July 30, 2025 • 28 mins
Gary Jarboe [00:00:00]:
That's why I keep coming back. This is my 10th time to come back as a P. Well, and I.
Jennifer [00:00:04]:
Think that, Gary, I hope you hear this. In all sincerity, that's why we wanted to ask you these questions for the podcast, because I think it's like, it's such a gift that you give here. And I'm like, I know other people want to hear that in terms of your experience and sharing it.
Ashlee [00:00:20]:
I also think it helps end the stigma, too. Like, I think this is exactly what we need is for people in your position to be like, open up. It is okay to go get that help. There is not a time limit on this either. Right. Like, you are. You are being open and honest. And we're so grateful that you're on here saying, like, I am an older gentleman, and yet I'm making progress still in my life because I've decided to go open up to someone about what I've been through and what I've seen.
Jennifer [00:00:51]:
Welcome back to the podcast. I'm Jennifer.
Ashlee [00:00:53]:
And I'm Ashlee. And you know what, Jennifer, you get to say what we have, who we have today.
Jennifer [00:00:58]:
Well, as always, we have a very special guest with us today, and I'm so excited that he is willing to be here and share. So I'm just going to give it to you. You want to tell the listeners who you are and a little bit about yourself.
Gary Jarboe [00:01:09]:
My name is Gary Jarvo. I'm a retired sergeant with the Owensboro, Kentucky Police Department. My background when. When I was 18 years old, I joined the Marine Corps in 1969, which was, you know, people would say that's pretty crazy thing to do in the middle of the Vietnam War. But I enlisted for four years and spent four years on transport airplanes as flight crew before I got out. When I got back from overseas, I married my high school sweetheart, and we've been married this month for 53 years.
Jennifer [00:01:39]:
Congratulations.
Gary Jarboe [00:01:41]:
We have two sons and two grown sons and three grandsons who we love to go see.
Ashlee [00:01:48]:
Karen is outnumbered.
Gary Jarboe [00:01:49]:
Yes, definitely. In 1980, I was hired by the Owensboro Police department and spent 21 years there.
Ashlee [00:01:59]:
Wow.
Gary Jarboe [00:02:00]:
Retired after I'd had all the fun I could stand and all the fun that they could stand, and worked for another company for 13 years, and we've both been retired completely for the last 10.
Jennifer [00:02:12]:
Wonderful. I appreciate you sharing that extensive resume, and I want to thank you for your service.
Ashlee [00:02:17]:
Yes.
Jennifer [00:02:17]:
I have very important to say. You know, one thing I really appreciate about you, Gary, is that you're always open about your experience and saying you know, Ashlee and I are mental health professionals and saying, where was this 30 years ago? So can you talk a little bit about the difference of today in terms of just us using the word mental health and the experience of when you were first on the department in your career and what mental health was like in terms of that experience?
Gary Jarboe [00:02:48]:
Yeah. My only experience with any mental health professional until I came to PCIS was an interview I had when I was hired. And it was. I don't know how I can put this delicately.
Jennifer [00:03:03]:
You don't have to.
Gary Jarboe [00:03:04]:
But none of us were impressed with the practitioner that we talked to.
Jennifer [00:03:08]:
I understand that is delicate.
Gary Jarboe [00:03:11]:
And throughout my career, we had an employee assistance program like you're required to have. No one that I know of would have ever called employee assistance because we knew it was a direct line to the chief and. Or city hall. And we instinctively have a distrust of what we don't understand. And we have all heard horror stories of people's bad experiences with mental health professionals, and that's with any. Any occupation. But cops are control freaks. They don't want to give up control to anybody.
Gary Jarboe [00:03:50]:
And to. And you don't bear your soul to anybody. And that's. And that's a problem for us. And I'll be honest, it was for me and dealing with. With my family, you know, we don't even talk way too often. We don't talk to our families about things and. Sure.
Gary Jarboe [00:04:07]:
Not going to talk to some stranger.
Jennifer [00:04:09]:
Exactly.
Ashlee [00:04:10]:
Ex.
Jennifer [00:04:11]:
I appreciate you sharing that experience that you had, and I'm gonna dig a little bit deeper. You know, I appreciate you sharing your experience with the military, and I was very honored to get to work with service members and their families. And I do believe that the military is work
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(00:00):
That's why I keep coming back. This is my 10th time to come
back if appear. Well, and I think that, Gary, I
hope you hear this in all sincerity, that's why we wanted
to ask you these questions for the podcast because I think it's
like it's such a gift that you give here.
And I'm like, I know other people want to hear that in
terms of your experience and sharing it.
(00:20):
I also think it helps end the stigma too.
Like I think this is exactly what we need is for people in
your position to be like, open up.
It is OK to go get that help. There is not a time limit on
this either, right? Like you are, you are being open
and honest. And we're so grateful that
you're on here saying like I am an older gentleman, and yet I'm
(00:45):
making progress still in my lifebecause I've decided to go open
up to someone about what I've been through and what I've seen.
Welcome back to the podcast. I'm Jennifer.
And I'm Ashley and you know what, Jennifer, you get to say
what we who we have today. Well, as always, we have a very
special guest with us today and I'm so excited that he is
willing to be here and share. So I'm just going to give it to
(01:05):
you. You're going to tell the
listeners who you are and a little bit about yourself.
My name is Gary Jarboe. I'm a retired Sergeant with the
Owensboro, KY, Police Department.
My background when when I was 18years old, I joined the Marine
Corps in 1969, which was, you know, people would say that's
pretty crazy thing to do in the middle of the Vietnam War.
(01:26):
But I've enlisted for four yearsand spent four years on
transport airplanes and flight crew before I got out.
When I got back from overseas, Imarried my high school
sweetheart and we've been married this month for 53 years.
We have two sons and two grown sons and three grandsons who we
(01:46):
love to go see. Karen is outnumbered.
Yes, definitely. In 1980, I was hired by the
Owensboro Police Department and spent 21 years there, retired
after I'd had all the fun I could stand and all the fun that
they could stand, and worked foranother company for 13 years and
(02:09):
we've both been retired completely for the last 10.
Wonderful. I appreciate you sharing that
extensive resume and I want to thank you for your service.
Yes, very important to say. You know, one thing I really
appreciate about you, Gary, is that you're always open about
your experience and saying, you know, Ashley and I are mental
health professionals and saying where was this 30 years ago?
(02:32):
So can you talk a little bit about the difference of today in
terms of just us using the word mental health and the experience
of when you were first on the department in your career and
what mental health was like in terms of that experience?
Yeah, my only experience with any mental health professional
(02:53):
until I came to PCIS was an interview I had when I was
hired. And it was.
I don't know how I can put this delicately.
You don't have to. But none of us were impressed
with the practitioner that we talked to.
I. Understand that is delicate.
And throughout my career, we hadan employee assistance program
(03:15):
like you're required to have. No one that I know of would have
ever called employee assistance because we knew it was a Direct
Line to the chief and or City Hall.
And we instinctively have a distrust of, of what we don't
understand. And we have all heard horror
(03:38):
stories of people's bad experiences with mental health
professionals. And that's with any, any
occupation. But cops are control freaks.
They don't want to give up control to anybody and to and
you don't bare your soul to anybody.
And that's and that's a problem for us.
And it, and I'll be honest, it was for me and, and dealing
(04:00):
with, with my family, you know, we don't even talk way too
often. We don't talk to our families
about things and sure not going to talk to some stranger.
Exactly, I appreciate you sharing that experience that you
had and I'm, I'm going to dig a little bit deeper.
You know, I appreciate you sharing your experience with the
(04:21):
military. And I, I was very honored to get
to work with service members andtheir families.
And I do believe that the military is working hard to
destigmatize mental health. But being in the Marine Corps,
being at war, sometimes I see that experience of veterans that
(04:42):
become police officers that it'sso ingrained of your soldier.
Suck it up. I didn't know if that was a
reinforcer or that made things different for you.
You know, I, I really don't know.
And, and I'll have to be honest,I spent four years in the Marine
Corps and I spent a little time in Vietnam, but I only saw the
rice paddies from altitude. I was flying.
(05:05):
I did not spend a year in Vietnam.
We would run detachments in country and, and I was over
there at the end of the Marine Corps involvement in Vietnam.
So I, I wouldn't even in there the entire time.
But it's you go to Parris Islandin 1969, they tell you you're
only there for one thing. And you know, they told us we
(05:26):
were all going to Vietnam, whichat that stage of the war, I
understand very few of the people I went to boot camp with
actually went in country. But it's the attitude that they
teach you and and it's the hard headed attitude.
And, and I'll be honest with you, that hard headed attitude
actually probably saved me. Oh.
Absolutely. Many years later when I had when
(05:47):
I was hit by a car and and I wasoff work two years and my wife
has told people that he probablycouldn't have come back if he
hadn't gotten hard headed at Parris Island because I wasn't
going to stay down. That sounds like a Marine Corps.
Yeah, really hard at it. Yeah, absolutely.
And and when I hear you talking about that too, like, I can't
(06:07):
help but think like, how much ofthat do you think translated to
your home life? Like way too much, way too much.
Yeah. So it's it's hard, right?
It's hard to get in that mindsetand then just change it.
I don't even know if that's possible for a lot of our first
responders or for people who like you like a Marine, right?
Like, yeah. And but yet it's so beneficial
(06:28):
on one side because we like you just said like hard headed and
you got through something so bigin your life.
And then yet it can be very impactful on the other side of
things too. Did you start to notice that at
all? It kind of going deep here with
your family, but like how that translated to your family A.
Little bit. Not until later, yeah.
You know, you, you don't show vulnerability.
(06:49):
Yeah, you can't be vulnerable. You know, you've got to walk
into the bar fight necessarily walk in by yourself.
But I mean, you, you weighed in the middle of it.
And when I was a when I was a rookie police officer, it was I
always had this thing in my mindthat, you know, how will I react
when I get to my my first fight because I was a little skinny
(07:12):
guy. I've gained the number of pounds
now. But yeah, I was, I was a pretty
thin guy, barely met the minimumweight limits to get into into
the Marine Corps. And, and until I had my first
knock down drag out on the street, I had that that doubt in
my mind. And it happened to be with my
(07:33):
training officer several months after I'd gotten up by myself.
And then, you know, he made the comment that you done good,
rookie, and that that was what Ineeded.
And that's what I did the rest of the time I was in.
Yeah, but yet you, you don't have that vulnerability.
And I didn't, I didn't tell a lot of things at home because I
(07:54):
didn't want to burden her. And she had never been exposed
to the kind of life that I was seeing every day.
I mean, at her family, there wasthere was no violence.
There was no alcoholism. I mean that that she'd never
seen domestic violence. And, you know, she used to say
(08:14):
that that she had heard all the stories, but what she heard was
the stories that we would joke about when we get together.
The PG stories, yeah. She didn't hear about the the
really bad ones. Someones where I was scared half
to death and you know, because you just don't burden your
family with that. Right.
And I think it's that thing thatis such a a tightrope to to walk
(08:37):
because I think it is. I love my family.
I would not want to burden them.I don't want to upset them.
I want to, you know, I'm protecting all these people in
my community. Of course, I want to protect my
family. And yet that sometimes can be
missed. Oh, we we paid a price for it.
Really, and I've said, you know,when I come to to the PCIS that
(09:01):
where was this 35 years ago, it would have been a whole lot
easier on on my whole family andon me had I've been able to, to
do what I've I've done since I've been here.
Yeah. Do you feel like your connection
then to your wife has grown stronger?
Oh definitely, definitely. And after we came here, we
talked about things and she heard about things that she had
(09:23):
never heard about in all the years since I got on the
department. Yeah.
And and even other things that we we have better communication
now than we had before. And I'm going to take a second
here to tell our our listeners alittle bit.
Like we won't go into details about the title or anything of
the program, but it is a mental health program that we met Gary
at that they get to come and it's for first responders and
(09:45):
they get to come and talk about some of these intense critical
incidences that they've been through and honestly open up and
get the help for mental health professionals and peers who have
been through it as well and get to talk with their families.
Wives are included. Spouses of any kind are
included. And so I just want to put it out
there because we're referencing it so much of like, I mean, I
think what's really powerful is that you were you were retired
(10:08):
and decided. Yeah.
I've been retired 21 years before I came.
Oh wow. Because it didn't exist at all
while I was working. Right, like the mental health
world didn't. But is it OK if I ask and if
this is too much, let us know Like what, what made you decide
finally to say, hey, I'm I got stuff I got to work on and I'm
going to go do that even after the career?
(10:29):
Well, a couple of friends of mine that I had worked with and
had retired and got back into it, it just in conversation told
me about PCIS. I'd never heard of it until a
little over two years ago. And they were telling me about
it and they both were raving about it, said it's great, you
need to, you need to go. So I did a little research and
looked at it. I looked online.
(10:50):
I thought I knew I had some demons hanging around.
And I sat down with with Karen and I said, would you go to this
with me? And she said, yeah.
So got online and got myself into it.
And I'll be honest with you, on Monday I was trying to figure
out a way that I could run. Understandably.
(11:12):
Run. Yep.
And on Wednesday, driving home, I was saying, where was this 35
years ago? You know, I hate to say this,
but I think you're a little bit of an outlier to know that
you've been retired. Ashley and I talk a lot about
the impact of the career and then retirement can be a really
dangerous place sometimes for officers.
(11:33):
Do you care to share a little bit like what helps?
I mean, you said, you know, I had these these demons and being
open, but unfortunately people that retire from a first
responder career, that can be some hard times.
And if you can share a little bit like what was helpful for
you in terms of or what has beenhelpful for you in terms of
retirement? Well.
I. Came in here with with one thing
(11:55):
that had had bothered me and hadbothered me for years and I
talked about it when I was here and then I realized that that
was just one of many. I have had a hell, I've lost
count 6-7 follow up sessions with an MHP since then.
You know, I'd, I'd, I call Hannah my savior, but it's, and
(12:19):
some of it goes back to my childhood.
But there were things that that had really bothered me.
I spent five years, about 90% ofmy time we spent investigating
sexual abuse of children. And you know, that stuff wears
on you. Absolutely.
And some of the other things that that I was in and and, you
know, I had, I had the the some guilt because of I was in the
(12:43):
Marine Corps. I went to Vietnam.
There were times that I was hesitant to even say that I was
a Vietnam vet because I wasn't in the rice Paddy.
You know, I wasn't out there Andand that's, and there's a whole
dynamic in that too, and that's not unusual.
Oh, it's not there's, it's something I read several months
ago when I, I sent it to a friend of mine that had even
more issues with that than I did.
(13:04):
And one of the first lines is ifyou've, if you've been deployed
10 times, you think you should have done more or if you
deployed once, you know, you, you think you should have done
more. So no matter what we do, the
idea is that we did what we weretold to do while we were there
and that's what our service was supposed to be.
But it's it's, you know, I'm 73 years old and I've got a lot of
(13:29):
crap baggage that I'm carrying from a lot of different things.
But this has been, you know, if somebody had told me I was when
I came here that I was actually going to sit down with a mental
health professional. But yes, thank you.
And it's the same response I have gotten.
And I've kind of made it my mission to talk to retirees that
(13:50):
I know to try to get them to come.
No, we don't talk about that. And I sure don't talk about
that. And we're a hard nut to crack.
Well. Understandably.
And, you know, I don't think that there's anything scarier
than being vulnerable. Especially for control freaks
like we are. Exactly.
Exactly, and there's a lot more comfortability walking into a
(14:11):
bar fight than there is walking into a therapist's office.
For sure 'cause I I. I at least have a clue what's
going to happen in the bar fight.
First time I sat down with a with a mental health
professional I had no clue. We're pretty scared.
I was just about. To say you.
Are you? You frightened me all to death.
Never. Married 53 years, That's
(14:33):
incredible. And again, just she's an.
Angel Well, I already. Know that, but any secrets, any
advice that you can give to people in terms of what it takes
to be married for 53 years besides the fact that your wife
has to be an Angel? Well.
And it would it's even you know,and then you to to put it in
terms that I use my wife marrieda Marine who became a cop.
(14:57):
So she has put up with so much and you know, and neither one of
us are perfect. We've, we've had our bad times.
I don't know. I've met her.
She might be perfect. Well, she's yes.
I mean, her birthday is my birthday.
Perfection. But we don't live with that.
Yeah, we, I won't tell any stories, but you know, it's the
(15:18):
commitment that I, I read something online the other day
and online it has to be true. The the thing was, somebody asks
a woman that had been married for 60 years what her secret
was. And she said we come from a
generation that when something is broken or not working right,
(15:40):
you don't throw it away, you fixit.
Yeah. And I thought that was a pretty
powerful statement. Oh absolutely.
It is important to work through things and I have seen
relationships that work through that brokenness and man, they're
even stronger because of it instead of walking away.
(16:02):
And I had, there were times thatspecially with on the department
that I was, I was certainly not the easiest guy to live with.
And I, I had, I had issues and didn't know how to handle them,
but, you know, didn't work them out perfectly, but worked them
out. And we've, and we've stayed
together and, and we're better now than we were a few years
(16:24):
ago. Wow.
And I mean, I, I see that happenin relationship and with family
dynamics is when you are in thissituation, you kind of withdraw
even more. And you know, I've always
reference families as this cogs in a watch, you know, and they
(16:45):
all kind of have to fit in orderfor the watch for the family to
work. And when somebody withdraws more
and more, it's hard for those cogs of a family to function.
And I think it says a lot that, you know, recognizing that and
saying like, but we're still, we're going to still keep time,
you know, we're still going to figure out that, you know, I
(17:08):
definitely want to be respectfulof your boys.
But I also think that they have big professions and have worked
really hard. So I don't know if you want to
share a little bit about what it's like being a dad and being
an officer. You know, it was I always
worried and I was talking to somebody last night that we
(17:33):
never really sat down and talkedabout that Dad was going to work
and that something might happen to her.
I didn't know how to bring that up.
They definitely saw me put on a gun and a vest every day.
They saw me with a black eye forsix weeks.
One time a broken hand. They have gotten up in the
(17:53):
morning and back in these days before blood borne pathogens,
you had a bloody uniform shirt. You put it in ice water.
Well, they've gotten up and there's in the kitchen sink is a
bloody uniform shirt and ice water.
Because I came home wasn't my blood, but I came home and and
changed uniform shirts and and went back to work.
And I get it. It was avoidance.
(18:14):
I didn't know what to what to say.
So I didn't say anything. Yeah, after right there that
was. Powerful after.
I decided that we were coming, we were on vacation together and
I got the boys and took them off.
We just sat down and and talked.Apologized for the way I had
(18:34):
been because I know I was an asshole at times, Probably a lot
of times. They weren't concerned.
They said I wasn't as bad as I seem to think I was, which made
me feel better. Yeah, of course.
Sounds like. They love you a lot.
When that's, I mean, that's whathappens when we love our family
members. There's Grace and I'm standing.
(18:54):
I think that speaks. To what we even do on this
podcast, right, is like I'm veryopen about some of the struggles
that I've had with my own dad and you know what I mean?
Like Jennifer is too. And yet we love them more than
like my, you know, like my dad hung the moon, you know what I
mean? And I feel so like we're, that
speaks volumes that because I dothink there's truth to a lot of
first responder children. We can look at our our parent
(19:17):
who is the 1st responder and be like, man, they are rough or
they are strict or they are assholes.
I've said that in my head beforetoo, right?
Like, and at the same time know that that love is still very
much so there. Like, I do think we have a
unique way of doing that as, as children of first responders.
And that just speaks so much volume of like, yeah, like you
(19:38):
weren't as bad as you think. You, you, you were.
And we do love you. Well, and I think.
The other piece of that, Gary, Ijust want to applaud you for you
taking the steps. I mean, what a gift that you
gave your boys, even if it was, you know, a couple years down
the road to say I was a human being and I'm sorry.
Those words, I say that all the time.
(20:00):
I say that with my first responders.
Police should like, what is the harm in owning it like?
But a lot of my first respondersstruggle with that.
And there's so much again, powerin the words.
I'm sorry. And you know, and.
I look back at the way I was. I didn't know any other way to
be. And you know, I, I have said
that I've had jobs where I didn't just have a job.
(20:22):
I became something. I will always be a Marine.
I will always be a cop. You know and and.
That's, and that's the truth. And, and we, so many of us just
immerse ourselves so much in thejob, you know, and, and from a
it, it's not a small town, but it's not a big city.
(20:44):
And within two years, every pumpkin town knows who you are
because they've seen you in court and you've locked them up.
So, you know, when you're just in town, going out to eat or
going to the mall and then, well, I locked that so big up
and well, I had to knock down that dragon fight with him.
And I just, you know, he just beat his wife last week, you
know, and, and it's you, you seethat and, and you're always
(21:05):
looking over your shoulder and, you know, and my wife is with me
and, you know, I don't know if this.
Resonates with you at all. But you know, you talk about
going to Paris Island and, you know, I think to be a police
officer, you got to go to the Academy.
You know, you get to take these courses and do these trainings.
And yet they don't have any of that for parenting, do they?
(21:29):
And so I think that's why we canidentify more as our career
sometimes than being a parent. I mean, we read the books, you
know, and this is a saying that my I'm totally stealing from my
dad. And when I became a parent, I'm
like, oh gosh, why is this so true?
But he says, you know, you can read all the books, you can take
(21:49):
all the classes and when you become a parent, you just pray
because that's all you kind of got.
And it's so true. And then to your point, like
it's what we we know, you know, we don't, we don't know and, and
stuff. And you have two kids and and
sometimes two kids need different things.
Oh yeah, my 2. Boys are so different in that
(22:10):
wild the same time. Thing.
Well, one. Of my sons has two boys and
they're about four between 4:00 and five years apart.
And they are just so different, like mine.
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, what's the age difference
between your boys? Five years.
OK, OK, Nice, nice. Yeah, absolutely.
(22:30):
So what? I want to be like mindful of our
time too, but what would you have any advice that you would
want to give to these younger generations coming up, coming
through career? Don't hold back like I did.
Wow. Yeah, any.
Dispatcher or officer that has actually worked for five years
(22:55):
probably has enough baggage thatthey need to come to a program
like this one. Yeah.
I do think it's beautiful seeingpeople say I'm trying to make
sure my bucket doesn't get full.Mm hmm.
And I think that is a younger generation thing.
Like it doesn't have to spill all over the floor in order for
(23:17):
me to maybe some of these people.
Come into this program, they weren't born when I started my
career. And that's.
And that's difficult for me. And, and well, and you know, the
only peer that comes to this that's older than me is your
dad. You know, I'm, you know, we're
the Ogs when, when we had this, like I asked some people, I
(23:39):
said, am I even relevant anymorebecause of that?
And, and I have been assured that I am, but you know, I look
at these, they're not kids, but you know, they're, I'm old
enough to be their grandfather, some of them.
I got to make this clear for my dad.
He's young on the inside. So just because you know, the
(24:00):
outside says different. He's young on the.
Outside, he's not slowed down from what I've seen of it,
definitely. Hasn't he?
Definitely. Hasn't.
But I think that there's power in saying where was this 30
years ago and taking from that? What can we do different?
And then the other part of it, Ido think it's powerful to say
(24:22):
I'm hard headed. Like that actually is a gift.
That's not a bad thing. You know, we would say that's
determined and being determined is a really powerful thing.
So I just want to applaud that. And I don't know, I think part
of this is like, well, I want togive what I wasn't given, you
know, like I that's why I keep. Coming back this is my 10th time
(24:45):
to come back at the pier well and I think.
That Gary, I hope you hear this in all sincerity.
That's why we wanted to ask you these questions for the podcast
because I think it's like it's such a gift that you give here
and I'm like, I know other people want to hear that in
terms of your experience and sharing it.
I also. Think it helps end the stigma
(25:05):
too. Like I think this is exactly
what we need is for people in your position to be like open
up. It is OK to go get that help.
There is not a time limit on this either.
Right, like. You are, you are being open and
honest and we're so grateful that you're on here saying like
I am an older gentleman and yet I'm making progress still in my
(25:29):
life because I've decided to go open up to someone about what
I've been through and what I've seen the the fear.
Is and and we have and. I know it's in the in the field
you have heard this, but findingthe right yes.
Provider. I mean, Ashley and I have tried
to. Talk about that too and I I hate
this but it's true. Like I think that finding a good
(25:50):
therapist is probably harder than dating well.
It's, I don't remember a whole lot about that, but but you
know, it's finding somebody who is used to dealing with first
responders. Just to.
Get in the phone book and and find a, a therapist or a
counselor. No, the year.
(26:11):
That's a crapshoot. And that's why I was so thankful
for this program because everyone here is trained and
dealing with first responders. So many of you all restrict your
practice to just first responders and their families.
So you, you can relate to us andyou 2 in particular being the
children of, of police officers,you know, but we've all heard
(26:35):
the horror stories, haven't we? And and that's the horror
stories scare everybody else. Well, and I think.
What I always say is when I havesomebody come to meet with me,
who's met with and, and sometimes it's not even a
horrible experience with anotherprovider, it was just like, it
just didn't feel right. It just didn't feel like right
and I always think it's amazing when they give it another try
(26:58):
cuz it's a easy write off the side.
Well, that person sounds like a Tonkin.
So they're all like that and I'mnever gonna try again.
And sometimes we can use that asa cop out and stuff.
So I appreciate that. Well, again, thank you so much
for your time. Thank you.
Thank you for sharing. Thank you for being our. #1 fan
he is and we love him. We love him.
(27:19):
So it's an honor to have you on and to Share your story and
hopefully have you back on soon too, to talk about a few things.
I think we could continuously pick your brain.
Oh, absolutely. Well.
And my wife and I listen to you every time we we do it together,
when we're on the road, when I get on.
The road. We.
We do travel quite a bit. Well, tell us.
(27:39):
Would you be comfortable sharingwhat you're going to be
celebrating in November the 10thof?
November is the 250th Marine Corps birthday.
Happy birthday and the Marine Corps birthday is a national
holiday. For those people that don't
know, when we got married and moved into base housing at at
Cherry Point, NC, we became friends with two other couples.
(28:00):
One of the couples was a newlywed couple like us.
They were married like a month after we were.
The other couple were married before he went overseas.
And actually we spent the same months overseas and, and, but we
were no kids in base housing 20 miles from the beach.
We got to be good friends and have kept in contact and since
we are all retired now, we've been able to get together more
(28:23):
often. And we are going to Branson, MO,
the most veteran friendly town Iknow of, and the six of us are
going to celebrate the 250th birthday of the Marine Corps.
That's something. I don't.
That's awesome. Well, and so on the road, you'll
get to listen to us and we always appreciate that.
So absolutely thank. You so much again for being on
(28:45):
today. And just to all of our
listeners, never forget that when the call hits home,
Jennifer and I are here for you.Thank you.
That's why I keep coming back. This is my 10th time to come
back if appear. Well, and I think that, Gary, I
hope you hear this in all sincerity, that's why we wanted
to ask you these questions for the podcast because I think it's
like it's such a gift that you give here.
And I'm like, I know other people want to hear that in
terms of your experience and sharing it.
(00:20):
I also think it helps end the stigma too.
Like I think this is exactly what we need is for people in
your position to be like, open up.
It is OK to go get that help. There is not a time limit on
this either, right? Like you are, you are being open
and honest. And we're so grateful that
you're on here saying like I am an older gentleman, and yet I'm
(00:45):
making progress still in my lifebecause I've decided to go open
up to someone about what I've been through and what I've seen.
Welcome back to the podcast. I'm Jennifer.
And I'm Ashley and you know what, Jennifer, you get to say
what we who we have today. Well, as always, we have a very
special guest with us today and I'm so excited that he is
willing to be here and share. So I'm just going to give it to
(01:05):
you. You're going to tell the
listeners who you are and a little bit about yourself.
My name is Gary Jarboe. I'm a retired Sergeant with the
Owensboro, KY, Police Department.
My background when when I was 18years old, I joined the Marine
Corps in 1969, which was, you know, people would say that's
pretty crazy thing to do in the middle of the Vietnam War.
(01:26):
But I've enlisted for four yearsand spent four years on
transport airplanes and flight crew before I got out.
When I got back from overseas, Imarried my high school
sweetheart and we've been married this month for 53 years.
We have two sons and two grown sons and three grandsons who we
(01:46):
love to go see. Karen is outnumbered.
Yes, definitely. In 1980, I was hired by the
Owensboro Police Department and spent 21 years there, retired
after I'd had all the fun I could stand and all the fun that
they could stand, and worked foranother company for 13 years and
(02:09):
we've both been retired completely for the last 10.
Wonderful. I appreciate you sharing that
extensive resume and I want to thank you for your service.
Yes, very important to say. You know, one thing I really
appreciate about you, Gary, is that you're always open about
your experience and saying, you know, Ashley and I are mental
health professionals and saying where was this 30 years ago?
(02:32):
So can you talk a little bit about the difference of today in
terms of just us using the word mental health and the experience
of when you were first on the department in your career and
what mental health was like in terms of that experience?
Yeah, my only experience with any mental health professional
(02:53):
until I came to PCIS was an interview I had when I was
hired. And it was.
I don't know how I can put this delicately.
You don't have to. But none of us were impressed
with the practitioner that we talked to.
I. Understand that is delicate.
And throughout my career, we hadan employee assistance program
(03:15):
like you're required to have. No one that I know of would have
ever called employee assistance because we knew it was a Direct
Line to the chief and or City Hall.
And we instinctively have a distrust of, of what we don't
understand. And we have all heard horror
(03:38):
stories of people's bad experiences with mental health
professionals. And that's with any, any
occupation. But cops are control freaks.
They don't want to give up control to anybody and to and
you don't bare your soul to anybody.
And that's and that's a problem for us.
And it, and I'll be honest, it was for me and, and dealing
(04:00):
with, with my family, you know, we don't even talk way too
often. We don't talk to our families
about things and sure not going to talk to some stranger.
Exactly, I appreciate you sharing that experience that you
had and I'm, I'm going to dig a little bit deeper.
You know, I appreciate you sharing your experience with the
(04:21):
military. And I, I was very honored to get
to work with service members andtheir families.
And I do believe that the military is working hard to
destigmatize mental health. But being in the Marine Corps,
being at war, sometimes I see that experience of veterans that
(04:42):
become police officers that it'sso ingrained of your soldier.
Suck it up. I didn't know if that was a
reinforcer or that made things different for you.
You know, I, I really don't know.
And, and I'll have to be honest,I spent four years in the Marine
Corps and I spent a little time in Vietnam, but I only saw the
rice paddies from altitude. I was flying.
(05:05):
I did not spend a year in Vietnam.
We would run detachments in country and, and I was over
there at the end of the Marine Corps involvement in Vietnam.
So I, I wouldn't even in there the entire time.
But it's you go to Parris Islandin 1969, they tell you you're
only there for one thing. And you know, they told us we
(05:26):
were all going to Vietnam, whichat that stage of the war, I
understand very few of the people I went to boot camp with
actually went in country. But it's the attitude that they
teach you and and it's the hard headed attitude.
And, and I'll be honest with you, that hard headed attitude
actually probably saved me. Oh.
Absolutely. Many years later when I had when
(05:47):
I was hit by a car and and I wasoff work two years and my wife
has told people that he probablycouldn't have come back if he
hadn't gotten hard headed at Parris Island because I wasn't
going to stay down. That sounds like a Marine Corps.
Yeah, really hard at it. Yeah, absolutely.
And and when I hear you talking about that too, like, I can't
(06:07):
help but think like, how much ofthat do you think translated to
your home life? Like way too much, way too much.
Yeah. So it's it's hard, right?
It's hard to get in that mindsetand then just change it.
I don't even know if that's possible for a lot of our first
responders or for people who like you like a Marine, right?
Like, yeah. And but yet it's so beneficial
(06:28):
on one side because we like you just said like hard headed and
you got through something so bigin your life.
And then yet it can be very impactful on the other side of
things too. Did you start to notice that at
all? It kind of going deep here with
your family, but like how that translated to your family A.
Little bit. Not until later, yeah.
You know, you, you don't show vulnerability.
(06:49):
Yeah, you can't be vulnerable. You know, you've got to walk
into the bar fight necessarily walk in by yourself.
But I mean, you, you weighed in the middle of it.
And when I was a when I was a rookie police officer, it was I
always had this thing in my mindthat, you know, how will I react
when I get to my my first fight because I was a little skinny
(07:12):
guy. I've gained the number of pounds
now. But yeah, I was, I was a pretty
thin guy, barely met the minimumweight limits to get into into
the Marine Corps. And, and until I had my first
knock down drag out on the street, I had that that doubt in
my mind. And it happened to be with my
(07:33):
training officer several months after I'd gotten up by myself.
And then, you know, he made the comment that you done good,
rookie, and that that was what Ineeded.
And that's what I did the rest of the time I was in.
Yeah, but yet you, you don't have that vulnerability.
And I didn't, I didn't tell a lot of things at home because I
(07:54):
didn't want to burden her. And she had never been exposed
to the kind of life that I was seeing every day.
I mean, at her family, there wasthere was no violence.
There was no alcoholism. I mean that that she'd never
seen domestic violence. And, you know, she used to say
(08:14):
that that she had heard all the stories, but what she heard was
the stories that we would joke about when we get together.
The PG stories, yeah. She didn't hear about the the
really bad ones. Someones where I was scared half
to death and you know, because you just don't burden your
family with that. Right.
And I think it's that thing thatis such a a tightrope to to walk
(08:37):
because I think it is. I love my family.
I would not want to burden them.I don't want to upset them.
I want to, you know, I'm protecting all these people in
my community. Of course, I want to protect my
family. And yet that sometimes can be
missed. Oh, we we paid a price for it.
Really, and I've said, you know,when I come to to the PCIS that
(09:01):
where was this 35 years ago, it would have been a whole lot
easier on on my whole family andon me had I've been able to, to
do what I've I've done since I've been here.
Yeah. Do you feel like your connection
then to your wife has grown stronger?
Oh definitely, definitely. And after we came here, we
talked about things and she heard about things that she had
(09:23):
never heard about in all the years since I got on the
department. Yeah.
And and even other things that we we have better communication
now than we had before. And I'm going to take a second
here to tell our our listeners alittle bit.
Like we won't go into details about the title or anything of
the program, but it is a mental health program that we met Gary
at that they get to come and it's for first responders and
(09:45):
they get to come and talk about some of these intense critical
incidences that they've been through and honestly open up and
get the help for mental health professionals and peers who have
been through it as well and get to talk with their families.
Wives are included. Spouses of any kind are
included. And so I just want to put it out
there because we're referencing it so much of like, I mean, I
think what's really powerful is that you were you were retired
(10:08):
and decided. Yeah.
I've been retired 21 years before I came.
Oh wow. Because it didn't exist at all
while I was working. Right, like the mental health
world didn't. But is it OK if I ask and if
this is too much, let us know Like what, what made you decide
finally to say, hey, I'm I got stuff I got to work on and I'm
going to go do that even after the career?
(10:29):
Well, a couple of friends of mine that I had worked with and
had retired and got back into it, it just in conversation told
me about PCIS. I'd never heard of it until a
little over two years ago. And they were telling me about
it and they both were raving about it, said it's great, you
need to, you need to go. So I did a little research and
looked at it. I looked online.
(10:50):
I thought I knew I had some demons hanging around.
And I sat down with with Karen and I said, would you go to this
with me? And she said, yeah.
So got online and got myself into it.
And I'll be honest with you, on Monday I was trying to figure
out a way that I could run. Understandably.
(11:12):
Run. Yep.
And on Wednesday, driving home, I was saying, where was this 35
years ago? You know, I hate to say this,
but I think you're a little bit of an outlier to know that
you've been retired. Ashley and I talk a lot about
the impact of the career and then retirement can be a really
dangerous place sometimes for officers.
(11:33):
Do you care to share a little bit like what helps?
I mean, you said, you know, I had these these demons and being
open, but unfortunately people that retire from a first
responder career, that can be some hard times.
And if you can share a little bit like what was helpful for
you in terms of or what has beenhelpful for you in terms of
retirement? Well.
I. Came in here with with one thing
(11:55):
that had had bothered me and hadbothered me for years and I
talked about it when I was here and then I realized that that
was just one of many. I have had a hell, I've lost
count 6-7 follow up sessions with an MHP since then.
You know, I'd, I'd, I call Hannah my savior, but it's, and
(12:19):
some of it goes back to my childhood.
But there were things that that had really bothered me.
I spent five years, about 90% ofmy time we spent investigating
sexual abuse of children. And you know, that stuff wears
on you. Absolutely.
And some of the other things that that I was in and and, you
know, I had, I had the the some guilt because of I was in the
(12:43):
Marine Corps. I went to Vietnam.
There were times that I was hesitant to even say that I was
a Vietnam vet because I wasn't in the rice Paddy.
You know, I wasn't out there Andand that's, and there's a whole
dynamic in that too, and that's not unusual.
Oh, it's not there's, it's something I read several months
ago when I, I sent it to a friend of mine that had even
more issues with that than I did.
(13:04):
And one of the first lines is ifyou've, if you've been deployed
10 times, you think you should have done more or if you
deployed once, you know, you, you think you should have done
more. So no matter what we do, the
idea is that we did what we weretold to do while we were there
and that's what our service was supposed to be.
But it's it's, you know, I'm 73 years old and I've got a lot of
(13:29):
crap baggage that I'm carrying from a lot of different things.
But this has been, you know, if somebody had told me I was when
I came here that I was actually going to sit down with a mental
health professional. But yes, thank you.
And it's the same response I have gotten.
And I've kind of made it my mission to talk to retirees that
(13:50):
I know to try to get them to come.
No, we don't talk about that. And I sure don't talk about
that. And we're a hard nut to crack.
Well. Understandably.
And, you know, I don't think that there's anything scarier
than being vulnerable. Especially for control freaks
like we are. Exactly.
Exactly, and there's a lot more comfortability walking into a
(14:11):
bar fight than there is walking into a therapist's office.
For sure 'cause I I. I at least have a clue what's
going to happen in the bar fight.
First time I sat down with a with a mental health
professional I had no clue. We're pretty scared.
I was just about. To say you.
Are you? You frightened me all to death.
Never. Married 53 years, That's
(14:33):
incredible. And again, just she's an.
Angel Well, I already. Know that, but any secrets, any
advice that you can give to people in terms of what it takes
to be married for 53 years besides the fact that your wife
has to be an Angel? Well.
And it would it's even you know,and then you to to put it in
terms that I use my wife marrieda Marine who became a cop.
(14:57):
So she has put up with so much and you know, and neither one of
us are perfect. We've, we've had our bad times.
I don't know. I've met her.
She might be perfect. Well, she's yes.
I mean, her birthday is my birthday.
Perfection. But we don't live with that.
Yeah, we, I won't tell any stories, but you know, it's the
(15:18):
commitment that I, I read something online the other day
and online it has to be true. The the thing was, somebody asks
a woman that had been married for 60 years what her secret
was. And she said we come from a
generation that when something is broken or not working right,
(15:40):
you don't throw it away, you fixit.
Yeah. And I thought that was a pretty
powerful statement. Oh absolutely.
It is important to work through things and I have seen
relationships that work through that brokenness and man, they're
even stronger because of it instead of walking away.
(16:02):
And I had, there were times thatspecially with on the department
that I was, I was certainly not the easiest guy to live with.
And I, I had, I had issues and didn't know how to handle them,
but, you know, didn't work them out perfectly, but worked them
out. And we've, and we've stayed
together and, and we're better now than we were a few years
(16:24):
ago. Wow.
And I mean, I, I see that happenin relationship and with family
dynamics is when you are in thissituation, you kind of withdraw
even more. And you know, I've always
reference families as this cogs in a watch, you know, and they
(16:45):
all kind of have to fit in orderfor the watch for the family to
work. And when somebody withdraws more
and more, it's hard for those cogs of a family to function.
And I think it says a lot that, you know, recognizing that and
saying like, but we're still, we're going to still keep time,
you know, we're still going to figure out that, you know, I
(17:08):
definitely want to be respectfulof your boys.
But I also think that they have big professions and have worked
really hard. So I don't know if you want to
share a little bit about what it's like being a dad and being
an officer. You know, it was I always
worried and I was talking to somebody last night that we
(17:33):
never really sat down and talkedabout that Dad was going to work
and that something might happen to her.
I didn't know how to bring that up.
They definitely saw me put on a gun and a vest every day.
They saw me with a black eye forsix weeks.
One time a broken hand. They have gotten up in the
(17:53):
morning and back in these days before blood borne pathogens,
you had a bloody uniform shirt. You put it in ice water.
Well, they've gotten up and there's in the kitchen sink is a
bloody uniform shirt and ice water.
Because I came home wasn't my blood, but I came home and and
changed uniform shirts and and went back to work.
And I get it. It was avoidance.
(18:14):
I didn't know what to what to say.
So I didn't say anything. Yeah, after right there that
was. Powerful after.
I decided that we were coming, we were on vacation together and
I got the boys and took them off.
We just sat down and and talked.Apologized for the way I had
(18:34):
been because I know I was an asshole at times, Probably a lot
of times. They weren't concerned.
They said I wasn't as bad as I seem to think I was, which made
me feel better. Yeah, of course.
Sounds like. They love you a lot.
When that's, I mean, that's whathappens when we love our family
members. There's Grace and I'm standing.
(18:54):
I think that speaks. To what we even do on this
podcast, right, is like I'm veryopen about some of the struggles
that I've had with my own dad and you know what I mean?
Like Jennifer is too. And yet we love them more than
like my, you know, like my dad hung the moon, you know what I
mean? And I feel so like we're, that
speaks volumes that because I dothink there's truth to a lot of
first responder children. We can look at our our parent
(19:17):
who is the 1st responder and be like, man, they are rough or
they are strict or they are assholes.
I've said that in my head beforetoo, right?
Like, and at the same time know that that love is still very
much so there. Like, I do think we have a
unique way of doing that as, as children of first responders.
And that just speaks so much volume of like, yeah, like you
(19:38):
weren't as bad as you think. You, you, you were.
And we do love you. Well, and I think.
The other piece of that, Gary, Ijust want to applaud you for you
taking the steps. I mean, what a gift that you
gave your boys, even if it was, you know, a couple years down
the road to say I was a human being and I'm sorry.
Those words, I say that all the time.
(20:00):
I say that with my first responders.
Police should like, what is the harm in owning it like?
But a lot of my first respondersstruggle with that.
And there's so much again, powerin the words.
I'm sorry. And you know, and.
I look back at the way I was. I didn't know any other way to
be. And you know, I, I have said
that I've had jobs where I didn't just have a job.
(20:22):
I became something. I will always be a Marine.
I will always be a cop. You know and and.
That's, and that's the truth. And, and we, so many of us just
immerse ourselves so much in thejob, you know, and, and from a
it, it's not a small town, but it's not a big city.
(20:44):
And within two years, every pumpkin town knows who you are
because they've seen you in court and you've locked them up.
So, you know, when you're just in town, going out to eat or
going to the mall and then, well, I locked that so big up
and well, I had to knock down that dragon fight with him.
And I just, you know, he just beat his wife last week, you
know, and, and it's you, you seethat and, and you're always
(21:05):
looking over your shoulder and, you know, and my wife is with me
and, you know, I don't know if this.
Resonates with you at all. But you know, you talk about
going to Paris Island and, you know, I think to be a police
officer, you got to go to the Academy.
You know, you get to take these courses and do these trainings.
And yet they don't have any of that for parenting, do they?
(21:29):
And so I think that's why we canidentify more as our career
sometimes than being a parent. I mean, we read the books, you
know, and this is a saying that my I'm totally stealing from my
dad. And when I became a parent, I'm
like, oh gosh, why is this so true?
But he says, you know, you can read all the books, you can take
(21:49):
all the classes and when you become a parent, you just pray
because that's all you kind of got.
And it's so true. And then to your point, like
it's what we we know, you know, we don't, we don't know and, and
stuff. And you have two kids and and
sometimes two kids need different things.
Oh yeah, my 2. Boys are so different in that
(22:10):
wild the same time. Thing.
Well, one. Of my sons has two boys and
they're about four between 4:00 and five years apart.
And they are just so different, like mine.
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, what's the age difference
between your boys? Five years.
OK, OK, Nice, nice. Yeah, absolutely.
(22:30):
So what? I want to be like mindful of our
time too, but what would you have any advice that you would
want to give to these younger generations coming up, coming
through career? Don't hold back like I did.
Wow. Yeah, any.
Dispatcher or officer that has actually worked for five years
(22:55):
probably has enough baggage thatthey need to come to a program
like this one. Yeah.
I do think it's beautiful seeingpeople say I'm trying to make
sure my bucket doesn't get full.Mm hmm.
And I think that is a younger generation thing.
Like it doesn't have to spill all over the floor in order for
(23:17):
me to maybe some of these people.
Come into this program, they weren't born when I started my
career. And that's.
And that's difficult for me. And, and well, and you know, the
only peer that comes to this that's older than me is your
dad. You know, I'm, you know, we're
the Ogs when, when we had this, like I asked some people, I
(23:39):
said, am I even relevant anymorebecause of that?
And, and I have been assured that I am, but you know, I look
at these, they're not kids, but you know, they're, I'm old
enough to be their grandfather, some of them.
I got to make this clear for my dad.
He's young on the inside. So just because you know, the
(24:00):
outside says different. He's young on the.
Outside, he's not slowed down from what I've seen of it,
definitely. Hasn't he?
Definitely. Hasn't.
But I think that there's power in saying where was this 30
years ago and taking from that? What can we do different?
And then the other part of it, Ido think it's powerful to say
(24:22):
I'm hard headed. Like that actually is a gift.
That's not a bad thing. You know, we would say that's
determined and being determined is a really powerful thing.
So I just want to applaud that. And I don't know, I think part
of this is like, well, I want togive what I wasn't given, you
know, like I that's why I keep. Coming back this is my 10th time
(24:45):
to come back at the pier well and I think.
That Gary, I hope you hear this in all sincerity.
That's why we wanted to ask you these questions for the podcast
because I think it's like it's such a gift that you give here
and I'm like, I know other people want to hear that in
terms of your experience and sharing it.
I also. Think it helps end the stigma
(25:05):
too. Like I think this is exactly
what we need is for people in your position to be like open
up. It is OK to go get that help.
There is not a time limit on this either.
Right, like. You are, you are being open and
honest and we're so grateful that you're on here saying like
I am an older gentleman and yet I'm making progress still in my
(25:29):
life because I've decided to go open up to someone about what
I've been through and what I've seen the the fear.
Is and and we have and. I know it's in the in the field
you have heard this, but findingthe right yes.
Provider. I mean, Ashley and I have tried
to. Talk about that too and I I hate
this but it's true. Like I think that finding a good
(25:50):
therapist is probably harder than dating well.
It's, I don't remember a whole lot about that, but but you
know, it's finding somebody who is used to dealing with first
responders. Just to.
Get in the phone book and and find a, a therapist or a
counselor. No, the year.
(26:11):
That's a crapshoot. And that's why I was so thankful
for this program because everyone here is trained and
dealing with first responders. So many of you all restrict your
practice to just first responders and their families.
So you, you can relate to us andyou 2 in particular being the
children of, of police officers,you know, but we've all heard
(26:35):
the horror stories, haven't we? And and that's the horror
stories scare everybody else. Well, and I think.
What I always say is when I havesomebody come to meet with me,
who's met with and, and sometimes it's not even a
horrible experience with anotherprovider, it was just like, it
just didn't feel right. It just didn't feel like right
and I always think it's amazing when they give it another try
(26:58):
cuz it's a easy write off the side.
Well, that person sounds like a Tonkin.
So they're all like that and I'mnever gonna try again.
And sometimes we can use that asa cop out and stuff.
So I appreciate that. Well, again, thank you so much
for your time. Thank you.
Thank you for sharing. Thank you for being our. #1 fan
he is and we love him. We love him.
(27:19):
So it's an honor to have you on and to Share your story and
hopefully have you back on soon too, to talk about a few things.
I think we could continuously pick your brain.
Oh, absolutely. Well.
And my wife and I listen to you every time we we do it together,
when we're on the road, when I get on.
The road. We.
We do travel quite a bit. Well, tell us.
(27:39):
Would you be comfortable sharingwhat you're going to be
celebrating in November the 10thof?
November is the 250th Marine Corps birthday.
Happy birthday and the Marine Corps birthday is a national
holiday. For those people that don't
know, when we got married and moved into base housing at at
Cherry Point, NC, we became friends with two other couples.
(28:00):
One of the couples was a newlywed couple like us.
They were married like a month after we were.
The other couple were married before he went overseas.
And actually we spent the same months overseas and, and, but we
were no kids in base housing 20 miles from the beach.
We got to be good friends and have kept in contact and since
we are all retired now, we've been able to get together more
(28:23):
often. And we are going to Branson, MO,
the most veteran friendly town Iknow of, and the six of us are
going to celebrate the 250th birthday of the Marine Corps.
That's something. I don't.
That's awesome. Well, and so on the road, you'll
get to listen to us and we always appreciate that.
So absolutely thank. You so much again for being on
(28:45):
today. And just to all of our
listeners, never forget that when the call hits home,
Jennifer and I are here for you.Thank you.
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