Electrical Shock and Arc Flash with Terry Becker

This months episode covers the extreme hazard of electrical shock and arc flash. We are joined by Terry Becker of TW Becker Electrical Safety Consulting.

Find more info on LinkedIn or by visiting twbesc.ca

As promised, here is a list of acronyms used this episode:

• NFPA 70E - (USA) National fire protection association (NFPA)  70E document covers procedures and requirements to limit and avoid shock, electrocution, arc flash/blast workplace incidents
• CSA Z462 - Canadian Safety Association Standard Z462 provides workplace requirements to protect workers from the possible dangers associated with live electrical work tasks.
• MOU - memorandum of understanding 
• OH&S - Occupational Health and Safety (Canada) 
• TSBC - Technical Safety BC (British Columbia, Canada) 
• TWBESC - TW Becker Electrical Safety Consulting Ltd.

Please consult with official organizations for legal descriptions of the content listed above.

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Episode Transcript

Zack Hartle (00:00):
Hi, and welcome to Watt's the Word an electrical

(00:03):
industry podcast. I'm your host,Zack Hartle, and I'm joined as
always by Jason Cox. And we'rehere to just have relevant
conversations with people fromall over the electrical
industry. Our goal is simple.
It's to learn something new andbring information to everyone
here listening to the show.
Thank you so much for joining ustoday. Today's episode is no

(00:25):
exception. It's about a veryimportant topic, electrical
shock and arc flash. With TerryBecker from TW Becker,
Electrical Safety consultants.
We're going to chat about a lotof acronyms today. So take a
look in the description or shownotes to see a list of those
acronyms. Thanks so much forjoining us.

Jason Cox (00:46):
Welcome to the show, Terry.

Terry Becker (00:48):
Thanks , Jason.
Glad to be here.

Jason Cox (00:50):
Terry, can you tell us a little bit about your
background and how you got intothis side of the electrical
industry?

Terry Becker (00:56):
Yeah, I'm an electrical engineer by
background and I started mycareer in oil and gas. And
that's where I first found outabout the arc flash and shock
hazard at a at a conference Iwent to and, and there was a
presentation on NFPA 70, estandard for electrical safety
and workplaces back in 2005. SoI was an electrical engineer
doing sort of standardelectrical engineering, for oil
and gas and engineeringconsulting before 2005. And at

(01:19):
the time, I was working forEncana Corporation, which
everyone will know in Alberta.
And that's when I found outabout arc flash and shock. And
that that was the change in mycareer. At that point. I somehow
a switch turned on, forgiveusing the analogy. And I said,
Geez, these two hazards arcflash and shock, we haven't done
anything. I didn't even knowwhat Arc Flash was in 2005. I

(01:40):
knew what shock was. But as anelectrical engineer, I'd really
never focused any attention onit, when in reality, I should
have been focusing attention onit as part of my my job for in
Canada at the time. Right. Sothat set me off on a new journey
and a new mission of my career.
After 2005, and there's a lotmore to that story, which,

(02:02):
again, we can talk about to ifneed be in the podcast.

Jason Cox (02:06):
So jumping in there, right away, you mentioned the
NFPA, can you kind of talk aboutthe difference, or the
similarities about the NFPA andthe CSA here for our listeners
in Canada, and I guess inAmerica,

Terry Becker (02:19):
yeah. And again, like, you know, the NFPA 70,
when I found out about it wasthis 2004 edition. And that was
back in oh, five. And we didn'thave CSAs at 462 at the time. So
part of my my, my my job atEncana was to manage risks
related to our use ofelectricity in our business and
and then we had these twohazards. And so I did a bit of

(02:40):
benchmarking with other oil andgas companies. And then I phoned
CSA, and after about 10 people,I got the right, the right
gentleman, and I said, you know,are you aware of this NFPA 70
standard for electrical safetyand workplaces Believe it or not
CSA knew about it in oh five,right? And they said, Well,
yeah, we're actually aware ofthat, you know, you're not the
only one that's been inquiring.
And we're going to have this newC code part one rule that's

(03:03):
going to be added to the 2006code. And I said, I said what?
It was strange, there wasconvergence on the topic. But
the convergence was actually aproblem because the new rule
rule 2306, called for a new arcflash and shock warning label to
be installed on electricalequipment. And we didn't even
know what Arc Flash was. And wehadn't actually identified arc
flash in the workplace or theshock hazard. Right. So that's,

(03:26):
that's what set me off. So whathappened is CSA said, Well, we
signed an MOU with NFPA toharmonize standards for North
America. And we're going tocreate CSAs at 462, workplace
electrical safety standard. Doyou want to be on that tech
company as the first, you know,vice chair and a voting member?
And I said, Well, at this time,but by this time, it can, I

(03:48):
think sort of rolling that weneeded to deal with these
hazards. So it was sort of anatural that I said yes. So we
did not have Z462, published inCanada, until January 2009. And
at that time, we were probablyfully harmonized with NFPA 70
II, but that's changed. So we'renow in our fifth edition of

(04:09):
Z462, published January 2021.
I'd say we're giving you anumber of 90%, harmonized with
70 E. But we've made some of ourown improvements, right, because
we have that ability to deviate,we do not have to stay
harmonized with 70 E and we havenot so then the latest edition
does have some interestingchanges that are not in NFP. 70.

Jason Cox (04:34):
Okay, so but wonderful that they both are
very similar. You're not goingto it's not apples and oranges.
It's two types of apples andmaybe the 70 II will borrow from
the CSA in the future. We don'twe don't know. Right?

Terry Becker (04:48):
Well, what will happen is we do try and submit
our changes through their publiccomments process, right, and in
turn, we track their publiccomments, and then bring those
back to Z462. So right Now we'realready into the 2024 edition,
right and far as far asreviewing changes. So present
462, we had over 50 dockets. Butunfortunately, most of those

(05:10):
dockets came from tech committeemembers, not the public. Whereas
in the US, they typically rangefrom 300 to 500. Public
comments, every region, thestandards a lot more mature,
maybe a lot more adopt, and alot more awareness and industry.
We're in Canada, I think westill lack awareness that the
Z462, workplace electricalsafety standard, is available

(05:33):
and can be used. So we reallyhaven't had a lot of public
comments. And then we are goingto attempt to stay harmonized,
but sometimes they reject ourpublic comments for changes that
we like, and they don't acceptthem, then we retain those in
CSAs Z462. And sort of viceversa, right. But we're, we're
going to the 2024 edition, Ithink, make sure we try and take

(05:55):
some of the good things thatthey have that we don't have,
and continue to push to them.
Some of the things that that webring forward. The challenge is
these tech minis, it's industry.
It's not it's not 70. It's notNFPA, or CSA group. It's it's
industry that structures, thesetech companies and people vote
right and, and there's differentpeople and their different sort
of understanding or drivers forwhat they want to see happen and

(06:19):
the standards, right. So that'snot necessarily a good thing,
because sometimes some reallygood content doesn't get voted
in.

Jason Cox (06:26):
Well, and yeah, it definitely can be self serving
and move in a direction thatmight not be best for the, for
the nature of the Safety SafetyAct. If I was looking at
starting a business, or I'm newto the electrical industry as a
contractor, what do I need toknow as like, obviously, the CSA

(06:48):
has rules and legislation inplace, what's the top thing that
you think that new contractorsshould be aware of as they're
entering into the business ofbeing an electrical contractor?

Terry Becker (07:03):
So obviously, we're in Alberta, so I'll speak
to Alberta, right. And it startswith, you know, occupational
health and safety regulations.
So if you're a one personcontract, or a five or 1000,
person contractor, you know,there's there's this overarching
legal obligation in part two ofAlberta's OHS regulations for
hazard identification, andapplication of risk control
methods. So that applies if I'ma one person contractor, like I

(07:25):
said, five or 1000. So if youstart your own company, you
you've got to protect yourself.
You're the CEO, the president,the safety officer, right and
the worker, right now,obviously, you're just one
person. But with respect to allworkplace hazards, Alberta says
that you have to manage those,identify them. And then if you

(07:45):
can't eliminate exposure,implement risk control methods.
The other challenge in Alberta,it's not a challenge. The other
part of the regulations that isvery strict is part 15. Control
of House Energy, right, which islockout tagout. And then in
Alberta, we have party teenpersonal protective equipment,
and arc flash shows up in Part18. So right now, it's a legal

(08:06):
requirement that if a qualifiedperson is exposed arc flash,
that the employer has to providearc flash PPE. But that's the
only portion in Alberta'sregulations that's specific to
arc flash, there's no specificlegislation related to the
electric shock hazard out ofthem part 15. Control has
energy. It doesn't it'll it'llindicate electricity, but it

(08:27):
doesn't uniquely identify theshock hazards. So small
contractor, large contractor,the regulations are your legal
obligation. And all workplacehazards, including shock, and
arc flash have to be identified.
And if we can't eliminateexposure, then apply risk
control methods. And guess wherewe get those risk control
methods from the CSA said 462,workplace electrical safety

(08:49):
standard.

Jason Cox (08:51):
And so when we're looking at risk control, I would
think the two things that aregoing to come come to be would
be PPE, and then a procedure tocomplete a process.

Terry Becker (09:07):
So again, I'll use the CSA said 462, because it's
the toolbox. And I telleverybody that 460 was a toolbox
for electricians rightspecifically to our topic today.
There's other task qualifiedworkers too. So the toolbox
provides prescriptive policyrequirements, right and the
first policy is to eliminateexposure. And if you can't

(09:29):
establish an electrically SafeWork condition lockout tagout
for electrical equipment, thenyou have to have justification
for energized work. And then youhave to complete a discrete work
task shock risk assessment, andan arc flash risk assessment to
identify additional protectivemeasures, which is boundaries to

(09:49):
apply and the arc flash andshock, PP tools and equipment.
So there's the PPE aspect ofthat 462 The Arc Flash and shock
risk assessments, butoverarching this As you need to
have a risk assessmentprocedure, so that we consider
likelihood of occurrence. Sowhat I find is that when there's
training on Z462 just says, Oh,just do the shock risk

(10:11):
assessment, and the arc flashrisk assessment. So that's
boundaries and PPE, but itneglects the topic of likely of
occurrence. And a true riskassessment procedure considers
potential severity of injury ordamage to health and length of
occurrence. And all of this isin Z462. So again, it's all
about the work task. I talkedabout this that will tell you

(10:33):
it's about the electricalequipment. No, no, no, no, let's
not, it's about the work taskfirst. And then you need to know
the maximum nominal voltage thatshe'll perform the work task at
on this electrical equipment. Sowork task, maximum nominal
voltage, because that determinesif you can receive a shock, or
we can sustain an abnormalarcing fault, and have an arc

(10:56):
flash result. And there'sthere's a sort of a first rule
for arc flash. If there's noabnormal arcing fault, there's
no arc flash. And then when Italk about this, there's normal
arcing in energized electricalequipment, but by design, the
arcs are extinguished, so theydon't become arc flashes. Right.
So So again, a long windedanswer to your question, but for

(11:18):
contractor, they're going toneed arc flash and shot PP one
person, five person 1000 person.
And really when I've talkedabout this, the first tip that
should be procured is rubberinsulating gloves with leather
protectors, then arc flash PPE,but you need both ultimately,
you're going to need both rightrubber insulating gloves and
leather protectors the rightclass number, right class zero

(11:39):
Max use 1000 volts AC for lowvoltage, and that should be
standard kit. And apprenticesshould be should be exposed to
this PPE they should be toldabout this PPE and and again,
some of these tools and said 462can be communicated to an
apprentice in school, becausethat's that's where we need to
start. And then and then outthere, the Germans are out

(12:00):
there. We need to get them whata call compliant art fashion
shock training so that they getthe right information. And they
maybe don't get the wronginformation. And that's another
topic. All right.

Jason Cox (12:13):
Now I'm gonna jump way back here. Yeah. So what I
need from you is, I know howindustry works. And I know it's
changed since since my the day Igot my tickets, it's definitely
gotten safer. But can you tellour listeners being the

(12:35):
contractor to the greenapprentice? What justified means
you can only work on liveequipment if the work is
justified. Real simply explainedto that apprentice right now who
doesn't think that he's doingsomething wrong? Tell him that
justified work on live circuitsis

Terry Becker (12:53):
justified work is diagnostics and troubleshooting
and isolation related worktasks. We want to eliminate
energize repair alteration,right, we want to eliminate that
and rule two, three or four inthe Canadian electrical code is
called disconnection. So weactually have this occupational
health and safety rule in oursafe installation standard,

(13:14):
which my opinion is it should bedeleted. But that's another
topic. And it says no repairalteration energised. But you
got to read the whole rule.
That's the code. You got to readthese rules, and you got to
interpret them, right don't takethem carte blanche necessarily.
So that rule 2304 saysdisconnection, no repair
alteration, comma unless it'sinfeasible. And then Appen dix B
in the sequel, part one pointsto Z462. So now back to Z462.

(13:37):
Justification for energizedelectrical work. It's lists it
lists three elements ofjustification, right? Increased
risk or hazard, and feasibilitydue to equipment design, or
operational limitations, or thevoltage is less than or equal to
30 volts AC, or less than orequal to 60 volts DC. So there's

(13:58):
no arc flash and shock hazard.
If we're equal to or less than30 volts AC, or 60 volts DC, you
can still get an arcing fault,but that's not an arc flash. So
justification would bediagnostics and troubleshooting
due to equipment design, howelse do we make this equipment

(14:19):
work? If we don't go and checkfor voltage, right? And then
when we isolate it, it'senergized electrical work to
test for absence of voltage.
That's one of the myths is thatI just opened the circuit
breaker. I don't need any ofthis PPE. That's false, right?
Until you test for absence ofvoltage with an approved test
instrument. It's energized workto test for absence. And that's

(14:39):
all justified work. Sodiagnostics, power control
circuits, right? Again,isolation work tasks, no
isolation work tasks, what arethose? Well, opening the circuit
breaker, right or the disconnectswitch, but that's operating
electrical equipment. So there'sa difference between
diagnostics, repair, operatingand isolation work tasks. So

(15:03):
diagnostics completely approved,go ahead, right. And an
apprentice is taught to usetheir test instruments to do
that, right. There's otherspecialized testing that's also
authorized. And we actuallyisolate the electrical
equipment, put voltage back onit. But we need to do this
diagnostics and testing to makesure the equipment will operate
to its identified parameters,right, and then it's operating

(15:26):
correctly. And then when it'snot, we can get it operating
again. So that's all justified,right? We want to eliminate the
repair and alteration. And wealso need to do those isolation
work tasks, which are racking inor out low voltage power circuit
breakers, racking and erode highvoltage power circuit breakers,
and for high voltage installingtemporary protective grounds,
right. So to summarize, it isnot against the law to do

(15:49):
energized electrical work. Itisn't right, we want to use risk
assessment as a tool to help usmake decisions. And higher risk
work performed energized isrepair or alteration.

Zack Hartle (16:04):
So with those things you're mentioning there,
and what you mentioned before,obviously, one of the first
things you're going to want fora lot of that work is to have
the rubber gloves with theleather protectors. So just to
take a step back to those for asec. If I want to get a pair of
approved rubber gloves withleather protectors, how much do
they cost? And where do I go toget them?

Terry Becker (16:24):
So a pair class zero. Now just one thing to all
this arc flash and shock PPE isnot CSA approved. Right. So
there's the other thing you needto be aware. Well, I need CSA
approved rubber insulatinggloves and leather protectors
No, because we don't and we willnever have CSA standards for arc
flash and shock PP. So the firstthing is I need to know that I'm
going to purchase an ASTMAmerican Society of test

(16:45):
materials standard approvedrubber insulating gloves, and
leather protector system. Rightand then I go to a vendor, and
I'm looking at probably, youknow, all in because I need to I
need the storage bag, thestorage bag, I gotta protect the
glove, I gotta transport it fromthe shop to the work location, I
can put the bag down on theground, the gloves don't get
dirty. So the class is zero Maxuse 1000 Volts AC and 1500 volts

(17:11):
DC because DC can shock us,right will cost you probably
about 200 Maybe $225 per pair,right? Ultimately, you need two
pairs, because you have to getthese rubber insulating gloves,
dialectically retested every sixmonths. So if you have a pair of
gloves in for tests, and youneed to do energize work, you

(17:34):
need a second set, and you haveto stagger the test date. So
just a little more than the costis ASTM approval, both 220 25
bucks in the storage bag,Reverend slitting glove with the
leather protector. Now thatleather protector is a unique
leather protector, you can'tjust get a leather glove from
the local hardware store. Right?
So 225 bucks, the dielectricretest costs about 20 bucks

(17:56):
every six months from labs,there's there's lab in Calgary
and a lab in Edmonton do theactual testing.

Zack Hartle (18:05):
And that's not so bad to obviously ensure they're
maintained and still workingcorrectly, right as going to ask
about the cost as a littleworried there. But 20 bucks
every six months isn't so bad.
So we've already addressed thisa little bit, but we need to get
the education coming in early inthe apprenticeship. But aside
from that formal training thatyou would receive in the

(18:28):
apprenticeship system, is thereanything else that people can
look at for training if theywant more information?

Terry Becker (18:37):
So, again, I've been trying to advocate that we
need, you know, better trainingat the apprenticeship level. And
unfortunately, the sequel partone's pretty thick. But you
know, this top of arc flash andshock, my opinion should start
in the first year all the waythrough the fourth every year,
there's like a refresher on arcflash and shock hazards, then,
then the apprentice gets theirgentleman's ticket, they are out

(18:58):
in industry. So at this point,the employer is obligated to
provide training, a broadspectrum of occupational health
and safety training. So uniqueagain to electricians after
they're trained in school andthey get their gentleman's
ticket. They need ongoingtraining, no zip 462. Again,
where do we go to get someinformation on training? So is
that 462 says that we shouldhave arc flash and shock

(19:20):
training every three years?
Because guess what Z462 cyclesevery three years, just like the
C code, part one, and we alignedthe cycling. So we were in
parallel with a sequel Pawan I'mglad it worked out that way. So
every three years my opinion isan apprentice that might be out
in industry working for anemployer, they would attend
independent arc flash and shocktraining, much like I offer

(19:43):
right so I offer web based orinstructor led arc flash and
shock training based on CSAs at462. Right, so that training
should be at least every threeyears. Now the other issue with
Z462, though, within thetraining requirements in clause
401 It says that we need totrain on emergency release of a
worker that's being shockedevery year. Right. So then what

(20:05):
I recommend is the employer andZ462 mandatory will acquires it
shall have an electrical safetyprogram. And that program is,
again, a documented system thatdirects activities related to,
you know, work on energizedelectrical equipment, and it
addresses training. So withinthat program, it should say,

(20:26):
hey, you know, once a year, weneed to have a little bit of a
meeting, right? Maybe we combineit with our annual safety
meeting, or maybe we havemonthly safety meetings, and
every six months, we have ad hoctraining, this is what's being
missed in industry, not only,you know, ad hoc training about
emergency release of a workerthat's being shocked, but ad hoc
training on those rubberinsulating gloves and leather

(20:47):
protectors. So formal training,eight hour course, low voltage,
16 hour course, low and highvoltage, Electrical Safety
Program role and orientationtraining. So once an employer
develops policies, you need totrain your workers on it. And
that would be this electricalsafety program, road orientation
training, and then blend annualrefresher or ad hoc training on

(21:08):
some of the key concepts. And Isaid rubber insulating gloves
and leather protectors, becauseI'm not because when I'm when
I'm out doing external ethicalsafety audits, guess what I find
the gloves maybe aren't evenbeing worn, they're still in the
bag, or the test frequency isout of date. Right? And for
shock, that will save anelectricians life. The current

(21:30):
was always flowing through thehands, right. So we need
training to be formalized inschool apprentice every year,
then again, the journalelectrician under the employers
in responsibility is providedarc flash and shock training
every three years. But thenintegrate this ad hoc short
training, you know on some ofthe key topics throughout the

(21:50):
year to keep it current to keepit fresh. And to remind that
journey, personal electrician,and apprentices that are out
there doing their hours, thatthis PPE you need to identify
it, you need to produce checkand inspect it, and then where
and then the risk to you is lowrisk that you'll be exposed to
shock and or arc flash. Right.

(22:15):
There's no zero risk. But I doquote with rubber insulating
gloves and leather protectors,if they're stored properly.
They're dialect retested everysix months, you pre use air and
visual check the rubberinsulating glove and inspect the
leather protector, you will notget current flow through your
hands into your body ever again.

Jason Cox (22:36):
Every one of the things you mentioned there is
doing audits and yourobservations and industry about
what's being done correctly andincorrectly. Where in industry,
are you seeing electrical safetyprocesses and procedures done?
Well?

Terry Becker (22:55):
That's a good question. And, you know, I
classify, you know, thecompanies that I work for as
institutional, commercial, andindustrial. So remember, my
journey started in oh, five fora large oil and gas company,
right. And I'll make a bluntstatement. The only gas industry
is the most safest industry inthis country. It is because

(23:15):
trust me, I've now been exposedto other industries. And just
general safety is not as intenseas it is in the oil and gas
industry. Alright, so industrialhas been leading the way. And
I'll be blunt, the oil and gasindustry started this whole
thing off. And I was one of thecatalysts of that I was the
catalyst, right. And thenunfortunately, commercial and

(23:38):
institutional lagged behind thisand identifying these two
hazards. And I find that theyhave weaker occupational health
and safety management systemsthan what I was used to in the
oil and gas industry. And sothey're lagging behind. Some of
them have funding problems,which I do recognize because
they're taxpayer funded. Sothey, you know, safety shouldn't

(23:59):
need a budget, but safety needsa budget. So when I'm out doing
external electrical safetyaudits now, I finally did get
back out there right last fall.
And I did a large industrial,external electrical safety
audit. And then I did a largewhat I'll call, you know,
institutional which will saymunicipality, right? Wastewater
water treatment, right. And sothe industrial was, you know,

(24:23):
the outcome of the audit was theindustrial was ahead of the
municipality, right. But theindustrial end user still had
issues when, because withsafety, it's called Plan, Do
Check Act. And it's a philosophyit's one of many philosophies in
occupational health and safety.

(24:45):
Now that philosophy isconsistent with CSA said 45,001,
which is an occupational healthand safety management system
standard that Canada adopted,which was ISO 45,001. So the
audit tells us what's happeningand industrials lead the way
then I'd say, you know,institutional, which would be

(25:06):
municipalities, largeuniversities, and school boards.
And then I'd say commercial, youknow, manufacturing sites, small
commercial, large commercialbuildings with, you know,
warehouses and then the likethey lag at the bottom of the
list on on who's done, you knowwhat, with respect to arc flash
and shock and who's done itwell. And then who's auditing

(25:26):
it? Right. And that's thechallenge. If you don't audit
safety, you don't know if it'sworking if those risk control
methods are actually working.
And there's another topic thatthat is relevant to this is
electrical supervisors, there'sa whole other topic and what
they are unfortunately, troubledwith today is doing a lot of
administrative work and lackinggetting into the field with the

(25:48):
electricians. Right. So butindustrials been leading the
way. A great

Zack Hartle (25:57):
how would you say Canada fairs compared to the
rest of the world? Is there anycountries we should be trying to
emulate a little bit more?

Terry Becker (26:05):
So you know, that these are some really good
questions, because they're allrelevant. And I've tracked all
this. Right. So when I was doingmy benchmarking back in oh,
five, it was canon us. Right.
And then it sort of expandedbecause I don't know, it seems
that at that time in the early2000s, you know, arc flash and
shock started to become relevantinternationally. Right. Now, the

(26:25):
NFPA in the US has a my opinion,a broader reach internationally,
right? US corporations takethings with them, because the
countries they go to do not haveh&s regulations, and they don't
have standards. So right now,NFPA 70 E is used either
voluntarily, or potentiallyadopted by a country

(26:47):
internationally, right. SoAustralia, New Zealand, I think
Brazil, or Argentina adopted 70E, and it's translated into
Spanish, right? We translatedZ462 into French. So South
Africa, South Africa, uses NFPA70 E. And then Asia would maybe
70. But that's that's all of thetopic, the Middle East, where

(27:11):
the US has a strong presence dueto oil and gas. Right, what
would be using 70 E. And thenEurope has now moved, you know,
as I would, I would suspect theEU has moved to developing their
own documents Australia and NewZealand have as well. So earlier
on when I was, you know, gettinginto this, and if you haven't
recognized got a lot of passion,I want to share, I actually

(27:33):
presented in Australia, on CSAs,Ed 462, and Canada adopting it
to influence and provideinformation, right, so I went to
Australia three times andpresented, I presented in
Canada, across Canada, atconferences and I present in the
US. So Canada is we quickly wentfrom nothing to you know, a
significant change. And so Z462,has made a significant change in

(27:58):
Canada, you know, in 10 years,went from really nothing and
these rubber insulating gloveswith leather protectors for
German electricians not beingknown or worn at all, to, you
know, yeah, an escalated, youknow, basis of it, but we still
got a long ways to go. SoCanada's is in good shape, I'd
say the US, you know, as fartheralong in their journey because

(28:20):
NFPA 70 II first published in1979. But it really didn't
change to its current formatuntil 2000 2004. So we have an
international issue with our youknow, with these hazards not
being identified. So right now,there's literally hundreds of
1000s of shocks occurring rightnow globally, right, as far as
arc flashes, not as many,because countries don't have

(28:43):
regulations. They don't evenhave proper training for German
electricians. So it's someonethat's just trained. Right. And,
and in general, the biggestproblem internationally in some
countries would be there's nointernet regulations. So Canada
is now at this topper top tier,I guess. We've aligned with with
with us, we've aligned withAustralia, New Zealand,

(29:04):
obviously the Commonwealth linkto Australia and New Zealand as
well.

Zack Hartle (29:10):
And it sounds like I mean, maybe the issue here in
North America, let's say isn'tthe having the standards and the
documents in place, it's maybebringing the awareness to
everyone about how to followthem correctly. Get the training
out there, like we've said,right.

Terry Becker (29:25):
So again, I mentioned, you know,
institutional, commercial,industrial. And, you know, the
last 10 years, the awareness ofZ462 has just ramped up it has
right and when I said earlierthat, you know, commercial and
institutional are laggingindustrial. I sort of equated
that to the fact thatindustrial, I think has more
liability under OHS regulations.
Not that the other industriesdon't, but there's a lot more

(29:47):
workers working at a worksitepotentially. So the liability of
the employer increases whenthere's a total man hour
increase, right. So, again,Canada is Is, is moving through
this, but we still havechallenges, because it's not
practiced everywhere, andespecially electrical
contractors, electricalcontractors, you know, they'll

(30:08):
they'll tear, they run a thinbusiness as far as profit
margins. But if you're running acontracting business, you're
still making money. But, youknow, forgive me for saying it,
I think there's a lack ofcontractors wanting to spend
money on arc flash and shock.
And that's the training becausethe training, yeah, it's, it's
going to cost you a certainamount of money per electrician,

(30:28):
right? And if it's goodtraining, you're gonna get good
value out of that. And I try toinstill that when I do my
training with the electricians,how do we feel apply this
information. And that's the,that's the differentiation of my
training. By the way, as I justdon't say, here's what's in
Z462. You know, I try andcommunicate the training through
what I call an energizedelectrical job workflow. Right?
So again, it's it's we got along ways to go. We need

(30:53):
improvements and training theindustry. But that's, forgive
me, it's next to impossible.
Because anybody can do our flashand shock training in Canada,
because there's no certificationbody certifying that training.
And it's called buyer beware,right. And what I find is that
the employers are not prequalifying companies that
provide our flash and shocktraining, and not pre qualifying

(31:13):
the instructor that Forgive mefor saying it that they're truly
a CSA Z462 SME, such as I am.
Right. So, again, we've got somework yet to do.

Zack Hartle (31:29):
What's the documentation process in Canada?
If there is an arc flash? Ormore importantly, if there is a
shock that happens? Do they getreported? Is it legislated that
they get reported? I know that'sa big issue. We're having

Terry Becker (31:42):
a really good question. So under OHS
regulations, whether it'sprovincially, territory or
federally, and moreprovincially, there's more
systems in place is a under youknow, workers compensation acts,
right, an injury in theworkplace has to be formally
reported to the government. And,you know, the workers should
seek medical aid. So for shocks,electricians have been shocked,

(32:04):
since we invented electricity.
And they didn't report them.
They accepted them. The Americanelectricians handbook, actually,
from 1942 to 1960, said, useyour fingers and or stick a wire
in your mouth, right. So we gotthis history, right. So
electricians should havereported them first to their
their employer. And then theyshould have filled out a WCB and
went to emergency every shock,you should have went to

(32:27):
emergency. Right and in been puton an EKG. So that's the first
obligation emergency response,get the worker to emergency fill
out a WCB. So you haveinsurance, right? Separately,
the employer right now hasanother obligation under the
electricity Safety Act or safetystandards acts across Canada,
you have to report theelectrical incident to the

(32:49):
jurisdiction having authorityfor the C code part one, because
they want to know if theincident was due to a lack of
code compliance or equipmentfailure. Right? So there's two
legal obligations to report ashock and an arc flash. And if
there's no injury, and we havean abnormal arc arcing fault, an
arc flash, you would only reportthat arc flash with equipment

(33:11):
damage to the jurisdictionhaving a 40 through the C code
part one. And and that has to bereported by a master electrician
in our province, or theprovinces or a field safety
representative in BC. Andthere's there's forms provided
by a governmental affairs forfor this province, or the TSP
CNPC, just as an FYI. So that'sa really good question, because

(33:33):
I don't think that the shockshave been reported. Well, they
haven't been reported at all, orif they have been reported, just
the WCB requirement, but not thejurisdiction having authority
for the Seedco part one.

Zack Hartle (33:44):
No. And I bring that awareness of the shock
hazard and reporting it as theonly way that we are going to
get see improvements in that. Imean, just as a side note for
all our listeners here, if youdo want to hear more about shock
hazard or the long term effects,which we call so CWLA Take a
listen to episode three, wherewe have John Knoll on who's a

(34:04):
huge advocate in the industryright now, for shock hazard in
the trade.

Terry Becker (34:10):
So I just want to comment on John John approached
me a year and a half ago becauseI talked about electric shock
sequela. But no one cameforward. No one No one never no
electrician ever came forward.
So I didn't I didn't talk aboutit a lot. Then John proach me
because I support the electricalcontract sociation, Alberta. I'm
trying to support them. I'mtrying to help their owners and

(34:31):
get good information to theirelectricians good training and
electrical safety programs. Johnapproached me and said, Terry,
you've talked about this. Isaid, Yeah, but no one's come
forward. And I said, he says,Well, where can I get diagnosed?
I said, Well, you got to go tothe Sunnybrook you know, the
Sunnybrook Health SciencesCenter in Ontario. It's the only

(34:52):
place that I know of that has anelectrical injury program, but
you know, so he did and and hewas diagnosed with sub quella,
but he has sub CWLA, which hasmultiple long term effects. So
then John owning it, becausehe's he's impacted. He's no
longer in the trade. Itdebilitated him. So he owned it.
And he owned it because he hadone WCB report for what he would

(35:13):
tell you. I've been shocked 100times, but he only had one WCB.
So that's the important thingabout shocks, you need to report
it so that if you do have longterm sub CWLA, you're going to
get insurance if you can nolonger be in the trade. So this
is new information. And it justhasn't been talked about because
there's no electricians comingforward. Now, my opinion is, you

(35:35):
know, percentage wise, if we didhave some statistics, maybe less
than 5% of electricians, maybeless than 1% may have some
quella. And so CWLA, because theelectrical current coming into
our bodies, is different for youor me, male or female, right.
And therefore, it may not havethe same and, you know,
cumulative effect and causesequelae. John did gets a quella

(35:56):
he's been diagnosed, and nowhe's owning it and sharing his
story. And I've been workingwith him, we actually went to
the IEEE Electrical Safetyworkshop, I took John with me,
we went down to Jacksonville inperson, we wrote a paper and we
had a poster. And ironically,the keynote speaker was Dr. Lee
and Dr. Jeschke, from theUniversity of Chicago, you know,

(36:17):
Saturday program. So that gotsome huge attention this year,
at that flagship electricalsafety conference. And John was
amazing. And he told his storywe had I, you know, we had 2030
people at our poster session,right, and it was really
engaging. So short term effectsof shock are immediate, you're
going to feel pain, or forgiveme be electrocuted, the long

(36:38):
term effects are not wellunderstood still. So be aware of
it. This is new information thatwe need to communicate to
journeyman electricians out there.

Jason Cox (36:51):
Terry, I have to admit that when we started this
podcast, I never thought that Iwould learn as much as I am. And
our episode with John Knoll was,it sounds really dramatic, but
it was life changing to realizejust what kind of impacts can
happen to people by beingshocked. So that that was a

(37:15):
totally changed my perspective.
And I've been in the trade nowfor close to 30 years. With our
and you've brought it up heretoday, there's always a question
about safety versus price, andyou can't put a price on safety,
but we do. So when we look atthe workers in industry. What's
the minimum PPE that we'relooking at for these people to

(37:37):
be doing their jobs on a dailybasis.

Terry Becker (37:42):
So here's a general rule. If you're going to
be doing energized electricalwork tasks on to eight volt,
three phase electricalequipment, or higher three phase
electrical equipment, you'regoing to need shock PPE and arc
flash PPE. So those minimumclasses are all rubber
insulating gloves with leatherprotectors. And then general
rule you need 8.0 calorie percentimeter squared full body arc

(38:07):
flash PPE which will be acoverall on our greater
balaclava on our graded faceshield, ear canal insert
earplugs worn first before youput the balaclava on CSA
approved clear eyewear. Becausethe arc rated fasceshield is not
Z94 rated for trapnell rightbecause they just didn't spend

(38:29):
the money to get thatcertification and you need own
rated footwear leather, right?
And that would be the minimumshock and arc flash PPE for
doing a voltage measurement attwo eight volt three phase or
480 volt three phase or 600 orhigher voltages and then you
decide if you need more usingthe tools in CSA Z462

Zack Hartle (38:52):
And what about underneath all of that one thing
I always remember from my dayswhat my days but one thing I
always remember is being told toonly ever wear cotton underwear
underneath my Carhartt pants orwhatever it was, is that a real
thing or a myth?

Terry Becker (39:08):
No So the problem with clothing one underneath are
created clothing is that if itis meltable polyester pod and
Kali blends, what happens is thePPE that you're wearing that's
are created as flame resistantfabric first that won't ignite
when it's exposed to arc flashincident energy. And there's

(39:31):
this very important value ofinstant energy 1.2 calories per
centimeter squared or higherwill ignite flammable clothing.
Alright, so cotton is flammableclothing, cotton Polly's
flammable clothing, so what youneed to wear underneath your
artery to cover all is 100%natural fiber clothing, cotton

(39:52):
wool or silk because the heatthat comes through the outer
layer, but the temperature thatthe of the of the into the
energy of the plasma cloud inthis instant energy that's
released, right? It's cooled bythe odor garment before it gets
to your skin. But thetemperature that could get to
your skin is 80 degrees Celsius,and that'll melt polyester,

(40:14):
right? So you need to wearhunterson natural fabric
clothing under acquittedclothing, and it's okay to have
some minimal elastics to holdthe underwear up. So whenever I
talk about this, we still haveto be reasonable and practicable
about some of these things.
Because the underwear it needsto be hold, held that now male
and female need to talk aboutit, right. And so if you have a

(40:35):
female, dirty person,electrician, because we're
getting more of them in thetrade, which is I think, a good
thing, by the way, but we haveto have a frank conversation
that they've got to wear cottonunderwear as well, they can't be
wearing, you know, like I'll saylike, you know, polyester type,
you know, female underwear, theygotta have cotton underwear. So
male or female, same rulesapply. Because if it's polyester

(40:56):
or poly blends, that heat fromthe arc flash, the sun's energy
goes through the outer layer,and the outer layer is doing its
job, it doesn't Ignite, and itcools that plasma so that when
it gets to your skin, right, theworst case burn injury you can
receive. Now, here's anothertopic is the arc thermal
performance value of thatgarment is such that you can
still get the 50% probability ofthe onset of a secondary burn,

(41:19):
but you don't want theundergarments to melt as well.

Zack Hartle (41:25):
And that was what I was always told was, it'll melt
to your skin, which it will orhave a problem, right. And the
other one I always heard sincewe're on the topic is contact
lenses in the event of an arcwould melt to your eye Is that
myth or fact?

Terry Becker (41:39):
So my opinion would be that's probably fact
because what's happening is,it's not the heat, now there is
heat coming through the shield,right? So when you got the arc
rated facial, it's doing thesame thing as the clothing,
right, it's reducing the amountof heat that gets through the
shield to get to your face. Butwe're still going to have
potentially high degree Celsiusheat there, right, and you've
got UV light coming through. Andthat's what's going to be the

(42:02):
big problem with your eyes. Soyou need to have prescription
safety eyewear that you wouldwear and I wouldn't recommend
wearing contact lenses. Right?
We got the heat we got the UVlight potential is those contact
lenses, right? Forgive me mightmelt.

Jason Cox (42:18):
All right, so I'm just throwing this out there. I
never even thought of this. Butlike, if you're wearing a bra,
like a lot of times bras likewomen in the trades now, there's
a whole lot of metal and, andsupport. Like that metal could
be disastrous as well for theburn.

Terry Becker (42:38):
Okay, but remember, we've got to be
reasonable and practical. Sorespectfully for females, their
anatomy is different than a maleand they need to be comfortable
when when they're working.
Right. So this comes up with twomilitary, can I wear metal
rimmed glasses, can I wear metalrimmed glasses? Or do I have to
get you know, plastic ripped?
Right, so there's two thingshere, there's the shock hazard,

(43:00):
and then this thermal hazardrelated to arc flash. So metal
rim glasses can be worn becauseyour head should never go inside
the restricted approach boundaryfor shock. It shouldn't be
there. And that's called aninadvertent movement risk. 12
inches is restricted approachboundary for low voltage
equipment. So why rimmed glassesare fine, but tell you said

(43:20):
some, you know, what about theheat? Well, I again, I've never
heard of any incidents relatedto glasses heating and causing a
specific burn to the face orknowledge and remember the
sample there isn't a lot offemale electricians out there.
But in our flashes are nothappening at the frequency that
some people may tell you theyare so we'll have no statistics.

(43:41):
So you might get some heatcoming through. And then the
wire you know the wire the wireaspect of the of the female
breezier, I don't think it wouldheat up and become a substantial
issue at all. So worker comfort,you know, whereas in previous
years, minimal plat, you know,minimal elastics we're getting
way overkill on a topic. Thebottom line is I want to work

(44:03):
with a clothing on anelectrician to start out with,
that's the first thing we needto do. And that's that minimum,
eight calorie per centimetersquared, full body arc flash PPE
208 volt, three phase or higher,and I gotta mention it 125 volt
DC, battery string output from aUPS or higher voltage for larger
ups, right? Same thing. And ifwe use that 462, and the arc

(44:28):
flash PPE category table method,that's what it would throw us
into anyways. So simple rule,and I'm really applying that 462
indirectly. And just trying tosay there's that simple rule on
minimum arc flash and shock, PP,right for low voltage work, and
then decide if you need an arcflash shoot. And if the voltage
is higher, then you got to upthe class to another class for a

(44:49):
higher voltage of exposure.

Jason Cox (44:52):
But you've definitely demonstrated how you're using
the CSAs at 462 as your toolboxI mean, It's, it's, you're
always going back to it and justrelating back to and I think
that's something we all need tostart really following that
example.

Terry Becker (45:11):
Because I always say it's a toolbox, right? So if
you're doing an electrician,well, if you're an apprentice,
you get a tool list and you goget those mental tools. So
general electrician needs, Z462.
And the tools that are in it, toapply against, again,
identifying for exposed areflashing chalk, doing actual
formal risk assessments forthose, and then getting those
boundaries because theboundaries applied only to the

(45:33):
primary worker. But theboundaries, keep unqualified,
unprotected workers out thatdon't have the PPE on. And if
they come in the boundaries,they distract the worker, which
increases the likelihood of youmaking a mistake when you flinch
back, because they surprise youwhen they come from behind you.
Right. So use the tools and said462. But the problem is, I don't

(45:53):
think a lot of the trainingcommunicates it that way. I do.
I said, here's a tool, and thenapply it against a workflow.
Jobs are given to journeyperson, electricians, planned or
reactive. And at that point, doelectrical hazard identification
against work tasks that you'llhave to perform to do the job.
And then use these tools insteadfor six to against the workflow,

(46:17):
right. And we need documentationin the field as well. So that
462 requires that before aqualified person does energize
work, that they have adocumented energized electrical
job safety plan, right. So theseare the other tools in Z462. And
I extract them and say, here's ajob safety planning forum. And
then as far as what's going onin industry, if there is

(46:38):
training, and there is somepolicies, I don't think that
journeyperson electricians arebeing told by their employers,
you know, fill this form outbefore you do energize work. And
what they're doing is they'reidentifying if they're exposed,
and they're telling themselvesthat I've got the right risk
control methods to manage mypersonal risk.

Zack Hartle (47:03):
Now, Terry, it's been a few years since I have
put on a calorie rated suit. Iremember it being big, clunky
heavy. Earplugs, safety glasses,balaclava. And then the big hard
hat with the orange face shield,hot, sweaty, difficult to move
in. How's things changed in thatrespect in the last couple years

(47:26):
with the PPE for arc flash?

Terry Becker (47:28):
So again, I've been doing this independent
Electrical Safety Consultant for14 years. And you know, the
reason electricians called ArcFlash sheets bomb suits 15 years
ago, because they were big andbulky, right. So with people
procuring this PPE the vendorstart to invest money, and well,
not all the vendors. So there'sthe other thing in Arc Flash
PPE. Not all vendors are alike,just like anything, right. So

(47:51):
there's leaders in Arc FlashPPE, they're the innovators, and
then other people follow. Sowhat we've seen is the fabric
technology has improved tolighter ounce weight per square
yard, and higher arc thermalperformance value as a single
layer garment. And then an arcflash shoot is a multi layered
garment. It's called totalsystem arc rating. So with that

(48:14):
innovation and fabric, themanufacturers can layer later
fabric and the arc flash shootsin our ultra lightweight, you
would not believe it, I wish Icould reach through the screen
right and give you one of thesesuits. And then you could go wow
from 10 years ago, so the arcflash shoots are lighter weight,
the actual single layers arelighter weight with a better
atpv. The other thing thathappened with the arc rated

(48:35):
facials or the lenses in ArcFlash suit hoods, they
transition from dark brown, darkgreen light green to what's
called true color gray now, sothere's full visual light
transmission, where before youcould you put on those you could
barely see what you're workingon. Right, which was a problem
because PPE should not increasethe likelihood of you being

(48:57):
exposed to the hazard we'retrying to protect you from so
we've seen improvements in thein the ounce weight of the
fabric to an ATV performance. Solighter weight more comfortable.
The shields now truecolorGreenland's top technology so
you can see you can see thewhole piece of electrical
equipment with normal light. Andso and it doesn't just color
wires, because the greendiscolored wires. So now that's

(49:18):
all gone. Right? The other thingthat's happened is there's other
aspects of this too, right thatare relative to if things go
wrong, right so one of thevendors now has an escape strap
vest available that you wouldwear over your everyday wear
with a 10 foot nonconductivestrap that's weaved into the
back like a harness and I coulduse that to remove a worker

(49:42):
that's been exposed to shock andrelease them. Well if a worker
has been exposed arc flash andthey're unfortunately in front
of equipment still I couldremove them. And that escape
strap is also now included in anarc flash suit jacket. So the
arc flash PPE is morecomfortable. It's the true color
Greenlands technology wear aidescape strap. There's other
innovations, there's what'scalled an extender rack. Right.

(50:05):
So for racking power circuitbreakers, it's actually a
telescopic, caustic, so you canshrink it to easily transport
it, then expand it out 17 to 20feet, and you turn the hot
stick. And in turn, it's got acoupling that turns and racks
the power circuit breaker in orout with the worker now being
potentially outside the arcflash boundary. Right? There's

(50:26):
other things too, like forinstance, you need to test
before touch with your testinstrument, right. So this has
been around for a while, but notmany people know it. There's one
of the leaders, right and testinstruments that's got a proving
unit, right, it's a low voltageproving unit fingers safe,
because it does give you a lowenergy AC output when an
alternate gives a DC output. Sothere's improvements in in a

(50:49):
test instruments or in thiscase, an instrument to prove out
your test instrument that yougot a positive before it tested
for absence and got zero andthen retest on a positive and
it's portable. You don't have tolook for a receptacle. I'm up on
a lift, how do I I gotta godown, I gotta go up. So
improving convenience, for thejourney, personal nutrition on

(51:10):
using these, you know, policiesand boundaries and things we
want them to do is a huge thing.
One last thing, too. This hasbeen around for a while, again,
probe extenders, right. Soagain, one of the vendors has
probe extenders, so your handsare out of the box. Right? They
didn't put the guard on the end,though. So you still need rubber
insulating gloves. But when yourhands were in the box, the

(51:30):
problem was Innova movement, andhe couldn't see the work really
well. Now with rubber insulatinggloves and leather protectors on
that gets worse because you gotmore of a bulky glove and can't
see the work with the probeextenders, you hold the end with
rubber insulating gloves, loadprotectors and probe in. Right.
So there's been improvements andarc flash PPE, improvements on
tools and equipment that areavailable. Yeah, like, again,

(51:50):
there's lots of information thatyou need to stay current with.
And that's the challenge of theemployer. But the journey
personal nutrition, I think ischallenged. Because how do they
find out about any of this?
Well, you find out about thisfrom someone like me that that
lives this and passionatelywants to share and make this
work out there. That's theproblem, we need to make it easy

(52:13):
or easier for the journey personelectrician to be successful.
Right and the PDP improvementswill now do that. But the
employer has to budget andprovide the new PPE to the
worker and replace the old PPE.
And that's a huge barrier.

Jason Cox (52:31):
Well said, Terry, if our listeners would like to
learn more about TW Becker,Electrical Safety consulting,
the services you provide, what'sthe best method for them to get
a hold of you.

Terry Becker (52:43):
So my website, www.TWBESC.ca, I've got a great
website, talks all about who Iam and bit of information about
my journey on there. And ittells you what I do, right. So
it's really good. I've got ablog on there as well. So my
blogs, and I've gotpublications, I write for the

(53:05):
electrical line magazine, Kevinburrs magazine, and if you're
not signed up with him, sign upwith him, his magazines, great.
There's not only me, but there'sa lot of good C code update
content there too. So my websiteis the best place to go. Sign up
and get on board with the leftalign magazine for my articles.
I've got a really good articlecoming out. Next edition on

(53:26):
electrical hazardclassification. That might be an
entire other podcast, by theway. So my website, I'm also on
LinkedIn. Right? So I encouragejourneyperson electricians to
get on LinkedIn. Right? I'll behonest with you. There's lots of
jobs being offered on LinkedInall the way from professionals
down to trades, right? So it's,it's the business network. So
I'm on LinkedIn and postingthere. I'm posting articles

(53:49):
there, but my website, thenumber one location to find out
more about me, and you can emailme at any time. If you've got
quick questions, I'll answerthem, right. So again, like I
said, I'm providing electricalsafety program development.
That's my priority is to getdocumentation in place as more
than other formal toolbox forjunipers, electricians, I do
external electrical safetyaudits. And I've got my brand of

(54:11):
one day low voltage arc flashand shock training course. And a
two day low voltage and highvoltage arc flash and shock
training course.

Zack Hartle (54:20):
Yeah, that's excellent. Terry, I just want to
thank you so much for coming onthe show today to chat with us.
As always, we learned a ton. Andas we mentioned, we could have
gone down many, many more rabbitholes and spent a few hours
talking about many of thesetopics. So I'm sure we'll have
to have you back on the show oneday to dig a little bit deeper
into some of them.

Terry Becker (54:41):
Zack, Jason, I really want to thank both of you
for for contacting me and giveme another venue to communicate.
And I would be more than glad tocome back in a future podcast or
even a reoccurring podcastforgive me for putting the plug
in for it. We need to keep thistopic front and center for
journeyperson electricians Rightand if we we let it you know, we

(55:02):
let it like back any of thegains will will see complacency
and pull back. So thank you bothfor contacting me. I enjoyed the
time answering questions withboth you today. Get in touch
with me anytime, anytime.

Jason Cox (55:15):
Awesome. Thanks a lot, Terry.

Terry Becker (55:16):
Thank you both.

Zack Hartle (55:17):
And to all our listeners out there. Thank you
once again for coming to listento what's the word and
electrical industry podcast.
Come back again next month wherewe'll explore some more into the
electrical trade. You can findus anywhere you find your
podcasts Apple, Spotify, Googleor YouTube, or check out our
website wattsthewordpodcast.com.

(55:41):
Thanks so much for listening.
Keep yourself safe out there andif he can someone else do it.