December 19, 2025 • 41 mins
Kathy McCabe, is the host of PBS’s Dream of Italy and editor in chief of Dream of Italy Magazine.
She is one of America’s leading voices on Italian culture and travel, and she’s the perfect guest to explore why Italy is poised to be one of the hottest destinations of 2026, with the Milano Cortina Winter Olympics shining a global spotlight on the country’s most beautiful regions.
The 2026 Games will be the most geographically spread-out Winter Olympics in history, spanning Northern Italy’s most captivating towns, from Milan’s design capital to the alpine charm of Cortina d’Ampezzo. With her signature warmth, humor, and insider perspective, Kathy can transport your listeners through these Olympic destinations while uncovering deeper stories about how travel through Italy can change your life.
Culture, Food, Destinations, Life, Enjoyment, Fulfillment.
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Episode Transcript
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SPEAKER_01 (00:00):
Welcome to the Travel Addict Podcast.
(00:02):
Your host and fellow traveladdict, Malcolm Teesdale, is
here to take you into the heartof the world's most fascinating
destinations.
He talks with passionateglobetrotters and fearless
explorers who share their wildjourneys and cultural insights
from around the world.
Or sometimes he just chats byhimself, describing enriching
travel experiences.
(00:22):
So buckle up and let's hit theroad.
Because the world is calling andwe're answering.
SPEAKER_02 (00:27):
Hello, everybody.
Malcolm Testel here, the traveladdict.
You're all doing well out there.
And when Kathy wrote to me,Kathy McCabe, who is just
waiting here to chat, she's anexpert on Italy.
And I thought, you know, it'sabout time everyone out there,
including myself, learned a bita bit more about this wonderful
(00:48):
country.
So, Kathy, glad you're here.
Can you hear me?
So am I.
SPEAKER_00 (00:53):
So am I.
Happy to be here.
SPEAKER_02 (00:56):
Oh, wonderful.
SPEAKER_00 (00:57):
I'm kind of addicted myself, not only to travel, but
mostly to Italy.
SPEAKER_02 (01:02):
Okay, well, we've got a lot to learn from you
today about Italy, and uh, I'vegot a few questions for you as
well.
So when was the last time youwere in Italy, by the way?
SPEAKER_00 (01:15):
Five weeks ago.
SPEAKER_02 (01:16):
Five weeks ago?
SPEAKER_00 (01:18):
Yes, yes.
SPEAKER_02 (01:19):
Are you missing it?
SPEAKER_00 (01:21):
Absolutely.
I miss the food the most becauseyou can tell that there aren't
as many chemicals in the food.
It just feels fresher.
I honestly feel better in Italyversus the United States.
So it's it's not just like mysoul, it's my body that misses
it too.
SPEAKER_02 (01:40):
You know, I I when you say the food, I'm one of
these people that grew up.
I never liked spaghetti.
And I don't know why.
I because probably my motherused to feed it to me.
No, I don't like that.
But I've changed over the years,you know.
I do have pasta occasionallynow, so it's all good.
But um, all right, so you've umyou've got uh website called
(02:04):
Dream of Italy.
We'll look at that, and yourfront page is something of
significance, obviously.
But you know all about Italy,and you go there.
How many times a year do you gothere, by the way?
SPEAKER_00 (02:15):
Just uh I mean I go like two or three times, but I
go for months at a time.
So I would say I spend like 40%of the year there.
Um, I might increase that, Imight end up moving, which is
which is the great dream of alot of people.
So I go for long chunks.
I film, I host a TV series, andsometimes we're filming, and
(02:37):
that can take weeks at a time.
Or I also uh edit and publish amagazine, and so I'm traveling
around uh covering things forthe magazine, so I'm never
bored.
SPEAKER_02 (02:48):
Well, well, well, you've got that magazine called
Dream of Italy, right?
Yes.
Yeah, it's the same as yourwebsite, Dream of Italy.
And yes.
But a lot of people love it.
I know a lot of people go there.
It's one of the favorite placesin Europe to visit.
Obviously, I Paris is one ofthem, and going to Italy because
there's such a lot to see there.
But um it's is Italy, in youropinion, becoming more popular
(03:12):
now, like in 2026.
SPEAKER_00 (03:14):
How do you see it is actually it is like you think it
can't become more popular, butthe numbers are going up and up
and up.
And I actually was just doing aninterview with the head of the
Italian tourism board,Alessandra Priante, and we were
talking about how there's likeno off season anymore.
(03:36):
People are going all year.
You know, people are going inNovember, December, January,
February.
It's actually delightful to goin the winter.
I think it's the summers can behot and crowded.
So, yes, it is insanely popular.
SPEAKER_02 (03:50):
What about what's it like there in like January?
Is it just is it cool or is itjust perfect?
SPEAKER_00 (03:57):
It is cool, but I did one a few years ago years
ago before COVID.
I went to uh I wanted to work onmy language skills, which are
always in need.
And I went to Florence to takelanguage lessons in January.
And I have to tell you, the wetI I was very lucky.
It was sunny most days.
It was um, I don't know, maybe65, 60.
(04:19):
It was lovely.
Of course, you can hit it whereit's rainy and cloudy, but
especially something likeFlorence, which has become
really crowded, January isalmost the best month to go
because it's the least, youknow, the le the least amount of
tourists.
SPEAKER_02 (04:34):
Yeah, which is always the best way.
But based on what's happeningglobally, warmth, even where I
live now, it's been horribly hotin the summer.
What's it like in the middle oflike July, August time there in
uh especially it's like thesouthern part of the country?
SPEAKER_00 (04:49):
It's hot, it's hot, and then you have that humidity.
I live when I'm not in Italy, Ilive in Denver, although I'm
from the East Coast, and it'snice and dry.
Although it gets extremely hothere, it's just a different
heat.
But in Italy, it's that humidityand it's hot, and trying to see
the cities and tour around thecities and like the ancient
(05:10):
sites, I think is a little bittrying.
But if you're by the seaside, Imean, Italy was made for seaside
vacations.
It's delightful.
So I think you have to paceyourself if you go in the
summer.
You can't try to do too much,and I think you have to build in
like the afternoon rest, theafternoon at the pool.
(05:31):
Um, really following, you know,doing things in the morning and
the evening because it's so hot.
Like if you're gonna go see theRoman Forum, do it first thing
in the morning.
So there are ways to tocounteract that, but everywhere
is getting hotter.
And it's interesting, there's atrend in travel.
I think it has a name which Ican't remember right now, but
(05:52):
people are going, say theDolomite Mountains, like people
are going to the Mountains inthe summer versus you know,
other places in Italy because itwill be more bearable.
SPEAKER_02 (06:01):
Yeah.
Interesting.
Um now when you go there toItaly, where'd you where do you
normally where's your base?
Where do you normally stay?
SPEAKER_00 (06:12):
I don't really have a base, I don't have an
apartment.
Um, we film in all differentplaces for the show, and I cover
lots of different places for themagazine.
I have a lot of friends in andaround Cortona, Tuscany.
And so I do go to Tuscany a lot.
If I if I if I had to say I hada base, and I also love there's
(06:33):
a part of Tuscany about twohours from there called Satoria.
These are places I go fairlyregularly.
If I had to say I had a base, itmight be Tuscany.
SPEAKER_02 (06:43):
Okay.
Yeah, um, I just wondered thatbecause um, you know, when when
people go to Italy, they alwaysthink of, well, Rome and Venice,
right?
So Rome obviously is steeped inhistory there, but I I'm gonna
be honest with you, Kathy.
Um, I think it was aboutprobably nine, ten years ago.
(07:04):
Um, I went to Venice.
SPEAKER_00 (07:07):
What did you think?
SPEAKER_02 (07:09):
I didn't like it.
SPEAKER_00 (07:10):
Really, why?
SPEAKER_02 (07:11):
I do you know why?
Too many people.
SPEAKER_00 (07:15):
But but okay, so you gotta go.
I agree, but I've been to Venicein the winter, and yeah, again,
there were a number of people,but I think Venice is one of the
most beautiful places on earth,and I think it's one of those
places like you have to see, youhave to give it a try.
SPEAKER_02 (07:33):
Yes, exactly.
SPEAKER_00 (07:34):
But please go, that's the place to go in
January.
It sounds crazy.
The light, the winter light isexquisite.
You know, that's a tough placeto go in July.
It's gonna be you and your fivemillion other best friends.
It's tough.
SPEAKER_02 (07:48):
Yeah, I know.
And now that's I I can'tremember the exact time of year
I went there.
But basically, well, I say I didthe big three.
I went to Venice first, it wasovercrowded, and restaurants in
the evening, the the tables wereso close to the restaurants.
Um, but then I went to Rome,which I've been to before, and
uh I stayed in a hotel, waswithin walking distance of
(08:11):
everything, which was great.
But you know, out of the bigthree, I like Florence the best.
SPEAKER_00 (08:17):
You know, mine even changes.
Uh Florence is exquisite, it'sjust um, you know, it is a
favorite uh out of the three.
It's hard, it's like pickingchildren, they're very different
personalities.
But Florence is very manageableand again can be dicey in the
summer.
The thing with the Florence isthose streets were small, you
(08:38):
know, they're small for areason.
They don't allow buses, but evenum, you know, lots of people.
Uh so I I I don't mean to speaknegatively, but I think people
have to become more strategicabout their trips to Italy and
their these popular places.
SPEAKER_02 (08:56):
Hmm.
I well, I'm trying to think ofthe hotel I stayed in now.
It was on the river close to thebridge, you know, the famous
bridge there.
SPEAKER_00 (09:04):
There's one that was in a room with a view.
There's a bunch of them.
SPEAKER_02 (09:07):
Well, this this this hotel was famous for the the uh
movie A Room with a View.
SPEAKER_00 (09:12):
That I knew exactly the hotel.
I could look it up, but it's Ihave walked by.
There's a great I I have a dearfriend in Florence, and our
tradition is to go to a rooftopbar.
Every time we see each other,we've probably been to 15 or 20.
The last time I was in Florence,we went to the rooftop bar of
that hotel.
I'm gonna look up the namebecause it's going to bother me.
(09:34):
Um, that's a nice, that's agood, great, the you can't beat
that location.
SPEAKER_02 (09:39):
Oh, it's great.
SPEAKER_00 (09:41):
It's right on the Ponte Vecchio.
SPEAKER_02 (09:43):
Yes, that's right.
SPEAKER_00 (09:45):
Um, I'm gonna find the name of the hotel because
it's a good one.
Should have come prepared forthis, but no, no, we're gonna
find it.
Good rooftop bar.
Uh we always have a Negroni.
A Negroni that's our uh it'scalled the Hotel de Orafi.
Oh Right.
SPEAKER_02 (10:05):
Yeah, there you go.
Yeah, nice hotel.
SPEAKER_00 (10:08):
Yeah, it's a good spot for people.
Yeah, good choice.
SPEAKER_02 (10:13):
Yeah, and it's a good, good, good place to stay
and just walk around, enjoy thecity, and uh so uh really
enjoyed it there and the foodand everything.
So anyway, um, so uh those thoseare three main places.
We mentioned Tuscany, of course,and there's also places in the
south.
There's a ton of places to goto.
Um, and you know, when you gothere, it depends what time of
(10:33):
year.
If you advise, if you speak tosomeone say, I want to go to
Italy, and what would be thefirst thing you would say to
them?
What where do you want to go to?
Or don't just go to one place?
Well, how would you preparesomething?
SPEAKER_00 (10:47):
Don't try to do, don't try to do too much.
You know, people.
I have a rule, I think it shouldeven be longer that you should
stay at least two nights, threedays in a place.
Like there's a lot of hit andrun tourism, right?
And then people forget, like ifyou're going between the cities,
it takes like a half a day, youknow.
By the time you go to the trainstation, get on the train, get
to where you're going.
(11:08):
People aren't accounting fortravel time.
So I think they think, yes, youcan get a really like a buffet
of good thing, you know, goodthings with a trip to Italy.
You're never going to be able tosee everything.
And I think people need to, Ialways say leave time for
serendipity, but like really cutback, you know, try to leave
(11:29):
some time for some unexpectedthings and also try to, you
know, spend an extra day in Romeor an extra day in Venice or
Florence or Tuscany.
It it can be it can be toorushed.
And I say that and I rush aroundtoo, but then I stay in some
places for a while also.
SPEAKER_02 (11:46):
Okay, got it.
Yeah.
Um have you been to Naples andum yes, yeah, Naples and um got
it.
SPEAKER_00 (11:54):
It's well worth the visit.
Milan, yeah, the Olympics arecoming up, and I'm going back um
to it's it's in Milan andCortina and all of northern
Italy.
Naples, I mean, if I had tochoose between the two cities,
my family's from the countrysideoutside Naples, but Campania,
the food, I mean, it's the best.
(12:14):
Ah, you can't even say it's thebest, but I mean it's because
then I'm like, oh wait, EmiliaRomagna.
But some of the best food, yousee Mount Vesuvius, um, the
pizza, the sfoliatelle, thecoffee, um, you know, the
history, the um Pompeii, um,Herculaneum.
(12:36):
I mean, there's a lot.
So southern Italy has my heart.
SPEAKER_02 (12:41):
Really?
I just wonder because you're inthat neck of the woods when you
go there, you actually like getum a plane and hop off to
another country somewhere or goacross the Mediterranean
anywhere, or just stay in Italy.
SPEAKER_00 (12:55):
Well, you know, what's interesting is I also
film another TV show calledDream of Europe.
And we decided, just because Iwas curious about it myself, to
do an episode in Malta.
Oh, Malta, you know, well, uhwas ruled by the British, and
it's fascinating.
It's not far from Italy.
It's great for a couple of days,and it's it's there are some
(13:17):
similarities, but it's reallytotally different.
SPEAKER_02 (13:20):
Yeah, funny because I was in Valletta um earlier on
this year.
I liked it.
Um I was on a cruise shippassing by, so I only got to
spend the day there, but wedocked there and I walked up um
into because it's it'ssurrounded by a wall there, but
walked around the uh the citycenter, and it's just lovely.
I have a couple of pubs there,and nice restaurants and coffee
(13:42):
places.
And I thought this is really anice place.
SPEAKER_00 (13:45):
There's a lot of layers to it.
It actually has all theseancient temples and ruins.
Um, but then you have thebridge, everyone was sort of
passed through.
So there's there's a Caravaggioin the um cathedral in Valletta,
which is interesting.
Um, the food, it's it'sfascinating.
And I think it's I wouldn't say,okay, like fly, you know, I you
(14:07):
don't, it's hard if you'rechoosing, but to add on to a
trip, it's really easy to do atrip to the street.
SPEAKER_02 (14:13):
Yeah, especially if it's in the neighborhood.
Yeah, that's that's what I likedoing a lot there.
Um, because you might as well,while you're there, just add a
few extra days and just stopsomewhere on the way back.
How do you actually from whereyou are, Denver, how do you
actually fly there?
SPEAKER_00 (14:28):
Well, what's interesting is we we filmed two
episodes in London, so we flewLondon to Malta on air Malta.
SPEAKER_02 (14:35):
Oh, okay, Malta.
SPEAKER_00 (14:38):
You want to hear the craziest story?
We went to the wrong airport inLondon, but we didn't know it.
We're standing, we're havingcoffee, we're and this is my
crew.
We have our deer.
And we go to check in.
I can't remember if we were atGatwick, you know.
(14:58):
I can't remember if we were atGatwick, we're supposed to be at
Heathrow.
I must have turned white becauseI also run the whole show, and
the and the um, you know, itwasn't specifically my fault nor
not my fault, but you know, themissing that flight, we got two
black cabs.
You wouldn't believe how muchstuff you can put in the black
cab.
And we were like, get us to theairport.
(15:19):
But luckily, my my sound guyJeff, he's like we call him no
no, like grandpa.
He's not that old.
But he was like, we need to beat the airport four hours early.
So luckily we were there soearly we made the other flight.
SPEAKER_02 (15:32):
So what where was your real flight going from
Heathrow?
SPEAKER_00 (15:36):
I think it was going from Heathrow, and we got
dropped off.
SPEAKER_02 (15:39):
So you went to Yatwick instead.
SPEAKER_00 (15:41):
And nobody, I mean, I'm traveling with eight people,
like we have a director, we haveuh, you know, the fixer, I
think, might have been the onewho sent us to the wrong area.
You know, we're all we were allguilty.
We just I don't think anyonelooked at the sign.
Uh and you hear, you know, youthink this will never happen to
you, but it happens.
SPEAKER_02 (16:01):
Of all places though, in London, because
London has four in class fiveairports because obviously
Gatwick, Heathrow, Stansted,London City Airport, and you can
count in Luton as well, which isjust north.
So it can get really confusing.
Anyway, you're not the firstperson to make that.
SPEAKER_00 (16:19):
Well, we were lucky because there's probably one
flight a day to Malta, and thenyou know, we're filming the next
day.
We're not so thank God it allworked out.
SPEAKER_02 (16:28):
You survived, you made it.
Yeah, I did.
It's all part of it, you know.
SPEAKER_00 (16:33):
Oh, I love it, it's fun.
SPEAKER_02 (16:35):
Oh hey, a part of your your profile, you mentioned
the Olympics, right?
Yes, what about the Olympics?
SPEAKER_00 (16:41):
So the winter games, and I went, so I love the winter
Olympics because 20 years ago Iwent to the Torino Olympics in
Torino, Italy in 2006, and I hadthe time of my life, and it was
one of my like top 10experiences.
There's something about anOlympics, and so Italy is
hosting them again, and they'rekind of sharing them between
(17:05):
Milan and Cortina, which is upin the Dolomite Mountains.
So it'll be for several weeks inFebruary, and then the
Paralympics in March, and you'regonna see all kinds of alpine
destinations.
Milan is gonna have, I'm goingto like figure skating and ice
hockey, some of those big indoorrink type things, yeah, and the
opening ceremonies.
(17:27):
And it's just, I mean, it's hardto be.
I like the winter Olympics,there's just something more
intimate about them.
SPEAKER_02 (17:34):
Yeah, well, pretty because I was just watching um a
famous sports team on TV uhyesterday from Italy, into Milan
soccer team.
SPEAKER_00 (17:43):
Oh, yeah.
And they take their uh they takethe football soccer very, very
seriously.
SPEAKER_02 (17:49):
Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (17:50):
As the Brits do too, you know.
SPEAKER_02 (17:53):
Oh, I absolutely absolutely and I remember those
days back when I was going,there's a famous player called
Luigi Riva.
Probably don't remember him.
You do?
SPEAKER_00 (18:02):
No, I don't because I wasn't probably that into uh
sports.
SPEAKER_02 (18:07):
Yeah, uh, but they haven't qualified for the World
Cup yet uh in North America, butI think they will, it's just a
matter of matter of time, andbut you say you could you're
spending what a third of theyear in Italy?
SPEAKER_00 (18:19):
Something like that, yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (18:22):
So but I think from what you're saying, you could
move towards spending a littlelonger there.
SPEAKER_00 (18:28):
I could.
So without a visa, I could spendAmericans or I guess foreigners.
I don't know, some countriesneed visas.
Uh Americans can spend 90 out ofevery 180 days.
It's rolling.
So basically six months, but notsix months straight.
Um, and there's a number ofpeople who buy a home in Italy
and they go for three months,come back for three months, go
(18:50):
for three months, and then um,so that's one option, or moving
there is another option.
Um, I think I will at some pointbecause I love it so much and I
have so much um work there.
But I also very much appreciatethe efficiency of America, you
know, the uh, you know, I verymuch understand Italy, both the
(19:14):
pros and the cons.
And having both is a really nicemix.
SPEAKER_02 (19:19):
Yeah, it is, but I know it's a fair way to go
because you have to, it's a fewhours travel, but you know,
there'll come a time, I'm sure,uh, that to you have to really
think, Kathy, about where do youultimately want to live and
retire at, right?
SPEAKER_00 (19:34):
And it might be Italy, and I'll tell you why.
It's much cheaper.
Yep.
Uh, you know, health insurancein America is insane.
Yeah.
Um, I've just experienced thatmyself.
You know, I had great care.
I had a little surgery recently,but Italy has great care too.
Um, there's just a it's a verybeautiful place.
(19:55):
Um, but you have to have acommunity um when you're there.
But you know, I know many peoplelive there and really love it.
So, you know, probably with myheart, I'm leaning towards
Italy.
I'm just not sure exactly where.
SPEAKER_02 (20:08):
You have to see how it goes.
I know uh more Americans now umthan ever before are traveling,
and quite a few are moving over.
They are.
And there's again the reasonsfor that, but I think you know
what they are.
But you know, it's uh they'rechoosing to move elsewhere, but
you just find with thesecountries as expat communities.
SPEAKER_00 (20:27):
Yes, and I know, and in fact, in fact, I say I go to
Cortona, there's a lot ofAmericans there um that have
their own, you know, they'rethey they they intermingle the
Italians but have a bigcommunity.
Um, and so definitely you're notyou're not gonna notch the
Americans.
SPEAKER_02 (20:44):
Yeah, I I think some countries now are saying, well,
say if you wanted to buy a housethere, buy some property, you're
investing so much money in theplace, you could qualify to
become a resident.
SPEAKER_00 (20:57):
Is that yeah, you know, Italy doesn't really do
that.
If they do, it's like a biggerinvestment visa.
But some of these countries,it's I think Portugal is doing
it.
Um, Greece, apparently, I wasjust reading, has really good
incentives for again, you buy ahouse and you can get residency.
Yeah in Italy, uh, just to beclear if anyone's interested,
(21:18):
buying a house does not give youresidency.
You would have to get your ownvisa or citizenship to go.
And it's not, I mean, it's hardbecause of the paperwork, but
there are possibilities.
SPEAKER_02 (21:31):
Yeah, I think every country has their own thing, but
um um some countries they theywant people to come and live
there, boost the economy, helpthe economy a little bit, and
they've got these incentives toto do so.
SPEAKER_00 (21:43):
So I I understand why people and there are um in
Italy, there's 7% zones.
If you go like sort of on theirelective residency visa, um, I
think most towns in the south,under 20,000 people, you get a
7% flat tax for 10 years.
Um And so there are incentivesin Italy.
Most of them are southern Italyor smaller towns.
SPEAKER_02 (22:06):
Yeah.
Well, there you go.
So yep, think but you're gonnabe thinking about it, I'm sure.
Probably the more you go.
You keep hey, you're going backeach year.
SPEAKER_00 (22:14):
So I do.
I do.
I do.
I do think about it all thetime.
SPEAKER_02 (22:20):
Okay, what's your favorite Italian food?
SPEAKER_00 (22:22):
Tortellini.
SPEAKER_02 (22:24):
Is it?
SPEAKER_00 (22:25):
I love tortellini.
I just love it.
I've loved it since I was a kid.
And I've been lucky enough.
I made it in Bologna.
I also made it in Modena.
These are the two towns thatfight over where it was
invented.
Uh it's a it's incredible.
And then for Christmas, a lot ofItalians have tortellini and
brodo in the in a soup, broths.
(22:46):
And uh that's a nice dish too.
SPEAKER_02 (22:48):
Yeah.
Oh boy.
Yeah, well, I I mean, uh yeah,it's it can get a bit more.
I used my the first Italian foodI like was lasagna.
unknown (22:57):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (22:57):
Oh, it's good too.
SPEAKER_02 (22:58):
Yeah, and uh so I got to like that.
Um, but I need to probably gothere a bit more myself.
I'm probably overdue for anothervisit there.
Because I I'm from Bridge fromEngland, so I usually I'm over
the across there, like at leastonce a year in Europe, anyway,
for one thing and another.
Um my sister's infer family arestill there in England, so it's
(23:21):
not far to try from Britain downto Italy somewhere, so
relatively short flight, youknow.
SPEAKER_00 (23:28):
Oh, and cheap flights, cheap, cheap flights.
SPEAKER_02 (23:30):
Oh, with a lot of competition, yeah.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (23:32):
Oh, yeah.
So it really opens it up.
And for people who want to dolike go to London for a week and
then tack on, you know, Rome,Florence, Venice, it's it's it's
uh it's definitely possible.
SPEAKER_02 (23:44):
Yeah, it it is.
So obviously, uh it peopleshould see that.
And I think Americans probablythink if they were going over to
uh Europe, Italy must be sort ofin the top three of the list, I
would think, right?
SPEAKER_00 (23:57):
I think it might even be number one.
It's become so popular, yeah.
And you know, and everyone likeAmerica September is very
crowded because everyone thinksit's not high season, and it's
like high high season becausepeople avoid July and August.
So it's um it is very, you know,we have a real affinity.
(24:18):
A lot of us, about 10% ofAmericans have Italian blood.
We have a real affinity forItaly.
Um, Americans do, and um no,it's very popular.
SPEAKER_02 (24:29):
Very popular.
Ah, okay.
Now, I'm looking at on my leftmonitor here, you can't see it.
I have on your website, Dream ofItaly, and there's a YouTube
video on the front page.
unknown (24:41):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (24:41):
Yes, that's from our very famous citizen.
And um Andrea.
Have you ever met AndreaBacelli?
SPEAKER_00 (24:49):
Well, yes, he was on season three.
I have interviewed him, met hiswife, interviewed her, met his
four dogs.
He's a big dog lover, as I am.
And we did a really unique uhepisode called Andrea Bocelli's
Tuscany, and it's about the townhe grew up in, the town where he
lives, and the town of Luca,which was uh the town of
(25:11):
Puccini, uh, the opera uhcomposer that really inspired
Becelli.
So I've actually become somewhatknown for um interviewing a
number of celebrities, uh,Francis For Coppola, Sting, um
Marissa Tomei, who've been onthe show.
And we all just love Italy somuch.
We talk, you know, we're nottotally talking about their
(25:33):
careers, we're really talkingabout Italy.
SPEAKER_02 (25:36):
Italy in general, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (25:38):
And our passion for Italy.
SPEAKER_02 (25:40):
In a way, though, Bricelli, he's probably got the
best voice on the planet, right?
SPEAKER_00 (25:44):
Yes.
SPEAKER_02 (25:45):
I think so, uh, without a doubt.
In fact, I was out of thecountry at the time, but he
played in a town quite nearwhere I live.
Greensboro smoke.
I can't remember exactly where.
SPEAKER_00 (25:57):
He really, I gotta say, he's one of the hardest
working people you will evermeet.
He tours a lot, he he he's atevery kind of Italian event.
I just went to a big uh tourismconference, a big international
tourism conference in Rome, andhe opened it singing, and the
prime minister was there, and heworks really hard.
SPEAKER_02 (26:19):
Yeah, I think well, with a voice like that, yeah, it
has to be impeccable.
It's uh it's a glorious voice,and he's done a lot of duets.
Funny, I was watching an oldYouTube video of him sing the
other day.
Um who was he singing with?
Time to say goodbye, that famoussong.
Yes, and uh who was a female?
SPEAKER_00 (26:38):
Uh oh, there's a woman, um, an Italian woman he
sings it with.
Oh you let's look that one up.
It's on the tip of my tongue.
SPEAKER_02 (26:54):
Oh, I yeah, the reason I say that is because
that particular song I played atmy father's funeral.
SPEAKER_00 (27:00):
Oh, it's Sarah Brightman again.
SPEAKER_02 (27:03):
Sarah Brightman, there you go.
SPEAKER_00 (27:04):
Right, but he has sung it with some others.
SPEAKER_02 (27:07):
Uh yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (27:07):
Oh, you really played that at his funeral.
Oh, it's a beautiful song.
SPEAKER_02 (27:10):
Yeah, the reason being is because um one of the
last tricks my father made, Iwent with him to Las Vegas and
they played that that uh songover and over again at the
Bellaggio when the fountainswent off, right?
SPEAKER_00 (27:23):
Well, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (27:24):
Yeah, and that's where Italian influence played
the song.
So yeah, it's a beautiful voice.
And um, yeah, and he just did arecent duet with Brian May from
Queen as well, but superb.
SPEAKER_00 (27:35):
He does some amazing duets.
He did one with Ed Sheeran.
He he really works witheverybody.
He's a he's really an incredibleperson.
SPEAKER_02 (27:43):
Yeah, he is.
SPEAKER_00 (27:44):
Um class act, class act, prolific, prolific and
hardworking.
SPEAKER_02 (27:49):
Yeah, exactly.
Uh I subscribe to a magazinecalled uh International Living.
SPEAKER_00 (27:55):
Oh, they do a great job, and they were like the
originals.
There's a lot of these expertsand sites coming on about moving
abroad, but they are really goodand they do conferences, they're
very good.
SPEAKER_02 (28:09):
Yeah, and they ranked uh let's say one, two,
three, four, sixth in the placeof um global retirement index of
best places to retire to.
Italy came number one.
SPEAKER_00 (28:21):
Italy.
And that's only problem withItaly is Greece came number one,
but uh what was one?
SPEAKER_02 (28:26):
Greece, Greece.
SPEAKER_00 (28:27):
They're doing a lot of incentives.
Italy, I'm telling you the toughparts, the taxes.
SPEAKER_02 (28:33):
Yeah, there you go.
And it's up there as well as uhfor healthcare, healthcare
system.
SPEAKER_00 (28:39):
Healthcare is excellent in Italy, but you also
have to live somewhere.
Not every area has great healthcare, nor is really close to a
hospital.
And unfortunately, my my familywere from the south.
It's a lot of the northern it'svery similar to the like you
know, it's uh the south wasalways poor.
(28:59):
And so the health care is verygood in Italy.
You just have to be sure youpick the right place.
Like all these people moving toSicily, which is fine.
There's health care, but if youneed something really
specialized, it may not be theeasiest or fastest place to get
it.
SPEAKER_02 (29:15):
Yeah.
But that that's I think that'simportant the older you get.
SPEAKER_00 (29:19):
You'll never go broke though, because of health
care, which you will in America.
SPEAKER_02 (29:22):
Yeah.
Well, but basically in Europe,medical costs, zero people go
broke.
SPEAKER_00 (29:28):
And you can get a private policy and you can get
amazing like extra care or animmediate care for like you
know, a thousand, two thousanddollars a year.
And so, and also if you can geton the national health system,
that depends on how yourresidency works.
But it it can be, you know, whenI talk about that retirement and
(29:51):
they talk about it, there arereal advantages.
SPEAKER_02 (29:55):
Yeah, exactly.
And uh when you when you get alot of people who want to live
overseas, that's that is aconcern.
And some of the Greece is, butItaly, France, good health
there, Spain, Portugal, theseare all places where Portugal
was I've never been.
SPEAKER_00 (30:14):
Portugal is like it sounds to me, it sounds
beautiful, but everyone andtheir mother is moving to
Portugal, and um, you know, Idon't know what it's
interesting, sort of what is thetolerance for so I mean it it
helps the economy, but it's aninteresting time to watch that.
SPEAKER_02 (30:30):
Okay, well, you know, that that's a that there
is one other major factor thatum when people consider moving
somewhere, and I I always saythis to people because it's it
even when you vacation there,and uh I I travel a lot these
days, but I will consult whatsomething called the Global
Peace Index.
(30:51):
You have a look at that?
SPEAKER_00 (30:52):
I've heard of it, yes.
SPEAKER_02 (30:54):
Yeah, and it looks at the safety of a place, which
is very important, and thesafest place in the world today
is Iceland.
SPEAKER_00 (31:03):
Fascinating.
SPEAKER_02 (31:05):
Yeah, well, it's small, but it's safe to go to,
and there's a lot of safety.
Very community Italy ranksfairly well in that, by the way.
SPEAKER_00 (31:13):
Yes, I always it's it's actually I did a special
for PBS called Travel, Transformand Thrive about moving to Italy
or or living the Italianlifestyle.
And we talked about safety.
I travel a lot by myself aroundItaly.
You know, there's the issue ofsay pickpockets or you know,
walking alone at night, but Ihave always felt extremely safe
(31:38):
in Italy.
SPEAKER_02 (31:39):
Yeah, yeah, true.
And um not I am living there asmuch as you are, I've only been
there.
SPEAKER_00 (31:44):
And or I guess the global peace index.
SPEAKER_02 (31:46):
I've never had a problem there walking around at
night, and that's the key, isn'tit?
You've got to be able to walk inthe world.
But is it also about war?
SPEAKER_00 (31:51):
I don't think they're going to war anytime
soon if we're talking abouthopefully not.
SPEAKER_02 (31:56):
No, they they're just they they just like to be
Italy doing their own thing.
People live there, they'rehappy, and it's a peace, and
it's safe.
And you know, uh you know, allthese these countries that uh
rank in the top 30 or so, Imean, are safe places to go to.
And I worry about that becauseit global peace index is sort of
(32:20):
used by travel companies to lookat the trying to get a company.
I'm gonna take a closer look atit.
And based on the safety, and umI don't know if you know this
where the USA is is ranked.
SPEAKER_00 (32:31):
50?
SPEAKER_02 (32:32):
No.
SPEAKER_00 (32:34):
25?
SPEAKER_02 (32:35):
No.
SPEAKER_00 (32:37):
100.
SPEAKER_02 (32:38):
128.
SPEAKER_00 (32:43):
That wasn't there like 190 countries or something.
SPEAKER_02 (32:46):
No, it's based on it 163.
SPEAKER_00 (32:48):
Now I wonder I wonder if it's because of guns.
SPEAKER_02 (32:51):
If what?
SPEAKER_00 (32:53):
Guns.
SPEAKER_02 (32:54):
Yeah, yeah.
Well, I that may have somethingto do with it.
SPEAKER_00 (32:57):
I think that's part of the weight of it.
Whether you're, you know, I'mnot making a political
statement, but I think we havegone violence, and that way is
it.
SPEAKER_02 (33:05):
Yeah, it's violence.
So it's that that's that's why.
SPEAKER_00 (33:08):
So that is staggering.
Yeah, you know, but I love whenI come on a podcast and I learn
something, you know.
I'm not just sharing, I'mlearning.
Very interesting.
SPEAKER_02 (33:20):
I know, so it's become a a concern.
I I look at it more now.
I mean, in recent years, in theindustry.
It's a crazy time.
2021.
I was in Kiev in the Ukraine,right before the war started,
and it was uh there was a lot ofnervousness in the air there,
but it was I could see somethingmight happen, of course, earlier
on in February the next year, itdid, you know.
(33:40):
So I got in and got out safely,but you you never know, right?
Um, so you know, there's someplaces that go up and down that
list each year, um, based on anumber of factors.
About how many is about 20 oddfactors that determine the
peacefulness of a place, butItaly fares quite well.
So basically, what you've gothere is a place that's safe,
(34:02):
it's beautiful, food is great,um, and uh it's livable, you
know, and so you've got allthese factors that might
encourage people to go livethere, so oh a lot of them are
going.
Yeah, so it's all good.
Now, if someone wanted to gethold of you, um Kathy, you've
got your website,dreamofitally.com, and they're
(34:24):
gonna have to play that videothat you've got on the front
page of Andrea.
Uh, so you've got the um travelmagazine there, and uh um can
they book trips by you?
SPEAKER_00 (34:33):
Yes, I have a service where I refer them.
I can consult on a trip, but Ialso refer them to some uh
someone I trust to book theirtrip.
And we're very into like thelocal experiences, and you know,
I'm all for like you go toVenice and you want to get on
the gondola.
So do all the things that you'vedreamed of, but then like a
little twist on them.
SPEAKER_02 (34:54):
Yeah, and also for Americans to go to Italy, you
can use a train system.
It's pretty funny.
SPEAKER_00 (34:59):
The train system is really, really good, very
impressive to Americans.
I'm the granddaughter of a steamlocomotive engineer, and I wish
you know, American trains.
I love trains.
I wish we had more um weinvested more in them and uh
public transport trains.
SPEAKER_02 (35:17):
I know that'd be a great idea.
You want to go to I'm back inEngland uh in February, but I'll
be taking the train there.
unknown (35:23):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (35:24):
And it's perfectly safe and uh sufficient.
So, you know, provided they'renot a strike, but it's it's
decent.
SPEAKER_00 (35:30):
So oh, Italy has their strikes too.
SPEAKER_02 (35:33):
So it's all good.
So um, so with a weird question,if you have to move there.
Oh, you you yeah, I think youalready have to that should
probably go um to Tuscany area,wouldn't you?
SPEAKER_00 (35:45):
That's probably what uh um yeah, which is very I I
have, but I'm like I like citiestoo.
So I've looked at some cities inAmelia Romagna, Milan.
I mean, not forever, maybe for alittle bit of time.
But my biggest piece of advice Iis go and try out the place.
You know, you can rent a placefor a few months.
I'm always amazed.
(36:06):
I guess unless you have a truecalling to a place, these people
just go and buy a house.
I mean, they're not veryexpensive, but you know, uh I
think trying places out is agood idea.
Um, but Tuscany, Tuscany justhas a little, I love the seaside
in Tuscany.
You know, Tuscany really has alittle bit of everything.
SPEAKER_02 (36:25):
Yeah.
So if you're advising someonewho's never been to Italy
before, where would you advisethem to go to and how long
should they stay?
SPEAKER_00 (36:35):
Well, I mean, I think Rome, Venice, and
Florence, and you might agree,or sort of even if you didn't
like Venice, you at least sawit.
And I I kind of believe youcould do three days in each of
those places.
And then depending on, you know,do you love the seaside?
Do you love the countryside?
Do you like wine?
You know, maybe adding in someof the countryside of Tuscany.
(36:57):
You can definitely do thecountryside of the Veneto near
Venice.
People, you know, a lot ofpeople will also do Naples, you
know, the big three Naples,Pompeii, Amalfi Coast.
Look, the Amalfi Coast isgorgeous, beautiful, but it's
overrun.
I'm sorry.
I love it.
And it's so expensive.
(37:18):
I mean, these hotels I went to20 years ago that were
reasonable are now like$2,000 anight.
And so it breaks my heart alittle bit.
Um, but if you are gonna go tothe Amalfi Coast, I say May,
October.
Please don't go in July or youknow, there's only that one
road.
SPEAKER_02 (37:36):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (37:37):
I've driven it, and now I think they're doing um
every other day certain licenseplates.
And it's not the it's just youcan it cannot handle all the
people.
SPEAKER_02 (37:47):
What about in fact it just came to my brain cells
there because the last time Iwas on a cruise ship go through
the Mediterranean, we stopped inPalermo, Sicily.
And I didn't know what to expectthere, but it was it was just
nice walking around.
That cathedral is fantasticthere.
SPEAKER_00 (38:03):
Oh, Sicily is uh, I want to do, we haven't done
Sicily on the TV show, andthat's sort of next for us.
And you know, everyone invadedSicily too, so there's so many
influences like Arab and Greekand um Sicily's a whole other
trip.
You know, Sicily is a wholeother thing, um, but a wonderful
place.
SPEAKER_02 (38:23):
Yep, there's so many wonderful places, not enough
time to do it.
So, anyway, hopefully uh peoplewill listen to you and get the
urge, they've got to do it, youknow.
SPEAKER_00 (38:33):
Do it now, also.
SPEAKER_02 (38:35):
I'm a very big in the state, live in the state, at
least travel overseas a bituntil there comes a time when
you don't want to get on a planeor you can't get on a plane
anymore, then then you can gosee the rest of the United
States.
SPEAKER_00 (38:48):
You know, yeah.
No, I always say do it whileyou're healthy, and you don't
know how long that will be, andfor various reasons, and people
have kids and parents, and likewhen you have the window, take
it.
SPEAKER_02 (39:00):
Exactly.
SPEAKER_00 (39:01):
You can make the money back, you can you know
save another time.
SPEAKER_02 (39:05):
You know, yeah.
Excellent.
All right, well, it's greathearing from you, um Kathy, and
I know and uh I'm sure you willenjoy yourself and looking
forward to the next time you arethere.
SPEAKER_00 (39:17):
I'm going for the Olympics.
SPEAKER_02 (39:19):
Good for you, yes, yes, and uh well, I'll have to
turn the TV on, and when thatcomes on, and uh you'll see so
many beautiful places.
SPEAKER_00 (39:28):
It's I mean you can watch just for the scenery, not
even just for the sports.
SPEAKER_02 (39:32):
Yeah, exactly.
It's all right.
Well, have a great time.
When did you say you're leaving,by the way, for Italy next?
SPEAKER_00 (39:38):
Oh, end of January.
End of January start.
Yep.
So I am a big proponent of Italyin the winter, and I'm looking
because you know, all the hotelsyou want to go to, unless
they're seasonal, the bestrates.
You know, you're going February,March, you're you know, you can
get into the restaurants, it's agood time to go.
SPEAKER_02 (39:57):
Guys, I just wonder whether when you go to Italy,
you've been there so many times,you go through immigration, and
they say, Welcome back, Kathy.
SPEAKER_00 (40:04):
I don't know, they should.
Um but you know, it's funny isI'm recognized in Italy because
I have the show.
Americans, if you see me inDenver, I have been recognized
in Denver, but more Americansrecognize me in Italy because A,
I always try to put makeup onand look a little nicer in
Italy, and B, I'm in the contextof the TV show.
(40:26):
Like you're seeing me with thecobblestones, and they're like,
oh, you're from Dream of Italy.
So it's fun.
I do, I do get recognized whenI'm there.
SPEAKER_02 (40:35):
All right.
Well, well, wonderful.
Um, with your website, uh, doyou update the pictures on that
from time to time?
SPEAKER_00 (40:42):
I should.
I've left that Picelli thing upthere for a while.
But if you come to like theInstagram or TikTok, we have all
kinds of okay.
SPEAKER_02 (40:50):
Well, send send me your your Instagram uh detail.
SPEAKER_00 (40:53):
All of it is Dream of Italy, really easy.
SPEAKER_02 (40:55):
Okay, last easy.
Same thing for everything.
Excellent.
Well, all right, Kathy, greathaving you on.
Thanks so much, Malcolm.
Go ahead and I'm going to joinI'm gonna check out this peace
index.
SPEAKER_00 (41:05):
I've learned something today.
Thank you.
It's interesting.
SPEAKER_02 (41:10):
Okay, got it.
SPEAKER_00 (41:11):
Okay.
SPEAKER_02 (41:12):
Well, good talking to you, and it was great.
SPEAKER_00 (41:15):
Let me know.
Yeah, we'll share it too.
Okay, bye.
Take care, bye-bye.
SPEAKER_01 (41:21):
That's it for this episode of the Travel Addict
Podcast, where we chase sunsets,flirt with danger, and
occasionally make questionablechoices in foreign lands.
Until next time, may yourflights be on time.
And your travel stories justscandalous enough to leave a few
details out.
Check out Malcolm's websites atmalcolmteesdale.com and
(41:43):
travelingenglishman.com.
Safe travels and enjoy life,everyone.
Welcome to the Travel Addict Podcast.
(00:02):
Your host and fellow traveladdict, Malcolm Teesdale, is
here to take you into the heartof the world's most fascinating
destinations.
He talks with passionateglobetrotters and fearless
explorers who share their wildjourneys and cultural insights
from around the world.
Or sometimes he just chats byhimself, describing enriching
travel experiences.
(00:22):
So buckle up and let's hit theroad.
Because the world is calling andwe're answering.
SPEAKER_02 (00:27):
Hello, everybody.
Malcolm Testel here, the traveladdict.
You're all doing well out there.
And when Kathy wrote to me,Kathy McCabe, who is just
waiting here to chat, she's anexpert on Italy.
And I thought, you know, it'sabout time everyone out there,
including myself, learned a bita bit more about this wonderful
(00:48):
country.
So, Kathy, glad you're here.
Can you hear me?
So am I.
SPEAKER_00 (00:53):
So am I.
Happy to be here.
SPEAKER_02 (00:56):
Oh, wonderful.
SPEAKER_00 (00:57):
I'm kind of addicted myself, not only to travel, but
mostly to Italy.
SPEAKER_02 (01:02):
Okay, well, we've got a lot to learn from you
today about Italy, and uh, I'vegot a few questions for you as
well.
So when was the last time youwere in Italy, by the way?
SPEAKER_00 (01:15):
Five weeks ago.
SPEAKER_02 (01:16):
Five weeks ago?
SPEAKER_00 (01:18):
Yes, yes.
SPEAKER_02 (01:19):
Are you missing it?
SPEAKER_00 (01:21):
Absolutely.
I miss the food the most becauseyou can tell that there aren't
as many chemicals in the food.
It just feels fresher.
I honestly feel better in Italyversus the United States.
So it's it's not just like mysoul, it's my body that misses
it too.
SPEAKER_02 (01:40):
You know, I I when you say the food, I'm one of
these people that grew up.
I never liked spaghetti.
And I don't know why.
I because probably my motherused to feed it to me.
No, I don't like that.
But I've changed over the years,you know.
I do have pasta occasionallynow, so it's all good.
But um, all right, so you've umyou've got uh website called
(02:04):
Dream of Italy.
We'll look at that, and yourfront page is something of
significance, obviously.
But you know all about Italy,and you go there.
How many times a year do you gothere, by the way?
SPEAKER_00 (02:15):
Just uh I mean I go like two or three times, but I
go for months at a time.
So I would say I spend like 40%of the year there.
Um, I might increase that, Imight end up moving, which is
which is the great dream of alot of people.
So I go for long chunks.
I film, I host a TV series, andsometimes we're filming, and
(02:37):
that can take weeks at a time.
Or I also uh edit and publish amagazine, and so I'm traveling
around uh covering things forthe magazine, so I'm never
bored.
SPEAKER_02 (02:48):
Well, well, well, you've got that magazine called
Dream of Italy, right?
Yes.
Yeah, it's the same as yourwebsite, Dream of Italy.
And yes.
But a lot of people love it.
I know a lot of people go there.
It's one of the favorite placesin Europe to visit.
Obviously, I Paris is one ofthem, and going to Italy because
there's such a lot to see there.
But um it's is Italy, in youropinion, becoming more popular
(03:12):
now, like in 2026.
SPEAKER_00 (03:14):
How do you see it is actually it is like you think it
can't become more popular, butthe numbers are going up and up
and up.
And I actually was just doing aninterview with the head of the
Italian tourism board,Alessandra Priante, and we were
talking about how there's likeno off season anymore.
(03:36):
People are going all year.
You know, people are going inNovember, December, January,
February.
It's actually delightful to goin the winter.
I think it's the summers can behot and crowded.
So, yes, it is insanely popular.
SPEAKER_02 (03:50):
What about what's it like there in like January?
Is it just is it cool or is itjust perfect?
SPEAKER_00 (03:57):
It is cool, but I did one a few years ago years
ago before COVID.
I went to uh I wanted to work onmy language skills, which are
always in need.
And I went to Florence to takelanguage lessons in January.
And I have to tell you, the wetI I was very lucky.
It was sunny most days.
It was um, I don't know, maybe65, 60.
(04:19):
It was lovely.
Of course, you can hit it whereit's rainy and cloudy, but
especially something likeFlorence, which has become
really crowded, January isalmost the best month to go
because it's the least, youknow, the le the least amount of
tourists.
SPEAKER_02 (04:34):
Yeah, which is always the best way.
But based on what's happeningglobally, warmth, even where I
live now, it's been horribly hotin the summer.
What's it like in the middle oflike July, August time there in
uh especially it's like thesouthern part of the country?
SPEAKER_00 (04:49):
It's hot, it's hot, and then you have that humidity.
I live when I'm not in Italy, Ilive in Denver, although I'm
from the East Coast, and it'snice and dry.
Although it gets extremely hothere, it's just a different
heat.
But in Italy, it's that humidityand it's hot, and trying to see
the cities and tour around thecities and like the ancient
(05:10):
sites, I think is a little bittrying.
But if you're by the seaside, Imean, Italy was made for seaside
vacations.
It's delightful.
So I think you have to paceyourself if you go in the
summer.
You can't try to do too much,and I think you have to build in
like the afternoon rest, theafternoon at the pool.
(05:31):
Um, really following, you know,doing things in the morning and
the evening because it's so hot.
Like if you're gonna go see theRoman Forum, do it first thing
in the morning.
So there are ways to tocounteract that, but everywhere
is getting hotter.
And it's interesting, there's atrend in travel.
I think it has a name which Ican't remember right now, but
(05:52):
people are going, say theDolomite Mountains, like people
are going to the Mountains inthe summer versus you know,
other places in Italy because itwill be more bearable.
SPEAKER_02 (06:01):
Yeah.
Interesting.
Um now when you go there toItaly, where'd you where do you
normally where's your base?
Where do you normally stay?
SPEAKER_00 (06:12):
I don't really have a base, I don't have an
apartment.
Um, we film in all differentplaces for the show, and I cover
lots of different places for themagazine.
I have a lot of friends in andaround Cortona, Tuscany.
And so I do go to Tuscany a lot.
If I if I if I had to say I hada base, and I also love there's
(06:33):
a part of Tuscany about twohours from there called Satoria.
These are places I go fairlyregularly.
If I had to say I had a base, itmight be Tuscany.
SPEAKER_02 (06:43):
Okay.
Yeah, um, I just wondered thatbecause um, you know, when when
people go to Italy, they alwaysthink of, well, Rome and Venice,
right?
So Rome obviously is steeped inhistory there, but I I'm gonna
be honest with you, Kathy.
Um, I think it was aboutprobably nine, ten years ago.
(07:04):
Um, I went to Venice.
SPEAKER_00 (07:07):
What did you think?
SPEAKER_02 (07:09):
I didn't like it.
SPEAKER_00 (07:10):
Really, why?
SPEAKER_02 (07:11):
I do you know why?
Too many people.
SPEAKER_00 (07:15):
But but okay, so you gotta go.
I agree, but I've been to Venicein the winter, and yeah, again,
there were a number of people,but I think Venice is one of the
most beautiful places on earth,and I think it's one of those
places like you have to see, youhave to give it a try.
SPEAKER_02 (07:33):
Yes, exactly.
SPEAKER_00 (07:34):
But please go, that's the place to go in
January.
It sounds crazy.
The light, the winter light isexquisite.
You know, that's a tough placeto go in July.
It's gonna be you and your fivemillion other best friends.
It's tough.
SPEAKER_02 (07:48):
Yeah, I know.
And now that's I I can'tremember the exact time of year
I went there.
But basically, well, I say I didthe big three.
I went to Venice first, it wasovercrowded, and restaurants in
the evening, the the tables wereso close to the restaurants.
Um, but then I went to Rome,which I've been to before, and
uh I stayed in a hotel, waswithin walking distance of
(08:11):
everything, which was great.
But you know, out of the bigthree, I like Florence the best.
SPEAKER_00 (08:17):
You know, mine even changes.
Uh Florence is exquisite, it'sjust um, you know, it is a
favorite uh out of the three.
It's hard, it's like pickingchildren, they're very different
personalities.
But Florence is very manageableand again can be dicey in the
summer.
The thing with the Florence isthose streets were small, you
(08:38):
know, they're small for areason.
They don't allow buses, but evenum, you know, lots of people.
Uh so I I I don't mean to speaknegatively, but I think people
have to become more strategicabout their trips to Italy and
their these popular places.
SPEAKER_02 (08:56):
Hmm.
I well, I'm trying to think ofthe hotel I stayed in now.
It was on the river close to thebridge, you know, the famous
bridge there.
SPEAKER_00 (09:04):
There's one that was in a room with a view.
There's a bunch of them.
SPEAKER_02 (09:07):
Well, this this this hotel was famous for the the uh
movie A Room with a View.
SPEAKER_00 (09:12):
That I knew exactly the hotel.
I could look it up, but it's Ihave walked by.
There's a great I I have a dearfriend in Florence, and our
tradition is to go to a rooftopbar.
Every time we see each other,we've probably been to 15 or 20.
The last time I was in Florence,we went to the rooftop bar of
that hotel.
I'm gonna look up the namebecause it's going to bother me.
(09:34):
Um, that's a nice, that's agood, great, the you can't beat
that location.
SPEAKER_02 (09:39):
Oh, it's great.
SPEAKER_00 (09:41):
It's right on the Ponte Vecchio.
SPEAKER_02 (09:43):
Yes, that's right.
SPEAKER_00 (09:45):
Um, I'm gonna find the name of the hotel because
it's a good one.
Should have come prepared forthis, but no, no, we're gonna
find it.
Good rooftop bar.
Uh we always have a Negroni.
A Negroni that's our uh it'scalled the Hotel de Orafi.
Oh Right.
SPEAKER_02 (10:05):
Yeah, there you go.
Yeah, nice hotel.
SPEAKER_00 (10:08):
Yeah, it's a good spot for people.
Yeah, good choice.
SPEAKER_02 (10:13):
Yeah, and it's a good, good, good place to stay
and just walk around, enjoy thecity, and uh so uh really
enjoyed it there and the foodand everything.
So anyway, um, so uh those thoseare three main places.
We mentioned Tuscany, of course,and there's also places in the
south.
There's a ton of places to goto.
Um, and you know, when you gothere, it depends what time of
(10:33):
year.
If you advise, if you speak tosomeone say, I want to go to
Italy, and what would be thefirst thing you would say to
them?
What where do you want to go to?
Or don't just go to one place?
Well, how would you preparesomething?
SPEAKER_00 (10:47):
Don't try to do, don't try to do too much.
You know, people.
I have a rule, I think it shouldeven be longer that you should
stay at least two nights, threedays in a place.
Like there's a lot of hit andrun tourism, right?
And then people forget, like ifyou're going between the cities,
it takes like a half a day, youknow.
By the time you go to the trainstation, get on the train, get
to where you're going.
(11:08):
People aren't accounting fortravel time.
So I think they think, yes, youcan get a really like a buffet
of good thing, you know, goodthings with a trip to Italy.
You're never going to be able tosee everything.
And I think people need to, Ialways say leave time for
serendipity, but like really cutback, you know, try to leave
(11:29):
some time for some unexpectedthings and also try to, you
know, spend an extra day in Romeor an extra day in Venice or
Florence or Tuscany.
It it can be it can be toorushed.
And I say that and I rush aroundtoo, but then I stay in some
places for a while also.
SPEAKER_02 (11:46):
Okay, got it.
Yeah.
Um have you been to Naples andum yes, yeah, Naples and um got
it.
SPEAKER_00 (11:54):
It's well worth the visit.
Milan, yeah, the Olympics arecoming up, and I'm going back um
to it's it's in Milan andCortina and all of northern
Italy.
Naples, I mean, if I had tochoose between the two cities,
my family's from the countrysideoutside Naples, but Campania,
the food, I mean, it's the best.
(12:14):
Ah, you can't even say it's thebest, but I mean it's because
then I'm like, oh wait, EmiliaRomagna.
But some of the best food, yousee Mount Vesuvius, um, the
pizza, the sfoliatelle, thecoffee, um, you know, the
history, the um Pompeii, um,Herculaneum.
(12:36):
I mean, there's a lot.
So southern Italy has my heart.
SPEAKER_02 (12:41):
Really?
I just wonder because you're inthat neck of the woods when you
go there, you actually like getum a plane and hop off to
another country somewhere or goacross the Mediterranean
anywhere, or just stay in Italy.
SPEAKER_00 (12:55):
Well, you know, what's interesting is I also
film another TV show calledDream of Europe.
And we decided, just because Iwas curious about it myself, to
do an episode in Malta.
Oh, Malta, you know, well, uhwas ruled by the British, and
it's fascinating.
It's not far from Italy.
It's great for a couple of days,and it's it's there are some
(13:17):
similarities, but it's reallytotally different.
SPEAKER_02 (13:20):
Yeah, funny because I was in Valletta um earlier on
this year.
I liked it.
Um I was on a cruise shippassing by, so I only got to
spend the day there, but wedocked there and I walked up um
into because it's it'ssurrounded by a wall there, but
walked around the uh the citycenter, and it's just lovely.
I have a couple of pubs there,and nice restaurants and coffee
(13:42):
places.
And I thought this is really anice place.
SPEAKER_00 (13:45):
There's a lot of layers to it.
It actually has all theseancient temples and ruins.
Um, but then you have thebridge, everyone was sort of
passed through.
So there's there's a Caravaggioin the um cathedral in Valletta,
which is interesting.
Um, the food, it's it'sfascinating.
And I think it's I wouldn't say,okay, like fly, you know, I you
(14:07):
don't, it's hard if you'rechoosing, but to add on to a
trip, it's really easy to do atrip to the street.
SPEAKER_02 (14:13):
Yeah, especially if it's in the neighborhood.
Yeah, that's that's what I likedoing a lot there.
Um, because you might as well,while you're there, just add a
few extra days and just stopsomewhere on the way back.
How do you actually from whereyou are, Denver, how do you
actually fly there?
SPEAKER_00 (14:28):
Well, what's interesting is we we filmed two
episodes in London, so we flewLondon to Malta on air Malta.
SPEAKER_02 (14:35):
Oh, okay, Malta.
SPEAKER_00 (14:38):
You want to hear the craziest story?
We went to the wrong airport inLondon, but we didn't know it.
We're standing, we're havingcoffee, we're and this is my
crew.
We have our deer.
And we go to check in.
I can't remember if we were atGatwick, you know.
(14:58):
I can't remember if we were atGatwick, we're supposed to be at
Heathrow.
I must have turned white becauseI also run the whole show, and
the and the um, you know, itwasn't specifically my fault nor
not my fault, but you know, themissing that flight, we got two
black cabs.
You wouldn't believe how muchstuff you can put in the black
cab.
And we were like, get us to theairport.
(15:19):
But luckily, my my sound guyJeff, he's like we call him no
no, like grandpa.
He's not that old.
But he was like, we need to beat the airport four hours early.
So luckily we were there soearly we made the other flight.
SPEAKER_02 (15:32):
So what where was your real flight going from
Heathrow?
SPEAKER_00 (15:36):
I think it was going from Heathrow, and we got
dropped off.
SPEAKER_02 (15:39):
So you went to Yatwick instead.
SPEAKER_00 (15:41):
And nobody, I mean, I'm traveling with eight people,
like we have a director, we haveuh, you know, the fixer, I
think, might have been the onewho sent us to the wrong area.
You know, we're all we were allguilty.
We just I don't think anyonelooked at the sign.
Uh and you hear, you know, youthink this will never happen to
you, but it happens.
SPEAKER_02 (16:01):
Of all places though, in London, because
London has four in class fiveairports because obviously
Gatwick, Heathrow, Stansted,London City Airport, and you can
count in Luton as well, which isjust north.
So it can get really confusing.
Anyway, you're not the firstperson to make that.
SPEAKER_00 (16:19):
Well, we were lucky because there's probably one
flight a day to Malta, and thenyou know, we're filming the next
day.
We're not so thank God it allworked out.
SPEAKER_02 (16:28):
You survived, you made it.
Yeah, I did.
It's all part of it, you know.
SPEAKER_00 (16:33):
Oh, I love it, it's fun.
SPEAKER_02 (16:35):
Oh hey, a part of your your profile, you mentioned
the Olympics, right?
Yes, what about the Olympics?
SPEAKER_00 (16:41):
So the winter games, and I went, so I love the winter
Olympics because 20 years ago Iwent to the Torino Olympics in
Torino, Italy in 2006, and I hadthe time of my life, and it was
one of my like top 10experiences.
There's something about anOlympics, and so Italy is
hosting them again, and they'rekind of sharing them between
(17:05):
Milan and Cortina, which is upin the Dolomite Mountains.
So it'll be for several weeks inFebruary, and then the
Paralympics in March, and you'regonna see all kinds of alpine
destinations.
Milan is gonna have, I'm goingto like figure skating and ice
hockey, some of those big indoorrink type things, yeah, and the
opening ceremonies.
(17:27):
And it's just, I mean, it's hardto be.
I like the winter Olympics,there's just something more
intimate about them.
SPEAKER_02 (17:34):
Yeah, well, pretty because I was just watching um a
famous sports team on TV uhyesterday from Italy, into Milan
soccer team.
SPEAKER_00 (17:43):
Oh, yeah.
And they take their uh they takethe football soccer very, very
seriously.
SPEAKER_02 (17:49):
Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (17:50):
As the Brits do too, you know.
SPEAKER_02 (17:53):
Oh, I absolutely absolutely and I remember those
days back when I was going,there's a famous player called
Luigi Riva.
Probably don't remember him.
You do?
SPEAKER_00 (18:02):
No, I don't because I wasn't probably that into uh
sports.
SPEAKER_02 (18:07):
Yeah, uh, but they haven't qualified for the World
Cup yet uh in North America, butI think they will, it's just a
matter of matter of time, andbut you say you could you're
spending what a third of theyear in Italy?
SPEAKER_00 (18:19):
Something like that, yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (18:22):
So but I think from what you're saying, you could
move towards spending a littlelonger there.
SPEAKER_00 (18:28):
I could.
So without a visa, I could spendAmericans or I guess foreigners.
I don't know, some countriesneed visas.
Uh Americans can spend 90 out ofevery 180 days.
It's rolling.
So basically six months, but notsix months straight.
Um, and there's a number ofpeople who buy a home in Italy
and they go for three months,come back for three months, go
(18:50):
for three months, and then um,so that's one option, or moving
there is another option.
Um, I think I will at some pointbecause I love it so much and I
have so much um work there.
But I also very much appreciatethe efficiency of America, you
know, the uh, you know, I verymuch understand Italy, both the
(19:14):
pros and the cons.
And having both is a really nicemix.
SPEAKER_02 (19:19):
Yeah, it is, but I know it's a fair way to go
because you have to, it's a fewhours travel, but you know,
there'll come a time, I'm sure,uh, that to you have to really
think, Kathy, about where do youultimately want to live and
retire at, right?
SPEAKER_00 (19:34):
And it might be Italy, and I'll tell you why.
It's much cheaper.
Yep.
Uh, you know, health insurancein America is insane.
Yeah.
Um, I've just experienced thatmyself.
You know, I had great care.
I had a little surgery recently,but Italy has great care too.
Um, there's just a it's a verybeautiful place.
(19:55):
Um, but you have to have acommunity um when you're there.
But you know, I know many peoplelive there and really love it.
So, you know, probably with myheart, I'm leaning towards
Italy.
I'm just not sure exactly where.
SPEAKER_02 (20:08):
You have to see how it goes.
I know uh more Americans now umthan ever before are traveling,
and quite a few are moving over.
They are.
And there's again the reasonsfor that, but I think you know
what they are.
But you know, it's uh they'rechoosing to move elsewhere, but
you just find with thesecountries as expat communities.
SPEAKER_00 (20:27):
Yes, and I know, and in fact, in fact, I say I go to
Cortona, there's a lot ofAmericans there um that have
their own, you know, they'rethey they they intermingle the
Italians but have a bigcommunity.
Um, and so definitely you're notyou're not gonna notch the
Americans.
SPEAKER_02 (20:44):
Yeah, I I think some countries now are saying, well,
say if you wanted to buy a housethere, buy some property, you're
investing so much money in theplace, you could qualify to
become a resident.
SPEAKER_00 (20:57):
Is that yeah, you know, Italy doesn't really do
that.
If they do, it's like a biggerinvestment visa.
But some of these countries,it's I think Portugal is doing
it.
Um, Greece, apparently, I wasjust reading, has really good
incentives for again, you buy ahouse and you can get residency.
Yeah in Italy, uh, just to beclear if anyone's interested,
(21:18):
buying a house does not give youresidency.
You would have to get your ownvisa or citizenship to go.
And it's not, I mean, it's hardbecause of the paperwork, but
there are possibilities.
SPEAKER_02 (21:31):
Yeah, I think every country has their own thing, but
um um some countries they theywant people to come and live
there, boost the economy, helpthe economy a little bit, and
they've got these incentives toto do so.
SPEAKER_00 (21:43):
So I I understand why people and there are um in
Italy, there's 7% zones.
If you go like sort of on theirelective residency visa, um, I
think most towns in the south,under 20,000 people, you get a
7% flat tax for 10 years.
Um And so there are incentivesin Italy.
Most of them are southern Italyor smaller towns.
SPEAKER_02 (22:06):
Yeah.
Well, there you go.
So yep, think but you're gonnabe thinking about it, I'm sure.
Probably the more you go.
You keep hey, you're going backeach year.
SPEAKER_00 (22:14):
So I do.
I do.
I do.
I do think about it all thetime.
SPEAKER_02 (22:20):
Okay, what's your favorite Italian food?
SPEAKER_00 (22:22):
Tortellini.
SPEAKER_02 (22:24):
Is it?
SPEAKER_00 (22:25):
I love tortellini.
I just love it.
I've loved it since I was a kid.
And I've been lucky enough.
I made it in Bologna.
I also made it in Modena.
These are the two towns thatfight over where it was
invented.
Uh it's a it's incredible.
And then for Christmas, a lot ofItalians have tortellini and
brodo in the in a soup, broths.
(22:46):
And uh that's a nice dish too.
SPEAKER_02 (22:48):
Yeah.
Oh boy.
Yeah, well, I I mean, uh yeah,it's it can get a bit more.
I used my the first Italian foodI like was lasagna.
unknown (22:57):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (22:57):
Oh, it's good too.
SPEAKER_02 (22:58):
Yeah, and uh so I got to like that.
Um, but I need to probably gothere a bit more myself.
I'm probably overdue for anothervisit there.
Because I I'm from Bridge fromEngland, so I usually I'm over
the across there, like at leastonce a year in Europe, anyway,
for one thing and another.
Um my sister's infer family arestill there in England, so it's
(23:21):
not far to try from Britain downto Italy somewhere, so
relatively short flight, youknow.
SPEAKER_00 (23:28):
Oh, and cheap flights, cheap, cheap flights.
SPEAKER_02 (23:30):
Oh, with a lot of competition, yeah.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (23:32):
Oh, yeah.
So it really opens it up.
And for people who want to dolike go to London for a week and
then tack on, you know, Rome,Florence, Venice, it's it's it's
uh it's definitely possible.
SPEAKER_02 (23:44):
Yeah, it it is.
So obviously, uh it peopleshould see that.
And I think Americans probablythink if they were going over to
uh Europe, Italy must be sort ofin the top three of the list, I
would think, right?
SPEAKER_00 (23:57):
I think it might even be number one.
It's become so popular, yeah.
And you know, and everyone likeAmerica September is very
crowded because everyone thinksit's not high season, and it's
like high high season becausepeople avoid July and August.
So it's um it is very, you know,we have a real affinity.
(24:18):
A lot of us, about 10% ofAmericans have Italian blood.
We have a real affinity forItaly.
Um, Americans do, and um no,it's very popular.
SPEAKER_02 (24:29):
Very popular.
Ah, okay.
Now, I'm looking at on my leftmonitor here, you can't see it.
I have on your website, Dream ofItaly, and there's a YouTube
video on the front page.
unknown (24:41):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (24:41):
Yes, that's from our very famous citizen.
And um Andrea.
Have you ever met AndreaBacelli?
SPEAKER_00 (24:49):
Well, yes, he was on season three.
I have interviewed him, met hiswife, interviewed her, met his
four dogs.
He's a big dog lover, as I am.
And we did a really unique uhepisode called Andrea Bocelli's
Tuscany, and it's about the townhe grew up in, the town where he
lives, and the town of Luca,which was uh the town of
(25:11):
Puccini, uh, the opera uhcomposer that really inspired
Becelli.
So I've actually become somewhatknown for um interviewing a
number of celebrities, uh,Francis For Coppola, Sting, um
Marissa Tomei, who've been onthe show.
And we all just love Italy somuch.
We talk, you know, we're nottotally talking about their
(25:33):
careers, we're really talkingabout Italy.
SPEAKER_02 (25:36):
Italy in general, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (25:38):
And our passion for Italy.
SPEAKER_02 (25:40):
In a way, though, Bricelli, he's probably got the
best voice on the planet, right?
SPEAKER_00 (25:44):
Yes.
SPEAKER_02 (25:45):
I think so, uh, without a doubt.
In fact, I was out of thecountry at the time, but he
played in a town quite nearwhere I live.
Greensboro smoke.
I can't remember exactly where.
SPEAKER_00 (25:57):
He really, I gotta say, he's one of the hardest
working people you will evermeet.
He tours a lot, he he he's atevery kind of Italian event.
I just went to a big uh tourismconference, a big international
tourism conference in Rome, andhe opened it singing, and the
prime minister was there, and heworks really hard.
SPEAKER_02 (26:19):
Yeah, I think well, with a voice like that, yeah, it
has to be impeccable.
It's uh it's a glorious voice,and he's done a lot of duets.
Funny, I was watching an oldYouTube video of him sing the
other day.
Um who was he singing with?
Time to say goodbye, that famoussong.
Yes, and uh who was a female?
SPEAKER_00 (26:38):
Uh oh, there's a woman, um, an Italian woman he
sings it with.
Oh you let's look that one up.
It's on the tip of my tongue.
SPEAKER_02 (26:54):
Oh, I yeah, the reason I say that is because
that particular song I played atmy father's funeral.
SPEAKER_00 (27:00):
Oh, it's Sarah Brightman again.
SPEAKER_02 (27:03):
Sarah Brightman, there you go.
SPEAKER_00 (27:04):
Right, but he has sung it with some others.
SPEAKER_02 (27:07):
Uh yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (27:07):
Oh, you really played that at his funeral.
Oh, it's a beautiful song.
SPEAKER_02 (27:10):
Yeah, the reason being is because um one of the
last tricks my father made, Iwent with him to Las Vegas and
they played that that uh songover and over again at the
Bellaggio when the fountainswent off, right?
SPEAKER_00 (27:23):
Well, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (27:24):
Yeah, and that's where Italian influence played
the song.
So yeah, it's a beautiful voice.
And um, yeah, and he just did arecent duet with Brian May from
Queen as well, but superb.
SPEAKER_00 (27:35):
He does some amazing duets.
He did one with Ed Sheeran.
He he really works witheverybody.
He's a he's really an incredibleperson.
SPEAKER_02 (27:43):
Yeah, he is.
SPEAKER_00 (27:44):
Um class act, class act, prolific, prolific and
hardworking.
SPEAKER_02 (27:49):
Yeah, exactly.
Uh I subscribe to a magazinecalled uh International Living.
SPEAKER_00 (27:55):
Oh, they do a great job, and they were like the
originals.
There's a lot of these expertsand sites coming on about moving
abroad, but they are really goodand they do conferences, they're
very good.
SPEAKER_02 (28:09):
Yeah, and they ranked uh let's say one, two,
three, four, sixth in the placeof um global retirement index of
best places to retire to.
Italy came number one.
SPEAKER_00 (28:21):
Italy.
And that's only problem withItaly is Greece came number one,
but uh what was one?
SPEAKER_02 (28:26):
Greece, Greece.
SPEAKER_00 (28:27):
They're doing a lot of incentives.
Italy, I'm telling you the toughparts, the taxes.
SPEAKER_02 (28:33):
Yeah, there you go.
And it's up there as well as uhfor healthcare, healthcare
system.
SPEAKER_00 (28:39):
Healthcare is excellent in Italy, but you also
have to live somewhere.
Not every area has great healthcare, nor is really close to a
hospital.
And unfortunately, my my familywere from the south.
It's a lot of the northern it'svery similar to the like you
know, it's uh the south wasalways poor.
(28:59):
And so the health care is verygood in Italy.
You just have to be sure youpick the right place.
Like all these people moving toSicily, which is fine.
There's health care, but if youneed something really
specialized, it may not be theeasiest or fastest place to get
it.
SPEAKER_02 (29:15):
Yeah.
But that that's I think that'simportant the older you get.
SPEAKER_00 (29:19):
You'll never go broke though, because of health
care, which you will in America.
SPEAKER_02 (29:22):
Yeah.
Well, but basically in Europe,medical costs, zero people go
broke.
SPEAKER_00 (29:28):
And you can get a private policy and you can get
amazing like extra care or animmediate care for like you
know, a thousand, two thousanddollars a year.
And so, and also if you can geton the national health system,
that depends on how yourresidency works.
But it it can be, you know, whenI talk about that retirement and
(29:51):
they talk about it, there arereal advantages.
SPEAKER_02 (29:55):
Yeah, exactly.
And uh when you when you get alot of people who want to live
overseas, that's that is aconcern.
And some of the Greece is, butItaly, France, good health
there, Spain, Portugal, theseare all places where Portugal
was I've never been.
SPEAKER_00 (30:14):
Portugal is like it sounds to me, it sounds
beautiful, but everyone andtheir mother is moving to
Portugal, and um, you know, Idon't know what it's
interesting, sort of what is thetolerance for so I mean it it
helps the economy, but it's aninteresting time to watch that.
SPEAKER_02 (30:30):
Okay, well, you know, that that's a that there
is one other major factor thatum when people consider moving
somewhere, and I I always saythis to people because it's it
even when you vacation there,and uh I I travel a lot these
days, but I will consult whatsomething called the Global
Peace Index.
(30:51):
You have a look at that?
SPEAKER_00 (30:52):
I've heard of it, yes.
SPEAKER_02 (30:54):
Yeah, and it looks at the safety of a place, which
is very important, and thesafest place in the world today
is Iceland.
SPEAKER_00 (31:03):
Fascinating.
SPEAKER_02 (31:05):
Yeah, well, it's small, but it's safe to go to,
and there's a lot of safety.
Very community Italy ranksfairly well in that, by the way.
SPEAKER_00 (31:13):
Yes, I always it's it's actually I did a special
for PBS called Travel, Transformand Thrive about moving to Italy
or or living the Italianlifestyle.
And we talked about safety.
I travel a lot by myself aroundItaly.
You know, there's the issue ofsay pickpockets or you know,
walking alone at night, but Ihave always felt extremely safe
(31:38):
in Italy.
SPEAKER_02 (31:39):
Yeah, yeah, true.
And um not I am living there asmuch as you are, I've only been
there.
SPEAKER_00 (31:44):
And or I guess the global peace index.
SPEAKER_02 (31:46):
I've never had a problem there walking around at
night, and that's the key, isn'tit?
You've got to be able to walk inthe world.
But is it also about war?
SPEAKER_00 (31:51):
I don't think they're going to war anytime
soon if we're talking abouthopefully not.
SPEAKER_02 (31:56):
No, they they're just they they just like to be
Italy doing their own thing.
People live there, they'rehappy, and it's a peace, and
it's safe.
And you know, uh you know, allthese these countries that uh
rank in the top 30 or so, Imean, are safe places to go to.
And I worry about that becauseit global peace index is sort of
(32:20):
used by travel companies to lookat the trying to get a company.
I'm gonna take a closer look atit.
And based on the safety, and umI don't know if you know this
where the USA is is ranked.
SPEAKER_00 (32:31):
50?
SPEAKER_02 (32:32):
No.
SPEAKER_00 (32:34):
25?
SPEAKER_02 (32:35):
No.
SPEAKER_00 (32:37):
100.
SPEAKER_02 (32:38):
128.
SPEAKER_00 (32:43):
That wasn't there like 190 countries or something.
SPEAKER_02 (32:46):
No, it's based on it 163.
SPEAKER_00 (32:48):
Now I wonder I wonder if it's because of guns.
SPEAKER_02 (32:51):
If what?
SPEAKER_00 (32:53):
Guns.
SPEAKER_02 (32:54):
Yeah, yeah.
Well, I that may have somethingto do with it.
SPEAKER_00 (32:57):
I think that's part of the weight of it.
Whether you're, you know, I'mnot making a political
statement, but I think we havegone violence, and that way is
it.
SPEAKER_02 (33:05):
Yeah, it's violence.
So it's that that's that's why.
SPEAKER_00 (33:08):
So that is staggering.
Yeah, you know, but I love whenI come on a podcast and I learn
something, you know.
I'm not just sharing, I'mlearning.
Very interesting.
SPEAKER_02 (33:20):
I know, so it's become a a concern.
I I look at it more now.
I mean, in recent years, in theindustry.
It's a crazy time.
2021.
I was in Kiev in the Ukraine,right before the war started,
and it was uh there was a lot ofnervousness in the air there,
but it was I could see somethingmight happen, of course, earlier
on in February the next year, itdid, you know.
(33:40):
So I got in and got out safely,but you you never know, right?
Um, so you know, there's someplaces that go up and down that
list each year, um, based on anumber of factors.
About how many is about 20 oddfactors that determine the
peacefulness of a place, butItaly fares quite well.
So basically, what you've gothere is a place that's safe,
(34:02):
it's beautiful, food is great,um, and uh it's livable, you
know, and so you've got allthese factors that might
encourage people to go livethere, so oh a lot of them are
going.
Yeah, so it's all good.
Now, if someone wanted to gethold of you, um Kathy, you've
got your website,dreamofitally.com, and they're
(34:24):
gonna have to play that videothat you've got on the front
page of Andrea.
Uh, so you've got the um travelmagazine there, and uh um can
they book trips by you?
SPEAKER_00 (34:33):
Yes, I have a service where I refer them.
I can consult on a trip, but Ialso refer them to some uh
someone I trust to book theirtrip.
And we're very into like thelocal experiences, and you know,
I'm all for like you go toVenice and you want to get on
the gondola.
So do all the things that you'vedreamed of, but then like a
little twist on them.
SPEAKER_02 (34:54):
Yeah, and also for Americans to go to Italy, you
can use a train system.
It's pretty funny.
SPEAKER_00 (34:59):
The train system is really, really good, very
impressive to Americans.
I'm the granddaughter of a steamlocomotive engineer, and I wish
you know, American trains.
I love trains.
I wish we had more um weinvested more in them and uh
public transport trains.
SPEAKER_02 (35:17):
I know that'd be a great idea.
You want to go to I'm back inEngland uh in February, but I'll
be taking the train there.
unknown (35:23):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (35:24):
And it's perfectly safe and uh sufficient.
So, you know, provided they'renot a strike, but it's it's
decent.
SPEAKER_00 (35:30):
So oh, Italy has their strikes too.
SPEAKER_02 (35:33):
So it's all good.
So um, so with a weird question,if you have to move there.
Oh, you you yeah, I think youalready have to that should
probably go um to Tuscany area,wouldn't you?
SPEAKER_00 (35:45):
That's probably what uh um yeah, which is very I I
have, but I'm like I like citiestoo.
So I've looked at some cities inAmelia Romagna, Milan.
I mean, not forever, maybe for alittle bit of time.
But my biggest piece of advice Iis go and try out the place.
You know, you can rent a placefor a few months.
I'm always amazed.
(36:06):
I guess unless you have a truecalling to a place, these people
just go and buy a house.
I mean, they're not veryexpensive, but you know, uh I
think trying places out is agood idea.
Um, but Tuscany, Tuscany justhas a little, I love the seaside
in Tuscany.
You know, Tuscany really has alittle bit of everything.
SPEAKER_02 (36:25):
Yeah.
So if you're advising someonewho's never been to Italy
before, where would you advisethem to go to and how long
should they stay?
SPEAKER_00 (36:35):
Well, I mean, I think Rome, Venice, and
Florence, and you might agree,or sort of even if you didn't
like Venice, you at least sawit.
And I I kind of believe youcould do three days in each of
those places.
And then depending on, you know,do you love the seaside?
Do you love the countryside?
Do you like wine?
You know, maybe adding in someof the countryside of Tuscany.
(36:57):
You can definitely do thecountryside of the Veneto near
Venice.
People, you know, a lot ofpeople will also do Naples, you
know, the big three Naples,Pompeii, Amalfi Coast.
Look, the Amalfi Coast isgorgeous, beautiful, but it's
overrun.
I'm sorry.
I love it.
And it's so expensive.
(37:18):
I mean, these hotels I went to20 years ago that were
reasonable are now like$2,000 anight.
And so it breaks my heart alittle bit.
Um, but if you are gonna go tothe Amalfi Coast, I say May,
October.
Please don't go in July or youknow, there's only that one
road.
SPEAKER_02 (37:36):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (37:37):
I've driven it, and now I think they're doing um
every other day certain licenseplates.
And it's not the it's just youcan it cannot handle all the
people.
SPEAKER_02 (37:47):
What about in fact it just came to my brain cells
there because the last time Iwas on a cruise ship go through
the Mediterranean, we stopped inPalermo, Sicily.
And I didn't know what to expectthere, but it was it was just
nice walking around.
That cathedral is fantasticthere.
SPEAKER_00 (38:03):
Oh, Sicily is uh, I want to do, we haven't done
Sicily on the TV show, andthat's sort of next for us.
And you know, everyone invadedSicily too, so there's so many
influences like Arab and Greekand um Sicily's a whole other
trip.
You know, Sicily is a wholeother thing, um, but a wonderful
place.
SPEAKER_02 (38:23):
Yep, there's so many wonderful places, not enough
time to do it.
So, anyway, hopefully uh peoplewill listen to you and get the
urge, they've got to do it, youknow.
SPEAKER_00 (38:33):
Do it now, also.
SPEAKER_02 (38:35):
I'm a very big in the state, live in the state, at
least travel overseas a bituntil there comes a time when
you don't want to get on a planeor you can't get on a plane
anymore, then then you can gosee the rest of the United
States.
SPEAKER_00 (38:48):
You know, yeah.
No, I always say do it whileyou're healthy, and you don't
know how long that will be, andfor various reasons, and people
have kids and parents, and likewhen you have the window, take
it.
SPEAKER_02 (39:00):
Exactly.
SPEAKER_00 (39:01):
You can make the money back, you can you know
save another time.
SPEAKER_02 (39:05):
You know, yeah.
Excellent.
All right, well, it's greathearing from you, um Kathy, and
I know and uh I'm sure you willenjoy yourself and looking
forward to the next time you arethere.
SPEAKER_00 (39:17):
I'm going for the Olympics.
SPEAKER_02 (39:19):
Good for you, yes, yes, and uh well, I'll have to
turn the TV on, and when thatcomes on, and uh you'll see so
many beautiful places.
SPEAKER_00 (39:28):
It's I mean you can watch just for the scenery, not
even just for the sports.
SPEAKER_02 (39:32):
Yeah, exactly.
It's all right.
Well, have a great time.
When did you say you're leaving,by the way, for Italy next?
SPEAKER_00 (39:38):
Oh, end of January.
End of January start.
Yep.
So I am a big proponent of Italyin the winter, and I'm looking
because you know, all the hotelsyou want to go to, unless
they're seasonal, the bestrates.
You know, you're going February,March, you're you know, you can
get into the restaurants, it's agood time to go.
SPEAKER_02 (39:57):
Guys, I just wonder whether when you go to Italy,
you've been there so many times,you go through immigration, and
they say, Welcome back, Kathy.
SPEAKER_00 (40:04):
I don't know, they should.
Um but you know, it's funny isI'm recognized in Italy because
I have the show.
Americans, if you see me inDenver, I have been recognized
in Denver, but more Americansrecognize me in Italy because A,
I always try to put makeup onand look a little nicer in
Italy, and B, I'm in the contextof the TV show.
(40:26):
Like you're seeing me with thecobblestones, and they're like,
oh, you're from Dream of Italy.
So it's fun.
I do, I do get recognized whenI'm there.
SPEAKER_02 (40:35):
All right.
Well, well, wonderful.
Um, with your website, uh, doyou update the pictures on that
from time to time?
SPEAKER_00 (40:42):
I should.
I've left that Picelli thing upthere for a while.
But if you come to like theInstagram or TikTok, we have all
kinds of okay.
SPEAKER_02 (40:50):
Well, send send me your your Instagram uh detail.
SPEAKER_00 (40:53):
All of it is Dream of Italy, really easy.
SPEAKER_02 (40:55):
Okay, last easy.
Same thing for everything.
Excellent.
Well, all right, Kathy, greathaving you on.
Thanks so much, Malcolm.
Go ahead and I'm going to joinI'm gonna check out this peace
index.
SPEAKER_00 (41:05):
I've learned something today.
Thank you.
It's interesting.
SPEAKER_02 (41:10):
Okay, got it.
SPEAKER_00 (41:11):
Okay.
SPEAKER_02 (41:12):
Well, good talking to you, and it was great.
SPEAKER_00 (41:15):
Let me know.
Yeah, we'll share it too.
Okay, bye.
Take care, bye-bye.
SPEAKER_01 (41:21):
That's it for this episode of the Travel Addict
Podcast, where we chase sunsets,flirt with danger, and
occasionally make questionablechoices in foreign lands.
Until next time, may yourflights be on time.
And your travel stories justscandalous enough to leave a few
details out.
Check out Malcolm's websites atmalcolmteesdale.com and
(41:43):
travelingenglishman.com.
Safe travels and enjoy life,everyone.
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