February 10, 2026 • 21 mins
Keaton Frieberg runs Texas Suits PLLC—a six-attorney business and real estate litigation firm in San Antonio. He launched right out of law school, merged with another firm within a year, and has built a sustainable practice.
In this Sterling Family Law Show episode, he breaks down how he built a six-attorney firm starting at 25 with no book of business. Door-knocking property managers. Speaking at investor meetups. Turning those early relationships into a referral engine that still drives clients three years later.
If you're trying to figure out how to actually get clients without a big marketing budget, Keaton's playbook is worth studying.
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📄 CHAPTERS
0:00 - Law Firm Merger: How Keaton Combined Two Firms Into One
1:07 - Meet Keaton Frieberg: Texas Suits PLLC in San Antonio
2:02 - Starting a Law Firm at 25 Right Out of Law School
2:51 - Building a Law Firm Clientele During Covid With Evictions
3:25 - The Law Firm Merger That Accelerated Growth for Both Sides
4:10 - Law Firm Business Development: Door Knocking & Investor Meetups
5:08 - Referral Strategy: Speaking at Real Estate Investor Events
14:09 - Law Firm Equity Split: How They Divided Roles at the Table
14:31 - Visionary vs Integrator: Finding Partners Who Complement You
16:38 - Law Firm Partnership Agreement: Documenting Obligations in Detail
18:21 - Niching Down: Why Texas Suits Is Narrowing Its Focus
19:45 - The Sterling Lesson: Every Time We Niched Down, Growth Got Easie
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Episode Transcript
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SPEAKER_02 (00:00):
Have you ever thought about merging your law
(00:02):
firm with another law firm afteryou've gotten started?
Keaton did just that.
He runs a very successfulbusiness law firm in San Antonio
and has an awesome story totell.
Welcome back to the SterlingFamily Law Show.
I am your host, Tyler Dolph.
I'm also the CEO of ourhyper-focused law firm-only
(00:26):
consultancy called RocketClixthat was born out of our own
26th attorney law firm calledSterling Lawyers.
Today we continue our interviewseries.
We have Keaton, who is a lawfirm owner.
He does a business law as wellas litigation in San Antonio.
He's built his firm to over sixattorneys.
(00:47):
He has a great story.
He went from starting the firmon his own to growing a little
bit and then merging withanother firm and now has a
thriving business.
Keaton, thank you so much forjoining us today.
Really excited to have you onthe show.
Do me a favor, introduceyourself and your firm to our
audience.
SPEAKER_01 (01:07):
Absolutely, Tyler.
Thanks.
Happy to be here.
My name is Keaton Freeberg.
I'm a real estate and businessattorney here in uh San Antonio,
Texas.
My law firm is Texas Suits LawFirm.
And um yeah, we're we're locatedhere in San Antonio.
We practice a little bit inHouston and Dallas as well.
But yeah, that's us.
Love it.
Uh how about so practice areas,is it just business and real
(01:29):
estate?
It is, yep.
Um you know that you got theoccasional client that needs
help with something else, butfor the most part, our primary
practice area, uh, we're workingeither business litigation, real
estate litigation, and or on thetransactional side of both of
those.
So we'll help.
Um we'll help individuals buyreal estate, buy new businesses,
sell real estate, sellbusinesses, and then we litigate
(01:51):
over it if it goes wrong.
SPEAKER_02 (01:52):
Awesome.
And you mentioned you have sixattorneys, two paralegals.
That's correct.
SPEAKER_01 (01:57):
Yep.
SPEAKER_02 (01:58):
Awesome.
Uh, how'd you get started?
SPEAKER_01 (02:00):
Tell me about the origin story.
Yeah.
So I started right out of lawschool.
Um, right out of law school, Ium partnered up with two other
uh individuals who who passedthe bar with me, and we we
really niched out and workedonly with real estate investors.
So the age of 25 started uhFreebergmorton PLLC, and we we
(02:23):
worked with property managersand real estate investors doing
LLC formations, you know,helping convey title.
We worked um it was actuallyduring the right smack dab right
outside of COVID.
And so uh a lot of our investorswere experiencing cash flow
issues as a result of um a lotof tenants that weren't uh
(02:45):
weren't paying rent at the time.
And so we did a ton ofevictions, and and that's that's
how we got started.
And then about a year intostarting Freeburg and Morton, we
partnered with another firm herein San Antonio.
We merged our firms together.
Um, I think it acceleratedgrowth for both both firms.
(03:06):
Um the client base at the at thefirm that we joined with was a
little bit it's a little bitbigger.
And rather than doing a lot ofvolume, which is what we were
doing at the Freeberg andMorton, uh working on some
bigger cases together.
So we had a nice mixture of ofvolume and then and then big
cases that we could that wecould build into and whatnot.
And that's that's how we startedTexas Suits.
SPEAKER_02 (03:28):
That's awesome.
Take me back to the beginning.
So I'm just thinking about this.
You graduate law school, you'reyoung, hungry, and and now
you're dealing with you knowvery wealthy businessmen or real
estate developers.
How are you able to do thebusiness development side?
You know, I I imagine you'rejust a young kid, and please,
(03:49):
you know, please give me achance.
How was that?
SPEAKER_01 (03:51):
No, this is a great question.
Um, I I was really confident.
I I did evictions for years.
I did evictions uh allthroughout law school.
Uh here in Texas, it'sinteresting.
You can practice in a in awhat's called a Justice of the
Peace Court without beinglicensed.
So um I was I knew I was fairlyfamiliar with the court process.
I already knew a lot of the umbig property management
(04:14):
companies and big investors herein San Antonio and New Bromfels,
which is just north of SanAntonio.
And so um I and I'm always kindof of the opinion if you're
gonna start a business that youshould already kind of have a
clientele to work with.
So um I felt pretty comfortablejust right off the bat jumping
into the the clientele that Ialready knew.
Um, but other than that, youknow, we we door knocked, kind
(04:37):
of.
We went to big propertymanagement firms.
We said, hey, look, here's whatwe do.
Just so you know, here's ourhere's our here's the services
that we have that offer, um, andhere's how we can help you.
And believe it or not, a ton wegot a ton of business that way.
So one, just going to propertymanagers, talking with them,
letting them know how we canhelp them out.
And two, we went to what whatare called real estate investor
(04:58):
meetups.
So there's just big groups ofinvestors who are who come
together usually once, twice amonth to talk about real estate,
talk about things that are goinggood, things that are going bad,
what they need.
And so I would go and put onpresentations.
I talked to I spoke a lot on theseries limited liability
company, which is just a greatfor real estate, uh, real estate
investors and protecting theirassets.
(05:19):
So I I spoke at a lot of thoseevents, and I have clients, I
have so many clients that foryou know, so it's been three
years that are still clients tothis day that I picked up from
those real estate investormeetups, and then they just
branch off via word of mouth.
So primarily right now, thatfoundation that we built of
going to meetups and approachinguh big property management
(05:42):
companies directly has reallykept us kept us going pretty
strong for the last couple ofyears.
SPEAKER_02 (05:47):
Love it.
Yeah, it's uh that's a bigmoment, I think, in in every
entrepreneurial journey, right?
You go to law school and youwant to be an attorney, which is
amazing, but you also have tolearn how to sell.
You got to learn how to sellyourself, you have to be able to
get clients, and then you alsohave to learn how to build a
business.
In those early days, what wasthe most challenging part?
Was it the business side ofthings doing the entrepreneurial
(06:10):
thing, or was it the businessdevelopment side of things
having to go build therelationships and create cash
flow?
SPEAKER_01 (06:16):
Probably the latter, just because um, well, I I had
started a few companies beforeum starting Freeberg and Morton.
I started a moving company ayear before that while I was
waiting on bar results with afriend, and this moving company
is still doing great.
I'm not I'm not involved with itas much anymore.
But uh so that that side comes alittle bit more naturally.
Um but but when anytime youenter into a new market, you
(06:40):
know, figuring out how do Iaccept payment from from these
from these new clients, youknow, and do I want to do it
flat fee?
Do I want to do do I want tohave an ILTA account?
And do I want to manage thatIOTA account?
All of that stuff was obviouslynew to me and and uh was a
little I guess it was a littlebit of a learning curve.
SPEAKER_02 (07:00):
Any uh anything you would do differently today that
could help our our listeners inin their journey?
SPEAKER_01 (07:07):
Yeah.
Um I would I would go work for afirm for a year before I
branched off and and opened up.
I mean, it was a great, it was agreat experience.
Uh money was definitely tight inthe beginning.
I mean, the it when I look backon it, I just don't even know
how I how I survived off the offthe nominal cash flow that we
(07:27):
had.
But I would go work forsomebody.
I would build up a little bit ofa a little bit of a nest egg and
then just learn a little bitabout the way that a law firm
works and particularly thebusiness side of how a law firm
works and what you do and don'tlike.
I think that that would be uh ifI did it again, that's what I
would do.
Although, with the caveat,because I I I am a little
(07:49):
concerned that had I done had Igone that route, maybe I would
have I wouldn't have branchedoff.
I don't know.
And I'm very happy with thedecision to branch off.
So I don't know, speaking with agrain of salt.
SPEAKER_02 (08:01):
Yeah, it's a great point and probably a huge
discussion topic because youneed security, you know, right?
Like coming out of law school,um, and to take that leap
without the experience,knowledge, whatever.
Did you have a mentor oranything that early on that that
(08:21):
you could bounce ideas off of?
SPEAKER_01 (08:23):
You know, not necessarily.
I had I worked at a firmpreviously that did that uh
before I graduated law schoolthat handled evictions.
So we did.
Um, and that in and thatindividual was definitely a
mentor to me.
He taught me the power ofniching, which I think is the
most important thing thatlawyers probably can learn.
Um, and so he taught me that,and and he he did, I knew how
(08:48):
the business, uh at least howevictions worked and the
business side of evictions fromfrom him, and that was great.
After starting our own practice,I felt a little I should I
probably shouldn't have, but Ifelt a little uneasy about
reaching out and asking him foradvice when I started a firm
that kind of was in the samearea, you know.
I didn't know how he would feelabout it.
Turns out super cool, did wassuper happy to uh, you know,
(09:11):
what I was doing and and happyto help.
And I I didn't reach out at thatpoint in time, but I but I
probably should have.
So everything that we did waswatching YouTube videos,
watching other uh, you know,business gurus really for the
most part, um, to figure out howto run this business.
SPEAKER_02 (09:28):
So you had enough grit and like do whatever it
takes mindset to to just figureit out.
SPEAKER_01 (09:34):
Yeah, and you know, at the time being 25, I I didn't
really have a lot ofobligations, right?
Like I I had a I had a littlebit of rent that I had to pay, I
could eat whatever.
So I think at that point in mylife, I was totally okay with
taking a ton of risk because itdidn't, you know, I didn't Yeah,
(09:55):
exactly.
And so I was I was okay withtaking on the risk and and yeah,
just grinding through it.
SPEAKER_00 (10:01):
Hey family law firm leaders, my partner Tony Carls
just released his book where helays bare our precise blueprint
for growing sterling lawyersfrom zero to 17 million.
This is the blueprint that westill use daily, and Tony
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The truth is, this is not simpleto do.
(10:22):
Success requires and demandshard work.
But if you have the patience andthe work ethic to do it, your
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SPEAKER_02 (10:32):
So you told me that you ended up merging with
another firm.
Talk us through that story,right?
You you have gotten off yourfeed, you got some cash flow
coming in, you're building yourbusiness.
How did you go through thatexperience of meeting another
firm and then ultimatelydeciding to come together?
SPEAKER_01 (10:48):
Yeah, absolutely.
So I guess another way that Istarted to get business was I
would go to um networkingevents, or uh I think this one
was called uh like a BNI orsomething like that.
But basically you meet withother professionals in the area
and you you you give referralsto one another was the was the
point.
And so um I was in a I was in aBNI and um another uh attorney
(11:13):
uh Garrett was in another BNIand we had both asked to meet
other attorneys because I I Iwant to uh meet other attorneys,
so when referrals come in, I canI can give um I can provide my
clients or or other individualswith great resources.
And so um building your buildingyour this is a side note, but
building your connection of ofattorneys, I think is one of the
(11:35):
most important things in in thepractice of law.
But anyway, uh I asked forattorneys, he asked for
attorneys, and this lady waslike, hey, I have a friend who
wants to meet more attorneys,and I have another friend who
wants to meet more attorneys.
She linked us up and we startedstarted chatting, and we we
worked a couple cases togetherum just because uh it worked out
(11:56):
well.
And I um would actually go intothe office sometimes and and see
the staff and and and work withthe other attorney on these
cases, and um that firm was wascalled Shumway Van, and they
were actually they weremulti-state firm and they were
breaking up.
And so uh and this was at theabout the same time that that I
(12:16):
had met Garrett, and so I sawthat Chumway Van had a ton of
resources that we didn't haveright now, we didn't have
paralegals, um our back-end umCRM or client management
software wasn't phenomenal.
And um also Garrett has 10 yearsof of litigation and and
(12:36):
attorney experience, and so I Ithought that that would be
great.
And obviously he saw that wewere young and hungry, and um I
think the that's that's how thethat's how the combo formed.
And so when Shoumway Van wounddown, um we decided that we'd
work together for a littlewhile, just still separate
entities, but but kind oftogether.
And then eventually we decidedit just made sense to combine
(12:58):
resources and and ultimatelycreate Texas suits.
SPEAKER_02 (13:02):
Yeah, okay.
So now for our listeners who arein this uh maybe in this same
situation or thinking aboutworking with another firm, take
us into the weeds a little biton the logistics involved.
Like how did you actuallycombine what did it look like
from an equity or ownershipstandpoint?
You don't have to give us, youknow, intimate details, but
(13:23):
how'd you work through that?
SPEAKER_01 (13:24):
Yeah.
Um, well, we sat around a tableand we talked about value and um
what kind of value each partywas bringing to the table.
And we also uh we also discussedwhat long-term looks like.
So um, and I think that'sreally, really important
long-term and what an exit wouldlook like if for some reason
things didn't work out.
Because I will say that the thepartnership occurred kind of
(13:46):
pretty quick.
Um, and so I think it was veryimportant to make sure that
everyone, one, understands theirobligations to one another, and
two, that um, if for some reasonthings don't work out, that
there's an easy exit plan foreverybody, which you know comes
in the form of an operatingagreement, and it's what we it's
what we preach to our clientsevery single day.
So um we sat around a table andwe we discussed what everybody
(14:09):
was going to bring to the table,and that's how we were able to
figure out equity um and alsoroles within the company,
because obviously if everybody'sdoing the same thing, that's not
really beneficial.
And and what I what I learned inin our time working together
prior to joining the compmerging the companies, um, and
(14:31):
also on that round tablediscussion was that you really
want to make sure you have apartner that or partners that
complement your skill set.
Um and so I was looking forsomebody who was more granular,
who could actually develop thesesystems and processes and and
put them into place because Ihad I have a lot of great ideas,
(14:53):
but sometimes it's hard when youhave all these ideas to actually
facilitate them.
And so that is what um Garybrought to the table and what I
really loved, and what some ofmy other partners bring to the
table is that they are really,really granular and really
detail-oriented and can canbuild out some of these
processes that that ultimatelyum facilitate the the growth of
our company right now.
SPEAKER_02 (15:14):
Have you heard of the entrepreneurial operating
system?
I have not.
Okay.
It's a business system, might beworth looking into, but there's
the idea behind this.
Uh they call it a visionary andan integrator.
SPEAKER_01 (15:27):
Oh, I think yes, I I I've definitely heard I've
definitely read this in a booksomewhere.
SPEAKER_02 (15:33):
Yes, yeah.
So that's it's EOS.
Um, but what you're describingis right, you you have a very
visionary mindset.
I'm the very I'm the same way.
Um, lots of big ideas, want tomove fast, ready to go.
You're thinking about tomorrow,not necessarily here today.
But we need to surroundourselves as leaders with people
that can get this stuff done,that can build the process.
(15:53):
Otherwise, it's just chaos.
SPEAKER_01 (15:55):
You're 100% right.
Yep.
Yeah, it is, it can be chaos.
And and um, those otherindividuals that we surround
ourselves with also slow me downa little bit too, which is good,
which is good.
I need it.
Need some breaks.
Yes.
But yeah, that's that's um, didthat answer your question about
what it looked like, what itactually looked like to come
(16:17):
together?
Yeah, no, is that and actuallyput this in our operating
agreement.
When I when a new client comesto me and they say, Hey, look,
I'm I'm gonna work with or I'mgonna form a company with
so-and-so is friend, or this ishow I know them, it's
acquaintance, or whatever, andwe we're gonna design the
operating agreement that's gonnagovern the obligations, rights
of the individuals in thecompany.
(16:38):
I have a exhibit now that listsout everybody's obligations to
one another, and we try and gointo excruciating detail about
what everybody's gonna bring tothe table because I've found
that the there's a ton ofbusiness divorces happening
nowadays, and I think it'sbecause there's a a lot of
(16:59):
people jumped formed LLCs, itbecame easier to form LLCs or
form businesses, and so they didso with with friends or people
that they thought we're gonnawe're gonna work out together,
and two years down the road itdidn't work.
So I now list out everybody'sobligations to one another in in
as excruciating detail as wepossibly can, so that everybody
(17:20):
can look back on that andreference it and say, hey, look,
you told me that you were gonnado this, that, and the other.
And you know, if we go and lookat this data, it's gonna show us
that you're not, or maybe maybe,hey, look, I'm doing that.
I I said I was gonna do this,but now I'm having to take over
your roles too, or somethinglike that.
And I guess the main point thatI'm trying to get at is that
just make sure that everybodyunderstands what they're
(17:41):
bringing to the table.
SPEAKER_02 (17:44):
100% agree, right?
You got to create clearexpectations because you don't
want to have a moment wherethere's gray.
Well, I thought you were gonnado it.
Oh, I thought you were gonna doit, and then there's no clarity
there, and now all of a sudden,you know, you're at odds with
each other.
SPEAKER_01 (17:57):
Yeah, and I think that especially for law firms,
if you have partners, if there'sno if there's not clarity, your
staff suffers as a result of ofof the gray areas because then
they don't know what to do.
And then you can't facilitate,you know, a well-oiled machine
when there's when there's grayarea and and you and you have
staff that can't make decisionsbecause they don't they don't
know what to do, you know.
(18:18):
So I think it's kind of tricklesdown from the top.
SPEAKER_02 (18:21):
Yep, 100%.
Love it.
As we're kind of finishing uphere, can you tell me about the
future of Texas Suits?
What are you building towards?
What are you excited about as uhyou're continuing to build your
firm?
SPEAKER_01 (18:33):
Yeah, thanks for asking.
I that's it's uh your favoritetopic, right?
Yeah, it is.
It is.
Um, I'm actually working rightnow to go back a little bit to
our roots, which is kind ofinteresting.
So as I explained, we startedoff with with uh primarily
evictions and LLC forformations.
That's what I was doing, a lotof it came really, really good
(18:54):
at it.
I'm I'm uh I'm authoring the umTexas Business Organizations
Code, a section of it on theLLCs this year.
And so I'm super duper excited.
And it's all and I feel like I'mable to do that as a result of
niching down.
And so we niche down, weexpanded a little bit, and we
started working with with awider variety of clients.
(19:14):
And my goal right now is toactually retract and um
consolidate the amount of thetypes of claims and the types of
cases that we're handling rightnow.
So that's what I'm super duperexcited about.
And just just so you know, I'mI'm I work primarily with with
real estate investors, and soI'm reducing our scope of claims
(19:35):
to just fit what they reallyneed and just really focus on
making sure that we have aproduct that um satisfies them
and what they what they're goingthrough.
SPEAKER_02 (19:45):
If I've learned anything during our experience
building, Sterling, uh, westarted out having you know
multiple practice areas andtrying to be everything to
everyone.
And and the same is trueactually at the agency we run.
Um every time we niche down,every time we focus, and now at
Sterling, you know, we'reexclusively family law and at
Rocket Clicks, we exclusivelywork with law firms.
(20:07):
It becomes so much easier to besuccessful because you're you
have an aligned North Star andyou're refining the same process
for the same avatar.
So you're continually gettingbetter as opposed to going wide,
you're going deep.
Uh, and so I love thatnarrative, Keaton.
(20:27):
I think it's gonna only meangreat things for your firm as
you continue to grow and scale.
Totally applaud that.
Uh, really appreciate your timeand the journey you've been on.
I love hearing entrepreneurialstories.
You know, you started outtalking about how did I survive,
you know, taking all this riskand the cash flow issues and and
eating your peanut butter andjelly probably uh to where you
(20:51):
are today.
It's a true testament ofsuccess.
So really applaud that and lookforward to continuing watching
you grow.
Well, thanks a lot.
It's been great meeting you anda great learning more about what
y'all do.
Have you ever thought about merging your law
(00:02):
firm with another law firm afteryou've gotten started?
Keaton did just that.
He runs a very successfulbusiness law firm in San Antonio
and has an awesome story totell.
Welcome back to the SterlingFamily Law Show.
I am your host, Tyler Dolph.
I'm also the CEO of ourhyper-focused law firm-only
(00:26):
consultancy called RocketClixthat was born out of our own
26th attorney law firm calledSterling Lawyers.
Today we continue our interviewseries.
We have Keaton, who is a lawfirm owner.
He does a business law as wellas litigation in San Antonio.
He's built his firm to over sixattorneys.
(00:47):
He has a great story.
He went from starting the firmon his own to growing a little
bit and then merging withanother firm and now has a
thriving business.
Keaton, thank you so much forjoining us today.
Really excited to have you onthe show.
Do me a favor, introduceyourself and your firm to our
audience.
SPEAKER_01 (01:07):
Absolutely, Tyler.
Thanks.
Happy to be here.
My name is Keaton Freeberg.
I'm a real estate and businessattorney here in uh San Antonio,
Texas.
My law firm is Texas Suits LawFirm.
And um yeah, we're we're locatedhere in San Antonio.
We practice a little bit inHouston and Dallas as well.
But yeah, that's us.
Love it.
Uh how about so practice areas,is it just business and real
(01:29):
estate?
It is, yep.
Um you know that you got theoccasional client that needs
help with something else, butfor the most part, our primary
practice area, uh, we're workingeither business litigation, real
estate litigation, and or on thetransactional side of both of
those.
So we'll help.
Um we'll help individuals buyreal estate, buy new businesses,
sell real estate, sellbusinesses, and then we litigate
(01:51):
over it if it goes wrong.
SPEAKER_02 (01:52):
Awesome.
And you mentioned you have sixattorneys, two paralegals.
That's correct.
SPEAKER_01 (01:57):
Yep.
SPEAKER_02 (01:58):
Awesome.
Uh, how'd you get started?
SPEAKER_01 (02:00):
Tell me about the origin story.
Yeah.
So I started right out of lawschool.
Um, right out of law school, Ium partnered up with two other
uh individuals who who passedthe bar with me, and we we
really niched out and workedonly with real estate investors.
So the age of 25 started uhFreebergmorton PLLC, and we we
(02:23):
worked with property managersand real estate investors doing
LLC formations, you know,helping convey title.
We worked um it was actuallyduring the right smack dab right
outside of COVID.
And so uh a lot of our investorswere experiencing cash flow
issues as a result of um a lotof tenants that weren't uh
(02:45):
weren't paying rent at the time.
And so we did a ton ofevictions, and and that's that's
how we got started.
And then about a year intostarting Freeburg and Morton, we
partnered with another firm herein San Antonio.
We merged our firms together.
Um, I think it acceleratedgrowth for both both firms.
(03:06):
Um the client base at the at thefirm that we joined with was a
little bit it's a little bitbigger.
And rather than doing a lot ofvolume, which is what we were
doing at the Freeberg andMorton, uh working on some
bigger cases together.
So we had a nice mixture of ofvolume and then and then big
cases that we could that wecould build into and whatnot.
And that's that's how we startedTexas Suits.
SPEAKER_02 (03:28):
That's awesome.
Take me back to the beginning.
So I'm just thinking about this.
You graduate law school, you'reyoung, hungry, and and now
you're dealing with you knowvery wealthy businessmen or real
estate developers.
How are you able to do thebusiness development side?
You know, I I imagine you'rejust a young kid, and please,
(03:49):
you know, please give me achance.
How was that?
SPEAKER_01 (03:51):
No, this is a great question.
Um, I I was really confident.
I I did evictions for years.
I did evictions uh allthroughout law school.
Uh here in Texas, it'sinteresting.
You can practice in a in awhat's called a Justice of the
Peace Court without beinglicensed.
So um I was I knew I was fairlyfamiliar with the court process.
I already knew a lot of the umbig property management
(04:14):
companies and big investors herein San Antonio and New Bromfels,
which is just north of SanAntonio.
And so um I and I'm always kindof of the opinion if you're
gonna start a business that youshould already kind of have a
clientele to work with.
So um I felt pretty comfortablejust right off the bat jumping
into the the clientele that Ialready knew.
Um, but other than that, youknow, we we door knocked, kind
(04:37):
of.
We went to big propertymanagement firms.
We said, hey, look, here's whatwe do.
Just so you know, here's ourhere's our here's the services
that we have that offer, um, andhere's how we can help you.
And believe it or not, a ton wegot a ton of business that way.
So one, just going to propertymanagers, talking with them,
letting them know how we canhelp them out.
And two, we went to what whatare called real estate investor
(04:58):
meetups.
So there's just big groups ofinvestors who are who come
together usually once, twice amonth to talk about real estate,
talk about things that are goinggood, things that are going bad,
what they need.
And so I would go and put onpresentations.
I talked to I spoke a lot on theseries limited liability
company, which is just a greatfor real estate, uh, real estate
investors and protecting theirassets.
(05:19):
So I I spoke at a lot of thoseevents, and I have clients, I
have so many clients that foryou know, so it's been three
years that are still clients tothis day that I picked up from
those real estate investormeetups, and then they just
branch off via word of mouth.
So primarily right now, thatfoundation that we built of
going to meetups and approachinguh big property management
(05:42):
companies directly has reallykept us kept us going pretty
strong for the last couple ofyears.
SPEAKER_02 (05:47):
Love it.
Yeah, it's uh that's a bigmoment, I think, in in every
entrepreneurial journey, right?
You go to law school and youwant to be an attorney, which is
amazing, but you also have tolearn how to sell.
You got to learn how to sellyourself, you have to be able to
get clients, and then you alsohave to learn how to build a
business.
In those early days, what wasthe most challenging part?
Was it the business side ofthings doing the entrepreneurial
(06:10):
thing, or was it the businessdevelopment side of things
having to go build therelationships and create cash
flow?
SPEAKER_01 (06:16):
Probably the latter, just because um, well, I I had
started a few companies beforeum starting Freeberg and Morton.
I started a moving company ayear before that while I was
waiting on bar results with afriend, and this moving company
is still doing great.
I'm not I'm not involved with itas much anymore.
But uh so that that side comes alittle bit more naturally.
Um but but when anytime youenter into a new market, you
(06:40):
know, figuring out how do Iaccept payment from from these
from these new clients, youknow, and do I want to do it
flat fee?
Do I want to do do I want tohave an ILTA account?
And do I want to manage thatIOTA account?
All of that stuff was obviouslynew to me and and uh was a
little I guess it was a littlebit of a learning curve.
SPEAKER_02 (07:00):
Any uh anything you would do differently today that
could help our our listeners inin their journey?
SPEAKER_01 (07:07):
Yeah.
Um I would I would go work for afirm for a year before I
branched off and and opened up.
I mean, it was a great, it was agreat experience.
Uh money was definitely tight inthe beginning.
I mean, the it when I look backon it, I just don't even know
how I how I survived off the offthe nominal cash flow that we
(07:27):
had.
But I would go work forsomebody.
I would build up a little bit ofa a little bit of a nest egg and
then just learn a little bitabout the way that a law firm
works and particularly thebusiness side of how a law firm
works and what you do and don'tlike.
I think that that would be uh ifI did it again, that's what I
would do.
Although, with the caveat,because I I I am a little
(07:49):
concerned that had I done had Igone that route, maybe I would
have I wouldn't have branchedoff.
I don't know.
And I'm very happy with thedecision to branch off.
So I don't know, speaking with agrain of salt.
SPEAKER_02 (08:01):
Yeah, it's a great point and probably a huge
discussion topic because youneed security, you know, right?
Like coming out of law school,um, and to take that leap
without the experience,knowledge, whatever.
Did you have a mentor oranything that early on that that
(08:21):
you could bounce ideas off of?
SPEAKER_01 (08:23):
You know, not necessarily.
I had I worked at a firmpreviously that did that uh
before I graduated law schoolthat handled evictions.
So we did.
Um, and that in and thatindividual was definitely a
mentor to me.
He taught me the power ofniching, which I think is the
most important thing thatlawyers probably can learn.
Um, and so he taught me that,and and he he did, I knew how
(08:48):
the business, uh at least howevictions worked and the
business side of evictions fromfrom him, and that was great.
After starting our own practice,I felt a little I should I
probably shouldn't have, but Ifelt a little uneasy about
reaching out and asking him foradvice when I started a firm
that kind of was in the samearea, you know.
I didn't know how he would feelabout it.
Turns out super cool, did wassuper happy to uh, you know,
(09:11):
what I was doing and and happyto help.
And I I didn't reach out at thatpoint in time, but I but I
probably should have.
So everything that we did waswatching YouTube videos,
watching other uh, you know,business gurus really for the
most part, um, to figure out howto run this business.
SPEAKER_02 (09:28):
So you had enough grit and like do whatever it
takes mindset to to just figureit out.
SPEAKER_01 (09:34):
Yeah, and you know, at the time being 25, I I didn't
really have a lot ofobligations, right?
Like I I had a I had a littlebit of rent that I had to pay, I
could eat whatever.
So I think at that point in mylife, I was totally okay with
taking a ton of risk because itdidn't, you know, I didn't Yeah,
(09:55):
exactly.
And so I was I was okay withtaking on the risk and and yeah,
just grinding through it.
SPEAKER_00 (10:01):
Hey family law firm leaders, my partner Tony Carls
just released his book where helays bare our precise blueprint
for growing sterling lawyersfrom zero to 17 million.
This is the blueprint that westill use daily, and Tony
explains it in very simpleterms.
The truth is, this is not simpleto do.
(10:22):
Success requires and demandshard work.
But if you have the patience andthe work ethic to do it, your
family law firm will succeed.
SPEAKER_02 (10:32):
So you told me that you ended up merging with
another firm.
Talk us through that story,right?
You you have gotten off yourfeed, you got some cash flow
coming in, you're building yourbusiness.
How did you go through thatexperience of meeting another
firm and then ultimatelydeciding to come together?
SPEAKER_01 (10:48):
Yeah, absolutely.
So I guess another way that Istarted to get business was I
would go to um networkingevents, or uh I think this one
was called uh like a BNI orsomething like that.
But basically you meet withother professionals in the area
and you you you give referralsto one another was the was the
point.
And so um I was in a I was in aBNI and um another uh attorney
(11:13):
uh Garrett was in another BNIand we had both asked to meet
other attorneys because I I Iwant to uh meet other attorneys,
so when referrals come in, I canI can give um I can provide my
clients or or other individualswith great resources.
And so um building your buildingyour this is a side note, but
building your connection of ofattorneys, I think is one of the
(11:35):
most important things in in thepractice of law.
But anyway, uh I asked forattorneys, he asked for
attorneys, and this lady waslike, hey, I have a friend who
wants to meet more attorneys,and I have another friend who
wants to meet more attorneys.
She linked us up and we startedstarted chatting, and we we
worked a couple cases togetherum just because uh it worked out
(11:56):
well.
And I um would actually go intothe office sometimes and and see
the staff and and and work withthe other attorney on these
cases, and um that firm was wascalled Shumway Van, and they
were actually they weremulti-state firm and they were
breaking up.
And so uh and this was at theabout the same time that that I
(12:16):
had met Garrett, and so I sawthat Chumway Van had a ton of
resources that we didn't haveright now, we didn't have
paralegals, um our back-end umCRM or client management
software wasn't phenomenal.
And um also Garrett has 10 yearsof of litigation and and
(12:36):
attorney experience, and so I Ithought that that would be
great.
And obviously he saw that wewere young and hungry, and um I
think the that's that's how thethat's how the combo formed.
And so when Shoumway Van wounddown, um we decided that we'd
work together for a littlewhile, just still separate
entities, but but kind oftogether.
And then eventually we decidedit just made sense to combine
(12:58):
resources and and ultimatelycreate Texas suits.
SPEAKER_02 (13:02):
Yeah, okay.
So now for our listeners who arein this uh maybe in this same
situation or thinking aboutworking with another firm, take
us into the weeds a little biton the logistics involved.
Like how did you actuallycombine what did it look like
from an equity or ownershipstandpoint?
You don't have to give us, youknow, intimate details, but
(13:23):
how'd you work through that?
SPEAKER_01 (13:24):
Yeah.
Um, well, we sat around a tableand we talked about value and um
what kind of value each partywas bringing to the table.
And we also uh we also discussedwhat long-term looks like.
So um, and I think that'sreally, really important
long-term and what an exit wouldlook like if for some reason
things didn't work out.
Because I will say that the thepartnership occurred kind of
(13:46):
pretty quick.
Um, and so I think it was veryimportant to make sure that
everyone, one, understands theirobligations to one another, and
two, that um, if for some reasonthings don't work out, that
there's an easy exit plan foreverybody, which you know comes
in the form of an operatingagreement, and it's what we it's
what we preach to our clientsevery single day.
So um we sat around a table andwe we discussed what everybody
(14:09):
was going to bring to the table,and that's how we were able to
figure out equity um and alsoroles within the company,
because obviously if everybody'sdoing the same thing, that's not
really beneficial.
And and what I what I learned inin our time working together
prior to joining the compmerging the companies, um, and
(14:31):
also on that round tablediscussion was that you really
want to make sure you have apartner that or partners that
complement your skill set.
Um and so I was looking forsomebody who was more granular,
who could actually develop thesesystems and processes and and
put them into place because Ihad I have a lot of great ideas,
(14:53):
but sometimes it's hard when youhave all these ideas to actually
facilitate them.
And so that is what um Garybrought to the table and what I
really loved, and what some ofmy other partners bring to the
table is that they are really,really granular and really
detail-oriented and can canbuild out some of these
processes that that ultimatelyum facilitate the the growth of
our company right now.
SPEAKER_02 (15:14):
Have you heard of the entrepreneurial operating
system?
I have not.
Okay.
It's a business system, might beworth looking into, but there's
the idea behind this.
Uh they call it a visionary andan integrator.
SPEAKER_01 (15:27):
Oh, I think yes, I I I've definitely heard I've
definitely read this in a booksomewhere.
SPEAKER_02 (15:33):
Yes, yeah.
So that's it's EOS.
Um, but what you're describingis right, you you have a very
visionary mindset.
I'm the very I'm the same way.
Um, lots of big ideas, want tomove fast, ready to go.
You're thinking about tomorrow,not necessarily here today.
But we need to surroundourselves as leaders with people
that can get this stuff done,that can build the process.
(15:53):
Otherwise, it's just chaos.
SPEAKER_01 (15:55):
You're 100% right.
Yep.
Yeah, it is, it can be chaos.
And and um, those otherindividuals that we surround
ourselves with also slow me downa little bit too, which is good,
which is good.
I need it.
Need some breaks.
Yes.
But yeah, that's that's um, didthat answer your question about
what it looked like, what itactually looked like to come
(16:17):
together?
Yeah, no, is that and actuallyput this in our operating
agreement.
When I when a new client comesto me and they say, Hey, look,
I'm I'm gonna work with or I'mgonna form a company with
so-and-so is friend, or this ishow I know them, it's
acquaintance, or whatever, andwe we're gonna design the
operating agreement that's gonnagovern the obligations, rights
of the individuals in thecompany.
(16:38):
I have a exhibit now that listsout everybody's obligations to
one another, and we try and gointo excruciating detail about
what everybody's gonna bring tothe table because I've found
that the there's a ton ofbusiness divorces happening
nowadays, and I think it'sbecause there's a a lot of
(16:59):
people jumped formed LLCs, itbecame easier to form LLCs or
form businesses, and so they didso with with friends or people
that they thought we're gonnawe're gonna work out together,
and two years down the road itdidn't work.
So I now list out everybody'sobligations to one another in in
as excruciating detail as wepossibly can, so that everybody
(17:20):
can look back on that andreference it and say, hey, look,
you told me that you were gonnado this, that, and the other.
And you know, if we go and lookat this data, it's gonna show us
that you're not, or maybe maybe,hey, look, I'm doing that.
I I said I was gonna do this,but now I'm having to take over
your roles too, or somethinglike that.
And I guess the main point thatI'm trying to get at is that
just make sure that everybodyunderstands what they're
(17:41):
bringing to the table.
SPEAKER_02 (17:44):
100% agree, right?
You got to create clearexpectations because you don't
want to have a moment wherethere's gray.
Well, I thought you were gonnado it.
Oh, I thought you were gonna doit, and then there's no clarity
there, and now all of a sudden,you know, you're at odds with
each other.
SPEAKER_01 (17:57):
Yeah, and I think that especially for law firms,
if you have partners, if there'sno if there's not clarity, your
staff suffers as a result of ofof the gray areas because then
they don't know what to do.
And then you can't facilitate,you know, a well-oiled machine
when there's when there's grayarea and and you and you have
staff that can't make decisionsbecause they don't they don't
know what to do, you know.
(18:18):
So I think it's kind of tricklesdown from the top.
SPEAKER_02 (18:21):
Yep, 100%.
Love it.
As we're kind of finishing uphere, can you tell me about the
future of Texas Suits?
What are you building towards?
What are you excited about as uhyou're continuing to build your
firm?
SPEAKER_01 (18:33):
Yeah, thanks for asking.
I that's it's uh your favoritetopic, right?
Yeah, it is.
It is.
Um, I'm actually working rightnow to go back a little bit to
our roots, which is kind ofinteresting.
So as I explained, we startedoff with with uh primarily
evictions and LLC forformations.
That's what I was doing, a lotof it came really, really good
(18:54):
at it.
I'm I'm uh I'm authoring the umTexas Business Organizations
Code, a section of it on theLLCs this year.
And so I'm super duper excited.
And it's all and I feel like I'mable to do that as a result of
niching down.
And so we niche down, weexpanded a little bit, and we
started working with with awider variety of clients.
(19:14):
And my goal right now is toactually retract and um
consolidate the amount of thetypes of claims and the types of
cases that we're handling rightnow.
So that's what I'm super duperexcited about.
And just just so you know, I'mI'm I work primarily with with
real estate investors, and soI'm reducing our scope of claims
(19:35):
to just fit what they reallyneed and just really focus on
making sure that we have aproduct that um satisfies them
and what they what they're goingthrough.
SPEAKER_02 (19:45):
If I've learned anything during our experience
building, Sterling, uh, westarted out having you know
multiple practice areas andtrying to be everything to
everyone.
And and the same is trueactually at the agency we run.
Um every time we niche down,every time we focus, and now at
Sterling, you know, we'reexclusively family law and at
Rocket Clicks, we exclusivelywork with law firms.
(20:07):
It becomes so much easier to besuccessful because you're you
have an aligned North Star andyou're refining the same process
for the same avatar.
So you're continually gettingbetter as opposed to going wide,
you're going deep.
Uh, and so I love thatnarrative, Keaton.
(20:27):
I think it's gonna only meangreat things for your firm as
you continue to grow and scale.
Totally applaud that.
Uh, really appreciate your timeand the journey you've been on.
I love hearing entrepreneurialstories.
You know, you started outtalking about how did I survive,
you know, taking all this riskand the cash flow issues and and
eating your peanut butter andjelly probably uh to where you
(20:51):
are today.
It's a true testament ofsuccess.
So really applaud that and lookforward to continuing watching
you grow.
Well, thanks a lot.
It's been great meeting you anda great learning more about what
y'all do.
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