Ep 155 / Savoring the Hunt: Wild Game Cooking with Hank Shaw

We're diving into the wild world of cooking game meat with the one and only Hank Shaw, and trust me, you're gonna want to stick around for this! Hank brings a treasure trove of knowledge about preparing everything from venison to the more exotic game, and he’s not shy about sharing his best tips and tricks. We chat about how to handle game meat to keep it from tasting "too gamey" (spoiler alert: it's all about the cooking!), and share some mouthwatering recipes that might just inspire your next meal. Plus, we swap some hilarious hunting stories that will have you laughing and thinking about what’s for dinner! So grab a seat at our virtual campfire and let’s get cooking!

Takeaways:

• Cooking wild game can be a culinary adventure, offering unique flavors and textures that differ significantly from store-bought meats.
• Proper meat handling is crucial to avoid gamey flavors in venison, and techniques like removing glands can make a big difference in taste.
• Utilizing all parts of the animal, including less common cuts like heart and tongue, can lead to delicious dishes and reduce waste.
• Wild game meat, such as venison, is typically leaner than conventional beef, making it a healthier choice packed with nutrients.
• Seasoning and marinades can enhance wild game dishes, but they should be applied thoughtfully to really elevate the flavors without overpowering them.
• Sharing your wild game meals with friends and family is a great way to promote hunting and show the benefits of fresh, home-cooked food.

Links referenced in this episode:

• huntgathercook.com
• substack.com
• amazon.com
• grittybowman.com

Companies mentioned in this episode:

• Hunter, Angler, Gardener, Cook
• Gritty Bowman
• Flavors of the Forest

Episode Transcript

(00:02):
Welcome to the WhitetailAdvantage podcast with.
Your host, Brett Bovin.
Thank you for tuning in andenjoy the show.
Oh, we're going on.

(00:24):
Oh, we're going to.
Oh, boy.
Double fist those bullets.
Oh, man, you know it.
Yeah, we're not going to do anintro, but I'll at least say this.
It's Tuesday, June 3rd.
Episode 155 Put your corn inthe slot machine.
Thank you to all the men andwomen in the military.

(00:45):
And let's just pull up a chairto electronic campfire and have an
awesome story tonight andlearn some wild game cooking with
our guest tonight.
Hank.
Hank, thank you for coming onthe show, brother.
Thanks for having me on.
John Squad, what's going on?
I don't like being in yourspot, Brett.
I don't like the spot.
You got to move.
I don't like it either, butthings were moving around and I can't

(01:07):
control it now at this point.
I'm sorry.
Oh, man, you're.
You're going to be running the show.
Apparently.
You're up there in the top left.
I feel weird now.
I.
I don't like it one bit.
Let's try something else here, man.
It's not doing that either.
Arguing about placements on your.
On a screen that no one cansee if they're listening.
Well, I mean, it means.
It means, you know, a lotbecause, you know, Brett.

(01:31):
Brett might get upset.
Brett is upset, clearly.
I mean, his face is turning red.
No, don't do that camera angle.
I hate it.
See, that just means I shouldmute Brett either way.
Hank, again, thank you forcoming on the show.
Yeah, we do a little banterand we get off the rails once in
a while, so I apologize.

(01:51):
I'm sure you're alreadyregretting coming on.
Already, but not yet.
Give me five minutes.
Well, brother, can you give alittle background about yourself?
Sure.
I live in the Twin Cities, andI've been.
I've been running a wild foodwebsite called Hunter, Angler, gardener,
Cook since 2007 and been onmost of the TV shows.

(02:15):
I won a few cooking awards,few writing awards.
I've written six cookbooks.
One literally just came outthree days ago.
And I basically have probablykilled, cooked, and eaten damn near
everything in North America.
Smaller than a moose.
Very cool.
Really cool.

(02:36):
I am closing in on themythical small game slam.
Oh, nice.
What exactly is it?
I invented it because nobody'sever done it.
It's basically to hunt, kill,and eat everything smaller than a
pig in North America.
And I think there's my gotmaybe 20 species still to go.

(02:59):
But I've.
It's been.
It's been kind of a funjourney and definitely good for.
For some kitchen stories.
Now, what is your.
Your most memorable one?
Easy.
So a guy named Brian Call.
He's a guy from Utah.
He runs a thing called.
I think it's called Gritty Bowman.
And so we're in.

(03:19):
And we're on the Mexicanborder in Arivaca in Arizona.
And so this guy shoots a coatof mundi with his bow.
And coatimundi basically looks like.
I don't know if a lemur and araccoon had a love child.
That's a.
That's a coati.
And there's.

(03:39):
They're legal.
You can kill one a year in Arizona.
So he sticks one with his bow,and I'm sick as a dog, right?
So I get up in the nextmorning, and I'm like, oh, God, I
can't hunt.
And he's.
He's skinning this thing inthe kitchen of the Airbnb, which
is hilarious, but.
And I'm like, what are yougonna do?
Like, I guess you're caping itout for a mountain or something.
He's like, yeah, yeah.
And then I'm gonna eat the meat.
I'm like, well, what are yougonna do?
He's like, oh, I'm just gonnathrow it on a grill.

(04:01):
I'm like, bro, you're gonnakill us all.
So let me just.
Just.
Just step away from the carcass.
Let me take care of it.
And I basically braised ituntil it was tender and then grilled
it over mesquite and then made.
Basically made tacos out of it.
It was damn good.
Wow.
Nice.
I.
I've learned that any meatthat's questionable is better as

(04:22):
a taco and.
Also better when you cook thehell out of it.
Oh, absolutely.
Where's my question go that Ialways draw a blank on the name of
it, but that silver.
That, like, in the venison.
Silver skin.
Huh?
Silver skin, yeah.
That silver skin.
Yeah.

(04:42):
Yeah.
So this is my main questionI've been dying to ask you.
All right, so people, whenthey say when they eat venison, they're
like, it tastes too gamey ortastes too rough.
I was always under theimpression that it's always coming
down to the cook who cooks upthe meat and stuff like that, but
in my opinion, it's thatsilver lining, that silver skin right

(05:05):
there that's been left on themeat that could cause that effect.
Is that true?
Not really.
In Fact, silver skin is a goodthing to keep on a back strap when
you're gonna freeze it becauseit provides an extra layer of protection
against freezer burn.
If it's going to be gamey, ifit's going to have an off smell to
it, there's a lot of reasonsthat that could happen and none of

(05:26):
them are involved with silver skin.
I always leave it on and thenI will remove it when I cook it.
So.
Because a, it's the protectionagainst freezer burn, but it's also,
it comes off way easier on athawed piece of meat than on a fresh
piece of meat.
It can be a little persnicketywith a fresh piece of meat and it's

(05:46):
basically peels off on athawed piece of meat.
If you're looking forsomething, why something is gamey.
Typically if you're shootingbucks and rot, that's a good reason.
If the deer didn't get cleanedquickly, that's a reason.
If the, if you got mud on it,if it's, if you gut shot it or as
they say in the trade, oh, Ishot a little far back.

(06:07):
Which means you shot like,like, yeah, that can do it.
There's a whole bunch of other reasons.
Like if you get a post rutbuck, they're so stressed and their,
their systems are so worn downfrom the whole rut period that the
quality of meat is just not good.
So I mean there's a ton ofreasons we could get into them if
you want, but it's not thesilver skin.

(06:28):
Yeah.
I'm curious to see what wouldreally cause that, that true gamey
feeling of when people try toeat it.
Because I, and I'll say this,my, my dad, my grandpa, he doesn't
like medicine.
I don't know why, he just does.
And we made up this acetypedeal and the main meat source protein
was, was venison.

(06:49):
And we surprised him with itand he said he loved it.
He said, oh, I always hatedvenison because it always tastes
too gamey.
And that's your main thing ofpeople, why they don't like venison
because it tastes too gamey.
That's all meat handling.
You know, it's, it's not allmeat handling, but it's mostly meat
handling.
You've got a lot of cases I'veseen where it's just, you know, have

(07:09):
some food safety, you know,ideas guys.
Like I've seen people workingon meat when it's like 60 degrees
out, 70 degrees and it's justlike kind of like getting warm.
I've seen people dunk it inwater and then the water gets over
40 degrees and then you'veessentially made bacteria soup.
I've just seen, I've seen hairall over the meat.
Just.
There's endless horror storiesof what can go wrong if you don't

(07:33):
have your act together beforeyou actually shoot the deer.
I mean, you should have a planfor what you're going to do with
the deer before you shoot the deer.
So being a basically a thirdgeneration Italian butcher, we learned
growing up as kids to get theglands out of the meat.
There's six and a deer.
That's, that's total.
A lot of people make themistake when they separate the meat.

(07:57):
They either cut through thegland and that tarsal gland.
Yeah, that's a good point.
Yeah.
The glands that you got, twoin the rumps, two in the front shoulders,
two up in the higher neck.
And what happens is it peoplewill take that meat, they cut through
that gland, the gland secretes.
And you know, let's be honest,your, your, your rumps, all your

(08:17):
roasts and everything, you'recoming out of the back, you know,
out of your rear hindquarters,and it contaminates the meat.
And, you know, not tooting myown horn, but when I make venison,
people think it's beef.
They, they can't believe itdoesn't have any gamey taste.
But it's just like you said,Hank, it's all in the preparation.

(08:37):
It's how you handle it fromthe time it hits the ground that's,
you know, gutting and then,you know, getting it hung up and,
you know, keeping thetemperatures right for that deer.
A lot of people think they candry age deer in their garage.
That's incorrect because youneed a constant, you know, temperature

(08:57):
that's set in a dry condition.
Apple coolers are good forthat, and regular refrigerated systems
are good for that.
But to sit there and say,yeah, I dry aged that meat in my
garage and the temperatureswent from, you know, 20s at night
and into the mid, you know,40s and maybe even the 50s and early
season.
Geez, you know, it's, it's ascary thing.

(09:19):
And I mean, you can get away.
With that for 48 hours, but.
Yeah, I know, I know, but it'sso freaking risky, man, when, you
know, you sit there and youthink about what people are and you
know, I go to game dinners andI'm like, oh, Lord, please protect
me, because I don't know howthey Handle it and what they're making,
but hopefully they cooked itgood enough.

(09:39):
So.
But yeah, just a, just alittle interesting thing we learned
as kids, you know, not to, notto cut those glands.
Get those glands out of the meat.
You can cook a whole hind legof a deer though, and you'll be fine
because then when you get intoit, you just remove that gland when
you, when you kind of get to it.
It's breaking the gland whenit's raw.
Exactly.
Yep.
Yeah.

(09:59):
No, you're fine with it aslong as you don't disturb it.
Like, you know, if you make itsecrete, then it's, then it's a problem.
The tarsals are the worst.
Oh yeah, big time.
What would you say is yourfavorite venison recipe?
I mean, I wrote an entire bookon cooking venison.

(10:20):
There's like 150 recipes in it.
So it's like which is yourfavorite child.
And just like most parents,your favorite child kind of changes
depending on how the child'sare acting.
My favorite recipe kind ofdepends on the season and really
what we're doing.
Like, I can tell you thoughthat I prefer recipes from the front

(10:40):
of the deer rather than theback of the deer.
So I would much rather playwith shanks shoulders neck.
Deer tongue is pretty good.
Deer heart is really good.
The thing about backstraps andhind leg roast is they're fine, but
they bore me.
You know, I'm a professional cook.
So it's like, okay, here,here's another venison backstrap.

(11:02):
Great, here you go.
And I made a nice sauce for it.
Everyone's gonna enjoy it.
I'm bored to tears.
Where you can make somethingreally interesting and special out
of the front of the deer.
Because of all that connectivetissue which you use to your advantage
by cooking it really slow andlow and, and, and covered like a
braise or you can smoke it.

(11:24):
And so one of the things I doa lot with the front end of a deer
or a moose or, or a caribou orwhatever is to smoke it for a couple,
two, three hours as a firststep to get a little bit of extra
flavor on it and then braise it.
So what you have that withthat two step is you get it.
It's super tender.
It makes the best barbacoayou've ever eaten in their life.

(11:46):
And that's.
Those are the things thatexcite me when I'm cooking deer meat.
So I would never think to cookup the tongue.
Oh yeah, deer tongue.
Well, I mean, Elk tongues andbison tongues and moose tongues are
better because they're bigger.
But you can go to a deer camp, right?
And like, hey, man, you guyswant your tongues?
And everyone looks at you likeyou have three heads.

(12:08):
I'm like, don't worry about it.
I got it.
And then they're awesome.
They're just as good as a.
As a beef tongue.
They're just smaller, that's all.
So now how to pick one of them up?
Well, first, you got to get itout of the deer.
And if you're familiar withthe Columbia necktie, it's that.
So you literally take it fromunderneath the chin, and you kind
of yank it down underneath,and then you remove it.

(12:30):
There's a couple.
Two bones that attach it atthe base, and you can either yank
real hard if you want, or youcan just cut around it.
You get those two bones out,and then you braise.
You always braise the tonguebecause it has a skin on it.
And this is just like a beef tongue.
It's smaller.
So obviously you wash it, butthen you would.
You would cook it just, like,in salt water.
And it's ready when you take,like, a paring knife or, you know,

(12:53):
any skinny, just sharp, thin knife.
Like, I use my flexible bladeboning knife to do this because it's
thin and sharp.
If you stick the tongue andthe blade goes right in, it's ready.
So you take it out, and thenas soon as it's cool enough to touch
it should still be hot, thenyou can absolutely just peel that
skin right off, and it willstick maybe in one or two places.

(13:16):
But if you do it right and youcook it long enough, that skin comes
right off, and then underneathit is just meat.
So I don't ever serve tonguesthat look like tongues because that's
weird and gross.
And it's like the food that tastes.
It's just.
It's the food that tastes you back.
But you chop it, you dice it,you shred it, and then I usually
always finish it on.
On a comal or a flat top orgrill it and then chop it, and it's

(13:40):
again back to tacos.
It makes a baller taco.
Oh, I bet.
I got into or I got onto a kitof venison heart tacos last season.
Oh, there you go.
Oh, man, they were amazing.
It's a perfect cut for a tacobecause you're cutting it small.
Oh, absolutely.
My wife just made usenchiladas with venison or my deer

(14:02):
I shot last year, and it's Delicious.
I love when she cooks theenchiladas, and I love when she'll
cook the.
She has this stuffed shellsrecipe, and she used to do beef,
and then she got with me, andthen she uses venison, and she'll
probably cook up like 40 at a time.
Oh, like Italian.
Italian chef shells.

(14:23):
Yeah, like the.
The.
Yeah, the stuffed shells.
And then she'll just throwmeat in it, and she'll use this.
I can't remember the name ofwhat it's called.
And she'll lump it alltogether, and it's just this meat
little ball type deal andwrapped in a salami shell.
And.
Oh, man, I can eat 20 of thosein one sitting.
And they're delicious.
I love when she cooks them.

(14:44):
They sound good.
Yeah.
I want to get her.
I asked her like, hey, becauseI know John's been working on this
cookbook, and I was like, hey,hey, Charity, can I.
Can I add those recipes forthose two?
And she goes, no, they're mine.
You ain't getting.
So I'll squeeze it out.
So.
Hey.
Oh, go ahead, bro.

(15:05):
I'm sorry.
Oh, no, you're good.
Go ahead.
I got two questions lined up.
Yeah, I got one for him, too.
Real quick.
I just wanted to see whilewe're on that subject, because he
was talking about how he makesthe tongue.
I was just wondering, do youhave any special marinades?
Like, what's your go tomarinade like when you're.
I know it's going to vary withthe cuts of meat, but give me one
of your typical go tomarinades for venison.

(15:26):
I actually don't use marinadesvery often because they.
They really only touch thesurface of the meat.
Salt will get all the way tothe center, but.
But all the other stuff reallysits in the surface, and it can.
It's not a terrible idea, butit's not a.
A lot of people have cur.
Like, oh, it's my marinade.
It's all my marinade.
Well, it is and it isn't.
You're going to get a littlebit of flavor residual on it from

(15:48):
after cooking the meat,because it's just going to be in
all the nooks and crannies ofthat piece of meat.
But really what you want to dois take that marinade and boil it,
whatever it is.
And so it's.
It's, you know, it's foodsafe, and then use it as a sauce
after you finish cooking the deer.
I would say the one that I usea lot is olive oil and soy Sauce

(16:11):
and puree.
Green or red chili.
It's a, it's a mixture Ilearned in Baja Mexico that they
use with arachera or skirt steak.
Okay.
And.
And it's really, it's a simple.
It's just sort of like a Bajacarne asada you marinate.
And it's just.
I don't really do a lot ofcomplicated stuff.

(16:32):
I do complicated sauces, but Idon't do complicated marinades.
Gotcha.
No, that's a good point.
That's.
That's cool.
I'll have to try that.
That sounds pretty amazingright there.
Yeah, I'm just trying toremember what I have in my freezer
right now.
I didn't pull that out for tomorrow.
There you go.
My first question is, I mighthave missed it in your intro, but

(16:55):
you being a professional chef,where exactly have you all worked
at?
So I.
My career track is kind of weird.
I started as a line cook and asous chef in Wisconsin when I went
to University of Wisconsin,and then I worked in New York and
I worked in Virginia, and Ibasically just bounced around professional

(17:18):
kitchens.
I was never an executive chef.
I never had my own restaurant.
And then I became a newspaperreporter for a long time.
And when the newspaperbusiness, you know, basically shit
the bed in the early 2000s, Ishifted back into the kitchen.
And I've basically been doingkinds of pop ups ever since.
And it's been a really cool, Areally cool experience because you

(17:40):
get to learn a lot ofdifferent cuisines, you get to work
with a lot of differentpeople, a lot of different kitchens,
and you don't really have thatday in and day out, drudgery of,
here's the menu.
We got to cook that menu everysingle time.
And it can get.
I mean, having done it, it canbe, it's.
It's rewarding because, youknow, you really get to know whatever

(18:01):
it is that is on the menu.
But it also bores you to tearsafter a while.
What would you say was yourfavorite place that you worked in,
one place that you learned themost from?
I learned the most from aplace called the Blue Marlin in Madison,
Wisconsin.
I started there as the fishprep guy because I'd been a commercial
fisherman in college.
And so I prepped all the fishfor the better part of a year.

(18:25):
And then, you know, as it.
If anybody out there listeninghas been in the restaurant industry,
you know that people justdon't show up sometimes.
And it's a little bit like in football.
It's like, next man up.
And so I went from fish prepguide to cooking saute, and I.
I got a chance to do all ofthe stations at that restaurant,
and it's one of thefoundations of the.

(18:46):
Of my ability to cook fish and seafood.
I mean, I ended up writing awhole book about it, and I learned
a ton there.
So I have a question aboutcooking seafood, then.
What is your go to.
Or do you even eat the walleye cheeks?
Sure, of course.
I mean, yeah.
I mean, any fish that hascheeks big enough is worth taking
the cheeks out.

(19:07):
Oh, absolutely.
So I completely agree.
And I think walleye cheek is,like, probably one of the best cuts
of fish I've ever had.
All cheeks are good.
And I mean, but walleye cheeksfor cod cheeks is what I grew up
with.
Cod cheeks are great.
Probably the best cheeks arehalibut because they're big and meaty.
They're also, like, 20 timesthe size of a walleye cheek.

(19:28):
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
I literally have done aservice where everyone gets one halibut
cheek, and I.
I did, like, a saffron tomatosauce underneath it, and it was.
It was pretty damn good.
But walleye cheeks, I justlike to flour them and fry them,
like.
And I like to fry fish inactual, like, Mexican lard.
And what I mean by that is the.

(19:50):
The.
The lard that's not shelf stable.
The stuff that's.
Yeah.
Like, fresh lard.
And that's my favorite frying medium.
Okay, Very nice.
It's weird.
Michael's back on the show.
I swear, he hated us.
Nobody came back on to just.
I can answer that question.
And.
And I personally have nevermade anything with possum, but I've

(20:12):
eaten possum.
I was dynamus.
Oh, we finally found somebody.
We finally found somebody.
Mike.
Mike, we found some.
Holy.
Hank, I'm sorry.
I didn't mean to call you up,but we've done.
Yeah, yeah.
We've got at least on 40 showswith him asking, have you tried possum?
And you're the first one finally.

(20:33):
Yeah.
So possum.
So it's down in.
In the deep South.
And it was an old black ladywho made a possum pie with sweet
potatoes.
There it is.
And it was really good, actually.
The meat was porkish.
It was.
It was a light in color.
It was kind of stringy becauseyet she cooked it.
Well, there's an expressionlike, because, you know, possums

(20:55):
will eat anything, right?
So a lot of people who eatpossums, they'll cap.
They'll catch them.
And what this lady says, youGot to feed the nasty out of them.
So she fed this possum likekitchen scraps for like a week and
then.
And then murdered this poor thing.
Yes.
You know, I mean, if you feeda possum for a week, it's your friend.

(21:17):
And.
And he.
He made a bad choice becauseshe killed him and.
And cooked him in a pot andserved him with sweet potatoes, and
it was pretty good.
Wow.
It's going to be someone fromdown south.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, we said that.
We said that.
Yep.
I.
Wow.
You have to cook them out.
Let me ask you.

(21:37):
I mean, I'll put it this way.
I won't go out of my way tokill and eat a possum.
Like, you know, it was.
It was fine, but it was fine.
It tastes like porcupine is.
Porcupine is much better.
I am a big fan of porcupine.
That is for sure.
Yeah.
A couple different times.
I also don't love killingporcupines because to me, they're
like.

(21:58):
They're slow and they're kindof chill, and they don't.
They're just more like hay,you know, and if I really needed
to eat, yeah, Hell, yeah, I'mkilling one.
But, you know, there's otherstuff that eat in the forest that's
besides Mr.
Porcupine.
Yeah.
So I typically like this timeof year especially, I draw it into
the woods where I'm at and get mushrooms.
Like, I have so many oystersand hen of the woods and chicken

(22:22):
of the woods already.
Any good recipes for those?
Well, I don't think you havehen of the woods.
You probably have chicken inthe woods.
Oh, we have both, actually,where we're at.
Yeah, you shouldn't have henof the woods in the spring.
They're a fall mushroom.
Oh, okay.
Yeah.
Chicken of the woods.
Yeah.
So that's the orange one thatgrows in, like, a shelf.
Yeah, that's chicken of the woods.
Yeah.
Those are just starting tocome out.

(22:43):
Those I like.
And those are really good.
I mean, they call them chickenof the woods because you get.
They're not that differentfrom chicken breast.
I mean.
No, I've done them on thedrill just like a chicken breast,
and they turn out amazing.
I like them.
Don't dry them because theybasically become wood.
Yeah, I found that out thefirst time.

(23:04):
Yeah.
So don't dry them.
One good way to preserve themis to cook them and just real simple
with salt and olive oil orbutter or something, and then cook
them as if you're going to eatthem that night.
And Then let it cool andvacuum seal that.
And that's a great way topreserve it.
Yep.
That's what I've done before.
And then I've also made like a.

(23:25):
Almost like a poured or apulled pork with them.
Oh, that's cool.
And that was really good.
And then I made a.
We had the lobster claw mushrooms.
I found those.
Oh, yeah, those are fun.
And oh, my gosh, those are amazing.
I made like a.
A lobster claw.
Poor boy sandwich.
And man, those.
You can try.
Oh, can you?
You can.

(23:46):
You could.
Lobsters dry better than chickens.
And then lobsters are great pickled.
Really?
You gotta cook them.
You know, you can't just,like, put them in there raw, but
you got to cook them and then.
And then you can pickle them.
And they'll keep.
They'll keep all year in the fridge.
Now, what about.
Have you ever tried anythingwith Old man of the Woods?
I've eaten Old man in theWoods a couple times, and they're

(24:09):
not my favorite.
So those are the three edible mushrooms.
Quasi edible.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And they're really easy toidentify, so that's why I started
with those.
And I tried them and I.
I was like, oh, mushrooms with eggs.
You can't screw it up.
So I made scrambled eggs and Iput Old man in the woods.
And you know how it is.

(24:29):
It turns those eggs completely black.
Yeah.
And, oh, my God, I couldn'tget over the visual effect of it
because, you know, you eatwith your eyes first.
Murder eggs.
I couldn't do it.
Like emo eggs.
Exactly.
Yeah.
I.
I had questions too, and thenI just got blindsided by.

(24:52):
I got.
I got one for him if he.
If he's interested.
I feel so comfort and easeright now.
I don't know why.
Oh, that's all right.
So, Hank, I.
I wanted to ask you.
What do you think is the mostunderrated game meat?
Underrated?
Probably javelina.
Javelin is probably the first.

(25:13):
That's the first thing thatpopped into my head.
Wow.
Okay.
Because it's.
It's a weird.
I mean, it's a New World pig.
So, I mean, I guarantee youthere's 17 people out there like
it's a rodent and like it'snot a rodent.
It's not a rodent.
No, it's not.
And nor is it really thatclose biologically.
Biologically to old worldpigs, except they'd be.
Although they look alike, they.

(25:34):
But they co.
Evolved.
Javelinas evolved in this hemisphere.
And one thing that I think isreally super cool about them is they're
vegetarian, so they will nevercarry trichinite parasites.
So in theory, I've never doneit, but in theory you could eat,
I mean, javelina sushi.
I'm not gonna.
But it's a hell of a lot saferthan doing that with pork.
But I think what happens isthey have a really nasty scent gland

(25:59):
at the base of their back,like kind of like a tramp stamp.
And if while you're skinning,if, while you're skinning that javelina
and you.
And you rupture it, God helpyou because it's a, it's like an
oily thing.
And, and what happens is themales kind of, they dig it, right?
So like they, they, they'restinky on the outside, but that's

(26:20):
all they, that's that oils ontheir fur.
So people get all bent out ofshape because, like, oh, they stink,
they're not edible, blah,blah, blah.
Well, wear a pair of gloveswhen you skin the animal because
it's going to get on yourfingers and it's going to get on
your knife and it's going toget on everything.
Skin the animal like you'dskin anything else.
Something special.
Just don't nick that part.
It's in the skin, so youwouldn't even see it unless you dick

(26:41):
around on the skin there.
Take it off, take those glovesoff, wash your knife and proceed
as normal.
And you will notice any smell.
Okay.
And that's what, really, whatgets people crosswise with that animal.
But it's delicious.
It's one of my favorite ones.
Nice.
I actually had no idea whatthis thing was until you said it.
And it looks just like a pigthat you'd see here in, like, Texas.

(27:02):
It's a micro pig.
Basically.
It's like a little razorbackmeat hunter.
And he cooks it inside of itsown stomach.
Oh, yeah, that was.
Yeah, that was horrible.
Yeah, that's.
That.
I'm not sure about that, but.
Right.
Yeah.
He also ate a coyote and that was.
Yeah, no, thank you.
The most heavily parasitizedanimal in North America.

(27:24):
Yes.
Number one.
Carries a rabies and distemper.
I don't have a marinade for that.
No, I do.
It's called a, it's calleda.200 4200ft per second.
My question is, hey, you saidyou love cooking the things that
affirm the animal.
Is that something that youwere always into or is that something

(27:47):
that kind of developed over time?
It developed because likeeverybody else, you know, when you
start out, the back strap is king.
Well, really probablyTenderloin is king.
And then backstrap, and thenyour hind leg roasts are all like,
those are the money cuts.
And.
But once you get that nailed.
And you know, I cook a lot ofdeer, a lot of venison.

(28:08):
I cook a lot of animals, and it's.
You get kind of bored with it.
And then you're trying to getdifferent flavors, you're trying
to get different textures.
And so the fact that there'sreally no fat.
Well, there's no intramuscularfat in these animals.
It's all on the outside.
And then the problem with deerfat and all cervid fat.
So deer, elk, moose, andcaribou, those fats don't necessarily

(28:34):
taste bad, but they're veryhigh in a very, very, very long chain
fatty acid called stearic acid.
So stearic acid is the samelong chain fatty acid that chocolate
has.
So when you eat chocolate, itcoats your mouth, and everyone's
like, oh, it's delicious.
But when you eat deer fat,that cools even a little.

(28:55):
If it's piping hot, it's delicious.
But if that deer fat coolseven a little, it coats your mouth
in the exact same way, andit's not so pleasant.
So everybody's like.
They'll say it tastes bad, but.
But it's not the taste so muchas the mouth feel, which is a little.
I mean, it's a technical difference.
But if you were to crisp uppieces of deer fat and they were

(29:15):
hot and crispy, they willtaste good.
It doesn't work.
On the same page.
Deer fat, like those littlemuscular, little white deer fat when
we're skinning them out.
I mean.
You mean the fat that coatsthe outside of the carcass is what
I'm talking about.
Okay.
Yes.
Yeah, yeah.

(29:37):
Okay.
The talent.
We're on the same page.
Yeah.
The tallow.
Yeah.
Yeah.
All right.
So am I doing something wrongwhen I cook that?
Because it always leaves,like, a really waxy, like, flavored,
like, literally what I.
Just talked about for three minutes.
Oh, no, I.
I understand.
I mean, that's what I was saying.
But yeah, it just like, if Icook the ribs, it's always in there

(30:01):
and stuff.
Yeah.
Because they're not hot enough.
The way.
The only way you get around itand is if you've got a hind leg roast
with some of the fat on the outside.
Yep.
Just.
Just don't even let the.
Even if you let it rest,you're going to get that waxy.
It's just gotta be hot, hot, hot.
And And I don't, I'll behonest, I don't eat a ton of deer
fat.
I just don't think it's asdisgusting as everybody thinks it

(30:24):
is.
So for example, if I'm gonnamake a deer sausage, I let's say
I'm gonna use three pounds ofregular deer meat.
I'm probably gonna use a poundand a half or a pound and 3/4 of
pork fat.
And then the rest I'm gonnamake up with a little bit of deer
fat, like a half a pound maybe.
So what that does is it's notenough to give you the waxy mouth,

(30:46):
but it is enough to A, use itso you're not throwing it out and
B, it makes your deer sausagetaste like a deer sausage and not
like a pork sausage.
So if you pro, if youprocessed your deer correctly, then
that's a good thing.
But if your deer is stinky,then yeah, don't use it.
One of my questions here iswhat, what was it about the heart

(31:10):
that me kind of talkingearlier that it's kind of a little
bit more challenging for youto cook?
Is there anything outside ofthat though that made like, wow,
the heart.
It's really, really likecooking this compared to just the
boring backstrap thateverybody does.
I love cooking the, all theinnards, all the offal.
I've cooked most of it.
And hearts.
The only challenging thingabout a heart is processing it.

(31:32):
So some people cut it intothese weird crosswise rings that
I think are bizarre looking.
And I don't.
It's not something I want to eat.
Calamari.
Yeah, exactly.
I basically trim all that hardfat off the top edge of the heart
and throw that out becausethat's the hardest, most saturated
fat on the whole animal.

(31:53):
And then I basically use the,the ventricles and the, and the chambers
and I open them up kind oflike a book.
I have instructions for it inmy cookbook and you get essentially
cutlets.
And then what I do with thatis if I'm going to do a stir fry,
I'll just cut those small.
But if I, I've made likeschnitzel out of it where you pound
it.

(32:14):
And this is the single bestplace to use that jacquard that they,
everyone wants to sell you.
That's that like spring loadedblade thingy that you go and it like,
it basically tenderizes meatby with all these blades.
The best use of it is that ison heart because you can then sear
it really hot and fast.
You want it kind of Rare,actually, and definitely no more

(32:37):
than medium.
And it's delicious.
The only other thing you cando with a heart is really, really,
really cook the crap out ofit, like three or four hours.
So it's, it's a little bitlike calamari, where it's got to
be cooked hot, fast, or forever.
Yeah, I, the way I would domine is thin or cut it really thin,
season it, and then justalmost like in a w.

(32:57):
Because once I, once I pull itout, eat it.
That's a great idea.
Yep.
I take it, I soak it in milk.
After I kill it, bring ithome, I throw it in a thing of milk,
and I let it sit in that.
It's preferably like buttermilk.
Let it sit open up theventricles the same way.
Like you said, I'll slice itpretty thin and then I'll cook it,

(33:19):
but I do it with olive oil,garlic, peppers, onions, and I kind
of make it like a stir fry.
And it is a little, sometimesit's a little tough, but it's, it's
doable because it's thin, andthat comes out great.
I, I, I never used to eat it,usually because it's in about four
or five pieces, but I, youknow, but I learned, you know, to

(33:40):
shoot a little far back forthe lungs.
So it's like, you know, it,it's, I actually look forward to
it now.
I really enjoy it.
Yeah.
I think the thing that I likethat nobody else really likes until
they try it when I cook it arethe, the kidneys.
And you talk about buttermilk,and the milk and buttermilk are,
are integral to that.
So, so kidneys, the Englishdon't soak them at all, which I think

(34:04):
is weird.
But so once you, I do a doublesoak on, on, you know, any large
game animal, kidneys.
So you'll, you basically takethem out, take the fat off.
There's a little thin membranearound each one that you have to
peel off, but you can just dothat with your fingers and then slice
them in half lengthwise.
So, I mean, they look like akidney bean.
So you slice it in a half,like, so it still looks like a kidney

(34:26):
bean.
It's just half a kidney bean.
And then there's going to besome white, gristly stuff in there.
I will usually take that outwith either a paring knife or with
shears.
And then that first night, itgets a soak in brine.
So just a very simple brine,like a quarter cup of salt plus a
quart of water, and then thatpulls a lot of smell and a lot of

(34:48):
blood out.
And then the next night, Irinse that off, and then I'll do
that in either milk or buttermilk.
And then after that, you cancook it in any recipe that you want.
Like, I do a steak and kidneypie with venison.
I do British deviled kidneys.
There's.
There's a bunch of really goodrecipes that if I serve them to you,
you're like, this is really good.
What is this?
I'm like, it's deer kidneys.

(35:09):
And it's because of that soak that.
That removes all that, youknow, essentially piss smell.
Oh, you have a video course onyour website.
I didn't see that.
I do.
I've been looking at yourwebsite now since I asked you to
come on the show, and I didn'tsee it.
What the.

(35:30):
Can you talk about this real quick?
I'm looking on it and it lookslike Benison 101.
And it looks.
It is.
Yeah.
I did that with there.
I don't think this companyexists anymore, but it's.
I did this video course withthem some years ago, and it was fun.
It was fun.
It was very high quality.
And they basically wanted a,you know, a Venison 101.
And there's a lot ofbutchering in it.

(35:50):
There's a lot of very basiccooking skills in it.
And I think it's still valid.
It's still there.
Like, it's.
I haven't heard from him inyears, so hard to say.
But it was.
It was fun to do.
And.
And when you watch it, it looks.
It's pro.
It's.
It's the real deal.
Wow.
Yeah.
Geez, I can't believe I missedthat thing.
You might have answered thisquestion, but like I said, I've been

(36:13):
trying to scour through yourwebsite here.
Is there an animal that youwould say that is the most challenging
to you to cook?
I mean, there's some that Idon't want to cook again, like muskrat.
I have no.
I have no interest in cookingmore muskrats, you know, and I can.
If I never cook another seaduck again, I.
I'll be okay.

(36:33):
Like, I know how.
I mean, I could cook sea ducksand make them taste good.
I can do it, but it's just like.
Like, you've got to get everyiota of fat off the sea duck.
Otherwise it stinks like lowtide in a hot day.
And, you know, when I used tolive in Northern California in Sacramento,
which is a great duck hunting region.
And then we would hunt ducksin San Francisco Bay.

(36:54):
And that was all kinds of fun.
But that was cool because thenyou use the rest of the carcasses,
Dungeness crab bait, and it'skind of amazing, but I don't need
it.
I don't really need to do thaton the regular.
Yeah, spoonies.
You know, spoonies aren't myfavorite duck.
Buffal heads aren't very good.

(37:15):
I'm trying to think of stufflike, I mean, there's.
There are challenging things.
So to flip the question, thereare challenging things that I like
to cook.
Yeah.
Like sharp tail grouse wouldbe a good example of that.
Spruce grouse would be a goodexample of that.
You know, some of thesestronger flavor dark meat birds are.
They're strong and they have abig flavor.

(37:35):
And you have to kind of workwith it.
If you try to, to erase it,you never going to do it and you're
going to be sad.
You just have to like, likesage grouse.
If you eat a sage, grouse willtaste like sage.
Well, duh.
That's what it eats.
That sucks.
Basically all this thing eats, right?
So.
So, yeah, so like.
Yeah, it's going to say sagey.

(37:55):
So go with that.
Go with like rosemary andjuniper and regular sage and.
And sort of southwesternflavors and you.
And you'll be all right.
But if you, if you try to makeit like a chicken, you're really
going to be sad.
Now, have you ever came acrossanything that you thought was going
to be horrible but that turnedout a lot better than you thought?
Are you just going to skipover flavors of the forest's comment,

(38:17):
you dickhead?
Oh, we're going to go on to ahuge topic of that, but okay.
All right.
Something I thought was goingto be gross.
It was actually really good.
Well, deer kidneys will be one.
I just basically did it as a,as a, as a dare, and it turned out
to be really good.
Nothing.
Let's see.

(38:37):
I was surprised how goodjackrabbits were.
You know what, how do thosecompare to, like, cottontails?
They're 100% different.
So jackrabbits are lean, darkmeat rabbit.
And so blacktail, whitetail,and antelope jacks are all closer
in the kitchen to deer thanthey are to cocktails because they're

(38:59):
big and red meat, but there'sno objectionable flavor at all to
them.
You know, beaver's prettysimilar, too.
Yeah.
Cue any number of beaver jokes.
I was getting there.
Well, I mean.
Well, never Met one I didn't like.
Right.
Oh, I have.

(39:20):
Well, then you just haven't.
You just haven't eaten enough beaver.
No, no, I've had plenty.
I just picked the right ones,I guess.
I guess.
But I mean, because we all.
Well, mine is Brett.
He is not a cook, but Squatchand I and Dave, the other guy that's
on here sometimes.
We all teamed up with thiscompany, Flavors of the Forest.

(39:40):
And they make a raw garlic dust.
Yeah.
And started off with just theraw darlic dust, and then they went
spicy, and now they have somany different flavors.
I think my favorite one is thelion's mane mushroom one.
Mine's spicy.
I like the spicy pepper.
I love that one.
Oh, that one's good too.
Yeah, but the.
The lion's mane mushroom.

(40:01):
Garlic on my eggs every morning.
Dude, you can't beat it.
Cool.
My second favorite, horseradish.
Oh, that's pretty tasty, too.
But I know Nelson.
He's the main chef over thereat Flavors of the Force.
I know he wants to really sendyou out some.
Some of your.
Of his seasonings, if you want.
Yeah, I'll take a look at them.

(40:22):
Absolutely.
Awesome.
They're.
Wow.
It's a rough crowd, right?
Man, Brett, you know why hedidn't like putting raw garlic dust
on his freaking Eggo waffle.
That's the only damn thing.
Oh, God.
Unless you're doing chickenand waffles, that might be good.
But, you know, he thinks.

(40:43):
He thinks Italian cooks islike Chef Boyardee.
And he sprinkles a littlegarlic powder on it.
He's like, oh, this is great,you know?
Nice.
Yeah.
Look at him.
Hey, hey, hey.
They're up in Oregon.
We have a bond that is just ona different wavelength, that no matter
what can't be broken becausethey're Oregon fans up there.

(41:05):
I'm an Oregon fan, and it'sall love between us, too.
You're just a fan of thetrannies and the liberals up there.
It is.
You know, you're all my.
Don't with it.
Your transition is coming.
Don't get all Ben.
Don't worry.
You'll be all right.
It's supposed to be apolitically correct show.
Okay.
Yeah.

(41:28):
Everything we do is freeze dried.
Yep.
Freeze dried garlic dust.
One question here before wekind of start wrapping up for the
night.
Hank is.
Obviously, there's the bigdebate out there now with.
I don't know if you want toconsider a debate, but you have people
that are anti hunters and antimeat, whatever you want to call it.

(41:51):
And vegan.
What is the vegan.
What is the actual healthbenefits from organic venison wild
game meat compared to buyingmeat from the store?
Well, I mean, I think there'sa lot of, there's a lot of ways to
go about it.

(42:11):
I think, number one, it'sgonna be lower in fat.
Number two, what fat that theyhave is very high in omega 3 fatty
acids, which are healthy.
I think another piece to it isyou're actually going out and taking
charge of what you feedyourself and your family.
And that's important becauseLord knows there have been an endless

(42:33):
series of scares andadulterated meat and E.
Coli and that whole stuff.
And so when you're dealingwith, when you're doing it yourself,
where, when you're takingcharge of the meat that you feed
your friends and your familyand that sort of thing, there's a
health benefit just in that,let alone that goes way beyond calories

(42:55):
and way beyond percentage offat or whatever.
And, and that's a huge pieceto it.
But, you know, venison ishigher in protein than beef is ounce
per ounce.
I mean, we can, we can gothrough those kinds of things all
day long.
I think when it comes to ducksand geese, the fat in ducks and geese

(43:16):
is one of the most healthyanimal fats in the world.
If you render out, you know,mallard or Canada goose or any wild
duck fat, which I used to doon the regular when I lived in California,
it is so unsaturated, it isliquid in a warm room, and it's actually
better for you than butter.

(43:36):
So there's a ton of differentexamples of just clean.
It's just clean eating reallyis probably the best way to put it.
And that's all the rage thesedays, where it's minimally processed.
Because even if you make yourown sausage, you're making your own
sausage, so you know what'sexactly in it.
And, and like, if you want toput lips and assholes in your sausage,

(43:57):
go for it.
I mean, I would suggest yougrind a little bit finer, but.
But go for it, you know, but.
But most people aren't gonna.
And it's just a.
I think the empowermentquestion is really a better way to
go about it than straight up nutrition.
But the nutrition thing is there.
It's just, it's.
It's leaner, it's denser incalories, it's denser in protein.

(44:20):
It's a, it's a more fulfillingand filling meat, ounce for ounce.
Yeah, I'm still on mute.
I remember when I was in thepolice academy and we had to do a
food log or food journal andwe had to keep track of everything
that we'd ate that we'd eat.
And one day we had a healtheating class.

(44:42):
I can't remember exactly whatwe called.
Anyways, our drill sergeantwas very important on eating healthy
foods, eating more vegetablesand eating clean meat.
Stuff like that one photo thatalways, it sticks out to me like
a Thor sore thumb.
He put up the, a picture of acow and it was very small, little

(45:05):
red meat and a bunch of fataround it.
And then he took like a rabbitI think, and it was just pure meat.
He said, which one do you wantto put into your body?
The slow, sluggish, fat cow ordo you want the clean cut, fast moving,
healthy rabbit in your body?

(45:25):
It's like, wow.
To put those two together likethat side by side really puts in
your brain of eating wild gamelike that is 10 times healthier than
going to the store and buying steak.
I mean, I'm wrong, I'll stilleat a steak once in a while, stuff
like that.
But to eat as much fast as Ican and eat lean, fast moving animals

(45:47):
in my opinion is the healthierway to go.
I think in the modern American diet.
You are correct.
However, one of the reasonswhy there is a lot of hate on things
like jackrabbits, it comesfrom the, from the Depression and
the pioneer days when peoplein the Great Plains got what was
called rabbit sickness and itwas basically their only source of

(46:11):
protein.
And so they ate so much ofthese lean, fast moving animals that
don't have any fat on themthat what it does is this lack of
fat over time inhibits yourability to metabolize protein.
So you actually getmalnourished by eating all, just
any.
You see it on the TV show alone.
That's a great example of it.
So if the, if they're up thereand they're snaring snowshoe hares

(46:34):
but they can't get those fattylake trout, they're in trouble.
So let, I think in the modernAmerican diet we get enough fat as
it is just by, you know, dailylife of, I don't know, Krispy Kreme
or whatever the hell we'reeating and that when it comes time
to cook a piece of meat, hellyeah, venison.
But I just wanted to say thatlike if you are really anal and retentive

(46:56):
about not eating any fat thatcan actually be damaging to your
body.
Yeah, he, that's what he said.
Like you still need some fatin your body, because that's.
Your body naturally needs it.
However, just don't consume itin large lump sums at one time, because
then you kind of get slow and sluggish.
And then doing more researchinto this, I started eating more.

(47:20):
What are they called, like,macronutrients and micronutrients
and anything.
A lot more like greens with mymeat itself, because then it.
Because I hurt my knee in thepolice academy.
And still to this day.
But eating those greens alongwith the.
The meat itself reducedinflammation in my joints.

(47:42):
And it.
The overall health, it gave tome just in the physical feeling of
it, mentally over everything,I just felt.
With everything put together,I just felt 10 times healthier, 10
times happier with what I wasputting into my diet.
Oh, yeah.
I mean, you can feel it just with.
I mean, just to digress alittle bit, like, I'm drinking a

(48:03):
beer right now.
But if you.
I think all of us listening tothis know that we don't feel our
best when we're pounding beers.
While we're pounding beers,it's great.
But the next morning, not so great.
And.
And it's just.
It's one of those things where once.
I think.
I think a lot of hunters areincreasingly becoming more in touch

(48:24):
with how you feel.
Like, especially people whoare hunting backcountry.
And like, I mean, I've been onsome hunts where, you know, it's
not five miles from the truck,it's 35 miles from the truck on foot.
And, you know, you.
You gotta.
You gotta get in shape for that.
And so there's a lot morepeople who are kind of paying attention

(48:45):
to that.
And it's been.
It's been really kind ofinteresting to watch.
Squatch, Johnny, did you guyshave any final questions for Hank?
No, I think I'm good.
I think I need to order hiscookbooks, that's for sure.
Yeah, I'm gonna do that here.
Yeah, that'd be great.
Because apparently I can't cook.
So I'm gonna.
We all know that I'm gonnacook something up amazing.

(49:06):
And I'm gonna say, yeah, Hankshowed me how to cook.
Dude, I challenge you to that.
We want to see that, right?
We want to see.
This year, I want you to bemaking this food.
Trust me, in Indiana, I'll becooking something delicious.
And I'm gonna put a littletippy cow right there for a nice
something to drink it down with.
Well, you almost had mewanting to go there.

(49:26):
Now I don't know, right?
We know, right?
It's a tippy cow, though I've not.
Been drinking a lot becauseit's been a lot of sugary and that's
what it caused me, be turnedinto a fat.
So cut that out.
So, no, I'll say this becauseeveryone knows, at least they've
been should know.
Start of March, I was intothis health kick and it's still going.

(49:47):
I, I weighed 225 pounds and I was.
My drill sergeant would lookat me and he goes, man, you're a
fat.
Get back in safe, you shit.
And now I'm down to 208.
I cut tippy cow out.
I, I'll still drink a beer ortwo here and there on the weekends
and just been running a lot,eating a little bit better and working
out as much.
And yeah, down to 208 and Ifeel a lot better what I was doing.

(50:13):
Oh, you're still ugly.
But oh yeah, ugly as.
I mean, genetics are genetics,you know.
We'll send you a brown paperbag that butter face.
Wow.
Hank, I got a couple rapidfire questions I want to shoot your
way though.
Okay.
All right, the answer is B.
Be nice.

(50:34):
Nice.
Besides, like hunting andcooking, is there anything, any other
hobbies or interests that you have?
I mean, I garden a lot and I,I'm, I'm a forager, so I'm out in
the woods all the time.
So there's a lot of, like alot of my life is revolves around
acquiring food somehow.

(50:55):
And whether it's hunting orfishing or foraging, I think that,
God, what would the other.
I don't know, man.
Like, I'm, I'm.
This is what I do.
It's, it's what I think I loveabout it is that there's so many
facets of all three of those things.
Plus cooking, of course.
You know, there's alwayssomething new to learn.
And especially because I onlymoved to Minnesota in 2023, the learning,

(51:16):
the brand new environment, thebrand new, you know, all the different
plants and the different waysof hunting.
It's been really exciting.
So I guess the answer to thatis, you know, learning new cool stuff.
Is there a wild game animalyou want to try eating that you haven't
tried yet?
I've killed most of them.

(51:38):
I just didn't know if there'ssomething out there.
Like, man, I really want to.
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Big horn, Big horn sheep.
Big horn.
Okay.
Yeah.
I'm not in the right taxbracket, but hopefully somebody will
give me some.
Let me see, where's the next question?
Last one here.
What do you think we as fellowhunters could or should do to help
improve the hunting communityas a whole?

(52:01):
I think the answer is to feedthem, feed them food.
Like the best way to make.
You're never going to turn,turn an anti hunter because their
minds are already set up.
But the most people in, inthis country are neither anti hunters
or hunters, they're nonhunters, which is, there's a difference.
And so if you can feed themsomething that tastes good that you

(52:23):
hunted and they like, oh, thisis really good.
And they can see that one ofthe major reasons, if not the major
reasons why we do what we dois to, is to give ourselves and our
friends and our family good,clean, healthy, delicious food.
The approval rating forhunting skyrockets to like 80%.

(52:45):
And it's, it's so I thinkcooking skills are for game and fish
too.
You know, I mean, everyone'shad bad fried fish and it's just
sort of sad.
And cooking skills will show off.
It doesn't have to be fancy,but I mean, good, solid bedrock cooking
skills will show off the gamethat we bring home and spend so much
time to, to get.

(53:06):
I mean the classic case islike you see these TV shows of, you
know, Billy Joe, Jim Bob, whohas been sitting in a deer stand
and he shoots this giant, youknow, 180, 180 class deer.
He's like, oh man, look at theG twos on this guy.
And, and it just looks like hejust sat there for like one morning
and blasted, you know, Mr.
Big Rack.
Right.
But what you don't know isthat guy probably sat in the stand

(53:31):
30 days to get that deer.
And so I think, I think the,another thing that, that hunters
can do is, is kind of expensive.
Explain the joy we feel whenwe finally get that thing done.
Because it's quite often theresult of sometimes years of either
training or practice or justputting in time.

(53:52):
And if you just see like thejubilant face of a guy, it's usually
a guy sitting over a deer.
Like that image doesn'ttranslate unless you know the backstory.
And so that a lot of peoplewho are ambivalent about hunting
see that and like, why are youlike so happy this thing died?
And it's not what we, that'snot what it is at all.

(54:14):
But it can look like that.
So being a little careful withthat hero shot is another good tip
to, you know, make non hunterssympathetic to what we do.
That's a perfect answer.
Oh, absolutely.
That's like a top two answerthat We've had on the show.
I'm not just doing that justto pat your dick or anything like

(54:36):
that.
I mean, that comes later.
That's.
But that costs extra.
There we go.
There we go.
That's what I'm talking about.
I mean, I need the two fisted.
I mean.
And Squatch sit on your hand.
I need the stranger.
Oh, look, I love this guy.
Hand them big hands.
Hey.
Oh, nice.

(54:58):
Hank.
Thank you so much.
I know you're a busy guy.
I know you're getting a booktour coming up here soon.
I want to say thank you somuch from myself and everyone from
the team here on the show.
We really appreciate it meansa lot to us.
Real quick, thanks for havingme on.
I.
I'm a real.
I'm sad my camera didn't work.
Yeah, it's okay.
I'm sure it would have brushedthe camera anyways.
That's probably why.

(55:19):
Just kidding.
Real quick, let me ask thisquestion first.
When does your book start?
Book tour start?
So it starts in the middle ofJune, so just a couple weeks away.
And I'm going to be trying toget to all over the country by Christmas.
So I've got about 35 eventsplanned right now.
And I'm going to try.
And I can't get to all 50states, but I'm going to try and

(55:41):
get to as many as I can and.
But you know, you can get thebook on Amazon.
It's called BorderlandsRecipes and Stories from the Rio
Grande of the Pacific.
And it is the culmination ofover 20 years of travel on both sides
of the border.
And it's not 100% hunting andfishing, but it's.

(56:01):
I gotta be me, right?
So it's for every beef taco,there are things with venison and
wild fish.
And it's just a cool, cool book.
And it's gonna be super fun topromote because it's gonna have a
little something for everybodyin it.
You have any stops in Michiganby chance?
Not yet.
I'm looking for a venue.

(56:21):
So if you got an idea, I wouldlove to go to Michigan because I
have so many readers there andI love that state.
I just.
I don't have a venue right nowand I'm looking for one.
So if you guys got ideas, I'll.
I'll see.
Like Kalamazoo or Portagewould probably be the best place.
Traverse City.
Traverse City, Grand Rapids,even Lance Lansing.

(56:43):
But yes, but Grand Rapids havehad a really good event before.
I.
I've not yet gone to TraverseCity, but everybody Else may need
to go.
And then.
And then Lansing.
I've had a number of good events.
You haven't been to TraverseCity yet?
Where?
Traverse City.
I have not.
I have not been there yet.
I need to.
I would go there.

(57:03):
I.
I would love for you to comehere to Kalamazoo.
Cause it's like right down theroad from me.
But if.
If I find out that you're upin Traverse City, I'm going to take
a vacation up there toTraverse City.
It is beautiful up there.
It's just amazing.
Amazing place up there.
I almost move my whole familyup there because it's just so beautiful
up there.
I fished near there, so I knowthe region.

(57:25):
Yeah.
Well, Hank, thank you so much, man.
Where can people find you andreach out to you and follow along
your journey and order your book?
Sure.
The Instagram is probablywhere I'm most active, so I am part
of Hunt Gathercook onInstagram and I have a Facebook group
called Hunt Gathercook.
You can find me there.

(57:46):
My website ishuntgathercook.com and that's the
easiest way to find that.
I also run an essay websitewhere I do actual writing.
Writing, you know, not justrecipes called to the Bone, and that's
on Substack.
So those are really good waysto follow where I go.
I think if you're interestedin the book, you.
You can get at Borderlands andall my other books on Amazon, that's

(58:08):
probably the easiest way.
You can also buy them directlyfrom my website, which is Hunter
Inglegardner Cook.
And that's about it.
You know, I mean, I'm.
I'm pretty easy to find.
Like you can.
I literally have a Wikipediapage, so it's.
Right on.
So, yeah, I'm pretty.
I can't hide real well.
So, you know, if you want tofind me, you'll find me.

(58:29):
But I would say Instagram or,or my, my website are the two best
places to go.
So which book in particularwould you say would I look at solely
for venison?
Oh, Buck Buck Moose, of course.
Buck Buck Moose.
Yeah.
It's an entire book dedicatedto all things big game.
So it's, it's.

(58:49):
It's primarily venison, butthere it is.
Yeah, it, it.
Here's a.
Here's a.
You know, spoiler alert.
Any venison recipe is going towork with antelope or moose or caribou
or even bison.
It's just a matter of size.
And there are only sort ofminor differences between one or

(59:10):
the other.
So Buck, muff, moose.
If you're a deer hunter,that's the book you need to start
with.
And by the way, Squatch.
Yeah.
You see that dish on the COVIDIt looks damn near the way you cook
deerheart, isn't it?
Yeah, it's deer heart.
Yeah, it's damn near the same recipe.
It's pretty wild.
That's awesome, man.

(59:31):
Yeah, that's a deer.
I put.
I liked it so much I put it onthe COVID Sweet.
That's deer heart.
Yeah, man.
Yeah.
Oh, that's badass.
And that's kind of like a secret.
Everybody thinks it's backstrapped.
I thought it was.
Yep.
That's.
I'm gonna have to save the.
Save the heart from my deerthis year.
I'm gonna cook that up.

(59:54):
Just shoot a boring deer andhead shoot it.
Yeah.
Well, actually I didn't hadshoot my deer this year.
It was a scored 150.
So I'm like, yeah, I'm notgonna blow that skull up.
Yeah, we're gonna save it.
But the year before I shotthree boring deer and so they.
They were all headshot.

(01:00:15):
Cool.
Nice.
Squatch.
How can people reach out toyou and find you, man?
You guys all know 8pm Sundaysand Tuesdays on the Whitetail Advantage.
You can also catch me onboondocks hunting Garden State outdoorsman
Mike Nitray and Frank Mystiqueand all the rest of the bunch out
there.
Instagram outdoors.
More in the squatch and myYouTube channel outdoors.

(01:00:37):
And more with the squash.
Thank you, guys.
Johnny, take us out.
Yeah, you can usually find meon Instagram at Nitro Outdoors.
And that's really about it.
And it's Grinder.
His grinder.
Yeah.
Nice grooming.
Actually.
Advantage like flavors of theforest said, it always turns out

(01:00:59):
to be a little gay on thisshow some way.
I mean, it's that month, isn't it?
Yeah.
And it's true.
There you go.
There's my month.
So though, accept it.
Yeah.
Have a great rest of your night.
I'm going to do the outrobecause I just want to myself anyways.
Have a great rest.
All right.

(01:01:19):
Have a good one, guys.
See you.
Take it easy.
Oh, man.
Well, everyone, that's goingto conclude another episode of the
Whitetail Ban podcast.
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