January 18, 2026 • 41 mins
Download Lisa's LAUNCH framework.
We map a partner-led framework that turns original research into an event-first engine for trust, relevance, and pipeline. From picking credible partners to unveiling findings on expert panels, we show how one study can fuel a year of targeted, high-signal content.
• why original research beats AI‑generated content
• how to choose partners with shared ICP and credibility
• using customer language to shape survey topics
• assembling minimum viable assets during fielding
• unveiling insights on expert panels without your team
• small events as strong intent signals
• feedback loops via platforms and post‑event surveys
• nurturing with themes, tools, and persona content
• translating practitioner–executive language gaps
• co‑promotion across newsletters, Slack, and LinkedIn
• timing a yearly research cycle for maximum impact
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Meet Lisa Shaw
Lisa Shaw is the founder of Devon Point Group, where she partners with global technology brands on research-driven thought leadership programs. A former journalist turned content strategist, she combines deep analytical skills with storytelling to create high-impact marketing campaigns. Her team's work has earned recognition from the Web Marketing Association and HSMA. Lisa writes about B2B event marketing strategy at MarTech.org.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_00 (00:34):
Welcome to Marketing.
I'm Sarah No Block.
This show is made for soloconsultants who want to get
booked out without burning out.
If you've ever thought, I justwant this to feel easier, you're
not alone.
Around here, we focus on simple,sustainable growth that actually
fits into your life so growthfeels doable instead of
overwhelming.
(00:56):
I'm gonna take my shoes off,relax a little bit, settle right
in.
There we go.
Um, okay, I'm really excitedabout this topic because I so
we're talking today aboutoriginal research and tying it
into events, an event firststrategy with that.
(01:16):
And I haven't seen that before.
So when I was looking at yourform, I was like, ooh, I'm gonna
learn a lot today.
SPEAKER_01 (01:23):
Yes, it's just a different channel and it's just
a way to make the research moreof an experience, like more 3D
rather than something flat.
SPEAKER_00 (01:34):
Yeah, that's a whole different way than like I work
with a decent amount of originalresearchers, and I haven't seen
anybody apply it in this way.
So before we get into all ofthat, can you introduce yourself
to the audience?
SPEAKER_01 (01:48):
Yes, absolutely.
I'm Lisa Shaw.
I'm the founder of Devon Point.
Um, my company works it's asmall content strategy practice.
My company works with um B2Btech founders and B2B technology
companies.
We focus mostly on originalcontent.
So my background is injournalism.
(02:09):
I still write for more tech onevent marketing.
And one of the most importantthings that companies can focus
on right now is the kind ofcontent that AI can't reproduce.
So by definition, eventsessions, subject matter expert
interviews, and originalresearch are areas that it
literally hasn't happened yet.
(02:30):
So no LLMs can train on it.
SPEAKER_00 (02:33):
Yeah.
That's where I'm focused, right?
That's that's brilliant.
That is absolutely brilliant.
So similar thought process whereit's like anything that AI can't
do or replicate is where youneed to focus because then you
can use AI to make like toexpand on whatever it is or
repurpose whatever it is thatyou're creating, but create
(02:56):
something original first becausethen that can't be duplicated.
There is no original thought inAI.
So I love this angle.
Can you walk me through how totie original research to an
event?
Absolutely.
So I have a whole framework forit.
Oh, I love the framework.
SPEAKER_01 (03:16):
And we all do.
Every, every small marketerneeds them.
And you know, you do such agreat job of bringing those
resources to our community ofsmall marketing teams where we
are always stretched forresources, right?
So yes, original research is oneof those things where you think,
oh, I really need a big team orI really need a big budget.
(03:37):
And that's why this framework isorganized this way.
Because no, I'm gonna show youthat you do not.
Um, what you meet are friends,partners.
And the partners are the focus.
The partners are people that youwork with for credibility and
reach.
And then they also are kind ofthe the cornerstone of the of
(04:02):
the event process.
So I'll start.
If you want me to start to talkabout the framework, I can't.
SPEAKER_00 (04:07):
Yeah, I'm dying.
I'm dying to know.
Like I'm I love partnerships.
Go on.
SPEAKER_01 (04:12):
Yeah, so awesome.
So research, the the frameworkis is called Blanche, and it's
based on um leading withpartners.
That's the L in the framework.
Lead with your partners.
You really need to get yourpartners on board, and they're
the ones who are going to beguiding the research because
(04:34):
they're the ones who are closeto the community.
They're the ones who know wherethe pain points are, they're the
ones who know really intimatelytheir membership because they
are there to serve theirmembership.
Um, and you're like, okay,partners, how do you find
partners, right?
SPEAKER_00 (04:49):
I was literally going to say, let's pause and
let's talk about like what makesa good partner.
Okay.
SPEAKER_01 (04:55):
So what makes a good partner?
Somebody in your space, right?
So when you think aboutpartners, credibility and reach,
you want to be able to partnerwith some organization that is
already has your ICP in it,right?
People who are going to benefitfrom the survey that you're
doing or the research thatyou're doing, and also be an
(05:16):
audience for you when you wantto talk to them after the survey
research is published.
So chances are very good.
Many companies haveorganizations that they partner
with already.
Um and you may have them, yourexecutives may have them.
Um, but if you don't, you know,you there's somewhere between 60
and 80,000 professionalorganizations in the United
(05:39):
States.
Those organizations servemembers.
And if they are in your industryor in your vertical, they would
be great partners becausethey're focused on member
services and you are focused ongetting research that you can
then repurpose in yourmarketing.
Um, one of the other reallygreat ways to find a good
(06:01):
partner is something that youtalk about in your masterclass
and in a podcast.
In niche communities, right?
You go, I know, right?
So quality over quantity, everytime.
If you get a few hundred reallyqualified respondents and a few
hundred really qualified people,those are a good pipeline.
(06:22):
Even if it's not thousands,they're really qualified and
they're showing intense signals.
So that's where we focus.
That's why this is number oneleading with the partners is so
important.
SPEAKER_00 (06:34):
Okay, let's pause before we move to A.
Okay.
Um, so with the partnerships,you're looking for someone who
has the same ICP as you so theycan get them to participate in
the survey.
So you have their data, but youcan also then share that survey
(06:59):
result with those communities.
And so you kind of have a leg upon whatever content you create
from that research.
Exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (07:09):
And they are also making sure that your survey
topics are credible, right?
So you want to make sure thatwhat you're doing research on is
not just self-serving.
You really need you need to gointo this in the in this frame,
you know, frame of mind thatyou're going to create a piece
of research that is not going tobe talking about your company,
(07:31):
but that you have leverage totalk about your company in a way
that people who are who thistopic resonates with will
understand, right?
You are going to go in as athought leader at that moment.
So that's why partnership is soimportant because they have the
access and they have thecredibility with those
(07:53):
communities.
SPEAKER_00 (07:55):
Yeah, it is pretty ick when you're seeing something
come out and it's just about thecompany.
Like, what am I supposed to dowith this?
SPEAKER_01 (08:03):
How do I apply this?
Right.
And as marketers, right, we havewhat um Hemingway called
built-in BS detectors, right?
That's true.
We can smell it.
We know we're living that life.
We totally do.
And it the mint, so here's areally good example of that.
So for one of the projects thatI did for a client, we got 83%
(08:24):
of our responses came from ourpartner communities.
Like we probably should havegotten this, but people weren't
interested because it was a itwas a we're a vendor, right?
This client was a vendor andthey they weren't trusting it.
But when it came from theircommunity, people were really
interested in the topic becauseit was more credible.
And one of the things that wedid during planning of that
(08:45):
research, we were using a termthat the community did not use
to describe themselves.
And if we didn't have thepartner to give us that insight,
we would have gone out therewith that like clunky term that
would have turned people offimmediately.
SPEAKER_00 (08:59):
Yeah, that's such a good point.
And you can pull that tip intoabsolutely everything.
If you're using jargon or phrasethat you specifically use
because you don't know what theyuse in their life or their job,
it's gonna ring that spell forthem because they're like,
(09:20):
you're not one of us.
Exactly.
Exactly.
And they know, right?
Yeah, they know.
Um, real quick before we move tothe A, one thing that you can
do, so not you, but you as thelistener can do to make sure
that you're using the rightphrasing that your clients use
(09:43):
is to pull the transcripts fromyour sales calls and the
meetings that you have withthem.
And you can throw thosetranscripts into ChatGPT and
ask, like, how does my idealcustomer talk about X, whatever
it is you're doing the researchon?
And you can find the specificwords because you're using their
transcript that they use, andthen just mirror that
(10:05):
description.
That is a great use of Chat GPT.
Um, yeah, transcripts plus chatGPT makes me very happy.
And then this is okay.
Now we can move to now we'reready.
Now we're ready.
SPEAKER_01 (10:20):
Now we're ready.
So A is for assemble assets,right?
So the assets are everything.
It's what your company is gonnause to build on this research.
And while the research is in thefield, you have to be making a
plan, especially if you're areally small team, which most of
your listeners are.
Um, you need a plan.
So you're gonna be puttingtogether your assets.
(10:42):
You you have to figure out,okay, what's my minimum viable
content plan?
Right.
The minimum viable content planis number one, the re the
research report.
I where is it gonna live?
Is it gonna live on yourwebsite?
Is it gonna be a PDF?
Is it gonna be on a Notion page?
Are you gonna gate it?
How are you gonna gate it?
(11:03):
Like all of those things youhave to figure that out.
Do you have the resources fordesign, right?
So that's another expense.
If you have the resources to dothat, great.
If not, you can create, maybeyou can work with um a graphic
artist just to create some ofthe data visualizations that are
gonna be the foundation of yourmarketing, right?
(11:25):
So that'll be a greatinvestment.
Um, once you've figured outwhere your report is going to
live and whether or not it'sgoing to be gated.
So do you need a landing page?
Do you need an inertian page?
The next thing you need are acouple of blogs.
Number one is the blog that'sgonna basically encapsulate all
of the research bindings.
This is gonna be the number onepiece that will have all of the
(11:48):
charts and all of the analysis.
It's gonna be your long formpiece and you're gonna pull
from.
Um, make sure you have anotherblog on deck.
And there are so many differentways to repurpose um research.
And you can figure out is itgonna be something that you're
gonna target to a particularmember of your audience?
So, you know, so that you havethat to lead with.
(12:10):
The next thing that you need tohave is a webinar deck because
remember, we're leading with theevent.
So you're gonna pull all of thattogether into a deck, and you're
gonna be using those charts andthose graphs from the research
project, and they're gonna putthose in a deck so that you're
ready to go.
Those graphics and thoseinfographics, they're gonna be a
(12:33):
key part of the next one, whichis a social carousel, right?
So all of the key findings willgo in the social carousel.
And then finally, the best thingthat I recommend is having a
lead magnet.
When you go to an event,everybody likes to have it
downloadable, like a littlesomething extra, right?
So you feel like, okay, I washeard and this is awesome, and
(12:54):
I'm gonna get this nice littlegift.
Um, so all of that has to bedone in advance, right?
So that when you have yourevent, you're you're gonna
launch, you're gonna be ready togo.
So during this couple of months,so the surveys in the field,
maybe six weeks, right?
So you've got a couple of monthsof planning time that you need
(13:14):
to put in and you're gonna puttogether a plan, a plan of
assets and a timeline and yourminimum viable content, you
know, put it all, pull all ofthose things together so that
once the research does startcoming in, you can you can pull
it all together and say, okay,did what we expect from the
(13:34):
beginning actually happen,right?
Where are our hypothesesvalidated?
What does the research actuallyshow?
Are we going to be able to tellthe stories that we thought we
were going to be able to tell inour planning meetings?
So that's gonna give you a goodframework.
So you're going out, you havesome assets ready, you have a
calendar so that you have amonthly kind of an idea of what
(13:58):
you're gonna be talking aboutmonth to month because you want
to make this stretch out for ayear.
You want a full year of contentfrom this.
So you have your themes, right?
Every month is gonna be a theme.
And now you've got this wholeplan.
It's already laid out.
You don't have everything filledin yet because you're gonna let
the data do the talking.
(14:19):
So now you're ready.
You're ready, you've goteverything in place, and you're
ready for your you.
Are we ready to move on?
I am.
Okay, so you is for unveil, andwe're unveiling the research at
our events, and the researchbecomes a shared experience.
(14:40):
And here's where we go back toour partners again.
Your partners have relationshipswith the people who have taken
your survey.
They are influencers in theirfield or they're experts in
their field, and they are goingto be on your panel.
This webinar is going to be themtalking about the research in
(15:00):
ways that only they can.
The most importantly interestingto remember is who is not on the
panel is you.
Nobody from your company is onthat panel because that's an
instant drop in credibility,right?
You don't want to be there.
You are the thought leaderbehind it.
(15:21):
You funded it, right?
You are just as interested inthe results from this research
as anybody else.
But if you put yourself on thatpanel, you automatically taint
the credibility of the research.
So that's the hardest thing.
It's the hardest thing.
Yeah, companies, right?
That is the hardest thing.
(16:41):
And I think that getting buy-infrom an executive, I think that
the the companies that I haveworked with show a lot of faith
because the executives are like,yeah, I can see that, but they
have to understand why that'simportant.
Because the research by itselfis not going to promote your
company.
It's what you do with itafterwards.
(17:02):
And the more credible it is andthe more it resonates with the
communities that you're tryingto reach, the better able you'll
be able to use that andrepurpose that content
afterwards, right?
SPEAKER_00 (17:13):
Yeah, that makes complete sense.
I so now that you're walking methrough it, I'm picturing this
as probably more of like amid-sized company that's doing
this if they are funding theresearch and then having the um
the influencers on the panel.
(17:34):
It would be less someone who'slike a tiny business, like a
solo business.
They're not going to be fundingsomething like this.
They'll probably beparticipating.
Right.
One of the survey participants,maybe.
SPEAKER_01 (17:50):
Or they could team up with others in the industry
and do a survey that benefitsall of them, right?
By definition.
Yeah, like a group.
Yeah.
Exactly.
Because by definition, thesurvey is agnostic.
The topics are topics thatpeople in the community are
interested in.
And then each one of theparticipants and each one of the
(18:12):
funders can then use thatresearch to their own benefit.
It doesn't have to be a bigcompany, right?
It can be a smaller companybecause remember, the partners
that you're that you're workingwith, you're not paying, right?
Yeah.
They're getting the research.
They're getting the end.
Exactly.
Exactly.
You're organizing it and they'regetting the research.
(18:33):
So that's a value add for theirmembership, right?
It's the very definition of awin-win.
And who doesn't like a goodwin-win?
SPEAKER_00 (18:41):
Um, I do.
I love that.
And I think that makes so muchsense though.
Like for maybe people who arelistening who are solo
consultants, if you team up withother solo consultants that are
going after the same ICP as youor dream client, um, that way
you can get research that youcan leverage for your own
(19:02):
business, but you're alsosharing the workload.
Exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (19:07):
So one of my clients, they had they had a
couple of partners that workedwith them on research.
So they did a couple of webinarsbecause each one of their
communities wanted to have theirown, right?
They wanted to have their ownexperts and their own people on
the panel.
So we did a couple of launcheswith that particular research
project.
(19:28):
And each one of those webinarsonly had 200 people register and
maybe 40 to 50 people show.
So it was really small, butthose audiences were, those were
intent signals, right?
Those audiences were locked intothat research.
They were, they were, they wereready for it, right?
(19:49):
They were ready for thefollow-up that came afterwards
because they had alreadyexpressed this is this is a
serious pain point.
And they heard that reflectedback at them in the webinar.
They heard it from experts theyalready trusted.
So when we followed up, when theclient followed up afterwards
with, hey, we noticed this wasan issue for you, they were
(20:10):
ready.
They were primed because wealready heard their voices.
So the webinar itself doesn'thave to be hundreds and hundreds
of people if those people arereally um targeted in your ICP.
SPEAKER_00 (20:24):
Yeah.
And I personally do not careabout the size of how many
people are at an event.
It's who is at the event.
Is it the right people in theroom?
Exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (20:36):
Exactly.
So one of the other things thatcame from most of the um
webinars, you do thesatisfaction studies afterwards,
right?
The survey, how did you likethis?
And some of this, some of thesome of these events become so
popular that people are sogratified, right?
That they're that they, oh wow,my pain point was reflected back
(20:58):
and these people get me.
I it's so exciting to hear this.
Like these people are in thetrenches every day.
Um, we get great feedback,quality feedback, and we can use
those quotes in socialcampaigns, which is another
smart, right?
It's just another source of justanother source of great content.
SPEAKER_00 (21:18):
Quick question What event platform do you use for
this where you get feedbackright away?
SPEAKER_01 (21:24):
So um my partners that work on the platforms.
Some of them are using Goldcast.
Some of them are using Rev.
I don't I don't know the techstacks of all the different
partners because we don't usingdifferent ones.
(21:44):
They're all using differentones.
Yes.
I'm trying to remember some ofthe ones, but those are the two
that popped out.
SPEAKER_00 (21:50):
I had someone from Goldcast on the show before.
I see they're great.
Yeah.
Um, so for the little guys whoare watching this, you can get
automatic feedback usingplatforms like Demio or Butter.
So those are two that I knowthat are interactive event
(22:12):
platforms that alsoautomatically request feedback
from attendees.
SPEAKER_01 (22:18):
I have actually been on an event with a on the Butter
platform, and it's really good.
It's it's easy.
SPEAKER_00 (22:25):
Yes, I used Butter for a long time.
It got a little glitchy to thepoint where I was like, I can't
use this until the glitches arefixed because it would like
bounce me out as the host.
I have like 50 problems a lot.
I'm like fix this and I'll comeback because everything else I
(22:45):
loved.
SPEAKER_01 (22:48):
Oh, that sounds so cringe.
Oh my god.
SPEAKER_00 (22:51):
Oh my god.
I got so lucky though, because Ihad some attendees there that
are friends of mine and juststepped up and like talked until
I was able to get back in.
Yeah.
Okay.
Go on.
Okay.
We're on.
We're ready.
SPEAKER_01 (23:11):
So the end is for nurture and nurture
continuously, right?
So remember, we we blocked outour plan.
We have our month-to-month umthemes, right?
So we we've already launchedwith our minimum viable content
plan.
And now we're going, we're notdoing any random publishing.
We we have a plan, but we'regoing to use engagement metrics
(23:34):
to figure out what are we goingto publish next?
Because this research now is anendless source of great content.
How are we going to produce it?
What channels are peopleresponding in?
And where do we need to go next?
So infographics, right?
Checklists, so many differentways that you can repurpose
that.
(23:55):
For one of my clients, I did aninteractive tool.
And this was really cool becauseit was a really low lift for
their little team.
It had we just everybody is sucha small team.
We have so many things that wehave to do.
But we were able to pulltogether this interacted tool
using type form that drilleddown on a pain point that people
(24:17):
were coming back and saying, ohmy gosh, this is so huge.
We could see it in theengagement with some of the
blogs.
We could see it in some of thecomments.
And that's what we did.
So this tool was aself-assessment.
Like, where do you really land?
How is this affecting you andyour work?
And it was a simple, I thinkmaybe seven or eight question
(24:38):
self-assessment, but it was sucha huge, huge thing.
It became the number one driverfor this client's amazing demo
request.
That was awesome.
I know it was smooth.
So just this one thing that weproduced from a survey became
this interactive tool that theynow use for their other
(25:01):
campaigns.
People are really excitedbecause they answer these
questions, they get some instantanswers.
And then when the companydecided to use it for other
campaigns, they had additionaldownloads from the company's own
white papers and, you know,other resources.
Brilliant.
It was awesome.
It was a really great thing.
(25:21):
So nurturing continuously is theway to go and letting the um
letting the data inform yournext plan for what you're going
to do for your next piece ofcontent.
SPEAKER_00 (25:33):
This is so intriguing.
So when I saw events andresearch, I was like, how do you
do an in-person event basedaround research?
But your panel idea, like itwould work in-person, virtual,
anything.
I don't know why my mindautomatically went to in-person.
(25:54):
Do not know because the vastmajority of the events I attend
are online.
But your panel idea is so smartbecause then people are giving
feedback and their observationsaround the research that was
pulled out from that and whatthey learned.
For sure.
SPEAKER_01 (26:13):
But you know what?
It also works in person.
So for one of the events thatwere one of the research
projects that I did, one of theevents that this research was
used in was an in-person event.
One of the partners decided thisresearch was so resonant with
their community that they theystood up a whole session at
(26:34):
their in-person event around theresearch.
So we weren't necessarily there.
We weren't on that panel either,but it just expanded the reach.
And of course, the client's namewas all over the research
because, you know, they fundedit.
SPEAKER_00 (26:51):
So okay, hold on.
I got an idea too.
Um the in-person conferencesthat are related to what your
research is.
Like, couldn't someone come inas like who is a panelist on one
of your webinars as a keynotespeaker and talk through those
data points.
Yeah.
Like there's so much you can doto expand the reach using
(27:14):
leveraging other people's eventstoo.
SPEAKER_01 (27:16):
Absolutely.
And that's where the partnerscome in, right?
You know, you just need thatreach.
And again, if the survey wasdone properly and designed well
and it's good quality data,people want good information,
right?
It's it it resonates with awhole bunch of different
audiences.
(27:37):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (27:38):
Yeah, makes complete sense.
Did that rebuff launch?
Like, was was are we on our H?
No, we have one more letter ofa.
Okay, that's what I thought.
SPEAKER_01 (27:53):
We are co-promoting now.
We are co-promoting with ourpartners.
And what we were just talkingabout, right?
The events where you could usethis research and in person, it
kind of goes along with this.
So your partners have access tochannels that you don't right.
They have subscribers.
Maybe they have a newsletter.
So their subscribers get thenewsletter every month or every
(28:15):
week.
You can talk about the researchin there.
The partners can.
Um, they have LinkedIn DMs andthey have their own um, their
own contacts on LinkedIn.
They also have private Slackcommunities where they are
always talking about differentthings.
And they can research.
I know, me too.
And they can bring the researchto the private Slack
(28:35):
communities.
And everywhere they go, they arebringing good quality research
that people have alreadyexpressed interest in.
And the client's name isattached to that research,
right?
So, what is the statistic that95% of your customers are not
actually going to buy from youright now?
That you need to be, you need tobe thinking about thought
(28:57):
leadership.
You need to be thinking aboutbrand.
And this is the way to do thatby working with people who are
credible in your industry andputting your name behind good
quality research that just can'tbe reproduced anywhere else.
So you give the partners whatyou're doing, right?
You've you've now you've alreadygot your months planned out and
(29:17):
you're giving them everythingthat you produce.
Okay, if you're doing if you'relooking at the research
differently, or maybe you'rerunning the cross tabs
differently, or maybe you havenew um data visualizations.
You're sharing all of that withyour partners, right?
They they may or may not use it,but at least they know what your
month's theme is and whereyou're going and what part of
(29:38):
the market you're gonna be, whatyou're gonna be talking about
with your part of the market.
Um for one project that I did,the partner hosted the research
on their website.
We got a fair number ofdownloads from ours, but there
were two and a half times thenumber of downloads of that
research from the partner sitejust because they're they're
more credible.
(29:59):
They're their community'salready there and already
comfortable with them.
So we saw a huge number of leadscome from that because the
partners, their partners arepart of the research.
They're they're really credible.
SPEAKER_00 (30:12):
Yeah, you're probably like, yes, please,
continue.
Exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (30:16):
Exactly.
Right, Coke.
Yeah, I I get your point abouthow this may not be feasible for
a really, really small likesolopreneur.
Um, but there are possibilities,right?
SPEAKER_00 (30:29):
It just stretches so far.
Yes, doing this one projectfeeds your content and your lead
generation for an entire year.
Yes.
So while I think it's possible,like your idea if you partner
with other solo consultants.
Um, I think that this would workreally well, though, for a small
(30:52):
team if they have an outsidepartner running the research.
Yeah, for sure.
Okay, now we're at H.
SPEAKER_01 (31:04):
H is for harvest insights, right?
So the numbers are great.
We all are looking for data, andthe numbers are great, but only
if they make us smarter.
So what we're gonna be tracking,we're gonna be tracking the same
thing that we do for any contentor any content campaign.
We're gonna track opens, we'regonna track downloads, we're
gonna look at our qualitativereplies to the webinars, and
(31:27):
then we're gonna think aboutwhat is it that has resonated
the most with people and whatcan we now produce to scratch
that itch.
Um, what are we uh what are welooking at?
So we've got a plan, but theactual tactic um uh uh
implementation of that plan isgonna happen in this phase where
(31:51):
we're thinking about, okay, uhone of the examples that
happened.
So uh in one of the webinarsthat we ran, uh it turned out
that this there was this painpoint in in the industry.
However, uh the two differentstakeholders within the
community were talking about itvery differently.
Uh one of them was was thepractitioner level, right?
(32:13):
They were thinking of it as, youknow, from a technology
perspective.
And the other stakeholders werethe C level, and they were
reporting back to their boardsand they were thinking about big
picture stuff.
They could not, they did nothave the language to talk to
their teams about what theirconcerns were.
And the teams were so frustratedbecause they would bring their
(32:36):
concerns to the executives andthey weren't heard because they
weren't using language that theexecutives understood.
So we saw that mismatch incommunication, and we developed
a blog series, how to talk toyour executives about pain
point.
And the executives, we had howto talk to your team or how to
(32:57):
get more from your team aroundpain point.
SPEAKER_00 (33:00):
And we watched pain point AI.
It was not the thing is right.
I have so many clients wherethat is what they're talking
about.
SPEAKER_01 (33:13):
It's well, everyone is talking about it now.
But this would no, this wasabout data quality, right?
And it does actually inform inAI because it's garbage in,
garbage out.
When you're working intechnology, you know that
anything you feed a system isjust gonna chuck it right back
at you.
And if it's garbage data, you'regonna get garbage back.
So this was a concern foreverybody, right?
(33:35):
Everybody was concerned aboutthe poor quality data, but the
tech, the tech teams weredealing with the actual data.
And the executives were like,what is it telling us and what
how can we fix it?
And they don't they don't wantto talk about the technology.
So we were we were giving thethe um the practitioner teams
(33:56):
the actual language to use.
If you have this problem, here'show you want to talk about it
with your executive.
Or if you have this problem,this is the language that your
executive will respond to.
And it was, it still is thenumber one most viewed blog on
the client site.
And the executive, I mean, eventhough the blog didn't reach as
(34:18):
many executives, that's thenumber seven.
I mean, it's just to this day,it's number seven.
SPEAKER_00 (34:22):
Yeah, and it wasn't even intended for the
executives.
It was supporting people who areworking with them.
SPEAKER_01 (34:28):
Exactly.
Exactly.
So that's just one example ofhow to repurpose and and how to
how to use the insights from thedata to inform your plan for
content.
SPEAKER_00 (34:40):
Yeah.
Yeah, and that really does liketake it in a whole other
direction.
You're they used it to rethinkhow to talk internally too.
SPEAKER_01 (34:53):
Exactly.
And it gets them, you know, itget it gets them on a little bit
closer, right?
Where they're all working towardthe same goal.
And sometimes thosecommunication gaps really
prevent people from movingthings forward.
SPEAKER_00 (35:09):
Yeah.
And often there's just adifferent perspective.
So while you may agree, it'sjust not your top priority
because an executive is going tohave a different, bigger problem
than the tech people.
Exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (35:24):
They usually do.
So that's it.
That is the launch framework.
It basically the H part is whatmakes it repeatable.
It which it's what makes it asystem.
Um, and then, you know, if if itresonated and the partners were
happy, then you can do it allagain the following year.
SPEAKER_00 (35:40):
Yes.
So quick question before we wrapup.
I know we're at time, at leaston the podcast time of things.
Um, when is the best time tolaunch research?
Like, is the is there aseasonality to it where people
are looking for it more oftenthan uh than others?
SPEAKER_01 (36:02):
I think a lot of this stuff starts at the
beginning of the year, right?
That's when we see the 2026survey of X, Y, and Z, right?
SPEAKER_00 (36:10):
That was my gut, but I'm not in the research game.
So I wasn't sure.
SPEAKER_01 (36:14):
No, that's pretty much where most of my clients
land.
They want to kick off the newyear with, you know, a look at
this or that or the other thingor insights and something to
inform their content plan andtheir marketing, their
go-to-market plan for the restof the year and having that
research to kick them off is areally good, a really good way
(36:35):
to start.
SPEAKER_00 (36:36):
So based off of the timeline that you were giving me
earlier, they should probably beready to start the research in
like September minimum.
Exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (36:49):
September, where you're talking about your
partner, talking to yourpartners and making sure that
you're aligned with them andeverybody's happy about the the
plan and then fielding it inOctober or November, maybe,
maybe even, you know, you'regoing to market in February.
Maybe you're launching andyou're gonna bypass that whole
beginning first month of Januarywe're we're talking about.
(37:11):
Not quite working yet.
Exactly.
Where we're too busy beingbombarded with come back to the
gym message.
SPEAKER_00 (37:18):
Yeah, my kids don't go back to school until
mid-January.
So I'm useless untilmid-January.
SPEAKER_01 (37:25):
Exactly.
I think a lot of people are thesame.
So, you know, there's nothingwrong with kicking off, you
know, February 1st.
And here we go.
That's the true new year.
Really is.
It really is.
SPEAKER_00 (37:37):
Thank you so much for joining me today.
Can you tell the audience howthey can find you, work with
you, where you hang out online?
SPEAKER_01 (37:46):
Absolutely.
So I am at devonpoint.com.
And once we're finished here, Iam going to put a copy of the
launch framework on my websitefor your listeners at
devonpoint.com forward slashtiny marketing so that they can
access that.
Um, I am I'm actually planningright now with my research
(38:08):
partner for 2026.
So we're hoping to have moreresources for people to download
for you know for next year.
Um, a lot of people areinterested in original research
now.
The more, what is it, work slop,I think is the new word that I
produce.
Um, the more people are lookingfor ways to differentiate.
(38:30):
And I think original research isgoing to be one of those ways.
So we're trying to get ahead ofthat and produce resources for
people to really understand whatis involved in doing a project
and and how they can getstarted.
SPEAKER_00 (38:41):
I love that.
And I think it's brilliant.
We all have to think about one,like what tech is happening
right now, and two, what theeconomy looks like and adjust
our offers accordingly, likewhat makes sense today and
always be ready to adapt.
The quick changers, the peoplewho adapt fast, they're the ones
that stick around.
SPEAKER_01 (39:02):
Absolutely.
And I think to your pointearlier, I think that's one of
the reasons why smaller teamsare actually making faster
headway with AI.
Um, just because they they'realready accustomed to adapting
very, very quickly to change.
SPEAKER_00 (39:16):
True.
And less red tape too.
The less people have to sign offon everything that you're doing.
100%.
That's why I always liked smallteams.
SPEAKER_01 (39:24):
I know.
So much more agile.
And if you see something is notworking, you can pivot right
away.
Yes.
Or double down on the stuff thatis.
SPEAKER_00 (39:32):
Lesson learned, goodbye.
That's exactly.
Exactly.
Yeah, that's why I always saymarketing is an experiment.
It doesn't matter if it fails.
That was a learning lesson.
So you know how to make thatlike what didn't work.
Cut that, try something else.
SPEAKER_01 (39:47):
Absolutely.
In technology, what we say is tofail faster, right?
SPEAKER_00 (39:52):
Yeah, they say the same thing in startups.
Fail fast, make a pivot.
Not a big deal.
Laugh for me.
It's not if this episode madethings feel a little more
doable.
I'd love to help you take thenext step with the booked out
blueprint.
It's a practical, low pressuresession to clarify your offers,
your marketing, and whatactually moves the needle.
(40:12):
You can book yours through thelink in the show notes.
You don't have to figure it outalone.
Welcome to Marketing.
I'm Sarah No Block.
This show is made for soloconsultants who want to get
booked out without burning out.
If you've ever thought, I justwant this to feel easier, you're
not alone.
Around here, we focus on simple,sustainable growth that actually
fits into your life so growthfeels doable instead of
overwhelming.
(00:56):
I'm gonna take my shoes off,relax a little bit, settle right
in.
There we go.
Um, okay, I'm really excitedabout this topic because I so
we're talking today aboutoriginal research and tying it
into events, an event firststrategy with that.
(01:16):
And I haven't seen that before.
So when I was looking at yourform, I was like, ooh, I'm gonna
learn a lot today.
SPEAKER_01 (01:23):
Yes, it's just a different channel and it's just
a way to make the research moreof an experience, like more 3D
rather than something flat.
SPEAKER_00 (01:34):
Yeah, that's a whole different way than like I work
with a decent amount of originalresearchers, and I haven't seen
anybody apply it in this way.
So before we get into all ofthat, can you introduce yourself
to the audience?
SPEAKER_01 (01:48):
Yes, absolutely.
I'm Lisa Shaw.
I'm the founder of Devon Point.
Um, my company works it's asmall content strategy practice.
My company works with um B2Btech founders and B2B technology
companies.
We focus mostly on originalcontent.
So my background is injournalism.
(02:09):
I still write for more tech onevent marketing.
And one of the most importantthings that companies can focus
on right now is the kind ofcontent that AI can't reproduce.
So by definition, eventsessions, subject matter expert
interviews, and originalresearch are areas that it
literally hasn't happened yet.
(02:30):
So no LLMs can train on it.
SPEAKER_00 (02:33):
Yeah.
That's where I'm focused, right?
That's that's brilliant.
That is absolutely brilliant.
So similar thought process whereit's like anything that AI can't
do or replicate is where youneed to focus because then you
can use AI to make like toexpand on whatever it is or
repurpose whatever it is thatyou're creating, but create
(02:56):
something original first becausethen that can't be duplicated.
There is no original thought inAI.
So I love this angle.
Can you walk me through how totie original research to an
event?
Absolutely.
So I have a whole framework forit.
Oh, I love the framework.
SPEAKER_01 (03:16):
And we all do.
Every, every small marketerneeds them.
And you know, you do such agreat job of bringing those
resources to our community ofsmall marketing teams where we
are always stretched forresources, right?
So yes, original research is oneof those things where you think,
oh, I really need a big team orI really need a big budget.
(03:37):
And that's why this framework isorganized this way.
Because no, I'm gonna show youthat you do not.
Um, what you meet are friends,partners.
And the partners are the focus.
The partners are people that youwork with for credibility and
reach.
And then they also are kind ofthe the cornerstone of the of
(04:02):
the event process.
So I'll start.
If you want me to start to talkabout the framework, I can't.
SPEAKER_00 (04:07):
Yeah, I'm dying.
I'm dying to know.
Like I'm I love partnerships.
Go on.
SPEAKER_01 (04:12):
Yeah, so awesome.
So research, the the frameworkis is called Blanche, and it's
based on um leading withpartners.
That's the L in the framework.
Lead with your partners.
You really need to get yourpartners on board, and they're
the ones who are going to beguiding the research because
(04:34):
they're the ones who are closeto the community.
They're the ones who know wherethe pain points are, they're the
ones who know really intimatelytheir membership because they
are there to serve theirmembership.
Um, and you're like, okay,partners, how do you find
partners, right?
SPEAKER_00 (04:49):
I was literally going to say, let's pause and
let's talk about like what makesa good partner.
Okay.
SPEAKER_01 (04:55):
So what makes a good partner?
Somebody in your space, right?
So when you think aboutpartners, credibility and reach,
you want to be able to partnerwith some organization that is
already has your ICP in it,right?
People who are going to benefitfrom the survey that you're
doing or the research thatyou're doing, and also be an
(05:16):
audience for you when you wantto talk to them after the survey
research is published.
So chances are very good.
Many companies haveorganizations that they partner
with already.
Um and you may have them, yourexecutives may have them.
Um, but if you don't, you know,you there's somewhere between 60
and 80,000 professionalorganizations in the United
(05:39):
States.
Those organizations servemembers.
And if they are in your industryor in your vertical, they would
be great partners becausethey're focused on member
services and you are focused ongetting research that you can
then repurpose in yourmarketing.
Um, one of the other reallygreat ways to find a good
(06:01):
partner is something that youtalk about in your masterclass
and in a podcast.
In niche communities, right?
You go, I know, right?
So quality over quantity, everytime.
If you get a few hundred reallyqualified respondents and a few
hundred really qualified people,those are a good pipeline.
(06:22):
Even if it's not thousands,they're really qualified and
they're showing intense signals.
So that's where we focus.
That's why this is number oneleading with the partners is so
important.
SPEAKER_00 (06:34):
Okay, let's pause before we move to A.
Okay.
Um, so with the partnerships,you're looking for someone who
has the same ICP as you so theycan get them to participate in
the survey.
So you have their data, but youcan also then share that survey
(06:59):
result with those communities.
And so you kind of have a leg upon whatever content you create
from that research.
Exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (07:09):
And they are also making sure that your survey
topics are credible, right?
So you want to make sure thatwhat you're doing research on is
not just self-serving.
You really need you need to gointo this in the in this frame,
you know, frame of mind thatyou're going to create a piece
of research that is not going tobe talking about your company,
(07:31):
but that you have leverage totalk about your company in a way
that people who are who thistopic resonates with will
understand, right?
You are going to go in as athought leader at that moment.
So that's why partnership is soimportant because they have the
access and they have thecredibility with those
(07:53):
communities.
SPEAKER_00 (07:55):
Yeah, it is pretty ick when you're seeing something
come out and it's just about thecompany.
Like, what am I supposed to dowith this?
SPEAKER_01 (08:03):
How do I apply this?
Right.
And as marketers, right, we havewhat um Hemingway called
built-in BS detectors, right?
That's true.
We can smell it.
We know we're living that life.
We totally do.
And it the mint, so here's areally good example of that.
So for one of the projects thatI did for a client, we got 83%
(08:24):
of our responses came from ourpartner communities.
Like we probably should havegotten this, but people weren't
interested because it was a itwas a we're a vendor, right?
This client was a vendor andthey they weren't trusting it.
But when it came from theircommunity, people were really
interested in the topic becauseit was more credible.
And one of the things that wedid during planning of that
(08:45):
research, we were using a termthat the community did not use
to describe themselves.
And if we didn't have thepartner to give us that insight,
we would have gone out therewith that like clunky term that
would have turned people offimmediately.
SPEAKER_00 (08:59):
Yeah, that's such a good point.
And you can pull that tip intoabsolutely everything.
If you're using jargon or phrasethat you specifically use
because you don't know what theyuse in their life or their job,
it's gonna ring that spell forthem because they're like,
(09:20):
you're not one of us.
Exactly.
Exactly.
And they know, right?
Yeah, they know.
Um, real quick before we move tothe A, one thing that you can
do, so not you, but you as thelistener can do to make sure
that you're using the rightphrasing that your clients use
(09:43):
is to pull the transcripts fromyour sales calls and the
meetings that you have withthem.
And you can throw thosetranscripts into ChatGPT and
ask, like, how does my idealcustomer talk about X, whatever
it is you're doing the researchon?
And you can find the specificwords because you're using their
transcript that they use, andthen just mirror that
(10:05):
description.
That is a great use of Chat GPT.
Um, yeah, transcripts plus chatGPT makes me very happy.
And then this is okay.
Now we can move to now we'reready.
Now we're ready.
SPEAKER_01 (10:20):
Now we're ready.
So A is for assemble assets,right?
So the assets are everything.
It's what your company is gonnause to build on this research.
And while the research is in thefield, you have to be making a
plan, especially if you're areally small team, which most of
your listeners are.
Um, you need a plan.
So you're gonna be puttingtogether your assets.
(10:42):
You you have to figure out,okay, what's my minimum viable
content plan?
Right.
The minimum viable content planis number one, the re the
research report.
I where is it gonna live?
Is it gonna live on yourwebsite?
Is it gonna be a PDF?
Is it gonna be on a Notion page?
Are you gonna gate it?
How are you gonna gate it?
(11:03):
Like all of those things youhave to figure that out.
Do you have the resources fordesign, right?
So that's another expense.
If you have the resources to dothat, great.
If not, you can create, maybeyou can work with um a graphic
artist just to create some ofthe data visualizations that are
gonna be the foundation of yourmarketing, right?
(11:25):
So that'll be a greatinvestment.
Um, once you've figured outwhere your report is going to
live and whether or not it'sgoing to be gated.
So do you need a landing page?
Do you need an inertian page?
The next thing you need are acouple of blogs.
Number one is the blog that'sgonna basically encapsulate all
of the research bindings.
This is gonna be the number onepiece that will have all of the
(11:48):
charts and all of the analysis.
It's gonna be your long formpiece and you're gonna pull
from.
Um, make sure you have anotherblog on deck.
And there are so many differentways to repurpose um research.
And you can figure out is itgonna be something that you're
gonna target to a particularmember of your audience?
So, you know, so that you havethat to lead with.
(12:10):
The next thing that you need tohave is a webinar deck because
remember, we're leading with theevent.
So you're gonna pull all of thattogether into a deck, and you're
gonna be using those charts andthose graphs from the research
project, and they're gonna putthose in a deck so that you're
ready to go.
Those graphics and thoseinfographics, they're gonna be a
(12:33):
key part of the next one, whichis a social carousel, right?
So all of the key findings willgo in the social carousel.
And then finally, the best thingthat I recommend is having a
lead magnet.
When you go to an event,everybody likes to have it
downloadable, like a littlesomething extra, right?
So you feel like, okay, I washeard and this is awesome, and
(12:54):
I'm gonna get this nice littlegift.
Um, so all of that has to bedone in advance, right?
So that when you have yourevent, you're you're gonna
launch, you're gonna be ready togo.
So during this couple of months,so the surveys in the field,
maybe six weeks, right?
So you've got a couple of monthsof planning time that you need
(13:14):
to put in and you're gonna puttogether a plan, a plan of
assets and a timeline and yourminimum viable content, you
know, put it all, pull all ofthose things together so that
once the research does startcoming in, you can you can pull
it all together and say, okay,did what we expect from the
(13:34):
beginning actually happen,right?
Where are our hypothesesvalidated?
What does the research actuallyshow?
Are we going to be able to tellthe stories that we thought we
were going to be able to tell inour planning meetings?
So that's gonna give you a goodframework.
So you're going out, you havesome assets ready, you have a
calendar so that you have amonthly kind of an idea of what
(13:58):
you're gonna be talking aboutmonth to month because you want
to make this stretch out for ayear.
You want a full year of contentfrom this.
So you have your themes, right?
Every month is gonna be a theme.
And now you've got this wholeplan.
It's already laid out.
You don't have everything filledin yet because you're gonna let
the data do the talking.
(14:19):
So now you're ready.
You're ready, you've goteverything in place, and you're
ready for your you.
Are we ready to move on?
I am.
Okay, so you is for unveil, andwe're unveiling the research at
our events, and the researchbecomes a shared experience.
(14:40):
And here's where we go back toour partners again.
Your partners have relationshipswith the people who have taken
your survey.
They are influencers in theirfield or they're experts in
their field, and they are goingto be on your panel.
This webinar is going to be themtalking about the research in
(15:00):
ways that only they can.
The most importantly interestingto remember is who is not on the
panel is you.
Nobody from your company is onthat panel because that's an
instant drop in credibility,right?
You don't want to be there.
You are the thought leaderbehind it.
(15:21):
You funded it, right?
You are just as interested inthe results from this research
as anybody else.
But if you put yourself on thatpanel, you automatically taint
the credibility of the research.
So that's the hardest thing.
It's the hardest thing.
Yeah, companies, right?
That is the hardest thing.
(16:41):
And I think that getting buy-infrom an executive, I think that
the the companies that I haveworked with show a lot of faith
because the executives are like,yeah, I can see that, but they
have to understand why that'simportant.
Because the research by itselfis not going to promote your
company.
It's what you do with itafterwards.
(17:02):
And the more credible it is andthe more it resonates with the
communities that you're tryingto reach, the better able you'll
be able to use that andrepurpose that content
afterwards, right?
SPEAKER_00 (17:13):
Yeah, that makes complete sense.
I so now that you're walking methrough it, I'm picturing this
as probably more of like amid-sized company that's doing
this if they are funding theresearch and then having the um
the influencers on the panel.
(17:34):
It would be less someone who'slike a tiny business, like a
solo business.
They're not going to be fundingsomething like this.
They'll probably beparticipating.
Right.
One of the survey participants,maybe.
SPEAKER_01 (17:50):
Or they could team up with others in the industry
and do a survey that benefitsall of them, right?
By definition.
Yeah, like a group.
Yeah.
Exactly.
Because by definition, thesurvey is agnostic.
The topics are topics thatpeople in the community are
interested in.
And then each one of theparticipants and each one of the
(18:12):
funders can then use thatresearch to their own benefit.
It doesn't have to be a bigcompany, right?
It can be a smaller companybecause remember, the partners
that you're that you're workingwith, you're not paying, right?
Yeah.
They're getting the research.
They're getting the end.
Exactly.
Exactly.
You're organizing it and they'regetting the research.
(18:33):
So that's a value add for theirmembership, right?
It's the very definition of awin-win.
And who doesn't like a goodwin-win?
SPEAKER_00 (18:41):
Um, I do.
I love that.
And I think that makes so muchsense though.
Like for maybe people who arelistening who are solo
consultants, if you team up withother solo consultants that are
going after the same ICP as youor dream client, um, that way
you can get research that youcan leverage for your own
(19:02):
business, but you're alsosharing the workload.
Exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (19:07):
So one of my clients, they had they had a
couple of partners that workedwith them on research.
So they did a couple of webinarsbecause each one of their
communities wanted to have theirown, right?
They wanted to have their ownexperts and their own people on
the panel.
So we did a couple of launcheswith that particular research
project.
(19:28):
And each one of those webinarsonly had 200 people register and
maybe 40 to 50 people show.
So it was really small, butthose audiences were, those were
intent signals, right?
Those audiences were locked intothat research.
They were, they were, they wereready for it, right?
(19:49):
They were ready for thefollow-up that came afterwards
because they had alreadyexpressed this is this is a
serious pain point.
And they heard that reflectedback at them in the webinar.
They heard it from experts theyalready trusted.
So when we followed up, when theclient followed up afterwards
with, hey, we noticed this wasan issue for you, they were
(20:10):
ready.
They were primed because wealready heard their voices.
So the webinar itself doesn'thave to be hundreds and hundreds
of people if those people arereally um targeted in your ICP.
SPEAKER_00 (20:24):
Yeah.
And I personally do not careabout the size of how many
people are at an event.
It's who is at the event.
Is it the right people in theroom?
Exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (20:36):
Exactly.
So one of the other things thatcame from most of the um
webinars, you do thesatisfaction studies afterwards,
right?
The survey, how did you likethis?
And some of this, some of thesome of these events become so
popular that people are sogratified, right?
That they're that they, oh wow,my pain point was reflected back
(20:58):
and these people get me.
I it's so exciting to hear this.
Like these people are in thetrenches every day.
Um, we get great feedback,quality feedback, and we can use
those quotes in socialcampaigns, which is another
smart, right?
It's just another source of justanother source of great content.
SPEAKER_00 (21:18):
Quick question What event platform do you use for
this where you get feedbackright away?
SPEAKER_01 (21:24):
So um my partners that work on the platforms.
Some of them are using Goldcast.
Some of them are using Rev.
I don't I don't know the techstacks of all the different
partners because we don't usingdifferent ones.
(21:44):
They're all using differentones.
Yes.
I'm trying to remember some ofthe ones, but those are the two
that popped out.
SPEAKER_00 (21:50):
I had someone from Goldcast on the show before.
I see they're great.
Yeah.
Um, so for the little guys whoare watching this, you can get
automatic feedback usingplatforms like Demio or Butter.
So those are two that I knowthat are interactive event
(22:12):
platforms that alsoautomatically request feedback
from attendees.
SPEAKER_01 (22:18):
I have actually been on an event with a on the Butter
platform, and it's really good.
It's it's easy.
SPEAKER_00 (22:25):
Yes, I used Butter for a long time.
It got a little glitchy to thepoint where I was like, I can't
use this until the glitches arefixed because it would like
bounce me out as the host.
I have like 50 problems a lot.
I'm like fix this and I'll comeback because everything else I
(22:45):
loved.
SPEAKER_01 (22:48):
Oh, that sounds so cringe.
Oh my god.
SPEAKER_00 (22:51):
Oh my god.
I got so lucky though, because Ihad some attendees there that
are friends of mine and juststepped up and like talked until
I was able to get back in.
Yeah.
Okay.
Go on.
Okay.
We're on.
We're ready.
SPEAKER_01 (23:11):
So the end is for nurture and nurture
continuously, right?
So remember, we we blocked outour plan.
We have our month-to-month umthemes, right?
So we we've already launchedwith our minimum viable content
plan.
And now we're going, we're notdoing any random publishing.
We we have a plan, but we'regoing to use engagement metrics
(23:34):
to figure out what are we goingto publish next?
Because this research now is anendless source of great content.
How are we going to produce it?
What channels are peopleresponding in?
And where do we need to go next?
So infographics, right?
Checklists, so many differentways that you can repurpose
that.
(23:55):
For one of my clients, I did aninteractive tool.
And this was really cool becauseit was a really low lift for
their little team.
It had we just everybody is sucha small team.
We have so many things that wehave to do.
But we were able to pulltogether this interacted tool
using type form that drilleddown on a pain point that people
(24:17):
were coming back and saying, ohmy gosh, this is so huge.
We could see it in theengagement with some of the
blogs.
We could see it in some of thecomments.
And that's what we did.
So this tool was aself-assessment.
Like, where do you really land?
How is this affecting you andyour work?
And it was a simple, I thinkmaybe seven or eight question
(24:38):
self-assessment, but it was sucha huge, huge thing.
It became the number one driverfor this client's amazing demo
request.
That was awesome.
I know it was smooth.
So just this one thing that weproduced from a survey became
this interactive tool that theynow use for their other
(25:01):
campaigns.
People are really excitedbecause they answer these
questions, they get some instantanswers.
And then when the companydecided to use it for other
campaigns, they had additionaldownloads from the company's own
white papers and, you know,other resources.
Brilliant.
It was awesome.
It was a really great thing.
(25:21):
So nurturing continuously is theway to go and letting the um
letting the data inform yournext plan for what you're going
to do for your next piece ofcontent.
SPEAKER_00 (25:33):
This is so intriguing.
So when I saw events andresearch, I was like, how do you
do an in-person event basedaround research?
But your panel idea, like itwould work in-person, virtual,
anything.
I don't know why my mindautomatically went to in-person.
(25:54):
Do not know because the vastmajority of the events I attend
are online.
But your panel idea is so smartbecause then people are giving
feedback and their observationsaround the research that was
pulled out from that and whatthey learned.
For sure.
SPEAKER_01 (26:13):
But you know what?
It also works in person.
So for one of the events thatwere one of the research
projects that I did, one of theevents that this research was
used in was an in-person event.
One of the partners decided thisresearch was so resonant with
their community that they theystood up a whole session at
(26:34):
their in-person event around theresearch.
So we weren't necessarily there.
We weren't on that panel either,but it just expanded the reach.
And of course, the client's namewas all over the research
because, you know, they fundedit.
SPEAKER_00 (26:51):
So okay, hold on.
I got an idea too.
Um the in-person conferencesthat are related to what your
research is.
Like, couldn't someone come inas like who is a panelist on one
of your webinars as a keynotespeaker and talk through those
data points.
Yeah.
Like there's so much you can doto expand the reach using
(27:14):
leveraging other people's eventstoo.
SPEAKER_01 (27:16):
Absolutely.
And that's where the partnerscome in, right?
You know, you just need thatreach.
And again, if the survey wasdone properly and designed well
and it's good quality data,people want good information,
right?
It's it it resonates with awhole bunch of different
audiences.
(27:37):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (27:38):
Yeah, makes complete sense.
Did that rebuff launch?
Like, was was are we on our H?
No, we have one more letter ofa.
Okay, that's what I thought.
SPEAKER_01 (27:53):
We are co-promoting now.
We are co-promoting with ourpartners.
And what we were just talkingabout, right?
The events where you could usethis research and in person, it
kind of goes along with this.
So your partners have access tochannels that you don't right.
They have subscribers.
Maybe they have a newsletter.
So their subscribers get thenewsletter every month or every
(28:15):
week.
You can talk about the researchin there.
The partners can.
Um, they have LinkedIn DMs andthey have their own um, their
own contacts on LinkedIn.
They also have private Slackcommunities where they are
always talking about differentthings.
And they can research.
I know, me too.
And they can bring the researchto the private Slack
(28:35):
communities.
And everywhere they go, they arebringing good quality research
that people have alreadyexpressed interest in.
And the client's name isattached to that research,
right?
So, what is the statistic that95% of your customers are not
actually going to buy from youright now?
That you need to be, you need tobe thinking about thought
(28:57):
leadership.
You need to be thinking aboutbrand.
And this is the way to do thatby working with people who are
credible in your industry andputting your name behind good
quality research that just can'tbe reproduced anywhere else.
So you give the partners whatyou're doing, right?
You've you've now you've alreadygot your months planned out and
(29:17):
you're giving them everythingthat you produce.
Okay, if you're doing if you'relooking at the research
differently, or maybe you'rerunning the cross tabs
differently, or maybe you havenew um data visualizations.
You're sharing all of that withyour partners, right?
They they may or may not use it,but at least they know what your
month's theme is and whereyou're going and what part of
(29:38):
the market you're gonna be, whatyou're gonna be talking about
with your part of the market.
Um for one project that I did,the partner hosted the research
on their website.
We got a fair number ofdownloads from ours, but there
were two and a half times thenumber of downloads of that
research from the partner sitejust because they're they're
more credible.
(29:59):
They're their community'salready there and already
comfortable with them.
So we saw a huge number of leadscome from that because the
partners, their partners arepart of the research.
They're they're really credible.
SPEAKER_00 (30:12):
Yeah, you're probably like, yes, please,
continue.
Exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (30:16):
Exactly.
Right, Coke.
Yeah, I I get your point abouthow this may not be feasible for
a really, really small likesolopreneur.
Um, but there are possibilities,right?
SPEAKER_00 (30:29):
It just stretches so far.
Yes, doing this one projectfeeds your content and your lead
generation for an entire year.
Yes.
So while I think it's possible,like your idea if you partner
with other solo consultants.
Um, I think that this would workreally well, though, for a small
(30:52):
team if they have an outsidepartner running the research.
Yeah, for sure.
Okay, now we're at H.
SPEAKER_01 (31:04):
H is for harvest insights, right?
So the numbers are great.
We all are looking for data, andthe numbers are great, but only
if they make us smarter.
So what we're gonna be tracking,we're gonna be tracking the same
thing that we do for any contentor any content campaign.
We're gonna track opens, we'regonna track downloads, we're
gonna look at our qualitativereplies to the webinars, and
(31:27):
then we're gonna think aboutwhat is it that has resonated
the most with people and whatcan we now produce to scratch
that itch.
Um, what are we uh what are welooking at?
So we've got a plan, but theactual tactic um uh uh
implementation of that plan isgonna happen in this phase where
(31:51):
we're thinking about, okay, uhone of the examples that
happened.
So uh in one of the webinarsthat we ran, uh it turned out
that this there was this painpoint in in the industry.
However, uh the two differentstakeholders within the
community were talking about itvery differently.
Uh one of them was was thepractitioner level, right?
(32:13):
They were thinking of it as, youknow, from a technology
perspective.
And the other stakeholders werethe C level, and they were
reporting back to their boardsand they were thinking about big
picture stuff.
They could not, they did nothave the language to talk to
their teams about what theirconcerns were.
And the teams were so frustratedbecause they would bring their
(32:36):
concerns to the executives andthey weren't heard because they
weren't using language that theexecutives understood.
So we saw that mismatch incommunication, and we developed
a blog series, how to talk toyour executives about pain
point.
And the executives, we had howto talk to your team or how to
(32:57):
get more from your team aroundpain point.
SPEAKER_00 (33:00):
And we watched pain point AI.
It was not the thing is right.
I have so many clients wherethat is what they're talking
about.
SPEAKER_01 (33:13):
It's well, everyone is talking about it now.
But this would no, this wasabout data quality, right?
And it does actually inform inAI because it's garbage in,
garbage out.
When you're working intechnology, you know that
anything you feed a system isjust gonna chuck it right back
at you.
And if it's garbage data, you'regonna get garbage back.
So this was a concern foreverybody, right?
(33:35):
Everybody was concerned aboutthe poor quality data, but the
tech, the tech teams weredealing with the actual data.
And the executives were like,what is it telling us and what
how can we fix it?
And they don't they don't wantto talk about the technology.
So we were we were giving thethe um the practitioner teams
(33:56):
the actual language to use.
If you have this problem, here'show you want to talk about it
with your executive.
Or if you have this problem,this is the language that your
executive will respond to.
And it was, it still is thenumber one most viewed blog on
the client site.
And the executive, I mean, eventhough the blog didn't reach as
(34:18):
many executives, that's thenumber seven.
I mean, it's just to this day,it's number seven.
SPEAKER_00 (34:22):
Yeah, and it wasn't even intended for the
executives.
It was supporting people who areworking with them.
SPEAKER_01 (34:28):
Exactly.
Exactly.
So that's just one example ofhow to repurpose and and how to
how to use the insights from thedata to inform your plan for
content.
SPEAKER_00 (34:40):
Yeah.
Yeah, and that really does liketake it in a whole other
direction.
You're they used it to rethinkhow to talk internally too.
SPEAKER_01 (34:53):
Exactly.
And it gets them, you know, itget it gets them on a little bit
closer, right?
Where they're all working towardthe same goal.
And sometimes thosecommunication gaps really
prevent people from movingthings forward.
SPEAKER_00 (35:09):
Yeah.
And often there's just adifferent perspective.
So while you may agree, it'sjust not your top priority
because an executive is going tohave a different, bigger problem
than the tech people.
Exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (35:24):
They usually do.
So that's it.
That is the launch framework.
It basically the H part is whatmakes it repeatable.
It which it's what makes it asystem.
Um, and then, you know, if if itresonated and the partners were
happy, then you can do it allagain the following year.
SPEAKER_00 (35:40):
Yes.
So quick question before we wrapup.
I know we're at time, at leaston the podcast time of things.
Um, when is the best time tolaunch research?
Like, is the is there aseasonality to it where people
are looking for it more oftenthan uh than others?
SPEAKER_01 (36:02):
I think a lot of this stuff starts at the
beginning of the year, right?
That's when we see the 2026survey of X, Y, and Z, right?
SPEAKER_00 (36:10):
That was my gut, but I'm not in the research game.
So I wasn't sure.
SPEAKER_01 (36:14):
No, that's pretty much where most of my clients
land.
They want to kick off the newyear with, you know, a look at
this or that or the other thingor insights and something to
inform their content plan andtheir marketing, their
go-to-market plan for the restof the year and having that
research to kick them off is areally good, a really good way
(36:35):
to start.
SPEAKER_00 (36:36):
So based off of the timeline that you were giving me
earlier, they should probably beready to start the research in
like September minimum.
Exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (36:49):
September, where you're talking about your
partner, talking to yourpartners and making sure that
you're aligned with them andeverybody's happy about the the
plan and then fielding it inOctober or November, maybe,
maybe even, you know, you'regoing to market in February.
Maybe you're launching andyou're gonna bypass that whole
beginning first month of Januarywe're we're talking about.
(37:11):
Not quite working yet.
Exactly.
Where we're too busy beingbombarded with come back to the
gym message.
SPEAKER_00 (37:18):
Yeah, my kids don't go back to school until
mid-January.
So I'm useless untilmid-January.
SPEAKER_01 (37:25):
Exactly.
I think a lot of people are thesame.
So, you know, there's nothingwrong with kicking off, you
know, February 1st.
And here we go.
That's the true new year.
Really is.
It really is.
SPEAKER_00 (37:37):
Thank you so much for joining me today.
Can you tell the audience howthey can find you, work with
you, where you hang out online?
SPEAKER_01 (37:46):
Absolutely.
So I am at devonpoint.com.
And once we're finished here, Iam going to put a copy of the
launch framework on my websitefor your listeners at
devonpoint.com forward slashtiny marketing so that they can
access that.
Um, I am I'm actually planningright now with my research
(38:08):
partner for 2026.
So we're hoping to have moreresources for people to download
for you know for next year.
Um, a lot of people areinterested in original research
now.
The more, what is it, work slop,I think is the new word that I
produce.
Um, the more people are lookingfor ways to differentiate.
(38:30):
And I think original research isgoing to be one of those ways.
So we're trying to get ahead ofthat and produce resources for
people to really understand whatis involved in doing a project
and and how they can getstarted.
SPEAKER_00 (38:41):
I love that.
And I think it's brilliant.
We all have to think about one,like what tech is happening
right now, and two, what theeconomy looks like and adjust
our offers accordingly, likewhat makes sense today and
always be ready to adapt.
The quick changers, the peoplewho adapt fast, they're the ones
that stick around.
SPEAKER_01 (39:02):
Absolutely.
And I think to your pointearlier, I think that's one of
the reasons why smaller teamsare actually making faster
headway with AI.
Um, just because they they'realready accustomed to adapting
very, very quickly to change.
SPEAKER_00 (39:16):
True.
And less red tape too.
The less people have to sign offon everything that you're doing.
100%.
That's why I always liked smallteams.
SPEAKER_01 (39:24):
I know.
So much more agile.
And if you see something is notworking, you can pivot right
away.
Yes.
Or double down on the stuff thatis.
SPEAKER_00 (39:32):
Lesson learned, goodbye.
That's exactly.
Exactly.
Yeah, that's why I always saymarketing is an experiment.
It doesn't matter if it fails.
That was a learning lesson.
So you know how to make thatlike what didn't work.
Cut that, try something else.
SPEAKER_01 (39:47):
Absolutely.
In technology, what we say is tofail faster, right?
SPEAKER_00 (39:52):
Yeah, they say the same thing in startups.
Fail fast, make a pivot.
Not a big deal.
Laugh for me.
It's not if this episode madethings feel a little more
doable.
I'd love to help you take thenext step with the booked out
blueprint.
It's a practical, low pressuresession to clarify your offers,
your marketing, and whatactually moves the needle.
(40:12):
You can book yours through thelink in the show notes.
You don't have to figure it outalone.
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