February 17, 2026 • 21 mins
Heather Quick went women-only and built her law firm mission statement around it. That one decision simplified her hiring culture, marketing, and growth.
When Heather told people she was pivoting her family law practice to only represent women in divorce, they thought it was a gimmick. Fifteen years later she's got 7 attorneys, 30 employees, and a firm that knows exactly who it serves.
In this episode of the Sterling Family Law Show, Heather walks us through how she found her niche, why her personal story became her firm's biggest marketing advantage, and what it actually looks like to build a law firm target audience around a single client avatar.
If you're trying to grow a family law practice but feel stuck doing everything for everyone, this one's for you.
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---
📄 CHAPTERS
0:00 - Law Firm Mission Statement: Meet the Attorney Who Went Women-Only
1:23 - Why She Left Criminal Defense to Pivot Her Law Firm Practice Area
3:45 - 60% of Divorces Are Filed by Women — And What That Means for Your Client Avatar
6:07 - How Finding Your "Why" Becomes Your Family Law Firm Branding
8:28 - "We're Your Advocate, Not Your Friend" — Niche Marketing for Attorneys
13:33 - The Hardest Part of Law Firm Owner Leadership: Learning to Delegate
18:06 - Why Law Firm Business Coaching Is the Best Money You'll Spend
----------------------
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_02 (00:00):
Oftentimes, firms or businesses, their culture
embodies the culture and themindset of the owner, founder,
or CEO that comes into play inhiring.
But I think it's reallyimportant that you have a point
of view.
Like if you're gonna run thefirm and you're gonna grow and
scale the firm and hireemployees, you can't just be in
the middle.
(00:20):
Welcome back to the SterlingFamily Law Show, the podcast
designed to help familyattorneys build the firm of
their dreams.
I am your host, Tyler Dolph.
I'm also the CEO of ourhyper-focused family law
firm-only marketing agencycalled Rocket Clicks that was
born out of our very own familylaw firm, Sterling Lawyers, that
(00:41):
has grown to over 27 attorneys.
Today we have Heather who runsFlorida Women's Law Group, a law
firm only for women.
She has seven attorneys and doesan amazing job building and
growing her practice.
Heather, thank you so much forjoining us.
If you wouldn't mind, introduceyourself to our audience and
tell us a little bit about yourfirm.
SPEAKER_00 (01:00):
Absolutely.
Thank you.
My name is Heather Quick, and Iown Florida Women's Law Group.
We are located in NortheastFlorida, the Jacksonville area,
and we represent women onlygoing through divorce.
And the firm has been open forabout 15 years now and had uh
some different iterations, grewas I grew, and we uh became what
(01:26):
we are today, which is sevenlawyers, a little over 30
employees.
SPEAKER_02 (01:33):
That's awesome.
Congratulations on that growth.
Talk to me about women's only.
Was that always the start?
How did that come to be?
And how do you use that as astrength today for your firm?
SPEAKER_00 (01:44):
So that was not always what we were doing.
I actually, when I first decidedto own my firm, I was gonna do
criminal defense.
And because I had been aprosecutor and that just seemed
the natural thing to do.
Unfortunately, prosecutor atheart couldn't really uh work to
keep people out of jail.
That just wasn't part of who Iwas, and that was part of the
(02:07):
evolution, I think, of the wholefirm is finding something that I
love uh that meant something tome.
And so family law just seemed tonaturally um come to me.
And then I really started toenjoy it.
And then of course I realizedand put the pieces together that
(02:29):
I had been um I had a front rowseat to my parents' divorce and
remarriages, other people andsubsequent divorces.
So I had a lot of experience umand I saw a lot of it.
So that really then I realizedthat's just why I'm so good at
it because I women play withtheir feelings.
(02:49):
So then that began to grow, andI then realized, and this was
also through a lot of businesscoaching, personal coaching and
growth, that I realized I reallyliked helping women.
I noticed that they were goingthrough the same patterns every
(03:10):
time.
Patterns I recognized fromwatching my mother go through
the divorce and the patterns Isaw her take during probably two
or three of those divorces, andreally um resonated with me.
I was like, wow, I can reallymake a difference for these
women because I can, you know,provide the strength and get
(03:31):
them to the other side when theydon't believe in themselves.
And so that was when I took theleap to do women only, which was
um, you know, a little nervousfor me because you're like,
there's everyone laugh at you,think it's just a gimmick.
Um, but it wasn't, it's not.
And it has allowed us to build afirm that really, you know, is
(03:51):
meeting the needs of our clientsand we can anticipate their
needs and those predictablethings that they go through, um,
that is also something that wecan do.
So it's really turned out to bewonderful.
SPEAKER_02 (04:06):
That's great.
I read a stat recently that 60%of divorces are started or um
initiated by the woman.
And that number jumps to 90% ifthey have a college education.
So, what I'm wondering isbecause you're women only, did
you have to shift how youeducate and work with your
(04:26):
clients, knowing that that mostof the time they were initiating
the divorce, they were startingthe process.
Did you feel like it was alonger kind of consultation
cycle before it actuallyhappened?
Or would you say it was on parwith when you used to have bull?
SPEAKER_00 (04:41):
I think that there's like the two different tracks,
right?
We have some people who are inour funnel for years and they've
seen us, they're watching thevideos, but they're it this was
a couple years ago.
The stat said four years.
A woman, it takes her about fouryears.
I would say four to six, really.
I think many women, when asked,knew quite some time ago.
(05:05):
And when they have the abilityto wait, they do for various
different reasons.
And um, till there's that, thisis it, I'm done.
And um, so yeah, I think there'sthe one where we definitely want
to continue to educate, support,provide really good resources
for the women who are waiting,and then some, you know, just
(05:29):
get to us right when they havedecided.
And part of that, uh, womenmaking that decision is that
then they're ready for it to bedone yesterday.
So that's a challenge, right?
It's like you've been married 15years, been thinking about it
for five, but you want us to dothis in, you know, in just a few
days, which is, you know,impossible.
(05:50):
But um, but at least weunderstand.
We understand they are ready.
Now it took so long and theyhave made this big decision.
They're ready, they're ready togo.
SPEAKER_02 (06:01):
That's really interesting.
All right, if we can, let'srewind the tape a little bit.
Tell us a little bit about yourentrepreneurial journey.
How'd you get started?
Um, you mentioned you were, youknow, a public defender and and
went through that.
As you evolved your firm and youstarted to make this evolution
into women only, what did youlearn along the way?
Help us, you know, educate ourlisteners on what it takes to
(06:23):
really pivot your firm one andthen really double down and
focus.
We'll give the second.
SPEAKER_00 (06:28):
Well, it definitely took it took a resolve to make
that decision.
And for me, it was wonderfuljust to determine why.
That helped me a lot.
This is why I want to do this.
I don't, I don't think that'snecessary for everybody, but it
can be very helpful because whenyou tell your story, when you're
marketing and there's a reasonwhy you're doing what you're
(06:51):
doing, it's much morecompelling.
So I think that was an importantpart.
And it means something to me.
And that way, when people ask, Ihave something to say as to why
we do this.
And I can talk about that, youknow, for ad nauseum, like
right, more than anybody wantsto hear.
But it also resonates with theclient.
(07:15):
So really understanding whyyou're doing what you're doing
and and and why it's importantto you, because that then allows
me to put in all those manyhours back in the day when it
was like we're gonna build thisfirm and we're gonna, you know,
pivot it this way.
And now this didn't comeovernight, but allows me to have
(07:39):
really better conversations withpeople we're hiring, right?
Because we have a mission, wehave a reason for doing what we
are doing.
And I want people on board withthat.
And if you're just here for apaycheck and you don't really
get behind our mission, I'm notsaying we won't hire you, but if
(07:59):
somebody really is behind ourmission, we'll pick that person
first because we are trying toexplain to you why we do what we
do.
And we want people who believein that.
And particularly when you're inum, you know, business to
consumer, we're dealing withindividuals all day long who are
very raw in difficult times oftheir lives.
(08:21):
It makes it that much moreimportant for me as an employer
to know I have staff that theyreally care about this.
They really care about helpingwomen when they are in this
difficult spot.
SPEAKER_02 (08:34):
That's great.
And I'm sure that that comesthrough in the consult room and
it comes through during theentire process that like they
have an advocate.
SPEAKER_00 (08:44):
Yes.
And, you know, and then that'sthere's a balance there.
You know, that's important too.
It's like we are your advocateand we're here for you, but
we're not your friend.
We are your attorney and we arestrong, but we're also gonna
stick up for you.
And so we we do work really hardto convey that and help them
understand that that's who weare as a firm.
(09:08):
And um, and believe it or not,it's not it's not a fit for
everybody.
SPEAKER_02 (09:12):
And that's the whole thing.
SPEAKER_00 (09:13):
Not all women, and that's okay, yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (09:16):
Yes.
When you were crafting thatnarrative around women only, I
feel like, you know, in today'spolitical environment's very
polarizing, you're like one oneend of the spectrum or the
other.
So I feel like you could havegone very, you know, men are
evil, don't trust them, all thethings.
How did you find that?
Like, where were you gonna sitin the women-only messaging?
SPEAKER_00 (09:39):
Well, the I think again, it goes back to the way I
am because I'm not I'm not thatperson.
And there are those attorneysout there, which is great
because sometimes they that'swhat people think they want or
they do want.
That's not me.
I don't hate men.
I'm happily married.
Um, however, I want to fight forwomen.
(10:00):
I want to be there for women,and that's where same with um my
podcast called Women WinningDivorce.
See, I don't believe thateveryone's, oh, nobody wins.
That's just not true.
Somebody always wins.
And sometimes both can winbecause they want really
different things.
And so we can be for womenwithout being against men.
(10:22):
Now they may perceive it thatway, and that's fine, that's on
them, but that's not the way itworks.
It's we can be for you because Ibelieve you are better than him.
I believe you do more than hedoes, and I believe I can should
try to get you as much money asI can or save whatever money is
yours.
So for me, it was a very naturalway to go about it because that
(10:47):
is the way I feel about it.
So it allows me to be veryauthentic with that.
Um, it may not be what everybodythinks.
They always think, oh, you'resuch a men hater.
It's like, whatever, if that'swhat you want.
I mean, you can say whatanybody, people say what they
want anyway, right?
And think what they want.
But it really isn't.
Now, it doesn't mean that if,you know, it's got to be a
(11:10):
battle in trial and you know,he's the worst thing, okay, we
will go there.
But if you guys are amicable,great.
You know, and I I have I havesoftened as I've aged and done
this more, right?
As to helping people, becausethat is what we do, and we try
to help them and really try toestablish what do you want
overall?
What are your objectives?
(11:31):
So that, and now let's craft away and a strategy to help you
get there.
SPEAKER_01 (11:35):
Hey, family law firm leaders.
My partner Tony Carls justreleased his book where he lays
bare our precise blueprint forgrowing sterling lawyers from
zero to 17 million.
This is the blueprint that westill use daily.
And Tony explains it in verysimple terms.
The truth is, this is not simpleto do.
(11:56):
Success requires and demandshard work, but if you have the
patience and the work ethic todo it, your family law firm will
succeed.
SPEAKER_02 (12:06):
One thing you you continue to say that I think is
really important for ourlisteners is oftentimes firms or
businesses, their cultureembodies the culture and the
mindset of the owner, founder,or CEO.
Right.
And so that comes into play inhiring, as you mentioned.
But I think it's reallyimportant that you have a point
(12:28):
of view.
Like if you're gonna run thefirm and you're gonna you're
gonna grow and scale the firmand hire employees, you need to
have you can't just be in themiddle, like on the fence all
the time.
You have to have a point ofview.
SPEAKER_00 (12:39):
Well, it makes it easier to talk about what I
think and um and what our firmis about, instead of it doesn't
matter, we're here for him,we're here for you, we're here
for anybody.
Um, but I um yes, it makes it aclearer message for me and
definitely our our point ofview.
(13:01):
And um it allows us, like yousaid, to craft the messages and
the marketing in that way tocreate the resources that are
for women.
I don't have to have, you know,different um material based on
who the client is.
So really that is um makes thatsimpler.
SPEAKER_02 (13:19):
So that's the start and finish of every process you
build.
Like, okay, well, we alreadyknow our avatar.
We know who we're marketing to,who we're talking to, who we're
building this firm around.
Focus is everything.
Yeah, that that really helped usin our consultancy.
We used to work with all typesof different businesses.
And as soon as we pivoted andonly worked with family law
(13:40):
firms, it became so much easierbecause you weren't building
everything for everyone.
You were building something fora single avatar.
SPEAKER_00 (13:47):
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, it definitely helps.
And then you get better becausethe clients all have
similarities, so you can learnmore and just continue to grow
and be better for your clientsbecause they all have those
similarities and the same, youknow, same likenesses.
Obviously, they're individuals,but it it makes it so much
(14:07):
easier and makes us better,right?
Like you said, because theclients are you know similar and
you learn from it.
SPEAKER_02 (14:14):
100%.
How have you had to grow in inbeing a leader as your firm has
scaled?
SPEAKER_00 (14:22):
Um, well, in delegating is a big thing and
allowing others to makemistakes, that's very difficult.
Um, because you know, inhindsight, you're like, oh, I
wouldn't have done that, butwould I have made the mistake?
Maybe.
Um, I I don't like I don't likemistakes.
(14:42):
I don't like things that whenthey don't go the right way, and
having learning how to react umwith grace for the person who
made a mistake and with a way totake it as an opportunity to do
better and learn and not be justlashing out or really hard.
(15:07):
I um I used to be more like thatwhen I was younger just because
there was a lot.
I had so much writing on it.
I have three children, they wereyounger, married.
You know, you have a lot ofplates in the air, everything
going at the same time, andsomething didn't go right.
And then I was in court a lot,and that I don't really allow
for any of those kind ofmistakes in the legal work,
(15:28):
right?
And the other parts of thingsthere can be, but there are
things that didn't get done andor not the way that it should
have.
And I would have I did lash outa lot.
I was more very short, and um,I've learned to grow from that.
And it does help to hire othersbecause then I might have my
(15:48):
initial thoughts and then orwrite out like what I'm really
thinking, well, you don't sendany that to anyone, and then now
they're showing up.
Okay, well, now tell me and letme take it in.
It doesn't mean I won't, youknow, address the issue, which
that was that was a stupid thingto do, or I don't, I wouldn't
have done that, however, not ina now you're fired, or you know,
(16:11):
I hate you.
So use it, right?
It's not, and we're dealing withpeople.
Um, you know, we still aredealing with people.
I even the more the A and I AIgrows, I'm like, I would like to
have more AI.
Um and people, but you know,they are people and they're
using their best judgment withthe information they have.
And so I've really had to learnto just be better in dealing
(16:36):
with that because I don't want,I can't be here every single day
making every single decision.
So you've got to trust that,train them, trust them, and let
them make a mistake and hopethat they're gonna come tell you
so that we can do better insteadof being such an ogre that
nobody wants to tell you and thewhole place burns down.
(16:57):
So we don't want that.
SPEAKER_02 (16:59):
So yes, 100%.
I couldn't agree more.
As you've grown and and thoughtabout the future of your firm,
do you foresee um a day in whichyou're not practicing at all and
you're just the leader of thefirm?
Or how do you how do you thinkyou're gonna have to continue to
evolve as your firm grows?
SPEAKER_00 (17:15):
I think in that way, and really with the platform of
the women-winning divorce typevehicle, I think that's where
I'll go with that and createmore resources and more um for
women, even beyond divorce.
It's like right in that so thedivorce will be one thing that
(17:38):
we do, but overall it will bemore and become more of an
inspirer, motivator, leader, andyou know, provider of
information.
I think that's where I reallywant to go.
And I have I have so manyinterests as it just relates to
women and and in their aspectsof life, work, business,
(18:00):
marriage, and how thoseintersect.
And so I think there's there'sstill room for me to do a lot in
that space.
That's great.
SPEAKER_02 (18:06):
I love that you're thinking such a big picture, and
and you have the opportunity.
And the the better leader youcan become, the more time and
resources you'll have to gopursue those other interests.
SPEAKER_00 (18:18):
Yes.
And and also um as my children,I've got one in med school, one
in college, one still in highschool, but that frees me up to
go visit them and my nieces thatare both in college and do
things like that, that is veryimportant to me, you know, which
we all we all work hard, but wewant that freedom to be able to,
(18:41):
you know, go visit them and andhave their time.
So that's been really great forme uh as well.
SPEAKER_02 (18:48):
Love it.
Otherwise, I appreciate yourtime today.
As we're finishing up, I wantyou to think about, you know,
your experience.
And if if you were to um give apiece of advice to someone
starting their own firm totomorrow, right?
What do they need to thinkabout?
What can fast track them to besuccessful and grow this new
(19:09):
firm that they're starting?
SPEAKER_00 (19:11):
Um I I do believe very strongly in coaching, in
business coaching.
I would highly encourage you,even when you don't think you
have the money, uh, there havebeen to have someone who can
provide you with that roadmapand encouragement and
accountability uh is reallyinvaluable.
(19:33):
I I did that when I started mybusiness.
I'm very thankful for that.
Because be careful.
Well, I guess that's one, andthen really look at who you're
taking advice from.
Because do they really have theexpertise to advise you?
It may not be the other lawyersin your community unless they
(19:54):
have what you want, you know,unless they're doing something
that you think is great, becausea lot of them aren't.
So I would just be very carefulfrom whom you take advice from
as far as running a business.
Have they run a successfulbusiness?
And is it really successful andprofitable?
And, you know, I think that isthose are two things that will
(20:16):
allow you to get sound advicebecause you shouldn't do this
totally on your own, even thoughit says, you know, solo
practitioner, I'm opening abusiness.
Like really seek out good, solidcoaching and help and pay for it
because then you've got skin inthe game and it will be serious.
SPEAKER_02 (20:34):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (20:34):
And it will take you seriously, and I think you can
fast track your growth and umbuild what you really want to
suit your life.
So I think that would be thenumber one thing.
SPEAKER_02 (20:53):
Wish you all the best and look forward to talking
to you again soon.
SPEAKER_00 (20:56):
Thank you so much for having me.
Oftentimes, firms or businesses, their culture
embodies the culture and themindset of the owner, founder,
or CEO that comes into play inhiring.
But I think it's reallyimportant that you have a point
of view.
Like if you're gonna run thefirm and you're gonna grow and
scale the firm and hireemployees, you can't just be in
the middle.
(00:20):
Welcome back to the SterlingFamily Law Show, the podcast
designed to help familyattorneys build the firm of
their dreams.
I am your host, Tyler Dolph.
I'm also the CEO of ourhyper-focused family law
firm-only marketing agencycalled Rocket Clicks that was
born out of our very own familylaw firm, Sterling Lawyers, that
(00:41):
has grown to over 27 attorneys.
Today we have Heather who runsFlorida Women's Law Group, a law
firm only for women.
She has seven attorneys and doesan amazing job building and
growing her practice.
Heather, thank you so much forjoining us.
If you wouldn't mind, introduceyourself to our audience and
tell us a little bit about yourfirm.
SPEAKER_00 (01:00):
Absolutely.
Thank you.
My name is Heather Quick, and Iown Florida Women's Law Group.
We are located in NortheastFlorida, the Jacksonville area,
and we represent women onlygoing through divorce.
And the firm has been open forabout 15 years now and had uh
some different iterations, grewas I grew, and we uh became what
(01:26):
we are today, which is sevenlawyers, a little over 30
employees.
SPEAKER_02 (01:33):
That's awesome.
Congratulations on that growth.
Talk to me about women's only.
Was that always the start?
How did that come to be?
And how do you use that as astrength today for your firm?
SPEAKER_00 (01:44):
So that was not always what we were doing.
I actually, when I first decidedto own my firm, I was gonna do
criminal defense.
And because I had been aprosecutor and that just seemed
the natural thing to do.
Unfortunately, prosecutor atheart couldn't really uh work to
keep people out of jail.
That just wasn't part of who Iwas, and that was part of the
(02:07):
evolution, I think, of the wholefirm is finding something that I
love uh that meant something tome.
And so family law just seemed tonaturally um come to me.
And then I really started toenjoy it.
And then of course I realizedand put the pieces together that
(02:29):
I had been um I had a front rowseat to my parents' divorce and
remarriages, other people andsubsequent divorces.
So I had a lot of experience umand I saw a lot of it.
So that really then I realizedthat's just why I'm so good at
it because I women play withtheir feelings.
(02:49):
So then that began to grow, andI then realized, and this was
also through a lot of businesscoaching, personal coaching and
growth, that I realized I reallyliked helping women.
I noticed that they were goingthrough the same patterns every
(03:10):
time.
Patterns I recognized fromwatching my mother go through
the divorce and the patterns Isaw her take during probably two
or three of those divorces, andreally um resonated with me.
I was like, wow, I can reallymake a difference for these
women because I can, you know,provide the strength and get
(03:31):
them to the other side when theydon't believe in themselves.
And so that was when I took theleap to do women only, which was
um, you know, a little nervousfor me because you're like,
there's everyone laugh at you,think it's just a gimmick.
Um, but it wasn't, it's not.
And it has allowed us to build afirm that really, you know, is
(03:51):
meeting the needs of our clientsand we can anticipate their
needs and those predictablethings that they go through, um,
that is also something that wecan do.
So it's really turned out to bewonderful.
SPEAKER_02 (04:06):
That's great.
I read a stat recently that 60%of divorces are started or um
initiated by the woman.
And that number jumps to 90% ifthey have a college education.
So, what I'm wondering isbecause you're women only, did
you have to shift how youeducate and work with your
(04:26):
clients, knowing that that mostof the time they were initiating
the divorce, they were startingthe process.
Did you feel like it was alonger kind of consultation
cycle before it actuallyhappened?
Or would you say it was on parwith when you used to have bull?
SPEAKER_00 (04:41):
I think that there's like the two different tracks,
right?
We have some people who are inour funnel for years and they've
seen us, they're watching thevideos, but they're it this was
a couple years ago.
The stat said four years.
A woman, it takes her about fouryears.
I would say four to six, really.
I think many women, when asked,knew quite some time ago.
(05:05):
And when they have the abilityto wait, they do for various
different reasons.
And um, till there's that, thisis it, I'm done.
And um, so yeah, I think there'sthe one where we definitely want
to continue to educate, support,provide really good resources
for the women who are waiting,and then some, you know, just
(05:29):
get to us right when they havedecided.
And part of that, uh, womenmaking that decision is that
then they're ready for it to bedone yesterday.
So that's a challenge, right?
It's like you've been married 15years, been thinking about it
for five, but you want us to dothis in, you know, in just a few
days, which is, you know,impossible.
(05:50):
But um, but at least weunderstand.
We understand they are ready.
Now it took so long and theyhave made this big decision.
They're ready, they're ready togo.
SPEAKER_02 (06:01):
That's really interesting.
All right, if we can, let'srewind the tape a little bit.
Tell us a little bit about yourentrepreneurial journey.
How'd you get started?
Um, you mentioned you were, youknow, a public defender and and
went through that.
As you evolved your firm and youstarted to make this evolution
into women only, what did youlearn along the way?
Help us, you know, educate ourlisteners on what it takes to
(06:23):
really pivot your firm one andthen really double down and
focus.
We'll give the second.
SPEAKER_00 (06:28):
Well, it definitely took it took a resolve to make
that decision.
And for me, it was wonderfuljust to determine why.
That helped me a lot.
This is why I want to do this.
I don't, I don't think that'snecessary for everybody, but it
can be very helpful because whenyou tell your story, when you're
marketing and there's a reasonwhy you're doing what you're
(06:51):
doing, it's much morecompelling.
So I think that was an importantpart.
And it means something to me.
And that way, when people ask, Ihave something to say as to why
we do this.
And I can talk about that, youknow, for ad nauseum, like
right, more than anybody wantsto hear.
But it also resonates with theclient.
(07:15):
So really understanding whyyou're doing what you're doing
and and and why it's importantto you, because that then allows
me to put in all those manyhours back in the day when it
was like we're gonna build thisfirm and we're gonna, you know,
pivot it this way.
And now this didn't comeovernight, but allows me to have
(07:39):
really better conversations withpeople we're hiring, right?
Because we have a mission, wehave a reason for doing what we
are doing.
And I want people on board withthat.
And if you're just here for apaycheck and you don't really
get behind our mission, I'm notsaying we won't hire you, but if
(07:59):
somebody really is behind ourmission, we'll pick that person
first because we are trying toexplain to you why we do what we
do.
And we want people who believein that.
And particularly when you're inum, you know, business to
consumer, we're dealing withindividuals all day long who are
very raw in difficult times oftheir lives.
(08:21):
It makes it that much moreimportant for me as an employer
to know I have staff that theyreally care about this.
They really care about helpingwomen when they are in this
difficult spot.
SPEAKER_02 (08:34):
That's great.
And I'm sure that that comesthrough in the consult room and
it comes through during theentire process that like they
have an advocate.
SPEAKER_00 (08:44):
Yes.
And, you know, and then that'sthere's a balance there.
You know, that's important too.
It's like we are your advocateand we're here for you, but
we're not your friend.
We are your attorney and we arestrong, but we're also gonna
stick up for you.
And so we we do work really hardto convey that and help them
understand that that's who weare as a firm.
(09:08):
And um, and believe it or not,it's not it's not a fit for
everybody.
SPEAKER_02 (09:12):
And that's the whole thing.
SPEAKER_00 (09:13):
Not all women, and that's okay, yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (09:16):
Yes.
When you were crafting thatnarrative around women only, I
feel like, you know, in today'spolitical environment's very
polarizing, you're like one oneend of the spectrum or the
other.
So I feel like you could havegone very, you know, men are
evil, don't trust them, all thethings.
How did you find that?
Like, where were you gonna sitin the women-only messaging?
SPEAKER_00 (09:39):
Well, the I think again, it goes back to the way I
am because I'm not I'm not thatperson.
And there are those attorneysout there, which is great
because sometimes they that'swhat people think they want or
they do want.
That's not me.
I don't hate men.
I'm happily married.
Um, however, I want to fight forwomen.
(10:00):
I want to be there for women,and that's where same with um my
podcast called Women WinningDivorce.
See, I don't believe thateveryone's, oh, nobody wins.
That's just not true.
Somebody always wins.
And sometimes both can winbecause they want really
different things.
And so we can be for womenwithout being against men.
(10:22):
Now they may perceive it thatway, and that's fine, that's on
them, but that's not the way itworks.
It's we can be for you because Ibelieve you are better than him.
I believe you do more than hedoes, and I believe I can should
try to get you as much money asI can or save whatever money is
yours.
So for me, it was a very naturalway to go about it because that
(10:47):
is the way I feel about it.
So it allows me to be veryauthentic with that.
Um, it may not be what everybodythinks.
They always think, oh, you'resuch a men hater.
It's like, whatever, if that'swhat you want.
I mean, you can say whatanybody, people say what they
want anyway, right?
And think what they want.
But it really isn't.
Now, it doesn't mean that if,you know, it's got to be a
(11:10):
battle in trial and you know,he's the worst thing, okay, we
will go there.
But if you guys are amicable,great.
You know, and I I have I havesoftened as I've aged and done
this more, right?
As to helping people, becausethat is what we do, and we try
to help them and really try toestablish what do you want
overall?
What are your objectives?
(11:31):
So that, and now let's craft away and a strategy to help you
get there.
SPEAKER_01 (11:35):
Hey, family law firm leaders.
My partner Tony Carls justreleased his book where he lays
bare our precise blueprint forgrowing sterling lawyers from
zero to 17 million.
This is the blueprint that westill use daily.
And Tony explains it in verysimple terms.
The truth is, this is not simpleto do.
(11:56):
Success requires and demandshard work, but if you have the
patience and the work ethic todo it, your family law firm will
succeed.
SPEAKER_02 (12:06):
One thing you you continue to say that I think is
really important for ourlisteners is oftentimes firms or
businesses, their cultureembodies the culture and the
mindset of the owner, founder,or CEO.
Right.
And so that comes into play inhiring, as you mentioned.
But I think it's reallyimportant that you have a point
(12:28):
of view.
Like if you're gonna run thefirm and you're gonna you're
gonna grow and scale the firmand hire employees, you need to
have you can't just be in themiddle, like on the fence all
the time.
You have to have a point ofview.
SPEAKER_00 (12:39):
Well, it makes it easier to talk about what I
think and um and what our firmis about, instead of it doesn't
matter, we're here for him,we're here for you, we're here
for anybody.
Um, but I um yes, it makes it aclearer message for me and
definitely our our point ofview.
(13:01):
And um it allows us, like yousaid, to craft the messages and
the marketing in that way tocreate the resources that are
for women.
I don't have to have, you know,different um material based on
who the client is.
So really that is um makes thatsimpler.
SPEAKER_02 (13:19):
So that's the start and finish of every process you
build.
Like, okay, well, we alreadyknow our avatar.
We know who we're marketing to,who we're talking to, who we're
building this firm around.
Focus is everything.
Yeah, that that really helped usin our consultancy.
We used to work with all typesof different businesses.
And as soon as we pivoted andonly worked with family law
(13:40):
firms, it became so much easierbecause you weren't building
everything for everyone.
You were building something fora single avatar.
SPEAKER_00 (13:47):
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, it definitely helps.
And then you get better becausethe clients all have
similarities, so you can learnmore and just continue to grow
and be better for your clientsbecause they all have those
similarities and the same, youknow, same likenesses.
Obviously, they're individuals,but it it makes it so much
(14:07):
easier and makes us better,right?
Like you said, because theclients are you know similar and
you learn from it.
SPEAKER_02 (14:14):
100%.
How have you had to grow in inbeing a leader as your firm has
scaled?
SPEAKER_00 (14:22):
Um, well, in delegating is a big thing and
allowing others to makemistakes, that's very difficult.
Um, because you know, inhindsight, you're like, oh, I
wouldn't have done that, butwould I have made the mistake?
Maybe.
Um, I I don't like I don't likemistakes.
(14:42):
I don't like things that whenthey don't go the right way, and
having learning how to react umwith grace for the person who
made a mistake and with a way totake it as an opportunity to do
better and learn and not be justlashing out or really hard.
(15:07):
I um I used to be more like thatwhen I was younger just because
there was a lot.
I had so much writing on it.
I have three children, they wereyounger, married.
You know, you have a lot ofplates in the air, everything
going at the same time, andsomething didn't go right.
And then I was in court a lot,and that I don't really allow
for any of those kind ofmistakes in the legal work,
(15:28):
right?
And the other parts of thingsthere can be, but there are
things that didn't get done andor not the way that it should
have.
And I would have I did lash outa lot.
I was more very short, and um,I've learned to grow from that.
And it does help to hire othersbecause then I might have my
(15:48):
initial thoughts and then orwrite out like what I'm really
thinking, well, you don't sendany that to anyone, and then now
they're showing up.
Okay, well, now tell me and letme take it in.
It doesn't mean I won't, youknow, address the issue, which
that was that was a stupid thingto do, or I don't, I wouldn't
have done that, however, not ina now you're fired, or you know,
(16:11):
I hate you.
So use it, right?
It's not, and we're dealing withpeople.
Um, you know, we still aredealing with people.
I even the more the A and I AIgrows, I'm like, I would like to
have more AI.
Um and people, but you know,they are people and they're
using their best judgment withthe information they have.
And so I've really had to learnto just be better in dealing
(16:36):
with that because I don't want,I can't be here every single day
making every single decision.
So you've got to trust that,train them, trust them, and let
them make a mistake and hopethat they're gonna come tell you
so that we can do better insteadof being such an ogre that
nobody wants to tell you and thewhole place burns down.
(16:57):
So we don't want that.
SPEAKER_02 (16:59):
So yes, 100%.
I couldn't agree more.
As you've grown and and thoughtabout the future of your firm,
do you foresee um a day in whichyou're not practicing at all and
you're just the leader of thefirm?
Or how do you how do you thinkyou're gonna have to continue to
evolve as your firm grows?
SPEAKER_00 (17:15):
I think in that way, and really with the platform of
the women-winning divorce typevehicle, I think that's where
I'll go with that and createmore resources and more um for
women, even beyond divorce.
It's like right in that so thedivorce will be one thing that
(17:38):
we do, but overall it will bemore and become more of an
inspirer, motivator, leader, andyou know, provider of
information.
I think that's where I reallywant to go.
And I have I have so manyinterests as it just relates to
women and and in their aspectsof life, work, business,
(18:00):
marriage, and how thoseintersect.
And so I think there's there'sstill room for me to do a lot in
that space.
That's great.
SPEAKER_02 (18:06):
I love that you're thinking such a big picture, and
and you have the opportunity.
And the the better leader youcan become, the more time and
resources you'll have to gopursue those other interests.
SPEAKER_00 (18:18):
Yes.
And and also um as my children,I've got one in med school, one
in college, one still in highschool, but that frees me up to
go visit them and my nieces thatare both in college and do
things like that, that is veryimportant to me, you know, which
we all we all work hard, but wewant that freedom to be able to,
(18:41):
you know, go visit them and andhave their time.
So that's been really great forme uh as well.
SPEAKER_02 (18:48):
Love it.
Otherwise, I appreciate yourtime today.
As we're finishing up, I wantyou to think about, you know,
your experience.
And if if you were to um give apiece of advice to someone
starting their own firm totomorrow, right?
What do they need to thinkabout?
What can fast track them to besuccessful and grow this new
(19:09):
firm that they're starting?
SPEAKER_00 (19:11):
Um I I do believe very strongly in coaching, in
business coaching.
I would highly encourage you,even when you don't think you
have the money, uh, there havebeen to have someone who can
provide you with that roadmapand encouragement and
accountability uh is reallyinvaluable.
(19:33):
I I did that when I started mybusiness.
I'm very thankful for that.
Because be careful.
Well, I guess that's one, andthen really look at who you're
taking advice from.
Because do they really have theexpertise to advise you?
It may not be the other lawyersin your community unless they
(19:54):
have what you want, you know,unless they're doing something
that you think is great, becausea lot of them aren't.
So I would just be very carefulfrom whom you take advice from
as far as running a business.
Have they run a successfulbusiness?
And is it really successful andprofitable?
And, you know, I think that isthose are two things that will
(20:16):
allow you to get sound advicebecause you shouldn't do this
totally on your own, even thoughit says, you know, solo
practitioner, I'm opening abusiness.
Like really seek out good, solidcoaching and help and pay for it
because then you've got skin inthe game and it will be serious.
SPEAKER_02 (20:34):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (20:34):
And it will take you seriously, and I think you can
fast track your growth and umbuild what you really want to
suit your life.
So I think that would be thenumber one thing.
SPEAKER_02 (20:53):
Wish you all the best and look forward to talking
to you again soon.
SPEAKER_00 (20:56):
Thank you so much for having me.
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