Unlock Your Success System

Episode Transcript
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SPEAKER_00 (00:09):
Hello everyone and welcome to the your weekly power
lounge.
This is your place to hearauthentic conversations from
those who have power to share.
My name is Amy Vaughn, and I amthe owner and chief empowerment
officer of Together Digital, adiverse and collaborative
community of women who work indigital and choose to share
their knowledge, power, andconnections.
You can join the movement atTogetherIndigital.com.

(00:33):
Today's conversation couldn'tcome at a better time.
In a world where burnout badgesare worn like honors and
calendar chaos is inevitable, weare asking a radical question.
What is if doing less isactually the answer?
Why does that feel scary,friends?
I think we're all in the rightplace if that's how it feels.
I'm thrilled to welcome DanaZeller.

(00:54):
She is an executive coach andfacilitator who has spent over
20 years in the corporate andagency roles learning what so
many of us are just beginning tounderstand that more hours is
the enemy of more impact.
As an ICP or IPEC and ICFcertified coach, Dana has made
it her mission to help womenreclaim their time and energy by

(01:16):
working smarter and not longer.
Yes, I know we're all feelingthat guilt.
Dana challenges the hustleculture that keeps us trapped in
a cycle of busyness.
And today we are here to sharepractical strategies for
creating your own successsystems, one built on clarity,
control, and confident decisionmaking rather than an endless

(01:37):
to-do list.
So whether you are drowning inmeetings, struggling to find
time for strategic work, orsimply exhausted from the
expectation of doing it all, youare in the right room, my
friends.
You have the right, you're tunedinto the right station.
This conversation is for you.
Welcome, Dana.
We are thrilled to have you herewith us today.

SPEAKER_01 (01:56):
Oh, thank you so much for having me.
I know this is such an importantconversation, and I'm so glad to
be having it.

SPEAKER_00 (02:02):
Absolutely.
Yeah, it's definitely not a newconversation for us here at
Together Digital, um, with allof us very overly ambitious,
hardworking women.
Um, but at the same time, youknow, it's it's one of the
things that I don't know, wecan't talk about enough because
uh it's uh it's conditioning,right, that we are trying to
break.
We've all been conditioned tobelieve that somehow busy equals

(02:24):
successful.
What is your per what was yourpersonal wake-up call that made
you realize what was actuallyholding you back?

SPEAKER_01 (02:31):
Yeah, no, it's so interesting.
I spent many years being thatperson who was the last person
in the office who was steppingin for things that I felt truly
needed to be done and raising myhand when other people were not
there.
And what happened was is itcreated a certain amount of
success.
And so that sort of feeds on itthat that's the kind of person

(02:54):
that you need to be.
That to-do list is never goingto be done.
There are always more things todo.
And yet I spent all my downtimerecovering from work.
Um, my vacations, you know, tookme days to recover.
And I was actually kind ofdreading it because being out of
the office meant I had to domore work before I left and more
work when I came back.

(03:14):
Um, and so I wasn't getting outof that.
And also there was a piece tothat that I wasn't as cognizant
about at the time, but thatperception of me being that
amazing rock star who was doingit all was actually also hurting
my perception and my advancementafter a certain point.

(03:37):
And so I had to kind of wake upto that and realize how do I
change that?
And for me, it was unfortunatebecause I wasn't sure I could,
which I think I hear from a lotof people.
There's, you know, this is justthe expectation of the industry,
this is the expectation of myrole.
I just have a lot going on.
And in order to do this, I haveto be the be all person.

(04:00):
Um, and it kind of took mestepping out of the industry and
starting to learn some tools andsome skills for me to reflect
back on the things that I couldhave done differently, um, but
really just couldn't see it atthe time.

unknown (04:16):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (04:16):
I mean, what we're talking about here is burnout
prevention.

unknown (04:19):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (04:19):
Right.
It's not just looking at what'shappening now, but really
looking towards the future tosay, what are the tendencies?
What are the patterns?
What are the assumptions I'mmaking and what success is and
looks like and how I get there.
And in the process, kind of justsetting yourself up for burnout.
It kind of reminds me a lot.
We were having um a conversationlast week on a panel for the AMA

(04:40):
local YP chapter, The YoungProfessionals.
And I just, I love it so much.
They're so young and bright-eyedand ready to go and unfettered
and unbiased, like not biased,unwhat's the word of thinking.

SPEAKER_01 (04:51):
Yeah.
They're uncrushed like they'reinitially.

SPEAKER_00 (04:56):
You know what I'm saying, Dana.
And, you know, one of thequestions that they had prepared
for us was, you know, what workshould we be taking on?
What projects should we betaking on?
How available should we bemaking ourselves to this extra
work?
And I said, you know, that's howwe all fall into the trap, no
matter where we are in ourcareer, young professional or

(05:17):
OP, old people, oldprofessionals like me.
I said, we we say yes to toomuch.
We think that doing is leading,and it's not because it keeps
you trapped in that space ofalways doing and never getting
to that 30,000-foot view.
And so I'm really excited to digin some more with you.
And I also want to remind thosefolks that are listening live.

(05:39):
We want you to ask questions.
If you have them, put them inthe chat.
We love having live listenershere because if there's
something I'm not hitting onthat you all need that from
Dana, I want you to ask.
Um, but first, let's talk aboutum, which is a nice tangent from
what we just discussed, havingmore control than we think we
do.
I think this is such a nicereality.
It sucks.

(06:00):
I hate I hate to say it, butit's such a good reality to come
to.
Um, from someone staring at acalendar packed with
back-to-back meetings that mightfeel impossible to believe, but
where does that control actuallyexist?
Yeah.
And why is it so important torecognize this too?
I would add that.

SPEAKER_01 (06:16):
It is crucial.
I think the thing that many ofus don't realize as we grow up
in our career, we start asdoers.
So we enter our job and we'rebasically told to do this task
that we were trained to do.
And so we keep that as our modeof working as we rise in the
organization and in our roles.

(06:38):
And I think what we really needto do is realize that other
people are not designing ourcareers or our days for us.

SPEAKER_02 (06:46):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (06:47):
They are just asking us to do stuff.
It is our responsibility toreally understand where we want
to go, what we want our days andour lives to look like, and
figure out how we can make thathappen.

SPEAKER_02 (07:02):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (07:02):
And we really do get into this frame of, you know, I
have to do all of these things.
I have to go to all of thesemeetings.
But the reality of that is wewant to step back and look at
the bigger picture.
It's not just about checking offeverything that's in front of
us, it's about figuring out whatwe're really trying to

(07:24):
accomplish.

SPEAKER_00 (07:24):
Yes.

SPEAKER_01 (07:25):
What are the most important things for us, for our
manager, for our department, forour organization, and how do we
filter and take control overthose pieces so that we're
focusing our energy on the rightthings.
Our it is our control and ourresponsibility, but we also have

(07:45):
a partnership that we want todevelop with our manager where
we help them understand what weare trying to do.
We get their buy-in that we areon the same page about that.
And then we start to figure outwhat are those levers that we
can start to play with.
Yeah.
Um, so that it's not everythingis on.
It's based on what we're tryingto accomplish, really, where is

(08:10):
the time best spent?

SPEAKER_00 (08:12):
Yeah.
And I can imagine this is achallenge.
I'm thinking of so many peoplethat I've coached and mentored
over the years, and and evenfriends and family that are
close to me.
We have this such a strong senseof accountability and duty.
I think this is very much like aWestern workaholic philosophy
and mindset, right?
Um, yay, capitalism.
But also, you know, I think likeyou said, looking at and

(08:33):
focusing on what you can controland looking at what lights you
up, what does success andprogress look like for you?
What are your values?
That to me, taking the actualtime just pause, slow down, look
at your calendar, look at whereyou're spending your time
strategically and saying, issitting in this hour-long

(08:53):
meeting that's an everydaymeeting, is it absolutely
necessary?
Is it making my work better?
Is it getting me my promotion?
Is it effective?
Then maybe it doesn't need tohappen every day.
Right.
You know, it's like one of thosethings where I think we we
definitely get in our own way.
And like you said here, it'slike we're handing over the keys
to our definition of success toother people by letting them

(09:16):
control our calendar, by lettingthem control the deadlines,
instead of knowing kind of bigpicture where we are, where we
want to go, and sort of kind ofusing that as our boundaries.
You know, we talk aboutboundaries a lot, but we don't
talk, I don't think we oftenshared it with people how to
define them and find them.
And to me, it is about paintingthat picture of where you want

(09:36):
to be in three to five years,but also looking at your values.
So if something comes your wayand it's out of alignment and
they're like, take this project,you would be so good at this.
Okay, yeah, I would be good atit, but is it going to get me
where I want to go?
Absolutely.
If it's not, then it's a no.
It does it align with my values.
Is it something that I treasurethat I that I will go out of my
way to do extra for because Iit's important to me?

(09:59):
Then yeah, sure, that can be ayes.
And if it's no, then yeah,definitely no.
And it just for me, it makesthat it eases the decision
fatigue and the analysisparalysis, right?

SPEAKER_01 (10:09):
Yeah, absolutely.
There was one thing you said inthere that I want to make sure
that we're really hearing, whichis sometimes we need to slow
down.

unknown (10:17):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (10:17):
Um, we need to slow down again to speed up.
This is going to have us be moreeffective and more impactful in
the long run.
Yes.
I do a lot of clarity work withpeople because it is one of
those things where if you askedanybody on the street, are you
clear about what you want?
They would probably say yes.
But when you really dig into itand say, okay, are you and how

(10:41):
does your life reflect that?
They would say no.
And so a lot of the the workthat we do, and I will give you
my four keys to clarity.
Yes, I love it.
Um, so the four keys to claritythat I work with a lot of people
on is reflection.
So take the time to really lookat your life.
When were you happy?

(11:02):
When were you fulfilled?
When are you lit up?
And when are you not?
And what is it about thosethings that's really working or
not working for you?
Um, and again, different timesin our life, it may manifest in
a different way.
But oftentimes there's somethingunderlying on that that you are
or aren't getting, um, which canhelp inform the second key,

(11:24):
which is your values, which iswhat you were talking about.
So we really want to be clear onwhat our values are, what's
important to us, and doing theexercise of really sitting down
and coming up with lots of wordsthat represent all the things
and really kind of narrowing itdown and stack ranking, you
know, your top three to fivevalues and have those printed

(11:46):
out, have those on your monitor.
These are one of the things thatyou want to come back to again
and again.
And like you mentioned, it'sgoing to help you with those
decisions, it's going to helpyou with that second guessing.
Um, and it's going to help usinform key number three, which
is our vision.
So we do want to spend a littletime thinking about where we
want to go.

(12:07):
Um, yes, it's it's the future isgonna be different than we
expect it to be.

SPEAKER_03 (12:12):
Always.

SPEAKER_01 (12:13):
But we want to start mapping out what is that North
Star?
What are the things that I Iwant to be moving toward?
How do I not only plot a plan toget there, but how do I start
bringing that into my lifetoday?
We are not gonna be thesedestination people who are
waiting to be happy.
We are gonna figure out what'simportant for us now and start

(12:34):
incorporating that into ourlives.
Um, and then the fourth key onthat is all of those keys right
now have talked a lot about whoam I, what do I think, what do I
believe?
But I don't know everything.
So, what are the gaps in myknowledge?
What are the pieces ofinformation that I don't know
and how do I get them?
How do I research?
How do I talk to people?

(12:55):
And how do I try things on tokeep informing that clarity so
that I really think about what'simportant to me?
Uh, so that's really the processthat I take people with.
And that's important for you,but it's also important to put
that lens towards anybody thatyou're working with.
So, what is your managerthinking?

(13:17):
What is your organizationthinking?
What is a similar way that youcan ask those questions about
what's important to them so thatas you're deciding what you
want, you can communicate thatin a way that's laddering up to
what's important to theorganization.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (13:30):
Cause what you're talking about there is
alignment.
And I'm sure you hear this allthe time too, Dana.
People are like, I'm leaving myjob.
I actually like what I do and Ilike who I work with, but I have
there's no growth.
I'm not growing.
And it's like you said again,like they're handing over
control for their career,success, happiness, and growth
to the company that pays them apaycheck to do a job.

(13:51):
Like you're asking the wrongperson.
So I love your framework and Ilove what you're offering
because I agree.
It's very much reflection.
We we just evaluate.
I think we see it.
I don't know why.
Is it like if it's too woo, it'stoo much of a feminine practice,
but I can think of men thatwould benefit from this greatly
because there's no point inburning yourself out and working
so damn hard only to get to whatyou thought was the perceived

(14:14):
position of success and findthat you weren't happy.

SPEAKER_01 (14:18):
Absolutely.
Because I've been there.
Absolutely.
It happens to so many people.
And I get a lot of people whoare like mid-what I would say
mid-career.
I think that the term is lostthese days on our trajectory,
but but it is that, you know,I've become successful in my
role.
And oftentimes there is still apart of that that intrinsically
I love that that is exciting tome.

(14:40):
But they get to that point andthey're like, I'm not happy.
And I've spent all these yearsignoring my personal life,
ignoring my health, you know,sort of backbird, you know,
backseating my family, all ofthose things.
Um, and that's what's importantto me.
You know, my job is in supportof my life.
My life is not in support of myjob.

(15:01):
And so, how do I keep what Ithink is this?
I need to be giving 100% of myjob in order to be successful.
How do I shift that and stillkeep my role and keep that
success, but start to reallyprioritize the things that are
important to me?
Um, and so that's a conversationpeople are looking at from now
until retirement.
Yeah.
You know, what does that looklike so that I'm not, again,

(15:24):
putting off this like somedayI'll have time.
Um, but how am I bringing thatinto my life now?

SPEAKER_00 (15:30):
Yeah, the procrastination is real.
Um, I definitely am really goodat that.
Like uh, we do this wholeworkshop at the start of every
year.
We were talking about Januaryand the reset and the new you
with our goal getters.
And I learned that myproductivity style was eat the
frog.
I will do every little gnat taskthat needs to be done.
I will not do the thing I don'twant to do, which just sounds

(15:52):
disgusting, but eat the frog,right?
That's why it's that.
Thanks, Mark Tween, for thevisual and analogy.
But it's effective, right?
Because it's like he says thefirst thing you should do every
morning is eat the frog.
So that has really helped mekind of stop procrastinating, do
the one hard thing that needs toget done and how much of the
mental burden and load goes awaywhen I kind of understand myself

(16:12):
better.
Because I think one thing I'velearned over the years is
everybody's productivity styleis different.
And so you the way you getthings done and what success
looks like is going to lookdifferent for you.
So that was another bonusquestion I had that wasn't on
our list was how do you workwith people and encourage people
to identify those values andwhat lights them up in success

(16:34):
when we are constantly beinginfluenced by the people around
us and the media and everythingelse and being told what success
should look and feel like.
It means a title, it means asalary, it means a suit.
I can tell you it's none ofthose things, but I know that
there's a lot of people whostill think that's the case.
How do you work through thatwith them?

SPEAKER_01 (16:51):
Yeah, I think through that clarity process, it
really uncovers.
Um, and again, I get people whostart and they're like, yeah,
yeah, I just want the promotion.
And you're like, okay, those arenot people that I'm gonna start
with clarity boot camp where wedig in.
We're gonna do that as a part oftheir goal.
But as we're doing that, we'realways gonna be doing the inner
work.

(17:12):
So so many times people come tome with one thing as their goal.
But as we start really movingalong that process, I can
continue to ask questions, I cancontinue to talk to them about
what's important, why they'redoing things, and really uncover
what it is they're trying toaccomplish.
Um, you know, one of theexamples I use on the visioning

(17:33):
work a lot of times is, youknow, people want to buy a big,
beautiful house.
So that might be on my visionboard.
And so I'm putting that up andI'm thinking about that, and all
of my energy is going towardsbuying that big, beautiful
house.
But then we start to uncoverwhat is it about that big,
beautiful house that you reallywant.
And sometimes it is status.

(17:56):
You know, I want to be next tomy neighbors and I want to be
seen as successful.
I want to be doing those things.
And so that is true.
That is real, that is valid.
And so we need to acknowledgethat as a part of the
conversation.
It's usually not the onlyreason, and it's usually not the
main reason.
So usually it is, you know, Iwant financial safety and

(18:19):
security.
I want to care for my family.
I want to be in a beautiful,serene surrounding that gives me
that ease and comfort.
If you want to care at home.
Yeah.
And so then we can start toreally uncover like, what is it
about whatever it is you'resaying you are going towards

(18:40):
that really is at the core ofit?
And again, the picture of wherewe go for that might look
different.
It might be that big, beautifulhouse.
I'm not saying it's not.
Um, but that longer term visioncan look a little bit different.
But then we again go back to howcan I incorporate that into my
life now?
What are the things that I'mmissing that I'm longing for?

(19:02):
And then as we start practicingand playing with those things,
then we get more information.
We get more information aboutwhat's really resonating, what's
making us happy and comfortableand confident, and what's not.
Because there will be a lot ofsteps along the way.
And it's like, I thought Iwanted that, and yet, you know,

(19:24):
I immediately move to what'snext or I'm not fulfilled.
And then you can really start tobreak it down and get to the
truth of what is really going tobe success.

SPEAKER_00 (19:36):
Ugh, I feel like that might have been like the
best sound bite, probably.
I mean, we still have like 40minutes, but like of this next
hour.
Because what you're askingpeople to do, and I think I'm
gonna even try to start doingthis because I was mentally, as
you were speaking, likedeconstructing your wants.
Yeah.
Um, I've often said follow yourenvy.
It's showing you what you want.
Oftentimes you see that big,beautiful house, you're like,

(19:57):
Oh, I'm so challenged.
I wish I had, but it's like,okay, what is it about that
house that I want?
Like you said, financial safety,security, serene space, a sense
of home when I come there, aplace where I can bring people
to gather together.
Like there's it is more thanjust that.
And to your point exactly, bydeconstructing those wants, I'm
really starting to learn what itis right now that I need.

(20:18):
And again, to your point, ratherthan waiting for that big long
someday to happen, which juststretches out for however long,
you can start to be like, okay,well, maybe there's things I can
do at home right now to createthat sense of serenity, that
sense of space.
You know, maybe I can find alocation where we can gather.
Because if I want to gather,then I should just be gathering
and that could be anywhere.

(20:38):
I really, really love that.
And I think it does kind of getpast that surface level of the
once, right?
Because you also mentionedsomething earlier that I've gone
down a rabbit hole on of thehedotic adaptation.

SPEAKER_02 (20:50):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (20:51):
You want, you want, you want, you get, and your
brain's like, great, we got it.
Next thing.
Yeah.
And that's not you, your yourbody, your brain, your mind,
everything needs not that littlehit of dopamine, but it's like
the release of serotonin, right?
That that longer lasting high oflike a sense of safety and
satisfaction and security.
And so that boat, that plane,that big house, just checking

(21:14):
that box isn't going to do thething.
I love that so much, Dana.
I'm this is like this is good.
Yeah.
I don't know about the rest ofyou, but I'm getting a lot out
of this.

SPEAKER_01 (21:23):
I think the other piece that you nodded right
there, too, is the fact that Ithink, again, this goes back to
the slowing down process where,you know, we've all got our
projects and we're familiar withdoing like our project retros or
whatever we're calling themthese days.
Um, and we want to incorporatethat into our everyday.
So we want to be having a reviewand planning.

(21:46):
So, you know, I recommend thatpeople do this on a daily,
weekly, monthly, annual basis.
Um, but really what it is is notjust the moving on to the next
thing, but what we're reallymissing is that reflection.
So, what happened?
What what did I do that wasamazing?

(22:07):
How can I savor and celebrate mysuccesses rather than just
moving on from them?
And yes, what do I want to keepdoing moving forward?
And what do I maybe want to do alittle bit differently?
What do I want to try next timethat might have a different
outcome?
Really treating it like gettinginformation for experiments that

(22:28):
I'm gonna continue with movingforward.
But that really pausing andreflecting, we don't appreciate
our accomplishments.
We skip right past them.
We have such a negativity biasthat all we can look at is what
went wrong and what what we'remissing.
And so we want to pause andenjoy and embrace those moments

(22:50):
and retrain our brains that weare doing good things and good
things are happening to us.
And these are the things I'menjoying.
So, how do I incorporate more ofthose moments into our life?
When I'm planning, it's not justabout the next project that's
being done.
It's about, you know, we weretalking about, you know, maybe
vacations or camping.
It's like, what are the momentsthat are really important to me

(23:12):
and how do I make sure those areincorporated as well?

SPEAKER_00 (23:16):
I love it.
It's like it's intentionalsuccess, is what it is.
Very intentional success.
Yeah, we literally were justtalking before we all hopped on
live with y'all about how, youknow, this season is my kids'
fall break, and I'm usuallyplanning a conference, which I
am, but it's in January nowinstead of October.
But I'm also opening up acoworking space next week.
And how this weekend is usuallylike my weekend to just go

(23:37):
somewhere with my kids and likeliterally no Wi-Fi, no internet,
and just be present and be innature.
And for me, that's such anecessity.
And so I've done a good jobthese last few years of making
sure that there's those standingmoments every year that I will
always do my best to kind ofmake sure they're kind of a part
of how we schedule things as afamily, because I think that

(23:58):
helps me.
It helps them.
And like you said, you know, youneed that pause to be able to
come back stronger and workharder.
Like that's that's thenecessity.
What you're talking about, Dana,is doing less, which sounds a
little scary to some people.
Sounds luxurious to me andamazing.
Sign me up.
But um, you've developed the sixD's of doing less.
Could you talk us through withthat?

(24:19):
Because we love our frameworkshere.
We love like talk about ourframework, a little your
framework and how someone couldstart to applying um these six
D's as soon as we get done here,because you know, it's Friday.
It's Friday.
Now is the time to spend it.

SPEAKER_01 (24:34):
Perfect time.
Absolutely.
So the foundation that we talkabout before we move into the
60s is that clarity work.
So, in order for us to decidewhat we're gonna be doing and
how we're gonna be doing it, wereally need to know what's
important.
We need to know what's importantto us, to our organization, all
of those things.
And we need to know what'simportant about how these things

(24:55):
fit in.
So that's the first thing we do.
The very first D that we look atis dump.
So we want to dump everythingthat we have to do on our to-do
list.
Um, I do suggest if you havetime, having this be a larger
exercise is great.
Um, if you want to do this justas a part of your weekly
process, it's going through andlooking at all your to-dos.
Um, so looking at everythingthat you have on your to-do

(25:17):
list, everything that you haveon your calendar, all of those
pieces so that we're sort oflooking at things holistically.
We never want to look at any yesin a vacuum because that's not
our reality.
Um, if that were the only thingwe had on we on our plate, we
might treat it differently.
But we really want to make surethat we're looking at everything
that we have to do.
So once we've dumped everythingout, then we want to do the

(25:39):
first D, which is the hardest D.
So don't feel pressure that youhave to do this one right away,
but it's delete.
So we want to decide what arethe things we're not going to
do.
We are not going to get toeverything that we have on our
to-do list.
And so there is so much benefitin deciding ahead of time that
we're going to delete it.
So I'm not going to think aboutit anymore.

(26:01):
No more of my energy is going togo to this thing.
I'm going to decide the thingsof lesser value, and I'm going
to make sure that I'mcommunicating any dependencies
so that nobody else is worriedabout this thing happening.
So that's the first thing wewant to do.
We can come back to this againand again.
So don't feel stressed that youneed to delete a lot of things
on your to-do list.
Um, the next D that we want togo into is we want to defer.

(26:24):
So I suggest that you think ofthis within about a month
framework.
So for October, what are thethings that really are need to
be dealt with or thought aboutin October?
If it is not an October thing, Iwant to make sure that it's
accounted for, but I want to putit in my backlog because again,
I don't want to waste any energyon something that I don't need

(26:47):
to do now and might change.
So I want to defer anything thatI'm not thinking about.
And it's written down, I have itsomeplace so that I can train my
brain, that there's a place thatI keep that information.
Part of this really is thattraining so I can relax about
those pieces.
The next D that we want to do iswe want to diminish.

(27:09):
So there are lots of ways wecould accomplish the things on
our list.
But when we go back to what'simportant about that thing and
what's important for us, what isthe least amount of scope that
is going to satisfy that?
What is our MVP of each taskthat we are doing?
Again, it's not in a vacuum.
I don't have endless time.

(27:30):
So we really want to think aboutgood enough here for some of
these tasks.
So maybe the scope of the taskand maybe the time that we're
spending on the task.
Some of these things likeresearch, maybe it's a time box.
And so we figure out how muchtime we want to spend against
those.
Um, the next D that we want todo is we want to digitize.

(27:51):
And this really goes into thetasks that we're doing on a
repeated basis.
How can we save time?
So, is there a system that wecan do for that?
Sometimes it might be just achecklist so I don't have to
think so much every time I dothis as I go through it.
Sometimes it's an email templateso that I don't have to write
that email.

(28:11):
Sometimes it's an internaldepartment fact or it's a form
that you have people fill out.
So, what are the simple thingsthat I can do that are just
going to make something that Ido on a repeated basis easier?
Our next D is delegate.
So this is the one that I thinkpeople want to embrace, but they

(28:34):
have the most trouble with.
So when I'm talking to myclients, they're like, I don't
have anybody to delegate to.
Like, that sounds great, butwhere are my people that I can
delegate to?
Um, and so part of this is aconversation with your manager
about really what are the thingsthat you should be doing.

(28:55):
And how can we help source thethings that are not as important
for me?
Part of this is the reality thatsometimes I'm gonna order
takeout.
Sometimes I'm gonna hiresomebody to clean the house.
What are the things that arereally gonna benefit?
Sometimes it's spending money.
Um, sometimes it's leaning onyour family and distributing
tasks.

(29:15):
Maybe it's on the girls'weekend, not being the one who's
always getting the reservationor always doing the booking.
So really just think about whatare the things that you can that
you don't need to be the personwho's doing, that somebody else
can take over.
Um, and I did these in order,and of course, we can delegate
much sooner in this ladder.

(29:36):
But the idea is if we'redelegating things, we also want
them to be thinking through theframework.
We don't want them to be doingmore on this task than they need
to.
We don't want them notautomating all of those things.
And so that brings us throughthe D's of sort of reducing the
amount of work that we have onour plate to then get us to what
we're gonna do.

SPEAKER_02 (29:56):
Actually, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (29:57):
And oftentimes we still have more things.
Things on our do list, then wehave time in our week.
And so there's a few ways thatwe want to handle that.
One is going back through thelist now that we've gone through
it and kind of thinking aboutit.
And then the other is how do Ibe more effective with my time
so that the things that I'mdoing don't take up more time

(30:18):
than they need, than theyshould.
Right.
Um, all of those pieces.
But part of that is once I getclear on what's important for
me, and we've kind of beenthinking about in a month range,
those new things that come inthat are the things that we
react to all day that take upall our time, I've been very
strategic about my list.
So as those new things come in,then I have an attention to

(30:41):
okay, is this more importantthan I have than something that
I have on my list?
Is this something that I want todelete, diminish, digitize,
defer, delegate?
So all of those things that arecoming in, instead of those
being the things that take myfocus as soon as I walk in every
day, those are the things thatnow I'm seeing with such a
stricter eye as to how I want tomanage those new tasks and those

(31:06):
reactionary things that come in.

SPEAKER_00 (31:08):
I love it.
Yay.
Love a good framework.
I'm sure all of our listenersare like taking notes.
So that's amazing.
We'll include them all in theshow notes too.
Right.
Uh what I think I think women inparticular struggle with the
delegate.
You know, I think oftentimesbecause we get rewarded so much
for doing and and being thedoers that it's hard because you

(31:30):
feel like it's part of youridentity and you feel like what
little recognition maybe you doget, um, it is going to come
from the doing.
And so that there's I feel likethere's some sense of like shame
sometimes behind the idea ofdelegating.
But I have to tell you, ladies,it's it's freeing.
Um, and as you were speaking,Dana, it just really occurred to
me, while it's the six D's ofdoing less, you're actually

(31:51):
going to accomplish more.
You will be doing less andaccomplishing more.
Like, yes, why would that not besomething you want to go through
in the process of doing?

SPEAKER_01 (32:00):
Yeah.
I think that's really thereframe that we need to take.
So instead of us saying, I'mgonna start shirking my
responsibilities, that's kind ofwhat goes through our head.
Like, I'm gonna, I'm gonna sayno to all these things and you
know it's gonna upset people andI'm not gonna get things done
and all of those things.
What we're doing is we'resaying, like, right now, what
I'm doing probably isn't aseffective as it could be on the

(32:22):
things that are important.
And so whether you're talkingabout carving out more time,
whether you're talking aboutgetting that promotion, whether
you're talking about steppinginto a new leadership role, this
is really the mindset that youreally want to take on.
Because why wouldn't we want tobe spending our time most
effectively on the things thatare most important?

(32:44):
Um, and so that goes back when Iwas telling kind of that story
about the perception of thebusyness.

SPEAKER_00 (32:50):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (32:51):
Yes, there's recognition and all of that
accomplishment, but there is alittle bit of there, you know,
when a leader steps into a roomand is crystal clear on the
things that are important andthe things that they're doing.
You don't think about thatperson as shirking their
responsibilities.
You think about them as beingstrategically focused.
Yes.
We all want to bring that intoour lives and into our days,

(33:14):
both our personal lives and ourprofessional lives.
Yes, absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 (33:18):
Yeah, because that does touch on that fear, right?
That if I start doing less,people think I'm not as
committed or I'll lose out onopportunities.
And I think it's like quite theopposite.
You know, like you said, itlooks like you are taking
control of what you have controlover, you are being deliberate
and intentional about the thingsthat you're working on.
You're talking to your boss andsaying, I need to be more

(33:39):
effective at work.
I need to the thing that youhired me for is the thing that I
want to be making sure that I'mdoing the most of.
But how many extra jobs and hatsdo we take on in the workplace
because we think it will lead toother opportunities and all
you're not being a martyr,you're just sacrificing
yourself, your sanity, andactually the success of your
work by taking on those thingsthat, you know, aren't going to

(34:01):
serve you.
You're not actually helping thecompany.

SPEAKER_01 (34:04):
They're not serving you, they're not helping the
company, and you're stretchingyourself so thin that I
guarantee you when things gowrong, people will a little bit
get it, but they will also alittle bit be like, you drop the
ball.

SPEAKER_00 (34:16):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (34:17):
And so we don't want to be putting ourselves in that
position.
We want to be setting ourselvesup for success.
We want to be doing things tothe best of our ability so that
we are getting the truerecognition we deserve for
accomplishing the things thatwere important.
Um, and part of that is theslowing down and being strategic
and planning what you're gonnafocus on.

SPEAKER_00 (34:37):
I love it.
So, say they've gotten throughall of that and they've worked
through the clarity and thevalues and the D's and all of
that.
Not all of us have fantasticbosses, right?
Or maybe we just are we strugglewith difficult conversations or
direct conversations, especiallywhen it comes to the things that
we maybe want and need.

(34:58):
Kind of on both sides of thatdifficult boss versus having
difficult conversations, whichis more of an internal than an
external problem.
What's your approach for havingthose discussions in a way that
doesn't make you feel likeyou're jeopardizing your job or
your value or yourself?
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (35:14):
I think it it does actually go back to the clarity
piece that we were talkingabout.
So again, I'm really clear onwhat it is that I'm trying to
accomplish, all of those things,but I'm also really thinking
about it from your point ofview.
What are you trying toaccomplish?
What do you want to set thesethings up for success?
Um, and we have all haddifficult bosses.

(35:35):
Um, if you have not, bless you.
Um, and congratulations.
I know, right?
Um but I will tell you, nobodywants to be a bad boss.
Um, they just are notnecessarily equipped.
They also do not have thebandwidth to do the things that
they want to do.
But if you approach them with away that is thoughtful and
really taking their point ofview into account, they are

(35:57):
going to be maybe notimmediately, but they are going
to be thankful that you arehelping them with this
information and involving themin the right decision points.
You are not always gonna getwhat you want.
Um, but by really practicingthat strategy and that thinking
and that approach, and again,really listening and asking

(36:17):
questions and reallyunderstanding what they're
trying to accomplish, um, you'rereally gonna be much more likely
to get to the ending that youreally want.

SPEAKER_00 (36:27):
I love it.
Well, because by putting it onpaper, by creating your career
path and strategy for yourself,taking ownership.
Um it here's the thing about badbosses.
It's like it they're gonnareveal themselves.
And like you'll get the answerthat you need after that
conversation, regardless.

(36:47):
Either you will get the supportthat you need from that boss
that sees you and values you andsays, wow, you did this great
work of understanding yourself,your values, but then also
considering the company's valuesand plans and goals.
And you're trying to work intandem with us, you know.
And so to me, if they areaccepting of you sharing this
plan, great, you have the greenlight to go forward.

(37:10):
And how many of us are sittingin a job where we're just like
waiting to get laid off?
We've quiet quit, you know,we're waiting for that
breakthrough moment, thatopportunity that will just make
everything shiny and betteragain.
Well, it's not coming.
Like the only person coming tosave you is you.
So by having that hardconversation with your boss and
being very clear on what youwant and even how you plan to do

(37:31):
that to help them and thecompany and you, if they tell
you no, you also have anotheranswer.
That could be your sign.
Like I, you know, they say youpeople don't quit bad jobs, they
quit bad bosses, right?
And so if that doesn't change,at least now you are clear and
you have your answer if youdon't have the support that you

(37:52):
need to move yourself forwardforward professionally.
At least that's my opinion.
And I know jobs are not a dime adozen around here, so I'm not
telling you to just go and quityour jobs.

SPEAKER_01 (37:58):
No, no, no, no, no.
But I think, but I but again,we're talking about getting more
information.
That is what we are alwaystrying to do is get more
information.
And if the information, again, Iwork with a lot of people who
who are like, I want to leave myjob.
And so a lot of the things thatwe do in that role is we we
practice some skills and then wesee does that turn things

(38:18):
around?
And maybe it doesn't.
Maybe that's just an opportunitythat's not ever going to be the
right fit, and you do want tostart looking for other things.
But those skills that you'repracticing, you want to learn.
And so this is a greatopportunity for you to practice
them.
The other thing to think aboutis while you're in a role,
again, we have more opportunityto practice other things.

(38:40):
So one is we want to beestablishing a lot of
relationships outside of ourmanager.

SPEAKER_03 (38:45):
Yes.

SPEAKER_01 (38:45):
We want to be talking to our skip, we want to
be talking to other leaders, wewant to be talking to peers.
We want to make sure that we'regetting a full understanding of
what is happening in theorganization.
Particularly if you're lookingto pivot in roles, doing that
within your existingorganization is gonna be so much
easier than having somebody inan external organization see
your value and see how you mightmake that move.

(39:07):
Very true.
I love that.
So if you can do that movewithin your organization, that's
always something worth lookingat.
Can I create what I want where Iam?
Again, sometimes theorganization itself is not gonna
be the long-term fit.
So again, maybe I'm justdeveloping the relationships
because relationships are ourcash and so they are going to
help us moving forward.

(39:28):
Maybe I'm practicing skills herethat are things that I want to
get under my belt, have anopportunity to do.
So, really thinking about what Ican get out of this job that is
going to help me, even if it'snot that I'm gonna stay in this
role really long term.
So that while I'm starting tothink about what do I want?
What would be a good fit?

(39:49):
What are the kinds oforganizations, what are the
kinds of people, what is thekind of working lifestyle, as
well as what are the specifictasks that I'm doing?
And so, how do I startformulating what that move could
look like while I'm still securein a role?
Because that's gonna help youfinancially, of course, but
there's also a certain amount ofuh negativity, which I wish were

(40:12):
not the case, um, about youknow, being out of a job is just
gonna be more challenging thanbeing in a job.

SPEAKER_00 (40:19):
So true.
That's so true.
Yeah.
So maybe it's like instead ofthe quiet quitting, you well, if
you want to quiet quit, I mean,I'm not gonna discourage it per
se.
I'm gonna say take that extratime that you're not giving the
extra and work on you becausethat's going to help you for the
next thing.
And I agree, like, you know, thethe more understanding you are
of yourself, the more alignedyou are with yourself, honestly,

(40:40):
the more opportunities come toyou.
I wouldn't be sitting here doingthis with Together Digital if it
wasn't for finding alignment inthe things that I love and do.
I I wouldn't be opening up aco-working space and have found
like the perfect businesspartner for that opportunity if
I wasn't spending my time andenergy in doing what you've
talked about today, which islike really understanding who I

(41:00):
am, what I want to accomplish,what does success look like for
me.
So I know how what opportunitiesare the right opportunities to
pursue.
But I will also say that's howopportunities have come to me,
even in the past.
Absolutely.
And so instead of sitting andkind of waiting to be wanted,
you will be sought out.
Like that's the other benefit, Ithink, of doing this work and
being very clear on that.

(41:21):
Um, I there was one thing too,as you were talking about
relationships and work.
I think one other thing I oftenstepped in, which I mean, I
wouldn't change or go back on,but I think I would look at it a
little bit differently.
And I'm kind of curious howoften you see this with the
people that you work with.
Like how much time we givementorship, counseling,
sponsorship, and support toothers versus time for
ourselves.

SPEAKER_01 (41:41):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Um, such a great question.
I think that when we look at thementorship and spend and
sponsorship in those things,there is a value not only with
paying it forward, which I thinkso many of us believe in, um,
but there is a value toourselves.

(42:02):
Um, so you know, by teachingsomething, by discussing
something, we really start tounderstand it in a different
way.
We really start to lean intothose things.
We understand the potential ofother people and moving into
those things.
And so there is a tremendousamount of value.
And I think when we're lookingat our sort of relationship

(42:22):
spiderweb is how I kind of thinkabout it.
We want to make sure that we areexpressing in as many spaces as
possible.
We want to be looking to ourmentors and sponsors.
And again, some organizationshave like a mentorship program,
which is great.
Um, but a lot of times what wedo is we get slices of
mentorship from different peoplein different roles.

(42:43):
We have our own sort of board ofdirectors, um, you know, where
we're looking to differentpeople for different things.
Um, and the idea that that'salso sometimes a reverse
mentorship, like people who arenew and younger in, you know, in
an organization, yeah, they'relooking at things in a different
way than than we did.
They are looking at, you know,digital as something that as as

(43:06):
a as a Gen X person, you know,we're just we're just raised
differently.
You know, we were not raised inthat same way.
And so that new way and newperspective of looking at things
is so valuable.
So I think that really ingeneral, the the thing that I
would say is we uh when we'relooking at our full plate and

(43:27):
all of our Ds that we've we'vedumped out, what we're not
always making time for, inaddition to vacations and rest
and recharging and personal lifeand things like that.
We're not looking at our uhcareer development.
Um, and so that covers kind ofall of those things.
And we want to make sure that weare making time for those
things.

(43:47):
How do we want to educateourselves?
What do we want to attend?
What, you know, are we hiring acoach?
Um, you know, are we going toeducation?
Are we involved in employeeresource groups?
Um, are we giving back?
Are we being a sponsor and amentor?
And that is a part of a job.
That is a part of the careercorporate ecosystem.

(44:10):
And so really thinking about howmuch of those, and yeah, we're
gonna be in different phases anddifferent times where those
might ebb and flow.
Um, but we do want to make surethat we're leaving time on our
plate for those things becausethey are as important as the
tasks that we do.

SPEAKER_00 (44:26):
Yeah, taking care of yourself as any kind of leader,
it's such an essential thing todo.
And I think it's such a good,healthy thing to model.
And I think, like as you weretalking, I was like, if I could
go back to give, you know,myself advice for all the advice
I gave to others, for all thetimes, for the coffees, for all
the lunches, for all the eventsessions, I just really realized

(44:48):
how I gave a lot, but I askedvery little.
And that's been something thathas really changed within me and
being part of Together Digital.
You know, we have our ask andgive exchange where we encourage
women to ask for what they need,no guilt, no shame, and to give
without any judgment.
And a lot of it is a more focuson the ask because it's like a
muscle you have to build up.
It's hard to ask for help.

(45:10):
It's hard to accept help evenmore than it is to ask, I think
sometimes.
Yeah.
I think we don't know what toask for a lot of the time.
Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (45:18):
And so we're like, okay, well, there's not an ask,
and so I just won't.
Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00 (45:23):
Yep.

unknown (45:24):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (45:24):
So that's why we kind of work to sort of change
that narrative by providingopportunities through like the
Slack community.
Every event we have, whetherwe're in person or virtual, we
open up the floor and we'relike, who has an ask?
Who needs something right now?
Because there's not somebodysitting in a room of even three
people that doesn't needsomething and help in some way.
And like you said, the more youget used to, you know, making

(45:47):
those asks, it becomes easier toidentify what the ask should be.
Because yeah, this deer andheadlights moment, we're like,
Well, does anybody have an ask?
And it's like, ah, the answer isyes.
You just are so conscious to askfor it.
And so that makes it hard.
So you have to practice.

SPEAKER_01 (46:01):
Yeah, I love that.
I took a negotiation course justbecause you know it's it's
valuable to me and to myclients.
Um, and one of the challengesshe gave us was to negotiate
something every week.
I love it.
And and so we sought out thoseopportunities and having it as a
challenge where you're like,okay, what can I negotiate?
What can I talk about?
I will tell you I've never paida late fee since.

(46:22):
I love it.
But um, but we're getting intothose conversations, and I think
asks is like a similar thing.
So thinking about what are thethings that you can ask for?
What can I ask for now?
Because the other thing that'sreally interesting is the
psychology of that is if youhave a small ask to someone
else, yeah, they are more likelyto want to do things for you.

(46:43):
Um, they want to help.
And I I think the other thingthat this sort of ties back to
which we were talking earlier,is when you formulate what it is
that you're looking for and whatit is you want, it comes to you.

SPEAKER_03 (46:56):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (46:56):
Because you're able to express it.
And people have thoseopportunities.
Yes.
Um, but if you walk into a roomand you're like, yeah, I'm
great.
Yeah, people are like, that isawesome for you.
Carry on.
And it's not that they're notinterested in helping, but
they're not going to do the workto figure out what it is.
Um so we want to get better atmaking those asks, at telling

(47:18):
people what we're looking for,even if we haven't totally
formulated it.
Yes.
So here's, you know, here's whatI'm struggling with.
Like, here's what I'm lookingfor, here's all of those things.
So figuring out how to get inconversations where you're
talking more about what it isyou want, who you want to start
talking to, who can theyintroduce you to maybe, um, so
that you can start to have thoseconversations.

(47:39):
And again, people want that.
They want to be a part of thathelpful cycle.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (47:45):
I agree.
Yeah, it always hurts when yousee somebody struggling and
you're like, how can I help?
They're like, Nope, I'm fine.
Yeah.
You know, it's like, no, youactually not just hurt yourself,
but you kind of hurt me a littlebit.
Like, don't resist, don'tdecline the help.
People want to be there.
There's that whole law ofreciprocation as well, because,
and that's the beauty of it isnow that you've been vulnerable
and made the ask to them, theyknow that they can come to you

(48:05):
and also ask for help.
Yeah.
And it's just, it's like, why,why do we choose to live on
these islands?
Yeah.
At home, at work, everywhere inlife.
It uh all it takes is a littlebit of openness and
vulnerability.
And you're gonna find so manypeople that are like, oh my
gosh, the same.
I feel that, I know that, I'veexperienced that.
And maybe they're like a halfstep ahead of you or a half step

(48:25):
behind you.
But to me, that is the beauty ofpeer mentors and then things
like that, where, and I agreewith you, it's like it's inside
of work, but I also think it'ssuper essential to find that
circle outside of work becauseno job is forever.
Um, you need to find bonds,friendships, and relationships
that transcend careers and andlife stages.
And I think in order to do that,you know, it you it can't just

(48:45):
be all your best pals are yourworkmates.
That's also another big pitfallI've seen.
Um, not to go on too much of atangent, but it is one of those
things where, you know, it justcan become a trap.
And so that's why gettingoutside help support um outside
of your company for yourpersonal and professional
development and growth.
It's again, like you said at thevery beginning, it's like you
have the keys.

(49:06):
You are in control instead ofleaving that control to your job
because God forbid tomorrow thatjob's gone, all your resources
are gone.

SPEAKER_01 (49:13):
Exactly.
Exactly.
And so, really thinking aboutokay, within my organization,
how do I do that?
I was coaching somebody who was,she was basically the, you know,
the only web person in her inher team.
And so she was establishingthose relationships.
But one of the things we reallyworked on was where can you find
your community?
Where can you get thoseresources outside?
Because not only do people inyour organization not have the

(49:35):
expertise of what you're doing,right?
Um, but there are someconversations that you don't
know how to have with thembecause you're so worried about
the politics of like, I don'twant to seem like I don't know
what I'm doing.
Sure.
I don't want to seem like I'mdemanding or all of those
things.
And so you can get perspectivefrom other people.
And you can also talk to leadersin other organizations who are

(49:56):
going to help you frame it andpractice in a way in your
organization.
And of course, down the road,when you're looking, you know,
beyond your organization, whichmost of us do at some point, you
do want to make sure that youhave a broader network.
Um, because yeah, people, peoplethat you know will leave to go
other places.
But yeah, you know, reallyreaching out to communities like
this and other more, you know,specific industry events, things

(50:20):
like that are really going toopen those doors.
I think people are reluctant tonetwork.
Um, and and really what it comesdown to is forming
relationships.
I think we are we are peoplefirst and thinking of it that
way, you know, and it's not whatcan you do for me?
It's how can we support eachother?

SPEAKER_00 (50:40):
Yes.

SPEAKER_01 (50:41):
Um, and really having that idea is something
that I think resonates a lotmore with people and feels more
authentic to who we are.

SPEAKER_00 (50:50):
Yes.
Oh holler.
Yeah, we can chit chat moreabout like some of the research
in the book I'm writing onnetworking because you just hit
all the points.
Okay, Dana, all the points.
Networking feels icky for somany reasons, and there's just
so much value to it because ifyou change your mindset too, I
am building relationships thatare meant to transcend my career
and life stages, like it feels alittle less icky and business

(51:12):
card swapping and whatnot.
But really, what we're talkingabout here, Dana, I feel like is
you're future-proofing yourcareer in a world right now that
feels super uncertain, where theeconomy is all over the place,
where companies arerestructuring and layoffs and
job seeking is hard.
You know, all of this work, eventhough it sounds like work, one,
you're going to be happier andmore satisfied for it.
You're going to have deeper,better relationships for it.

(51:35):
Um, you know, I don't, I can'tthink of any reason why y'all
shouldn't be doing this ifyou're not already.
But um, looking at kind of thebigger picture, you know, we
kind of started in this place ofdo less and um what success
looks like.
Um how do you see theconversation around productivity
and success starting to shift,especially for women, um kind of
in our area, digital and tech,and what gives you hope that

(51:58):
we're moving away from thisalways-on culture?

SPEAKER_01 (52:02):
Yeah.
No, I think that again, therethere's a few pieces to that.
So one is I think thatproductivity has gotten kind of
a bad rap because it's the ideathat people canoe is doing more.

SPEAKER_02 (52:15):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (52:15):
Um, and that's absolutely not what we are
looking at.
We are looking at beingefficient with our time and
effective with the things thatwe're doing.
So when I talk aboutproductivity, I my therapist
joked with me because she waslike, You're talking about being
more efficient with your rest.

(52:36):
And I said, Yeah, yeah, I am.
Because if I'm taking 30 minutesoff, I want to figure out how
what is the most restful?
What am I really craving for?
So it's not me sitting therescrolling on my phone.

SPEAKER_02 (52:49):
No.

SPEAKER_01 (52:49):
So it's it's what is restful for me.
So I really think of that sortof productivity and
effectiveness is really what I'mtalking about in all of those
areas of our life.
So it's not about doing more,it's about really looking at
that holistic piece and saying,how can I spend the right amount
of time on each of these thingsand not more time than things
are are worth.

SPEAKER_00 (53:10):
Yeah.
That's so true.
That's another really goodexercise too, finding those
little time socks.
It's like the difference betweenmaking sure that your time is
spent mindfully versusmindlessly.
We all need to decompress, but Ithink we default to mindlessness
versus mindfulness as a way todecompress.
And what you're talking aboutthere and being more effective
with your rest is really justbeing more mindful and aware of

(53:31):
how you're spending yourdowntime to make sure that it's
truly something that fills youback up, that gives you a sense
of just deep contentment andsatisfaction.
And I'm not talking mindfulnessasn't it's gotta be a meditation
or hugging a tree or anythinglike that, although those all
sound good to me.
Find out what that is for you,and then that's where you start
to spend that time to rest.

(53:53):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (53:54):
Exactly.
I mean, studies show again andagain that being in nature,
being having movement, all ofthose things really bring back
to you.
And so, like, I'm reallyinterested in that because yeah,
I want to return my energy.
I don't want to just be spendingenergy.
And so I want to know what thosethings are, and I think you're
absolutely right.
It's we need to play with it andhave play is another thing that

(54:15):
can be energy building.
So, like, we need to play withthose things and see what are
the things that I like to do sothat again, we're not defaulting
to some of those things that arereally seem easier, but actually
don't refill our cup.

SPEAKER_03 (54:28):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (54:29):
And so, and so I think thinking about kind of
everything in our lives with alittle bit of that lens where
we're again being intentionalabout what we're doing and how
we're spending our time justbenefits us in the long run and
makes us happier and healthierand everyone else around us,
right?

SPEAKER_00 (54:46):
And everyone else around us intentionally for
ourselves in a way that actuallydoes help us show up better.
We're showing up better foreveryone.
So it's not selfish, likeself-care.
We know we see that a lot.
Self-care is not selfish, butit's not selfish.
I know.

SPEAKER_01 (55:01):
I mean, I yeah, I think like what you were saying
about, you know, we're we're nottalking about doing less, we're
talking about actually beingmore impactful professionally.
That idea that that these thingsare not mutually exclusive, and
in fact, one really benefits theother.
So that idea that reallythinking about how we're
spending our time professionallyalso applies to personally.

(55:22):
So when they talk about likeengaged work communities are
more productive, you know what?
Rested, healthy people are moreengaged with their family and
their personal lives.
And so we really want to bethinking about all of those
things because it is not takingaway from what we are trying to
do.
If we are talking about, youknow, our quality of

(55:43):
relationships, it's not aboutmore, it's about really being
present in all of those things.
And what do I need in order tobe present in my life?
And sometimes that's downtime,sometimes that's sleep.
Um, so making sure that I amfilling my cup in order to fill
other people's.
Um, it seems trite at thispoint, but it's one of the

(56:04):
things that it if it's simple,but it's not easy.

SPEAKER_04 (56:08):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (56:08):
Um, and I think we all know these things, but
really giving ourselvespermission and then figuring out
how we practice them issomething that we need to be
just really thoughtful and kindof putting ourselves on our
to-do list.

SPEAKER_00 (56:21):
I love it.
All right, I'm gonna do twoquick power round questions
before we sign off for the day.
Dana, this has been so good.
This is like one of those daysin conversations where it's
like, oh, I needed all thesereminders.
Because as much as knowledge asI might seem to have as all the
sayings, I might have all thereadings I've done.
Like, yeah, we're all work inprogress.
I mean all the reminders.
Yeah.
We all backslide because life,life life and work works and all

(56:42):
the things happen.
So um, my two of my favoritequestions that we had that I
think our audience would like tohear as well that were in the
power round is what was thefirst thing you deleted?
Because that was a scary thingyou started with then your D
deleted from your calendar thatchanged everything.

SPEAKER_01 (56:54):
Yeah, for me, I think the first thing I deleted
was anything that was recurring.

unknown (57:01):
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (57:02):
Um, so all of those things that I'm doing out of
habit for me, I started fromscratch.
I love it.
And I added some things back in,but I really deleted everything.
And then I kind of started backto how am I intentionally
choosing?
Is this the right format?

(57:23):
Is this the right time?
Is this the right thing that Iwant to do?
Um, and so the clean sweep ofthat is a little weird, but um
it's helpful.
It's like cleaning out yourcloset.
You know, it's it's you can do alittle damage by taking things
out one at a time, but sometimesyou gotta you gotta take it all.
Take up a whole pile.

SPEAKER_00 (57:41):
I love the recurring.
That's such a great, and Ihonestly realized just now I
I've done that instinctually fora long time because I like to do
time blocking and day themingand things like that.
But sometimes things change andI have to kind of take those and
scrap them.
Well, and then like you said, ifit's if it's like that or I
think I said it earlier, thehour meeting every day, like is

(58:02):
that an absolute necessity?
Or do I just feel like that's ahave to do that's really eating
up my time?
Because you need to, if youdon't respect your time, ain't
nobody else gonna respect it.
Okay.
One last question before we jumpoff.
One boundary you felt that youone boundary that you set that
felt scary at first, but now youwould never give it up.

SPEAKER_01 (58:21):
Um, so this is less about a specific boundary than
about a technique.
Um, but I decline things withoutan excuse.

SPEAKER_00 (58:29):
Yes.
Oh, I love that.

SPEAKER_01 (58:31):
I've started doing that too.

SPEAKER_00 (58:32):
That's so good.

SPEAKER_01 (58:33):
So people don't need to know.
Uh they they don't need to know.
I just I I can't do it.
It's not gonna happen.

SPEAKER_00 (58:41):
I know.
And it just it's and it's sofunny because I've done it now
the last couple of weeks,especially because life's been
so again, life, and like I said.
And I'll be like, oh, you knowwhat?
I really wanted to do this thingfor you and show up for you and
help you, but we need toreschedule.
And I won't give theexplanation, I won't give the
excuse.
And I just send it and peopledon't come back all mad at me.
They're not like, tell me why.
I'm like, oh, I don't, friends,just listen to me right now.

(59:05):
Like, unless it's a partner orfamily member that's dependent
upon you in some way, you don'towe anybody an explanation.
You do not.

SPEAKER_01 (59:11):
You do not.
And by starting to do it, it'snot only for them, but it's like
your emotional turmoil thatyou're kind of putting yourself
through.
You're like, is this a goodenough excuse?
Is this not a good enoughexcuse?
Are they gonna hear it?
Are they not gonna hear it?
No.
Gone.
It's I have made the decisionthat that is not happening.
Right.
Um, and that's it.
And that's all people need toknow.

SPEAKER_00 (59:31):
That's all you need to know, people.
That in the whole last 60minutes of this episode.
This was phenomenal, Dana.
Thank you so much.
We've talked about this topic alot, but I just feel like we've
hit on some really, I think,deep and important truths.
And I really hope that ourlisteners get a lot out of it.
And like I said, for all theconversations I've had and all
the reading I do, I'm walkingaway with a lot.
So hopefully they are too.
And what a great way to go intothe weekend.

(59:54):
I hope you all carve out sometime for yourselves.
Dana, if people want to reachout to you, get a hold of you,
how do they do that?

SPEAKER_01 (01:00:00):
Yes, so I am at DanaZellars.com for my website.
Um, you can find me on Instagramat Dana underscore Zellars,
LinkedIn, Dana dash Zellers.
And the other thing I want tooffer is I do have a free better
week blueprint atDanaZellars.com slash
betterweek, which will help youplan your weeks with intention.

(01:00:20):
So it's a great, great tool Iwork with most of my clients on,
and I want to make sureeverybody has a copy.

SPEAKER_00 (01:00:25):
Fantastic.
Dana, thank you again so much toyour for your time.
Thank you to our listeners andour amazing friends at Heartcast
Media for helping make all thispossible.
All right, we're at time.
So we're gonna wrap it.
We'll see you all next week.
Until then, everyone, keepasking, keep giving, and keep
growing.
We hope to see you soon.

SPEAKER_04 (01:00:50):
Produced by Heartcast Media.

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