CFO of your company?
And now a quick word from ourpartners.
It really feels like you'rehaving a moment, pun intended,
when you're sipping on thelovely and refreshing moment.

(28:36):
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I love the blood orange.
I love the spicy mango, but it'salso good for you, which is
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(28:56):
It also is packed withashwagandha, which is great for
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(29:16):
In the morning it's great for aboost to start the day versus in
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I love to have a moment afterthe gym versus going into the
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(29:38):
busy day and enjoy a deliciousmocktail without the hangover,
then Moment is great for thattoo.
One of the best parts for mewith Moment is I feel like it's
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Head over to drinkmoment.

(29:59):
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elaine-williams_1_04-07-202 (30:10):
The chief funny

Track 1 (30:12):
I love that so much.
How can we become the CFOs ofour lives in sobriety?

That is a great question.
I think that we teach what weseek to master for ourselves.
So even though I love teachingand coaching and uplifting and,
you know, I'm still alwayslearning too, when you can put
in five minutes of humor.
day, five minutes, and you canfind out what works for you.
So America's funniest videoslike YouTube, there's so many

(30:41):
brilliant comedians, I sharegoofy dog videos with people
like at the end of my day, I'llscroll for fun.
And the, the silly dog and horseand cat videos just crack me up
sometimes.
I'm five, you know, but likegiving yourself permission
laugh.
And like one of my clients Iwork with, you know, some, some

(31:02):
of my clients are in theirsixties and seventies and one
woman, they found like polyps orwhatever, she had a colonoscopy
and they were like, Oh my gosh,you have cancer.
And then they were like, okay,we're going to you're having
surgery.
Like it was like, bam,

Track 1 (31:17):
Right.

bam.
And so I remember telling her, Isaid, your only job is to laugh
every day.
I want you to watch funny moviesbecause.
There's something that happens,Right.
So when we laugh, we take inmore oxygen, our serotonin
levels, our dopamine that goesup the feel good chemicals.
We release toxins.
We burn calories

Track 1 (31:36):
Yes, we do.

elaine-williams_1_04-07-202 (31:38):
And we let our emotional walls down.
And to me, like I've goosebumps.
Like to me, it's like God, it'slike, it's you can laugh that
doesn't mean what's happening inthe world isn't affecting you,
but it gives you more resilienceto make a difference.

(31:59):
know, like if you, you reallygot in touch with all the crazy
shenanigans happening in theworld, we would like
spontaneously combust at thewhore, right?
Like it's so much, if you're asensitive, empathic person like
I am.
So I try to train myself to, ifI'm getting too intense, I like
try to take a break and, youknow, change my energy, state,

(32:20):
jump around, dance.
You know, I do all kinds ofthings.
Cause I'm working alonesometimes in my house for a
while to me that if you canpattern interrupt, You will have
an ability to deal with thingson a whole other level, I spoke
about assault all over thecountry and at military bases.

(32:41):
And so when that Sandusky thingwas happening at Penn state, I
got like, was like, so angry.
It's horrible that it happensand it, and people are sick and
twisted and we need to keepgetting better about protecting
children from pedophiles.
But the fact that it wasoverlooked for so long,

Track 1 (33:00):
Right.
Right.

like even worse, I was in such a
state of like, I remember I hadto go to two yoga classes that
day and I said, okay, Lane,you're in timeout, no more news.
Like.
You're not good to anybody whenyou're in this

Track 1 (33:15):
Right.

Yes, you're Right.
about how horrible it is, but ifyou're in this righteous, crazy
state, what good are you?
You know?
And so I learned, like I watchthe news, but I'm careful with
my brain before I go talk.
I don't watch the news.
I don't talk to certain peoplelike I really want to protect.
So I can be of service.
And so I always teach peoplelike, it's okay to laugh.

(33:39):
It doesn't mean that you don't

Track 1 (33:41):
Yeah.

Like it's okay to still have fun you
need to laugh at your humanityAnd it will help give you space
and resilience.
And it's okay.
It doesn't mean, that you don'tcare or that you're insensitive

Track 1 (33:54):
It doesn't mean that people won't take your message
seriously.
Cause I think so many peoplebelieve that like, if you inject
humor, like it diminishes thevalue of the message or what
you're saying.
And that's not true.
I would argue actually, thatwhen you can make someone laugh
or when you can inject alightness or humor into a
situation, it, it, it, it kindof lowers people's barriers,

(34:15):
right?
It's like the opposite of likeme attacking you, right?
It's like, then immediatelypeople's walls go up.
But if I'm like making you laughand we're having this exchange,
I feel like you're morereceptive to what I'm going to
say next, right?
So it's almost like a tacticthat you can use to connect
people and have them thinkbeyond what maybe they were
privy to listening tobeforehand.

elaine-williams_1_0 (34:37):
Absolutely.
Nadine.
So I always, I talk about this.
when a woman walks on stage,especially if she's attractive,
I had this scientist woman.
She was perfect.
She was so beautiful and sosmart.
And I was like, okay, so whenyou first walk on stage, all the
women in the audience are goingto hate you for a second because

(34:58):
it's just cave women.
So if you can crack one jokeabout how you should have seen
me covered in milk, I'm an hourago or try to get the kids off
to school.
We need to know that you're

Track 1 (35:08):
Right.

elaine-williams_1_04-07-202 (35:08):
and then we can hear you.
And so I, I love to teach peopleabout, or just saying, starting
off with a hooking questionthat, can make people laugh A
lot of times people are like,Oh, I don't have to worry about
the speaker, you know, becausesometimes we've had speakers
where you're like, are theygoing to make it?
Are they going to fall over?
They seem so

Track 1 (35:27):
Right.

elaine-williams_1_04-07-202 (35:28):
And so yeah, humor, humor can be
like the best secret weapon inso many

Track 1 (35:33):
And also, like, in connection to sobriety, it's
like, it doesn't mean that yoursobriety isn't serious just
because you're poking light orpoking fun at the things that
you did or you're doing in yoursobriety or what you did before
sobriety.
It's just this idea that I'mhuman, like you said, and I'm
going to make mistakes and I'mgoing to own up to those
mistakes and I can even laugh atthose mistakes.

(35:54):
So I think so many people Iknow, like, have DM'ed me or
like comment.
Things about just like, I lovehow positive you are and how
funny your page is.
Like I, of course I take mysobriety serious.
It is the most serious thing Ihave going on for myself because
I wouldn't be able to doanything without it.

Right.

Track 1 (36:11):
So it's like, of course it's the most sacred thing to
me, but that doesn't mean thatI'm not going to have fun with
it.
I'm not going to laugh at myselfand poke fun at some of the
things that I do or we do in thesober community, because it
humanizes us as mentioned.

elaine-williams_1_04-07-2024_ (36:25):
I love that.
I love that so much.
And I love that you're travelingand sharing about that because,
I, to me travel is, it's one ofmy passions.
It's one of my passions and.
I had to learn how to do itsober and

Track 1 (36:39):
Adjustment.

elaine-williams_1_04- (36:39):
airports, you know, I was listening to
your thing, like, Ooh, yeah.
Like I like to do work atairports.
I make program calls at airportsand I also go hang out in the
bookstores.
Because it is like this weird,no man's land kind of place.
but I love it, you know, you canhave so much fun traveling.
You don't need alcohol and youactually can see a lot more

(37:02):
because you're awake and awareas opposed to being hung over or
whatever, you

Track 1 (37:07):
Yeah.
Airports were especiallytriggering to me in the
beginning and funny enough,within the first month of my
sobriety, I embarked on a likesix week, six country tour.
Like, and they say like, don'tdisrupt, you know, people,
places, things, or I shouldn'tsay don't disrupt very similar
to you.
Like you changed everything.
And they're like, no, no, no,no.

(37:27):
Like stay, keep the routine.
But I felt like for mepersonally, I needed to kind of
keep myself busy in the earlystages of my sobriety and New
York was triggering for mebecause that is, that was my
playground.
That's where I did all thethings.
So I went off for six weeks withtwo girlfriends, two trusted
sources who could help hold meaccountable.

(37:48):
And it was one of the mostamazing trips I had because it
was the first time that I wasable to travel sober and it was
just amazing.
A way for me to like, kind oflike take myself out of
obsessing about the fact that Iwasn't using substances and see
the world and then see that Ican have fun without substances.

(38:09):
While I travel because travelingfor me also is one of my most
like favorite things that I've,I ever will do and continue to
do, but when I was doing it,drinking, it was very dangerous.
I was putting myself in verycompromising situation, similar
to what you mentioned when yourfriend was like, Elaine, you
can't pass out in New York.
Well, that was me passing out inforeign countries, like

(38:30):
literally going out by myselfbecause I love to travel with
people, but like, if no onewants to go.
I'm going by myself and I woulddo that drinking and using drugs
and pass out and like, just putmyself in the most dangerous
situations that, you know, I canonly thank God that it wasn't
worse.
Right.
So now I just have a newfoundsense of appreciation for the

(38:54):
journeys that I take now becauseI, A, remember them and B, I
feel a lot safer.
And C, it just enhances theoverall experience for me and
for people that I travel withbecause before I was boring, I'm
like, all I wanted to do wasdrink on vacation.
Like, that's not fun.
Like, everything revolved arounddrinking or like an activity

(39:15):
connected to drinking.
So, yeah.

elaine-williams_1_04-07-2024_ (39:17):
I so get it.
I remember I, after I graduatedfrom college, this friend took
me on this amazing trip.
He'd been planning for him andhis fiance, but they had broken
up and I was like, well, I'llgo.
So we're in New Zealand andAustralia.
beautiful, amazing in thenineties, like,

Track 1 (39:35):
Wow.

elaine-williams_1_04-07-202 (39:36):
all I could think about was where,
where, where are we drinkingtonight?
Like so much of the trip wasabout being hung over.
Where am I going to pee?
Like, so I was seeing all thisbeauty and all this amazing
stuff, but it's just amazing howmuch brain space alcohol took up

(39:56):
in my brain, you

Track 1 (39:58):
It was a fixation, like an absolute fixation.
And I just feel free.
I that's the best sense ofliberation and the best gift
I've given myself is like thefreedom to not obsess about.
When I was drinking, when mynext drink was like, how I was
going to get my next drink, justall of the things.

(40:19):
So I, I kind of want to winddown our conversations and I do
think that we Need to have apart two.
So I'm going to ask the audiencewhat other questions you have
for us In regards to this topicof humor and sobriety.
But I would love to ask you,Elaine, like what piece, I don't
necessarily say advice, but likeI can't think of another word
right now.
So just in terms of tips orstrategies, what piece of advice

(40:42):
would you have for anyone who islooking to embrace humor on
their sober journey?

elaine-williams_1_04-07-202 (40:50):
Oh, that's a great question.
I'm a big fan of notebooks and,you could just say, I'm going to
study comedians and who do Ithink is really funny?
Like I think Wanda Sykes isbrilliant.
I love her for so many reasons.
Maria Bamford is quirky andweird.
But I love her too.
There's other people, I respectthem, but they don't make me

(41:10):
laugh.
But I think their act outs aregreat or whatever.
So if you could, you know,that's a great way to be like,
okay, five minutes a day.
I'm going to watch differentcomedians and think about, you
know, who I love.
And then also you can get acomedy buddy and you can send
each other, you know, say, okay,every day, night, whatever, I'm

(41:31):
going to send you my favoritegoofy video from the day and you
send me one.
Or you can, go look at the farside things like there's so many
ways you can just add it intoyour life.
And then if you want to take upclass.
You should call me.
I'll tell you who to, who towork with or whatever.

(41:53):
Going to an open mic is sofreeing and scary and
terrifying, but I have broughtso many people, I would bring
people from work and I'd belike, Oh, I signed you up by the
way, go.
And they'd be like, are youkidding?
But then they always thanked me.
So there's a million ways youcan just start playing with the
idea of, of humor and comedy.
You know, you can take an improvclass.

(42:15):
there's improv classes overzoom.
I know a great improv teacher,so feel free to reach out to me.
There's books you can, you canread.
Like there's so many ways youcan learn to cultivate humor.
Like my yoga teachers say thatwe cultivate calm and we, you
know, we cultivate, we seek moreunderstanding and awareness of

(42:37):
ourselves at certain times.
And I believe that you cancultivate comedy.
Not everybody's going to bebrilliant like Richard Pryor or
Joan Rivers, but you can learnto be funnier.
just for yourself.
And it's, it's a gift that keepsgiving.
And, you know, another thing islike, if you're not having fun
in your home group, maybe it'stime to try a different home

(43:00):
group, like my home groups, we

Track 1 (43:03):
That's good.

elaine-williams_1_04-07-202 (43:04):
not all the time.
I mean, sometimes it's reallyheavy.
But sometimes it's funny.
Like on Saturday, I go to thismeeting in person in Dallas and
the guy, he goes, I remember Iwould drink all the time on my
mountain bike.
And I would think I am the bestmountain biker ever.
And The insanity that, like he'slucky.

(43:26):
He didn't

Track 1 (43:26):
Right.

Right.
We didn't end up in the desert,dehydrated and you know, but
Yeah.
like there's ways you cancultivate it or you can just
think about how do I how do Iwant to add more comedy?
And we, we all want to laughmore in our lives because it's,
It's good for our soul and youcan go see comedy shows like
this.

(43:47):
I invite you to experiment andjust be in this inquiry of who
do I love and why?
And, you know, maybe when youwere drinking, you loved Andrew
Dice Clay, but you realize he'sa misogynist and that's not your
speed anymore.
You know, it's okay to change.
know, I used to think somepeople are funny and now they,
they don't do it for me.
It's okay.

(44:07):
Just give yourself some space

Track 1 (44:09):
I love going to comedy shows to this day.
Comedy is something that I'vealways enjoyed, but I actually
appreciate it more now from asober perspective.
But I, I find that I enjoymyself more because I'm more
observant of the crowd and likethe dynamics of the, the space
and I feel the energy more.
And if I laugh, it's trulybecause I think it's funny, not

(44:29):
because I'm inebriated and theperson, right?
I'm just like tipsy, right?
But I think if you can get agood laugh out of someone who is
completely sober, it means more.
Like, I think the value of thelaugh is worth more.
And it reminds me.
It reminds me to something youshared just about like the sober
jokes, like in your home group,the guy who is the best drunk

(44:50):
mountain biker.
I have a comic.
I can't think of her name rightnow.
If I think of it, I'll plug itbelow in the show notes, but she
has this amazing joke.
She's sober.
And she says, you know,sometimes when I go out to bars,
to parties, to clubs, Okay.
I feel like I'm a benchprofessional.
Like I'm just sitting on thesidelines.
Like I would, I could do this somuch better than you.

(45:11):
Like if I were out there rightnow, like if I were drinking
right now, I would be on thetable, I would just be out
there, it's just like hilarious.
Cause I can relate to that beingalso like the life of the party
air quoting that being the mostwild, most extreme.
I'm just like, sometimes when Igo out, like.
Oh, yeah, I'd be so much betterthan you at this, but
thankfully, I'm not thereanymore.

(45:32):
I really just appreciate that.
Just finding opportunities toembrace humor in your life even
if it's 5 minutes a day, I lovethat.
Like, just finding anopportunity to laugh because I
feel like getting that release,especially.
If you're struggling with yoursobriety, your recovery, it's
really important to laugh.
Like laughter is the bestmedicine.
Like people don't realize that,like you have to release some of

(45:53):
that heaviness sometimes.
So everything you shared Elaine,so, so amazing.
I want to open the space for younow to share, what are you
working on?
Where can we find you?
How can we connect with youfurther?

elaine-williams_1_04-07-202 (46:07):
Oh, thank you, Nadine.
I think the easiest way is onInstagram.
I am Elaine Williams fun becausethat's really as part of my
brand.
And then I do have a websitecaptivate the crowd.
com.
So if you want to work onspeaking or video or just reach
out, there's lots of ways youcan message me or you can find
my email and my phone numbers onthere too.

(46:29):
And I love helping people insobriety.
I love Just sharing the storiesand helping people see the
resources that are out therebecause it it really is an
exciting time It's overwhelmingall the information we have but
it's also because there are zoommeetings There is an there is a
women's a a meeting that'sinternational that meets every

(46:50):
hour on the hour Like there's anAl Anon meeting that like,
there's so much out there.
And so it doesn't matter, ifyou're struggling, you know,
reach out, please, because needyou.
The world needs you.
The world needs more soberpeople who are helping focus on
solutions and nobody does itlike you.

(47:14):
And it's okay.
If you're struggling, you know,when I, when I first got sober,
I was like, all right, so mylife's going to be really easy
now.
Right?
Like, I'm not going to make anymore mistakes.
I'm going to have this alltogether.
Like I really thought like,okay, why am I not on Broadway?
Like I really was like, and Ihad to, you know, it's like, Oh,

(47:35):
life is still hard.
And at 10 years I was like angrybecause I thought I was supposed
to be at a different place.
So, you know, that's ego.
Right.
And so luckily I just keptcoming and I've had awesome
sponsors, but you know, ifyou're struggling, it's okay.
Change it up.
You know, maybe you need to goto a different meeting, reach
out to me or Nadine.

(47:56):
Maybe you need a differentsponsor.
Maybe you need to check outanother program.
Maybe it's time for you to getback into some therapy.
You know, I'm a big fan of like,I come to AA as my foundation,
but I have done a ton of otherwork.
I'm a big fan of professionaloutside help.
I've done.
EMDR, EFT, tapping, Feldenkrais,Alexander technique, lots of

(48:21):
yoga, meditation retreats, likeyou name it, I've done it.
And it's all added to myprogram.
And so, know, just if you'restruggling, reach out, you're
not alone and you maybe you justneed a little bit of a tweak in
what you're doing.

Track 1 (48:37):
Beautifully, beautifully said Elaine.
Thank you so much for coming onand I have a feeling there's
going to be a part 2.
so thank you Elaine.
And I'm so glad that weconnected today to talk about
this very important topic.

Thanks, Nadine.
Thank you.
Thank you for tuning into thisepisode of the Sober Butterfly
podcast with Elaine Williams.
We hope you found our discussionon using humor as a tool for
healing and supporting others insobriety, both enlightening,
uplifting, and also funny.
If you enjoyed today's episode,please consider subscribing to

(49:10):
our podcast on your favoriteplatform.
And don't forget to leave us a 5star rating and review.
Your feedback helps us continueto grow and reach more listeners
who may benefit from ourcontent.
If you're interested in Elaine'slatest book, The Power of
Community, Courage, Compassion,and Collaboration Leads to
Success, it's available onAmazon and it's a number one

(49:32):
bestseller in the U.
S.
and internationally.
Elaine's chapter specificallyusing humor to amplify your
message was one of nine otherchapters by her co authors, all
brilliant and wise colleagues.
Remember, you are not alone onyour journey to sobriety.
Until next time, stay strong,stay sober, and keep shining

(49:52):
bright like the beautifulbutterfly you are.

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Episode Transcript

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.css-r6mb8g{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:1;overflow:hidden;}1. Stuff You Missed in History Class

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Humor Heals: Elaine Williams on Comedy and Recovery

1. Stuff You Missed in History Class