February 11, 2026 • 26 mins
In this episode we hear from Jennifer McGee, a visual artist and advocate for autism.
Jennifer shares her transformative journey of adopting her non-verbal autistic nephew, Isaiah, and becoming his devoted guardian and advocate.
She discusses her transition from art to advocacy and how Isaiah's presence inspired her to write children's books like 'Izzy Can't Talk' and its upcoming sequel 'Izzy Can't Talk, But He Can Make Friends.' Jennifer describes the challenges they faced, the resources they utilized, and the incredible progress Isaiah has made.
She also touches upon her aspirations to foster inclusion and neurodiverse participation through her initiative, Inclusive Art House, and her efforts in the autism advocacy space. J
ennifer's story is a testament to the power of love, persistence, and community in transforming lives impacted by autism.
Meet Jennifer McGee: Artist and Advocate
Adopting Isaiah: The Beginning
Navigating Autism: Early Challenges and Learning
Therapies and Progress
Traveling and Community Involvement
Inclusive Art House and Advocacy
Future Plans and Final Thoughts
Conclusion and Contact Information
IINTRO/OUTRO Music: T.Wild
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The content on Why Not Me: Embracing Autism amd Mental Health Worldwide, including discussions on mental health, autism, and related topics, is provided for informational and entertainment purposes only.
The views and opinions expressed by guests are their own and do not reflect those of the podcast, its hosts, or affiliates.
Why Not Me is not a medical or mental health professional and does not endorse or verify the accuracy, efficacy, safety of any treatments, programs, or advice discussed.
Listeners should consult qualified healthcare professionals, such as licensed therapists, psychologists, or physicians, before making decisions about mental health or autism- related care.
Reliance on this podcast's contents is at the listener's own risk.
Why Not Me is not liable for any outcomes, financial or otherwise, resulting from actions taken based on the information provided.
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SPEAKER_00 (00:06):
Welcome to Why Not Me, embracing autism and mental
health worldwide.
Hosted by Tony Mirator.
Broadcasting from the heart ofMusic City, USA, Nashville,
Tennessee.
Join us as our guests sharetheir raw, powerful stories.
Some will spark laughter, otherswill move you to tears.
(00:30):
These real life journeysinspire, connect, and remind you
that you're never alone.
We're igniting a global movementto empower everyone to make a
lasting difference by fosteringdeep awareness, unwavering
acceptance, and profoundunderstanding of autism and
(00:52):
mental health.
Tune in, be inspired, and joinus in transforming the world one
story at a time.
Hi, I'm Tony Miantour.
Welcome to Why Not Me, EmbracingAutism and Mental Health
worldwide.
Joining us today is JenniferMcGee.
She's a visual artist of over 25years who travels the country
(01:15):
promoting her business bodypizzazz to various events.
Now her greatest masterpiece isher autistic nephew Isaiah, whom
she welcomed into her life ashis devoted guardian at age 15.
This led to her book Izzy Can'tTalk, which follows young Izzy,
a nonverbal boy using signlanguage, pictures, and a speech
(01:36):
pad to connect in a heartfeltway.
She will also talk about herupcoming sequel, Izzy Can't
Talk, but he can make friends,which celebrates inclusion and
the magic of connection.
Today she shares her journeyfrom artist to advocate,
inspired by Isaiah, which hasset her on a path to amplify the
(01:58):
neurodiverse voices proving artcan heal and unite.
So before we dive into ourepisode, we'll be back with an
uninterrupted show right after aword from our sponsors.
Thanks for coming on.
SPEAKER_01 (02:11):
Oh, I'm so excited.
I'm excited to be here with youand to talk about the autism and
inclusive art house.
SPEAKER_00 (02:17):
Yeah, so if you would tell us how it all
started.
SPEAKER_01 (02:20):
So in 2020, my husband and I adopted our
nephew, who was 15 at the time.
He is uh non-speaking,completely nonverbal, and um, he
had not had any therapy at all.
He needed a home.
And we, you know, we love him,but we had no idea like what to
do with autism, what it evenreally entailed.
(02:40):
So 2020, all of our events wereshut down.
Like I said, I do face painting,and so we just really took that
time to learn about autism andlook for resources for Isaiah,
and there's just not a lot.
So that's really how it started.
Us learning and seeing a needand trying to educate ourselves
and other people.
SPEAKER_00 (03:00):
That makes total sense.
Did you know he was autisticbefore you adopted him?
SPEAKER_01 (03:05):
For sure, but we really didn't know what that
meant.
I mean, you know, of course,like we saw him like at birthday
parties and we we spent timewith him, but not at the level
of okay, we have to care forhim, and what does that really
mean?
SPEAKER_00 (03:17):
Yeah, absolutely.
I think this is reallyinteresting.
This is a completely differentscenario.
Most parents find out that theirchildren are autistic at a very
young age.
Now you have an autistic nephewthat's 15, and you're just
starting to find out what autismis all about.
I think many people would admireyou for the road that you took
(03:40):
with this.
By doing this, what path did yousee yourself going down?
What was you learning?
SPEAKER_01 (03:46):
So, really, that I don't know anything, and I I
need to just continue to learn.
And so I wrote a children'sbook.
As I was understanding Isaiah, Iwanted other people to
understand him.
And so the book is called IzzyCan't Talk.
In the book, we really discussthe communication techniques
that we use, such as signlanguage, a speech pad, uh
(04:06):
picture cards.
PEX is really big in our life.
But then also as an artist, Ifeel the need to create art that
is inclusive of people withautism and also people with
mental health issues and otherdisabilities.
SPEAKER_00 (04:20):
What were some of the first things that you
learned?
You adopted him.
He's autistic, nonverbal.
What path did you take?
What did you find initially?
You were facing the big unknown.
How did you navigate throughthat?
What were the first steps thatyou took?
SPEAKER_01 (04:37):
So the first thing is we knew that Isaiah, I mean,
he's he's significantlydevelopmentally delayed.
He could not open a waterbottle.
I mean, he's level three asprofound autism.
And so to us, we didn't reallysee it as autism.
It was just Isaiah.
Isaiah is different, but it'swhen we started seeking
therapies that it was explainedthat he has autism.
(04:57):
So we were very fortunate to uhget speech therapy and
occupational therapy, and theneventually find an ABA therapy
that would take him because he'solder.
A lot of therapists want smallerkids, or they they really feel
like that once they're 15,they're they're too far gone.
And then once he started ABA,the BCBA started to teach us how
(05:20):
to teach him and how to um setup his routine and use
communication and just all ofthe things to really start
understanding his behaviors.
And that was a game changer.
SPEAKER_00 (05:32):
Okay, so that was how long ago?
SPEAKER_01 (05:35):
So that was 2020.
So we've had him for five years.
SPEAKER_00 (05:38):
Okay, five years.
Now, what are some of thechanges you've seen in these
past five years?
SPEAKER_01 (05:45):
Oh wow.
So when we first got him, evenbefore like we he came to live
with us, we went on a few likesmall trips and we would go to
dinner and we would may have toleave the restaurant because he
would start throwing his glassacross the restaurant or running
all through the restaurant.
When he first came to live withus, breaking a lot of TVs, just
(06:07):
aggressive behavior that welearned is communication.
He really had zero functionalcommunication.
So not being able to tell usthat, you know, my stomach is
hurting, or, you know, I want uhlemonade, not tea, you know,
just little things like that.
So once we started giving himthese avenues to communicate,
(06:29):
and along with the other ABAtechniques, we really started to
see significant change in hisbehavior.
SPEAKER_00 (06:36):
You said at times he got aggressive.
That could be meltdowns, thatcould be other various things.
Have you seen a change in that?
Is that more under control nowwith everything that you've been
doing?
SPEAKER_01 (06:47):
Oh, yeah.
And for Isaiah, he's normallyvery gentle anyway.
So even at his worst, themeltdowns weren't as significant
as I know a lot of otherfamilies have to deal with.
But for sure, we were at a pointwhere we were, when we first got
him, okay, we didn't think wewould be able to travel for work
anymore.
Like today, he flies, he travelswith us, actually a good bit.
(07:10):
He's not with us right now, buthe travels a good bit.
That's a complete, you know,change for him.
SPEAKER_00 (07:15):
So tell me a little bit about how he travels with
you and what that looks like.
SPEAKER_01 (07:20):
I really want to reiterate how well he travels.
And for our lifestyle, we reallythought we were gonna have to
give up our career.
I've been doing events for over20 years.
We just didn't think that wewere gonna be able to do it.
After working with him andintroducing him to travel and
doing it slowly, he reallyenjoys it.
We've taken him to Disney World,and that's how we we know he
loves roller coasters.
(07:41):
Trying those different things,and I feel that is something
that our family really can helpother people with, is don't be
scared to go into the community.
You do have to navigate it withsafety, of course, but it's your
community too.
And Isaiah has every right tolive his best life as anybody
else.
And we don't have to keep himhidden away.
(08:01):
And I think there's a lot offamilies that feel like they're
embarrassed or they're worriedabout what their loved one is
gonna do.
Do it anyway.
The world needs to see you.
This is your living your life isyour advocacy.
So I think that's really, reallyimportant.
And little by little, again, heflies.
We never thought we'd be able totake him on a plane.
Slowly, we went to the airportseveral different times, getting
(08:24):
him familiar with the things.
Delta has a wonderful program.
And using those differentthings, the TSA has a special
line that you can go through.
Those accommodations make itpossible for Isaiah to fly and
enjoy life.
SPEAKER_00 (08:38):
Have you had any issues with people they didn't
understand anything aboutautism, and for lack of a better
word, they were just rudebecause of it?
SPEAKER_01 (08:48):
Very little.
We did have an issue one timein, I think we were in Florida,
I don't remember.
We were somewhere, and Isaiahloves the hot tub.
So we try to stay in hotels orresorts that have hot tubs.
So we get to the hot tub, andthere was a young man in his
mid-30s.
His girlfriend started to leaveand he was in the hot tub and he
said, Don't leave me or don'tleave me.
He made some comment like that.
(09:09):
We just ignored it.
Isaiah got in the hot tub, hemoved a little close to the guy.
Not he didn't touch him.
I mean, he wasn't in his bubble.
He jumped out of that hot tublike he was going to get hooties
or like he was gonna catchautism.
It was really disgusting.
That was horrible, but most ofthe time, and I would say over
95% of the time, people arereally kind and accommodating.
(09:33):
So it's very encouraging to see.
And that's why I say people needto get out.
Don't be scared to get out.
SPEAKER_00 (09:39):
Yeah, that's great.
Now, is he still non-verbal?
SPEAKER_01 (09:43):
Only recently has we've started to hear a few
syllables.
Ma, that's his most we've got hehums a lot, but no speech at
all.
SPEAKER_00 (09:51):
Okay.
Now he's 20, correct?
SPEAKER_01 (09:54):
Yes, yes, he's 20.
SPEAKER_00 (09:55):
So what do you see in the next few years for him?
You're continuing to do things,you're continuing to help him
evolve.
What do you see coming down thepath for him in the future?
SPEAKER_01 (10:06):
Well, with the syllables that we've heard,
we're really hoping that we willget some speech.
I mean, we would be thrilled ifwe even got a few words.
That would be phenomenal.
But I just enjoy seeing Isaiahembracing his own life.
For example, we know that heloves music.
We were in Florida walking alongthe beach, and there was a
(10:27):
restaurant that had a live band.
He went right in, sat down, andhe didn't want to leave.
And you could just see on hisface how much he was enjoying
the music.
And so discovering these thingsthat he likes, it's very
rewarding for us, and it alsogives us the path to put more
things like that in his day.
SPEAKER_00 (10:46):
Now that you're five years into this, things are
starting to work out more.
Did you have any reservationswhen you first started this
because you were gettingoverwhelmed by the autism and
not having a grasp on what itwas?
SPEAKER_01 (11:00):
Yes.
Oh, for sure.
I mean, I've probably had acouple of meltdowns that
actually I know I did justcrying, just feeling hopeless,
and we wouldn't be able to takecare of him, and how scary that
is for him and also for us.
It's it's very emotional, youknow.
And um, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (11:17):
Yes, I hear that all the time.
That's a very natural response.
How has it changed from the timethat he first came to live with
you to now, five years later?
SPEAKER_01 (11:29):
Well, it's definitely a more of a
connection.
Like I know that he enjoys ourcompany.
There have been times that he'sactually come and sat down
beside me.
He really is connected to myhusband, Brandon.
And there have even been timesthat he's come and like laid his
head on his shoulder in thebeginning and all throughout his
(11:50):
life.
Um, I was in the room when hewas born.
So I've always been aroundIsaiah, but we've never had any
kind of connection like that.
He's never had a closeness, andwe didn't understand autism.
We thought he was morecomfortable with us being far
away from him.
So to see him now, you know,enjoying our company, and um, of
(12:10):
course, he still likes hisspace, but yeah, but just
knowing and having thatconfidence and that he does want
affection and closeness.
He will even give us a hug if weask for for a hug.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (12:22):
That's great.
That actually was one of my nextquestions.
Texture and touching.
Does he have an issue witheither one of them?
SPEAKER_01 (12:29):
So he'll he'll hug us, that's it.
You know, and then he wants togo and you know, sit down in his
spot.
Not so much texture.
I mean, he's pretty tolerant ofmost things, yeah, but he
definitely likes his space.
SPEAKER_00 (12:41):
Yeah, I get that completely.
What did his school look like?
Was it private?
Was it public?
What uh happened there?
SPEAKER_01 (12:48):
So he was in school, he was in public school, but his
level of communication andability, we were recommended
that he get full-time ABA athome so that he could develop
his daily living.
That really changed everythingfor our family and for Isaiah.
They started working with him onhis morning routine, helping him
(13:09):
learn to shower, and us how tohelp him shower and how to build
on those skills and brushingteeth.
I mean, everything, even settingthe table, unloading the
dishwasher.
I never thought that those wereskills that he would be able to
do.
So, we know before the ABA, wedidn't even try to implement
chores or him, you know, helpingbring in groceries, those type
(13:32):
of things.
SPEAKER_00 (13:33):
Okay, so when you go to school, you go through the
grades, you graduate.
Now, how has his journey beenfrom school to ABA therapy and
doing everything he's beingtaught?
How have you seen him change onthat?
And most important, how's hedoing now?
SPEAKER_01 (13:51):
So when we don't work on a skill all the time,
there is some regression, butvery little.
We've really, I'm really proudof him.
Um, for example, we practicedgoing to the doctor.
That was something really bigthat the therapist worked on
him, you know, putting themonitor in his ear, doing a
tongue depressor.
(14:12):
And when we've actually had togo to the doctor, he was so
comfortable.
And we use calm counts.
Um and we're right there withhim doing calm counts.
So that's been really good.
I haven't seen a lot ofregression, but some.
SPEAKER_00 (14:26):
Okay.
What are some of the things thathe really excels at?
SPEAKER_01 (14:30):
You know, it's so funny.
We have seen him balance like aguitar on the back of the couch.
And none of us, none of theadults, none of the other kids,
could do it.
But he just balanced that guitaron the back of the couch.
He also took a chair and put iton one leg and balanced it in in
the kitchen.
And we were all just amazed,like, Isaiah, how did you do
(14:53):
that?
And and we couldn't do that.
So that is something that he'sreally excelled at.
Just watching his personalityevolve.
He loves roller coasters and wehave a golf cart.
He loves riding the golf cart.
And if I stop, he's trying tolike push the accelerator and
make it go.
SPEAKER_00 (15:11):
That's great that he enjoys all that.
Now, you just brought up hispersonality.
How would you describe hispersonality?
What's it like?
SPEAKER_01 (15:20):
Oh, he's very laid back, he's very much an
observer.
He likes to just sit in his spotand just chill out.
And just like anybody else, Imean, there's times that he
wants to be mischievous andfunny, and we know that, and we
can see those grins on his face.
He's very much a foodie, and welove to eat, we love to travel.
So we know he loves tacos.
(15:41):
You just know that he lovesthese things.
So his personality is verychill, though.
SPEAKER_00 (15:46):
Yeah, that's great.
With all this going on, did thislead to you starting a charity?
SPEAKER_01 (15:52):
No, it's actually not a charity.
We're actually working on that.
So I have a business, a facepainting business.
When I wrote the book, I createdInclusive Art House as a
business because I didn't reallyknow, like I didn't really know
what to do.
I just knew I wanted to createart.
And I mean, I created thebusiness to protect the art.
But as I've evolved with this,we don't really bring in very
(16:12):
much revenue.
I support it with my otherbusiness.
It's just become a passion ofour family.
Just make the art and the booksand do library readings and
different things for advocacy.
SPEAKER_00 (16:24):
How do you see that evolving?
Do you see that getting to thelevels of being a charity?
What's the plans on that?
SPEAKER_01 (16:32):
Yeah, that is what we're we're thinking to turn it
into a charity.
Currently, I'm working withother charities.
For example, the art of theUnited States.
Um, we did some design work forthem for a fundraiser that they
have.
And I work with a lot oflibraries, like I said, and
schools.
So just partnering with them,I'm hoping that we can get
enough uh revenue to sustain ourexpenses.
(16:53):
We have a couple of full-timeartists that do illustrations uh
with the book and the art.
I wanted to show you one of thepieces right here, which I know
your listeners can't see, butthis is one of the pieces you
see the green ribbon for mentalhealth in the background.
You can see there's uh signlanguage.
The sun flowers representinvisible disabilities.
This is just, I feel like thisis our signature piece because
(17:16):
it represents all disabilities,and everyone has the right to be
themselves and have support andacceptance.
SPEAKER_00 (17:23):
So, what are some of your goals?
What are your plans for the nextthree, four, five years from
now?
SPEAKER_01 (17:30):
So I'm really interested with the the charity
work in helping autistic peoplefind work and purpose for like
for Isaiah, what that would looklike, maybe helping uh stock
shelves for a food bank, or youknow, he doesn't have a lot of
technical skills, but he can putthings on a shelf.
And just that makes him feelgood.
(17:50):
So finding ways to to helpautistic individuals find
purpose and work, even though itmay not be like traditional
work, that's really important tome.
SPEAKER_00 (18:01):
Yes, I think that's a great thing to be passionate
about.
So, what do you see in yourfuture for the advocacy that
you're trying to do?
What are your plans?
What are your thoughts?
Can you expand on your plans forthe future?
SPEAKER_01 (18:13):
So I attend a lot of conferences.
I'm still feel like I'm new andI'm educating myself.
And as I'm on this journey, I'mtrying to write, do podcasts,
uh, make the art, and put it outinto the world, but I'm still
very much learning myself.
So my advocacy is learning andeducating others as I'm
(18:34):
learning.
I I went to the Profound AutismSummit in Boston this year.
It was really amazing.
That's a great group.
If any of your listeners can goto the Profound Autism Alliance,
and there's just a wealth ofinformation there for people
that have um profound autism.
I went to the uh internationalconference uh for autism and uh
(18:56):
neurodivergent persons inOrlando this year.
I met Temple Grandin.
Amazing.
Just her story is so inspiring.
And she just it's so, eventhough her uh diagnosis was so
long ago, it's still veryrelevant today and she has so
much to say.
So that's what I want tocontinue to do and really um
find ways to help in thecommunity that are profoundly
(19:20):
autistic kids and adults canparticipate in the community in
some way to give them purpose.
SPEAKER_00 (19:26):
What are some of the things that you've learned from
these conferences that you'vegone to?
You went there just to learn alittle bit, meet a few people,
engage.
Then all of a sudden, you foundthings out that you said, whoa,
I didn't realize this.
SPEAKER_01 (19:41):
Adatonia was something that I didn't realize
was such a big thing thatparents are dealing with.
And I think a lot of timespeople don't understand or know
what that is.
I'm still like learning aboutit, but just getting tested for
that can change how you'retreating the autism because it
can be more than just autism andthe behavior.
So that was really eye-opening,and it's so hard what some
(20:04):
families have to go through.
I feel really blessed, eventhough our struggle is hard.
SPEAKER_00 (20:07):
Yes, it's very tough for many different people.
It all just depends upon thespectrum of where they fall and
how the families have to dealwith it.
SPEAKER_01 (20:16):
Autism is such a large spectrum, and there's a
lot of misconceptions aboutautism.
So these conversations arereally, really important for
sure.
SPEAKER_00 (20:25):
Yeah, that's absolutely true.
Now, you wrote a book, it's beenout for a while.
Can you give us a little moreinformation about the book?
SPEAKER_01 (20:32):
So, yeah, Izzy Can't Talk.
I wrote it in uh 2023.
Yeah, it was published at theend of 2023.
So it's gotten some some goodfeedback.
I actually just finished thesecond book, Izzy Can't Talk,
but he can make friends.
So the first book, we talk aboutthe communication, the different
ways.
And in the second book, we talkabout the social part of autism
(20:54):
and what Isaiah experiences likewhen he meets a new person and
kind of the processes that hegoes through.
And that will actually bereleased in November.
SPEAKER_00 (21:03):
That's great.
Can you tell the listeners wherethey can get this?
SPEAKER_01 (21:07):
They can get it uh on Amazon, of course, but also
our website,inclusivearthouse.com, has all
of our books.
We have three coloring books.
SPEAKER_00 (21:16):
Oh, that's good.
Can you give us a little moreinformation about that?
SPEAKER_01 (21:19):
The coloring books are really cool.
They're activity books.
They kind of back up the bookwith activities that you can do
to reinforce the learning, thecommunication.
We have some uh word searchesthat are done in sign language,
and yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (21:33):
That's really good.
Now, what do you see happeningwhen he meets someone new?
You just brought up the socialpart of it.
How is his social activity andinteraction?
How does he react when he meetssomeone for the first or even
possibly the second time?
SPEAKER_01 (21:49):
Yeah, so it's he he takes time to warm up.
The key to Isaiah's heart isfood.
He's a foodie.
So I'll tell you a little story.
We were traveling with uh withsome of our Artist and they did
a Chick-fil-A run and gotthemselves Chick-fil-A.
Well, one of the girls ate allthe Chick-fil-A, and Isaiah was
sitting right there.
One of the guys gave Isaiah someof his Chick-fil-A.
(22:11):
So for the next few weeks,anytime the girl would come up
and say, Hey Isaiah, he just hewould not acknowledge her.
But the young man that gave himthe Chick-fil-A, he was all
about the high fives, and it wasreally, really funny.
He finally did warm up toAndrea, the young lady, but it
was really funny.
It was very clear that he wasupset that she snubbed him and
(22:32):
didn't give him any Chick-fil-A.
SPEAKER_00 (22:34):
Oh, that's interesting.
Yes.
Well, that's a big part ofinteracting because at least by
doing that, he's interacting andevolving.
SPEAKER_01 (22:44):
Exactly.
And we've seen that develop overthe years for sure.
In the beginning, very much justto himself.
As a matter of fact, the uh BCBAtold me that she had never seen
a person that she had no ideahow to motivate him.
And so she started with gummybears.
And that's how she won him over,uh, was with gummy bears.
(23:05):
And then from there she was ableto build on that.
SPEAKER_00 (23:07):
So, with everything that you've been learning, what
you've been going through forthe past five years, you've been
going to the forums, theconventions, everything that you
can do to find out more aboutautism.
Now, how do you see this allblending together to help him
help your advocacy and continueto build on what you've learned?
SPEAKER_01 (23:31):
You know, I feel like that this is my duty and my
purpose.
And I'm really excited andgrateful that I have the ability
to do this work.
So I really want to keepbuilding on it.
I feel like that there's so manyparents that are just struggling
to survive and they don't havethis uh platform that I have.
(23:54):
So I'm very, very grateful.
And I really just want tocontinue connecting with other
parents and also withlegislators.
I feel like that we really haveto reach out to our
representatives so that the lawscan, that there can be support
in the system.
So that's where I feel like mywork is really headed.
SPEAKER_00 (24:14):
So have you got in that arena yet?
Have you spoken with anylegislators?
How's that progressing?
SPEAKER_01 (24:20):
I've tried.
I went to Washington a fewmonths ago actually.
Being part of the ProfoundAutism Alliance, they do a lot
of advocacy in Washington andthey encourage all 50 states,
support in all of the 50 states,and give a lot of guidance about
how to participate in yourstate.
So I'm getting more involvedwith that.
SPEAKER_00 (24:40):
Yeah, I think that's really great.
The more you get involved, thebetter, especially when you get
into the legislative part of it.
So, what do you think is reallyimportant that our listeners
hear on what you've beenthrough, what you're going
through now, as well as yourplans for the future?
What do you think that they needto hear?
SPEAKER_01 (24:59):
Um, just never give up and really just keep trying
different things and reach outfor support.
There is support there.
You may have to look for it, butjust don't give up.
In terms of um what we're doing,I would love to hear from
anyone.
I enjoy doing readings andcoming to events.
SPEAKER_00 (25:19):
I think that's really good.
How do they find you?
SPEAKER_01 (25:22):
It's easy to find me.
My website isinclusivearthouse.com.
SPEAKER_00 (25:26):
Yeah, that's really good.
Well, this has been great.
Great conversation, greatinformation.
I really appreciate you takingthe time to join us today.
SPEAKER_01 (25:35):
Yeah, I'm so grateful for the work that
you're doing.
Talking about mental health andautism.
This is how change andacceptance happens is having
these conversations.
So I really appreciate the workthat you're doing.
SPEAKER_00 (25:48):
Oh, it's my pleasure.
Thanks again.
Thanks for taking time out ofyour busy schedule to listen to
our show today.
We hope you enjoyed it as muchas we enjoyed bringing it to
you.
If you know someone who has astory to share, tell them to
(26:10):
contact us at why notme.world.
One last thing spread the wordabout why not me.
Our conversations, our inspiringguest, the Joe.
You are not alone in this world.
Welcome to Why Not Me, embracing autism and mental
health worldwide.
Hosted by Tony Mirator.
Broadcasting from the heart ofMusic City, USA, Nashville,
Tennessee.
Join us as our guests sharetheir raw, powerful stories.
Some will spark laughter, otherswill move you to tears.
(00:30):
These real life journeysinspire, connect, and remind you
that you're never alone.
We're igniting a global movementto empower everyone to make a
lasting difference by fosteringdeep awareness, unwavering
acceptance, and profoundunderstanding of autism and
(00:52):
mental health.
Tune in, be inspired, and joinus in transforming the world one
story at a time.
Hi, I'm Tony Miantour.
Welcome to Why Not Me, EmbracingAutism and Mental Health
worldwide.
Joining us today is JenniferMcGee.
She's a visual artist of over 25years who travels the country
(01:15):
promoting her business bodypizzazz to various events.
Now her greatest masterpiece isher autistic nephew Isaiah, whom
she welcomed into her life ashis devoted guardian at age 15.
This led to her book Izzy Can'tTalk, which follows young Izzy,
a nonverbal boy using signlanguage, pictures, and a speech
(01:36):
pad to connect in a heartfeltway.
She will also talk about herupcoming sequel, Izzy Can't
Talk, but he can make friends,which celebrates inclusion and
the magic of connection.
Today she shares her journeyfrom artist to advocate,
inspired by Isaiah, which hasset her on a path to amplify the
(01:58):
neurodiverse voices proving artcan heal and unite.
So before we dive into ourepisode, we'll be back with an
uninterrupted show right after aword from our sponsors.
Thanks for coming on.
SPEAKER_01 (02:11):
Oh, I'm so excited.
I'm excited to be here with youand to talk about the autism and
inclusive art house.
SPEAKER_00 (02:17):
Yeah, so if you would tell us how it all
started.
SPEAKER_01 (02:20):
So in 2020, my husband and I adopted our
nephew, who was 15 at the time.
He is uh non-speaking,completely nonverbal, and um, he
had not had any therapy at all.
He needed a home.
And we, you know, we love him,but we had no idea like what to
do with autism, what it evenreally entailed.
(02:40):
So 2020, all of our events wereshut down.
Like I said, I do face painting,and so we just really took that
time to learn about autism andlook for resources for Isaiah,
and there's just not a lot.
So that's really how it started.
Us learning and seeing a needand trying to educate ourselves
and other people.
SPEAKER_00 (03:00):
That makes total sense.
Did you know he was autisticbefore you adopted him?
SPEAKER_01 (03:05):
For sure, but we really didn't know what that
meant.
I mean, you know, of course,like we saw him like at birthday
parties and we we spent timewith him, but not at the level
of okay, we have to care forhim, and what does that really
mean?
SPEAKER_00 (03:17):
Yeah, absolutely.
I think this is reallyinteresting.
This is a completely differentscenario.
Most parents find out that theirchildren are autistic at a very
young age.
Now you have an autistic nephewthat's 15, and you're just
starting to find out what autismis all about.
I think many people would admireyou for the road that you took
(03:40):
with this.
By doing this, what path did yousee yourself going down?
What was you learning?
SPEAKER_01 (03:46):
So, really, that I don't know anything, and I I
need to just continue to learn.
And so I wrote a children'sbook.
As I was understanding Isaiah, Iwanted other people to
understand him.
And so the book is called IzzyCan't Talk.
In the book, we really discussthe communication techniques
that we use, such as signlanguage, a speech pad, uh
(04:06):
picture cards.
PEX is really big in our life.
But then also as an artist, Ifeel the need to create art that
is inclusive of people withautism and also people with
mental health issues and otherdisabilities.
SPEAKER_00 (04:20):
What were some of the first things that you
learned?
You adopted him.
He's autistic, nonverbal.
What path did you take?
What did you find initially?
You were facing the big unknown.
How did you navigate throughthat?
What were the first steps thatyou took?
SPEAKER_01 (04:37):
So the first thing is we knew that Isaiah, I mean,
he's he's significantlydevelopmentally delayed.
He could not open a waterbottle.
I mean, he's level three asprofound autism.
And so to us, we didn't reallysee it as autism.
It was just Isaiah.
Isaiah is different, but it'swhen we started seeking
therapies that it was explainedthat he has autism.
(04:57):
So we were very fortunate to uhget speech therapy and
occupational therapy, and theneventually find an ABA therapy
that would take him because he'solder.
A lot of therapists want smallerkids, or they they really feel
like that once they're 15,they're they're too far gone.
And then once he started ABA,the BCBA started to teach us how
(05:20):
to teach him and how to um setup his routine and use
communication and just all ofthe things to really start
understanding his behaviors.
And that was a game changer.
SPEAKER_00 (05:32):
Okay, so that was how long ago?
SPEAKER_01 (05:35):
So that was 2020.
So we've had him for five years.
SPEAKER_00 (05:38):
Okay, five years.
Now, what are some of thechanges you've seen in these
past five years?
SPEAKER_01 (05:45):
Oh wow.
So when we first got him, evenbefore like we he came to live
with us, we went on a few likesmall trips and we would go to
dinner and we would may have toleave the restaurant because he
would start throwing his glassacross the restaurant or running
all through the restaurant.
When he first came to live withus, breaking a lot of TVs, just
(06:07):
aggressive behavior that welearned is communication.
He really had zero functionalcommunication.
So not being able to tell usthat, you know, my stomach is
hurting, or, you know, I want uhlemonade, not tea, you know,
just little things like that.
So once we started giving himthese avenues to communicate,
(06:29):
and along with the other ABAtechniques, we really started to
see significant change in hisbehavior.
SPEAKER_00 (06:36):
You said at times he got aggressive.
That could be meltdowns, thatcould be other various things.
Have you seen a change in that?
Is that more under control nowwith everything that you've been
doing?
SPEAKER_01 (06:47):
Oh, yeah.
And for Isaiah, he's normallyvery gentle anyway.
So even at his worst, themeltdowns weren't as significant
as I know a lot of otherfamilies have to deal with.
But for sure, we were at a pointwhere we were, when we first got
him, okay, we didn't think wewould be able to travel for work
anymore.
Like today, he flies, he travelswith us, actually a good bit.
(07:10):
He's not with us right now, buthe travels a good bit.
That's a complete, you know,change for him.
SPEAKER_00 (07:15):
So tell me a little bit about how he travels with
you and what that looks like.
SPEAKER_01 (07:20):
I really want to reiterate how well he travels.
And for our lifestyle, we reallythought we were gonna have to
give up our career.
I've been doing events for over20 years.
We just didn't think that wewere gonna be able to do it.
After working with him andintroducing him to travel and
doing it slowly, he reallyenjoys it.
We've taken him to Disney World,and that's how we we know he
loves roller coasters.
(07:41):
Trying those different things,and I feel that is something
that our family really can helpother people with, is don't be
scared to go into the community.
You do have to navigate it withsafety, of course, but it's your
community too.
And Isaiah has every right tolive his best life as anybody
else.
And we don't have to keep himhidden away.
(08:01):
And I think there's a lot offamilies that feel like they're
embarrassed or they're worriedabout what their loved one is
gonna do.
Do it anyway.
The world needs to see you.
This is your living your life isyour advocacy.
So I think that's really, reallyimportant.
And little by little, again, heflies.
We never thought we'd be able totake him on a plane.
Slowly, we went to the airportseveral different times, getting
(08:24):
him familiar with the things.
Delta has a wonderful program.
And using those differentthings, the TSA has a special
line that you can go through.
Those accommodations make itpossible for Isaiah to fly and
enjoy life.
SPEAKER_00 (08:38):
Have you had any issues with people they didn't
understand anything aboutautism, and for lack of a better
word, they were just rudebecause of it?
SPEAKER_01 (08:48):
Very little.
We did have an issue one timein, I think we were in Florida,
I don't remember.
We were somewhere, and Isaiahloves the hot tub.
So we try to stay in hotels orresorts that have hot tubs.
So we get to the hot tub, andthere was a young man in his
mid-30s.
His girlfriend started to leaveand he was in the hot tub and he
said, Don't leave me or don'tleave me.
He made some comment like that.
(09:09):
We just ignored it.
Isaiah got in the hot tub, hemoved a little close to the guy.
Not he didn't touch him.
I mean, he wasn't in his bubble.
He jumped out of that hot tublike he was going to get hooties
or like he was gonna catchautism.
It was really disgusting.
That was horrible, but most ofthe time, and I would say over
95% of the time, people arereally kind and accommodating.
(09:33):
So it's very encouraging to see.
And that's why I say people needto get out.
Don't be scared to get out.
SPEAKER_00 (09:39):
Yeah, that's great.
Now, is he still non-verbal?
SPEAKER_01 (09:43):
Only recently has we've started to hear a few
syllables.
Ma, that's his most we've got hehums a lot, but no speech at
all.
SPEAKER_00 (09:51):
Okay.
Now he's 20, correct?
SPEAKER_01 (09:54):
Yes, yes, he's 20.
SPEAKER_00 (09:55):
So what do you see in the next few years for him?
You're continuing to do things,you're continuing to help him
evolve.
What do you see coming down thepath for him in the future?
SPEAKER_01 (10:06):
Well, with the syllables that we've heard,
we're really hoping that we willget some speech.
I mean, we would be thrilled ifwe even got a few words.
That would be phenomenal.
But I just enjoy seeing Isaiahembracing his own life.
For example, we know that heloves music.
We were in Florida walking alongthe beach, and there was a
(10:27):
restaurant that had a live band.
He went right in, sat down, andhe didn't want to leave.
And you could just see on hisface how much he was enjoying
the music.
And so discovering these thingsthat he likes, it's very
rewarding for us, and it alsogives us the path to put more
things like that in his day.
SPEAKER_00 (10:46):
Now that you're five years into this, things are
starting to work out more.
Did you have any reservationswhen you first started this
because you were gettingoverwhelmed by the autism and
not having a grasp on what itwas?
SPEAKER_01 (11:00):
Yes.
Oh, for sure.
I mean, I've probably had acouple of meltdowns that
actually I know I did justcrying, just feeling hopeless,
and we wouldn't be able to takecare of him, and how scary that
is for him and also for us.
It's it's very emotional, youknow.
And um, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (11:17):
Yes, I hear that all the time.
That's a very natural response.
How has it changed from the timethat he first came to live with
you to now, five years later?
SPEAKER_01 (11:29):
Well, it's definitely a more of a
connection.
Like I know that he enjoys ourcompany.
There have been times that he'sactually come and sat down
beside me.
He really is connected to myhusband, Brandon.
And there have even been timesthat he's come and like laid his
head on his shoulder in thebeginning and all throughout his
(11:50):
life.
Um, I was in the room when hewas born.
So I've always been aroundIsaiah, but we've never had any
kind of connection like that.
He's never had a closeness, andwe didn't understand autism.
We thought he was morecomfortable with us being far
away from him.
So to see him now, you know,enjoying our company, and um, of
(12:10):
course, he still likes hisspace, but yeah, but just
knowing and having thatconfidence and that he does want
affection and closeness.
He will even give us a hug if weask for for a hug.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (12:22):
That's great.
That actually was one of my nextquestions.
Texture and touching.
Does he have an issue witheither one of them?
SPEAKER_01 (12:29):
So he'll he'll hug us, that's it.
You know, and then he wants togo and you know, sit down in his
spot.
Not so much texture.
I mean, he's pretty tolerant ofmost things, yeah, but he
definitely likes his space.
SPEAKER_00 (12:41):
Yeah, I get that completely.
What did his school look like?
Was it private?
Was it public?
What uh happened there?
SPEAKER_01 (12:48):
So he was in school, he was in public school, but his
level of communication andability, we were recommended
that he get full-time ABA athome so that he could develop
his daily living.
That really changed everythingfor our family and for Isaiah.
They started working with him onhis morning routine, helping him
(13:09):
learn to shower, and us how tohelp him shower and how to build
on those skills and brushingteeth.
I mean, everything, even settingthe table, unloading the
dishwasher.
I never thought that those wereskills that he would be able to
do.
So, we know before the ABA, wedidn't even try to implement
chores or him, you know, helpingbring in groceries, those type
(13:32):
of things.
SPEAKER_00 (13:33):
Okay, so when you go to school, you go through the
grades, you graduate.
Now, how has his journey beenfrom school to ABA therapy and
doing everything he's beingtaught?
How have you seen him change onthat?
And most important, how's hedoing now?
SPEAKER_01 (13:51):
So when we don't work on a skill all the time,
there is some regression, butvery little.
We've really, I'm really proudof him.
Um, for example, we practicedgoing to the doctor.
That was something really bigthat the therapist worked on
him, you know, putting themonitor in his ear, doing a
tongue depressor.
(14:12):
And when we've actually had togo to the doctor, he was so
comfortable.
And we use calm counts.
Um and we're right there withhim doing calm counts.
So that's been really good.
I haven't seen a lot ofregression, but some.
SPEAKER_00 (14:26):
Okay.
What are some of the things thathe really excels at?
SPEAKER_01 (14:30):
You know, it's so funny.
We have seen him balance like aguitar on the back of the couch.
And none of us, none of theadults, none of the other kids,
could do it.
But he just balanced that guitaron the back of the couch.
He also took a chair and put iton one leg and balanced it in in
the kitchen.
And we were all just amazed,like, Isaiah, how did you do
(14:53):
that?
And and we couldn't do that.
So that is something that he'sreally excelled at.
Just watching his personalityevolve.
He loves roller coasters and wehave a golf cart.
He loves riding the golf cart.
And if I stop, he's trying tolike push the accelerator and
make it go.
SPEAKER_00 (15:11):
That's great that he enjoys all that.
Now, you just brought up hispersonality.
How would you describe hispersonality?
What's it like?
SPEAKER_01 (15:20):
Oh, he's very laid back, he's very much an
observer.
He likes to just sit in his spotand just chill out.
And just like anybody else, Imean, there's times that he
wants to be mischievous andfunny, and we know that, and we
can see those grins on his face.
He's very much a foodie, and welove to eat, we love to travel.
So we know he loves tacos.
(15:41):
You just know that he lovesthese things.
So his personality is verychill, though.
SPEAKER_00 (15:46):
Yeah, that's great.
With all this going on, did thislead to you starting a charity?
SPEAKER_01 (15:52):
No, it's actually not a charity.
We're actually working on that.
So I have a business, a facepainting business.
When I wrote the book, I createdInclusive Art House as a
business because I didn't reallyknow, like I didn't really know
what to do.
I just knew I wanted to createart.
And I mean, I created thebusiness to protect the art.
But as I've evolved with this,we don't really bring in very
(16:12):
much revenue.
I support it with my otherbusiness.
It's just become a passion ofour family.
Just make the art and the booksand do library readings and
different things for advocacy.
SPEAKER_00 (16:24):
How do you see that evolving?
Do you see that getting to thelevels of being a charity?
What's the plans on that?
SPEAKER_01 (16:32):
Yeah, that is what we're we're thinking to turn it
into a charity.
Currently, I'm working withother charities.
For example, the art of theUnited States.
Um, we did some design work forthem for a fundraiser that they
have.
And I work with a lot oflibraries, like I said, and
schools.
So just partnering with them,I'm hoping that we can get
enough uh revenue to sustain ourexpenses.
(16:53):
We have a couple of full-timeartists that do illustrations uh
with the book and the art.
I wanted to show you one of thepieces right here, which I know
your listeners can't see, butthis is one of the pieces you
see the green ribbon for mentalhealth in the background.
You can see there's uh signlanguage.
The sun flowers representinvisible disabilities.
This is just, I feel like thisis our signature piece because
(17:16):
it represents all disabilities,and everyone has the right to be
themselves and have support andacceptance.
SPEAKER_00 (17:23):
So, what are some of your goals?
What are your plans for the nextthree, four, five years from
now?
SPEAKER_01 (17:30):
So I'm really interested with the the charity
work in helping autistic peoplefind work and purpose for like
for Isaiah, what that would looklike, maybe helping uh stock
shelves for a food bank, or youknow, he doesn't have a lot of
technical skills, but he can putthings on a shelf.
And just that makes him feelgood.
(17:50):
So finding ways to to helpautistic individuals find
purpose and work, even though itmay not be like traditional
work, that's really important tome.
SPEAKER_00 (18:01):
Yes, I think that's a great thing to be passionate
about.
So, what do you see in yourfuture for the advocacy that
you're trying to do?
What are your plans?
What are your thoughts?
Can you expand on your plans forthe future?
SPEAKER_01 (18:13):
So I attend a lot of conferences.
I'm still feel like I'm new andI'm educating myself.
And as I'm on this journey, I'mtrying to write, do podcasts,
uh, make the art, and put it outinto the world, but I'm still
very much learning myself.
So my advocacy is learning andeducating others as I'm
(18:34):
learning.
I I went to the Profound AutismSummit in Boston this year.
It was really amazing.
That's a great group.
If any of your listeners can goto the Profound Autism Alliance,
and there's just a wealth ofinformation there for people
that have um profound autism.
I went to the uh internationalconference uh for autism and uh
(18:56):
neurodivergent persons inOrlando this year.
I met Temple Grandin.
Amazing.
Just her story is so inspiring.
And she just it's so, eventhough her uh diagnosis was so
long ago, it's still veryrelevant today and she has so
much to say.
So that's what I want tocontinue to do and really um
find ways to help in thecommunity that are profoundly
(19:20):
autistic kids and adults canparticipate in the community in
some way to give them purpose.
SPEAKER_00 (19:26):
What are some of the things that you've learned from
these conferences that you'vegone to?
You went there just to learn alittle bit, meet a few people,
engage.
Then all of a sudden, you foundthings out that you said, whoa,
I didn't realize this.
SPEAKER_01 (19:41):
Adatonia was something that I didn't realize
was such a big thing thatparents are dealing with.
And I think a lot of timespeople don't understand or know
what that is.
I'm still like learning aboutit, but just getting tested for
that can change how you'retreating the autism because it
can be more than just autism andthe behavior.
So that was really eye-opening,and it's so hard what some
(20:04):
families have to go through.
I feel really blessed, eventhough our struggle is hard.
SPEAKER_00 (20:07):
Yes, it's very tough for many different people.
It all just depends upon thespectrum of where they fall and
how the families have to dealwith it.
SPEAKER_01 (20:16):
Autism is such a large spectrum, and there's a
lot of misconceptions aboutautism.
So these conversations arereally, really important for
sure.
SPEAKER_00 (20:25):
Yeah, that's absolutely true.
Now, you wrote a book, it's beenout for a while.
Can you give us a little moreinformation about the book?
SPEAKER_01 (20:32):
So, yeah, Izzy Can't Talk.
I wrote it in uh 2023.
Yeah, it was published at theend of 2023.
So it's gotten some some goodfeedback.
I actually just finished thesecond book, Izzy Can't Talk,
but he can make friends.
So the first book, we talk aboutthe communication, the different
ways.
And in the second book, we talkabout the social part of autism
(20:54):
and what Isaiah experiences likewhen he meets a new person and
kind of the processes that hegoes through.
And that will actually bereleased in November.
SPEAKER_00 (21:03):
That's great.
Can you tell the listeners wherethey can get this?
SPEAKER_01 (21:07):
They can get it uh on Amazon, of course, but also
our website,inclusivearthouse.com, has all
of our books.
We have three coloring books.
SPEAKER_00 (21:16):
Oh, that's good.
Can you give us a little moreinformation about that?
SPEAKER_01 (21:19):
The coloring books are really cool.
They're activity books.
They kind of back up the bookwith activities that you can do
to reinforce the learning, thecommunication.
We have some uh word searchesthat are done in sign language,
and yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (21:33):
That's really good.
Now, what do you see happeningwhen he meets someone new?
You just brought up the socialpart of it.
How is his social activity andinteraction?
How does he react when he meetssomeone for the first or even
possibly the second time?
SPEAKER_01 (21:49):
Yeah, so it's he he takes time to warm up.
The key to Isaiah's heart isfood.
He's a foodie.
So I'll tell you a little story.
We were traveling with uh withsome of our Artist and they did
a Chick-fil-A run and gotthemselves Chick-fil-A.
Well, one of the girls ate allthe Chick-fil-A, and Isaiah was
sitting right there.
One of the guys gave Isaiah someof his Chick-fil-A.
(22:11):
So for the next few weeks,anytime the girl would come up
and say, Hey Isaiah, he just hewould not acknowledge her.
But the young man that gave himthe Chick-fil-A, he was all
about the high fives, and it wasreally, really funny.
He finally did warm up toAndrea, the young lady, but it
was really funny.
It was very clear that he wasupset that she snubbed him and
(22:32):
didn't give him any Chick-fil-A.
SPEAKER_00 (22:34):
Oh, that's interesting.
Yes.
Well, that's a big part ofinteracting because at least by
doing that, he's interacting andevolving.
SPEAKER_01 (22:44):
Exactly.
And we've seen that develop overthe years for sure.
In the beginning, very much justto himself.
As a matter of fact, the uh BCBAtold me that she had never seen
a person that she had no ideahow to motivate him.
And so she started with gummybears.
And that's how she won him over,uh, was with gummy bears.
(23:05):
And then from there she was ableto build on that.
SPEAKER_00 (23:07):
So, with everything that you've been learning, what
you've been going through forthe past five years, you've been
going to the forums, theconventions, everything that you
can do to find out more aboutautism.
Now, how do you see this allblending together to help him
help your advocacy and continueto build on what you've learned?
SPEAKER_01 (23:31):
You know, I feel like that this is my duty and my
purpose.
And I'm really excited andgrateful that I have the ability
to do this work.
So I really want to keepbuilding on it.
I feel like that there's so manyparents that are just struggling
to survive and they don't havethis uh platform that I have.
(23:54):
So I'm very, very grateful.
And I really just want tocontinue connecting with other
parents and also withlegislators.
I feel like that we really haveto reach out to our
representatives so that the lawscan, that there can be support
in the system.
So that's where I feel like mywork is really headed.
SPEAKER_00 (24:14):
So have you got in that arena yet?
Have you spoken with anylegislators?
How's that progressing?
SPEAKER_01 (24:20):
I've tried.
I went to Washington a fewmonths ago actually.
Being part of the ProfoundAutism Alliance, they do a lot
of advocacy in Washington andthey encourage all 50 states,
support in all of the 50 states,and give a lot of guidance about
how to participate in yourstate.
So I'm getting more involvedwith that.
SPEAKER_00 (24:40):
Yeah, I think that's really great.
The more you get involved, thebetter, especially when you get
into the legislative part of it.
So, what do you think is reallyimportant that our listeners
hear on what you've beenthrough, what you're going
through now, as well as yourplans for the future?
What do you think that they needto hear?
SPEAKER_01 (24:59):
Um, just never give up and really just keep trying
different things and reach outfor support.
There is support there.
You may have to look for it, butjust don't give up.
In terms of um what we're doing,I would love to hear from
anyone.
I enjoy doing readings andcoming to events.
SPEAKER_00 (25:19):
I think that's really good.
How do they find you?
SPEAKER_01 (25:22):
It's easy to find me.
My website isinclusivearthouse.com.
SPEAKER_00 (25:26):
Yeah, that's really good.
Well, this has been great.
Great conversation, greatinformation.
I really appreciate you takingthe time to join us today.
SPEAKER_01 (25:35):
Yeah, I'm so grateful for the work that
you're doing.
Talking about mental health andautism.
This is how change andacceptance happens is having
these conversations.
So I really appreciate the workthat you're doing.
SPEAKER_00 (25:48):
Oh, it's my pleasure.
Thanks again.
Thanks for taking time out ofyour busy schedule to listen to
our show today.
We hope you enjoyed it as muchas we enjoyed bringing it to
you.
If you know someone who has astory to share, tell them to
(26:10):
contact us at why notme.world.
One last thing spread the wordabout why not me.
Our conversations, our inspiringguest, the Joe.
You are not alone in this world.
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