3 & Out - Drake Maye & Patriots CRUSHED Jaxson Dart & Giants on MNF - The Herd with Colin Cowherd

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
The volume. What is going on Everybody? John Middlecoff Three
and Out podcast brought to you by my friends at

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Zone Pouches. Actually just got a big delivery. I might
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So we are rocking and rolling. Used a couple, popped
a couple in as I watched the Patriots dominate the Giants.
We will dive into that game some more, Lane Kiff
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app today. I do think we need to start with
the New England Patriots, and I would say two teams
that I was hesitant to really get behind that at
this point in time, I just have to embrace as

(02:29):
just like real contenders are the Bears in the NFC
and clearly the New England Patriots now, I do think
the Bears and the Patriots are a little different. And
we'll talk about Ben Johnson a little bit later. He
had a comment today where he's like, we're winning despite
our passing game, and I do think it gets hard

(02:49):
in some big playoff games. The NFC's definitely a little
deeper one through seven. Your passing game has to be
on a little bit to make a run in the playoffs.
But you look at New England, like they can win
the AFC, and if you win the AFC, you certainly
can win the Super Bowl. I think we have to

(03:10):
embrace that the New England Patriots can win the Super Bowl.
And I'm not trying to act they just beat up,
you know, a two to ten Giants team who are
in complete shambles. Their star, you know, number three overall
draft pick pass rusher to get benched every week, which
we'll dive into in a second. But the Patriots have

(03:31):
a couple things going for him. One like their quarterback
is really talented and he's really come into his own
this season what they have taken. You know, everyone was
really high on him last year. I was hesitant to
kind of get behind that, not that he couldn't be
a good player. But to put much substance behind what
we were watching. They were getting killed every game. Their

(03:51):
team was so shitty. It was almost like watching a
draft pick on an awful team right in college, And
it happens sometimes Mahomes played on bad teams Josh Allen,
who I didn't even think was a good college player.
If you go way back, like Cutler at Vanderbilt, you
get some of these guys that don't win a lot.
You just kind of look at their physical attributes and

(04:13):
that's kind of how you do how to do with
Drake May this year, you watch him, you go. He
throws like the most beautiful catchuble deep ball in the league,
hits everyone in their hands. He's obviously a fantastic athlete.
He's in complete control his ability to layer throws, his
touch passes on screens. But to me, their most valuable
asset is one they're led by a guy who has

(04:37):
won in the playoffs, like Mike Vrabel has won road
playoff games. Clearly, he's one of the top like leaders
of men in the league. He transformed this team. I
understand they've had an easy schedule, but overnight, even if
you have an easy schedule. This team had been a
complete laughingstock in the NFL, and boom, They're gonna win

(04:57):
thirteen or fourteen games. Now their season, especially for the
one seed, is gonna be defined these next couple weeks.
I'm pretty sure they have a bye and then they
play the Bills, and then they play at Baltimore, and
obviously you win those two games, I think they have
a very very good chance to have the number one seed.
If they beat the Bills, they're clearly gonna win the division,

(05:20):
and then the Ravens game would probably determine whether they're
the one or the two seed, which is a big
deal in twenty twenty five. Right most of my life,
it's like, long as you got one of the top
two seeds, you're on the bye week. Well, that dramatically
changed once the NFL did the Monday night wild Card game.
They wanted the extra wild card game, they added an

(05:40):
extra team in the playoffs, and they want more inventory
for us to watch on that first weekend of the playoffs,
which I'm not gonna argue with, but it does, you know,
hurt a team that goes thirteen to four and is
the two seed, Like that kind of sucks. But this team,
whether they're the two seed or the one seed, like
I can envision them winning multiple playoff games and the

(06:03):
other thing they really have going for him. I just
thought of this right before we hit record. I don't
know what the number is, but my guests would be
over under forty ish that Josh McDaniel playoff games. Josh
McDaniels has called as an offensive coordinator. So they have
a head coach with experience obviously as a player. I

(06:23):
mean they were showing tonight. He caught multiple balls touchdowns
in the Super Bowl. As a player, he was a linebacker.
I mean I was thinking about this. His ability to
relate to players, and I've heard like Taylor Lewan talk
about this on busting. His ability in front of a
room is like he can look at every guy and go,
I can relate to you. You're on the practice squad.

(06:43):
I've been there. You're a backup playing on special teams.
I've been there. You're a guy on a big contract.
I've been there. You're the team captain. I've been there.
You're an older player this fighting for a roster spot
that might be a cap casualty or traded. I've been there.
There's literally not a guy on the room in in
the room that Mike Vrabel can't relate to. And obviously
as a coach he's pretty elite. And Josh McDaniels, there

(07:06):
is no disputing, like sometimes you just realize you're not
a one and there's nothing wrong with that. In the NFL,
you make five six million dollars being the number two
call and plays aspect fanjo it's a pretty good life.
So their power of having Vrabel, having Josh as their
number two clearly their their home field advantage. Like those
fans are used to winning a lot of playoff games,
It's gonna be a very very tough place to win.

(07:28):
They're going to, you know, have to rely on the
run game. Clearly, you saw to night and I get it.
They're playing a shitty team. They were crushing people. The
physical mentality that Mike Vrabel has given to that team
is really really impressive. I mean that's a team that, like, listen,
if you just remove the quarterback and go guy for

(07:50):
guy New England or the or the Denver Broncos. I
like the Denver Broncos, but how can you watch the
two quarterbacks play and go, well, I like May a
lot more than I like bo Knicks, So it wouldn't
shock me at all if that's the AFC championship game.
We used to see that game a lot when it
was you know, the Peyton Manning Tom Brady or even

(08:11):
before Mike Shanahan back in tom Brady's younger days. But
the Patriots are for real, and uh, I think the
scary part is for the AFC is like this is
a team on the come. This is a team that
in next year, the following couple year is going to
be way better. This was year one that you know,
you you look at the Washington this year who took

(08:32):
a step back? That felt a little bit like obviously
this offseason they got old. They extended a lot of
older players. Like I watched the Patriots, like their core
guys are young, Like the Commanders are pretty reliant, even
last year on Zach Hurtz, he's a pretty important player,
Bobby Wagner, Like I'm watching the Patriots like, uh, Trevion Henderson,
Kyle Williams, Drake May, even Christian Gonzalez, who's the quote

(08:56):
unquote veteran on the team. Howld was Christianzalez twenty seven
to twenty eight years old is even that So, I
mean the core group of their guys are young, even
Milton Williams, who's injured, but what was he four years
on the Eagles. It's not like he's a thirty two
year old veteran player. So they're gonna have another draft
class Like this is a team that's not going anywhere.

(09:16):
But sometimes you know you're ready a little faster than
you realized, and all of a sudden, I'm not. This
is not an apples to apples comparison because the Chiefs
had been a consistent playoff team when Patrick came in.
Chris Jones is already on the team, Travis and Tyrek
Hill were already on the team. But once Patrick came

(09:37):
on the team, I think people were hoping for good things,
but they were already made and ready to go. And
I think once they were able to turn Drake may
and do a really good player in this offense with
the coaching and obviously he deserves a lot of credit,
this team is way more real quick then even the
most diehard Patriot fan could have, you know, imagined if

(10:00):
I would have told every Patriot fan at the beginning
of the year, hey, you'll win eleven games and you'll
be the sixth seed. That there's not a soul that
wouldn't have signed up for that. But if I would
have told you on December first that you would be
the number one seed. Have a guy that's you know,
him and Ben Johnson are going to be co coaches
of the Year. Have a quarterback that's in the MVP discussion,

(10:21):
and just have young offensive players that are explosive. Stefan
Diggs immediately mixes in and just like they have a
lot of cohesion that that's the one thing Washington had
last year, Like this is this isn't tennis, this isn't golf.
It's a team game, you know. Meanwhile, the antithesis of
that is the Giants, who you're like, what is going

(10:42):
on here? It's like they're just kinda it doesn't all
flow together. Sometimes it does, but typically bad teams kind
of feel like more individuals than the group as a whole.
And the Patriots it's a little bit of a throwback. Again.
I'm not saying they're going to the super Bowl, and
I'm not saying they're as good as these teams in
the early two thousands, but like there was a time

(11:05):
when people didn't know who Mike Vrabel, Teddy Bruski and
some of these guys were, and then they started winning
big and they're like God. And if you know, even
if you're a younger Patriot fan, I'm sure you've heard
these stories. But like, the thing that defined those teams,
especially the first Super Bowl team, was like when they
played the Rams in that Super Bowl, they didn't get

(11:26):
announced as individuals. They came out as a group, which
was unheard of at the time. And I do think
Mike Vrabel, you know, he took those Titans teams, he's
doing it again. His teams just feel very very like
arm in arm, very connected, and clearly they're well coached,
they're tough, and that quarterback is extremely talented. So congrats

(11:50):
to the Patriots. That was a Hey, we're playing on
Monday night, everyone's watching. Anytime that you play a crappy team,
to me, it's always a little risky, like they get
to fly under the radar a little bit, and your
players don't take them that seriously. They're human beings. It's
their super Bowl. The Giants had been playing pretty well
and they're up thirty to seven at halftime. I mean, honestly,

(12:12):
you could end of the game at half. I mean,
I mean seriously, just so no one gets injured. I'm
always a proponent of that. But at the same time,
I'm in the content creation business, so you know, you
never know if crazy things happened in the second half.
But that was they stepped on their throat early and
the game was over. It felt like in the blink
of an eye. So the Patriots are for real. And

(12:35):
on the flip side, I do think the Giants are
a very interesting job. And I've been saying this for
a long time now. The Steeler fans are behind me.
I mean, what happened the other day and me and
Colin started our podcast on Sunday afternoon during that game

(12:56):
because once the once Josh scored made it like tw
twenty three to seven, there wasn't a soul alive that
thought like the Steelers can't come back, So we just
we just started recording. So I didn't even see the fire.
Tomlin chance. If I am Mike Tomlin, I would try
to run to the Giants job. I would imagine every

(13:16):
coordinator worth their salt is gonna want the Giants job.
They have a young quarterback that clearly has a ton
of talent. They have multiple young defensive pieces. They have
a star talent at wide receiver who's gonna come back
off an ACL injury. They're gonna have top draft picks.
They are one of the premier franchises in the NFL

(13:36):
in terms of brand, in terms of market size, in
terms of overall fan base. They play in the marquee
or one of the marquee divisions in the league. It
is a job that any coordinator worth their salt that
is gonna interview is gonna want to not only interview,
but want that job. You know, There's been a lot
of talk like Robert Sala. Robert Sala would start running
right now to New York City from San Jose to

(13:58):
get that job. If I am the New York Giants,
I feel a little unlucky because last year the cycle
was so incredible. Mike Vrabol or Ben Johnson would take
your job. That guy doesn't like I'm not hiring Clint Kubiak, right,
I'm not hiring any of these coordinators like Shoe lad
Into Rams. I've already done that song and dance and

(14:19):
has blown up in my face every single time. Well,
one of the headline stories of this game was that
Abdul Carter for the second time second story game, was bitched.
Why because he's showing up late or not showing up
to meetings. And the last time it happened, the reports
claimed that he was sleeping. He pushed back and just

(14:39):
said that he missed it because he was in rehab.
Either way, guess what happens on bad teams that type stuff.
Guess what does not happen on well run teams, players
missing meetings, especially young players. I'll never forget a current
GM to Adam Peters. I was talking to him a
couple of years ago at at forty nine or practice,

(15:00):
and we were actually talking about Hufunga and he was
kind of describing to me. And I remember John Lynch
a little later we talked. I talked to him about
this too. Is like when you go into one of
these these teams that are really bad in college and
a coach gets fired at the time, like Clay Helton
had got fired. It's just a mess. And I've experienced
this a little bit when I was scouting. Right when

(15:23):
you go into a team that's like Alabama, Georgia, Ohio State,
like everyone's in a good mood. It's easy to get
information when you go into some of these programs that
everyone's losing. Like if you went into the University of Tennessee,
that's eighting four, and that's that's eight and four, but
a six and six team, any of these teams with
high expectations or coaches getting fired. People were on edge.
Everyone's negative. People just start crushing players. This guy's a loser,

(15:46):
this guy doesn't listen that, this guy's out for himself,
this guy's selfish. And I remember Adam telling me about
who Funa is, like you couldn't find a negative word
said about him, and everyone in the program to a
man was like, I'd swear by that guy. He's here early,
he's working out late, he studies hard, he plays his

(16:08):
ass off. He's everything you would want, good or bad, regardless,
you want this guy on your team. Six seven years later,
look at tallanohu funga shocker. He's a stud And you know,
Abdul Carter came from Penn State where over the last
couple of years they were awesome, right, which is kind
of ironic because James Franklin got run out of town

(16:28):
in the middle of the season, partly because of the
expectations built by the Abdul Carter teams. People thought they
could win the championship this year and rightfully so, which
looking back like, losing Abdul Carter and Tyler Warren's pretty
big blow. But Abdul Carter, like most programs, most people
are not leaders, right. I don't claim to be a leader.
Most human beings are followers. Right. There's a small small

(16:53):
percentage of true leaders, and most people will kind of
follow the group in a business setting, a team setting,
it's a natural human instinct. Right, Well, only so many.
There's only one Moses leading me through the Red Sea, right,
There's only one Vince Lombardi leading me out in the field.
There's not seven Nick Sabans on a football team. There's one.

(17:14):
And most players like kind of fit in and follow.
And when you're in high functioning organizations, like when you
play for the Chiefs, when you play for the Rams
or the forty nine ers, it's like, if you don't
fit in, you will have no shot. If you're showing
up late, you'll be on the bus to the practice squad.
It just it will not work. It wouldn't even be tolerated,

(17:35):
so you wouldn't even think even if you might have
those tendencies, it wouldn't even be allowed. Like if you
put Abdul Carter this year on the Seattle Seahawks, right,
or you just pick the New England Patriots, this would
not be happening. You know why it didn't happen in
Penn State because that wasn't the culture that wasn't tolerated. Well,

(17:56):
when everyone gets fired, it's a complete shit show. You
get chaos, and you get situations like this, and it's
pretty clear that the Giants need a grown up because
guess what, this would not happen with the grown up.
But you look around like, who are you hiring to
be a grownup? And to me, I will hammer this
home like it's time. And if I'm Mike Tomlin, that's

(18:17):
the type job. It's a bright lights job, big market job,
with a lot like going for it. Now, the quarterback,
he's a little reckless that there is no disputing that.
He reminds me a little bit when when I got
to the Eagles and Michael Vick started and resurrected his career.
Michael's greatest attribute was also kind of his downfall was

(18:41):
his incredible athleticism slash toughness led him to get a
hit a lot, and he wasn't the biggest guy, and
he got injured all the time because he was fearless. Well,
being fearless, like in a business meeting trying to land
a client, it can serve you pretty well, right, being

(19:02):
fearless when you're running and a guy that weighs fifty
pounds more than you is running at a similar speed
and hitting you going out of bounds is not gonna
go well for you most of the time as a quarterback.
So Jackson Dart's gonna need some direction of like, we
need to corral this a little bit. No one questions
your toughness. I'm watching Mike Vrabel with Drake May like

(19:23):
he's clearly corralled some of his reckless nature. This is
not and I think it's this most of my life
in the NFL and even college football, but definitely the
NFL quarterbacks were scared to do two things. One take
off and get hit because they would get absolutely destroyed
and they could get injured. I mean, think about some

(19:44):
of the famous hits on these quarterbacks over the years.
Why Tom Brady's career happened because Drew Bletsoe was killed
on the sideline against the Jets. Those hits don't even
take place anymore. And you know the NFL used to
be like the freeway. Well, guess what most human don't do.
They don't try to walk across the freeway. But if
you just went to a random road, you see people

(20:05):
crossing it all the time. And I do believe these
quarterbacks have less fear now because they don't look at
the road like a freeway because they don't think they
can get hit, and even when they do, they feel
protected by the referees. So to me, you need to
get a guy in there. And I've had I've brought
up this name a couple times, and I've had a

(20:26):
buddy in the NFL that goes you need to stop
bringing up Mike McCarthy because he's like, look at what
Brian Schottenheimer's doing since he left. Look at what happened
to the Packers once he left. Like Jerry was right
about Mike McCarthy, Like, Mike McCarthy, that's pretty risky. Now
he's good with quarterbacks or whatever, but you could argue
that like might be a little overrated. The Packers don't

(20:47):
miss him. Cowboys surely don't miss him. Jerry was right,
like Mike, I'm not paying you anymore. I'll just go
with Brian schottenheimmer and guess what, We'll win nine or
ten games with a team that's not as good as
some of the teams you had. So I do you
think there's only one option that I see, and that's
a guy who literally, as fans are channing to fire them,
the team is circling the drain. I mean, they are

(21:09):
going nowhere fast. This feels like there couldn't be an
easier transition. I do think the Giants gotta be kicking
themselves a little bit because they would have been an
incredible landing spot for Ben Johnson, but there were a
year late, and they didn't pull the trigger last year,
and who knows, like if they would have done it
if Jackson dart on the team, no one ever knows.

(21:29):
And if I'm a Bears fan, I feel pretty good
that it all worked out that way. And same thing
with the Patriots of Mike Vrabel and I think you
see the impact of those two guys, Like those guys
are star coaches, their teams are freaking awesome, and both
teams probably don't have the as like they shouldn't be
as good as they are. Now we're gonna find out
with the You know, the Patriots have already beat the Bills.

(21:51):
The Bears are lining up now against the Packers twice
in three weeks. We're gonna learn a lot about them.
But we've already learned like they're they're good right now?
Are they like super well contending good? The NFC is
clearly harder than the AFC. It's gonna be more difficult,
but it just jumps off the screen. Meanwhile, the Giant's
just a rudderless ship. They got this star young pass rusher.
The thing with Abdul Carter is he's got the talent

(22:13):
to be one of the best players in the league,
right Malik Davers got the talent to be one of
the best players in the league. Jackson Dart's got the
talent to be a top ten quarterback in the NFL.
So anytime you got a quarterback that is a talent
to be a top ten quarterback in the NFL, you
gotta star pass rush, you got a star wide receiver,
got some other young pieces, You're gonna have a bunch
of draft picks. It's listen. I think you could even

(22:36):
make the argument because even if the Steelers like, yeah,
we're not gonna fire him, but you know, we might
might be willing to, you know, go our separate ways.
What do you trade your second round pick for? I'd
be more inclined to do that than hire one of
these coordinators or one of these retread guys that haven't won.
Like that's why I struggle with I can do a
retread guy if he's won somewhere. But it's like I

(22:57):
like Robert Saul a lot, and he's an excellent defensive coordinator.
Can he be a good head coach? I have no clue,
like I Arthur Smith. I mean, these are some of
the names that are out there that are going to
be available. So this class, if I'm the Giants, I
would hone in on one guy, and it'd be the
guy in Pittsburgh as that building clearly is on fire.
And if I'm Tom and I'm looking around, TJ. Watt's

(23:19):
old in half the games, he doesn't even look like
young TJ. Watt. You know this DK metcalf contract. One
Dale Robinson, check the stats. Check one Dale Robinson stats
and check DK Metcalf stats and holler back at me,
who's are more impressive. A spoiler alert, it ain't Dk Metcalf.
So you got these huge albatross contracts with players that

(23:40):
aren't equaling the return on investment on those contracts. I'm
sure Cam Hayward is going to retire they have no
quarterback again. If I'm Tom and I'm getting in my
car and I'm driving to the Giants, so congrats to
the Patriots. Today's show is brought to you by our
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New Jersey, Ohio, Tennessee, Virginia. A couple other quick things.

(25:34):
I've been thinking a lot about this. I think the
hard thing about football that's different than a lot of industries.
If you get into the private sector and you get
into the business, there are gonna be times when you
have to be a little selfish It's just part of
the reality of life. You know that there are times
when you have to think about yourself first. And some

(25:54):
of our jobs impact less people than others, right. Obviously,
if you're the CEO of a company, you impact a
lot of individuals. If you play a role on a
team or whatever, maybe you impact ten people. If you're
the head coach of an NFL team or a college
football team, you're talking a lot of human beings. So

(26:16):
when you make a quote unquote selfish decision, it impacts
other people. And anytime they get impact impacted, they are
going to judge your decision whether it's good for them
or bad for them. So anytime, and here's the thing,
the NFL actually used to have stuff like this happen
when I was younger. In the late nineties, Mike Holmgren

(26:37):
left the Green Bay Packers to the Seattle Seahawks. They
had Brett freaking far of in the prime of his career.
You know why, because Seattle paid him a boatload of money.
I think at the time it was like five years
twenty million dollars average four million dollars a year back
in the late nineties. WNU factor in inflation probably a
lot of coin. You know. A couple of years later,

(26:58):
Al Davis refused to give John Gruden a massive contract
like the one that Mike Holmgan got. Guess what happened.
He had to trade him to the Tampa Bay Buccaneers
who were willing to pay him. And historically a lot
of these coaches in college, even in the pros back
in the day, would leave a job for money. That
is no longer the case in the NFL. Let's use

(27:21):
the Rams and the forty nine ers. When Sean McVay
and Kyle Shanahan got there, those jobs sucked. They were terrible.
Both of them couldn't have been losing anymore that they
were just they were an embarrassment. And now eight nine
years later, those guys can stay in those jobs forever
and they don't need to leave to get more money,

(27:42):
to get better opportunities for players like you just stay
no different all around, Like Andy Reid never needs to leave,
right Mike McDonald the things go well, and see how
he's just stay there like you just don't jump around
so the day and age, because all these teams have money.
If the going rate for you is fifteen million dollars,
even Kevin O'Connell felt like, you know, he's like, they
might trade for me and the Vikings is given a

(28:03):
bunch of money. Yet in college typically you left for
two reasons one money. Usually the bigger job paid a
lot more. That's no longer the case Kurt Signetti. In
the history of the sport, whenever football was in't vetted
in the late eighteen hundreds, right, you would never stay

(28:24):
in Indiana to not go to Penn State. Ever, no
human alive in the history of football up until now
would ever make that decision. Yet when Kurt Signetti made
that decision, you're like, oh, they gave him ninety three
million dollars. I don't even blame him. I want to
stay two and he's winning big his team if he
beats Ohio State, which is going to be difficult. But

(28:44):
if he did this Saturday in Indianapolis, he would be
the number one seed in the playoffs. It would be
the most remarkable thing I've ever seen. But he literally
just did it, and he said, I don't need to
go to Penn State. And I do think Lane Kiffin,
like the reason you went from Indiana to Penn State
was too obviously they'd give you way more money, and

(29:04):
two it was just easier to get better players. Well,
now with the portal and nil is it, it's obviously
you can get better players at Ohio State, in Texas
and Oregon, Well, they're paying more money for those guys
to go. Why did Lane Kiffin have many people consider
one of the best rosters in the country last year
at Old Miss. He hasn't played that much because he's

(29:27):
been injured. But whenever I look up an Arizona Cardinal
game and you see Walter Nolan, You're like, geez, Louise
guy's a monster. You know that quarterback that I'm like, yeah,
I would run to that job if I'm Mike Tomlin.
Oh that was Lane Kiffin's quarterback. I think Trey Harris,
the wide receiver had a big catch for the Chargers,

(29:48):
played at Old Miss. I mean, so the world has
really changed, and I think inherently it's hard because coaches,
I've always thought it was a little fraudulent in football.
Everyone's like the T team can't be selfish. It's the team.
It's the team. Yet everyone when it comes to jobs
is kind of out for themselves, and at least in
college football, we kind of acknowledge that everyone's a mercenary coaches, players,

(30:14):
and I think the hooplaw and the pushback is like
I think the fair question is five years ago, no
one even would a questioned even if Lane didn't handle
it well. Of course you're going to ole Miss to LSU,
and clearly LSU's history compared to ole Miss is not
even comparable. LSU has a bigger stadium. I think those

(30:34):
people would say it just matters more here and many
people woul say it's one of the best jobs in
the country. But you could argue that Lane Kiff in
these last couple of years has turned ole Miss into
one of the best jobs in the country. Now is
it because of him? Is it because of the program?
We're about to find out. But I think a lot
of people making these concrete stances about him being selfish,
about him not handling it well, Like we've seen this

(30:55):
happen over and over and over. Like if you think
these college football coaches are consumed with like, yeah, I'm
leaving these guys, it sucks, but like I'm not gonna
hold the guy's hand through life, Like it's it's not
that big a deal. I truly believe that like, it's
I think we have acted and I listen. I do
think Laye playing the victim card is a little outrageous.

(31:18):
You know, they just wouldn't let me coach. I was
thinking about this, like he wants his cake and he
wants to eat it too. Once you no one's ever
got the cake and then not eating it. So it's
like I was thinking about that statement. I'm like, am
I is that statement kind of stupid? He wants his
cake and he wants to eat it too? Well, who
wants cake and doesn't want to eat it? Like he

(31:41):
wanted to coach the team, which is understandable, Ole miss,
you would be you'd be viewed as the biggest group
of loser pussies in the history of sports. If you
allowed him to keep coaching. They had no choice. They
had to get in packing. Now, when you get every
everything you want, whether you're a little kid, whether you're

(32:03):
you know in the business you work for, you're like
a star employee, and they do everything that you want
them to do. That when you finally do hear no,
this is not going to be allowed, you don't react, well, right,
why because you've lost touch with reality. So I think
when Lane's not reacting that well, of course he's not.
Ole Miss is done. When Lane said jump for the

(32:23):
last six years, they said how high and kind of
jump again and for the first time, They're like, this
is not going to be allowed. And he knew it,
and he kind of turned into a petulant child, which
he kind of can be. But like I said, you know,
sports needs not everyone can be a good guy. You
need to have some people that piss people off. You
need to have some people that move the average fan

(32:46):
emotionally to like I can't stand that guy. Sometimes I
miss not hating more people in sports, right, because sometimes
when you do this for a job, like I don't
like just sitting on my couch and being indifferent, Like
I kind of like rooting against people and anyone. If
you're an Eagle fan, if you're an Alabama fan, if
you're whoever, Like it's cool to hate the Cowboys, like

(33:07):
I can't stand Jerry Jones, I can't stand Auburn and LSU. Right,
that's good emotions and sports. Right. The one team I
truly still root against and I just hate is the Lakers,
though I hate him a little less with Luca because
he's just like he's hard to hate. He's so great.
But every time I look down, they're like sixteen and four,

(33:29):
I'm like, God, it sucks. They're not going anywhere. I
was supposed to hate the Dodgers, but it's like, what
am I doing? You just kind of tip your hat.
I wish I hated more people in sports, even Ryan Day, Like,
I like, I gotta he's pretty good, you know, I
just got to acknowledge, like he's just kicking everyone's ass.
Like what am I gonna hate? Just every single game
he's beating someone by twenty or thirty points. I wanted

(33:51):
to not like Matt Patricia, but I gotta respect him.
He went from college or excuse me, from the pros
with Belichick forever, and then it comes to college and
I get it. He goes the best pro he starts
kicking everyone's ass. Like I respect people's talents and their
talents are working. So I've been Ohio State hater, but
I might just have to take a gigantic l on
that one because if I was a betting man right now,

(34:11):
I kind of expect them to win the whole thing again.
You went back to back natties in the NIL era.
Even if you got a lot of money in your program, Like,
that's pretty impressive. So the selfish word, I think it's
like we're all a little selfish. Anyone in business is selfish,
Like welcome to life. The other thing is Kevin Petola's
house was egged, and I was thinking, like God, when

(34:33):
I was young, I used to do a lot of tepeeing.
There was probably under five, but there were definitely some
homes egged. And like that is when you're egging someone's home,
it's typically someone that you want to feel like we
hate you. Like that is a double middle finger like

(34:54):
kind of scumbag move from whoever's doing that. I also
think it reflects nobody, and I mean nobody in the
NFL needs a bigger week of just like thirty five points,
three or four touchdown, some cool plays, some explosive plays,
and just like a fifteen point victory than the offensive

(35:14):
coordinator in Philly. Because the city's turning on them, the
players feel like are kind of on the fence on them.
And at the end of the day, even if the
organization in Sirianni like the guy personally, it's a production
based business and if you don't get it, done these stories.
You know. The one thing in Philly which I hate

(35:35):
the cold weather, but I really enjoyed working there because
I love football and when I was working in it,
it was so cool to be in a place where
it just really mattered. It's why talking to people that
work are associated with the SEC, it literally just means more.
And when you work at one of these programs, it

(35:55):
just feels like life or death. And that's what you
want when you're a competitive when you're working in a sport,
like it's a bigger deal to be associated with the
Yankees or the Red Sox than it is with the
Texas Rangers. Right, it just means more. And in Philly
that team means a lot. And I think people go, oh,

(36:17):
you're boo, they just won the Super Bowl last year. Well, yeah,
it's December and they can't get a first down. You
want me to clap, you want me to cheer. Now,
I'm not condoning egging a home. And while I'd be
a hypocrite to say that you should never egg a
home because I've done it a couple of times, I
actually think it'd be harder to egg homes now. I mean,
I got seven cameras around my house. My brother was

(36:39):
telling me a story over the Thanksgiving weekend that I
guess there's some like TikTok trend with like young kids
like twelve thirteen to do like you know, doorbell ditches.
And He's like, in the neighborhood I live in, everyone
knows each other. We all have ring cameras. The dudes
ringing my doorbell. I work with, like two of the
guys I call. I'm like, hey, hey, James, like your

(37:03):
kid just doorbell dish me. Here's the picture. It's like
his son with his backwards hat. It's like, what do
you do? Are you just an idiot? You do those
cameras everywhere? But Big Dom will probably be all over
that a couple of things before we get out of here.
Sauce Gardener's Week to week I've said this forever. I
just that feeling as a GM when you make a move.

(37:24):
The only thing Again, if a guy like Sauce was
never going to be a terrible player, so you felt
pretty good about what you were gonna get with the guy.
But when you see the person that you just give
multiple first round picks laying on the ground, your heart
has to just go to your stomach. And I saw
Sauce say that. You know, at first it felt like
he got shot and the first thing you think is

(37:44):
like Achilles, but clearly avoided disaster. But it just shows
you how fickle sports are. You know, you make this
big move, which I thought was a little polarizing and controversial,
But if he plays like an elite player, if Charvarius
comes back, you got two elite corners. You know you're
gonna meet your defense to carry you. Especially if Daniel
Jones is limping around now. I just can't even imagine

(38:06):
that feeling when he was laying on the ground and
then has to be helped off and he can struggle
to put weight on it. Chris Baller probably had a
rough twelve hours. But luckily, you know, big picture, he's
gonna be okay. You know, justin Herbert. The surgery on
the hand is you know, who knows like you're gonna
throw him out there? You know, in a Rogers situation.
I mean part of the reason if Rogers was thirty

(38:29):
years old, he would not have played in that game.
He would just like miss a month, right and come
back when it was somewhat healed. But he knows like
the season's not going well. This easily could be his
last season. Who knows if Mike Tomlin's even gonna be
there next year. That's why he played with the cast
on which I respected, but that wasn't normal. And I

(38:50):
do think and I get it, they're eight and four,
so they got maybe a week of wiggle room. I
just don't think if it's somewhat of a similar situation,
you can put a player out there, even with the
non throwing hand. There were a couple times when Rogers
would like hit the ground. Your natural reaction as a
human being is to put the wrist on the ground.
And I just you've invested way too much money into

(39:14):
this human being. Your big picture of your franchise hinges
on him. I think you've got to be very, very
careful when it comes to him. Well, we just saw
one of the worst performances ever, not totally his fault.
Probably shouldn't be starting an NFL game, but luckily JJ
McCarthy is set to return. I do think this month,

(39:35):
if it continues to just be as ugly as it's been,
I don't know how any Vikings fan like you have
to be a really patient individual it's like, just give
him time. Just give JJ some more reps. There's not
a fan of Live that's gonna want to give him
more reps. There's not a fan of Live that's gonna
be okay with the offseason, not having someone else to

(39:56):
come in to essentially be the starter. Now, who that
guy is, I don't know, Like Mac Jones with his
eyes closed as a better quarterback than this guy. So listen,
the best case for JJ McCarthy would be to come
back from this concussion, not get injured again, and just
have some good games, not a good series, like a
couple good games and good games. I the bar is

(40:19):
not that high, right. Just don't throw some of the
worst interceptions we've ever seen. Don't throw balls twenty five
feet over justin Jefferson's head. Just throw a couple of touchdowns,
have some completions, just have some drives that leave the
field goals. Just look like a capable NFL player. Because
the NFL has never moved faster, there's more money in

(40:40):
the line, there's more pressure. Because of the amount of
money the owners have, they can get rid of people quicker. Plus,
we just have recent examples of quarterbacks not getting long leashes.
People just turn on you. Why because back to the
Lang Kiffin thing, you're these coaches and gms are inherently selfish,
you know, is what coaches you usually do when they're

(41:01):
they're losing games. They don't They don't go to the
owner of the GM, like I want to fire myself?
Can I fire myself? You know what they do. I'm
fired my offensive coordinator. I'm firing my dB coach. I'm
firing my own line coach. They never go fire me,
right they No, No one wants to fire themselves. No
one wants to get They throw everyone overboard before they

(41:23):
get thrown overboard. So I promise you this. When it
comes to Kevin O'Connell, who seems like a nice guy,
always upbeat, positive, optimistic individual, they'd better show some signs.
And I know this guy made a comment about how
organizations fail quarterbacks. I'm not even putting this on him
in terms of they made the wrong decision with the
player potentially, but like there's some players that just aren't

(41:46):
gonna be good enough. That's the thing with the NFL.
It's the cream of the crop and it even separates,
like certain people are just not going to be good enough.
It's why after training camp, basically half your team does
not make the active roster. They get cut, and then
a small percentage of those people get to come to
the practice squad and try to, you know, claw for
their career to get to become a backup. It's very,

(42:08):
very difficult. It's probably one of the more more difficult
things to do in America in terms of the private sector,
to make it on a field and play NFL football
just to be like, hey, I had a two year
NFL career. Let alone be like, yeah, I started at
quarterback for ten years. Look at Marcus Mariota. Marcus Mariota
is one of the most herolded college players. He was

(42:31):
a top he was a second pick in the draft
and hasn't been a starter in like seven years. And
it's gonna have a long career, right, so that this
thing can change on a dime. You can get derailed quick.
You can just prove to the league like you're not
good enough. And I think there is tangible pressure over this.
I think I would imagine the Viking's have five more

(42:52):
games left in the season for JJ McCarthy to like
show subsiious, don't get rid of me yet, guys, because
if he doesn't and continues to play like he does,
my prediction would be like this thing is over before
it even started. Banging out mail bags at John Middlecoff

(43:22):
Instagram that this is a mail bag. If you hear
people banging in the background, it's the roofers. It's why
my fugazi a couple of weeks ago, I said he'd
better be very careful when you buy something. You know,
it's nothing like being a renter. You got an issue,
you just place a call. Well, when I bought this
house it needed a new roof, put it off for
a couple of years, and you have historic rainfalls. You realize, yeah,

(43:45):
I don't think I can put this off anymore. So
I had to do it sooner or later, definitely before
we have a kid, so that that will be the
noise if you hear anything in the background again. Mail
bag at John Middlecoff. At John Middlecoff is the Instagram
fire in those dms start with Jack, I'm drinking the
koul ad. After how the Bears looked against that, against

(44:07):
the defense that has shut down both the Lions and
the Packers in the past month, I'm starting to believe
the Bears can make a run no matter how many
times it burnt me in the past. I think this
upcoming game at Green Bay is the hardest game left
on the schedule for the Bears, with the game in
San Francisco being the second hardest, and if they win,
I can see them winning the rest of their games.

(44:28):
My question, do you think there is a world where
we can actually get the number one seed? And if
they do, does the style of football they play, strong
run game, good third down pass game, and a takeaway
defense translate to the playoffs. How far do you think
they can go if the playoffs run through Soldier Field. Well,
I think the division will be, like you said, in

(44:52):
the next month, because this game is not must win,
But if you lose this game, I do think you
would have to win in the next two. Obviously, the
Browns take care of the Packers at home, and then
if you go to the Niners and win, there's a
chance that Lions game Detroit's just done, like they're completely
out of the playoffs and that game is meaningless to them.

(45:14):
So listen, there's gonna be a lot of emphasis on
this game. It's the Packers, this historic rivalry which has
really been one sided. But to me, the game is
much more about the home game against the Packers. Like
if you go to Green Bay, even if you lose
by ten, it's like, yeah, you went to Green Bay
and lost, but can you beat him at home? And
I think he can. You know, the forty nine Er game,

(45:37):
the forty nine Ers defense is a shell unit because
of all the injuries Bosa, Fred Warner, Mikel Williams. I
mean they're playing Cleveland Ferrell, who was a practice squad
level player earlier this season. Again he's he's done an
admirable job. But the way you guys play that, that
is a very winnable game. Again, they're kind of like
the Spider Man meme the Niners and the Bay in

(46:00):
terms of the way they want to play. Very fascinated
these two games against the Packers. You know, how you
guys look against their defense. You know their strength is
that pass rush? You know, is Ben Johnson's gonna run
in fifty times? You know a game which I would
imagine he's gonna try. But your game translates to the
playoffs anytimes you anytime you have an elite run game

(46:24):
and you're playing playoff games, whether it's in Chicago. Even
if you don't win the division and the Packers do,
you could go to Green Bay and win. Given the
way you play, you could go to Seattle and win.
San Francisco probably be the seven or six seeds, so
you wouldn't have to do that, but go to the
Rams and win. Like your stuff's gonna translate, so you know,
your first round game if you're the five seed, would

(46:46):
probably be the Tampa Bay Buccaneers, And if you're the
one seed would obviously you get a buye, which is
pretty crazy. It's it's honestly nuts were even have in
this conversation, But I also think it's it's kind of unneeded.
We'll know a lot by the time that that game.
I guess TBD. They have a flex schedule ability for it.

(47:07):
So I'm fascinated. If you win two of the next
three games and you are what's your record right now,
nine to three. So if you are eleven and four
going into that forty nine er game, assuming the forty
nine ers would be they have a bye this week,
then they play the Titans, so let's give them a

(47:27):
win there. That would be ten and four at Indy.
I don't want to get too confident. But I would
say Indy's in a little bit of trouble because just injury.
Sauce Gardner now is week to week. Obviously their quarterback
has banged up. They just haven't been playing as well.
So if both teams are eleven and four in that game,

(47:49):
that would be pretty nuts. So it's a great time
to be a Bears fan. You should be very excited.
I'm happy to be wrong. Yeah, I mean, your coach
is just fantastic. I'm curious as to who you think
will win the Super Bowl this year. To my eyes,
there are about ten very good teams in the NFL,
but the gap between them and the five six good ones.

(48:10):
There are ten very good teams, okay, and then the
gap between the next five isn't that big. Like if
I told you the forty nine Ers beat the Seahawks
in their last game, you wouldn't be shocked that if
the Bengals won out and someone won their division there
are only two games behind with some divisional games upcoming,
no one would be shocked either. It seems that any

(48:31):
team could beat any team on a given weekend. I
totally agree. To my mind, I would just trust the
people who have been to the dance before. For example,
I trust Kyle Shanahan and the forty nine ers to
at least be consistent in the playoffs. I don't know
what the version of the Eagles or the Lions I
would be getting in a game in the AFC if
Buffalo is in, do I trust Bo Knicks and the

(48:53):
Broncos or the Jags and Trevor Lawrence or Josh Allen.
Sean McDermott will I agree. I do think health plays
a pretty big role. You know, once everyone is somewhat even,
right if we assume if you look at the playoffs
right now, in the standings in the NFC, we know
it's the Bears, the Packers, Seattle, the Rams, the Niners,

(49:16):
Tampa and Philly, all those teams could beat each other. Now.
I do think the forty nine Ers are an example
of their defense, it's going to be difficult. The margin
for aer on their offense would be slim to nun
Like they couldn't overcome an interception and a fumble because
their defense is going to struggle to stop people. Right now,

(49:37):
if you're playing the Eagles, what if their offense is terrible?
Right if you're playing the Rams and Stafford as one
of his games, though he feels like he plays pretty
well against the forty nine ers. I just think you
have to look at a very matchup based and health wise,
like what the Bills just did against the Steelers on
Sunday afternoon. Are they winning playoff games two starting tackles?

(50:01):
I have a hard time think of that. But I
also watched Deon Dawkins, of starting left tackle play against
the Houston Texans and he could barely move. So it's like,
are you better off with a guy who's fully healthy,
even if he's clearly a backup over a guy who's
your starter. That's sixty percent? Yeah, I mean these are
the arguments. I also think momentum matters, like how you've

(50:23):
been playing. You know, the forty nine has been winning
a lot of games, right, The Bears have been really
really hot. I mean the Bears have won five straight games.
The Packers now have won three straight games. They have momentum,
like how you're playing going into the playoffs. The Rams
last year had a lot of momentum going into the playoffs.
The Broncos, so they've just they've won nine straight games.

(50:44):
Same with the new England Patrins, Like, you win nine
straight games, you're playing at a really, really high level.
I'm recording this before the Monday night game the Colts,
like if they limp in as the six or seven seed, Like,
I don't know that much faith in them, So to me,
it matters how you're playing, how healthy you are. And
then I totally agree having Kyle Shanahan, having Sean McVay,
having Vrabel and Sean Payton, like there's a big advantage. Like,

(51:06):
you know, Ben Johnson's coached a lot of playoff games.
I know he hasn't been the head coach, but he's
been involved in a lot of them as a coordinator.
Kevin Patula he's never called plays before in his life
before this year, So what's he gonna be like in
a playoff game? You know, Seattle's kind of interesting. Mike's
never been a head coach for a playoff team. Kubiak
never called plays for a playoff team. Like those are
things to watch, you know. Matt Lafleur, Kyle Shanahan, Sean McVay,

(51:31):
Ben Johnson, whether as an assistant or a head coach, Like,
they've been involved in a lot. I actually think the
coaching in the NFC. You know, even Mike McDonald was
the DC for the Ravens. Obviously, the Packers, the Niners,
you know, Sirianni and Fangio, Sean McVay, Ben Johnson, like
these guys, they've coached a lot of games. Meanwhile, you

(51:52):
look at the AFC. You got Sean Payton, who's you know,
super Bowl winning coach, coached a lot of playoff games.
He got Varible and Josh McDaniels that they've been around
the block. Liam Cohen, would you know that would be
a little bit of a if they are either win
the division or a wild card. You know, the Ravens
would be a team that would make you a little
nervous in a playoff environment. The Chargers just have so

(52:15):
many injuries. The Colts, those guys have never coached, like
I guess you know, as assistant coaches. They have, but
Shane Stiken, since he's been there, they haven't been in
the playoffs. When's the last time Chris Ballard went to
the playoffs. So I'm with you on the Bills. They
have a pretty big advantage. I think the Bills would
be the sleeper in the AFC. I've noticed continued John,

(52:40):
I've noticed continued references to kiffen sobriety and weight loss
as evidence to his changed personality. In twelve step circles,
we often consider drinking as a symptom of a person's overhaul,
overall alcoholism, self centeredness, or general narcissism. Stop drinking is
the starting point at which a person can begin to

(53:03):
affect a meaningful personality shift, often through their improvement, improve
treatment of others, and amend for the past transgressions. Clearly,
Lane has not progressed to that and level that he
probably never will. To me, this reinvented image is entirely superficial,
and he's just the same guy he's been with a

(53:26):
slightly different haircut. I do think it's pretty evident by
his body that he stopped drinking, definitely at the level
in which he was. Is the man completely sober? I
mean truly, only he knows that, but it's clear his
lifestyle changed. But I'm with you, just because you change
a lifestyle doesn't mean it changes your mentality. I'm going

(53:50):
to talk about this on the main podcast. I'm recording
this during the day. I'll do it in after we
talk about the Monday night football game, a level of
selfish selfishness I think you have to have in most
industries to be successful. So clearly, I think we'd all agree,

(54:12):
even in a tough situation to handle. And typically when
a coach leaves a program, especially a stepping stone job,
which historically all misses kind of always been for LSU,
if one program is doing really well and the other
program is down, there is this you're leaving us for them,

(54:33):
even though we're better than them right now, though they've
been better than us historically, there's like this little brother syndrome,
so that the fans get involved in. There's always it
feels like a little shadiness with the way it's handled,
and people just offended the wrong word. But just you know,

(54:54):
emotions run really really high. But historically, like Nick Sagan's
left multiple jobs. He left Michigan State for LSU, Miami
from LSU, and then he left Miami to go coach Alabama,
and he almost left Alabama to coach for the University
of Texas. So I think a lot of times like
didn't Urban Meyer bowling Green to Utah, Utah to Florida,

(55:15):
kind of quit on Florida and then went to a
house state. I just think these the profession is naturally
more nomadic than what most of us do. Now. We
love and I know, speaking for myself, I love football.
I don't have that much in common with just like
every couple of years picking up and leaving. Though relative

(55:36):
to most people I've known, I've lived all over the country, right,
I've lived in California, I've lived now in Arizona. I've
lived in Kansas City for a little bit, i lived
in Philadelphia. I've been nomadic in my pursuit of some
quote unquote professional dream. Now. I also think when you're
a public figure like him, everything gets dissected. I'm totally

(55:58):
with you though the sixty video that he did with ESPN,
which I enjoyed, like that there was a you know,
there was a reason that was produced, right, it was
basically the bat signal to the other programs. I'm a
changed man. What you know about me because people talk

(56:20):
is no longer the case and the Lord the no
more booze my family, Like these things are important to
me now where they used to not be, and he
wanted everyone to know. Now you can say that's self serving,
like that's not what the reason why someone should get
sober or gravitate toward God is to tell everyone in

(56:42):
your profession that you've done that. But that was the
only way he was going to get hired. Now I
think the question mark is moving forward is is it
gonna be quiet? And when I say quiet, obviously from
a recruiting standpoint, from a hype standpoint, he's gonna do things.
But like, does he find himself in controvert lsu And
I'm not talking like a recruiting controversy. I'm talking legitimate

(57:04):
like whoa, that's not a great look because we've seen
that with people over the years in the sec from
Patrino banging the strength coach's wife to Hugh Freeze and
all the hookers and the strippers, Like if you are
not winning and you are no long Last year, Lane
went nine and three. Five years in with the expectation

(57:25):
of a roster that could win the national championship, and
they went nine and three. I was like, oh, no,
no big deal. Cool, we'll get you more money and
we'll get another team the next year and this year.
Clearly they didn't think they were going to be this good,
but like they were very supportive nine and three. I'd
even say, a couple of years at eight and four
would not be the end of the world there as
long as you have the occasional ten or eleven win

(57:47):
season that he just had and everyone's you know, jumping
for joy. That's not how it's going to be tolerated
at LSU. It's just not Look at Kaylin at Alabama,
Rocky season year one, which players leave left and right,
I mean, his starting quarterback and his starting star safety
immediately go to Ohio State. So Nick Saban retires, the

(58:11):
transfer portal and everything. I'm pretty sure the timing I'm
not as dialed in as some of you that follow
it closer than I do. But it was after the
national championship, so it was late in the cycle, and
he went nine to four, which, obviously for Alabama standards,
might as well be a two win season. Okay, we'll
give you somewhat of a pass. You get your boy
Ryan Grubb back from Seattle. Anything less less than the

(58:32):
playoff berth this year is a disaster, and we might
think about firing you. It's like, well, John, they don't
have the money, Well we'll fucking find it. And that
game against Auburn, you felt like he was coaching for
his job. That's year two. You'd be like, well he's
following Saban. Well, yeah, I'm at LSU. Where the expectation
I'm giving you one hundred million dollars. Like the reason
Brian Kelly was shoved out was obviously because he just

(58:55):
wasn't winning and his program clearly wasn't close to you know,
Bama or Georgia. But like old Miss was in a
different world. He was losing to teams, like he simply
was not as good as teams that he's expected to
be better than. And he didn't make the playoffs and
he didn't make it till the end of year four. Now,

(59:15):
obviously being an asshole and that type stuff what made
it an easy decision. I just think you better win.
And you know, the sobriety, the the hot yoga, the living.
I guess with your ex wife like that that is,
you know, it's important to let everyone know that. But
now no one cares. We're not teaching life lessons here.

(59:38):
We're trying to win Daddy's you know, And can you
get us closer to that? If you can, no one
will care about any of your indiscretions. If you pick
back up the bottle. If you started running around your
wife again, no one would care, not a soul. But
if you have an eight and four year, it'll be
a problem full stop. Now, you could win an actual

(01:00:00):
championship and then have an eight and four year and
people will let up on you a little bit. But
the expectations. The one thing I will say about Ryan Day,
who you'd be like middlecoff, I own an apology. He's kicking,
Asendagen names his program is elite right now. And hiring
of Patricia that was a big time That was a

(01:00:20):
big time hire. And clearly the not beating Michigan thing
was a big deal. He knew it. He had to
get it done and they just kicked their ass. But
like you start rattling off national champions ships, like if
they win it this year again, you start going to
final fours like his The standard's really really high there
and he's just answering the belt year in year out.
It's like a bunch of dudes in the NFL. We're

(01:00:42):
top five every year, we're competing to win the Natty.
We have one of the best teams clearly in the
country every single year. But that's the expectation, Like anything
less than that he would get fired. He was so
good outside of Michigan for a couple of years that
couldn't really stick to him. But if last year he
would have lost in the first round, it would have
been a much bigger problem. Because the expectations are just outrageous,

(01:01:05):
and I would say you could make the argument that
in twenty twenty six, the highest expectations in the country
are number one Ohio State, because they now are consistently
the highest expectations. I even think Georgia's, in a weird way,
have lowered because of the transfer portal. It's like, yeah,

(01:01:26):
probably never gonna get as good as like twenty two
and twenty three or twenty one whatever they won back
to backs. As long as we're in the mix final fours,
and if Kirby can win another one like their last
championship was nineteen eighty, like I saw Mark Rick for
fifteen years, you know, be a top twenty fifteen Tennish team,
like what Kirby's done, Like he's a made man now.
And as long as every year they're in the SEC

(01:01:48):
title competition in the playoffs, it's all good. That's not
the case of Ohio State and I don't think that's
gonna be the case for the LSU. But also that's
what I think drove Lane to go there. You know,
part of in certain industries when you're you know, it's
pretty clear Lanes pretty ambitious person. You kind of are

(01:02:10):
driven to the craziness. It's like I think a lot
of people and listen, I sometimes I question what would
I do? Like why would you leave all Miss? You
got a great gig, They're paying you a ton of money,
they're very supportive, and you can clearly win there because
I want the highest level possible. And let's face it,
and this is no shaded Ole Miss. LSU is just

(01:02:31):
a slightly higher level. It used to be way higher
in the pre anil. It's still higher. And I just
think he wanted to test himself. No different than when
Brian Kelly left from Notre Dame and he failed. But
always respect a guy for getting up to bat and
taking a swing, even if it was ugly. And we
can debate that all day long. You could argue everyone

(01:02:54):
shitting on Lane. What about LSU. It's like they don't
care about their business partner, Ole Miss. They don't care
at all, Like they don't bear any responsibility in this.
I think it's all just very complicated. Obviously, I do
not feel like Lane is the victim at all. Him
playing that card is a little egregious. But I do
think like tough situation, it's not as black and white

(01:03:17):
as everyone's making it out to be. Playing a little
Monday morning quarterback. How crazy would it have been for
the Lions to trade Dan Campbell and promote Ben to
head coach. Obviously he would wouldn't have ever been a thought.
But who do you think? But what do you think
the Lions could have gotten in return for Dan Campbell

(01:03:38):
in a trade? I think it's always easy to play
this game. I think they played it in New York
with Sean Payton. I think they played in Dallas with
Sean Payton. I think Dallas has done this before with
some of the coaches they've let out the door, Sean Payton,
Dan Campbell. You know, look at Washington when that picture
comes up of like Kyle and Sean McVay. I think

(01:04:01):
sometimes when you are it's no different than your parents
always look at you like their child, and you sometimes
you have to leave the nest to kind of, you know,
earn your true respect right, There's something powerful about leaving
the house at seventeen, eighteen, nineteen years old and going
to do your own thing and proving it to yourself,
to them, to whoever. No different than someone that gives you,

(01:04:23):
you know, your first internship out of college. Most people
don't take their first internship and then go become the CEO.
Start in the mail room and work their way up.
There are stories of that, but the majority of it
are guys that have to go you know, stepping stone,
jump to somewhere else because they use that position to
gain more leverage. And like, listen, I think Dan Campbell

(01:04:47):
and I think Ben Johnson'd be the first to tell
you this. His leadership and his toughness, we would never
have got to where we got through the mud in
the three and thirteen season and even that next sea
and I think it went nine to seven that year
that they beat Rogers at the end of the season
and knocked them out of the playoffs without him, Like,
I don't know if Ben would have been capabable to

(01:05:08):
do that a couple of years ago. Now, if you
give them both equal teams, like if I give them
the Lions, I give them the Bears, I give them
the Packers. If all things are equal, would you take
Ben Johnson like Steve Kerr? Would he be equipped to
take some shitty NBA team and build them up to
like a seven seed? I don't think so. Would Phil

(01:05:29):
Jackson be equipped? No, But those guys can really handle stars.
They're equipped to do that. Steve Kurr has been around
Michael Jordan and Tim Duncan right. Steve Kerr called for
the ball for Michael in his heyday. That takes some balls.
He's comfortable being around like no different Joe Tory being
around dude on the Yankees. Not everyone can handle being

(01:05:49):
manager of the Yankees. Even if you're though the manager
of the Tampa Bay Rays. You can win more games
a little bit easier. Less people are watching you, a
little less media scrutiny. You know, a lot less people
in this Dans did you get to fly under the radar?
So I think Ben Johnson, I do think I'd be
stunned if he didn't admit this that he learned a
lot about leadership in just like mental toughness, from watching

(01:06:14):
the way Dan handled that. Now, I don't think it's
really arguable Ben is an elite schemer and if you
had to have a guy scheme, you a game plan
on a given week. I think Ben is immediately elevated
near the top of the league, and that's really impressive
to do. But uh yeah, I mean, if if you
could have over the next month, who would you rather

(01:06:36):
have calling the plays, Ben Johnson or Dan Campbell for
the Lions, You'd take Ben Johnson, I think you you know,
I think the New York Giants would give him a
first round pick for Dan Campbell. Pretty sure Dan Campbell
did he play for the New York Giants. Pretty sure
he did got he had great hair. He played for
the Giants for cop you know, it's great here and

(01:06:58):
I always notice it on TV. He's obviously he's been
He's been good whenever. I you know, depending on how
my four box sit up, I don't always listen to him,
but JJ Watt's pretty good. He has just elite hair.
I'm just I'm jealous of that flow someone that has
no hair. No one in my family does, though, my
brother I'm actually going to dinner with him Monday night
before the Monday night game. He's got he's got no

(01:07:20):
hair as well. We're bald as a bad luckily for
our kids. It's on our it's on our wife's side.
Who both sides have a hair, but god, we're bald
in my family question. I'm a Tampa fan and hated

(01:07:45):
how Liam Cohen went about things, But how much do
you think Jason Light maybe regrets not keeping him and
moving off Todd, especially since our defense looks at a
nept at the moment. I suppose it's easy to say
it now, but we did look considerably better with Cohen
on the staff. I think it's always easy to play

(01:08:06):
Monday morning quarterback, Right, you have your reasons and you
make your decisions, you know, And this is not one
of those where you dump her and then you look
on Instagram three years later and she just looks like
a dime and she's married to a guy who's way
richer than you, and her life looks way sweeter. Right.
This is one of those situations where it's pretty hard
when you're winning to fire your head coach, even if

(01:08:29):
like you take a step back and you go, yeah,
who would be the better higher for the next ten years.
I bet Jason Light would have admitted over a beer
that like, yeah, it's probably Liam Cohen, But what am
I gonna do fire Todd Bowles and you'd be like, well,
sometimes as the leader, you got to make tough decisions.
It literally never happens. I do not remember a situation
where it's like he got us out of the mud,

(01:08:49):
he got us going in the right direction. But we're
gonna trade Dan Campbell for Ben Johnson. Listen. I know
Todd has done a just an impressive job. He has
kept the ship going in the right direction. He's taking
us to the playoffs post Tom Brady. But we got
to fire him and go with Liam Cohen, who has

(01:09:09):
been an offensive coordinator for one season. Yes, I think
if you could, you would. I just don't think it's
very possible to do that. I don't think it's realistic.
Aren't ninety five percent of Division I college football jobs
just stepping stones, not destination schools? Isn't that the real

(01:09:30):
reason Ole Miss fans are so salty, Not so much
that they lost their coach, but that the last couple
of years they had the best feeling themselves thinking they
were Bama, LSU Georgia tier program, and Kiffen leaving for
LSU kind of gave them a double dose of reality
that they are not a top tier destination school. I

(01:09:53):
think sometimes getting humbled in life can be a great
reminder for us all. And I think it's really difficult.
I think it's easy to understand. You know, in football,
it's like, hey, in college, historically, when a program would lee,
lose another coach or lose a coach to another school,

(01:10:16):
it would be Wow, they've doubled his salary. You'd be like, well,
what are we gonna do? Like, what are we gonna do? Right?
Even now, if you lose a recruit, it's like, well,
we offered them four hundred grand the other school offered
him nine hundred thousand dollars. It wasn't my shitty recruiting.
It's like easy to justify it. And then every once
in a while it's like, no, this is just kind

(01:10:37):
of who you are, right you are. This is the
greatest three year stretch in the history of the school.
Ten wins, ten wins, eleven wins. I think Lane Kiffin
said this eleven wins is the most regular season wins
by Mississipi or Misissippi State in the history of either program.

(01:10:58):
Think I'm I mean Bama. I think how many times
Bama went undefeated LSU's their national championship with Joe Burrow.
They were undefeated. So I think the dose of reality hurts.
But I think where it hurts now it's like, well,
we could offer the same amount of money. We've been
giving him huge money for recruits. Like it's literally not

(01:11:19):
for the money, and it's kind of not as much
this time. It's just because through his lens, and he
told you this through his actions. I don't give a
shit what he tells Marty Smith, what he tells McAfee,
what he'll ever say moving forward. At a press conference,
he told you with his actions, and let's face it,

(01:11:40):
he'd committed to going to LSU weeks ago. You could
argue he committed the moment he sent his wife and
his kids to go check out Florida and bat and Rouge.
And I do think you know they just hired Dave Caldwell,
the former Jags GM at Florida from the Eagles that
Lane was never going to have a GM for him.

(01:12:00):
He has too much leverage. So there, I've been read
some articles and some different people that cover their tweets
that thought that was an area that made him uncomfortable. Well,
you're gonna because in the pros. It happens sometimes, Right,
you gotta work with this GM. Lane ain't working with
anybody he doesn't want to work with, right, So if
he's gonna work with somebody, it's gonna be because he's

(01:12:21):
choosing to work with that guy. And I do wonder
if like Florida was already kind of out and Jimmy,
who's no dummy as a businessman, it was like, hey,
send them there, use a little leverage and we'll get
more money. But the moment Lane sent his family on
the fact gathering information trip, he gowned. I mean he gowned,

(01:12:46):
and at that moment, every old miss fan kind of knew,
like we're getting played a little bit, and he's such
a good coach, and they beat the shit out of
Missippi State and the Egg Bowl. It just it's no
different than if you know you're getting divorced, or you
know you break your breaking up and the relationship's gonna end.

(01:13:07):
We've all been to that position where it's inevitable it's
gonna end. But then you just have a night where
you maybe go get some cocktails and then you know,
they spend the night together and the sparks are fine,
maybe even again in the morning, You're like, ah, this
is good, but deep down you know it's over. And
that's what I think sucks about the situation is like
it was everyone kind of knew it was over a

(01:13:28):
couple weeks ago, and then you played that game and
Lane was smiling. But even the way that he attacked
that dude that said called him can't make a whole
housewife when everyone acknowledges that analogy's perfect. And I even
saw that guy say that, Lane called him and apologized.
I think sometimes we snap back when we know what

(01:13:50):
you say to us is true. Like you know, Lane's like,
I'm sober now, I'm not sleeping around. I back with
my wife. You call me a hoe like that kind
of struck a nerve, even though he like, he wasn't
even talking about your sexual proclivities out in the town.
He's talking about your ability to just jump around. You
just go to a lot of places naturally most coaches do,

(01:14:11):
but Lane does a lot more than most. Okay, a
couple more. Watching the Sunny Night game has me questioning
Sean Payton. He turned that franchise around, but his play
calling is dreadful. He makes Andy Reid look like a
run heavy coach, except Sean doesn't have Mahomes under center.
I know Coward loves him, but tell me I'm not

(01:14:33):
crazy to think he's a bit overrated. Side note, these
officials have been awful. Another side note, Marcus mary Otah
Collinsworth is awesome. I don't know why Collinsworth couldn't just
call him his name that we all call him Mariota.
I was actually thinking about this this morning cause I
nitpick bo Nicks, But what was the Broncos record post

(01:14:59):
Peyton man Like if you go back to just when
Fangio took over to so if we go Kubiak, the
end of Kubiak five and eleven, and then you just
start in twenty eighteen when it was Vance Joseph six
and ten, seven and nine, five and eleven, seven and ten,
five and twelve, eight and nine, Peyton's first year. So

(01:15:21):
think about that from Peyton manning super Bowl win the
following year nine and seven, five and eleven, six and ten,
seven and nine, five and eleven, seven and ten, five
and twelve, they had seen some hard times. Sean gets
there eight and nine last year, playoffs ten and seven.
This year they're ten and two with tied with the
Patriots for the best record in the league. I think

(01:15:44):
he's pretty good. I think he's got a you know,
the thing's a little weird with the quarterback. But ten
and two is ten and two. Hear me out. I'm
twenty five, about to be twenty six, played JV in
varsity sports, graduated high school, applied to, got into and
graduated from college with a four year degree. Started a

(01:16:06):
career in aerospace smart guy, got engaged, planned a wedding,
and got married, got my first dog, bought my first car,
lived in four quote four different cities. All since the
Steelers have won their last playoff game. I have been
waiting to see an end do Tomlin's time in Pittsburgh

(01:16:28):
since I was in college. So it feels validating to
hear people I respect so much, like you saying it
as well. Say what you want about him as a coach,
but Tomlin the staff builder is not someone I want
in charge of the future of my team. Moving forward.
With all that said, my question is this, with the
benefit of hindsight, how good of a coach is Mike Tomlin? Really?

(01:16:51):
The Steelers defense of the past were good, but that
was with Dick Lebou, who was a legend and a
cowerd guy. I think we're gonna find out how good
Mike Tomlin is when he's the coach of the New
York Giants next season, when he's the coach of the
Miami Dolphins in two years, when he's a coach somewhere else.

(01:17:12):
That's not as easy, and it's kind of on him.
Like after a while, people questioned Andy in Philadelphia and
they say, Okay, I'll go to the Kancie Chiefs, who
have the number one over overall draft pick, who just
had a linebacker shoot his fiance and then blow his
head off in the parking lot. The franchise was in shambles.
Andy gets there, brings in Dorsey brings Beach, brings in

(01:17:35):
you know, Naggy and Doug Peterson, all those guys immediately
there in the playoffs. Five six years later, they got
Patrick Mahomes. They become a dynasty, and all they've done
is won, and now no one can dispute like Andy's elite.
Sean Payton took over the Saints, who or a joke,
won a Super Bowl, won a lot. It's like, okay,
got Drew Brees. Good luck Denver, Okay eight nine, ten

(01:17:58):
and seven hour, ten and two, and we got a
month to be the number one seed with an elite defense,
and we feel pretty good for the one seed. At
minimum we'll be in the conference championship game. So I
think you really prove your worth and really earn your
respect the second place, Like it's like, how is Mike Rabele? Well, actually,

(01:18:20):
I actually think it's more impressive of what he did
in Tennessee watching Tennessee now and what a disaster that
organization is, and then you watch him go to New England,
a place that had been a joke and immediately turn
them down. So I do think Mike tomlins kind of
legend and his validation if he goes to the Dolphins

(01:18:41):
and all of a sudden they're just good every year,
he's gonna get a lot of respect because I do
think the stars dimmed and a lot of people question
it rightfully. So you haven't won a playoff game in
a decade, your team now just sucks. He's definitely gonna
have He's gonna have a spot on him wherever he goes.
And I think he'll be at another organization neither this

(01:19:03):
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(01:19:27):
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for twenty percent off at checkout. Okay. Last question, this
is from Eli. After the huge win against the Rams

(01:19:47):
and with all the bright, young love, honest, opinion hate,
who knows what? What can I expect for my Panthers
Finishing off the season? We have the Buccaneers two more times,
Seattle once, and the Saints again. Our run game this
past week looked great, splitting the carries between Hubbard and Dowdell,

(01:20:08):
and our defense the past two weeks against the Niners
in the Rams looks like a top five unit. I
know we're not gonna go to the Super Bowl. But
what's your honest opinion. Well, let's bring up Carolina, who
is Let's go conference. They are currently the tenth seed,
so the Cowboys are above them, the Lions are above them,

(01:20:30):
and then the Niners are several games above them and
beat them straight up. So if you go to Carolina,
like you said, they play the Bucks twice. They get
the Bucks at home this week, which is a massive game.
If you lose to the Bucks and you go to
seven and seven and they go to eight and five,

(01:20:53):
I do think you would be in major trouble given
that you would have multiple losses. They beat you head up.
In their schedule, it's not exactly Murderer's row. So they
the Buccaneers. I guess they play you. So the Bucks

(01:21:14):
have the Saints, the Falcons at Panthers, the Dolphins, and
then the Panthers. What schedule was I looking at? I
don't know what I did there. I don't think you're
making the playoffs. I think Tampa's schedules is too easy,
and if they just split with you, I think the

(01:21:34):
big question mark is is Bryce young this offseason? If
you go eight to nine or nine and eight and
you missed the playoffs, is that an auto you're not
picking up his fifth year option. Like, is he getting
his fifth year option picked up? There's my roof. I
don't know. I would say right now, no, But he

(01:21:57):
has more games like yesterday where he's going fifteen to twenty,
throw a couple of touchdowns. Actually, I think he threw
three touchdowns yesterday. What was he yesterday? Yeah, fifteen to
twenty for three touchdowns. It's amazing what a running game
will do for a young quarterback. It's kind of important.
So if I would have told you at the beginning

(01:22:19):
of the season that's starting in December, you would control
your own destiny to make the playoffs against the Tampa
Bay Buccaneers and have a home playoff game. You would
have one hundred percent signed up for that, So you
could argue that the season has already been a win.
The volume

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3 & Out - Drake Maye & Patriots CRUSHED Jaxson Dart & Giants on MNF

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