How Awayward is Making International Travel Safer

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Getting sick while traveling is more common than most people realize. Whether it's food poisoning, a fever, an injury, or an unexpected illness, navigating a foreign healthcare system can quickly become one of the most stressful parts of any trip. You may not speak the language, know where to go, or trust the care you're receiving.

In this Company Spotlight, Dan sits down with Max Levine, CEO and Founder of Awayward, a virtual healthcare platform designed specifically for international travellers. Max shares the personal travel experiences that inspired him to launch the company and explains why calling your family doctor back home often isn't enough when local prescriptions, licensing, and healthcare systems come into play.

They discuss how Awayward connects travelers with vetted, English speaking doctors who are licensed in the country they're visiting, providing trusted medical care wherever the journey takes them. The conversation also looks at why travel healthcare is becoming increasingly important for tour operators, travel advisors, employers, hotels, and study abroad programs as part of their duty of care.

Max also discusses where AI can improve the travel healthcare experience, where human expertise remains essential, and why access to trusted medical care is becoming an important part of the overall travel experience.

Whether you're a frequent traveler or work in the travel industry, this conversation offers practical insights into one of the most overlooked aspects of travel planning.

Learn more at awayward.com.

For corporate travel, visit awayward.com/corporate-travel.

For study abroad, visit awayward.com/study-abroad.

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Episode Transcript

SPEAKER_00 (00:05):
Hello, everyone, and welcome back to the Travel
Trends Podcast.
I'm your host, Dan Christian, ofcourse.
And today we have a specialspotlight episode on a topic I
was really keen to cover becausewhen we did a recent Adventure
Travel and Trade Associationepisode on the legal aspects of
tour operators, one of thethings that stood out to me when
we were talking about people'smedical needs and what happens

(00:28):
on a trip, it's the part that wenever like to talk about.
But the reality is, and it'sobviously a commitment of this
show, is to focus on the partsthat make travel most
remarkable.
But today we're going to betalking about the moments that
nobody plans for.
When you get sick on the otherside of the world, anyone who's
ever dealt with a fever in aforeign city knows exactly what

(00:48):
I'm talking about.
You don't speak the language,you're not sure who to touch,
and you're not sure who totrust.
And my guest today has beenbuilding a solution to that
problem.
He is Max Levine, the CEO andfounder of A Wayword, a virtual
care platform that connectsinternational travelers with
vetted English-speaking doctorswho are licensed locally in the

(01:09):
destination that they'reactually in.
I've seen, unfortunately,multiple times on people on
guided tour trips that have anaccident in India and they're
concerned about what hospital togo to and the care that they're
going to get.
And so today we're going to getinto this because it's really
key to making sure if you havean issue on your trip, there
isn't just a hotline that'stelling you to go to a clinic.

(01:29):
This is actually a doctor whoknows the local healthcare
system that can coordinatefollow-up care nearby and stays
with you through your trip.
There is a website, a wayward,there's an app that you can
download, and they're alreadylive in more than 10 countries
and growing quickly.
And so in this conversation, Iwant to hear Max's founding
story.
I'm always keen to get thebackground of how Max, he's got

(01:51):
a very impressive backgroundbefore he launched this
business, but why he decided ontraveler healthcare, since it is
something that has been achallenge for many travelers,
although we don't often speakabout it.
We've never covered it on thispodcast, which is why I wanted
to do this spotlight episode.
But we're going to look aboutlook at how Ayword works for
both travelers and thebusinesses that serve them and
where this whole category isheaded.

(02:12):
So let's get into thisconversation with Max Levine
from AwayWord.
Max, welcome to the podcast.
Great to have you with us.

SPEAKER_01 (02:18):
Thanks for having me, Dan.
It's great to meet you.
I'm a longtime listener and fanof the show.

SPEAKER_00 (02:21):
I'm thrilled.
I'm and particularly thrilledfor that exact reason because
when Max had reached out and hadspoken to Melanie and Catherine
on our team, and I was reallylooking forward to having this
conversation with him, it allstarted with the fact that he is
a fan and listener of the show,which I greatly appreciate.
And for me, it's always abouttrying to make sure that I could
advance people's careers andcompanies by virtue of uh giving

(02:42):
yourself a voice to a globalaudience that's really
interested in this subjectmatter.
But let's tell everyone a littlebit about your background, Max.
So, and specifically for thosepeople who are not familiar with
Awayword, I'm sure they'll bechecking out awayward.com as
we're having this conversation.
Um, but tell us a little bitabout your background and the
problem you set out to solvewith this business.

SPEAKER_01 (03:01):
Yeah, um, again, I appreciate it.
My background stems, I think,two really important pathways in
my life that kind of divergedinto one with the founding of
Awayword.
The first is what I was doingprofessionally.
Um, I was fortunate to be uhspending my time in New York
City for the last five years asa venture capitalist, where I
get to talk to dozens, if nothundreds, of companies, learning

(03:24):
about the problems that they'resolving, the incredible founders
that are solving those problems,and even helping them, jumping
in, putting out fires, doingsales pitches, whatever is
needed to help these startupsgrow.
Uh, and being in the ventureworld and the tech world is the
greatest job you can ask for.
But it was summer of 2024 that Iactually left that job to go and

(03:44):
travel the world, which bringsme to that second pathway, which
is my love and desire to travel,which I'm speaking to the choir
here with you, Dan, with therest of your listeners, I'm
sure.
But since I was young, travelhas been so important to me.
Uh, started off raising moneyand keeping it an envelope
titled New Zealand when I was 10years old because of this

(04:05):
far-off place that I wanted toadventure.
And it led me to the spring of2024 when I went to my team at
New System Ventures.
It's a venture capital firm thatI was lucky to help be a
founding member of, and toldthem, guys, this is incredible.
I love building.
I need to go see the world.
I need to take extended time,explore the culture, eat the

(04:26):
food, meet the people.
And they were even more graciousby saying, go ahead, take the
time you need and then comeback.
You'll have a job waiting foryou.
And I left, I had a one-wayticket to Tokyo and traveled the
world for the next three plusmonths.
And that's where everything fromme dealing with real healthcare
issues, which I'll share aboutmore, I'm sure, in this

(04:46):
conversation, but also justseeing the problems meeting the
people led to the first ideationof what later became a wayward.
So that's how I got here.

SPEAKER_00 (04:55):
That's fantastic.
And I appreciate you sharingyour backstory.
And that's where, you know, uhunderstanding your uh profile
and knowing you're in the VCcommunity, uh, and the key that
you mentioned there, obviously,when the conversations you're
having with entrepreneurs is theproblem that they're solving.
And this is something that I'malways very keen to talk about
on the show because it reallyhighlights whatever the unique
selling proposition of aparticular venture is.

(05:17):
Like, what is it the problemyou're solving?
Why are you doing it better thananybody else?
And this is a very real problem,people running into issues on
their travel.
They may have uh got travelinsurance, and then depending on
the type of travel insurancethey have uh and the process
that they're expected to follow,like you know, pay for it on
your travels, collect thereceipts, uh, try and get
redeemed on your return, allthese things that you know, it's

(05:39):
not it's not when you run, it'snot until you run into the
situation um that you realizejust how important it is.
Tell us a little bit about whyyou decided to create a wayward
itself.
Like, was there a personal uhchallenge you had while
traveling that you'd experiencedor seen people having?
How did you realize or recognizewhat an opportunity this was?

SPEAKER_01 (06:00):
Yeah, I think it's all the above, but there
certainly were those personalexperiences that so many of us,
in fact, 60% of internationaltravelers do experience a
healthcare issue abroad, whichis staggering that I did not
have the solution I needed,despite millions of people
dealing with it.
And in that world trip that Imentioned uh a few summers ago,

(06:21):
it happened to me a few times.
I initially landed in Tokyo, Iwas backpacking, meeting people,
staying with locals, and abouthalfway through just the Japan
part of my trip, I got the flu.
I tried to go to local clinics,and you mentioned at the intro,
there was language barriers.
And there's many Americans oreven Europeans, wherever it may

(06:42):
be, that expect English to bethat language, but it isn't
always.
And the more um off the beatenpath you go, language barriers
do become more challenging.
And that was one issue of Icouldn't get the support I
needed.
I ended up calling my doctorback home in New York City.
He told me exactly what wasgoing on, what medication I
needed, but then I was stuckthere.
He couldn't prescribe, hecouldn't diagnose abroad.

(07:03):
So that was the first glimpse inthat trip of what became.
Uh, it happened again in SriLanka when I was surfing, phone
tour coral reef, had a bacterialinfection.
This time I did go to a localclinic because I thought it
would spread.
Whatever medication they gave mein Ahangama, Sri Lanka was
clearly not what I needed.
And I was allergic to it.

(07:24):
And it spread worse than theactual infection itself was the
medication I took.

SPEAKER_00 (07:28):
Oh my god.

SPEAKER_01 (07:29):
Um, I could bore you with stories forever, getting
Montezuma's revenge in MexicoCity, getting sick in India, all
these places.
But it was those experiences ofnot only dealing with the
healthcare challenge, but thelack of solution I had.
And one more point on that, Dan,is you mentioned insurance.
Some of my trips, I've hadinsurance, whether it was
covered by my credit card or Iwas with family or someone else,

(07:52):
or I didn't have insurance.
And to me, travel insurance isan incredibly productive tool to
protect your wallet, to protectyour spending and where the cash
goes.
However, it sometimes almostfeels like it helps your bags
and your belongings more thanyour actual health itself.
So we've been very conscious ofthe effort that whether you have

(08:12):
insurance or not, and we partnerwith travel insurers, um, we can
be your support to actually gethigh quality care, not only
support your bank account.

SPEAKER_00 (08:22):
So you mentioned that 60% of travelers have had
an issue related to their healthwhen they're traveling.
So when you're looking at theaddressable market, um, the TAM,
as it's gotten referred to inyour VC space of the total
addressable market, like how bigis the market size for this?
And I'm sure you get asked thatfrom your investors.
And um, as you continue to scalethis business, tell us what is

(08:43):
the actual size of the market.
Because if you add up the numberof global travelers and you look
at the insurance business,because what I'm really keen to
understand with a wayward is thegap that you're serving in the
marketplace that clearly didn't,you know, a solution like this
didn't really exist before.
And obviously you're now, youknow, continuing to scale and
roll it out.
But what was the gap in themarket and what is it you're a
wayward is really solving?

SPEAKER_01 (09:05):
Yeah.
So the market size, despite asmany market analysis that I've
done when I was a in in venture,it's still a very challenging
one because one, we're in a newarea.
Many people think inherentlyit's the insurance market or
it's the uninsured market.
But rather, we're able tosupport both sides.
So when we look at as a team,when we look at the market

(09:27):
sizing, I think it's importantto be direct at first.
And our most focused goal ishelping Americans abroad with
virtual care.
It's more niche.
That's one start of the productsand offerings that we have.
But that's a hundred millionplus outbound trips per year,
um, split between businesstravel, between family tourism,

(09:48):
between visiting family backhome from where people are from.
And that number is growing.
So more than 100 millionoutbound trips uh for the fourth
year in a row this year, Ibelieve, if not, if I'm not
mistaken.
So when you combine that withthe global market of a billion
and a half annual internationaltrips, it's a pretty astonishing

(10:09):
number of people who aretraveling abroad and who need
healthcare support.
So we have some specific numbersin the multi-billions, but when
you really go for that globalmarket of not just English
speakers, but as we expand toFrench speakers, Spanish,
Italian, um, then the sharing ofa market number would almost be
a little inconceivable becausewe're starting a little tighter

(10:31):
trying to get the Americansfirst, and we'll grow from
there.

SPEAKER_00 (10:34):
Well, and I want to uh give you an exact scenario
from my experience, and I'm keento get your take on this as far
as how we would have approachedthis differently, my wife and I
on our trip through SoutheastAsia had we been using a
wayward.
So here's my uh example that wasvery uh reasonably dramatic at
the time, but the in retrospect,like this is where a service

(10:55):
like this would have been veryuseful for us.
We arrived after travelingthrough uh Cambodia to Ho Chi
Minh City or Saigon, and my wifehad gotten really bad food
poisoning um the day before wearrived and spent the next two
days sleeping, and to the pointwhere I was concerned about
leaving her because I wasn'tsure uh if she was gonna be
breathing when I got back.

(11:15):
Like it was she was she hadn'teaten for two days, she was so
weak, and um, so I kept goingout to try and get some crackers
or like but I didn't know whereto turn at the time.
I didn't know what else like umand so the um thankfully she
made the she started to make theturn like on the third day and
started to get some strengthcome back, and then we booked a
tour, and this um and we gotpicked up on motorcycles, and

(11:38):
she made the unfortunate mistakeof climbing off the wrong side
of the motorcycle, and she gotwhat we now what we became
familiar with as a Saigontattoo.
And so her leg burned quiteseverely on the side of the
motorcycle because she clearlydidn't take it off fast enough,
and it was horrific at the time,and the pain was obviously and
we didn't weren't sure to how togo to a hospital, they weren't

(12:00):
sure what to do with us.
They patched her up and we didthe tour for the day, but she
was barely functional.
And then for the next week, wewere still trying to figure out
what we should do about it.
Now, thankfully, uh the my wifeis a pharmacist, and I'm only
saying that because she has agood understanding of medical
care and how to treat a wound,uh, but other people were
telling her to put toothpaste onit.
It was like other travelerswere, you know, what really

(12:21):
helps with those types of burnis toothpaste.
And she was like, she knew thosecomments to be ridiculous, but
we kind of said to each other,could you imagine if you just
took other travelers' advicethat you know had told you what
to do?
So in those scenarios, Max,whether it was us being uh held
up in our hostel, you know, notsure what my wife's fate was
going to be, and trying tofigure out if I get her to a
hospital or need to get her to ahospital, or after having, you

(12:43):
know, being severely burned likeon a motorcycle on the street of
Saigon, like you know, boththose situations, we never went
to a hospital.
We just, you know, usedself-care and thankfully
navigated it.
But really, that was far fromideal.
So, what would have beendifferent for us if we had left
to travel and had uh theAwayword app and it actually
decided to make sure we had sometype of not just medical

(13:06):
insurance, but some type ofactual coverage that would treat
us in destination?

SPEAKER_01 (13:11):
Yeah, unfortunately, you're one of so many who I
speak to who have stories, andeach one is unique in its own
right, but the solution is assimple as possible, and that's
our goal.
In the first situation, we'vehad, I was with my brother in
Mexico City, and this happened.
I've uh Vietnam is one of myfavorite places, and I know
people get sick there as well.
In your hotel, in your hostel,it would have been a matter of

(13:34):
three clicks.
You go on the website or theapp, you request a doctor, and
you get assigned a doctor inthat country who speaks your
language.
Whether you want to be seenimmediately, you can be seen
within minutes, or scheduling itout for a few hours or even the
next day.
You and your wife could havehopped on the phone with a
Vietnamese trained licensedprovider who can give you that

(13:54):
guidance and even more thanguidance, that clinical
expertise.
They could diagnose and thenthey can prescribe if you need
it.
If it was a prescription thatwas required to support the
stomach and whatever else shewas going through, it could be
sent to your local pharmacy.
And all you do is you go to thatpharmacy, you show them the
awayword app, which is housingthe prescription that that

(14:16):
doctor sent to you, and it'ssolved.
Most of these things arenon-urgent cases, which is what
we call them.
Um, in fact, the InternationalSociety of Travel Medicine did
uh one of the largest studies onthis a few years ago, which
showed 95% plus by count ofcases abroad can be solved using
virtual care.

(14:36):
So all you would need to do ishave this conversation with one
of our providers, go to thatpharmacy, and hopefully it's
resolved.
That's the simplest outcomeoutcome, which most of them do
fall into.
If for whatever reason there'smore challenges with that first
episode of care, as we call it,we offer 14 days continuous care

(14:57):
messaging with your provider.
So if her stomach was stillupsetting her or if the
medication was having some weirdside effects, you go directly in
the platform in a secure,compliant portal and you can
message your provider.
The reason we keep it open for14 days is because I have dealt
with organizations domesticallyand abroad where I see a doctor

(15:20):
via telemedicine, I think it'sgreat.
I have a follow-up question, andthey're nowhere to be seen.
Um, we were really intentionalthat continuous care matters.
On top of that, I'm not sure howlong you run your trip for, Dan,
but many groups we work with,corporate executives, for
example, they don't have threedays to stay in bed.
They're there for a conference,they're there for an event.

(15:42):
I know you do a lot of travelevents as well.
Nobody wants to miss those.
So being able to be seen as soonas possible and get support as
soon as possible is one of ourmain goals and priorities.
The second part that youmentioned, the motorbike, I did
the Hajjang loop a few yearsago.
And you would think that thelocal attire is bandages on legs

(16:02):
because every traveler eitherfalls on their motorbike or gets
burnt.
And the same thing would happen.
You can hop on the phone, youcan FaceTime, or not FaceTime,
you can do the videoconsultation to show the doctor
what's going on.
If they believe a hospital isrecommended, they can refer you
and recommend a trusted one andeven write up the report in both

(16:22):
languages to know that thatcommunication is translated
clearly.
Or in many cases, again, it'sget an ointment, this is how we
recommend it, and you can talkto a doctor who can guide you
through that as well.

SPEAKER_00 (16:34):
And well, I'm keen to know from both a consumer and
business point of view, becauseobviously our podcast, as you
well know, is B2B.
So a lot of travel advisors,tour operators uh would likely
be interested in this type ofsolution for their guests, but
obviously there are a lot oftravelers that listen to our
podcast as well.
So I'm going to start with themjust because that uh situation I
shared with you.

(16:54):
So when a traveler is looking toutilize a wayward, so let's take
for the example an Americantraveler uh going to Europe.
Let's just actually pick a uh uhand they have their health
coverage.
Tell us a little bit about theprocess of actually getting a
wayward, like downloading theapp, choosing, and and part of
the reason I'm asking that nowis because uh just when we were

(17:15):
traveling, we would always getthe point you said to me is so
relevant.
We uh use a company called WorldNomads.
I've worked at Lonely Planet formany years.
World Nomads was an insurancecompany that many of the
backpackers that we uh hadtraveled with had said, oh, you
make sure you get World Nomadstravel insurance so that it will
protect your laptop and yourgear if it gets stolen at a
hostel.
And like it was very interestingbecause it was more about your
stuff or your travel uh plansbeing interrupted than it was

(17:38):
about the healthcare.
And the healthcare is really thepart that is actually what
ultimately you need to be mostconcerned about.
And then it's really complicatedto understand healthcare
providers.
I'm a Canadian, of course, andwhen I travel internationally,
you know, one of the things thatthe healthcare providers are
trying to do is just repatriateme as fast as possible.
So it's like if you've beeninjured, it's like let's treat
the acute care, but let's getyou back to a Canadian hospital

(18:00):
where the bulk of the cost canotherwise be better managed,
right?
And this is something that a lotof people know about their
healthcare programs, especiallyAmericans that within a network.
I lived in the U.S.
for a few years, and it's justtrying to navigate private
health care is its owncomplexity.
So the reason I'm asking youthis specific question right now
is because many travelers listento this thinking about, well, do
I need this over and above myhealth insurance?

(18:22):
How does this work from a costpoint of view?
Because I'm always amazed howreasonable the cost is, like
when I go out and actually buythat private travel insurance
compared to what the potentialramifications could be if I
didn't have it.
And so take us through if youwouldn't mind sharing some of
the cost and the approach for atraveler looking to use a
wayward on their next trip.

SPEAKER_01 (18:41):
Great question.
And you also mentioned thebusiness to business angle,
which is actually what we werefounded on was how can we serve
the organizations.
But we realized so manytravelers, including myself,
wanted this directly when theywere going on their own
journeys.
So we do offer two generalservices.
The first is what we call a carepackage.
Prior to your departure, whetheryou have insurance and want to

(19:04):
buy this on top of it, we usedthe one medical example here in
uh the States.
I'm not sure what the comparableis in Canada, which is you have
insurance, you have coverage,but you want to pay for this
virtual care solution on top ofthat to know that you have a
doctor ready to go to reallyprotect yourself.
So prior to a trip to Florence,you go on the app or the

(19:26):
website, you put in yourdestination, how long they're
going, who needs to be part ofthis plan.
And you pay as low as 80 cents,50 cents a day, up to a few
dollars a day.
So it can be very reasonable.
Um, and we also have packagesfor study abroad and for these
longer duration trips.
And then throughout yourjourneys, if you do need to see

(19:47):
a doctor, we act as thatscheduling tool, we act as the
service that helps you connectwith them and it's included.
There's no extra added cost, youdon't have to do any filing.
It's all there through that carepackage.
The second direct consumer angleis what we call the as needed.
Many people already are coveredby World Nomads or another
travel insurer, and they want tostick with that.

(20:09):
They want to wanna buy anothercare package.
So if you get sick, if you needmedical attention, even if you
just lose your prescription,which is such a common um use
case of our platform, then youcan similarly go on to the app
or the website, request aconsultation, and then get
reimbursed by your insurer.
So quite simple, seamless,whether you have insurance or

(20:30):
not, and we're able to supportyou in both outcomes.

SPEAKER_00 (20:33):
Really interesting.
I appreciate sharing thatbecause I think that's one part
that I was uh I was keen tounderstand.
I'm sure our listeners are aswell, is that idea that it might
cost you$10 for the trip.
And it's like, well, whywouldn't you?
Like for future travels, just tohave that um to have that
security and also just that uhreassurance.
And so for me, obviously uh thisis gonna be something I'm gonna

(20:57):
layer in now too, on top of whatI'm you know, my essential
travel insurance.
Um, because for me, the concernis in a destination, especially
if you're traveling your familyor your kids, is the time and
effort involved in getting to ahospital as opposed to having
someone that can assess youremotely and tell you whether or
not you need acute care or cangive you the recommendations for

(21:20):
what you need to do to treatthat effectively by staying in
the resort or staying in yourhotel.
Um so let's but let's talk aboutthe business side of it, since
that is where the businessstarted.
Um keen to know, Max, when yousay the business was the impetus
of this, is like to covercompanies.
Tell us a little bit more thethe B2B angle for a wayward.

SPEAKER_01 (21:40):
Yeah, at the start of this conversation, uh I
shared, and then you mentionedthat we were trying to solve a
problem that exists for manystakeholders.
Not just do better of whatexists, not necessarily be
another insurer, but reallysolve something that wasn't
otherwise solved.
And we saw that time and timeagain with organizations while
trying to.
Travelers, whether you're acorporate traveler, a family,

(22:02):
and a student, whatever it is,are the ones who actually get
sick.
It is that organization that youare with that bears the brunt
and has the burden economically,um, liability-wise, and just
customer satisfaction whensomebody gets sick.
I'll give a few examples, butone is an employer.
We talked about that corporateexecutive who was sent from his

(22:25):
company to go to a conference orto go to meet a uh perspective
customer abroad.
If they're sick, if they're notable to do that, the ROI and
their business travel goes downto horrible, horrible outcomes.
We want to be able to serve thatorganization.
And we can do it in a peremployee per month.
We do partnerships with otherbenefit providers so that your

(22:47):
employees are covered abroad.
In addition to just the this isgreat because it's an ROI,
there's also duty of care.
And if you're not familiar, dutyof care is put simply the
responsibility as an employer tokeep your people safe and
healthy, not only in the officethat you work in or in the
country that you are, but evenwhen they're abroad.

(23:09):
So in the past few years, um,they've come out with new
versions of the duty of careobligations.
The most recent one is ISO31030, if I have that correct,
which states that you need tohave a plan and a preparation
for around the clock serviceswherever you are.
So there's many of thesesecurity firms and duty of care

(23:31):
firms, um, like Global Guardian,who do amazing work for the
Starbucks of the world and themedicine of the world, and are
focused on emergency evacuation.
We are focused on the vastmajority of count, which is
these non-urgent virtual carecases.
And we can serve employers.
Another example is a touroperator.
We're talking to, I know youhave a career in with tour

(23:54):
operators, but we're talking tomany of them because again, when
somebody gets sick, whetheryou're biking around Italy or
you're just doing a tour of theVatican, when somebody gets
sick, it is on that touroperator to find a solution.
It's better for their customerservice.
It'll help that group come backnext time.
So it improves your economicsand reduces your churn.
And there's just liability.

(24:16):
So we serve businesses in a fewdifferent models with recurring
subscriptions to our platformthat allows all of their
travelers to be covered for pertrip.
So whether it's study abroad orcorporate travel, the
organizations are actuallypaying for an awayward, uh a
wayward coverage across all oftheir travelers.

(24:37):
And they can decide if they wantto upsell it and upsell it in
the tuition or the fees, or ifthey just want to eat that cost
because they know that it'll bea benefit of them later.
Um, and there's so many otherpotential partners that we work
with as well, including but notlimited to hospitality.
So we are partnered with anexceptional hotel group out in

(24:58):
Mexico named Capitalia, where inMexico, so many people,
especially Mexico City, get sickfrom the water.
They go down on the front desk,they say, I don't feel, I need
to see a doctor.
Either they say, look it up onGoogle, or here's a card of a
doctor that they gave this to mefive years ago.
And there's a liability andthere's risk there.
So we act as that partner tothem where they say scan a QR

(25:22):
code.
You can see a doctor through ourpartner a wayward.
You are not coming back to usevery time you're in Mexico
because you had such a greatexperience.
The traveler is able to enjoytheir trip, and both sides are
saving money of going tohospitals and dealing with all
of this adventures just to get abasic prescription.

SPEAKER_00 (25:40):
Yeah, it's amazing how I mean everyone was using
WebMD.
And like this is kind of theshift that we're also seeing in
terms of uh consumer behaviorfrom Google search to AI tools,
because now everyone's eitherusing Claude or Chat GPT.
Um but the reality is in both ofthose scenarios is that yes, you
now have some agentic AI thatcan give you better analysis of
your situation, but it stillcan't actually take the

(26:02):
additional steps to figure outgetting you to the hospital or
connecting you to someone thatlike so you you're armed with
more information, but if you'renot a healthcare uh practitioner
expert, you're obviously limitedin what you can do with that
information.
So and the thing that stood outto me, and I was looking forward
to um asking about this in ourconversation, is having that

(26:24):
extensive experience with touroperators, the thing of duty of
care.
And I mentioned in the in theintroduction about the episode I
had done with the AdventureTravel and Trade Association on
uh the legal implications, Ispecifically asked the two
lawyers about duty of care.
And I wanted them to explainduty of care to our listeners
and so that our listeners canbetter understand who who has
the responsibility for you indestination.

(26:47):
If you're on a group trip andyou end up doing a day tour with
a third party and you have anaccident um and you require uh
and it could lead to something,a potential lawsuit later, lots
of other and so that's a legalimplication.
But they were sharing somestories, Max, that I were
heartbreaking about a familygoing on holiday and being in a
car accident.
The mother was killed and thedaughter uh also passed away,

(27:09):
and the other two my familieswere in hospital, they're
sending lawyers down to likesurvey the scene.
It's like exactly the nightmarescenario that no one wants to
face.
But the reality then becomesokay, health insurance and um
the coverage that they're goingto receive.
And so when you mentioned dutyof care, one of the things that
stood out to me was we're alwaystrying to encourage travelers to
get travel insurance.

(27:29):
And I think most people wouldknow in the industry you can't
mandate people buying travelinsurance.
You can't force people to buytravel insurance.
You can highly encourage it.
Um, but travel companies do makeyou know profit off of selling
travel insurance, and so thereis the additional benefit of
selling travel insurance, butultimately my view is I don't
care where you get your travelinsurance from, but don't leave
home without it, right?

(27:50):
Make sure you have travelinsurance.
In this instance, I also feellike it would be an opportunity
for tour operators to include awayward as a part of the unique
proposition that they have, andthat you could co-brand it or
you could partner with a companythat sees the benefit of
providing that to theirtravelers.
And so it's interesting for meto hear that it sounds like that

(28:11):
is a new business line for youor a potential way to grow this
business through hotels or touroperators that will roll this
into their cost to make surethat their travelers have a
positive experience if they haveany medical issues.

SPEAKER_01 (28:24):
Exactly.
We're already building portals.
You mentioned that, thatpartnership in Crow Branded.
Um, we're doing X care poweredby a Wayword, and we're offering
these ways that theseorganizations can give you the
best care possible when you aretraveling.
As you said, insurance is great,and we want that to protect your
wallet, and we you should haveit.

(28:45):
However, when you're doing awith let's use study abroad,
we're talking to one of thebiggest study abroad
organizations in the world, andthey're incredible.
They have dozens of citiesacross Europe where they have
students.
And for each trip, let's saythere's 150 to 200 students,
there's only one to two staffmembers.
When one student gets sick, 50%of their workforce has to stop

(29:10):
what they're doing, take them bythe hand, walk them to the local
clinic, walk them to thepharmacy, call their parents,
ask questions about theirallergies, and that's half of
their staff focusing on this onechild.
So not only is it the duty ofcare obligation, but it's that
convenience, it's thatoperational inefficiency that we
can solve.

(29:30):
Let's reverse that.
And that the study abroadpartner is using a wayword.
Then the student gets sick, theysend them the link or they
already have the app download ontheir phone before their trip.
Two clicks, they jump on, theysee a doctor, and it's resolved.
It is saving money, it is savingtime.
Parents are happier, studentsare happier.

(29:51):
And on top of that, just on theside of study abroad, many
student illnesses and challengesdo not go to the program because
there's an insecurity.
There's a UTI or there's anotherthing they don't want to share
to their program.
So instead of solving it whenthey need to solve it and
getting a medication, they letit sit there and they don't get

(30:12):
the support they need.
By having an a wayward policyand a wayward plan, they're able
to get the help and it savesthat study abroad program, the
student, and the parents.
But the same goes for a touroperator.
We know that insurance shouldhelp you with duty of care, but
what do you actually do whensomeone gets sick?
We don't want a phone bookanymore.
And that's what some otherpartners on the or some other

(30:35):
groups in the market do offer isa one-off list.
You go through, you find adoctor, you see if they're
available.
We want to give you thatend-to-end experience to not
only schedule, but to meet andto continue to get that care to
save the tour operators and thetravelers time, uh, give them
better health care and give thema better experience.

SPEAKER_00 (30:54):
Well, one of the things that anyone who takes a
guided tour knows is that theexperience really comes down to
the guide that they're part, youknow, that they're and the
group, those two things.
And uh unfortunately, sometimeson a group trip, someone does
get sick, someone gets hurt.
And often what happens is itserves as a major distraction.
It's unfortunate for thatindividual, of course, but it
also has a negative impact onthe group because the guide's

(31:16):
attention is now shifted toturning to being accessible to
them, getting to the hospital.
And uh it it it's a whole newequation now that um and you see
people come back from the trip,they're like, well,
unfortunately, somethinghappened to someone on day two,
and they, you know, it so one ofthe things that stands out to me
as an immediate benefit isactually ensuring that the guide
can carry on running the tripand the um the traveler can get

(31:39):
the care and attention that theyneed from an expert because
these guides are not obviously,you know, they're they have the
essential medical training, butultimately they need to be seen
by a doctor or an expert.
And so I'm keen, if you wouldn'tmind.
Obviously, I shared that oneexample um so with my wife, and
and I'm sure with partners, youhave examples of that kind of

(32:00):
illustrate the value that you'recreating for partners because I
can I I can think of severalexamples.
We were in India um on thetuck-tucks, like the actual
cycling ones, and um one of theguests who was from Australia,
she unfortunately did not haveher feet down when they hit the
brakes and she went flying outand she broke her collarbone.

(32:20):
Um and this is a lady in herlate 70s, and it's one of the
things that you know she wasconcerned about going to the
hospital and it really had anegative, she tried to stay on
the trip and eventually had todrop out.
Her and her husband flew back toAustralia so she could get the
care that she needed.
And obviously, we were all likereally disappointed for her
because they were really lookingforward to this trip, and now
everything had changed.
And so if that tour operator umhad that option, like it could

(32:44):
have been a different outcomefor her, not that it would have
changed the accident, but interms of being able to get the
care they need and not becausethey left because they weren't
they were uncertain about thecare.
So they literally just tried theminimal amount of treatment so
they could get home and have theproper surgery and everything.
And that may or may not havebeen the right decision because
I think what a pe a lot of uhtravelers also find that

(33:05):
hospitals in other countries arenot as scary as you imagine.
It's like some of the healthcarearound the some of the
healthcare around the world isfantastic.
Look at a country like Colombia,it has an amazing healthcare
system.
And so it's it's also perceptionthat if you know you're outside
the US or outside Australia thatyou're not going to get the
medical attention that you need.
But the reality is that you mayneed it urgently, and that the

(33:27):
best way to solve that is to beto have the surgery there and
then.
So I guess where I'm going withthis is I'm I'm keen to know if
you wouldn't mind sharing someexamples of where you've seen
situations turned around forpeople.

SPEAKER_01 (33:40):
Yeah, absolutely.
And and you mentioned, I guess,one side of the spectrum, which
is unfortunately the one of fewwhen you look at the actual
slice of the pie, cases that dorequire you to leave your trip
to maybe get heli uh to justleave wherever you are by plane.
But a vast majority of cases, asI shared earlier from the

(34:01):
International Society of TribalMedicine, share that they are
these non-urgent cases thatcould be solved as easy as this
conversation ban.
We hopped on within seconds, itwas scheduled, we can see each
other, we can speak with eachother.
That's what many of the casesrequire.
I'll use one of the most commonbecause we already talked about
stomach aches, which there'sBali Belly, there's Matasuma's

(34:21):
Revenge, there's Deli Belly.
Everywhere you go, our stomachsare not always up for the fight.
Um, but another really commoncase is forgotten medications
and prescriptions.
There can be a group, a familytour who's going to Europe or
going to Paris for the firsttime.
And it's their big trip and youthink that you're prepared, but
you forgot your medication.

(34:43):
We do not want that individualor that tour operator to stress
about what do we do now?
And we have to miss thisonce-in-a-lifetime experience
because you forgot yourmedication.
So if the tour operator is apartner of a wayward, all they
do is share the link.
The traveler can hop on, theycan, if necessary, and up to the
clinical judgment of thecontract or of the third-party

(35:06):
providers we work with, they canget that prescription.
They can be on their way, theycan continue their trip.
Whether it's a stomach ache, aheadache, the flu, mono, or a
lost prescription, if a touroperator is a partner of a
wayward, that challenge can besolved almost immediately,
seamlessly, and you don't evenhave to go to the hospital or to
the clinic because virtual caredoes solve so many of these

(35:28):
healthcare challenges abroad.

SPEAKER_00 (35:30):
Well, the one thing that stands out to me too, just
having this conversation withyou, Max, is that one other
example that I can see in theindustry that is like an
ancillary product to be moreclinical in the terminology of
looking at how travel companiesgenerate revenue but also serve
their guests well.
So knowing that 97% was a statthat I wouldn't I was

(35:52):
interviewing the team from uhOlafly of people that use their
smartphones in destination.
So people need to stayconnected, which is why there's
a huge e-sim market.
People also need to make surethat they're protected and
covered when they have and henceinsurance and also like um a
service like a wayward.
A lot of travel agencies haveconsidered bundling in e-sims.

(36:13):
Um and I'm wondering if the samething applies here with a
wayward, is that you know, we'vebeen talking about the tour
operator, and obviously the touroperator is ultimately the one
that's going to be delivering inthe experience, but travel
advisors and travel agencies canalso sell add-on products and
like they do offer travelinsurance.
So is there an option for themto either bundle it in or to add
that on at the point ofpurchasing their trip from a

(36:36):
travel agency?

SPEAKER_01 (36:38):
100%.
And I'm glad you mentioned thatbecause there are so many
verticals that we are goingafter that we we try to be
direct, but brokers and travelagencies is another really
strong market that we're goingafter.
On the agencies, as youmentioned, there's two ways to
do it.
One is ancillary.
We're working with a lot ofancillary or a lot of groups to

(36:58):
be an ancillary add-on.
Would you like to add this?
And it's so minute in the grandscheme of your$5,000 trip that
the thought of getting sickabroad makes you more sick than
anything.
So adding it really is a strongway to know that you're
protected.
Another way, especially for thehigh-end travel agencies, and
I've talked to a lot here in NewYork that deal with large family

(37:21):
offices and individuals and evencelebrities, is these individual
travel agencies, they want tosponsor it.
By sponsoring it, that meansthey're paying for it.
They're not asking you to add afew hundred dollars on top of
your$20,000 trip, but ratherthey're saying, we now offer
virtual care.
So if you get sick, you come tous and we'll help you out.

(37:43):
Why do they do that?
Because if you're spending whattens of thousands or a few
thousand dollars going on a tripand you get sick, and the travel
agent that you've worked withcan now say, Hey, we're so sorry
you're not feeling well.
Here's a link, it's already paidfor, talk to a doctor and get
resolved.
They're coming back to you nexttime.
If they come to the travelagent, they say, sorry, I'll

(38:05):
look it up on Google, or maybethere's a clinic near you, then
why am I spending all this moneyin the whatever 8% of my total
trip towards a travel agent ifthey're not able to help me when
things go awry?
So it is a really strong marketto be able to support them when
needed and being able to sponsorthat benefit, so to speak.

SPEAKER_00 (38:25):
Well, and that's where I see, you know, um very
little competition in themarketplace or the sector that
you're serving.
I see huge upside with uhespecially the aging baby boomer
demographic, which you know thatis obviously one of the key
drivers of um a continuedincrease in international
travel, especially for you knowuh Americans.
And their biggest concern ishealthcare and and making sure

(38:48):
that they can be seen andtreated.
And so that's why for me, Iwould see this as an advantage
to a marketer or a brand thathas access to this and build it
into their messaging becausepeople are always looking for
peace of mind and reassurance.
Um I've had you know my aunt wholives in Atlanta, she was really
concerned about going on thisriver cruise trip because she
was concerned when she wasreading the documentation that

(39:10):
there was more active activitiesoff the ship that she thought
she might be not up for, goingupstairs and like having a fall,
which are obviously very realand valid concerns for older
travelers.
And so knowing that they couldbe seen quickly, easily, um, I
would see it as a huge sellingadvantage.
So um, but tell us a little bit.
So obviously, there's a numberof different sectors you can go

(39:31):
into.
You've had the business for uhalmost a year now, and so I see
so much upside and potential.
Tell us as we look at the restof 2026 and going into 2027,
what are some of youraspirations for growing this
business?
What are some of the directionsthat you're looking to pursue?
And for our listeners that aregoing to start to hear more and
more from you, um, from youknow, uh, your marketing

(39:53):
messages, tell us a little bitabout some of the initiatives
that you have underway.

SPEAKER_01 (39:57):
So many that it's hard to even choose, but our
goal is to do one thing verywell, the best in the world, and
that's international virtualcare.
We want any person that'straveling abroad to know that a
wayward has their back, whetherthey're paying for it or the
organization that is with themis paying for it.
And that's that one more tidbitof what you just mentioned.

(40:18):
We're now seeing hotel partnerswhen they say 11 a.m.
checkout, 24-7 spa, 24-7healthcare support through a
wayward.
And that is already becoming sovaluable because when you're
comparing a like-for-like hoteland it does offer our services,
people tend to choose that.
But in terms of what the rest ofthe year looks like and what the
rest of next year looks like, iswe're growing in two different

(40:41):
ways.
One is geographically.
Uh, we have coverage across allof the EU and Mexico, which is
where a vast majority of UStravelers do go to.
But we're seeing a lot ofinterest in newer and really
exciting markets that I'veloved, the Vietnam and Thailand
or Colombia, Costa Rica, Brazil,Peru.
So we're expanding marketsrapidly and able to really serve

(41:06):
these partners and individuals,no matter where they go around
the world.
The second is all of theproviders on our platform, which
I'm also happy to share moreabout because the question I get
often is who are these doctors?
We are not clinical.
We are not a medical clinic, asin a wayward, but we are very
selective.
Less than 20% of providers thatapply to join our network are

(41:30):
actually accepted.
We go through a strict androbust vetting process.
I to date have met every singleprovider.
Not sure how long that'll beable to scale because that's
just in about 16 countries, butthere's many more to go.
We have a medical director whodoes a mock interview and a mock
consultation with everyone toensure that that care is great.
But all of the providers rightnow act as family medicine or

(41:53):
general practitioners.
We have already started to seespecialists want to join the
platform on the one side of themarketplace, and individuals
want to see specialists on theother.
Um, we just onboarded our firstallergist in Mexico because
allergies are so common.
Um, and many people who go toMexico City, they have
challenges with the pollution,they think it's allergies, and

(42:15):
they want to talk to someone.
We're starting to onboardpediatricians and mental health
experts.
So as this next 18 monthsunfolds, we will continue to do
what we do best, and that isvirtual care for these
non-urgent cases abroad, butalso expand our geographic
coverage and expand thespecialists and the individual

(42:36):
doctors that are on ourplatform.

SPEAKER_00 (42:38):
Yeah, you've just explained something that stood
out to me too, because uh, whenI was reviewing your website in
anticipation of our conversationtoday, I was going the f uh
through the businesses sectionand then also through the
providers.
And when I was looking at theproviders like Join Our Care
Network, um, I was actually keento better understand how you do.
So you obviously um having youbrought it up is actually one of

(42:59):
the things I did want to ask youabout because I was trying to
wrap my head around um how youvet the individuals that are
going to be providing that carein destination.
And the reason I I'm havingtraveled extensively and having
the experience of being innon-English speaking countries
is that people genuinely carefor other people.
And it's one of the beautifulthings about traveling is that

(43:20):
you know people care forstrangers and people and by and
large, healthcare is better thanwhat people expect.
And it's so it's like but it'sbut it's all that fear, which is
understandable.
But having someone in Saigon,because this was my concern
about you know, if we're gonnaget patched through to someone
back into like Canada or the US,like the key is that local
expertise, that someone thatactually fully understands where

(43:43):
the hospitals are, uh if or ifit if it if or how would you get
access to a prescription if it'sa script that you need.
Um so tell us a little bit moreabout that, because I think that
obviously that's key to yourongoing success is that when it
it has to deliver when someonehas an issue, and when it does.
Then you're gonna have acustomer for life who's gonna
tell everybody else that I hadthis issue, and thank God I had

(44:04):
a wayward because I got in touchwith a local doctor in Saigon,
and within 24 hours, I was backon my feet and I was enjoying
the rest of my holiday.

SPEAKER_01 (44:13):
Absolutely.
There are three main ways thatwe describe a provider network.
They are vetted, they're Englishspeaking, and they are local.
All three of them hold animmense amount of weight.
On the vetted side, as you said,doctors, I think doctors in
general are such anunderappreciated individual.

(44:33):
And you go through all theseyears of service and work and
schooling, and you want to dowhat is good for the world.
And I think doctors inherentlyare trustworthy and amazing
people, but it's about findingthe doctor that's right for you.
You can be in Saigon, you can bein Mexico City.
Many of the doctors, as great asthey are, don't speak your
language.
Or they don't understand theWestern, so to speak, the

(44:55):
Canadian, Australian, Americanhealthcare system to know what a
ZPAC is, or to know what yourmedication does or does not go
with on a prescription basis.
So having doctors that areextremely vetted, that their
English is amazing and they'relocal allows you to solve all
those challenges anduncertainties.
And we find them through avariety of ways.

(45:17):
One way is partnerships.
We partner with organizationsthat already have doctors
abroad, or organizationsdomestically in the US, Canada,
and Western Europe, where weknow that these doctors are
trained at incredibleinstitutions.
They have experience withforeign travelers, and now
they're back home.
I love the example of a doctorin Vietnam who she was born and

(45:42):
raised in Vietnam, came to theUS to study medicine, worked and
lived here for 20 years.
So not only is she just an asmart woman, but she knows the
US healthcare world.
And now she's back in um, she'sback in Vietnam.
We're able to connect ourtraveler with somebody who

(46:02):
understands how to treat foreigntravelers, understands the
American healthcare system, isincredible, incredibly talented
and speaks English, but is ableto prescribe and diagnose in
Vietnam.
And finding where all of thoseconverge is non-trivial.
And that's why we've spent aboutseven months finding these

(46:22):
doctors in markets around theworld to ensure that the doctor
you speak with is great and canhelp you solve your challenges
and is able to prescribe.
Because it's it's very easy tohop on the phone and call your
doctor or your primary careprovider in your home city, but
they can't diagnose or prescribeabroad, and you're kind of left
at that 15-yard line for afootball reference.

SPEAKER_00 (46:42):
Yeah, no, exactly.
The prescription is the big uhissue, and then also
understanding the medications.
And you know, as I mentioned, mywife being a pharmacist, this is
you know this is exactly why thefirst thing you get asked is
what other medications areyou're on if you're you know
being treated in a crediblehospital or with a you know a um
professional care provider,because they're gonna want to
understand the whole patientfirst to be able to evaluate the

(47:03):
options.
And and so and this is why youknow I find that you know, if
you have the opportunity tospeak to someone, and and but my
question for you is in the faceof technology, when I gave you
that scenario of where peopleare using generative AI tools
and LLMs to try and improve,maybe they're using it for their
healthcare plan already, they'reusing it for exercises, you
know, they're you know fallingin love with their AI agent and

(47:26):
um and using it for everything.
Um what I wanted to highlight iswhere the limitation is, because
where I see the limitation is inthe fact that there's no
question that people will gointo their doctor today armed
with the information that usedto just be WebMD.
Now they're it's armed with allthe information.
They've done all their research,they're going in to the doctor
saying, this is what I think itis, this is based on you know me

(47:49):
putting all of this these inputsin.
Um, but ultimately to receivecare, you need a human.
So you need there's something tobe a human on the other side of
that.
And uh, and you're also gonnaneed someone that is a true
expert that's still gonna beable to process all this
information that you think youknow you may have you know
coming in armed with.
So, my question, I guess, whereI'm going to, since you're a
technology company, how much canAI benefit or does it benefit?

(48:13):
Um, and what is that the nextpoint of just getting someone on
the phone with someone?
So is is there a layer of youknow trying to help someone
through the process using AI andand technology, or is the key
just get someone to a human asfast as possible?
And clearly that human can alsobe utilizing the AI tools that
will help them better diagnose.

(48:35):
Because I'm seeing more and moredoctors today when I go in for
an appointment, their firstthing is, you are you okay if I
record this?
Um, because then I don't have totake notes, and it's like it
will collect all the informationand it'll help me make better
decisions.
And I love hearing doctors thatare embracing this technology,
not just assuming anyone is hasthe you know one expert opinion,
is like leverage the power ofthis technology.

(48:55):
So I'd love to understand howyou're seeing that uh either be
built into a wayward or how uhwe should be thinking about that
as it relates to ending up inthese situations.

SPEAKER_01 (49:05):
Yeah, I am very bullish on AI generally.
I think it is the greatestknowledge transfer and knowledge
tool uh in technology history.
And I think it'll do exceptionalthings for health care and for
travel.
We use AI every single day tobuild our platform.
We use it to research and tofind doctors and build
partnerships.

(49:26):
And we also allow travelers touse it, like you said, with
summaries and otherconversations.
Where it falls short right nowis exactly what you said.
AI is an exceptional knowledgetool.
But the reason we don't marketourselves is an AI tool, um, at
least not yet, is because evenin the US, as we are the most,

(49:47):
I'd probably say the quickest,the fastest mover for AI for
prescriptions.
Uh, last I saw Texas was one ofthe first states to allow an AI
to prescribe.
The fact that it is juststarting in one of the 50 states
in the US, it still needs tospread rapidly and then spread
to Cannes and spread to all ofthese places.
Many countries, even WesternEurope, are far behind in that

(50:10):
route.
They still need to have apatient be seen by a provider.
Let's say in the future thingstremendously change and every
single country allows AIprescriptions, then we will have
the best data, the best access,and the best resources of any
international care platform toallow that.

(50:31):
Um, so I'd say to answer yourquestion succinctly is I believe
AI is really strong and we aremonitoring it every day, and we
will continue to add AI featuresto make your life easier.
But at the end of the day, whenyou're traveling, when you need
a prescription, you need tospeak to a professional who is
licensed in that area.
And as technology and regulationevolve, as will we.

SPEAKER_00 (50:54):
Yeah, no, I find that uh uh really uh fascinating
is that when it comes to beingable to give humans what they
need, obviously it it ends up uhbeing the human touch is
actually still what's going tobe required in these situations.
And uh and that local knowledge,which that combination of those
two things, um, I think ishugely valuable because not only

(51:17):
knowing it's one thing to findout what hospitals are, but it's
actually to know which specificuh healthcare providers you
should actually be going tobased on you know how crowded
they are, the lineups, or likewhat what information you'll
need to actually when you getthere, because that's another
issue you run into, is if youdon't have your insurance
information or the rightdocumentation that all of a
sudden you might have to go backto your hotel or like just all

(51:39):
these things you start runninginto without having a true
expert on your side.
Um so obviously there's uh uh areal meaningful business here to
grow and scale.
I'd love to hear where you areat the moment in terms of the
team and investors, because I'msure we might have some
investors listening to this.
They're like, wait a second,there's um a waywards onto

(52:00):
something, and um we need to bea part of this.
So tell us where you guys aretoday in terms of scaling this
business.
Uh, what's next for you as faras growing the team?
Because I could imagine somelisteners to this as well,
especially being based in NewYork.
We did a great episode withFora, and the whole uh focus was
a great episode.

SPEAKER_01 (52:15):
I listened.

SPEAKER_00 (52:16):
Oh, thank you so much.
I really appreciate that.
I loved uh you know thatconversation with Jake and being
in New York.
And the whole objective of thatconversation was really around
them filling this uh a new floorwith engineers and the number of
people that reached outafterwards because they got a
better understanding of thecompany, the people.
And so um tell us a little bitabout what's ahead for you guys

(52:37):
the rest of the year as far asbuilding out this business and
uh from investors and buildingout the team.

SPEAKER_01 (52:41):
So we I left my job in September of last year to
launch this business.
And I knew that capital would berequired.
You're not a capital-intensivebusiness by any means.
We have exceptional margins withdoctors.
Um, we are very fairly pricedwith partners because of the
international arbitrageopportunity, which is doctors

(53:04):
around the world are paid lessthan doctors in the US.
So if you can kind of cut thatmargin, then we're able to have
a strong business while notbreaking the bank for our
partners.
So, all that said is we did notraise the tens of millions of
dollars that we see in headlinestoday for many AI companies and
for many organizations that Ihad invested in the past.

(53:24):
I wanted to build a businessthat was scalable, that was
ready to proceed without justpouring cash into a problem.
Um, I think cash is green, andif you can throw money at it,
then it's not a real problem.
You have to solve it in otherways.
And I also knew that proving itout is the most valuable
milestone.
When I raised our first dollar,where we raised about$800,000 at

(53:47):
the start of the year to justget this business going.
We had no doctors.
Um it was a vision, it was anidea, and now we have dozens of
doctors in dozens of markets,and we have this thing to stand
on, this platform to stand on.
So our team is lean, we have anexceptional team, and we're
actually relocating to Chicago,where most of our team will be

(54:08):
based, at least our operationaland business team.
We have engineers in Mexico Cityand Bogota, Colombia, to just
like doctors, there'sexceptional talent around the
world.
I urge every company to look atthose amazing individuals that
are in other countries.
But we'll be growing our teamrapidly this year.
We'll be growing on themanagement side, um, on the

(54:30):
sales side.
And we're also looking for evenpart-time individuals who want
to help sell this service andhelp bring it to the world.
In terms of funding and capitalallocation, there are things
such as geographic expansionthat require some capital.
We are an exceptionally detailedcompliance business.
Um, in fact, one of our biggestinnovations is how we've been

(54:52):
able to successfully navigatecompliance in all of these
unique regions around the world.
So we wanted to prove this.
We wanted to prove that not onlythe technology works, but that
our providers are world-classand that the experience is
unlike any other.
And in the next few months, herewe will raise some more capital
to uh pour gasoline on the fireand allow us to be that virtual

(55:14):
care platform that allowstravelers anywhere in the world
to get seen quickly.

SPEAKER_00 (55:20):
That's great and really exciting.
And obviously, one of the thingsthat I um I'm also interested to
get your take on is, you know,when I was asking you where to
from here in 26 and 27, clearlyyou've got a long-term view for
this business and you thinkabout all the different ways
this business can evolve andgrow and keeping that mindset
from the very beginning of whatproblem you solve and making
sure that you continue to adaptas technology changes.

(55:42):
The point you made about the uhreliance on the local experts
and the fact that they areavailable and at a lower cost is
one of those things that reallyyou know it highlights, you
know, you think of a countrylike Cuba as a good example as
well.
You know, it's obviously a morechallenged destination to visit
at the moment for all thegeopolitical reasons.
Um, but being a Canadian whereyou had access to travel to
Cuba, the healthcare in Cuba isremarkable for the people who

(56:05):
live there and the fact thatwhat you know uh doctors make in
Cuba, but it's actually Cubandoctors are you you meet them
throughout uh Latin America, umamazing Cuban doctors who are
then you know that are in othercountries because they trained
in Cuba.
It's one of the best places toget medical training.
And again, this is likeovercoming stereotypes of

(56:26):
destinations and realizing thatand and clearly you're building
out a successful business modelon this this framework.
Um so tell us you know whereyou'd like this business to be,
whether it's three years fromfive years from now, um, but
what would you like to scalethis towards?
Because from my sense inspeaking to you and get a chance
to meet you, Max, like this isum in many ways, like it's it's

(56:47):
it's a it's a very viablebusiness, but it also it's
something you're passionateabout and something that you
obviously really care about andand want to see scaled to
growth.
It's not something you're justbuilding to sell.

SPEAKER_01 (56:59):
Absolutely.
I have been part of manyorganizations from founding and
investing and working on, andthis is the problem that
whatever the solution is, if itdrifts towards more more towards
AI or if it's just connecting tothese amazing doctors, is the
mission that I am devoted to formy career.
And I feel confident of that.
Listen, companies are arebought, not sold, and if

(57:20):
something happens, it happens.
But to answer where we are inthree to five years, I think
there's two core missionsgenerally of where I see a
wayward going.
The first is the mental side.
The number one reasonindividuals don't travel after
the economic, just being able toafford it, is that fear.
Especially in a post-COVIDworld, people are afraid to go

(57:43):
abroad.
They're afraid of what happensif I get sick, they're afraid of
what if I lose my medication.
I want every individual who hasthat opportunity to see the
world to have the confidence tosee the world safely with a
wayward.
Whether that is an individualpaying for us directly, whether
that's a program that's servingthem, whether that's partnering
with domestic insurancecompanies, so you don't even

(58:05):
have to think twice, but youknow that you have that
confidence to go abroad.
The second pillar is that, andagain, I'm an idealistic and I
have these big ideas andaspirations, but I see a future
where any individual leavingtheir home country knows where
to find a doctor, and that'sthrough us.
It can be a person from Colombiagoing to Canada, it can be

(58:28):
somebody from the US going to uhFrance.
I believe that a wayward can bethat tool that no matter where
you are or who you are, when youare away from home, you can
still find a trusted doctor tohelping you get through your
trip and then see the world.

SPEAKER_00 (58:45):
Yeah.
Well, the one thing I would loveto see is that uh recently I was
speaking to a colleague who isum works at a travel agency and
he'd had uh the privilege to goon a um adventure travel trip.
I won't name the company onlybecause it was an unfortunate
incident outside of theircontrol.
They were riding on a local bus.
It was him and his wife who's ateacher, and they went to Costa
Rica for the first time.

(59:06):
And on the very first day, theywere taking local transport with
their group, and her bag wasstolen from above.
And her bag was stolen.
The the bigger issue was hermedication was in her bag.
And so when I saw him, he waslike, and I was like, How was
your trip to Costa Rica?
His first reaction was, uh,unfortunately we ran into some
issues.
I'm like, tell me.
I was I and had that been a suchbecause the the effort they then

(59:26):
went to and they almost had toleave the trip and come back,
but it derailed a seven-day tripfor the first three days they
were trying to figure outanother option for medication
for.
The idea that you could justpull out your phone, speak to
someone at a wayward, and againget a prescription, like the
idea that that that would havebeen a solution for them could
have put their trip right backon track and um would have been
better for the tour operator,better for the travel agency.

(59:49):
So I guess my my vision for thisconversation would be I would
rather have seen him and say,you know, and maybe that didn't
even come up because it's justlike, oh, we got a fun one, we
got one funny story though.
Our bag was stolen, but anyway,it all worked out.
12 hours later, we were back ontrack.
Uh but unfortunately, I thinkmost people listening to this,
they end up in that situationand they're not sure where to
turn.

(01:00:09):
The guy tries to figure out howto get the bag back or trying to
figure out how you get yourprescription.
And it's also a very personalthing, too.
You don't want to necessarilyreveal now to the rest of your
group that you had medication.
What is your medication?
Like it's that's your ownprivate personal medical history
as well.
So I didn't even want to Ididn't even want to ask him that
question.
I'm like, what what medicationdid she need?
It's like that's none of anyoneelse's business.

(01:00:31):
So this is the sort of stuffwhen it comes to healthcare that
is so different and unique.
So, Max, I'm I'm obviously veryexcited for you and the team,
and um, I'm thrilled that we'vegot a chance to beat.
I'm obviously um I love thatyou're a listener to our show
and now have the opportunity tobe on the Travel Trends Podcast.
And I I want to make sure all ofour listeners can follow your
journey as you move to Chicago,build out your team.

(01:00:52):
And I think there's no shortageof companies, and I'll make sure
we put a link in uh to this aswell if you want to schedule an
appointment or book in anopportunity to speak to Max and
the team.
Um, because even after this, Iknow I'm gonna be sending this
episode to several colleaguesand emphatically telling them,
you guys need to look at thisbecause if you get onto this

(01:01:12):
now, there's a big opportunity,big upside for you to do
something great for your uhcustomers that will keep them
coming back.
So yeah, so Max, having had thatendorsement from me, which is uh
very real and genuine, I wouldlove for you to also share the
best ways for our listeners toreach out to you and to look to
partner or collaborate together.

SPEAKER_01 (01:01:31):
Yeah, I appreciate the kind words and that support,
Dan.
And uh it's great to hear yourvoice through my headphones
directly rather than walking onmy morning commute.
But we want to help allindividuals see the world
safely.
We want to help allorganizations differentiate,
improve their economics, andprovide world-class experience.
And you can do that by going toawayword.com, uh, downloading

(01:01:55):
the AwayWord app, or reachingout to me at max at
awayword.com.
I would love to talk to anyoneand everyone, whether you're
part of an organization thatbelieves that you have travelers
that you need to serve, whetheryou're a parent of a student
who's about to study abroad andyou don't want them to leave
home before having a doctor, oryou're just an individual who's

(01:02:15):
passionate about travel andpassionate about helping people
and wants to be part of our teamnow in the future.
Um, again, max at awayward.comwould love to hear from
everyone.
And Dan, it's been a pleasure.
And I really appreciate youtaking the time to share the
thing that most people don'twant to think about when they're
traveling.
They want to think about thatamazing cycling through Vietnam

(01:02:35):
or uh food tour through Italy.
But unfortunately, we want toalso allow you to have those
experiences and not lethealthcare go in the way.

SPEAKER_00 (01:02:43):
Well, it's interesting.
When I was just traveling withmy brother and he was talking
about the fact he's got thiscritical illness and coverage
insurance, and it's just likefor his family, he's got young
kids.
And he was saying to him, itactually gives him the greatest
peace of mind knowing that hehas that in place.
Like if anything were to happen.
And I think that is the samething that I would say to our
listeners, is that, and uh um,is it will enhance your travel

(01:03:04):
experience if you know that ifthis comes up, you it's an issue
that's going to be much moremanageable in the scenario when
you have uh a wayward in yourpocket.
So, Max, uh, I'm glad you'vedecided to join the travel
industry.
Uh, I'm certainly very excitedfor uh the future for a wayward.
Good luck with the move uh andscaling this business.
And I look forward to seeing youat conferences over the course

(01:03:25):
of the year and keeping in touchas things progress.
So thank you again for being apart of this.

SPEAKER_01 (01:03:29):
Thanks for having me, Dan.
Looking forward to it andlooking forward to continuing to
listen to this, but moreimportantly, all future episodes
that you guys put out.

SPEAKER_00 (01:03:35):
Fantastic.
Thank you.
And thanks to all of ourlisteners.
I think this episode wasparticularly special for all the
reasons that I've beenhighlighting throughout.
I think this is the firstconversation we've had on our
podcast, and we've been reallytalking about uh medical care in
destination.
And I'm gonna be interested tosee where we go from here
because I'm sure many of ourlisteners will want us uh to
further focus on this in theseason eight or in 2027.

(01:03:58):
So feel free to reach out to me,Dan at Traveltrendspodcasts.com,
with any feedback on thisepisode specifically, or if it
gave you some ideas for where weshould continue to focus content
on this important topic.
And I really hope for any of youthat are now empowered with this
information to either come upwith a much more successful way
to integrate this into yourcurrent offering, but also just

(01:04:21):
to make sure you're continuingto delight guests and meet them
where they are and make surethat they have amazing uh travel
experiences.
Because the one thing Idefinitely want to do when Max
mentioned that a lot of peopledon't travel because of fear,
there is still a lot asignificant untapped market
potential to get more peopletraveling, and there's something
holding them back, and thismight be one of those things.

(01:04:41):
So um I encourage you to putthat into the consideration set
to say, you know what, this is areason this there's no reason
not to travel when you have thisin uh your pocket as well.
So definitely check outawayward.com, reach out to Max
on LinkedIn, email, and um Ilook forward to uh seeing your
comments.
And then don't forget we do postclips and highlights on all our

(01:05:02):
social channels.
So you can find those onInstagram, LinkedIn, and YouTube
at Travel Trends Podcast.
Thanks again for joining us.
If you're interested in morespotlight episodes, check out
traveltrends.comslashspotlights.
Thanks again to Max and theteam.
And until next time, safetravels.