February 21, 2019 • 27 mins
Dan Beyer and 10 year NBA veteran Ryan Hollins fill in for Doug and talk about Duke’s Zion Williamson getting hurt against North Carolina. They also react to the breaking news that the NBA has officially proposed lowering the draft eligibility age from 19 to 18. Plus, Sports Illustrated Senior NBA writer Chris Mannix joins the show to talk about Kyrie Irving’s beef with the media.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for listening to the best of the Doug Gottlieb
Show podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday
from three to six pm Eastern Time, that's twelve to
three Pacific on Fox Sports Radio. Find your local station
for the Doug Gottlieb Show at Fox Sports Radio dot com,
or stream us live every day on the I Heart
Radio app by searching f s R. This is the
(00:21):
best of the Doug gottli Show on Fox Sports Radio.
And riding right next to me for the next three hours.
Ten year NBA veteran Ryan Hollins, Welcome into the Doug
Gottlieb Show here on Fox Sports Radio. You could always
listen to the show on the I Heart Radio app.
And boy, Ryan, a lot to get to today. Zion.
(00:42):
Here's Zion there, Zion everywhere. As the potential number one
overall pick plays less than a minute and last that's
game against North Carolina, injures his knee in that loss,
and now the speculation running rampant about what should happen,
who was to blame, who was at faults, and what
Zion Williamson should do. Amazing to see what transpired in
(01:04):
the forty seconds that he played last night Dan just
before it happened. Before it happened. I don't want to
say I'm I was a mind reading because what is it?
This is a bad mind reading thing, because my thoughts
were as I'm collecting it, and I don't know if
you've seen it. I have very strong feelings as a
(01:25):
former collegiate athlete, as a as a guy who who's
been there before and and done it, and I feel
like college isn't for everybody. Now, I'm a guy that
college was for me. All four years were for Ryan Islands. Okay,
I needed them, Okay, and I'm some guys need eight,
you know, need eight or nine. But yeah, to your point,
(01:48):
but when you look at the overall grand scheme of things,
and we're gonna get to this later on in the show,
they charged dollars for tickets, I can't tell tell you
how much Zion himself has re created this resurgence of
college basketball. I can't turn on my TV without seeing
(02:09):
Duke basketball because of Zion and having some type of
peaked interest in college that I haven't had in some time. Honestly,
it's it's been a minute. And then know that he's
not being paid and some can make this big uproar
all he get paid. He's getting paid. It's a scholarship,
it's per diem. His housing he has board. Like I
(02:30):
just said, it's per diem. It's pretty diem. If God forbid,
and I only think it's a sprain his knee had
gone out, this kid would have left a billion dollars
on the table because he's spent a year in college.
Now you can also say the rewards beyond everything towards
his professional career, he got to learn from one of
(02:50):
the greatest coaches we've ever seen in basketball period, in
Coach k And I can say that because he's got
the respect of Lebron Kobe, all those guys from the
Olympics to your household name, yeah, Zion, I mean it's
a unique name anyway, There's no other Zion's out there.
He's got that going forward. I just hated Dan, I
just I just hated to my to my core that
(03:12):
this kid is making nothing, and not just that the
system is the system, but how it's blown up around him.
Because you guys see money and advertisements and sales and
tickets out and tickets ain't nothing compared to the TV
money that this kid's dunks and highlights have brought in
and the viewership and he makes nothing. It kills me
to my core. Okay, Now, this is a message that
(03:35):
I had heard last night and read on Twitter, and
I've heard all that Ryan. I said it before the game,
put it out and it's a conversation even before he
was injured, because of all that he was doing as
a college basketball player. But this is where I think
you're missing the boat, and everyone's missing the boat. Talk
to me. This isn't an n C Double A issue.
(03:57):
Anybody who went on social media last night was complaining
about Zion Williamson. Look at what the n C Double
A has done to you. Then Double A did nothing
to Zion Williamson except give him an opportunity to play
college basketball for a year. If anybody is to blame
for Zion Williamson's injury last night, it is the NBA
and the NBA Players Association, because it is them and
(04:20):
not the n C Double A that has put a
rule in that does not allow players to enter the
association until they are a year removed from playing in
high school. And that is the only reason why Zion
Williamson is at Duke last night's injury had nothing to
do with the n C Double A. It had nothing
to do with paying players. It had nothing to do
(04:41):
with compensating them for their likeness. That had nothing to
do with it. If the NBA didn't have the rule
of forcing a player to stay out of their league
for a year until they were that year removed. If
that wasn't there, Zion Williamson would be in the NBA
right now. The only reason he is at Duke is
because he can't be in the NBA. So last night,
(05:03):
with everybody complaining about paying college players and and his
likeness and how much Duke is making off of him,
I can argue that as well. But the fact is
is the points are misguided. If they're not relevant, they're
not connected. The NBA was the reason. The NBA is
the reason why Zion Williamson was in Durham last night
and not in the NBA. So me and you decide
(05:25):
to put on our ski mask, and there's that good
old Starbucks down the way, chilling the car. We're about
to hit the leg, chilling the car, going on, We're
gonna steal from Starbucks. Okay, you're chilling the car. I'm
gonna go robbing Starbucks and when I come out, you
(05:45):
get the gas, you floorid all right, you Florida, We're
out of here. Who's guilty me or you? Well, I
think it's a team efforts there of I'm driving the
getaway car and you would be robbing the starbus. That
That's that's how I've feel about the NBA right now.
And I'm gonna give you some angles to that because
I've had defined talks with Commissioner. I was a board
(06:08):
member with the n B p A represented my team
for a number of years. I've I've said in hours
of those those meetings, and the problem was, you're getting
NBA coaches in the middle of nowhere in these high
school gyms, dealing with handlers au coaches. And it was
a big effort in the one and done rule, not
just to say some of these kids from themselves, but
(06:29):
from the handlers, and to get these NBA executives out
of high school gyms and having to deal with these people.
And I say that, just say that there's now a
time and change in Zion's energy and injury, hopefully just
just small minor four weeks. That's what it's crazy. I
think I'm a mind reader, exactly what I said. I'm
(06:50):
a referee, I'm a trainer therapist. But look, it's time.
It's time now. But I do understand why the rule
was in place. I get the why the rule was
in place as well. And then double A is is
not perfect by any means. There there are many issues,
and all of the issues that you mentioned are legitimate
(07:12):
issues that if you are supporting a college athlete or
or representing them or just a fan of they're all legit.
The problem is is it just doesn't apply to last night.
Zion is that guy. Zion is the guy who could
have gone from high school to the NBA. That is
the guy that Zion is. It's not r. J. Barrett,
(07:34):
it's not other freshmen throughout the country. Zion is the
unique circumstance that can do it. But to blame that
then to say that the n C double A was
the problem, and that the n C double A should
be sick for what they're seeing. They shouldn't play it.
They should be, but it's not. But it's not there.
(07:56):
I wish I had a better word for this. Okay,
forgive me. Is that dump he jumping up? John? John Ramos,
do you have the dump button ready for Ryan Hollins. Okay,
I'm a clean guy, but when I see it, I cannot.
I wish my whole cabin. I see pimping. I see pimping.
(08:17):
And why do I say that? Why do I say that?
Because not only do I says, okay, as you choose
a zion, as you choose to come to my university.
Because and this is only for a special case, right
some kids, Ryan Hollins, this didn't apply for you. You're
glad to get your degree, okay, all right to a
good school. So okay, neither here to there. Okay, but look,
(08:38):
not only will I not pay you anything more than
room and board, room and board, because I was in
when I participate in collegiate sports, you're not gonna make
enough to kind of take care of yourself or get
anything extra. My father essentially, like had to take out
loans because I couldn't apply for financial aid. But he
(08:59):
didn't quite make enough where he could just get me
whatever I needed. But he had to take out loans
just to get me. And I'm a I'm a scholarship athlete.
God forbid. If I actually had to like work my
way through school at the time. That's just wrong, that's
just wrong. And then there's another element. And I won't
know how you feel about this. Not only will I
not pay you more than this meager, this meager per
(09:20):
diemn you, my friend, cannot go out and get your
own advertisements. You cannot be your own brand, and you
you amateur all these other professionals around you cannot make
your own money. So Zion couldn't have gotten a shoe
deal if you went and played in Europe for a year.
Now this is now, but not. And and that's where
(09:45):
the NBA is the problem, because the n c Double
A just gives them an avenue to go somewhere kinda
Liza rice Is commission that was going to clear up
college basketball. Remember from the from the FBI investigation. They
had looked in and they said that the one and
done is absurd, The one and done is ridiculous. It
needs to go away. In that report, it's specifically stated
(10:08):
the only problem is it has nothing to do with
the n C Double A. It's all up to the
NBA and the NBA Players Association. And and that's where
the fact, that's what happened last night through the misguided
conversation of everything that you talked about, of athletes not
getting what they're worth, not getting paid, having crappy per
d M. All of that is legit and real, but
(10:29):
it wasn't the reason that he blew out his shoe
last night and almost injured as me. You you weren't
in the getaway car. Somehow you're you're excluding yourself from
the getaway Dukes supposed to say, no, we don't want you,
because we don't want the bad pub is bigger. It's
bigger than Duke bro It's bigger than Duke. And also
understand the initiatives of the NBA cares and his junior
(10:49):
NBA Excuse me, the junior n b A is trying
to clean up these problems and now they're just gonna happen,
have to happen a lot sooner than later. They're gonna
have to happen a lot sooner than later. But there's
no way that we see what's going on. And you
don't see the n c double A as a broke system.
And I completely agree. But my thing is looked. Let
(11:09):
these kids make their money, let them get advertisement deals,
let them get whatever they want, because get I get
it if you don't want to pay for it, and
you want to say what's fair, what's not fair? These
aren't amateurs. Okay, Well, let me ask you this. If
Zion Williamson could get paid in college and then get
paid in the NBA, and he had both options out
(11:30):
of high school, where do you think he goes? If
you could pay a college athlete and you could then
go to or go to the pros and also get paid,
where do you think he goes? I would say he
would grow the most in the pro Yes. And that's
what was preventing him from going to the pros is
the NBA. So I get all the college stuff. I
(11:51):
just I think people are just completely missing the boat
on what last night was all about. And if it's
not Mike Saschowski and it's not the College A d
S and it's not at the n C double A,
that should feel sick, should be Adam Silver and the
Players Association being like, oh wow, we almost he's gonna
be a number one pick, whether he towards a c
L or not. By the way, there was no doubt
about that. It's just when you're looking at the blame,
(12:14):
so much of it was directed at college basketball for
no reasons had anything to do with last night. Let
me fancy you with this. Let me fancy I'm just
saying the NBA is making steps to get rid of
the rule. Tell me the steps that college is making,
my man to get rid of their pimping. What are
(12:35):
they doing? What are they The commission for Kotda Liza
Rice was a good first step. I'll just know that
was putting band aid on on a bullet wound. Baby.
May be sure to catch live editions of The Doug
dot Leap Show week days in noon eastern three pm
(12:55):
Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and the I Heart Radio app.
Let's bring in Chris Mannock, senior writer covering the NBA
four Sports Illustrated. Find him on Twitter at s I
Chris Manno, say Chris, how you doing today? What's going on? Guys?
Ryan Hollins and I are trying to wouldn't maybe even
not trying to settle it. Ryan's on one side, I'm
on the other. I'll ask the question. So it's definitely
(13:18):
slanted in my favor. Ryan, Should the n B a you?
In my mind, I believe that they should. There a
majority of the fault from last night Zion Williamson injury?
Who who? Who gets the fault of last night's injury
for Zion Williamson? I don't. I mean, I don't know
if there's even fault in anyone really. I mean, do
(13:38):
we want to really fault the Sneaker company for you know,
making a sneaker that does not quite able to withstand
the motion of a six seven two or eight five
pound super athlete? Um, is it his fault for playing
in these games at all? Is it the NBAS fault
for having the one and done rule where he wouldn't
be playing in the NBA right now now? Because look,
(14:02):
I mean this is I'm writing something about this tomorrow
and then you're right this like every year it gets,
without fail, it comes up because of some kind of
incident or something that happens that sparks this debate once again.
But you do have to remember that, you know, there
were other options available to Zion Williamson, like if he
really didn't want to go to Duke. I'm not saying
(14:22):
that the G League offers a ton of money. It
certainly does not, but that money can be recouped in
a massive sneaker deal of his own I mean, you
don't think that Nike and Puma Adidas wouldn't battle for
the rights to pay Zion Williamson even while he's in
the G League. I do, so I don't like I
go back and forth over the one and done rule.
(14:43):
I mean it, it certainly has its flaws. But I
also kind of grew up in a time where and
I was a ball boy back in the day with
the Celtics for years, and I was friendly with kore
Leon Young and you know guys that that came out
of high school that that didn't make it, and the
countless other guys that thought they were in being ready
and weren't even drafted. So it's impossible to prove a negative.
(15:04):
But I do believe that the one and done rule
has probably stopped some kids from going pro sent them
to college, and maybe their lives turned out differently. Chris,
let me ask you a real question, because I know
you're a real dude. My man. I'm a big fan
over I'm a big fan of the stuff you got
going app that tell me right now that colleges cannot
(15:26):
pay athletes, because they keep singing this to tell me
that they can't pay athletes tell me that it's impossible,
and I'll leave it alone. I don't look in a
in a vacuum. I think it's impossible for colleges to
cut up the pie in a way that will make
sense to everybody, because you know, and I wrote part
of this, you know, for for tomorrow, and I already
(15:48):
wrote today that you know, how do you do it?
I get to hear a coherence, you know, just you know,
argument or a plan for how you divide the pie. Okay,
you want Zion to get paid? Does you know that
mean Jordan Goldweyer also gets paid? You want the Duke
team because it's on national TV thirty one time to
get paid? Do you want Wake Forest to get paid?
(16:08):
I don't know how you you bring this up? And
then you go football. It's even more difficult because the
quarterbacks are the stars of of that particular space what
I do think college basketball should do And it's kind
of dumb that they haven't let these guys earn off
their own likeness. If if thank you, If if Nike
wants to step in and pay Zion Limpson, is it? Look,
(16:30):
I didn't play the game you did, but I mean,
is they're really going to affect the integrity of a
locker room. If Zion's get his own sneaker and other
guys don't, I think they're aware of, you know, the
hierarchy within that locker room. And I'm not saying that
you should allow autographs signings after every practice, but you know,
cack carve out some time in the in during the
calendar year. Let's call it during spring break when when
(16:52):
you know these college kids are off doing something else
during spring break, Zion Williamson should get to make appearances
and make some money off off being Zion Williamson. I
think that is a completely logical and easy thing to
carve out. Chris Bannocks joining us here on the Doug
Gotlum Show on Fox Sports Radio. He's Ryan Hollins. I'm
Dan Buyer filling in for Doug today. Chris, is Kyrie
(17:14):
Irving handling everything the way that he should in Boston?
Because now there was more comments as the media blew
up the conversation that he had with Kevin Durant in
a hallway or in a tunnel. How could Kyrie Irving
handle all of these situations better? And is this any
signal towards maybe what he may do in this offseason.
(17:36):
You know, it's one of the more puzzling, you know,
potential or likely free agencies that I've covered in a while.
And I'm pretty close to it. I'm based in Boston
in Milwaukee right now for the Celtics Bucks game tonight. Um.
You know, Kyrie also, to put it this way, Kyrie
keeps making mountains out of a mole hill. He really does.
And you know, he could have not said anything about
(17:59):
the convery station with Lebron, but when he did, it
came across to a lot of people like he was saying,
you know, I was a jackass. Now you helped me
learn how to deal with these jackasses. It sort of
just came across that way to me and to many
others across the league. And then you know, the the
interview with Rachel Nichols that he did over All Star weekend,
(18:20):
and then you had what happened yesterday at the at
the practice where you know, I think it's a fairly
you know, depend I asked the question, but it's a
fairly innocuous question. I don't think that that Kyrie, I
and Kevin Durant We're standing in a hallway in front
of everybody discussing the Knicks double max cap space. You
have to be I think, a special brand of gullible
to really believe that they were doing that there when
(18:41):
there are so many other places that they could potentially
do it. Yeah, I mean so so so. But but Kyrie,
he hasked to understand that there's interested. And if Kyrie
had just said, absolutely, man, we're discussing double max and
Olympiacos next year, it's gonna be huge, We're going to
agree you could do huge stuff like this so easily
and dead he took. He got offended by it, which
(19:02):
which I mean, Look, I've pissed plenty of players off
in my time, you know, with questions or whatever. I
get that, But but that's not that to me, isn't
isn't a ridiculous question. You know, the internet was buzzing,
you know, for a good twenty four hours in a
lot of goofy ways. I know some reporters, even more
like you know New York based reporters were the ones
that kind of thing put that stuff in the universe.
But it's not a ridiculous question to ask Kyrie what
(19:25):
he thought about, you know, the stuff going on out there.
But said Kyrie is like the Internet isn't real and
is that really your life? And you're just doing this
for clicks? And I don't. I just again, I go
back to the mountains out of Mole Hills. Man, he
could very easily diffuse situations. He's choosing not to. Enough
about Kyrie. Enough about Kyrie. I want to talk about
his teammate next year, Lebron James. Okay, you heard Hey,
(19:50):
is Lebron James? Tell me? Tell me Chris. Is Lebron
James still the baddest man on the planet. Is he
gonna take this this niter, this me a Lakers squad
to the playoffs? Tell me yes or no? Come on,
I'm done betting against Lebron. So I'm gonna say yes. Um.
And it's it's part that the l A Clippers, you know,
(20:11):
their front office absolutely doesn't want to make the playoffs
for the reason we know they keep their draft pick
if they don't. And the idea that I'm gonna bett
in the Sacramento Kings doing anything like you know, productive
is is not gonna happen. Like that's just not I mean,
I love this narrative, like the Kings of this upstart.
You know, you know, great story that they've been out
of the playoffs since oh six, that had seventy two
(20:32):
lottery picks in the last twelve years. Like they should
be a playoff team right now, not one nipping at
the heels of the fringes of the postseason. But Lebron's Lebron.
He's great and I think it also means a lot
to him to be in the playoffs and not see
that consecutive playoffs. Tree again should be a dandy tonight
in Milwaukee, Celticston and Bucks. Enjoy that one, Chris, We
(20:53):
appreciate the time and enjoy the second part of the
NBA's regular season. Be sure to catch live editions. So
the Doug Got Leave Show week days in noon eastern
three pm Pacific, ISAAC had the news that's the NBA
working on the proposal to limit the age limit or
to the age limit from nineteen. You're cheering because you're
(21:15):
proving my point, Ryan. That's the that's the that's the
issue with this. This is this is the this is
the NBA, This is the NBA. And I know it's
coincidental that it was on the heels of the Zion injury.
But do you think this report really comes out if Zion,
if it comes out today on a Thursday, if Zion
isn't hurt last night, do you think this report comes
(21:35):
out today? Are you just questioning the timing? Listen, the
NBA is appropriate. Can you argue with just and appropriate?
That is it perfect? No? But can you fault effort?
This is not a mile away or the highway type
of approach. The NBA saw problem. They put um responsible
(21:58):
steps in place to fix it. And now Zion Williamson
last night show you how appropriate it is to absolutely
abolish the rule. And so I don't I don't know
how you're what do you complain to it? Are you
still are you hold on? Are you still blaming the NBA? Dan?
I am because this is why. Because if the rule
(22:23):
wasn't placed yet in place yesterday, Zion Williamson isn't in
a duke uniform with his legs in the form of
a Z on the camera the north floor. So if
you are carrying your lunch in your hands, you can
make any analogy. We heard some stupid ones on Fox Sports.
(22:44):
I'll tell you that much. You got your lunch in
hand and I trip and I knock over your lunch,
I knock your drink over. Okay, you got Starbucks? I
knock your drink always? What are you? Hey? Ryan? It's okay,
it's an accident. Where about it? What if I walk in,
I slap it off, slip your drink off the table.
You're gonna have a problem. Hey, what's wrong with you?
You're gonna have some choice words for me. That's what
(23:06):
the n C double A does. That's the difference between
n C Double A and the NBA. If the NBA
makes a mistake, they are going to go about it
the right way, conflict management and trying to make it right.
So how do you don't know? How do you fault
that that that you The answer is in what you
just said. They're trying to make it right because it's
wrong right now, and the reason that it's wrong has
(23:27):
put Zion Williamson in the situation that he's in because
this now would change the rule that would allow Zion
Williamson to go from high school to the NBA getting
rid of the one and done. If Jeff zill Get
of the USA today is correct and his reporting that's this,
It makes my whole point that, yeah, the NBA is
(23:47):
finally getting it right. But last night all anybody wanted
to do was claimed that the m C double A
was at fault for Zi Williamson, getting the whole reason.
You have no hold you hold value here. You cannot
you cannot look me in the face right now, and
I look talk talk to our listeners. Okay, let's say
(24:08):
this holds no value. That the n b A is
pro active and they are not telling you this is
a my way or the highway type of approach. They
are doing what's best not just for the league but
for the players because the NBA's prospering. But it values
Zion in these young prospects and what's good and what's
(24:29):
best for them. Condoleeze or Rice, as I said earlier
in that Rice Commission to look into college basketball, said
it perfectly. The one and done should be done. It
should be out of college basketball if you want to
help clean up the sport. The problem is the n
C Double A has no say in it whatsoever. It's
all on the NBA and the NBA Players Association, which
they have done. Unfortunately, for Zion Williamson, it's too late
(24:53):
because he had to play under the old rules. Of
the NBA. In the NBA, you know, you know what
big message the NBA saying right now, the big message,
We're sorry, shut it down. They should have shut it
down earlier than Zion Williamson wouldn't have a shoe blowing out,
(25:14):
Adam down, shut it down, shut it down. Well, the
the point is the NBA, for as great as proactive
as they are, they were late to the bus on
this one. And that's the case. If it's forty degrees
below zero and you're standing outside and wanting to come inside,
Ryan Hollins, and I'm saying, nope, you've got to wait.
(25:36):
You're one hour before coming inside. You're gonna go outside
and freeze to death. That exactly what it is. That
is the best analogy we have heard on Fox Sports Radio,
by the way of any analogy of of what actually
went on. Is that accurate? Just trying to make you right.
This is the NBA saying, hey, we're gonna put a
plan in place, rather than making an emotional hold here
(25:59):
here in emotional response is saying, look, man, we are
going to create a junior NBA. We're gonna have positive
resources here for you so that you guys can be
the best that you can be by the time you
make the NBA, rather than just saying we're getting one
and done. Because guess what, you had g ms and
(26:19):
executives in slimy high school gyms. They had to deal
with broken down AU coaches. It was a complete mass
you had to protect. And then you had kids trying
to jump to the NBA skipping class that wasn't going
to not guard NBA. But last night had nothing to
do with any of that. Last night had everything to
do with the NBA not allowing Zion Williamson to go pro.
And today it is not a coincidence that this story
(26:42):
was leaked. It is not There is no way, this
isn't even done yet. This isn't even so you're not
commending this. I'm just saying that there's a reason why
this came out the day after Zion Williamson sprained his
knee in a game against North Who. But you're you're skipping.
Can you commend the m E No, No, I I
am commending it, but I'm saying for Zion Williamson's situation,
(27:05):
for him, it was too late and me confused, you
know what, the saying shut it down
Thanks for listening to the best of the Doug Gottlieb
Show podcast. Be sure to catch us live every weekday
from three to six pm Eastern Time, that's twelve to
three Pacific on Fox Sports Radio. Find your local station
for the Doug Gottlieb Show at Fox Sports Radio dot com,
or stream us live every day on the I Heart
Radio app by searching f s R. This is the
(00:21):
best of the Doug gottli Show on Fox Sports Radio.
And riding right next to me for the next three hours.
Ten year NBA veteran Ryan Hollins, Welcome into the Doug
Gottlieb Show here on Fox Sports Radio. You could always
listen to the show on the I Heart Radio app.
And boy, Ryan, a lot to get to today. Zion.
(00:42):
Here's Zion there, Zion everywhere. As the potential number one
overall pick plays less than a minute and last that's
game against North Carolina, injures his knee in that loss,
and now the speculation running rampant about what should happen,
who was to blame, who was at faults, and what
Zion Williamson should do. Amazing to see what transpired in
(01:04):
the forty seconds that he played last night Dan just
before it happened. Before it happened. I don't want to
say I'm I was a mind reading because what is it?
This is a bad mind reading thing, because my thoughts
were as I'm collecting it, and I don't know if
you've seen it. I have very strong feelings as a
(01:25):
former collegiate athlete, as a as a guy who who's
been there before and and done it, and I feel
like college isn't for everybody. Now, I'm a guy that
college was for me. All four years were for Ryan Islands. Okay,
I needed them, Okay, and I'm some guys need eight,
you know, need eight or nine. But yeah, to your point,
(01:48):
but when you look at the overall grand scheme of things,
and we're gonna get to this later on in the show,
they charged dollars for tickets, I can't tell tell you
how much Zion himself has re created this resurgence of
college basketball. I can't turn on my TV without seeing
(02:09):
Duke basketball because of Zion and having some type of
peaked interest in college that I haven't had in some time. Honestly,
it's it's been a minute. And then know that he's
not being paid and some can make this big uproar
all he get paid. He's getting paid. It's a scholarship,
it's per diem. His housing he has board. Like I
(02:30):
just said, it's per diem. It's pretty diem. If God forbid,
and I only think it's a sprain his knee had
gone out, this kid would have left a billion dollars
on the table because he's spent a year in college.
Now you can also say the rewards beyond everything towards
his professional career, he got to learn from one of
(02:50):
the greatest coaches we've ever seen in basketball period, in
Coach k And I can say that because he's got
the respect of Lebron Kobe, all those guys from the
Olympics to your household name, yeah, Zion, I mean it's
a unique name anyway, There's no other Zion's out there.
He's got that going forward. I just hated Dan, I
just I just hated to my to my core that
(03:12):
this kid is making nothing, and not just that the
system is the system, but how it's blown up around him.
Because you guys see money and advertisements and sales and
tickets out and tickets ain't nothing compared to the TV
money that this kid's dunks and highlights have brought in
and the viewership and he makes nothing. It kills me
to my core. Okay, Now, this is a message that
(03:35):
I had heard last night and read on Twitter, and
I've heard all that Ryan. I said it before the game,
put it out and it's a conversation even before he
was injured, because of all that he was doing as
a college basketball player. But this is where I think
you're missing the boat, and everyone's missing the boat. Talk
to me. This isn't an n C Double A issue.
(03:57):
Anybody who went on social media last night was complaining
about Zion Williamson. Look at what the n C Double
A has done to you. Then Double A did nothing
to Zion Williamson except give him an opportunity to play
college basketball for a year. If anybody is to blame
for Zion Williamson's injury last night, it is the NBA
and the NBA Players Association, because it is them and
(04:20):
not the n C Double A that has put a
rule in that does not allow players to enter the
association until they are a year removed from playing in
high school. And that is the only reason why Zion
Williamson is at Duke last night's injury had nothing to
do with the n C Double A. It had nothing
to do with paying players. It had nothing to do
(04:41):
with compensating them for their likeness. That had nothing to
do with it. If the NBA didn't have the rule
of forcing a player to stay out of their league
for a year until they were that year removed. If
that wasn't there, Zion Williamson would be in the NBA
right now. The only reason he is at Duke is
because he can't be in the NBA. So last night,
(05:03):
with everybody complaining about paying college players and and his
likeness and how much Duke is making off of him,
I can argue that as well. But the fact is
is the points are misguided. If they're not relevant, they're
not connected. The NBA was the reason. The NBA is
the reason why Zion Williamson was in Durham last night
and not in the NBA. So me and you decide
(05:25):
to put on our ski mask, and there's that good
old Starbucks down the way, chilling the car. We're about
to hit the leg, chilling the car, going on, We're
gonna steal from Starbucks. Okay, you're chilling the car. I'm
gonna go robbing Starbucks and when I come out, you
(05:45):
get the gas, you floorid all right, you Florida, We're
out of here. Who's guilty me or you? Well, I
think it's a team efforts there of I'm driving the
getaway car and you would be robbing the starbus. That
That's that's how I've feel about the NBA right now.
And I'm gonna give you some angles to that because
I've had defined talks with Commissioner. I was a board
(06:08):
member with the n B p A represented my team
for a number of years. I've I've said in hours
of those those meetings, and the problem was, you're getting
NBA coaches in the middle of nowhere in these high
school gyms, dealing with handlers au coaches. And it was
a big effort in the one and done rule, not
just to say some of these kids from themselves, but
(06:29):
from the handlers, and to get these NBA executives out
of high school gyms and having to deal with these people.
And I say that, just say that there's now a
time and change in Zion's energy and injury, hopefully just
just small minor four weeks. That's what it's crazy. I
think I'm a mind reader, exactly what I said. I'm
(06:50):
a referee, I'm a trainer therapist. But look, it's time.
It's time now. But I do understand why the rule
was in place. I get the why the rule was
in place as well. And then double A is is
not perfect by any means. There there are many issues,
and all of the issues that you mentioned are legitimate
(07:12):
issues that if you are supporting a college athlete or
or representing them or just a fan of they're all legit.
The problem is is it just doesn't apply to last night.
Zion is that guy. Zion is the guy who could
have gone from high school to the NBA. That is
the guy that Zion is. It's not r. J. Barrett,
(07:34):
it's not other freshmen throughout the country. Zion is the
unique circumstance that can do it. But to blame that
then to say that the n C double A was
the problem, and that the n C double A should
be sick for what they're seeing. They shouldn't play it.
They should be, but it's not. But it's not there.
(07:56):
I wish I had a better word for this. Okay,
forgive me. Is that dump he jumping up? John? John Ramos,
do you have the dump button ready for Ryan Hollins. Okay,
I'm a clean guy, but when I see it, I cannot.
I wish my whole cabin. I see pimping. I see pimping.
(08:17):
And why do I say that? Why do I say that?
Because not only do I says, okay, as you choose
a zion, as you choose to come to my university.
Because and this is only for a special case, right
some kids, Ryan Hollins, this didn't apply for you. You're
glad to get your degree, okay, all right to a
good school. So okay, neither here to there. Okay, but look,
(08:38):
not only will I not pay you anything more than
room and board, room and board, because I was in
when I participate in collegiate sports, you're not gonna make
enough to kind of take care of yourself or get
anything extra. My father essentially, like had to take out
loans because I couldn't apply for financial aid. But he
(08:59):
didn't quite make enough where he could just get me
whatever I needed. But he had to take out loans
just to get me. And I'm a I'm a scholarship athlete.
God forbid. If I actually had to like work my
way through school at the time. That's just wrong, that's
just wrong. And then there's another element. And I won't
know how you feel about this. Not only will I
not pay you more than this meager, this meager per
(09:20):
diemn you, my friend, cannot go out and get your
own advertisements. You cannot be your own brand, and you
you amateur all these other professionals around you cannot make
your own money. So Zion couldn't have gotten a shoe
deal if you went and played in Europe for a year.
Now this is now, but not. And and that's where
(09:45):
the NBA is the problem, because the n c Double
A just gives them an avenue to go somewhere kinda
Liza rice Is commission that was going to clear up
college basketball. Remember from the from the FBI investigation. They
had looked in and they said that the one and
done is absurd, The one and done is ridiculous. It
needs to go away. In that report, it's specifically stated
(10:08):
the only problem is it has nothing to do with
the n C Double A. It's all up to the
NBA and the NBA Players Association. And and that's where
the fact, that's what happened last night through the misguided
conversation of everything that you talked about, of athletes not
getting what they're worth, not getting paid, having crappy per
d M. All of that is legit and real, but
(10:29):
it wasn't the reason that he blew out his shoe
last night and almost injured as me. You you weren't
in the getaway car. Somehow you're you're excluding yourself from
the getaway Dukes supposed to say, no, we don't want you,
because we don't want the bad pub is bigger. It's
bigger than Duke bro It's bigger than Duke. And also
understand the initiatives of the NBA cares and his junior
(10:49):
NBA Excuse me, the junior n b A is trying
to clean up these problems and now they're just gonna happen,
have to happen a lot sooner than later. They're gonna
have to happen a lot sooner than later. But there's
no way that we see what's going on. And you
don't see the n c double A as a broke system.
And I completely agree. But my thing is looked. Let
(11:09):
these kids make their money, let them get advertisement deals,
let them get whatever they want, because get I get
it if you don't want to pay for it, and
you want to say what's fair, what's not fair? These
aren't amateurs. Okay, Well, let me ask you this. If
Zion Williamson could get paid in college and then get
paid in the NBA, and he had both options out
(11:30):
of high school, where do you think he goes? If
you could pay a college athlete and you could then
go to or go to the pros and also get paid,
where do you think he goes? I would say he
would grow the most in the pro Yes. And that's
what was preventing him from going to the pros is
the NBA. So I get all the college stuff. I
(11:51):
just I think people are just completely missing the boat
on what last night was all about. And if it's
not Mike Saschowski and it's not the College A d
S and it's not at the n C double A,
that should feel sick, should be Adam Silver and the
Players Association being like, oh wow, we almost he's gonna
be a number one pick, whether he towards a c
L or not. By the way, there was no doubt
about that. It's just when you're looking at the blame,
(12:14):
so much of it was directed at college basketball for
no reasons had anything to do with last night. Let
me fancy you with this. Let me fancy I'm just
saying the NBA is making steps to get rid of
the rule. Tell me the steps that college is making,
my man to get rid of their pimping. What are
(12:35):
they doing? What are they The commission for Kotda Liza
Rice was a good first step. I'll just know that
was putting band aid on on a bullet wound. Baby.
May be sure to catch live editions of The Doug
dot Leap Show week days in noon eastern three pm
(12:55):
Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and the I Heart Radio app.
Let's bring in Chris Mannock, senior writer covering the NBA
four Sports Illustrated. Find him on Twitter at s I
Chris Manno, say Chris, how you doing today? What's going on? Guys?
Ryan Hollins and I are trying to wouldn't maybe even
not trying to settle it. Ryan's on one side, I'm
on the other. I'll ask the question. So it's definitely
(13:18):
slanted in my favor. Ryan, Should the n B a you?
In my mind, I believe that they should. There a
majority of the fault from last night Zion Williamson injury?
Who who? Who gets the fault of last night's injury
for Zion Williamson? I don't. I mean, I don't know
if there's even fault in anyone really. I mean, do
(13:38):
we want to really fault the Sneaker company for you know,
making a sneaker that does not quite able to withstand
the motion of a six seven two or eight five
pound super athlete? Um, is it his fault for playing
in these games at all? Is it the NBAS fault
for having the one and done rule where he wouldn't
be playing in the NBA right now now? Because look,
(14:02):
I mean this is I'm writing something about this tomorrow
and then you're right this like every year it gets,
without fail, it comes up because of some kind of
incident or something that happens that sparks this debate once again.
But you do have to remember that, you know, there
were other options available to Zion Williamson, like if he
really didn't want to go to Duke. I'm not saying
(14:22):
that the G League offers a ton of money. It
certainly does not, but that money can be recouped in
a massive sneaker deal of his own I mean, you
don't think that Nike and Puma Adidas wouldn't battle for
the rights to pay Zion Williamson even while he's in
the G League. I do, so I don't like I
go back and forth over the one and done rule.
(14:43):
I mean it, it certainly has its flaws. But I
also kind of grew up in a time where and
I was a ball boy back in the day with
the Celtics for years, and I was friendly with kore
Leon Young and you know guys that that came out
of high school that that didn't make it, and the
countless other guys that thought they were in being ready
and weren't even drafted. So it's impossible to prove a negative.
(15:04):
But I do believe that the one and done rule
has probably stopped some kids from going pro sent them
to college, and maybe their lives turned out differently. Chris,
let me ask you a real question, because I know
you're a real dude. My man. I'm a big fan
over I'm a big fan of the stuff you got
going app that tell me right now that colleges cannot
(15:26):
pay athletes, because they keep singing this to tell me
that they can't pay athletes tell me that it's impossible,
and I'll leave it alone. I don't look in a
in a vacuum. I think it's impossible for colleges to
cut up the pie in a way that will make
sense to everybody, because you know, and I wrote part
of this, you know, for for tomorrow, and I already
(15:48):
wrote today that you know, how do you do it?
I get to hear a coherence, you know, just you know,
argument or a plan for how you divide the pie. Okay,
you want Zion to get paid? Does you know that
mean Jordan Goldweyer also gets paid? You want the Duke
team because it's on national TV thirty one time to
get paid? Do you want Wake Forest to get paid?
(16:08):
I don't know how you you bring this up? And
then you go football. It's even more difficult because the
quarterbacks are the stars of of that particular space what
I do think college basketball should do And it's kind
of dumb that they haven't let these guys earn off
their own likeness. If if thank you, If if Nike
wants to step in and pay Zion Limpson, is it? Look,
(16:30):
I didn't play the game you did, but I mean,
is they're really going to affect the integrity of a
locker room. If Zion's get his own sneaker and other
guys don't, I think they're aware of, you know, the
hierarchy within that locker room. And I'm not saying that
you should allow autographs signings after every practice, but you know,
cack carve out some time in the in during the
calendar year. Let's call it during spring break when when
(16:52):
you know these college kids are off doing something else
during spring break, Zion Williamson should get to make appearances
and make some money off off being Zion Williamson. I
think that is a completely logical and easy thing to
carve out. Chris Bannocks joining us here on the Doug
Gotlum Show on Fox Sports Radio. He's Ryan Hollins. I'm
Dan Buyer filling in for Doug today. Chris, is Kyrie
(17:14):
Irving handling everything the way that he should in Boston?
Because now there was more comments as the media blew
up the conversation that he had with Kevin Durant in
a hallway or in a tunnel. How could Kyrie Irving
handle all of these situations better? And is this any
signal towards maybe what he may do in this offseason.
(17:36):
You know, it's one of the more puzzling, you know,
potential or likely free agencies that I've covered in a while.
And I'm pretty close to it. I'm based in Boston
in Milwaukee right now for the Celtics Bucks game tonight. Um.
You know, Kyrie also, to put it this way, Kyrie
keeps making mountains out of a mole hill. He really does.
And you know, he could have not said anything about
(17:59):
the convery station with Lebron, but when he did, it
came across to a lot of people like he was saying,
you know, I was a jackass. Now you helped me
learn how to deal with these jackasses. It sort of
just came across that way to me and to many
others across the league. And then you know, the the
interview with Rachel Nichols that he did over All Star weekend,
(18:20):
and then you had what happened yesterday at the at
the practice where you know, I think it's a fairly
you know, depend I asked the question, but it's a
fairly innocuous question. I don't think that that Kyrie, I
and Kevin Durant We're standing in a hallway in front
of everybody discussing the Knicks double max cap space. You
have to be I think, a special brand of gullible
to really believe that they were doing that there when
(18:41):
there are so many other places that they could potentially
do it. Yeah, I mean so so so. But but Kyrie,
he hasked to understand that there's interested. And if Kyrie
had just said, absolutely, man, we're discussing double max and
Olympiacos next year, it's gonna be huge, We're going to
agree you could do huge stuff like this so easily
and dead he took. He got offended by it, which
(19:02):
which I mean, Look, I've pissed plenty of players off
in my time, you know, with questions or whatever. I
get that, But but that's not that to me, isn't
isn't a ridiculous question. You know, the internet was buzzing,
you know, for a good twenty four hours in a
lot of goofy ways. I know some reporters, even more
like you know New York based reporters were the ones
that kind of thing put that stuff in the universe.
But it's not a ridiculous question to ask Kyrie what
(19:25):
he thought about, you know, the stuff going on out there.
But said Kyrie is like the Internet isn't real and
is that really your life? And you're just doing this
for clicks? And I don't. I just again, I go
back to the mountains out of Mole Hills. Man, he
could very easily diffuse situations. He's choosing not to. Enough
about Kyrie. Enough about Kyrie. I want to talk about
his teammate next year, Lebron James. Okay, you heard Hey,
(19:50):
is Lebron James? Tell me? Tell me Chris. Is Lebron
James still the baddest man on the planet. Is he
gonna take this this niter, this me a Lakers squad
to the playoffs? Tell me yes or no? Come on,
I'm done betting against Lebron. So I'm gonna say yes. Um.
And it's it's part that the l A Clippers, you know,
(20:11):
their front office absolutely doesn't want to make the playoffs
for the reason we know they keep their draft pick
if they don't. And the idea that I'm gonna bett
in the Sacramento Kings doing anything like you know, productive
is is not gonna happen. Like that's just not I mean,
I love this narrative, like the Kings of this upstart.
You know, you know, great story that they've been out
of the playoffs since oh six, that had seventy two
(20:32):
lottery picks in the last twelve years. Like they should
be a playoff team right now, not one nipping at
the heels of the fringes of the postseason. But Lebron's Lebron.
He's great and I think it also means a lot
to him to be in the playoffs and not see
that consecutive playoffs. Tree again should be a dandy tonight
in Milwaukee, Celticston and Bucks. Enjoy that one, Chris, We
(20:53):
appreciate the time and enjoy the second part of the
NBA's regular season. Be sure to catch live editions. So
the Doug Got Leave Show week days in noon eastern
three pm Pacific, ISAAC had the news that's the NBA
working on the proposal to limit the age limit or
to the age limit from nineteen. You're cheering because you're
(21:15):
proving my point, Ryan. That's the that's the that's the
issue with this. This is this is the this is
the NBA, This is the NBA. And I know it's
coincidental that it was on the heels of the Zion injury.
But do you think this report really comes out if Zion,
if it comes out today on a Thursday, if Zion
isn't hurt last night, do you think this report comes
(21:35):
out today? Are you just questioning the timing? Listen, the
NBA is appropriate. Can you argue with just and appropriate?
That is it perfect? No? But can you fault effort?
This is not a mile away or the highway type
of approach. The NBA saw problem. They put um responsible
(21:58):
steps in place to fix it. And now Zion Williamson
last night show you how appropriate it is to absolutely
abolish the rule. And so I don't I don't know
how you're what do you complain to it? Are you
still are you hold on? Are you still blaming the NBA? Dan?
I am because this is why. Because if the rule
(22:23):
wasn't placed yet in place yesterday, Zion Williamson isn't in
a duke uniform with his legs in the form of
a Z on the camera the north floor. So if
you are carrying your lunch in your hands, you can
make any analogy. We heard some stupid ones on Fox Sports.
(22:44):
I'll tell you that much. You got your lunch in
hand and I trip and I knock over your lunch,
I knock your drink over. Okay, you got Starbucks? I
knock your drink always? What are you? Hey? Ryan? It's okay,
it's an accident. Where about it? What if I walk in,
I slap it off, slip your drink off the table.
You're gonna have a problem. Hey, what's wrong with you?
You're gonna have some choice words for me. That's what
(23:06):
the n C double A does. That's the difference between
n C Double A and the NBA. If the NBA
makes a mistake, they are going to go about it
the right way, conflict management and trying to make it right.
So how do you don't know? How do you fault
that that that you The answer is in what you
just said. They're trying to make it right because it's
wrong right now, and the reason that it's wrong has
(23:27):
put Zion Williamson in the situation that he's in because
this now would change the rule that would allow Zion
Williamson to go from high school to the NBA getting
rid of the one and done. If Jeff zill Get
of the USA today is correct and his reporting that's this,
It makes my whole point that, yeah, the NBA is
(23:47):
finally getting it right. But last night all anybody wanted
to do was claimed that the m C double A
was at fault for Zi Williamson, getting the whole reason.
You have no hold you hold value here. You cannot
you cannot look me in the face right now, and
I look talk talk to our listeners. Okay, let's say
(24:08):
this holds no value. That the n b A is
pro active and they are not telling you this is
a my way or the highway type of approach. They
are doing what's best not just for the league but
for the players because the NBA's prospering. But it values
Zion in these young prospects and what's good and what's
(24:29):
best for them. Condoleeze or Rice, as I said earlier
in that Rice Commission to look into college basketball, said
it perfectly. The one and done should be done. It
should be out of college basketball if you want to
help clean up the sport. The problem is the n
C Double A has no say in it whatsoever. It's
all on the NBA and the NBA Players Association, which
they have done. Unfortunately, for Zion Williamson, it's too late
(24:53):
because he had to play under the old rules. Of
the NBA. In the NBA, you know, you know what
big message the NBA saying right now, the big message,
We're sorry, shut it down. They should have shut it
down earlier than Zion Williamson wouldn't have a shoe blowing out,
(25:14):
Adam down, shut it down, shut it down. Well, the
the point is the NBA, for as great as proactive
as they are, they were late to the bus on
this one. And that's the case. If it's forty degrees
below zero and you're standing outside and wanting to come inside,
Ryan Hollins, and I'm saying, nope, you've got to wait.
(25:36):
You're one hour before coming inside. You're gonna go outside
and freeze to death. That exactly what it is. That
is the best analogy we have heard on Fox Sports Radio,
by the way of any analogy of of what actually
went on. Is that accurate? Just trying to make you right.
This is the NBA saying, hey, we're gonna put a
plan in place, rather than making an emotional hold here
(25:59):
here in emotional response is saying, look, man, we are
going to create a junior NBA. We're gonna have positive
resources here for you so that you guys can be
the best that you can be by the time you
make the NBA, rather than just saying we're getting one
and done. Because guess what, you had g ms and
(26:19):
executives in slimy high school gyms. They had to deal
with broken down AU coaches. It was a complete mass
you had to protect. And then you had kids trying
to jump to the NBA skipping class that wasn't going
to not guard NBA. But last night had nothing to
do with any of that. Last night had everything to
do with the NBA not allowing Zion Williamson to go pro.
And today it is not a coincidence that this story
(26:42):
was leaked. It is not There is no way, this
isn't even done yet. This isn't even so you're not
commending this. I'm just saying that there's a reason why
this came out the day after Zion Williamson sprained his
knee in a game against North Who. But you're you're skipping.
Can you commend the m E No, No, I I
am commending it, but I'm saying for Zion Williamson's situation,
(27:05):
for him, it was too late and me confused, you
know what, the saying shut it down
Host
Doug Gottlieb
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