November 16, 2025 • 46 mins
What if the dream trip starts feeling like a job? We sit down with traveler and author Melissa Rodway to unpack the real highs and lows of a life built on movement—starting with a wild childhood year in Western Australia, a no-guidebook leap through Europe in the 90s, and the pre-smartphone hacks that kept her safe and curious in Costa Rica.
The story turns when she quits an advertising job and heads to Southeast Asia for months of motion—Thailand, Laos, Cambodia, Vietnam, and China—where gritty bus rides collide with occasional five-star stays. Melissa shares how travel fatigue sneaks in, why purpose is the antidote, and the moment a seasoned traveler taught her the hardest lesson of the road: know when to go home. Those long rides turned into pages, and pages into The People You Meet, a witty, honest travel book about culture, food, and the human dramas that follow you across borders.
Then we switch gears to a slower kind of adventure: five winter weeks in Quebec City during her year off. Daily cross-country laps on the Plains of Abraham, ice skating under big skies, a Nordic spa two minutes from home, and the electric roar of Carnival with its ice canoe races on the St. Lawrence. We dig into the ice hotel, maple syrup snow taffy, tourtière, French schools for all levels, and why Quebec is built for outdoor lovers in every season—plus practical tips on walkability, ferries to Lévis, nearby trails, and affordable stays that make lingering easy.
If you’re craving travel that’s deeper, steadier, and more you, this conversation is your map.
You can find Melissa:
On Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/fly_travel_media/
Her website at: https://flyrodway.com
Melissa's book: The People You Meet Book
Please download, like, subscribe, share a review, and follow us on your favorite podcasts app and connect with us on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/wherenextpodcast/
View all listening options: https://wherenextpodcast.buzzsprout.com/
Hosts
Carol Springer: https://www.instagram.com/carol.work.life
Kristen: https://www.instagram.com/team_wake/
If you can, please support the show or you can buy us a coffee.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_03 (00:14):
Hi, welcome to our podcast, Where Next.
Travel with Kristen and Carol.
I am Kristen.
And I am Carol.
And we're two long-term friendswith a passion for travel and
adventure.
SPEAKER_00 (00:26):
Each episode, we interview people around the
globe to help us decide where togo next.
Well, thank you, Melissa, forcoming on.
I appreciate that.
I am so excited.
I want to start talking aboutyour travel, your website, your
experiences.
Um, you know, growing up, didyou do a lot of travel with your
family?
SPEAKER_01 (00:47):
So the story is that uh when I was about seven um in
1981, my dad took us to WesternAustralia.
So we lived uh just outside ofPerth in a very, very small
community.
So he was a teacher at the time,so we did a teacher exchange, so
(01:08):
swapped houses and jobs.
Our school was very remote.
It was uh in the middle ofnowhere.
We had to take like a bush pathto get there, and it was pretty
wild.
And this was 1981, so um therewas no helicopter parenting
happening, and basically ourparents just like opened the
door and off we went and wesurvived.
(01:30):
And we didn't want to go.
I remember when we first heardwe were leaving, we all cried
and thought this was terrible.
And then a year later, when wewere supposed to come back, we
didn't want to come back.
So it's just tells you howquickly you adapt.
Um, but in that year, we went toBali, and that was 81.
So no one was really going toBali.
Now Bali is like extremelytouristy, but not at that time.
(01:52):
So when we went, I had very,very blonde hair, and all the
women were giving us chocolateand touching my hair like I was
some like divine spirit.
And my sister was very tall forher age, she was 12, and they
wanted to marry her off.
And uh, it was pretty wild formy mom.
So that was pretty big.
(02:13):
And then we rented a van at onepoint, and we traveled around
Australia in a van and into NewZealand pre-internet.
So 81 is like you're kind of,you know, just going off.
And uh my parents probably sentthe odd letter or phone call
back to our relatives in Canada,but you're pretty cut off.
So that was pretty cool,actually.
(02:33):
I would say that was the firstsort of, well, at seven, that
was a pretty major thing.
I'm from a small town.
I live in Toronto now in Canada,but I grew up in a small town
about an hour and 20 minutesnortheast of here.
And my parents also grew up inanother small town.
So this was probably quite bigfor them.
And the message my dad alwaysgave us was um, you know, you
(02:56):
can create a life anywhere.
So, you know, that that wasyeah, that was pretty big.
And then after that, I mean, wedid a lot of camping and other
things, but I wouldn't say thatas a family we traveled a ton
together.
That was probably the biggestthing that we had done.
SPEAKER_00 (03:12):
Right.
And then so after that, youdidn't do any other big trips,
it was just camping and thingslike that.
So it didn't happen until Yeahwith my family, yes.
SPEAKER_01 (03:20):
But my parents always encouraged us to like go
and do things.
Um, so you know, I spent like asummer in Quebec, which we'll
talk about later when I was 15or 16.
My sister went off up north towork in resorts.
We both went out west to theRocky Mountains in in Alberta
and Jasper to work.
(03:41):
Like we were always encouragedto just keep doing things and to
have experiences and to do themactually without anyone that we
knew.
So go to camp, go to this, go tothat, but don't go with your
friends.
That was sort of the message.
So, yeah, so there was a lot ofindependence.
Um, I went to Belgium in highschool on exchange for two
months in high school.
Nice.
(04:02):
It's a different world now, andI don't know that that was the
best thing in hindsight, but uhthat was the message at the
time.
My brother and sister went backto Australia, and uh I went to
Europe and to Western Canada,and uh yeah, so it's being
independent and havingadventures has always been a big
message in our family for sure.
SPEAKER_00 (04:23):
Makes a lot of sense with your where you've where
you've gone.
Are your siblings are they stillin Australia or did they come
back?
SPEAKER_01 (04:29):
No, they just went, uh we all took a year off after
high school and they wentbackpacking around and working
there.
And uh, I never wanted to goback, to be honest.
It doesn't seem different enoughto me.
I mean, obviously they havedifferent animals and a
different climate, but I don'tfeel like the culture is
(04:50):
different enough for me to goagain.
SPEAKER_03 (04:53):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (04:53):
But uh they had a great time and still have
friends from there, so yeah,huge connections for sure.
SPEAKER_00 (04:59):
So when you took off your year after high school and
you you said Europe, did you goto Europe for a year?
SPEAKER_01 (05:06):
I went for a few months.
So I spent half that time inJasper in the Rocky Mountains in
Alberta, which I absolutelylove.
So I don't know if you guys havebeen to Ban for Lake Louise or
Jasper, but yes, you have.
Yeah, Jasper is like the mostnormal of all of them.
It has um not so much of I meanit's touristy, but it's just
(05:28):
more, it's a little calmer.
It's just a bit more of a normallifestyle if you're gonna be in
one of those towns.
Anyway, I absolutely loved itthere.
I spent way too long there.
I was there from off and on from18 to 21.
Had way too much fun there.
So we can make the story.
Um, but it was fun.
(05:49):
And then so part of the year Iwas out there and then I went uh
to Europe for a few months andwas in like France and Germany,
Austria.
I didn't have a clue what I wasdoing.
I was useless.
So I was actually how did youpick the places or know where
you just kind of I didn't do itwell.
I I will be so honest aboutthat.
Luckily, we had a family friendthere who who had moved to
(06:12):
France, and I used her as abase, and she helped me like
plot out a trip while I wasthere.
But again, this is like this wasdumb.
I was by myself, I was 19 yearsold, I had no idea what I was
doing.
I'd only lived in a small town.
I didn't even have a guide book,I didn't even know they existed.
I had no clue about lonelyplanets.
(06:34):
I was so naive, I just bought aplane ticket and showed up.
And there was no internet, therewas no research, there was
nothing.
How did you get that bravenessfrom?
Yeah, it's kind of it was kindof like there was no option.
That braveness was like youdidn't question it, you just
kind of did it.
And in hindsight, I'm like, thatwas that wasn't great.
(06:55):
Um had a good time.
Yeah.
Yeah, I always say I didn't haveinsurance, I did not have a clue
what I was doing.
So I survived it.
I met some people along the way.
I learned the hard way about howto do this.
But it's not like you know, alot of people romanticize about
that.
And I think now, if you're 19,it's probably all a lot easier
(07:17):
because of the internet.
But back then it's Did you havelike a suitcase where you held
with your hand?
Or just a backpack?
I'm still a backpacker.
I just remember one day readingsomeone gave me a very old
lonely planet.
I was in the middle of nowherein Switzerland, and I read
somewhere that this bus mightcome by, and I'm like, this
(07:38):
edition is many years old.
Like, I hope this bus stillcomes by.
Like it was just crazy.
That's hilarious.
SPEAKER_00 (07:44):
Some of it did the bus come?
SPEAKER_01 (07:47):
Yeah, I got I got on the wrong bus, but you know, I I
I figured it out.
But it is, it's just such adifferent time now.
I mean, that was the 90s, andum, yeah, here we are.
SPEAKER_00 (07:57):
So you know, I went to Costa Rica in 2002, and um I
had all this extra vacation timeand I wasn't gonna lose it.
I had 16 weeks vacation.
I took 12 out of 16 weeks, butone month I went to Costa Rica
and I had talked to thiscompany, Costa Rican Adventures,
and I wrote on a piece of paper,uh, because the internet, we
didn't really do that either.
(08:18):
Uh 50 people's names and phonenumbers that if once I got
there, if I needed help.
And I just I wrote everythingdown.
I gave uh my family theitinerary and then I kept
changing it.
And uh, you know, you had acalling card that I called and
said, okay, I'm gonna go live ona kayak for three days.
I'm not doing that, or I'm goingover here instead, and just kind
(08:38):
of went with it.
I think that was more normal.
And for our age growing up, too,it was more normal.
Whereas now for my kids who are18 and 21, you know, over the
every moment.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (08:51):
Right.
So different.
Oh, totally.
And there's a part of me thatyou kind of miss that.
Like that, that was a real like,if you're going, you're going,
and whatever's gonna happen isgonna happen.
But I do think it's a lot safernow, to be sure.
And it's easier, it's so mucheasier.
But there is some real beauty tothat, that way it used to be, I
(09:11):
think.
SPEAKER_00 (09:12):
So, what what what was your favorite trip on that
trip?
How long were you gone for?
Or was it like how did you kindof uh go?
Because it sounds like a couplemonths you'd go and then you'd
come back.
And I don't know if you were inschool or working or yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (09:25):
So that year that I took off, I wrote my exams early
from high school and I went outwest and lived there for I think
um five, six months, and then Iwent to Europe for maybe three
months backpacking and trying tofigure out what I was doing.
And then I went back out west,and then I went to university in
(09:47):
Montreal in Quebec after that.
Ended up moving back um toVancouver Island at one point.
I I moved a lot in my 20s.
Yeah, sounds like it.
Yeah, yeah.
Well, you learned, you had fun.
I was trying, I was trying tofind my place, right?
I think sometimes um peoplethink the 20s are the best of
times, and sometimes they're thehardest times are pretty
(10:09):
confusing of like what you'resupposed to do.
And I think the biggest lessonI've learned is that as you get
older, you actually feelyounger, and you're like, ugh,
like I can, you know, whenyou're young, you have all this
pressure, or so you think tolike figure it all out.
And then when you get older,it's like, oh my god, I was a
baby.
Why did I do that to myself?
Um but that's uh yeah, oh I lovethat.
SPEAKER_00 (10:33):
Figure it out.
So, and then um you went towork, but then you have a travel
um website and you you travel alot now.
Um, or you know, how did thattransform?
So your 20s, did you do thetravel and then now you're
working, but then you do take alot of time off.
And then of course we want totalk about the year off that you
(10:54):
took.
SPEAKER_01 (10:55):
Yeah.
So um I've never done the careerthing very well.
Um, I have made very strangedecisions that didn't really
suit me because uh yeah, Iprobably if I could go back in
time, that's one thing I woulddo over.
However, in my late 20s, Istarted traveling more and more
and more.
So I would say around 29 iswhere it became like a part of
(11:21):
my lifestyle.
So I Costa Rica was my first bigtrip like that, and then I was
hooked.
It's such an amazing country,it's safe, it's there's so much
to do, it's beautiful.
Um, and that I got the bug fromthat, to be honest.
And then so I I will just fastforward through that.
A few years later, I metsomebody who worked in the
(11:43):
travel industry, and so wetraveled as much as we could.
We were from differentcountries.
That ties into um my book thatwe can talk about in a minute.
Yeah, but anyway, so we met on acycling trip in Cuba.
He was from England, I was fromCanada, and we ended up
traveling together for many,many years.
(12:04):
Uh, he moved to Canada at onepoint, that's a whole other
story.
And then when I was 35, I quitmy job.
I was working in advertising andI hated it.
Yeah, I just it wasn't for me.
And so we took time off and wentto Southeast Asia.
So on that trip, we went toThailand, Lao, Cambodia,
(12:26):
Vietnam, and China.
And that's what my book is aboutthat I just put out.
It's called The People You Meet.
Subtitle is Luxury Leeches Loveand Lao La with a host of
interesting characters inSoutheast Asia.
So this was a trip where heworked in luxury travel and he
was researching routes of theworld.
(12:50):
And I was pretty much just alongfor the ride, which is fine by
me because I actually hateplanning trips.
I like going on them.
I don't like all the dirty work.
It's horrible.
But we he was on an agenda.
Like it was, I would say 90%backpacking, 10% luxury.
So we were staying in some, youknow, less than desirable places
(13:11):
a lot of the time.
And then once or twice a week,sometimes more, but sometimes
less.
We'd stay in a really likeover-the-top luxury, you know,
where the likes of AngelinaJolie would have been.
Like it was very expensive andwe didn't pay a dime for it.
It was very like one extreme tothe other.
(13:33):
And the point of it was for himis that he was making these
connections so that down theroad he would be able to sell
these hotels in itineraries tohis luxury clients.
But for me, I get very restless.
So, as wonderful as all of thiswas, and it was, after a few
weeks, I got very cagey becauseI didn't have a purpose.
And I think that's one thingthat has come up through travel
(13:55):
over the years is there used tobe this real dreamy thing about
I'm just gonna head off andtravel and see what happens.
But I don't think that it's likethat as much anymore.
You have digital nomads who arelike working while they're
traveling, people who arevolunteering, people who are
like picking up odd things todo.
I think we all need purpose.
(14:16):
And if you're on the road forweeks and weeks or months and
months, you can get a littlecrazy.
So I was so I was sitting onthese buses and trains, and they
were very long, sometimes like36 hours on trains and buses,
and it was not easy.
No, and in my head, I startedcreating all of these um stories
(14:37):
about what was happening, who wewere seeing, what was going on
between the two of us.
And so I wrote these emails oncea week, because again, we I
didn't have a phone.
I was going to internet cafes,and some people won't even know
what that means.
SPEAKER_02 (14:51):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (14:52):
We were like lucky to have a computer at a guest
house or a hotel.
So then I started sending theseemails, and people were loving
them, and they started sendingthem to friends and family.
Long story short, I turned thatall those emails into the book.
That was a long way to answeryour question.
So for me, um for that, I just Ijust quit my job.
(15:15):
I was 35, and that was probablya good and bad thing to do at
that time, but I didn't reallycare and I wanted to do it, and
off we went.
It wasn't easy rebuilding afterthat, but um, it's always worth
it.
So yeah, I did that for fourmonths.
He continued um for nine, but wewere on the road every day, like
(15:37):
almost every day, on in a newplace, doing something
different.
And after four months, I waslike, I'm out, I'm done.
Um, it's very exhausting.
And this is another thing that Ilearned on that trip.
And trust me, I love more thananyone being away.
I love adventures, I'm up forpretty much anything.
I love who I am when I'm awaybecause I think that you're a
(15:59):
very different person.
But there is something that Ilearned on that trip called uh
travel fatigue, and it is aliveand well.
And I remember I had met thiswoman.
She was in her 50s at the time.
I was in my 30s, and she hasdone everything.
This woman was remarkable.
She was like the icon, thelegend of any traveler I've ever
(16:21):
met, even to this day.
And I remember I was with hersomewhere.
We were in northern Lao orThailand.
I don't know where the hell wewere.
Anyway, we were somewhere, andthese two young girls came
through with backpacks uh to gettickets on some random bus.
And she looked at them for abit, and then she looked at me
(16:42):
and she said, They need to gohome.
And I said, What are you talkingabout?
What do you mean?
She said, They're done.
They're they're over it.
They've probably been on theroad too long, and their trip
should end.
And she said, That is one of thebiggest lessons, the most
important lessons in travelingthat nobody talks about is like
when you know that it's time togo home because you stop seeing
(17:04):
things.
You're seeing things, but you'renot seeing things, becomes a
job.
It becomes about your ego sayingthat you've been to XYZ even
though your heart is no longerin it.
And so, so I learned that lessonon that four-month trip where I
was like, it doesn't matter ifyou take me um to Hawaii at the
moment, I'm done.
I'm out.
(17:24):
So that was for me a veryinteresting thing.
So yeah, after that I came back,rebuilt my life a little bit,
and then uh when I was 48, Itook another, like I took a year
off again and did another likeseries of trips.
SPEAKER_00 (17:37):
So and then I have a question back on the you know,
the travel fatigue.
I experienced that too when Iwas backpacking across Europe.
I just like I just feel like Ineed to do something.
I'm like, if I could work when Iwas there, I probably would have
stayed a lot longer.
But have you heard that from alot of people?
SPEAKER_01 (17:51):
Is that like other travelers?
I don't think people like totalk about it, but um I'm very
honest.
So if you go on my Instagram, Iwrote a huge thing about it when
I was in um Chile and Argentina.
I think I was still in Chile,and I almost came home.
I had only 10 days left to go,and I was like sick over it and
(18:15):
just a disaster.
And my partner was like, You'vegot 10 days, you have to like
suck it up and get through it.
But I wrote a huge thing aboutit, and so many people, yeah, so
many people were like, Oh mygod, thank you.
Yes, and you know, what when youwhen anyone admits to anything
that we're afraid to say, peoplecome out of the woodwork and
(18:35):
they're like, Oh, me too, metoo.
But no one wants to admit, likethere's a lot of ego in travel,
I have to say.
Um, not for everybody, butthere's a lot of bragging
rights, and there's a lot of,you know, I'm better than you
because I've been to this numberof countries and blah, blah,
blah.
And it's so stupid.
But um, yeah, I think I thinkpeople talk about it more and
(18:56):
more now.
I think because of mental healthis like a big deal.
And I think also people have uhcome up with new ways to combat
that, right?
Like, say if you're feeling thatbadly, then just find a location
to like stay.
If you can, if you have theluxury of time and money, then
just stay put somewhere for abit and have a normal life and
do normal things.
(19:16):
I think that like we'venormalized travel more and more
and more.
Whereas back in the day it wasjust glorified as this, like,
you know, beautiful dream thatevery day you're skipping
through the tulips.
And it is not true.
It is hard.
It is hard.
It is hard.
SPEAKER_00 (19:31):
Yeah, especially people that move around a lot,
like every week living in a newplace.
That sounds totally exhausting.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (19:37):
Yeah.
And when we did this trip in2010, we were every two days uh
somewhere new, if not like, youknow, I think the longest we
stayed anywhere was three orfour nights.
That was it.
So it's very tiring.
SPEAKER_00 (19:50):
If people wanted to look at these trips on your
website, where do they find you?
I will say my website is not upto date, but you can go there.
SPEAKER_01 (19:57):
It's flyroadway.com.
Yep.
But the best place is Instagram.
So that's fly underscore travelunderscore media, and there you
will see everything.
And I if I had an assistant, mywebsite would be really great,
but it is not really great rightnow.
SPEAKER_00 (20:16):
Okay.
Tell us you don't live in QuebecCity, but you l love it.
You've spent a lot of timethere.
SPEAKER_01 (20:23):
In 2023, I took a year off, and as I said, my
first destination was QuebecCity, which a lot of people
thought I was crazy, especiallyif you're Canadian.
They're like, that's not veryexotic.
But um, I love it there, andit's very European.
So uh, and I it's very wintryand I'm a winter person, and I
always wanted to spend timethere.
(20:45):
So I lived there for five weeks.
It is an eight-hour drive fromToronto, it's a three-hour drive
from Montreal.
And you know, I don't know ifyou guys drive a lot in the
States, but to us, like we driveall the time.
It's a big country, so drivingis is what it is.
Yeah, so I spent some timethere.
I had an Airbnb that was verycheap.
(21:05):
It like for me in uh Canadiandollars, it was about 800 bucks
for five weeks, which isnothing.
Five weeks.
Oh, wow.
Oh, yeah, it's very, very cheap.
It's Quebec, the province ofQuebec has always been a little
cheaper than other places.
Personally, I really loved it.
It's also very beautiful in thesummer, but I was there for the
snow, and basically um my lifeconsisted every day of like um
(21:32):
cross-country skiing,snowshoeing, ice skating,
whatever, any of thosecombinations.
And then I lived um two minutesfrom a beautiful Nordic spa.
So I often went there later,would come home, read a book,
have a bath, watch Netflix, andgo to bed.
And I did that for five weekssolid, and it was heaven.
(21:54):
Did you get any travel fatiguethen?
No, exactly.
I had no, I had only one set offriends, like a couple that I'd
met.
I was I took I had an incidentbefore I got there.
My car was broken into and Ilost almost everything the night
before I got there.
So that's another story.
We can go there if you want to,but we know so I befriended this
(22:16):
couple uh at a French school.
I went to school for one week,which interrupted my winter
activities, but I did it.
And outside of them, I had zerosocial life, and I loved that
too.
It was just like heaven.
And I lived along the St.
Lawrence River, which is verybeautiful, and in the winter
it's full of uh ice flows, andso you could just see the ice
(22:39):
moving constantly along theriver, and it was very
meditative and peaceful.
And I mean, they get so muchsnow there.
So if you're not a winterperson, it's not for you.
SPEAKER_00 (22:50):
Okay, and then so you know, because I'm not really
a winter person, but I know likeit's it's not like bad weather,
there's bad clothing, right?
So do you like do they walkaround with like snow pants,
like just when you're cruisingaround?
I did.
I lived in them.
SPEAKER_01 (23:04):
Yeah, yeah.
I went outside all day.
And if I wasn't like skiing orskating or whatever, I was just
walking.
And the thing about Quebecers isthey um they go outside no
matter what.
So there was a winter, there's awinter carnival there every
year, and the year I was there,it was like between minus 40 and
minus 50.
(23:25):
That's extremely cool.
Yeah, Celsius.
But they're still out,everyone's there.
Yes.
So you everyone is wearing likesnow pants, snow boots, like you
you have to.
There's otherwise you're gonnabe inside for like many months.
Do schools ever have snow days?
Um, I don't know.
(23:45):
I'm sure that they do there.
We do here in Ontario quite abit.
I'm sure in Quebec they do too.
But the thing is, is they'revery prepared.
Like if there was a snowstormcoming, their plows are out like
right away.
They are under, they have thisunder control.
Toronto, we are not equipped.
Like we had so much snow thisyear, it was insane and it was a
disaster.
But Quebec is like, it's part oftheir lifestyle, it's part of
(24:07):
their culture, the snow.
So they're nothing to do.
SPEAKER_00 (24:09):
Yeah, it's probably like our mountains in Colorado.
Like they want those skiers,they have it ready.
Yeah.
Okay.
And then I've heard about uh asport called canoes, ice
canoeing.
Can you tell us about that?
And I wanted to also, yeah,that's part of the Carnival de
Quebec.
Is that that's I was justlooking.
It's February 6th through the15th this next year.
(24:30):
It sounds so much fun.
It's so much fun.
SPEAKER_01 (24:32):
Um, so ice canoeing is a traditional sport in
Quebec.
And during the carnival, thereare um competitions.
It's one of the most excitingparts of Carnival, Carnival, and
they actually have teams fromall over the world that come and
do it.
So I have tried it.
It's very hard, but it's veryexciting.
(24:53):
So basically, what happens isyou are put into a very large
canoe and it's made of metal,and they give you a paddle with
a spike on the end, they giveyou spikes to attach to your um
uh sorry, spikes to attach toyour boots, and they give you
some wetsuit uh leggings andthings like that.
Not your full body, but justlike from the knees down and
(25:16):
knee pads.
So I'll try to sum this up foryou.
But basically, you're in a withfive or six other people.
If you are in ice, becauseyou're on the river, you are you
have one knee in the canoe andthen your other leg is like
pushing off ice.
Wow.
You're pushing to and you'repushing the boat at the same
time.
You're looking to get to openwater.
(25:37):
As soon as you hit open water,everybody does like a 180, they
jump in the boat and they startpaddling.
And if there's any like icearound them, they have this
spike to like chop up the ice.
So you're paddling through thewater.
Once you hit ice again,everyone's out, you're pushing,
you're running, you're liketrying to get to open water, you
do it again.
It's insane, but it's reallyfun.
(25:59):
How long does it go for?
Like, oh, so when I did it, theytake you for like um an hour, an
hour and a half.
And but when you watch theevent, uh the race, they're
doing they're going back andforth across the river, the St.
Lawrence River.
And I think the river is isabout a kilometer long.
So it depends what categoryyou're in, but sometimes they're
going back and forth, back andforth, back and forth, depending
(26:22):
on what race they're in.
It's insane.
It's insane.
Yeah, but it's I think everyonejust like cheering on the
sidelines sometimes.
Yes, yes, yes.
SPEAKER_00 (26:30):
Oh, it's super exciting.
Yeah.
I mean, they compete.
I mean, like I've seen pictures,and and there's one picture I'm
looking at, and there's uh snowand water.
So there's a canoe of paddlers,and then another canoe behind
them still still pushing in thesnow to get to the water.
Yeah.
Wow.
SPEAKER_01 (26:48):
Yeah.
And in Quebec itself, I mean,they do it for carnival for like
it's an international event, butaround Quebec proper, they
compete all when like there'speople that this is their life.
This is their team, this is whatthey do all winter long.
So it's a big sport there.
SPEAKER_00 (27:03):
Okay.
And then so at the carnival, yousaid in February, is this kind
of like tied to Mardi Gras herein the States or Carnival in
Brazil?
Like no, it's its own um yeah,no, it's its own French
tradition.
SPEAKER_01 (27:16):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Oh, French tradition.
Well, yes, it's a French, aFrench place.
So um, yeah, it's really fun.
They have like ice sculpturesand an ice palace, and like
there's just tons to do.
It's a small city, it's not bigat all, and it just really uh is
electric for those 10 days, Ithink it is, or two weeks.
SPEAKER_00 (27:35):
The ice castle and the sculptures, you can stay in
an ice hotel, it sounds like,just like in Sweden, I think you
were mentioning.
SPEAKER_01 (27:43):
Yeah, the ice hotel is um about half an hour away.
So that's in a place calledBalcartier.
So they build this every yearwith a different theme in mind.
So that I forget how many roomsthere are, like 16, maybe
something like that.
And every room looks different.
And they have like a hotellobby, it's all made of ice.
You can just go, you can spendthe night, it's 400 bucks, or
(28:04):
you can just go for 25 and touraround the hotel and have a
welcome drink and all of that.
It's like really, really neat.
And the couple that I did meet,they did it.
They spent the night.
They said they were very warm.
They have like a sauna, I think,in a hot tub that you have to go
into the night before just tolike get your body warm.
And then they provide you withlike proper sleeping bags and
(28:26):
blankets and all that.
And if you really can't handleit, they book a hotel room for
you to go into in the middle ofthe night.
But my friends survived it andthey absolutely loved it.
So that's a super cool thing tosee, even if you don't want to
stay overnight, like just tohang out there for an hour or
two.
It's awesome.
It's it's really impressive.
SPEAKER_00 (28:44):
It looks incredible.
And I'm assuming it's notdripping on you, it's frozen and
oh yeah.
Oh, it's cold.
SPEAKER_01 (28:50):
Like when I was there, it was so cold.
Yeah, and then attached to that,they have a tubing park.
So if you're into tubing, whichI had never done properly, it's
actually like going to a skihill.
Like you have to go up the um,you know, the tow rope, and they
have like black diamond,intermediate, easy runs, and
it's really fun.
(29:11):
So that's a really fun day.
And in the summer, you can gothere for like a water slide.
So if winter's not your thing,it's a pretty cool little area
to check out anyway.
Obviously, no ice hotel in thesummer, but right.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (29:24):
And so it's is the whole um province French
speaking then?
Yes.
Okay.
SPEAKER_01 (29:30):
Well, yes, there are communities in Quebec that are
anglophone, um, but major themajority is French.
So, but yeah, like there's partsof Quebec where people grow up
speaking English and theyprobably their French is not
that great, but that's rare.
I mean, I would say 80 to 90percent of Quebec is French.
Okay.
SPEAKER_02 (29:52):
Wow.
SPEAKER_01 (29:52):
You can get by.
Like in a city like Montreal,Montreal is very touristy.
Quebec City is also verytouristy, so if you don't speak
French, you're fine.
Because they rely on tourism.
It's also a bit of a governmenttown, but they rely on tourism
heavily.
So you will survive.
But it does help to know like alittle bit, because you know, a
little bit goes a long way.
(30:12):
It's inundated with tourists inthe summer of that place.
SPEAKER_00 (30:15):
That sounds good.
And so you say you went to aFrench school there.
Is that very common?
And is that is it prettyadvanced French or is it like a
brand new movie?
Just because that sounds likealso like some people want to
travel with a purpose.
So let's go to Quebec City andlearn French while we're there.
SPEAKER_01 (30:31):
Totally.
It's a very good idea.
So for me, it happened becauseum all my stuff had been stolen
at that time and I didn't have Icouldn't like ski or anything.
I got it all back.
That's a different story.
But, anyways, for one week I wasin kind of stuck.
And so I decided to do it.
And um yeah, you can be anylevel.
(30:52):
You can be brand new to thelanguage, you can be
intermediate, senior, whatever.
And the people that I met, therewere a lot of young people
actually, um, but from manydifferent countries that had
come there to learn French.
And uh it was pretty cool.
It was not easy.
My it was not a like uh easybreezy.
I was like writing news articlesand looking at, yeah, it was it
(31:14):
was it was hard, but I loved itand I loved my teacher, and I'm
glad that I did it.
But one week was enough.
And I speak French pretty well,actually, but yeah, we can all
be better.
SPEAKER_00 (31:25):
So you you only took five weeks.
Did you have to go back to work,or how come you didn't stay
longer?
SPEAKER_01 (31:31):
Um, so that five weeks was part of uh my year
off.
So that was my first adventure,and then I went back to Toronto
for like three weeks, and then Iwent to South America.
If I had to stay there the wholeyear, I would have been fine.
I loved it.
There's so much to do in Quebec.
Like there's if you'reoutdoorsy, everything is within
reach.
So right in the middle of thecity is a park called the Plains
(31:53):
of Abraham, which is actually avery um historical place for
Quebec and Canadian history.
It's the site of a major battle.
But now it's like if you're awinter person, you can
cross-country ski there forfree.
There's, I think, 15 kilometersof trails.
It's beautiful.
There's a massive skating ovalthere.
(32:14):
In the summer, it's a beautifulpark.
It has beautiful views of thewater, and they do tons of
festivals in there.
Um, so it's like right in themiddle of the city.
And how cool is that?
I mean, if you can't getsomewhere, you can hang it
there.
But everything around there,like ski hills, um, other places
to skate, everything is under anhour.
(32:35):
So, like in Toronto, you have todrive forever to get to places
like this, but in Quebec City,everything is close.
I was skating at phenomenalplaces that were 25 minutes
away.
Once I drove an hour and a halfto do like a skating thing that
was in the forest, it was 15kilometers of ice skating, like
around trees and with differentanimals.
(32:57):
Oh my gosh, I've never heard ofthat.
Yeah, it's an amazing province.
Do you need these poles when youskate in the trees?
No, okay.
They will like clear it,Zambonian or ISAT or whatever it
is they need.
Oh, yeah.
But they take that stuff reallyseriously there.
Like they are serious outdoorsypeople.
It's awesome.
But yeah, so if I had had tostay long, I cried the whole way
(33:20):
home.
I didn't want to leave.
I I could just live here.
I mean, I cry often on my wayhome from most trips, but um, I
felt very uh connected there andthat I could easily live there.
It was amazing, and I would livethere.
It's just like my French ispretty good, but not good enough
to have a proper job there.
SPEAKER_00 (33:39):
All right.
You say that as a kid, when Iwould leave vacations, I would
cry.
And then when I first learned towake surf in Shasta Lake, I felt
like uh tears were formingbecause I was like, oh my god,
this is so much fun.
You know, it's yeah, if thathappens.
SPEAKER_01 (33:55):
Yeah, totally.
I mean, I don't know.
Sometimes I'm like, what doesthat say about my regular life?
Maybe that's the problem.
But um, it's fun to go away,right?
And to have a different life.
Absolutely.
SPEAKER_00 (34:08):
Very curious also.
And I think uh Carol will betalking questions, but food.
I was curious about the thefood, and I know there's French
onions.
Well, no, no, the well, I'm surethey have onions suited in
Quebec.
Um, but if there was traditionalfoods or things that they would
eat that was different orspecific to Quebec.
SPEAKER_01 (34:26):
So I um I drank a lot of hot chocolate because I
love it, and it's very goodthere.
Actually, they have some reallyamazing places there.
They're known for maple syrup inQuebec.
Uh so you can go to like a maplesugar shack or a tasting or
whatever, and they actually pourum maple syrup in the snow, and
(34:48):
you roll it with like a a stickand it creates like a a sucker.
Like it you have to look it upto uh wow, that's very unusual.
I love it.
SPEAKER_00 (34:59):
It's so natural, right?
Just one ingredient.
SPEAKER_01 (35:02):
They have a lot of they have an amazing culture
there, Quebec.
It's very different than otherparts of Canada.
So they're into food, they'reinto like having fun, they're
into drinks, they're into music.
Like that's sort of their thing.
But in terms of food, Frenchonion soup certainly is huge.
There's a pub there called umUncle Antoine's, and that's the
(35:23):
English version.
In French, it's uh L'EncleAntoine, I think.
I don't know, maybe I butcheredthat.
Anyway, it's very good.
And they have like the it's veryEuropean there, so you'll be in
these restaurants that are oftenvery old and like there's stone
everywhere, and you feel likeyou're kind of in a cave, and I
don't know, it's beautiful.
Um, other things, they eat a lotof tortillas, which is like a
(35:46):
meat pie.
That's very good, actually.
And then they um, well, poutineis what everyone says Quebec is
known for, but I don't reallyunderstand that.
I don't like it.
It's called Poutine.
It's French fries with gravy andcheese curds.
It's kind of gross, actually.
A lot of people love it, but Idon't think it's that great.
But there is a place in Quebecthat I did not make it to that
(36:10):
was recommended.
So um there's a parliamentbuilding in Quebec City where
they the government that has agovernment, and I'm not a
political person, but it's areally cool tour.
You can do free tours there inEnglish or French to check out
the parliament buildings.
And then in the summer, theyhave a beautiful garden in the
front of that area, and theyhave a restaurant and they uh
(36:32):
serve everything that's grownfrom that garden, and
everything's fresh, and it'sapparently really delicious.
And they also have like abeekeeping area and they make
their own honey.
So if you go there in thesummer, it's called Le
Parlementaire, and it'sapparently amazing.
So very affordable.
So you probably can't get thethe suckers, the maple syrup
suckers in the summer, huh?
(36:53):
And you need the only like intourist shops.
But if you want the like true,like authentic experience, yeah,
it's you go like they have theyset them up everywhere in the
snow, and it naturally is cool.
And Quebec City itself, likeit's full of patios and
restaurants, and like there'sprobably I didn't eat out there
a lot because I was on my ownand I don't always love that.
(37:14):
Um, and I was saving my moneyfor my adventures and gas.
But um, but yeah, there's tonsof restaurants there, tons and
tons and tons.
SPEAKER_00 (37:23):
Yeah, I mean good.
Okay, so we're ready for ourrapid fire questions.
Always okay.
All right.
So what would you have forbreakfast?
So I mean normal breakfasts eachday there in Quebec City.
SPEAKER_01 (37:35):
Um, I don't think my experience is something you're
gonna be interested in, but theydo have a lot of like Oh, I want
to know.
So, you know, you know, really.
SPEAKER_00 (37:44):
Um granola, that's like the most popular across the
world.
SPEAKER_01 (37:49):
Yeah, like peanut butter and honey toast.
Um, but crepes, crepes are verybig there, so that's everywhere.
Like they're into bakeries, solike there's a lot of pan
chocolat and croissants and allthat kind of stuff.
And they have like deliciousfruit, like they have an island,
it's called Ile d'Orléans, it'sfive kilometers outside of
(38:09):
Quebec City, and it's 7,000people and I think six different
communities, but in thesummertime it's all like
orchards and vineyards andgardens and beautiful produce.
Yeah, and that's a really if ifyou're going in the summer,
that's a must.
You can cycle around there orjust drive around or do
(38:30):
whatever.
So you say it's like an island,how like what kind of like yeah,
you cross a bridge, there's likeI think a bit of a causeway, and
then it's just yeah, it's justlike an island.
What do they call it again?
Uh Ile d'Orleans.
So island of Orleans, if thathelps.
Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (38:47):
Okay.
SPEAKER_01 (38:47):
Yeah.
Um, it's beautiful, sobeautiful.
So a lot of delicious food comesfrom there and uh like yeah,
fruits, vegetables, all thatkind of stuff.
SPEAKER_00 (38:58):
Alrighty.
And then the money situation, alot of times I like to ask, is
it like just credit cards?
Are you better to exchange?
I mean, for you, it's you're inCanada going to Canada.
So, but is there the money?
It's all the same as Toronto oris it different?
SPEAKER_01 (39:12):
Yeah, so Canadian money is the same through the
whole country.
Um, but it's like anywhere.
So credit cards are acceptedeverywhere there.
And then um it's up to you uh asto what the exchange rate is
like for you when you come toCanada.
But yeah, it's uh, you know,modern place, so whatever works
for you.
(39:33):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (39:33):
And what's the music like?
Anything unique about music inwell, all of Quebec or because
since it's more mainly Frenchfocused?
SPEAKER_01 (39:41):
Yeah, I mean, they they would certainly be also
inundated with English music, sothey know English music, but
they also are very loyal to uhbands that are from Quebec.
Yeah, so there's some amazingFrench music, and a lot of
people don't like it that aren'tpeople are not from Quebec, but
I love it because I love thatprovince.
So yeah, it's fun.
(40:03):
I don't know how to describe it,it's kind of like folky party,
like it's like a kitchen partykind of tone.
But um yeah, like uh what arethose things called?
Ukulele's and fiddles and likeall that kind of stuff.
Not all the time, but that wouldbe like the Maritimes in
general, the East Coast ofCanada, that they're kind of
known for that.
But yeah, Quebecers have somepretty amazing musicians.
(40:24):
I mean, the most famous one, ofcourse, is Celine Dion, but I
wouldn't say she'srepresentative of like
traditional French music, right?
She's pretty international now.
But yeah, they have some.
SPEAKER_00 (40:38):
His name is uh Roque Vazine.
SPEAKER_01 (40:40):
That's right.
So yeah, he's like pretty famousfrom Quebec.
And there was another one calledMitsu.
She was also pretty famous fromthere.
Yeah, they're different, they'redifferent people, they're super
fun, and yeah, they just havetheir own kind of way.
I love them.
I think they're like I love theculture of Quebec.
(41:01):
It's fine.
Fantastic.
SPEAKER_00 (41:02):
And so when you get there, do you drive around a
lot?
Like, so if you somehow got toQuebec City, do you need a car
or is the is there publictransportation?
SPEAKER_01 (41:10):
Um, there are buses there for sure.
If you're there in the summer,you if you're only staying in
the city, there's a lot you cando in the city that is walkable,
and it's a walkable city.
I walked those streets likeevery day, all the time.
Um, but there's things to doalso outside of the city for
sure.
So for me, I I certainly neededa car.
(41:31):
Um and also it's touristy, solike groceries, you don't want
to go to like the grocery storesright in in the tourist areas
because they're gonna be afortune.
So yeah, but there are publicbuses, but I I did have a car
and I would recommend it.
But in the summer, too, I mean,there's a ferry, a beautiful, a
beautiful part of the city isthat there's a Chateau Frontenac
(41:53):
there, which is an old hotel.
It's a Fairmont Hotel, and itjust towers.
If you Google Quebec City,that's the first thing you're
gonna see.
So it just like towers over theSt.
Lawrence River, and there's abeautiful boardwalk along the
river.
But you can take the ferryacross the river, the St.
Lawrence River, to theneighboring town of Levis to
look at Quebec City.
(42:13):
Oh, the chateau.
Okay, yes, and that's beautifulat any time of the year.
Summer, fall is beautiful.
Quebec City in the fall, I'venever seen colors like that.
Like the trees are unbelievable.
So that's something I would tellpeople to do.
Yeah, they have something calledthe Montmorency Falls there.
They're beautiful, like thewhole city, the whole province
(42:36):
is so pretty.
But in the fall, it's sogorgeous with leaves.
SPEAKER_00 (42:41):
It sounds like you need to spend a year there, go
through all the seasons.
SPEAKER_01 (42:45):
Do you know what?
I when um COVID hit, a part ofme was like, Oh, I wish I had
just gone to Quebec for COVIDand just like been stuck there.
I think that would have beenjust awesome.
But hindsight, you know?
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (42:58):
I mean, totally.
Alrighty.
And then how about the closestplace to surf?
Where do people is there anykind of surf culture, whether
it's behind a boat or um like atthe big great lake?
SPEAKER_01 (43:11):
I mean, I don't know.
I can't tell you about Quebec.
Quebec's full of lakes, justlike Ontario.
So Canada in general is the landof lakes and rivers, but we
don't we have ocean of onobviously there's three oceans
that we're surrounded by, butum, I'm not in that world.
So I can tell you that inToronto we have the odd moment
where people are surfing on LakeOntario, which is one of the
(43:32):
Great Lakes.
But that is rare, but it doeshappen.
But I don't know in Quebec, Ican't tell you.
I'm sure they must have an areatoo where it's wild enough for
that, but they are also, andmaybe along like in the Gas Bay
Peninsula or on the riversomewhere, it might be like
that, but I wouldn't know.
You'd have to Google that one.
Okay, sounds great.
SPEAKER_00 (43:53):
And then your book again is called I copied and
pasted it, uh, The People YouMeet, Luxury, Leeches, Love, and
La La with a host of interestingcharacters in Southeast Asia.
And you said there's a couplebooks called The People You
Meet, so be sure listeners.
Uh The People You Meet byMelissa Rodway, if you want to
Google that.
And we'll put we'll put a linkin the show notes as well.
(44:15):
How to find it on Amazon.
SPEAKER_01 (44:17):
Amazon.
Yep, that's perfect.
Thank you.
I appreciate that.
And it's fun, it's an easy, funread.
You'll feel like you're on theadventure with me.
You'll feel like you're rightbeside me.
That's my tone.
That's how I I write, like as ifyou're there.
It's hilarious.
It's very honest.
And um, yeah, you'll learn alittle bit about that part of
the world, like certainlygeography, food, culture,
(44:41):
climate.
But um, more than anything, it'sjust a really good adventure,
and you'll be happy that I did alot of these things for you
because they're not alwayspleasant.
SPEAKER_00 (44:51):
Yeah.
Well, yeah, I'm very youmentioned uh like Cambodia, that
you you really loved it.
So I'm very excited because Iwould never go.
Eh, I don't know.
I don't know if I need to go toCambodia.
China too.
Wasn't that another one that wewere like, oh, China, like that
you really liked or something,or was I was it Cambodia only?
I can't remember.
SPEAKER_01 (45:07):
Um, Cambodia was my favorite, China was my least
favorite.
China is it was.
I was trying to remember, yeah.
That did it's very challenging,yes, but very beautiful.
It's a very beautiful place, butit was not an easy place for me.
But no, okay.
SPEAKER_00 (45:25):
Well, thank you very much.
And thank you for having me.
I really appreciate that.
Have a great weekend.
Okay, thank you.
You too.
Bye.
Thanks for listening.
If you enjoyed the podcast, canyou please take a second and do
a quick follow of the show andrate us in your podcast app.
And if you have a minute, wewould really appreciate a
(45:46):
review.
Following and writing is thebest way to support us.
If you're on Instagram, let'sconnect.
We're at where next podcast.
Thanks again.
Hi, welcome to our podcast, Where Next.
Travel with Kristen and Carol.
I am Kristen.
And I am Carol.
And we're two long-term friendswith a passion for travel and
adventure.
SPEAKER_00 (00:26):
Each episode, we interview people around the
globe to help us decide where togo next.
Well, thank you, Melissa, forcoming on.
I appreciate that.
I am so excited.
I want to start talking aboutyour travel, your website, your
experiences.
Um, you know, growing up, didyou do a lot of travel with your
family?
SPEAKER_01 (00:47):
So the story is that uh when I was about seven um in
1981, my dad took us to WesternAustralia.
So we lived uh just outside ofPerth in a very, very small
community.
So he was a teacher at the time,so we did a teacher exchange, so
(01:08):
swapped houses and jobs.
Our school was very remote.
It was uh in the middle ofnowhere.
We had to take like a bush pathto get there, and it was pretty
wild.
And this was 1981, so um therewas no helicopter parenting
happening, and basically ourparents just like opened the
door and off we went and wesurvived.
(01:30):
And we didn't want to go.
I remember when we first heardwe were leaving, we all cried
and thought this was terrible.
And then a year later, when wewere supposed to come back, we
didn't want to come back.
So it's just tells you howquickly you adapt.
Um, but in that year, we went toBali, and that was 81.
So no one was really going toBali.
Now Bali is like extremelytouristy, but not at that time.
(01:52):
So when we went, I had very,very blonde hair, and all the
women were giving us chocolateand touching my hair like I was
some like divine spirit.
And my sister was very tall forher age, she was 12, and they
wanted to marry her off.
And uh, it was pretty wild formy mom.
So that was pretty big.
(02:13):
And then we rented a van at onepoint, and we traveled around
Australia in a van and into NewZealand pre-internet.
So 81 is like you're kind of,you know, just going off.
And uh my parents probably sentthe odd letter or phone call
back to our relatives in Canada,but you're pretty cut off.
So that was pretty cool,actually.
(02:33):
I would say that was the firstsort of, well, at seven, that
was a pretty major thing.
I'm from a small town.
I live in Toronto now in Canada,but I grew up in a small town
about an hour and 20 minutesnortheast of here.
And my parents also grew up inanother small town.
So this was probably quite bigfor them.
And the message my dad alwaysgave us was um, you know, you
(02:56):
can create a life anywhere.
So, you know, that that wasyeah, that was pretty big.
And then after that, I mean, wedid a lot of camping and other
things, but I wouldn't say thatas a family we traveled a ton
together.
That was probably the biggestthing that we had done.
SPEAKER_00 (03:12):
Right.
And then so after that, youdidn't do any other big trips,
it was just camping and thingslike that.
So it didn't happen until Yeahwith my family, yes.
SPEAKER_01 (03:20):
But my parents always encouraged us to like go
and do things.
Um, so you know, I spent like asummer in Quebec, which we'll
talk about later when I was 15or 16.
My sister went off up north towork in resorts.
We both went out west to theRocky Mountains in in Alberta
and Jasper to work.
(03:41):
Like we were always encouragedto just keep doing things and to
have experiences and to do themactually without anyone that we
knew.
So go to camp, go to this, go tothat, but don't go with your
friends.
That was sort of the message.
So, yeah, so there was a lot ofindependence.
Um, I went to Belgium in highschool on exchange for two
months in high school.
Nice.
(04:02):
It's a different world now, andI don't know that that was the
best thing in hindsight, but uhthat was the message at the
time.
My brother and sister went backto Australia, and uh I went to
Europe and to Western Canada,and uh yeah, so it's being
independent and havingadventures has always been a big
message in our family for sure.
SPEAKER_00 (04:23):
Makes a lot of sense with your where you've where
you've gone.
Are your siblings are they stillin Australia or did they come
back?
SPEAKER_01 (04:29):
No, they just went, uh we all took a year off after
high school and they wentbackpacking around and working
there.
And uh, I never wanted to goback, to be honest.
It doesn't seem different enoughto me.
I mean, obviously they havedifferent animals and a
different climate, but I don'tfeel like the culture is
(04:50):
different enough for me to goagain.
SPEAKER_03 (04:53):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (04:53):
But uh they had a great time and still have
friends from there, so yeah,huge connections for sure.
SPEAKER_00 (04:59):
So when you took off your year after high school and
you you said Europe, did you goto Europe for a year?
SPEAKER_01 (05:06):
I went for a few months.
So I spent half that time inJasper in the Rocky Mountains in
Alberta, which I absolutelylove.
So I don't know if you guys havebeen to Ban for Lake Louise or
Jasper, but yes, you have.
Yeah, Jasper is like the mostnormal of all of them.
It has um not so much of I meanit's touristy, but it's just
(05:28):
more, it's a little calmer.
It's just a bit more of a normallifestyle if you're gonna be in
one of those towns.
Anyway, I absolutely loved itthere.
I spent way too long there.
I was there from off and on from18 to 21.
Had way too much fun there.
So we can make the story.
Um, but it was fun.
(05:49):
And then so part of the year Iwas out there and then I went uh
to Europe for a few months andwas in like France and Germany,
Austria.
I didn't have a clue what I wasdoing.
I was useless.
So I was actually how did youpick the places or know where
you just kind of I didn't do itwell.
I I will be so honest aboutthat.
Luckily, we had a family friendthere who who had moved to
(06:12):
France, and I used her as abase, and she helped me like
plot out a trip while I wasthere.
But again, this is like this wasdumb.
I was by myself, I was 19 yearsold, I had no idea what I was
doing.
I'd only lived in a small town.
I didn't even have a guide book,I didn't even know they existed.
I had no clue about lonelyplanets.
(06:34):
I was so naive, I just bought aplane ticket and showed up.
And there was no internet, therewas no research, there was
nothing.
How did you get that bravenessfrom?
Yeah, it's kind of it was kindof like there was no option.
That braveness was like youdidn't question it, you just
kind of did it.
And in hindsight, I'm like, thatwas that wasn't great.
(06:55):
Um had a good time.
Yeah.
Yeah, I always say I didn't haveinsurance, I did not have a clue
what I was doing.
So I survived it.
I met some people along the way.
I learned the hard way about howto do this.
But it's not like you know, alot of people romanticize about
that.
And I think now, if you're 19,it's probably all a lot easier
(07:17):
because of the internet.
But back then it's Did you havelike a suitcase where you held
with your hand?
Or just a backpack?
I'm still a backpacker.
I just remember one day readingsomeone gave me a very old
lonely planet.
I was in the middle of nowherein Switzerland, and I read
somewhere that this bus mightcome by, and I'm like, this
(07:38):
edition is many years old.
Like, I hope this bus stillcomes by.
Like it was just crazy.
That's hilarious.
SPEAKER_00 (07:44):
Some of it did the bus come?
SPEAKER_01 (07:47):
Yeah, I got I got on the wrong bus, but you know, I I
I figured it out.
But it is, it's just such adifferent time now.
I mean, that was the 90s, andum, yeah, here we are.
SPEAKER_00 (07:57):
So you know, I went to Costa Rica in 2002, and um I
had all this extra vacation timeand I wasn't gonna lose it.
I had 16 weeks vacation.
I took 12 out of 16 weeks, butone month I went to Costa Rica
and I had talked to thiscompany, Costa Rican Adventures,
and I wrote on a piece of paper,uh, because the internet, we
didn't really do that either.
(08:18):
Uh 50 people's names and phonenumbers that if once I got
there, if I needed help.
And I just I wrote everythingdown.
I gave uh my family theitinerary and then I kept
changing it.
And uh, you know, you had acalling card that I called and
said, okay, I'm gonna go live ona kayak for three days.
I'm not doing that, or I'm goingover here instead, and just kind
(08:38):
of went with it.
I think that was more normal.
And for our age growing up, too,it was more normal.
Whereas now for my kids who are18 and 21, you know, over the
every moment.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (08:51):
Right.
So different.
Oh, totally.
And there's a part of me thatyou kind of miss that.
Like that, that was a real like,if you're going, you're going,
and whatever's gonna happen isgonna happen.
But I do think it's a lot safernow, to be sure.
And it's easier, it's so mucheasier.
But there is some real beauty tothat, that way it used to be, I
(09:11):
think.
SPEAKER_00 (09:12):
So, what what what was your favorite trip on that
trip?
How long were you gone for?
Or was it like how did you kindof uh go?
Because it sounds like a couplemonths you'd go and then you'd
come back.
And I don't know if you were inschool or working or yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (09:25):
So that year that I took off, I wrote my exams early
from high school and I went outwest and lived there for I think
um five, six months, and then Iwent to Europe for maybe three
months backpacking and trying tofigure out what I was doing.
And then I went back out west,and then I went to university in
(09:47):
Montreal in Quebec after that.
Ended up moving back um toVancouver Island at one point.
I I moved a lot in my 20s.
Yeah, sounds like it.
Yeah, yeah.
Well, you learned, you had fun.
I was trying, I was trying tofind my place, right?
I think sometimes um peoplethink the 20s are the best of
times, and sometimes they're thehardest times are pretty
(10:09):
confusing of like what you'resupposed to do.
And I think the biggest lessonI've learned is that as you get
older, you actually feelyounger, and you're like, ugh,
like I can, you know, whenyou're young, you have all this
pressure, or so you think tolike figure it all out.
And then when you get older,it's like, oh my god, I was a
baby.
Why did I do that to myself?
Um but that's uh yeah, oh I lovethat.
SPEAKER_00 (10:33):
Figure it out.
So, and then um you went towork, but then you have a travel
um website and you you travel alot now.
Um, or you know, how did thattransform?
So your 20s, did you do thetravel and then now you're
working, but then you do take alot of time off.
And then of course we want totalk about the year off that you
(10:54):
took.
SPEAKER_01 (10:55):
Yeah.
So um I've never done the careerthing very well.
Um, I have made very strangedecisions that didn't really
suit me because uh yeah, Iprobably if I could go back in
time, that's one thing I woulddo over.
However, in my late 20s, Istarted traveling more and more
and more.
So I would say around 29 iswhere it became like a part of
(11:21):
my lifestyle.
So I Costa Rica was my first bigtrip like that, and then I was
hooked.
It's such an amazing country,it's safe, it's there's so much
to do, it's beautiful.
Um, and that I got the bug fromthat, to be honest.
And then so I I will just fastforward through that.
A few years later, I metsomebody who worked in the
(11:43):
travel industry, and so wetraveled as much as we could.
We were from differentcountries.
That ties into um my book thatwe can talk about in a minute.
Yeah, but anyway, so we met on acycling trip in Cuba.
He was from England, I was fromCanada, and we ended up
traveling together for many,many years.
(12:04):
Uh, he moved to Canada at onepoint, that's a whole other
story.
And then when I was 35, I quitmy job.
I was working in advertising andI hated it.
Yeah, I just it wasn't for me.
And so we took time off and wentto Southeast Asia.
So on that trip, we went toThailand, Lao, Cambodia,
(12:26):
Vietnam, and China.
And that's what my book is aboutthat I just put out.
It's called The People You Meet.
Subtitle is Luxury Leeches Loveand Lao La with a host of
interesting characters inSoutheast Asia.
So this was a trip where heworked in luxury travel and he
was researching routes of theworld.
(12:50):
And I was pretty much just alongfor the ride, which is fine by
me because I actually hateplanning trips.
I like going on them.
I don't like all the dirty work.
It's horrible.
But we he was on an agenda.
Like it was, I would say 90%backpacking, 10% luxury.
So we were staying in some, youknow, less than desirable places
(13:11):
a lot of the time.
And then once or twice a week,sometimes more, but sometimes
less.
We'd stay in a really likeover-the-top luxury, you know,
where the likes of AngelinaJolie would have been.
Like it was very expensive andwe didn't pay a dime for it.
It was very like one extreme tothe other.
(13:33):
And the point of it was for himis that he was making these
connections so that down theroad he would be able to sell
these hotels in itineraries tohis luxury clients.
But for me, I get very restless.
So, as wonderful as all of thiswas, and it was, after a few
weeks, I got very cagey becauseI didn't have a purpose.
And I think that's one thingthat has come up through travel
(13:55):
over the years is there used tobe this real dreamy thing about
I'm just gonna head off andtravel and see what happens.
But I don't think that it's likethat as much anymore.
You have digital nomads who arelike working while they're
traveling, people who arevolunteering, people who are
like picking up odd things todo.
I think we all need purpose.
(14:16):
And if you're on the road forweeks and weeks or months and
months, you can get a littlecrazy.
So I was so I was sitting onthese buses and trains, and they
were very long, sometimes like36 hours on trains and buses,
and it was not easy.
No, and in my head, I startedcreating all of these um stories
(14:37):
about what was happening, who wewere seeing, what was going on
between the two of us.
And so I wrote these emails oncea week, because again, we I
didn't have a phone.
I was going to internet cafes,and some people won't even know
what that means.
SPEAKER_02 (14:51):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (14:52):
We were like lucky to have a computer at a guest
house or a hotel.
So then I started sending theseemails, and people were loving
them, and they started sendingthem to friends and family.
Long story short, I turned thatall those emails into the book.
That was a long way to answeryour question.
So for me, um for that, I just Ijust quit my job.
(15:15):
I was 35, and that was probablya good and bad thing to do at
that time, but I didn't reallycare and I wanted to do it, and
off we went.
It wasn't easy rebuilding afterthat, but um, it's always worth
it.
So yeah, I did that for fourmonths.
He continued um for nine, but wewere on the road every day, like
(15:37):
almost every day, on in a newplace, doing something
different.
And after four months, I waslike, I'm out, I'm done.
Um, it's very exhausting.
And this is another thing that Ilearned on that trip.
And trust me, I love more thananyone being away.
I love adventures, I'm up forpretty much anything.
I love who I am when I'm awaybecause I think that you're a
(15:59):
very different person.
But there is something that Ilearned on that trip called uh
travel fatigue, and it is aliveand well.
And I remember I had met thiswoman.
She was in her 50s at the time.
I was in my 30s, and she hasdone everything.
This woman was remarkable.
She was like the icon, thelegend of any traveler I've ever
(16:21):
met, even to this day.
And I remember I was with hersomewhere.
We were in northern Lao orThailand.
I don't know where the hell wewere.
Anyway, we were somewhere, andthese two young girls came
through with backpacks uh to gettickets on some random bus.
And she looked at them for abit, and then she looked at me
(16:42):
and she said, They need to gohome.
And I said, What are you talkingabout?
What do you mean?
She said, They're done.
They're they're over it.
They've probably been on theroad too long, and their trip
should end.
And she said, That is one of thebiggest lessons, the most
important lessons in travelingthat nobody talks about is like
when you know that it's time togo home because you stop seeing
(17:04):
things.
You're seeing things, but you'renot seeing things, becomes a
job.
It becomes about your ego sayingthat you've been to XYZ even
though your heart is no longerin it.
And so, so I learned that lessonon that four-month trip where I
was like, it doesn't matter ifyou take me um to Hawaii at the
moment, I'm done.
I'm out.
(17:24):
So that was for me a veryinteresting thing.
So yeah, after that I came back,rebuilt my life a little bit,
and then uh when I was 48, Itook another, like I took a year
off again and did another likeseries of trips.
SPEAKER_00 (17:37):
So and then I have a question back on the you know,
the travel fatigue.
I experienced that too when Iwas backpacking across Europe.
I just like I just feel like Ineed to do something.
I'm like, if I could work when Iwas there, I probably would have
stayed a lot longer.
But have you heard that from alot of people?
SPEAKER_01 (17:51):
Is that like other travelers?
I don't think people like totalk about it, but um I'm very
honest.
So if you go on my Instagram, Iwrote a huge thing about it when
I was in um Chile and Argentina.
I think I was still in Chile,and I almost came home.
I had only 10 days left to go,and I was like sick over it and
(18:15):
just a disaster.
And my partner was like, You'vegot 10 days, you have to like
suck it up and get through it.
But I wrote a huge thing aboutit, and so many people, yeah, so
many people were like, Oh mygod, thank you.
Yes, and you know, what when youwhen anyone admits to anything
that we're afraid to say, peoplecome out of the woodwork and
(18:35):
they're like, Oh, me too, metoo.
But no one wants to admit, likethere's a lot of ego in travel,
I have to say.
Um, not for everybody, butthere's a lot of bragging
rights, and there's a lot of,you know, I'm better than you
because I've been to this numberof countries and blah, blah,
blah.
And it's so stupid.
But um, yeah, I think I thinkpeople talk about it more and
(18:56):
more now.
I think because of mental healthis like a big deal.
And I think also people have uhcome up with new ways to combat
that, right?
Like, say if you're feeling thatbadly, then just find a location
to like stay.
If you can, if you have theluxury of time and money, then
just stay put somewhere for abit and have a normal life and
do normal things.
(19:16):
I think that like we'venormalized travel more and more
and more.
Whereas back in the day it wasjust glorified as this, like,
you know, beautiful dream thatevery day you're skipping
through the tulips.
And it is not true.
It is hard.
It is hard.
It is hard.
SPEAKER_00 (19:31):
Yeah, especially people that move around a lot,
like every week living in a newplace.
That sounds totally exhausting.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (19:37):
Yeah.
And when we did this trip in2010, we were every two days uh
somewhere new, if not like, youknow, I think the longest we
stayed anywhere was three orfour nights.
That was it.
So it's very tiring.
SPEAKER_00 (19:50):
If people wanted to look at these trips on your
website, where do they find you?
I will say my website is not upto date, but you can go there.
SPEAKER_01 (19:57):
It's flyroadway.com.
Yep.
But the best place is Instagram.
So that's fly underscore travelunderscore media, and there you
will see everything.
And I if I had an assistant, mywebsite would be really great,
but it is not really great rightnow.
SPEAKER_00 (20:16):
Okay.
Tell us you don't live in QuebecCity, but you l love it.
You've spent a lot of timethere.
SPEAKER_01 (20:23):
In 2023, I took a year off, and as I said, my
first destination was QuebecCity, which a lot of people
thought I was crazy, especiallyif you're Canadian.
They're like, that's not veryexotic.
But um, I love it there, andit's very European.
So uh, and I it's very wintryand I'm a winter person, and I
always wanted to spend timethere.
(20:45):
So I lived there for five weeks.
It is an eight-hour drive fromToronto, it's a three-hour drive
from Montreal.
And you know, I don't know ifyou guys drive a lot in the
States, but to us, like we driveall the time.
It's a big country, so drivingis is what it is.
Yeah, so I spent some timethere.
I had an Airbnb that was verycheap.
(21:05):
It like for me in uh Canadiandollars, it was about 800 bucks
for five weeks, which isnothing.
Five weeks.
Oh, wow.
Oh, yeah, it's very, very cheap.
It's Quebec, the province ofQuebec has always been a little
cheaper than other places.
Personally, I really loved it.
It's also very beautiful in thesummer, but I was there for the
snow, and basically um my lifeconsisted every day of like um
(21:32):
cross-country skiing,snowshoeing, ice skating,
whatever, any of thosecombinations.
And then I lived um two minutesfrom a beautiful Nordic spa.
So I often went there later,would come home, read a book,
have a bath, watch Netflix, andgo to bed.
And I did that for five weekssolid, and it was heaven.
(21:54):
Did you get any travel fatiguethen?
No, exactly.
I had no, I had only one set offriends, like a couple that I'd
met.
I was I took I had an incidentbefore I got there.
My car was broken into and Ilost almost everything the night
before I got there.
So that's another story.
We can go there if you want to,but we know so I befriended this
(22:16):
couple uh at a French school.
I went to school for one week,which interrupted my winter
activities, but I did it.
And outside of them, I had zerosocial life, and I loved that
too.
It was just like heaven.
And I lived along the St.
Lawrence River, which is verybeautiful, and in the winter
it's full of uh ice flows, andso you could just see the ice
(22:39):
moving constantly along theriver, and it was very
meditative and peaceful.
And I mean, they get so muchsnow there.
So if you're not a winterperson, it's not for you.
SPEAKER_00 (22:50):
Okay, and then so you know, because I'm not really
a winter person, but I know likeit's it's not like bad weather,
there's bad clothing, right?
So do you like do they walkaround with like snow pants,
like just when you're cruisingaround?
I did.
I lived in them.
SPEAKER_01 (23:04):
Yeah, yeah.
I went outside all day.
And if I wasn't like skiing orskating or whatever, I was just
walking.
And the thing about Quebecers isthey um they go outside no
matter what.
So there was a winter, there's awinter carnival there every
year, and the year I was there,it was like between minus 40 and
minus 50.
(23:25):
That's extremely cool.
Yeah, Celsius.
But they're still out,everyone's there.
Yes.
So you everyone is wearing likesnow pants, snow boots, like you
you have to.
There's otherwise you're gonnabe inside for like many months.
Do schools ever have snow days?
Um, I don't know.
(23:45):
I'm sure that they do there.
We do here in Ontario quite abit.
I'm sure in Quebec they do too.
But the thing is, is they'revery prepared.
Like if there was a snowstormcoming, their plows are out like
right away.
They are under, they have thisunder control.
Toronto, we are not equipped.
Like we had so much snow thisyear, it was insane and it was a
disaster.
But Quebec is like, it's part oftheir lifestyle, it's part of
(24:07):
their culture, the snow.
So they're nothing to do.
SPEAKER_00 (24:09):
Yeah, it's probably like our mountains in Colorado.
Like they want those skiers,they have it ready.
Yeah.
Okay.
And then I've heard about uh asport called canoes, ice
canoeing.
Can you tell us about that?
And I wanted to also, yeah,that's part of the Carnival de
Quebec.
Is that that's I was justlooking.
It's February 6th through the15th this next year.
(24:30):
It sounds so much fun.
It's so much fun.
SPEAKER_01 (24:32):
Um, so ice canoeing is a traditional sport in
Quebec.
And during the carnival, thereare um competitions.
It's one of the most excitingparts of Carnival, Carnival, and
they actually have teams fromall over the world that come and
do it.
So I have tried it.
It's very hard, but it's veryexciting.
(24:53):
So basically, what happens isyou are put into a very large
canoe and it's made of metal,and they give you a paddle with
a spike on the end, they giveyou spikes to attach to your um
uh sorry, spikes to attach toyour boots, and they give you
some wetsuit uh leggings andthings like that.
Not your full body, but justlike from the knees down and
(25:16):
knee pads.
So I'll try to sum this up foryou.
But basically, you're in a withfive or six other people.
If you are in ice, becauseyou're on the river, you are you
have one knee in the canoe andthen your other leg is like
pushing off ice.
Wow.
You're pushing to and you'repushing the boat at the same
time.
You're looking to get to openwater.
(25:37):
As soon as you hit open water,everybody does like a 180, they
jump in the boat and they startpaddling.
And if there's any like icearound them, they have this
spike to like chop up the ice.
So you're paddling through thewater.
Once you hit ice again,everyone's out, you're pushing,
you're running, you're liketrying to get to open water, you
do it again.
It's insane, but it's reallyfun.
(25:59):
How long does it go for?
Like, oh, so when I did it, theytake you for like um an hour, an
hour and a half.
And but when you watch theevent, uh the race, they're
doing they're going back andforth across the river, the St.
Lawrence River.
And I think the river is isabout a kilometer long.
So it depends what categoryyou're in, but sometimes they're
going back and forth, back andforth, back and forth, depending
(26:22):
on what race they're in.
It's insane.
It's insane.
Yeah, but it's I think everyonejust like cheering on the
sidelines sometimes.
Yes, yes, yes.
SPEAKER_00 (26:30):
Oh, it's super exciting.
Yeah.
I mean, they compete.
I mean, like I've seen pictures,and and there's one picture I'm
looking at, and there's uh snowand water.
So there's a canoe of paddlers,and then another canoe behind
them still still pushing in thesnow to get to the water.
Yeah.
Wow.
SPEAKER_01 (26:48):
Yeah.
And in Quebec itself, I mean,they do it for carnival for like
it's an international event, butaround Quebec proper, they
compete all when like there'speople that this is their life.
This is their team, this is whatthey do all winter long.
So it's a big sport there.
SPEAKER_00 (27:03):
Okay.
And then so at the carnival, yousaid in February, is this kind
of like tied to Mardi Gras herein the States or Carnival in
Brazil?
Like no, it's its own um yeah,no, it's its own French
tradition.
SPEAKER_01 (27:16):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Oh, French tradition.
Well, yes, it's a French, aFrench place.
So um, yeah, it's really fun.
They have like ice sculpturesand an ice palace, and like
there's just tons to do.
It's a small city, it's not bigat all, and it just really uh is
electric for those 10 days, Ithink it is, or two weeks.
SPEAKER_00 (27:35):
The ice castle and the sculptures, you can stay in
an ice hotel, it sounds like,just like in Sweden, I think you
were mentioning.
SPEAKER_01 (27:43):
Yeah, the ice hotel is um about half an hour away.
So that's in a place calledBalcartier.
So they build this every yearwith a different theme in mind.
So that I forget how many roomsthere are, like 16, maybe
something like that.
And every room looks different.
And they have like a hotellobby, it's all made of ice.
You can just go, you can spendthe night, it's 400 bucks, or
(28:04):
you can just go for 25 and touraround the hotel and have a
welcome drink and all of that.
It's like really, really neat.
And the couple that I did meet,they did it.
They spent the night.
They said they were very warm.
They have like a sauna, I think,in a hot tub that you have to go
into the night before just tolike get your body warm.
And then they provide you withlike proper sleeping bags and
(28:26):
blankets and all that.
And if you really can't handleit, they book a hotel room for
you to go into in the middle ofthe night.
But my friends survived it andthey absolutely loved it.
So that's a super cool thing tosee, even if you don't want to
stay overnight, like just tohang out there for an hour or
two.
It's awesome.
It's it's really impressive.
SPEAKER_00 (28:44):
It looks incredible.
And I'm assuming it's notdripping on you, it's frozen and
oh yeah.
Oh, it's cold.
SPEAKER_01 (28:50):
Like when I was there, it was so cold.
Yeah, and then attached to that,they have a tubing park.
So if you're into tubing, whichI had never done properly, it's
actually like going to a skihill.
Like you have to go up the um,you know, the tow rope, and they
have like black diamond,intermediate, easy runs, and
it's really fun.
(29:11):
So that's a really fun day.
And in the summer, you can gothere for like a water slide.
So if winter's not your thing,it's a pretty cool little area
to check out anyway.
Obviously, no ice hotel in thesummer, but right.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (29:24):
And so it's is the whole um province French
speaking then?
Yes.
Okay.
SPEAKER_01 (29:30):
Well, yes, there are communities in Quebec that are
anglophone, um, but major themajority is French.
So, but yeah, like there's partsof Quebec where people grow up
speaking English and theyprobably their French is not
that great, but that's rare.
I mean, I would say 80 to 90percent of Quebec is French.
Okay.
SPEAKER_02 (29:52):
Wow.
SPEAKER_01 (29:52):
You can get by.
Like in a city like Montreal,Montreal is very touristy.
Quebec City is also verytouristy, so if you don't speak
French, you're fine.
Because they rely on tourism.
It's also a bit of a governmenttown, but they rely on tourism
heavily.
So you will survive.
But it does help to know like alittle bit, because you know, a
little bit goes a long way.
(30:12):
It's inundated with tourists inthe summer of that place.
SPEAKER_00 (30:15):
That sounds good.
And so you say you went to aFrench school there.
Is that very common?
And is that is it prettyadvanced French or is it like a
brand new movie?
Just because that sounds likealso like some people want to
travel with a purpose.
So let's go to Quebec City andlearn French while we're there.
SPEAKER_01 (30:31):
Totally.
It's a very good idea.
So for me, it happened becauseum all my stuff had been stolen
at that time and I didn't have Icouldn't like ski or anything.
I got it all back.
That's a different story.
But, anyways, for one week I wasin kind of stuck.
And so I decided to do it.
And um yeah, you can be anylevel.
(30:52):
You can be brand new to thelanguage, you can be
intermediate, senior, whatever.
And the people that I met, therewere a lot of young people
actually, um, but from manydifferent countries that had
come there to learn French.
And uh it was pretty cool.
It was not easy.
My it was not a like uh easybreezy.
I was like writing news articlesand looking at, yeah, it was it
(31:14):
was it was hard, but I loved itand I loved my teacher, and I'm
glad that I did it.
But one week was enough.
And I speak French pretty well,actually, but yeah, we can all
be better.
SPEAKER_00 (31:25):
So you you only took five weeks.
Did you have to go back to work,or how come you didn't stay
longer?
SPEAKER_01 (31:31):
Um, so that five weeks was part of uh my year
off.
So that was my first adventure,and then I went back to Toronto
for like three weeks, and then Iwent to South America.
If I had to stay there the wholeyear, I would have been fine.
I loved it.
There's so much to do in Quebec.
Like there's if you'reoutdoorsy, everything is within
reach.
So right in the middle of thecity is a park called the Plains
(31:53):
of Abraham, which is actually avery um historical place for
Quebec and Canadian history.
It's the site of a major battle.
But now it's like if you're awinter person, you can
cross-country ski there forfree.
There's, I think, 15 kilometersof trails.
It's beautiful.
There's a massive skating ovalthere.
(32:14):
In the summer, it's a beautifulpark.
It has beautiful views of thewater, and they do tons of
festivals in there.
Um, so it's like right in themiddle of the city.
And how cool is that?
I mean, if you can't getsomewhere, you can hang it
there.
But everything around there,like ski hills, um, other places
to skate, everything is under anhour.
(32:35):
So, like in Toronto, you have todrive forever to get to places
like this, but in Quebec City,everything is close.
I was skating at phenomenalplaces that were 25 minutes
away.
Once I drove an hour and a halfto do like a skating thing that
was in the forest, it was 15kilometers of ice skating, like
around trees and with differentanimals.
(32:57):
Oh my gosh, I've never heard ofthat.
Yeah, it's an amazing province.
Do you need these poles when youskate in the trees?
No, okay.
They will like clear it,Zambonian or ISAT or whatever it
is they need.
Oh, yeah.
But they take that stuff reallyseriously there.
Like they are serious outdoorsypeople.
It's awesome.
But yeah, so if I had had tostay long, I cried the whole way
(33:20):
home.
I didn't want to leave.
I I could just live here.
I mean, I cry often on my wayhome from most trips, but um, I
felt very uh connected there andthat I could easily live there.
It was amazing, and I would livethere.
It's just like my French ispretty good, but not good enough
to have a proper job there.
SPEAKER_00 (33:39):
All right.
You say that as a kid, when Iwould leave vacations, I would
cry.
And then when I first learned towake surf in Shasta Lake, I felt
like uh tears were formingbecause I was like, oh my god,
this is so much fun.
You know, it's yeah, if thathappens.
SPEAKER_01 (33:55):
Yeah, totally.
I mean, I don't know.
Sometimes I'm like, what doesthat say about my regular life?
Maybe that's the problem.
But um, it's fun to go away,right?
And to have a different life.
Absolutely.
SPEAKER_00 (34:08):
Very curious also.
And I think uh Carol will betalking questions, but food.
I was curious about the thefood, and I know there's French
onions.
Well, no, no, the well, I'm surethey have onions suited in
Quebec.
Um, but if there was traditionalfoods or things that they would
eat that was different orspecific to Quebec.
SPEAKER_01 (34:26):
So I um I drank a lot of hot chocolate because I
love it, and it's very goodthere.
Actually, they have some reallyamazing places there.
They're known for maple syrup inQuebec.
Uh so you can go to like a maplesugar shack or a tasting or
whatever, and they actually pourum maple syrup in the snow, and
(34:48):
you roll it with like a a stickand it creates like a a sucker.
Like it you have to look it upto uh wow, that's very unusual.
I love it.
SPEAKER_00 (34:59):
It's so natural, right?
Just one ingredient.
SPEAKER_01 (35:02):
They have a lot of they have an amazing culture
there, Quebec.
It's very different than otherparts of Canada.
So they're into food, they'reinto like having fun, they're
into drinks, they're into music.
Like that's sort of their thing.
But in terms of food, Frenchonion soup certainly is huge.
There's a pub there called umUncle Antoine's, and that's the
(35:23):
English version.
In French, it's uh L'EncleAntoine, I think.
I don't know, maybe I butcheredthat.
Anyway, it's very good.
And they have like the it's veryEuropean there, so you'll be in
these restaurants that are oftenvery old and like there's stone
everywhere, and you feel likeyou're kind of in a cave, and I
don't know, it's beautiful.
Um, other things, they eat a lotof tortillas, which is like a
(35:46):
meat pie.
That's very good, actually.
And then they um, well, poutineis what everyone says Quebec is
known for, but I don't reallyunderstand that.
I don't like it.
It's called Poutine.
It's French fries with gravy andcheese curds.
It's kind of gross, actually.
A lot of people love it, but Idon't think it's that great.
But there is a place in Quebecthat I did not make it to that
(36:10):
was recommended.
So um there's a parliamentbuilding in Quebec City where
they the government that has agovernment, and I'm not a
political person, but it's areally cool tour.
You can do free tours there inEnglish or French to check out
the parliament buildings.
And then in the summer, theyhave a beautiful garden in the
front of that area, and theyhave a restaurant and they uh
(36:32):
serve everything that's grownfrom that garden, and
everything's fresh, and it'sapparently really delicious.
And they also have like abeekeeping area and they make
their own honey.
So if you go there in thesummer, it's called Le
Parlementaire, and it'sapparently amazing.
So very affordable.
So you probably can't get thethe suckers, the maple syrup
suckers in the summer, huh?
(36:53):
And you need the only like intourist shops.
But if you want the like true,like authentic experience, yeah,
it's you go like they have theyset them up everywhere in the
snow, and it naturally is cool.
And Quebec City itself, likeit's full of patios and
restaurants, and like there'sprobably I didn't eat out there
a lot because I was on my ownand I don't always love that.
(37:14):
Um, and I was saving my moneyfor my adventures and gas.
But um, but yeah, there's tonsof restaurants there, tons and
tons and tons.
SPEAKER_00 (37:23):
Yeah, I mean good.
Okay, so we're ready for ourrapid fire questions.
Always okay.
All right.
So what would you have forbreakfast?
So I mean normal breakfasts eachday there in Quebec City.
SPEAKER_01 (37:35):
Um, I don't think my experience is something you're
gonna be interested in, but theydo have a lot of like Oh, I want
to know.
So, you know, you know, really.
SPEAKER_00 (37:44):
Um granola, that's like the most popular across the
world.
SPEAKER_01 (37:49):
Yeah, like peanut butter and honey toast.
Um, but crepes, crepes are verybig there, so that's everywhere.
Like they're into bakeries, solike there's a lot of pan
chocolat and croissants and allthat kind of stuff.
And they have like deliciousfruit, like they have an island,
it's called Ile d'Orléans, it'sfive kilometers outside of
(38:09):
Quebec City, and it's 7,000people and I think six different
communities, but in thesummertime it's all like
orchards and vineyards andgardens and beautiful produce.
Yeah, and that's a really if ifyou're going in the summer,
that's a must.
You can cycle around there orjust drive around or do
(38:30):
whatever.
So you say it's like an island,how like what kind of like yeah,
you cross a bridge, there's likeI think a bit of a causeway, and
then it's just yeah, it's justlike an island.
What do they call it again?
Uh Ile d'Orleans.
So island of Orleans, if thathelps.
Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (38:47):
Okay.
SPEAKER_01 (38:47):
Yeah.
Um, it's beautiful, sobeautiful.
So a lot of delicious food comesfrom there and uh like yeah,
fruits, vegetables, all thatkind of stuff.
SPEAKER_00 (38:58):
Alrighty.
And then the money situation, alot of times I like to ask, is
it like just credit cards?
Are you better to exchange?
I mean, for you, it's you're inCanada going to Canada.
So, but is there the money?
It's all the same as Toronto oris it different?
SPEAKER_01 (39:12):
Yeah, so Canadian money is the same through the
whole country.
Um, but it's like anywhere.
So credit cards are acceptedeverywhere there.
And then um it's up to you uh asto what the exchange rate is
like for you when you come toCanada.
But yeah, it's uh, you know,modern place, so whatever works
for you.
(39:33):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (39:33):
And what's the music like?
Anything unique about music inwell, all of Quebec or because
since it's more mainly Frenchfocused?
SPEAKER_01 (39:41):
Yeah, I mean, they they would certainly be also
inundated with English music, sothey know English music, but
they also are very loyal to uhbands that are from Quebec.
Yeah, so there's some amazingFrench music, and a lot of
people don't like it that aren'tpeople are not from Quebec, but
I love it because I love thatprovince.
So yeah, it's fun.
(40:03):
I don't know how to describe it,it's kind of like folky party,
like it's like a kitchen partykind of tone.
But um yeah, like uh what arethose things called?
Ukulele's and fiddles and likeall that kind of stuff.
Not all the time, but that wouldbe like the Maritimes in
general, the East Coast ofCanada, that they're kind of
known for that.
But yeah, Quebecers have somepretty amazing musicians.
(40:24):
I mean, the most famous one, ofcourse, is Celine Dion, but I
wouldn't say she'srepresentative of like
traditional French music, right?
She's pretty international now.
But yeah, they have some.
SPEAKER_00 (40:38):
His name is uh Roque Vazine.
SPEAKER_01 (40:40):
That's right.
So yeah, he's like pretty famousfrom Quebec.
And there was another one calledMitsu.
She was also pretty famous fromthere.
Yeah, they're different, they'redifferent people, they're super
fun, and yeah, they just havetheir own kind of way.
I love them.
I think they're like I love theculture of Quebec.
(41:01):
It's fine.
Fantastic.
SPEAKER_00 (41:02):
And so when you get there, do you drive around a
lot?
Like, so if you somehow got toQuebec City, do you need a car
or is the is there publictransportation?
SPEAKER_01 (41:10):
Um, there are buses there for sure.
If you're there in the summer,you if you're only staying in
the city, there's a lot you cando in the city that is walkable,
and it's a walkable city.
I walked those streets likeevery day, all the time.
Um, but there's things to doalso outside of the city for
sure.
So for me, I I certainly neededa car.
(41:31):
Um and also it's touristy, solike groceries, you don't want
to go to like the grocery storesright in in the tourist areas
because they're gonna be afortune.
So yeah, but there are publicbuses, but I I did have a car
and I would recommend it.
But in the summer, too, I mean,there's a ferry, a beautiful, a
beautiful part of the city isthat there's a Chateau Frontenac
(41:53):
there, which is an old hotel.
It's a Fairmont Hotel, and itjust towers.
If you Google Quebec City,that's the first thing you're
gonna see.
So it just like towers over theSt.
Lawrence River, and there's abeautiful boardwalk along the
river.
But you can take the ferryacross the river, the St.
Lawrence River, to theneighboring town of Levis to
look at Quebec City.
(42:13):
Oh, the chateau.
Okay, yes, and that's beautifulat any time of the year.
Summer, fall is beautiful.
Quebec City in the fall, I'venever seen colors like that.
Like the trees are unbelievable.
So that's something I would tellpeople to do.
Yeah, they have something calledthe Montmorency Falls there.
They're beautiful, like thewhole city, the whole province
(42:36):
is so pretty.
But in the fall, it's sogorgeous with leaves.
SPEAKER_00 (42:41):
It sounds like you need to spend a year there, go
through all the seasons.
SPEAKER_01 (42:45):
Do you know what?
I when um COVID hit, a part ofme was like, Oh, I wish I had
just gone to Quebec for COVIDand just like been stuck there.
I think that would have beenjust awesome.
But hindsight, you know?
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (42:58):
I mean, totally.
Alrighty.
And then how about the closestplace to surf?
Where do people is there anykind of surf culture, whether
it's behind a boat or um like atthe big great lake?
SPEAKER_01 (43:11):
I mean, I don't know.
I can't tell you about Quebec.
Quebec's full of lakes, justlike Ontario.
So Canada in general is the landof lakes and rivers, but we
don't we have ocean of onobviously there's three oceans
that we're surrounded by, butum, I'm not in that world.
So I can tell you that inToronto we have the odd moment
where people are surfing on LakeOntario, which is one of the
(43:32):
Great Lakes.
But that is rare, but it doeshappen.
But I don't know in Quebec, Ican't tell you.
I'm sure they must have an areatoo where it's wild enough for
that, but they are also, andmaybe along like in the Gas Bay
Peninsula or on the riversomewhere, it might be like
that, but I wouldn't know.
You'd have to Google that one.
Okay, sounds great.
SPEAKER_00 (43:53):
And then your book again is called I copied and
pasted it, uh, The People YouMeet, Luxury, Leeches, Love, and
La La with a host of interestingcharacters in Southeast Asia.
And you said there's a couplebooks called The People You
Meet, so be sure listeners.
Uh The People You Meet byMelissa Rodway, if you want to
Google that.
And we'll put we'll put a linkin the show notes as well.
(44:15):
How to find it on Amazon.
SPEAKER_01 (44:17):
Amazon.
Yep, that's perfect.
Thank you.
I appreciate that.
And it's fun, it's an easy, funread.
You'll feel like you're on theadventure with me.
You'll feel like you're rightbeside me.
That's my tone.
That's how I I write, like as ifyou're there.
It's hilarious.
It's very honest.
And um, yeah, you'll learn alittle bit about that part of
the world, like certainlygeography, food, culture,
(44:41):
climate.
But um, more than anything, it'sjust a really good adventure,
and you'll be happy that I did alot of these things for you
because they're not alwayspleasant.
SPEAKER_00 (44:51):
Yeah.
Well, yeah, I'm very youmentioned uh like Cambodia, that
you you really loved it.
So I'm very excited because Iwould never go.
Eh, I don't know.
I don't know if I need to go toCambodia.
China too.
Wasn't that another one that wewere like, oh, China, like that
you really liked or something,or was I was it Cambodia only?
I can't remember.
SPEAKER_01 (45:07):
Um, Cambodia was my favorite, China was my least
favorite.
China is it was.
I was trying to remember, yeah.
That did it's very challenging,yes, but very beautiful.
It's a very beautiful place, butit was not an easy place for me.
But no, okay.
SPEAKER_00 (45:25):
Well, thank you very much.
And thank you for having me.
I really appreciate that.
Have a great weekend.
Okay, thank you.
You too.
Bye.
Thanks for listening.
If you enjoyed the podcast, canyou please take a second and do
a quick follow of the show andrate us in your podcast app.
And if you have a minute, wewould really appreciate a
(45:46):
review.
Following and writing is thebest way to support us.
If you're on Instagram, let'sconnect.
We're at where next podcast.
Thanks again.
Popular Podcasts
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
Are You A Charlotte?
In 1997, actress Kristin Davis’ life was forever changed when she took on the role of Charlotte York in Sex and the City. As we watched Carrie, Samantha, Miranda and Charlotte navigate relationships in NYC, the show helped push once unacceptable conversation topics out of the shadows and altered the narrative around women and sex. We all saw ourselves in them as they searched for fulfillment in life, sex and friendships. Now, Kristin Davis wants to connect with you, the fans, and share untold stories and all the behind the scenes. Together, with Kristin and special guests, what will begin with Sex and the City will evolve into talks about themes that are still so relevant today. "Are you a Charlotte?" is much more than just rewatching this beloved show, it brings the past and the present together as we talk with heart, humor and of course some optimism.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.