December 22, 2025 • 48 mins
Welcome to The Power Lounge! In this episode, "Marriage, Marketing & Making It Work," Amy Vaughan engages with Rhea Allen, the driving force behind Pepper Shock Media and host of the highly acclaimed Marketing Expedition podcast.
For over two decades, Rhea and her husband Drew have achieved what many couples only dream of: running a thriving business while nurturing their family and marriage. Join Amy as she uncovers the authentic stories behind their success—how Rhea and Drew balance work and home life, manage the pressures of entrepreneurship, and sustain creativity without losing sight of themselves.
Discover practical strategies for juggling business and family, candid insights into the realities of partnership, and valuable advice for those on the entrepreneurial path—especially those blending love with business. Rhea also shares her unique approach to preventing burnout, the significance of clear communication, and the impact of community and mentorship on achieving real success.
Prepare for an insightful conversation filled with practical wisdom and inspiration for both your professional and personal journey.
Chapters:
00:00 - Introduction
00:10 - "Power Lounge: Empowerment & Insights"
06:03 - Harmony Through Balance and Compromise
08:57 - "Balancing Life Through Connection"
12:23 - Living by the Calendar
15:38 - Co-Regulation for Stress Relief
18:55 - Podcasting Success and Networking Insights
22:47 - "Women's Health, Community, Vulnerability"
26:58 - Processing Leadership Challenges Together
28:47 - "Smart, Supportive CFO Friend"
33:41 - "Planning Goals and Future Vision"
34:40 - "Future Plans for Growth"
38:24 - First Scotch Experience
43:31 - Video Production and Advertising Insights
45:57 - "Behind the Scenes Insights"
47:24 - Authenticity in Business and Life
48:40 - Outro
Quotes:
"Rest isn’t just a reward—it’s the fuel that allows us to show up, build, and thrive. Take the breaks you need, because that's what leads to your best work and your best life."- Amy Vaughan
"You can't go at this alone—lean on your people, ask questions, and pay it forward. The real secret to thriving is building your support system both in business and in life."- Rhea Allen
Key Takeaways:
Building Together: The Power of Partnership
Intentional Boundaries & Real-World Balance
Continuous Growth: Learning, Leaning, and Leadership
Embracing Rest and “Me Time”
Navigating Disagreements with Respect and Love
The Magic of Community & Giving Back
Podcasting as a Door Opener
Connect with the guest Rhea Allen:
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/peppershock/
Website: https://peppershock.com/
Connect with the host Amy Vaughan:
LinkedIn: http://linkedin.com/in/amypvaughan
Podcast: https://www.togetherindigital.com/podcast/
Learn more about Together Digital and consider joining the movement by visiting Home - Together Digital
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_00 (00:09):
Hello everyone and welcome to your weekly Power
Lounge.
This is your place to hearauthentic conversations from
those who have power to share.
My name is Amy Vaughn, and I amthe owner and chief empowerment
officer of Together Digital, adiverse and collaborative
community of women who work indigital and choose to share
their knowledge, power, andconnections.
You can join the movement atTogetherindigital.com.
(00:32):
And today I am thrilled towelcome someone who has been
living the entrepreneur dreamand reality for over two
decades.
Ray Allen is the president andco-founder of PepperShock Media,
and a certified women-ownedbusiness that has been building
brands in bottom line since2003.
She's also the host of theMarketing Expedition Podcast.
(00:53):
This has been a fun littlepodcast episode swap.
I highly encourage you to gocheck out her podcast.
I had a blast being on it acouple weeks ago.
So we're excited to have herhere with us.
Her podcast, MarketingExpedition, is ranked in the top
5% most popular podcastglobally.
Go Ray.
And as uh she's also an adjunctmarketing professor.
(01:14):
But here's what makes Ray'sstory so stand out.
She has built all of thisalongside her business partner
and husband, Drew, while raisingtwo kids, sons, so boy, mom, uh,
and keeping their spark aliveboth professionally and
personally.
Today, Ray is sharing how sheand Drew balances marriage,
marketing, and making it allwork without losing themselves
(01:35):
in the process.
We're diving into theentrepreneur, into
entrepreneurship boundarieswithout losing yourself.
Oh, no, I read that line again.
We're diving.
I'm I'm I'm trying to stay abovethe water.
We're diving intoentrepreneurship boundaries,
burnout, creative collaboration,and real talk about what it
actually takes to sustain both athriving business and a thriving
(01:56):
relationship.
Ray, welcome to the PowerLounge.
Well, thank you so much, Amy.
Wow, that was a lot to read.
You know, it is for Friday, butwe did it.
So I'm just gonna pat myself onthe back.
And yeah, that's the hard part.
That's over.
The conversation never,especially with you, Ray.
Um, the two of you have been inbusiness um partners and
(02:17):
spouses, which I mean, I think alot of us that are listening
right now are like, well, that'snot for everybody, and not
everybody could do that for overtwo decades.
And that is, you know, obviouslyremarkable and wonderful.
What made you decide to build acompany together?
And what do you what did youthink at the time would be the
hardest part?
SPEAKER_01 (02:34):
Well, I guess it all started back when um I was
working at a TV station herelocally in the Boise market, and
in comes walking this guy, I'mlike, who is that?
And anyway, he got hired, and uhit turns out I at the time was
his boss.
Um we didn't date or anything,and I at the time was already
(02:56):
dating somebody else, and youknow, that didn't work out.
But um, yeah, so we were friendsand hung out and um you know got
to know each other for quite awhile just as friends.
And you know, they always saylike friends first, so that kind
of worked out and fast forward,and he actually quit working in
the TV station and um worked forMicron, but then they laid
(03:18):
people off and he decided I wantto move to Seattle, and I
decided, well, I do too.
I want to get out of Dodge,right?
I want to go explore the world.
And uh, so I had to finish myundergrad at Boise State, and
then we both moved to Seattle,and I worked at Northwest uh
Cable News and then Fox Station.
He got a degree at the ArtInstitute, and so we lived there
(03:40):
for a little while until he gothis degree, and then I worked on
my master's degree at the sametime.
And um, while I was in Seattle,got a whole bunch of big city
experience working at the FoxStation and did promotions in
the afternoon, did news atnight, and um really just um
after working news, it's a kindof a love-hate relationship,
right?
You you you work Easter andChristmas and New Year's Eve and
(04:02):
all the things, all theholidays.
And um at the time, my the mainnewscast director had been there
for years and years, and he'sstill there to this day.
So I really had no forwardmovement up.
And uh there was one point wherehe took some time off for his
wife who had twins, and I endedup working 52 days straight, um,
filling in for him and for uh,you know, and and I was like,
(04:24):
this is not what I want to dofor the rest of my life.
And my um undergrad was in masscomm and marketing.
I kind of combined two degreesinto one, and then my master's
degree was entrepreneurship andmarketing.
And so I've always had theentrepreneurial bug in me
growing up with my grandparents.
They both had farm, a farm and amotel and just um had that kind
(04:45):
of work ethic.
So fast forward, we moved back,we boomeranged back to Boise uh
in and got married in August of2003 and started the business in
October of 2003.
So we've not known any otherway.
SPEAKER_00 (04:58):
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's so fantastic.
And you've obviouslysuccessfully grown Pepper Shock
Media.
Now it is a certifiedwoman-owned small business.
Um, you work on a lot ofdifferent industries.
Looking back, what moment madeyou realize that you needed to
establish stronger boundariesbetween work and home to
actually sustain growth?
Because I can only imagine youwork together, you live
(05:21):
together, it would be so easy tojust work nonstop, which is what
you were leaving for, right?
That's why you went and did yourown thing.
SPEAKER_01 (05:27):
Yeah, yeah.
I think um, and we're alsogrowing babies together a couple
of years later, our our oldestson was born.
But um, I think the the I guessthe I don't know, the secret
sauce or whatever it is is justthat we really balance each
other out.
So if I have a networking eventto go to in the evening, you
know, he would take care of theboys, or vice versa.
(05:49):
He's a morning person, I'm not.
I'm a night owl because workingnews you in in Seattle got I got
off at, you know, the news goeson at 11 o'clock at night, and
so I wouldn't get out and youknow, so I was just always a
night owl and he's a morningperson, which again balances
each other out.
And honestly, there's a lot ofthings that are yin and yang
about us, and I think that thatis really the the key that
(06:10):
helped us make it work.
Um, because we could really, Imean, I'm a little more, I can
take risks, he's a little morerisk adverse, so then we kind of
you know compromise and balanceand and talk things through.
And um, and that's been I thinkthe the pattern for us is being
able to just understand whatwe're doing and how we're doing
(06:31):
it and and scheduling everythingthat we can as much as we can.
I mean, gonna we kind of liveand die by our calendars these
days, but yeah, um, you know,and some flexibility too, like
when the when one of the boyswas sick or when you know
something happened, we just youknow maneuvered the things that
we needed to and and worked itout.
And um, yeah, sure, there'stimes that could be stressful or
(06:54):
or you know, heated moments, Iwill say, um, in in multiple
different ways.
But I think that we have a anunderstanding, a mutual
understanding of you know how hecan help me and how I can
support him.
And and it has been um, yeah,after 22 years of of just really
(07:15):
understanding each other'sneeds, and and he's he's
actually really a good guy too.
I mean, he brings me coffee inthe morning and um he cooks and
cleans, which is amazing.
So there's that uh that is alsovery helpful.
He's he's a really um, you know,just uh giving and thoughtful
person that can, you know, helparound the house and in the
(07:39):
business.
SPEAKER_00 (07:39):
So having that balance and and that
intentionality, I think, isreally good.
And then able to also feel likeyou can have those conversations
that might feel like I don'tknow what your old style is, but
like, you know, if one'sconfrontational, one's
non-confrontational.
Or if you're bothnon-confrontational, it can get
really challenging when you'rekind of dealing with not just
(08:00):
like household decisions andmoney decisions and family
decisions, but businessdecisions.
Do you feel like you guys doanything extra out of just like
kind of being in sync from apersonality standpoint?
Are there other intentionalefforts you guys make in order
to make sure that each one ofyou feels seen and heard, not
just as a partner partner inyour marriage, but also is
(08:21):
business partners?
SPEAKER_01 (08:22):
Yeah.
So we follow um, well, I mean,not not necessarily religiously
follow the EOS system, but Imean we do incorporate quite a
bit and um yeah, same pagemeetings.
And um I am the person who isideation is one of my top
strengths, and I come up with somany different ideas now.
(08:43):
It's awesome to have the team tohelp implement some of those
ideas.
Um and he's sort of the soundingboard that I will come up with
in sometimes fast and furiousideas, and he's gonna be like
one that's pulling the reins andsaying, whoa, Ray, let's let's
like slow down a little bit andlike let's finish what we
started and and you know theexecution part of it.
(09:04):
So uh the same page meetings arereally helpful.
Um, and it used to be when theboys were little, my grandma and
his grandma would make it apoint to watch the boys just so
that we would have date night atleast once a month.
Um, and that was that washelpful and meaningful.
And then they the boys could gosee their grandparents and and
be a part of that.
Um so there's different thingsthat we would do and places we
(09:27):
would go, and sometimes we wouldjust um you know take weekends
off or day trips or road tripsor something.
A lot of what happens indecisions that get made is when
we're driving on long road tripssomewhere because we have that
dedicated time that we're in thecar together, and and now my
oldest son he um goes to schooland it takes about 10 hours to
(09:50):
get to where he's at.
SPEAKER_02 (09:52):
Wow.
SPEAKER_01 (09:52):
And you know, recently we um we have a
production van and we needed togo take him some furniture
because he we just bought atownhouse with him together and
um has he had no furniture, sowe we took a road trip and um
yeah, I mean it just those arethe moments that we make
decisions and talk thingsthrough, or we'll listen to
(10:15):
audio um audiobooks, or we'll uhlisten to podcasts and you know
just get ideas and things thatwe can do to continuously
improve.
We're we definitely practice,you know, continuous
improvements a lot, um, and justyou know, processes and those
types of things.
And the big news is we justbought another agency.
Oh, congrats, that's huge.
(10:37):
And now we have new employee andnew 25 new clients all
overnight, right?
Um, as of December 1st.
So we um there's a a um a guythat showed up to one of my
networking events, and I'm like,Tom, what are you doing here?
You're you're my competitor.
He's like, I come in peace.
I want to take you to lunch.
(10:57):
And um he's you know, going toeventually retire.
He's in the business now withus.
And um, so we got to talking andum he wanted to find somebody
that would take care of hisclients just as he's he's taken
care of his clients, you know.
And so anyway, that's that's uha whole nother, you know, a
(11:18):
whole nother ball game to puttogether and and put to in into
motion.
But um I think fantastic, we cando it.
SPEAKER_00 (11:27):
Yeah, absolutely.
Well, I guess on that note,burnout is kind of a real thing,
right?
Within digital marketingadvertising, the clients, the
demands, especially when you'regaining 25.
Um, how have you worked?
Like, what are some actionablethings you've done to help
manage the pressure of running abusiness, teaching, hosting a
podcast, and then also beingpresent for your family without
(11:50):
burning out completely becausethere's a lot right there that
you're doing.
SPEAKER_01 (11:53):
Oh, yeah.
Well, there's always a lot.
Um, I think that I've always hadhigh energy anyway.
And so slowing down is I mean,it's it's a good part of what I
do occasionally.
Like I'll specifically scheduletime away, or like um a friend
of mine, we we there's amountain town here called
McCall.
(12:13):
It's a couple hours away.
Just take a weekend and getaway, right?
Um do kind of a spot a sort ofthing.
Um, I do intentionally put timein to just just just slow down,
take a break.
Um, but while I'm in the midstof it, while I'm teaching, um,
while I'm you know doingpodcasts and running the
business and family and allthose things, I really do live
(12:34):
and die by the calendar.
And if I have it in thecalendar, it's gonna happen more
likely than not.
And um, unless I get sick, whichdoes happen every once in a
while, but um and still, youknow, the nice thing is you can
work from home when you havehave to.
Uh, but I think the the aspectof just making sure that you
spend time doing doing yournails.
(12:56):
Like I'm showing my nails.
Like I every every once in awhile a friend of mine and I get
together to do that and justslowing down to do the things
that can give you some of thatme time and um let allow your
brain to relax.
I do um sometimes I'll bingewatch some Netflix, I'll admit,
uh, just because I want to turnmy brain off and just watch some
dumb show, you know?
(13:18):
Um, and those things kind ofhelp, you know, to to just
unwind and um not have my braingoing 24-7 like it otherwise
could.
SPEAKER_00 (13:27):
Yeah, yeah.
It's yeah, it's all about pacingyourself, right?
It's not a sprint, it's amarathon.
And if you're not pacingyourself and taking the breaks
that you need, like you're notgoing to go farther faster.
You are gonna collapse, right?
At mile 22.
Yeah, I agree.
I think a rest is a great way toactually perform better.
I think sometimes we foolourselves into thinking that a
(13:50):
rest is actually going to slowme down, but no, what you get
from that rest is going to helpyou perform better.
Um better.
SPEAKER_01 (13:58):
The other day, you need to rest so that you can do
all of the rest.
SPEAKER_00 (14:02):
Yes, yes, that's a great one.
I love that.
Rest so you can do the rest100%.
I am right there with you onthat.
So we kind of touched on this alittle bit earlier.
Um, you know, both of you, youand Drew are co-founders.
How do you navigate the creativedifferences or when you disagree
on a business decision?
How do you keep that fromspilling like into the family
(14:23):
life and the family dynamic?
SPEAKER_01 (14:25):
Um, yeah, I mean, I won't lie, there's definitely,
you know, discussions that comeup when we're home and you know,
our our boys know the businessjust in just as much as we do
because they've been around itand seen it and been a part of
it.
And I when they were little, Iwould take them to networking
functions so they knew lots ofthings too.
So it's really um, you know,we're integrated.
I mean, the the whole work-lifebalance thing is is I think
(14:49):
somewhat of a farce that youcan't necessarily do that a
hundred percent.
That's right.
Um, but now, you know, I thinkthat we we do take time away and
like let's just not talk aboutthat right now and let's just
relax, or you know what, mybrain's done for today.
Let's just, you know, um focuson something else or do
something else.
And we play games a lot and doum some gameplay things, and I
(15:12):
love trivia.
Um I love trivia.
And uh my dad is like thiswalking, I don't know,
encyclopedia, you know, and sowe and it's fun because we can
go to Trivia Night and have thedifferent generations and
there's something there foreveryone.
So it's a really fun thing todo.
Um, so yeah, sometimes we'lljust do some things that are
just for fun, you know, and andthat helps a lot.
SPEAKER_00 (15:35):
Yeah, no, that's good.
Well, because I've also beenlearning lately um about like
co-regulation, you know, whenyou get dysregulated because of
stress and burnout, which wewere just talking about, or if
you're in a state of conflictover something with a in a
business, in a closerelationship, your nervous
system's like, what?
Um and you can be qualified orflight.
(15:55):
So this is a great tip foranybody, whether you're in a
romantic relationship or in awork relationship that gets kind
of contentious, um, going for awalk together, playing cards
together, anything like that canhelp you like co-regulate.
Um, anything like that that kindof takes you out of that moment
of like fear and flight andbrings you back into kind of
calm and logic and left side ofthe brain stuff.
(16:17):
Yeah.
Um, and I've even started doingthat kind of things with my kids
just as well to kind of likegive us both time and space to
kind of chill out for a minuteand maybe pause the conversation
and discussion and give us it'snot a again, like the rest,
right?
So you can do the rest, it'sit's not a distraction to
permanently detract, it's tohelp bring yourself back into
(16:38):
regulation.
So then you can kind of come atthe problem one more time, maybe
a little less hot.
SPEAKER_01 (16:42):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (16:43):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (16:44):
No, I know it's definitely um helpful to to take
a pause.
You know, one thing I also do isI have a ladies poker group and
I love it.
And it's nice to go and see theladies and hang out with them.
Because I mean, I'm I'm a boymom, right?
I at home I have all a bunch ofboys, so it's kind of fun to go
to do that.
And um, it's it's fun to getaway and do those things.
(17:05):
And then Drew, you know, alsohas his friends and he does, you
know, the hunting, fishing,hiking, biking things.
And so it's also good for usbecause we work and live and
sleep together, that we youknow, sometimes have time apart
from each other too, and andthat's okay.
And whenever he's gone huntingfor, you know, a couple weeks at
a time, it's like, uh, I misshim.
SPEAKER_00 (17:27):
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, that makes sense.
I love that.
That's good advice.
All right, let's talk about yourpodcast, The Marketing
Expedition.
It is in the top five percent ofmost popular podcasts globally
again.
Preach way to go, awesome.
What is it like building thatalongside everything else?
And what does it add to yourlife and business?
(17:47):
Because I know I could speak onthis, so I'm kind of curious on
from your standpoint because itwas such a delightful experience
being on your show as well.
SPEAKER_01 (17:54):
Well, thank you.
Um, so the cool thing about theMarketing Expedition podcast, I
mean, we I've been podcastingfor years and years and years.
Before podcasting was such acool thing to do.
I've just did it whenever Iwanted to, or whenever I had
somebody cool in the studioalready that we were
interviewing, I'd just say, hey,let's record a podcast.
Are you cool with that?
And then we would.
And then pandemic happened, andwe started seeing the numbers
(18:18):
like explode of peopledownloading.
And I thought the opposite.
I was like, oh, no one's gonnalisten because they're not
commuting anywhere.
They're commuting from the couchto the kitchen, right?
They're not they're not gonnalisten, but boy was I wrong.
And suddenly it just imploded,and we started getting, you
know, 60,000 downloads and allover the world.
And I loved that.
And so we did it every week.
(18:39):
We now do it bi-weekly justbecause it's like I you know,
during during COVID, you hadtime, right?
Now it's like okay.
Um, and so we we do pre-recordand and put them out there, and
I have people um come to thestudio too, this the studio that
I'm recording at now.
And it's been great because acouple things happen.
One, I learned from industryexperts from all over the world
(19:00):
and very um interesting uhcutting edge, bleeding edge
things that people are talkingabout.
And that is that is so criticalto our business because now I
can implement things that I'velearned.
And I've also gained new vendorsbecause of people that we've
talked to and interviewed, andpartners from all over that
we've worked with.
(19:21):
Then second, thirdly, I guess Iwould say is um it's it's great
for our clients too, and it'sjust that thought leadership and
authority that I get tointerview them and and have
them, you know, develop thatrelationship.
And I've developed clients overum you know podcast guesting
with and guests, it's great.
Um, and then I guess the thefinal thing really is um it
(19:43):
gives some uh whenever I speakon a stage or um whenever I'm
asked to do things, it it givessome of that like thought
leadership and authority of ofyou know um reputation building
and things like that.
So when you say it's a Top 5%podcast globally, you know, it's
it's it's like, wow, that's socool to hear.
(20:05):
I mean, I want 1%, right?
I'm I'm a little competitivetoo.
That's a little bit in mystrengths.
But I think um, and definitelybuilding it up over time and and
having some really amazing, coolpeople like you on the podcast,
you know, it's been it's beensuch a journey and and and
growing that show and thenmonetizing it, right?
Monetizing the mic.
So it's been fun.
(20:26):
Yeah.
I love it.
unknown (20:27):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (20:27):
Yeah, congrats.
It is no small feat.
Podcasting, like you said, whenyou started, there was nothing
like in the space and happening.
And now there's a lot out there.
And I do think people um do missor do underestimate the power of
like looking at networking as away or not, looking at
podcasting as a way to networkand build relationships.
(20:48):
And I don't mean networking inlike the slimy transactional
way, but in like the truerelationship building kind of
way that can ended up beingtransformative, like you said,
finding vendors, findingclients.
Yeah.
You know, just finding newprofessional friends.
Like that's just really, I thinkwhat I enjoy best about it for
sure.
And I think that that's whatmakes it easy to give it time,
right?
When you're already so busy, isbecause you know the value of
(21:10):
that.
So you're like, oh, one hourevery other week, yeah.
If it leads to new business, oh,why wouldn't I?
If it gets me a great vendor,why wouldn't I?
SPEAKER_01 (21:18):
If I make a new BFF, let's get it.
That's a fun thing too.
Like, and sometimes I havepeople come back, or they'll
have me come back too, becauselike what we're doing is pod
swapping, right?
And it and it's nice because nowwe can both promote each other's
show.
Um, and it also builds and thethe other cool thing, I guess
(21:39):
the bonus thing is now we haveall this amazing content that we
can pull from and do.
And I I think that um being ableto have snippets of all of these
things that we can put outthere, little quotable moments
and things, helps with socialmedia, helps with the
recognition and and you know,just having that visibility
(21:59):
online and in person.
And and when I speak um uh onstages, you know, I'll have them
download the the QR code or lookat the QR code to do the podcast
and always see a spike of it.
And it's nice to hear back whenpeople hear the show and have
wonderful comments to say.
It makes me feel good.
SPEAKER_00 (22:17):
It does.
I agree.
Yeah, it's and it's always kindof trippy when people are like,
I heard you on this show.
I listened to the whole episode.
It was so good.
I'm like, ah it's very real, butalso very nice because again,
it's like you, you know, I thinkin your show, like I feel like
the whole conversation,everything was so easy and
relatable, you know, it makespeople feel hopefully a little
(22:38):
less alone in what they might befacing in or dealing with.
Because we talk about just abouteverything on on the digital
power lounge.
Like I don't know that there'smany topics of between mental
health and women's health andwhat we do as marketers that we
haven't really touched on atleadership in ways that have
been really truly vulnerable.
And I just I appreciate it somuch because a lot of women are
(22:59):
kind of working, living on anisland and don't always have the
partners that they need, youknow, to kind of muddle through
or get through or figure it out,you know.
They feel like they have to doit all in on their own.
Um, and so I think that's wherelike community and podcasting
and being a part of podcastingcommunity is a really great
thing.
Um, so yeah, shout out to all ofyou that are listening, live
listeners, by the way.
You can drop questions into thechat if you have any for Ray.
(23:22):
Um, but I would say like Iencourage you, like step out
there.
If you're looking at publicspeaking, I think podcast
guesting is a great way to justget your chops, like to build
your chops, get your musclebuilt up on like doing
interviewing, answeringquestions, finding your talking
points.
And it to me, because it's moreconversational, I think it all
comes out more naturally onceyou start doing actual public
(23:42):
speaking, in my opinion.
Because no offense, all my livelisteners, but I have the time I
just forget.
I get so consumed by theconversation with my person, I
just am like, oh yeah, y'all arehere listening.
Just kidding.
I know y'all are here.
And I love you and appreciateyou.
But do recommend you consideringit.
So don't be shy.
Look around.
Um, was it PodMatch?
That's a good one to look at umfor podcasting.
(24:04):
You don't have to start your ownpodcast right away.
That is an endeavor of its own.
But guesting alone, great way tobuild relationships.
SPEAKER_01 (24:12):
Yeah, no, definitely.
And we get a lot of people whowant to be on the show.
And I always say, listen, if youcome on the show and you're
there just to promote yourselffor you know an hour and just
be, you know, kind of salesy thewhole time, nobody wants that.
And that's not either for ouraudience, right?
And so I always want to makesure that people give value and
(24:32):
have something of value to giveand and share.
And then yeah, okay, we'll we'lldrop the the stuff at the end.
But I think um if if peopleunderstand that people want to
listen to stories, people wantto hear things that are gonna be
relatable to them.
And and so when people arethinking about being on a
podcast or being a podcast host,right?
(24:54):
Uh think about your audience andwho it is that you want to hear
and have resonate with you.
Yeah, absolutely.
SPEAKER_00 (25:02):
I agree.
That's such good advice.
Yeah, 100%.
I think that making it useful,making it relatable, making it
real, you know, is is so very,very important.
You're gonna see a lot more umcome out of that, otherwise.
But yeah, no, great call.
All right.
When you look at couples inbusiness together, what is one
thing that separates those whothrive from those who maybe
(25:23):
struggle, would you say?
SPEAKER_01 (25:26):
Ooh, um, I mean, I I would say that we've struggled
and thrived uh up and down allaround too.
So we've got to in either way.
Um, I think those that thrivehave a support staff and and
team to build them and and theand not just the support staff
(25:47):
that they might hire, but maybethe support around them.
So one of the things that we didearly on was I made a pepper
shock advisory board of peoplewho wanted to help see us
succeed.
And I had former executives thathave retired, I had a lawyer, I
had a financial planner, uh, Ihad a client sit on our advisory
(26:10):
board.
I love it.
And I think that was reallyhelpful, uh, especially since we
were kind of young at the timewhen we started the business.
I mean, I was 25.
Um didn't know what I was doing,right?
And I I I mean, I had to fake ittill I made it, right?
I mean, that's that's part ofit.
But I feel like asking questionsand having a mentor, mentors is
(26:34):
super critical in being able tothrive.
The other thing I did is um wedid a ladies' mastermind group
and um worked with or and justhad other leaders in in that
ladies' mastermind group.
And and there's about 10 of us,not everybody could always show
up every time, but once a monthwe'd get together for a couple
hours over lunch.
(26:54):
You know, we paid for lunch.
That's the we didn't charge oranything, you know, because it
was just uh all of us comingtogether.
And I think we process a lot ofissues that leaders go through.
Yeah.
Um, we had like the CEO of acredit union, um, another um a
person that had worked inhealthcare that got burnt out on
(27:15):
healthcare and then started herbusiness and was, you know,
coming from healthcare being anurse to now starting a business
is completely different.
So we processed a lot of things.
Another gal was like she was avet an event um planner and
wanted to go big.
And so we just we processed somany things for each other and
we learned from other peoplewhat they were going through and
(27:36):
how we can incorporate that.
I mean, I I you know, I haveeverything from employee issues
to um, you know, I wanna when wemoved um building spaces years
ago, I needed to process do wewant to move?
Is this the right decision?
Sure.
You know, what am I not thinkingabout that I should?
And maybe some of the people hadalready been through a move
before.
And oh, Ray, you gotta thinkabout this, and oh, you gotta
(27:57):
spend money on this, and oh, yougotta think about that, and you
didn't think about this.
I'm like, oh my gosh, right?
So it was just a really goodthing to lean on other people's
expertise and experiences.
And um, you know, you do have tobe careful about who you take
advice from, right?
Sure.
Sometimes they their advice maynot necessarily be 100%
applicable to yours or yoursituation.
(28:19):
Um, so obviously you have todiscern what advice you're
getting and how you are going toincorporate it, but having those
people around you and having thesupport is definitely you can't
go at this alone.
You really have to have otherand lean on other people's
expertise.
I have to do one more shout outto a really dear friend of mine.
Um we went through an emergingleaders program together through
(28:41):
the SBA Small BusinessAdministration, and um she's a
she's a CFO, CPA, smart, smartperson.
And I was like, I really want tobe in her group because she does
numbers, and I'm not great atnumbers.
Like I have a little bit ofdyslexia, so numbers and I like
I know that I need that.
Yeah, and she has been like sucha great asset and person in my
(29:04):
life, and just um, you know,lean on for a friendship, but
also just she's so smart.
Cheryl is her name.
And I am so glad that we metbecause she has um just kind of
acted as a pocket CFO, if youwill.
Uh, and and I think that havingthose support people around you
who are smarter than you incertain areas has have been the
(29:26):
secret to really um being, youknow, thriving versus you know
surviving.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (29:32):
No, that's great advice.
No, a hundred percent.
Like the never underestimate thepower of your peers and peer
mentorship.
I think sometimes we think wehave to go to people who have
10, 15 years on us, but there'ssomething really amazing about
people who are kind of can be inthe thick of it with you because
that's maybe where they werelike a half step ago, you know,
or maybe you're just a half stepahead of them.
And so you kind of know exactlywhere they're at, what they're
(29:53):
going through.
You know, 10 years from now,it's kind of like giving birth,
right?
We just kind of like, well, youknow, it was bad, but it wasn't
that bad, right?
Because then we have more kids,otherwise we wouldn't.
SPEAKER_01 (30:02):
Well, paying it forward, right?
And my students now that I meanthat's what they do.
They get to build an agency andpitch a real client.
And I love being able to pay itforward and say, here's what
I've done, here's what I know.
You know, learn from me if youwant, and and absorb, you're
gonna get whatever you you knowput into it, but uh definitely
paying it forward and mentoringother people.
I mean, I've done the B Wiseprogram for the Boise Young
(30:24):
Professionals and mentoringyoung people is it.
I mean, I needed that, and now Iabsolutely want to give it to
other people when I can, forsure.
Love it.
SPEAKER_00 (30:34):
Love it.
All right.
For any of our listeners ormembers who are thinking about
um starting a business withtheir partner, or they maybe
they're already on that journeyand maybe hitting a rough patch.
What's the most importantconversation would you say that
they need to have?
SPEAKER_01 (30:50):
Oh, um, so many thoughts kind of go through my
mind.
And uh I think the number onething that you have to
understand is not everybody isentrepreneurial spirit.
Not everybody has thatentrepreneurial drive.
And and so when you pick apartner that you're gonna go
(31:10):
into business with, whether it'syour your your husband or your
spouse or your any partner, youhave to understand where their
skill sets are and where yourskill sets are and how you can
come together and understand howyou're going to be able to,
because there sometimes youwon't agree.
You just won't.
No matter who you are, no matterwhat, not everybody agrees with
(31:32):
everything, and that's okay.
How are you gonna handle it?
What's the reaction?
What's the plan to get throughsomething like that that you
don't agree on?
How are you gonna come throughthe other side?
And maybe talk about the processthat you're gonna go through
when you have disagreements andwhat does that look like?
Feedback is a gift, I say,right?
Yeah.
And we say, you know, don't denydefender blame, just say thank
(31:52):
you when you have feedback.
One of the things that I'velearned is ask if you can give
feedback before you give it.
Because that gives a moment oflike, okay, she's got something
to say to me.
Yeah.
Let me get in the rightheadspace.
And and that's helped a lotbecause I used to just be like,
Go straight for it.
Go straight for it, tell youwhat I think, when I think it,
(32:12):
and how I think it.
But that emotional intelligenceto stop, pause, and be like, I
have something I need to say,but I need to think about what
they're at and how they're gonnareceive this from me.
And that is something I've I'veworked on a lot.
I mean, after the last 20 years,is like we don't want to we
don't want to be like the wrathof Ray, right?
(32:33):
We want to have the rewards,right?
We want to be in a in a positivespace.
So I've definitely learned a lotover the years.
And what I would say to thosewho are starting a new business
in in a partnershiprelationship, whatever it is,
um, have conversations aroundhow you're gonna handle conflict
and how you're gonna be able toget paid back to each other.
And and sometimes you have tojust take a pause and walk away.
(32:56):
Yeah, and that's okay.
And just notice like, okay,things are getting heated.
I need to take a break.
Let's just take a break.
And and that's okay, you know?
SPEAKER_00 (33:05):
Yeah, that's wonderful advice, Ray.
Wonderful.
Thanks.
All right, got a couple.
Oh, I've got one more question,and then we're gonna go into our
fun little power round, um,which are like our lightning
round questions.
And then again, live listeners,if you have any questions for
Ray that are a little morespecific to maybe what you're
dealing with or doing, um, welove having you here.
So feel free to jump into thechat and let us know if you have
(33:27):
questions.
Looking ahead at the nextchapter of your work in life,
how are you thinking differentlyabout success balance in what
you're building together goingforward, especially with this
new news of this new agency?
SPEAKER_01 (33:37):
I know, I know.
Well, right now it's kind oflike moment by moment, day by
day, just trying to, you know,meet all the new clients and
everything.
But fast forward from now, Ithink the the goal that we want
to establish is um or you know,maintain, and actually we're
we're gonna be doing goals atthe beginning of the year um and
(34:00):
and kind of really laying theseout our vision of what we want.
Um, but some of the kind of thethoughts behind what we want to
do is um be in a part in a placewhere like Tom just sold his
business to us, eventuallyeither we're gonna be in that
position where we will um sellour business and or our
(34:20):
employees can, you know, we cango through that process if they,
you know, are in a spot theywant to uh carry forward with
with having it being employeeowned or not.
Um, and or uh I don't thinkeither one of our boys are gonna
make, I don't know what they'reI don't know.
They're they're they're 20 andabout to be 18.
So they've got some time aheadto figure that out.
(34:42):
But I think ultimately we'regoing to get into a spot where
we're not in the day-to-day asmuch as we are right now.
And I'm gonna focus more on theconsulting speaking authorship
kind of um area of of what I'malready doing, just maybe at a
at a higher, you know, uhcapacity.
(35:05):
And I mean, I get to speak allover the world, they they fly me
everywhere, but I I want to ummaybe hone in a little more on
being able to be that speakerthat people need for me, the
content expert speaker that I uhthat I am, and um do more of
that and also you know, finishanother book and get that out in
the world.
And so those so those are someof the kind of the sites I see
(35:28):
in in the future um where wehave the staff and the team to
fully take on more of theresponsibilities that Drew and I
are doing now on the operationside for Drew and for me, kind
of the business development,managing, running the company
kind of thing, and start to peeloff some of those pieces and
some of those duties that eachof us do to others and have them
(35:49):
um be able to be fullysustainable without just Drew
and Ray doing the things thatneed to get done.
So that's where I see us in youknow the next five, 10 years.
So that's what we're thinking.
SPEAKER_00 (35:59):
Super exciting.
I love it.
That's great.
And I love that you guys arecoming back to it on an annual
basis.
It's so important.
All right, time for a lightninground.
What is the best businessdecision that you and Drew have
made together?
What do you say?
SPEAKER_01 (36:13):
Oh, best business decision that we made together.
Well, this is kind of a funlittle, I'll keep it short.
Um, we were in northern Idaho,which is about eight hours from
where we are, six to eight hourswhere we are, on another
project.
And I took I got this randomphone call uh on my phone, and
(36:36):
it was PMS productions.
So uh uh Peter Scott McGregorProductions that called and I'm
like, who is this random personcalling me?
I somehow we were in the toyshop buying toys for the boys.
There's a cute little locallyowned toy shop up there, and I'm
like, I'm looking at this, I'mlike, okay, I'll answer it.
Turns out it happened to be theproduction company that hired
(37:02):
Mr.
Harrison Ford himself.
And we got to work on adocumentary about flight and
aviation because Mr.
Ford is a backcountry air uhpilot, right?
And um, so we got to spend aweek with production, and
there's um one of the toughestlanding strips in North America
(37:24):
is in Idaho called Wilson Bar.
And um, so this this wholedocumentary it was for the
Smithsonian Um Wings Over theRocky Air Museum in Denver,
Colorado.
So the Rocky Mountains, right,through Idaho and and and
Colorado, right?
And um anyway, so we got to workon this amazing production that
(37:45):
was so cool, and we had to keepit under wraps because we, you
know, no one would know that Mr.
Ford was in town and doing allthis with us.
And um the the fun little storyis that we found out that he
likes scotch.
Okay.
And I had never had it before.
And and the liquor store'sclosed.
So I'm calling all my friendswho have vacation homes in
(38:05):
McCall area, right?
In the mountain town resort.
And we found somebody that theyand like, can we like borrow
your bottle of like it was a15-year-old bottle of McClellan,
McClellan's uh scotch, I thinkit's called.
And we get it.
And um, one of the the eveningsthat we're doing the dinner, you
(38:26):
know, doing the like nightthing.
Well, Mr.
Ford decides to pass the bottlearound and we all take a swig.
And I had never really hadscotch before.
I know that you don't really,you don't just chug it, you just
kind of it's like a sippingthing.
And oh my gosh, I had to likekeep my composure because when I
when the scotch went down mythroat, it like to me, it was
(38:49):
like gasoline coming down mythroat because it was too much
and I, you know, took too much,whatever.
And uh oh my gosh, I had to likekeep calm and and he's like he's
smiling with his little smirk,you know, and he's seeing what
I'm going through and I'm like,oh my gosh.
SPEAKER_00 (39:04):
So that's my first experience with Mr.
Ford and Spongebob and you know,at least you didn't spit it out
in his face.
SPEAKER_01 (39:11):
Oh, I know, right?
Drew was it quoted in the paperlike it was like, holy shit,
that's Han solo.
And they actually put the wordfit in the paper.
Sorry if you so forgive it.
But it was like it was so fun.
It was so it was just an amazingfun experience.
So I'm the the best decisionthat we made is taking that
phone call.
Right, ran into the phone.
(39:32):
You know, I mean we we get spamcalls all the time, but you
never know what it's gonna bethat call that comes up that
you're like, wow, this was sucha cool opportunity for us to get
to do and work on this and youknow, shoot the footage and
audio.
And and um we had a Cineflexhelicopter um with uh because
this is before drones, this is2009.
(39:52):
Um, and it had a camera on it,and the helicopter pilot was
like a uh former helicopterpilot in Vietnam and He also is
the pilot in Transformers.
And so anyway, um it was just itwas so cool.
Such a cool experience.
SPEAKER_00 (40:06):
I was gonna say, sounds like it was pretty
surreal.
That's amazing.
All right, finish the statement.
Um the secret to our marriagesurviving entrepreneurship is
um, you know, I think the secretto surviving marriage and
(40:27):
entrepreneurship is I think wejust have a love for each other
that will never go away.
SPEAKER_01 (40:38):
I love him, he loves me, and I know that, and and we
love each other and our and ourkids, right?
And our family.
And I think that sometimes, youknow, when I do something stupid
and dumb, he can forgive me.
And when he does somethingstupid and dumb, I hate the way
stupid.
Maybe I should say ignorant, butit's okay.
You know, we forgive each otherto me.
We forgive, forget, move on, andcarry on.
(41:01):
And I think that our secret isthat you know, we love each
other.
SPEAKER_00 (41:06):
Really.
Yeah.
When it sounds to it its core,and I think this is important
for just any relationship,platonic or otherwise, right?
Is that there's trust andrespect for each other.
You know, and once that's kindof that when that's broken, it's
really hard to make it work, nomatter what kind of relationship
it is.
So I love that.
All right, what is what boundarythat you've set that has
surprised your family maybe inthe best way?
SPEAKER_01 (41:30):
Oh, um gosh, boundaries are always like a I
don't know.
Do I have boundaries?
Yeah, I do.
Um I would say something that II guess when it comes to how our
(41:53):
kids were being raised or thethings that we would, you know,
want for our kids that maybewere something that you know
some family member wouldn'tagree to, or I don't know,
whatever.
Um like I don't know, I I that'skind of hard to say, but I think
you know, we we our kids aregood kids, and I think that um
(42:18):
we kind of had to set someboundaries about what we wanted
as far as for our kids' rules goand like how they would, you
know, be able to to interact andbehave and be around.
So, you know, when they would goto grandparents or when they go
to other people's, like wewanted them to be respectful and
we wanted them to, you know, doall the things that we would do.
(42:39):
And they were they're my oldestis an Eagle Scout, the youngest
is about to get his Eagle Scout.
He's in social side.
Awesome.
That's no small feat board ofreviews and stuff.
So um, yeah, that would be onething.
I think um that would, you know,surprise family.
I don't know.
Um I I don't know.
I struggle with it because Iprobably need more boundaries to
(43:00):
be honest.
Yeah, it's okay.
SPEAKER_00 (43:02):
I think we all feel that.
We all feel that.
It is hard, it is hard.
I feel you.
Um, all right, this is a fun onebecause a lot of us here or that
are listening are workingparents, and you know, kids just
kind of don't always get it.
What I mean, I know your sonsare older now.
Um, but what do your sons thinkthat your their their parents do
(43:23):
for work?
Or maybe when they were younger.
Was there any funinterpretations of that?
SPEAKER_01 (43:28):
Yeah, I mean, so we do video production and uh
advertising, you know, fullservice advertising, but I think
that they were most seeing usdoing video because the all the
gear and the equipment they hadto load out, you know, help us
load up and load out gear.
So I think that that's what theythought we did the most with
cameras and and video, notnecessarily seeing the other
(43:50):
side of like the strategy andthe planning and the you know,
the marketing audits that we do,that was not as visible to them.
So I think that they justthought that we, you know,
mostly made commercials or orsomething like that.
There was a time, so we kind ofspoiled my my youngest son.
Um, we did a commercial withSanta Claus and Mrs.
(44:11):
Claus.
Um it was the big Ford um FordPickup 150 red beautiful sleigh.
We turned it into a sleigh, andit was a car commercial.
And Mr.
and Mrs.
Claus were there, and it was afundraiser or uh food drive.
And so we were having my sonload the truck up with food with
Mr.
(44:31):
and Mrs.
Claus.
Well, while we were busy gettingthe set, you know, the scene set
up, Mr.
and Mrs.
Claus were kind of entertainingand keeping my kid, you know,
pretty little.
Um, you know, they were coloringwith him and just keeping him
entertained.
Of course, it was Smither andMrs.
Santa Claus.
Of course, he felt so special.
And he was so convinced and solike just believed because they
(44:55):
knew his name and they, youknow, talked to him and knew all
the things about him, right?
And it took a really long timefor him later in life to not, or
just to let me, I don't want tospoil it this for anybody, but
just to to get past that, youknow what happens with parents
(45:18):
and I just will never forget,you lied, you lied the betrayal.
How fun is that?
Oh my gosh, older brother toldlittle brother, and you know, of
course they do so upset.
Oh my gosh, because like it itit it took it you know a few
(45:39):
more years than like the olderbrother figured it out, but the
younger brother was like soconvinced, right?
Yeah, but this is a shelf thing,right?
Yeah, and so Charlie was theelf's name, so they they would
like go up to Charlie and say,sorry, Charlie.
I love it.
SPEAKER_00 (45:55):
Anyway, love it.
Yeah, no, I think that is thefun part of what we do.
I think because there'ssometimes tangible things.
I mean, my daughter's probablytoo young to remember, but I
took her on set a couple timesfor you know photo shoots and
commercials and just lettingthem see behind the scenes, you
know, and kind of know likethat's really cool.
Because you're right, when it'sintangible and it's like, oh,
hey kids, look at this amazingPowerPoint slide and content
(46:18):
strategy.
They're like, What?
You uh I mean, even adults arelike, what the hell?
I don't like my parents, theydon't even know.
SPEAKER_01 (46:23):
Right.
Yeah, yeah.
So it's like it is you'd besurprised what you'd remember.
My my mom in college used to,she worked at or she did stuff
with the PBS station.
And I remember Big Bird and Iwas really little.
Um, but you know, Sesame Streetwas a big thing, and they had
like this fundraiser thing.
And I I was probably three,maybe.
(46:45):
Um at least that's kind of thetiming.
But I remember Big Bird, like Iremember that.
And I remember switcher, and youknow, fast forward, I worked in
in news and I, you know, workedon a switcher.
So I mean, you'd you'd besurprised, like what what kids
days?
SPEAKER_00 (47:01):
Yeah, what stays.
I love that, dude.
I just realized I had thismoment.
I was like, oh my god, big bird,I would be fangirling even as an
adult.
I'm like, oh, does that mean bigbirds might hear me out?
I don't know.
I think I just need to talk tomy daughter about this.
SPEAKER_01 (47:16):
I know.
Sesame Street was a big part ofmy life for sure.
SPEAKER_00 (47:21):
What a cool experience.
Well, Ray, thank you so much forbringing such, you know,
amazing, authentic energy as youalways do.
Oh, and some great wisdom to theconversation.
Um, you've definitely given ourcommunity um permission to do
something that we don't talkabout enough, which is be honest
about the challenges of havingowning, sustaining a thriving
business without sacrificing therelationship and the life that
we're trying to build, becauseyou're doing both of those
(47:42):
simultaneously.
So if any of you have beeninspired by Ray's journey, I
encourage you to check out theMarketing Expedition Podcast, uh
fantastic resource.
You can also connect with Ray onLinkedIn to stay in the loop
with PepperShack Media's work.
And for anyone who is watchingand or listening to learn what
Together Digital is all about,again, check out the website.
Um, we're all about creatingreal conversations with women
(48:03):
who are doing amazing thingslike Ray and are willing to be
honest about them so that therest of us can, you know, work
together and figure it out.
So, Ray, you're just like ashining light for exactly what
like the Together Digitalcommunity is about.
You're full of women who aresupportive and encouraging and
enthusiastic.
We love what we do and we aren'tgatekeepers about it.
Um, so definitely loved havingyou on the show.
(48:26):
I know lots of our members willbe tuning in.
Um, that's all we've got for youtoday, folks.
We hope you enjoy the rest ofyour Friday.
Until then, keep asking, keepgiving, and keep growing.
Take care, everyone.
SPEAKER_02 (48:48):
Produced by Heartcast Media.
Hello everyone and welcome to your weekly Power
Lounge.
This is your place to hearauthentic conversations from
those who have power to share.
My name is Amy Vaughn, and I amthe owner and chief empowerment
officer of Together Digital, adiverse and collaborative
community of women who work indigital and choose to share
their knowledge, power, andconnections.
You can join the movement atTogetherindigital.com.
(00:32):
And today I am thrilled towelcome someone who has been
living the entrepreneur dreamand reality for over two
decades.
Ray Allen is the president andco-founder of PepperShock Media,
and a certified women-ownedbusiness that has been building
brands in bottom line since2003.
She's also the host of theMarketing Expedition Podcast.
(00:53):
This has been a fun littlepodcast episode swap.
I highly encourage you to gocheck out her podcast.
I had a blast being on it acouple weeks ago.
So we're excited to have herhere with us.
Her podcast, MarketingExpedition, is ranked in the top
5% most popular podcastglobally.
Go Ray.
And as uh she's also an adjunctmarketing professor.
(01:14):
But here's what makes Ray'sstory so stand out.
She has built all of thisalongside her business partner
and husband, Drew, while raisingtwo kids, sons, so boy, mom, uh,
and keeping their spark aliveboth professionally and
personally.
Today, Ray is sharing how sheand Drew balances marriage,
marketing, and making it allwork without losing themselves
(01:35):
in the process.
We're diving into theentrepreneur, into
entrepreneurship boundarieswithout losing yourself.
Oh, no, I read that line again.
We're diving.
I'm I'm I'm trying to stay abovethe water.
We're diving intoentrepreneurship boundaries,
burnout, creative collaboration,and real talk about what it
actually takes to sustain both athriving business and a thriving
(01:56):
relationship.
Ray, welcome to the PowerLounge.
Well, thank you so much, Amy.
Wow, that was a lot to read.
You know, it is for Friday, butwe did it.
So I'm just gonna pat myself onthe back.
And yeah, that's the hard part.
That's over.
The conversation never,especially with you, Ray.
Um, the two of you have been inbusiness um partners and
(02:17):
spouses, which I mean, I think alot of us that are listening
right now are like, well, that'snot for everybody, and not
everybody could do that for overtwo decades.
And that is, you know, obviouslyremarkable and wonderful.
What made you decide to build acompany together?
And what do you what did youthink at the time would be the
hardest part?
SPEAKER_01 (02:34):
Well, I guess it all started back when um I was
working at a TV station herelocally in the Boise market, and
in comes walking this guy, I'mlike, who is that?
And anyway, he got hired, and uhit turns out I at the time was
his boss.
Um we didn't date or anything,and I at the time was already
(02:56):
dating somebody else, and youknow, that didn't work out.
But um, yeah, so we were friendsand hung out and um you know got
to know each other for quite awhile just as friends.
And you know, they always saylike friends first, so that kind
of worked out and fast forward,and he actually quit working in
the TV station and um worked forMicron, but then they laid
(03:18):
people off and he decided I wantto move to Seattle, and I
decided, well, I do too.
I want to get out of Dodge,right?
I want to go explore the world.
And uh, so I had to finish myundergrad at Boise State, and
then we both moved to Seattle,and I worked at Northwest uh
Cable News and then Fox Station.
He got a degree at the ArtInstitute, and so we lived there
(03:40):
for a little while until he gothis degree, and then I worked on
my master's degree at the sametime.
And um, while I was in Seattle,got a whole bunch of big city
experience working at the FoxStation and did promotions in
the afternoon, did news atnight, and um really just um
after working news, it's a kindof a love-hate relationship,
right?
You you you work Easter andChristmas and New Year's Eve and
(04:02):
all the things, all theholidays.
And um at the time, my the mainnewscast director had been there
for years and years, and he'sstill there to this day.
So I really had no forwardmovement up.
And uh there was one point wherehe took some time off for his
wife who had twins, and I endedup working 52 days straight, um,
filling in for him and for uh,you know, and and I was like,
(04:24):
this is not what I want to dofor the rest of my life.
And my um undergrad was in masscomm and marketing.
I kind of combined two degreesinto one, and then my master's
degree was entrepreneurship andmarketing.
And so I've always had theentrepreneurial bug in me
growing up with my grandparents.
They both had farm, a farm and amotel and just um had that kind
(04:45):
of work ethic.
So fast forward, we moved back,we boomeranged back to Boise uh
in and got married in August of2003 and started the business in
October of 2003.
So we've not known any otherway.
SPEAKER_00 (04:58):
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's so fantastic.
And you've obviouslysuccessfully grown Pepper Shock
Media.
Now it is a certifiedwoman-owned small business.
Um, you work on a lot ofdifferent industries.
Looking back, what moment madeyou realize that you needed to
establish stronger boundariesbetween work and home to
actually sustain growth?
Because I can only imagine youwork together, you live
(05:21):
together, it would be so easy tojust work nonstop, which is what
you were leaving for, right?
That's why you went and did yourown thing.
SPEAKER_01 (05:27):
Yeah, yeah.
I think um, and we're alsogrowing babies together a couple
of years later, our our oldestson was born.
But um, I think the the I guessthe I don't know, the secret
sauce or whatever it is is justthat we really balance each
other out.
So if I have a networking eventto go to in the evening, you
know, he would take care of theboys, or vice versa.
(05:49):
He's a morning person, I'm not.
I'm a night owl because workingnews you in in Seattle got I got
off at, you know, the news goeson at 11 o'clock at night, and
so I wouldn't get out and youknow, so I was just always a
night owl and he's a morningperson, which again balances
each other out.
And honestly, there's a lot ofthings that are yin and yang
about us, and I think that thatis really the the key that
(06:10):
helped us make it work.
Um, because we could really, Imean, I'm a little more, I can
take risks, he's a little morerisk adverse, so then we kind of
you know compromise and balanceand and talk things through.
And um, and that's been I thinkthe the pattern for us is being
able to just understand whatwe're doing and how we're doing
(06:31):
it and and scheduling everythingthat we can as much as we can.
I mean, gonna we kind of liveand die by our calendars these
days, but yeah, um, you know,and some flexibility too, like
when the when one of the boyswas sick or when you know
something happened, we just youknow maneuvered the things that
we needed to and and worked itout.
And um, yeah, sure, there'stimes that could be stressful or
(06:54):
or you know, heated moments, Iwill say, um, in in multiple
different ways.
But I think that we have a anunderstanding, a mutual
understanding of you know how hecan help me and how I can
support him.
And and it has been um, yeah,after 22 years of of just really
(07:15):
understanding each other'sneeds, and and he's he's
actually really a good guy too.
I mean, he brings me coffee inthe morning and um he cooks and
cleans, which is amazing.
So there's that uh that is alsovery helpful.
He's he's a really um, you know,just uh giving and thoughtful
person that can, you know, helparound the house and in the
(07:39):
business.
SPEAKER_00 (07:39):
So having that balance and and that
intentionality, I think, isreally good.
And then able to also feel likeyou can have those conversations
that might feel like I don'tknow what your old style is, but
like, you know, if one'sconfrontational, one's
non-confrontational.
Or if you're bothnon-confrontational, it can get
really challenging when you'rekind of dealing with not just
(08:00):
like household decisions andmoney decisions and family
decisions, but businessdecisions.
Do you feel like you guys doanything extra out of just like
kind of being in sync from apersonality standpoint?
Are there other intentionalefforts you guys make in order
to make sure that each one ofyou feels seen and heard, not
just as a partner partner inyour marriage, but also is
(08:21):
business partners?
SPEAKER_01 (08:22):
Yeah.
So we follow um, well, I mean,not not necessarily religiously
follow the EOS system, but Imean we do incorporate quite a
bit and um yeah, same pagemeetings.
And um I am the person who isideation is one of my top
strengths, and I come up with somany different ideas now.
(08:43):
It's awesome to have the team tohelp implement some of those
ideas.
Um and he's sort of the soundingboard that I will come up with
in sometimes fast and furiousideas, and he's gonna be like
one that's pulling the reins andsaying, whoa, Ray, let's let's
like slow down a little bit andlike let's finish what we
started and and you know theexecution part of it.
(09:04):
So uh the same page meetings arereally helpful.
Um, and it used to be when theboys were little, my grandma and
his grandma would make it apoint to watch the boys just so
that we would have date night atleast once a month.
Um, and that was that washelpful and meaningful.
And then they the boys could gosee their grandparents and and
be a part of that.
Um so there's different thingsthat we would do and places we
(09:27):
would go, and sometimes we wouldjust um you know take weekends
off or day trips or road tripsor something.
A lot of what happens indecisions that get made is when
we're driving on long road tripssomewhere because we have that
dedicated time that we're in thecar together, and and now my
oldest son he um goes to schooland it takes about 10 hours to
(09:50):
get to where he's at.
SPEAKER_02 (09:52):
Wow.
SPEAKER_01 (09:52):
And you know, recently we um we have a
production van and we needed togo take him some furniture
because he we just bought atownhouse with him together and
um has he had no furniture, sowe we took a road trip and um
yeah, I mean it just those arethe moments that we make
decisions and talk thingsthrough, or we'll listen to
(10:15):
audio um audiobooks, or we'll uhlisten to podcasts and you know
just get ideas and things thatwe can do to continuously
improve.
We're we definitely practice,you know, continuous
improvements a lot, um, and justyou know, processes and those
types of things.
And the big news is we justbought another agency.
Oh, congrats, that's huge.
(10:37):
And now we have new employee andnew 25 new clients all
overnight, right?
Um, as of December 1st.
So we um there's a a um a guythat showed up to one of my
networking events, and I'm like,Tom, what are you doing here?
You're you're my competitor.
He's like, I come in peace.
I want to take you to lunch.
(10:57):
And um he's you know, going toeventually retire.
He's in the business now withus.
And um, so we got to talking andum he wanted to find somebody
that would take care of hisclients just as he's he's taken
care of his clients, you know.
And so anyway, that's that's uha whole nother, you know, a
(11:18):
whole nother ball game to puttogether and and put to in into
motion.
But um I think fantastic, we cando it.
SPEAKER_00 (11:27):
Yeah, absolutely.
Well, I guess on that note,burnout is kind of a real thing,
right?
Within digital marketingadvertising, the clients, the
demands, especially when you'regaining 25.
Um, how have you worked?
Like, what are some actionablethings you've done to help
manage the pressure of running abusiness, teaching, hosting a
podcast, and then also beingpresent for your family without
(11:50):
burning out completely becausethere's a lot right there that
you're doing.
SPEAKER_01 (11:53):
Oh, yeah.
Well, there's always a lot.
Um, I think that I've always hadhigh energy anyway.
And so slowing down is I mean,it's it's a good part of what I
do occasionally.
Like I'll specifically scheduletime away, or like um a friend
of mine, we we there's amountain town here called
McCall.
(12:13):
It's a couple hours away.
Just take a weekend and getaway, right?
Um do kind of a spot a sort ofthing.
Um, I do intentionally put timein to just just just slow down,
take a break.
Um, but while I'm in the midstof it, while I'm teaching, um,
while I'm you know doingpodcasts and running the
business and family and allthose things, I really do live
(12:34):
and die by the calendar.
And if I have it in thecalendar, it's gonna happen more
likely than not.
And um, unless I get sick, whichdoes happen every once in a
while, but um and still, youknow, the nice thing is you can
work from home when you havehave to.
Uh, but I think the the aspectof just making sure that you
spend time doing doing yournails.
(12:56):
Like I'm showing my nails.
Like I every every once in awhile a friend of mine and I get
together to do that and justslowing down to do the things
that can give you some of thatme time and um let allow your
brain to relax.
I do um sometimes I'll bingewatch some Netflix, I'll admit,
uh, just because I want to turnmy brain off and just watch some
dumb show, you know?
(13:18):
Um, and those things kind ofhelp, you know, to to just
unwind and um not have my braingoing 24-7 like it otherwise
could.
SPEAKER_00 (13:27):
Yeah, yeah.
It's yeah, it's all about pacingyourself, right?
It's not a sprint, it's amarathon.
And if you're not pacingyourself and taking the breaks
that you need, like you're notgoing to go farther faster.
You are gonna collapse, right?
At mile 22.
Yeah, I agree.
I think a rest is a great way toactually perform better.
I think sometimes we foolourselves into thinking that a
(13:50):
rest is actually going to slowme down, but no, what you get
from that rest is going to helpyou perform better.
Um better.
SPEAKER_01 (13:58):
The other day, you need to rest so that you can do
all of the rest.
SPEAKER_00 (14:02):
Yes, yes, that's a great one.
I love that.
Rest so you can do the rest100%.
I am right there with you onthat.
So we kind of touched on this alittle bit earlier.
Um, you know, both of you, youand Drew are co-founders.
How do you navigate the creativedifferences or when you disagree
on a business decision?
How do you keep that fromspilling like into the family
(14:23):
life and the family dynamic?
SPEAKER_01 (14:25):
Um, yeah, I mean, I won't lie, there's definitely,
you know, discussions that comeup when we're home and you know,
our our boys know the businessjust in just as much as we do
because they've been around itand seen it and been a part of
it.
And I when they were little, Iwould take them to networking
functions so they knew lots ofthings too.
So it's really um, you know,we're integrated.
I mean, the the whole work-lifebalance thing is is I think
(14:49):
somewhat of a farce that youcan't necessarily do that a
hundred percent.
That's right.
Um, but now, you know, I thinkthat we we do take time away and
like let's just not talk aboutthat right now and let's just
relax, or you know what, mybrain's done for today.
Let's just, you know, um focuson something else or do
something else.
And we play games a lot and doum some gameplay things, and I
(15:12):
love trivia.
Um I love trivia.
And uh my dad is like thiswalking, I don't know,
encyclopedia, you know, and sowe and it's fun because we can
go to Trivia Night and have thedifferent generations and
there's something there foreveryone.
So it's a really fun thing todo.
Um, so yeah, sometimes we'lljust do some things that are
just for fun, you know, and andthat helps a lot.
SPEAKER_00 (15:35):
Yeah, no, that's good.
Well, because I've also beenlearning lately um about like
co-regulation, you know, whenyou get dysregulated because of
stress and burnout, which wewere just talking about, or if
you're in a state of conflictover something with a in a
business, in a closerelationship, your nervous
system's like, what?
Um and you can be qualified orflight.
(15:55):
So this is a great tip foranybody, whether you're in a
romantic relationship or in awork relationship that gets kind
of contentious, um, going for awalk together, playing cards
together, anything like that canhelp you like co-regulate.
Um, anything like that that kindof takes you out of that moment
of like fear and flight andbrings you back into kind of
calm and logic and left side ofthe brain stuff.
(16:17):
Yeah.
Um, and I've even started doingthat kind of things with my kids
just as well to kind of likegive us both time and space to
kind of chill out for a minuteand maybe pause the conversation
and discussion and give us it'snot a again, like the rest,
right?
So you can do the rest, it'sit's not a distraction to
permanently detract, it's tohelp bring yourself back into
(16:38):
regulation.
So then you can kind of come atthe problem one more time, maybe
a little less hot.
SPEAKER_01 (16:42):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (16:43):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (16:44):
No, I know it's definitely um helpful to to take
a pause.
You know, one thing I also do isI have a ladies poker group and
I love it.
And it's nice to go and see theladies and hang out with them.
Because I mean, I'm I'm a boymom, right?
I at home I have all a bunch ofboys, so it's kind of fun to go
to do that.
And um, it's it's fun to getaway and do those things.
(17:05):
And then Drew, you know, alsohas his friends and he does, you
know, the hunting, fishing,hiking, biking things.
And so it's also good for usbecause we work and live and
sleep together, that we youknow, sometimes have time apart
from each other too, and andthat's okay.
And whenever he's gone huntingfor, you know, a couple weeks at
a time, it's like, uh, I misshim.
SPEAKER_00 (17:27):
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, that makes sense.
I love that.
That's good advice.
All right, let's talk about yourpodcast, The Marketing
Expedition.
It is in the top five percent ofmost popular podcasts globally
again.
Preach way to go, awesome.
What is it like building thatalongside everything else?
And what does it add to yourlife and business?
(17:47):
Because I know I could speak onthis, so I'm kind of curious on
from your standpoint because itwas such a delightful experience
being on your show as well.
SPEAKER_01 (17:54):
Well, thank you.
Um, so the cool thing about theMarketing Expedition podcast, I
mean, we I've been podcastingfor years and years and years.
Before podcasting was such acool thing to do.
I've just did it whenever Iwanted to, or whenever I had
somebody cool in the studioalready that we were
interviewing, I'd just say, hey,let's record a podcast.
Are you cool with that?
And then we would.
And then pandemic happened, andwe started seeing the numbers
(18:18):
like explode of peopledownloading.
And I thought the opposite.
I was like, oh, no one's gonnalisten because they're not
commuting anywhere.
They're commuting from the couchto the kitchen, right?
They're not they're not gonnalisten, but boy was I wrong.
And suddenly it just imploded,and we started getting, you
know, 60,000 downloads and allover the world.
And I loved that.
And so we did it every week.
(18:39):
We now do it bi-weekly justbecause it's like I you know,
during during COVID, you hadtime, right?
Now it's like okay.
Um, and so we we do pre-recordand and put them out there, and
I have people um come to thestudio too, this the studio that
I'm recording at now.
And it's been great because acouple things happen.
One, I learned from industryexperts from all over the world
(19:00):
and very um interesting uhcutting edge, bleeding edge
things that people are talkingabout.
And that is that is so criticalto our business because now I
can implement things that I'velearned.
And I've also gained new vendorsbecause of people that we've
talked to and interviewed, andpartners from all over that
we've worked with.
(19:21):
Then second, thirdly, I guess Iwould say is um it's it's great
for our clients too, and it'sjust that thought leadership and
authority that I get tointerview them and and have
them, you know, develop thatrelationship.
And I've developed clients overum you know podcast guesting
with and guests, it's great.
Um, and then I guess the thefinal thing really is um it
(19:43):
gives some uh whenever I speakon a stage or um whenever I'm
asked to do things, it it givessome of that like thought
leadership and authority of ofyou know um reputation building
and things like that.
So when you say it's a Top 5%podcast globally, you know, it's
it's it's like, wow, that's socool to hear.
(20:05):
I mean, I want 1%, right?
I'm I'm a little competitivetoo.
That's a little bit in mystrengths.
But I think um, and definitelybuilding it up over time and and
having some really amazing, coolpeople like you on the podcast,
you know, it's been it's beensuch a journey and and and
growing that show and thenmonetizing it, right?
Monetizing the mic.
So it's been fun.
(20:26):
Yeah.
I love it.
unknown (20:27):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (20:27):
Yeah, congrats.
It is no small feat.
Podcasting, like you said, whenyou started, there was nothing
like in the space and happening.
And now there's a lot out there.
And I do think people um do missor do underestimate the power of
like looking at networking as away or not, looking at
podcasting as a way to networkand build relationships.
(20:48):
And I don't mean networking inlike the slimy transactional
way, but in like the truerelationship building kind of
way that can ended up beingtransformative, like you said,
finding vendors, findingclients.
Yeah.
You know, just finding newprofessional friends.
Like that's just really, I thinkwhat I enjoy best about it for
sure.
And I think that that's whatmakes it easy to give it time,
right?
When you're already so busy, isbecause you know the value of
(21:10):
that.
So you're like, oh, one hourevery other week, yeah.
If it leads to new business, oh,why wouldn't I?
If it gets me a great vendor,why wouldn't I?
SPEAKER_01 (21:18):
If I make a new BFF, let's get it.
That's a fun thing too.
Like, and sometimes I havepeople come back, or they'll
have me come back too, becauselike what we're doing is pod
swapping, right?
And it and it's nice because nowwe can both promote each other's
show.
Um, and it also builds and thethe other cool thing, I guess
(21:39):
the bonus thing is now we haveall this amazing content that we
can pull from and do.
And I I think that um being ableto have snippets of all of these
things that we can put outthere, little quotable moments
and things, helps with socialmedia, helps with the
recognition and and you know,just having that visibility
(21:59):
online and in person.
And and when I speak um uh onstages, you know, I'll have them
download the the QR code or lookat the QR code to do the podcast
and always see a spike of it.
And it's nice to hear back whenpeople hear the show and have
wonderful comments to say.
It makes me feel good.
SPEAKER_00 (22:17):
It does.
I agree.
Yeah, it's and it's always kindof trippy when people are like,
I heard you on this show.
I listened to the whole episode.
It was so good.
I'm like, ah it's very real, butalso very nice because again,
it's like you, you know, I thinkin your show, like I feel like
the whole conversation,everything was so easy and
relatable, you know, it makespeople feel hopefully a little
(22:38):
less alone in what they might befacing in or dealing with.
Because we talk about just abouteverything on on the digital
power lounge.
Like I don't know that there'smany topics of between mental
health and women's health andwhat we do as marketers that we
haven't really touched on atleadership in ways that have
been really truly vulnerable.
And I just I appreciate it somuch because a lot of women are
(22:59):
kind of working, living on anisland and don't always have the
partners that they need, youknow, to kind of muddle through
or get through or figure it out,you know.
They feel like they have to doit all in on their own.
Um, and so I think that's wherelike community and podcasting
and being a part of podcastingcommunity is a really great
thing.
Um, so yeah, shout out to all ofyou that are listening, live
listeners, by the way.
You can drop questions into thechat if you have any for Ray.
(23:22):
Um, but I would say like Iencourage you, like step out
there.
If you're looking at publicspeaking, I think podcast
guesting is a great way to justget your chops, like to build
your chops, get your musclebuilt up on like doing
interviewing, answeringquestions, finding your talking
points.
And it to me, because it's moreconversational, I think it all
comes out more naturally onceyou start doing actual public
(23:42):
speaking, in my opinion.
Because no offense, all my livelisteners, but I have the time I
just forget.
I get so consumed by theconversation with my person, I
just am like, oh yeah, y'all arehere listening.
Just kidding.
I know y'all are here.
And I love you and appreciateyou.
But do recommend you consideringit.
So don't be shy.
Look around.
Um, was it PodMatch?
That's a good one to look at umfor podcasting.
(24:04):
You don't have to start your ownpodcast right away.
That is an endeavor of its own.
But guesting alone, great way tobuild relationships.
SPEAKER_01 (24:12):
Yeah, no, definitely.
And we get a lot of people whowant to be on the show.
And I always say, listen, if youcome on the show and you're
there just to promote yourselffor you know an hour and just
be, you know, kind of salesy thewhole time, nobody wants that.
And that's not either for ouraudience, right?
And so I always want to makesure that people give value and
(24:32):
have something of value to giveand and share.
And then yeah, okay, we'll we'lldrop the the stuff at the end.
But I think um if if peopleunderstand that people want to
listen to stories, people wantto hear things that are gonna be
relatable to them.
And and so when people arethinking about being on a
podcast or being a podcast host,right?
(24:54):
Uh think about your audience andwho it is that you want to hear
and have resonate with you.
Yeah, absolutely.
SPEAKER_00 (25:02):
I agree.
That's such good advice.
Yeah, 100%.
I think that making it useful,making it relatable, making it
real, you know, is is so very,very important.
You're gonna see a lot more umcome out of that, otherwise.
But yeah, no, great call.
All right.
When you look at couples inbusiness together, what is one
thing that separates those whothrive from those who maybe
(25:23):
struggle, would you say?
SPEAKER_01 (25:26):
Ooh, um, I mean, I I would say that we've struggled
and thrived uh up and down allaround too.
So we've got to in either way.
Um, I think those that thrivehave a support staff and and
team to build them and and theand not just the support staff
(25:47):
that they might hire, but maybethe support around them.
So one of the things that we didearly on was I made a pepper
shock advisory board of peoplewho wanted to help see us
succeed.
And I had former executives thathave retired, I had a lawyer, I
had a financial planner, uh, Ihad a client sit on our advisory
(26:10):
board.
I love it.
And I think that was reallyhelpful, uh, especially since we
were kind of young at the timewhen we started the business.
I mean, I was 25.
Um didn't know what I was doing,right?
And I I I mean, I had to fake ittill I made it, right?
I mean, that's that's part ofit.
But I feel like asking questionsand having a mentor, mentors is
(26:34):
super critical in being able tothrive.
The other thing I did is um wedid a ladies' mastermind group
and um worked with or and justhad other leaders in in that
ladies' mastermind group.
And and there's about 10 of us,not everybody could always show
up every time, but once a monthwe'd get together for a couple
hours over lunch.
(26:54):
You know, we paid for lunch.
That's the we didn't charge oranything, you know, because it
was just uh all of us comingtogether.
And I think we process a lot ofissues that leaders go through.
Yeah.
Um, we had like the CEO of acredit union, um, another um a
person that had worked inhealthcare that got burnt out on
(27:15):
healthcare and then started herbusiness and was, you know,
coming from healthcare being anurse to now starting a business
is completely different.
So we processed a lot of things.
Another gal was like she was avet an event um planner and
wanted to go big.
And so we just we processed somany things for each other and
we learned from other peoplewhat they were going through and
(27:36):
how we can incorporate that.
I mean, I I you know, I haveeverything from employee issues
to um, you know, I wanna when wemoved um building spaces years
ago, I needed to process do wewant to move?
Is this the right decision?
Sure.
You know, what am I not thinkingabout that I should?
And maybe some of the people hadalready been through a move
before.
And oh, Ray, you gotta thinkabout this, and oh, you gotta
(27:57):
spend money on this, and oh, yougotta think about that, and you
didn't think about this.
I'm like, oh my gosh, right?
So it was just a really goodthing to lean on other people's
expertise and experiences.
And um, you know, you do have tobe careful about who you take
advice from, right?
Sure.
Sometimes they their advice maynot necessarily be 100%
applicable to yours or yoursituation.
(28:19):
Um, so obviously you have todiscern what advice you're
getting and how you are going toincorporate it, but having those
people around you and having thesupport is definitely you can't
go at this alone.
You really have to have otherand lean on other people's
expertise.
I have to do one more shout outto a really dear friend of mine.
Um we went through an emergingleaders program together through
(28:41):
the SBA Small BusinessAdministration, and um she's a
she's a CFO, CPA, smart, smartperson.
And I was like, I really want tobe in her group because she does
numbers, and I'm not great atnumbers.
Like I have a little bit ofdyslexia, so numbers and I like
I know that I need that.
Yeah, and she has been like sucha great asset and person in my
(29:04):
life, and just um, you know,lean on for a friendship, but
also just she's so smart.
Cheryl is her name.
And I am so glad that we metbecause she has um just kind of
acted as a pocket CFO, if youwill.
Uh, and and I think that havingthose support people around you
who are smarter than you incertain areas has have been the
(29:26):
secret to really um being, youknow, thriving versus you know
surviving.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (29:32):
No, that's great advice.
No, a hundred percent.
Like the never underestimate thepower of your peers and peer
mentorship.
I think sometimes we think wehave to go to people who have
10, 15 years on us, but there'ssomething really amazing about
people who are kind of can be inthe thick of it with you because
that's maybe where they werelike a half step ago, you know,
or maybe you're just a half stepahead of them.
And so you kind of know exactlywhere they're at, what they're
(29:53):
going through.
You know, 10 years from now,it's kind of like giving birth,
right?
We just kind of like, well, youknow, it was bad, but it wasn't
that bad, right?
Because then we have more kids,otherwise we wouldn't.
SPEAKER_01 (30:02):
Well, paying it forward, right?
And my students now that I meanthat's what they do.
They get to build an agency andpitch a real client.
And I love being able to pay itforward and say, here's what
I've done, here's what I know.
You know, learn from me if youwant, and and absorb, you're
gonna get whatever you you knowput into it, but uh definitely
paying it forward and mentoringother people.
I mean, I've done the B Wiseprogram for the Boise Young
(30:24):
Professionals and mentoringyoung people is it.
I mean, I needed that, and now Iabsolutely want to give it to
other people when I can, forsure.
Love it.
SPEAKER_00 (30:34):
Love it.
All right.
For any of our listeners ormembers who are thinking about
um starting a business withtheir partner, or they maybe
they're already on that journeyand maybe hitting a rough patch.
What's the most importantconversation would you say that
they need to have?
SPEAKER_01 (30:50):
Oh, um, so many thoughts kind of go through my
mind.
And uh I think the number onething that you have to
understand is not everybody isentrepreneurial spirit.
Not everybody has thatentrepreneurial drive.
And and so when you pick apartner that you're gonna go
(31:10):
into business with, whether it'syour your your husband or your
spouse or your any partner, youhave to understand where their
skill sets are and where yourskill sets are and how you can
come together and understand howyou're going to be able to,
because there sometimes youwon't agree.
You just won't.
No matter who you are, no matterwhat, not everybody agrees with
(31:32):
everything, and that's okay.
How are you gonna handle it?
What's the reaction?
What's the plan to get throughsomething like that that you
don't agree on?
How are you gonna come throughthe other side?
And maybe talk about the processthat you're gonna go through
when you have disagreements andwhat does that look like?
Feedback is a gift, I say,right?
Yeah.
And we say, you know, don't denydefender blame, just say thank
(31:52):
you when you have feedback.
One of the things that I'velearned is ask if you can give
feedback before you give it.
Because that gives a moment oflike, okay, she's got something
to say to me.
Yeah.
Let me get in the rightheadspace.
And and that's helped a lotbecause I used to just be like,
Go straight for it.
Go straight for it, tell youwhat I think, when I think it,
(32:12):
and how I think it.
But that emotional intelligenceto stop, pause, and be like, I
have something I need to say,but I need to think about what
they're at and how they're gonnareceive this from me.
And that is something I've I'veworked on a lot.
I mean, after the last 20 years,is like we don't want to we
don't want to be like the wrathof Ray, right?
(32:33):
We want to have the rewards,right?
We want to be in a in a positivespace.
So I've definitely learned a lotover the years.
And what I would say to thosewho are starting a new business
in in a partnershiprelationship, whatever it is,
um, have conversations aroundhow you're gonna handle conflict
and how you're gonna be able toget paid back to each other.
And and sometimes you have tojust take a pause and walk away.
(32:56):
Yeah, and that's okay.
And just notice like, okay,things are getting heated.
I need to take a break.
Let's just take a break.
And and that's okay, you know?
SPEAKER_00 (33:05):
Yeah, that's wonderful advice, Ray.
Wonderful.
Thanks.
All right, got a couple.
Oh, I've got one more question,and then we're gonna go into our
fun little power round, um,which are like our lightning
round questions.
And then again, live listeners,if you have any questions for
Ray that are a little morespecific to maybe what you're
dealing with or doing, um, welove having you here.
So feel free to jump into thechat and let us know if you have
(33:27):
questions.
Looking ahead at the nextchapter of your work in life,
how are you thinking differentlyabout success balance in what
you're building together goingforward, especially with this
new news of this new agency?
SPEAKER_01 (33:37):
I know, I know.
Well, right now it's kind oflike moment by moment, day by
day, just trying to, you know,meet all the new clients and
everything.
But fast forward from now, Ithink the the goal that we want
to establish is um or you know,maintain, and actually we're
we're gonna be doing goals atthe beginning of the year um and
(34:00):
and kind of really laying theseout our vision of what we want.
Um, but some of the kind of thethoughts behind what we want to
do is um be in a part in a placewhere like Tom just sold his
business to us, eventuallyeither we're gonna be in that
position where we will um sellour business and or our
(34:20):
employees can, you know, we cango through that process if they,
you know, are in a spot theywant to uh carry forward with
with having it being employeeowned or not.
Um, and or uh I don't thinkeither one of our boys are gonna
make, I don't know what they'reI don't know.
They're they're they're 20 andabout to be 18.
So they've got some time aheadto figure that out.
(34:42):
But I think ultimately we'regoing to get into a spot where
we're not in the day-to-day asmuch as we are right now.
And I'm gonna focus more on theconsulting speaking authorship
kind of um area of of what I'malready doing, just maybe at a
at a higher, you know, uhcapacity.
(35:05):
And I mean, I get to speak allover the world, they they fly me
everywhere, but I I want to ummaybe hone in a little more on
being able to be that speakerthat people need for me, the
content expert speaker that I uhthat I am, and um do more of
that and also you know, finishanother book and get that out in
the world.
And so those so those are someof the kind of the sites I see
(35:28):
in in the future um where wehave the staff and the team to
fully take on more of theresponsibilities that Drew and I
are doing now on the operationside for Drew and for me, kind
of the business development,managing, running the company
kind of thing, and start to peeloff some of those pieces and
some of those duties that eachof us do to others and have them
(35:49):
um be able to be fullysustainable without just Drew
and Ray doing the things thatneed to get done.
So that's where I see us in youknow the next five, 10 years.
So that's what we're thinking.
SPEAKER_00 (35:59):
Super exciting.
I love it.
That's great.
And I love that you guys arecoming back to it on an annual
basis.
It's so important.
All right, time for a lightninground.
What is the best businessdecision that you and Drew have
made together?
What do you say?
SPEAKER_01 (36:13):
Oh, best business decision that we made together.
Well, this is kind of a funlittle, I'll keep it short.
Um, we were in northern Idaho,which is about eight hours from
where we are, six to eight hourswhere we are, on another
project.
And I took I got this randomphone call uh on my phone, and
(36:36):
it was PMS productions.
So uh uh Peter Scott McGregorProductions that called and I'm
like, who is this random personcalling me?
I somehow we were in the toyshop buying toys for the boys.
There's a cute little locallyowned toy shop up there, and I'm
like, I'm looking at this, I'mlike, okay, I'll answer it.
Turns out it happened to be theproduction company that hired
(37:02):
Mr.
Harrison Ford himself.
And we got to work on adocumentary about flight and
aviation because Mr.
Ford is a backcountry air uhpilot, right?
And um, so we got to spend aweek with production, and
there's um one of the toughestlanding strips in North America
(37:24):
is in Idaho called Wilson Bar.
And um, so this this wholedocumentary it was for the
Smithsonian Um Wings Over theRocky Air Museum in Denver,
Colorado.
So the Rocky Mountains, right,through Idaho and and and
Colorado, right?
And um anyway, so we got to workon this amazing production that
(37:45):
was so cool, and we had to keepit under wraps because we, you
know, no one would know that Mr.
Ford was in town and doing allthis with us.
And um the the fun little storyis that we found out that he
likes scotch.
Okay.
And I had never had it before.
And and the liquor store'sclosed.
So I'm calling all my friendswho have vacation homes in
(38:05):
McCall area, right?
In the mountain town resort.
And we found somebody that theyand like, can we like borrow
your bottle of like it was a15-year-old bottle of McClellan,
McClellan's uh scotch, I thinkit's called.
And we get it.
And um, one of the the eveningsthat we're doing the dinner, you
(38:26):
know, doing the like nightthing.
Well, Mr.
Ford decides to pass the bottlearound and we all take a swig.
And I had never really hadscotch before.
I know that you don't really,you don't just chug it, you just
kind of it's like a sippingthing.
And oh my gosh, I had to likekeep my composure because when I
when the scotch went down mythroat, it like to me, it was
(38:49):
like gasoline coming down mythroat because it was too much
and I, you know, took too much,whatever.
And uh oh my gosh, I had to likekeep calm and and he's like he's
smiling with his little smirk,you know, and he's seeing what
I'm going through and I'm like,oh my gosh.
SPEAKER_00 (39:04):
So that's my first experience with Mr.
Ford and Spongebob and you know,at least you didn't spit it out
in his face.
SPEAKER_01 (39:11):
Oh, I know, right?
Drew was it quoted in the paperlike it was like, holy shit,
that's Han solo.
And they actually put the wordfit in the paper.
Sorry if you so forgive it.
But it was like it was so fun.
It was so it was just an amazingfun experience.
So I'm the the best decisionthat we made is taking that
phone call.
Right, ran into the phone.
(39:32):
You know, I mean we we get spamcalls all the time, but you
never know what it's gonna bethat call that comes up that
you're like, wow, this was sucha cool opportunity for us to get
to do and work on this and youknow, shoot the footage and
audio.
And and um we had a Cineflexhelicopter um with uh because
this is before drones, this is2009.
(39:52):
Um, and it had a camera on it,and the helicopter pilot was
like a uh former helicopterpilot in Vietnam and He also is
the pilot in Transformers.
And so anyway, um it was just itwas so cool.
Such a cool experience.
SPEAKER_00 (40:06):
I was gonna say, sounds like it was pretty
surreal.
That's amazing.
All right, finish the statement.
Um the secret to our marriagesurviving entrepreneurship is
um, you know, I think the secretto surviving marriage and
(40:27):
entrepreneurship is I think wejust have a love for each other
that will never go away.
SPEAKER_01 (40:38):
I love him, he loves me, and I know that, and and we
love each other and our and ourkids, right?
And our family.
And I think that sometimes, youknow, when I do something stupid
and dumb, he can forgive me.
And when he does somethingstupid and dumb, I hate the way
stupid.
Maybe I should say ignorant, butit's okay.
You know, we forgive each otherto me.
We forgive, forget, move on, andcarry on.
(41:01):
And I think that our secret isthat you know, we love each
other.
SPEAKER_00 (41:06):
Really.
Yeah.
When it sounds to it its core,and I think this is important
for just any relationship,platonic or otherwise, right?
Is that there's trust andrespect for each other.
You know, and once that's kindof that when that's broken, it's
really hard to make it work, nomatter what kind of relationship
it is.
So I love that.
All right, what is what boundarythat you've set that has
surprised your family maybe inthe best way?
SPEAKER_01 (41:30):
Oh, um gosh, boundaries are always like a I
don't know.
Do I have boundaries?
Yeah, I do.
Um I would say something that II guess when it comes to how our
(41:53):
kids were being raised or thethings that we would, you know,
want for our kids that maybewere something that you know
some family member wouldn'tagree to, or I don't know,
whatever.
Um like I don't know, I I that'skind of hard to say, but I think
you know, we we our kids aregood kids, and I think that um
(42:18):
we kind of had to set someboundaries about what we wanted
as far as for our kids' rules goand like how they would, you
know, be able to to interact andbehave and be around.
So, you know, when they would goto grandparents or when they go
to other people's, like wewanted them to be respectful and
we wanted them to, you know, doall the things that we would do.
(42:39):
And they were they're my oldestis an Eagle Scout, the youngest
is about to get his Eagle Scout.
He's in social side.
Awesome.
That's no small feat board ofreviews and stuff.
So um, yeah, that would be onething.
I think um that would, you know,surprise family.
I don't know.
Um I I don't know.
I struggle with it because Iprobably need more boundaries to
(43:00):
be honest.
Yeah, it's okay.
SPEAKER_00 (43:02):
I think we all feel that.
We all feel that.
It is hard, it is hard.
I feel you.
Um, all right, this is a fun onebecause a lot of us here or that
are listening are workingparents, and you know, kids just
kind of don't always get it.
What I mean, I know your sonsare older now.
Um, but what do your sons thinkthat your their their parents do
(43:23):
for work?
Or maybe when they were younger.
Was there any funinterpretations of that?
SPEAKER_01 (43:28):
Yeah, I mean, so we do video production and uh
advertising, you know, fullservice advertising, but I think
that they were most seeing usdoing video because the all the
gear and the equipment they hadto load out, you know, help us
load up and load out gear.
So I think that that's what theythought we did the most with
cameras and and video, notnecessarily seeing the other
(43:50):
side of like the strategy andthe planning and the you know,
the marketing audits that we do,that was not as visible to them.
So I think that they justthought that we, you know,
mostly made commercials or orsomething like that.
There was a time, so we kind ofspoiled my my youngest son.
Um, we did a commercial withSanta Claus and Mrs.
(44:11):
Claus.
Um it was the big Ford um FordPickup 150 red beautiful sleigh.
We turned it into a sleigh, andit was a car commercial.
And Mr.
and Mrs.
Claus were there, and it was afundraiser or uh food drive.
And so we were having my sonload the truck up with food with
Mr.
(44:31):
and Mrs.
Claus.
Well, while we were busy gettingthe set, you know, the scene set
up, Mr.
and Mrs.
Claus were kind of entertainingand keeping my kid, you know,
pretty little.
Um, you know, they were coloringwith him and just keeping him
entertained.
Of course, it was Smither andMrs.
Santa Claus.
Of course, he felt so special.
And he was so convinced and solike just believed because they
(44:55):
knew his name and they, youknow, talked to him and knew all
the things about him, right?
And it took a really long timefor him later in life to not, or
just to let me, I don't want tospoil it this for anybody, but
just to to get past that, youknow what happens with parents
(45:18):
and I just will never forget,you lied, you lied the betrayal.
How fun is that?
Oh my gosh, older brother toldlittle brother, and you know, of
course they do so upset.
Oh my gosh, because like it itit it took it you know a few
(45:39):
more years than like the olderbrother figured it out, but the
younger brother was like soconvinced, right?
Yeah, but this is a shelf thing,right?
Yeah, and so Charlie was theelf's name, so they they would
like go up to Charlie and say,sorry, Charlie.
I love it.
SPEAKER_00 (45:55):
Anyway, love it.
Yeah, no, I think that is thefun part of what we do.
I think because there'ssometimes tangible things.
I mean, my daughter's probablytoo young to remember, but I
took her on set a couple timesfor you know photo shoots and
commercials and just lettingthem see behind the scenes, you
know, and kind of know likethat's really cool.
Because you're right, when it'sintangible and it's like, oh,
hey kids, look at this amazingPowerPoint slide and content
(46:18):
strategy.
They're like, What?
You uh I mean, even adults arelike, what the hell?
I don't like my parents, theydon't even know.
SPEAKER_01 (46:23):
Right.
Yeah, yeah.
So it's like it is you'd besurprised what you'd remember.
My my mom in college used to,she worked at or she did stuff
with the PBS station.
And I remember Big Bird and Iwas really little.
Um, but you know, Sesame Streetwas a big thing, and they had
like this fundraiser thing.
And I I was probably three,maybe.
(46:45):
Um at least that's kind of thetiming.
But I remember Big Bird, like Iremember that.
And I remember switcher, and youknow, fast forward, I worked in
in news and I, you know, workedon a switcher.
So I mean, you'd you'd besurprised, like what what kids
days?
SPEAKER_00 (47:01):
Yeah, what stays.
I love that, dude.
I just realized I had thismoment.
I was like, oh my god, big bird,I would be fangirling even as an
adult.
I'm like, oh, does that mean bigbirds might hear me out?
I don't know.
I think I just need to talk tomy daughter about this.
SPEAKER_01 (47:16):
I know.
Sesame Street was a big part ofmy life for sure.
SPEAKER_00 (47:21):
What a cool experience.
Well, Ray, thank you so much forbringing such, you know,
amazing, authentic energy as youalways do.
Oh, and some great wisdom to theconversation.
Um, you've definitely given ourcommunity um permission to do
something that we don't talkabout enough, which is be honest
about the challenges of havingowning, sustaining a thriving
business without sacrificing therelationship and the life that
we're trying to build, becauseyou're doing both of those
(47:42):
simultaneously.
So if any of you have beeninspired by Ray's journey, I
encourage you to check out theMarketing Expedition Podcast, uh
fantastic resource.
You can also connect with Ray onLinkedIn to stay in the loop
with PepperShack Media's work.
And for anyone who is watchingand or listening to learn what
Together Digital is all about,again, check out the website.
Um, we're all about creatingreal conversations with women
(48:03):
who are doing amazing thingslike Ray and are willing to be
honest about them so that therest of us can, you know, work
together and figure it out.
So, Ray, you're just like ashining light for exactly what
like the Together Digitalcommunity is about.
You're full of women who aresupportive and encouraging and
enthusiastic.
We love what we do and we aren'tgatekeepers about it.
Um, so definitely loved havingyou on the show.
(48:26):
I know lots of our members willbe tuning in.
Um, that's all we've got for youtoday, folks.
We hope you enjoy the rest ofyour Friday.
Until then, keep asking, keepgiving, and keep growing.
Take care, everyone.
SPEAKER_02 (48:48):
Produced by Heartcast Media.
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