February 10, 2025 • 19 mins
Unlock the challenges facing U.S. military service members in their pursuit of affordable housing with insights from our guest, Alissa Czyz, a Director at the Defense Capabilities and Management Section of the Government Accountability Office (GAO). The GAO report titled Military Housing: DOD Should Address Critical Supply and Affordability Challenges for Service Members is the cornerstone of our discussion. With two-thirds of service members relying on off-base housing, often in expensive markets, Alissa sheds light on the financial burdens that disproportionately affect junior enlisted personnel. Our conversation unravels the reality of service members facing costly housing markets based on deployment orders, with disparities between locations like the budget-friendly Fort Bliss and the costly Key West.
Discover the ongoing efforts to address the military housing crisis, emphasizing the pivotal role of accurate data collection and the pressing need for Congressional oversight. As we explore potential solutions, the conversation underscores the continued need for direct engagement with the troops. Join us in extending heartfelt gratitude to Alissa and her team for their indispensable work.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Larry Zilliox (00:00):
Good morning.
I'm your host, Larry Zilliox,Director of Culinary Services
here at the Warrior Retreat atBull Run, and this week our
guest is Alissa Czyz.
She's the Director of DefenseCapabilities and Management
Section Department not sure whatit's officially called over at
GAO and I asked her to join usthis week because I ran across a
(00:23):
report that they had done.
I asked her to join us thisweek because I ran across a
report that they had done titledMilitary Housing DOD Should
Address Critical Supply andAffordability Challenges for
Service Members, and I readthrough this report and I was
really surprised.
A number of things jumped outat me.
So, Alissa, welcome to thepodcast.
I really appreciate you beinghere with us.
Alissa Czyz (00:45):
Thank you, larry, thanks for having me.
Larry Zilliox (00:47):
If you would, can you tell us a little bit about
your background and how you cameto be the department or the
director head over there?
Alissa Czyz (00:55):
Sure, so my name is Alyssa Sizz.
I'm a director in our defensecapabilities and management team
at GAO.
I have spent over 20 years atGAO auditing the Department of
Defense as well as theintelligence community on a
variety of issues, and so partof my body of work that I
oversee is DOD militaryinstallations and housing, and
(01:17):
that is how I came to lead thisparticular review that we'll be
talking about today.
Larry Zilliox (01:21):
Wow, and how long have you been at GAO?
You said 20 years.
Alissa Czyz (01:25):
Yep, I'm coming up on 21 years this month, wow.
Larry Zilliox (01:29):
Well, that's awesome.
Thank you for hanging in there,actually, because in reading
the report I got to say therewere points of it where I could
almost feel the frustration andjump off the page.
It can't be easy auditing DOD.
I can't believe that that's aneasy task.
(01:50):
But I just wanted to highlighta couple of things from the
report that jumped out at me andjust actually read a few things
here for our listeners and sortof level set and establish a
baseline of kind of what we'retalking about but right off the
bat and what the GAO foundsection of the report.
(02:10):
It says DOD does not use itshousing assessments to identify
a comprehensive list of areaswhere service members and their
families are most severelyaffected by housing supply or
affordability challenges.
So I think our listeners willunderstand that affordable
housing is a national crisis orsituation.
(02:33):
Almost 50% of those renters outthere are cost burdened where
they're paying more than 30% oftheir income for housing, either
renting or leasing some sort ofhousing and it's surprising,
but it's no different for themilitary.
(02:54):
In fact, in some places it'sworse.
Some service members reporthaving to take on debt or
commute long distances to affordquality housing, and we'll talk
about that and then a surveythat you did in connection with
this audit was there were 150local government officials
(03:15):
housing officials near militaryinstallations around the country
that were surveyed and reportedthat they felt that the housing
in their area was unaffordable,and I just really surprised at
that.
So two things that I think ourlisteners are not familiar with.
(03:37):
One is that DOD relies on theprivate sector, which would be
housing available to servicemembers off of the installations
for two-thirds of the servicemembers out there.
So only a third of militaryservice members are actually
housed on base number one.
(03:58):
Number two is I didn't knowthis and I was really surprised
is I didn't know this and I wasreally surprised.
Since 1996, dod has beenprivatizing base housing and
virtually all of it almost 100%of it is privately owned, which
came as a shock to me.
Can you talk a little bit aboutthe burden that the lack of
(04:22):
affordable housing puts onservice members, especially
junior enlisted today that youfound as a result of your audit?
Alissa Czyz (04:34):
Sure, thanks, larry .
I'll unpack a little bit ofthat.
You're right.
So for this report, we focusedon off-base housing, and the
majority of service members donot live on base.
They live off of a base nearby,and they get a housing
allowance that they put towardeither renting or buying a home.
So this is the majority offolks here, and I think another
(04:58):
point that you made that I wantto underscore is housing
affordability is not just aproblem for DOD, it's a national
issue here too, so housingprices have increased a lot
during the COVID pandemicparticularly.
Supply is short, demand is high, and so a lot of us are feeling
(05:19):
the pinch of high pricedhousing.
Service members are no different.
I think maybe, though, one ofthe differences is that service
members are no different.
I think maybe, though, one ofthe differences is that service
members often don't get tochoose where they live, so they
are deployed to a certainlocation and then have to find
affordable housing.
So that was really the focus ofour review and of what are the
challenges that these servicemembers are facing as they are
(05:41):
looking for housing, and I wantto underscore also that this was
not a challenge at alllocations that we visited, so we
did a site selection.
We looked at about seveninstallations and we did a
survey.
As you mentioned, in somelocations like Fork, bliss and
Camp Lejeune, service memberswere able to find affordable
(06:04):
housing.
According to folks in our focusgroups, their housing allowance
would allow them to be able tofind something affordable and
quality housing.
In other areas, this was anextreme challenge for service
members.
Larry Zilliox (06:19):
Now, a lot of this is very similar to what our
listeners may have heard aboutin resort areas.
So I'm thinking Colorado, likeAspen, and places like that,
where housing is just soexpensive that the workforce is
unable to live in closeproximity to where they work.
(06:39):
And some of these installationslike Key West was highlighted
(07:00):
where long-term rentals are justalmost unheard of because
landlords just don't want tocommit to that because then
they're missing out on seasonalrentals which they can just
charge through the roof for.
So what did you come up with asan answer to that?
Where there just isn't, there'sno housing on base, but then
it's so hard to find housing offbase, are these branches
willing to pay more money orsubsidize it in some way?
Alissa Czyz (07:21):
Yeah, so that's an issue that came up in our review
.
We actually chose Key West asone of the sites we visited
because, according to DOD data,there were a lot of vacancies in
the area.
So we thought this would beactually a good news story.
But when we did talk with thefolks at Key West, it's exactly
what you said, larry, that thereare vacant rentals outside of
(07:44):
the base but landlords are notoffering those for rent because
they want to hold them for thevacationers and get more money.
So Key West on paper looks likeit's doing pretty well, but
when you're going to dig downbeneath the surface there, it's
actually really a huge challengeto find affordable housing
there.
(08:05):
One of the bottom line of ourreport is that DOD really needs
better information to find outwhat the real situation is at
its various bases.
So you referenced earlier thatDOD is not using its housing
assessments to have acomprehensive list of areas of
critical housing.
That's exactly what we foundright.
So each of the militaryservices is required to do an
(08:28):
assessment of each location andlook at the housing market and
various factors.
They're required to do thatassessment of each location and
look at the housing market andvarious factors.
They're required to do that ata certain interval.
Our report found that a lot ofthose housing assessments were
outdated.
In some cases some of the baseshad not done those.
Some of the commanders at thebases had not done those in
about 10 years.
So a lot has changed in 10years.
(08:50):
So they don't have goodinformation to be able to take
action right.
So first is just gettinginformation, doing those housing
assessments, coming up with acomprehensive list of where
there are issues, where thereare not issues, and then kind of
targeting actions as needed.
But you first have to startwith good information.
Larry Zilliox (09:10):
So I found in the report that it appears as
though each branch uses its ownsort of standards or metrics for
measuring this, and my questionis why isn't there a DOD
standard that all branches use,so that the data is comparable
(09:32):
amongst all branches?
I don't understand why the DODcan't come up with something
that everybody uses, so it'sstandardized.
Alissa Czyz (09:42):
Right.
So we did find also that theOffice of Secretary of Defense
really needs to strengthen theiroversight across the services,
so to come up with standardmethodologies to help the
services do these assessments ina consistent manner and then
use those assessments and otherinformation to kind of inform
(10:03):
the department and have aholistic view of what's going on
.
So we did make a recommendationin that area, but really it's
the Office of Secretary ofDefense there's a chief housing
officer for DOD who isresponsible for this and they do
need better information andconsistency so they can get a
holistic view.
Larry Zilliox (10:21):
It looks as though the National Defense
Authorization Act of 2023 mayaddress the issue of the length
of time that varies betweeninstallations for when they're
actually doing an assessment ofhousing in their local area,
according to your report thatthe NDAA for 2023 requires these
(10:44):
assessments to be done on everyinstallation by 2027 and then
within five years after that, soit looks like there's some sort
of schedule that's been put inplace by Congress.
What's your sense of the faithyou have in that actually being
(11:05):
completed in that time frame?
Alissa Czyz (11:07):
Yeah, congress did act because DOD was not doing
consistent housing assessmentsaccording to its own guidance.
So its own guidance said everyfour years.
There was a little ambiguitywith that guidance.
Congress stepped in and saidfive years.
Right now it's too soon to saythey were late on a few things
that they owed Congress withrelation to housing.
(11:28):
So we are following that.
One of the recommendations wemade is that DOD needs to update
its own guidance to make surethat they are following that
congressional requirement.
Larry Zilliox (11:38):
I know there are service members that here we're
talking too, by the way, of justCONUS assignments and
installations we're not talkingabout internationally.
Dod pretty much owns all thehousing on its installations on
bases overseas.
But this is just here in theUnited States.
They get on a list, you know,they get assigned, they travel
(12:01):
to that base and they check inand check with the housing
office and they get on a listfor on-base housing and in the
meantime they're forced to seekhousing in the community.
There are a number of servicemembers that I know that don't
take their families with them,and because their family's not
with them, then you have asergeant or a tech sergeant or
(12:24):
someone senior enlisted goinginto the barracks and basically
living in the barracks whiletheir family stays at home
because they can't afford it orthey just don't have to pay out
of their own pocket.
Is there anything in the worksthat you know of that there's
going to be some sort ofincrease in base housing
(12:48):
allowance that will help servicemembers defray these costs or
offset these costs in certainareas?
Alissa Czyz (12:55):
Right, larry.
So we heard similar things withsome service members in our
focus groups too, some of thechallenges that you mentioned of
having to use up all of theirsavings or take on significant
debt to be able to affordquality housing.
Some of them had to live farfrom a base or commute long
distances, and some did have toleave family members behind in
(13:18):
other states because theycouldn't find suitable housing
that would house their entirefamily at an affordable level
for them.
Some of them had to take onsecond jobs or, you know, choose
housing with lesser qualityconditions as well.
So, these are all very seriousissues.
Dod has a number of tools andwe point this out in the report.
(13:41):
There are challenges with eachof the tools.
They can look at leasing.
They can look at differenttypes of pays or increasing
housing allowances in certainareas.
They have different tools thatthey can look at.
Really, kind of the centralmessage, though, of our report
is kind of going back to ourearlier discussion.
(14:02):
Dod needs good information to beable to make informed decisions
.
So they do do a survey, atenant survey of satisfaction
with housing, but that surveyonly goes to folks that are
living on base.
So you know the majority ofservice members live off base
and they're not getting thatinformation from the service
members.
The OD also does an annualstatus of forces survey.
(14:25):
They used to include questionsabout housing in that survey.
Several years ago they removedthose questions to try to
shorten the survey and also atthat time housing wasn't a
priority for them.
They've since been required toadd those questions back onto
the survey.
So they will get some moreinformation there.
If they start doing the housingassessments consistently and
(14:49):
develop a comprehensive list ofhousing areas, these will all
help inform, kind of whatactions need to be taken.
I will say you know the DODofficials that we spoke with
take this issue very seriously.
They want to make sure servicemembers are taken care of, but
our recommendations really go tohaving good information to be
able to inform decisions.
Larry Zilliox (15:15):
Well, that's great.
I think in the end, ourlisteners probably know that it
just comes down to money, thatcost of living increases or COLA
increases need to be done inthese areas and, like you say,
they just need to look a littlebit to see where they're having
these issues.
It's not rocket science, really.
What advice would you have forour listeners if they want to
(15:36):
help bring awareness to thisissue?
Would the best thing be to justreach out to their
representatives and ask them topress the issue?
Alissa Czyz (15:45):
I think so, or talk to the service members too
about their experiences.
I think everybody wants youknow.
Service members have a lot ontheir plates, a lot of stress
that they're dealing with.
Finding affordable housingshould not be one of those
stressors.
So everything that we can do tohelp the service members is
important.
Obviously, we point to the sixrecommendations we made in our
(16:06):
report.
You know we did this report forCongress and you know we know
that the Congress takes thisissue very seriously.
Dod did concur with all of ourrecommendations.
So we will continue to followup with the department to ensure
that they are taking actions toaddress the six recommendations
.
Larry Zilliox (16:24):
Wow, listeners, I think that's you know.
That's going to be.
The key here is follow up withyour congressmen, congresswomen,
senators, and say, hey, this isa problem and this is not fair.
Service members shouldn't haveto pay out of their own pocket
to find a place where they canlive just because there's a
(16:47):
shortage of base housing.
So, yes, reach out, and I'mgoing to have a link to the
report in the show notes, soread it for yourself.
It's 80 pages or so.
It's really interesting workand I really appreciate the work
that you all do.
(17:08):
You know, without GAO, so muchwould never be understood about
a number of things out there,and I think GAO doesn't get the
credit that it deserves for theamount of work that you do on
behalf of Congress and theAmerican people for sure.
I have one last question, and Iask this to a lot of different
(17:32):
guests, but especially in yourline of work how do you see AI
contributing to what you do inthe future?
Alissa Czyz (17:43):
Well, I think that's a little bit outside the
scope of this review too, but Ithink think there are a lot of
potential benefits to AI if weare able to implement it
responsibly.
It could be a big help to us interms of information gathering
and that sort of thing, but itdoesn't, you know, of course,
replace the need for kind ofwhat our bread and butter is.
(18:05):
We get out on the ground andtalk to folks, you know.
Our teams go out to talk withservice members, do focus groups
, do surveys, you know, and tryto uncover what is really going
on and make recommendations forthe Congress.
Larry Zilliox (18:19):
Well, listen, thank you so much for joining us
I really appreciate it andthanks for all the great work
that you all do.
Alissa Czyz (18:27):
Great.
Thank you, Larry.
Thanks for having me.
Larry Zilliox (18:29):
For our listeners .
If you have any questions orsuggestions, you can reach us at
podcast at willingwarriorsorg.
We'll have another episode nextMonday morning at 0500.
Until then, thanks forlistening.
Good morning.
I'm your host, Larry Zilliox,Director of Culinary Services
here at the Warrior Retreat atBull Run, and this week our
guest is Alissa Czyz.
She's the Director of DefenseCapabilities and Management
Section Department not sure whatit's officially called over at
GAO and I asked her to join usthis week because I ran across a
(00:23):
report that they had done.
I asked her to join us thisweek because I ran across a
report that they had done titledMilitary Housing DOD Should
Address Critical Supply andAffordability Challenges for
Service Members, and I readthrough this report and I was
really surprised.
A number of things jumped outat me.
So, Alissa, welcome to thepodcast.
I really appreciate you beinghere with us.
Alissa Czyz (00:45):
Thank you, larry, thanks for having me.
Larry Zilliox (00:47):
If you would, can you tell us a little bit about
your background and how you cameto be the department or the
director head over there?
Alissa Czyz (00:55):
Sure, so my name is Alyssa Sizz.
I'm a director in our defensecapabilities and management team
at GAO.
I have spent over 20 years atGAO auditing the Department of
Defense as well as theintelligence community on a
variety of issues, and so partof my body of work that I
oversee is DOD militaryinstallations and housing, and
(01:17):
that is how I came to lead thisparticular review that we'll be
talking about today.
Larry Zilliox (01:21):
Wow, and how long have you been at GAO?
You said 20 years.
Alissa Czyz (01:25):
Yep, I'm coming up on 21 years this month, wow.
Larry Zilliox (01:29):
Well, that's awesome.
Thank you for hanging in there,actually, because in reading
the report I got to say therewere points of it where I could
almost feel the frustration andjump off the page.
It can't be easy auditing DOD.
I can't believe that that's aneasy task.
(01:50):
But I just wanted to highlighta couple of things from the
report that jumped out at me andjust actually read a few things
here for our listeners and sortof level set and establish a
baseline of kind of what we'retalking about but right off the
bat and what the GAO foundsection of the report.
(02:10):
It says DOD does not use itshousing assessments to identify
a comprehensive list of areaswhere service members and their
families are most severelyaffected by housing supply or
affordability challenges.
So I think our listeners willunderstand that affordable
housing is a national crisis orsituation.
(02:33):
Almost 50% of those renters outthere are cost burdened where
they're paying more than 30% oftheir income for housing, either
renting or leasing some sort ofhousing and it's surprising,
but it's no different for themilitary.
(02:54):
In fact, in some places it'sworse.
Some service members reporthaving to take on debt or
commute long distances to affordquality housing, and we'll talk
about that and then a surveythat you did in connection with
this audit was there were 150local government officials
(03:15):
housing officials near militaryinstallations around the country
that were surveyed and reportedthat they felt that the housing
in their area was unaffordable,and I just really surprised at
that.
So two things that I think ourlisteners are not familiar with.
(03:37):
One is that DOD relies on theprivate sector, which would be
housing available to servicemembers off of the installations
for two-thirds of the servicemembers out there.
So only a third of militaryservice members are actually
housed on base number one.
(03:58):
Number two is I didn't knowthis and I was really surprised
is I didn't know this and I wasreally surprised.
Since 1996, dod has beenprivatizing base housing and
virtually all of it almost 100%of it is privately owned, which
came as a shock to me.
Can you talk a little bit aboutthe burden that the lack of
(04:22):
affordable housing puts onservice members, especially
junior enlisted today that youfound as a result of your audit?
Alissa Czyz (04:34):
Sure, thanks, larry .
I'll unpack a little bit ofthat.
You're right.
So for this report, we focusedon off-base housing, and the
majority of service members donot live on base.
They live off of a base nearby,and they get a housing
allowance that they put towardeither renting or buying a home.
So this is the majority offolks here, and I think another
(04:58):
point that you made that I wantto underscore is housing
affordability is not just aproblem for DOD, it's a national
issue here too, so housingprices have increased a lot
during the COVID pandemicparticularly.
Supply is short, demand is high, and so a lot of us are feeling
(05:19):
the pinch of high pricedhousing.
Service members are no different.
I think maybe, though, one ofthe differences is that service
members are no different.
I think maybe, though, one ofthe differences is that service
members often don't get tochoose where they live, so they
are deployed to a certainlocation and then have to find
affordable housing.
So that was really the focus ofour review and of what are the
challenges that these servicemembers are facing as they are
(05:41):
looking for housing, and I wantto underscore also that this was
not a challenge at alllocations that we visited, so we
did a site selection.
We looked at about seveninstallations and we did a
survey.
As you mentioned, in somelocations like Fork, bliss and
Camp Lejeune, service memberswere able to find affordable
(06:04):
housing.
According to folks in our focusgroups, their housing allowance
would allow them to be able tofind something affordable and
quality housing.
In other areas, this was anextreme challenge for service
members.
Larry Zilliox (06:19):
Now, a lot of this is very similar to what our
listeners may have heard aboutin resort areas.
So I'm thinking Colorado, likeAspen, and places like that,
where housing is just soexpensive that the workforce is
unable to live in closeproximity to where they work.
(06:39):
And some of these installationslike Key West was highlighted
(07:00):
where long-term rentals are justalmost unheard of because
landlords just don't want tocommit to that because then
they're missing out on seasonalrentals which they can just
charge through the roof for.
So what did you come up with asan answer to that?
Where there just isn't, there'sno housing on base, but then
it's so hard to find housing offbase, are these branches
willing to pay more money orsubsidize it in some way?
Alissa Czyz (07:21):
Yeah, so that's an issue that came up in our review
.
We actually chose Key West asone of the sites we visited
because, according to DOD data,there were a lot of vacancies in
the area.
So we thought this would beactually a good news story.
But when we did talk with thefolks at Key West, it's exactly
what you said, larry, that thereare vacant rentals outside of
(07:44):
the base but landlords are notoffering those for rent because
they want to hold them for thevacationers and get more money.
So Key West on paper looks likeit's doing pretty well, but
when you're going to dig downbeneath the surface there, it's
actually really a huge challengeto find affordable housing
there.
(08:05):
One of the bottom line of ourreport is that DOD really needs
better information to find outwhat the real situation is at
its various bases.
So you referenced earlier thatDOD is not using its housing
assessments to have acomprehensive list of areas of
critical housing.
That's exactly what we foundright.
So each of the militaryservices is required to do an
(08:28):
assessment of each location andlook at the housing market and
various factors.
They're required to do thatassessment of each location and
look at the housing market andvarious factors.
They're required to do that ata certain interval.
Our report found that a lot ofthose housing assessments were
outdated.
In some cases some of the baseshad not done those.
Some of the commanders at thebases had not done those in
about 10 years.
So a lot has changed in 10years.
(08:50):
So they don't have goodinformation to be able to take
action right.
So first is just gettinginformation, doing those housing
assessments, coming up with acomprehensive list of where
there are issues, where thereare not issues, and then kind of
targeting actions as needed.
But you first have to startwith good information.
Larry Zilliox (09:10):
So I found in the report that it appears as
though each branch uses its ownsort of standards or metrics for
measuring this, and my questionis why isn't there a DOD
standard that all branches use,so that the data is comparable
(09:32):
amongst all branches?
I don't understand why the DODcan't come up with something
that everybody uses, so it'sstandardized.
Alissa Czyz (09:42):
Right.
So we did find also that theOffice of Secretary of Defense
really needs to strengthen theiroversight across the services,
so to come up with standardmethodologies to help the
services do these assessments ina consistent manner and then
use those assessments and otherinformation to kind of inform
(10:03):
the department and have aholistic view of what's going on
.
So we did make a recommendationin that area, but really it's
the Office of Secretary ofDefense there's a chief housing
officer for DOD who isresponsible for this and they do
need better information andconsistency so they can get a
holistic view.
Larry Zilliox (10:21):
It looks as though the National Defense
Authorization Act of 2023 mayaddress the issue of the length
of time that varies betweeninstallations for when they're
actually doing an assessment ofhousing in their local area,
according to your report thatthe NDAA for 2023 requires these
(10:44):
assessments to be done on everyinstallation by 2027 and then
within five years after that, soit looks like there's some sort
of schedule that's been put inplace by Congress.
What's your sense of the faithyou have in that actually being
(11:05):
completed in that time frame?
Alissa Czyz (11:07):
Yeah, congress did act because DOD was not doing
consistent housing assessmentsaccording to its own guidance.
So its own guidance said everyfour years.
There was a little ambiguitywith that guidance.
Congress stepped in and saidfive years.
Right now it's too soon to saythey were late on a few things
that they owed Congress withrelation to housing.
(11:28):
So we are following that.
One of the recommendations wemade is that DOD needs to update
its own guidance to make surethat they are following that
congressional requirement.
Larry Zilliox (11:38):
I know there are service members that here we're
talking too, by the way, of justCONUS assignments and
installations we're not talkingabout internationally.
Dod pretty much owns all thehousing on its installations on
bases overseas.
But this is just here in theUnited States.
They get on a list, you know,they get assigned, they travel
(12:01):
to that base and they check inand check with the housing
office and they get on a listfor on-base housing and in the
meantime they're forced to seekhousing in the community.
There are a number of servicemembers that I know that don't
take their families with them,and because their family's not
with them, then you have asergeant or a tech sergeant or
(12:24):
someone senior enlisted goinginto the barracks and basically
living in the barracks whiletheir family stays at home
because they can't afford it orthey just don't have to pay out
of their own pocket.
Is there anything in the worksthat you know of that there's
going to be some sort ofincrease in base housing
(12:48):
allowance that will help servicemembers defray these costs or
offset these costs in certainareas?
Alissa Czyz (12:55):
Right, larry.
So we heard similar things withsome service members in our
focus groups too, some of thechallenges that you mentioned of
having to use up all of theirsavings or take on significant
debt to be able to affordquality housing.
Some of them had to live farfrom a base or commute long
distances, and some did have toleave family members behind in
(13:18):
other states because theycouldn't find suitable housing
that would house their entirefamily at an affordable level
for them.
Some of them had to take onsecond jobs or, you know, choose
housing with lesser qualityconditions as well.
So, these are all very seriousissues.
Dod has a number of tools andwe point this out in the report.
(13:41):
There are challenges with eachof the tools.
They can look at leasing.
They can look at differenttypes of pays or increasing
housing allowances in certainareas.
They have different tools thatthey can look at.
Really, kind of the centralmessage, though, of our report
is kind of going back to ourearlier discussion.
(14:02):
Dod needs good information to beable to make informed decisions
.
So they do do a survey, atenant survey of satisfaction
with housing, but that surveyonly goes to folks that are
living on base.
So you know the majority ofservice members live off base
and they're not getting thatinformation from the service
members.
The OD also does an annualstatus of forces survey.
(14:25):
They used to include questionsabout housing in that survey.
Several years ago they removedthose questions to try to
shorten the survey and also atthat time housing wasn't a
priority for them.
They've since been required toadd those questions back onto
the survey.
So they will get some moreinformation there.
If they start doing the housingassessments consistently and
(14:49):
develop a comprehensive list ofhousing areas, these will all
help inform, kind of whatactions need to be taken.
I will say you know the DODofficials that we spoke with
take this issue very seriously.
They want to make sure servicemembers are taken care of, but
our recommendations really go tohaving good information to be
able to inform decisions.
Larry Zilliox (15:15):
Well, that's great.
I think in the end, ourlisteners probably know that it
just comes down to money, thatcost of living increases or COLA
increases need to be done inthese areas and, like you say,
they just need to look a littlebit to see where they're having
these issues.
It's not rocket science, really.
What advice would you have forour listeners if they want to
(15:36):
help bring awareness to thisissue?
Would the best thing be to justreach out to their
representatives and ask them topress the issue?
Alissa Czyz (15:45):
I think so, or talk to the service members too
about their experiences.
I think everybody wants youknow.
Service members have a lot ontheir plates, a lot of stress
that they're dealing with.
Finding affordable housingshould not be one of those
stressors.
So everything that we can do tohelp the service members is
important.
Obviously, we point to the sixrecommendations we made in our
(16:06):
report.
You know we did this report forCongress and you know we know
that the Congress takes thisissue very seriously.
Dod did concur with all of ourrecommendations.
So we will continue to followup with the department to ensure
that they are taking actions toaddress the six recommendations
.
Larry Zilliox (16:24):
Wow, listeners, I think that's you know.
That's going to be.
The key here is follow up withyour congressmen, congresswomen,
senators, and say, hey, this isa problem and this is not fair.
Service members shouldn't haveto pay out of their own pocket
to find a place where they canlive just because there's a
(16:47):
shortage of base housing.
So, yes, reach out, and I'mgoing to have a link to the
report in the show notes, soread it for yourself.
It's 80 pages or so.
It's really interesting workand I really appreciate the work
that you all do.
(17:08):
You know, without GAO, so muchwould never be understood about
a number of things out there,and I think GAO doesn't get the
credit that it deserves for theamount of work that you do on
behalf of Congress and theAmerican people for sure.
I have one last question, and Iask this to a lot of different
(17:32):
guests, but especially in yourline of work how do you see AI
contributing to what you do inthe future?
Alissa Czyz (17:43):
Well, I think that's a little bit outside the
scope of this review too, but Ithink think there are a lot of
potential benefits to AI if weare able to implement it
responsibly.
It could be a big help to us interms of information gathering
and that sort of thing, but itdoesn't, you know, of course,
replace the need for kind ofwhat our bread and butter is.
(18:05):
We get out on the ground andtalk to folks, you know.
Our teams go out to talk withservice members, do focus groups
, do surveys, you know, and tryto uncover what is really going
on and make recommendations forthe Congress.
Larry Zilliox (18:19):
Well, listen, thank you so much for joining us
I really appreciate it andthanks for all the great work
that you all do.
Alissa Czyz (18:27):
Great.
Thank you, Larry.
Thanks for having me.
Larry Zilliox (18:29):
For our listeners .
If you have any questions orsuggestions, you can reach us at
podcast at willingwarriorsorg.
We'll have another episode nextMonday morning at 0500.
Until then, thanks forlistening.
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