Photography Business Systems: How to Simplify, Streamline, and Scale with Deb Mitzel

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to Tried and True with the Dash of Woo, where
we blend rock-solid tips with alittle bit of magic.
I'm Renee Bowen, your host,life and business coach and
professional photographer atyour service.
We are all about gettingcreative, diving into your
business and playing withmanifestation every year.
So are you ready to getinspired and have some fun?
Let's dive in.
Hey, hey, welcome back to Triedand True with a dash of woo.

(00:27):
I am Renee Bowen, your host.
Thanks for joining me hereagain.
I have a fantastic guest for youguys today, but before we get
into that, I have a couple ofhousekeeping things and some
reminders for you guys.
First of all, I just want tokind of check in with you guys,
check in with my community.
It has been a really stressful,rough week and I'm not going to

(00:49):
get into specifics of what'sgoing on in the world.
That's not what my podcast isabout.
However, I would be remiss if Ididn't mention a little bit
about the mindset, because I dobelieve that there is a mindset
piece of this and I just kind ofwant to be a reminder for you.
There are very few things thatwe can control in this life Very

(01:12):
few, pretty much the only thingthat we can control are our
actions and our reactions, andpretty much the way that we act
or react is based uponunconscious programming, which
means things that we learnedfrom our past, our past lived
experiences, from the time wewere born until now, and
everyone has their own map ofthe world, their own perspective

(01:34):
, and everybody, everybody,thinks that they are right.
So I just want to remind you ofthat, because getting someone
to change their perspective isnot easy that's not to say it
can't be done, but it's not easy.
And I want to remind you ofthat, because getting someone to
change their perspective is noteasy, that's not to say it
can't be done, but it's not easy.
And I want to remind you toprotect your peace, and I want
to remind you that every singlesocial media platform that we

(01:55):
have access to first of all, wedon't own any of that.
The second of all, every singlealgorithm is based on you using
the platform, and we know for afact the best way to get users
to use a platform is to keepthem in a loop of stress super
high, highs, super low, lows sothey are going to prioritize

(02:16):
content that gets you to reactand stay on the platform.
I'm going to invite you to notparticipate in that because it
is a choice.
You have a choice in how youwant to use your energy.
You can use it to rage bait.
You can use it to bereactionary and continue the
loop of fight or flight contentthat is being put out.

(02:36):
Or you can choose to beproactive in your actions and
you can choose to give yourenergy to other things and other
people.
And you can choose to give yourenergy to other things and
other people.
I know most of us run onlinebusinesses or we need to be a
face of our business online.
You can do that withoutparticipating in the rhetoric If
you find that this is causingyou stress and keeping you in

(02:59):
that cycle of fight or flight,because when you are in that
cycle of fight or flight, whathappens in your brain is that
all the blood rushes from yourbrain down to your arms and legs
to make you fast so you can getaway from the danger, because
that's what your body thinks ishappening.
When you have a stress response,you immediately go into fight
or flight, freeze or fawn.

(03:20):
You go into some sort of actionthat is going to keep you safe
and keep you alive and usuallyit's to run away, get away.
So the blood is not in theconscious part of your brain.
It's not the best time to bemaking decisions.
If you feel any of those signsthat your body is heading into
fight or flight or freeze orfawn any of those stress

(03:41):
responses, and anytime you feellike your nervous system is not
regulated, get offline literallytouch grass, get in nature,
breathe.
Regulate yourself first.
Okay, I want you to prioritizethat really hardcore over the
next couple of months.
And I'm not telling you to notbe an activist.
If that is part of who you areand you feel passionate about

(04:03):
that, that's fine.
I'm not telling you to stopbeing active and to not create
change.
Follow your purpose, butregulate yourself, please,
because you're not going to begood for anybody if you are
literally just in a constantstate of reacting to your
environment, which is prettyvolatile at the moment and, as

(04:25):
always, be very, very careful inwhat you believe online,
because we can be easilycontrolled when we are in a
state of fear and fight orflight.
And when you're regulated andyou're calm and you're centered,
you're much harder to control.
Don't buy into the divisiveness.
It's not our baseline.
You can make change.
You can speak your truthwithout contributing to the

(04:46):
rhetoric of divisiveness.
I truly believe that at theheart of it, we're all connected
.
I just want you to take care ofyourself and your nervous
system, because I've seen whathappens to people when they
don't.
Okay, that's my little mindsetspiel for you.
Also, really quickly, I have alot of AI things and trainings
that are coming soon that I wantto tell you about.

(05:06):
I'm going to put them in theshow notes as well.
If you're a photographer, I amparticipating in the Sync AI
Summit for Photographers.
You can find the link below tojoin us.
It is free to watch live and ifyou want to get the replays and
things like that, then you canupgrade.
This is going to be reallyawesome and specifically geared
toward photographers.
So if you're a photographer andlistening to this, you

(05:29):
absolutely should be watchingthis training.
My presentation is all aboutyour brain on AI, and I am going
to give you a lot of reallygood tips and some prompts as
well, so some out of the boxideas on how you could be using
Chet Shpt in your business.
And then also coming in Octoberis the Her AI Summit, which I
love because it is all aboutwomen in AI and we're very

(05:53):
underrepresented in this field,so I'm very passionate about
that, and my presentation forthat is called Mindset in the
Meta Age, so definitely sign upfor the waitlist for that.
That link is there below foryou as well.
That's going to be really,really amazing to one of the
women who is spearheading it.
She is just an AI powerhouse,so you're going to learn a lot.

(06:13):
There's going to be a lot ofreally great contributions in
that summit.
And then there is one going onright now as well, called the
ease and alignment AI bundle,and I contributed a PDF for that
that you guys are going to love.
So all the information on thoseare below for you guys.
And then, really quick, I dohave a lot of you guys asking me
if I'm going to be offering anyone-on-one training
specifically designed to helpyou build AI systems and

(06:38):
implement AI or anything likethat, basically like a VIP day
AI related, and I am trying toput something together for that
right now.
If you're interested in that,please get in touch and just let
me know that this is somethingthat you would be interested in.
This would be like you and Ispending the whole day together
over Zoom or in person, ifyou're not far from me, and me

(06:59):
coming up with systems for yourbusiness, basically kind of
poking holes in what you haveand then seeing how we can make
AI get your life to be a loteasier and to have things run
smoothly, whether that meansbuilding out custom GPTs with
you, teaching you how to usecustom projects and things like
that for your business.
I love doing that kind of work.

(07:20):
I've been doing it alreadyinside of my one-on-one coaching
containers, where you sign upfor either three or six months
coaching with me, and so if thatis something that is important
to you, we can definitely workwith it inside of a coaching
container as well, and I find itto be way more beneficial just
in general, because we can workon all the pieces of your

(07:41):
business and, again, it's atleast a three-month container.
So if you are interested inone-on-one with me just in
general.
I do have a couple of spots open, so hit that link below.
Book a free call with me.
We're going to chat and see ifwe would be a good fit to work
together and then, if you'reinterested in just like a VIP
day, hit me up on Instagram atRenee Bowen and let me know that
that's something that you wouldfind interesting, because I'd

(08:04):
love to pick your brain a littlebit about some of the things
that you think you'd like andthat will help me tailor that
experience.
So let me know.
And then I just wanted to thankyou guys again for being a part
of the podcast.
It's actually my birthday today, so if you're listening to this
, on Wednesday the 17th, I'mmost likely getting a really
long massage and headed todinner with my husband, so I am

(08:26):
not going to be working, but Ijust wanted to say thank you
guys for being a part of myworld, whether it's here, or on
my Instagram or online.
I know that I haven't met a lotof you in person, but I do
appreciate you being a part ofmy community and helping me and
my little businesses thrive.
So let's talk about Deb.

(08:47):
She's pretty amazing.
I've known Deb for a long time.
She was a photographer for awhile and she has now segued
that business into helpingcreatives get organized and get
their shit together.
Basically, she's one of thosepeople who's just like really
fantastic about pointing outthings that need to be fixed and

(09:10):
coming up with like reallyamazing ideas quickly for the
fix.
She's great with systems andthis was a conversation that
I've been wanting to have withher for a long time.
So we finally made it happenand got her on the show and I
know you guys are going to enjoyit.
Some of you guys might know Debalready, especially if you are
a 17 hats user, because she is a17 hats like pro expert you

(09:36):
name it.
She can help you with it.
So, if just a little side note,if you need some help with that
, it's specifically.
You got to get in touch withDeb and she's got free resources
and things like that.
So, again, check the show notesfor all of the links that you
need and I hope you enjoy mychat with Deb.
Hey, hey, welcome back to Triedand True with a Dash of Woo.
I am your host, renee Bowen, andtoday I have one of my really

(09:59):
good friends and justproductivity extraordinaire, deb
Mitzel, on the show today, andDeb and I have known each other
a long time.
She was a photographer for avery, very long time and that's
how we met, and she has movedinto a different phase of her
business over the last few years.
She's a system strategist,creative ops queen.

(10:22):
Basically, she helps creativebusiness owners and
photographers make theirbusinesses less chaotic before
they hit automate.
She helps small business owners, creative business owners,
photographers, just anyone whoneeds help with that
productivity and systems pieceof their business and
organization.
She's fantastic at helping youget a handle on all of that.

(10:45):
I am consistently impressed byher brain.
She just knows how to makesense of all of this stuff.
And today we're actuallyspeaking about a very specific
topic and one that I haven'treally talked about yet on the
show, and that is about processmapping.
So basically, how to get yourbusiness less chaotic before you

(11:05):
even try and automate things.
So we know that automations arereally, really important, and I
talk about that a lot.
We want to make sure that wehave systems set up for us and
our businesses to make things.
We want to make sure we havethese systems set up to make our
businesses run more smoothly.
But there are some things thatyou need to be doing before you
even get to that piece, andthat's what today's show is

(11:27):
about, so let's just dive in.
Hey, deb, you're one of my goodfriends, so I feel like I just
see you and talk to you all thetime, but thanks for being on
the show today.

Speaker 2 (11:36):
Absolutely.
I'm so excited to be here.
You know I love talking aboutall this stuff, so, yes, I'm
glad this finally worked out forus to get together, I know.

Speaker 1 (11:43):
We've been planning this and trying to plan it
basically for a long time.
So tell everybody how you gotinto this.
You were a photographer formany years but you've always
been really good at this sort ofsystems and productivity and
organization, and so what madeyou want to sort of go into this

(12:03):
part of your business, like theconsulting and helping
photographers and creativesmanage their businesses?

Speaker 2 (12:09):
Well, you know, it's one of the things that I saw
when I was doing photography.
I mean, I was in business for30 years in a completely
unrelated business, but it wasbusiness nonetheless.
And as a side gig when I wasdoing that, I started doing
photography.
So one of the things that I sawwhen I was doing photography
was all these really amazingphotographers that had such
creative talent but didn'tnecessarily have the business

(12:29):
acumen to back it up on thebusiness side.
And so I kind of made thatdecision, probably 10 years ago,
that once I had the time ie Iretired from the day job that I
would actually spend some timeworking with other photographers
and creatives to help themlevel up that business side, so
that they could really get whatyou know from the financial

(12:50):
aspect as well, what they wereworth creatively actually
hitting their bank account.
So that's kind of where thisall started for me.

Speaker 1 (12:58):
Yeah, and I love that .
Well, first of all, you're justlike a natural at so much of
this and I know firsthand too,guys, because like she's also
helped me with pieces.
So I don't just know her likefrom what she does, I also refer
people to her, and she's workedinside of my business a little
bit.
So some people are just reallynaturally drawn to that sort of

(13:20):
thing and I always say, like thefastest way to learn something
is to like study with somebodywho's already done what you want
to do, but also, like sometimesyou just need to hand that
stuff over.
And so Deb is also just reallygood at that.
She can teach you how to do it,but she's going to also just
sort of like take the reins alittle bit too.
So it was a good segue,basically, I think, for you.

(13:40):
I think that this is like whatyou're meant to be doing.

Speaker 2 (13:44):
Well, and I feel that way too.
One of the gifts that I thinkI've always had is the ability
to see kind of the high level ofwhat's going on inside of a
business or just in general.
I always see kind of that bigpicture, but I can also then
drill it down into how did youget from point A to point B and
what does that mean?
And so I think that's what'sbeen really helpful for me being

(14:05):
able to come inside of otherpeople's businesses and actually
figure out what they're doingas it relates to what they want
to do, because sometimes youknow you get so stuck.
What is that saying?
You can't see the forest forthe trees, right?
You're so stuck in the treesthat you can't see the bigger
picture, and that sometimesderails you a little bit.

Speaker 1 (14:30):
Yeah for sure.
So we're going to talk a lotabout these automations and
systems and processes and thingslike that to make sure that
your business is running moresmoothly and you're making more
money and you're having moretime to actually live your life.
But really, kind of what we'regoing to get to is this process
mapping, and a lot of people maynot have even heard that term
before, because it's kind ofwhat you have to do before you
got to do what you got to do.
And so if anyone is out therenot knowing what that is, what

(14:53):
actually is process mapping?

Speaker 2 (14:57):
Well, I think very simply stated is it is what do
you do like from A to Z in yourbusiness, whether you're looking
at the client journey andaccounting process.
It's the processes.
We've heard of SOPs or standardoperating procedures, but, very
simply, it's just what do youdo?
When do you do it?
What's involved and oftentimesin our businesses it's talking

(15:19):
about the client journey, fromthe time they come in our
businesses as a lead to the timewe ask for a review, maybe on
the backside or following upyear to year, whatever that
looks like.
But very simply, it's just whatdo you do and how do you do it.

Speaker 1 (15:32):
Yeah.
So a lot of people have probablyused this.
I mean, there's a lot of wordsthat we can use for this right,
like workflow or, you know, likeyou said, client journey, which
is a really big piece of it,because what I have seen inside
of my coaching as well is thatmany, many photographers and
just creative business owners ingeneral you sort of just fall

(15:56):
into it.
Even if you do make an actualdecision, like, yeah, this is
what I want to do, these littlepieces are very easy to skip
over or just not even notice,like not be intentional about,
like what am I actually doing,like you said.
So that's kind of what I wantyou guys to who are listening to
, like think about it's thisfoundational piece that a lot of

(16:19):
people tend to skip over, andit's also why your systems, when
you do start implementingsystems, they don't actually
really stick because you didn'tdo the foundational work that
we're going to kind of betalking about here.
So kind of walk us through likethat first piece of it in your
opinion for a photographer,let's say because you know most

(16:40):
of my listeners arephotographers, but let's say
we're talking about a portraitphotographer here and mainly
either families or seniors orsomething like that, or they
maybe could do weddingphotography as well.
But what are some of the firstthings that we need to be
thinking about in terms of like,okay, what is my process in the
first place?
Like, how am I doing what I'mdoing?

(17:00):
Because a lot of us just kindof run by the seat of our pants.

Speaker 2 (17:04):
Yeah, that's, that's so true, and I think for most
people starting out, that'salmost the way it has to be.
You know, one of the thingsthat I talk a lot about is the
messy.
You know, I have people who Italk to about working in their
business and things they want toaccomplish and they're like, oh
, I really want to get itcleaned up before I let you in.
It's like, no, the messy ispart of what got you to where

(17:25):
you are.
But the messy is what helps youlearn about what it is you're
doing, what you should be doing,and how to kind of dial that in
and make it into a consistentprocess.
So you know that is part of it.
You know you just have to getout there, start doing the work
and figure out what's working,but then pretty quickly you
realize that you need to putsome consistency into the

(17:47):
process, and one of the mainreasons I talk about that and
that I think it's so importantis because we're all looking for
referrals.
I mean, at the end of the day,if you're in business to make
money and to keep growing, youneed referrals, not only just
throwing advertising out there,but you need referrals.
And so the example I alwaysgive is what if you've got you
know one person that you did afantastic job for as a client?

(18:09):
They loved you, everythingabout the way you handled the
process was fabulous, and thenthey referred them to one of
their friends.
Then that friend comes in andthey end up with a different
process, like they have adifferent experience because
what you did for client A didn'tnecessarily also happen for
client B.
Well, in my opinion, that's thefastest way to shoot yourself

(18:30):
in the butt.
So that's one of my argumentsfor why processes are so
important.
If you want to get thatconsistent client experience,
you want to get those repeatsand referrals and know that
every client is gettingeverything every time.
Let's say you give a welcomegift, say you're a senior
photographer, you give a welcomegift, that's really cool and
the client loves it and talksabout it, but then you forget to

(18:53):
do it on the next one.
What does that do for yourreputation as a business owner?
So at the end of the day, itall comes down to that and
having that consistency.
So I think what it really boilsdown to when you ask about you
know where do you start, what doyou do?
Step back and look at what itis you're doing.
I think the most importantthing to start off is to look at

(19:15):
that client inquiry process,the front end of the process.
You know, if we don't handlethat correctly on the front end,
it doesn't really matter whathappens after that.
So I would start there get someconsistency in not only
responding to people butresponding in a timely manner,
responding with good and validinformation that the client
wants to know.

(19:36):
That's why I'm such a huge fanof automation.
I think even if you just startedby automating the inquiry
process, you know, because we'veall been on those websites
where you know there's a contactme form or whatever it says,
but you press the button, yougive them your name, you give
them your email address, maybeyour phone number, and then you
get that standard reply thatsays thanks for your inquiry,
we'll get back to you in 24 to48 hours.

(19:57):
Back to you in 24 to 48 hours.
Well, I was excited, like I wason your website.
I was excited right now.
I wanted a little more than the24 to 48 hours response.
So a simple thing that we cando is just send an email right
then and there, instead of that24 to 48 hours.
Just give a little more details.
You know, if they said they'reinterested in a senior session,
tell them what that looks like.

(20:18):
You know, this is what a seniorsession looks like with me.
Here's a couple links to mywebsite that maybe you haven't
checked out.
If this sounds like what you'reinterested in, let's take the
next step and then you lay outwhat that next step is.
But I think that's the realplace to start and then
continued on the path of whatdoes the booking process look
like?
What is actually, you know?
Is there a pre-sessionconsultation, for example, if

(20:39):
you're a photographer?
That's pretty standard.
What does that look like?
What?
What is actually you know?
Is there a pre-sessionconsultation, for example, if
you're a photographer?
That's pretty standard.
What's the session look like?
What is after the session?
Look If it's an IPS session,just all those things.
Just start dialing it in one byone and you know, and pretty
soon you'll have the wholeprocess dialed in.

Speaker 1 (20:56):
Yeah, that's really good advice because I think I
just saw something just recentlytoo.
I just wanted to touch on thatwhole getting back to people
right away.
I mean, I'm a really bigbeliever in this.
I have been for a long time butI think that more and more
we're so used to this instantgratification.
Just in general, we're used togetting answers pretty much

(21:17):
right away.
So if you don't have somethingset up to where they are getting
something, like you said,they're excited, they've reached
out to you and they're notgetting anything back from you,
they're going to probably moveon to somebody else.
But the other day I saw it was aTikTok and it was about a woman
who was trying to find a familyphotographer in San Francisco

(21:38):
and she swears.
I find this so hard to believe,but she said that she contacted
multiple photographers.
I mean we're talking likeprobably.
She said like eight to 10, Ithink Not only could she not get
information like she neverheard from a lot of them, like
no follow-ups.
Look, sometimes our emails aregoing to hit spam, especially if

(22:01):
you do have automations andmaybe links and stuff built into
it, but no follow-ups, no textfollow-up, no email follow-up,
nothing.
And she was like do people justnot want to get booked?
And I was like my mouth wasjust my jaw was just dropped,
because I hear fromphotographers on the daily about
how they just want clients andthey want to get booked and they

(22:23):
want to be in business.
And I'm like okay, first stepis that you guys actually have
to respond to the peoplereaching out to you.
So I know that you are a hugeadvocate for 17 Hats.
You are one of their partnersand you've been using it for a
really long time.
So we are going to talk a littlebit about CRMs today here and
we'll definitely touch on 17Hats because it is your

(22:46):
wheelhouse, but there's a lot ofCRMs out there, so, and there's
a lot of platforms you can use.
So I don't want to make thisspecifically about 17 Hats, but
I know that this is a big pieceof you know as photographers and
what we do.
We got to have something set upso that it's happening for you
and you're not having to do it,because if you're listening to

(23:08):
this and you're like, well, Ican't possibly get back to
people right away, well, that'swhat a CRM is for.
So what do you think?
And we're not going to get intothe nitty gritty.
I don't think of exactly whatshould be in that per se,
because this is going to dependa lot on how you want to run
your business, what kind ofbusiness you're running.

(23:28):
All of those pieces reallymatter.
Do you want to get people on aphone right away?
Do you want to follow up with aphone call?
These are all things that youhave to take into consideration,
just as the business owner.
But, like as a whole, that30,000 foot view, how easy is it
to set that, that automation up, though?
You know what I mean.
Like, that's kind of what Iwant to start with.

Speaker 2 (23:48):
Yeah, and it's super easy.
I mean very simply stated youcould do this, as you mentioned,
with any number of tools.
I happen to love 17 hats.
I've used it since 2015.
I mentioned at the top of thecall that you know I had a
former life.
I was in the car business for30 years and I was doing
photography on the side withthat.
I had a high-level position inthat organization, so it was

(24:09):
kind of a 24-7 job.
I mean, I was at the top and itrequired a lot of my time and I
knew going in granted, I hadseen in that world CRMs and
platforms that worked, so Ialready knew they existed before
I ever started doingphotography.
Once I started doingphotography, I was also, you
know, probably because of mybusiness experience, but I had

(24:31):
the foresight or whatever toactually think about the fact
that I need to make sure I canhandle these people properly,
because I'm big on customerservice and I knew that there's
no way, given my day job, that Iwould be able to handle
everything without having somesort of system.
So you know, 17 hats there's aton of them out there but you
can do this with something assimple as you know, google, I

(24:54):
think you know you could tieyour Gmail to Zapier and there's
so many tools out there.
If you get crafty and you justwant to band-aid a bunch of
stuff together and make it work,you can find a way to do it.
But even if nothing else, youget a more specific email going
out that just doesn't say thanksfor inquiring.
I'll get back to you in 24 to48.

(25:15):
If you just get something alittle more specific to what the
client is actually interestedright out of the gate whether
you send it manually or you useautomation to send it for you
within a quick period of timethat is going to make a huge
difference.
I mean massive difference, andthe big part of that is, you
know whether it's again 17 hatsor something else.
Just actually putting that intoplace will be huge just to get

(25:40):
people moving forward andgetting them a response in a
timely manner.
The real key point there isthat you can put a system
together with any of the toolsyou already have If you want to
level up and you want to infusesome automation and a little
more time savings.
That is where the key is.
I guess the thing I was reallygoing to point out is that what

(26:03):
happens in so many people'slives, and I know this from a
photography standpointspecifically.
You know, I'm in the Midwest.
So when I was doing photography, I had a shooting season and I
did high school seniorsprimarily, so we were shooting
outside.
Our season was June to October,so you've got a six month
window if I did my math right.
I'm not sure about that, butyou've got a very short window

(26:24):
to shoot.
And so what happens is, you know, from March through May you're
worried about booking clients.
You've got all the time in theworld, so to speak, to give
those clients attention on thefront end when they are
inquiring.
Then what happens when youstart to get into June and July,
when you're really busy?
Well, people haven't thoughtahead that if they want to book

(26:45):
an October session, you know itwould have been great to do that
in May, for example, when youhad time.
Well, now what happens whenyou're in the heart of the busy
season and you're out shootingevery evening and you're calling
and editing during the day andyou forget or miss an email or
whatever happens, and you don'trespond to that client who wants
to book October when you stillhave some availability?
Without a system in place again.

(27:07):
You're kind of shootingyourself in the foot.

Speaker 1 (27:09):
Yeah, big time.
No, that's a really good point.
And I call that the feast orfamine cycle all the time, like
that's so common.
I mean not even just forseasonal, like I can shoot year
round, but it happens here inthose climates as well.
Like, even if you are able toshoot, like you just kind of get
into these rhythms and systemsof like seasons of busyness and

(27:29):
if you don't have anything setup before that, it really is a
hard thing to get a handle onwhen you are in the thick of
your business.
But I wanted to ask you reallyquickly because this is
something that comes up a lot inmy coaching.
People will ask me when is theright time to get a CRM?
So if someone is starting outor maybe they don't have clients

(27:52):
yet, maybe they're building thefoundations of their business
when do you know the time isright to actually invest in a
system?

Speaker 2 (27:59):
One of the things that I found is super common is
that when people are at thatpoint when they say I am too
busy to take on more clientsthat's a really key phrase I
hear a lot or just that they'reso disorganized they feel like
they can't keep up with the onesthey have.
So I mean ideally, in a perfectworld, I would say you decide
you're going to start a business, think about what you're going

(28:20):
to do and set it up.
But that's not realistic formost people.
I mean most people, like I saidearlier, need to get into the
fray of things and kind of get afeel for what they're doing,
how they're doing it, before itreally makes sense anyway,
because on the front end youdon't know enough about what
your business might look likebecause it's still fresh.
So I think any time is a goodtime, but I will say you have to

(28:41):
be willing and understand thatyou're going to have to invest
some time.
You know I help a lot of peopleset up their systems.
If you're my client, I can't doit without you, because I'm a
big believer in setting up asystem that actually works the
way you do business, because Imight come in and go.
Okay, I was a photographer,this is how I handled it, but if
that's not the way you run yourbusiness, you're not going to

(29:01):
use it.
It's not going to have thepayoff and the return that
you're looking for.
So ideally, I would say anytime is a good time, but make
sure it's a time that you setthe time aside to work with the
person who's helping you to doit.

Speaker 1 (29:16):
Yeah, that makes really good sense because if
you're hiring somebody like meor you, you know what I mean.
Like if you're hiring someoneto help you with your business,
like you're serious about it,you know what I mean, like you
are taking it serious and I'm abig believer in putting it out
there as well, right, like somaking that statement to the
universe and to yourself, likeI'm doing it, and holding
yourself accountable to it.

(29:36):
So there's a lot to say forthat.
I realize it's an investment ofmoney, but if you are serious
about sort of building it in avery strong way and building a
good, strong foundation, thenthat is, I believe, a very
important piece of it for a lotof different reasons.
I remember when I first startedout, I used a couple of

(29:58):
different systems before I'm I'mwith Tave, but I used a couple
of different ones before thatand I never really took the time
to really figure out what thosesystems did from the beginning,
you know, and so it ended upbeing super messy and that's
kind of what I like to try andsave people from, if I can.

(30:18):
Like, yeah, you kind of got toget in there and do stuff, like
you said, but kind of got to getin there and do stuff, like you
said.
But like, if you're in thereand you don't understand the
things and you're like I don'tknow, like I don't have 72 hours
to sit in front of thiscomputer and like get it set up,
that's when you do seeksomebody out, like Deb, who can
help you make sense of it.
But because it's so importantto have like this process

(30:41):
mapping in place first, that'skind of what I want to like make
sure we're touching on Like howdo you even it could be as
simple as a Google Doc, rightLike just have people write down
, like what do you do?
Like all the steps, what aresome of those major steps that
they need to be paying attentionto and actually recording,
either on a Google Doc or avideo or whatever?

Speaker 2 (31:02):
You know and I have a little freebie that we'll talk
about later for your audiencebut one of the biggest things is
just to actually sit back andgo OK, when a client inquires, I
mean so, start there, becausethat's, I mean, the first step.
Right, but you do this forevery step of your business.
But what happens?
Like, ok, somebody inquiresFirst of all, how are they doing
it?
Is it on your website?
Is it on Instagram?
Is it, you know, via textmessage?

(31:23):
Thinking about all the waysthat people inquire with you,
then what do you do?
Like, what is your next step?
Are you emailing them something?
Are you calling them on thephone?
Whatever, you know, what doesyour process look like?
So I would say, basically,start with it could be a yellow
legal pad.
I mean, you can take itcompletely back to basics and
just like step one through 10.
What do I do?
But keep in mind, as you'redoing that, what is my process.

(31:45):
So how do I respond to theclient?
You know, is it via an email?
Okay, what does that email looklike?
Even if you do nothing else,from an automation or system
standpoint, but you determinewhat that initial email looks
like.
Create a template, just createa template in your Gmail and set
that up so that you can go findthat when somebody inquires, to
save yourself that time ofreinventing the wheel every

(32:08):
single time, you're responding.
Because, again, that's wheresome of that consistency in the
client's eyes comes from too.
It's like if you respond toeverybody in the same way,
generally speaking, that's goingto serve you well in the long
run.
So, thinking about that, okay,if somebody inquires, what do I
want to do?
How am I responding?
What does that communicationlook like?
If it's email text, whatever,or phone call, then what?

(32:29):
What's the timing?
You know, if they inquired andI responded and I didn't hear
back from them, so let's saythat initial response usually
will have some sort of a call toaction.
What do I want them to do?
You know it's a matter of kindof what does this all look like?
They inquired, I responded.
What did I ask them to do?
Did they do it?
Just thinking about it in thatkind of sequencing, you might

(32:52):
want to then say, ok, I sent afollow up, but I haven't heard
back from them.
Ok, how long is it that I wantto wait before I reach out again
and say, hey, I sent you theinformation.
I want to make sure you got it.
You know, whatever, is thatthree days?
Is that two days?
Is that one day?
Is it a week?
What does that look like foryou and your business?
But just taking that approach,through the entire sequence of

(33:13):
your client's journey throughyour business, yeah, okay,
that's a good point.

Speaker 1 (33:17):
So I really really hope that you take the action of
doing that after listening tothis episode, because it can be
simple, like she said, likewhether you are just writing it
on paper, making a Google doc Imean, heck, if you're a verbal

(33:38):
processor and writing is, likeyou know, pulling eyelashes out
just open Zoom and record itlike talk into Zoom and then run
that through AI or atranscription service, because
we have tools now that we canuse to make that process easier.
But the whole point is that youare not just mapping out the way

(33:58):
that you actually do things now, but the way you want to do
things as well, because in thatprocess you might kind of like
look at it and say, hmm, I thinkI could tighten that up a
little bit, like I would rather,instead of having two emails go
out, maybe three, maybe myfollow-up needs to be a
different type of follow-up.
A lot of this is going to beexperimental as well, because

(34:23):
you kind of have to test it out,see what's working, get the
feedback, and there's no failure, it's just feedback.
So if you put something intopractice and it's not working,
you can change that, and I knowthat you've worked with people
like that one-on-one as well, soI'd like to know first of all,
just kind of like a little bitof a case study maybe, if you

(34:44):
have one, of where someone camein and and how, how they were
able to shift things into beingmore efficient in a very simple
way, and also maybe testing it,and how the revision was not as
hard as they maybe thought itwas gonna be, but it was
necessary, you know.

Speaker 2 (35:01):
That's a good point, and there are so many people
that are, you know, afraid totake that step, because change
is hard and I totally get it.
And the case study I'm gonnatalk about is somebody that you
and I both know, somebody who isa photographer and had her
entire business manually, youknow, between spreadsheets and
Google Docs and those sorts ofthings, and, you know, knew she
needed to change that.

(35:23):
She needed to in order to growher business.
She needed to make a changebecause the admin was sucking
her time too much.
So, you know, basically westarted out and I sat down with
her, and when people work withme, I have a process that I go
through where I ask them to kindof brain dump for me what their
process looks like.
You know, and I have enoughbackground in not only business

(35:43):
but photography in this casethat I can look at it and go,
okay, have you thought aboutdoing things this way or what
about us doing that?
But the bottom line is, youknow, we kind of went through
and said, okay, what's yourprocess?
Dialed it in, set it up andfrom the inquiries to the
bookings, because the onlinescheduling she's somebody that I
set up with 17 hats.
But again, there's lots ofoptions for you to do this stuff

(36:04):
.
We got to the point where herclients were going online,
choosing the date for theirsession, making the payment
right then and there, and then,if there was a consultation that
needed to be, we then sent anemail that said, hey, now you
need to choose a date for yourconsultation.
Let's choose the date for yourin-person sales session.
All of that stuff is handled bythe system with very minimal

(36:27):
interaction from her, and theinvoicing, the quotes, all the
things that you need as aphotographer to make sure you've
dialed in in your business, arehappening without you having to
touch all these things.
So we got it all set up.
And then you know, on the backend, we've also got it set so
that you know she's sendingthank yous and reminders for

(36:48):
appointments and all the thingsand actually asking for that
Google review, which we alwaysforget to do if we don't have it
as part of our process.
So you know we set that wholeprocess up and it was a give and
take.
You know we had conversations,we had a couple hops on Zoom
calls together to talk throughit.
I have some Google Docs that Ihave my clients fill out.
But at the end of the day Imean, she's raved so many times
she's like I can't believe howmuch time you've saved me.

(37:10):
You know and that's it's not me, it's the system I was able to
take what she was doing manually, put it into a system that will
do so much of that for her, andthen she only needs to touch
the really important stuff.
You know, so many people areafraid of automation that it's
impersonal.
You know how many times have weheard that?
Right, it's like, oh, I can'tdo that because it's not going

(37:31):
to sound like me or whatever.
Well, I get that to a degree,but you take this entire string
of your client journey and lookat which pieces of that are
crucial for your touch, if youwill, and your personalization.
Spend your time there and let asystem or an automation handle

(37:51):
the stuff that you don't need totouch.
Give yourself a break.
Live life, Use the tool.

Speaker 1 (37:58):
Yeah, because it's the running joke, I guess, right
, and especially in thephotography world.
It's like oh, I signed up to bea photographer, not an admin
person, a social media person, ablogger, blah, blah, blah.
But basically you're signing upfor that because you're running
a business and you need to knowhow to run your business, but

(38:21):
what happens is too manyphotographers, they stay stuck
in manual mode, basically, likeyou said, sort of like doing
everything with spreadsheets andthings, and they kind of get
stuck there because they do getbusy and they realize like, okay
, I just have to kind of keepgoing, I have to keep going and
before they know it, they'vejust got all of these like
spreadsheets and various placesand it's there but it's not

(38:43):
organized, and so they'reworking in their business way
too much and they're not gettingmore clients on repeat
automatically without themactually having to do it, and
they're not getting more clientson repeat automatically without
them actually having to do itand they're not living their
life, which is really kind ofthe whole point of what we do.
Right, like we, we want to bean entrepreneur or a
photographer, run our owncreative business because of the

(39:04):
freedom that it entices us with, but at the end of the day,
you're not free if you're tiedto these processes in a way that
feels super clunky and takes upall your time, because time is
money.
I'm sorry, but the cost of theCRM, no matter which one we're
talking about any CRM is farmore economical and a better

(39:27):
financial decision, I think, inthe as opposed to, like, let's
say, hiring an actual assistantto do this work for you.
So before you even think abouthiring somebody to, you know, be
a VA, let's say and do some ofthese things for you.
This is a thing you need first,I think.
And if you don't have time,like if you're already busy,

(39:49):
you're already shooting, you'vealready got clients and you
don't have, like I said in thebeginning, time to like sit down
and figure this out by yourself, that's when you do hire
somebody like Deb, who can walkyou through this process and
either take the reins a littlebit or show you how to do it, or
both.
And I think it really doesdepend on the person as well.
It depends on how good you areright, because I'm sure you
worked with some people who arelike okay, just here's all the

(40:11):
things, and they give you allthe information and they tell
you what they want it to looklike, but then you end up having
to sort of like, put some stuffin place for them.
And then there's also peoplewho are like, okay, I need to
know, I need to see what you'redoing.
So I think that it's just supervaluable for people to
understand first, have theself-awareness to know what you

(40:32):
want and how you work, and thenget all of that stuff mapped out
, whether it's on paper, a doc,a video.
Get it all and Deb has.
If you're going to work withsomebody like Deb, like she said
, she's going to make you dothat anyway.

Speaker 2 (40:49):
Well, it's critical.
If you want a good end product,you have to do that work.
You know, and you were talkingabout the ways to do it and you
mentioned AI just a little bit.
But another thing is, even youknow, just talking to AI, just
you know, using the voicefeature on AI in ChatGPT and
just tell it what you do andhave it summarize it.
You know, even that directthing, just talking to it is
amazing.
Even that direct thing, justtalking to it is amazing.

(41:09):
One other thing I was going tomention from what you said is
you mentioned the possibility ofhiring a VA and those things,
which I agree.
I think starting with a CRM orsomething like that is the best
place to start and then youmight go to a VA of sorts.
But whether you start with aCRM, start with a VA or whatever
the situation is, you stillneed to know your processes.
The situation is you still needto know your processes Because

(41:32):
if you go to try to hire a VAand you haven't taken the time
to step back and know what it isyou need, how you need it done,
what the timing is, all thethings we just talked about,
hiring a VA will just waste youmoney because that person
doesn't know what to do, becauseyou haven't gotten enough
clarity in your own process tobe able to help them.
So again, it kind of doesn'tmatter which of those paths you

(41:54):
start down.
You still have to back up anddo the work.

Speaker 1 (41:57):
Yep, that's a really big, important piece.
I have so many people who talkabout that and they're like, oh
my God, they're just so stressedbecause they have work and they
have stuff coming in, but theyhaven't done this process
mapping, they haven't beenintentional about the steps of
their business or actually howthey want it to look.
Because a lot of times when youdo this process you realize

(42:19):
it's not really how I want it tolook in the next year to three
years.
So it's important to allowyourself to kind of dream up a
little bit of like okay, in aperfect world, this is kind of
like how I actually want it torun, but like they haven't done
that.
And so then they have thatroadblock of like well, I'm not
going to pay for somebody thatI'm not going to be able to use,

(42:41):
and so start a little bitbefore you're ready.
Like honestly, like don't,don't let it get.
If you can, if you can, don'tlet it get to that point where
you are constantly overwhelmedand stressed.
Pay attention to oh, okay, Ithink my business is moving into
a different place now.
Like I'm ready to scale or I'mready to change things up, or

(43:05):
you want more clients, like yousaid before, if you're like, oh
my God, I literally can't takeany more clients on, then that's
a sign that we need to to lookat some inner workings, because
chances are there's room, butyou have to make the room.
And so I do want to touch onreally quickly, because you are
such an expert with 17 hats,it's one of those systems that

(43:28):
is very intuitive, and so one ofthe questions I have is, let's
say we've got a workflow, thatwe're setting up this first
inquiry right, just kind ofstarting at the basics, is it
possible, within 17 hats andprobably most CRMs, but that's
the one you know the most tohave it do different things
triggered by different events?
That's one of the main things Ihear from people is like, well,

(43:49):
yeah, I can set up automations,but like what if somebody does
get back to me?
Or like this person ends up,you know, asking a question?
I don't want to then sendanother email that looks like I
didn't get it Right.
So like, for people who haven'tworked inside of systems like
this, is that possible and whatdoes that kind of look like?
Basically, yeah, absolutely.

Speaker 2 (44:09):
And again, it's one of those things that you kind of
have to first of all think ofwhat does my business look like
and what are those triggerpoints, like what's important
and when do things happen?
What's what's happening before?
That leads to the next thing.
But using that inquiry example.
So, for example, you know mostpeople are going to, let's say,
they go to your website, they'regoing to fill out the form
saying they're interested in.
Well, first of all, you canhave options.

(44:31):
So if you're a portraitphotographer who is working with
high school seniors, familiesand headshots, you can ask them
which of those three they'reinquiring about and give them a
different response for each ofthose, which I think is the
first point of that argumentagainst the oh.
Automation is impersonal,because right then, from the

(44:53):
start, you're giving them theopportunity to tell you what
they specifically are interestedin that you offer, and then you
can customize your responsebased on whatever those things
were.
So let's say they said theywere interested in senior
photography versus the otherthings you offer.
You can customize that initialemail to be specifically about
their inquiry about seniorphotography.
You can, you know, give theminformation, as I mentioned

(45:15):
earlier, and then you can havethat call to action.
Whatever that is for yourbusiness.
What is the next thing you wantto have them do?
In most cases, I think it isasking them to book a phone call
.
Some cases it may be.
Let's say, you're a weddingphotographer, maybe you need
them to fill out a questionnaire, maybe there's a little more
information you want to knowabout their event, the date,
whatever that looks like.
So you could send them aquestionnaire or you could ask

(45:36):
them to book a call and a numberof other things, but those are
the two most common ones in thatscenario.
And so in the case of that call, so we're going to give them a
link to book the call.
If they go book the call, thenyou can tell the system once
they book the call, start aworkflow.
So that will then be so.
I went and booked my call.
Maybe a day later or three dayslater or whatever.

(45:57):
I want to send them aparticular email of some sort
leading up to the call.
You know in advance of the call.
This is what we're going totalk about.
Whatever that looks like, youcan trigger that based on
scheduling.
Similarly, you can do that withyou know the calls themselves.
So, like you could set up aworkflow to say, after the call
date, you know, send a thank you, send a follow up.
If it's if you're doingconsulting or coaching and you

(46:19):
need to send like a recap of aphone call, you can have that
automatically pop up to tell youto do it.
But you can also do other thingsbased on, for example, somebody
paying an invoice.
If you need something to happenafter they pay the invoice, you
can tell the system thisinvoice is considered complete
when it's paid or the firstpayment is made or whatever that

(46:41):
looks like, and then that canlet the next piece of the
workflow start.
So you can key a lot of stuffoff of contracts, questionnaires
, invoices, those thingshappening.
You know you can tell anautomation to happen immediately
once that happens.
So you do have some flexibility.
Is it 100% like everything youwant it to be?

(47:02):
Probably not.
But the gap between where youare now if you're not using
something and where you can getwith a CRM system is like huge.

Speaker 1 (47:13):
Yeah, for sure, and I like the fact that you can get
so like specific and kind ofyeah, it might like your brain
hurt a little bit trying tothink about like okay, if this
happens, then this happens, andyou know.
But once you kind of get inthere and you start working with
it, it gets a lot easier.
It's just like anything else.
You know it's going to feeloverwhelming and too much for a

(47:36):
creative brain who has a hardtime focusing on stuff like that
, because most creatives aren'tnecessarily super excited about
this piece of their business,which is another reason why you
know why you might want to lookinto chatting with Deb about
that.
But just in general, it's not apreferred task.
Let's just be honest, right.

Speaker 2 (47:58):
Well, you're a photographer because you like
taking photos.
That's what it comes down to.

Speaker 1 (48:03):
Yeah, exactly.
So the point that I guess I'mtrying to make here is that you
got to get it done.
Honestly, at the end of the day, it really isn't like a nice to
have.
I really believe it's a musthave in your business, and I
know you believe that too.
Otherwise you wouldn't be doingwhat you do and so find a way
to make that happen, whetherit's figuring it out, whether

(48:25):
it's, you know, setting it up onthe back end but at least start
.
You have not done this.
At least start with.
What exactly am I doing here?
What are the pieces of mysystem?
What is each step?
And I know that you've gotsomething.
You mentioned it a little bitearlier.
You have a freebie for people.
Will that help them in thisprocess as well?

Speaker 2 (48:46):
Yeah, and it's called the CRM Star kit.
But it's really if any of thisis resonating with you, even if
you're not right now someorganizational tools for your
business in general, talkingabout things like naming

(49:14):
conventions.
So, no matter what you do, evenif you're dealing with Google
Drive and Explorer and filenames, email sorting and
whatever if you just have someconsistent ways that you
organize those things inside ofyour business and I often
recommend that you do that basedon revenue streams.
So when I say revenue stream,if you're a photographer, again,
and you're doing seniors,branding and families, each one

(49:37):
of those three is what I wouldcall a revenue stream.
So organize your things basedon revenue stream.
So, if it's an email thatrelates to that revenue stream,
it's a template that you've gotjust sitting in your, you know,
gmail folders.
Organize that folder name sothat it matches with all where
all the files are, stayconsistent across the board.
So it's going to talk about thata little bit.
It's also going to give you astart to that workflow process

(49:59):
or to that process mapping,where it says okay, here's a
little sheet that's going togive you a couple prompts to
walk through and start to thinkabout.
What does my process look likeso, and along with that, I give
a little surrounding informationabout why you would do that.
Okay, and again, it's going tobe valuable whether you're in
the process of starting a CRM,have a CRM or haven't even

(50:19):
thought about a CRM, it's a.
I would download it, check itout, because it'll give you some
information that maybe youhaven't thought of before.

Speaker 1 (50:25):
Okay, so that's a good place for people to start
to dig in, like you said, butthen I think you also have
something else that's actually alittle bit meatier for people
to actually kind of like diginto specifics of their business
.
Tell me a little bit about that.
It's like a mapping service,basically correct.

Speaker 2 (50:44):
Yeah, it is, and that's something that I do, like
I said, so often in a smallerform with my clients as I'm
working and building otherworkflows, workflows and seeing
the CRM.
But it's called a smallbusiness process mapping session
and the gist of it is thatwe'll spend a couple hours on
the phone together talkingthrough whatever segment of your
business it is that you'reconcerned about.

(51:05):
Maybe it's your generaloverflow, the client journey in
general, so maybe we stay alittle higher level and get the
details ironed out.
Or maybe we're honing in on thein-person sales session, for
example, and we want to reallydig deep on that.
So, whatever that looks like,whatever you need the help with,
we'll spend a couple hours on aZoom call talking through all

(51:25):
the pieces of that process.
What do you do?
When do you do it?
Are there documents involved?
Are there appointments involved?
How are you scheduling them?
And kind of nailing that wholeprocess down and at the end of
it, what I do is I willsummarize and give you either a
visual and or written summation,if you will, of what we talked

(51:47):
about, along with guidance onwhat your next steps might be,
maybe how you implement thethings we've talked about.
So it's an informationgathering session first of all.
Then I step back a little bitand kind of review the process.
I might have a couple questionsfor people throughout the
process, you know, as I'mreviewing, but the idea is that
you walk away with a documentand or a visual.

(52:09):
A lot of people like to see,like a mirror board, some sort
of a visual flow of what theirprocess looks like, and so
you'll walk away with that.
So whether, then, that leads toyou setting up a CRM system,
because that's kind of a goodfirst step, or you're looking to
hire that VA, like we talkedabout, you're going to have
something that you can then takeand start to run with.

(52:31):
So, whether that's the firstpart of working with somebody
like me to get it dialed in, orsomething you do on your own, or
a combination, it's a reallygood way to start to really dial
in what your business lookslike and start to see things
that maybe you don't see.
You know you touched on it alittle bit just the way you

(52:52):
might want your business to run.
The other side of it is whenyou start looking at what you
are doing, you're like, wow,that's kind of a roadblock for
my customers.
You know, maybe I'm shootingmyself here.
This isn't the best way to doit.
It's a barrier to entry for myclients.
The best way to do it.
It's a barrier to entry for myclients.
One thing about working withsomebody like me, just as you're

(53:14):
talking through, that is, anoutside perspective is always
really helpful and I've workedwith enough people now that you
know I will often say tell mewhy you do it that way.
Have you considered this?
You know, and just having thatoutside perspective sometimes
leads us to a better end resultthan we would have on our own.

Speaker 1 (53:30):
Yeah, that's a great point, Okay.
So I'm going to link that aswell, yeah, and I think that
you're giving people some moneyoff as well with the code, so
I'm going to put all of thatinformation there too.
So if you're like ready foranother step, if you're further
along in your business andyou're ready for that, then
that'll be in the show notes foryou as well.
And then, before we wrap up, Ijust kind of want to.

(53:51):
I just want to touch on realquick.
We we talked about it for asecond.
But you know, creatives, like Isaid, typically think of
themselves.
I'm not calling them out rightnow.
I'm one of them.
We we sort of like labelourselves.
As you know, I'm just notreally organized or I'm not good
at that.
Like, my thing was oh, I'm justnot really good at math.

(54:13):
Well, because that was becausein sixth grade I had a nun who
used to like beat the crap outof me because I didn't
understand what she was talkingabout, and so for the rest of my
educational existence Ibelieved that I wasn't good in
math, but it really was justbecause I wasn't taught properly
.
So most of us have some sort ofprogramming, let's just say, or
belief, and it becomes a beliefthat we're not good at this.

(54:35):
You know like, oh, I'm not goodat that.
So what do you want to tellpeople about that kind of
mindset, and you know just whatyour perspective is on that.

Speaker 2 (54:46):
Basically, yeah, one of the first things that comes
to mind is it's a bit of aself-fulfilling prophecy If you
tell yourself you're not good atsomething, you're going to get
what you've said.
And so my first thought wouldbe change that mindset.
Tell yourself you are capableof learning, because we know you
are.
You know you're not doing thethings you are doing because

(55:08):
you're incapable of learning.
So just always remember that,first of all, and do some things
that challenge that, whetherthat's journaling or whether
that's meditate or whatever.
Just open your mind up to thepossibilities of what you can do
, because if you shut the dooron yourself before you ever give
yourself the opportunity tolearn, you're only shortchanging

(55:28):
yourself.
I mean, you are capable.
If you're a photographer, acreative, if you're, I don't
care what it is you're doing forthe work that tells me you're
capable of learning and growing.
So if you just open yourself upto that and I understand that
it's not everyone's strongestsuit, granted, you know, but

(55:51):
it's not that you don't have itat all, yeah, have it somewhere.
And so, if it's not yourstrongest, spend a little time.
Maybe book a you know, like aone hour call with somebody,
whether that's somebody like meor whatever, to kind of bring
that out of you and get thebasics started to say, okay,
what does your process look like?
If we're talking about processagain, because that's, you know,
that's the focus here, butgetting that jump started, so

(56:13):
then you can take it and runwith it.
Somebody can guide you alongthe way if you feel like you
don't have all the structure toplace around it.
But that doesn't mean you'reincapable of doing it, and it
certainly doesn't mean you'reincapable of doing it, and it
certainly doesn't mean that youare stuck where you are.
So that would be my best advice, I guess Just open yourself up
to it.

Speaker 1 (56:33):
Yeah, I love that.
So, before we finish, because Ilove the melding of strategy
and woo and you are very much aswell, you're very strategic but
I also want to ask you I alwayslike to ask my guests, like,
what's something woo that you do, like whatever you consider

(56:54):
that like, what are some of your, let's say, mindset or focus
techniques?
What are some things that keepyou on track and keep you going?

Speaker 2 (57:03):
I think, from what most would maybe consider a bit
of a woo standpoint.
I do meditation regularly.
I actually go to the gym and Ido meditation in the sauna, like
I heal two birds with one stone, so to speak.

Speaker 1 (57:16):
Very strategic and efficient of you.
Yes exactly.

Speaker 2 (57:18):
I know I'm always trying to like make things more
efficient.
It's a curse, but I journal andyou know, and honestly, renee,
I have you to thank for a lot ofthis because you're my woo
friend right, you're the personwho has brought a lot of the woo
to the table, which I love, andso I have tried things that
maybe, you know, 12 years ago Iwouldn't have tried because you
exposed me to that, and that'skind of what this is about too.

(57:41):
For those of you who arethinking about processes, you
know, just being exposed to thepossibilities is huge.
So, yeah, I meditate, I dojournaling daily, just lots of
self-care stuff.

Speaker 1 (57:52):
I mean, it's not a woo.

Speaker 2 (57:54):
but I think you know like I love human design and
it's one of those things that Ikind of go in and out of.
But I mean I think there's somany things out there that you
can use to open yourself up topossibilities.
So just learning more aboutyourself, and if meditation
helps you, do it great.
If journaling helps, you, do itgreat.
Just find that thing for you,because we all need something.

(58:14):
I mean, a walk in nature islike awesome for me, like when I
need to clear my head, I'm outthe door.

Speaker 1 (58:19):
Yeah, and you like to work outside a lot in the
summer because you're up inMinnesota and I love seeing your
stories.
Like she will bring up I'm notjust talking about her laptop,
y'all she will bring out herentire ass set up outside, like
this is not playing around.
She's like, no, this is myoffice today and she's
legitimately like in herbackyard, which is gorgeous.
I would too.
Um, so yeah, like I love thatpoint too.

(58:42):
It doesn't have to be like Ihave to go and do a yoga class
for an hour and then, like,leave the house Like you could.
You can find some pieces in yourday, like I always talk about
in our elevate group cause Debsa, and still in my elevate group,
even though she's not doingphotography anymore.
I love having her in therebecause she's such a great
resource for the otherphotographers too, and she's
always talking about you know,just just, you know, starting

(59:10):
starting with what you got.
You know that's kind of whatI'm always talking about, these
15 minutes, what's yournon-negotiables every day?
You got 15 minutes.
You just got to like decidethat you do and, real quick, you
brought up the human designpiece of it and that's
definitely something you know.
I'm into that and I don't knowif you had a chance to look at
it yet, but I've done in Elevate.
I've gone through and I'vecreated a master document of
everyone's human designs, notjust because I want everyone in
Elevate to, and my one-on-onecoaching students I do this with

(59:31):
two.
But like inside of Elevate, Iwanted everyone to see like
everyone else's designs too andlike pull out similarities.
But like when I was doing yours, it's literally in your
incarnation cross and yourdesign to be the way that you
are, like it says it in there,like I know it was a processes
person, like this person isreally good at this and I was

(59:54):
like, oh my God, that is so cool.

Speaker 2 (59:57):
I read it and I'm like, are you sitting behind me?
Like what is going on?
But that's the thing.
I mean there's, like I said,there's those tools and you know
, sometimes you just need alittle reinforcement too,
because I mean, we all I'm not aI hate the word imposter
syndrome, but I think we allsecond guess ourselves and
sometimes the tools, the peoplearound us.

(01:00:17):
You know, like the Elevategroup I love being part of that
because I think everybody needspeople to lift them up, have
that connection with, and youknow it just somebody who
understands what you're goingthrough but also sees you, like
you don't always see yourself,and can kind of reflect that
back at you and go.
You know you are good at that.
Why are you questioning that?
You know, let's, let's have aconversation.

(01:00:39):
So I think that stuff is soimportant and I loved it.
I read it and I was like man,this girl's reading my mail.

Speaker 1 (01:00:46):
It's in the design.
It was just literally it pulledout of the design.
I was like, oh my gosh, that isso freaking cool, like I mean I
know that about you, but itliterally is part of of that
design.
And so, yeah, and also forthose of you guys who are in, I
have a very large high schoolsenior photography Facebook
group.
It's free.
I'll link it below I think it'salready linked like just in the

(01:01:09):
automations that I have set upmy own automations for my
podcast to join the freeFacebook group If you are a
senior photographer.
Deb is in there and one of thethings that we are going to
start doing here soon is Deb'sgoing to have some office hours
in the group.
She's going to go in there andjust kind of be available.
Deb's going to have some officehours in the group.
She's going to go in there andjust kind of be available.
We're going to kind of work outall of those details soon.
So watch for that.

(01:01:29):
I'm going to have datesscheduled like for myself,
because I want to do some lives.
I want to have you know justkind of like walk you guys
through some of the processes asa senior photographer, specific
sort of thing.
And then Deb is going to comein and do her own sort of like
office hours to help you guyswith some of these questions.
So if you're not a part of thegroup, definitely join.
It's free.
If you're in there already,that's coming.

(01:01:52):
And then Deb.
Also, where do you want peopleto connect with you outside of
that?

Speaker 2 (01:01:56):
Probably the best place is either Instagram or my
website.
My Instagram is atdebmitzelcreative and my website
is debmitzelcreativecom.
So Mitzel Creative and mywebsite is debmitzelcreativecom.
So those are the two bestplaces.
You can always find a way toget to me from there.

Speaker 1 (01:02:09):
Perfect, I will list those two and as well as the
freebie and also your processmapping service.
So thank you so much for beinghere.
This was super, super fun.

Speaker 2 (01:02:19):
Absolutely, thank you .
It was fun and you know me, Ilove talking business, so any
opportunity to chat about allthe things is totally my thing,
so thank you.

Speaker 1 (01:02:28):
Always such a great conversation with Deb, even if
we're just chatting over Voxer.
She's a great person to bouncethings off just in general.
She could really talk aboutbusiness pretty much all day.
That's not a lie.
Some people I just really loveit.
I love doing that too, but someof it just kind of makes my
brain just want to go offlinesometimes.

(01:02:50):
And she's just really goodabout just making it simple and
breaking it down into bite-sizedchunks that creatives don't
feel so charged up about doing.
So I hope you all enjoyed thatconversation with Deb, that you
take advantage of the thingsthat she has listed below for
you.
She's a great resource, just ingeneral.
Follow her, get in her universe.

(01:03:13):
She's always giving out reallygreat tips.
So if you haven't done yourprocess mapping, if you haven't
done that audit of what is myprocess, what do I actually do
inside my business, this is yourinvitation to do that and just
cross that off your list,because when you do things like
this, you are telling theuniverse, you're telling your
higher self, that I'm ready.
I'm ready for something biggerand better and more, and I'm

(01:03:36):
putting these things intopractice.
Right, because we're alwaystalking about at least I am
about how you don't get what youwant.
You get what you are.
And if you want something more,if you want something like you,
have this dream, you have thisvision of a business and a life
that you want.
Well, what does that version ofyourself do on the daily to hold

(01:03:57):
that energy, to hold theresonance of that coming in?
Is she scattered?
Is she running around like achicken without her head cut off
?
Is she just throwing stuff upagainst the wall and hoping that
it sticks?
Because that is not the versionthat's going to get what you
want right, like that version ofyou who already has what you
want.
First of all, that alreadyexists, because it's just

(01:04:19):
physics.
So that version of you isalready doing that in a
different timeline, and thatversion of you has discipline
and has systems and has thingsset up already to support this
level of business that she'srunning.
Okay, she has different habits,probably, than you have right

(01:04:42):
now.
So the fastest way for you toget to that place, to get what
you want to become that versionof yourself, is to do have right
now.
So the fastest way for you toget to that place, to get what
you want to become that versionof yourself is to do those
things now.
That's literally it.
That's literally manifestation.
Law of attraction in a nutshellis that you just need to be
that now.
If you want to be more organized, if you want to have more
efficiency in your business andif you want more clients and you

(01:05:04):
want to make more money, thenwhat does that version of
yourself do to have that?
Does that mean she gets up anextra hour early?
Does it mean that she doesthose 15 minutes of
non-negotiables every day?
Does it mean that she stayscalm and regulated so that
things are able to drop in andthere's no constriction?
Because that's a big, big pieceof it is that you have to have

(01:05:26):
space.
If you're constantly trying tocontrol things and if you're
constantly trying to, like, makethings perfect, just as a side
note, you're not leaving anyroom for the universe to drop
anything good in.
Because, like, think about thatclosed off energy, you're
constricted.
It's like you're at like a, youknow, in a cave, but you want
to be open.
You want to be open, you wantto be, you want your energy to

(01:05:48):
be open so that you can receiveeverything that you're asking
for.
Because you might be asking andif you're wondering, why am I
not getting it?
That could be why.
So release, let go a little bitof that.
Okay, realize that the onlythings that you can control are
you know your actions and yourreactions.
That's pretty much it.
And so what can you controltoday in these actions?
Well, you can.

(01:06:08):
You can look at your processesand you can decide do I want it
to look like this, is thisefficient, like, does this feel
good for me, does it feel goodto my target client, or do I
want something different?
Do I want to change somethingabout this?
So those are little things,small little things that you can
do just to get you to thatplace right.
So allow yourself to dreambigger, but also give yourself

(01:06:32):
space to have it come into yourawareness.
You know, I got to throw in alittle mindset dip in there, but
it's a big one.
It's a really big piece of this.
So maybe somebody out thereneeded that reminder.
If that's you, you're welcome.
So go out there, be good toyourself today and have a great
rest of your week.
Love you Bye.

All Episodes

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

Stuff You Should Know

Las Culturistas with Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang

Dateline NBC

.css-15opob5{left:0;position:absolute;top:0.8rem;} All Episodes

.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Photography Business Systems: How to Simplify, Streamline, and Scale with Deb Mitzel

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

.css-r6mb8g{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:1;overflow:hidden;}Stuff You Should Know

Las Culturistas with Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang

Dateline NBC

All Episodes

Photography Business Systems: How to Simplify, Streamline, and Scale with Deb Mitzel

Stuff You Should Know